# Information on saddle brands



## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

Ok, well i'm looking at buying a starter saddle to ride english in. Anyways, so far i've found 2 i like. The first is the Silver Fox saddle package that horse.com sells for $169, then the 2nd is a used Derby Original. The only thing is the derby is synthetic, i love my western synthetic, but i don't know much about english ones?? Has anybody had experience with either brands, and/or english synthetic saddles? The derby is a little beat up, and i wouldn't know how to clean it since its not leather. But the price is great on it. So any input would be great, i'm still looking around, but these 2 are on the top of the list. Also, can you show in a synthetic saddle? It would only be local open shows.


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

You clean an English synthetic just as you should your western - with good ol' fashioned water and, if/when needed, mild soap.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

themacpack said:


> You clean an English synthetic just as you should your western - with good ol' fashioned water and, if/when needed, mild soap.


Well i've never had to clean my synthetic lol, if it gets some hair on it, i just use a soft brush and brush it down. But this one looks like it might have scratchs, and with anything leather i've owned, good cleaning and oiling normally takes out a lot of notice of the scratchs. Maybe thats just me though.


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## unclearthur (Feb 25, 2012)

Those Silver Fox saddles are cheap Far East/Indian manufacture. Leather's okay but trees are weak and poorly shaped and the flocking is rubbish. You get what you pay for with these, which is not a lot. Personally I wouldn't put one on my horse's back. Sorry.

Cavalrytales Blog


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

unclearthur said:


> Those Silver Fox saddles are cheap Far East/Indian manufacture. Leather's okay but trees are weak and poorly shaped and the flocking is rubbish. You get what you pay for with these, which is not a lot. Personally I wouldn't put one on my horse's back. Sorry.
> 
> Cavalrytales Blog


Alright, well thanks for the information.
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## IslandWave (Nov 25, 2009)

I would not go with a starter type saddle. It looks and sounds painful for both the rider and the horse. Not to mention that it probably will not last you very long, as the quality is usually compromised.

I would look for a used, but good quality saddle that has been well cared for. Take Stubbens for example. They can last 30-40 years, easy and are top of the line. I personally ride in a 30-ish year old County dressage saddle daily on numerous horses. It is my favorite saddle and I show it it, too.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

All the nicer name brand saddles seem to be out of my budget even used ones, which is why im looking at starter type saddles.
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## IslandWave (Nov 25, 2009)

What is your budget, if you don't mind me asking? 
I would rather ride bareback than in a cheapo starter saddle.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

Well im not going to ride bareback, that would defeat the purpose of trying to learn english. My max is $100 for just the saddle, or about $150 if it comes with everything.
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## DraftXDressage (Aug 29, 2011)

I would wait until you can afford a decent quality used saddle. The cheapy "starter package" type saddles aren't even worth their absurdly low prices.


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## iridehorses (Oct 22, 2007)

Born2ride, the starter packages are pure junk and you are wasting your money. If you only have $100 for a saddle, then you really need to wait until you can save more money for a decent used saddle. Don't be in a rush to ride English if you really can't afford to do it properly - for your sake and especially for the sake of your horse.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

DraftXDressage said:


> I would wait until you can afford a decent quality used saddle. The cheapy "starter package" type saddles aren't even worth their absurdly low prices.


Well since im going to be getting my own horse to pratice on in between lessons, I have to have my own saddle to ride in.
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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

iridehorses said:


> Born2ride, the starter packages are pure junk and you are wasting your money. If you only have $100 for a saddle, then you really need to wait until you can save more money for a decent used saddle. Don't be in a rush to ride English if you really can't afford to do it properly - for your sake and especially for the sake of your horse.


Im not exactly sure why everybody is against starting out with a cheaper saddle?? Im not looking to go pro here or anything, just need something to use to pratice riding at my house. I don't know many people who start out with a 300-500 saddle, not around where I live anyways. I'll have to talk to my instructor and see what she thinks.
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## livestoride (Mar 30, 2011)

Wintec is a good starting brand and has a changeable gullet. The resale tends to still be pricey because they withstand anything, but if you watch Craigslist and ebay you can find them closer to your budget.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

livestoride said:


> Wintec is a good starting brand and has a changeable gullet. The resale tends to still be pricey because they withstand anything, but if you watch Craigslist and ebay you can find them closer to your budget.


