# Breeding My Mare



## BitingTheBit (Feb 16, 2012)

I am looking into breeding my mare very soon...
She is a Quarter horse x ( the person i bought her off didn't know what she was crossed with :shock: )
Anyway does it matter which breed of stallion i breed her with for best conformation with the foal?


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## DrumRunner (Jan 26, 2011)

Before answering, I want to know why you want to breed her? Just curious..


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

Uh oh.....


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## NdAppy (Apr 8, 2009)

I would be interested to know why you want to breed her as well...


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## SkyeDawn (Mar 31, 2011)

BitingTheBit said:


> I am looking into breeding my mare very soon...
> She is a Quarter horse x ( the person i bought her off didn't know what she was crossed with :shock: )
> Anyway does it matter which breed of stallion i breed her with for best conformation with the foal?


Short answer: yes, it matters very much. Not just the breed but also the conformation of the stallion.

But the conformation of your mare matters as well. What are your plans for the foal? It would be very difficult to sell an unregistered foal.

I want to breed my mare as well, but only because she has exceptional conformation and amazing bloodlines, and it won't be for a long time yet. If I didn't think she was broodmare worthy, I wouldn't breed her. I'm not going to breed her just because she is a mare and can. I'm also waiting to see how she performs. If she performs poorly, conformation and lines are not enough of a reason for me to breed her. I need all three, AND an exceptional stallion.

Why do you want to breed your mare, and what are the plans for the baby? What traits make you want to breed your mare? How is her conformation? Her lines? Are there studs you are looking at?

I'm also not a bloodline snob, but I'm only going to breed an animal with good bloodlines because if A) I can't keep the baby for unforeseen reasons, I want to be able to find the baby the best possible home and B) I want to give the baby the best chance of success I can, starting with proven lines that produce good babies.

ETA: You also need plans for the baby's future. Do you want a western horse? English horse? Trail horse? That all changes the kind of studs you want to look at, and your mare needs to have the corresponding traits and conformation to match the stallion. If your mare has a long back, you want a stallion with a shorter back. But the most amazing stud in the world will NOT fix your mares conformational flaws. You need to have an amazing mare and good reasons to justify breeding her.


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## gigem88 (May 10, 2011)

Can you post some confirmation shots of your mare? What discipline will you want the foal to participate in? Breeding is chancey at best, I've seen horses with "exceptional confirmation" beget something short of a train wreck and less than good horses throw some great babies! Go figure. A good resource is a local trainer or riding instructor, they can steer you in the right direction and most are willing to help out a fellow horse person.


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## BaileyJo (Aug 23, 2011)

Although some of us members may cringe at these types of questions (simply because of fearing the results of breeding an unregistered mare and the question shows a potential for lack of horse knowledge), I am glad you asked it. We may prevent an undesireable breeding.

You will learn a lot from this post and asking that question.


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## cowboy bowhunter (Mar 15, 2012)

It sounds like she is grade why would you want to breed her. Makes her chances later in life not as good. Makes her hard to sell.


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

BitingTheBit said:


> I am looking into breeding my mare very soon...
> She is a Quarter horse x ( the person i bought her off didn't know what she was crossed with :shock: )
> Anyway does it matter which breed of stallion i breed her with for best conformation with the foal?


I would suggest you read your signature carefully and consider that the "journey" in breeding is to produce a foal that you have a reasonably good expectation in advance of what it will be like and what its abilities will be.

You can select a stallion that appears to be complimentary to your mare, but if you don't know the parentage of your mare, you cannot have a reasonable expectation of what you will get. If you breed your mare it will be like throwing a hook into a lake with a worm on it - you have no idea if you will catch a bluegill, a bass, a catfish.....or a turtle...


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## cmarie (Dec 19, 2011)

Papers don't make a horse, there are many 1/2 what ever registries out there, if papers are important. More important is what do you want this foal to do, figure that out and then starting looking for a stud that's strong where your mare is weak in what it is your looking for. The stud fee is the easy part, ask your self if you have the means to care for the mare while she's carrying and foal after it's born, vets are expensive. As Faceman says which is true for all breeding's by the way, there is no guarantee you'll get what you ordered.

