# Should I fold more?



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Hello! You are in Mexico? just wondering if I remembered right . . 

First of all, I will admit that I am NOT a jumper, but I know the basics of a good , effective position.
Let me say that your stirrups look way too short. You are standing up and putting way too much 'air' between your butt and the saddle. And, yes, you are too vertical So, lengthen stirrups a bit, and fold more. 
At your level, you should be using the horse's neck as a place to stabilize yourself , actually putting your hands ON the top of your horses mane (or just to each side of the top),, and giving the horse plenty of rein for freedom. You are using the reins to balance yourself and this is harsh on the horse's mouth, You can see his very unhappy expression.

Really, for such a low jump, you hardly need to lift out of the saddle at all. Just let the horse go over it, and you fold forward just a bit, and keep your heels down a bit . With your stirrups that short, the stress on your legs must be tremendous.

We appreciate your willingness to hear a ccritique, even if it may not feel good to hear it.
Others will have a lot more to say, . . . those that are jumpers.


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## CallmeDior (Apr 26, 2021)

tinyliny said:


> Hello! You are in Mexico? just wondering if I remembered right . .
> 
> First of all, I will admit that I am NOT a jumper, but I know the basics of a good , effective position.
> Let me say that your stirrups look way too short. You are standing up and putting way too much 'air' between your butt and the saddle. And, yes, you are too vertical So, lengthen stirrups a bit, and fold more.
> ...



Thanks for your response! Yep, I am in Mexico! I do think I need to fold more so my arms can extend forward to do either a crest or automatic release as well as heels down. Yeah, I also agree that I pull him and that isn't nice on his mouth. I don't feel stressed on my legs and my coach was the one who decided which hole the straps should be on coz I got this new wide straps. But I do admit I just adjusted one hole up 2wks ago. 😫 Here's so more pics of my stirrup position.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

the saddle flap is not at all in the position it should be in. Your knee should point into the roundest part of the kneepad. your knee IS way ABOVE the whole flap. I guess the saddle is too large for you, and, it doesnn't fit the horse, AT ALL. it is way up on his neck, almost. The whole balance is way off, which makes things VERY difficult for you to post the trot, and to get into a correct jumping position.

Wouldn't you rather learn how to ride Charro style, in a good Mexican saddle? I just think you'd be better able to find a good fit going that way. I know your choices are limited, but I also know there are many fine Charro horses in Mexico, and good saddles, too. 
Many years ago (like almost 50 years ago) I rode a fine Charro horse in Mexico (near Morelia) We rode many hours, and since we had two horses, three humans and ONE saddle, I had to ride bareback while the other two guys rode in and behind the saddle. the horse had so much brillo that he never stopped jigging, trotting, galloping. I was exhausted when we finished,, and so sore I could hardly walk the next day.


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## CallmeDior (Apr 26, 2021)

tinyliny said:


> the saddle flap is not at all in the position it should be in. Your knee should point into the roundest part of the kneepad. your knee IS way ABOVE the whole flap. I guess the saddle is too large for you, and, it doesnn't fit the horse, AT ALL. it is way up on his neck, almost. The whole balance is way off, which makes things VERY difficult for you to post the trot, and to get into a correct jumping position.
> 
> Wouldn't you rather learn how to ride Charro style, in a good Mexican saddle? I just think you'd be better able to find a good fit going that way. I know your choices are limited, but I also know there are many fine Charro horses in Mexico, and good saddles, too.
> Many years ago (like almost 50 years ago) I rode a fine Charro horse in Mexico (near Morelia) We rode many hours, and since we had two horses, three humans and ONE saddle, I had to ride bareback while the other two guys rode in and behind the saddle. the horse had so much brillo that he never stopped jigging, trotting, galloping. I was exhausted when we finished,, and so sore I could hardly walk the next day.



Mmmmh no jajajaj! I am not interested in Charro style riding at the moment. I am learning to ride english for now and jumping because I like to compete as well as I am training for my dream adventure (Horse safari where I ride horses with bunch of peeps who EW passionate about riding and can also jump trees on the ground while checking out animals in the wild) I have to admit, I tried riding when I was little in Los Angeles in search for more hobbies but then they started me slow for safety reasons. I walked and I thought it was so boring so I quit that day. (I respect their rules) However, when I wintered in Buenos Aires last year I thought I'd pick up riding again. I honestly didn't think I would be jumping or even competing at all a year later. They started me at post trot and I thought it was super fun so I carried on.

Maybe when I get better at english, I can try other disciplines like dressage or charro.

