# Lessee avoiding me, not sure what to do



## NeuroticMare (Jan 8, 2012)

Hi all, I wasn't sure where to put this, but this seemed as good of a place as any.

I need some advice regarding a lease. I have been leasing my gelding to a younger girl for the last two years (she is 16 now). They (her and her parents) have been wonderful and take regular lessons, have always been good with my gelding, etc.

Last weekend, she went to a 2 day dressage show, I hauled her and played groom/friend/shrink for the show. It was a LONG weekend, it was rainy and cold the entire weekend, the showgrounds are beautiful, but spread out so traveling between barns/show rings, etc was a process and it just ended up being an exhausting weekend.

It caught up with lessee on Sunday afternoon, it was near 3 o'clock and her final test was second to the last for the day. She had had a wonderful morning test (TL1) with the highest score of the weekend. Gelding was pooping out a little by her second test (TL2) and by TL3, she was having trouble getting him to focus. He was fussing and wiggly... it turned out he had to pee, which he did later, after the test.

However, the way lessee conducted herself in the test shocked me. She spurred him so far he got raised bumps on his side. She also yanked on his mouth so hard and repeatedly when he started to fuss, that she caused sores in his mouth. I'm not talking dripping blood (he was in a hollow, loose ring french link snaffle, as my trainer says, might as well be chewing gum), but it goes to show that ANY bit is as harsh as the hands that hold the reins.

When she came out of the ring I started to softly discuss what we never do to our horses, but she said "don't" and started crying and rode back to the barn alone. When we got back, I started to take out pony's braids and get him groomed and ready to go home. Every time I tried to speak with her, she started to cry and told me to leave her alone. At this point, I was a bit irritated, we were 3 hours away from home and I didn't really want to ride home in a truck with someone who didn't want to speak with me. So, I sent her home with her parents and hauled the horse home by myself. It was okay (luckily, my brand new trailer had gotten hit in a parking lot on the way TO the show and I was a bit worried about one of the tires, but I stopped at a TA and the guy working in the garage said I was fine to get home).

I didn't mind taking him home and taking care of him, honestly, he's my horse, of course it's not my show and I expect her to usually take care of him after a show, but under the circumstances, I wanted to take care of him myself.

I texted her that Monday and asked her to please call me when she had a minute, as we needed to chat. She said she would call me, but never did. Our barn manager quit unexpectedly on Sunday, so I have been doing feeding, turnout, and some stalls every day to help out BOs. I work nights (10pm-6am) and take care of the horses from 6:30am until noon or later, so needless to say, I've been exhausted.

I tried to call her, sent texts, got no response. I ended up sending an email stating my piece so that she could respond at her leisure, however, she hasn't. She has not been out to the barn because I had left her (my) tack and such in the trailer and as of this morning (Friday morning) it was still there, I finally took it out and put it back in our locker.

I'm at a loss of what to do. I do not really want to involve the parents, even though they are well involved in the lease as is, because I don't want to embarrass her any more than she already is. I'm not even sure the parents noticed her going to town on him, if they did, they didn't say anything. I keep re-reading my email, wondering if I was too harsh? I don't want to be. We all make mistakes, and I get that.

I know she has read my messages as she has made offhand comments on Facebook about being hurt. So, I don't know.

Here is my email, please let me know if I was too harsh:
_
Hey girl,

I left my phone at the barn and after working 13 hours, I'm too tired_ _
to go get it (8 hours at [work], and then 5 more at [barn]).

I thought I would send you a quick email before I go to bed, as I can_ _
say what I need to and you won't feel like it's a confrontation, it's
really not.

I was not angry with you on Sunday, and I'm not now. I was surprised,_ _
shocked and very disappointed. You lost your temper and took it out
on [pony]. I know the test was not going well, people see that all the
time at horse shows and would think nothing of that. What people did
see was you kicking, spurring and yanking on the reins. In fact, [pony]
has painful sores in and around his mouth that are still healing. You are
very fortunate the TD was watching the warmup arena, not your test.
Although the steward did see it and asked me what was going on, I told
her I would handle it.

Unfortunately, you ride a unique-looking horse and the horse community_ _
is SO small. My friend (a PSG dressage rider) used to joke that you
could sneeze on the west side of town and they would shout "god bless
you" on the east side of town. I used to laugh, but now I do realize
how small it is, especially in dressage. People
will remember what they saw for a long time.