Bottom line is she's your mare and the decision is up to you to breed or not. I would go to local farms and talk to breeders have them show you their mares and foals from their studs if they have a mare like yours her foal is likely to be similar, from the same stallion. And I would have your mare tested for HYPP, Herda, Lethal White, and what ever else you can think of because you don't know her bloodlines, and make sure the stud you choose is also negative.

I may get roasted for this but there are very few actual purebred horses in the world, most have other breeds in the lines such as 1/4 horses and Paints have alot of TB in the lines.

Good luck to you on what ever you decide to do with your mare.


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## BitingTheBit (Feb 16, 2012)

I'm very sorry this thread has alarmed you all !!
You see, when my little sister told me that she had posted something in my profile in the middle of a fight, i instantly freaked out and demanded her to tell me where it is...
My sister loves horses right, but she is quite young and doesn't know enough to have her own and of course she wants a foal, so she has her heart set on breeding my mare! And she figures i can just look after it for her.
I have taught her a bit but she's still learning....

I will try to keep teaching her things so she doesn't have to ask you all silly questions, or i'll just learn to logout! 

I'm sorry you all wasted your time answering!


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## SkyeDawn (Mar 31, 2011)

cmarie said:


> Papers don't make a horse, there are many 1/2 what ever registries out there, if papers are important.
> 
> I may get roasted for this but there are very few actual purebred horses in the world, most have other breeds in the lines such as 1/4 horses and Paints have alot of TB in the lines.


My comment isn't in regard to being purebred anything, it's in knowing the history of my mare, her lines, their attributes and achievements. I don't care if she is half whatever, I just want to be able to trace it back so I can know reasonably what to expect. It is also a hell of a lot easier to sell a papered foal than an unregistered one, but you can always register a paint or some other kind of cross.

The value isn't in the papers, but the reliable information and knowledge.

To the OP, I'm glad you don't want to sell your mare willy nilly, but I don't think the question is a silly one. The only way to learn is to ask.  I'm glad she had the forethought to go onto this forum and ask for opinions on the correct procedure. It speaks volumes for her future.


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## cmarie (Dec 19, 2011)

Your right the value isn't in papers, it's in ability, training, conformation, and the heart of the horse and rider.


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## GoAppendix (Mar 22, 2012)

cmarie said:


> I may get roasted for this but there are very few actual purebred horses in the world, most have other breeds in the lines such as 1/4 horses and Paints have alot of TB in the lines.


This is a poor comparison. Both the AQHA and APHA allow thoroughbreds as approved outcrosses and both registries have always allowed the influence. Completely different than breeding a random QH cross to a random stallion.


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## cmarie (Dec 19, 2011)

GoAppendix said:


> This is a poor comparison. Both the AQHA and APHA allow thoroughbreds as approved outcrosses and both registries have always allowed the influence. Completely different than breeding a random QH cross to a random stallion.


That's exactly what I mean, you can cross them and still paper them. How is it different your still getting a cross, some crosses are good some aren't.


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## GoAppendix (Mar 22, 2012)

cmarie said:


> That's exactly what I mean, you can cross them and still paper them. How is it different your still getting a cross, some crosses are good some aren't.


I don't think you understand how the registries work. Do you understand outcrosses or advancement out of the appendix registry?


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## cmarie (Dec 19, 2011)

Oh I do understand how the registries work. All's I'm saying it's still a crossbred.


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

GoAppendix said:


> I don't think you understand how the registries work. Do you understand outcrosses or advancement out of the appendix registry?


Oh, I think most of us "understand". But registration policies don't change the fact that a QH crossed with a TB is a mixed breed cross. The fact that TB's are part of QH roots is not relevant. At this point in time they are different breeds with different muscle composition and different conformations. Arabs are part of QH roots as well, but not recognized as a registerable cross. Registration policies do not supercede genetics...never have, and never will. I don't oppose Appendix Quarterhorses - I like them in fact because of their versatility. But a cross is a cross nonetheless...


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

BitingTheBit said:


> I'm very sorry this thread has alarmed you all !!
> You see, when my little sister told me that she had posted something in my profile in the middle of a fight, i instantly freaked out and demanded her to tell me where it is...
> My sister loves horses right, but she is quite young and doesn't know enough to have her own and of course she wants a foal, so she has her heart set on breeding my mare! And she figures i can just look after it for her.
> I have taught her a bit but she's still learning....
> ...


