# Not gelding a horse that you have no intention of breeding



## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Bump please


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## Tarpan (May 6, 2012)

I told my boyfriend that there was only room in my life for one stud, so it was going to be him or the horse that got gelded.


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## ~*~anebel~*~ (Aug 21, 2008)

IMO a big part of gelding is for the horse's own welfare. Stallions in general live a very lonely life where they are isolated from other horses and many facilities don't have enough turnout for them to be in a large enough area to run and play and eat grass. Often a stallions life consists of being kept in a 12x12' box and an equally tiny turnout, breeding and getting ridden - not a nice life!!
Geldings can be kept in a herd environment meaning often that facilities have enough room for a herd of horses to be in a large area where they can run and play and eat grass.
I am personally all for gelding unless you are a facility/business owner and can ensure the best life for a stallion, and have a good rider for him and market him well.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Tarpan said:


> I told my boyfriend that there was only room in my life for one stud, so it was going to be him or the horse that got gelded.


**** that's one way to do it. Not an option for me though. I found a guy that is horse smart AND will let me keep a horse for myself. Among other things, this guy is too perfect to give that ultimatum.


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

your in a battle of wits with an unarmed man. Just get the horse gelded.


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

If you board, 99% of facilities have a "no stallions" rule, so finding a place to keep a stallion is more difficult. 

You need stronger fencing for a stallion (additional cost).

Geldings are, as a rule, more healthy than stallions and tend to live longer lives.

Forget showing, at least at local levels, as most small time/schooling shows have "no stallions" rules.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Clayton Taffy (May 24, 2011)

Sorry to say, but I think a guy that is horse smart would have no problem gelding a horse.


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## rookie (May 14, 2012)

The risk of accidental breedings. A stallion can easily get out of most pleasure horse pastures. Then you have to cover either mare/foal care of the mare he covers or the cost of aborting the fetus. Many boarding stables don't want stallions, particularly if there are children that ride there. 

In the end its the horses testicles that are being removed not his. I am willing to bet that none of my geldings stand around everyday thinking "gee I miss my balls". I am pretty sure they think "Gee I wish I had more food, or why won't this other horse play with me". I have never seen a newly gelded horse look between his back legs like "where did they go?". 

I once heard a respected horse person say. A stallion wonders around all day looking for a mare and food and is not content without those two things. A mare walks around and once every few weeks is cranky and wants a stallion. A gelding walks around looking for food and friends.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Joe4d said:


> your in a battle of wits with an unarmed man. Just get the horse gelded.


He's actually very horse-smart. He just doesn't think chopping off a horses nuts is fair when he didn't do anything wrong. It's not the horse's fault that he had bad breeding or faulty trainers. I see what he means, but fair or not, its something that needs to be done.


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## Annanoel (Mar 29, 2011)

Jalter-- Being horse smart he should know what the best desicion is. I mean we all do have those moments where we find what we think is an "amazing" stallion, then snap back to reality and realize he'd be a better gelding. Among the liability of having a stallion, all of the things you listed, among many other facts people can throw at you. Gelding would be best unless you have an established and functional breeding farm / program. Good luck, I know how tough it can be to persuade our other halves.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

rookie said:


> The risk of accidental breedings. A stallion can easily get out of most pleasure horse pastures. Then you have to cover either mare/foal care of the mare he covers or the cost of aborting the fetus. Many boarding stables don't want stallions, particularly if there are children that ride there.
> 
> In the end its the horses testicles that are being removed not his. I am willing to bet that none of my geldings stand around everyday thinking "gee I miss my balls". I am pretty sure they think "Gee I wish I had more food, or why won't this other horse play with me". I have never seen a newly gelded horse look between his back legs like "where did they go?".
> 
> I once heard a respected horse person say. A stallion wonders around all day looking for a mare and food and is not content without those two things. A mare walks around and once every few weeks is cranky and wants a stallion. A gelding walks around looking for food and friends.


Exactly the answer I was looking for, thanks


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

Nobody has really mentioned the training/handling issues between stallions and geldings.

Stallions are more difficult to train and you have to be a more proactive handler. No chances to just sit back and enjoy yourself, you always have to be on guard.

After all, stallions are a lot like men. God only saw fit to give them enough blood to think with one "head" at a time :wink:.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

smrobs said:


> After all, stallions are a lot like men. God only saw fit to give them enough blood to think with one "head" at a time :wink:.



That made my day xD


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## Tarpan (May 6, 2012)

Jalter said:


> He's actually very horse-smart. He just doesn't think chopping off a horses nuts is fair when he didn't do anything wrong. It's not the horse's fault that he had bad breeding or faulty trainers. I see what he means, but fair or not, its something that needs to be done.


Horses don't have the ability to think abstractly. They cannot think, "Oh gee... just think of how much better my life would be if I still had my testicles." Men who have a tendency to anthropomorphize as well as empathize, on the other hand... 

Honestly, cutting off the horse's tail would inconvenience it more then getting it gelded. Let those nuts hit the ground!


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## FGRanch (Feb 9, 2008)

No way, no how would I ever own a stallion unless it was for breeding purposes. My main reason is that they are generally not great around other horses, I want a horse that can be in a herd situation and get along well with others. As far as training and manners, that depends on the horse. My stallion has just as good a mind as most geldings.