[pony] will heal physically, and horses are probably the most forgiving_ _
creature on earth, so I believe him to be okay. As riders... no, not
just riders, as horsemen, you cannot lose your temper with a horse,
ever. Horses are merely horses, as smart and cool as [pony] is, he is
still a horse. Horses do not do things to make you mad, they do not
do things to scare you, things they do are reactions to the
surroundings, to their handlers, and to their past. Horses have very
good memories, in fact, they don't forget horses or people they have
met before, or places they have been. Which is why, even after years
of wonderful treatment, [a horse at the barn] can still come unglued over something
that triggers a memory of pain.

Luckily, [pony] doesn't have many bad memories to flash back to, his_ _
life has been pretty peachy. I never treat my horses, or any horse,
with disrespect. But don't be surprised if he does not trust your
hands for a while and come on the bit for you. You have to make doing
the right thing easy and the wrong thing hard, but all that yanking
has taught him is that bits hurt.

That said, I do believe in second chances, and I'm going to give you_ _
one. However, I do not want to ever see that happen again. It would
be more noble to have dismounted and handed the horse off, than to
continue the test as you did.

As of now, no more hitting. Remove your spurs for a while too. Give_ _
him some time off to let his mouth heal. Think about your goals right
now and what you want to achieve. Are horse shows fun for you? If
the stress is making too difficult, it's okay to change or tweak your
goals a bit, everyone does at some point.

An apology to [pony], myself, and [trainer] are in order. When you have_ _
your trainer sign your form, you are riding as their student. Out of
respect for him, in the future, you must conduct yourself with nothing
but a professional and courteous manner to every horse and person you
come in contact with, whether it be at the barn, a show, or even on a
trail ride. [trainer] is a humane agent, so it is even more important
to show him that you can handle your horse compassionately.

Don't be sad, I still love and adore you, which is why I am writing_ _
this rather than ending the lease. You have a long, bright future
ahead of you both with horses and everything you do. We all make
mistakes, and you are lucky to have made it young so you can learn
from it and we can all move on from this whole mess.

You can talk to me anytime, about anything. I really do think of you_ _
as a younger sister. As a good friend too.

Take care, we'll talk soon._


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## muumi (Oct 17, 2011)

Look, its a complicated situation, and you are not wrong in anything you felt or said.
But, I'm just putting myself in the mind of a 16 year old girl, who already knows she screwed up, and probably feels horrible about it.

I think your letter was a little too much, too long, and kept repeating the offence, and if I were a young teenage girl, I probably would have no idea how to deal with it, and would be wanting to avoid you too.
I don't know if when I was a teenager, whether I would have been able to deal with confrontation at all well, so maybe just keep in mind that this girl is in fact a child.

She should not have acted as she did, but the situation probably just got away from her in a way that she couldn't cope rationally.
But I'm sure she knew that she did wrong, and is probably feeling plenty disappointed in herself as it is.

But again, you are not wrong. Just maybe a little harsh.

My two cents.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## muumi (Oct 17, 2011)

Actually, I would say, that throwing out the implications that everyone saw it, knows about it and won't forget it etc. is quite unnecessary, and I wouldn't be surprised if it unnerved her to a degree that she may be questioning herself quite seriously.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Rascaholic (Oct 4, 2010)

Nice email. You were open and honest without being aggressive. You stated your case, gave an example with the other horse, and gave the kid an easy way to turn it around. What more can you do?


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## Cacowgirl (Feb 19, 2011)

I think it is a very compassionate letter & let's her know that she is forgiven ,but must apoligize for her (bad) actions & to the adults that vouch for her. I know 16 yr. old girls can be quite emotional & there could be other things going on in her life also. Hope you hear something soon.


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## csimkunas6 (Apr 18, 2010)

I think it was well written. Looking at it in your eyes, it is your horse, and you have the right to say anything about your horse, and if you like how someone is treating your horse. But thats just my opinion. Good Luck with everything!


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## CecilliaB (Jan 21, 2010)

Your way nicer then I would be. I don't care how tired or PO'd you are you don't take it out on the horse and she should of been there taking care of him right along side you.

Crying at a show? Seriously? You win some, you lose some pull up your big girl panties do your best and take what ya learn from every show. She had a great test and then a not so great one, big dealio. My gelding rarely pee's at shows. He is usually wonderful and consistent but one show he just plain sucked. Got him home, he went in his stall and pee'd the atlantic ocean LOL. 

I cannot STAND people who put winning before quality horsemanship. In my mind they are missing the very foundation of a good horse person.


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## Ripper (Apr 1, 2012)

Talk to the parents.

You are dealing with them.

A minor can not lease anything legally.


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## Joidigm (May 8, 2012)

If I acted like that I am pretty sure my instructor would walk into the show arena and haul my **** off her horse, no if's and's or but's. :lol::-|


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## muumi (Oct 17, 2011)

Oh dear! Seems I'm a bit of a softy compared to these other folk. 

