# would you breed this mare?



## nikelodeon79 (Mar 3, 2008)

Do you have conformation pictures without the saddle?
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## kimberlyrae1993 (Mar 20, 2013)

Need more details like how old what's her bloodlines what's the reason for breeding who is the stud
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## MollyBelle13 (Dec 25, 2014)

I am not sure who the stud will be, I am actually looking for a stud for her as well. My trainer suggests a Cassini I line, but I am having hard time finding one state side. Its so hard to search sometimes! Feisty Belle Horse Pedigree

there is her TB pedigree. I got her off the track last Xmas. 

I use her for Jumpers and I simply would like another horse - a good quality horse and I love Belle. She is comfortable, beautiful mover, amazing jump, can free jump 5ft and loves it. Hunts the jumps etc. She is almost 6. 

The only pics I have of her with the saddle off and no blanket are those, I added, but I can take some additional if they are not adequate.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

Based purely on those photos at this point in time and with the current poor market no I wouldn't.
If in a few years time she was proving to be a consistent jumper at a fairly high level then maybe I might if the market had improved enough to justify it


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## MollyBelle13 (Dec 25, 2014)

H Jaydee, What do you mean by "current poor market"? Sorry if that is a dumb question. Like there are no good stallions around?

Also I do plan to wait a couple of years. I am just trying to do my homework ahead of time so I am prepared if I decide to


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## CandyCanes (Jul 1, 2013)

No, she means nobodys buying horses for anything more than a tuppence these days. Horses aren't worth anything right now. Wouldn't be worth your while to breed, should you sell.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

Current poor market for selling non -proven horses or horses bred from non-proven stock
There are some good stallions around but a good stallion won't necessarily produce a good competition horse from a mare with no great ability (or even one that does) and you could end up spending a lot of money in fees and maintenance for a foal that doesn't make anything of itself when fully grown.
Breeding is a lottery - you can make money out of it - but you can also lose a lot
See how your mare progresses as a competition horse over the next few years and then consider it.


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

The mare's hocks to ankle are behind the point of the hip instead of lining up with the point of the hip.


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## sorrelmare (Sep 9, 2014)

She is a very nice looking mare and appears to be very athletic. However, I would advise not to breed. Not that I don't think she's capable of producing a nice foal, but because the equine market is a crapshoot right now. TB's are sort of a dime a dozen and easily attainable. Once raced, they are pretty much given away here in my area and honestly I am not sure what happens to most of them since there are more horses than homes. There really isn't a huge market for "average" horses (regardless of breed) unless they have parents that are highly sought after. Even so, many well bred, broke horses are shipped to slaughter everyday. If you want another horse please look into adopting another off the track or perhaps saving a life out of the feedlot.


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## Jumping4Joy (Jan 29, 2014)

Your mare is beautiful, but I do agree with some of the other posters. There are so many horses who will be slaughtered each year, month, day, etc. that can accomplish things such as jumping 5ft with the proper training and whatnot. The economy is bad in general, let alone for what most people consider as a "hobby". Even if you breed for personal use, you have no clue how things will be in 2 years. People are looking for exceptional horses and there is too much of a chance to have an average horse.
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## silverxslinky (Jul 23, 2013)

Are you in the states? You might want to take your location into account when making this decision. While the market is definitely soft warmbloods and warmblood crosses do still seem to be selling in my area provided they are either: A. priced well B. Very well bred or C. have some decent experience. 

I agree with the other posters that breeding is risky. But if you present the mare and foal at inspection and get the foal registered with a respectable warmblood registry (not AMR), you significantly reduce the risk, in my opinion. 

It is my understanding that some breed registries are a bit more likely to accept thoroughbred mares and their foals than others, though this could be a misconception. I see a lot of people registering their warmblood crosses oldenburg, swedish, and RPSI.

Other posters in this thread are likely much more experienced than me, and I do think you should take their advice seriously. But if I were in your situation and professionals I trusted thought she was worth breeding I would probably go for it.


