# How to switch boarding barns?



## Blondehorselover

I've only had my horse for about 1 1/2 months and I've had him at this boarding stable just as long. But...I don't like this stable. The facility is decent but I feel like they could do a much better job. They have him standing in knee deep mud and I have to let him run out of the gate when I go get him otherwise I'll get stuck. And I feel they aren't giving enough hay. I could buy more from them but they'll charge me double for what they pay and I won't even know if he gets it all because they just throw it in with all the other horses. They also require about 8 different vaccines some of which they require again in fall...I'm not one that believes in too many vaccines. And the people are bipolar. I could go one day and they'll be very talkative then the next they won't even talk to me. 

Anyway, I've found a barn a few miles away from this one that costs a little bit more but it seems they're more family oriented and focus more on the horses (plus they live on site which is a plus). I called the lady last night and she talked to me for nearly an hour and she was very helpful. I'm going to go look at it in a couple days but I already like the looks/sound of it. Plus they don't require all those vaccines and it's up to the owner if they want to vaccinate their horse or not. Except she does of course require a couple basic ones....NOT 8!!!!!!!!!!!! 

My question is how do I go about telling my current barn that I'm moving him (if I decide to) since he's only been there for a couple months?


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## mls

Blondehorselover said:


> My question is how do I go about telling my current barn that I'm moving him (if I decide to) since he's only been there for a couple months?


You don't have to tell them anything. Write up your notice and say "I will be moving Blaze on January 1, 2012. Thank you, signed _____________" 

If your contract says you need to provide a written notice.


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## ~*~anebel~*~

Give 30 days notice that you are moving him (usually this means on the first of the month, so Jan 1 tell them you are moving him on Feb 1. You have no obligation to say why or where and if they ask, say its closer to your house. They don't need to hear that you think they take bad care of the horses.

I also hate to mention it but there are some vindictive people who will take out your leaving on the care of your horse. Be prepared if this happens you may want to move him to the new place before Feb 1. You will however be paying board at both places as you will have to pay all the way to Feb 1 at the old place regardless. 

Good luck!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Speed Racer

It's a business arrangement, not a relationship. 

Give them 30 day's notice and tell them you'll be moving your horse. You don't have to give a reason why, even if they ask. It's none of their business.

Just be prepared to move your horse before those 30 days are up, if necessary. Many times it is.


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## Joe4d

depends on your contract, what does it say about notice ? Let me guess no written contract. Since it is a care issue in the absence of any written contract I dont think it would be out of line to tell them now that you will be moving by the end of the year since you most likely have vacation days and it will be easy on you. Thats still over 20 days. I wouldnt wait or pay all the way up to the end of January unless there was a contractual obligation. Even then a case could be made that they wern't living up to their end of the bargain and you needed to move the horse for it's well being. I wont keep my horse in a group pasture, and your hay situation is just another example of why.


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## Cowgirls Boots

sounds like the exact same problem i am having!


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## mls

Joe4d said:


> I wont keep my horse in a group pasture, and your hay situation is just another example of why.


So how do you keep your horse?


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## Blondehorselover

mls said:


> So how do you keep your horse?


 


I would like to know this as well...as I don't really have a choice all the horses go out to pasture together. And I was always told they're happier that way anyway. Thanks everyone for your answers! This is a month to month contract so I can cancel at the end of the month if I end up liking this place...


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

I don't have anything to add re: moving your horse or changing barns. But one sentence bothered me a little. 

"Plus they don't require all those vaccines and it's up to the owner if they want to vaccinate their horse or not. Except she does of course require a couple basic ones....NOT 8!!!!!!!!!!!"

What does she require and what does the current barn require that you don't want to give? For example, I only require 3, Rabies, WNV, Fluvac Innovator 6, but they cover a lot.


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## Blondehorselover

What does she require and what does the current barn require that you don't want to give? For example, I only require 3, Rabies, WNV, Fluvac Innovator 6, but they cover a lot.[/QUOTE]


She requires tetanus/coggins. But I will also be giving rabies/WNV. Here's what my current barn requires (and I've checked with vets in my area and most of these are separate vaccines...unlike a lot of people have 1 vaccine cover a lot of these, so I'd be paying for each separate vaccine...it's ridiculous)

Mandatory Fall vaccinations (deadline September 30th)
-Intranasal Flu
-EHV
-Annual Dental exam/float

Mandatory Spring vaccinations (deadline April 30th)
-Intranasal strangles (given two weeks after other vaccines) <---meaning an extra farm call
-Rabies
-West Nile
-Intranasal flu
-EWT
-EHV
-Coggins Test
-Fecal egg count

Ok so I may have exaggerated a bit on how much but I will feel much better knowing that I can choose what I want my horse vaccinated against.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

She requires tetanus/coggins. But I will also be giving rabies/WNV. Here's what my current barn requires (and I've checked with vets in my area and most of these are separate vaccines...unlike a lot of people have 1 vaccine cover a lot of these, so I'd be paying for each separate vaccine...it's ridiculous)

Mandatory Fall vaccinations (deadline September 30th)
-Intranasal Flu
-EHV
-Annual Dental exam/float

