# What do you think of these horses (pedigree)



## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

How can i attach it so that it is readable?


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## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

Use this for th e pictures  Some have a [x] and are unveiwable i am aware but please tell me what you think  click - click on the tab called reports and go down to "photos" to see them


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

A little motherly love going on there...:lol:


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## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

Faceman said:


> A little motherly love going on there...:lol:


 I wish she was mine, she means alot to me  I hope that one day i can buy her foal (one so far) or her.  She is such a loving mare, even though she is alpha.


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## cmarie (Dec 19, 2011)

Faceman said:


> A little motherly love going on there...:lol:


maybe it was one of those pasture oops that we all hear about.


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## doubleopi (Dec 27, 2011)

Yeah, first you get Grandfather to granddaughter then it's son to mother! I guess that's one way to "fix" a trait....good or bad.


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## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

Please stop with the remarks about inbreeding - i hate it alot... but she is my heart horse and i dont like to pay her out for something she cannot help ;/ I just want a critique (on the things in first post)


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## cmarie (Dec 19, 2011)

At least grandfather to grand daughter has a bigger gene pool.


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## cmarie (Dec 19, 2011)

We know you didn't bred her and it sounds better calling it line breeding not inbreeding, and some breeders did that to get a certain quality, not all of them knew the problems it caused down the road. Nobody is bagging on the mare or you. Just making observations of the pedigree you posted for review.


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

Yeah, just yanking your chain...:lol:

My best Appy stallion had a little fatherly love going on and was a fantastic stallion...

Diamond Goer Appaloosa


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## cmarie (Dec 19, 2011)

I think most of us have line bred or "double breed" horses. I have a little mare that has Impressive all over her pedigree.


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## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

Im sorry i got offended - Im just like that..
No harm done... He sounds stunning Faceman!


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## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

Can someone please do what i asked for in the first post - really eager to here some replys.


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## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

Bump...please????


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## DrumRunner (Jan 26, 2011)

Hi ma'am, I just got your message..I'm subbing so I can come back to this tomorrow! I'm on my phone right now and it's a lot easier to type out a detailed response on my laptop. I'm more than happy to help and see what I can tell you though!


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## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

Thanks a heap DrumRunner!


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## DrumRunner (Jan 26, 2011)

You're welcome!


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## SunnyDraco (Dec 8, 2011)

I recognize a couple names four generations back. Not much help here

Off topic...
The strangest line breeding I ever saw was a mare bred to her grandson (she was about twenty years old at the time of breeding) and the resulting colt was used as a breeding stallion. Both mother AND great grandma at the same time :shock:

A different pedigree I saw had the same mare all over both sides of this particular stallions chart. The mare was on there about six times, all her foals were by different stallions and those foals were bred to one another :shock:

Some people just really like particular lines :lol:


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## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

SunnyDraco said:


> I recognize a couple names four generations back. Not much help here
> 
> Off topic...
> The strangest line breeding I ever saw was a mare bred to her grandson (she was about twenty years old at the time of breeding) and the resulting colt was used as a breeding stallion. Both mother AND great grandma at the same time :shock:
> ...


 
Thanks  Gotta say the breeding here: 


The strangest line breeding I ever saw was a mare bred to her grandson (she was about twenty years old at the time of breeding) and the resulting colt was used as a breeding stallion. Both mother AND great grandma at the same time :shock:

A different pedigree I saw had the same mare all over both sides of this particular stallions chart. The mare was on there about six times, all her foals were by different stallions and those foals were bred to one another 



Ick ick ick xD I would NEVER knowingly inbreed... esp after seeing a inbred arab with a "retarded" face... scared the crap out of me.. Poor horse..


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## DrumRunner (Jan 26, 2011)

Alright, here's what I can tell you..I hate that there is that little chunk of information missing on her pedigree, and those are TBs I'm guessing. I can access all of the AQHA records but not the Jockey Club..Anyway, here goes..I'll start with the bigger names..Even though they are farther back than I like to see when looking at a horse, that doesn't mean that she shouldn't have a good set up as an all around horse. She is definitely bred for western disciplines. Mainly cow and foundation bred horses. There are a few running horses such as Go Man Go and Top Deck that definitely jump out at me first, because I am a runner and love those bloodlines..The mare should have a nice set up for any all around Western discipline if she has the conformation and mindset to do it.. A lot of people in the Quarter Horse world also love the Foundation bred horses, which is what a majority of the "bigger names" horses are further back in her pedigree.

I'll start with the fourth and fifth generation as they are closer and contain some of the bigger names. 

*King Fritz *- AQHA H-14/P-23.5, AQHA Champion, ROM Cutting , National Reined Cow Horse Association Hall of Fame.
National Cutting Horse Association life time earnings $81, 100% Foundation, Breeder: R. Q. Sutherland, Kansas City, MO 
Owner: Fritz & Helen Watkins, Wasco, OR.; Les Vogt, Santa Maria, Ca.

