# How much weight can he carry?



## waresbear

He looks solid enough to carry 200lbs & maybe over that as well.


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## bsms

Does the guest rider know how to ride?


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## Pistol Babe

Most of them don't. lol Some do, but usually it's their first time riding.


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## brighteyes08

250 lbs max, any more than that and you could be pushing it, especially if their doing anything more than a walk, plus this horse looks to have low set, thin pasterns.


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## caseymyhorserocks

I would not do more than 180 lbs. for this guy for people who don't know how to ride. 200 lbs. for someone who does know how to ride, he is pretty stocky.


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## Pistol Babe

Ok, Thank you!


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## mls

Pistol Babe said:


> Most of them don't. lol Some do, but usually it's their first time riding.


Are they riding or just putzing?

Also - does the saddle fit? If you are asking larger folks to squeeze into a smaller saddle, it's not comfortable for the guest or your horse.


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## Pistol Babe

If they don't know how to ride they just ride around in the round pen or arena at a walk. They don't typically want to go faster than that lol And I won't let anyone who doesn't know how to ride trot anyway.

I have saddles I can use for larger riders than myself.


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## Faceman

Mind you, those aren't the best pictures to see his conformation, but in those pictures his fronts look a bit wonky and his front pasterns look weak. With that in mind and given his weight and the fact he is not particularly big boned, I wouldn't put more than 180 pounds on him including tack. Pictures can be deceiving, though - perhaps his fronts aren't as bad as they appear here...


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## Joe4d

people get caught up in the 20% thing because they dont read all the way into it. No reason that horse couldnt easily carry 300 o 400 lbs at a putz around speed on easy terrain with a bit of conditioning. Look at the normal weights for ponyies and horses in military service.
The 20 percent issue was based on cavalry studies that found a horse loaded to 20% could carry that weight all day every day indefinetly with no ill efffects. 
Whereas horses that were loaded to30% would wear down and need rest after a couple weeks. Somewhere along the lines the first 20% sentence was read and now it gets repeated as gospel on what a pasture pals max load is.
Remember that 20% was for a horse road all day every day for weeks and months at a time not for a couple hours aroud the block. I only have two legs and am old an out of shape and 20% wouldnt even phase me. WHen I was n shape I could carry my body weight on patrols several miles at a time


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## bubba13

Joe, horses and humans are not built the same. It's the old suspension bridge analogy. Their spines cannot support massive amounts of weight, and even after a short ride they are extremely sore and may have long-term, even life-long problems. Lordosis, kissing spine, muscle damage, etc.

Watch the horse buckle under this guy's weight and tell me that's OK:


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## Sahara

The leading experts in horse biomechanics and anatomy would tell you to never put more than 250# on ANY horse. Period. Wither height has nothing to do with weight bearing abilities either. Generally speaking, the strongest horses are those with short, wide loins coupled with a 15-18% pelvic angle. Narrow horses with shallow pelvises tend to suffer from more weight-bearing injuries.


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## Joe4d

I'd say those leading experts wern't very leading or very expert or hired by PETA Lots and lots of horses were and are used to carry alot more than #250 lbs. Thats just insane. My horse is carrying that on 25 plus mile rides and he's just an average 15 or so hand walker.


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## bubba13

Joe4d said:


> I'd say those leading experts wern't very leading or very expert or hired by PETA Lots and lots of horses were and are used to carry alot more than #250 lbs. Thats just insane. My horse is carrying that on 25 plus mile rides and he's just an average 15 or so hand walker.


And you've had all of these horses thoroughly vetted for pain, right? And you've followed them along their lifetimes to look for signs of advanced rates of arthritis and lordosis too, right? And you've actually read the biomechanics veterinary studies and found the flaws in their physics calculations, right?


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## Faceman

bubba13 said:


> And you've had all of these horses thoroughly vetted for pain, right? And you've followed them along their lifetimes to look for signs of advanced rates of arthritis and lordosis too, right? And you've actually read the biomechanics veterinary studies and found the flaws in their physics calculations, right?


You can't reason with someone that suggests you can put 400 pounds on a 900 pound horse...waste of time.

The amount of weight a horse can comfortably carry without causing issues is dependent upon a lot of factors - size and weight of the horse, strength and length of the back, density of bone, size and quality of hooves, gait of the horse, riding ability of the rider, what type of riding will be done, and obviously the condition, soundness, and leg conformation of the horse - lots of things. There is no standard percent - one size does not fit all...I've seen 1,000 pound horses that could carry 300 pounds pretty comfortably, and then I have seen 1,200 pound horses that had trouble carying 200...


