# How high to jump??? :?



## BluMagic (Sep 23, 2007)

I am not sure how high the jumps are for 4-H. 

I am not sure how high Blu can jump.

I am not sure how high I should train him to jump.

Help!!!

Okay, I can hopefully find out the first one on my own. I was just wondering if I should just train and jump Blu when the time comes at an easy pace. Like do some training and then some free jumping. But how high do I place the jumps and increase? I was just thinking I should start with like two feet. And see how he does like that. Then increase it but what should I increase it to? I don't want to over work him, bore him, or hurt him in any way! 

Any ideas?


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## Rachluvshorses4eva (Apr 11, 2007)

Just start the jumps on the ground. Then increase the hight every 2nd time, by 10cm. :wink:


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## jazzyrider (Sep 16, 2007)

most people dont really know how high their horse can jump until they get there 

i would suggest you start at the beginning. as you find he is tackling each jump with confidence and consistency, lift it a little. dont push him through them though. take it as slow as you and blu need to go. the key is making sure HE is confident with the height he is jumping. the biggest mistake some people make is thinking that the horse is doing great and lifting the jumps too soon. the last thing you want is to have a nasty accident by rushing and set him back in his confidence. 

you will know when he has reached his limits and dont push him past that. its no failure to not make grand prix heights 

most of all, enjoy what you are doing. you have been talking for a while now about english and jumping and i think its great that you are spreading your wings  have fun blu


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## luvs2ride79 (Dec 17, 2007)

Also remember that jumping with a rider takes a lot of muscle and balance. Before he can jump well, he has to be strong and well balanced on the flat. Do lots of work over trot poles and caveletties, pattern work at all gaits, and trails up and down hills are also helpful. When you start jumping, just work on little x rails at the trot and canter, to let him get the feel for it. 

Contact your show organizer to find out the jump heights and types for the classes you will be in. Most 4-H shows I've seen use smaller jumps, either x-rails or 1'6" verticals, but ask to make sure.

Then at home, school those heights a few times until he's going consistently, then drop down to one lower, and only jump 1 or 2 days a week. Jumping is fun, but it's hard on a horse's knees, shoulders, hocks, and stifles. For long term soundness, you shouldn't jump a horse too high or too often. Even the big Grand Pix riders do more Dressage work than they do jumping at home :wink:.


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

How old is your horse your planning on jumping? Mine is only 3 and I keep her at 1ft or a little over 1ft for now. Just for safety.


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## luvs2ride79 (Dec 17, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> How old is your horse your planning on jumping? Mine is only 3 and I keep her at 1ft or a little over 1ft for now. Just for safety.


No horse should jump any height with a rider on their back before their 5th birthday, preferably their 6th brithday. The horse's knees are the first things to close at 2-3 yrs old. The hocks don't close until 4-5 yrs old, and all of the bones in a horse are closed at around 6yrs old (give or take 6 months). 

Jumping before the growth plates in those major bones/joints have hardened completely is a serious risk to a horse's long term soundness and health. Horses are NOT supposed to be "over the hill" at 15-17 years old... A horse should NOT be getting hock injections at 8yrs old, or arthritic and stiff by 15... A horse SHOULD be jumping sound, at least over small stuff, well into their early 20's (barring any injuries or serious conformational issues that would prohibit jumping).


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

I've heard of horses jumping 3ft when they were only 4 years old and they were fine. My horse is 3 years old and she only jumps around 1ft like I said and she is fine. If it is so stressful for them why do they race 2 and 3 year olds? I can see if I was trying to jump my horse 3ft now but come on 1ft. I guess we need to lock up the horses till there 6 years old so they don't gallop too fast and hurt themselves! :wink:


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## Equina (Jul 28, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> If it is so stressful for them why do they race 2 and 3 year olds?


Have you seen many 15 year old horses continuing to race if they were started at 2 years old? Probably not. They physically can't.

I think what luvs2ride79 was getting at is that, a younger horse physically _can_ jump, it could just adversely affect their joints, etc and cause issues later in life. And I completely agree, luvs2ride79.


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

Yeah but a 3 year old going on 4 in March jumping 1ft a couple times every few weeks aint going to hurt them.


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## hunterequlover781 (Dec 27, 2007)

I have always heard that you should not jump a young horse until they are at least 4 b/c their knees need to be developed. I free lunged my filly as a yearling over small x's. It is important for your horse to be solid on the flat before you even start worrying about jumping. I would start out over tiny x's and then just start working up a little after he starts getting comfortable. Just remember that with babies you need to take it slow and not overwhelm them when it comes to jumping.


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## Equina (Jul 28, 2007)

I think we're getting a little off track from Blu's questions! Also, I'm pretty sure Blu is over 6, so he's good to go.