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## Kayella (Feb 11, 2012)

Basically everyone has already covered all the issues. A horse is going to have more emotional hinderance being kept alone without a herd environment than having his coin purse emptied. Horses are meant to be in a herd environment. In the wild it's no problem. A stallion either leads a herd or starts a small band with other younger, weaker bachelor studs and roam like that. In captivity, it is our responsibility to ensure our horses are as comfortable as possible. Usually, a gelding will live longer and have less reproductive system complications than a stallion. How is it fair to leave them intact fully aware of the healthier choice, just because you "feel for him" and don't want his balls chopped off?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## hemms (Apr 18, 2012)

rookie said:


> I once heard a respected horse person say. A stallion wonders around all day looking for a mare and food and is not content without those two things. A mare walks around and once every few weeks is cranky and wants a stallion. A gelding walks around looking for food and friends.


This. I see it with machoists and their intact dogs all day long in my profession. It's not a matter of punishment or having rites. Just image being hard wired to do ONE thing and never be able to do it. Eating for a stud is often an afterthought, to scouting out mares. Every horse can be taught manners under saddle/in hand. It's his time just being a HORSE that is compromised. 

Take nookie off the table until he changes his mind. It's the same **** thing.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

A lot of men tend to empathize with their pets and really feel guilty getting them fixed. Have the horse gelded. He'll get over it.


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## hemms (Apr 18, 2012)

I always like the fact that I have geldings... If I end up with a foal, that gelding sure is going to make me some big $$$! Otherwise, I never have to fret a whoopsie.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## paintedpastures (Jun 21, 2011)

Sounds like he has to stop sympathizing with the horse use the logic & brain between his ears not his legs:wink:.Which is ALSO the reason the horse should be gelded & make for a better riding horse for you.


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## doubleopi (Dec 27, 2011)

There is also some evidence (Though not everyone agrees!) to suggest that gelding before puberty results in a taller mature height due to the testosterone not closing the growth plates early. I concur with the idea that a testosterone driven life with no opportunity to have an outlet for that (Breeding) would be terrible. The isolation necessary to ensure no unwanted breedings. The difficulty finding venues for riding/training/showing/boarding. All seems completely unnecessary to me. In fact, I wish they had a quicker, easier methods to spay mares too!
Also, testicular cancer is a non issue with a gelding....just sayin. :wink:


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Jalter said:


> I found a guy that is horse smart AND will let me keep a horse for myself.


What do you mean he'll LET YOU keep a horse for yourself? Aren't you an able bodied adult who can think and pay for things yourself? Why the heck would you need a man to 'let you' do _anything?_ If you're_ that_ dependent on him, I suggest you get a job and learn to take care of yourself. :?

As far as him thinking it's 'not fair' just because a horse has bad breeding, that's the MAIN reason you geld other than temperament. 

Regardless of what you say, he sure as heck doesn't sound very horse smart to me.


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## Reckyroo (Feb 5, 2013)

Another thing i've heard about stallions (correct me if i'm wrong) is that the longer they are left as "stallions" means that they learn stallion behaviour and re-training them out of it can be difficult - if they are gelded at a younger age, they don't learn the whole "mares are the centre of my universe" thinking.


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## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

If you can't handle a horse if he is intact, then more than likely the problem lies with your handling. Gelding will help take some factors out of the equation, but gelding is not a magic cure-all for male behavioral issues. 

If there is no intent to breed, and no incentive to breed from the horse(Ie. being breeding quality. Bloodlines, conformation, temperament, training, all that fun stuff), then yes, it is a good idea to geld. What if you had to sell him? A lot of people have strong reservations about buying a stallion due to mishandling. That will only cause the horse to decrease in value. 

Studs are liabilities. What if your neighbor gets a mare and he decides to jump the fence for a visit? What if he causes property damage or hurts your neighbor's horse or other livestock? What if he is hit by a car on the road? 

Nah, unless you have intent to breed, there is far too much potential stress involved. Geld him to stave off worries. If he is well behaved and well handled now, and you are not in a position financially for the procedure, then great. Keep handling him well until you do.


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## Reckyroo (Feb 5, 2013)

LadyDreamer said:


> If you can't handle a horse if he is intact, then more than likely the problem lies with your handling. Gelding will help take some factors out of the equation, but gelding is not a magic cure-all for male behavioral issues.


 
I've personally never had a stallion - so I couldn't comment on my handling of one - my sons ex had one and he was the sweetest horse around - until he was sent away to "learn some manners for a stallion grading" and then he changed, was fearful and guarded of everyone - i think he'd been trained how "stallions" are trained, even though he was the easiest horse to handle - it was just a theory i'd heard - but if my baby's a colt, he'll be nutless before he even knows what they are :lol:


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Reckyroo said:


> Another thing i've heard about stallions (correct me if i'm wrong) is that the longer they are left as "stallions" means that they learn stallion behaviour and re-training them out of it can be difficult - if they are gelded at a younger age, they don't learn the whole "mares are the centre of my universe" thinking.


