# All Purpose Saddle Fit



## AnitaAnne (Oct 31, 2010)

Jkreber0 said:


> Hey! This is my first post on here. I bought an All Purpose Saddle to use for jumping and flat work. It is a 16.5. I'm 5'8, 125 lbs. I showed it to my trainer, she thinks I need an 18 due to my long legs. Fits the horse, but I will be riding in it tomorrow for the first time. I've ridden in a 16.5 my entire riding career. I guess I'm just a little confused as to whether or not I should stay in a 16.5, or move to a bigger saddle. I am afraid the 18 would just be too big. Thoughts?


Welcome! 

I think if a 16.5 is comfortable you should ride in that size! I am 5'7" with very long legs and *cough* weigh quite a bit more than 125 and I ride in a 17" Dressage and can fit fine in my daughter's 16.5" Wintec 2000. 

A friend of mine told me that I needed a bigger saddle too, but no way would I consider an 18" like she used. So I "compromised" on a 17.5" and I hate it. It just feels too big :frown_color: 

Also, different brands and styles feel different. I tried a 18" endurance saddle once in a store and OMG it was horrible! So big and flat I felt like two people could have sat in it. I much prefer a deeper seat. 

Bottom line; ride in what feels good to you, not what someone else "thinks" will fit you.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Agree with the above & to my knowledge, it's people's bums that go in saddles, not legs.


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

The twist will effect how you sit and leg placement. As will how the flap is set. While you may need to go up some a size and a half is a bit much. Half size maybe. You want something with a longer more forward flap. Saddles designed with men in mind tend to fit women with longer thigh bones.


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## Dehda01 (Jul 25, 2013)

loosie said:


> Agree with the above & to my knowledge, it's people's bums that go in saddles, not legs.


No, it is femur length that determines size, not the size of the behind. 

This is just one link, but all saddle fitting pages base it this way. 
https://www.doversaddlery.com/how-to-select-and-size-an-english-saddle-for-a-rider/a/519/

“Hip to knee length determines where your knee and leg fit in accordance to the angle and point of the flap. When you try out saddles, look to fit this part of your leg first. The rotation and size of the saddle flap should complement the angle of your leg. Your knee should hit at the top point of the flap with at least two fingers to spare.”

I am 5’10” and typically need a 18”-18.5”. Some dressage saddles I need larger because of the very deep seats fit/measure small. I have been skinny, I am not currently. And tend to Yoyo. My seat size doesn’t change.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Riding in a saddle that is too small can put your butt, and your weight, back so that it's bearing down ON the cantle , and that s not good for the horse's back. So, it isn't just a matter of ride in whatever you like, no matter what it is.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Dehda01 said:


> No, it is femur length that determines size, not the size of the behind.


Oh, OK. Wasn't actually aware of that stipulation. I think that must depend entirely on the style & balance(as relates to rider) of the saddle. I don't think it is so relevant when you're riding on your seat bones with long leathers for eg, which is what I'm most familiar with. I can't remember it being relevant to riding in a Stock saddle either. But perhaps it's more relevant to a 'chair seat' style saddle/riding, and I just don't know about jumping, I imagine it is relevant there. I don't jump(aside from logs & small fences on trails) so...


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## AnitaAnne (Oct 31, 2010)

Femur length determines the size of the Flap, not the size of the seat. Your bum and personal preference determine the size of the seat.

The three points of fit for a rider are the twist, the flap length and angle, and the seat length and depth. 

Block size and location are strictly rider preference and comfort considerations. 

Custom and many high end saddles can be ordered with any combination of twist, flap and seat.


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

This is from the Dover link:
*Saddle Seat Sizes and Saddle Fitting for the Rider*

After you've determined the type of saddle you need, consider these key points to determine appropriate saddle size and fit:



*Hip to knee length* determines where your knee and leg fit in accordance to the angle and point of the flap. When you try out saddles, look to fit this part of your leg first. The rotation and size of the saddle flap should complement the angle of your leg. *Your knee should hit at the top point of the flap with at least two fingers to spare.*
_Saddle seat size_ affects your comfort level, ability to move and your effectiveness in your riding. Ignore the seat size measurement of the saddle, and work with what actually fits your body. Every manufacturer's saddle sizing will feel different between models of saddles. *Most saddles require that you fit between three to four fingers (or a hand's width) behind your bottom and the tip of the cantle.* If you feel confined in a deep seated saddle, then try the next seat size up.
*Flap length*, as described previously, is less important than the way the flap shape complements the angle of your leg. As a very general guideline, the flap will fall only about a third of the way down your calf. *The goal in determining flap length is to avoid having the edge of the saddle flap interfere with the top of your tall boot or half chap.*
*Riding style, your own personal preference for any one factor of the saddle and your position as determined by your unique physical build is always important.* For some riders, having two fingers behind their bottom and the cantle is sufficient as they prefer a snug seat. Others prefer a roomier feel in the seat.