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## SlideStop (Dec 28, 2011)

Instead of breeding why not rescue another ottb?
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## LittleBayMare (Jun 2, 2014)

Since purchasing my mare, who I have come to love dearly, I have, at times, found myself wandering down the same train of thought. However, after doing some serious consideration of the situation and cost calculations in regards to the stud I would want to breed her too, I have come to the conclusion that I would be far better off purchasing a foal by that stud. The ranch that stands him has many quality mares of even higher quality than my own and the foals are all of similar linage to the mare I own, a linage known to produce the very qualities I treasure so much in my girl. By going this route, I will be able to secure the exact gender, conformation, and color of my choice without all the stress, risk, cost, and having to take my mare out of work for an extended period of time.
I highly recommend you consider the same course of action as there are so many things that could go wrong with breeding if you are not experienced. You could end up with extensive vet bills, or even losing your mare. You could end up with an unhealthy foal, or even losing the foal. There is only so much you can do to control the outcome of the situation.
Your mare looks like she would produce one pretty baby, but, IMO, if you treasure her that much, it's not worth the risk. As other posters have already pointed out, there are so many horses out there for good prices. I'm sure you can find something to suit your needs. It is a buyers market at the moment.


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

She's nice but not that nice imo.


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## MollyBelle13 (Dec 25, 2014)

Thank you "little bay mare" that is insightful and helpful. Yogiwick, a comment telling me "shes not that nice" does nothing and means nothing. A comment critiquing conformation etc. would be appropriate, which is the opposite of what you wrote.


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## SunnyDraco (Dec 8, 2011)

MollyBelle13 said:


> Thank you "little bay mare" that is insightful and helpful. Yogiwick, a comment telling me "shes not that nice" does nothing and means nothing. A comment critiquing conformation etc. would be appropriate, which is the opposite of what you wrote.


You can have a nice mare but not nice enough to want to breed. You asked for personal opinions and yogiwick gave you an opinion. A quick response without long details to explain the opinion. For some it may be that they need to see something about a horse that is exceptional in order to consider breeding. Doesn't need to be a certain fault that says, "nope, not breeding" but a lack of something special that is seen by the casual observer. We can all wear rose tinted glasses and see our own horses as being special or perfect. Others may see see a fault, other issues or something just seems a "little off but can't quite place what it is" and just give a quick response without details. I like to write novels :lol:

My personal opinion, add up all the costs of breeding (stud fee, a year of vet checks/preg checks for mare and 3 years for the foal, 18 months of shots for the mare, shots for the first 3 years for the foal, extra feed/supplements the mare requires during the last trimester/nursing, all feed/supplements the foal will need for the first three years, extra tack like foal/weanling/yearling halters, training costs to start under saddle). Add this up, be generous as hay prices fluctuate and we tend to purposely underestimate the costs associated with breeding (including AI/shipping/vet checks and rebreed costs if the mare doesn't take the first time). With that number in hand (should be several thousand), start looking at the market and see the variety of young started horses who are already proving they are a naturally talented jumper and can compete on the level you desire. 

When breeding, you only hope you get the talent and natural drive. You also only hope for certain builds and height as well as good legs, conformation and stride. When horse shopping, you can typically find a horse that is everything you wanted and typically for less money than if you tried to breed for it and hoped luck was in your favor. Nothing is for certain when you breed, even if you are guaranteed a color when crossing two particular horses, you cannot predict shade of color, white markings or if a black horse will fade in the sun.http://www.horseforum.com//www.pinterest.com/pin/create/extension/


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## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

I would try to get her approved with one of the Warmblood registries, other than AWS, as was said already, preferably Hannover,Holstein or Oldenburg. If she is well received by the judges I'd probably ask opinions of other breeders for a  matching stallion. Then I'd get a good performance record established, THEN I'd look into the market and decide.


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## Allison Finch (Oct 21, 2009)

It's hard to tell with these photos, but her left front hoof appears somewhat clubbed. This is often a trait that can be passed to offspring and can affect it's soundness. Not worth the risk, IMO.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

I thought the hoof looked club as well. I was going to ask if that was a trait that could be passed down. My opinion on this one is that you have a nice mare that you really enjoy so continue to enjoy her and look around for a weanling that fits your needs/wants. You'll spend less money in the long run...


