# Tums for ulcers?



## DriftingShadow (Jun 4, 2012)

Hi all!
Drifter has been showing signs that he may be developing ulcers. He fits the type. Worrier, recently moved, girthy, and he's starting to throw fits whenever leg is applied. Vet thought he was a likely candidate and so do I.

Anyways, we are doing a "test" treatment to see if it helps. He told me I could give Drifter tums for a week. If I saw changes, I could look into having him scoped because he more than likely did indeed have ulcers.

Has any one done this before? I think Drifter's dose is going to be 6 tablets 2x/day with his AM and PM feeding if I understood correctly. I will be discussing it more with the vet tomorrow when he comes out, we talked on the phone today.

Just wondering if any one has done a "trial test" like this, and if your horse actually showed improvement if it turned out they indeed have ulcers. Thanks!


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## twiz454 (Sep 3, 2012)

I have not tried that. For ulcers I've used what my vet recommends (cannot remember the name of it, it was pricey though) and pair it with Miracle Clay to protect the stomach lining to prevent future ulcers.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

I cant think why you would buy Tums - you can get lots of non prescription antacids for horses that have a recommended doseage to follow- try Smartpak or Valley Vet to order online if you dont have a local place that sells them. Pro CMC (Absorbine) is one that contains calcium carbonate (same as in Tums) and magnesium
Use it with the Miracle clay - you can order that online too


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## Rachel1786 (Nov 14, 2010)

Unless your horse is very small, I don't think that is enough tums. My horse is about 1,000lbs and she needed 15-20 tums ultra(the 1,000mg ones). I found rantidine(sp?, I use generic zantac) to be very effective at treating them(tums won't treat ulcers, just symptoms) and much cheaper then gastrogard. I also never scope as my vet said it was a waste of money unless I wanted to know the severity, which doesn't effect treatment. My mare has been ulcer free for month, I have her on ulc-r-aid daily to keep them at bay.
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## DriftingShadow (Jun 4, 2012)

So Rachel...I should essentially treat his symptoms with 2000mg/per 100 lbs of his body weight? Vet said same thing you mentioned about only treating symptoms, not cause. But he told me if it does make a difference, than that's a good way to know he has ulcers without paying for a scope. I had scoped drifter a few months back and nothing had showed. So I really don't wanna do it again :/
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## Rachel1786 (Nov 14, 2010)

DriftingShadow said:


> So Rachel...I should essentially treat his symptoms with 2000mg/per 100 lbs of his body weight? Vet said same thing you mentioned about only treating symptoms, not cause. But he told me if it does make a difference, than that's a good way to know he has ulcers without paying for a scope. I had scoped drifter a few months back and nothing had showed. So I really don't wanna do it again :/
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It's been a while since I treated my horse with tums, but I'm pretty sure it was somewhere in that area. Pure aloe juice is also very good, and a few weeks ago I found out paypa juice is also good, my horse had a cut that made her lame and I was worried about giving bute(tares her stomach up every time) My barn manager called her vet(or a knowledgeable friend, not sure) who said paypa juice and it worked great, her ulcer never flared up.


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

If your horse has ulcers and you treat them, you will see a difference in a couple of days. So yes a trial treatment is a good idea. 

I wouldn't pay for a scope for ulcers, it's expensive and only has results if the ulcers are in certain areas. 

I wrote up something about treating ulcers the other day, I am lazy so here's the link. 

http://www.horseforum.com/horse-health/i-think-he-has-ulcers-what-137010/page2/#post1677109


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## Brighteyes (Mar 8, 2009)

I do this! My mare is ulcery. Never scoped (vet said you didn't need it unless you wanted to know severity), but showed symptoms. Girthy, grinding teeth, refusing food, not traveling well, diarrhea. She just got _irritable_ when she was worked hard or trailered somewhere. She is that "type": worried, anxious, hot.


Management changes have helped her a _lot_. She is no longer stalled. She is turned out 24/7 to graze. She also has PSSM, so she is on a low starch/sugar diet that also did _wonders_ for her ulcers. She eats 2 pounds of a high fat/low starch pellet and three pounds of rice bran daily, split into two or three meals. In the morning, she gets 15 crushed Tums. Sometime in the afternoon, either pre-ride (see below) or during her afternoon meal, she gets 15 more.

