# Skinny horses, authorities don't care?



## TeeBee

There is a woman in my area with SEVERAL underweight horses. She has, for years, claimed them to be rescues, but what the non-horse-savvy community fails to realize is that the conditions she is keeping these horses in is NOT suitable for ANY horse, let alone ones that need rehabilitation. A metro officer will visit her place after complaints, and she will say, "Oh, this is a rescue. I just got him." Not only is that a lie, but even if it were true, she doesn't have the knowledge, facilities, or finances to rehabilitate these horses. They're in AWFUL condition. AND, she uses them for the public to ride. She allows "customers" to ride these skinny horses in an open field with other loose horses ... perhaps to someone who doesn't know a lick about the equine world that doesn't seem that big of a deal. But to people with experience and knowledge, we see that she is putting these customers at risk beyond their understanding. She is a woman with good intentions, but no knowledge of how to follow through and help the horses. In my opinion, after being complained on for YEARS, I think the authorities should make her provide proof that she's producing results from these "rescues". This woman used to run a public riding stable and they gave a news team (who had been told the horses were neglected by several people) some bullcrap about all of those horses being rescues. Some of those horses belonged to friends of mine and looked perfectly fine when they went in. After a few months their conditions deteriorated severely and they removed them from the stable. Now, the horses are back to normal (because they're gone out of that hell-hole). I was there when they put a customer on a skinny horse and the horse went down and had to get euthanized later. He was too skinny and malnourished to go on the trail, but they were using him anyway to make money. However local authorities claimed the stable was "up to par" upon their investigation.

As of late, the woman has been 'evicted' from the riding stable and is now keeping the horses at her own personal property. People still pay for rides there, and her young sons "run the show" without adult supervision while she's at work at the Post Office.

What would you do? I've forwarded some photos and information to a few different people and even had a friend of mine who owns her own stable go out to see. She agrees the horses are in bad shape but couldn't get onto the property to investigate further.


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## Beauseant

TeeBee said:


> She allows "customers" to ride these skinny horses in an open field with other loose horses ... perhaps to someone who doesn't know a lick about the equine world that doesn't seem that big of a deal.


Even if I didn't know a lick about the equine world, I would STILL know that that IS A VERY VERY big deal.

Since she is dealing with the public in that she is selling a service, isn't there an authority that oversees that?

You know, like how the state health inspector inspects restaurants for the health and safety of the public....


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## Poco1220

Maube try the Better Business Bureau?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Speed Racer

Child Protective Services would probably like to hear about it, too. 

Contact the local labor board and let them know that someone is operating a business without a license, insurance, and using child labor. 

There's more than one way to get someone to take notice.


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## Darrin

We recently had a similar thing happen out this way. Cops were called multiple times and nothing happened. The police are busy and often know no more about horses then anyone else so they take her word at face value. Took getting the humane society involved to get things done in the case out here.


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## TeeBee

I have contacted the Humane Society as well as Metro Animal Services, which is the "authority" when it comes to removing the horses. They told me, "Oh, she just got these horses from a neglectful situation a few months ago" and I politely informed them that is a load of bullcrap. I have also contacted a few of my friends and a rescue that my friend suggested. The person who owns the rescue is sort of turning this into a nightmare... she is trying to involve my vet, whose father owns the place where I board, and posted something on her facebook page (which has 5000+ friends) about how she got into a discussion with him about slaughter, and how he inadvertedly supported it, and she said she would find a new vet if she (the vet) feels this way as well (I can clarify in detail if anyone wants...it's a whole different discussion). This woman has also contacted PETA. :shock: BUT, she did get in touch with the HSUS (Humane Society of the US). There's a lot being done ... lots of people have been contacted.


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## TeeBee

I've decided to go ahead and post pictures of one of the horses I saw there ... he is a stud and based on his teeth he's around 5. He was locked in a stall with no hay. According to her son, they've had him for a year. If they seize the horses and I find a place, I want to take him. I may just outright offer them $100 for him. He'll need a TON of weight before I even THINK about gelding him...


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## Speed Racer

Neither PETA nor HSUS will involve themselves if there's no media opportunity for them. HSUS and PETA are too much alike for me to want to contact either of them.