It's not a waste of time. Remember that for every poster there are scores of readers that don't post - some of whom may be considering breeding at some point. It is never a waste of time to have informational discussions where people can access information and opinions to help them make breeding decisions...


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## cmarie (Dec 19, 2011)

I have an Appendix mare love her to death, she has more TB characteristics than 1/4, she goes either english or western.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

OP, not a waste of our time at all .

*Perhaps let your little sister read this thread, maybe it will help her to learn more about the reasons behind breeding.*

Cmaire, what they are talking about is that the registered half breeds (I'll only discuss the AQHA and Appendix horses as I don't know much about the Arab registry) is that both parents are still registered and you can still track their lineage. You know what their lines are and you can look back at their parents and grandparents to see what kind of conformation runs in those lines. Knowing the lineage is also useful for tracking genetic diseases. For example, many people won't buy a horse with Impressive on the papers even if the horse is N/N just because of the stigma attached to that name. People buy grade horses every single day and many of the N/H progeny in recent years have been left unregistered _because _they are N/H. That means when a person decides to breed their grade mare because she's cute or because she's sweet, they could be creating another horse with a completely avoidable affliction.

Now, I'm just using this as an example but if the OP's mare happened to be Impressive bred and was a non-symptomatic N/H, then there is a chance that the foal could be born N/H too. Both of them could theoretically live long and productive lives and remain asymptomatic....or they could both start showing symptoms and be dead in a month.

In the case of the OP's mare, they only know that she is a QH cross. Since they don't know what the other half of her lineage is (and likely her QH parent wasn't registered either so that lineage is completely unknown), there is a huge risk for some freaky conformational or genetic thing hiding in the genes just waiting to jump onto the genes of a foal.

Anyway, there are serious things to think about before a person should consider breeding and breeding a mare is nowhere close to a cheap endeavor.

First, you have to make sure that both the sire and dam have great conformation. A few minor flaws are acceptable, so long as the other evens it out, but there are some that are huge no-nos in breeding like calf knees, pigeon toes, extremely posty legs, super long backs, etc.

Also, the conformation of both sire and dam need to compliment each other. Generally speaking, if their conformation doesn't work well together, it wouldn't produce a desirable foal. That's why you breed cutting horse to cutting horse, jumping horse to jumping horse, dressage horse to dressage horse. I can't imagine the foal between a dressage horse and a cutting horse would be good for either of those disciplines. Plus, if it got just the wrong traits from each parent, you may end up with the fugliest foal on the planet.

Really, both parents should have proven themselves at some discipline first as well. Being sweet doesn't automatically qualify a horse as breeding quality, they need to be talented at something other than converting grass to poop.

Both parents need to be genetically tested to make sure that there are no genetic diseases like HERDA or HYPP or OLWS or any one of the other countless diseases hiding in there somewhere.

Each parent needs to have an amazing temperament because temperament can be genetic. If the sire is a beautiful horse with a rotten attitude, then you risk ending up with a foal with a rotten attitude who may not be so beautiful.

After the horse has been deemed worthy to reproduce, then you have to look at the costs to breed a horse.

1) There's the pre-breeding exam of the mare to make sure she's sound for breeding and having her tested to make sure she's not carrying any STD's (stud should be tested too)

2) There's the breeding fee itself

3) There's the numerous ultrasounds and vet visits during the pregnancy to make sure the mare isn't carrying twins and then to make sure everything is progressing nicely and the mare and fetus stay healthy.

4) There's the potential risk of the foaling, in which you could lose the mare, the foal, or both. If something goes wrong and you are able to save both, the vet bills from that would feed a small country for a week.

5) Then there's the immediately doubled feeding costs, farrier costs, vet costs, boarding costs, and training costs.

You also have to consider whether you honestly have the capability to train the foal. Let me tell you, training a foal is difficult. I'd been training older horses for about 10 years before I had my first foal experience and it was challenging as hell.