Did you find out high high 4-H jumps are? I would recommend that you eventually get Blu comfortably jumping things a few inches taller than the 4-H limit so that he can easily handle the jumps at shows.

Someone mentioned 4-H probably goes up to 1'6" and Blu can definitely do that! YOU could probably run and jump over that yourself. It's pretty small. Blu is 16.1hh right? So is my horse and he gets lazy and pretty much walks over anything too small. He really perks up and has fun when we're at 1 foot or more. You could try free-lunging him over jumps. Then you can easily increase the fence height since you're already on the ground. Of course, he'll be able to jump much easier (and higher) without a rider. Then you can take some cute pictures too! :lol: 

Take Jazzy's advice and listen to Blu...when he's totally comfortable with a height, increase it a little. Slow & Steady wins the race. luvs2ride also has good advice about conditioning with caveletti, hills, and pattern work. When he's strong on the flat, it'll be easier for him to jump. And easier on you (when you're strong too). We have this little pond at our barn that dries up in the summer. It's perfect for riding up and down the edge for hill conditioning. We don't have any trails near by. Anyways, I even noticed that when we're riding up the hill, I naturally get in a very comfortable forward position and move well with my horse. Of course, when I jump with him in the arena, my legs slip back, I'm too ahead of the motion, I don't release enough, etc etc. I think I need to ride that hill more often!!

Another thing to remember, jumping is more than just getting over an obstacle! Even at a 6" crossrail, you can add things like flower boxes, tarps, or other scary objects (near by). Then Blu will be ready for anything at a show plus he'll be less likely to get bored if you're sticking to smaller heights for a while. Also, set up little courses in your mind and ride them. Concentrate on your preparation before the jump (coming in straight, centered, and balanced) and after the jump (balanced, correct lead, looking where you're going). 

Wow, I'm really rambling! Anyways, have FUN! That's the most important part. Have you jumped before with other horses?


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## hunterequlover781 (Dec 27, 2007)

O my bad I just assumed he was a baby. I don't know why.


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## AKPaintLover (May 26, 2007)

*"I've heard of horses jumping 3ft when they were only 4 years old and they were fine. My horse is 3 years old and she only jumps around 1ft like I said and she is fine."*

She may be fine now, but waiting to jump is looking after their long term soundness. I also heard to wait until they are about 6 years old to start jumping them to make sure they are fully developed, and have developed the balance and musculature for doing it. 

*"if it is so stressful for them why do they race 2 and 3 year olds?"*

For money. It seems that many involved in racing care more about the overall business than the actual horse and what happens to them after they are no longer able to race. Many horses end lame and unable to do ANYTHING due to being worked too hard too early with high impact sports. Why would you risk doing that to your horse? 

I feel like this discussion has occurred before with you?? I know and respect that you chose not to listen to others about your training and such (as you stated in your rearing post) - so I apologize if my input is unwanted. 

Blu - sorry for that aside. As for the height you should take blu - I would just take it slow as stated before and go up in increments. Don't go up in height until he is confident and consistent at a particular height (with all appearances and forms - oxers, decorated and plain, etc.). I think you will likely know when you reach his max height - it may take a couple of seasons or more to reach it. Just try to read his confidence especially carefully and be sure to back up your jumping practice with plenty of flat work to keep him balanced and strong. 
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## luvs2ride79 (Dec 17, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> I've heard of horses jumping 3ft when they were only 4 years old and they were fine. My horse is 3 years old and she only jumps around 1ft like I said and she is fine. If it is so stressful for them why do they race 2 and 3 year olds? I can see if I was trying to jump my horse 3ft now but come on 1ft. I guess we need to lock up the horses till there 6 years old so they don't gallop too fast and hurt themselves! :wink:


They might be fine now, but what about 3, 5, or even 10 years from now? Working a horse too hard young can cause all sorts of long term damage to their joints and bones.

Those 2 and 3 year old race horses OFTEN break down on the track, or develop serious issues soon after, like bone chips, bowed tendons, hairline fractures, early onset arthritis, etc.

Just RIDING her at 3yrs old for more than 15-20 minutes can stress her growing joints and bones (if you and ALL of your saddle and tack weighs more than 150 lbs and you go at more than just a walk on flat ground). 

Jumping is stressfull on a horse's knees, pasterns, shoulders, hocks, and stifles, as well as the horse's back, neck, and hips. Done correctly, it's no problem. But done too early or too much, and the horse can develop long term soundness issues.

And no, on their own a horse will not (usually) hurt themselves. They need to have large pastures to run and play in as they grow. And riding a horse early (at 2.5-3) with a LIGHT WEIGHT rider can even strengthen a horse's bones, but you need to FULLY understand a horse's physiology and maturation process. If you just get on and go, you can risk doing long term damage to the horse. 