I think it depends on the stallion. I rode a Peruvian paso who had been used as a breeding stallion his whole life and was gelded at 13. He was a perfect gentleman around all horses, mares in heat or not.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Reckyroo (Feb 5, 2013)

DraftyAiresMum said:


> I think it depends on the stallion. I rode a Peruvian paso who had been used as a breeding stallion his whole life and was gelded at 13. He was a perfect gentleman around all horses, mares in heat or not.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


My son's ex's stallion was the same - never tried to run a fence, or push himself onto our mare until he was allowed in the field with her with the intention of breeding - which he did - but that didn't change his behaviour towards us or the mare x

Like I said, it was a theory i'd heard and wasn't sure if the stallion I knew was a rarity


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Speed Racer said:


> What do you mean he'll LET YOU keep a horse for yourself? Aren't you an able bodied adult who can think and pay for things yourself? Why the heck would you need a man to 'let you' do _anything?_ If you're_ that_ dependent on him, I suggest you get a job and learn to take care of yourself. :?
> 
> As far as him thinking it's 'not fair' just because a horse has bad breeding, that's the MAIN reason you geld other than temperament.
> 
> Regardless of what you say, he sure as heck doesn't sound very horse smart to me.


I don't see why you have to be rude. You don't know our situation, so I suggest you don't tell me how to live my life. I have a job, and am more than capable of taking care of myself. We share finances, so yes, I care if the expenses of a horse bother him. It doesn't so it's no issue.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Ray MacDonald (Dec 27, 2009)

You can have they bestest stallion in the world.... He could have perfect conformation, temperment and training.... 

90% of the time they will be angels!
10% they will be absolute sh*t heads...

You always have to watch them because if they see a mare and you don't get their attention back to you quickly, they will run you over to get to that mare. You can NEVER turn your back to a stallion. They are hardwired to fight and breed. They don't even know they are going to do it but then some instinct clicks in their mind and they just do it...

Mare and gelding that are mentally sound, will always think before they do something because they will figure out if thy are going to get punished for the action they will perform...

Such as biting... They will get smacked
But they know if they walk up to you and nuzzle you they wont


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## ParaIndy (Sep 10, 2012)

I just had my 8 month old gelded yesterday, and these are the reasons I decided to go that route.

I will be doing trail riding, possibly showing, and endurance racing with him. I wouldn't be able to do ANY of those things if he was a stallion, because most shows won't allow stallions to be present, trail riding would be unsafe because of the possibility of meeting a mare in heat on the trail, and endurance riding for the same reasons. Plus, what reason do I have to keep him intact? He is of very good breeding, has a great temperament, and is registered, but many many horses have those things. I don't have the set up for a stallion, I plan on getting a mare some day (which would not work if I had a stallion!), and I have no plans of breeding. 

Also, gelding is not a huge deal when they that young. The vet puts them to sleep, does the deed, then the colt gets up with no idea of what just happened. He is sore and stiff for a while, but he gets over it quickly and never looks back.

Talk to your boyfriend and tell him that if he wants your horse to be as happy as possible, have him gelded. A stallion that is not allowed to breed and is in solitary confinement is not a happy horse! Gelding is MUCH better for your horse's happiness in the long run.


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## dbarabians (May 21, 2011)

My stallion is a true gentleman and i never have to worry or be on gaurd when handling him. More than I can say about a couple of mares that I own.
Star is handled with a rope halter and can be led through a group of mares even if any are in heat. He talks he prances but he does not pull on the lead or run you over.
Stallions take more planning and do not respond well to rough handling. If you are not going to breed your horse then there is no incentive to keep him in tact. The extra care, planning, and handling you will need to provide are not worth the effort. Good luck Shalom


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

It's not true, at least not at the shows I attend, that you can't show a stallion, I did, all up & down the province, Pacific Rim competitions. Trail rode all time, past mares running the fenceline along side the roads we were on, no problems, true test of a well trained horse. As for endurance, I don't know, never did that. However, first & foremost, a stallion is a breeding animal, if you are not going to breed him, be kind and geld him. Makes no sense to have a stallion if you are not going to breed, and it's a headache keeping a stallion, as far as fencing, having other horses with him.


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## Palomine (Oct 30, 2010)

Let him get savaged by a stallion a few times and I imagine he will rethink this.

Stallions are gelded because they can be dangerous, unpredictable, and a danger to everyone that has to be around them, depending on stallion.

BF needs reality check.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Palomine said:


> Let him get savaged by a stallion a few times and I imaginewill rethink this.
> 
> Stallions are gelded because they can be dangerous, unpredictable, and a danger to everyone that has to be around them, depending on stallion.
> 
> BF needs reality check.


 He figures if you can't handle the stallion, sell It to someone who can. I see his point, I'm just trying to get him to understand the horse would be happier as a gelding anyways. Everyone else has got this just fine before your rude comment was posted.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SunnyDraco (Dec 8, 2011)

Jalter said:


> He figures if you can't handle the stallion, sell It to someone who can. I see his point, I'm just trying to get him to understand the horse would be happier as a gelding anyways. Everyone else has got this just fine before your rude comment was posted.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Perhaps it should be less about his or your ability to handle a stallion and their natural stallion behaviors and more about why he should even be left a stallion. If he was sold down the road as a stallion because he got too much to handle, new owners would either 1. Geld him or 2. Breed him 

There is no reason to keep him a stallion if he isn't going to breed. He will have all the testosterone and no way to release it by breeding. He will require special fencing, only able to interact with geldings or always alone, more training and attention while handling. 

If your boyfriend thinks that it is unfair to take geld a colt when he did nothing wrong, it is more unfair to let him be a sexually frustrated colt that is secluded from any herd environment. You will do the colt a favor by gelding him when he will never be used for breeding. Then he can be a happy horse, run with mares and have a normal life.


