# I want this horse, but so does she



## grayshell38 (Mar 9, 2009)

Sorry, she had him first. Find another steady eddie to gain confidence on.


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

All I have to say is that if you master the naughty horse, then you will be the better rider.....let her have the easy ride and you start seeing that you could actually learn a whole lot from the stubborn horse....I'd take it as an opportunity to learn, and if you can get this horse paying attention to you and doing as asked the your confidence will go up tenfold:lol:


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## existentialpony (Dec 4, 2012)

I assume that these horses are your lesson horses, but not ones that you own? Have you considered taking lessons without your best friend so that you can both ride Grey Guy? Or, asking if you can take turns every other week?

Horses can tell when you're frustrated, not confident, upset... maybe if you swap off, you can make every other week on Grey Guy your confidence-builder, and when you're on the other horse you can work on transferring your confidence to him!

Don't forget that you can always go to your instructor. They are paid to help you grow as a rider.


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## Tessa7707 (Sep 17, 2012)

As an instructor, I think it's best for a student to learn on an easy, willing horse before moving up to a more difficult horse. My suggestion, if you were my student, take lessons at a different time than your mom and friend so you can ride Grey Guy. Sounds like he's a great beginners lesson horse, while Kelly is more suited for a more experienced rider ready for more of a challenge. However, I will say, if your horse is more difficult than your friends or moms, your instructor probably thinks you can handle her. Also, it's probably not up to you who you ride, as an instructor, I choose the horses my students ride for very specific reasons, and it's quite an art matching riders to horses.


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## existentialpony (Dec 4, 2012)

I also wanted to say... stop thinking about whether you're a good rider or not.  I used to worry about that, and even after riding for many years and now owning a horse who I ride daily, I would hesitate to ever describe myself as a "great rider." We are all constantly learning, so taking it one day at a time to become a *better* rider, learn to control your frustration and emotions, and become confident in communicating with any horse you get up on!


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Well. That was fast. o.e

Gray-No, she didn't. At the beginning of the lessons, I used Gray Guy. But when I found Kelly, I decided to try her out. I didn't end up liking her, but Cass had Gray and I held my dislike for Kelly in.

Muppet-Maybe, but I'm still new to this. I need a good, easy ride until I'm experienced enough to deal with her. Then maybe I'd be ready. 

Exist-Yup, learning horses. Doing it without Cassidy? That's like ice cream without pickles! I have so much more fun with her there. That's a pretty good idea...I just have a feeling I'm not going to be able to give him up.

Tessa-My instructor, Virgil, doesn't care. As long as we're comfortable on the horse we're riding. As said before, Cassidy makes everything more enjoyable. And my mother does it because she enjoys it, and I don't want to stop her from doing that. Virgil only does lessons on Wednesdays at one time, so there's no other day for me to do it anyway.

Exist-Thanks, I'll keep that in mind.


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## sandy2u1 (May 7, 2008)

Y'all agreed to trade for the day and that is it. If you aren't happy with your horse, then ask to trade or move your lesson time so that both of you can ride the horse you like. You shouldn't hurt a friend over a horse.


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## acorn (Nov 27, 2012)

Hazels said:


> Today, I really did not want to go. I didn't want to go knowing that I'd leave feeling like a fool. That's when my mother suggested Cassidy and I trade horses, just for the day. She rode a mellow, older white horse named Gray Guy. We were both reluctant, so I told her that if she didn't like my horse, Kelly, we could totally switch back.
> Cassidy, on the other hand, ended up getting so incredibly frustrated that she sobbed through half of the lesson. She obviously did not like my horse.
> 
> She wants Gray Guy back. I don't want to give him back. For the first time in over a month, I feel like I can be a good rider one day. I just love his obedience and smoothness and he overall personality.
> ...


Read the first paragraph, the part where you told her if she didn't like your horse you would totally switch back. Give him back. It's the right thing to do.


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## sandy2u1 (May 7, 2008)

> If you aren't happy with your horse, then ask to trade or move your lesson time so that both of you can ride the horse you like.



Read more: http://www.horseforum.com/horse-talk/i-want-horse-but-so-does-151845/#ixzz2JaqCtA8g
Just to clarify, when I said if you aren't happy with your horse, then ask to trade....I meant to get an entirely different horse. 
​


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Already stated I'm not doing it without Cass. Twice, actually. 

I know, I know...but I can't go back to Kelly after Gray Guy! I actually enjoyed my lesson so much more on him.


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## sandy2u1 (May 7, 2008)

Exactly what is it that you would like us to tell you then? Cassidy was crying over having to ride yours, so you know she won't be wanting to do that again. We suggested that you ride different times so you can both ride him, ask for a totally different horse or maybe try and learn from the horse you get. Except go somewhere else or suck it up, I don't know what else could be done.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

I don't know. I was just wondering if anyone had any different ideas that weren't the obvious ones. I do appreciate the advice, though.


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## Tessa7707 (Sep 17, 2012)

Hazels said:


> Already stated I'm not doing it without Cass. Twice, actually.
> 
> I know, I know...but I can't go back to Kelly after Gray Guy! I actually enjoyed my lesson so much more on him.


Well, you can't have both, so you have to choose which is more important: Allowing your friend to ride her original horse, grey guy, and you ride Kelly (or) ride grey guy and make your friend ride Kelly, when she 'sobbed through half the lesson' If my friend started sobbing at any point during the lesson due to a decision I had made, I would rescind that decision and switch back to my original horse. I would rather watch my friend ride grey guy while I waited for my lesson than make her cry so I could ride at the same time. You know what I'm saying?
I still don't think it should be up to you who rides which horse, that is a decision reserved for the professional instructor.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

My teacher knows what he's doing. He wouldn't let us on any horse we weren't ready for.

I understand. I care about Cass far more then a nicer horse. I just have a miserable time on Kelly. Well, thanks anyway guys. Maybe Cass and I can have a talk and work it all out.


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

I find it somewhat curious that your instructor 'doesn't care' which horse you ride... that's kind of important for an instructor to care about, wouldn't you say?

What does your instructor tell you while you struggle with Kelly?


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Virgil is extremely knowlegable about horses...I think he knows what he's doing. His horses are all dead broke, they just have different personalities. He trusts us enough to let us decide which horse clicks with us.


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## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

Perhaps it is time to talk with you instructor about a few things. 

Such as:
- is there a third horse hidden away somewhere that is not Kelly that you could try. 
- what it would cost to board a horse there and take lessons, and possibly consider purchasing or leasing a horse. 
- see of your instructor is open to purchasing another lesson horse of her own and encourage/help her find one if there are none available. 

If there ARE more available, go with a new one. 

Could you afford to take a second lesson a week by yourself? That way you get to still work with the confidence booster horse AND still ride with your friend. Getting more riding time in, with added one-on-one direct coaching will help your riding and confidence too. 

You might want to see if you could switch every now and then. Talk to your friend about how riding a difficult horse makes you a better rider, and so does riding a bunch of different horses. You might be able to work out a schedule. Switching every other lesson, or ride one a month and then switch. "You have February, I'll take march. You take April. I will take may..." You can work out a schedule. 

Eventually, you are going to get fed up and quit, while your friend continues on. You may say it won't right now, but trust me. You WILL quit if you are miserable. It might be six months down the road, but you are doomed to fail if you cannot enjoy anything about the lesson. This mare seems like she is the type to suck the fun out of a situation. That is awful.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

Hazels said:


> Virgil is extremely knowlegable about horses...I think he knows what he's doing. His horses are all dead broke, they just have different personalities. He trusts us enough to let us decide which horse clicks with us.


They might both be dead broke, but Grey Guy sounds like a more tolerant horse. Your issue here is likely a riding issue. Everyone makes mistakes while they learn -- some horses are just more tolerant of mistakes than others.

