# M. Toulouse saddles



## SionTheMonster (Mar 6, 2011)

Looking for some reviews and input.  I'm looking at the Aachen with the Genesis system for me and my boy for this fall when I have some money, and potentially the Annice Genesis next year or whenever I need it/can afford it.

For now though, I'm mostly looking for the deets on the Aachen. What kind of back does it fit? Are the seats true to size? What kind of position does it put you in? How does it hold up against use? Where's the best place to get one, for the best price? (So far I've only found them on SmartPak for $1,599.)

I wanna hear any other things you have to say about them, too - good or bad!  Thanks in advance!


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

I had the Annice (not the adjustable one) and LOVED it. Best saddle ever! I sold it because it wasn't wide enough for my horse. I ended up buying the bates but I really wish I had gotten another Toullouse. I may look into selling or trading once I finish paying for my bates....


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

i have an M Toulouse Celine with a wide tree that im gonna be selling soon ! i love it, but it no longer fits my horse =[


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## SionTheMonster (Mar 6, 2011)

Yay! I like to hear good things about these saddles.  What kind of back shapes do your horses have? I've got a wide, short-backed paint x Arab pony with basically no wither, LOL. Pretty much build like a barrel. Makes for *super* comfy bareback riding, but saddle fit can be tricky!


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## DandyLonglegs (Jan 1, 2012)

I'm going to piggy back onto your post as I'm also looking at the Toulouse saddles with the genesis tree. I'm looking at the Annice, Dennise, and maybe the Legano. 

My guy has your typical TB withers (aka, high) but has a wide shoulder and it's hard to fit. 

I'd love to hear opinions on the genesis system!


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## SionTheMonster (Mar 6, 2011)

Lol! Feel free, Dandy.  From what I've heard from a few other sources, the Annice seems to fit lower withered, wider horses better...does this ring true for anyone else?


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

My horse is a quarter horse w/ really wide shoulders. The wide Toullouse Annice was not wide enough. W/ the genesis completely as wide as we could get it, it was an ok fit. That's why I went to the bates but even the bates on my guy is not a perfect fit.

The annice was the most comfortable saddle. SO good and I LOVE the leather...


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

ive heard they do run a little narrow


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## DejaVu (Jul 6, 2011)

I have the Annice with the Genesis, so I'll talk most about it, since it's the only one I have any real hands on information with.
Best purchase ever!! 

I've thought about used Antares, or CWD's and such, but I'd honestly rather have this, with the Genesis. As long as the tree angle is correct, then you can fit it to any horse in width. I'd rather have a mid-range saddle that fits my horse like a glove, than a name brand saddle that makes me cringe at every ride for the safety of his back.

My gelding is very broad through the shoulder, wide set, and semi-curvy.
I'm pretty sure all MT models run on the curvier side.

The calfskin leather is pretty delicate, but it's not really a problem. I've gotten some pretty deep scratches on it, due to my neglect, but a quick conditioning, and they aren't visible anymore. 
The seat is comfortable. It's very sofa-like, but without drowning you. I'm just as solid down in a full seat, but still have no problems getting up into a two point. 

I'm not sure about the Aachen, I'd wish I'd sat in it when I was at Dover last. :/
But the Annice puts me in a great position for hunters/Eq. Very balanced.
If I rode more dressage, I'd definitely get the Aachen as well. But as little as I do, my Wintec suits me fine.

I've loved having the Genesis system. It takes literally two minutes to refit it to any horse. 

Toulouse, in general is a good, well built saddle. It'll last you for quite a while.


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## DejaVu (Jul 6, 2011)

Also, have you looked at Classic Saddlery? They sell all the Toulouse models for a great price.


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## JoesLove (Mar 1, 2012)

Hey all, 
I just joined this site, but have been reading different threads for a bit now. I had seen the M. Toulouse Aachen and immediately fell in love, especially since the price was only $1149 and came with free leathers and with smart pak had free ground shipping and return. At first I put in a spot to wait for the 17.5inch test ride, but after doing a lot of research I decided since I ride in a 17.5inch all purpose that I better go ahead and get the 18inch seat on the toulouse since it has a deep seat. My trainer thought it looked like i would love this saddle and put my leg in a good position, so tonight I went ahead and ordered it on smartpak as an early birthday present to me, I have never had a nice real leather saddle! My first saddle was a kincade (so terrible i was always forward) then i got the wintec, now I decided to ride/train dressage so going to be selling anything hunter,etc. I am expected to get this saddle march 7th, as it is not the 'test ride' one I ordered I will be very careful with this, but I think I will like it as I'm not too picky as long as it feels comfortable and fits my horse. I will definitely update everyone in a week when I get the saddle( i didn't get the genesis since my horse has been easy to fit, and hes the main one I ride. 16.2 medium build breeding stock paint, not too thick backed, and no shark fin withers, hes just right ;] ) I do have to say I am extremely excited to try this saddle and that 90% of reviews on this saddle were good! I do not expect this saddle to last me 20 yrs but if it lasts me close to 10 I will be happy.