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## Tarpan (May 6, 2012)

There are a lot more stallions then people able to handle them properly.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Jalter said:


> He's actually very horse-smart. He just doesn't think chopping off a horses nuts is fair when he didn't do anything wrong. It's not the horse's fault that he had bad breeding or faulty trainers. I see what he means, but fair or not, its something that needs to be done.


 Maybe you could explain how sexually frustrating it would be for the horse to have a sex drive and never get any release. Why don't you cut your BF off and see how long he can go with out any release.


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## jannette (Aug 24, 2011)

Jalter said:


> He's actually very horse-smart. He just doesn't think chopping off a horses nuts is fair when he didn't do anything wrong. It's not the horse's fault that he had bad breeding or faulty trainers. I see what he means, but fair or not, its something that needs to be done.


lol its a there isnt a thought of "what the heck what happend to my nuts" like many have said he will be happier because his options in life will be better as a gelding..being riden, around other horse ect. if he is stalion he has little to no options exept breeding and very little play..we gelded our colt when he was a little over a year and he runs and plays and is very happy within the herd. the studs that are at the ranch that ive purchased most of our horses from stand in a small corral with a little shelter and whinnies at the other horses ....i dont think he thinks he's living large cuz he's intact..good luck


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

Show him this video. He can see what happens with stallions that are not properly trained.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7FMuIwI8vU


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

The logic that if the stallion is too hard to handle, sell him to someone who can handle him is also a little flawed on your boyfriend's part (not meaning that offensively.) By the time you've discovered this stallion is too much to handle, chances are he'll have already learned bad behaviours or be expressing the aggression that is natural to him and you're not going to find him to be very marketable to anyone, no matter what their experience is. IMO, if you have an unmanageable, aggressive stallion (or any horse for that matter), you are increasing his vulnerability to end up in a bad home or meet abuse.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Jalter said:


> He's actually very horse-smart. He just doesn't think chopping off a horses nuts is fair when he didn't do anything wrong. It's not the horse's fault that he had bad breeding or faulty trainers. I see what he means, but fair or not, its something that needs to be done.


He's an idiot and if you buy into his thinking......well, let's say you're well suited to each other. 

I own stallions and I have a HUGE liability policy to cover me if my horse ever gets out, breeds a mare whose owner didn't want bred, breaks down the fences between me and my neighbors, loses his mind and decides to hurt a human. That policy caused my "escrow" portion of my house payment to go up $400/month. Do you have that kind of money to p*ss away on a stallion, who in your own words is not breeding quality? Or will you just run bare and cross your fingers? 

My stallions are easy going, respectful and can be ridden in any crowd and unless someone looks, they'd never know the horse was intact. They are used for breeding, and the second one of them gets out of line, they lose their parts; doesn't matter what I paid for them. 

You are already subscribing to the beliefs that a stallion is a wild, fiery beast who can't truly be controlled or handled. If he misbehaves you'll say, "Well, he's a STALLION!" as if that explains everything and he will go on to become a monster until you have to put him down because you can't handle him any longer. 

If he's not only breed quality but such an outstanding specimen he takes your breath away, then geld him. You're doing him a favor. 

If the boyfriend persists in his thinking, find another boyfriend.


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## PonyPainter (Aug 25, 2012)

I'm with everyone else on this one. If you're not in the breeding business (for the right reasons) then there isn't 1 good reason to keep a male horse intact. There are too many good reason's to geld him to list so i'll save the time...most of them have already been listed in this thread already


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

Quite frankly, it sounds like your boyfriend has made his mind up already using his own testicles which is just asinine. 

I don't care how "horse smart" he thinks he is, anyone who tries to justify such ignorant thinking by anthropomorphizing a stallion is the LAST person who should be ever handling a stallion. That kind of arrogance around horses is what gets OTHER people hurt. *shakes head*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> He's an idiot and if you buy into his thinking......well, let's say you're well suited to each other.
> 
> I own stallions and I have a HUGE liability policy to cover me if my horse ever gets out, breeds a mare whose owner didn't want bred, breaks down the fences between me and my neighbors, loses his mind and decides to hurt a human. That policy caused my "escrow" portion of my house payment to go up $400/month. Do you have that kind of money to p*ss away on a stallion, who in your own words is not breeding quality? Or will you just run bare and cross your fingers?
> 
> ...


I never said I agree with it. Reread the opening post. I'm looking for more reasons to EXPLAIN to him why I don't want a stallion. I never said I'd get one, I'm just trying to show him WHY I don't want one, just so we can avoid the drama in the future if we find the perfect horse that I want to geld.

You do not know who he is, so I suggest you don't insult people unless you do; otherwise, you sir, are the idiot. And why would I dump my boyfriend because he didn't understand one point? I know plenty of horse people with a significant other that knows absolutely nothing about horses. That is no reason to look for a different guy. As long as we are throwing around insults here, you must be a shallow know-it-all.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

MacabreMikolaj said:


> Quite frankly, it sounds like your boyfriend has made his mind up already using his own testicles which is just asinine.
> 
> I don't care how "horse smart" he thinks he is, anyone who tries to justify such ignorant thinking by anthropomorphizing a stallion is the LAST person who should be ever handling a stallion. That kind of arrogance around horses is what gets OTHER people hurt. *shakes head*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Reread the original post please. We are not getting a stallion. I started this thread so I could pull together the reasons not to get one. Someday I may find the perfect horse. What if he is a stallion, and I want to geld him? I want to have my reasons set up. I'm sure everyone here wanted a "pretty black stallion" as a little kid. Did people go around calling you stupid for thinking that? No, they probably explained to you why it was a bad idea. What is the difference here?

