# Moody Mare? Saddling problems...HELP!



## Light (Mar 4, 2012)

Hi,

What kind of saddle are you riding in? What kind of pad? Why are you mounting from the ground? What kind of horse is she? What does she eat? How is she housed? Need more information please. 

It could be that the saddle does hurt. It could also be that her gut hurts. Have you tried running your hand around the girth area? Do you always mount from the ground? She could be expecting you to do that and she knows it will hurt when you do. How long has she been being ridden by you? She wasn't ridden much before? She sad for a year right? 

When did the Veterinarian see her? When did the chiropractor see her? Did she get adjusted? 

I would rule out pain before assuming it is behavior. With that kind of reaction, I would be getting a second opinion, be it Chiropractor or Veterinarian.


----------



## Daisymae98 (Feb 1, 2017)

I ride in both Western and English saddles, she begins the behavior with any and all saddles. Rather, she begins the behaviors with only a blanket on her back. I use a thick therapeutic gel pad with her...I was hoping that would help...It has not. I mounted from the ground a couple of times out of necessity and because I wanted to see her reaction. I prefer to and most always use a mounting block when it is available - I'm shorter, so it's better on her back and overall easier for me to use a mounting block. It is important that I am able to mount from the ground, however, as come summer we will be doing a lot of trail riding. If there is an emergency on the trail, I need to be able to get back in the saddle from the ground should I have to get off in the first place. She is a 14.3h Quarter Horse. She is on the smaller side as Quarter Horses are concerned. She is an easy keeper, gets two alfalfa/grass mix flakes per day along with a scoop of grain in the evening. She has a very large stall with a run...she is not in any way cooped up. 

She only behaves badly when I am saddling her. I can rub (even with pressure - I tried) all over her body and she just falls asleep. She loves to be groomed, even in the girth/cinch area. 

She did sit for a year, in that time I did not own her, nor was she in my immediate area. Before that she did western pleasure and trail riding which is exactly what I am doing with her. I am not an aggressive rider, no crazy fast running events/rodeo events/etc. Like I said before, she doesn't seem to exhibit any signs of pain or aggression in the saddle, when I mount/dismount, etc...only when initially saddling. 

Both vets (I've asked two) and chiropractor saw her a week and a half ago. Clean bill of health. 

I have owned her for approx. 2 months.


----------



## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

Often when horses are like this, very sour at being saddled it is because the saddle was uncomfortable for them and/or the girth was done up tomtightly from the start. 

The fact that a saddle now fits and you do not over tighten the girth from the start, will take some time to register with the mare. Correct the ill manners, have a whip and when she goes to cow kick use it on the offending leg. Take your time in tightening the girth and when she is good, reward with scratches in a favourite spot.


----------



## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

Probably she associates this process with bad experiences. Either someone put on a saddle that pinched, or else they tightened the girth hard and fast.

I had a cinchy mare that came to me that way also, and first I tried punishing her for the behavior. I'd tell her to stop, stand, smack her neck, etc. That toned down the behavior a little. 

What worked better for me was when I started making saddling a very positive experience. I decided we'd take a longer time for the process, and I moved very slowly and gave her pets and treats throughout. When she was standing, I'd give her a little treat, then raise the saddle pad. If she objected, I'd move it back down, wait a little and then do it more slowly. Each time she stood nicely I'd give her a reward. Same with the saddle. 

Then I would tighten the girth very slowly, one hole at a time and resting between, giving treats. After about five of these sessions, my mare was thinking much more positively about getting saddled. She sometimes still moves around a little, but she doesn't make faces, show teeth, turn her head back or stomp her feet. If she ever gets worked up again I go back to slow, easy, working on low anxiety and giving rewards. Mostly we just saddle up like a normal horse, but I always with all horses tighten very slowly and gently because many horses dislike having the girth tightened fast or hard.

I also practiced saddling more often than I would ride, just putting the saddle on and taking it off before feeding time. This also made my mare think more positively about getting saddled.

There are a lot of horses that have had bad experiences with being saddled, and they remember these for a long time. Many people just throw heavy saddles up, slamming them onto the horse's back. I've seen people hitting horses in the sides and flank with the stirrups. Then they grab the strap and yank it up as hard as they can. It's a wonder any horse would stand politely for that.


----------



## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

I'm with the others, sounds like she was in an ill fitting saddle and someone tightened the girth hard and fast. It doesn't take long to make a horse develop bad manners when that happens. My DH is a beginner and I watched him saddling up my horse they other day. The horse started to pull back when he tightened the girth, he just gave it a hard yank, no 'finesse' about it. I told him to slow down and made the horse stand still. He still yanked the girth and the horse sat back again, harder this time. I showed him how to slowly tighten the girth, and leave it a little loose at first, then walk the horse to the arena, then tighten a little, then lunge a little. Final tighten just before he mounts. Stretch the front legs to make sure nothing is pinching behind the 'elbow' and then mount. You can bet until this becomes habit, I'll be watching him saddle up like a hawk. I'm not having him give my horse that kind of bad habit. And, the horse is a total diamond, he has never even offered to step back let alone pull back before DH started saddling on his own. 

In your mare's case, I wouldn't walk her to the saddle, I'd bring it to her. And I'd tie short like you say you are doing, and keep a whip handy for the cow kicking and let her have it if she kicks. I'd give her a good one to the belly with my boot, but if that's not your way, then skip that one. The kicking is something that just can't be allowed to go on. Once that's sorted, then I'd go to rubbing, and treating her for standing still, when she gets a pad on, then when you add the saddle and so on, until it's a nice thought and not a negative one. It's going to take some time though, and if you ever over tighten or go too fast, you're always going to have to remember to be careful around this horse for that reason. They don't forget and can revert very quickly.


----------



## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

She is back to work from being a pasture pet....a grumpy attitude, YOU BET!!

However, it needs to be stopped.
Tie her short to protect you from her aggressive teeth.
_If she doesn't stop with a growl of "QUIT", throws a hoof in your direction she would be wearing a boot carefully aimed at her. 
Her biting a wall is also *not* to be tolerated....it's dangerous she reaches out to bite!
Someday it might not be a wall but someones face...

_As for her feet, she raises one to kick she would get a kick back..._a hard one from me!!
Swift and *instantly *retaliate in kind...._
Carry a crop/bat/short whip and use it if not your foot...._she earns her punishment._
She kicks at you, you have one swat _*immediately*_ in return, then return to saddling her as normal in a normal demeanor from you and go for a ride.

If you ruled out pain,discomfort of ulcers or saddle fit, it is just bad manners.
Manners that need correcting before she hurts you or someone else...

_Don't let her get away with her threats and ****y attitude....
She's *not* stupid and will quickly figure out if she acts badly she is punished in kind in return...
:runninghorse2:....
_


----------



## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

Agree with the rest
Learned behavior in horses, has to be first removed, before any re training can begin, including an automatic reaction, due to past negative association.
That is why it is way better never to have a horse learn to rear, halter pull ect in the first place, nor to subject them to things like poor saddle fit and saddling techniques, so that they then have an associated negative response, long after the cause has been eliminated.
Thus, it will take time, and positive association with being saddled, to over ride that automatic negative learned reaction


----------



## Daisymae98 (Feb 1, 2017)

Thank you everyone for taking the time to give me advise! It is truly and greatly appreciated!


----------



## charrorider (Sep 23, 2012)

It could be so many different things. You're going to have to do some detective work. Try new things. Eliminate others. For example, what would she do if you put a nice book of alfalfa hay and let her munch while you saddle her?


----------