Then, there's the wait time. You're looking at 3 years before you can ride it, and that 3 years is a very long time when you're anxious.


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## GoAppendix (Mar 22, 2012)

Faceman said:


> Oh, I think most of us "understand". But registration policies don't change the fact that a QH crossed with a TB is a mixed breed cross. The fact that TB's are part of QH roots is not relevant. At this point in time they are different breeds with different muscle composition and different conformations. Arabs are part of QH roots as well, but not recognized as a registerable cross. Registration policies do not supercede genetics...never have, and never will. I don't oppose Appendix Quarterhorses - I like them in fact because of their versatility. But a cross is a cross nonetheless...


Nope, it really isn't a "mixed breed." I mean you can use this argument to try and justify breeding low-quality horses all you like, but it still won't make it a valid argument.


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## cmarie (Dec 19, 2011)

Smrobs, I know what they meant and how the registries work I was just pointing out it's still a crossbred horse and I agree with your post, but you did leave out the costs involved if the foal is ill at or after birth or has leg angular deformities, does the vet know how to deal with them, the means to transport a new born to the vet, trailering a newborn has it's own set of issues.


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## cmarie (Dec 19, 2011)

No body is trying to justify breeding low quality horses, but just because it hasn't been shown or rodeoed doesn't make it a low quality horse, not knowing bloodlines doesn't make it a low quality horse. I've seen some very nice pedigreed horses that were conformationally flawed when neither parent was. Breeding is a gamble each time.


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## GoAppendix (Mar 22, 2012)

Ah yes, now that is some proper justification of poor breeding practices.


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## dbarabians (May 21, 2011)

The only difference beween a good quality grade horse and a good quality registered horse is the papers.
You do get the ability to reference the ancestors of the registered horse.
Registration papers are only to tract the bloodlines of the horse.
There are many Qh's that are 50 -75 % TB and look it. You see alot of them in the english and racing bloodlines.
there are over 30 arabian stallions listed as the sires of foundation Appaloossa . 
Until the books are closed to outside breeds the QH, Paint, and Apps may claim full registration but many are crossbreds. These breeds are still evolving.
I am not impressed that a horse is registered or by what bloodlines they carry. I am however impressed by the fact that they are correct stay sound are trainable and have good temperaments.
All these qualifications can be found in grade horses. Shalom


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## GoAppendix (Mar 22, 2012)

dbarabians said:


> There are many Qh's that are 50 -75 % TB and look it. You see alot of them in the english and racing bloodlines.


You're right. I own one, though he is 7/8 thoroughbred. And guess what? He could have his white papers, earning full rights. Advancement is a wonderful thing. 

Back to the point, pointing out that registries allow outcrossing is a very poor argument for justifying breeding a grade mare of unknown parentage. Not comparable.


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## cmarie (Dec 19, 2011)

I'm not justifying anything, and no body on this forum can tell the OP she can't breed her horse, it's her horse and her call not anyone else. The only thing anyone can do is offer advice but you seem to want to bash and point fingers, and disagree with everyone who has a different point of view than you do. With that said we can agree to disagree.


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## dbarabians (May 21, 2011)

A grade horse can have a value equal to or better than most registered horses if trained properly. 
There is a market for good quality horses that are well trained and no papers are necessary.
Unless you are showing in breed show or planining on breeding a certain breed registration papers are not necessary.
It is no crime to own or breed a grade horse. The process needs to be well planned and not taken lightly.
If one does not like grade horses do not buy or breed one. Its that simple. Shalom


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

Guys, nobody is saying that grade horses are bad, heck, most the horses on my place are grade. We're saying that _breeding_ grade horses that you know nothing about more than "well, one parent was a QH" is bad. Without knowing what the parents/grandparents looked like, it is a much greater gamble than breeding 2 well conformed horses where the lineage is _known_. Yes, not every single foal will turn out perfectly, but you aren't likely to get something that looks like a 5 legged donkey if you were to breed.... we'll say Zenyatta and Cigar.

It isn't unheard of for 2 completely fugly horses to create a foal that, by some miracle, _isn't_ a mutant. But that foal, who is now a mature horse and of breeding age, still carries the possibility of passing those fugly genes on to their foal.