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## TeeBee

Speed Racer said:


> Neither PETA nor HSUS will involve themselves if there's no media opportunity for them. HSUS and PETA are too much alike for me to want to contact either of them.


I've contacted the media but I am not the one who contacted PETA or HSUS nor do I really condone them being contacted. At this point, though, I am mostly concerned about getting the horses removed from that property. I think it should be escalated in stages though, not just outright contacting every org under the sun ... especially one like PETA.


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## mls

TeeBee said:


> I've decided to go ahead and post pictures of one of the horses I saw there ... he is a stud and based on his teeth he's around 5. He was locked in a stall with no hay. According to her son, they've had him for a year. If they seize the horses and I find a place, I want to take him. I may just outright offer them $100 for him. He'll need a TON of weight before I even THINK about gelding him...


Well - he is very thin. I am curious though as to why his coat shines? The shine typically goes prior to the weight loss.

As far as the no hay in the stall - after they finish eating - there usually isn't. Not defending anyone - simply stating a fact.


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## TeeBee

mls said:


> Well - he is very thin. I am curious though as to why his coat shines? The shine typically goes prior to the weight loss.
> 
> As far as the no hay in the stall - after they finish eating - there usually isn't. Not defending anyone - simply stating a fact.


His coat shines? I saw the horse in person and his coat was very rough and almost "hard". I don't know how to describe it. These photos were taken on my cell phone.

They didn't have any hay at the facility. I asked the boy if I could give him some hay, and they said they didn't have any. The only hay there belonged to someone else (boarders, I think).


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## ilovemyPhillip

Oh dear, he's skinny. About the weight of my old guy, who wont be with us much longer.  good luck.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## AlexS

ilovemyPhillip said:


> Oh dear, he's skinny. About the weight of my old guy, who wont be with us much longer.  good luck.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Why does 'your old guy' look like that? And he likely will not be around for much longer, if you don't feed him he will slowly starve to death!


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## reiningfan

ilovemyPhillip said:


> Oh dear, he's skinny. About the weight of my old guy, who wont be with us much longer.  good luck.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 
That is very disturbing. What does your vet say is wrong with him? Maybe you should be getting him a senior feed and getting the weight back on.


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## Golden Horse

The horse pictured is beyond thin, he is emaciated, how can anyone defend that? I doubt very much if his coat actually shines, good luck in helping him out OP.

As to Ilovemyphilip, if you have a horse who looks the same then maybe his time is now?


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## mbender

Don't let him suffer
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lonestar22

I hope you can get something figured out for that poor boy.

Phillip - I pray you don't say its cause he is old. We kept a good weight on our old guy for a long time. He never was fat, but deffinately not emaciated, and when he would no longer hold weight at all we had him PTS. Hopefully you have enough respect for your horse to do the same.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Alwaysbehind

ilovemyPhillip said:


> Oh dear, he's skinny. About the weight of my old guy, who wont be with us much longer.  good luck.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Posts like this one make me think you just like to have people annoyed with you for the attention it gets you.


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## ChingazMyBoy

Wishing you luck with finding a way to help out these horses & I can only hope that there is a positive outcome. Please keep us updated on your progress in helping with the situation.

Thumbs up for being the one to finally do something about it!


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## Speed Racer

Lonestar22 said:


> Phillip - I pray you don't say its cause he is old.


Old is no excuse. I have a 25 y/o that I have to watch very carefully because he'll get tubby if he's overfed! 

If an older horse is losing weight and it's not their teeth, there's obviously something wrong internally. If you can't afford a diagnostic workup, at least put the poor thing down instead of waiting until he keels over on his own and you have an emergency euth. :?


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## Alwaysbehind

Speed Racer said:


> Old is no excuse. I have a 25 y/o that I have to watch very carefully because he'll get tubby if he's overfed!
> 
> If an older horse is losing weight and it's not their teeth, there's obviously something wrong internally. If you can't afford a diagnostic workup, at least put the poor thing down instead of waiting until he keels over on his own and you have an emergency euth. :?


Why would she do that for an old horse when she was not willing to do any of that for the goat she called her heart goat?