For the long term soundness and health of a horse, they should not be ridden until 3yrs old (AFTER their ACTUAL 3rd birthday), no hard training like a lot of canteing on circles and hard and long (more than 3 hours) trail riding until 4.5 years old (so the hocks can develop), and no intense riding/training like jumping, cutting, barrel racing, etc. until 5yrs old or later. And the horse should be well conditioned for hard training and intense work, not just hopped upon and jumped one day :?.

http://www.equinestudies.org/knowledge_base/ranger.html
http://www.robertmmiller.com/andthcaushol.html


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

My last instructor started jumping her gelding when he was 3 or 4 years old 2ft and up. And he is still jumping and he is 26 years old. Same with Poise the mare I learned to ride on. She jumped, sis western pleasure, and ran barrels full time since she was 3 years old and she is 23 and fully sound.

Like I said my 3 year old jumping 1ft every couple weeks isn't going to hurt her.


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## BluMagic (Sep 23, 2007)

^^^ They are just saying to be careful. Every horse is different so you never know. And if you want to take that chance...we can't tell you what to do but we can help guide you. 

Blu is approx. 7rs old now. I've arranged his birthday to be the day I got him, June 26th. lol. We've had so many mixed answers about his age. Some vets said, others said 5. But the most answers we've had are at 7 and 8. Yes, he's 16.1hh since the last time I measured. 

Like I said a while back, the highest he's jumped was about four feet....or to his chest. He's got long legs. lol. 

I'm going to try the trot poles and all that. Sounds like it will help a lot. The one muscle he seems to build very easily are his gaskins, I believe they are called. Right below the shoulder and hindquarters. Those are big now and its Winter! lol. My baby's bulking up! 

I really appreciate everyone's help here!


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## jazzyrider (Sep 16, 2007)

horseluver - i mean no offence by this i just want to say that its a good idea sometimes to listen to what people who have been doing this for many many years have to say. what has been mentioned about horses age for jumping is very fair not to mention right. no amount of arguing the point is going to change the facts.

as i said i mean no offence so sorry if its taken that way


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## luvs2ride79 (Dec 17, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> My last instructor started jumping her gelding when he was 3 or 4 years old 2ft and up. And he is still jumping and he is 26 years old. Same with Poise the mare I learned to ride on. She jumped, sis western pleasure, and ran barrels full time since she was 3 years old and she is 23 and fully sound.
> 
> Like I said my 3 year old jumping 1ft every couple weeks isn't going to hurt her.


Just because some horses turn out okay, doesn't mean all horses will turn out okay.

Blu: Sounds like you have a good plan for your boy! I'm sure he'll do fine :wink:. Yup, gaskins in back, forearms in front, at least that's what I remember from 4-H class, lol.


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

How do you know when your horse is comfortable and confident to go higher? I've started my 4 year old mare over cavallettis, trot poles and very low "jumps" I was doing it in the summer, but have slowed down due to the snow/winter. I don't plan on doing anymore jumping with her until she's older and done growing (never knew how fast horses can grow. Got her a blanket last her and this year its a little tight). Anyways, how do you know when its time to move the jump up?


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## jazzyrider (Sep 16, 2007)

^^^^^ what i ask myself to judge that is: does my horse face every jump steadily and with confidence? is he constantly clearing each jump? is he clearing different styles of jumps with the same confidence eg; cross rails, oxers, coloured ones, decorated ones etc? how is his form? has he gained enough muscle and condition to be able to handle higher jumps?

but yeah as said earlier, the worst thing to do is rush it. spend a couple of months on one height if you need to. you and your horse should be able to jump each height in your sleep before moving on 

hope that has helped a bit  im sure others will have more to add though


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

> Just because some horses turn out okay, doesn't mean all horses will turn out okay.


My horse is built like a Thoroughbred so she will be fine. Thanks though!


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## jazzyrider (Sep 16, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> > Just because some horses turn out okay, doesn't mean all horses will turn out okay.
> 
> 
> *My horse is built like a Thoroughbred so she will be fine. Thanks though! *


can you guarantee that?


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

Yep! Oh my gosh you should see her muscles she's gotten from all the lounging and riding we have done. Her chest and gaskins are rock hard. Her legs are flawless! And when she moves, it's like raw power! lol I take alot of pride in my horse. :lol:


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## Equina (Jul 28, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> My horse is built like a Thoroughbred so she will be fine. Thanks though!


Does being "built like a Thoroughbred" mean her bones, joints, etc develop faster than other builds of horses? You've struck my curiosity!


