# Can you guys pleaseee help!! Major problem.



## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

Ok well i rode my horse sunday and it was the worse ride of my life!! She was rearing and throwing her head and then she would be fine! then just randomly BOOM she galloped off well she wouldnt stop even tho there wasnt a foot left of the reins from my hands to her mouth! well i tryed to turn her and she turned to sharply and i lost my balence and i came off well my foot was still in the stirrups and i got dragged a while!! Well i went to see her today and my trainer rode her before me and she was fine no rearing no head throwing no galloping walk trot canter perfect. well i was getting up on her and i just froze! i freaked and ive been on a horse thats took off before and i was fine. but even my trainer said that shes never seen me like this in the 8 yrs shes been teaching me to ride. I mean i got up in the saddle and froze tensed up and she started throwing her head and rearing i think she knew i was scared. And i know if i get on a diff horse i could go canter off in the feilds with out worries. What should i do! When i got home i just couldnt figure out why i freaked usually i dont even when i got ran over by a horse i was fine and got over it. please please reply.


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## FGRanch (Feb 9, 2008)

HAF if the horse is only doing this with you then I would think that it must be something you are doing. Can you have an experienced horse person watch you ride and tell you if you are doing anything wrong? It could be something so simple. Me and Kita when thru a stage where she would rear, so I had my husband watch me riding her and sure enough I was making a mistake. It wan't Kita at all. Most of the time that horses have an issues is actally because of their owner/handler. I'm not saying that you are a bad rider, but everyone makes mistakes. And if you are timid with her it is only going to make matters worse. Trying working her on the ground more, get used to her again. She is still a young horse and she needs training be patient with her. 

Just our of curiosity why do you not get a older, been there, done that horse?


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

ok my trainer is an exsperience rider [shown and won a TON] and she watches me ride a lot and her and I KNOW when she took off i wasnt doing anything wrong and i know today she was rearing cause i was tense cause of what happened all i want to know is how can i get over freezeing up when i get up on her. the day she took off she was just over excited but ya and ive had a been there done that horse and ive had 8 yrs of exsperence with riding and it was boring there was nothing to fix or work with lol


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## FGRanch (Feb 9, 2008)

HAF if you want my honest opinion. I don't think you are ready to train a horse. You have had problems with your last two horses. Now I'm not trying to sound mean but maybe it's best for both you and the horses if you get a horse with more training. Not necessarly a been there done that horse but a horse with all the basics that you can just put the minor finishing touches on. 

And if you find well broke horses boring what are you going to do when Chance is finished? Sell her? Trade her for a grennie? I mean I enjoy riding horses weather they are finished show horses or my greenies. Isn't that the way it's supposed to be?

And I really don't care if your "trainer" has showen and placed. That does not mean that she knows how to train a horse. All that tells me is that she knows how to ride.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Sorry, HAF, but I have to go with FGR on this one; if Chance didn't do anything wrong with your trainer on her, then by ruling things out, there must be something that is up between you and her. 

For the stopping - try turning her in a tight circle if she bolts - drop one rein and make her spin into a small circle. 

If she's tossing her head and rearing - well, don't let her get out of work - punish her for being bad by making her go forwards, do lateral work... just something other than rearing. Trick is to get her working hard the moment you feel her start to act up. 
Your horse should stay in a collected frame all the time - correct it immediately if she comes out of it. If she starts to get out from being bent to the right direction, correct it. Any foot she puts wrong, correct it - don't let her think for a second she has any chance of getting away with anything.

Greenies are tough to deal with, which is why it takes a very experienced hand to being them along; Chance is at a very impressionable age, so you have to be very firm in what is right and wrong.

As for the freezing up, don't worry about it - we all do that once in a while... you just have to shake it off and get ready for the next round - unfortunately with a young horse you're going to have good days and bad, but with time and training the good will soon outnumber the bad. 
I would suggest sitting down for 5 minutes before each ride and imagine yourself going through a perfect ride - don't let anything go wrong in your mind, then take 5 deep breaths and go for a great ride! It's amazing what positive thinking can do!


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## .Delete. (Jan 7, 2008)

HorsesAreForever said:


> i freaked .