Does your instructor ever ask you to evaluate /why/ your horse isn't listening?


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## sandy2u1 (May 7, 2008)

One thing you could do is go to your instructor and let him know that you can't handle the horse you have been given. He may be able to switch her out for you with a student that can handle her.


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## Tessa7707 (Sep 17, 2012)

Hazels said:


> Virgil is extremely knowlegable about horses...I think he knows what he's doing. His horses are all dead broke, they just have different personalities. He trusts us enough to let us decide which horse clicks with us.


Well, speaking from personal experience instructing hundreds of students, if a student was ever sobbing during a lesson, I would completely reevaluate everything I was doing, from horse to lesson plan. Same if a student was ever having as much trouble as you seem to be. If Kelly truly is a good lesson horse, then he knows what he's doing and chose you to ride her. He thought you were more prepared to ride Kelly than Cassidy was. Take that as a compliment and Kelly as a blessing to help you progress in your riding ability.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Enough about his teaching method, thank you. 

Well, I spoke to my mother about it. She said that Gray Guy would be really good for me and I should stick with him for a while. She didn't think Cassidy really loved Gray Guy, she just really disliked Kelly. So, we might try having Cassidy switch with Gabriel, the only other kid in our class. He rides Fooler, a horse Cass is used to. He's more experienced than the both of us, so he might be able to handle Kelly. That sounds pretty good to me, but I don't know how happy Gabe and Cass will be about it. I'll have to talk to them.


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## sandy2u1 (May 7, 2008)

It is clear that you are a spoiled brat used to getting her own way. I really hope Cassidy can find herself a better friend.


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## mudpie (Jul 15, 2011)




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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Well. That was really rude uncalled for. First off---we've been friends for almost six years now. I doubt either of us would find a better friend, thank you. Second, I would never make that descision without asking everyone first. It was a mere idea that my mother came up with. Please don't go around call people you don't know spoiled brats. I am extremely offended.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Thanks for the mood-lightener, mudpie. //Just laughed so hard


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

/shrug

I know you aren't interested in hearing this, but if I were you, I'd still be interested in why Kelly isn't responding to you. When does she act up? What are you asking for when she refuses to listen? When you identify that, ask yourself if you're giving your horse the correct aids. If you're not sure, ask your instructor. If you are giving correct aids and Kelly is still refusing to move, there is a hole in her training or another underlying issue. If you aren't giving the correct aids, how can you fix them?

Even if you do end up continuing to ride the horse your friend was already riding, you should take this opportunity to better yourself as a rider.

I have learned that if a horse is acting up, chances are, it's the rider's fault. If it's not the rider's fault, then it's a training gap, and that horse doesn't need to be used for beginner lessons.


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## sandy2u1 (May 7, 2008)

You have made it clear that you want the horse Cassidy rides right from the beginning. We have offered you other suggestions that don't require Cassidy to have to give up anything. Why don't you switch to Fooler?


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Thank you, Leah, for actually addressing the situation.

I think it's partially her fault and partially mine. I don't take control very easily, and she doesn't mind very well. It's not a very good mix.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Sandy-I've never ridden him before. She's ridden him from day one up until a month or so ago. It was just an idea, and I don't even like it. I doubt anyone else will either. Maybe I'll ride Gray Guy unless she asks for him back---which she didn't. Maybe she would like Fooler better than Gray anyway. Maybe Gabriel wants to try Kelly. I dunno.


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

Hazels said:


> Sandy-I've never ridden him before. She's ridden him from day one up until a month or so ago. It was just an idea, and I don't even like it. I doubt anyone else will either. Maybe I'll ride Gray Guy unless she asks for him back---which she didn't. Maybe she would like Fooler better than Gray anyway. Maybe Gabriel wants to try Kelly. I dunno.


I think sobbing during her lesson would indicate that she would like to ride the other horse.

The bottom line is realizing that you can't just take Gray Guy away from Cassidy. You switched horses for a day and realized that there is a communication issue going on between you and Kelly. Now it's time to finish what you started. Take what you just learned about yourself (that you are a capable rider and that you are lacking control over Kelly) and use it to become a *better* rider.

Ask your instructor to show you how to take control. Go into it knowing that you are capable -- because if these horses are as broke as you say, then you ARE capable of getting her under control. You just need to ask the right questions.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

You asked to switch horses for one lesson, and then decided you liked her horse better and now you don't want to switch back?
No offence, hon, but I'd be dropping you as a friend very, very quickly. It DOES sound as if you're quite used to 'getting your own way' and you don't seem at all concerned about your friend and what horse she wants to ride so long as it benefits you. Very nice.


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## mudpie (Jul 15, 2011)

Hmm, dear, I think you may be a wee bit caught up in whose fault it is. 

When you say "I don't take control very easily," what do you mean? Is you lower leg secure, and in the right place? Are you using your seat? Are you giving clear, correct aids?

More likely than not, she's fine. Riding horses is about communication, to put it pretty simply. That's why it's so important to take lessons, and ride correctly. You're just learning to communicate, if we take it to a very basic level. It's complicated, but more likely than not, you're having trouble communicating with her. Maybe you're not using enough leg. Maybe you're not secure enough in your seat yet for her to respect you.

It's where we all start; every single one of us has had trouble "controlling" a horse countless times, without exception. And more often than not, that trouble is entirely our fault. 

There's nothing wrong with that, but just remember not to get too frustrated. Focus on your own riding, and make sure that you're doing everything right before you immediately resort to being exasperated with your horse, no matter which it may be. I know that it can be difficult, but life is.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

You asked to switch horses for one lesson, and then decided you liked her horse better and now you don't want to switch back?
No offence, hon, but I'd be dropping you as a friend very, very quickly. It DOES sound as if you're quite used to 'getting your own way' and you don't seem at all concerned about your friend and what horse she wants to ride so long as it benefits you. Very nice.


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## sandy2u1 (May 7, 2008)

Are you serious? She was crying over riding your horse. How much clearer of a message can she send that she wants her horse back. 

I think it benefits people to ride different horses. What bothers me is the way you are trying to just take your friends horse. If you can't handle the horse you are riding, then talk to your trainer. Maybe you can get a different horse and won't even need to stab your friend in the back.


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## BennysLace (May 9, 2010)

Hazels, I owned a horse for almost 4yrs that sounds like your stubborn mount. She had been a broodmare all her life, I bought her sent her for 60days training and quickly realized I had no clue what I was doing. After the 4yrs I have so much more confidence because I mastered most of her faults, I would only ride her bareback. She threw me after owning her a month, and I let her set fr 5 months. Needless to say she did not want to get back to work. She was stubborn, she was barnsour, and she was very foward if we were heading anywhere toward home. I learned to handle her bratty spells, I never truly enjoyed many of our trail rides it was always a battle. Not saying some of those battles weren't me she could probably read that I was dreading the ride. I had to rehome my mare over the summer, and I miss her dearly we bonded but she just did not like to work. My confidence was broken she broke it, but then rebuilt it by allowing me to conquer many of her downsides. She taught me so much, and I learned I have a better seat then I thought. a 380 degree turn while she is trying to trott(her conformation allowed for a very bumpy ride) while bareback and I staying on yep much better then I thought. I will be getting another horse this summer, a smoother horse this summer and a better behaved horse. I want to enjoy those rides, but now I know I can handle more then I thought and will be less likely to go for the dead head horse. Good luck but I say stick with the mare, talk to your trainer who may have some advice to get you on the right track with the ol' girl.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

//Sigh

I didn't think I could really enjoy my lessons until Gray Guy. It's just hard to explain. If she wants him, we'll figure it out. I realize now it was a terrible mistake to ask here, because obviously no one would understand or take anything the right way. To anyone actually trying to help; thank you. {Leah, Lace, Benny}

I've done so many things for her as she's done many for me. Cassidy would never drop me as a friend, and I wouldn't either. I've asked nicely before and I'll do it again---do not make assumptions about me or my friendship with her. It is extremely hurtful and none of your concern anyway, so just...stop. Please.