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## mbender

Besides a work up on blood, hopefully she's feeding the poor thing. Some people are very clueless when it comes to feeding. I started a thread just on feeding so that people who are clueless can check it to see what others are feeding.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MHFoundation Quarters

OP - I sincerely hope that something gets done for those poor horses. 

Phillip - as others have said old is no excuse to look like the horse pictured. (You said yours looked in the same condition) He is either not being properly cared for or has underlying issues. Given past posts I've read I would question the former. My old guy will be turning 30 on his next birthday and is in fabulous shape. He requires more frequent dental work and chopped hay but aside from that is an easy keeper even at 29. If your guy is legitimately in the same type of condition as the photo provided, please do the right thing and put him down.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Speed Racer

Alwaysbehind said:


> Why would she do that for an old horse when she was not willing to do any of that for the goat she called her heart goat?


Sigh, I can hope can't I? :-|

Heck, a bullet to the head would be better than letting him waste away to nothing and dying on his own. That's just as much abuse and neglect as anything else. :-x

I can't believe Phillip would even SAY something like that, knowing that all of us are aware of her history and how she treats her animals. Like you, I guess she wants the attention or something. Negative attention is still better than none, right? :?


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## mbender

Here's the thing MH, you are feeding your old horse according to his needs. Phillip either isnt or gave up because he/she feels the animal isnt worth the extra time and money. And that is real sad. Called abuse anyway you slice it.


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## MHFoundation Quarters

I agree MB and in my book there's no excuse to not provide proper care. If you can't financially or aren't willing for whatever the reason may be, find someone who will or put the poor guy out of his misery. *trying very hard to refrain from a rant*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mbender

I know MH, its heart breaking when I see that. I just dont get it.


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## Beauseant

*pulling out my hair*

The horse in the picture is NOT thin, very thin, or even really thin!!!!!!!

It is emaciated!!!! 

I cannot believe that the "authorities" cannot see this....you don't need to be equine savvy to see when an animal is starving. DUH.


As for the Philip person, definately seems like a grab for attention to me. So I won't bother fulfilling her dream.


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## ChingazMyBoy

Speed Racer said:


> Sigh, I can hope can't I? :-|
> 
> Heck, a bullet to the head would be better than letting him waste away to nothing and dying on his own. That's just as much abuse and neglect as anything else. :-x
> 
> I can't believe Phillip would even SAY something like that, knowing that all of us are aware of her history and how she treats her animals. Like you, I guess she wants the attention or something. Negative attention is still better than none, right? :?


Ignoring her history. Let's just hope she has _some_ reasoning for this horse not to be in it's correct weight range. I personally cannot find any excuses for horses to be underweight without any progress or ongoing attempts to help the horse gain the wait.

But I do hope she has a good answer..


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## Equilove

I know this woman personally and have for about 3 years. She is not an evil woman, she is just naive and has false views of what a "rescue" is. In her eyes, she has rescued these horses because they are no longer in the horrible situation they WERE in. For example. The little grey stud was found wandering along the highway. Okay. He is out of that situation. So he is better off, right? Well... yeah, if he had proper care. But she doesn't know how to handle an animal like that, that needs such a commitment. She WANTS to do right by these horses. She isn't sitting back going, "eh, don't think I'll feed today." It's not that all. She wants to feed, but she doesn't have any money to BUY feed. And this is where my problem is with her. I agree she should give a good 15 horses away (which would still leave her with a handful) and she should focus on that small manageable amount. She is in way, way, way, over her head. Things have gotten out of hand, and she knows it - but she doesn't want to give up... one day, she'll realize the biggest help to these animals would be to give them to appropriate homes and stop taking in more than she can handle.


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## Saddlebag

Perhaps let the humane society know that if they don't take proper action that you will be informing the media of their lack of caring. They do survive on public funding and in hard times it starts drying up. This means their jobs. You'd just be adding a little fuel to the fire.


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## AlexS

Equilove, she sounds like a hoarder. I am sure many of us would rescue a lot of horses if we could afford it - the think that stops us is responsibility.


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## Equilove

AlexS said:


> Equilove, she sounds like a hoarder. I am sure many of us would rescue a lot of horses if we could afford it - the think that stops us is responsibility.