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## SionTheMonster (Mar 6, 2011)

Thank you so much DejaVu! Those're exactly the things I like to hear.  It's strange because I'd heard so much about these saddles that was just kind of blase, but I'm so happy to hear that everyone's raving about them! Definitely going to invest in one (or maybe two! hehe...) in the future. 

JoesLove, I would definitely love to hear all about it when it comes in! I'd love to see some pictures of it too, and of your guy's back, maybe? Just so I can get a better idea for shape, since I will hopefully/definitely be buying myself the Aachen later this year.


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

farmpony84 said:


> My horse is a quarter horse w/ really wide shoulders. The wide Toullouse Annice was not wide enough. W/ the genesis completely as wide as we could get it, it was an ok fit. That's why I went to the bates but even the bates on my guy is not a perfect fit.
> 
> The annice was the most comfortable saddle. SO good and I LOVE the leather...


You might want to consider Duett saddles. They specialize in fitting wiiiiide and flat backed horses.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

mildot said:


> You might want to consider Duett saddles. They specialize in fitting wiiiiide and flat backed horses.


Good to know. I'll have to look into them. It's funny because to me, he really does not look that massive. He just looks like a horse....


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

farmpony84 said:


> Good to know. I'll have to look into them. It's funny because to me, he really does not look that massive. He just looks like a horse....


Duett Saddles: The Partnership of Horse & Rider


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## Ink (Sep 25, 2009)

I'm in the same boat as Farmpony. I bought an Annice but the medium tree doesn't fit my rolly polly quarter horse at all  

SO sad because it is the most comfortable saddle I've ever ridden in! I wish I had gone for the adjustable one, but I didn't like the feel of it quite as well. 

I'm finally going to break down and sell mine to finance the purchase of a new western saddle. If anyone is interested in a very gently used 17.5 medium tree Toulouse let me know :lol:


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## JoesLove (Mar 1, 2012)

This week I will work on getting shots of my horses back and then once the saddle comes in I will make sure to take lots of good pictures and probably post them via photobucket or something of the sort!


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## SionTheMonster (Mar 6, 2011)

Yay! Thank you, JoesLove.  I can't wait to see & hear all about it!

Anyone else have any input about M. Toulouse stuff?


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## crimsonsky (Feb 18, 2011)

i'm glad someone posted this - i know i'll end up needing a wide tree for my pony when she's back "up and running", so to speak, and i was looking at the M. Toulouse saddles at the tack store last weekend. they certainly seem nice.


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## DejaVu (Jul 6, 2011)

When I was first looking at new saddles, I also was seeing some not so great reviews, but I just think those reviews are from people who weren't fully educated in what they wanted. Don't be swayed by them. I haven't heard anything technically bad about them. Just more personal preference, type things.

With my requirements in a new saddle, (adjustable gullet, and short flap), I was down to Bates, MT, or Pessoa.
It's great quality. So glad I bought the MT.


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## SionTheMonster (Mar 6, 2011)

I'm thinking that's what it was, too. Definitely glad to hear all these positive things.  The Aachen is definitely on my 'will buy' list for the near future!


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## SionTheMonster (Mar 6, 2011)

Oh! One more question for all of you who own one of these, especially the Annice: what do the seat sizes feel like? Are they true to size, snug, roomy, etc? I'm just wondering because right now I can't ride in anything 17" or over since my guy's short-backed and little. I ride in a 16" ride now, but the Annice only starts in 16.5". I believe we tried a 16.5" Bates on him when I was hunting, and it was just a smidge too long - then again, from my experience the Bates saddles run a little large by about .5".


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## SionTheMonster (Mar 6, 2011)

Okay, I lied...one more question LOL. What is the colour like on your Annices? Could you maybe post some pictures, if possible?  I've got a Pessoa bridle I paid a good chunk of money for that I *love*, and I'm hoping to all hopes that they'll match!


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## DejaVu (Jul 6, 2011)

Sion- I ride in a 16" as well, but I ended up with a 17", because when I bought it, it came with a package deal (ended up with $200 off the price), and it was only in 17".

I definitely could have waited and paid full price for a 16.5", but it's okay. I don't feel swamped by it at all, I'm really quite ok with it. I mean, what's a half inch really going to do?

I only have pics of when I first bought it, before I oiled it. It takes oil beautifully.
I'm still darkening it quite a bit more, since I've always had dark tack, and prefer it. I'll try to get some recent pics of it tomorrow.