Mandatory Spring vaccinations (deadline April 30th)
-Intranasal strangles (given two weeks after other vaccines) <---meaning an extra farm call
-Rabies
-West Nile
-Intranasal flu
-EWT
-EHV
-Coggins Test
-Fecal egg count

Ok so I may have exaggerated a bit on how much but I will feel much better knowing that I can choose what I want my horse vaccinated against.[/QUOTE]

Ok, well Coggins she can't get away from, it's a state thing. I would recommend you get the Fluvac because it covers, Flu, Rhino and the Sleeping sickness viruses and has tetanus in it, costs about $18 if you buy it and give it yourself. West Nile I give separately, and it's expensive, $27, and Rabies is cheap and one I wouldn't ever do without. I can buy a 10 dose vial of Rabies for about $12, so even if you give individual it's probably less than $10. Lots cheaper than vet visits. I don't get into all the EHV, & Intranasal stuff because it's all more expensive than the combo shot. I do intranasal strangles for my horses but I don't require it for the boarders.


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## Joe4d

When my horse isnt at home I board at a place where all the horses are kept seperate. The big field is subdivided into smaller 2 to 3 acres fields, With small runins. Horses from different owners dont intermingle. My hay goes to my horse along with lots of other advantages. 
I know I am in the minority on this forum and even though post after post after post describe problems specifically caused by mixed owner horses in same area, everyone constantly makes excuses why doing otherwise is sooooooooooooo impossible and sooooooooooooooooo hard, and just wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy to much to ask. They are just that, excuses. It is easy, it's cheap, it eliminates so many hassles and I wouldnt have it any other way.


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## Stakie

I just moved my horse a couple weeks ago. If you have a contract read it. Give them the right amount of notice and move your horse ASAP. If it's a better place your horse deserves it. As for moving as soon as possible because they might take it out on your horse.. well take that advice. The old barn said my horse wasn't eating and that is why he lost so much weight.. but they were actually starving him. Don't let it happen to you!


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## Alwaysbehind

Blondehorselover said:


> Mandatory Fall vaccinations (deadline September 30th)
> -Intranasal Flu
> -EHV
> -Annual Dental exam/float
> 
> Mandatory Spring vaccinations (deadline April 30th)
> -Intranasal strangles (given two weeks after other vaccines) <---meaning an extra farm call
> -Rabies
> -West Nile
> -Intranasal flu
> -EWT
> -EHV
> -Coggins Test
> -Fecal egg count


Those are not all vaccines, you realize that, right?

Nothing they require seems out of line to me.
I am not sure why it is more appealing to be at a barn that does not require the horse your horse is next to be protected against things that they can pass along to your horse.

Fecal egg count is a way to determine your horse's worm load to help figure out the best deworming schedule for that horse. Not a vaccine.

Coggins is a test for EIA. It is a blood draw, not a vaccine.


Giving vaccines separate (vs. mixed in one shot) actually has advantages. (Not saying you have to do it that way, saying it is not something bad.)


Month to month still requires 30 days notice. Even if you do not have a written boarding contract, 30 days notice is the industry standard and the polite thing to do. You are a new horse owner, the horse would is smaller than you think, you do not want to be known as 'one of those people' who does not give notice.


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## Beauseant

Joe4d said:


> When my horse isnt at home I board at a place where all the horses are kept seperate. The big field is subdivided into smaller 2 to 3 acres fields, With small runins. Horses from different owners dont intermingle.


I prefer it this way also.

I do not like my horses in with other peoples horses. It is such a hassle in so many ways!!! When we had just Epona, before we bought Beau, she was in a mixed herd.... The BO threw a specific amount of hay, and the top horses ate almost all of it...so Epona was left to eat whatever was left over, if any....even though i paid the same as the other boarders for board, my horse was getting way less hay. 

And when we went to get her, we put our lives in danger. The boss horse would charge her and bite her, causing her to spook and nearly crush my son against a run in. The boss horse had no respect for us, and we didn't want the hassle nor were we allowed to take the time to teach him to. He didn't respect his owner either for that matter. he would constantly charge at Epona when we tried to take her out of the pasture not because he was protecting her....but because he connected "out" with grain time...and he wanted out to get his grain....and woe to anyone who stood in his way. He charged at us, and when we sent him off, he charge by us when we opened the gate. It was a royal PITA to go out to the field to get our horse. And we were without recourse as we were not allowed to take crops or otherwise smack or hit another boarder's horse...ESPECIALLY not the boss horse....his owner was ....adament that no one touch her horse. And she was the BO's favorite.

When we got Beau, they were given a paddock to themselves, thank God. And even though he is a psycho alpha, since we OWNED him, we were able to teach him to respect us and NOT to charge us or the gate or Epona. We were also allowed to buy extra hay from the BO to make sure Epona had enough to eat, since Beau had first pickings on the hay piles.

So, when we were barn shopping last year, that was one of our requirements. Private turnout. No exceptions. We were more than willing to pay extra for it just to not to have to deal with other people's badly behaved horses. Unfortunately, most facilities didn't have the space to offer private turnout.:--(

so, we were extremely blessed to find that an acquaintence of ours owned a 23 acre private residence farm with six horse stalls ...that was not being used. So we moved our horses there. Now they have the ULTIMATE in private turnout since they are the only horses on the prooperty.:lol::lol:

As Joe said, private turnout for me...I wouldn't have it any other way.

