# ? How do you tell if a mare is in foal?



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

I bought Rosie towards the end of November. The lady I bought her from SAID she was feeding her 1 gallon of grain in the morning and 1 gallon at night, along with hay. Not to mention she had a yearling filly from Rosie in the paddock area.

My dilemma is that I'm feeding her the same amount with a comparable feed. She had her feed mixed at a co-op and I don't have one close enough to me to do that. I'm feeding her the Purina Molene 200. It doesn't have quite as much molasses in it and the corn is ground instead of whole kernal (like was in hers). I noticed a couple of weeks ago how much better she was looking since I've had her up here. But today, I noticed that her sides are starting to protrude a little...just in the stomach area.:shock: She's not putting any weight on in her hips. I mess with her every day too. Today, when I was brushing her and looking at her, I ran the brush under her stomach (as usual), she actually turned and looked at me. Not in a bad way, but normally she stands statue still when being groomed in the stall. 

I emailed the lady this evening to ask her. I know for a fact that she has 3 or 4 stallions there. I also called her trainer. Neither have called me back yet. I've never personally owned a mare before...until now. And with her temperament, I had considered breeding her, but wanted to wait a couple of years just to be sure it actually was something I wanted to do. When does a mare start showing if she has been bred? Is there any way the vet can check her without going through the ultrasound? I hope I'm just being paranoid.


----------



## thunderhooves (Aug 9, 2009)

they can check by stickig their hand......in there..yeah..... and i think with weefoal. Also, it depends completely on the mare. some show at 7 months, some at 10 months,depending on the mare.


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

I'm going to say that she would probably start showing at 7. The one the lady had wasn't the first baby of Rosie's. As a matter of fact, I think she had bred her at least 3 times. Not to mention, she was far from being in shape when I bought her. She has literally come a long way just in the 2+ months I've owned her. 

Horses normally carry for 11 months? I can't remember what I was told years ago. And should I go ahead and have the vet out to check her. I mean if she is in foal, I need to change her feed to make sure both her and the baby are getting what they need...right?


----------



## thunderhooves (Aug 9, 2009)

yes, on average 11 months, give or take. defiantly have the vet out, if she is, read all you can about pregnancy and raising foals. NEVER feed the preggo mare fescue grass. pm me and let me know once the vet is out.


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

Her free access hay and bale hay (for the stall) are both orchard grass. I know the guy personally and have seen the field it comes from. I guess I'll make the call in the morning. Of course it's snowing tonight...so tomorrow is probably out of the question for a non-emergency. But hopefully later in the week...before we get the 20+" that they're calling for this weekend.


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

thunderhooves said:


> NEVER feed the preggo mare fescue grass.


I do give her 2 or 3 alfalfa cubes as a treat before I leave the barn. Is that OK?


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

Ok...update. The trainer just called me. There is a chance that she was bred by the barn help who wanted a baby out of her and one of the lady's studs. If so, she is bred to a black Tennessee Walker. He told me not to worry. Just to watch her as the days start getting longer. He said she'd more than likely come into season with the first stretch of pretty sunny days that she can actually be out in.


----------



## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

The only way to know for sure if she is in foal is to have the vet out.


----------



## kassierae (Jan 1, 2010)

Get the vet out. Some mares do show sins of estrus while in foal. Also, please don't breed her based on her temperament.


----------



## ilovemyPhillip (Apr 4, 2009)

_Oh gosh! Well I hope all goes well, and yes, a vet is the best idea. With all this dang snow I hope it isn't going to ice tomorrow. You know how Spotsy Schools have missed THREE DAYS this week. Ugh, hopefully everything goes back to normal tomorrow. Except for MORE frickin' snow this weekend! They're callin' for about 12 inches! Ugh! Well good luck_


----------



## thunderhooves (Aug 9, 2009)

alfalfa cubes are ok. sounds like a nice stud. have the vet out and let me know! good luck!


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

kassierae said:


> Also, please don't breed her based on her temperament.