That could be one of your problems. You panic, in any situation it automatically because many times worse.


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## SonnyWimps (Feb 22, 2008)

I'm agreeing with JDI and FGR on this also.

Sounds like there is an issue between you and Chance, since you said your trainer could ride her fine. Like JDI said, do lots of groundwork...do LOTS of circles, the moment you feel her acting up pull her in a tight circle and get the attention back on you. 

Also like JDI said, we all freeze up once in a while. Just when you do, take a deep breath and continue on


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## PrintMeInColor (Apr 2, 2008)

A horse that randomly does that can be in pain or ill.

-back problems
- inside their body problems
- legs hurts
- sore muscles.

And green horses can easier to get problems like that.

Suddenly they have started their training.
They get a saddle on that might hurt their back.
They have to train and use new muscles that they might not have used. They have pretty much been out of anything that will be called a training.
It's just like if you put a horse out in a field for some years (3 maby)
and then take it back in and start riding it.
The horse isn't going to be ready in just few weeks.
They will have to train their muscles again.

Almost everytime it's the riders fault. We are almost allways the ones that are making mistakes. Sadly but yes.
While riding a horse we give them lots of signals. Turn her, do that, slow down, go faster ect ect.
With young horses it's allways harder then full trained.
They don't know those signals. We have to teach them, and show them and make them understand that when we push our leg her then we want the horse to do this and that. It can take alot of time teaching it.
Also if we give the horse a signal that might say turn or something and they don't know it, they don't feel save anymore. If the horse doesn't feel save or it is sceared, it will do the only thing they do best. Run from the dangeour.



- I couldn't finish my post because I had to run-
but here comes the last part.

Make sure that the horse know that you are the leader, and that it respect you.
Have it calm while you are working with it.
We all "freak" out or freeze at times. It's pretty normal, you see horse goes crazy of corse we freeze, we freeze and think about what will happen if the horse lends on you. They are so much bigger, and stronger, we just have to be wiser.

Training a green horse is hard as hell.
You have to do it step by step, and being careful all the step of the way. One mistake and the horse has good memory and you can be pretty sure that the horse will remember it for a quite long time.

Take a deep breath.
Make sure the horse fully understands you.
Work slow.
And think about what you are doing wrong, because we are allways doing something wrong.
Oh and also chek if the horse is in pain or ill.


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

ok FGR I know i can train a horse ive done it before and i also enjoy riding been there done that horse but i dont want one i want one i can finish myself! Also and i didnt come here for u guys to tell me to get a diff horse!! Look I know I didnt do anything wrong and I freaked because of what happened its not easy to get over being draged quite a while! all i asked was how can i get over my fear and my trainer also had schooled many many horses. and i did get after her when throwing her head whichh lead to rearing then boom and i couldnt do anything else BUT turn in in a tight circle because she wouldnt STOP. And I think my trainer could ride her cause she was calm and not nervous but was because of what hapened and i know she knew it so she was gonna take advantage. 

BTW: Chance isnt green she just hasnt been ridden all winter and needs a ton of work 

FGR: only one of my other 2 horses has had problems will just was very sick. Also No i wont sell her when she gets going again Ill feel accomplished knowing I did it. I know i can handle her Ive handled worse

Also I have had chance checked out no pain nothing wrong so it has nothing to do with that. And it couldnt just be me doing something cause she took of with my friend aswell.


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## Brandon (Jan 17, 2008)

Well in my opinion, the only way to over come a fear is to face it head on. I would say that you need, in my opinion, build up your confidence in her and her in you. Maybe do some ground work and just kinda ease back into it, your just hittin a speed bump right now with her. I think she is feelin un-easy because you are un-easy. 

P.s. - HAF they are just givin there opinion, you came here for opinions and you got them. So lets not all get heated about this.


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

Ya im deff gonna be doing a ton of ground work and i understand that there giving there opinion and all the advice is good I just dont want ppeople telling me i should get a different horse thats all.