30 minutes before every ride, I feed her about a quart of alfalfa pellets and 15 crushed (generic) Tums. (Alfalfa is suppose to help ulcers as well and it hides the flavor of the Tums.)

Aloe vera juice can also be added to feed. My horse refused to eat it, so YMMV.

The Tums have helped decrease her symptoms, though I put it more up to changes in turn out and diet. Since crushing little tablets is the most irritating thing in the world, I'm starting U-Guard next month. Hope to see results. :wink:


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

Omaprazole is often prescribed, same as for people and yes it's not cheap. Ranitidine should help but you'll go thro a pile of them. Also whatever grain he is on switch him to oats. Oats are the only thing that will help heal hind gut ulcers. You may also need to consider if he is testing you by displaying some orneriness.


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## DriftingShadow (Jun 4, 2012)

How many x a day did you give the tums? More than twice?
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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

Saddlebag said:


> Omaprazole is often prescribed, same as for people and yes it's not cheap. Ranitidine should help but you'll go thro a pile of them.


It's the opposite way around at least with OTC meds. Omeprazole comes in 20mg pills, and that comes to a massive amount per day. 
Ranitidine is available in 150mg pills and is about 20 pills a day, depending on horse body weight.


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## DriftingShadow (Jun 4, 2012)

I have taken into consideration that it could be a training issue. The first time I had him scoped a while back, some of it was. He has always been girths and had a bad attitude involving anything near his girth area but lately it is sensitive to touch, along with a spot farther back in his belly. The acting up is very unlike him. I thought maybe he had pain somewhere else like his hocks but vet said he was 98% positive it was ulcers. He has never been hot per se, but he is a worrier. He is a sensitive gelding. Has had a lot of problems settling in at the new barn, was moved around a lot prior to me getting him. He is on 24/7 turnout already. He Has never gone off his feed. He gets about 4lbs of strategy split up into 2 feedings--am and pm. He has recently started pawing which he has never done. Is developig an overall just bad attitude. Which isnt drifter. Gut sounds are always loud. Also, he has started to look a little tucked in in his flank area. I am really thinking ulcers, that's why I want to do the trial. Does it sound like ulcers to y'all? Am willing to bring up other possible causes with vet of course, just to rule them out. Keep the advice/insight coming! That's what I love about this place? Just to be clear my vet is involved and has been since my first day with drifter. Just asking for other ideas in case there is something he hasn't thought about that someone on here might have had a similar experience with. Thanks as always y'all!
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## Cowgirl140ty (Jan 7, 2010)

Ranitadine will only treat symptoms. Got a stud in for training who we believed had ulcers. My vet had me put him on ranitadine 10 pills 2x a day for a week. And all his symptoms left. So we treated him for ulcers. We put him on a prescription ulcer guard. I cant remember the exact name. It was $50 a tube. He got one tube a day for a week. And havent had a problem since. I got a whole bottle of ranitadine for $20.
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## DriftingShadow (Jun 4, 2012)

Oh and Alex S- I read your write up, thanks for the link  I have a question though, if I were to treat him using the Ranitidine, do I just treat for 30 days and then stop until he shows signs again? Or would I also need to do maintenance doses?

As far as getting him to take/eat whatever he needs to- that won't be a problem. My vet warned me some horses don't like the taste of tums. Drifter slurped them right up and stood looking in the tack room like, "more?". He's special


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## DriftingShadow (Jun 4, 2012)

Cowgirl140ty said:


> Ranitadine will only treat symptoms. Got a stud in for training who we believed had ulcers. My vet had me put him on ranitadine 10 pills 2x a day for a week. And all his symptoms left. So we treated him for ulcers. We put him on a prescription ulcer guard. I cant remember the exact name. It was $50 a tube. He got one tube a day for a week. And havent had a problem since. I got a whole bottle of ranitadine for $20.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thanks Cowgirl! You answered the post I just added  I guess I will use Ranitadine to see if he acts any better. Drifter weights about 1230 lbs... could I still do the 10 pills 2x/day ? Or would he need a bigger dose? Also, if the trial shows he does have ulcers I will be treating them using ulcer guard or some other such product. i just wanted to see if he actually has them first.


