# Dropping to front knees when tacked



## Lonestar22 (May 22, 2009)

Some horses do that when you pull the cinch too tight too quick. Maybe try just cinching her lightly until you are about to mount then cinch up tightly, but not all at once.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## HollyLolly (Dec 25, 2009)

By Jove, I think you've got it!!! I never thought about that! I feel so stupid now, I mean, I know she's cinchy, and yet I still pulled it pretty fast, compared to what I normally do - well, I'm pretty newish to doing up cinches, as I used to ride English, only very recently made the transition, so I've been doing things pretty slowly and meticulously, so as not to get it wrong, but now I'm getting more confident, I did it up quite quickly (even though I know she's cinchy anyway - bit silly on my part)

Thank you so much for enlightening me on this, that is such a huge weight off, and I'm certain you're right, as I did it up particularly sharply and quickly today. Many thanks, this information is such a relief, I really appreciate it!


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## BaileyJo (Aug 23, 2011)

This happened with me once. I cinched up and she went down. She is quite touchey as well with the cinch. Plus she was very green. She would rather do with the saddle, especially a western saddle. Was riding her once and she actually went to her knees and started to roll with me - and the saddle on. Course I jumped off before she got to far and got her on her feet, but I was shocked!


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## MIEventer (Feb 15, 2009)

I would ensure that her back isn't out or in pain, make sure that the saddle is fitting correctly - there is pain issue going on here. I would also check for ulcers *if she is cinchy*. 

I wouldn't just pass it off as girthing her up too quickly - all though, that is not the right way to tack up. You always girth up slowly and progressively.


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

My friend's arab gelding does the exact same thing if he's cinched too quickly...except he goes all the way down in a dead faint. Watched it with my own eyes. Most amazing thing I have ever seen (in a scary way). His cinchiness is caused by an old injury, though (was cinched too tightly with his previous owners and the buckle on the off-side of the cinch pinched him so bad it left a scar...and then he was ridden on an endurance ride with the cinch that way).


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Doing the girth up harshly IMO, whether english or western, whether the horse is used to it or not, is still doing the girth up harshly. Of course a horse will be 'cinchy' if she's defensive about the pain/discomfort she knows is coming. There are also nerves & muscles that can be pinched. **However, agree thoroughly with MI & wouldn't just jump to that conclusion without considering other causes.

If your horse has a sore back, then IMO you shouldn't be riding her - or at least perhaps you wouldn't be hurting her to ride bareback, but be considerate of her comfort - if she's bruised or otherwise damaged because of a badly fitting saddle, wait until she's better, regardless of how well fitting the current one may be.


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## mom2pride (May 5, 2009)

Could be narcolepsy as well...if she was 'sleepy' before and after...


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Hi Mum2,

I'm curious, what's with the narcolepsy? Just that I've heard it mentioned a few times lately, but never before in relation to horses. Do you know, have there been diagnoses made lately? How were they made? Wonder if it's been confused with - or a lable given - for horses who are constantly over tired because their stay aperatus isn't functioning properly - so it takes effort for them to stand still/sleep standing. I did wonder too whether in this case, the girthing procedure may have suddenly broken the stay aperatus suddenly(not familiar with nerves & tendons in that area for more than (wondering) & the horse, unprepared, wasn't ready to have to hold herself up.


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## faye (Oct 13, 2010)

Narcolepsy is a condition that is seen in all animals.

You can read about it in humans here:

Narcolepsy - PubMed Health

The symptoms are the same for other animals


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## HollyLolly (Dec 25, 2009)

Thank you for your replies everyone.
Firstly, I didn't do it up quickly on purpose, I wasn't really thinking, and just did it up more quickly than what I normally would. Well, it would have happened before if I did it on a regular basis.

Secondly, she's had time off for her back, and she's not had problems with it. I've just notice on a couple of occasions since, if I put a _lot_ of pressure on the muscles either side of her withers, she can twitch a little, but I've only noticed it twice since, and I check very regularly. Despite this, I am still getting the physio to be 100% sure. I was just trying to think of all the possible reasons she did this; and, despite being alright now, I thought it was still important for people to know, as it could have affected diagnosis.