Yeah, unfortunately I don't have saddle options. I do admit that the saddle is quite big. I feel the flap is too big it's hard to position my knees straight. They asked if I want to buy my own saddle but I said no coz I am not carrying a saddle around the world jajajaja. I do have my own straps and stirrups. This is probably why sometimes he no longer like to start at a certain direction... Poor horse.. I need to talk to my coach and see if we can do something about it. Thanks for pointing that out. I knew something was up when I started using my new stirrups. We changed saddles when I started using my new stirrups.

If we can't change saddles, I will just give him more massages on his withers LOL! OMG I am so happy he hasn't done anything to throw me off the ground. This boy saves me every time! Been riding him for 6 months 3-5x a week and we are good. Knock on wood! I hope it stays that way! 😊


Below are the 2 other saddles I used to use. They both look better than the one I use now I think.




This is the saddle I am using now ever since I got my own stirrups. I just noticed his coat is looking shiny and amazing compared to when I first started riding him (pic with royal blue saddle pad- dull coat)



It looks like my stirrups are in the right length I think. Or is it still too high? I was sitting trot here.


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

Hang your legs and have someone stretch them. Then let them.drape. The bar of the stirrup you rest your foot on should be at your ankle. It can be adjusted from that point to refine your leg. Another way is to stand level with the saddle and stirrup should touch just under your arm in your arm pit. That gives you a starting point. Your leg does not line up with your body.

The posting picture shows way to much space between you and the horse.


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## CallmeDior (Apr 26, 2021)

QtrBel said:


> Hang your legs and have someone stretch them. Then let them.drape. The bar of the stirrup you rest your foot on should be at your ankle. It can be adjusted from that point to refine your leg. Another way is to stand level with the saddle and stirrup should touch just under your arm in your arm pit. That gives you a starting point. Your leg does not line up with your body.
> 
> The posting picture shows way to much space between you and the horse.


Thanks! Yeah, I will adjust it this week. Thank goodness for vids and pics.... I know a lot of people don't like constructive criticism but I do. How else would I progress if I don't fix the problem, right?


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

My written words come across harsh, they are *not* meant that way, but as constructive criticism...
I care you *not* get hurt...

Yes your stirrups are to short, probably 1 - 2 holes to short.
That saddle is doing absolutely_ nothing_ good for your riding. 
From what I can see of it it appears old and the padding is spent, gone and the saddle is more looking like junk than something you should be riding in...you fight with that saddle every step, every stride..
Every picture you show riding in it that can be seen.
Your money you pay for lessons that often of 3 - 5 times a week your instructor should have you in something that helps you which in turn helps keep his horse sound and happy.
The saddle not fit you nor the horse, period.
I know riding is expensive and you are paying a lot....
Flat out tell the instructor you ride in a saddle that is supportive of you, that fits you and that horse as the other saddle did or you will take yourself elsewhere to get lessons...
For your safety and the health of that horse you are pounding the back of....you might need to move on to a different barn but _your safety comes first! It must!!_

As for your riding over fences of that size and you appear like the pictures on the flat and over fences above....  
You are riding 18" - 24" cross-rails. That is 45 cm - 60 cm....about right??
I'm sorry but you are no where near ready to ride even this with your hand or body position to this fence about the size of what you are jumping...you're going to get hurt, wearing a impact vest or not you're going to be hurt and probably pretty badly.





























As you can see by every picture I grabbed off the internet there is a huge difference in you to them in appearance.
The first picture is about the height you are jumping but a vertical rail not cross-bar..
The other pictures are far more advanced riders over oxer fences _{they are double jumps and space between called the spread set as one obstacle}_
The last picture is actually a 2-point position of balance ridden by a beginner rider...all that rider needs to do to then transfer to "jump position" is close her hip angle, tip her upper body forward at the hip about 3 -4" allowing the horse to rise to her upper body, not her collapse on the neck.
None of these riders have hands sky high balancing their body on, none of these riders have but a few inches of air space between buttock and saddle, none of these riders are standing straight up in their irons as you do..
Now go back and look at you and understand why you put yourself in harms way and "your instructor" needs a swat upside his head for allowing you to dictate the lesson and move forward when clearly you are not ready to...
You do pay a lot of money so your instructor is afraid to lose the customer {you} by being honest and saying you are not ready for....
You need a better, stronger, firmer foundation and that in every one of your pictures is very lacking to me.