I appreciate most of the advice posted here and will take a majority of it under consideration.


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

I guess I'm not sure what kind of advice you wanted. :\

Lots of suggestions have been made about what you can do to remedy the situation, which is what you asked for, I thought.


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## mudpie (Jul 15, 2011)

Whatever, here's a potato.


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)




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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

D'aww. I think I'm going to like you guys. <3

I was just looking for advice on my riding and not on my relationship with Cass.  I got quite a bit of it, and I will take all of the actual advice into heavy consideration. A lot of good tips have been pointed out that I will be using in the future.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

"If she wants him, we'll figure it out"
Really you should be saying, "I'll figure out how to get new mount, or deal with the one I've been given." It isn't hard to see things the right way, you want something that is HERS because you think it is better than what you have. You want to have the 'good' thing and give her the 'bad' thing because you think you deserve to enjoy your lesson, while it's okay for her to cry through half of it.


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

Hazels said:


> //Sigh
> 
> I didn't think I could really enjoy my lessons until Gray Guy. It's just hard to explain. If she wants him, we'll figure it out. I realize now it was a terrible mistake to ask here, because obviously no one would understand or take anything the right way. To anyone actually trying to help; thank you. {Leah, Lace, Benny}
> 
> ...


Could you and your friend switch off every week - also what horse does you mom ride? Could you ride that one instead?


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

It's not really hers. I meant that maybe we could figure out a schedule or something. It isn't okay for her to cry, it broke my heart a little. I love her to pieces, and no one likes to see their friend cry. I didn't really know what to do; I figured I should be able to try out Gray, too. Even though I like him, I would never just take it from her.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Switching off every week might work. We're going to figure it out. We always do.

We considered that...the only thing is, my mother really enjoys it and it's fair that she can get the horse she wants. We don't want to have to bother her with our problem and make it hers.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

See, OP, your most recent post makes you sound like a more reasonable girl, had you posted something like that at the beginning of the thread I imagine you would have gotten more favourable responses, rather than implying that you wanted him for yourself.

And I second what Punks said... although I wasn't sure I read right. Is your mom riding in your lesson? Also you never did clarify, is your instructor using ALL of his lesson horses in your lesson?


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

Hazels said:


> Switching off every week might work. We're going to figure it out. We always do.
> 
> We considered that...the only thing is, my mother really enjoys it and it's fair that she can get the horse she wants. We don't want to have to bother her with our problem and make it hers.


What if each week the three of you rotate? This way you all learn to master different types of horses AND have some really enjoyable lessons and some tough ones - well balanced. Are there only 3 horses at this lesson program? They haven't got an extra good pony for you to ride?


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

Okay I was going to edit but the forum is being weird with my posts...

I want to edit what I said before. I _personally_ don't believe it's right of your mother to watch children struggle with difficult horses / a decision like this without suggesting letting you switch horses with her. Have you even brought it up with her?


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

There's a difference between taking and wanting. Through my horse adventure, we've had each other's backs. Since the time when she went home crying to when I felt worthless because I wasn't as good as the rest of the class. I would never just steal her horse. I want it, but friends don't steal or take. I'm pretty sure I said that in the first place, but everyone just took it wrong I guess.

He owns five dead broke horses: Blazer, Kelly, Fooler, Jelly and Gray Guy. Jelly is very young and unpredictable, so all of us refuse to ride her. Blazer is my mom's horse.

My mother offered Blazer up, but we didn't want to take him. He's a real good horse, but it's not fair for her. She deserves to ride just as much as us. We talked to her about it, but she believes Kelly is an easy horse. Just stubborn. I think we all agree on that, too. A little seven year old rides the heck out of her without any difficulties. I think it just depends who's on her.

{I'm going to bed.}


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

You did say that you didn't want to give him back, and that your mother suggested you continue the switch for a few more weeks, and that that was what you were going to try... so regardless of whether or not that is what you meant, that is what you said, and you were given some fairly sound advice on the situation.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

I'm going to talk to the others about it, okay? I wouldn't just take it from her. We're really close, and we just don't do that. We actually talked a bit about the situation on the ride home: She wants him, and I want him, but neither of us are just going to take him. We decided that. My mother thinks I should tell her that I need Gray for a while, and although I do, I couldn't do that to her without full permission.

She has had him for almost two months though, and I do think I should have him at least until I can gain full confidence. If she's deadset on not ever giving him up, I'd leave her be and maybe try Blazer. If that doesn't work, I'll suck it up and try Kelly again.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

Before you TELL her that you need him for a few months, _ask_ her nicely, without pressuring her, if you can ride him for a little while. But not if it means she's going to be stuck with Kelly... It is VERY clear to me from what you've written that she cannot handle your horse AT ALL and I think you need to ensure that she has a different horse to ride BEFORE you begin to ride the one she is comfortable on.

Not to mention- what does HER mother have to say about this? Did she witness the lesson? Is she aware of what happened?


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Why the caps? c:

Of course we would have a civilized conversation about it. I'd just explain that I really need a confidence booster until I ride Kelly again, then I'll give him back. I'm sure she'd understand. Kelly can be very stressful to a wrong rider---which both of us are. Maybe my mother would give up Blazer and try Jelly---still doesn't seem very fair for mom, but...

Her mother has never come to a lesson and isn't interested at all in horses.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

Because I was too lazy for italics. :lol:

I think you're missing my point, to be honest. You said yourself that Kelly made her cry, before you ask to switch to her horse for a little make SURE that she has a different horse to ride, or you might risk her dropping out of lessons completely.


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## EvilHorseOfDoom (Jun 17, 2012)

Why not suggest each spending half the lesson riding Kelly and half Gray Guy? Kelly, being a challenge, will teach you more about horses and riding but sometimes it's also nice to ride a horse that will just do what you ask. It's probably better for both of you to ride both horses, as much as riding Kelly might not seem much fun.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

We'll figure it out. We have three weeks until the next lesson, we've got plenty of time to decide.

So. No hard feelings? {<--- @Everyone}

Evil-That would be a bit difficult. Having to get on and off a horse every hour and a half, I mean. We could do it, it just might be a bit time consuming.


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## PurpleMonkeyWrench (Jun 12, 2012)

wow it's a shame to see the responses on this thread. It really really is. I have read every post and some of you people calling her a "spoiled brat" and belittling her for wanting to take lessons on a certain horse. Calling the OP a bad friend...really? Now in my opinion Cass would be the bad friend if she didn't share Grey guy. OP is doing nothing wrong and is presenting herself to be a lot more mature than most of the posters on this thread. Pat yourself on the back OP you sound like your doing the right thing by trying to figure something out and talking it over with all the people involved in the situation. To the rest of you...well....SMH it's a crying shame.


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## apachewhitesox (Dec 9, 2010)

First off I don't know but I believe maybe OP that you are having the same sort of ideas as what everyone has written, the way you have written though comes off as rather self-centered. (not saying that is actually how you are thinking) 

Secondly I like the idea of your friend, your mother and you swapping horses every week. That way everyone gets to have a lesson on a quiet horse and everyone gets a challange. Its not being unfair to anyone it is actually giving everyone a fair chance to learn more with the different horses. If you are having so much trouble with Kelly and she really is dead-broke then you really need to think about what you are specifally doing wrong. If you really can't work it out ask your instructor talk to him about it, that is what he is there for not just to watch.

