# Please help me!!!!!!!!



## Horseychick94

My posting sucks. My horse is EXTREMELY bouncy and bumpy. I cannot sit his trot.I cannot post on the correct diagonal with him because one of his diagonals is stronger than the other. Is there a way to make his trot smoother? Why are my heels all twisted?


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## BarrelracingArabian

first of all get him OFF that asphault(sp?) second of all it looks like you need to slow him down. Bump him if he gets going to fast for you to post/sit. Also not sure how to explain it but it looks like you over post yu should not be way out of the saddle when yu post your ankles could be pushing out because you are using your stirrups to post more then your legs. Someone with more knowledge can explain farther though


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## smrobs

Now keep in mind that I am a long way from an expert on posting; however, I believe that you might be posting from your feet. I mean that you put all of your weight on your feet to push yourself up out of the saddle, that will make everything seem rougher and uncoordinated. Your feet really shouldn't move, you should use the horse's own motion for the upward momentum but keep contact with your knees and thighs. Sorry I am not better at explaining things, I am sure that somebody like JDI or Maura can explain it much better. Also, on your endurance saddle, I think your stirrups might be a hole too short. Ideally, if you stand in the stirrups, you should be able to put a fist between your pelvic bones and the seat of the saddle, but no more.


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## Horseychick94

BarrelracingArabian said:


> first of all get him OFF that asphault(sp?) second of all it looks like you need to slow him down. Bump him if he gets going to fast for you to post/sit. Also not sure how to explain it but it looks like you over post yu should not be way out of the saddle when yu post your ankles could be pushing out because you are using your stirrups to post more then your legs. Someone with more knowledge can explain farther though


The vet said that it was fine to ride on the rd.


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## Horseychick94

smrobs said:


> Now keep in mind that I am a long way from an expert on posting; however, I believe that you might be posting from your feet. I mean that you put all of your weight on your feet to push yourself up out of the saddle, that will make everything seem rougher and uncoordinated. Your feet really shouldn't move, you should use the horse's own motion for the upward momentum but keep contact with your knees and thighs. Sorry I am not better at explaining things, I am sure that somebody like JDI or Maura can explain it much better. Also, on your endurance saddle, I think your stirrups might be a hole too short. Ideally, if you stand in the stirrups, you should be able to put a fist between your pelvic bones and the seat of the saddle, but no more.


Oh. Thanks!!!! That makes sense! At least my horse looks good LOL:lol:


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## BarrelracingArabian

riding is okey on the road but trotting is not recommened on hard surfaces. If you are trotting on it i would recommend shoes to help them from chipping


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## kmacdougall

SMROBS is right, you are posting off your stirrups, which is evident in the fact that your leg disengages from the horse when you post. You want to keep even pressure on him with your calves, even when you're out of the saddle posting. If you press your legs around him (think of your legs like a set of parenthesis - they should curve around the horse and keep contact when not engaged () ). Now, when you go to post, picture someone holding a long pole in front of you, about 3 - 4 inches from your bellybutton, and not high up at all. You want to bring your belly button to hit that imaginary pole. Posting does not have to be a high, exaggerated movement. It needs to be a clear way for the horse to come up to meet you while you get off his back. In no way should your other aids change, the only aid change should be from your seat. Your legs and hands must remain the same.


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## Horseychick94

kmacdougall said:


> SMROBS is right, you are posting off your stirrups, which is evident in the fact that your leg disengages from the horse when you post. You want to keep even pressure on him with your calves, even when you're out of the saddle posting. If you press your legs around him (think of your legs like a set of parenthesis - they should curve around the horse and keep contact when not engaged () ). Now, when you go to post, picture someone holding a long pole in front of you, about 3 - 4 inches from your bellybutton, and not high up at all. You want to bring your belly button to hit that imaginary pole. Posting does not have to be a high, exaggerated movement. It needs to be a clear way for the horse to come up to meet you while you get off his back. In no way should your other aids change, the only aid change should be from your seat. Your legs and hands must remain the same.


okay! I will try it when I ride again!


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## BarnBum

BarrelracingArabian said:


> riding is okey on the road but trotting is not recommened on hard surfaces. If you are trotting on it i would recommend shoes to help them from chipping


 
Shoes are the worst thing for roads! That makes it slippery and dangerous, barefoot is best if you MUST trot on road. I disagree with trotting on the road anyway.


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## smrobs

Also, one thing that I forgot to mention earlier is that your horse is travelling a bit hollow and strung out with his head high. This will make even a smooth travelling horse seem rough. However, that is something that can be worked on after you get your position solid.