I am fully aware that getting a stallion is a bad idea, and after reading the (helpful) answers, my boyfriend now understands as well. What I posted wasn't his absolute last opinion, that's just what he thought before seeing the reasons.


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## Clayton Taffy (May 24, 2011)

If you don't have the horse already, don't even look at a stallion.

As for the perfect horse.....make it a point that no stallion will ever be the perfect horse for you.


*Problem solved!*


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Jalter said:


> I know plenty of horse people with a significant other that knows absolutely nothing about horses. That is no reason to look for a different guy. As long as we are throwing around insults here, you must be a shallow know-it-all.


LOL! I may be a shallow know it all, it's possible. :lol: But I am a very safety conscious shallow know it all, who has 40 plus years of horse knowledge and experience, most of which involve handling stallions. First for my parents breeding operation and now for my own operations. I, indeed, married a man (I'm not a sir btw) who knew nothing about horses, and even after 22 years of mostly happy marriage catch myself thinking, "Why the H*LL did I marry a non-horseman? Life would be so much easier if......"

If you truly do know people who have non-horsemen in their lives, then you probably also know that there's no way in the world that they would allow this non-horseman to make decisions/dictate policy about how the horses are cared for, what kind of training/treatment they'd receive or whether or not a horse should be gelded. I don't and have never consulted with my husband on anything pertaining to horses, except whether or not the budget would stand for me to add another one. He doesn't consult with me about his medical practice, so we're even. 

We have a standing joke around here when he tries to overstep his bounds into my business. I hold up a pair of my shorts and ask him, "Who wears these pants? Can you get into them?" In the beginning he fell for it and said, "Well, they're your pants, no I can't get into those, they're way too small.". I replied, "Well sir, if you don't change your attitude, they'll remain too small and you'll never get into them.". He got the hint.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Taffy Clayton said:


> If you don't have the horse already, don't even look at a stallion.
> 
> As for the perfect horse.....make it a point that no stallion will ever be the perfect horse for you.
> 
> ...


As someone said earlier, a great stallion will be an even better gelding. Why would a stallion be a horrible idea if that's the case? If he is an amazing mount, good ground manners, etc, then he would be an even better horse after gelding him.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

Here's an idea - maybe articulate a little better and try sounding slightly less like your boyfriend wears the pants and you're just a weak female without a say and maybe we wouldn't jump to those conclusions. 

Clearly you can't read either considering I never stated nor insinuated that you had or were getting a stallion. Good grief.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

You just never know with stallions - they can be perfect for years and then suddenly change and once its older unless its a real classy horse with proven ability in something no one is going to want to buy it if it starts to become a problem - you're then left with the more risky castrating op and the chances of retained habits afterwards
If there are other mares in the area he can scent theres a good chance he's going to break out of any paddock to get to them - or injure himself trying.
Best advice is that you dont buy a stallion in the first place and then the argument wont happen.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> LOL! I may be a shallow know it all, it's possible. :lol: But I am a very safety conscious shallow know it all, who has 40 plus years of horse knowledge and experience, most of which involve handling stallions. First for my parents breeding operation and now for my own operations. I, indeed, married a man (I'm not a sir btw) who knew nothing about horses, and even after 22 years of mostly happy marriage catch myself thinking, "Why the H*LL did I marry a non-horseman? Life would be so much easier if......"
> 
> If you truly do know people who have non-horsemen in their lives, then you probably also know that there's no way in the world that they would allow this non-horseman to make decisions/dictate policy about how the horses are cared for, what kind of training/treatment they'd receive or whether or not a horse should be gelded. I don't and have never consulted with my husband on anything pertaining to horses, except whether or not the budget would stand for me to add another one. He doesn't consult with me about his medical practice, so we're even.
> 
> We have a standing joke around here when he tries to overstep his bounds into my business. I hold up a pair of my shorts and ask him, "Who wears these pants? Can you get into them?" In the beginning he fell for it and said, "Well, they're your pants, no I can't get into those, they're way too small.". I replied, "Well sir, if you don't change your attitude, they'll remain too small and you'll never get into them.". He got the hint.


You missed my point entirely. I am not looking for insults toward my boyfriend and me, I am looking for a list of reasons a stallion would be better off as a gelding. 

As for horse smart, yes he is. He grew up on a ranch, and has been around horses his whole life, though he has been away from horses for at least 13 years. He helped me out all the time with my old horse, and was able to do everything with him just fine (handling, riding, knowing when he was sick or lame, etc). 

He may have missed out on some things, like why a stallion is a horrible idea, but that is because he has never been around stallions. After all the help from people who have, he now understands. People ask questions so they can learn, not so they can get ridiculed for not knowing.

