# Help me, i need direction in my self-criticism!:)



## Gossalyn (Sep 12, 2013)

Hey Everyone!

First off, I am SO excited - just got my guy back in November and he is the love of my life... Such a good boy! I can't say enough good things about this horse.

Anyway, his trot was a lot bigger than i was used to but I'm slowly getting into it. I keep watching this video and over analyzing myself. But I need help. Give me some feedback? I know I can be better. I feel like my post could be less bouncy...

I've been just trying to get used to him so he's gotten to run around with his nose out.. which he loves.  

I love this horse so much.. !!!!!!! He's such a beauty.. I just need to get my chops up to match him.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

I would say the thing that stands out the most is your hands. When you post up your hands should go down so not to bump his mouth. It is worse in certain parts of the video that others,


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## Gossalyn (Sep 12, 2013)

churumbeque said:


> I would say the thing that stands out the most is your hands. When you post up your hands should go down so not to bump his mouth. It is worse in certain parts of the video that others,



ahhh yes.. I'll do an exercise where I touch my fingers to the neck and they have to stay there while I post... that is always good to help me keep my elbows more fluid and feel what that feels like. It's an old issue, but agree it's creeping back in. Thanks for the feedback! I will work on that!


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

Looks good, you post with your stomach first, nice, you look in the direction of travel, nice! You do need your shoulders back a bit more and that will stabilize your hand movement, as they will be steadied on your sides. Almost think of your shoulder blades touching at the back, you can even practice that on the ground in your spare time. Your legs could be a bit more quiet with your toes lifted up and elongating your calves. Overall, you look very nice, thanks for posting.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I think the hands will solidify when your posting eases up. right now, I think you are behind the motion a little bit, and laboring at getting up . your leg is almost too far back and it looks like you may be gripping up a bit with your lower leg. do you like that saddle? does it make you feel at all as if you are riding down hill? or the vertical thigh blocks, do they feel restrictive?

when you went straight, things went better and your posting started to match the horse's better. 

while it's good to look where you are going, you are looking much farther into the turn than is necessary, more like a hunter/jumper would, in a corner.

I love the horse, and I have a feeling that with a bit of time , you two will be a really lovely pair. your riding is essentially good, and the hrose looks like a willing , honest fellow. lots of potential here.


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## DanteDressageNerd (Mar 12, 2015)

I agree with Tinyliny. I think your legs being so far back is throwing your balance a bit off and making it harder for you. I also really like your horse. He seems like a good soul. Very genuine, honest guy. I really like him and quite a nice moving horse. I love him and want to ride him lol.

I think you're doing a nice job for the most part. I think when you're on a circle you need to look over your outside shoulder to get your body in the correct line. Like literally look over your outside shoulder like you're trying to see what is behind you. That will help you set your body up better through turns and help with the crookedness.

With posting with your hands, try grabbing onto the pommel and posting that way. Feel your elbows move. No shame in that but I think it will really help you learn to relax your elbows and allow you to post with your hands more quiet.

Also when he leans too much to the inside, step into your outside stirrup to tell him where you want him to put his weight. 

He is a big mover, I think you'll need to get stronger in your core, upper body and thighs. He doesn't look like he'd be easy to sit lol. You post a bit heavy and I think a part of that is not being as strong as you need to be. Planks are a great exercise for building lower back and core strength, as well as stability. Any kind of yoga or dance. Push ups are good. Pull up bars are great and holding your legs out extended in from of you and holding or just start with your knees up. Pilates ball exercises just for ideas. They make a difference. But you're on the right track. Keep it up! He's a lovely boy!


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I'd never heard that, about looking literally over your outside shoulder. interesting.


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## DanteDressageNerd (Mar 12, 2015)

For whatever reason it works and straightens the rider's body up and sets them up in the correct position. It helps a LOT with canter transitions if a rider is struggling to get the correct lead or if they're struggling to maintain counter canter.

Even training a horse, sometimes it helps with training a horse which lead to pick up or when you start introducing simple changes and flying changes. I still do it if I feel like my body is being contorted or I'm getting crooked. I let my friend ride Dante. She'd get crooked, so he'd get crooked but when she'd look over her outside shoulder, she got straighter in her body, so he could get the correct bend, was more balanced and through and able to meet the contact. I don't know exactly why it works other than is works and gets the rider's body in the right position. A lot of what is correct is counter intuitive.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Gossalyn said:


> ahhh yes.. I'll do an exercise where I touch my fingers to the neck and they have to stay there while I post... that is always good to help me keep my elbows more fluid and feel what that feels like. It's an old issue, but agree it's creeping back in. Thanks for the feedback! I will work on that!