Tip: The saddle seat size of an English saddle is measured in inches from either of the nail heads or brads on each side of the pommel to the middle of the cantle. *Which is where your seat goes and how size of the saddle is determined.*
Twist width is usually a fairly personal choice, too, though the twist is an aspect of saddle design that is supposed to accommodate the horse's shape more than the rider's. The front of any saddle tree has a steep angle to accommodate the horse's withers, while the back of the tree has a flatter angle to accommodate a horse's back. The twist occurs where the bars of the tree "twist" to form the transition between the front and back of the tree. The twist is located behind the pommel and at the front of the actual seat.


The blue is what you are looking at to determine if the saddle fits. The red is mine and is what determines the saddle size. So your thigh length determines flap and seat determines size.


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## Dehda01 (Jul 25, 2013)

https://www.thorowgood.com/fitting/10-measuring-the-rider

Upper leg length	Recommended seat size
Up to 16½"(41cm)	15"
Up to 18½"(46cm)	16"
Up to 20"(50cm)	16½"
Up to 21½"(54cm)	17"
Up to 23"(58cm)	17½"
Over 23" (59cm or longer)	18"

I have fitted many riders, and while personal conformation can play an impact, I can get the most information on how they will sit the saddle, by their height, and femur length. Some tall people are longer through the body, shorter through the legs and visa versa.

Too many riders like to play vanity and squeeze into a small seat size and then complain that they can’t find a flap that won’t fit them. There are certain some people that the forward flap is an answer, but in many cases it is the wrong balance point unless they have the correct angles through their femur and fibia.


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## AnitaAnne (Oct 31, 2010)

Out of curiosity I measured my thigh length and it is 24" from seat back to knee. Most of that is femur, not rear end. My western style saddles are 15" and my Dressage is a 17". I have never understood how a half inch or so can make such a difference, but no way would I be comfortable in an 18" or larger! 

As i mentioned above, I can sit in the saddle one of my daughter's used; it is a 16.5" Wintec Pro 2000 (all purpose style). I cannot ride comfortably in the kids' 16" Wintec Pro Dressage.

Currently I ride in a size 1 Barefoot Tahoe. Originally I purchased the Barefoot Cheyenne in a size 2 as was recommended by the dealer. The seat is too big.

The only reason the femur length is important is where your knee hits the knee roll when jumping. When I was riding jumpers I had an extra long flap on the 16" seat (I was a lot lighter weight then).


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

I was taught a long time ago that saddles 16" and below in size are for very petite adults and children.
16.5" are for riders not yet body mature large child stature riders and still petite adults.
Used to be 17" was a standard commonly seen adult size in saddles.
Then that number went to 17.5" seat size...
Today, I see more and more new saddles advertised at 18" and above...
That above is a "rule of thumb" and very stature specific.
Some saddles have a fuller cut flap, a more forward set flap and longer flap and forward & longer flap length.
"New" saddles can be ordered with such options.
It has to do with the length of the saddle flap and the width of that flap that as we mature your body adds bulk of bone and thicker muscle. I believe it. 
I've seen the leggy child ride in a saddle larger seat than you think is needed but they are not balanced properly on their legs in a smaller seat with a long leg....give them a year of maturing and suddenly they in front of your eye "fit" in that saddle correctly.
For some I've seen it be a vanity thing. They can't bear others knowing what size seat the saddle is...no one knows anyhow. 
They can't see the stamp under the flap and they aren't running around with a tape measure...
What is seen is if you sit in a to small a saddle with to short a flap for your leg... :|

I am 5'7" tall and weigh more than you....
I sit in a cc saddle with a seat size of 17.5 inches.
I fit in a 17", but am more comfortable with my femur and knee not extending past the flap front seam edge when riding with a longer "flat work" length leg.
If I shorten my stirrup one hole...my leg is not supported properly against the flap.
Yup, a 1/2" larger seat size has that much more room automatically cut for the flap to "balance" the saddle appropriate for rider riding in it.
My saddle has pencil knee rolls if you call them that.
I use to own a A/P saddle and in that I comfortably fit in a 18" seat.
Not ridiculous knee roll either and I fit, not swam in it.

