# (mini) Mule training question



## jmc (Jun 10, 2012)

My molly mini mules are now about 8 months old. One is beginning to stand quietly at the tie, but the other fiddles around rears, digs, and just generally is a nuisance unless you're grooming her or Right There With Her. I've tried various corrections, to no avail.

I tried to do some patience tying with her today, and after two hours of rearing, fiddling around, digging, and a spot of throwing herself to the ground, I finally gave up, made her just stand quietly with me right there for 30 seconds (which took nearly 10 minutes), and put her back out.

If she was an adult, I'd probably just leave her to fret for the day. And keep doing it each day, as my trainer (who is training a riding mule now) suggested. Is there a preferred way to teach a mule patience? With my horse gelding, it just came over time, I never did any kind of "stand around for hours" kind of patience training with him, but Thistle's fiddle-f*rting around is annoying and I'd like to find a way to stop it.


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## xJumperx (Feb 19, 2012)

The woman I rode under (saddle mules) trained her molly filly to tie just how you suggested - tie her up to something solid with a solid tie and just let her fight it out. It took about 2 weeks of just throwing a tantrum before she finally just settled in. She was a young foal when this all went down, so I'm not sure if it makes a difference that she is a saddle/full sized mule and your girl is a mini.


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## Mulefeather (Feb 22, 2014)

I would go back a step from tying- go back to teaching her to give to pressure, and teach her the command "stand". 

As you mentioned, she's a baby still. It's going to take time, repetition, and a fair amount of patience on your part. Right now I'd be worried about the potential damage she could do to her neck and spine from setting back on a tie line, so letting her throw a tantrum is probably not the best solution- and the fighting she's doing shows she doesn't really "get" the concept of giving to pressure, to me. 

It's going back to baby steps, but if that's what she needs to understand what you're asking of her, that's what she needs. You can teach "Stand" in hand in a stall by just asking her to stop- that's it. If she moves, put her back and tell her "stand" again. If she stands, pet her and praise her. It may take 500 times of doing it, but once the idea is there that she needs to stop and stand still whenever she hears "Stand", you can work with her on tying - when she gets fussy, tell her "STAND".


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## jmc (Jun 10, 2012)

Mulefeather said:


> I would go back a step from tying- go back to teaching her to give to pressure, and teach her the command "stand".


Yes, that's basically what I'm doing now, which is the way I taught Yankee (a horse) originally. I had someone tell me that I should be doing this with my mules, but I was unhappy with the results so I won't be. I worried about damage, too, though I tie them with a short thick bungee trailer tie rather than a solid rope tie for that reason (and others).

She gives to pressure fairly well, but she's an alpha mare and really just wants to do things her way. She responds *very* well to food rewards, but rather too well, because even though she understands what the food reward is for, she gets pushy and demanding for food in a major way after the first reward, as soon as she's completed the required action, and even if she hasn't, so I use them *very* sparingly. I really don't want to use food rewards for standing still, anyway.


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## Mulefeather (Feb 22, 2014)

Honestly I wouldn't use food rewards without a marker signal and the behavior being tied to a cue or command. Part of the issue with training with treats is that without a marker signal (like a clicker) it can take a lot longer to pair the desired behavior with a reward. They also need to learn that mugging or pushing for treats doesn't work- just like a job, you don't work, you don't get paid.


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## jmc (Jun 10, 2012)

Mulefeather said:


> Honestly I wouldn't use food rewards without a marker signal and the behavior being tied to a cue or command. Part of the issue with training with treats is that without a marker signal (like a clicker) it can take a lot longer to pair the desired behavior with a reward. They also need to learn that mugging or pushing for treats doesn't work- just like a job, you don't work, you don't get paid.


I use a 'marker signal' of "good girl". They didn't know what treats were in the beginning, so I've only just started demanding, as I do with Yankee, that they ALWAYS perform an action before getting a treat, even if it's just the typical "smile" - and they don't get a treat unless I specifically ask for the action; Yankee is always asking for treats by "talking" (because he never quite got "smile"), but he won't get one unless I specifically request the action.

They're babies though, and they haven't learned yet that mugging gets them the opposite of what they want. They will learn soon enough, though, and probably a lot faster than Yankee did.


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