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## Poseidon (Oct 1, 2010)

Pepto-Bismol shows a major difference too. 60ccs twice a day. It's a lot messier than tums, but you will notice a difference. My mare was given Pepto before I could get her ulcer medication and it worked quite well to make her stomach feel better.


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## DriftingShadow (Jun 4, 2012)

Did you give it over food poseidon? Or in an oral injectable like wormer? Worming drifter can be a pain haha
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## Poseidon (Oct 1, 2010)

Just straight like a wormer. Unfortunately, all I could get at the time was a 10cc syringe. _Major_ PITA because she doesn't like things stuck anywhere near her mouth and deworming is always a fight. 

You could try it over food because it does have a slightly mint flavor. She didn't mind the flavor of it, it was just the fact that I was sticking a syringe in her mouth.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

Pepto puts a coating on the lining of the stomach which keeps the acid away and helps the ulcers heal. If you use that with omeprazole which is a proton pump inhibitor and reduces the acid production you should see effects fairly quickly. Ulcerguard is a non prescription source of omeprazole The stuff with calcium or magnesium helps neutralise acid and ranitidine is also a blocker which reduces the amount of acid in the stomach rather than neutralise it


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

Cowgirl140ty said:


> Ranitadine will only treat symptoms. Got a stud in for training who we believed had ulcers. My vet had me put him on ranitadine 10 pills 2x a day for a week. And all his symptoms left. So we treated him for ulcers. We put him on a prescription ulcer guard. I cant remember the exact name. It was $50 a tube. He got one tube a day for a week. And havent had a problem since. I got a whole bottle of ranitadine for $20.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I have not heard of any week long treatment of ulcers - everything I have seen, heard and read says a 28-30 day treatment. 





DriftingShadow said:


> Oh and Alex S- I read your write up, thanks for the link  I have a question though, if I were to treat him using the Ranitidine, do I just treat for 30 days and then stop until he shows signs again? Or would I also need to do maintenance doses?


Just the 30 days, and then you make changes to his life style to try to prevent them from coming back. More forage, more turnout, less stress etc. There's supplements you can feed which are supposed to stop them coming back, Succeed is one of them, but I don't have any personal experience of it. 





DriftingShadow said:


> Drifter weights about 1230 lbs... could I still do the 10 pills 2x/day ? Or would he need a bigger dose?


It's 3mg per 1lb of horse. 
1230 lb horse = 3690mg daily
The Walmart Equate brand is 150mg dosage
3690 / 150 = 25 pills a day.


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## DriftingShadow (Jun 4, 2012)

Thank you alexS. As far as turnout, he is out 24/7. I think he developed ulcers when first moved around, as the timeline I have put together from his past has him changing owners (and barns, herd mates, etc) every 2-3 1/2 months for a year and a half. He is already a worrier and an internalizer type, so I can only imagine the stress created from this.

Now while researching ulcers I've read "no grain". Drifter is on about 4lbs of purina strategy a day due to his inability to keep weight on (hard keeper most definitely). Will that aggravate any ulcers he has? What can I switch it out with? He has never gone off feed, and he still eats incredibly fast. 

I will give the ranitidine tablets you suggested. Thank you!


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

have you tried a senior feed ? tagamet was also used for horses with ulcers.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

You might find this link helpful. I always think that gathering all info and then evaluating it is good


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## DriftingShadow (Jun 4, 2012)

That's how my vet diagnosed him jaydee! Or at least, that's what led to us doing this trial. He was presenting like the last horse, Bucky :/

He is a changed horse after only 3 days on trial so the vet has confirmed ulcers. Now I am just trying to get them under control for drif's sake


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

I've still been feeding grain (or more accurately my BO has) while treating ulcers. My horse would be skin and bones if I did not, I simply cannot take him off grain unless it was a life or death situation.