Dealing with the bite wounds, kick wounds, low horse not getting enough hay, being charged at by the alpha, alpha horse charging out the gate, etc.....who needs that kind of crap!!!

On the other side, though. When Beau was in a herd for the few months after we bought him until we could move him to Epona's barn, we had NONE of those hassles!!! HE was the alpha, and no horse would dare approach him when we came into the field to get him. They kept their distance from him ....at all times. 
It was such a relief to actually be able to walk up to your horse, halter him and lead him out without being charged at, charged by or him being bitten!!!

Starkie is right...be careful of spiteful BOs. We had to actually SNEAK Beau out of his barn...but legally. We came to the farm one day, informed the BO we were moving him, paid him for the final 30 days of board as we were required to give 30 days notice, and when he asked, so when will you be moving him, I replied "in about 15 minutes".

The contract required 30 days notice of termination of the contract which was paying for a stall, feed, etc. No requirement that the horse had to be there to receive those things...just my obligation to PAY for those things.

We did this as we were concerned for Beau's safety.


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## Beauseant

Blondehorselover said:


> She requires tetanus/coggins. But I will also be giving rabies/WNV. Here's what my current barn requires (and I've checked with vets in my area and most of these are separate vaccines...unlike a lot of people have 1 vaccine cover a lot of these, so I'd be paying for each separate vaccine...it's ridiculous)
> 
> Mandatory Fall vaccinations (deadline September 30th)
> -Intranasal Flu
> -EHV
> -Annual Dental exam/float
> 
> Mandatory Spring vaccinations (deadline April 30th)
> -Intranasal strangles (given two weeks after other vaccines) <---meaning an extra farm call
> -Rabies
> -West Nile
> -Intranasal flu
> -EWT
> -EHV
> -Coggins Test
> -Fecal egg count
> 
> Ok so I may have exaggerated a bit on how much but I will feel much better knowing that I can choose what I want my horse vaccinated against.


I don't see a problem with these vaccines. You may come to regret the"each owner chooses what they want their horse vaccinated against" stance. :-|

Horse facilities are breeding grounds for horse diseases...and you will never know for sure what the horses your horse lives with are vaccinated against or what they may have picked up in the off site travels. SCARY.

it cheaper to pay for the vaccines than to pay the vet later when my horse came down with strangles or the flu....or worse. 

The same for worming....if the barn owner doesn't have a worming regimen or FEC testing done, you could be spending money on wormer for no reason as it may not be working, or if the other horses aren't wormed, they could be reinfecting your horses as soon as the wormer leaves your horses bodies.

SOME things need to be done on a GROUP basis in a boarding facility, IMO.....vaccination and worming schedules are paramount!!!!

In these cases, EVERY horse in the facility needs to be on the same page!!!


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## Joe4d

As far as vaccines, I never paid much attention. I have a pretty good deal with my vet. He doesnt work on tugboats, I dont give him medical advice. I give my vet a very good description of my horse, where I take him, what he will be exposed to and trust his judgement, When you add in the 1000's for tack, fuel, horse trailers, hay, feed, shoes, barn, fencing, etc etc, I dont think a $20 vaccine is gonna break the bank.


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## Courtney

Beau – I dealt with a couple horses like that at my old barn too. Another person owned two Haflingers and a Friesian. The Haffies were stubborn and had the tendency to bully my young gelding, but would generally steer clear with a warning look from me. The Friesian, on the other hand… she was a bit of a witch and did not respect subtle warnings to stay out of my space. The first day she snaked her neck at me was the day she earned a good smack on the shoulder. The day she nearly ran me over in her haste to bite and chase my horse away was the day I introduced her to the crop I’d started carrying in that field. One good smack and she never came near me again. 

I don’t care whose horse it is – if it charges me and tries to run over me to get at my horse, it’s getting a good smack. If the tables were turned, I would fully expect someone to smack my horse for being pushy, rude or dangerous. There is no excuse for that behavior and I refuse to be injured because an owner can’t discipline their 1000-pound animal.


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## mls

Joe4d said:


> When my horse isnt at home I board at a place where all the horses are kept seperate. The big field is subdivided into smaller 2 to 3 acres fields, With small runins. Horses from different owners dont intermingle. My hay goes to my horse along with lots of other advantages.
> I know I am in the minority on this forum and even though post after post after post describe problems specifically caused by mixed owner horses in same area, everyone constantly makes excuses why doing otherwise is sooooooooooooo impossible and sooooooooooooooooo hard, and just wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy to much to ask. They are just that, excuses. It is easy, it's cheap, it eliminates so many hassles and I wouldnt have it any other way.


Cheap? Do you have any idea what individual turnout is in most places?

We have the ocassional scuffle in the turnout but 99% of the time, the horses get along just fine. Horses are herd animals and meant to have buddies.


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## Alwaysbehind

MLS, you noticed that Joe boards, right? People who board are well known for thinking their preferred way of doing things is cheap and no big deal for the barn owner to do.