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## Brandon (Jan 17, 2008)

Ya just try that for awhile and just really try to build up your confidence. Because, in my opinion, I think that is the problem. She feels uneasy becuase you are and so once she is nervous she is gonna not act right. So try that for awhile and keep us posted, becuase i would really like to find out what happens. The reason i think that these problems are do to uneasiness of both parties, is because like you said, the trainor could ride her and have no problems but when you started to ride, things just kinda went sour. So try that and like i said, KEEP US POSTED!


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## Dumas'_Grrrl (Apr 2, 2008)

HAF- (((((hugs))))) I think we've prob all freaked at one time or another....dust yourself off, wear the bruises as a been there done that, and go on... its one of those easier said than done things but you can do it, we all have. or at least I have. I wish you courage and wisdom.. :wink:


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

DG- aww ty I needed that! Ill keep u all posted and have videos every now and then  Im hoping i can really get over this and make some progress with her  Sunday after noon ill probably have some kinda of Journal up maybe with a video  So this weekend check the journal section and i may post on in general


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## FGRanch (Feb 9, 2008)

HAF if you think you can train her then go for it girl!

But you can not say Chance is a finished horse. A finished horse will always stop, no matter what. I can leave all of my "finished" horses all winter get on them and have NO problems at all. I've have ridden tons of horses and I've never ridden a "finished" horses that didn't stop :? Maybe it's just me?


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

HorsesAreForever said:


> i want one i can finish myself!



.. didn't you say Chance was finished??


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## Delregans Way (Sep 11, 2007)

> I've have ridden tons of horses and I've never ridden a "finished" horses that didn't stop Maybe it's just me?


Its not only you, Iv ridden for alot of years now, and i have never came across a "finished" horse. And i dont think i ever will.... :? :roll:


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## .Delete. (Jan 7, 2008)

I have ridden many maany horses. Personally i don't think there is ever such thing as a /finished/ horse. :roll:


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## FGRanch (Feb 9, 2008)

Well said Delete. I don't think there really is either. That's was my finished is always in quatation marks. Number on they are animals, they are unpredictable, number two, just like people horses always have sometime new to learn. 

But in my opinion Chance sounds very green, I wouldn't ever go as far to call her well started.


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

well i know shes pretty much finished because ive seen her be shown , trail ridden, jumped a ton of logs out in the feild no problems. I think shes becomes servely herd bound. and maybe ur right maybe shes not finished at all but i mean ive seen what she can do

and last summer i jumped her over 2'6" so shes not really green


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## SonnyWimps (Feb 22, 2008)

HorsesAreForever said:


> well i know shes pretty much finished because ive seen her be shown , trail ridden, jumped a ton of logs out in the feild no problems. I think shes becomes servely herd bound. and maybe ur right maybe shes not finished at all but i mean ive seen what she can do


Mainly, I think, the reason that she's freaking out is because you are...I can get on Sonny and be all calm...but the minute I go into panic mode, he goes into it also...if I tense us...he tenses up. It's the bond between the rider and their horse....Chance can sense that you are nervous when you are on her...she doesn't know why you are nervous, but she knows you are afraid of something, and that is making her become afraid.

Clear your mind and picture you are riding Chance in a show...she is doing everything correct because YOU have confidence that she can do it. Our emotions, posture, and attitude will have an affect on how the horse acts....they can sense if we are nervous, angry, or happy.

If you go to ride Chance and you are starting to fell uncomfortable, do NOT get on...walk around the arena with her by your side until you feel confident to try again. Don't push yourself to do something that you aren't ready to do. It was the same thing with me...I was afraid to canter on my horse due to he'd either not stop, trip, or gallop instead...I did not canter at all until I was good and ready, and I had no butterflies in my stomach.

Remember that Chance isn't doing this just to be mean...she is as frightened as you are... she's picking up on your nervousness and thinking that something horrible is going to happen.

Let us know how it goes and keep us updated!!


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

thxs  im deff gonna work on getting over this and i think that is why she fliped cause i was nervous and i knew i shouldnt get on but idk self consiously i was like i have to. But i also think chance is herd bound like seriously sometimes its almost impossable to get her away from them so im gonna start stalling her and letting her out a few hours during the day instead of allday all night. that will give me a good opertunity to really work with her aswell. cause like i said ive jumped her over 2 foot 6 and seen her do a cross country course out in the feild so im thinking some of it is due to being herd bound Besides stalling her any other ideas to get her away from being herd bound??


