# From snaffle to shanked



## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

I have searched around the forum to see if this topic is already here and I couldnt find one so I apologize if this info is already here somewhere.


My daughter wants ride our horse Western (walk/trot) in 4H shows next summer so I need to switch bits for her to show.
We have been riding him in a full cheek snaffle and he has been doing fine , but she cannot ride him with this bit in the shows.
He is getting the hang of neck reining just with the snaffle, walking he does really well, trotting about half but we are still working on this.
Also we have been working on getting his trot slower (more like a western horse jog) I realize that he may never be a Western Pleasure horse but I would like to see his head come down more too.

Any suggestions on easy bit for him to transition too for the 4H shows?
thanks


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## rodeogirl309 (Aug 11, 2008)

I had a similar issue this past year for 4h. But, I ended up dropping the Western showing and just went with English (only because I ran out of time to train XD). As I switched from a Dr.Bristol english bit, to a low/medium port shank. Lets just say my mare was confused! That's why I dropped out of the idea, ran out of time to get her used to it. I watched some of the western classes at the fair and I could have sworn people were using Tom Thumbs. Now, when I rode my mare (well, I leased her..) western, I used a TT. She understood it. The only reason I didn't use it as a showing option, is because I thought we had to use port bits. Guess not.

I think you could use a TT. Unless the rule books says you can't, I say go for it. They never checked out our bits, except for Gymkhana.


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## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

Well, I thought of that but I heard some not great things about TT so I dont know....I have looked over the rule book and I didnt notice if they were mentioned but I did read that you had to ride one handed and no snaffles for horses over 5...
She wants to ride western....if we can get him working well with it over the winter than by the time shows start up he should be pretty good.
thanks for the input : )


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## rodeogirl309 (Aug 11, 2008)

Right. TT are supposed to be ridden one handed (though I cheat sometimes and use two hands when trianing). Tom Thumbs are only "bad" if they are in rough hands. For showing, I think that it may be a good choice for your daughter and her horse. Never hurts to try!


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## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

yes, that is true...I believe that I have a TT somewhere around here I could try it and see .....it may work, never know.


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## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

I just found the thread on tom thumbs in the forum I was searching for one but didnt see it until now, I will go to that thread and read more.....hopefully find out some more info thanks


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

I don't really like shanked bits with broken mouths (of any kind) because if you pick up one rein like you have to while training neck reining, then the signals get confusing to the horse. When my green horses start to pick up the basic idea of neck reining, then I transition them to a bit exactly like this. I don't know if this type would be acceptable or flashy enough for the show ring but there are ton's of solid mouth bits with swivel shanks that are prettier than this one. Swivel shanks are a MUST for teaching neck reining.










The port is high enough for tongue relief but low enough that there is minimal palate interference. Plus, it allows me to pick up one rein without confusing the horse. Switching from a snaffle to a shanked does cause some initial confusion regardless because the pressure is all different and can be so much stronger. BTW, the shorter the shanks are, the softer the bit will be. I personally like 6' shanks but they are a little hard to find.


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## Tophandcowgirl (Jun 23, 2007)

I would suggest a mild, short shanked curb such as the Myler Flat Shank

Toklat - Horse Tack - Saddle Pads - Horse Riding Apparel - Myler Bits - Bits

Dont' let the shanks be fixed or have a fixed mouthpiece because this is such a big transition from a snaffle. Also, using a "S" shanked bit will be milder than a straight shank, if you like the look of them. They take longer to engage than does a straight shank, and thus will be an easier transition! 

Hope this helps!

Tophandcowgirl


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## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

Thanks for the info , I will check around and see if I can find something like this bit


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## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

Tophandcowgirl said:


> I would suggest a mild, short shanked curb such as the Myler Flat Shank
> 
> Toklat - Horse Tack - Saddle Pads - Horse Riding Apparel - Myler Bits - Bits
> 
> ...


 
Are you able to show in this bit? Would I need another bit after this bit if I used it for the shows?


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

^^ You might want to check with the show officials and find out exactly what kind of bit is required. Some shows require a ported bit and others only require shanked. The best bet is check with the show people.