Yes that is how I've described her before. Not only does she not have the finances or knowledge, she doesn't have the time. She works a full time job and is almost never home.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Celeste

The emaciated horse pictures show a horse that needs immediate help. He is dying of starvation. In Georgia, the department of agriculture would pick him up. Surely there is somebody that will shut down this insane horse hoarder. Please don't rest until you get somebody to do something. 

Hoarding disorder is a very serious mental disorder. Animal hoarding usually starts in a person who has good intentions. They just get in over their head, and because of their mental disorder, they don't stop taking in more animals. The poor animals suffer for their neglect. Neglect is a criminal and can be prosecuted in most places.


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## Ladytrails

^^This. Hoarders don't ever realize that the animals would be better off with another person who could afford to feed them - their mental condition doesn't allow them to think that. They think they're the only ones who truly love the animals. 

So, an intervention is needed. Give the picture to a vet or a lot of vets in the area and tell them that the horse has been there for months, that the rescue was long ago, and that the son says there's no food for them. And go to the authorities again. Find out who RUNS the authorities in your area and call them and call their community relations/public relations people. Look up the horse breed associations that are popular in your area and see if any of the board members are in your locale - and tell them the story to see if they can reach out to one of their contacts.


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## Celeste

If all that stuff that Ladytrails said fails, I would involve the news media. Embarrassment is a powerful tool. It will get authorities and animal hoarders in gear.


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## Equilove

Remember the little gray stud?

He is now a happy healthy gelding getting started under saddle and up for adoption.


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## themacpack

Equilove said:


> Remember the little gray stud?
> 
> He is now a happy healthy gelding getting started under saddle and up for adoption.


Outstanding update!


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## Speed Racer

Yay! So glad! He's an *adorable* gelding! :clap:


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## Corporal

*Use EVERY Resource to Attack This Problem*

This is NOT the 1st thread re: neglect. We go in circles discussing the same things and the thread is often hijacked. IMO, I would appreciate it if you PM members about off-thread topics. Ppl have to wade through the posts anyway, and it just adds to it. Here’s how I see it:



Darrin said:


> We recently had a similar thing happen out this way. Cops were called multiple times and nothing happened. The police are busy and often know no more about horses then anyone else so they take her word at face value. Took getting the humane society involved to get things done in the case out here.


 *True. Unreliable help.*



TeeBee said:


> I have contacted the Humane Society as well as Metro Animal Services, which is the "authority" when it comes to removing the horses…This woman has also contacted PETA. BUT, she did get in touch with the HSUS (Humane Society of the US). There's a lot being done ... lots of people have been contacted.


 *Unreliable.*



Speed Racer said:


> *Neither PETA nor HSUS will involve themselves if there's no media opportunity for them.* HSUS and PETA are too much alike for me to want to contact either of them.


 *AGREED!*


Beauseant said:


> *pulling out my hair*
> The horse in the picture is NOT thin, very thin, or even really thin!!!!!!!
> It is emaciated!!!!
> I cannot believe that the "authorities" cannot see this....you don't need to be equine savvy to see when an animal is starving. DUH.


 *Unreliable.*



Equilove said:


> I know this woman personally and have for about 3 years. *(She needs to) stop taking in more than she can handle.*


 *Precisely. YOU are her enabler.*


Celeste said:


> If all that stuff that Ladytrails said fails, *I would involve the news media. Embarrassment is a powerful tool. It will get authorities and animal hoarders in gear.*


 *…AND use Facebook, Utube and other net resources. Email pictures to your non-forum or social media friends.* 
The MORE people know about these cases, the more interested they will be. You WILL embarrass authorities without having to get in their faces about it, which the authorities would tune out.


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## nvr2many

mbender said:


> Here's the thing MH, you are feeding your old horse according to his needs. Phillip either isnt or gave up because he/she feels the animal isnt worth the extra time and money. And that is real sad. Called abuse anyway you slice it.


I am not sure about phillips past, but I have to say.............. my animals are worth ALL my money! I would starve before I let them! Actually they eat better than I do!!!!

ADD: oops I realized this thread is old! I did notice the gray stud and OMG! WONDERFUL!


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## Equilove

Corporal said:


> *Precisely. YOU are her enabler.*


Sorry?