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

HorsesAreForever said:


> well i know shes pretty much finished because ive seen her be shown , trail ridden, jumped a ton of logs out in the feild no problems. I think shes becomes servely herd bound. and maybe ur right maybe shes not finished at all but i mean ive seen what she can do
> 
> and last summer i jumped her over 2'6" so shes not really green


Sorry, HAF, but if Chance is nearly "finished" (the term being used loosely to describe a horse that w/t/c/stop/back/lateral movemets/discipline-specific movements without being bad) ... it doesn't sound like it - a "finished" horse doesn't take off, rear, and toss her head around. Isn't she only 5 years old? 
Just because a horse has shown, been trail ridden and jumped doesn't mean it's finished - I've shown, jumped, and trail ridden many many greenies, and let me tell you, they were G-R-E-E-N!! I'm not trying to argue with you, I'm just letting you know that you shouldn't expect a horse that's done those things to be completely finished - that would be a big mistake and if that's what you're expecting, you might be sorely disappointed. 
Really it sounds like she is a green horse that needs a lot of work; and if you're willing to go with the guidance of your trainer, then go for it! But, like I said before - Chance is at a very impressionable age, one where you have to be confident in what you're doing to teach her the right things to do... She sounds like a nice horse that does have potential, and if you think you can bring it out in her, I wish you the best of luck, and will help where I can, but you have to realize that Chance does need work. 



How has her stopping been recently? Have you worked her since you last posted? How was she?


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

the more i think about it i guess i agree with her being green. Which im more then willing to spend time with her and realllly work with her as much as i can. Yes she is only 5. And accually if shes paying attention she stops right when i asked sometimes might take a extra step but besides that she stops if shes paying attention. and im going up there tomorrow and hoping to get some videos and pictures maybe u guys can tell me whats going on with her. and i know she has it in her to be a good well behaved horse and will be a good jumper with a lot of work like i said im willing to work with her but i may need some help from u guys along the way because my barn doesnt believe in natural horseman ship or anything i do so i cant always depend on them to help me out


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## FGRanch (Feb 9, 2008)

HAF good for you for taking a different training route then what your barn offers (sometimes it's not always the best methods) It's nice to hear that you are now admitting that she is green, should make your training job a bit easier. Now what you are considering her green, you will have more patience and a better work ethic. You are not going to get on her and expect her to be "finished." 

Just some advice:

Remember firm but gentle. Never hit, yell or get angry with your horse. They are an animal and without your guidance they will never know the difference between right and wrong. Be a positive influence in your horses life. The more they like you they better they will work for you. Take time to love and cuddle her, not just work her. I find my love sessions often accomplish more then my working sessions. Remember as long as you can be your horses best friend they will strive to be yours. Good luck, and I hope you guys can develop a strong bond. There is no better feeling in the world then a true and honest bond between horse and rider. 

So once again HAF good luck and would love to see videos and photos.


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

FGR- Ty  that accually was really touching and every part of it was true. And i usually give a firm tap only hit if its 100% nessacary. I try not to yell because its not like they can understand but sometimes its kinda hard for me not to raise my voice but im working on being more gentle and patient im still learning  everyone is  and since im going up there tomorrow ill get videos and poor girl got in a fight and took a small chunk off of her hoof so we are having a farrier come out on the 10th to fix it probably will have to sadate her cause its almost impossible to pick up her hooves ill post that in a diff topic later lol


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## FGRanch (Feb 9, 2008)

Your welcome and I'm glad you found my words touching.


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

Welcome


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## love-a-hero (Apr 3, 2008)

1. Theres no such thing as a finished horse
2. Your horse sounds green....deal with it
3. Stop acting like you know everything

Not trying to start anything, but this is just giving me the willies! :roll:


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

Love a hero.. U do NOT know this horse and i am not saying i know everything! I have had over 8 yrs of exsperience with horses and training them so i do know a good amount of things! So dont say im trying to know everything when ur the one saying Your horse is green deal with it. You dont need to be rude about this. My horse is not completely green just needs a reffresher and needs to relearn a few things.


