# Cremello/Perlino/Smokey Cream



## Ashsunnyeventer (Aug 17, 2012)

I've just started learning about horse golor genetics, and I'm confused on the cream dillution gene. I understand 2 of the single dillutes (buckskin, and palomino), but how do you know if your horse is smokey black? From what I've read, the coat is prone to sun bleaching, but other than that, black-based horses don't show signs of the cream dillution.

Also, the double dillutes all look the same to me. They all have pink skin and blue eyes. Cremello is a complete dillution of a red-based horse. Perlino is a complete dillution of a bay horse, and Smokey Cream is a complete dillution of a black-based horse. What confuses me is how to look at a horse and pick perlino, cremello, or smokey cream. They are all completely dilluted, so how do you tell their base color?


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## Ashsunnyeventer (Aug 17, 2012)

Also, these horses look like they have pink skin to me, so how is the foal a buckskin? He doesn't have dark points on his legs. I would think they would be a double dillution of the cream gene because of their light skin and blue-looking eyes.

BR Peaches Moore and Innishfael Dragon | Equine Color Genetics


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## ThirteenAcres (Apr 27, 2012)

The double dilutes are harder for me as well.

And I've heard that truly the only way to know a non-typical black based cream is to test it out.

I realized all that was very unhelpful. I typically think of a perlino as having a more reddish tint to the mane and tail, and the cremellos as having a more creamy tint. But they really can be hard at times.


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## ThirteenAcres (Apr 27, 2012)

Ashsunnyeventer said:


> Also, these horses look like they have pink skin to me, so how is the foal a buckskin? He doesn't have dark points on his legs. I would think they would be a double dillution of the cream gene because of their light skin and blue-looking eyes.
> 
> BR Peaches Moore and Innishfael Dragon | Equine Color Genetics


Ok. Very late at night, so Chillaa and NdAppy can hit me tomorrow if this is totally off...BUT. The pink is a lot because the foal is mainly white, and all white markings are pink based skin. However, looking at that foal, I wouldn't think buckskin either based on face value...


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## Ashsunnyeventer (Aug 17, 2012)

I couldn't see any black or dark points, not even just a little by his fetlocks ( I know some foals ca have a teeny tiny amount of dark pigment around the hooves and shed off into dark socks). I'm questioning the accuracy of the site I'm learning off of because there is no way that you can tell a cremello form a perlino from a picture. It just can't be possible with out testing...


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## haviris (Sep 16, 2009)

I don't know if I could spot a smokey cream, but perlinos tend to have more orangish points. As for smokey black, you're right, you can't see the cream on black, why it has a special name I couldn't tell ya.

As for the pic, there is no color on the foal's legs, they are white, so that is no indication. Foal color changes ALOT from birth and I could buy this baby being a buckskin, hard to tell for sure on that pic. Only their white areas have pink skin, their colored spots have dark skin. I can't tell their eye colors from those pics, but blue eyes from pinto are different then double dilute eyes, DD eyes are not the super bright blue of typical pinto blue eyes, they're more pale colored.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Ashsunnyeventer said:


> Also, these horses look like they have pink skin to me, so how is the foal a buckskin? He doesn't have dark points on his legs. I would think they would be a double dillution of the cream gene because of their light skin and blue-looking eyes.
> 
> BR Peaches Moore and Innishfael Dragon | Equine Color Genetics


He might be reg'd as a bucksin pinto, but he wouldn't be accepted in the Buckskin registry, they have an excessive white rule and he violates it all to H*ll and back.


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## HorseLovinLady (Jul 18, 2011)

You can usually tell a cremello from a perlino is perlinos usually have a coppery color to their mane and tails where cremellos usually have lighter colored manes and tails. Most cremellos manes and tails are the same color as their body.


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## Chiilaa (Aug 12, 2010)

That website is a very correct one, with very current information and many users who are very well versed in colour genetics. The same site has a picture of him fully grown:


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

I know the stallion, Innishfael Dragon, personally. He is gorgeous and a lovely Buckskin OVERO PINTO Stallion. He is not eligible for Buckskin Registry as they do not accept pintos. 

From ABRA's Site:

*White Markings*






[*]ABRA accepts horses with white marking on their head and legs, provided the white markings fall within these parameters: 






[*]On the legs, the white must not exceed the center of the knee on the front legs or the center of the hock on the hind legs. 






[*]White marking on the horses face must not extend past a line dropped from the center of the horses ear to the corner of his mouth. 






[*]White is allowed on the horses chin, but may not exceed a line drawn from one corner of the mouth to the other.


Not trying to say he isn't buckskin in color, but he's not a Buckskin registered horse.


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## verona1016 (Jul 3, 2011)

I missed the part where the website or any of the posts says the horse is registered in the Buckskin Registry? Buckskin is a color (black + agouti + cream) that can be further acted upon by other genes (splash, frame, etc.); the Buckskin Registry is an organization that registers buckskin colored horses, but does not accept horses with loud pinto markings. The foal in the picture is buckskin colored (with pinto markings). The links doesn't say anything about his registry status, but the breeder's page says he's registered Pinto Horse Association.

As for double dilutes, perlinos are fairly easy to pick out because their manes and tails are darker than the rest of their body:









Cremellos are the same color throughout:









Smoky creams are harder to identify and can be easily mistaken for cremello, perlino, or even other colors.

Smoky black is also hard to distinguish in many cases. Unbleached, they can look just like a regular black horse, and once sunbleached they can be mistaken for brown, bay, grulla, liver chestnut, etc!


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

verona1016 said:


> I missed the part where the website or any of the posts says the horse is registered in the Buckskin Registry?


No one said he was ABRA reg'd. But because of this question, "Also, these horses look like they have pink skin to me, so how is the foal a buckskin?", I included info about Buckskin Registry, just for clarity's sake.


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## Ashsunnyeventer (Aug 17, 2012)

Thanks for the info! The pictures of cremellos and Perlinos that I was looking at were very similar. The picture that Verona posted really shows the coppery color.


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