 
It's her termperament, and her build (when she's in good shape). Not to mention, she's double registered with the Tennessee Walking Horse Association, and the American Racking Horse Association. 

She was underweight when I got her, but I have seen pictures of her from before the lady cut back on all of her horses feed because her husband being out of work. She also has a very nice, natural gait; and throws some beautiful babies (I've seen pictures of them also). If she's not bred now, I was looking at this stud within the next couple of years...just not this year. Carvins Cove Stables

He's been sold, but I emailed and now have the information on the new owners. I just hope they still have him when and if I actually get ready. Of course, if she's already bred, I won't do it to her again.


----------



## kassierae (Jan 1, 2010)

Build doesn't change with their level of fitness, it's their bone structure. As for the stallion, he's nice but IMO not stallion quality. He's very pretty, but I'm betting if he was any other color he would be a gelding. He also hasn't done anything but stand there and be pretty and make babies. And registration has less to do with breeding than conformation and accomplishments, IMO. If you do in fact choose to breed, breed to something that will provide you with a well built MARKETABLE foal, because nothing is ever set in stone. Breeding is very expensive, and many times if you breed to a lower quality stud you will not get what you put into it to have that baby. Not to mention the obvious risks to mare and baby.


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

I thought the pictures below the main one spoke for themselves. I wouldn't be breeding for the looks of a show horse. I want the solid structure with a good level mind. I know that in breeding there are no guarantees. But IF she's bred now to the stud that the trainer told me about, I already have 2 people, that he spoke to today, that want it just because of it being from Rosie. 

Besides, what is marketable in one place, could not be marketable in another. Ty was not marketable in this area...because he didn't jump. He was shown only as a WTC horse. Took him to where I'm from, traded him for Rosie, and gave her money to boot. She sold him for $1000. I only paid $200 for him from a lady in MD, and Rosie's previous owner only allowed me $400 as a trade. It's all according to preferences.


----------



## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Did you call the vet and make an appointment to have her checked?


----------



## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

I wouldn't have a wait and see attitude like the previous owners. Pregnant mares need shots at certain intervals for some virus can't remember what one???


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

They're supposed to be out in the morning. Weather permitting that is. We're supposed to get between 16 & 24" of snow starting tomorrow morning at about 10. They're supposed to be there at 11, but that was the quickest they could get out.


----------



## lacyloo (Jul 1, 2008)

Glad you're getting the vet out !


----------



## Indyhorse (Dec 3, 2009)

So what did the vet say? Is Rosie bred?


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

They didn't make it out with the snow coming. She said the earliest would be later next week. So, I have the lady that I ride with call her vet and see if he can see her when the roads clear enough for me to get the trailer out. I've got to find out soon. If she is, I want to get the inside stall ready. The barn has 5 stalls, 1 being used for hay. 2 open up to the paddock area (1 of which she's in), and 2 inside stalls. The BO's miniature donkey had her baby in one of them this past July.


----------



## FeatheredFeet (Jan 27, 2010)

Charlicata, I'd look past that blue stallion if I were you. I notice he toes out in all four feet in almost every picture. His sire does also and I dug up a pic of one of his foals who also does.
I can't find a proper conformation shot of him, so it's difficult to tell exactly what faults he has but I'm thinking he might also be a bit sickle hocked.
If your mare is as good as you say, then breed her to a stud she deserves.
JMHO


----------



## orin (Jul 22, 2009)

sorry but i agree i didnt like the blue stallion. also is it usual for them to be broken in at 2years old?

have you had any news yet?


----------



## trIplEcrOwngIrl (May 13, 2009)

orin said:


> sorry but i agree i didnt like the blue stallion. also is it usual for them to be broken in at 2years old?


I was thinking the same thing. He sure is pretty though!! Not that that should be the cause for breeding to him(not that that is why you are considering him eighter). So, any news??


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

Woke up to two foot of snow. Hopefully they'll get the roads cleared and I can get her to my friends vet on Monday or Tuesday. So no word yet. The BO had to take care of her for me today. My truck was acting like a plow and I couldn't make it. I'll let you guys know as soon as I find anything out.