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

Not to kill everyone's buzz, but I've heard the dye in the leather rubs off on your pants? This saddle with #1 on my list until I read a few reviews about that.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

that never happened to me...


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## Ink (Sep 25, 2009)

I hadn't had any issues with the dye rubbing off on my pants either.

Here are a few pics of mine. I love the contrasting leather on the seat and knee rolls. I probably should have cleaned it one more time before taking pictures to try and buff out some of those scuff marks


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## JoesLove (Mar 1, 2012)

This is a small update but I am excited, just checked my tracking number and looks like saddle is getting delivered tuesday instead of wednesday! So one day earlier I will be on here with pics. I do have to admit I am very nervous of the calf skin leather as some people make it seem like riding on a paper towel like it will just fall apart, then other people who seem really loyal to the MT's seem to love it. At least the saddle came with the calf skin leathers!


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## SionTheMonster (Mar 6, 2011)

Aaaaahhhh...it's just gorgeous, Ink! ♥ I love the two-tone, as well. I'm thinking/hoping the lighter brown might match my bridle...fingers and toes crossed, lol! What a gorgeous colour though, honestly! I can't wait until I can get one now


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## SionTheMonster (Mar 6, 2011)

JoesLove: That's so exciting!!! I was so pumped waiting for my Collegiate to come in when I got it...I've always loved that feeling of anticipation when I get new things. 

DejaVu: Can't wait to see it!


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## DraftXDressage (Aug 29, 2011)

One quick word to those of you who mention having very wide horses: Unless your horse is quite mutton withered, adjustable gullets are not going to be your friend, as you loose wither clearance when you widen the three. As much as I absolutely adore some of the adjustable saddles, they will never fit my draft cross mare who has the draft shoulders but the thoroughbred withers. Just something to keep in mind.

That being said, I spoke with a saddle fitter at a show a couple weeks ago. She was carrying a number of high end brands...and M. Toulouse. She absolutely could not stop raving about them, and I really liked the look and feel of them. I used to own an Ainsley saddle with the Wellup adjustment system, and the Toulouse saddles have made one huge improvement on that design: namely, they have added two screws to keep the tree from slipping wider as you ride in it, which used to be a huge problem with the Ainsleys and the Rembrandts, particularly as they got older. Toulouse is also putting a 10-year warranty on the tree, I believe, so they obviously believe in their product. If I thought for one second that I might be able to make it work on my mare, I'd pick up a Legano in a heartbeat. They're gorgeous.


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## DejaVu (Jul 6, 2011)

I've never had a problem with color rubbing off either.

I was also concerned about the calf skin leather, but it's not really a problem now.
I ride in jeans 80% of the time, and it still looks brand new. The only sign of wear on it, is from my ancient half chaps that bleed black onto it. That comes off though, so when I scrub the black stuff off, it's good as new.

Also, I completely forgot about recent pics.
But, here's the color before I oiled it. After about two oilings, it's about the color of the panels. Less orange, more chocolate-ish. It matches Edgewoods perfectly....


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## JoesLove (Mar 1, 2012)

Beautiful saddle dejavu! What do you clean it with? I read that you have to clean it with specific kinds of conditioner, but I hear so many different things. I'll have the black dressage saddle so I am a little nervous, I havent had a leather saddle in years and Ive had a synthetic for so long now. I just don't want to ruin it early!


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## SionTheMonster (Mar 6, 2011)

DraftX: Thank you for all that! All of that is good to know  Thankfully my guy is pretty much the flattest backed horse I've ever seen...it's honestly ridiculous. But oh well...hopefully as he loses his winter pudge, his withers will magically sprout! 

Ooooh, DejaVu, that is just gorgeous...hmmmmm, I wonder if my coach + parents would kill me if I bought another close contact...? LOL


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

Does anyone with a Legano care to share pics? I'm considering buying one.


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## DejaVu (Jul 6, 2011)

JoesLove said:


> Beautiful saddle dejavu! What do you clean it with? I read that you have to clean it with specific kinds of conditioner, but I hear so many different things. I'll have the black dressage saddle so I am a little nervous, I havent had a leather saddle in years and Ive had a synthetic for so long now. I just don't want to ruin it early!



I use a Fiebings glycerin bar, or the Lexol foam or spray, depending on my mood, and Lexol conditioner. Neatsfoot oil, every other month or so (very light coats). Nothing fancy. If I clean, I condition.

One of my favorite things for my leather is the tack wipes.
That way, I can just wipe down my saddles and bridles after rides. Super fast, just enough to keep the dirt and sweat off. Also, makes things easier, for when I do a big deep clean with the products posted above. It's basically already clean anyways.

As long as you keep it clean, covered, and in a dry area, all will be fine.