Doesn't matter. The point is, she is obviously avoiding you because she feels like crap, so the only thing you can do is give her time, and she will get over it or not.

The only alternative, is to phone the parents.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kait18 (Oct 11, 2011)

i think the letter was great but i also think it was redundant for a teenager. she knows she did wrong already and mentioning it once in the letter would have been suffice. and telling her that everyone will remember it for a long time was probably a big killer... depending on what her emotions are at the moment that line could make her want to stop riding forever...

HOWEVER!!!! as owner of the horse i do not think you were wrong in sending the letter and think you handled it extremely well. i would have been ****ed myself and would have set things straight before loading the horse in the trailer.

i would call the parents and just make sure she is ok and not mention the incident if they don't bring it up and ask politely when she will be coming to the barn as pony misses her.. i think even after an episode like that the horse wont completely have lost faith in her and that you should really let her know that forgiveness is easy to come by.

good luck hope you hear from her soon


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## usandpets (Jan 1, 2011)

We can only speculate as to what's going on with her. At 16, there are a lot of hormones running through her. She probably is very emotional. She might feel like she needs to please you or her parents and feels like she failed. Since she did great at the one test, she might be getting down on herself for her last test. Who knows?

I think your email was fine but I would have put a couple things differently. Instead of saying that we need to chat, I would have said I just would like to talk to you. You mean well but it puts it in a different connotation. Instead of it sounding like a demand or that she has to do it, it'll be more friendly and less aggressive. Same with the ending. Instead of we'll talk soon, could have put please call me. 

I would give her some time off, maybe another week. Send her another email or text but keep it short and friendly. "Hey. I haven't heard from you for a while. How are things going? I'm just concerned about you. (Horse) misses you and so do I. Could you give me a call?"

When you do talk to her, tell how impressed you were with how well she did in her first test. Explain that it was just a long weekend and by the third test, the horse was pooped out. I wouldn't get into what she did wrong right away, at least not the first couple times you talk with her. I think you explained it well enough in your email. After you get to talking with her again for a while, then you could bring up and ask if she understands what you said in the email. 

Like I said earlier, I think she's just down on herself for the whole ordeal.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## KelliB (May 7, 2012)

Just realized I was 16 6 years ago made me sad... It felt like it wasn't thaaat long ago... I'm still an emotional teenager at heart haha 

Anyways!!! I think the letter was good. I also agree with usandpets, build her up a little. She probably is really worried about impressing everyone and needs reassurance that when she wasn't upset she was doing very well. Be like her mentor, it'll do her a lot of good in the end. Explain to her how to handle the situation next time and reassure her she can come talk to you whenever she has a problem that's going to push her to that point again and you will do whatever you can to help her not only for the pony but for her as well. 

I'm sorry you're going through this. You are handling it a lot better than most. Pretty sure most people would have snatched the horse away from her. You're actually trying to help. I admire that.


Good luck!


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## Meatos (Apr 30, 2012)

Sorry to hear you're going through this. The email was a bit long and I agree that the part about the horse and community not forgetting the girl's behaviour for a long time would be a bit painful to read and cause her to shut down. However, since you are the owner I totally understand your viewpoint and I agree that she needs to put on her big girl panties and get in touch with you to talk about what's going on in her head. Her reaction makes me think that something could be going on in her personal life that is causing additional stress and she just doesn't know how to deal. 

I think in most of the email, you were extremely sensitive and caring and hopefully she can find a second to recognise that and be less fearful of contacting you.

If you don't hear anything for a few days, I would contact the parents. You've certainly done your part trying to deal with this girl directly. She is being immature, would just be nice to be able to find out WHY (aside from being a 16 year old girl, of course).


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## cakemom (Jul 4, 2010)

I can tell you that your letter was no harsher than our trainer would have sent out to my 13 year old. If she's old enough to ride and make the decision to mistreat the horse then she's old enough to realize the implications of her actions. Early on children need to realize that their actions are watched and judged, that's life. 
Better to ride in with honor and out with pride than to ride in with attitude and out with ribbons...no 60 c ribbon is worth a horse being poorly treated.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## xJumperx (Feb 19, 2012)

Lot nicer than me  If I saw that crap, she'd be off the horse, she'd be done leasing, and I'd be done talking to her. 16 or not, that is no reason to snatch and yank at a horse like that. Talk about bad horsemanship. I'd kill her, figuratively. Maybe.