Anyone can be an expert, but you can't know everything. You may have been around horses for 20+ years, but I'm sure you still learn something new every day. In the horse world, experience may be a big part of the job, but that doesn't mean that someone with questions isn't allowed to learn.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

MacabreMikolaj said:


> Here's an idea - maybe articulate a little better and try sounding slightly less like your boyfriend wears the pants and you're just a weak female without a say and maybe we wouldn't jump to those conclusions.
> 
> Clearly you can't read either considering I never stated nor insinuated that you had or were getting a stallion. Good grief.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Other people have insinuated that though, so it was a general reply. I was only asking for a list of reasons, not a bunch of insults about my dominance in my relationship, my boyfriend's intelligence, etc. None of those things are even related to the topic.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Jalter said:


> You missed my point entirely. I am not looking for insults toward my boyfriend and me, I am looking for a list of reasons a stallion would be better off as a gelding.
> 
> As for horse smart, yes he is. He grew up on a ranch, and has been around horses his whole life, though he has been away from horses for at least 13 years. He helped me out all the time with my old horse, and was able to do everything with him just fine (handling, riding, knowing when he was sick or lame, etc).
> 
> ...


No, I didn't miss your point, but you are missing ours. It's okay. Free advice is worth exactly what you pay for it, so take it or leave it, it doesn't make any difference to us.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> No, I didn't miss your point, but you are missing ours. It's okay. Free advice is worth exactly what you pay for it, so take it or leave it, it doesn't make any difference to us.


The advice has already been taken. I was looking for a list of reasons to present my boyfriend. I got it, he understands, we will never have a stallion for longer than it takes the vet to come out to geld it, if we get a stallion at all. And all the advice was great except for the obnoxious crap you and a few others had to throw in there.


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## Clayton Taffy (May 24, 2011)

Jalter said:


> As someone said earlier, a great stallion will be an even better gelding. Why would a stallion be a horrible idea if that's the case? If he is an amazing mount, good ground manners, etc, then he would be an even better horse after gelding him.



I never *said* a stallion would be a horrible idea....

If you were smart and wanted to avoid the entire problem of gelding and talking boyfriend into gelding.... I said "don't get a stallion" 

Come on you are making way more out of this than you need to.
Don't even look at a stallion.

When I look for a horse I just pass up the stallions ads, you should to.
You are going to end up with a stallion that neither one of you can handle... 

What a mess.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Taffy Clayton said:


> I never *said* a stallion would be a horrible idea....
> 
> If you were smart and wanted to avoid the entire problem of gelding and talking boyfriend into gelding.... I said "don't get a stallion"
> 
> ...


I won't be looking for a stallion though. But IF the perfect horse happens to be a stallion, I will need to be able to convince my boyfriend that gelding isnt a bad thing that only people who cant handle horses do.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

Ok, you need to be creative. Try to come up with an idea where the bf will want to geld this stallion and that it becomes his idea. If it works, no gliggling - he mustn't know, ever. If I wasn't getting thro to hubby I'd have a chat with his best buddy, tell him why and he'd make the suggestion. Hubby would come home with a good idea and present it to me. Sometimes I'd have to inflict pain on myself to keep from laughing. We gals have to be resourceful.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Saddlebag said:


> Ok, you need to be creative. Try to come up with an idea where the bf will want to geld this stallion and that it becomes his idea. If it works, no gliggling - he mustn't know, ever. If I wasn't getting thro to hubby I'd have a chat with his best buddy, tell him why and he'd make the suggestion. Hubby would come home with a good idea and present it to me. Sometimes I'd have to inflict pain on myself to keep from laughing. We gals have to be resourceful.


Haha sounds like a good plan to me. All my bf needed was to see the reasons, hes convinced now. Thank you though 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Casey02 (Sep 20, 2011)

> He doesn't like the idea of gelding a stallion because you can't handle it. If you can't handle it, sell it to someone who can.


Let your boyfriend handle the stallion when he is in heat..nuff said. There is no reason a person who doesn't know what they are doing should have a stallion. Horses can be dangerous animals when not handled properly.. and they are a few more hundred pounds than the cute puppy who got to keep his balls


http://www.horseforum.com/horse-training/agressive-stallion-refused-lay-down-%2Along%2A-156015/

here let him take a look at this one


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## rookie (May 14, 2012)

Can we file this under "how to have a thread go from productive to fight in 5 seconds or less".


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## BellaMFT (Nov 15, 2011)

I am going to offer my experience with buy a horse who was stallion. We bought Snickers when he was 7 years old he had just been gelded about 6 months before we bought him. The first time we told him on a trail ride, he tried to mount the mare I was riding. Let me tell you there is not enough room for both of us. :lol: He has been a handful and still thinks he is stud. I have to watch him all the time. He fights with the other geldings and herds the mares as if they are his. He still mounts the mares when they go into heat. He is 14 now. I am not telling you not to buy a stallion and geld him. Just keep in mind that a gelding who was once a stallion might still think he is king of his herd.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

BellaMFT said:


> I am going to offer my experience with buy a horse who was stallion. We bought Snickers when he was 7 years old he had just been gelded about 6 months before we bought him. The first time we told him on a trail ride, he tried to mount the mare I was riding. Let me tell you there is not enough room for both of us. :lol: He has been a handful and still thinks he is stud. I have to watch him all the time. He fights with the other geldings and herds the mares as if they are his. He still mounts the mares when they go into heat. He is 14 now. I am not telling you not to buy a stallion and geld him. Just keep in mind that a gelding who was once a stallion might still think he is king of his herd.