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## Joe4d

I wouldnt care if it was a big deal or not. Thats what I looked for. I know exactly what it costs, as I am paying it. And it is the same cost as other places that just throw all the horses in one big field. If more people looked for it more barns would offer it. I know several places that do it, so I know by example it is pretty simple. But like I said above everyone prefers to make excuses and then put up with injuries, accidental breedings, worms, disease, lack of food, violent horses, stolen tack and on and on and on,I dont really believe in turn out either. Each field has a run in. The horses turn themselves in and out as they like. Sorry I just wouldnt tolerate group pasture. It is to simple not to.


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## Alwaysbehind

Guessing more places do not offer it because there are people who prefer horses go out in groups. Them being herd animals and all.

Thankfully there are barns that offer all kinds of set up situations so everyone can be happy.


Group or private working better or worse truly depends on the animals and the situation.


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## Chardavej

I have a boarding barn with mixed turnout. I have 3 seperate pastures with shelters. I have them according to who gets along, the meek horses are together in two of the pastures and the others are in the larger pasture. There is the occational bite mark, but very rarely. They all get along well and are happy and fat. They all like to greet you and are well mannered. Sometimes they can start to get a little too much in your space ("Hi there! Missed you! Got a cookie??") but waive your hand and they back up.

But they also are not hungry, round bales of nice soft hay in all pastures, feedstalls that they line up in to eat (so going "out" of the pasture doesn't = feeding time). They are all rotationaly wormed the same day with the same product and we have spring shots/coogins and fall shots and exams. 

It's my way on that, I wont deal with "well I don't want to worm my horse with that or I don't want to vaccinate against this". 

And here is some pics of the feedstalls, which are AWESOME as they are covered, the feedroom door opens right out to them, they line up every morning and evening and each horse gets their correct feed and suppliments:







































http://s36.photobucket.com/albums/e28/chardavej/BB photos/?action=view&current=Ginger001.jpg


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## Beauseant

Courtney said:


> I don’t care whose horse it is – if it charges me and tries to run over me to get at my horse, it’s getting a good smack. There is no excuse for that behavior and I refuse to be injured because an owner can’t discipline their 1000-pound animal.


 
My thoughts exactly! EXCEPT this alpha horse's owner was the queen of the barn...and NO ONE smacks or threatens the QUEEN'S horse!!! EVEN the Queen!!!:shock::shock:

I am not kidding. Seriously.


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## Beauseant

Just to clarify: I agree horses do better in a group. I have two horses. I want them grouped together....same if I had 3 or 4.

I want my horses in a group.

I just want to make sure i OWN all the horses in the group.


**********************************************************
This is serious, folks. I've dealt with too many spoiled brat boarder horses! Oh, the stories I could tell....:shock:


Currently, I have 2 horses...so that is the grouping I want them in. If we ever get a 3rd horse, I will want all three grouped together...and so on.

Here's a newsflash: ALOT of owners do not discipline or teach their horses manners! They let them walk all over them! And one day, that may be literal....It's sad, but as long as I don't have to deal with their horses, it's fine with me if they are ruled by them!!!!


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## Beauseant

I have a question for ChardaveJ....how do you keep a horse from reaching through the space between boards and biting it's neighbor?

It's a nice setup, but it wouldn't work for our psycho alpha OTTB...he'd reach his head through the boards openings and bite his neighbors!

ALOT of things NORMAL horses do wouldn't work for our psycho. Take run in sheds for example....no go. HE would take over the run in and let no one else in it. Our current property owner suggested we leave the barn door open so the horses could go in and out as they wish. We told her it wouldn't work. And it didn't. ANY time Epona tried to enter the barn, Beau chased her off. Once she sneaked in when he wasnt' looking and all heck broke loose.....he cornered her and attacked her...and he meant business. So, no runs ins for Beau, and no nice setups like in Chardavej's pics....:-(

I guess it's the price we pay for having a psycho horse.

Wanted to add: private turnout isn't just a PREFERENCE, it's a necessity.... Beau is the greatest horse in the world with people. He's aggressive and dangerous to other horses.


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## Alwaysbehind

Beauseant said:


> I have a question for ChardaveJ....how do you keep a horse from reaching through the space between boards and biting it's neighbor?


Her horses are only in there to eat. Nothing more. They are too busy eating to bite their neighbor.


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## Beauseant

I know that AB!!!!!

....but Beau WOULD find time. In between mouthfulls of grain. Just wondering if she has that problem or if Beau is truly just a psycho!!!!

He is fed in his stall and he STILL tries to bite her through the bars.....he can't of course because the bars are too close together...but those boards in the pics are NOT.....


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## Alwaysbehind

Did you read, she has her pastures divided by personality type. 
It appears her horses are not like yours.


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## mls

Alwaysbehind said:


> Did you read, she has her pastures divided by personality type.
> It appears her horses are not like yours.


Ha - so are ours but food is food! 

We have tie stalls similiar but ours have custom made steel bar grates so they cannot contact the next horse. We also put up rump chains so the horse cannot leave until we say so. Horses are fed per need. If horse A is done before horse B, horse A cannot leave their stall and chase horse B out.