Maybe one of the leather straps that you put on the saddle would make it easier.


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## Gossalyn (Sep 12, 2013)

I am so happy with all of your feedback - thanks so much!

In this morning's ride I started off with my pinky's touching his neck as I held the reins and feeling the rhythm of how my elbows needed to move to keep still, once I felt I understood it I continued in that manner.. and his head went into this beautiful position. (I think it was his way of saying "Thank you Horse Forum ")

They key to that will be remembering and getting it into non-conscious memory, but his instant feedback was wonderful.

I am a H/J convert so I'm sure some of that shows (aka the looking too far ahead), good to note.

Will work on getting my lower leg a bit more forward, not sure what's going on there. I don't think I grip (in fact i used to keep my lower leg very off the horse) but he was pulling me forward for a bit for a while and i think i situated my lower leg to far back to compensate. (although that wasn't happening in the video). At any rate.. will work on.

The looking over your outside shoulder thing is interesting and I will experiment with it!

strength and keeping up with him will come in time, hopefully. I ride pretty much every day. I used to do bootcamp 2x a week but stopped when I increased my riding schedule. That said, I feel like some of the core strength you need for riding needs to be maintained outside of riding, and it's been a little while.

Thanks everyone! I will post back next time I get some video of how we progress over the next month or so. 

and @DanteDressageNerd Thanks for the compliments... lol. This guy is SO SO special to me. He's such a perfect horse in so many ways - and it makes me want to strive to be the best I can be for him.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

DanteDressageNerd said:


> I think you're doing a nice job for the most part. I think when you're on a circle you need to look over your outside shoulder to get your body in the correct line. *Like literally look over your outside shoulder like you're trying to see what is behind you. *That will help you set your body up better through turns and help with the crookedness.
> 
> 
> 
> !



when you say this, do you just do it for a minute, to help align your body, then go back to looking forward? do you twist hard , to see over your outside shoulder? I am intrigued with this.. my guess is that this help you line up with the horse's shoulders, which on a right lead circle will have the inside shoulder advanced over the outside, no?


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## DanteDressageNerd (Mar 12, 2015)

You're welcome  he's a lovely boy!

With a horse that moves as big as he does, you'll definitely have to do core and back exercises outside of the saddle. You develop riding muscles but you still have to supplement it. It makes a HUGE difference even if all you do is a 30 sec plank and 10 push ups every morning and every night you will feel a difference and feel more effective.

An example of what I mean with the "look over the outside shoulder" because I don't know how to describe it, you don't permanently ride like that. You do it as needed and hold it for as long as necessary if that makes sense. It aligns the shoulders and the hips into the right position. A lot of rider's contort in their spine and sometimes a horse being off balance or having something wrong can create crookedness too. Sometimes the shoulders are facing one way and the hips are facing another, this helps everything from the base of your skull to your pelvis align to where they need to be. For example I do it on my horse going right because his right stifle is weak and it throws/contorts my body, so I have to remind myself of it or I get crooked. You'll notice, especially if you ride a lot of different horses that some of them even when mostly balanced may throw your center of balance off, it may be slight or it may be more than you realize. This can happen because they might have a shortness in a leg or whatever, so you have to know where your center of balance is so you can organize the horse and correct their balance. No horse is perfectly symmetrical from left to right and no horse is perfectly coordinated from left to right but training evens it up. They're just like us. You can lunge a baby horse for the first time and you will see clear and definite differences. From what I've seen the majority are naturally more coordinated left and less flexible right so going left you may ride straighter and going right you may ride for more bend if that makes sense. There was a video with Carl Hester and Charlotte Dujardin talking about this but it was deleted :-( I remember a baby who couldn't bend right to save his life for the longest time lol. He needed so much help. Babies definitely test your ability to organize lol.