Not sure what brand, make or model you are owning but I tend to agree the saddle is to small for your stature.
Not sure you need a 18" saddles but you could definitely sit comfortably balanced in the deepest part of a larger saddle and not so much on the cantle. 
Even though you think you don't need it, try a larger saddle and see if your balance point is easier held and felt while riding...
You should be able to balance real easy in align in a 2-point, not fight to keep steady and un-moving.
Nothing to lose, much to gain or your point made that you don't need a larger saddle will be proved. 
:runninghorse2:
_jmo..._


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## AnitaAnne (Oct 31, 2010)

If the saddle fits the horse, and fits you comfortably, then it is the right saddle for you. 

If you want to try some different sizes/combinations and they fit the horse, by all means give them a try. 

Personally I ignore the size and just use what is comfortable so long as it fits the horse. No vanity involved...

Bottom line? Only the one sitting in the saddle can determine if it is the right one, everyone else's opinions are really just suggestions.


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## ClearDonkey (Nov 27, 2016)

My trainer also said to get an 18" saddle in the past, but I am 5'7 and ~155 pounds. I am personally uncomfortable in anything smaller than a 17", and my dressage saddle is a 17". I am much more comfortable in my 18" event saddle, than that dressage saddle. Bigger seats do take a bit to get used to; I went from a 16.5" synthetic all purpose to my 18"... I will never go back. I can ride big movement much better, and jumping in it feels so much easier than what it used to be.


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

Dehda the measure Thorowgood uses is the femur length PLUS the seat. So you are measuring bone (just beyond tip of femur at knee to a line where there is a right angle where the vertical line of your back/rear meets the horizontal line of the chair) plus padding.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

If you are jumping and need a shorter stirrup so you can get fully out of the saddle, then the folded leg has to have some place to go. With a folded leg, how far the flap extends forward and at what angle will be affected by femur length.

OTOH, using my Aussie stock saddle - which fits me identically to how my Bates Caprilli AP saddle fit me - my leg looks like this:








​ 
When your thigh is pointing down, then lengthening the stirrup strap provides the room for the thigh. I'm 5'8" and like my 18" Aussie saddle, but I like that size in part because it gives me ample room between my thigh and the poley.

It could be the trainer is suggesting a larger saddle to promote a goal of jumping. 

A friend of mine used the same western saddle for years as a rancher. He's 5'9" and about 200 lbs. After a few decades, the saddle was showing hard use and he decided to get another. But when he tried sitting in some at a store, they all felt wrong. So the sales lady asked him to bring in his old saddle. Turned out it was a 13.5 inch kid's saddle. He had been given it when he was 10 and never thought to buy a larger one.

He ended up buying a 16" western, but had his old saddle repaired and still uses it sometimes. He says it still 'feels right' to him...:wink:


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## Dustbunny (Oct 22, 2012)

Dehda01 said:


> https://www.thorowgood.com/fitting/10-measuring-the-rider
> 
> Upper leg length Recommended seat size
> Up to 16½"(41cm) 15"
> ...



Thank you for this!!!! You can tell me how to measure seven ways to Sunday. But a photo??? Perfect.


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

I measured mine too. 26 inches. Most is femur but I am a padded 5'10". Before I lost the almost 20 pounds recently I'd ride in my son's 17.5" AP but his 17" dressage was a squeeze. Now I am quite comfortable and really liking that dressage saddlle. I went from 210 down to almost 190. My child is closing on 6' and 150. My legs are still just a bit longer than his. I swim in a friend's 18 inch AP (different brand than ours). She is both heavier and shorter than I am. She has a shorter flap - aggravating as my tall boot top and the bottom edge of the flap are right at the same spot and I get caught on her saddle.


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## my2geldings (Feb 18, 2008)

Jkreber0 said:


> Hey! This is my first post on here. I bought an All Purpose Saddle to use for jumping and flat work. It is a 16.5. I'm 5'8, 125 lbs. I showed it to my trainer, she thinks I need an 18 due to my long legs. Fits the horse, but I will be riding in it tomorrow for the first time. I've ridden in a 16.5 my entire riding career. I guess I'm just a little confused as to whether or not I should stay in a 16.5, or move to a bigger saddle. I am afraid the 18 would just be too big. Thoughts?


It's quite possible you do need a bigger saddle. A size 18 seems a little extreme but without a photo of you in that said saddle, it's hard to agree or disagree with your trainer. Saddles come in all shapes and sizes and are not created equal. I would suggest posting a photo so we can help you further.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

You have to compromise a bit when you're tall and slim - an 18 inch would be too big for you in the seat - you'll be wandering around in it. 
A 16 inch is too small especially with a GP saddle if you want to shorten your stirrups for jumping
I would aim at a 17 inch in a GP if you want to jump in it


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