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## trailhorserider (Oct 13, 2009)

I would imagine she had high hopes (especially after the first successful test) and got frustrated when the last test fell apart. Not that it's an excuse. It isn't. 

But I'm just saying from her actions I would bet she is feeling very guilty and wondering if she should even keep riding at this point. That is how I would read the crying and avoidance. That is exactly what I would do if I was in her situation. Sometimes things are just too painful emotionally to talk about so you avoid talking about it.


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## DressageDreamer (Feb 29, 2012)

I am wellllllllll over 16 years old and doing training level with my horse. My instructor does not allow the use of spurs at this level in her barn. I must agree, especially with such a young rider that is learning herself. If the rider is seasoned and training a new horse to do training level, that is one thing. BUT, if the rider is still learning as well as the horse, I don't feel spurs should be allowed. 

As far as your letter to her, it was good. However, as others have pointed out, telling her that the horse community is small (which it is) and that everyone will remember for a long time, has probably made her feel even worse about how she acted. I think she cried because she knew she messed up and knew that she was going to be reprimanded. Nothing helps postpone a butt chewing like a few tears!! Teenagers can be manipulative. She doesn't want to face you because she is scared and ashamed. I would call the parents. If she wants to lease the horse, then she needs to talk with you AND her parents. If not, then find someone else to lease the horse.

OK that was my two cents worth


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## Remy410 (Nov 7, 2011)

She's probably very embarrassed by her actions and now doesn't want to face you in person. Or, as teenagers are always right (eye roll) she may in some way think that you've been unjust in your reprimand. I have a 15 year old daughter and boy do they love the drama.......

I would just back off for a bit and let her come to you. Contact her parents if there's a concern over whether or not the lease will continue.


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

NeuroticMare said:


> When she came out of the ring I started to softly discuss what we never do to our horses, but she said "don't" and started crying and rode back to the barn alone.


I would have held the horse, ordered her to dismount, and ended the lease on the spot.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I agree with Muumi that the letter was a bit too long and complex for a girl of that age. It's easy to overestimate the emotional maturity of someone that age because they often do behave very maturely, but when things get hard, they are not equipped to respond as yout thought they would.

I think I might have waited and said nothing , to see if the girl would not come out on her own and make an apology, which would be very theraputic to her and build her self esteem, such that it wouldn't fall apart in the ring and come to a tantrum on horseback.

Guess I am a softy, too.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

I think the letter was toooooo direct. It sounded more like a post on here where we see someone beating their horse and we say "Hey no this is everything I saw wrong!"

Yes it's bad to take anger out on the horse, he didn't deserve that. I would have gone with a softer approach that had an underlying "not okay" vibe to it.

It sounds like she was really frustrated with your boy, and maybe they've been hving some trouble. Do you know her trainer and has she been giving you updates?

I'm not going to lie, once I got ****ed at this horse for stealing my reins and I lost my cool and made her trot her head off and I was really harsh with her mouth. Back when I was stupid and immature. Now I know better, but maybe there's something else going on. Or maybe it was one of those one-thing-sucks-after-another days and she lost it. 

It is your horse, and you have a right to be upset that your horse wasn't taken care of properly. Just I would have changed the delivery.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Raise your hand if you have never lost your temper and been a bit harsh with hand or whip or spur?


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

tinyliny said:


> Raise your hand if you have never lost your temper and been a bit harsh with hand or whip or spur?


 Of course but not in public at a show on a horse that I do not own. If I was the parent of this teenager, I would want to be informed of my kid's behaviour so I could end that crap immediately. Sorry, but I don't tolerate poor sportsmanship and tantrums, it nauseates me. OP, it's not your problem, tell her parents. If they don't deal with it, you'll see that behaviour again.


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

tinyliny said:


> Raise your hand if you have never lost your temper and been a bit harsh with hand or whip or spur?


Yes, and especially when I was 16. My concern would be that you cannot be in someone elses mind and understand their motivations, and if this girl was willing to do that at a show, in public - how might she behave in private? 


OP I'd talk to her parents. I think the girl is either being stubborn, or embarrassed, either way - I don't think she is going to talk to you about it.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Sure, 16 year old kids can be emotional blah blah blah but they are not stupid. Most of them are pretty smart so she understood the email just fine. And if she didn't she better get a clue and quickly.

I had a little sympathy for her bad day until reading spur lumps and tore up mouth. All my "poor baby had a bad day" dissolved into "poor horse has a brat on board". 