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

OK...update. Let me start off by saying that the vet is supposed to be out later in the week. In trying to research some of this stuff, I came across this website Foaling . So, being the impatient person that I am, I tried to "milk" Rosie. I got clear fluid out of the one, and ran (as fast as I could on ice) up to the barn owners house to ask him. We ended up going and trying the other side...and yes, clear fluid there too. He called one of his friends who told him where to push to see if anything moved. I tried, didn't feel anything without her moving to the side, so I stopped. Then he told me to see if she was dilated. When I moved her tail to the side, I could see a little pink. SO, Rosie is now in a stall that has been heavily bedded with straw. I'm just hoping that the vet will actually be able to make it out as scheduled because we're supposed to be hit with yet another 10 or so inches of snow tomorrow into Wednesday, and the roads still aren't exactly clear from the weekend snow. 

If you're religious, please pray for her. THANKS!!!!


----------



## JB44 (Feb 7, 2010)

A few comments from an ex breeder that may or may not be of any use:

First 2 questions:
do you know what day she might have been bred? any idea how far along she could be?
and is she making a big milk bag? has it changed lately at all?

FYI:

they can do a blood test for pregnancy if you don't want her palpated.you ship the serum to BET labs in KY. BET LABS home Page . They run total estrogen levels.

Some mares get liquid, even milk, when not in foal

A hay belly can resemble a pg belly. this happens NOT from too much hay, but from lesser quality hay that they must eat more of to get the nutrition they need. 

Hope you can get a vet out between snow storms!! what a year for snow.


----------



## JB44 (Feb 7, 2010)

PS they rarely dilate until the last few hours before foaling. you should see other signs before then.


----------



## Indyhorse (Dec 3, 2009)

charlicata said:


> OK...update. Let me start off by saying that the vet is supposed to be out later in the week. In trying to research some of this stuff, I came across this website Foaling . So, being the impatient person that I am, I tried to "milk" Rosie. I got clear fluid out of the one, and ran (as fast as I could on ice) up to the barn owners house to ask him. We ended up going and trying the other side...and yes, clear fluid there too. He called one of his friends who told him where to push to see if anything moved. I tried, didn't feel anything without her moving to the side, so I stopped. Then he told me to see if she was dilated. When I moved her tail to the side, I could see a little pink. SO, Rosie is now in a stall that has been heavily bedded with straw. I'm just hoping that the vet will actually be able to make it out as scheduled because we're supposed to be hit with yet another 10 or so inches of snow tomorrow into Wednesday, and the roads still aren't exactly clear from the weekend snow.
> 
> If you're religious, please pray for her. THANKS!!!!


The fact that there is fluid coming out of her udder doesn't necessarily mean she is close, you can only really get further indication from actually testing the milk (and from a quick click around the website you referenced, I believe that is what they are talking about). Believe me I am going through this right now, been milk testing my mare for a week and based on her results we are still a ways off from foaling, _despite_ other signs she is showing which would indicate readiness to foal. I know this based on having the vet come out and do an ultrasound. Since you are not even sure if the mare is bred, I wouldn't let this be a cause for panic at this point. When mares get close to foaling, it is VERY obvious in the size of their belly, I don't think it could be readily mistaken for a hay belly when they are close enough to be producing from their udder. I'd stop scaring yourself with websites and get a professional opinion.


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

I'm trying to get the vet out. Everytime they're supposed to come, it snows. I'm so danged frustrated with it. I can't even get the trailer out to try to take her myself. That alone is driving me nuts. 

JB44, I don't know the answer to either of the first 2 questions. As for the 3rd, she is making a milk bag. It was bigger this morning than it was last night...but still not as big as the pictures on that website. I wish I could just say that her belly is from the hay. I even asked the BO again this morning when I went out. He said that with the horses that he has had in the past, that it definitely isn't because of the hay. Not to mention I get a very good weed-free orchard grass hay for her. I know the guy personally and know the pains he goes through to keep his hay that way.