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## Beauseant

Apparently, NO ONE's horse is like mine.:? Else NO ONE would use run in sheds, or set ups like in Chardavej's pics....

sounds like a cool set up mls....wish you had pics.

I like the idea of Chardavej's pics....but it wouldn't work for Beau. Now, if those board slats were closer together or if there were bars so he couldn't bite his neighbor, it would work.

It's nice to see the horses all getting along so nicely in the pic.... makes me wish our boy wasn't so equine aggressive.


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## paintsrule2

I have been both a boarder and now a BO. Since I have show horses, I have never accepted group turnout either, as my show horse would inevitably come in marked up from a scuffle between it's pasturemates. I do however, provide private turnout where horses can see each other, but not touch each other. My broodies are in a large pasture together, the weaners get turned out together, the yearlings get turned out together, but after that, they get separated over a fence line. I also never feed in a group situation, except for hay in the above stated groups. Grain is always fed individually so that I know that the horses are getting their own whole ration and supplements. If a horse begins to lose any weight, or a boarder even thinks that they may be, that horse then stays in until they have eaten their entire ration, hay and all, and then can go out with the group. In the past few years, I have basically closed the barn and no longer take boarders, except for a few close friends in the winter months. As a person who generally loves animals more than people ) I could no longer deal with the challenging personalities that you can sometimes encounter as a boarding facility...


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## Blondehorselover

Alwaysbehind said:


> Those are not all vaccines, you realize that, right?
> 
> Nothing they require seems out of line to me.
> I am not sure why it is more appealing to be at a barn that does not require the horse your horse is next to be protected against things that they can pass along to your horse.
> 
> Fecal egg count is a way to determine your horse's worm load to help figure out the best deworming schedule for that horse. Not a vaccine.
> 
> Coggins is a test for EIA. It is a blood draw, not a vaccine.
> 
> 
> Giving vaccines separate (vs. mixed in one shot) actually has advantages. (Not saying you have to do it that way, saying it is not something bad.)
> 
> 
> Month to month still requires 30 days notice. Even if you do not have a written boarding contract, 30 days notice is the industry standard and the polite thing to do. You are a new horse owner, the horse would is smaller than you think, you do not want to be known as 'one of those people' who does not give notice.


 
I realize that's not all the vaccines. And I'm not a new horse owner. I just don't remember ever giving that many vaccines to my other horses and I just thought it'd be nice for ME to actually have a say what my horse gets


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## paintsrule2

Many vaccines come lumped together in one shot now, for example, I purchase:

WNV + EWTFR as one
PHF + Rabies as one
IN strangles

I give all of my own shots, and save considerably over having the vet come out every year to do this (since I own 10 of my own) It costs me about $80/horse. Since a few of these have specified that they are 6mo shots (WNV and PHF) I usually vaccinate right before vector season, so that the horses are protected and I don't have to give a booster of the shot.

For horses that travel away from the farm, the do get an extra Flu shot, sometimes every 90 days. Also, horses that travel west of the Mississippi or to the deep south, may end up getting additional vaccines for viruses that are not as prevalent in the northern midwest.


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## Alwaysbehind

Blondehorselover said:


> I realize that's not all the vaccines.


I was not sure you realized that since you said there were eight vaccines and there are eight things on that list.


I personally would not want to board at a facility that does not require a good vaccine and deworming program.



ETA - When considering giving your own vaccines be sure to find out what your state requirements are. Many states require certain vaccines be given by a licensed veterinarian.


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## Chardavej

Alwaysbehind said:


> Her horses are only in there to eat. Nothing more. They are too busy eating to bite their neighbor.


Well we did have one chunky monkey that was food aggresive, but an easy keeper so he got a little grain (a lite low NSC grain) and he would back up a little bit and bite at the feet of the horse beside him and they would back out, he would back up and rush in their stall. If you see in the second pic we added solid wood walls all the way to the ground and that stopped that. After that he would then just back out and wait patiently for them to finish then go in a lick the bowl, hoping for a crumb or two, poor hungry skinny guy! (his mom complained about how big he was, said he was pregnant, LOL!) 

If anyone tried to bother another while in the stall they would warn with a back hoof, so we didn't have much issues after we put up the walls.

I tell you another thing, it doesn't take them long to figure out to go in them to eat. I usually have to put a food bowl on the ground near the end. And horses that WERE hard to trailer load, load like a dream after a few weeks of going into these narrow feedstalls! Plus!!


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## Courtney

Beauseant said:


> My thoughts exactly! EXCEPT this alpha horse's owner was the queen of the barn...and NO ONE smacks or threatens the QUEEN'S horse!!! EVEN the Queen!!!:shock::shock:
> 
> I am not kidding. Seriously.


It's probably a good thing I'm not at that barn, because the Queen would have been appalled. :wink:


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## Beauseant

Courtney said:


> It's probably a good thing I'm not at that barn, . :wink:


A very good thing, indeed! You smack or scare the Queen's horse and she'll have you beheaded!!!!!:shock:


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## kitten_Val

Alwaysbehind said:


> Month to month still requires 30 days notice. Even if you do not have a written boarding contract, 30 days notice is the industry standard and the polite thing to do. You are a new horse owner, the horse would is smaller than you think, you do not want to be known as 'one of those people' who does not give notice.