Example of what I mean with looking over the outside shoulder. Don't judge my friends riding off of this. She is a very nice rider, my horse is just a special cookie and hard to ride and organize. I wasn't suggesting too much on the half halts because he needs to be working into a steady connection first and if your timing isn't spot on with him when you start bringing him up and doing a lot of half halts, he can be quite naughty. Right side because of the stifle it contorts the rider more and is harder to ride/organize. I should have been more helpful through the change of direction but I hadn't taught in a while.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKwanLYYdxw


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

interesting.


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## farahmay (Sep 2, 2013)

I'm not one to criticize I just wanted to say he's absolutely gorgeous and has such bold movements! What a gorgeous horse, good luck with him


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## Gossalyn (Sep 12, 2013)

I just want to come back and say thanks again. 

Can't wait to post an update video. The thing about the "looking over your outside shoulder" exercise that I realized is not that you need to ride looking over your outside shoulder all the time - you really just need to do it once to feel how that feels. Once I felt it, I just had to think about looking over my outside shoulder and I could put my shoulders/upper body into that straighter frame. I think I was overcompensating turning my head/shoulders in the direction of travel.

I only hope all these ah-ha! moments I feel I got out of posting this really pay off in my next video.  (You know the classic "I think I'm riding so much better" and then you watch a video of yourself and you're like "**** it... I still stink!" )

but it's how we learn i suppose...! Exercising outside the saddle is still hard for me. Mostly because after I ride the rest of the day my thighs and core/upper body feel that they are done for the day.  I'm definitely building strength doing it everyday.. but I accept that I need to supplement it with out of the saddle exercise - even if they are a little sore. Just... need... to ... suck it up.

I rode my friends horse yesterday who I used to think was "so bouncy" and it was like riding a western jog... so easy! so I'm definitely progressing in my tolerance for big movements and bouncy horses. 

And thank you for all the <3 of my horse...! He motivates me all the time.


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

First thing I would tell you is to shorten your reins.

Lovely horse, you will get there I'm sure!


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## Gossalyn (Sep 12, 2013)

I took a video to send his previous owner (set up on a jump, no camera person) but here's us a week later. I see some improvements. some things still WIP... we'll keep at it! Soon I should probably start shortening my reins too.. I just didn't want to go there until I was more secure / less bouncy.


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## Gossalyn (Sep 12, 2013)

I took a video to send his previous owner (set up on a jump, no camera person) but here's us a week later. I see some improvements. some things still WIP... we'll keep at it! Soon I should probably start shortening my reins too.. I just didn't want to go there until I was more secure / less bouncy.

http://youtu.be/rVAv3ctPfTQ


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## DanteDressageNerd (Mar 12, 2015)

You're jumping up quite a bit with your outside rein which is part of the problem for holding a steady rein contact, especially important as you shorten up. You still tend to rotate your body to the inside a bit too much, I think why this is a problem is it makes you step down more into your inside stirrup and throws his balance off as well as makes you crooked. He looks like a horse whose balance is easily affected by which stirrup you put your weight in. I judge this based on how he reacts, he looks like he looks to put himself underneath your body.

Example when I'm teaching babies like just been broke babies to steer how we begin is literally stepping into the inside or outside stirrup and feeling them follow the weight for a step. We might open a rein to guide them towards the direction. For example to turn left step left, open left rein out and if necessary put the outside leg forward and bump their outside shoulder.

I'd actually make a conscious reminder to keep your outside rein low, especially when going left. It sort of bounces and tends to more forward or sometimes higher than the other one. I'd set it at his wither so you're more aware of it and more consistent with it. I think that will really help you.

Another thing to pay attention to is the shape of your circle, maintaining a constant bend and occasionally give him the inside rein to test if you can steer him just off your outside aids which can be outside rein, thigh, or leg. And leg yield, step into the outside stirrup, look where you're going, add inside leg when you feel his rib cage push into your inside leg and in the next moment half halt.

I also agree with why you're keeping your reins long, I agree they will need to be shortened so you can have more influence over the connection but for now I think you made a good decision so you can focus on getting your hands better without also having to half halt and back him off the bit. I can see him being something that could get a bit heavy or lean in the bridle and try to pull you out of the saddle if you're not a bit firm in the bridle for a few moments with release and having some strong core-leg, half halt the outside rein. That will help a lot with controlling the size/shape of your circle. 

