# help 4 month old filly "wild child"



## ~* Rider in the Mist *~ (Oct 29, 2006)

As a trainer, this is a concern for me for several reasons. At this age, your foal is in a very impressionable stage. She will either learn to accept being handled with a confident and knowledgeable handler, or she will learn to evade, kick, turn her butt, etc if you continue to ignore her and not work with her through this phase.

My other concern is for you to be working with her by yourself. I do NOT recommend this. Not only because you stated she is getting too big, but because the assistance of another person when teaching a foal to halter and handle makes all the difference in the world. From your post, I did not get the feeling that you would be able to successfully accomplish your goal alone.

First what I recommend that you do is contact someone who is experienced in working with foals. Then, the two of you together should start by working with her in a small area such as a safe stall. Remove any objects in the stall for those sessions, such as water buckets, feed tubs, toys, etc. and anything that she may crash into when you work with her.

You and your other handler will have to go in confidently and slowly approach her together, working towards putting her in a corner to finally capture her. You must first decide between the two of you who will be holding her, and who will be doing the hands on work. One of you will be holding her from in front of her chest to behind her rear, and the other person will need to be from about the shoulder area to her head area in order to contral her front end.

I will honest with you, be prepared to be knocked in the teeth or nose, possibly kicked a couple times, reared up on, etc. You many even clash a few times into your handler (and have a good laugh about it later on). If there is any way for a third person to come into the picture, you can try that as well.

Keep in mind that you are NOT to chase the foal around the stall, there is no point to that. If you are chasing the foal, then the both of you are out of position and not working to "corner" her properly. If she is running around, simply park yourselves still for awhile and let her run herself down. 

I specialize in behavioral reformation, and i'm often called upon to come out to a barn with a foal who no one else can work with. I go in very prepared with another handler- and a plan. Yes I may get kicked, stomped on, bruised, etc, but I get amazing results from approaching the situation head on and not backing down. It is the intial fear and insecurities of the foal to try to flee, that is natural. Some foals have learned to many tricks that they are quite the challenge and can be dangerous, nontheless, they need the lessen just as much.

You may have good days and bad days with this foal. She may do well one day,then surprise you the next. I would make a schedule with your second handler to come and assist you on a daily basis for about two weeks to get this baby handled, halter broke, and getting her accustomed to things like basic grooming, etc. Then, work with her alone and have your handler show up every so often to reassist you and make sure your foal has been respecting her lessons....I hope this helps, let me know how things go...


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## brandig (Nov 12, 2006)

*thank you*

thanks so much for your advice!!! and you are right!! it takes 3 people to handle her. i cant do it by myself but all of my friends are terrified of her with good reason. even pros are learry of her. man she is wild!! i bought a whip which i have never touched her with it but i crake it a little and give a sound to let her know that i dont want to see that butt and she is better with that and i had stopped looking at her when she would come up to me so the charging has all but stopped thank goodness!! but if i make a move for her even really slow off she goes either turns her butt to me and i correct her or bobbs her head and pins those ears back ect which i also correct. i wish i had someone to help every day for a while that would be great!! but the people that dont work wont go near her. we still love her all the same and hope she will some around soon. she seems pretty smart the little booger!! thanks again and maybe i can bribe someone to help me and yes i dont like working with her by myself either. that makes me nervous. if she does hurt me and i cant get out,, i haven't caught her in a week or so and she is doing better now that i'm not catching her every day. i wondered if i was doing too much at one time. touching her all over. it takes her about 30 min to calm down. she will still pull away and try to move away a little of course after that time but i leave on a happy note every time. if i try to catch her i make sure i have the time to do so and make sure she is calm and not pulling ect when i let her go on her way and man she runs!! anyway i'll keep you updated . thanks again


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## ~* Rider in the Mist *~ (Oct 29, 2006)

In response to Desert Rats post, I DO NOT recommend that you stop feeding this horse for two days as a form of either forceful communication or as punishment.

It is NOT wise to stop feeding a horse for these reasons, and is not good advice to offer a person who is learning about young horses. Not only that, it is not the kind of horsemanship one should be practicing.

I certainly hope she follows the advice that I offered in my earlier post and resists the kind of advice that you have offered.

Sure the horse might come to her more willingly after two days of being starved of needed nutrition, but that is NO guarantee that this horse will do any better than before! 

It is HANDS ON TRAINING that this horse needs


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## Desert Rat (Nov 26, 2006)

Mist I don't know how long you have called yourself a trainer but in 60+ years I have saved many horses and mules from the dog food can from people with your way of thinking. If you want that colt outlawd at a young age your method will surly do it quick. You gotta get their trust and cofidence. You don't do this by a bunch of predators pushing it into a corner and bull doging it.


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## ~* Rider in the Mist *~ (Oct 29, 2006)

I have been a Quarter Horse trainer since 1987 and specialize in not only behavioral reformation, but young horses from foal to finished show horse. I see that you do not work with young horses and you also prefer to persuade horses to get near you by waiting until they are hungry enough to dare to get close (I am referring to your "advice" from your own post), yet you claim that my method of working with a young horse as soon as possible to help educate them with handling is wrong? Hmmm, this may not be your approach nor your opinion, so I will refrain from any further comment about this subject with you as I am not interested in a battle- or a waste of my time discussing it.