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## jazzyrider (Sep 16, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> Yep! Oh my gosh you should see her muscles she's gotten from all the lounging and riding we have done. Her chest and gaskins are rock hard. Her legs are flawless! And when she moves, it's like raw power! lol I take alot of pride in my horse. :lol:


it isnt just the muscles that are the problem. but, if you say so. my personal opinion is that its better to be safe than sorry but hey, i do worry about keeping my horses sound throughout their whole lives


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

No, but like I said, she is a strong horse!


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## luvs2ride79 (Dec 17, 2007)

It's like try to reason with a rock... :roll:


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

No I get what yall are saying but my horse is sound enough to jump 1ft every couple weeks.

Jumping everyday would be strenuous.


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

> It's like try to reason with a rock...


I could say the same about you. :wink:


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## BluMagic (Sep 23, 2007)

Ouch...


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

you know I honestly have to say how a simple question from BluMagic is turned into this whole debate thing. I've read numerous articles online that horses are done maturing between the ages of 5-6. Yes i have seen videos of people jumping horses earlier than that, but i'm not asking my 4 year old to jump major courses, and as of right now the only thing she jumps over is a ground pole. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but can we please try to be more polite about it? A simple,"I can understand where you are coming from and I appreciate that information" would be very nice....I think anyways....


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

> but i'm not asking my 4 year old to jump major courses, and as of right now the only thing she jumps over is a ground pole.


I didn't say I jumped her major courses now did I? All I said was I jumped her over a 1ft log every couple weeks. In fact I haven't jumped her in 2 months.

Look I know it may sound like I'm being closed minded but once again, look at whats going on:
You guys are trying to tell me that jumping young horses causes problems when there older. And I understand that.
I'm trying to tell you that I know my horse more than you do. :wink: 
See this thing is 2 way. Analyze the situation before you point fingers k?


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

horse lover, when did I ever write that you were jumping your horse over a major course? Never. 



> Yes i have seen videos of people jumping horses earlier than that, but i'm not asking my 4 year old to jump major courses, and as of right now the only thing she jumps over is a ground pole.


That was the full sentence i wrote. No where in there did I mention you or your horse

Try to be a little more relaxed when you read the posts. We aren't trying to attack you if thats what you are thinking. 

We are all just giving our opinions on jumping a young horse.


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

I know, and I respect the facts, but you guys must respect that I know my horse.


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## luvs2ride79 (Dec 17, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> You guys are trying to tell me that jumping young horses causes problems when there older. And I understand that.


No you don't, otherwise you wouldn't jump a 3yr old at all.



> I'm trying to tell you that I know my horse more than you do.
> See this thing is 2 way. Analyze the situation before you point fingers k?


We're pointing out your lack of understanding. Muscle strength does NOT equal bone density... I'm sure you know your horse just fine, but you obviously don't understand horse physiology or bone maturation, otherwise you wouldn't question our advice.

No one is pointing fingers, we're only trying to edcate you... Did you read the articles I posted? They are both very informative and written by VETS who have done clinical and real world research on the issue.


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## tim (Dec 31, 2007)

luvs2ride79 said:


> horse_luver4e said:
> 
> 
> > You guys are trying to tell me that jumping young horses causes problems when there older. And I understand that.
> ...


Riiight...

Anyways,
I'd like to make an attempt to return this thread to it's original intent.

My 2 cents worth for BluMagic:

I don't jump so I'm not going to make a schedule for you. All I have to say is that consistency is the most important component of a healthy training schedule. If you're getting into jumping a certain horse for the first time, and you have long term plans in mind, it's always best to take things slow. Start from the beginning. There is a reason Hunt seat and Hunter pleasure exist. They are foundations for horses to be built upon. Be sure you've mastered the less complicated bits before you make an attempt to move into jumping. You know what they say about a house built on stone. 

It's true what they are posting about jumping young horses, but you have to realize that always being afraid of what might happen to your horse will get you nowhere. Basing your training on caution will destroy your ambition.

Try not to see Jumping as a separate arena from the flat events. Its all part of the same road. Different horse/rider combos travel at different paces and some can only go so far. Just start from the beginning and keep moving forward steadily.


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

> otherwise you wouldn't question our advice.


This post is for BluMagic I didn't ask anything! :lol:


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## BluMagic (Sep 23, 2007)

Well, I know Blu is happy. I've done some lunging and all that and he gets so excited. Jess and I walked the dogs over to his pen and as soon as he saw Theo, his best puppy friend, he took off bucking and snorting and neighing. He was happy! lol. Thanks so much you guys!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

I'm glad to hear Blu is doing great. And thats so cute with his little puppy friend. I'm not sure what Vega will do around dogs, not sure i want to try until she's settled down a bit. Keep up the good work!


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

No. I jumped her maybe 4 times. I'm just working on reining right now. I might get back to jumping after a while.


Good to hear BluMagic! :wink:


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