Seriously, why breed a horse if you know nothing of their genetics and take the risk of possibly creating something like this, that _nobody_ will want,








when you could just go out and buy a horse of any color/size/breed/conformation/temperament/age right now for less than it costs for a tank of gas.


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## SkyeDawn (Mar 31, 2011)

smrobs, you are my hero.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

GoAppendix said:


> Nope, it really isn't a "mixed breed." I mean you can use this argument to try and justify breeding low-quality horses all you like, but it still won't make it a valid argument.


What is it about the term "mixed breed" you don't understand?

Quarterhorses are a breed.

Thoroughbreds are a breed.

A Quarterhorse crossed with a Thoroughbred is a mix of two breeds, thus is a mixed breed.

Now with all due respect, that is a duh.

To be redundant, whether AQHA or any other registry registers the cross is not relevant...it is still a mixed breed horse. There is nothing wrong with that, but it is what it is.

ApHC registers Appy/QH, Appy/TB, and Appy/Arab crosses in their registry - they are still mixed breeds. Many warmbloods are mixed breeds and are registered.

Registration does not define a breed. Genetics do. That is not an argument, it is fact...


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## SkyeDawn (Mar 31, 2011)

Faceman said:


> What is it about the term "mixed breed" you don't understand?
> 
> Quarterhorses are a breed.
> 
> ...


I think the point is that


> Quarterhorses are a breed.
> 
> Thoroughbreds are a breed.
> 
> A Quarterhorse crossed with a Thoroughbred is a mix of two breeds, thus is a mixed breed.


The original Quarter Horse that you started with ALREADY had Thoroughbred mixed into it even if it is registered full Quarter Horse. So mixing it further with another Thoroughbred you can still register it as Quarter Horse. So even though it is a mix of two breeds, it is still a Quarter Horse, and not called "grade" or "mix breed"

I think the term "mix breed" is really negative, and it applies more to like.. an accidental or nonsensical mix, like a quarter horse and a draft.


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## SkyeDawn (Mar 31, 2011)

cmarie said:


> No body is trying to justify breeding low quality horses, but just because it hasn't been shown or rodeoed doesn't make it a low quality horse, not knowing bloodlines doesn't make it a low quality horse. I've seen some very nice pedigreed horses that were conformationally flawed when neither parent was. Breeding is a gamble each time.


Guys I think that we are all arguing different points.

I'm not a breed snob, I don't care if it is Arabian or Standardbred or Thoroughbred or Quarterhorse, if it works for my discipline I'm going to use it.

Our point about the papers isn't "Look at my pretty papered horse! It's better than yours!" It's that we can look at the history. Research sires and grandsires, their crosses with other mares, that mares history, the outcome, and increase our own odds in what we breed our mare with. It's not that having papers makes the horse any better. It's increasing the odds in our favor as far as breeding goes. Yes, breeding in any form is a gamble. I would just rather stack the odds.

I love grade horses. There is absolutely nothing wrong with them, and some are absolutely freaking amazing, and much better than a lot of papered horses. But you can breed a papered horse poorly just as easily as you can poorly breed a grade horse. It isn't the PAPERS that made a good horse. That grade horse that performs amazingly? Probably had good ancestors. And if it didn't? The odds of breeding that horse true and NOT getting any dilution from the wonky ancestors are VERY slim. But it CAN be done. I am just not willing to take that risk, personally. Leave that to the professional breeders that have the money and have done the research, and have the facilities to experiment with breeding, and the resources to home the failed experiments.

Papers or no, fugly conformation or no, every horse deserves love and a good home.


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

SkyeDawn said:


> I think the point is that
> 
> The original Quarter Horse that you started with ALREADY had Thoroughbred mixed into it even if it is registered full Quarter Horse. So mixing it further with another Thoroughbred you can still register it as Quarter Horse. So even though it is a mix of two breeds, it is still a Quarter Horse, and not called "grade" or "mix breed"
> 
> I think the term "mix breed" is really negative, and it applies more to like.. an accidental or nonsensical mix, like a quarter horse and a draft.


I understand the point, that point being in theory if you reintroduce blood that went into the origin of a breed, you haven't introduced anything "new".