Also if you mother is anything like mine she would gladly give up her horse so you could have a chance at some fun. Its not unfair at all, for all you know she might be very capable of riding Kelly and might find it a fun challange to ride a different horse. I know if I had to ride the same horse all the time that didn't play up at all and I was a decent enough rider I might want a challange.


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## EvilHorseOfDoom (Jun 17, 2012)

Hazels said:


> We'll figure it out. We have three weeks until the next lesson, we've got plenty of time to decide.
> 
> So. No hard feelings? {<--- @Everyone}
> 
> Evil-That would be a bit difficult. Having to get on and off a horse every hour and a half, I mean. We could do it, it just might be a bit time consuming.


Nah, it's not hard at all. I used to switch horses with my instructor half way through every lesson - and they were hour lessons. It was a good way to challenge my riding ability. I had to get used to variance in difficulty, size, gait, temperament, ability etc in a short time, and it made me a much better rider.


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## gogaited (Oct 8, 2012)

Hazels said:


> Already stated I'm not doing it without Cass. Twice, actually.
> 
> I know, I know...but I can't go back to Kelly after Gray Guy! I actually enjoyed my lesson so much more on him.


Your "instructor" is worse than worthless.


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## Saranda (Apr 14, 2011)

This situation, actually, should really be sorted out by the instructor, and his decisions would show the quality of his work. Lesson horses should not just be switched by the liking of the students, but be assigned according to the specific needs of each horse and student. A good instructor should also prevent such personal misunderstandings that sometimes come up between students regarding who rides which horse - it should all be handled by a knowing supervisor. 

Not caring about who rides which horse... "Dead broke" horses, who give their riders such hard times that they don't even want to ride them (regarding Jelly)... Inadequte assistance and tutoring - regarding always having the same problems with one horse (Kelly) and not showing any progress - and letting to get away with that by simply changing horses!.. All of that doesn't look good.

Girl, I've riden tons of hard lesson horses in my time - the stubborn ones, the flighty ones, the uncooperative ones, young ones, old ones, all kinds of them. Sometimes I felt like giving up, like when I was given a particularly hard mare - and when I asked for a different horse I was told that I will keep riding this mare until I sort out at least one of my problems. And I did. All of that gave me extremely valuable experience in dealing with different horses - riding only an easy and likeable horse would have brought me nowhere! So appreciate what you're getting and stop acting like a spoiled child. At times like these...we just have to grow up.

And I understand the fun side of getting to be at the same lesson with your best friend, but you will get mutch further riding-quality-wise, if you just concentrate on yourself and the horse. Otherwise, you'll always be too busy to learn how to cooperate with Kelly.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

OP, I'm sorry, but it seems to me you don't really like horses and are only taking lessons because your mother and friend are doing it. I get no feeling of passion from you about riding or the animals themselves, just that it's 'fun' to hang out with your friend.

I also wonder at your instructor. Where was he when all this was going down? A GOOD instructor doesn't let his students decide which horses they want to ride, they're assigned ahead of time. That's like a teacher in a classroom letting her pupils decide on which lesson program she'll be teaching.

You're a very well spoken and obviously intelligent young lady, but this whole thing doesn't give me confidence that you really like horses or that your instructor seems to have any authority over his students.

You really need to ask yourself WHY you're taking lessons. If it's just for the camaraderie and not because you want to be a decent rider, then maybe it's time to find another activity in which you truly have an interest.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Wow. Lots of replies.

Speed-Why would I drive thirty five miles out to the middle of no where and ride until dark and get my toes frozen off if I didn't like horses? I love horses! I honestly have no idea where your coming from with that. It was my idea in the first place, and Cassidy just decided she wanted to come. The only thing was that it was extremely difficult for me to enjoy lessons on a horse that I disliked. 

I'm getting tired of the comments on my teacher. I've explained it before; I think he knows what he's doing. I could add more but I've done it before and no one listened, so I won't.

Also, if you're going to post, please stop with the spoiled comments. You don't know me, and I was said before, it's hurtful. Thank you~

I think that covered all of it.


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## Saranda (Apr 14, 2011)

That's not how public forums work, dear. If you set up a thread, anyone gets to reply, no matter what opinions they are going to share, unless they are rude or harrassing. Which cannot be said about any posts in this thread - everyone's been blunt and honest to the bone, but helpful. Besides, I know that several of the people who have replied here, are very experienced horsemen - you should drop your pride and try to be more open. It helps with horses, too.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

I still don't feel judging my personality based on a website would help my riding at all. If they knew me personally, then that might help with my riding. But since it's all based on what they read in a website, they don't truly know me and shouldn't be calling me "spoiled" or a "brat". Just my two cents.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

By your own posts I got no feel that you actually love horses. If that's not the case, then good. I'd hate to think someone was taking lessons 'just because'.

As far as driving 35 miles one way to ride, so what? I drive 70 miles round trip every day to work, and when I get home in the middle of nowhere I have to feed and water after dark and get my toes, nose, and ears frozen off. So if you're trying to lay it on thick about how _difficult_ and time consuming it is for you to ride, I don't think anyone is impressed. 

You may not be spoiled, but you're certainly coming off as holier-than-thou with just a touch of entitlement. If that's not how you really are, then you need to stop posting that way.


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## acorn (Nov 27, 2012)

Hazels said:


> I still don't feel judging my personality based on a website would help my riding at all. If they knew me personally, then that might help with my riding. But since it's all based on what they read in a website, they don't truly know me and shouldn't be calling me "spoiled" or a "brat". Just my two cents.


Unfortunately we can only go on what you say and it does appear from what you say that you are spoiled and totally uncaring about your friend.
Also appears that you certainly are not a person whose word is worth anything. Remember you told your friend that if she didn't like your horse you would "totally" swap back? Then you didn't.

I also do not understand when your friend was crying why your Mom didn't instruct you to swap back. Or why she would tell you to tell your unhappy friend that NOW you need the horse for a while.

Appears spoiled rotten to the core to me.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Well, I'm trying to act like that. I guess it just came off that way. Over the Internet, you know, it's hard to tell.

I was just saying that I wouldn't go through with it if I didn't like horses. I truly do like horses, and I really haven't said anything to make anyone think otherwise. Why would I be on this website if I dodn't like horses?


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## Saranda (Apr 14, 2011)

Ok, if you truly care for horses, then why don't you just take the challenge and try becoming a better horsegirl by riding a difficult horse that takes you directly to your weak spots? These horses can teach us the best lessons and you will be very grateful to Kelly one day.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

It's really difficult to learn on Kelly. She just frustrates me and yes, I cried on her too. I just feel that it would help me become a better horse rider if I could stick with the easier horse, even if just for a little while. 

I can understand how I may have come off as conceded on previous posts. I'm not self-centered, and I don't know how many people noticed, but I'm trying to change my posts to appear less selfish. I don't know how well it's working, but I am trying and I'd appreciate it if people would disregard some of the snobiness in early posts.


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## DancingArabian (Jul 15, 2011)

Everything I originally wrote was already suggested and shot down so I deleted my post.

Here are your options:

1. Ask for a different horse
2. Ride at a different time
3. Stop riding
4. Keep riding and make him behave instead of just expecting him to and hoping it will happen
5. Keep riding and letting him do his thing until you are turned off of riding

No matter what, those are your only options. Lets say 2, 3 and 5 are out. Leaves you with 1 and 4.

I don't know the barn to know if 1 is an option which leaves us with 4.


What is the horse doing? What riding experience do you have? What discipline/style are you taking lessons in? Maybe we can help you get more results from the beastie. I know how much riding a bratty horse sucks but it really will make you a better rider.