You're doing a good job. I can definitely see quite a bit of improvement from last week. Keep it up! Your seat is much more stable and you're bouncing a lot less with your hands. Good job. He's a really lovely boy. He looks super fun and capable.


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## Gossalyn (Sep 12, 2013)

i'm eating all this up!!  love it. I was trying to be straighter but off to looking over my outside shoulder again  I did make an effort on that front but it wasn't a severe change - I will go further with my correction of that. 

and I see that renegade outside hand you refer to! It's going on "the list." 

My favorite thing about this video is how he puts his head down at times.. I see that as him telling me I'm doing better, but I need to be consistent. (funny enough I feel he does this more when I go to the right and that outside hand is less of an issue)


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## DanteDressageNerd (Mar 12, 2015)

He's a good guy and you definitely had some good moments, right looked more consistent but you're on the right track!

And it's okay at one point I had a really messed up elbow that would lock up and I eventually figured out something in my elbow would catch and would cause it to contract strangely, so I had to make a conscious effort to relax it for a while. I also changed my sleeping pattern so my arms were always aligned when I slept because I figured it had to be related lol. I also did squat exercises with my hands touching my drawers so I had to post and move through my elbows. Whatever I struggled with, I tried to find something connected outside of the saddle and it helped.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

looks better going right than going left. I wonder why.

dante?


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## DanteDressageNerd (Mar 12, 2015)

My guess is he's more flexible/coordinated to the right than the left. He looks more unbalanced right over left, he's leaning to the inside quite a bit but looks more flexible to the right. He also appears more active going right, so more energy from behind connects into the bridle better. Left he's not as flexible but doesn't lean as much. Some of it is crookedness and stepping too much into the left or right stirrup which to correct, looking over the outside shoulder a few strides stepping more into the outside stirrup and leg yielding out to the outside rein. Left he needs a little more bend and suppleness, little more energy to half halt. But I'd focus on the hands and crookedness first and play around with the weight in either stirrup first that's more important.

A horse like his is more straight forward (his body is more like one bending line vs something that can contort itself into a bunch of parts or a zig zag) and he looks quite ridable (allows rider to influence) but he looks like he'd be a lot to organize and piece together and it takes quite a bit of strength to half halt and put together. Not necessarily in your hands/arms but in your core, legs and upper body (back and shoulders). I've ridden a horse very similar and he was a tb/hanoverian cross about 17.1 or 17.2h sweet boy.


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## Gossalyn (Sep 12, 2013)

one more question!!!  (ok there will be millions of questions when it comes to riding well..)

My trainer wants me to turn my shoulders in the direction of travel. 

NOW... is that a contradiction to the looking over your outside shoulder / body straightening technique? Because when i look over my outside shoulder, my outside shoulder goes back (not in the direction of travel).

And I wonder if her instruction is a H/J vs. Dressage world collision.. (She teaches both). 

My trainer also seems to think if I lean right, I will push my horse left. But I have often heard that horses generally are trained to move into weight. (I guess with her line of thinking, the theory is they move away from pressure?). I've definitely ridden a dressage horse in lesson before and 'stepped' into the left stirrup and he would go left.. (and vice versa)... but I don't think my trainer is lying to me. 

Anyway.. my eyes just crossed and today while i was walking my guy around, i was leaning to the right... then leaning to the left... and scientifically noting his movements. I didn't really learn much and probably looked like a lunatic.... 

no wonder this sport is hard. I can't believe I've been riding for almost 3 years and I still get so confused sometimes over the simplest concepts!


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I remember once, like 15 years ago, going to watch a Charles De Kumfy clinic, and he suggested this to some riders at the canter. he said, when the horse lands on his leading leg, that THAT shoulder is advanced for a sec, and as the rider, you, too should advance your inside shoulder , timed to sort of "meet" that insides shoulder of the horse "touching " each other with each final beat of the canter.


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## DanteDressageNerd (Mar 12, 2015)

I don't want to step on toes but I disagree with your trainer.

One of my trainers also does both dressage and hunter jumpers but you do not show your chest where you are going, that creates crookedness. Looking too far to the inside creates crookedness, where as looking to the outside tends to help correct the crookedness that creates. The idea isn't that you're constantly leaning one way or the other but that you find straight and center, so you can then see how you move your body affects the horse. If your always crooked the horse will adapt to compensate.