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## BarrelracingArabian

barnbum-oh ya tru tru didnt think about that


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## UnrealJumper

Agreed with the above posts. But I definitely do not agree with anything more than a walk on pavement, even if the horse has shoes. It's still a no no.


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## Deerly

BarnBum said:


> Shoes are the worst thing for roads! That makes it slippery and dangerous, barefoot is best if you MUST trot on road. I disagree with trotting on the road anyway.


Hmm. When we kept horses on our property we had special shoes that were extra durable for riding on pavement to get to the trails. I think proper shoes are just fine for riding on roads and we never had any issues but we also kept our horses at a walk on the roads except for mild excited jigging every now and then.

I agree that you want to avoid trotting on those hard surfaces when possible. Just like you wouldn't want to be running your own legs on hard pavement or you are liable to injure your knees! It might not hurt you every once in a while but all that impact over extended periods can do major damage.


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## Horseychick94

Deerly said:


> Hmm. When we kept horses on our property we had special shoes that were extra durable for riding on pavement to get to the trails. I think proper shoes are just fine for riding on roads and we never had any issues but we also kept our horses at a walk on the roads except for mild excited jigging every now and then.
> 
> I agree that you want to avoid trotting on those hard surfaces when possible. Just like you wouldn't want to be running your own legs on hard pavement or you are liable to injure your knees! It might not hurt you every once in a while but all that impact over extended periods can do major damage.


Would it be okay if I used either 1) those new plastic shoes or 2) hoof boots?


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## JustDressageIt

I would imagine that the plastic shoes would wear down really really quickly on pavement, and I'm not sure you can use hoof boots over shoes... 

Anyways... yes, it looks like you are posting from your ankles; you want to post from your knees and hips to prevent being bounced out of your tack.


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## Horseychick94

okay. I will only trot in the field now or just trot on the road only occasionally


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## Horseychick94

These are the shoes I was wondering about BTW Hoof-it® Horse Care Horse Shoes - Composite


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## JustDressageIt

I would recommend you make a conscious effort to not trot on the road at all from now on, now that you know it can be dangerous. It only takes one slip of a steel shoe to lead to injury for both you and your horse.
You are now educated about the danger; you cannot claim ignorance if your actions lead to injury.


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## kitten_Val

Horseychick94 said:


> The vet said that it was fine to ride on the rd.


It's slippery even when not wet. My both horses fall on my driveway when they spooked and turned too fast. So asphalt does have some give (although it's still too hard to do anything besides walk), but it's still dangerous IMO for you and your horse. 

You want to keep your heels more down and post by moving your hips, not from the legs as (it looks like) you are doing. Your horse may be pretty unbalanced as well, which doesn't add much to the comfort. 

If you have a big exercise ball ($20 in Walmart) you can imitate the trot there (I was taught it at the dressage clinic and it was pretty amazing). Basically you sit on ball with your legs just in same spot and move your hips forward and back to the ball, so the ball would bounce like horse would do.


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## Horseychick94

JustDressageIt said:


> I would recommend you make a conscious effort to not trot on the road at all from now on, now that you know it can be dangerous. It only takes one slip of a steel shoe to lead to injury for both you and your horse.
> You are now educated about the danger; you cannot claim ignorance if your actions lead to injury.


I have him barefoot ATM. I wont trot on the rd anymore but would these Hoof-it® Horse Care Horse Shoes - Composite be worth a try?


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## Horseychick94

kitten_Val said:


> It's slippery even when not wet. My both horses fall on my driveway when they spooked and turned too fast. So asphalt does have some give (although it's still too hard to do anything besides walk), but it's still dangerous IMO for you and your horse.
> 
> You want to keep your heels more down and post by moving your hips, not from the legs as (it looks like) you are doing. Your horse may be pretty unbalanced as well, which doesn't add much to the comfort.
> 
> If you have a big exercise ball ($20 in Walmart) you can imitate the trot there (I was taught it at the dressage clinic and it was pretty amazing). Basically you sit on ball with your legs just in same spot and move your hips forward and back to the ball, so the ball would bounce like horse would do.


Okay. Exercise ball? That is a GREAT idea!!!! So this means I should definitely not take the pony cart on the rd?


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## dreamergurl4101

BarrelracingArabian said:


> riding is okey on the road but trotting is not recommened on hard surfaces. If you are trotting on it i would recommend shoes to help them from chipping


Riding on asphalt is terrible for their legs. Thats way to much strain on their muscles and tendons. Stay off!