I moved without any notice when my horse was beat up badly, and when I started to complain (the BO put very aggressive new horse in field that run others badly (for several weeks and didn't calmed down) from the hay bale and just in general), the BO refused to even try to solve the situation (by either move the horse or move my horses in other field), and said I can leave if I don't like it. My contract said nothing about the notice, and it was almost the end of the month, so in couple days I just loaded them on trailer. I don't care how small the horse world is or what other people say about me when it comes to the health of my animals. Period.


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## Alwaysbehind

Good practice does not always have to be written down.

Lots of people leave with out giving any notice. It does not make it right.

And giving notice does not mean you have to stay there for the 30 days. It just means you have to pay for the 30 days.



Again, the horse world is a small place. Far smaller than most people want to believe it is. Word does get around if you are one of those boarders who likes to leave with out giving notice.

ETA - It is not like the OP has some reason to leave that is life and death for her horse either. There are some things she does not like. Kind of different.


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## kitten_Val

Alwaysbehind said:


> ETA - It is not like the OP has some reason to leave that is life and death for her horse either. There are some things she does not like. Kind of different.


Oh, yes, I agree with that. I absolutely didn't care about my BO behavior (if she wasn't in mood to talk let it be), and frankly that wouldn't be even a reason for me to like/dislike the barn. But if there is not enough hay for the horses (and that's what I understood from the original post) then IMHO it's violation of the contract. Because feed (enough to keep an average horse in good weight (not talking about those hard to keep the weight on, of course) and fresh water are a must for the boarding. If it's indeed a case and BO doesn't care then I don't see any reason to wait. Just move to the different barn. 

With that being said I can only tell from what I read, and without seeing everything (or at least pics) it's really hard to judge what's going on.


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## Alwaysbehind

Feed amounts are whatever you (general you) agreed to in your boarding contract. In many cases that is not enough to keep a horse in good weight and the owner has to pay extra for more. A barn has no requirement to provide extra feed just because a horse owner proclaims their horse needs it.


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## kitten_Val

Alwaysbehind said:


> Feed amounts are whatever you (general you) agreed to in your boarding contract. In many cases that is not enough to keep a horse in good weight and the owner has to pay extra for more. A barn has no requirement to provide extra feed just because a horse owner proclaims their horse needs it.


I've never seen the feed amount to be a part of the boarding contract to be honest (I'm talking about hay and grass here, not the grain). If horse is an "easy keeper" and healthy, and still loosing the weight then obviously there is not enough feed out there. I still say it's wrong if you pay for full board feed including (unless it's a self-care barn).


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## mls

kitten_Val said:


> I've never seen the feed amount to be a part of the boarding contract to be honest (I'm talking about hay and grass here, not the grain). If horse is an "easy keeper" and healthy, and still loosing the weight then obviously there is not enough feed out there. I still say it's wrong if you pay for full board feed including (unless it's a self-care barn).


So you are saying as a BO when I say we feed per need, I am not honest?


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## Alwaysbehind

In the big world there are plenty of facilities (big and small) that feed an amount. Period. No more than that amount. Unless you pay for it (some will even not let you pay for more hay). Read through any number of threads on any horse forum. 
Full board does not equal one thing always.


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## mls

Alwaysbehind said:


> In the big world there are plenty of facilities (big and small) that feed an amount. Period. No more than that amount. Unless you pay for it (some will even not let you pay for more hay). Read through any number of threads on any horse forum.
> Full board does not equal one thing always.


I understand that some folks aren't honest. But again, someone here is painting the everyone with the same brush. It's very frustrating. "Everyone" and "No one" are very limiting terms. I merely want to open eyes.


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## Alwaysbehind

mls said:


> I understand that some folks aren't honest. But again, someone here is painting the everyone with the same brush. It's very frustrating. "Everyone" and "No one" are very limiting terms. I merely want to open eyes.


I agree. My point was more towards Kitten who was insisting that full care means one thing period and a barn must feed whatever a horse needs, period.

I have experienced more barns with maximum feed (with out additional pay or the owner doing the addition work) limits than I have encountered barns that do not have them.


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## kitten_Val

mls said:


> So you are saying as a BO when I say we feed per need, I am not honest?


Actually I think "per need" is more honest than all the same. Not too many BOs I know do it this way (or you have to pay extra if you want it).

"To be honest" = IMO if that was a confusion. :wink:


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## kitten_Val

Alwaysbehind said:


> I agree. My point was more towards Kitten who was insisting that full care means one thing period and a barn must feed whatever a horse needs, period.
> 
> I have experienced more barns with maximum feed (with out additional pay or the owner doing the addition work) limits than I have encountered barns that do not have them.


AB, I still stand my opinion that the average (healthy and not a hard keeper) horse should have enough hay/grass to maintain a good weight. Are you saying if I pay quite a lot for the boarding I also have to deliver my own hay? That doesn't make any sense (plus how in world would I check that hay goes to MY horse and not all others unless it's one horse in paddock?). Grain, supplements, eta-eta-eta extras should be paid by the owner (unless discussed/negotiated with the BO).