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## DRichmond

Whoever successfully intervened for that horse, bless your heart. Are there any updates about the facility and any other at risk horses?


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## Endiku

What a cutie pie! I just love the sweet look on his face. Thank you SO much, Equilove, for the update! Those old pictures of him were just heartbreaking, and seeing him now- healthy, happy, and gelded...well, it just made my day!

Praying that this beautiful little boy will find the perfect forever home! I'd snatch him up in a heartbeat if he were near us. Any news of the others on that farm?


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## Equilove

All horses were seized by the metro police and fostered out. I think a few had to be euthanized over the winter, but a good number made it out. Fortunately there were no others in as horrible shape as the grey stud.


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## Hoofprints in the Sand

Glad to hear the authorities step in. It's so sad when someone has a hoarding problem, my bleeding heart feels bad for them in a way, but at the same time, worse for the poor animals who truly suffered from her addiction. My horse Sandie was actually a rescue from a similar situation...

Animal Abuse: 45 horses seized from convicted abuser - Lodi, OH | Pet-Abuse.Com Animal Cruelty Database


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## Eileen

When was the last time the horse was wormed and was it wormed for tape worm. Has anyone asked this question of the owner before reporting them?


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## Hoofprints in the Sand

Eileen said:


> When was the last time the horse was wormed and was it wormed for tape worm. Has anyone asked this question of the owner before reporting them?


Sorry but if the horse had tapeworms so bad that it made him THAT skinny, then perhaps the owner should have bought some $12 dewormer several months ago and prevented it from happening in the first place. Anyone who would just let it get that bad without keeping up with simple deworming practices isn't really doing a very good job caring for their horses, IMO.


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## Eileen

So true and I have seen owners that do everything right and forget about good worming habits.


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## Saddlebag

While hoarding has been mentioned, in tough financial times, including when the cost of hay goes thro the roof, people will do what they can to get rid of what has become an unwanted horse. Many will tell a kind hearted person a story about drastic measures that will have to be taken if this person doesn't take the horse. Emotional blackmail. It can be difficult to turn an animal away, especially a horse. People have tried this with me but don't get the response they were expecting.


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## Eileen

I wish I had a few hundred acers I would never turn away a horse and I would never turn away a child that could not afford one but would love to have one. My dream had always been to have a ranch for children and adults to come and experience the joy of a horse. If I ever won the power ball that is how my money would be spent.


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## Hoofprints in the Sand

If everyone had the capacity and thought like you the world would be a much better place 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Eileen

When we are traveling the country side and I see all the acerage for sale I day dream about where I would put everything, and how I would set up trails and camping ares, picknic areas No cars allowed no bicycles either all horse ridden or driven. I kind have done this with my farmvill on facebook. All kinds of great things to do with horses.


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## Randella

Great improvement in the little grey stud! He's cute as a button! 

It's sad to say there's people like that in the world. Their hearts are often in the right place, and are unable to see the negative that goes along with their decisions.


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## peppersgirl

AlexS said:


> Why does 'your old guy' look like that? And he likely will not be around for much longer, if you don't feed him he will slowly starve to death!



My first horse(s) were a mare (11 at the time and fat and happy) and an ollllldddd gelding that looking like that horse in the picture. We got two for one because we had to take the gelding with the mare in order to purchase the mare.. the story behind his skinnyness is that he had starved himself when she had been previously sold away from him- hence they HAD to stay together.

Due to his age we had a hell of a time keeping weight on the old boy, and we did what we could to make him gain/keep weight (teethfloating,worming, 24/7 hay (wich didnt help the fat mare lol) senior feed, and calorie additives)...he was not a cheap horse to keep around.. and we had alot of people who called animal control on us over his appearance. We finally put him down when he started to LOSE weight despite our efforts with him. 

get off your self righteous horse and dont be so darn quick to judge! NOT ALL OLD HORSES CAN KEEP WEIGHT!


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## Celeste

The horse in the pictures that started this thread was a young horse. He was dying of starvation due to neglect. There is no excuse for this kind of neglect and nobody feels sorry for the people involved. They should not own horses. 