That is a very good point, but I was thinking of adopting a younger horse, like 2 or 3. I know a horse can still turn into a monster in that time, which is also why I wont specifically be looking for a stallion.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

Jalter said:


> I won't be looking for a stallion though. But IF the perfect horse happens to be a stallion, I will need to be able to convince my boyfriend that gelding isnt a bad thing that only people who cant handle horses do.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The perfect horse will not be a stallion.

You're right, gelding is not a bad thing'.

I'd be done with this guy........


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## BellaMFT (Nov 15, 2011)

Jalter said:


> That is a very good point, but I was thinking of adopting a younger horse, like 2 or 3. I know a horse can still turn into a monster in that time, which is also why I wont specifically be looking for a stallion.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Every horse is a individual. I am sure you have heard it before but don't fall in love with the first horse you meet. I have made that mistake. :lol:


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Muppetgirl said:


> The perfect horse will not be a stallion.
> 
> You're right, gelding is not a bad thing'.
> 
> I'd be done with this guy........


You must be a great person to live with, you know, being done with a guy because he has a few questions on horses. How is someone supposed to learn without ever asking a question?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## RiverBelle (Dec 11, 2012)

I know your problem - My boyfriend doesn't want to get his male dog fixed. I think it's a guy thing. "How would I feel if someone cut my balls off?" Kind of thing. Just remind him that it is healthier and safer for the animal if they are gelded.
Also...
If you had a stallion that you could not handle, could you really feel right by selling the stallion to someone else, not knowing if this person can handle the horse or not? It would make you feel bad if that stallion you sold to someone ended up hurting them. 

Just saying..


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

Jalter said:


> You must be a great person to live with, you know, being done with a guy because he has a few questions on horses. How is someone supposed to learn without ever asking a question?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Actually I am great to live with, I have a great marriage and I make my own decisions, based on what's best for the family as a whole. If I had to make a list of reasons to convince my 'horse savvy' boyfriend why we shouldn't buy a stallion.....or should buy a stallion and then not geld it......then that means 'I AM NOT BEING HEARD, NOR AM I BEING TAKEN SERIOUSLY'........

Your boyfriend ' feels sorry' for anything that's neutered/gelded......that's called anthropomorphism, not something you EVER want to apply to a stallion.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Muppetgirl said:


> Actually I am great to live with, I have a great marriage and I make my own decisions, based on what's best for the family as a whole. If I had to make a list of reasons to convince my 'horse savvy' boyfriend why we shouldn't buy a stallion.....or should buy a stallion and then not geld it......then that means 'I AM NOT BEING HEARD, NOR AM I BEING TAKEN SERIOUSLY'........
> 
> Your boyfriend ' feels sorry' for anything that's neutered/gelded......that's called anthropomorphism, not something you EVER want to apply to a stallion.


And he understands that now. I wasnt trying to build him a list because he wont listen to me. Its my horse, he doesnt care what sex it is. He just thought it would be cruel to geld a horse. I wanted to make the list so he would understand im not trying to be cruel, if anything the exact opposite.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## WSArabians (Apr 14, 2008)

I wish some men were as easy to geld as a horse.


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## BellaMFT (Nov 15, 2011)

wsarabians said:


> i wish some men were as easy to geld as a horse.


amen! :d


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## WSArabians (Apr 14, 2008)

Muppetgirl said:


> Actually I am great to live with, I have a great marriage and I make my own decisions, based on what's best for the family as a whole. If I had to make a list of reasons to convince my 'horse savvy' boyfriend why we shouldn't buy a stallion.....or should buy a stallion and then not geld it......then that means 'I AM NOT BEING HEARD, NOR AM I BEING TAKEN SERIOUSLY'........
> 
> Your boyfriend ' feels sorry' for anything that's neutered/gelded......that's called anthropomorphism, not something you EVER want to apply to a stallion.


You'd probably kick him in the head if he didn't listen. :lol:


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## Hang on Fi (Sep 22, 2007)

Jalter said:


> He's actually very horse-smart. He just doesn't think chopping off a horses nuts is fair when he didn't do anything wrong. It's not the horse's fault that he had bad breeding or faulty trainers. I see what he means, but fair or not, its something that needs to be done.


Odds are you, your boyfriend, and the horse will be far happier if his family jewels are gone. Regardless of your boyfriends "personal" feelings that simply are his relation to having his own jewels and rather not be neutered. When in truth, there is absolutely NO comparison to the two and shouldn't be compared, imo. 

My mini colt only dropped one testicle which means (as I told my hubby) the vets will have to "dig/cut" the other one out once we find where the ****** is hiding, that alone sends his knees to pinch and cringe. So I can sympathize your boyfriends ignorant view on the stallions jewels. 

Simply not gelding a stallion for remorseful reasons is all the more reason to geld them. If you don't have the facility to own one, you don't need one. There are plenty of studs out there, don't let him keep his jewels, especially if he has no redeeming qualities of a stallion, just because your boyfriend (or you) "feel bad" for gelding him.  You'll thank yourself later  

I always heard that "A good stallion will make an even better gelding." My mini colt would be a cute producer (of color) but his sickle hock, overbite, awkward looks, argue "Pretty" over "Functionality" thus he's being gelded :lol:. 

Although I do sympathize with you. A friend of mine refused to neuter his dog because "I won't do something to my dog that I wouldn't do to my kid." Apples to Oranges :|


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

Jalter, if you're paying for this horse...or if this horse is going to be staying on your property...or if you are going to be "sharing" any part of the ownership, then you can decide to geld and you don't need to _convince_ bf of anything.