Start with demanding a better saddle to ride in not a piece of junk.
The first picture you put with the red piped saddle pad, that saddle fits you and it shows.
It supports you where you need the support but allows you to move in it as you need to do.
That would be my pick for you to ride in or _*not ride, period! *_
I don't want to see you dumped and hurt but continue as you are in junk as you are and you will be...its a matter of how soon it shall occur and how bad your injuries are going to be...

I'm sorry, I don't mean my words to be cruel, _never ever that._
My words are truthful and if you continue to push forward in this bad-fitting saddle, without strengthening your base of support, learn the true basics of riding position on the flat and over fences you can not go higher or to more difficult challenges than you are really struggling with currently if honest.
You build a house on a solid foundation or as it grows larger it crumbles when stressed...that applies to riding horses too.
Its great fun to jump fences, it is...
Its not fun to take a fall and really not fun to get injured.
I've eaten more dirt than some, not as much as others and lucky never been hurt bad but for my confidence...
My words are given, my limited experience shared so you not get hurt.
Learn from others comments, learn from our mistakes...
Insist on good equipment to ride in for you, for your mount.
The horse is a saint, but the animal also has its limits to what it will allow from you & has a meltdown...
Do not rush your education skipping over those so very critical basics to "play" far beyond your ability...
That saddle you are being made to ride in does not help you , but hinder you and jeopardize your safety.
You need some refinement, you're not far off from having it but getting quality equipment to use is a must that fits you, supports your weaknesses and improves you and that is complimentary to your mount, who ever that mount is.

As said, my words are *not* meant to be hurtful or mean...but to learn from.
We, those who previously commented see so much more of what you suspect...because we have been where you are and where you want to get to.
Reach for that goal, but do not rush getting their to fast or you may be hurt in the process and never reach the end you so desperately want...
Be safe and be careful in the process.
🐴*...*


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## CallmeDior (Apr 26, 2021)

horselovinguy said:


> My written words come across harsh, they are *not* meant that way, but as constructive criticism...
> I care you *not* get hurt...
> 
> Yes your stirrups are to short, probably 1 - 2 holes to short.
> ...



Thanks! Don't worry about the criticism. I came here for honest answers. I will ask for my coach if she can change me to the saddle you suggested. I felt it already when I started using the last saddle but just wasn't sure what to tell them. I know they don't have a lot of options on their saddles but maybe I can work something out with my school for obvious reasons.

I posted this question because I know I am not folding intentionally because I am a little scared. I am guilty , I actually never tried harder to fold. lol! This video was taken last Friday when I started learning how to change leads on a fence. I saw my arms in the air and my horse get startled and run faster after the jump. On my other videos my arms released more but I was not changing leads. It would be just a straight jump. On a turn, would just trot then canter after if I am not on the correct lead. I am sure it is a combo of everything of my arms flying up in the air. I will take another video after all the adjustments made to see the difference.

I admit I can't fully understand my cuban coach sometimes coz he speaks so fast in Spanish and he shouts too much. At some point I learned to tune him out. I do think he is one of the best coaches I've had. His daughter is my real coach (she's nicer and more patient). Sometimes his dad trains me in the background during competitions. I get nervous when he teaches me because he shouts not to be mean but just how cubans are (cuban culture- all cuban coaches shouts in other schools too) I get startled when there's too much shouting, I learn to tune out or I get very nervous. During competitions, he is the one that guides me but that's only 1 minute and I am fine with it. However, for 1hr class I am so nervous and I start to not think straight. He knows about it because I've told him the truth when he asks me then we laugh about it. However, I learn so much more in his class and I do see he is very passionate in teaching too. I've been taught by coaches who are on their phone the whole time and not paying attention. This old cuban man is all eyes on me, it is all on video. LOL!

I will try to lower the stirrups 1 or 2 down this week and see how it goes. I am guilty, I actually put 1 hole higher 2 wks ago from the original hole my coach set up. My bad!

Yeah, I do agree I shouldn't hurry. I am not trying to be some professional athlete and I just want to learn everything the proper way. I just enjoy jumping and all the horses. I am lucky we have been safe for the last 6 months. I hope to keep it that way ofcourse.

My old school wanted us to advance faster because most students want to jump fast here (even they keep falling off) and they do it also in hope to sell you a horse. (I think you are familiar with the story) I fell for the first time there due to them making me jump a vertical 40cm on a triple gymnastics and I have never jump a vertical on a canter, let alone gymnastics before. That was in March and with my new school (6 months & no falls so far- knocking on wood!) , they take their time and I don't have a problem with it. I also made it clear that I won't be buying any horse because I don't live in one place normally. They don't mention anything about buying horses which is a relief.