*Poco Dell* - 100% NFQHA, AQHA H-35/P-15, ROM Arena
AQHA Champion, National Cutting Horse association life time earnings $941.85, Breeder: E.P.Waggoner, Ft.Worth,TX., Owner: Jimmie Randals, Montoya,NM., Leading Sires Lists: #13 All-Time Leading Broodmare sire of AQHA Chs and #18 All-Time Leading Sire AQHA Chs., Headed the 1962 List of Leading Sires of Halter
Sired 474 foals, 11-Supr H, 4-Supr P, 52-P ROMS

*Cutter Bill* - AQHA H-15/P-334 AQHA Champion Superior Cutting Horse Performance ROM Halter ROM 1962 NCHA World Champion Cutting Horse NCHA Earnings: $35,964.05 1963 AQHA World Champion Cutting Horse 1963 & 1964 ACHA World Champion Cutting Horse 1963 & 1964 PHBA World Champion Cutting Horse PHBA Hall of Fame (1962) AQHA Hall of Fame (2003) NCHA Hall of Fame ACHA Hall of Fame 1962 AQHA High Point Honor Roll Cutting Horse 94% NFQHAOwner:Rex Cauble Trained by Muscles Foster Sire of Cutters Indian & Cutters First. AQHA Hall of Fame horse. 

*Go Man Go* - He was named World Champion Quarter Running Horse three times in a row, one of only two horses to achieve that distinction. Go Man Go was considered to be of difficult temperament. While waiting in the starting gate for his very first race, he threw his jockey, broke down the gate, and ran alone around the track; he was eventually caught and went on to win the race. During his five years of competition until his retirement from racing in 1960 he had 27 wins, earning more than $86,000 (approximately $713,000 as of 2012).

*Top Deck* - Stallion Show Record for Top Deck (TB) Hall of Fame Stallion Offspring Record for Top Deck (TB) Supreme Champion Offspring World Champion Offspring Superior Halter Offspring Superior Performance Offspring AQHA Champion Offspring ROM Performance Offspring Race ROM Offspring NCHA Money-earners Race Money-earners Outstanding Offspring for Top Deck. Top Deck was foaled in 1945 and was injured as a young foal, preventing a racing career.[1] His sire was a grandson of Man o' War named Equestrian. His dam was a daughter of Chicaro, a horse known for speed at the short distances.[2]. Inducted into the AQHA Hall of Fame in 1990. 

*Wimpy* - Breeder/Owner: King Ranch, Kingsville, TX. 
Later owned by: George Clegg, and last Rex Cauble, Houston, TX. 
He achieved everlasting recognition by being awarded the number P-1 in the AQHA registry , 1941 Fort Worth Exposition and Fat Stock Show Grand Champion Stallion 
Sire of 174 registered foals; 1 AQHA Champion, 13 hlt.pt. earners, 2 Supr.Hlt. awards, 4 perf.pt. earners, 1 Supr.perf. award, 4 Perf. ROMs, and 1 race starter. 
Died Aug 13, 1959 Inducted into AQHA Hall of Fame 1989 
Legends8

*Hired Hand* - 100% Foundation bred. Breeder/Owner: King Ranch, Kingsville,TX.
AQHA CH.OFFSPRING: H H Dee, Henrys Bullet, Strawboss T
SUPR.PERF.OFFSPRING: Fistful, Strawboss T
ROM ARENA OFFSPRING: El Jalisco, Fistful, HH Dee, Henrys Bullet, Hired Hands Rey, Rey Ricardo, Strawboss T, Sugar Russom, Water Boy
_________________________

There are also a few big names further back in her pedigree such as King and Poco Bueno. Even though they are farther back they still play a role in the horse that she is and the horses that she came from. 
*
King* - Breeder: Burney James, Encinal, TX. Owner: Jess Hankins, Rocksprings, TX. 100% Foundation bred, AQHA Hall of Fame.Died 1958 
A L.M. Gdsire ROM Race, A Leading sire/Maternal G.Sire AQHA CHs. & ROM Arena 
Sire Of 2 AQHA HofF: Poco Bueno & Royal King 
658 foals, 218 performers from 23 crops. 35 race starters, 17 winners, 44 wins, 12 ROM/183 show performers, 104 hlt.pt. (1,088 pts); 107 perf.pt.-earners (2,061 pts) 147 total pt-earners with a total of 3,149 points All Divisions combined. 
King was born June 25, 1932, the offspring of Zantanon and Jabalina.[1] Originally named Buttons by his breeder,[2] he was renamed King when he was registered with the AQHA as number 234. King died on March 24, 1958 of heart failure