However, that is a false premise. In the first place, the Quarterhorse has been further developed than the original, with breeding to alter the muscle composition to the highest possible ratio of fast twitch muscle. There have been other conformational alterations, but that is the primary one IMO. Secondm, and concurrent with the ongoing evolution of the Quarterhorse, the Thoroughbred is certainly not the same as when it contributed to the QH origin. Breeding has lightened bone, joints, and hooves, which is just the opposite of a Quarterhorse, and the muscle composition has been stabilized at an in between ratio that permits both strength and endurance - not as strong as a QH, and not as much endurance as the Arab.

So at this point in time, the two are (obviously) very different and distinct breeds - unlike when the QH was first developed, and was, for lack of a better term, a "tweaked" Thoroughbred.

As to the negativity of the term mixed breed, perhaps some people view it that way, but that would IMO be an ignorant opinion. There isn't anything intrinsically negative about a mixed breed horse. Many, if not most, warmbloods are mixed breeds, and there are fantastic Quarabs, Araloosas, and so on. Half Arabs are among the most versatile of horses. Honestly, many mixed breed horses are highly skilled and versatile - moreso than pure breds that are bred for a specific function. Yes, breeding a pair of multi mixed breed horses would likey result in a horse of limited ability, but that is not the same as intelligently breeding a good cross like a warmblood or Appendix or Araloosa - those are apples and oranges.

As I said earlier, I understand AQHQ registers Appendix horses - just as other registries register certain crosses. They are registered horses with known pedigrees. And yes, certain TB's - Three Bars comes to mind for obvious reasons - have had great impact on the QH breed, and it can certainly be reasoned that a limited reintroduction of TB blood is good for the breed. However none of that alters the fact that an Appendix is a mixed breed horse because it is a mixture of two breeds. That is about as basic as you can get. I raised Araloosas for many years, and they were and are fantastic horses. ApHC will register them as regular Appys just as AQHA does with Appendix horses, and AHA will register them as half Arabs, but they are still mixed breed horses.

I don't think there is really anything to debate here... There is absolutely nothig wrong with a mixed breed horse if bred responsibly, but a mixed breed is a mixed breed, and no amount of rhetoric or rationalization can change that. In these breed discussions there are always those that parrot the mantra "well all horses are mixed breeds", but that is not true. While all breeds were developed from other breeds, once enough generations go by and a population begans breeding true to a homogenous genotype and phenotype, they become a distinct breed - as is the case with both Quarterhorses and Thoroughbreds...


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## StellaIW (Feb 5, 2012)

Lol, I'm happy I didn't post a thread here when I was picking a stallion for my little mare.


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## GoAppendix (Mar 22, 2012)

Faceman said:


> What is it about the term "mixed breed" you don't understand?
> 
> Quarterhorses are a breed.
> 
> ...


Yeah, you are wrong here. The breed registries define the breed. 

And you, as well as others, are missing my point entirely. Which is that you can't justify breeding a horse of unknown breeding just because certain breeds allow approved outcrosses. It isn't the same and it isn't comparable.


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## dbarabians (May 21, 2011)

The breed standard for a QH is not an appendix if it was they would be registered by bloodlines alone like every other QH. Your horse has to qualify to be fully accepted into the breed registration. 
The few QHs here that I own only required DNA and a breeding certifficate. They are foundation bred. The basic standard for the breed.
Breeding any horse requires a plan. Registration papers only make the process easier and eliminate some of the guess work.
You are refusing to see our very valid point. 
No one is suggesting that anyone just breed any mare to any stallion randomly. 
Any horse requires too much time and expense to take ownership much less breeding lightly. One must not only plan for the mating but the long term care of the foal. Shalom


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## GoAppendix (Mar 22, 2012)

Why are you going off on random tangents? Did anyone say appendix horses were the breed standard? The fact that you think foundation quarter horses are somehow superior is quite laughable, though. Thanks for you.

But since you want to bring this up, let me point out that you seem confused on the appendix registry. Horses in it are very much "accepted into the breed registration." They have full rights except when it comes to breeding to another A) appendix or a B) Thoroughbred.

Shalom.