I would NOT appreciate anyone treating one of my horses in such a manner. She needs to pull her big girl panties on and deal with a less than perfect score and you put your iron panties on and dealt with it - good for you. I would tell her that no one would treat my horse that way and if she couldn't treat him right and FAIRLY she would not be leasing! Hope your boy is good to go quickly - give him a hug from me and The Biscuit. Rough treatment they don't forget - it took me months and months to make a breakthrough with Biscuit after buying him because he was roughly treated.:evil:


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## Chiilaa (Aug 12, 2010)

I don't think the letter was over the top for a 16 year old.

Social constructivism tells us that kids learn through interaction, both with their peers and with adults. Adults, in this world, model how behaviour is expected. We also model how to use our knowledge, and how to think, but in this case I will stick to behaviour and maturity. We show kids how to react in all sorts of situations, good bad AND ugly. By treating her with respect and offering her a mature, heartfelt response, I think the OP has modeled beautifully how we expect an adult to behave. Kids then take this model they are shown, and "test" it on their peers. You see it from babies to adults - think about two kids playing "house" - they are emulating the behaviour adults have modeled to them.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I should have added that if the girl does not own up and apologize pretty quickly that you should talk to the parents. I don't think this should go undealt with, but I only suggested to give her a bit of time to do it on her own. 
I know that if I let my son stew on things a bit, he almost invariably came and apologized to me, which gave him a sense of self respect that my lecturing him did not.


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## Prinella (Jul 12, 2011)

That she went to the extent of spur lumps and a wounded mouth worries me. As has been stated show me a person that's never had a bad day and I'll show you a liar. 

I think you did the right thing and yes she'll be stressing about it. I think you need to involve the parents so they know what's going on. Then when you chat to her offer to allow her parents alongIf you've book Christina can you make sure Olivia isn't coming she was a no show last week. Yes I have a 1 o click tomorrow.

I don't think I have time for other lessons I have 3 on tuesday and want to ride my own horses. Uni Wednesday and Friday. That leaves me Monday and some of Thursday to do assignments washing and everything else and i want to start doing a day here and there at schools.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Snizard93 (Oct 12, 2011)

I am 18 years old, so I can remember well what I was like at 16! I think she is feeling really bad and guilty about what she did to the pony, I think it might have been one of those split second decisions, that she now really regrets.

If I got that email at the age of 16 I would be overwhelmed I think. I think she just needs time to get over what happened, she's probably guilty and embarassed. 

However, as the owner of the pony I totally see where you are coming from!


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## thesilverspear (Aug 20, 2009)

Tough one, Neurotic Mare. I remember being an emotional, reactive 16-year old and flew off the handle at my horse when I shouldn't have. It was my own horse, though, and there were no marks on her (this was mostly me waving the lead rope at her and shouting, but not making contact) and no ill-effects later and there wasn't anyone else around. But still, I felt absolutely horrible afterwards. Your lessee probably knows she royally screwed up, feels completely guilty and embarrassed and awful for what she did to the horse, and that's why she is avoiding you.

The email is sent but I suppose another way to have worded it would be to have a clear sentence or two about what she did to the horse and why it was wrong but not gone on for a while about the long memories of horses. That's the sort of lecture that is best delivered in person. 

Still, at this point she does need to man up and talk to you. And you need to talk to her parents. Especially as she did cause a wee bit of physical harm to your horse and her parents can maybe work with her on anger management as well as being in the best position to talk to her about why she was so frustrated at the show, her riding goals, etc.


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## Lexiie (Nov 14, 2011)

I'm 16, and I lease a horse too
Honestly, I think you should call her parents.
Although I see my horse's owner (my trainer and BO) as my second mom so I'd listen to her no matter what, sometimes kids just have more respect for their parents

Maybe she's scared you'll be mad at her and is afraid to read what you've been sending her.
Could you call her parents and tell them she hasn't been responding and you'd like to talk to her?


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Okay I re-read the letter and I disagree with my initial thought.

Seriously it was a really different tone when I read it the second time. It had a lot of compassion and it explained things and made her feel a little guilty too.

She needs to talk to you, this is childish. I know if I ever did that to my trainer's horse I would be spanked with the crop whip and she'd take my bridle away and make me ride in a halter and probably bareback too. Poor horse.. grr. 

She's had enough time to come clean. I would call her and if she refuses to talk, then talk to her parents. It's not okay to hide away in a corner feeling sorry for yourself and not take account of her actions.


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## MHFoundation Quarters (Feb 23, 2011)

I think it was well written and frankly much more nice & forgiving than I'd have been. A 16 year old can handle more than some give them credit for. She needs to take responsibility and figure out how to make it right instead of avoiding it. At 16, I had been showing for over 10 years, still had a teenager attitude of course and did have "tantrums" after a bad ride but NEVER did I take it out on my horses. My mom was my trainer and I assure you, had I behaved like that, she'd no doubt have marched into the ring, pulled me off the horse and loaded up. 