I watch Ebay and Craigslist daily, i've also been browsing Tacktrader, which is how i found the Derby Original.


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## IslandWave (Nov 25, 2009)

You can ride "english" in a western saddle. Or vice versa. I could ride dressage in western tack and a snaffle with a headstall made of baling twine. In fact, I used to practice my 2nd Level dressage tests on a western pleasure QH gelding with all of his western tack.

I'll go look around on Ebay for some saddle, but I will agree that your budget is limiting. I personally just would hate to sacrifice quality and the comfort of my horse for price. What seat and tree size do you need?


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## unclearthur (Feb 25, 2012)

The problem with cheap foreign saddles is they often don't fit the horse at all well. You then end up with an uncomfortable horse; not the best way to begin a new partnership. Especially because if the horse objects to the saddle this is often mistaken as 'temperament'. The horse then gets punished, increasing both its confusion and discomfort and you are at the beginning of a vicious cycle of pain and resistance. 

If you can find a cheap saddle that fits both the horse and you well, then that's fine. But they are rare beasts.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

IslandWave said:


> You can ride "english" in a western saddle. Or vice versa. I could ride dressage in western tack and a snaffle with a headstall made of baling twine. In fact, I used to practice my 2nd Level dressage tests on a western pleasure QH gelding with all of his western tack.
> 
> I'll go look around on Ebay for some saddle, but I will agree that your budget is limiting. I personally just would hate to sacrifice quality and the comfort of my horse for price. What seat and tree size do you need?


17" seat and a regular tree, i'm looking at a tb right now, so i will ask the owner what kind of saddle shes ride him in. I've seen several on ebay for bid, but i'm not to familiar with brand names. I think there was a thorowgood, i've heard that brand name before, but not sure if there a nice saddle.


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## IslandWave (Nov 25, 2009)

Born2Ride said:


> 17" seat and a regular tree, i'm looking at a tb right now, so i will ask the owner what kind of saddle shes ride him in. I've seen several on ebay for bid, but i'm not to familiar with brand names. I think there was a thorowgood, i've heard that brand name before, but not sure if there a nice saddle.


Take a look at Horse Tack Review.com - Reviews of horse tack and rider supplies! for saddle reviews.

Older Dressage saddle. Still has alot of miles left!! | eBay

BATES WINTEC black saddle 17 1/2" | eBay

Older Wintec Pro dressage saddle, size 17 with MW and M gullets | eBay

eBay - New & used electronics, cars, apparel, collectibles, sporting goods & more at low prices

CROSBY PRIX DES NATION SADDLE 16.5M ~EXCELLE PAD LEATHER+ IRONS ~ NO RESERVE | eBay

Dressage Saddle | eBay

Just a quick search. All will be better choices than a starter saddle.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

IslandWave said:


> Take a look at Horse Tack Review.com - Reviews of horse tack and rider supplies! for saddle reviews.
> 
> Older Dressage saddle. Still has alot of miles left!! | eBay
> 
> ...


I like the crosby and bates, but idk if the crosby will fit me.
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## livestoride (Mar 30, 2011)

When are you getting the horse? (Congrats by the way)

It may be worth it to just wait until you have the horse so you don't eat up your entire budget on a saddle that doesn't fit. Most used saddles in this price range don't come with a trial period, so you may end up with a saddle you need to resell quick before you can buy another one.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

livestoride said:


> When are you getting the horse? (Congrats by the way)
> 
> It may be worth it to just wait until you have the horse so you don't eat up your entire budget on a saddle that doesn't fit. Most used saddles in this price range don't come with a trial period, so you may end up with a saddle you need to resell quick before you can buy another one.


Not sure if were getting him, were going to look at him this week to see if he will be a good fit for me.
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## iridehorses (Oct 22, 2007)

B2R, I'm going to talk to you like I would my daughter ... why are you in such a hurry to buy a cheap saddle for a horse that you don't own yet?

Wait until you have a horse so that you can get the proper fit and in many cases it isn't unusual to spend more money on the saddle then the horse. A cheap saddle will have a very poor tree that is prone to breaking or may be warped. The leather is typically like cardboard due to their tanning process and resale of the saddle is nonexistent.

You are going about this the absolutely wrong way.