Horses definitely travel in the direction where you put your weight. It's like if I put a 20lb backpack on you and you had it swung over one shoulder you're naturally inclined to follow the weight of the backpack. And I can say from breaking babies that is how we teach them to steer or if you ride a school master that is how they steer. It's based off of where you put your weight. Like if your rode my young horse and didn't steer that way he would have no problem running you into the wall because he puts himself under your weight. He's also a horse who can contort and twist his body in a variety of ways, so if you're not pretty straight and aware of all his pieces he will contort himself like a zig-zag (arabs are known for this). If you want him to leg yield, you almost just position, step into the outside stirrup, look where you're going and ask. The steepness being controlled between the inside leg and the outside rein. Straightness off of position and organization. If you step into the inside stirrup you may need to guide him with the outside leg because I will say we teach them to follow our weight because our goal in training is that our effort appear effortless even though nobody knows how many hours we've spent training to get it to look effortless.

I say this because straightness matters in dressage ESPECIALLY when you start moving into 2nd and 3rd level when you're doing a lot of laterals and movements and counter canter, simple and flying changes. When you do half pass and you go haunches in and into half pass (same with piroettes). Haunches in you sit more to your inside seat bone and lift the outside seat bone with the outside leg back, inside leg at girth to keep bend through the rib cage as the haunches are brought around the inside leg, then as you go into half pass you just ask the horse to travel side ways from the haunches in looking between the ears. What you see between the ears is where you're headed. If that makes sense. 

Or when you pick up true canter inside leg at the girth, outside leg behind and I look over the outside shoulder if they're not getting true canter because it puts my seat bones where they need to be for canter, so that when I teach the horse to pick up either lead of canter I can get it based on my position if that makes sense. When you turn with the outside shoulder forward like you're looking where you're going, your outside seat bone is forward, inside seat bone back and that is not in line with the shoulders or the horse at canter. Inside shoulder should be forward, inside seat bone forward, outside seat bone back as you ask because you are in a way mimicking and following the horse's body. If that makes sense.

My youngster in shoulder in, so you can see where my shoulders are in relationship to him and how his body is responding. He's pretty straight but correctly bent around my inside leg in shoulder in. It's consistent.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJswKAohbwI

Charlotte Dujardin. World number 1 dressage rider. Just note this is a very hot, strong and difficult young horse but it shows you a lot of what dressage riders do. There are moments when she does turn her chest in but that's for the hind leg. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXpROP5ht34

I'm including other riders too who aren't world class, except for Catherine Haddad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tcB-71_B38&list=PLJui2bgUdHlSXnu6_pCk-qu2hihYTXddQ&index=86

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8AneU8jz94

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLM_1MXjp1o

Sorry went really long with this but I'm trying to explain and I'm not always good at that so I get long winded trying to be detailed and conclusive. But I was going to say to your understanding of basics will constantly evolve as you discover better and better ways to do things. This is constant you'll always evolve and learn as you progress. All this sport is is learning new and better ways to do something. The moment you start feeling like you know what you're doing and you got this, you will ride a horse who will teach you a whole new set of rules and ways to ride. I think it's what makes it so hard to get cocky because every time you start feeling like you know your stuff and youre awesome, you will get knocked down many pegs and sometimes in the dirt. It's wonderful lol.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Gossalyn said:


> I only hope all these ah-ha! moments I feel I got out of posting this really pay off in my next video.  (You know the classic "I think I'm riding so much better" and then you watch a video of yourself and you're like "**** it... I still stink!" )



LOL, I have been feeling I'm riding a lot better, I keep thinking I'll get a video done, but I haven't for that very reason, I just want to enjoy FEELING better, before I look at it and go "yeah you still stink" :rofl:


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## Gossalyn (Sep 12, 2013)

I think what you are saying about weight makes sense. and I am still confused if there's a misunderstanding going on between me and my trainer. Horses do move away from pressure, but lateral pressure. If someone throws me off balance with a sack of potatoes over one shoulder, I'm going to try and compensate and support it.

I just found a clip from Sally Swift "Centered Riding" which I think helps a little.. If I compare myself to what she says, I am over looking with my head, my nose goes out of line w/ my sternum. She thinks looking w/ your 'chest eyes' is ok - but that is probably a very slight movement, not over exaggerated. (At least this is today's theory).


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