So yeah, thanks for your suggestions. I will try to implement them this week. I came here looking for that! Thanks for you time!


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

this saddle looks like a better fit to you and the horse. That old saddle is also a bad fit for the horse. please do not spend any more time riding in that old saddle. it will build BAD habits for you, and sour your good horse to being ridden. 
Best of luck!


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## CallmeDior (Apr 26, 2021)

tinyliny said:


> View attachment 1115520
> 
> 
> this saddle looks like a better fit to you and the horse. That old saddle is also a bad fit for the horse. please do not spend any more time riding in that old saddle. it will build BAD habits for you, and sour your good horse to being ridden.
> Best of luck!



Thanks! I am now feeling guilty. I do feel my horse is feeling off once we used that old rag saddle. 😫 I will ask my coach to change to this one next week even if I will pay a little more for me and my horse sake. I am just going to tell them my knee is hurting from the old one. I also put my stirrups higher 1 more hole 2 wks ago. I will change it back to the original or even try putting it 2 holes lower. I will do it this weeks training.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

oh, by the way, when I said, "That old saddle", I meant the ugly brown one you are currently riding in. that is an old saddle the black one looks 'newer' and so much better fit. Riding in a saddle that doesn't fit you are the horse and has bad balance is SOOOO frustrating. It's like no matter how hard you try, you can't get things right. It's a waste of time,, pain and money.


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## CallmeDior (Apr 26, 2021)

tinyliny said:


> oh, by the way, when I said, "That old saddle", I meant the ugly brown one you are currently riding in. that is an old saddle the black one looks 'newer' and so much better fit. Riding in a saddle that doesn't fit you are the horse and has bad balance is SOOOO frustrating. It's like no matter how hard you try, you can't get things right. It's a waste of time,, pain and money.



Yes, I got you! That's the one I am talking about too. I changed to the current one (The old big saddle) since I got my new straps and stirrups but I knew it already felt weird on my very first ride. I also noticed my horse doesn't want go on the right or left even on a walk sometimes when we're about start our lesson. Now, I am thinking it could be that the saddle is just so not right for him because the only thing that changed was the saddle and ofcourse the straps and stirrups but I don't think straps and stirrups will do much harm to my horse? OMG, I hope not! I will ask my coach to change back to the saddle with the grad saddle pad.

I see it fit better on me looking at the pictures. What will I do with out these pics and videos to proove something is really wrong. I know I felt it but I was in denial or something or just oblivious. Id like to think I have a very good relationship with this horse and I see every cuts he get in his body. I give him baths every after rides and inspect everything to the teeth. I know Ive only known him for 6 months but Id like to think I know his quirks and I accept it as he accepts my errors too. He doesn't do anything bad to me thank goodness! I actually like to think he saves me every time. 

I must have been riding on just bad saddles the whole time that I don't really even notice what is a good or saddle except for this one I am currently using coz it is really wide and big it was hard to keep my knees straight. When I was in Argentina , I honestly didn't even know that it made a difference. How gullible am I? Well, now I know!

BTW, how do I know which size saddle is good for me and the horse? I mean I see saddles sold online and it be hard if I buy one in the USA and take it to Mexico then it doesn't fit on the horse or something... Im kinda bit frustrated on that part. Any suggestions?


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

Try these ....





Saddle Sizes & Fitting a Saddle for a Rider | Dover Saddlery


Selecting a well-fitting saddle is key to a comfortable riding position. Read our guide on saddle sizes and finding the correct saddle seat size for a rider.




www.doversaddlery.com









English Saddle Fitting Guidelines | Dover Saddlery


Read our guide on saddle fitting and how to check the fit of a saddle. Visit a Dover Saddlery store for a free saddle fitting consultation.




www.doversaddlery.com





Hope they answer many of your questions. There is a entire "library" of informative to learn from through this store..
🐴


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## CallmeDior (Apr 26, 2021)

horselovinguy said:


> Try these ....
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yes, Thank you! I have good news! My coach is changing my saddle to the one that fits me better. The one with gray saddle pad. It is never too late! 

I was thinking of buying a saddle but then the problem is I don't live in one place and for now it isn't really inconvenient. I don't like buying & accumulating things especially ones I can't carry with me when I move around.

In the future when I decide to live in one place or at least a more permanent place. I like being a part of caring for my horse. I call them my horse even if they aren't mine. I enjoy the process very much and I worry about other people caring for it for some reason. 

My school let's me care for this horse like my own at the moment. Kinda like I am practicing on him but I love him so more than just practicing. 

Thank you again!


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