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## NorthernMama

Bubba, that guy is alot more than 250 lbs, plus the horse is light, plus the saddle is not designed for good weight distribution, plus the saddle is too small for the guy. Not comparable at all.

As for hauling around 250 lbs of pack -- that's different than 250 lbs of rider. It can be distributed differently. A horse can do that all day.

Though I agree that the _average healthy_ horse with a good saddle has no problem with a 250 lbs decent rider at a walk. A good rider at more than that.


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## NorthernMama

I want to "like" Faceman's post, but there isn't a clickable "like."


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## Ladytrails

I had an experience once with a very heavy noobie rider on my precious 14+ hand QH mare, in my saddle (a heavy western saddle but now I know it was at least 2" too small for him). He decided to try to ride like a yahoo from TV and almost fell out of the saddle, nearly taking my mare with him. I had to get him off of her. I learned a big lesson - I always told the little kid guest riders what the 'rules' are and assume that adults have some common sense. But, now, I pretty much don't let adults ride and my precious mare doesn't carry any guests over grade school age.


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## bubba13

NorthernMama said:


> Bubba, that guy is alot more than 250 lbs, plus the horse is light, plus the saddle is not designed for good weight distribution, plus the saddle is too small for the guy. Not comparable at all.


I was responding to Joe, who said it was reasonable to ask a 900 lb horse to carry a 400 lb rider.


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## NorthernMama

Well, I guess Joe can respond to that if he'd like. However he did say a conditioned horse and he didn't specify a rider of that weight -- just that amount of weight. To me, that meant pack weight. 

Point taken though Bubba.


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## Joe4d

I dont really need to analyze socalled experts when I can look all around me and see horses every day carrying more than 250 lbs. And yep there is no reasoning with someone who has first hand experience seeing with my own eyes many many horses carrying over 250 lbs and the ability to think for myself. 
In fact in the 16th-18th century there was actually a unit of measure called a "horseload" which equaled 200lbs of cargo.. not counting the pack equipment. These were horses used to carry way more miles than we will ever ride. Not to mention back in the day there wasnt really much distinction between pony and horse, all were considered horses, with the averages in the 13-14 hand range.
If we listened to these experts they basically say no men should ever be riding western even on a Budweiser Clydesdale. My first horse was a 14.3 QH/ saddle bread cutting horse, carried me over hill and dale until he was retired at about 28, lived into his 30's with no ill effects. I never did a Vulcan mind meld and asked him how he felt though.
Based on my research in military and commerce equine history and what I see around me each and every day , I'm just gonna go ahead and raise the big giant BS flag on that one.


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## Golden Horse

Different experts say different things, and we all decide what we think of their opinions, for instance there are a whole bunch of experts and a wealth of history monitor our use and growth of our language, I suppose they went to college rather than rodeo. Those experts and those conventions should prevent me wondering how much you paid for a "Bread Cutting Horse" must of been a pretty penny.

Being a heavy rider myself, currently above the 250 pound mark, I am careful who I ride and how long for, and the most important person in the equation is the horse, if you listen they will often tell you when enough is enough.


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## Faceman

Joe4d said:


> I dont really need to analyze socalled experts when I can look all around me and see horses every day carrying more than 250 lbs. And yep there is no reasoning with someone who has first hand experience seeing with my own eyes many many horses carrying over 250 lbs and the ability to think for myself.
> In fact in the 16th-18th century there was actually a unit of measure called a "horseload" which equaled 200lbs of cargo.. not counting the pack equipment. These were horses used to carry way more miles than we will ever ride. Not to mention back in the day there wasnt really much distinction between pony and horse, all were considered horses, with the averages in the 13-14 hand range.
> If we listened to these experts they basically say no men should ever be riding western even on a Budweiser Clydesdale. My first horse was a 14.3 QH/ saddle bread cutting horse, carried me over hill and dale until he was retired at about 28, lived into his 30's with no ill effects. I never did a Vulcan mind meld and asked him how he felt though.
> Based on my research in military and commerce equine history and what I see around me each and every day , I'm just gonna go ahead and raise the big giant BS flag on that one.


Call BS all you like - that is your right. But you are on record for the world to see saying a 900 pound horse can carry 400 pounds, and furthermore you defend it. That speaks for itself...quite clearly...


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## bsms

Well, the war horses of old were around 15 hands high, and they carried knights in armor. The armor actually only weighed around 50-75 lbs, but added to a 150-180 lb knight and saddle, and you would be in the 250+ range.