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## Hayden69 (Mar 19, 2014)

she is gorgeous, but i too would encourage adopting another horse. If a foal is what you want, there are pretty that will be needing homes very soon! Over the next few month's there will be lot's of homeless foals. I was considering breeding my mare until I saw this, it's so sad. Last Chance Corral : Ohio Horse and Foal Rescue


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## LittleBayMare (Jun 2, 2014)

SunnyDraco said:


> You can have a nice mare but not nice enough to want to breed. You asked for personal opinions and yogiwick gave you an opinion. A quick response without long details to explain the opinion. For some it may be that they need to see something about a horse that is exceptional in order to consider breeding. Doesn't need to be a certain fault that says, "nope, not breeding" but a lack of something special that is seen by the casual observer. *We can all wear rose tinted glasses and see our own horses as being special or perfect.* Others may see see a fault, other issues or something just seems a "little off but can't quite place what it is" and just give a quick response without details. I like to write novels :lol:


I could not agree more. I still catch myself making excuses as to why I should breed my mare. "But she's just so talented! She's got such a great mind! She practically came out of the womb fully trained! She's just so beautiful, gorgeous, extraordinary, [insert rose-colored adjectives here]!" :evil: No! Bad Bay! Her legs are funky and I won't risk paying a $3,000 stud fee too get a baby with her funky legs, I don't care how smooth her gaits are (she's like riding on a cloud ) or how great her mind is, it ain't happening. At this point I'm saving up to get a foal by my favorite stud which will have similar linage to her, but more concentrated. Still expensive? Yes. Still risky? Yes. But not as expensive and not near as risky as breeding my little miss funky legs.
Now, I am no conformation expert. I am still learning. But I also believe that there is only about 5% of the equine population that deserves to reproduce, if even that much, especially in this economy. 
Put the money aside for a moment. I have seen too many threads on here about people producing poor quality foals that they were "absolutely positively 110% guaranteed going to keep"...and then it was bad tempered, or it had health problems, or they didn't like the color, or they fell on hard times and couldn't afford to keep all their horses, or any combination therein. Then what? Another average or below average foal in a poor market with little to no chance of making it. Is that what you would want for the baby of your precious mare? Could you live with yourself? :shock: I know I couldn't.
Think of the worst case scenario for your foal. Could you look at yourself in the mirror at the end of the day and know that you did the right thing? 
That is the question I ask myself every time someone tries to convinces me to breed my mare. I couldn't live with myself knowing that the baby of my sweet girl might one day end up in the slaughter house because I acted out of pure selfishness and did not consider the consequences of my actions.



SunnyDraco said:


> My personal opinion, add up all the costs of breeding (stud fee, a year of vet checks/preg checks for mare and 3 years for the foal, 18 months of shots for the mare, shots for the first 3 years for the foal, extra feed/supplements the mare requires during the last trimester/nursing, all feed/supplements the foal will need for the first three years, extra tack like foal/weanling/yearling halters, training costs to start under saddle). Add this up, be generous as hay prices fluctuate and we tend to purposely underestimate the costs associated with breeding (including AI/shipping/vet checks and rebreed costs if the mare doesn't take the first time). With that number in hand (should be several thousand), start looking at the market and see the variety of young started horses who are already proving they are a naturally talented jumper and can compete on the level you desire.
> 
> When breeding, you only hope you get the talent and natural drive. You also only hope for certain builds and height as well as good legs, conformation and stride. When horse shopping, you can typically find a horse that is everything you wanted and typically for less money than if you tried to breed for it and hoped luck was in your favor. Nothing is for certain when you breed, even if you are guaranteed a color when crossing two particular horses, you cannot predict shade of color, white markings or if a black horse will fade in the sun.


I rest my case.


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## KigerQueen (Jun 16, 2013)

people always tell me i should breed my lil grade arab. "she has an amazing personality" "she has amazing hooves!" "her face is gorgeous!""she moves so smoothly".
All they are seeing is pic #1. I force myself every time to look at pic #2.


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