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## BarrelracingArabian

dreamergurl4101-oh i know riding on the road is bad for horses legs but i figured arguing about it would get me no where i should probably have worded my response better .. either way i dont know of any vet that would tell yu its okey to ride on a road. unless its once in awhile like for a parade


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## smrobs

Okay, guys. I think the whole riding on the road point has been made. Perhaps it is time to go back to the OP's original questions about posting and position.


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## dreamergurl4101

dreamergurl4101 said:


> Riding on asphalt is terrible for their legs. Thats way to much strain on their muscles and tendons. Stay off!


 Alrighty, sorry.


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## payette

I find it helpful to practice posting on a lunge line, so you don't have to hold the reins at the same time, just lightly clasping the pommel of the saddle. Definitely use the above advice about not posting from your feet. When you feel like you are getting it, try without stirrups, on the lunge. That will bring to your attention the muscles you should be using in order to post correctly. Good luck!


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## danastark

I think the lunging idea is great. We have our kids put their arms out to the side for balance and learn to feel the horse's stride. I have a young horse and he tends to vary his gait at the trot so sometimes I will even count, 1-2, 1-2 and post at that count, plus half-halting to get him to maintain a steadier trot. Make sure you aren't using his mouth to balance either, should be able to post without holding on. Goodluck, he's a really nice looking boy


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## Gidget

Riding on the rd is okay if you are walking BUT cantering and trotting will do nothing but damage to his legs. You will have nothing but health problems in the future with his legs and well it won't be very fun.

I am still new and trying to keep my post on beat(sometimes I get off beat) but how I was taught was to act like there is a string tied to your belly button and act if someone was pulling you towards your horse instead of going up down on your horse. It's obviously not a drastic movement. It will get easier. Also if you get off beat what will help is if you purchase rhythm beads that way you can keep beat with your horse  I'm thinking about purchasing some.


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## Gidget

oops, sorry I didn't read all the posts that were made...sorry for repeating about the road!


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## kelley horsemad

Neither of your saddles fit you well. That is part of your problem. As someone already mentioned, you’re posting by standing up in your stirrups. You need to fix this and post from the hips. He’s very hollow which will make any horse’s trot uncomfortable and you coming down on his back hard and balancing on your hands will only serve to make this worse.. You need to work on getting him soft and round and through his back – really lifting his back up and carrying you. Do you work with a coach? I agree that longe lessons, taking your reins away, would be a good first step.


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## Horseychick94

kelley horsemad said:


> Neither of your saddles fit you well.


They feel fine. They are all I could afford. My english saddle is an 18" and the western is a 17". It is probably the angle of the pics because I had a really short photographer. (a kid)


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## kelley horsemad

They may feel fine to you, but I’m only telling you what I see. Your English saddle is a particularly poor fit and is doing nothing to help your position.


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## Horseychick94

kelley horsemad said:


> They may feel fine to you, but I’m only telling you what I see. Your English saddle is a particularly poor fit and is doing nothing to help your position.


How is it a poor fit? It could be that I never use flexiblocs and I did in the pics.


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## Cinnys Whinny

Here is my opinion, and you can take it or leave it but...

I agree your saddles don't seem to be a good fit. I know this is frustrating to hear, in fact I have been told this myself only a few weeks ago. This can cause your horse pain because your weight isn't being distributed properly. So here is part of the problem of roughness, it's partially a reaction to a saddle that isn't proper for the both of you. I also did not have a new saddle in the budget, however I found a good "working" one that fits at a consignment store in a more proper size for me and I have seen a 200% improvement in Cinny's way of going! It's ugly as heck, but until I can get my old one sold and save up for a better one, it will do for now. Besides, "beauty is as beauty does" Anna Sewell

You need to learn to post from the insides of your knees/thighs. Let the horses motion "thrust" you out of your seat and sort of support yourself coming down. It takes a LONG time to get this...it took me years and I haven't riddin for a good 10 years and gained 80 pounds so I am still getting it back myself. I love the idea of the exercise ball, I'm going to try that one myself. My favorite exercise involves a Walmart special 1 dollar children's ball...the ones that you would play handball or kickball with. They make wonderful CHEAP thighmasters. While watching tv just slip it between your knees and squeeze squeeze squeeze.