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## SaddleOnline (Oct 20, 2011)

Someone mentioned Suceed earlier, I have had great success with that as a preventative after healing (it smells super yummy too!) I always have a few extra tubes around when showing/hauling whatever just to be safe. I lucked out and this horse's treat of choice has become the wildberry Tums, after doing an experiment like yours. He also is on Purina Strategy, we had tried switching him to a senior feed so that we might be able to get away with less grain, and it made him super hot and stressed out, which was exactly what we were trying to avoid! We ended up keeping him on the Strategy and Succeed (its really expensive though) I have heard of people trying a scoop of brewer's yeast as an alternative, as it helps balance out the PH of the stomach or something like that. Hope this helps!


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## Poseidon (Oct 1, 2010)

DriftingShadow said:


> Thank you alexS. As far as turnout, he is out 24/7. I think he developed ulcers when first moved around, as the timeline I have put together from his past has him changing owners (and barns, herd mates, etc) every 2-3 1/2 months for a year and a half. He is already a worrier and an internalizer type, so I can only imagine the stress created from this.
> 
> Now while researching ulcers I've read "no grain". Drifter is on about 4lbs of purina strategy a day due to his inability to keep weight on (hard keeper most definitely). Will that aggravate any ulcers he has? What can I switch it out with? He has never gone off feed, and he still eats incredibly fast.
> 
> I will give the ranitidine tablets you suggested. Thank you!


My mare _started_ getting grain when she was diagnosed with ulcers. Her treatment was this random wound cleaner that was diluted (it was really high in magnesium) with an equal part of water. It was poured over grain twice a day for 30 days. The stuff was called Draw. I can't find it at any sort of store and I've only managed to track down the website for it once. It cost me $80 total for treatment because my vet is a lovely lady and considerate of my broke college self. The alternative to that would have been driving over an hour several times to pick up tubes of Gastrogard at $35 a pop. Yeah. No thanks.

And for what it's worth, I also use U-Gard as a preventative now. The only reason we could decide on for a cause was just that Abby's extremely anxious all the time. I put her on SmartCalm also, which is a godsend. We haven't had any issues since.



AlexS said:


> I have not heard of any week long treatment of ulcers - everything I have seen, heard and read says a 28-30 day treatment.


Gastrogard and Ulcergard are extremely potent. If I remember right, they recommend 25-30 day treatment, but I gave Abby 2 tubes of Gastrogard and noticed an immediate difference after just 2 days. I imagine you would only really need the full 30 days for a severe case.


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## Cowgirl140ty (Jan 7, 2010)

I will have to ask my vet what she gave me. But when he came in. He wouldnt even eat a scoop of grain a day. And now i have no problems getting him to eat. He shows no other signs of ulcers now either. And whatever he got was one tube a day for a week. Ill get with her and find out.
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## Rachel1786 (Nov 14, 2010)

I kept meaning to come back earlier to comment again. Rantidine cured my mare's ulcers when I did it for the full 30 days, but they came back when I moved her. Starting her in Ulc-R-Aid has greatly minimized the occurrence of her ulcers. Some people may dissagree, but I found that strategy was HORRID for my mare, while she was on it I couldn't get her ulcers under control for the life of me! The sugar and starch is very high in it and caused her a ton of problems. I switched her to triple crown senior and alfalfa pellets which helped her put on weight and I was finally able to get her ulcers under control with the rantidine. I have since taken her off the alfalfa pellets. I should also mention you can get rantidine for extremely cheap at walmart, a pack of 2 65count bottles(150mg) cost me $4.00! I think I needed 6 bottles total to treat her for a month. While scouring the internet for other treatment alternatives(in other words, not having to give her a million pills 2-3x a day) I found this website Affordable and Quality Equine Gastric Ulcer Treatments for Horses I went with the tablets at the bottom of the page, 3 tablets= 1 tube of gastrogard, at the price I figured it was worth a shot and they worked great, much faster then the rantidine and only having to give 3 tabs once a day was great. Once her symptoms went away I dropped her to the 1 tab/day prevention dose for a few weeks. I still have a ton of pills left so maybe I didn't need to order the 200(or maybe I went with the 300) pills I ordered, but it's nice to have them on hand incase she needs them. So far she has gone to a few shows and she hasn't had a flare up, she's only on Ulc-r-aid and a pre/pro biotic right now.


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## janev (Sep 26, 2012)

Rachel.....did you give all 3 tablets of omeprazole, 700mg, at one feeding? Did your horse eat them freely? Thank you for the information!
jane


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