# Mare "always" in heat now heavily bleeding.... :/



## MaggiStar (Mar 19, 2010)

Odd the vet knows nothing is there a university hospital you can send her to perhaps for indept tests


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## New_image (Oct 27, 2007)

I informed the owner last week when it happened if she were my mare we'd be headed down to MSU. 

The vet here drew blood but is hesitating to send it in because he says blood tests will not show hormone levels or if she has a tumor. I don't understand this and told him to send it anyway and have a whole blood panel work up done on this mare.

She is now doing just as a I predicted and leaking a puss like "infection" goo. I assumed this would happen as something ruptured and bled which means something "could" become infected. Both vets say antibiotics will not help whatever "it is" and I have ignored that, started giving her a feed threw antibiotic this morning as I feel trying something is better than the nothing happening here. She does not have a temp, yet. But I'm sure thats next.


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

New_image said:


> Both vets say antibiotics will not help whatever "it is" and I have ignored that, started giving her a feed threw antibiotic this morning as I feel trying something is better than the nothing happening here. She does not have a temp, yet. But I'm sure thats next.


 
What? TWO vets have said an antibiotic will not help - yet you have decided differently for your boarders horse? For shame! Not knowing what the issue is, you are putting the mare at risk by lowering her immunity. 

It is possible she has a uterine infection and feed threw? (I believe you mean through or correctly termed oral) antibiotics are not the drug of choice. She would need a lavage to flush her uterus.

IF that is what is going on. Please do not second guess the professionals. Talk to the boarder and send the mare down for a work up at the U.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

It sounds like there is more going on here than your local vets want to deal with. Please suggest the owner send her to the university for further testing.


I am not sure the purpose of giving antibiotics if two vets specifically told you not to.


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## Jacksmama (Jan 27, 2010)

This sounds pretty serious, I have never heard of a mare bleeding like that! Honestly, I would do everything I could to scare the bejeezus out of the owner so they take her somewhere, this isn't something to blow off.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Either take the mare to an equine hospital and bill the owner, or have her do it.

Giving the mare antibiotics when not one but TWO vets said it was contraindicated, is all sorts of wrong. You're not a vet or the owner of the animal, so you have no right to give unauthorized medication.

I know it's frustrating for you to watch this mare suffer, but she's not your animal and you don't get to make the decisions on her health care.


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## New_image (Oct 27, 2007)

Good grief! Un-knot you're panties all, the vets did not say NOT to give her antibiotics, they said that they don't think that it will help nor hurt. I am simply trying "something" and *the owner knows this.* 

Speed racer, taking the mare to a hospital and billing the owner would contradict you're last statement would it not? _...you don't get to make the decisions on her health care._ Thats right, I -UNFORTUNATELY- do not get to make the calls or she WOULD have been in the trailer Friday morning!!!

This IS well over the local vets heads and they do not know where to go from here. 

I continue to suggest to the owner to take her to state. 

I posted wondering if anyone has heard of this, not to be yelled at.


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## iridehorses (Oct 22, 2007)

First of all, no one yelled at you. Secondly, did I read it correctly that the owners are inexperienced - so asking them if you could administer antibiotics is rather pointless since they don't know any better.

2 vets saying that antibiotics won't help sure sounds like I wouldn't be giving it unless I, at least, asked if it would do no harm.

You need to get through to the owners that the horse's well being, if not life, is at stake and they need to get her to the proper facility.


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## Masquerade (May 17, 2011)

I agree with your original thoughts of ovarian tumor, specifically a granulosa cell tumor with the behavioural symptoms you described and I have read about the tumors rupturing causing massive hemorrhage but it would be into the abdominal cavity and therefore contained within the body. I can not think of anything to correlate the behavior with the bleeding and the falling! If they decide to take her to MSU for further testing please let us know what they find out.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Is the mare truly bleeding, or does it have a dark discharge that is sticking to her tail and hind legs? Way back when, I was worried my mare was bleeding because her hind legs and tail were coated in a dark substance, but it was a dark discharge (completely normal) that mixed with dirt when she laid down or rolled to make it appear to be almost dried-blood-like (new word of the day...)