Oh, also, the saddle she has now has been fitted professionally, and fits her well.

And lastly, I did think about narcolepsy, but she's never done it before, she does get dosey in the sun, but never collapsed before, in fact, I never even see her lying down (I know she must now and then, but I never get a glimpse haha) I also thought of a stroke, but you start to think of extreme things when you're in a panic.

Thank you all for your input,
Holly


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

You missed an opportunity to lay her down and rub her all over. google endospink and watch Paul lay down problematic horses using this technique. He calls it "the Tap". Works on the endorphins.


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## faye (Oct 13, 2010)

Saddlebag, what a total load of rot!
The horse wasnt lieing down and allowing itself to be fussed it had collapsed due to something being wrong you don't start rubbing a collapsed horse in order to bond with it. You get it up anc check it can stand, then you check it for injuries, then you decde whether or not to call a vet. This is also not a problem horse!

to the OP, I had a thought. It has been unseasonablyu hot up here in HULL (so UK too) if your horse was drowsing in the sun and has started to gain a winter coat a mild case of heat stroke might have caused it.
I've seen it once before when a horse collapsed like yours did in the back of my lorry. He was just too **** hot, we got him out cooled him down and he was absolutly fine afterwards. His was a lot more severe then yours sounds though as he was severely distressed and I couldnt get him off the lorry for a good 30 mins due to being on the M6 at the time it happened


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

faye said:


> Narcolepsy is a condition that is seen in all animals.
> 
> You can read about it in humans here:
> 
> ...


Interesting. I do know about the condition in people, having known a guy who suffered it. Just haven't heard of it in animals before. I did re-read that article you linked to tho & didn't recall it being linked to lack of a specific protein in the brain. I wonder if carefully balanced nutrition could be a 'cure'...

Of course, the symptoms, being chronic or frequent drowsiness could easily be due to other causes - stay aperatus issues being a common prob that came to mind with horses for eg, which is why I asked the questions.


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## HollyLolly (Dec 25, 2009)

Faye, that's a very good point, it has been warm! And, it's been so changeable, I've put her lightweight turnout on, which won't have helped. And you're right, she does have a winter coat coming through... hmm, I better keep an eye on this, I never thought about that!

Many thanks to everyone's coments, oh, and also, the physio's coming on saturday to check her back, just to put my mind at rest


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## Clementine (Sep 24, 2009)

Something is definitely not right. Sounds like a pain issue to me for sure. Either her back is out, her saddle doesn't truly fit, or she may have ulcer(s). 

When I saw the title of this thread, my brain screamed SADDLE DOES NOT FIT!!! I hate to say it, but there are a lot of pro saddle fitters that are unfortunately a piece of ****. Do you ever notice any dry spots in her sweat pattern after you ride her & remove the saddle? That would be a sign of a pinch which would be causing her a lot of discomfort. Just saying, don't rule out a poor fitting saddle just because a "pro" has weighed in. I'd be interested to see if she reacted similarly to having a surcingle tightened around her. If she didn't, that would rule out "girthing" issues and point to saddle issues.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Clementine said:


> When I saw the title of this thread, my brain screamed SADDLE DOES NOT FIT!!! I hate to say it, but there are a lot of pro saddle fitters that are unfortunately a piece of ****.


Hmm, as with any 'specialist', there are good ones, but many are just spurts under pressure!:lol:


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## NCRider (Sep 8, 2011)

If her back is still sore, she probably needs some time off from being ridden. If you keep putting pressure on it, even with a properly fitting saddle, it will take longer to heal and she may develop behavior issues. Cinchiness, for one, and that's just the start.

Do groundwork with her for awhile and give that back a rest.


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## telly (Aug 6, 2011)

I made a mistake today, cinched my saddle and realized I had forgot to clean his hoves when I picked up his front leg over he came Apparently It pinches a nerve and me lifting his front leg messed up his balance, chalk one up for experience anyways i loosened the cinch tied him back up( after he had busted the tie down from pulling back to catch his balance) finished his feet and he was fine. Not saying that your situation is the same but just sharing my experience because when that nerve is pinched it can happen, keep a eye on her though.


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