I think another issue about your horses balance that nobody else has touched on is, you are riding with a mechanical hacamore. These are wonderful when used properly. Yours is the type that is generally used when riding one handed and neck reining. When you use them two handed, you end up sending your horse very mixed signals. This is something I learned the hard way years ago, so I am speaking of experience. Next time you bridle up, while on the ground pull with both reins..you will most likely see that the reins engage the shanks and this puts your curb chain/strap into the chin when causes the bridle to also put pressure on the poll. Next, try only one reins, as if you were cuing to turn, what happens. Pretty much the same thing, only one sided. Instead of the horses head being guided into a turn, you are squeezing the curb into one side of the chin and squeezing one side of the poll. I really don't know if squeezing one side of the muzzle and one side of the poll is a cue for anything. So this can cause a great imbalance as well because your horse will most likely either brace against the cue, fight it, ignore it, or maybe you have lucked out and your horse has figured out what you mean but turning towards the poll and chin pressure is a bit unnatural and I imagine painful. You may have better luck with a sidepull or an indian knotted hackamore (the one I have can be converted to sidepull) you can find them pretty cheap on Ebay, if you wish I could tell you which seller has some pretty good ones just PM me. Also with a hackamore it is much much harder to teach your horse important things such as collection and hind end engagement....both do wonders for helping a horse move in a balanced and smooth way. 

When a horse works unbalanced on one side, then that horse needs MORE work on that side...and correct work so not posting on that side is not the answer. Your horse will become more and more unbalanced on that side if you don't do work to strengthen it.

I also noticed that your horse has a little bit of crooked angulation, commonly known as **** footed. It's where the fetlocks bend excessively. This can cause some strain especially on concrete. I understand you said the vet said it was ok to ride on asphalt, but he may not have realized you meant more than a walk. I also suggest that when you can, get some sort of supportive boots for your horse like SMB's or something. Horses who's feet do that have a tendency to break down faster.

IMO this is NOT something that will be fixed to your liking in weeks or even months, especially without a trainer or lessons to help you. I also know all these things are much easier said than done..believe me I am in your shoes. I know all the hows, and wheres but my body doesn't seem to remember them so I look hideous riding right now as I am getting back into it after over 10 years off. Just remember, the more comfy cozy your horse is, the easier it will be for it to smooth out for you.

Good luck, I know with a bit of hard work, you can definitely get to where you want to be.


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## Cinnys Whinny

Horseychick94 said:


> How is it a poor fit? It could be that I never use flexiblocs and I did in the pics.


It sort of fits you the way my 16 inch currently fits me....which is why I had to get a bigger saddle.

This is how it was gently put to me not so long ago in my thread http://www.horseforum.com/horse-riding-critique/brutal-honesty-accepted-here-56672/page2/#post653595



mom2pride said:


> there should be a bit of room between your hiney and the 'end' of the saddle; that would help with your balance, and seat ALOT.


Not sure how else to explain it.


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## kelley horsemad

I don’t believe the flexi-blocs are your problem. Plain and simple, the saddle is too small for you. It’s so small it’s impossible to even say if the stirrup bars are in the right place so your leg will hang properly.

As an aside, I find it very difficult to use my leg properly when I ride in jeans with no ½ chaps. Maybe I’m just a big wimp, but I find it very uncomfortable to the point of chafing. Proper attire may also help you ride more effectively.


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## Horseychick94

kelley horsemad said:


> I don’t believe the flexi-blocs are your problem. Plain and simple, the saddle is too small for you. It’s so small it’s impossible to even say if the stirrup bars are in the right place so your leg will hang properly.
> 
> As an aside, I find it very difficult to use my leg properly when I ride in jeans with no ½ chaps. Maybe I’m just a big wimp, but I find it very uncomfortable to the point of chafing. Proper attire may also help you ride more effectively.


Yeah, I usually use half chaps but yeah, I was in pain LOL. The saddle may be too small for me but I can't replace it. I will be losing weight soon so it will be better then


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## kelley horsemad

It’s not to do with the weight, though. Saddle fit is mostly to do with the length of your thigh bone. Unfortunately, that particular saddle will still be too small, whether you lose weight or not.


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## Horseychick94

kelley horsemad said:


> It’s not to do with the weight, though. Saddle fit is mostly to do with the length of your thigh bone. Unfortunately, that particular saddle will still be too small, whether you lose weight or not.


Eh, I don't use it that much anyways...it fits a lot better than most saddles I have tried. The flexiblocs push my leg back so I am gunna take em off. I can fit three-four fingers in the back so it fits according to some


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## kelley horsemad

I don’t understand why people ask for help and then discount what people say. I don’t see how it’s remotely possible that you can fit a hand width between your behind and the cantle, not from the photos you’ve shown and I'm told the camera doesn't lie.  You will be unable to progress riding in that saddle and it is likely not terribly comfortable for your horse since it won’t be distributing your weight well. That is quite evident in his way of going. Good luck to you. I’d stick to riding in the other saddle as it's somewhat less poor fitting than the English saddle.