That is how I would tell my daughter - but I'd have a few expletives in there and would say it more forcefully then I could here.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

iridehorses said:


> B2R, I'm going to talk to you like I would my daughter ... why are you in such a hurry to buy a cheap saddle for a horse that you don't own yet?
> 
> Wait until you have a horse so that you can get the proper fit and in many cases it isn't unusual to spend more money on the saddle then the horse. A cheap saddle will have a very poor tree that is prone to breaking or may be warped. The leather is typically like cardboard due to their tanning process and resale of the saddle is nonexistent.
> 
> ...


Could you please tell me where in the heck I said I was in a hurry to buy a saddle?? I never said that, you guys asked my budget and I gave it. That's what my husband is willing to pay, I just wanted to know about these 2 saddle brands. I never said I was going to go right out and buy it. Also, if I bring him home this week and wait, say a couple months to get a saddle, that's a couple months I wont be able to ride him. I had got an arabian last year to ride english and got her before the saddle. I couldn't find one that would work for me, so I figured I could just ride her western. Well at 20yrs.old and never being rode western, she didn't respond to kindly to the western saddle. I didn't want to end up in the same situation, since I was underage at the time, my mother decided to give her to some kids for 4h use. So no, im not in a rush to ride english. I've been wanting to do it for a long time. Now me and my husband are financially secure I am able to start lessons and begin a path of english riding. But if my husband puts a cap on my budget, I have to respect that. If he can't spend $400 on a new pair of golf clubs, he's certainly not letting me spend it on a saddle.
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## iridehorses (Oct 22, 2007)

An inexpensive set of golf clubs won't hurt his hands but a cheap saddle can and will hurt your horse. You could very well end up with a horse that is acting up stemming from a poorly made saddle.

The fact that you are looking for a saddle so you can ride a horse that you don't own yet tells me you are in a hurry. I can understand the meaning of a budget but maybe you need to wait a bit more.

That is just my opinion, you can take it or leave it - but that is what way over 30 years of experience has taught me. I've done what you are doing and I'm passing along experience.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

iridehorses said:


> An inexpensive set of golf clubs won't hurt his hands but a cheap saddle can and will hurt your horse. You could very well end up with a horse that is acting up stemming from a poorly made saddle.
> 
> The fact that you are looking for a saddle so you can ride a horse that you don't own yet tells me you are in a hurry. I can understand the meaning of a budget but maybe you need to wait a bit more.
> 
> That is just my opinion, you can take it or leave it - but that is what way over 30 years of experience has taught me. I've done what you are doing and I'm passing along experience.


Im just that, looking. I haven't bought anything, i was simply looking for information on 2 saddles i was looking at to buy in the future. The owner of the horse im looking at said he isn't hard to fit and rides in a regular tree. Most of the horses i get just require a regular tree, so i've never had a problem buying a saddle then getting a horse. Also, lets say, you go to look at a horse, turns out the owners saddle wont fit you? So.. you can't ride said horse your looking at, 95% of the people i know always test a horse in there own saddle. Yes, you could borrow a saddle, but if your just starting out, not many people are going to know to many people in which are willing to trust them with there saddle. Therefor, its very common for people to buy a saddle, prior to the horse. Then if it turns out the saddle doesn't properly fit, you have 2 options. Sell, or get a correction pad for the saddle. I'm certainly not knocking your experience, i respect that. But my mom also has 30 years experience, and in her 30 years shes had no problems riding a horse in a $150 saddle. So though i understand your experience with having problems, i also know people who have not had problems. It doesn't make one of you wrong or right, everybody has had different experiences. Thats just how life works, what may have not worked for you, may work for me. You may have not found a decent saddle for cheap, but believe me, they are out there.


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## SullysRider (Feb 11, 2012)

Born2Ride said:


> Im just that, looking. I haven't bought anything, i was simply looking for information on 2 saddles i was looking at to buy in the future. The owner of the horse im looking at said he isn't hard to fit and rides in a regular tree. Most of the horses i get just require a regular tree, so i've never had a problem buying a saddle then getting a horse. Also, lets say, you go to look at a horse, turns out the owners saddle wont fit you? So.. you can't ride said horse your looking at, 95% of the people i know always test a horse in there own saddle. Yes, you could borrow a saddle, but if your just starting out, not many people are going to know to many people in which are willing to trust them with there saddle. Therefor, its very common for people to buy a saddle, prior to the horse. Then if it turns out the saddle doesn't properly fit, you have 2 options. Sell, or get a correction pad for the saddle. I'm certainly not knocking your experience, i respect that. But my mom also has 30 years experience, and in her 30 years shes had no problems riding a horse in a $150 saddle. So though i understand your experience with having problems, i also know people who have not had problems. It doesn't make one of you wrong or right, everybody has had different experiences. Thats just how life works, what may have not worked for you, may work for me. *You may have not found a decent saddle for cheap, but believe me, they are out there.*