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## Vidaloco (Sep 14, 2007)

Please try to keep this friendly. I think HAF is looking for constructive helpful advise. Remember the Conscientious Etiquette Policy.


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## love-a-hero (Apr 3, 2008)

:roll: Fair enough...


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## jazzyrider (Sep 16, 2007)

no need for :roll: either  its not always what a person says, its the way they say it that can make a problem


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

ty vida and jazzy


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## Brandon (Jan 17, 2008)

HAF my opinon to you, and this is only my opinion. Would be to go over all the ground work again with her, and dont ride her much, try to build trust agian. I mean obviously there is somethin wrong. Have your trianor help you. I would just build that trust up again. Just be patient with her.


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## Delregans Way (Sep 11, 2007)

Hmm i agree with whats been said. Just yeh... try and be patient, which im sure you will.. =]


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## regardinghorses (Oct 26, 2007)

HAF - was this an isolated incident or is the tossing her head and rearing something she's been doing? (I tried to read all of the posts, but I may have missed it if you said).

It's spring and most horses are feeling pretty good even if they have been worked all winter. And some horses don't take well to having time off. The horse I'm working with is pretty level-headed, but she gets really really resistant when she hasn't been worked. It's like her way of telling me she's annoyed that we haven't been doing anything. It takes a few consistent rides to get it out of her system, but she always does. She's an older horse, but she was mostly trail ridden her whole life so I'd call her green. We're focusing on collection, bending, straightness, and a lot of those basics. And it's those things that go out the window when she's feeling resistant. It's really frustrating, but I've learned that tossing her head and going sideways and refusing to bend are her typical behaviors when she hasn't been worked.

I don't worry about making her behave perfectly when she's starting back up. A lot of it at first is just having a relaxing ride and getting back in shape and in the right mindset before working on polishing. I try not to push her too much until we've had a few rides, because it just makes it worse. After a few rides, she'll suddenly soften up and do everything she knows she's supposed to do. 

If you're feeling unconfident with Chance, just start slow. Spend some time on other horses if you can just to keep your general confidence up. Maybe get on Chance and just walk her with somebody leading her, or even on a lunge line. Do lots of serpentines and bending exercises. These will help her to soften up and relax and be more receptive to your stop cues. If it will help, ride without stirrups so you don't have to worry about getting your foot caught while you are regaining your confidence. 

Learning the one-rein stop would help too. When she's just standing, reach half way down the rein and pull it up to your hip and hold it until you feel her bring her head around and really give to the pressure. Once she's good at a halt, do it while walking. When you pull her head around, she'll probably go in a tight circle, and let her circle until she stops. Key here is getting her to "disengage" her hindquarters too. As she gets better, you should be able to lift up slightly on one rein, say whoa, and sit down in the saddle and she'll stop. If you can master this at lower speeds, hopefully it will help if she would ever bolt. 

These are just a few ideas that may help. Good luck, and let us know how it's coming!

P.S. you have to be careful of turning too tightly when a horse a bolts. You could either end up throwing yourself off (like what happened) or run the risk of overbalancing your horse and pulling her over.


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

thxs for replying  ill probably start working on her bending and things in a round pen where its not so big an area. She has had the winter off so I think its the spring coming lol teh goose were flying back over the pasture and she did this like happy dance xD literally way funny! But ill be doing a ton of ground work and things u said aswell if u want u can reply to my 'what kind of ground work do u do' if u would like


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## daroczy (Feb 14, 2008)

Besides being 5 years old - does this horse work on the bit...?
The fact that she can rear and shake her head idicates to me that this horse is beyond the bit. 
Maybe your trainer rides her on the bit sending him forward very well, that's why she does not do this things with her. Horses being sent forward hardly cannot rear. Maybe you should use more help acting forward and a calm, sensitive hand. 