In that situation, I'd most likely have given her a second chance BUT with the attitude afterwards not wanting to talk about it ("Don't") and her not stepping up to the plate and being responsible in discussing the situation, I'd be much less inclined.


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

tinyliny said:


> Raise your hand if you have never lost your temper and been a bit harsh with hand or whip or spur?


That's not the point.

The point is that by not addressing her behavior swiftly and harshly, she's not going to learn anything other than "I got away with it".

The softies in this thread are wrong. This girl needs a swift kick in the behind (figuratively) to learn that what she did is not acceptable.


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## chandra1313 (Jul 12, 2011)

I think you are completely right in your dissappointment but that email is way to long for a 16yr old. Most 16yr olds are either going to get angry at you and not hear you or their confidence is going to sink and they can't hear you either. 
You didn't want to sit in the car with her for three hours with what you thought would be a uncomfortable ride= she doesn't want to talk to you because she knows you are dissappointed. We all like to avoid confrontation. 
I personally love to get teenagers alone in a car lol they have no where to run. Maybe you should have not said anything get the horse loaded and on the way home with her, opened the lines of communication with her to find out where her head was in the show, was she mad at the horse was she mad at herself then guide her through how to calm herself and not hurt your horse. Just my opinion. I know it had to be hard watching your horse being treated badly.
I think now its time to talk to the parents by the way and see if they can help you with her.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

I think the email had the right tone...compassion and understanding, yet she did explain the consequences. I don't think it was too long for a 16 year old - at least not for the 16 year olds I have known. My kids were pretty darn smart at 16 and so are my nieces and nephews even if they can be pills. 

Looks to me like she is a brat and has gotten away with that behavior - kinda like my daughter when she was two and three. Morgan thought if she covered her eyes and didn't see me that I couldn't see her. :shock::shock: She is avoiding you so she doesn't have to deal with it. That is fine if it is her own horse and she isn't your student that you are being paid to train her and leasing her YOUR horse. 

I would call her parents. She is behaving in a way that can also be construed as arrogant. That seems to be the norm for loads of young folks these days. Tell the parents you would like to have a meeting with them and the student. Don't be surprised if parents want to smooth over it and make everything just ducky for Muffin without having to actually discuss it.

On the other hand you may get a parent that is well aware that Muffin is a pill and a brat and make sure she gets to said meeting and listens up. Best of luck with this - depending on their reaction would be the determining factor on whether I would retain her as a client. I could have handled the bratty sulky ****iness (I am not the mom of three kids for nothing) but rough treatment of horses will get someone drop kicked for a field goal from QOS:-x


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## NeuroticMare (Jan 8, 2012)

Thanks for your responses everyone, it gave me a lot to think about and made me feel a lot better about the situation. I am not perfect, I'm a younger adult and not mature for my age even, so these things are over my head a bit. I am not her trainer (or even a trainer at all), or even show the same discipline as her so all of this is somewhat new to me as well!

I did finally hear from her this morning. She got behind in school and said she was working with a tutor and her parents had limited her phone and internet access. Her father was out of the country (he usually deals with all the horse stuff) and just returned. She did apologize profusely and said she would never do anything to intentionally hurt him, that she lost her head and she feels really bad. She also thanked me for taking such good care of him.

We'll talk more in person when she's at the barn next. She had to cancel her lesson tomorrow because of school work (this I know is true, she is in the national honor society and in all advance placement classes, very smart girl). 

I am happy it looks like things will work out, I'm glad for her sake and mine. My gelding would not be difficult to lease out to someone else, but I do enjoy his rider now, and her reaction at the show is not the norm.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Hope it all gets resolved to everyone's satisfaction...especially your horse! This may have been a hard lesson for her and I sure hope, for her sake, that she come away with some life lessons on good sportsmanship and control of her emotions when things sometimes don't go as planned. Life is full of ups and downs and curve balls. How one handles problems makes a huge difference in the way people perceive them.


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

tinyliny said:


> I agree with Muumi that the letter was a bit too long and complex for a girl of that age. It's easy to overestimate the emotional maturity of someone that age because they often do behave very maturely, but when things get hard, they are not equipped to respond as yout thought they would.


I'm fifteen, and honestly, this letter is exactly what I would have needed (and deserved) after doing something like that. If she doesn't understand it, it's because she's trying to mitigate it, not because she's truly trying to understand the implications of what she did and can't figure it out. She needs to grow up and face her problems. Cutting you short with the haughty "Don't!" and leaving you with the horse was inexcusable. I would have ended the lease right then and there.