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## Alwaysbehind

kitten_Val said:


> AB, I still stand my opinion that the average (healthy and not a hard keeper) horse should have enough hay/grass to maintain a good weight. Are you saying if I pay quite a lot for the boarding I also have to deliver my own hay? That doesn't make any sense (plus how in world would I check that hay goes to MY horse and not all others unless it's one horse in paddock?). Grain, supplements, eta-eta-eta extras should be paid by the owner (unless discussed/negotiated with the BO).


I am saying there are barns that your full board check, big as it is, small as it is, whatever, includes X quarts or X pounds of grain and Y flakes of hay. Period. 

What a healthy not hard keeper Arabian might take is very different than what a not hard keeper TB might take. 

There is no set amount of feed that works for all horses. So the barn(s) pick a maximum that is included in your board. (For one Arabian barn near me that is a very low number too. But all their horses do fine on it.)

I checked out a barn (owned by well known horse people) whose maximum hay allotment was two small flakes 2x per day. (Probably came out to 10 pounds of hay daily total.) In my world that is not enough. But that is what their boarding contract said. If the horse owner wants more hay given they have to buy it themselves, transport it themselves, and put it outside their horses stall, daily (no storage at the barn).
This barn is usually full. (And since I feel hay is far more important than grain I chose to not board at this facility even though it offered everything else I could have wanted.)


So....in your small snap snot of the world maybe a barn owner should/has to feed whatever amount a horse takes. Reality is very different. 

And really, who decides what is average when there is no set amount in writing?


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## mls

Alwaysbehind said:


> There is no set amount of feed that works for all horses. So the barn(s) pick a maximum that is included in your board. (For one Arabian barn near me that is a very low number too. But all their horses do fine on it.)


Yes. 

We feed per need. Some horses do absolutely nothing. They get a couple of handfuls. Some are hard keepers, they get more. We have two boarded special needs horses that are medicated 3x a day - they have extra grain to eat their meds. 

Have I asked for extra from the boarders - yes. Two horses owners wanted more weight on. I suggested they purchase a supplement that I am happy to add to their evening meals. Horses are in fine shape. We compromised.


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## kitten_Val

Alwaysbehind said:


> I am saying there are barns that your full board check, big as it is, small as it is, whatever, includes X quarts or X pounds of grain and *Y flakes of hay*. Period.


Really. How about feeding big bales hay/grass while in pasture and not in stall (yes, I can see Y flakes agreement for the stall board)? I've never seen any ad either in paper or on website (or the contract and I've seen number when I was looking for the barn while back) saying "1 big bale/month" for your horse. When they feed big bales it usually says "free choice". Or nothing at all.


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## Alwaysbehind

I have never boarded anywhere that round bales were fed. In my part of the world round bales are not considered horse feed by many people. (I buy horse quality round bales in the winter and use them, I am talking boarding barns.)



You can twist it anyway you want but the long and short of it is, there is no universal 'full care means all the food they want' rule. Period.


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## mls

kitten_Val said:


> Really. How about feeding big bales hay/grass while in pasture and not in stall (yes, I can see Y flakes agreement for the stall board)? I've never seen any ad either in paper or on website (or the contract and I've seen number when I was looking for the barn while back) saying "1 big bale/month" for your horse. When they feed big bales it usually says "free choice". Or nothing at all.


Boils down to communication. Ask up front.

Our rules state that contracts can be amended to meet the needs of the boarder. We don't advertise we are pushovers, but we are certainly willing to discuss what the horse needs.


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## kitten_Val

mls said:


> Boils down to communication. Ask up front.


Very true.

All good barns I've been to trying the best to address the needs and agree/negotiate something acceptable for the BO as well as the border. Which IMHO is a way to go to benefit both. There may be an extra pay for that (since many "special needs" require more time and hassle), but it is very fair. 

The problem I've seen (in real life as well as on the forum), often people complain or make assumptions without just going straight to the BO (or the border if other way around) and discussing the situation and possible ways to resolve it.


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## Alwaysbehind

kitten_Val said:


> The problem I've seen (in real life as well as on the forum), often people complain or make assumptions without just going straight to the BO (or the border if other way around) and discussing the situation and possible ways to resolve it.


This is true.

They also assume that because they think it should be (fed more, given more bedding, turned out a certain way, etc) that it has to be that way, period.


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## kitten_Val

Alwaysbehind said:


> I have never boarded anywhere that round bales were fed. In my part of the world round bales are not considered horse feed by many people. (I buy horse quality round bales in the winter and use them, I am talking boarding barns.)
> 
> 
> 
> You can twist it anyway you want but the long and short of it is, there is no universal 'full care means all the food they want' rule. Period.


It's interesting, because round bales are very common here (cheap barns as well as pricey ones). Square bales most of the time are used for feeding in stalls (I feed square bales myself, but I have a storage problems with round). 

I never argued there is universal definition of the "full care". There is _*not*_ such a thing. But in those good barns I've never seen a skinny horse (I'd say quite opposite - some should wear grazing muzzles because they were getting fat), and owners I talked to don't pay any extras or deliver own hay. In those not-so-good (to say polite) there are plenty of skinny ones.