However, you are correct in that it is often very difficult to keep weight on very old horses with no teeth. Not all skinny horses are neglect cases. When they get so that they are in bad shape regardless of being fed high quality senior feed, there is eventually a time that putting them down is the only humane thing to do.


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## peppersgirl

totally agree with you there celeste.... If you cant afford to feed a horse properly and provide at the very least BASIC care/vet care, you really do not have any business owning a horse.. Just having had experience with an old starved looking horse (and the judgement that goes with it), this post hit a nerve with me.


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## Celeste

I am currently the proud owner of a 30+ year old pony gelding that my kids enjoyed many years ago. It is quite a challenge to keep weight on him. He looks good right now. At one point, he lost a lot of weight and I thought I was going to have to put him down. He is doing better with a locally made senior feed in very large quantities. He earned his retirement by taking care of my kids.


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## Eileen

My first horse looked like he was under weight when I bought him but he wasn't he had a hay belly which pulled down his on his back and his ribs showed through. After a few months of excessive and ridding him he lost the hay belly, put on muscles and no longer looked like he was starving.


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## Eileen

I meant exercise


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## Eileen

not excessive


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## stevenson

Animal control did nothing? That horse is being abused. I would go to a supervisor. Are the pens clean ? water clean and available 24/7? if not try Code Commission.


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## stevenson

i have mulitple aged horses, they are very expensive to feed. some look better than others, a couple look thin, a bit ribby but being fed hay, on pasture for the ones that still have top and bottom teeth and no eye issues, sr feed, a+m for the ones that have dental problems could use some horsie dentures  , so unless a young horse has medical issues there is no excuse for it being skinny bony.


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## SeamusCrimin

Is there any chance of you contacting a local rescue or organisation? They could help bring the matter to authorities or "higher up" people.


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## Cherie

Authorities around here no longer investigate animal neglect. They do not have the money or resources to seize or care for the animals, so they just tell people outright that unless it is clearly a case that would result in felony charges and prison time, they can no longer afford to get involved. The rescues are full, private funds are not available and public taxpayer money has run out. Hay and feed are 3X to 4X higher than 2 years ago and their budget will not let them do anything. They would have to seize, feed and care for the animals involved and they cannot do it. 

They will tell you that you can offer all of the help and feed you want to someone. You can offer to take the animals off of their hands. But, you cannot force anyone to accept your help or suggestions and you cannot trespass if they do not want you there.


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## SunnyMeadeFarm

*Photo History*



mls said:


> Well - he is very thin. I am curious though as to why his coat shines? The shine typically goes prior to the weight loss.
> 
> As far as the no hay in the stall - after they finish eating - there usually isn't. Not defending anyone - simply stating a fact.


Well, I looks like he doesn't have a coat shine, that different than simply the camera catching the light shining through the stall, that just mother nature and hard science, and the hay really should have enough for a stalled horse to graze on all day since horses stomachs are made to be constantly eating. 
---

But anyway, to the original poster, I would suggest this; 
get your camera set to time stamp your photos, all simple compact camera have it, if you don't know how and don't have the camera manual, just Google "how to set a time stamp on a [insert camera model and brand here]" it should come up. 

*1.* Take a picture with the time stamp 

*2.* Then take series of photos over time and print them as evidence that they _are not_ getting rehabilitated, this is solid proof because that time stamp on a camera usually is saved in the photos digital profile and can't be replicated so even if someone claims you put it on yourself, bring along a portable drive, sometimes called a thumb drive, a memory stick... idk what you call it but here's one:








save the pictures from your computer on them, so wherever you are showing these photos you can access the digital ones and put it in the computer and right click the photo to show properties, and it should be saved in the properties and that is not able to be edited. (NOTE: this will only work if your camera is set to the correct date itself) I would Google that as well if you can't figure it out. 

*3.* Contact a ASPCA, HSUS, or any local rescue, show them the photos, emailed or in person, both will show the time stamp directly on the photo. 
Then you will have proof they are not caring for these animals. make sure to showcase the same animals over so they can't say they are different animals!


Hope I Helped! 
Update up with any info.


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## alexis rose

What an improvement on the little stud! I love seeing happy endings!

Shadow was emaciated like he was when I got her.


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