# Foaming in the Mouth



## Equinebrium (Dec 24, 2019)

What is the foam that comes out of the horse's mouth? Why do they do it? It is "good" or "bad" or just a thing that sometimes does or does not happen? I am getting a lot of mixed, conflicted answers about it.

Some say that if a horse foams, it is good because the horse is "on the bit" (or "in the bridle") and accepting contact, working "back to front."
Some say that is a horse foams, it is bad because it is not "natural", that normally the horse would and should swallow the extra saliva - that the horse has a "locked jaw" and is stiff.
Some say the if a horse foams, it means that they have mouth problems.

Some say that if a horse doesn't foam, it means that the horse is "stiff" and "evading" contact.
Some say that if a horse doesn't foam, it "just cause".

Why do some horses foam and others don't? Why do some horses foam in a bit but not bitless? Why do some horses not foam in a bit but foam bitless? What about a horse that never foams or always foams? What does it mean?

How much foam? Some say a just a little "lipstick". Some say they want it a little dripping. Some say they want a rabid, covered-in-foam horse.

Opinions?


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## AtokaGhosthorse (Oct 17, 2016)

If a horse is foaming - something ain't right, IMO. No idea why anyone would WANT a horse to foam at all.


I can tell you some foam because of the material a bit is made of... specifically aluminum. Because it tastes nasty and their mouths dry out.


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## boots (Jan 16, 2012)

Some trainers like to see a little foam. Means the mouth is moist, not dry.

I know one who puts a little honey on the bit before riding.

I don't think it's always indicative of misery. I would consider the overall picture.


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## AtokaGhosthorse (Oct 17, 2016)

boots said:


> Some trainers like to see a little foam. Means the mouth is moist, not dry.
> 
> I know one who puts a little honey on the bit before riding.
> 
> I don't think it's always indicative of misery. I would consider the overall picture.



A little foam, when put this way, makes sense. I thank you for that nugget of information.



I get a little alarmed at anyone who wants a horse foaming like a rabid animal though... I mean... WHY? Is there a reason for that that I don't know? And I know I don't know a lot, so, I'm here to openly receive and process any information you have on that one.


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## Acadianartist (Apr 21, 2015)

I don't know who you're talking about when you use the expression "some say" because I've never heard any of those things. All I can say is that I've observed individual Friesians and Canadians do it systematically. Like some breeds of dogs that drool a lot, some horses seem prone to foaming at the mouth, and these specific horses did it all the time, even when ridden lightly (my daughter rode a Friesian for a summer when she was about 9 and there are a couple of Canadians at her coach's barn, though only one foams). So I wouldn't put too much stock in what it means.


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## Equinebrium (Dec 24, 2019)

Acadianartist said:


> I don't know who you're talking about when you use the expression "some say" because I've never heard any of those things.


Want me to link the videos/articles/posts?


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## Caledonian (Nov 27, 2016)

A little foam is okay, it shows that they're accepting the bit and relaxed. 

Excessive foam can mean that the horse can't swallow, as it's tense through it's jaw and body, is wearing a tight noseband, and/or has difficulty with a bit(s),

Of course no foam can equally mean tension.

It depends on the horse and how well it copes with being ridden.


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## ApuetsoT (Aug 22, 2014)

I like lipstick, doesn't even have to be the full mouth(but even on each side). It shows a mobile and relaxed mouth. They aren't stuck and tight through the jaw.


No foam doesn't mean they aren't those things, some wont foam up the same as others. Likely some individual saliva production that plays into it.


Too much foam, they are working the bit too much. Too active of a mouth. Chomping, pushing the tongue around. Tight, tense.


Just saliva, not foaming, they can't swallow effectively.


My horse does not get lipstick easily, so I know if he has some at the end of the ride, we had a really good ride.


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## LoriF (Apr 3, 2015)

So I'm going to assume that you are talking about when riding. Not when they are expectant of their food like my mare does.








Or, they have a twig stuck in their mouth, or choking, or rabies.

Apparently the common thought is that when they are foaming in the mouth when working (bit or no bit) they are posturing themselves correctly, relaxed in the poll and mouth, soft and supple. This stimulates the salivary glands. When moving rigidly and stiff it inhibits the salivary glands


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## LoriF (Apr 3, 2015)

I went to look further into and if they are not foaming, it doesn't necessarily mean that they are not working properly either. I guess some horses drool more than others.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

About the only time my horse foams is when he is chewing grass while we ride. I've seen Cowboy foam a little when ridden by someone with too-active hands. No foam is standard for just about every horse I've met. Apart from eating.

Don't believe for a moment that a dry mouth means tension.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

This question has come up before - I think I've brought it up once myself - and it seems to me there's just no real evidence for the theory that 'lipstick' = relaxed mouth/working 'on the bit'. There's just what people say, I suppose from seeing it when they think the horse is working well. Are there any studies done on it that people know of??

I am NOT discounting that it _may_ be true, but I think, from what I've seen & read(nothing of any studies that may exist), at best, it's irrelevant(a little bit of saliva, not heaps) & may not signify anything in some horses - it's not _necessarily_ problematic. 

But IME it signifies distractedness/discomfort with the bit in others(most?) Granted I don't do dressage but I have trained many horses to the bit and to me, a 'busy mouth' means I haven't taken enough care to desensitise the horse to just wearing the bit. Or it's uncomfortable or too tight. Or the rider is being too 'heavy' or confusing... 