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## JustDressageIt

Cinnys Whinny said:


> Here is my opinion, and you can take it or leave it but...
> 
> I agree your saddles don't seem to be a good fit. I know this is frustrating to hear, in fact I have been told this myself only a few weeks ago. This can cause your horse pain because your weight isn't being distributed properly. *So here is part of the problem of roughness, it's partially a reaction to a saddle that isn't proper for the both of you.* I also did not have a new saddle in the budget, however I found a good "working" one that fits at a consignment store in a more proper size for me and I have seen a 200% improvement in Cinny's way of going! It's ugly as heck, but until I can get my old one sold and save up for a better one, it will do for now. Besides, "beauty is as beauty does" Anna Sewell
> 
> You need to learn to post from the insides of your knees/thighs. Let the horses motion "thrust" you out of your seat and sort of support yourself coming down. It takes a LONG time to get this...it took me years and I haven't riddin for a good 10 years and gained 80 pounds so I am still getting it back myself. I love the idea of the exercise ball, I'm going to try that one myself. My favorite exercise involves a Walmart special 1 dollar children's ball...the ones that you would play handball or kickball with. They make wonderful CHEAP thighmasters. While watching tv just slip it between your knees and squeeze squeeze squeeze.
> 
> *I think another issue about your horses balance that nobody else has touched on is, you are riding with a mechanical hacamore. These are wonderful when used properly. Yours is the type that is generally used when riding one handed and neck reining. When you use them two handed, you end up sending your horse very mixed signals. This is something I learned the hard way years ago, so I am speaking of experience. Next time you bridle up, while on the ground pull with both reins..you will most likely see that the reins engage the shanks and this puts your curb chain/strap into the chin when causes the bridle to also put pressure on the poll. Next, try only one reins, as if you were cuing to turn, what happens. Pretty much the same thing, only one sided. Instead of the horses head being guided into a turn, you are squeezing the curb into one side of the chin and squeezing one side of the poll. I really don't know if squeezing one side of the muzzle and one side of the poll is a cue for anything. So this can cause a great imbalance as well because your horse will most likely either brace against the cue, fight it, ignore it, or maybe you have lucked out and your horse has figured out what you mean but turning towards the poll and chin pressure is a bit unnatural and I imagine painful.* You may have better luck with a sidepull or an indian knotted hackamore (the one I have can be converted to sidepull) you can find them pretty cheap on Ebay, if you wish I could tell you which seller has some pretty good ones just PM me. Also with a hackamore it is much much harder to teach your horse important things such as collection and hind end engagement....both do wonders for helping a horse move in a balanced and smooth way.
> 
> When a horse works unbalanced on one side, then that horse needs MORE work on that side...and correct work so not posting on that side is not the answer. Your horse will become more and more unbalanced on that side if you don't do work to strengthen it.
> 
> I also noticed that your horse has a little bit of crooked angulation, commonly known as **** footed. It's where the fetlocks bend excessively. This can cause some strain especially on concrete. I understand you said the vet said it was ok to ride on asphalt, but he may not have realized you meant more than a walk. I also suggest that when you can, get some sort of supportive boots for your horse like SMB's or something. Horses who's feet do that have a tendency to break down faster.
> 
> IMO this is NOT something that will be fixed to your liking in weeks or even months, especially without a trainer or lessons to help you. I also know all these things are much easier said than done..believe me I am in your shoes. I know all the hows, and wheres but my body doesn't seem to remember them so I look hideous riding right now as I am getting back into it after over 10 years off. Just remember, the more comfy cozy your horse is, the easier it will be for it to smooth out for you.
> 
> Good luck, I know with a bit of hard work, you can definitely get to where you want to be.


OP, please read this.. it's a good post. I agree about everything - the saddle doesn't fit, and the mechanical hack probably isn't doing you a whole lot of good right now.


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## Horseychick94

He only goes that way because he was trained to. He is an ex harness racer and is used to traveling with his head cranked up.


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## Horseychick94

My trainer said my saddle is fine


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## kelley horsemad

You can make every excuse in the book for why he goes that way. I have seen many, many Standardbreds who go beautifully, soft, through and over their backs. He simply looks uncomfortable to me. I would beg to differ with your trainer. Again, good luck to you if these (saddle, trainer) are the resources available to you.