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

Mist - I train too. Every fall I work 2-3 weanlings at a time from the herd of a cutting/reining horse breeder. Previous to coming to me, they are not handled. I have never pushed them into kicking me. I will sit in the stall and allow them to come to me. The most agressive thing I do is leave a catch rope on if they simply do not want to be caught. When they return to the breeder they halter, lead, pick up their feet and can be touched anywhere on their body.

Desert rat - as far as the feed trick - I may stand near the feeder so they understand I brought them the feed and they learn to appreciate me. But I would never with hold feed!


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## ~* Rider in the Mist *~ (Oct 29, 2006)

Thank You Mis for having a more sensible response to my posts : )

I have also worked with cutting horses and reining horses for several years in both Georgia and Florida. Those particular lines of horses are the most well behaved, aren't they?? **smiling** they are naturally level headed and easily trained.

In this string of posts, my advice to the original poster was in response to how she described as a very unruly youngster who is not responding to the kind simplicity of just being near her as the cure to the foals behavior. The poster clearly stated other difficulties she was having with this foal.

My advice to her was geared towards the situation when a foal has gotten to the point of being difficult and playing tricks when she is in need of some handling on him. She apparently has not been able to work with this foal just from being in the stall alone, and she even stated that her other friends who wanted to help where having some trouble around her as well.

The advice I gave her was geared towards a foal on a different level because of the problems she stated. 

If you are an experienced trainer, then you know there are some very very smart foals that can out manipulate the owners. There is a point where a foal may *become* dangerous in the hands of someone who is not as experienced. Hence the reason I posted some training methods to do WITH other experienced people, NOT by herself. Out of all the babies that get handled for the first time with no fuss, no problems, no stress, etc, and are a breeze to halter break, there is one foal that eventually comes along that is not very accepting of his first time handling. Then there are the foals that were improperly handled from the start and even worse, mistreated. 

Anyway, I appreciate your input and only wanted to let the original poster know that learning to stop feeding the babies (or any horse for that matter) for any length of time to coax them into handling is not advisable from my own personal standards as a successful, considerate, and gentle trainer.


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

Hmm - level headed and easy? I wouldn't say that. Smart yes. Hot yes. Reactive yes.

Not all horses can be trained the same way. A person has to take in all of the advice and work with the horse to see what fits. There ARE horses that need more assertive handling. There are some you cannot raise your voice without causing a melt down.

Also to the OP - weanlings have very short attention spans. You need to be quick (not jerky) but accomplish something and then leave the filly alone. Does she have a herd buddy to play with? To act out her 'horse' behavior?


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## Desert Rat (Nov 26, 2006)

Mist I believe there was a misunderstanding here. Maby it was me but she said she got this colt when it was already 4 mos old. Being no older then that it has not had its mothers disaplin or confidence installed. Handleing and imprinting at birth is great if it's done right. But it must be done immediatly after birth to be efective. As to working horses and mules I prefer mules but at the present I have some of the best blood line 1/4 horses in the country in training. Skipper W Three bars, Poco, and Hancock. Sorry if I ofended you but I would rather have a colt come to me of his own free will and bonding, knowing I have something like feed that he will learn to trust me for theto give in by fear. The old days are gone when we used to crawl on them yank the blindfold and let em buck.


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## ~* Rider in the Mist *~ (Oct 29, 2006)

Ok....that was nice of you to say, yes it's been a bit of a misunderstanding....Even though we have all expressed differences in opinions, it's clear to see that we all care very much for horses in our own way, and that's great to know~~


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## sammiwhiskers2k6 (Dec 4, 2006)

0o! its like the jerry springer show on here!!  as to your question, you handle her only, if she puts her ears back... ignore her... spend lots of time grooming and doing things she likes.. if shes good... make sure u praise her! u have to learn her that being around you is fun! i no it seems like.. well in the mean time while she adapts to me.. im still going to have to put up with her off-ish-ness but hey! your still doing it. make sure the time she spends with u is better than out in the feild... u need to learn her that 'your' her mommy, not the mare in the feild  good luck!


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## child in time (Dec 4, 2006)

You first must understand that your filly is very young, other words, she is still baby and babies aren't supposed to be treated the same way that old horses are. It's very bad expirience for her that she has passed such bad thing. What they learn in their first days it's very important for whole their life. You see what I mean.... So why don't you try to let her to come over to you somewhere in pasture or paddock or box? She will anyhow get some of confidence, but It's a long process. You must work with her every day and you must give her some time. Let her to approach you and then step by step prove to her that you aren't so bad, but remember, don't force her. If you see that she don' wanna you around or she isn't comfortable, quit with what you are doing, and try again a little bit after. Tell us how is it going......

With ignorance you will put your self in a dangerous position, rather look to her what she is tellin' you.