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

Hazels said:


> There's a difference between taking and wanting. Through my horse adventure, we've had each other's backs. Since the time when she went home crying to when I felt worthless because I wasn't as good as the rest of the class. I would never just steal her horse. I want it, but friends don't steal or take. I'm pretty sure I said that in the first place, but everyone just took it wrong I guess.
> 
> He owns five dead broke horses: Blazer, Kelly, Fooler, Jelly and Gray Guy. _Jelly is very young and unpredictable, so all of us refuse to ride her_. Blazer is my mom's horse.
> 
> ...


These horses are clearly not as broke as your instructor believes them to be.


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

Also, just because YOU think your instructor knows what he's doing doesn't mean he does. I see red flags all over this training program.


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## Tessa7707 (Sep 17, 2012)

Hazels said:


> We'll figure it out. We have three weeks until the next lesson, we've got plenty of time to decide.
> 
> So. No hard feelings? {<--- @Everyone}
> 
> Evil-That would be a bit difficult. Having to get on and off a horse every hour and a half, I mean. We could do it, it just might be a bit time consuming.


So your lessons are 3 hours long? Wow, I see no problem at all with dismounting, switching, and mounting again. I have done it many times in classes of 15 plus students in just 45 minute classes. It only takes a minute. I think that's a great idea evil. 
No, no hard feelings at all, not from my end anyway.


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## Tessa7707 (Sep 17, 2012)

LeahKathleen said:


> These horses are clearly not as broke as your instructor believes them to be.


Agreed Leah. To the OP, keep in mind, all students think their instructors know everything and are great at what they do. At first. I am still finding things that some of my first instructors taught wrong, and I thought they knew everything there was to know back then. I don't know anything about your instructor other than what you have told me, and I too see many red flags.


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## aerie (Jul 19, 2010)

OP please don't take offense to this, I really am just trying to help, but I really don't think that this barn is the best place for you, your friend, or your mother. Your riding instructor may know what _he_ is doing as in he is an excellent rider and knows his way around horses but from what I have read (again not trying to bash him you have just given us very little information on him other than *not* to bash him) he doesn't know how to teach it to others. I help give lessons to beginners and work as a riding instructor at a summer camp. At every lesson I have ever taught the horse is assigned to the rider. It isn't because I don't think that the rider is unable to pick a horse they "click" with, it is because the horse they "click" with may not be the appropriate horse for them. Horses each have their own personalities and quirks and as an instructor it is important to know each and every one of those quirks and match them to a rider that can

A.) Not be scared by said quirk and gain confidence
or
B.) Learn from said quirk and become a better rider because of it

It concearns me that your instructor lets you pick your own horses, because I know if I let_ my _beginners pick their own horses they would all end up on horses that are too challenging for them or too easy for them. Sure they might "click" personality-wise, but they probably won't match up skill wise. 

Now I am not trying to say your instructor is a bad guy maybe he just didn't evaluate everyone's ability correctly. I will admit that I have done that before and have had to talk with my students about how they feel about their riding abilities and who they feel they would be more comfortable on. Have you talked to your instructor about your insecurities? When it comes to being insecure or nervous or whatever you are feeling during a lesson you should always be able to go to your instructor, that is what they are there for  Try talking to him with your friend about the horses that you guys ride, maybe he will have a different solution or tell you why you _should_ stick with your original horses, or maybe he will tell you it is a good idea to switch, maybe he will even put you on different horses completely! Whatever he choses you should feel comforted and better about yourselves, your riding, and the progress you will make. If he doesn't listen (which I am not saying he won't) I think it is time to find another place to take lessons.

Good luck with whatever you choose and let me know if I was helpful at all! And again please don't feel attacked by my post, I am jst trying to help you with your situation from what I have read


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## Sunny (Mar 26, 2010)

I shall just repeat others; this is an instructor issue.


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## Delfina (Feb 12, 2010)

I am confused......

How is switching horses time consuming!? The last lesson I had, the trainer was mounted as well as myself (free lesson, paid ones she's not) and the two of us got on and off our respective mounts probably half a dozen times to check on a sleeping kid, get water, chase down an escaped pony.... Other than escaped pony, none of them took more than 2 minutes max, even when we switched mounts which required adjusting the stirrups as she's tall and I... am not. That even included hauling the horses over to the mounting block!

You don't WANT help, you want to stand around going Poor pitiful widdle me... I'm not getting what I want so all of you tell me it's okay to take the horse I want and tell my friend it's just too bad, so sad for her... :?


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## Jake and Dai (Aug 15, 2008)

Hey OP. I think you've gotten a lot of good ideas so far on here and I can see that you're trying to take them in and relate them to your situation. I have a suggestion, why not start a thread in the appropriate Horse Riding section for your discipline, and describe the issues you are having with Kelly? There are some fantastic riders and trainers on here who might be able to give you some tips on how to ride Kelly.

I really do agree with the others that say, focus on riding Kelly and overcoming the issues you are encountering with her. I think if you take it one step at a time, you will be amazed at what you can do and how far you will come in your horsemanship.

So try starting that new thread and think through what is going on, then describe it in as much detail as you can. Then please be open to all the help you will get on here. It really is a very helpful and informative place. I've learned tons since joining!

Good luck to you!


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

To be honest, I think you have to make a decision between furthering your riding and spending social time with your friend at the lesson. You've made it clear there's only one (two counting your mother's) horse you are content with riding, and two people that want that horse. You either have to suck it up and ride the difficult pony for the sake of hanging out with your friend during the lesson, or ride the quiet pony in a lesson without your friend. 

It sounds like you two are good friends. I wouldn't want to destroy that friendship over this.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Casey02 (Sep 20, 2011)

Ok I just read through this whole thread. I see a few things going on.. 


There is one horse that sounds like he is "dead broke" and that is Grey Guy. Why are you guys paying for lessons if you are not comfortable on the horse? I hate to say it but your trainer does not sound like he knows what he is doing and if he does know then he doesn't care. There is no reason his students should be crying after a lesson and if they are he needs to fix it. You both need to enjoy lessons (that includes the horse) and if your instructed does not make it enjoyable nor fix the problem it is time to move on.

Im actually scratching my head, why your mom has not done anything about the situation and has let it get this bad? I do not believe you or your friend should be this sad from a lesson. I do not think it is worth breaking up the friendship but you need to speak up and ask your instructor if you can ride a different horse or find some place else that you can both enjoyably ride.


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## DimSum (Mar 28, 2012)

Okay, I did look up some of the OP's other threads and this one jumped out at me:
http://www.horseforum.com/rider-wellness/i-need-get-over-traumatic-experience-145025/

(gently spoken as the interwebs aren't good at conveying tone)

It does seem to me that you do need to work through some riding issues, not just the fall but overall basic horsemanship. As others have stated here, I would recommend you take a good hard look at how you are riding and what foundation areas you need to improve on. That being said I would have an honest discussion with your trainer as to why you are having such a hard time with the mare you apparently felt good about riding a month ago. Then together you can map out a plan, whether it entails taking lessons for a few weeks on the easier horse or whether you need one-on-one rather than group lessons.


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

I'm not one for many words, but to be quite frank and honest with you, WHY in heavens name should YOUR problems/issues be planted on your friend? In your fist couple of posts you said that she could have the grey horse back and she spent most of the lesson crying on the other horse. Your issues are YOURS don't make your friends time miserable because you are having a hard time confronting your own confidence and insecurity issues.

Forget the trainer, forget the friend, forget the two horses....this is YOUR issue to deal with. Donot hurt your friend.


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## EliRose (Aug 12, 2012)

I really, really don't understand why your instructor is leaving these decisions to his students. That is a huge red flag, and you need to seriously consider either talking to him or leaving. You "think" he knows what he is doing. You don't actually know.