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## Gidget

kelley horsemad said:


> I don’t understand why people ask for help and then discount what people say. I don’t see how it’s remotely possible that you can fit a hand width between your behind and the cantle, not from the photos you’ve shown and I'm told the camera doesn't lie.  You will be unable to progress riding in that saddle and it is likely not terribly comfortable for your horse since it won’t be distributing your weight well. That is quite evident in his way of going. Good luck to you. I’d stick to riding in the other saddle as it's somewhat less poor fitting than the English saddle.


 

I honestly couldn't agree more with you.

If you want help you should accept it instead of fighting it.Your saddle doesn't fit and you are in clear denial. This can HURT your horse's back.
You need to find a saddle that fits you and your horse. It is very important that you do so. Go on craigslist and post an ad...see if people are willing to trade or try selling your saddle. Pawn shops are awesome as well. This,IMO is one of the most important things you can do when it comes to riding. 
A lot of people are trying to help you but you won't accept the help. That's too bad because you can learn a lot from people on here. Listen and learn. Not all trainers are correct.


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## Horseychick94

JustDressageIt said:


> OP, please read this.. it's a good post. I agree about everything - the saddle doesn't fit, and the mechanical hack probably isn't doing you a whole lot of good right now.


I did read it. It is a great post. I replaced the mechanical hack with a french link hunter dee which he seems pretty pleased with. The saddle may not fit me but he is happy in it. Trust me on that. This horse puts up with no crap whatsoever. I have ridden him in some pretty poor fitting saddles. If he has no problem with it, neither do I.


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## Horseychick94

Oh, and if you are judging that he is uncomfortable by the second pic, he was trying to swerve left and I was steering him but he was being a brat. This horse is happy as a clam.


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## Gidget

Glad you decided to change the hackamore.
It may just be me but did the hackamore look to low?


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## Gidget

I meant too*


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## Horseychick94

Gidget said:


> Glad you decided to change the hackamore.
> It may just be me but did the hackamore look to low?


Maybe. I punched as many holes in the bridle as I could. It is funny, the hack was fine when I put it on but it slipped down as I rode :? My horse is VERY content in his new bit. He doesn't constantly chomp at it as it doesn't have a roller. Well worth the $35!


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## Gidget

I'm glad it is working out for you


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## Hukassa

I'm glad the bridle is working better for you ... but I agree with the other posts, the saddle is a poor fit, and that can make even smooth trots so much rougher ( I should know, when I rode for the first time this year with my western saddle I couldn't understand why I was being launched out of the seat, I looked up some pictures and turns out I had grown over the winter (I'm 15) and was riding like a jockey. Its not the same but an example) And you say your horse is happy as a clam and the saddle is causing him no discomfort or distress, but there are some horses that can be in pain and never show it, they show go with the flow, or he loves being ridden around and doesn't show pain because he's enjoying himself. My mare had her foot caught in a cattle guard as a yearling, limps 24/ 7 nothing we can do about, just make her comfortable (natural balance shoes, supplements in the grain, etc..) but when she gets running around in the pasture or even just trotting and she's enjoying herself their is NO limp at all. She's enjoying herself, ignoring the pain I assume.


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## Horseychick94

I am,too. Every single bit I would use on him, he would fight it. He would chew incessantly. He wouldn't pay attention. Whenever I would pick up my reins or gently pull on the reins, he would pull back. Sometimes even pulling the reins out of my hands. He does chew some but not like he used to. He doesn't pull that stuff anymore. Finally found a bit for him after two years


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## Horseychick94

K. So here are some pics taken by a normal sized photographer and in these (at eye level) shows that my saddle fits better than you think. I can ALMOST fit a full hand behind me. So yeah the saddle is a LITTLE too small but not so dramatic that it is going to hurt my horse


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## justsambam08

That saddle is about a 1/2 size too small, maybe even a full size. 

Also, in the original photos as well as the one that you just posted, it looks like you don't have very much wither clearance in either of those saddles, making it additionally harder for your horse to work and carry you correctly.

My OTTB also gets very hollow in the back and puts his head up, but we also haven't done any work on getting him to use his back. I suggest teaching him to carry himself better, i.e. working on his topline on the lunge and doing some dressage.

Although I am sitting very far back in the saddle because I was just stretching my legs, you should have a good amount of space in front of you....there that's about a hand width and a half. 

Ice


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## JustDressageIt

The saddle is too small for you, and the wrong shape. You have a long femur (thigh bone) and it's almost off that saddle even just sitting there; you need a differently shaped saddle to accommodate that. This saddle also throws you onto the pommel, compromising your balance. Overall, not a good fit, and a good size too small.