Rearing is a kind of refusing the work in my opinion. I think she does it because she tried it once and she saw that she could do that without any consequency! So, although I agree with others that abuse and violence is usually not a solution but you must retaliate if she does something wrong or she will never learn it. I'm sure you are not as smart rider as your trainer is, but I'm sure when a horse does this with a rider who has been riding for 8 years on different horses, it's not *only* the riders fault. An average horse must not act like this, and if you accept it with that "Ah, yes, I'm not as experienced as my tariner, this is the problem", the horse will not be able to ridden on anyone except from your trainer or a rider as experienced as she is. 

One of my friend always sais: "The horse is well trained when you can give it to your 6-years old child to have a ride on it."


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## love-a-hero (Apr 3, 2008)

> Besides being 5 years old - does this horse work on the bit...?
> The fact that she can rear and shake her head idicates to me that this horse is beyond the bit.
> Maybe your trainer rides her on the bit sending him forward very well, that's why she does not do this things with her. Horses being sent forward hardly cannot rear. Maybe you should use more help acting forward and a calm, sensitive hand.
> 
> ...


Agree


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

My trainer even had trobles with her aswell yesterday she emailed me and told me so it isnt just me. This horse has had a horrible past [starved, neglected, abused] and needs to be taught things she once knew and its gonna be me who trains her i have a ton of confidence i can break threw her problem. again this horse is herd bound and if she sees a horse in the herd having fun she starts acting up i know her problem and i think i can fix it im just gonna need a little advice every now and then. she is perfect in the drive way with me walk trot canter except a few small rears she needs to get back into the swing of things and in her mind shes not ready. and I know shes starting to really get interested in what i want from her because shes been a lot better on leading and shes trusting me to lead her threw very tight spots and last weekend i needed her to come up to me quick so the other horse wouldnt get out i said her name and acting all enthusiatic about it and she troted up to me and followed me out. So i think i can get her back to her old self and belive it or not she was once used for beginers lessons. and was perfect.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Something isn't adding up..... a 5 year old that's been abused... only 2-3 years under saddle (MAX!) being used in beginner lessons? really? And is now acting like this?


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

She was abused and startved in her really early years we worked with her and shes very good girl she just needs to get back into things. Yes she was used as beginers lessons i taught one of the lessons she was being ridden in. I think her major problem is being herd bound when she sees the herd havin fun she starts rearing this is why now im seperating her from them for a while she gets turned out in a round pen with a buddy.


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## Abby (Nov 26, 2007)

In my opinion, she sounds like a HIGHLY sensitive horse in which case hitting or force will not work and will actually bring her more in an uproar. Have you ever been riding a sensitive horse and kicked them a little to hard and instead of them going they stop and throw their head up or step backwards? It is too much pressure on them. I think you should try to get a different trainer or tell the one you've got to TONE it down a little and see how that works. If she is not willing to work with you, she is NOT a the trainer for you. Now this is just MY opinion but I think you should sit down and look up some reputable places to have a good solid 30 days of foundation training put on her by a professional, and reputable facility where you can CALL and talk to customers as well as make surprise visits on training sessions with chance. I think she is a little too green for someone non-professional to handle. She needs gentle but clear handling, patience and consistency. I think whips put too much pressure on her causing her to react in the way she does. When she is getting scared, get her away from you. The last thing you want is to be standing next to a scared frustrated 1000lb animal with nothing but self preservation in mind.

I think your best options would be and in this order:

1. Sit down with your trainer. Tell her you think she should take it easy on her, put the whips away for a change. Chance should not be getting that out of control without being provoked by something and I feel it may be the whips.
2. Change your current trainer to someone else if she is not willing to try something new. If trainers do not try something new, they are generally not good trainers. They should be able to change and flex their ideas to conform to different personalities of the horses.
3. Have her sent to a professional, reputable (KIND!) trainer with GOOD SOLID resources for at least 30 days of SOLID ground training.
4. I think your last option should be to sell her and find a more suitable horse. Probably one that is already broke to ride with a good SOLID foundation and is bellow a five on the temperament scale. I would be way more than willing to help you find a good calm horse, I'm just not the best at picking out a good conformation.


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

I have someone to help me out with parelli. Im going to talk to my instructor about no whips or hitting involved I too agree that the whips are making things worse im starting over with her and im not sending her away ive heard bad things from my friends its not happening thxs for throwing that out there tho. and if i could switch places i would


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