His horses are obviously not as well-broke as you say if one of them is bringing both you and your friend to tears and one of them is "unpredictable". That's another red flag, and a situation I've been in before. I left and couldn't be happier where I am. I highly recommend you do the same, or at least think about it.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Red flags all over the place for this "instructor" - three hour long lessons, and beginner children crying and not feeling safe? 
I'd be out of there so fast..!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

Hazels said:


> If this is in the innapropriate forum, I apologize. I literally looked through all of the forums, but none of them fit. Correct me if I chose the wrong one.
> 
> Well, here's my dilemma. I take horseback riding with my mother and best friend, Cassidy. We enjoyed it quite a bit, but then I began to realize me and my horse did not click. She is extremely stubborn and distracted when I am on her, and it really lowers my confidence when she acts against what I asked her to do. It makes me look like a bad rider.
> 
> ...


This is the first post. To me, I do not see anything asking for "riding help". Or help learning how to ride. Or help on how to regain your confidence. Or help on riding the problem horse. 

I see asking for help on how to _get_ to ride the one one horse, when another person wants to ride him. 

I think if you wanted riding advice, like you claim, you could have phrased it better. Such as "Here is my problem with the horse I am riding. How do I fix it? How do I ride her better?"

Instead, it came off as trying to take another persons horse, friend or not, and stick her with the bad one. That is just how it came off. It really did come off as selfish and uncaring. I believe you when you said you did not mean it to come off that way. Re-read what has been posted, both by you and how others responded. We don't know the situation, the horses, your friend, when you get to ride, or anything other than what you share and how you share it. This is a learning experience as well. 

From what has been posted, it also sounds like you and your friend are just going out for pony rides and not actual riding lessons. And that is completely fine, don't get me wrong. If it were a real riding lesson, the instructor would not let it get to the point of tears. The instructor would be right there _instructing_ you and her how to ride the horse better. "Here is the problem. Here is what you are doing wrong. Here is why she is acting like that. Here is what you need to do to fix it." That is how a riding lesson works. 

What age range are you and your friend? 

I think you (or she) should try a new horse. Disregard the fact that you (or she) has never ridden that particular new horse. That is how you learn.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Oh Geeze. This went up fast. 204 likes, 9 pages and 1,885 views?

I don't know how to reply to all of this. I'll try to read it all.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Okay, finished. I'm not going to quote posts, I'll just make a few general statements.

I came here to ask for advice on how to talk to my friend about this. That was my main intention. I got very few points on the actual subject, but I learned a few things along the way I suppose. 

I can't really explain why, but I can't see myself leaving Virgil. He doesn't understand why we have such a hard time, but he's still the reason we are the riders we are today. He has a successful teaching method and we've become such better riders because of him, and I don't see us switching anytime soon. I definitely can understand why you'd all think he was a bad teacher, though.

Did I cover it all?


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## apachewhitesox (Dec 9, 2010)

Can I just ask what his teaching method is exactly, I'm really curious? I also don't understand how an instructor wouldn't understand why your having such a hard time?


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## EliRose (Aug 12, 2012)

I am too, I've never heard of three hour beginner lessons.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

From 4:00 to anywhere from 5:30 to 6:30. It differs.

It's hard to explain. It really is.


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## apachewhitesox (Dec 9, 2010)

Well I'm sorry but it obviously isn't working if you are having unhappy lessons, whether it be unsuitable horses or he isn't actually helping you improve your skills to ride the horse. 

Your lessons shouldn't end with someone crying, I have been there it just shouldn't be that way.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Thanks Apache. For the most part, we leave happy and more knowledgable. It's just parts throughout we get frustrated. And well, we're girls. We cry when we get frustrated. c;


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Hazels said:


> he's still the reason we are the riders we are today. He has a successful teaching method and we've become such better riders because of him, ?


How long have you been taking lessons?
I understand loyalty to one teacher - I rode with one instructor for much longer than I should have. The trick is knowing when to move on.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

Hazels said:


> Thanks Apache. For the most part, we leave happy and more knowledgable. It's just parts throughout we get frustrated.* And well, we're girls. We cry when we get frustrated.* c;


That attitude isn't going to get you very far in the horse world. :lol: :wink:


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Oh, not tears of giving up. We brush them away and continue on. It's just our personalities, I suppose. 

Thank you, Dressage. I will consider that. There is a few more instructors in town, maybe we'll check them out.


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## TheRoundPen (Mar 15, 2012)

Now I just read the whole 10 pages and a question has been asked a few times. How long have you been riding? Maybe I missed it somehow, after all that is a lot of reading. To me, it does sound like an instructor problem. If he is letting his beginner students pick their own horse.. Well he just isn't smart. My personal opinion


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## Lexiie (Nov 14, 2011)

If I were you, I'd want to stick with Kelly!

But I like a challenge. 

Four years ago, I got my first horse. She was unruly and disrespectful, uncomfortable and would do whatever she pleased.

But I stuck with her. I took all the advice I could get, and guess what?
Now I have the best horse in the world who will do anything for me! She's taught me so much! I can ride almost any other horse and feel comfortable with them, because of how uncomfortable she is! Bahahah

If you feel unsafe on Kelly, than see if you can switch to another horse.
If you DO feel safe on her, stay with her!

Speak to your trainer, ask him specifically what you can do to get her to behave. Be very clear with her! I promise you, when you get on her one day, and have an amazing ride with no back-talk from her, you'll feel 100 times better than if you were to get on a smooth, well behaved horse, and have a good ride

Good luck and happy riding!


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

We've both been riding since October 2012.

Thanks for the advice, Lexi. c:


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## LisaG (Nov 11, 2012)

I just skimmed your other post about falling off the other horse. You've had a bit of a rough time (and to get over the trauma of that, my one suggestion would be to quit replaying the accident in your head, and to replace it with an image of a positive experience).

Kelly might not be a bad horse at all. But maybe, given your fall, you do need a quieter, more cooperative horse. Or maybe not. It's hard to say without actually seeing you ride the horse.

Talk to your instructor. If he can't resolve it to your satisfaction and help you rebuild your confidence (without taking away your friend's horse) maybe you do need to find a different instructor.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

I think Lisa's answer is one of the best ones yet. c:

I think she's one of the few people here that realize that I do need a quieter horse; at least for a little while. Cassidy and I will talk about it. Hopefully she will understand I want to use Gray Guy until I'm ready, then she can have him for as long as she wants him. But we'll find her a good horse to ride before we decide to switch, of course.

And I am considering trying someone else, it's just...difficult to think of riding on anyone but Virgil's horses.

^Does that sound like a better plan? c:


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## aerie (Jul 19, 2010)

Sometimes moving on to another instructor (and new horses) can be hard. But honestly this may be a great chance to overcome your insecurities and find a quiet horse that works well for you  However, if your current instructor is able to help you guys come to a riding situation that works for both you and your friend then you may not have to switch at all! The most important thing to remember in the horse world is to keep an open mind, and have fun


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## LisaG (Nov 11, 2012)

Your other post on this forum about your accident gave me a different perspective. Up until then, I was sort of the same mind as everyone else. I also didn't realize you'd only been riding since October.

You and your friend both need quiet horses that you can both feel confident on. Hopefully your instructor has horses that will work for both of you. I guess I would say just make sure she doesn't get stuck on a horse that makes her experience miserable, either.


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## nikelodeon79 (Mar 3, 2008)

The biggest point I see people trying to make is that this should not be your decision.

I'm not saying you shouldn't get a say, but your instructor needs to make the decision who rides who. That way, you aren't put in the difficult position you're currently in with your friend. If the instructor makes the decision, he gets to be "the bad guy" and your relationship with your friend and your mother doesn't have to suffer.

In other words, this isn't your responsibility and I'm sorry the lack of participation of your instructor has put you in a difficult position.