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## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

Yes, I will do that , I intend to discuss this with her 4H leader at the next meeting. If we could we would just continue to use the snaffle but I dont think she is going to change her mind and go English. Thank you


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## Tophandcowgirl (Jun 23, 2007)

If you are just showing 4-H in it, it most likely will be allowed. I use that bit for showing 4-H. Check first though.

Tophandcowgirl


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## rodeogirl309 (Aug 11, 2008)

smrobs said:


> I don't really like shanked bits with broken mouths (of any kind) because if you pick up one rein like you have to while training neck reining, then the signals get confusing to the horse. When my green horses start to pick up the basic idea of neck reining, then I transition them to a bit exactly like this. I don't know if this type would be acceptable or flashy enough for the show ring but there are ton's of solid mouth bits with swivel shanks that are prettier than this one. Swivel shanks are a MUST for teaching neck reining.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's the exact bit I have...Thought I'd say that since my description wasn't too great :lol:


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## Pidge (Sep 5, 2009)

ok bit transitioning....had to do lots of this with my gelding...He started on a snaffle and ended up on a light weight solid shank low/med. port bit. I had to switch because he turned into a knot head and absolutely would not listen to his snaffle anymore...:evil:

I started by switching to a TT...that worked for a while but he started throwing his head so i decided to try a basic grazing bit. All my friends used them...it has regular shanks with almost a strait bar...sort little bump in the middle not really even a port...that worked fine for a while too but then he wouldnt stop and it was a bit heavy so i switched to my current bit. He tranistioned through all of them withing a few months and is now perfectly happy with his little curb.

So this is the order and pictures of the bits i went through:
1: http://www.probertencyclopaedia.com/j/Snaffle.jpg
2: http://www.valhallafarm.net/TomThumbBit.jpg
3: http://www.horses-and-horse-information.com/images/curb_bit.gif
4: http://brokenspur.com/shop/images/640curbbit.jpg

As for the transition to neck reining I taught my boy in four days flat...really it can be done!!!

Start on the ground with nothing but a halter and a long rope tied like reins. Step back out of the horses point of view and use the rope to neck rein them over in small circles, if at first they dont get it pull their head too but only long enough to get their feet moving. After they do maybe five circles with just neck pressure stop and relieve the pressure. This is their reward for actually doing the neck rein, no more pressure. Then start up again and work until they do it consistantly. Once they are turning circles with just the pressure on their neck not pulling their head switch sides and start over doing the same thing. This makes up day one.

Day two refresh the ground stuff with about ten circles each direction then in a roundpen or small corral mount up with just the halter and rope still. Walk around neck reining the horse both ways, pointing his head when needing to with the direct rein again but try to use nothing but the neck rein. Once the horse understands it at a walk work at a trot. Do the same thing as when you walked, its just faster now. Once your horse is comfortable neck reining in the pen move to ride the pasture neck reining, still with only halter and lead rope. This makes day two.

Day three you go out with the bridle and bit and all start on the ground again. By using the halter first you built up a base in your horses head of what the neck pressure meant without any confusion. Now with the bit he may start out confussed but he still has an idea. After working ground work just like day one he will understand better and not be confused. Just work like you did on day one until he is good on both sides with the bit. That closes day three.

Day four is just a repeat of day two only with bit and bridle. Ride until he gets it in the pen then ride around the pasture neck reining. Im highly positive your horse will know how to neck rein at this point.

Now my horse is hot headed and he didnt like the switch from direct reining to neck reining. Once he understood the concept I just had to ride him lots and make him do it over and over. Now he flips like a charm!

Also it will help if you complete your bit transitioning first! So what ever bit you decide they will be ridden on is the one you need to train the horse with.

Hope all of that helps you with your bit transitions and your neck reining!


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## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

So once I make the transition from the snaffle to the shank , do I never go back to the snaffle? 
He does well with the snaffle now .....I just need something for showing...
I guess what I am trying to say is what if she wanted to ride him english at some point ...could we just go back to the snaffle?