> Too much foam, they are working the bit too much. Too active of a mouth. Chomping, pushing the tongue around. Tight, tense.


Without more facts on the hows & whys - as in proper studies - who's to really say what's OK & what's 'too much'? It can only be subjective, opinion only IM... O. 

LoriF, you said that (common thought is) that a horse working well, either bitted or bitless will foam at the mouth if it is 'posturing correctly'. I have never seen a bitless horse foam at the mouth, though I've seen some beautiful bitless/bridleless dressage. Seems to me it's solely a 'thing' in bitted horses. And perhaps only 'English' ridden ones at that. Granted, have seen very little 'cowboy dressage' but I don't recall seeing it in Western horses, or for that matter our (non English ridden) Aussie ones. 

I've also not heard of it being breed related Acadian. I know a few Friesians, including one who does beautiful dressage, both bitted & bridleless, and he doesn't foam or move his mouth at all.



> Just saliva, not foaming, they can't swallow effectively.


Never heard that one before. I don't really understand what you mean by it or how it can make sense - foam IS saliva. Just more of it, mixed with air from a 'busy mouth'.

So, the theories of... Shows they're relaxed & not 'stuck'. No foam equals tension. If there's foam at the end of a ride you know you had a good ride, etc... Again, I hear people say they believe this, but WHY do you believe it? What are you basing your reason on? I just don't see any real reasoning behind the theory. So I don't buy it. As said, not discounting that there may be evidence to show otherwise, but with my current knowledge, it doesn't make sense to me.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

bsms said:


> Don't believe for a moment that a dry mouth means tension.


And for that matter, when is a 'dry mouth' actually dry?? I'd say that could signify a medical/dehydration prob rather than a training one.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Equinebrium said:


> Want me to link the videos/articles/posts?


If the sources you're talking about have any real evidence, rather than just someone stating they like it & they believe... yeah, that might give us something to consider.


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## ApuetsoT (Aug 22, 2014)

I don't think no foam equals a tense mount, but it's an indicator for a horse who would otherwise give you some. You can have a perfectly relaxed, supple mouth with zero foam if that's what that horse gives you. They will move the bit a certain amount on their own when they are relaxed, type of bit cheek/mouth is likely a factor here too, and that motion will create the foaming. Opposite is also valid. A horse who normally foams very little might have the same amount as another one when they are tense. You could say it's not the presence or absence of foam by itself that dictates anything, but it adds colour to the picture.



I don't think there is much for studies, as with most horse topics. I looked briefly, but didn't see much.


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## Cedar & Salty (Jul 6, 2018)

Honestly, I think it is something that varies from horse to horse. One of ours (Hoot), foams a lot, even with the bit he likes best. The other three foam very little. I don't think it means a lot one way or another. I would hypothesize that foaming is more related to individual horses' saliva production, and less to bit preference , relaxation, or other variables,


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

ApuetsoT said:


> I don't think no foam equals a tense mount, but it's an indicator for a horse who would otherwise give you some.


Yeah but I'm interested in WHY you believe that? I can say I believe the earth's flat, cos no one's fallen off 'Down Under' lately but without any evidence, why should you believe _me_? That's what I'm getting at - not that it _necessarily_ isn't correct, but when there seems so much evidence to the contrary(as I tried to explain above), what is your reasoning for this belief? Sorry, I just don't do blind faith very well.



> Opposite is also valid. A horse who normally foams very little might have the same amount as another one when they are tense. You could say it's not the presence or absence of foam by itself that dictates anything, but it adds colour to the picture.


Is it really 'valid', in the strict sense? What _makes _it valid, that it 'adds to the picture'?

...And BTW not trying to pick on you Apuetsot, or anyone who has said 'they believe', just interested to get to the bottom of this belief & is there any grounding to it.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

What follows is speculation.

Suppose foam is a product of saliva and air mixed by movement of the bit. That would explain why saliva is uncommon in western riding since (typically) slack reins means the horse is carrying the bit and the bit is not moving around as much, mixing air and saliva.

Then a tense, resisting horse ridden 'on the bit' might be gripping the bit, with less movement and less foam. Flip side, a relaxed, willing horse on the bit might give light foam, and a horse either being given lots of bit cues (a demanding test profile) OR resisting by moving the bit around would BOTH give a lot of foam. Thus foam good or bad would depend on the individual horse and what it was doing that day and how it was performing that day.

And my horses would typically not foam at all because they pack their bit and I don't use it much. Same for a lot of western or trail riders. It would also explain why an individual horse might foam or not, depending on saliva production, lip conformation, etc.

PS: Bandit foamed some on a couple of rides using a bit with a copper roller. Then he got used to the roller, stopped playing with it, and the foam went away. That would be consistent with my theory of why foam forms.


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## Equestrian Girl 3000 (Oct 19, 2019)

I've heard that a lot of trainers think that it's just fine--even good--if a horse froths at the mouth. They say that it usually means that the horse is relaxed enough to chomp at the bit, thus mixing saliva and air and creating slobber. Like someone else said though, it depends on the horse's health, activity level, etc.


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

As all things, foam is fine in moderation. Too much of it (rabid animal level) is indicative of inability to swallow, caused by either an overtight noseband or a tongue that's stuck in place by bad bitting or bad hands. None is generally an indication of lack of acceptance of contact (which I think is why Western horses don't tend to foam - you don't ride Western on a contact, how can they accept what isn't there?).

My mare gets lipstick foam in a halter OR a bridle. So it's not solely bit-related.


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