Indyhorse, if I could get out to the WalMart, I would definitely buy the stuff to do it. Right now, I'm lucky to actually get to the barn...and it's just 2 miles down the road. I really wasn't all that scared or nervous until the BO called me last night and told me that I needed to come back and get the stall ready...that I needed to get her in the other stall last night. As far as her size, she was very skinny when I bought her in Nov. I thought she was gaining nicely, she just wasn't gaining in her hips. Then, I started seeing her backbone again. She hadn't lost any weight, it just dropped into her stomach. That's when I started making the phone calls and then made the post.

Her previous owner did call me back this morning (at long last). She told me that she didn't know that Rosie was bred when she sold her to me. But then went on to tell me that she didn't know that another of her mares was bred last year until she got up one morning and found the surprise in the field. I'm sorry, but how do you NOT notice that type of changes in one of your horses if you actually take care of them? I really really need to get the vet out ASAP though. Aparrently, Rosie had twins about 4 or 5 years ago. Of course only one of them lived. Luckily, she did tell me that she would send me the information on her two studs that have been DNA'd. That I could have the baby DNA'd and the registry would match the baby to the stud. Can they actually do that? If she does have a baby, I would like to be able to register it. OH, and she offered to come and get Rosie (5-6 hrs each way), and bring me a "comparable horse" if I felt it was too much for me. Wasn't that kind of her?:roll: She's badly mistaken if she thinks I would ever send Rosie back down there to her. If I had the money, I'd go buy a few more of her horses just to get them out of there. 

I'm sorry this is so long. I do appreciate everybody's input though. THANKS!!!:smile:


----------



## Indyhorse (Dec 3, 2009)

charlicata said:


> I'm trying to get the vet out. Everytime they're supposed to come, it snows. I'm so danged frustrated with it. I can't even get the trailer out to try to take her myself. That alone is driving me nuts.
> 
> JB44, I don't know the answer to either of the first 2 questions. As for the 3rd, she is making a milk bag. It was bigger this morning than it was last night...but still not as big as the pictures on that website. I wish I could just say that her belly is from the hay. I even asked the BO again this morning when I went out. He said that with the horses that he has had in the past, that it definitely isn't because of the hay. Not to mention I get a very good weed-free orchard grass hay for her. I know the guy personally and know the pains he goes through to keep his hay that way.
> 
> Indyhorse, if I could get out to the WalMart, I would definitely buy the stuff to do it. Right now, I'm lucky to actually get to the barn...and it's just 2 miles down the road. I really wasn't all that scared or nervous until the BO called me last night and told me that I needed to come back and get the stall ready...that I needed to get her in the other stall last night. As far as her size, she was very skinny when I bought her in Nov. I thought she was gaining nicely, she just wasn't gaining in her hips. Then, I started seeing her backbone again. She hadn't lost any weight, it just dropped into her stomach. That's when I started making the phone calls and then made the post.



I don't think you can get the test kits at Walmart. I had to get mine from my vet.

I can understand where you are coming from, for sure, as I mentioned I have been going through something similar with my mare. She was essentially a rescue, I didn't know if she was bred but since she was pastured with a stallion after her foal was born I knew it was likely. Having no breeding date to go on can be very difficult in knowing what to expect. I was lucky enough to at least know when her last foal was born so it gave me something to go by. They can be very tricky with what signs they exhibit as well, see my thread http://www.horseforum.com/horse-breeding/foaling-qs-46465/ and you'll see what I mean - I was worried my mare was going to drop a foal prematurely based on the signs she was exhibiting (and is still exhibiting) but getting the vet out to do the ultrasound, along with starting her on milk test, has gone a long way to ease my mind, despite her signs of readiness I think I have several weeks left before I have to start camping out in the barn. I also understand about the weather - we are under winter storm warning right now and predicted to get 8-12 inches of snow tonight. Overall, though, it's awfully early in the season to be expecting foals and I'm guessing if your mare has only just started being super-obvious with her baby belly then you probably have a bit of a wait left. Hopefully your vet will get out there soon and be able to set your mind at ease!