*Poco Bueno* - Breeder: Jess Hankins, Rocksprings, TX. Owner: E. P. Waggoner, Ft. Worth, TX. 100% Foundation bred. H-37.0/P-8.0 AQHA Champion/ROM Arena/Hall of Fame Sire of AQHA Chs/ROM Arena/Pro.Dghts/etc. HERDA Carrier He was grand champion stallion at Denvers National Western Stock Show, the Southwestern Exposition and Fat Stock Show in Fort Worth, State Fair of Texas in Dallas and the American Royal Livestock Show in Kansas City. As a 4-year-old, in 1948, Poco Bueno started his performance career as a cutting horse, and his amazing ability helped him to quickly acquire an impressive record - and a legion of fans. He was the first quarter horse to be insured for $100,000.00. Poco Bueno died November 28, 1969 and Mr. Waggoner left specific instructions in his will that Poco Bueno was to be buried in a standing position in a grave across from the ranch entrance on Hwy. 283. He was the first quarter horse to be insured for $100,000.00
More info can be found at Waggoners Poco Bueno Info

*Old Sorrel* - Inducted into the AQHA Hall of Fame 1990 Old Sorrel was purchased by the King Ranch and he developed into the greatest cow horse to ever set foot on this famous ranch. When Old Sorrel had proven his ability as a cow horse, he was given the opportunity to breed a band of the best mares on the ranch. His foals proved to be good using horses and Old Sorrel became the foundation sire of one of the most successful breeding programs in the world.


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## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

Wow thanks HEAPS & HEAPS Drum  I've got some serious reading to do lol.. i noticed people talking about Herda (spelling) In the Poco lines.. (i think?) what does it do and how are they affected???? Thanks everyone who can help me out


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## DrumRunner (Jan 26, 2011)

You're welcome! 

As far as the HERDA is concerned, I doubt you have much to worry about because it's so far back..That said, if you want to be positive, you can always have her tested..I would, just to be sure. Horses with HERDA can either have one or two HERDA genes. If they just have one gene they are just a "carrier" horse and it won't effect the horse throughout it's life. If the horse has two HERDA genes, they are the horses that will be affected by the disease. HERDA can "hide" in horses in the younger stages in their life but will usually surface when the horse is started under saddle, these horses usually have to be put to sleep..I'm not the best with all of the HERDA knowledge. I've never dealt with it first hand but I know a good bit about it. I'll post a little more information about it as well and you and your friend can research it as you wish..

Horse HERDA
"Hereditary equine regional dermal asthenia (HERDA) is a genetic skin disease predominantly found in the American Quarter Horse. Within the breed, the disease is prevalent in particular lines of cutting horses. HERDA is characterized by hyperextensible skin, scarring, and severe lesions along the back of affected horses. Affected foals rarely show symptoms at birth. The condition typically occurs by the age of two, most notably when the horse is first being broke to saddle. There is no cure, and the majority of diagnosed horses are euthanized because they are unable to be ridden and are inappropriate for future breeding. HERDA has an autosomal recessive mode of inheritance and affects stallions and mares in equal proportions. Research carried out in Dr. Danika Bannasch's laboratory at the University of California, Davis, has identified the gene and mutation associated with HERDA.

The diagnostic DNA test for HERDA that has been developed allows identification of horses that are affected or that carry the specific mutation. Other skin conditions can mimic the symptoms of HERDA. The DNA test will assist veterinarians to make the correct diagnosis. For horse breeders, identification of carriers is critical for the selection of mating pairs. Breedings of carrier horses have a 25% chance of producing an affected foal. Breedings between normal and carrier horses will not produce a HERDA foal although 50% of the foals are expected to be carriers."


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## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

DrumRunner said:


> You're welcome!
> 
> As far as the HERDA is concerned, I doubt you have much to worry about because it's so far back..That said, if you want to be positive, you can always have her tested..I would, just to be sure. Horses with HERDA can either have one or two HERDA genes. If they just have one gene they are just a "carrier" horse and it won't effect the horse throughout it's life. If the horse has two HERDA genes, they are the horses that will be affected by the disease. HERDA can "hide" in horses in the younger stages in their life but will usually surface when the horse is started under saddle, these horses usually have to be put to sleep..I'm not the best with all of the HERDA knowledge. I've never dealt with it first hand but I know a good bit about it. I'll post a little more information about it as well and you and your friend can research it as you wish..
> 
> ...


Thank you...again .. - this was for my curiousity
and you have satistfied it well..... thanks heaps


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## DrumRunner (Jan 26, 2011)

Good, glad to help. You're welcome!


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## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

Is she bred mainly to work cows (had been used for cmpdrafting before her accident) or is she bred mainly for halter? I know there are some QH racehorses as well as TB's like Man O War in there.  Whatever shes bred for she would be quick on her hooves if she didnt have that injury lol, poor girly.


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## DrumRunner (Jan 26, 2011)

She's definitely bred for more of a cow horse discipline. That's what a majority of the Foundation bred horses were used and bred for..They were also halter horses, but the definition of halter horses then is completely different than halter horses today..Those halter horses also did performance work and didn't just stand around and look pretty..


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## sommsama09 (Oct 28, 2010)

Ok thank you


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## DrumRunner (Jan 26, 2011)

lol You're welcome!


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