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## kitten_Val

JustDressageIt said:


> The saddle is too small for you, and the wrong shape.* You have a long femur (thigh bone) and it's almost off that saddle even just sitting there; you need a differently shaped saddle to accommodate that. *This saddle also throws you onto the pommel, compromising your balance. Overall, not a good fit, and a good size too small.


JDI, can you explain that, please?


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## JustDressageIt

kitten_Val said:


> JDI, can you explain that, please?


Of course  
See how her knee is almost in front of the saddle flap? That flap is the wrong shape for her. 
So... instead of a saddle with a flap that's this shape:








She might consider a saddle with this kind of a shape, with a more forward flap:









HOWEVER... because this saddle also throws her in front of the "center of balance" it might be exacerbating the problem. 

I have the thigh problem too:








So my next saddle will eliminate that problem. The saddle in that photo has been retired


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## Horseychick94

Grrrrr. I guess I need a new saddle then. Anyone want to trade?


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## JustDressageIt

Ohand I forgot to mention - good choice with the hunter dee french link


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## Horseychick94

thanks  I am so upset that I need a new saddle  I dont want a new saddle and I am SO tired of shopping for them. Do you know which size seat I need?


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## JustDressageIt

What size is that one? I hate saddle shopping as well, but once you find "the one" (lol) it will improve your riding and your horse's comfort so much you won't believe it.


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## Horseychick94

This one is an 18". How much should I ask for it? Do you know of any good ones?


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## JustDressageIt

I would start looking for a 19 or 20" seat then. Prices for that saddle depend on what brand it is, and how much wear it has. Saddle brands I'd recommend depend on how much you're willing to spend  Old Collegiate saddles are really well made and affordable, and (the old) Collegiate is now Ovation if you're looking for a well made reasonably priced newer saddle. 
Bates makes nice saddles for the price... it all depends on price point and what you have available to you to try out


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## Horseychick94

Ok. I am selling this saddle for $400. Comes with the gullet kit, flexiblocs, and may even include the webbers


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## kitten_Val

JustDressageIt said:


> Of course
> See how her knee is almost in front of the saddle flap? That flap is the wrong shape for her.


Thank you! I was somewhat confused with what you were talking about.


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## kitten_Val

JustDressageIt said:


> Bates makes nice saddles for the price... it all depends on price point and what you have available to you to try out


Bates is very nice (I use one at the trainer's place once in while), but they are costly (at least new ones in Dover  ).


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## kelley horsemad

My AP saddle is a Bates. Their sizing is pretty generous. I’m long through the thigh and far from slim and the 18” Bates Caprilli AP fits me perfectly. I don’t think they come bigger than 18”, but I’m not positive on that. If you can’t afford to spring for the Bates – likely in the region of $1200 without fittings - Wintec is the same design, just synthetic instead of leather. You may want to look at a close contact model with more forward flaps. That’ll give you even a little more room.


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## Horseychick94

kelley horsemad said:


> My AP saddle is a Bates. Their sizing is pretty generous. I’m long through the thigh and far from slim and the 18” Bates Caprilli AP fits me perfectly. I don’t think they come bigger than 18”, but I’m not positive on that. If you can’t afford to spring for the Bates – likely in the region of $1200 without fittings - Wintec is the same design, just synthetic instead of leather. You may want to look at a close contact model with more forward flaps. That’ll give you even a little more room.


The close contact model's largest seat is only 17.5" :-(


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## kelley horsemad

Yes, but typically you can go down 1/2 size in a CC versus an AP.


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## JustDressageIt

Horseychick94 said:


> The close contact model's largest seat is only 17.5" :-(


Please don't forget to TRY the saddle before you buy it!! Unfortunately saddles are kind of like pants... you might be a 19 in some saddles and a 17.5" in others; it depends on the depth of the seat. Be sure to check out your knee clearance as well - put your leg in jumping position in the store (ask to try some leathers and irons if you need) and make sure your knee isn't too near the edge of the flap. You should also be sitting in the middle of the saddle, it shouldn't push you onto the pommel or too far back, and your pelvis should be neutral.


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## Horseychick94

So you think I could do a CC. What size would I need? If I need a 19-20" ap?


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## kelley horsemad

As JDI said above, it depends... it depends on the brand, the design, etc. One brand's 19" could be like another's 17.5". You have to TRY them to figure what will work for you.