At my barn, there is a dry erase board and my trainer writes down the horse/rider pairings for each lesson. We can request certain horses, but the ultimate decision is hers, and that's the way it should be.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## nikelodeon79 (Mar 3, 2008)

Here's an example: for my last two lessons, I've been on an intermediate horse. Because I'm struggling with keeping my legs quieter when I ride, I am making the horse upset, which in turn frustrates me and makes me feel sorry for the poor horse.

My pride makes it difficult for me to request an "easier" mount, but my instructor knows that would be best. She told me she's putting me on a different horse next week, and why. It's not fair for me or the horse to keep struggling, so as an instructor she needs to make a decision that might upset someone. I might be offended at being "downgraded" to a beginner mount and the person who normally rides the horse I'll now be riding might be offended at losing her mount. 

If my instructor wasn't willing to make the decisions she knows to be right, she wouldn't be a great instructor. Both horses are safe, but one is going to help me become a better rider. It's her job to decide which one that is.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

There we go. Back on track!

Definitely find out her needs as a rider too. One thing you need to ask is what she thinks about staying at that barn with Virgil or trying something new 

You need to ask yourself and her: "Where do I want to go in my riding career?"

Can Virgil and his horses get you there? 

One reason the top riders are...well...top riders is that they dove in head first. They learned from everyone that would teach them. They rode, and learned how to ride as many horses as they could mount.

I think everyone here is exceedingly greatful for their first horses and ponies an their first instructors who helped nurture their love of the sport. Very few of us are capable of staying with the same instructor and the same horses their entire career. Riders often outgrow horses and sometimes instructors' skills are designed for certain skill levels of rider. 

Moving on or even trying a new teacher, be it horse or human, is in NO WAY a betrayal of the first. The more people and horses you learn from, the better a rider you will be.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

It's not really my job to tell my teacher how to teach. I appreciate all the responses, but there's nothing I can do about it. I'm not going to tell my teacher that he needs to choose; in the end, it's his decision. I agree that HE should pair us up, but I'm not sure what I'd say to him.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Lady-I used to be that way. Then, I fell off a horse for the first time and it really shook me up. It's difficult to want to try and tackle everything when I'm half-scared to trot a horse in the first place...I'm slowly getting over it, but it's taking time. One day I hope I can be a go-getter again, and when that time comes I will take any challenge that comes my way.


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## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

Then go to him as a student and ask. Explain your position to him and ask "Who do you think I should try today?" When you are having a problem, go to him and ask specifically "What am I doing wrong? How do I fix it?" Asking questions and taking direction is the sole responsibility of the student.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Thank you very much, I'll will try that. Good idea.


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## nikelodeon79 (Mar 3, 2008)

LadyDreamer said:


> Then go to him as a student and ask. Explain your position to him and ask "Who do you think I should try today?" When you are having a problem, go to him and ask specifically "What am I doing wrong? How do I fix it?" Asking questions and taking direction is the sole responsibility of the student.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes, this exactly.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

Teaching horses is easy. Teaching people is very difficult. You don't have to have very good verbal communication skills to train a horse. Sometimes, you have to pull the information out of the person you want to learn from. Some of the most skilled and knowledgeable people are the worst teachers. They will tell you how to do anything, but you have to ask the right questions.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

And about you confidence... Yes, that is awfully hard to get over. I am right there with you. I am a groundwork girl. I like my feet safely on the ground. When I am on the ground, I feel I can do anything. When I am in the saddle, I feel as though I have NO control. Naturally, the horse I felt the most comfortable on died. When that happened, it was over a year before I could get in the saddle again. What helped me a great deal was one of my best friends. She couldn't find anyone to go ride with her. I too love my friends dearly, and wanted to see her happy, so I dusted off my helmet and saddled up for a happy trail ride. I was so very tense, but the horse didn't kill me. I even trotted a little and didn't die. It was awesome. Every good ride should help. Think not about the little things that went wrong during the ride, but the good parts. The big one being "I did not die." Lol!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

I really like you and your advice, Lady. c: I don't think I can express how grateful I am for it.


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## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

You are welcome. I am happy to help. 

Many of us have been in your shoes. 

If you feel absolutely out of control, or utterly unsafe, have Virgil hook a long lunge rope to you. As scared as I am about riding, I am usually the first person on our babies at home. The only reason for that is my dad is right there, hooked to the horse and in complete control. If I were riding any horse and needed it, he would clip a line on the horse in a heartbeat. 

What is the John Wayne quote? "Courage is being scared to death but saddling up anyway".
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## loveduffy (Dec 22, 2011)

Lady you hit the nail on the head this is what I love about the forum everybody can get help here


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## nvr2many (Jan 18, 2011)

mudpie said:


> Whatever, here's a potato.


Viola.....


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Agreed, Love~

Omg, Nvr. Those are some sexy potatoes right there.


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## nvr2many (Jan 18, 2011)

LOL, thanks. When given lemons, make lemonade. Right?? LOL. 
Hope you get this figured out where everyone is happy! 
Keep us posted on how it goes.


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## QuarterCarolina (Dec 16, 2012)

I agree with lady as well. My first lesson with a trainer was when I was 7 years old. I was put on a 16hh horse and the trainer told me I had to learn how to fall off as my first lesson, needless to say that didn't appeal to me at 7 years old and I begged my parents to get me off the horse and take me home. My dad bought me a pony when I was 9 and I taught myself to ride. I was bucked, thrown into barbed wire, bit, kicked, and trampled by that pony. (Shetlands -__-). My dad sold her after she trampled me. I was terrified to get in the saddle let alone be on the ground with a horse. I then rode horses on ranches I worked on and bought my first horse myself when I got in high school. My first time on her back she spooked, reared and flipped over backwards with me, lucky she sort of shifted her self so that I didn't get crushed. She accidentally kicked me in the face when she got up. I was rushed to the hospital but luckily was okay. I was beyond terrified to get back in the saddle after that, but I knew I had to get over it for my love of horses. My dad put a lot of time into her and I got back on her back, she of course responded differently to me and it was difficult for me to ride her. She had broke my confidence and I knew riding her was the only thing that could help rebuild it. I certainly got frustrated with my fear of her doing that dangerous maneuver again and also with the fact that I couldn't control her, but I stuck with it and now that mare is the best horse I've ever come across. I learned a lot from her and she would run off a cliff if I asked her to. It took a lot of patience on both our ends, but we learned how to work together rather than against. I could have given up on her and rode one of the "bombproof" horses, but I needed to push forward rather than throw in the towel and in the end it paid off. Give Kelly a chance, you'll be much happier with yourself and the outcome. You just have to learn how to work with her and she will surprise you 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## faye (Oct 13, 2010)

Sorry but I'm alo going to chip in with here with the fact that I'm gettin gHUGE red flags about your instructor. I teach occasionaly and normaly on the kids own horse (so I dont get much say in what they ride), however I would never EVER end a lesson with a child in tears. If I did have the choice of horses then I would be the one choosing not the student.


Begginer lessons should NEVER be 3 hours long. Adults lose concentration after approx 40 mins, children shorter periods of time (it has been scientificly proven that your ability to learn drops dramaticly after the 40 min time). My Lessons are generaly between 45 mins and an hour depending on the number of riders. more riders means I need more time at the beggining to get every one mounted, comfortable and sorted (so lesson sceduled for an hour). 

Generaly though I give 45 min lessons as they work best and then people have a week to go away and digest all the information they have been given, think about it, mull it over, ask me for clarification etc.

Many of the horses you have described I would NOT concider as suitable for begginers, anything "unpredictable" would never be allowed into the lesson in the first place.

Heck if someone got to the point where the horse was reducing them to tears and I had no other suitable horse available then I would be getting on that horse and giving it hell untill it started behaving.