----------



## CheyAut (Nov 26, 2008)

Pool test kits work, and those you can get at Walmart


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

That's what I was wanting to get from WalMart CheyAut. If I could only get out...lol. I just got back from down there, and she's dilated 3/8 of an inch, and I'm pretty sure I saw movement in her stomach. Not to mention she sighed real big when it stopped. Her teets aren't completely swollen yet, but they are fuller than they were yesterday and very warm. Her tail is very floppy, and I noticed that her butt is more sloped. Not to mention the little area between her thigh and stomach is actually filled out today. My hubby stopped by and scared the begeesies out of me when I had her tail up checking to see if she's bigger "there" than she was yesterday. Can you say akward moment?...lol Anyway, the BO came down before I left and had a look for himself. He's saying within the next week. I just hope I can actually get the vet out beforehand.

And...It's snowing again. BIG flakes. It would be pretty if there wasn't already so much of the danged white stuff.


----------



## JB44 (Feb 7, 2010)

if her bag is progressing, she may well be pregnant. and the filling out between the belly and thigh, can mean the baby is moving back into position. (or it simply shifted for no reason) it's so aggrevating trying to second guess mares!!

you might want to at least be sure she doesn't have a Caslicks. you would not want her foaling if she is sewed shut. a gloved finger reaching in and feeling the top of the opening will tell you that. if she is gentle of course. don't get kicked.

when did her bag start developing? was it very recently?

usually the nipples fill out to the end before foaling - they stand right out. but then nothing follows the rules.

good luck.


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

Thank you JB44. I know she doesn't have Caslicks. The woman who I bought her from did have foals with her, but she flat out told me this morning that the check when the vet came out afterward was basically to check the sack and afterbirth. She said he would listen to the mare and the baby, check the afterbirth stuff, and leave. I didn't start checking her bag until the weight that was flattening out her back all dropped into her stomach. I could actually see her backbone again, the way it was when I bought her. But her stomach area started widening out. 

I couldn't have asked for a more gentle and docile mare. I think if she was going to kick me, she would have done it yesterday when I milked her. Instead, she just stood there...with no halter or lead. And yes, it is very aggravating trying to second guess a mare. I've read that their personalities can change when they're in foal. I just hope she keeps this personality after everything is over with.


----------



## JB44 (Feb 7, 2010)

sounds like a sweety-pie. you will have such fun with her baby! !


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

The vet was out. She couldn't give me a date though. Just said that they both look good, and to call them with any emergencies.

I tested the calcium and ph this evening. Her calcium is at 100 and the ph is at about 7.5.


----------



## Indyhorse (Dec 3, 2009)

Haha, then we can wait and pull our hair out together. :lol: My mare is at CAL 100 and ph 8 tonight, so maybe they will be on a similar timeline. Prolly not though, goodness knows no two are ever alike. 

At least you know for sure now though!


----------



## Indyhorse (Dec 3, 2009)

CheyAut said:


> Pool test kits work, and those you can get at Walmart


Are you serious? God my vet has me pegged for such a sucker.....:lol:


----------



## rockaway (Jan 14, 2010)

HI we had a foal last spring. It was a surprise to us as she was bred at the trainer's barn - their stud got loose last year. We could not tell ( we were not looking -her personality did not change in the least) as it was winter - thick coat and I had been trying to put weight on her. 
At ten months we finally saw movement - yikes - it was much too early in the year and we had just moved so we had to put her in our garage (barn is being built) . I had no idea about foaling but read a book. It was textbook - the signs and timing happened exactly when the book said it would. I knew that she would give birth the night she did as she filled up and then waxed - they said within so many hours she would give birth and she did ( I was naive about having a foal and so relied on the book - from all I have read and heard I have no idea why it worked out so perfectly). It was so amazing it all happened as if she was reading the book. I woke at 3.00 a.m. and went to check her. I changed her stall and as soon as I did that I could tell she was going into labour. I was shaking the whole time and waiting for that first foot to appear ( a little white balloon came out of her first and was there for a few minutes). The only help we gave was to take the placenta off the nose as she was being born ( we could see it being sucked in and out by her nose). I did not realize just how much afterbirth there was or that it came a few hours later - some came out right away and I thought that was it. You must clean that up right away and not let the horse eat it. My horse did a little - yecky I know it doesn't always happen this way but it was so beautiful. We have no large animal vets here so no one was around to check - all went well. The only bad thing that came out of this is that we will not use the trainers any longer as they did not even really apologize for what happened ( my horse had been sick - from being at their place and was very underweight at the time and so the pregnancy was hard on her - she is just now 1 year later gaining her weight back. We gave the filly away as I had just purchased a yearling and did not want two young ones. I am sure she will be a wonderful horse. The trainers wanted to buy the filly as it was from their stud but I thought it best to go to a home of my choosing. Best of luck - I hope you witness the birth - you will be in awe


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

You know CheyAut, I went to WalMart this morning and they were closed. The sign said closed due to inclement weather problems. It was closed last night also according to my co-worker. So, I went to PetSmart. They didn't have anything for regular water...just salt-water in fish tanks. I finally stopped by a pool place and asked for test strips. The guy showed me a pack for $25 and I guess he saw me cringe a little. So he asked me if I was testing a pool or spa. When I told him I was testing my mare's milk to see if she was anywhere close to delivering the foal, he went into the back and got a container. He brought it back out to me and and said, "These should do it for you." When I asked how much, he said Adios. He actually just GAVE them to me!!!! I was so amazed. So, as soon as this baby is born, I'll be taking him pictures. He told me to stop back in to let him know how it was going. Such a nice guy!!!

And rockaway, when I absolutely know it's within a couple of days, I'll probably be camping out down at the barn. I warned the BO today...lol


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

Indyhorse said:


> Haha, then we can wait and pull our hair out together. :lol: My mare is at CAL 100 and ph 8 tonight, so maybe they will be on a similar timeline. Prolly not though, goodness knows no two are ever alike.
> 
> At least you know for sure now though!


 
Wouldn't it be something if they were born on the same day???


----------



## thunderhooves (Aug 9, 2009)

wow. keep me updated! and Good Luck with the whole brithing and raising process!


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

Thanks thunderhooves! I'll be sure to keep everybody up to date on the progress.


----------



## rockaway (Jan 14, 2010)

any baby yet?????


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

I'm sorry I haven't posted anything in a while. She lost her baby. The vet came out and checked about 3 or 4 weeks ago (I think) and broke the bad news. I'm still kind of upset about the whole thing. But as he said, I got her too late to actually be able to help her actually produce a healthy baby. She was bone thin when I got her in November. He said that as poor and out of shape as she was that it was pretty inevitable. The way I'm looking at it is that if it was to be, it would have been. At least I still have her!!!

Now, I'm just considering just buying a colt at some point. I not sure I want to put her through another pregnancy and risk losing her and the baby.

Of course, I'm waiting for Indy. Hoping she might find it in her heart to sell Freyja's baby  **In my dreams** LOL


----------



## lilkitty90 (Nov 11, 2009)

aww no! Charlicata i'm sorry for your loss but your right at least you still have the mom. at least you gave it a shot and thats what counts. plus you've given the mare a nice wonderful home where she will now be taken care of


----------



## charlicata (Jan 12, 2010)

Thank you littlekitty. And yeah, I'm very happy with Rosie. She looks so much better since I got her back in November. I've started working her on a regular basis now. She's starting to muscle up a little bit in the back. I'm just hoping that her hips start filling out a little more as she builds more muscle. The previous owner had 20 some head of horses Her husband had been injured, and they couldn't afford to feed them the way that they needed to be fed. Not to mention the only one's that they really took the time to work and actually take care of were the one's that they were planning on showing this year. I wish I could have taken more of them.


----------