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## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

Pidge ,thanks for the extra info on teaching the neck rein I wll try this as well


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## Pidge (Sep 5, 2009)

Your welcome and if you wanted to go back to a snaffle I think that would be ok but in order to do that I think it would be best if you rode him with a snaffle occasionally to ensure he still responds to it after training him to the curb, plus once he is transitioned he should still remember the snaffle if hes been ridden with it for a while.

So I dont see an issue with switching between a snaffle and curb when switching between western and english just so long as you make sure he understands both.


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## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

I was thinking of trying this one it is 6" cheeks BitLogic from classic equine and I also looking for curb (low port) 
Hmm, I dont really know though...would the Bitlogic bit be the same idea of the tom thumb?


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

I believe that it is just a fancier version of the TT, yes. IMHO, any bit with shanks needs to have at least a mostly immobile mouth. If you are looking for a bit that has independant rotation of each side without the confusion of the TT, you might want to look into a Myler or Billy Allen type mouth with shanks.


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## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

Where could I find a bit like this , low port with swivel shanks? Is there a website or should I hit the tack stores?
I have found a Billy Allen that I may buy ...Just trying to decide which may be the best one to try.


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## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

^^ 
I actually found this bit from the tack outlet , I just traced the pic back to that website so I think I am going to try it ..thanks for all the info everyone : )


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## kevinshorses (Aug 15, 2009)

RadHenry09 said:


> I was thinking of trying this one it is 6" cheeks BitLogic from classic equine and I also looking for curb (low port)
> Hmm, I dont really know though...would the Bitlogic bit be the same idea of the tom thumb?


 
This is the type of bit I use to transition from a snaffle. Remember that they are all "curb" bits because they work off the curb chain under the horses jaw rather they have a high port or low port or snaffle mouth if it has shanks it's a curb bit. After you get him in a curb bit don't be afraid of a higher port as a next step. The higher port helps with vertical flexion and is often more comfortable for the horse.


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## ClassicalRomantic (Jun 2, 2009)

I just tranisitioned my mare as well for training WP. I use a Billy Allen bit and it has been wonderful for her transition.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

The ported bit you are looking to get is a really nice bit, IMHO. I ordered it from that site when I needed another bit and it works wonderfully. It is very balanced and mild for an excellent price. Good luck and I hope you are as fortunate with it as I have been.


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## Rugersremi (Mar 27, 2009)

I have my eye on the below bit, via Ebay. Any opinions on this Billy Allen? Would it make a good transition bit from a TT? Of course it has long shanks and not too sure about that??

Black Steel Show Bit Billy Allen Snaffle 3 Piece - eBay (item 270453834657 end time Sep-15-09 11:19:56 PDT)

Renee


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## ClassicalRomantic (Jun 2, 2009)

here is a good website for billy allen bits


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## Rugersremi (Mar 27, 2009)

Was there a link? 

Renee



ClassicalRomantic said:


> here is a good website for billy allen bits


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## ClassicalRomantic (Jun 2, 2009)

opps forgot to add the link 
Billy Allen Bits


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## Rugersremi (Mar 27, 2009)

OMG! What a selection! Now I have no idea which one to even choose haha!! I know that I cannot afford more than $40 for a bit though.


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## ClassicalRomantic (Jun 2, 2009)

I got the first bit  I jsut started riding my mare in it to transition her for showing WP and she is going wonderfully in it! everyone at the barn complimented us on how well she looked and what a change since i started using this bit! she is really happy in it and very responsive! I would try a BA bit I think it was only like $30 or something like that so in your budget!


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

smrobs said:


> I don't really like shanked bits with broken mouths (of any kind) because if you pick up one rein like you have to while training neck reining, then the signals get confusing to the horse.


Going to disagree with you on this.

Cutters, reiners, etc use broken mouth pieces with shanks. I'm sure you have seen some excellent video out there.

I ride with a shanked broken bit. I use two hands when I am working cattle. Yet I use the same bit one handed when I trail ride or ride in parades or carrying a flag.


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