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

The horse might do fine if it were for a 45 minute lesson. Any horse is going to get extremely tired of a lesson that lasts 3 hours, especially if it is a beginner lesson. Did you ever have to sit and listen to a 3 hour lecture at school?


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

See, I can't really tell him how long his lessons should be. I mean, there's somethings I could tell him, but I don't really think this is one of them. We do end up using every second, even though for at least a half hour to an hour we're just sitting in a circle on our horses and just talking. 

Besides that, I actually like the length as it's the only time I'm around horses all week. We get a lot in and get a lot done, but we're all ready to be done when it's over.


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## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

You said your next lesson will be in three weeks right? Is that the usual stretch between lessons, or is it usually once a week? I am just curious.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## aerie (Jul 19, 2010)

I don't think you should tell him how long his lessons should be, you are right that is not your place. But could you try and explain what you do in those three hour lessons? I just want to get a better understanding of what he is having you guys all do! lol  Does her have you groom your horses, tack them up? What is the general schedule of a lesson. I know things are going to change lesson to lesson but what stays the same for the most part? Just wondering :-D


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## LisaG (Nov 11, 2012)

Regardless of everyone's opinion on your instructor, I think it's only fair that you talk to him about your issues. I'm sure the people here who teach lessons would like to have the same courtesy from their students before their students switched instructors (though I'm not sure anyone/everyone is actually suggesting you just switch immediately).

I think your instinct to avoid telling him how to do his job is right. I would just talk about the problems you're having with Kelly, etc.. etc... and see what solutions he comes up with. 

If, after some time, his solutions don't work for you, I think you'd be justified in finding a different instructor.


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## aerie (Jul 19, 2010)

LisaG said:


> If, after some time, his solutions don't work for you, I think you'd be justified in finding a different instructor.


This  I think you should definately give this guy a chance to help you, maybe he just hasn't clued in to the issues you are having. The only way he will know is if you talk to him (politely of course as I am sure you will do ) Although if he is unable/unwilling to help you with the situation then it is probably time to move on. He may be a great instructor, but maybe not the one for you. But as LisaG said, you should give him the chance to help you, your friend, and your mother.


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Lesson schedule-

Arrive at 4:00.
Get ready and grab our stuff, done in five minutes or so.
Help tack up and groom all three to four horses, done in 20 minutes.
Get on, do exercises and walk our horses around a bit. We can get that done in 15 minutes.
Begin actual lesson by walking around the arena, turning circles, stopping and backing up. 30 minutes-ish.
Do whatever the lesson was that day. 25-30 minutes.
Sit around talking for 15 minutes or so, but the time really differs on this one.
Dismount, help take off horse tack and thank Virgil. Usually this only takes ten minutes.

Therefor, the lesson usually ends at around 6:10.

We have lessons every week, but this month we have to wait three weeks. My mom is leaving for DC and there's no one to take us.

@Everyone: Thanks again, I'll consider a lot of it~ <3 If we all decide it's right, we will try to find another instructor.


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## BennysLace (May 9, 2010)

Ok, heres what I would think about. Lets say your mom bought you a horse(not a suggestion at all) and your horse started acting like Kelly would you give up on her? Would you dump her? No (atleast I'd hope not) you would want to make your partnership as good as possible and work on the issues. Do that with Kelly, you may find she is the best horse at the barn. Oh and think how good you will look when(because you will do it if you put everything into it) you show everyone how awesome your mount is.


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## EvilHorseOfDoom (Jun 17, 2012)

BennysLace said:


> Ok, heres what I would think about. Lets say your mom bought you a horse(not a suggestion at all) and your horse started acting like Kelly would you give up on her? Would you dump her? No (atleast I'd hope not) you would want to make your partnership as good as possible and work on the issues. Do that with Kelly, you may find she is the best horse at the barn. Oh and think how good you will look when(because you will do it if you put everything into it) you show everyone how awesome your mount is.


Yup, for me there's nothing more motivating than people saying "Oh, that horse is so difficult/unpredictable/stubborn" or "Why not just sell him and get something fun to ride?" - got that second one a lot with Brock. There were many times when I'd be found having a good cry in the tackroom after a bad session. But the more people said "you just don't seem to be having fun" or "wouldn't you like a horse that's ready to compete?", the more determined I became to overcome the problems. I knew I wasn't overfaced with him, it was just such a wide range of problems and the lazy bit of me just wanted to hop on and ride like I would on a finished horse, and concentrate on my riding. 

But riding Brock did more for my riding skills than any lesson horse ever did - my seat is 1000% better, my confidence is sky-high and I've learned a lot of patience and how to problem-solve on the go. No well-behaved push-button horse could have ever taught me that stuff. And people saw me ride and remembered what he was like when I first got him, and remarked that we'd come a long way. That was nice, but the best feeling came from when I'd realise we'd just done something without even thinking that we couldn't do at all 3-6 months before. That was real payoff for all the blood, sweat, dirt, tears, bruises and replacement helmets.

Keep persevering with Kelly (if you can't change instructors) - but do try and ride Gray Guy occasionally, even if it means getting a separate additional lesson. It's sometimes good to check your progress on an easier horse, and I think you'll quickly find as you progress with Kelly that riding horses like Gray Guy is pretty boring (no offence to them - they have an important job!). I can't even go on a trail or hack anymore without asking for a horse with spooking/bolting issues - I need _something_ to keep me entertained :lol: and you will too. Just keep reminding yourself you'll be a much better rider at the end of it all, and tick off each thing you can do with Kelly as you do them (start off with simple stuff like "an energetic walk" or "cantering" but then move onto more difficult stuff like "canter at the first ask", "halt with seat only", "well-shaped small circle at trot" etc). It's a great way to feel like you're actually getting somewhere!


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

Hey guys. Again, I appreciate the responses.

I actually created another thread similar to the topic of this own, read it maybe? <3

http://www.horseforum.com/rider-wellness/scared-speed-152406/#post1878632

Thanks!


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## Hazels (Jun 23, 2012)

I hate to dig up old posts, but I need to. I'm just here to report that I have not been on Gray Guy since I wrote this thread, and by sticking with Kelly, have conquered my biggest goal since I began this journey. Cassidy quit the second it started getting hard and I have realized I can do things without her, whether I like it at first or not. I actually enjoy it more without her since it's just me, my mother and a newer student and I couldn't feel better! I LOVE Kelly now and I'm so glad you all influenced me, because I've made one of the most fabulous decisions I ever have! While I didn't agree with all of you at first, I realize most of you had really valid tips and pointers and so many of you were directing me in the right way.
I went up a large, steep hill today and I could not imagine doing it on any other horse besides her.
Thank you all,
-Hazels


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## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

Rock on sister! Love to hear it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## countrylove (Oct 18, 2012)

Yay!! Congrats!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EliRose (Aug 12, 2012)

Good job!


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## nvr2many (Jan 18, 2011)

Awesome!


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## ElaineLighten (Jan 1, 2012)

Ok ignore this post I just read your update


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## Roadyy (Feb 9, 2013)

I liked a post on the first page that had to do with you sticking with Kelly before realizing it was made back in Jan. lol


Glad it worked out and hope you continue to grow as a rider and horse lover.


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## apachiedragon (Apr 19, 2008)

Way to go!


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## aerie (Jul 19, 2010)

Get it girl! Can't wait to hear about all of your adventures with Kelly! Pictures?


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## eventing13 (Oct 31, 2012)

If you had Grey Guy first, I think you should talk with the trainer about it. If you feel so confident on this horse, talk to your friend and trainer and work something out.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

Eventing, the issue has been resolved. Did you see her update?


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## Roadyy (Feb 9, 2013)

Doesn't appear that they got past the first page with that response.


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