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## Horseychick94

oh. so I should probably go to a tack shop then


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## barrelracer892

I have the same problem with my horse. He's extremely bumpy and only when he's calm and in a familiar place will he trot slow for me to sit to his trot. Also, when I post I end up starting off on his left diagonal. When I need to switch I just sit one beat and start posting again. Try trotting medium sized circles to get some energy out of your horse so it will make him go a little slower. Also, I notice that I lean forward sometimes when I'm posting. I just tell myself to sit back, put my toes on my stirrups, and put my heels down. Maybe practicing standing while trotting would help too.


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## Horseychick94

barrelracer892 said:


> I have the same problem with my horse. He's extremely bumpy and only when he's calm and in a familiar place will he trot slow for me to sit to his trot. Also, when I post I end up starting off on his left diagonal. When I need to switch I just sit one beat and start posting again. Try trotting medium sized circles to get some energy out of your horse so it will make him go a little slower. Also, I notice that I lean forward sometimes when I'm posting. I just tell myself to sit back, put my toes on my stirrups, and put my heels down. Maybe practicing standing while trotting would help too.


Great post! Thanks!


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## Horseychick94

What do Y'all think about these saddles? They come in 19" and have heard good reviews. I think I will get the CC if I do

http://www.downunderweb.com/store/Saddles_English.html


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## payette

They look decent. It is nice that they offer a wither-tracing fit eval- so you have some idea if it fits your horse. Is there a trial period?


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## Horseychick94

payette said:


> They look decent. It is nice that they offer a wither-tracing fit eval- so you have some idea if it fits your horse. Is there a trial period?


IDK. The tack shop said they might even let me return my current saddle!!!!!


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## Horseychick94

They dont have trial periods. I called them and it looks like I will not be getting one of these. They are made in India.


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## Horseychick94

JustDressageIt said:


> Please don't forget to TRY the saddle before you buy it!! Unfortunately saddles are kind of like pants... you might be a 19 in some saddles and a 17.5" in others; it depends on the depth of the seat. Be sure to check out your knee clearance as well - put your leg in jumping position in the store (ask to try some leathers and irons if you need) and make sure your knee isn't too near the edge of the flap. You should also be sitting in the middle of the saddle, it shouldn't push you onto the pommel or too far back, and your pelvis should be neutral.


I will do that. I dont want to end up in the same mess again


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## payette

Definitely a good idea to get one you can try first! Good luck!


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## Horseychick94

Yes! Thanks!


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## kitten_Val

Horseychick94 said:


> They dont have trial periods. I called them and it looks like I will not be getting one of these. *They are made in India.*


Yes, stay away from those. May be there are exceptions, but all saddles made there (and in Vietnam) I run into were total junk. 

Horsey, why wouldn't you look into the used one? You can get a nice brand for the same price.


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## Horseychick94

kitten_Val said:


> Yes, stay away from those. May be there are exceptions, but all saddles made there (and in Vietnam) I run into were total junk.
> 
> Horsey, why wouldn't you look into the used one? You can get a nice brand for the same price.


I actually would prefer a used one but 19-20" is hard to find unless you ride saddleseat


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## kitten_Val

Horseychick94 said:


> I actually would prefer a used one but 19-20" is hard to find unless you ride saddleseat


Hmmm.... I see... Yeah, that's the problem, I agree. You can try to contact Carpenoctumstable (from this forum). I believe she has bigger saddles from time to time. I know her in person, actually, and she's very nice to deal with.


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## Horseychick94

kitten_Val said:


> Hmmm.... I see... Yeah, that's the problem, I agree. You can try to contact Carpenoctumstable (from this forum). I believe she has bigger saddles from time to time. I know her in person, actually, and she's very nice to deal with.


Sweet! Thanks!!!!


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## danastark

Typically you measure your thigh to figure out what seat length you need. Sit in a chair. Measure from your rear on the side to your knee. Try a bunch of saddles, even if they are too expensive. Then when you find what you want, you can go online and shop for used ones that are less expensive.

Goodluck to you. Finding the right saddle is very important for balance, function and comfort for both you and your horse. BTW, he looks so much happier in the snaffle!


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## Horseychick94

danastark said:


> Typically you measure your thigh to figure out what seat length you need. Sit in a chair. Measure from your rear on the side to your knee. Try a bunch of saddles, even if they are too expensive. Then when you find what you want, you can go online and shop for used ones that are less expensive.
> 
> Goodluck to you. Finding the right saddle is very important for balance, function and comfort for both you and your horse. BTW, he looks so much happier in the snaffle!


thanks!!!!


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## Horseychick94

What about this one?
Used 18.5" Crosby English Saddle for Sale - FREE Ads


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