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## nvr2many (Jan 18, 2011)

AlexS said:


> Yes, and especially when I was 16. My concern would be that you cannot be in someone elses mind and understand their motivations, and if this girl was willing to do that at a show, in public - how might she behave in private?
> 
> 
> OP I'd talk to her parents. I think the girl is either being stubborn, or embarrassed, either way - I don't think she is going to talk to you about it.


I too think, if she would do this at a show, in public, and with you there, what would she do in private! I would worry as to how my boy was being treated behind closed doors so to speak. I would also bet, this is not the first time this has happened.

Oh and to add: How many times have you heard a teenager complain that they are being treated like a baby, or a kid?? Well, you are treating her like and pre-adult that she is and IMO that is GOOD!


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

nvr2many said:


> I too think, if she would do this at a show, in public, and with you there, what would she do in private! I would worry as to how my boy was being treated behind closed doors so to speak. I would also bet, this is not the first time this has happened.


 I'm going to respectfully disagree with this and say that she was worked up, embarrassed, and knew she had a crowd and a judge watching a test where neither of them were looking so hot. It was NOT acceptable....however, she was under a lot of pressure and it doesn't sound like it's something she does regularly.


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## nvr2many (Jan 18, 2011)

equiniphile said:


> I'm going to respectfully disagree with this and say that she was worked up, embarrassed, and knew she had a crowd and a judge watching a test where neither of them were looking so hot. It was NOT acceptable....however, she was under a lot of pressure and it doesn't sound like it's something she does regularly.


Your probably right. Looks like I spoke too soon before getting to the last page. I am glad that it all worked out. Hard to tell with just speculation. Sounds like she is one of the good ones. There are so many that are not!!! Im glad she got a hold of you and all will be worked out!! YAY!


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I never said that the owner did not have the right to take disciplinary measures. I only said that often the less said the better. Sometimes a long lecture by a parent gets the child so much on the defensive that they forget that it is THEY who are in the wrong and who bear the responsibility of making amends. After a long berating lecture (not that the letter was berating, it wasn't ), teens will often feel that they have sufferred punishment enough and lose the feeling that that owe the parent/teacher/mentor an apology. 

In any case, I am so glad that things worked out, and all in all, your patience is just marvelous. I think I would have been hard pressed to sit three hours with a pouting teen, even though I myself advocated for the "wait and see" approach. I am tempermental myself, so would probably just rant. It's just that I usually regret it when I DO rant.


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## maura (Nov 21, 2009)

I don't know if this is helpful or not, but I once had a student lose it like this in the ring at a show.

Great kid, great student, went on to do wonderful things as a rider and horsewoman, but had a temper, got frustrated and took it out on the horse, spurring and yanking on the mouth in a pure temper fit and made a little scene in the ring.

I turned to the parent and said "I think her show's over. Do you have a problem with that?" Parent shook their head, clearly relieved I was going to handle it. 

Met the kid coming out of the gate and walked back to the trailer with her. Told her that the show was over for and she was going home, that she had embarassed me and herself, and that we would work on the horse's training issues at home, but we would not be showing again until she could control herself. 

And walked away. 

This worked because this kid was very serious about her riding and very motivated. The idea that I was unhappy with her was very upsetting to her.
Another kid, I might have had to set down harder and longer. (I found out later this incident was legion in the barn, so no one after that lost their temper in the ring.)

So, I think the OP did the right thing by addressing the behavior. Since I didn't see the incident, and don't know the personality of leasor, I'm going to have to trust that OP judged the situation correctly.


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## Samstead (Dec 13, 2011)

Cacowgirl said:


> I think it is a very compassionate letter & let's her know that she is forgiven ,but must apoligize for her (bad) actions & to the adults that vouch for her. I know 16 yr. old girls can be quite emotional & there could be other things going on in her life also. Hope you hear something soon.


 I agree it doesn't seem like too long ago that I was 16, pretty emotional time for every girl and alot of people I knew had other stuff going on then. I think when she said "Don't" and cried it was because she knew what she'd done and felt bad enough and didn't want the issue lingered on and feels like you are with all the texts and calls. That said she does need to bite the bullet and talk to you about and apologize to those affected by it (maybe with a carrot to pony?)


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## hberrie (Apr 28, 2012)

i had to have almost the same talk with my daughter. She loves our horse but I noticed that whenever she is unsure(especially around other more experienced girls her age) she would become very harsh and agressive with the horse. I had to nip it in the bud quick before it became a very bad habit. Girls especially can become very angry when embaressed.