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## SionTheMonster (Mar 6, 2011)

For the record, I usually use Belvoir Step 1 spray-on cleaner on my tack, and then Step 2 Glycerin soap.  However, my Step 1's almost run out so now I use LeatherNew foam to clean and condition. Apparently it gets dirty faster if you just condition, which I have noticed, so I'm going to do a quick layer of my glycerin soap from now on.


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## crimsonsky (Feb 18, 2011)

DejaVu and Ink - what models specifically are the ones you posted pictures of?


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## Ink (Sep 25, 2009)

Mine is the Annice model with a fixed tree. It's darkened up some with oiling.


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## livestoride (Mar 30, 2011)

I tried the Aachen with genesis on my Arab mare. I loved the genesis system and think every saddle should have it. The leather was super soft with just the right amount of stick to it. The problem I had is the twist is very wide and it was very uncomfortable on my thighs. I ride in a saddle with a narrow twist and it fits me way better. Also the length of the flap was too long. I am 5'3" and at the moment can't recall my inseam but it isn't that long. The flaps came below my ankle even with a longer stirrup length which provided no contact. If it was narrower or the flap shorter I would have jumped all over it.


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## JoesLove (Mar 1, 2012)

So I rushed home to get the saddle and break it out of the box, and guess what? Smartpak forgot to put in the free calfskin leathers! I know it sounds petty but I am soo frustrated and upset. She said she would call me back tomorrow and see, and they could expedite them. I really hope they dont give me any problems I tore apart both boxes I got (saddle and halter boxes) and all the packaging they came in. The saddle itself looks nice, but I can tell where it's been tried out before, where the leathers go and on the billets where the girth was. I told the lady I hope they don't only give me partial credit if I return it due to other people, and she said they evaluate each saddle before they send them out, so we will see. The twist is fairly wide, intec's website said a medium twist, but hopefully I find it comfortable. I'm taking it to the barn tomorrow so I will get better pics out in the sun, and I will be trying it out and I guess using my leathers and wrapping them so i think since I'll have them wrapped it will be okay to not ride in calfskin leathers just once lol. One thing one person was right on is the billets are pretty stiff, someone said "like cardboard" and I sort of agree. Well, Im just going to take a breath and be patient, I will find out in the morning if it is a keeper or not!


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## Ink (Sep 25, 2009)

Oh yeah, the billets are really thick and stiff. I forgot that part. I was hoping they'd eventually break in, but I wasn't able to use the saddle long enough to find out. A few good oilings might do it. 

Good luck with your new saddle. I hope it works for you, and you get your leathers lickity-split!


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## JoesLove (Mar 1, 2012)

So I ended up trying the aachen today, unfortunately it was not a good fit for me :[ My trainer rode in it first, as soon as she sat down she said she didn't even want to move just sit there since it was comfortable as a couch, and she told me Im not sending it back (before I tried it ) lol! She rides in a wintec since her county is custom fitted to her horse, and she said "Forget the wintecs!" haha! It truly was nice and soft and comfortable, but I believe my problem was the medium twist (or some people call it a wide twist but the website states medium). When I sat down it did feel really nice, but when I started to trot was where the problem was. My horse is not a sensitive horse, he takes A LOT of leg and contact to get going, and with the bigger kneeblocks, and deep seat, it was hard for me to get him going because he does take a lot of leg and some whip. Once I got going when i posted my crotch kept hitting the pommel area, when I sat the trot it rubbed bad at the top of my crotch on the pommel, very uncomfortable and annoying feeling. I did order the 18 inch, I have always ridden in 17.5inch so I really dont think it was the seat size per se, Im thinking it was that wider twist, since Im used to a narrow twist. 

We finished our lesson in my AP wintec 500 saddle, it was like going from a nice luxury car to a low quality car lol. I HATE my wintec now, after seeing what true comfort feels like, now I realize how my wintec tips me forward and feels so uncomfortable. I just wish the Aachen had worked for me, it was so nice, but since I just started dressage I do mostly posting trot. I will get some pics up soon, I forgot to take pics of how it fit my horse, but I did get one pic of his back, the medium fit him decently, we thought it might be a little snug but not too bad. I will put it on a chair and get some pics of how it looks. I already called smartpak and now waiting on my return tag :[ So for anyone looking at the aachen, very nice and comfortable saddle for the price, did stain my new white dressage pad though lol after a 15 min ride but thats okay, deep seat (my trainer said it wasnt the deepest one she has seen of course, but to me it was deep haha), keeps you nice and snug, but definitely not a saddle that fits anybody. My friend is opening up her tack store at our barn next month, and today my trainer told me shes having a saddle fitter come. So what Im going to do is just hold off on buying another saddle and wait until the saddle fitter comes, by then my guy will be more muscled and filled out anyways. Hope this review helped some!


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