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## New_image (Oct 27, 2007)

Masquerade, I still think so also. My local vet seems to think that since everything feels normal when she is palpated that there cannot be any tumors. Does anyone know if thats entirely correct? I have a hard time thinking there couldn't be a tumor just because he spent five minutes feeling around. 

Justdressageit, Yes it was actually blood. There were dark red "stringy" clots but for the most part the mare had bright red stained/streaked legs and a mostly red tail. She was still "dripping" when I came out and saw this. 

She has since -this evening- gone back to "in heat" and will not leave the other horses alone. We've separated her for everyone's safety, but thats hard with her as she doesn't want to eat when separated. I had a lengthily discussion with the mares owner this evening and she feels that she cannot afford taking the mare to state. The vets here are leaning towards - for lack of knowing whats wrong - putting the mare down. I am pulling my hair out over here, if she were mine she would have been hauled to MSU the morning of. But she is not and I am not in the position to put tests into someone elses twenty year old mare :-|


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

I suggest you let the owners and her vets make a decision. If the owner can't afford to have further testing done on the mare, then either you pay for it or let it go. If the mare is not in pain and other than acting in heat all the time, then let her be. 
Not sure how well a vet can feel the entire uterous through a rectal exam, but I imagine they can probably feel a tumor if it is big enough. If an ultrasound is not done, and the vet say they feel no tumor, then it doesn't sound like there is much left to be done. If she is leaking pus, then it sounds like a uterine infection of some kind. Have the blood run and see if an infection shows up.
If the vets won't do the blood and the owners don't feel like forcing the issue, then I believe you need to step aside and let the owner deal with her horse as she feels she financially can.


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## Gidget (Jan 19, 2010)

subcribing

hope that the mare will be alright.

We had a mare that was ALWAYS in heat it seemed but she never poured blood..but her stall would be soaked with nasty pee stuff.


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

Ohhh no  Our 22yo grey arab mare did this over a year ago, the vets never figured out what it was and she just kept bleeding, they did all sorts of tests on her, loads of internal scans etc, bloods, never figured it out. Then one day we went out and she was colicing really badly, the vet was rushed out and he said there was nothing that we could do to save her and she ended up being put down, RIP Laasanna, 28th april 2010.
I really really hope whatever is causing this is found, and found quickly.


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## Masquerade (May 17, 2011)

New_image said:


> Masquerade, I still think so also. My local vet seems to think that since everything feels normal when she is palpated that there cannot be any tumors. Does anyone know if thats entirely correct? I have a hard time thinking there couldn't be a tumor just because he spent five minutes feeling around.


Most often I have seen granulosa cell tumors diagnosed by ultrasound showing a fairly classic "bubble wrap" appearance (you see tons of small follicles). The ovary can feel huge or it can feel normal but the opposite ovary is usually very small since the tumor secretes inhibin which has a negative feedback on FSH. I know many vets who could diagnose these tumors in 5 minutes of palpating but I don't know that you could truely rule it out that quickly especially since her behavioural changes are very suggestive of this disease. 
Here is a short article by Purdue University that expalins GCTs in a bit more detail for you, hope it helps. 
Granulosa-Theca Cell Tumors in the Mare


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

HollyBubbles said:


> Ohhh no  Our 22yo grey arab mare did this over a year ago, the vets never figured out what it was and she just kept bleeding, they did all sorts of tests on her, loads of internal scans etc, bloods, never figured it out. Then one day we went out and she was colicing really badly, the vet was rushed out and he said there was nothing that we could do to save her and she ended up being put down, RIP Laasanna, 28th april 2010.
> I really really hope whatever is causing this is found, and found quickly.


I was just going to ask the OP what color the horse was. Grey horses are prone to melanoma. Not all of the tumors are external. Unfortunately the internal tumors are undetected until they cause other issues - colic is the primary but uterine and bladder issues are not uncommon.

I had to put down a mare due to a tumor in her carotid artery. The vet had her on the table for 3 hours and could not excise. It was too entwined with all of the vessels. She was only 8.


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## New_image (Oct 27, 2007)

The mare is a grey Quarter Horse cross.


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