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## kitten_Val

Alwaysbehind said:


> They also assume that because they think it should be (fed more, given more bedding, turned out a certain way, etc) that it has to be that way, period.


Lol! AB, when I talk about feed, bedding, turn-out, and so on I'm talking from the point of view of the _reasonable _border. :wink: Of course there are people with unreasonable (or even unrealistic) requests. But that's the different story.


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## Alwaysbehind

I am not sure how not seeing a skinny horse equates to a barn feeding whatever the horse needs at no extra cost.


I only know of the one barn that requires you to bring your own hay if you want more than their small ration. 
I do know most barns have a maximum feed that is included.
If you want Dobbin to have more feed you pay extra. 

If you board at a good barn you tend to be willing to pay the extra to make sure Dobbin is fat and happy.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

All this talk about feed limits and such made me go look at my boarding contract because I couldn't remember the wording on it and I knew I addressed feed and water in it. 

"Dreamcatcher Arabian Horses LLC agrees to provide a clean facility and appropriate feed and water to maintain the animal."

That's it. That's all I say about the feed, water and bedding situation here. The horses all have free choice grazing access to a round bale in pasture, are brought in at night to get their 'grain' (Strategy), salt and any supplements their owners provide. They get grass from a small bale to keep them busy through the night. They have a pond to drink out of and huge stock tanks all over the property and each stall has clean water at all times. I bed deep, pick 2X/day and strip and disinfect monthly. 

And when I brought in a horse I'd had to reposess because she was being starved, when I took her to the vet the vet tech said, "NO WAY is that one of Pat's horses, she likes her horses ROUND!". LOL!

I figure I feed appx 10lbs of grass hay at night, each horse gets approx. 5 lbs of Strategy a day and they get 1 oz loose salt at night in winter, 1 oz twice a day in summer. 

I would charge extra if for instance, the horse I reposessed was a boarder. I'm feeding her 2 lbs Strategy & 1 lb Amplify 4X/day to get her weight back up. That's quite a bit more than Maintenance, so I'd charge extra for the Amplify ($40), and roughly 240 lbs Strategy/mo and the other horses on Maintenance are getting about 150, so I'd add 2 bags of Strategy to the bill. Otherwise, she gets the same free choice hay, so there'd be no charge for that. So, I'd charge about $75/mo extra until she gets up to weight. Then it would drop off to normal. 

Otherwise, unless there's something really odd, I don't add a bunch to my board bills.


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## ~*~anebel~*~

At our barn everything is fed as much as it needs hay wise (from fat ponies to 18hh 86" blanket wearing monsters) and outside of beet pulp, complete feed, oats and bran if you supply it they will feed it for no extra charge. If your horse needs timothy hay for health reasons, they will bring it in for you no extra charge.
The outdoor horses are all on group turnout and a round bale and they try to keep the ones that get supplements all in one field so they can all get fed at the same time, however if it is just one horse they will grab a halter and go stand with the horse to feed it (I think this is only the one horse they have now that they do this for because she is ancient and has been at that barn since she was young). Everyone always has water access even though the individual turnouts have buckets.. they get dumped every night so they don't freeze in winter and re-filled when the horses go out or drink everything.

So everyone is generally fat and happy outside unless it's a baby in a growth spurt and the indoor horses are all maintained at a good weight (my horse always looks awesome - I have to try to keep weight off of him and when we clip him he is shinier than he is with long hair). Keep in mind that board is nearly $700/mo indoors and $350/mo outdoors... So you do have to pay for the care and facilities that you want..

They do require worming and usually just do everyone in one go unless you request to do it yourself. Everyone gets spring vaccines, flu/rhino, 3 or 5 way depending on if they go off property and IN strangles. My horse gets flu/rhino in the fall as well because he travels off property in winter. Teeth floating is another common practice, it's not required but you get looked at funny if you don't at least get the vet to look at your horses teeth. None of those things do I consider "too much"... it's part of owning a horse to make sure they are comfortable and protected from life threatening diseases which there are vaccines for...


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## kitten_Val

Alwaysbehind said:


> I am not sure how not seeing a skinny horse equates to a barn feeding whatever the horse needs at no extra cost.


It depends on what you mean by "what the horse needs". Flax (I add it)? No. Min/vit supplements (I add it)? No. Oil (some people add)? No. Those are extras even though I consider them as a "need" for my horses. No skinny horses means just one thing: they get enough nutrition in (which is just hay or grass borders don't pay extra for). That's all I tried to say. And I want to add that we are walking in circles here trying to get who's "definition" is more "defined"...


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## Alwaysbehind

kitten_Val said:


> No skinny horses means just one thing: they get enough nutrition in (which is just hay or grass borders don't pay extra for).


How do you know, driving by, that the amount of hay and grain given to those fat horses is not something the boarders paid extra for?

That is some pretty serious assuming you are doing!


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## kitten_Val

Alwaysbehind said:


> How do you know, driving by, that the amount of hay and grain given to those fat horses is not something the boarders paid extra for?
> 
> That is some pretty serious assuming you are doing!


Because I talked to some of those borders. And to the BOs asking what is extra. :wink: I rarely assume something (and if I don't know or guessing I have no problem to say so).


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