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## Rascaholic (Oct 4, 2010)

Threads like this keep me out of the breeding section most of the time. *sigh*


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## SkyeDawn (Mar 31, 2011)

> Threads like this keep me out of the breeding section most of the time. *sigh*


 Really? I love intellectual debates as long as no one gets belligerent or angry. I really like to see other point of views and I genuinely enjoy learning things I had no idea about. 

Also, I think this whole discussion is fascinating. The problem is that people see a superiority in established breeds, but I firmly believe there is always something to improve upon, and I for one have no wish to see the gene pool go stagnant. Mixing in other breeds is completely necessary, and their registry is just as valid as any other. That's all that really matters, isn't it?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## dbarabians (May 21, 2011)

No matter what you nthink your horse has more TB blood than QH.
I too own an appendix registered mare her papers state this. I did not say that foundation QH are superior. I said that they are the breed standard. 
No one is disputing that your horse is registered with the AQHA. We are just stating that he is a cross. Shalom


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## GoAppendix (Mar 22, 2012)

Ha, did I say anywhere that he wasn't almost entirely thoroughbred? Please read. I, myself, said he was 7/8. The difference is that with approved outcrosses (do you see me using this word yet again?) you get a horse that is entirely able to be registered with a breed association. Not some random cross. There is a difference. 

And no, foundation horses are not the breed standard. Better luck next time.


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## dbarabians (May 21, 2011)

Goappendix, I assure you that I need no luck. I have the facts and your ignorance of the history and developement of the QH is very apparent.
A debate is healthy your attempt to argue is not. Shalom


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## MangoRoX87 (Oct 19, 2009)

Really the Foundation bred horses are the closest to what the breed standard USED to be and SHOULD be. Now it's stupid and over specialized.


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## CLaPorte432 (Jan 3, 2012)

I agree Mango.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cowboy bowhunter (Mar 15, 2012)

MangoRoX87 said:


> Really the Foundation bred horses are the closest to what the breed standard USED to be and SHOULD be. Now it's stupid and over specialized.


Those foundation lines like when you look back on them were rougher horses, could work all day, but would buck for nothing. But that wasnt as big of a deal for the cowboys that used them. Now horses being specialized they have breed the good one so they arnt as mean. They can have speed or no speed. They can be cowy or not cowy. I see no problem with specializing breeds and making the QH better at a event and breeding for it.


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## cowboy bowhunter (Mar 15, 2012)

But as people are arguing i do see problems with breeding a grade horse. The horse may be the best horse that ever walked but the problem is see is there is no forever home stuff happends. With all the good bred horses out there now, the grade horses just dont have as good of a chance. I feel if your going to breed breed the best that has the best chance of being sold if needed. That give the horse the best chance in life.
If that is appendix, QH, or anything breed for the best to give them the best change.


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## MangoRoX87 (Oct 19, 2009)

I see lots of problems with it when the QH was originally bred to be the most versatile horse (not just as a breed, but as a single horse itself), specializing goes COMPLETELY against that.


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## cowboy bowhunter (Mar 15, 2012)

MangoRoX87 said:


> I see lots of problems with it when the QH was originally bred to be the most versatile horse (not just as a breed, but as a single horse itself), specializing goes COMPLETELY against that.


Back when there was foundation lines that was it. It was just working ranch horses roping. But those horses didnt do that wellin reining or cutting so they had to make them better. Sometimes specializing a breed is a good thing. It better then making there own breed for a event.


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## dbarabians (May 21, 2011)

The TB has definitely influenced the QH in a very positive way. It increased agility speed and refinement.
Cowboy I do however digress about the events of reining and cutting. Those foundation QH's could do the job and do it well. Yet as the events evolved they became more and more sophisticated and profitable. Demanding that the horses become more and more specialized.
I see this happening now in the Arabian breed.
The Qh stallions in the past were used for halter perfromance and racing before breeding. It was a good practice and essential to the developement of the breed. Now you have so many different types that breeding a Champion race horse to a halter horse would spell disaster. Shalom


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## MangoRoX87 (Oct 19, 2009)

And, plus, quarter horses were pretty much the only horses in reining, so them not doing well at it makes no sense.
A QH should have bone, speed, consistency, and cow. Now that's way too much to ask for these days.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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