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## Samstead (Dec 13, 2011)

NeuroticMare said:


> Thanks for your responses everyone, it gave me a lot to think about and made me feel a lot better about the situation. I am not perfect, I'm a younger adult and not mature for my age even, so these things are over my head a bit. I am not her trainer (or even a trainer at all), or even show the same discipline as her so all of this is somewhat new to me as well!
> 
> I did finally hear from her this morning. She got behind in school and said she was working with a tutor and her parents had limited her phone and internet access. Her father was out of the country (he usually deals with all the horse stuff) and just returned. She did apologize profusely and said she would never do anything to intentionally hurt him, that she lost her head and she feels really bad. She also thanked me for taking such good care of him.
> 
> ...


 I bet her reaction in the ring was partly due being behind in school. That plus the stress of a show and it not going well would drive any 16 yer old girl crazy!


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

hberrie said:


> i had to have almost the same talk with my daughter. She loves our horse but I noticed that whenever she is unsure(especially around other more experienced girls her age) she would become very harsh and agressive with the horse. I had to nip it in the bud quick before it became a very bad habit. Girls especially can become very angry when embaressed.


Yep, that'll do it. Trying to look perfect infront of your pals and your horse not listen is "embarrassing" and can trigger angry "This is your fault, stupid horse" responses.


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## CookieCrumbs (Apr 24, 2012)

I think you handled that Perfectly!


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## Army wife (Apr 29, 2012)

I think you were dead on in your letter. You are teaching her things that real life would teach her a lot harder!! Like the fact that people do watch you and judge you. You are never out of anyones sight. That is your horse, and you have the right to say whatever you want about the way she treats him. I'm glad that she got your messages loud and clear, now to see if they really sank in. Good luck, hope your horse is healed physically and mentally/emotionally.


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

equiniphile said:


> I'm fifteen, and honestly, this letter is exactly what I would have needed (and deserved) after doing something like that. If she doesn't understand it, it's because she's trying to mitigate it, not because she's truly trying to understand the implications of what she did and can't figure it out. She needs to grow up and face her problems. Cutting you short with the haughty "Don't!" and leaving you with the horse was inexcusable. I would have ended the lease right then and there.


Are you sure you're only 15?:wink:


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## Live2Ride15 (Feb 22, 2012)

I agree with some of the other posters 16 year olds can handle more than we give them credit for, I am 15 and I and many 16yo that I know could get that email and understand it and not be overwhelmed by it.

OP I am glad everything looks to be working out!!


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

natisha said:


> Are you sure you're only 15?:wink:


 LOL yep, just had my birthday ;-)


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## Cacowgirl (Feb 19, 2011)

So glad this is getting resolved. How is the horse doing?


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## KaylaMarie96 (Dec 5, 2011)

I am 16 and I understood the email completely. I will tell you right now, I would have walked into that arena and made her get off my horse and ended the lease right then and there. You were not too harsh at all! It sounds like this girl probably has some issues in her life she needs to work through and unfortunately she took it out on the horse. I'm sorry you are going through all this and I hope you can talk to this girl and help her out.


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## myhorsesonador (Jun 21, 2009)

I think you did the right thing. I know some people don't think you should have said some of those things, but I live in a small town, so I know what you were talking about. She just made a name for herself, and sadly word travels fast.


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## Palomine (Oct 30, 2010)

16 years old not that long ago were getting married, raising family and settling in the West, and marching off to war also.

In many parts of the world? They still do.

Coddling kids accomplishes nothing but make them weak.

You have seen what she will do, in public. What do you think she does in private?

Your letter wasn't harsh enough, and should have included the sentence "I am cancelling the lease".

If she doesn't understand consequences? She darn sure needs to.


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## NeuroticMare (Jan 8, 2012)

Cacowgirl said:


> So glad this is getting resolved. How is the horse doing?


He is doing well, we both gave him a week off, and on Tuesday he had the vet out for dental work (not because of what happened, he has a weird mouth and gets floated every 6 months to control some hooks and waves he gets). I looked in his mouth while he was sedated and had the speculum in there and his cheeks, lips and right inside are completely healed. I showed vet his bridle and he said he could almost go up a size on his loose ring/french link, but he is a 14.3hh horse already in a 6" bit, I don't even know where to look for a 6.25? But I am looking! He is so funny, he has a wide, but short head. Oversized browband and 6" bit, with horse size crown piece, pony cheek pieces and cob noseband. 

Mentally, he is no worse for wear. He is such a kind soul, always has been. I took him for a light hack down the road yesterday to see how he was faring and he was happy as a clam.


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