If bf is stubborn enough that he simply won't geld out of a misplaced sense of empathy even though it would be for the good of the horse, then I would say that you need to exclude all stallions from where you're looking.

That would be best for the horse.


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

smrobs said:


> Jalter, if you're paying for this horse...or if this horse is going to be staying on your property...or if you are going to be "sharing" any part of the ownership, then you can decide to geld and you don't need to _convince_ bf of anything.
> 
> I'm not worried about him stopping me, its my horse I'll do what I want. I just dont want him to think I'm cruel for gelding him  He understands now though.
> 
> ...


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

Sorry, that last post turned out weird, im on my phone. its the middle paragraph of the 'quote'
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

WSArabians said:


> I wish some men were as easy to geld as a horse.


LOL< OH they CAN be......a rusty hoof knife is an amazing tool.....jus' sayin'....:hide::rofl:


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> LOL< OH they CAN be......a rusty hoof knife is an amazing tool.....jus' sayin'....:hide::rofl:


Bahahaha! From what I know....shhhhhh.....WS just kicks em real hard where it counts.....shhhhhh don't quote me on that:wink:


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## Tarpan (May 6, 2012)

Honestly, his opinion on the subject shouldn't even matter. Your horse, your choice. If your decision to geld YOUR horse is causing a bunch of drama then you have bigger things to worry about in the long term then whether your boyfriend agrees with your decision. 

Nothing has nuts in my house except my boyfriend. If it's male, it sings castrato as far as I'm concerned.


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## Iseul (Mar 8, 2010)

Personally..if I was male, I'd rather have no balls and not breed, than balls and still never get to breed. That's like medieval torture, IMO.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## WSArabians (Apr 14, 2008)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> LOL< OH they CAN be......a rusty hoof knife is an amazing tool.....jus' sayin'....:hide::rofl:


Bobbitt got away with it.... LOL


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## dbarabians (May 21, 2011)

OK ladies this thread has now taken on a new angle that kind of has me and my ummmm jewels kind of nervous. Now your making me cringe.
I might return when the topic gets a little more "male" friendly. LOL By the way no man likes to hear the name bobbit . Shalom


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## WSArabians (Apr 14, 2008)

dbarabians said:


> OK ladies this thread has now taken on a new angle that kind of has me and my ummmm jewels kind of nervous. Now your making me cringe.
> I might return when the topic gets a little more "male" friendly. LOL By the way no man likes to hear the name bobbit . Shalom


Wanna come over for dinner, Donald? :twisted: :lol:


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

Bahahahahahaha!!! I laughed out loud at that!! ^ :rofl:


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

WSArabians said:


> Wanna come over for dinner, Donald? :twisted: :lol:


You gonna serve some fava beans with that? HAH!


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

Well we feed our dogs "bull pizzle", why not some "human pizzle?" MUAHAHAHAHAHA. 


LOL
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> You gonna serve some fava beans with that? HAH!


And a nice Chiante?


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## DimSum (Mar 28, 2012)

Jalter said:


> That is a very good point, but I was thinking of adopting a younger horse, like 2 or 3.


Well if by adopting you mean from a rescue, then you have no problems as reputable rescues do not place stallions-they are gelded before they are let go


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## palogal (May 30, 2008)

Jalter said:


> He's *actually very horse-smart*. *He just doesn't think chopping off a horses nuts is fair when he didn't do anything wrong.* It's not the horse's fault that he had bad breeding or faulty trainers. I see what he means, but fair or not, its something that needs to be done.


The bold and the red contradict each other. Geld the horse.


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## Reckyroo (Feb 5, 2013)

WSArabians said:


> I wish some men were as easy to geld as a horse.


Haha - My hubby was (in the human sense of course) after 4 kids! :rofl:


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## dbarabians (May 21, 2011)

I will have to sadly decline the invitation to dinner. Maybe some other time when the conversation is a bit more mild. Shalom


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

how about this.. Most stallions end up as dog food , or steaks in Japan .


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## Ray MacDonald (Dec 27, 2009)

Or maybe hiding in lasagna?


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## dbarabians (May 21, 2011)

stevenson and ray mcdonald remind me to decline the offer or a meal at your house also. Shalom


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## Jalter (Oct 5, 2012)

stevenson said:


> how about this.. Most stallions end up as dog food , or steaks in Japan .


Have you heard of the thing going on in the UK, with the horse meat in burger kings and mcdonalds burgers? I live in the US, but refuse to eat the 'beef' at either place. I know it hasnt been tested in the US, but with slaughter plants open, I wouldnt be suprised. Hell, their beef Is mainly pork now >.<
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Nightside (Nov 11, 2012)

Jalter said:


> Have you heard of the thing going on in the UK, with the horse meat in burger kings and mcdonalds burgers? I live in the US, but refuse to eat the 'beef' at either place. I know it hasnt been tested in the US, but with slaughter plants open, I wouldnt be suprised. Hell, their beef Is mainly pork now >.<
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Well, it IS called a HAMburger! :lol:
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## trainerunlimited (Jan 26, 2012)

Whoa....I have to say dbarabians, I've always thought you were a woman til you made that statement. LOL, sorry! Good to know xD


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## Ray MacDonald (Dec 27, 2009)

You don't want to come over for some nice, hot horsey lasagna?


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