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## brandig (Nov 12, 2006)

*tinker*

that last post is exactly what i have been doing for the past two months and we are getting right along. i think at first first of all she didn't know me there for didn't trust me and she had only seen a human right at birth then never there after until she came here. and with me messing with her right away and every day she was getting worse and worse so i talked to many people and it was about half and half. half said sure back off of her since what you are doing is not working and the other half said no that is giving her what she wants and you cant let her win. well i backed off and it took a few weeks for her to make the first move. but she is sooo much better. she doesn't totally trust me. i cant just walk up to her and pet her but she smalls me a lot and nibbles a little and has alowed me to touch her a few times but only for a second or two. i am sooo glad she is getting better!! i'll keep you all informed!!


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## kristy (Dec 8, 2006)

Brandig, 

Congats :wink: It takes time, there truely is no need to rush. I am so happy you went with a calm, easy and suttle approach. I believe if you were forceful that the incident would have been traumatic and displeasing for you both - setting you 12 steps back. I think what you chose to do was very wise. 

I am disappointed in some of the responses, really. One response being cruel and completely off the wall to the point of having to delete it - another response being completely boastful and a "I know what's right" approach. My only advice is to ask and listen. Gather as many opinions as possible about any situation you have and filter out those that you are uneasy about. Listen to gut instinct at times. Ignore those who are closed minded to other's opinions and focus only on their own. How can one learn and improve if they do not take in outside knowledge? Those who are arrogant, do not admit to their mistakes or are afraid to ask a question are the ones I am very weary of. 

I know much of this isn't directed towards you, brandig (the disappointing responses)- and I'm sorry! It seemed to take up less space on the board this way. Anyway, this was not a direct insult to any of you. I did not want to point fingers at anyone - honest. But I felt that I did need to address this somehow.


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## Skippy! (Dec 18, 2006)

Hey!

I couldn't read through this post too thoroughly, as i think some of it was a battle of opinions, but i saw a few good points being made. My two cents, is *Always End On A Good Note.* Furthermore, *Set goals, every time your goal is reached, end your training session*.

Some of your training sessions will be as simple as clipping a lead rope on her halter. This could take as long as hours, or as short as 5 minutes. Once your goal is attained, gently, GENTLY praise her. A soft hand on her neck, and a soft voice reassuring her as you unclip the lead. Slowly back out of the stall, careful not to startle her, then close the door. She will begin to learn "Hey, this ain't so bad!" and you can start expanding your goals, this time incorporating clipping the halter and leading her around her stall.

Always leave her wanting more. If she learns that turning her butt to you will get you to leave her alone, she will -ALWAYS- do it. Let her know your boss! =)

I trained a completely feral 9 year old Walking Horse mare this way. Her owner couldnt believe it. I had her from feral, to willingly and unaided being loaded into a horse trailer.

Stay patient, and dont show fear! Be bold hun!

Good luck! Keep us posted!


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## Lagartohorses (Jul 2, 2010)

We have a yearling Arabian...she used to cattle kick us and run over us. We started showing her that her actions weren't appreciated and took back being the bosses...her attitude then changed. She is a sweety...still very protective of us to other horses...but would never hurt us. At least I hope so.


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## PonderosaMiniatures (Oct 2, 2009)

Respect and trust in a round pen, work , and work, and more work you will be surprised how soon your baby wants to come up to you, and when she does, work some more....go slow it take time...soon you will be able to walk right up to her and touch her all over....stick and a string are a great training method aswell, as soon as you can touch ...rub with stick....all over...repeat and repeat and repeat...

Training little ones is a process, you can do it alone, you dont need 3 people...but you do need a smaller area, round being the best. 

Everyone is a trainer, lol ....there is no one out there , who is perfect and knows everything, all horses, have their own issues, work them on one on one basis.

You dont need to pay anyone, to come in and do it, unless you are truly uncomfortable with your baby... Im doing a 14month now, and she is coming along super nice..

Everyone has their own way of training, I like to do my one, I want then use to me, the way I want them. She will be my 2nd one, my first, living until she was 32....

Good luck, and just be patient...dont spoil, dont starve, dont trick, just be a human in charge, she will come around I promise...


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## PonderosaMiniatures (Oct 2, 2009)

Forgot to add, she is only 4 months, did they pull her from mama early? and also if she pins her ears and gives you her butt.....we run....and run, in a pen....until she gives you her eyes, then let stand and soak it in...dont ever let her be disrespectful, and give you her butt or pin ears.....she is not the boss..


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## 5cuetrain (Dec 11, 2009)

Doesn't sound to me like she is doing anything other than being a 4 month old filly. Gain control of her feet and life is sweet.

How you do that is real important. Do it right and she will have a good foundation that can be built on when she is older. Do it wrong and get the jack hammers out cause someone will have to bust out the bad foundation and build another. Costs lots of extra time and usually money.

Two choices;

1. Hire someone who can help you do it right.

2. Get Clinton's dvds on starting a youngin. Theres more risk doing it this way but if you listen and learn you can do it.

Doesn't mean that I agree with everything Clinton does but he has spent the time and effort in putting a package together that covers most of the bases for sure.


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