Horses used for cavalry in the 1600s carried their own supplies with them, and I've seen calculations that these horses, around 14 hands, carried loads of 300-350 lbs on long days of riding.

One of the studies I saw said that experienced horses changed the way they moved when carrying a heavy load (>30%). They couldn't go as fast, but the adjustment meant their joints had no more strain than otherwise.

Here is some reading for anyone interested:

Heavier Riders' Guide

Horses

How Much Weight Can Your Horse Safely Carry?

http://www.distanceriding.org/php/articles/health/Function.pdf

My 835 lb gelding, who weighed less as a ranch horse, carried a >200 lb guy with 40 lb saddle for 8-12 hour days in the mountains, daily. He would lose weight over the summer, since there was no money for grain & he had to forage while being ridden, but he doesn't seem worse for wear.

Cavalry mounts during the Civil War would regularly be ridden distances of 40-50 miles/day for a week running. They would wear out if pushed any further, but that is use that almost no recreational rider puts their horse thru.

I'd bet there are a lot of cowboys who weigh 225 in their stockings, and they find horses to ride - although I'd bet their horses are conditioned better than a lot of recreational horses.

This photo is of my 5'0" daughter-in-law on Cowboy, but Cowboy is a 13 hand mustang who seems to have no trouble at all with my 175 lbs + 30 lb saddle...has a kind of weird gait, but based on the last 2 weeks, it looks like the little sucker will really go. Wouldn't put anyone over 200 lbs on him, but I'm told he has done it before:


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## AlexS

It totally depends on the horse, Joe surely you can see that? 
I would never put a 250lb person on my skinny TB, but my 290lb husband can ride a draft.


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## Joe4d

The statement made was leading experts claim NO HORSE should Ever carry over 250 lbs. That's total BS. Last 5 years of Roscoes life I wouldnt put 50 lbs on him. I imagine the Bush Gardens horses could easily carry well over 600 lbs. That's less than 30 percent in their case. 
Assuming health and time for conditioning 250 lbs isnt too much for any animal nowadays labeled "horse" and probably most animals labeled "pony" Just too much historical and first hand eyebball experience all over the world that shows otherwise.


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## Faceman

Joe4d said:


> The statement made was leading experts claim NO HORSE should Ever carry over 250 lbs. That's total BS. Last 5 years of Roscoes life I wouldnt put 50 lbs on him. I imagine the Bush Gardens horses could easily carry well over 600 lbs. That's less than 30 percent in their case.
> Assuming health and time for conditioning 250 lbs isnt too much for any animal nowadays labeled "horse" and probably most animals labeled "pony" Just too much historical and first hand eyebball experience all over the world that shows otherwise.


I don't know who made that statement, but lots of horses can carry 250 pounds...some can carry the 400 pounds you referenced. But not a 900 pound conventional horse.

The "Bush Gardens" horses, more accurately called Clydesdales, cannot carry as much weight as you think. Drafts cannot carry as large a percentage of their bodyweight as regular horses, just as regular horses canot carry as large a percentage of their bodyweight as mules or burros...different conformations, different capabilities. Obviously a sound and well conformed draft can carry more weight than a sound and well conformed horse, but it can carry less percentage of its body weight. Just because a big draft may weigh twice a horse does not mean it can carry twice the weight.

NorthernMama, both the OP and Joe's post referred to a rider - not pack weight. Horses can carry more pack more weight than rider weight because the weight is distributed over a far greater area of the back, and when packed properly is more stable, and has a much lower center of gravity, all of which cause far less stress. I would still be hesitant to put that much pack weight on a 900 pound horse nonetheless, although with packing, justas with riding, much depends on the distance and terrain to be negotiated. 

Lots of large sized people ride, and many of them are very good riders. It always makes me sad when large people don't ride because they feel they are too heavy. There is no reason a 300 or 350 pound person with 50 pounds of tack can't ride...but it needs to be a proper horse, and a 900 pound horse is absolutely not suitable. I would venture to guess that most people know that, but hopefully people new to horses and riding won't get the wrong idea and place themselves and their horse in danger...


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## spookychick13

It totally depends on the horse. Really, it's just common sense. My 15.2 hand arab has a very short back and thick bone and he can carry my 230lb trainer and 30lbs of tack without batting an eyelash, at any speed and length.


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## mls

spookychick13 said:


> It totally depends on the horse. Really, it's just common sense. My 15.2 hand arab has a very short back and thick bone and he can carry my 230lb trainer and 30lbs of tack without batting an eyelash, at any speed and length.


 
Gosh - don't go throwing common sense into the mix! That just confuses people! :-o


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