What you just said and are looking for are two different things. They are trying to tell you that you should look for a used, at least decent saddle, if that means the saddle is older, who cares?! But you are talking about cheap, poorly made, not even worth the shipping price saddles. They are trying to tell you to slow down take your time looking and find a brand that is generally praised in the price range you are looking for, they are out there. And I have never heard of anyone using their own saddle to try a horse because no saddle fits every horse, and correction pads are not the way to go.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

SullysRider said:


> What you just said and are looking for are two different things. They are trying to tell you that you should look for a used, at least decent saddle, if that means the saddle is older, who cares?! But you are talking about cheap, poorly made, not even worth the shipping price saddles. They are trying to tell you to slow down take your time looking and find a brand that is generally praised in the price range you are looking for, they are out there. And I have never heard of anyone using their own saddle to try a horse because no saddle fits every horse, and correction pads are not the way to go.


I am looking in to nicer brands, which is why after given the input I kept looking and didn't take further interest in the other 2 saddles. Also, I myself, always bring my own saddle, because every time I've went to look at a horse they ask "did you bring your own saddle"? Also correction pads were designed to help fit the saddle properly. It may not be the way you go, but several people do. Like I said, everybody has there own experiences. These just happen to be mine.
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## DraftXDressage (Aug 29, 2011)

Born2Ride said:


> Im just that, looking. I haven't bought anything, i was simply looking for information on 2 saddles i was looking at to buy in the future. The owner of the horse im looking at said he isn't hard to fit and rides in a regular tree. *Most of the horses i get just require a regular tree, so i've never had a problem buying a saddle then getting a horse.* Also, lets say, you go to look at a horse, turns out the owners saddle wont fit you? So.. you can't ride said horse your looking at, 95% of the people i know always test a horse in there own saddle. Yes, you could borrow a saddle, but if your just starting out, not many people are going to know to many people in which are willing to trust them with there saddle. Therefor, its very common for people to buy a saddle, prior to the horse. Then if it turns out the saddle doesn't properly fit, you have 2 options. Sell, or get a correction pad for the saddle. I'm certainly not knocking your experience, i respect that. But my mom also has 30 years experience, and in her 30 years shes had no problems riding a horse in a $150 saddle. So though i understand your experience with having problems, i also know people who have not had problems. It doesn't make one of you wrong or right, everybody has had different experiences. Thats just how life works, what may have not worked for you, may work for me. You may have not found a decent saddle for cheap, but believe me, they are out there.


If you think it's as simple as "This horse takes a 'regular' tree (regardless of the fact that regular/medium/standard means different things to different saddle makers)," then your first step should be to learn more about how to properly fit a saddle.

I am also willing to bet that the Arab mare didn't object to your western saddle because it was western, but rather because it didn't fit her.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

DraftXDressage said:


> If you think it's as simple as "This horse takes a 'regular' tree (regardless of the fact that regular/medium/standard means different things to different saddle makers)," then your first step should be to learn more about how to properly fit a saddle.
> 
> I am also willing to bet that the Arab mare didn't object to your western saddle because it was western, but rather because it didn't fit her.


It is possible it didn't fit her, but I didn't have the chance to find out, since my mom rehomed her. We got her for english, she wasn't being rode for english, and as soon as we put the western saddle on and went to cinch she wasn't having it. I've rode 1 saddle on multipule horses, then when I got my twh I sold my saddle for something more fitted to us both with a rounded skirt (which I was adviced to get from a twh breeder).. It was a $75 synthetic, don't know the brand name, and it fits her back fine. When I wrote the owner of tb, that's exactly what she told me "regular" tree then she listed the brand names of the saddles he's been rode in. So im obviously not the only one who uses that word.

Im also going to be working with an instructor and im sure she will be able to help me fit a saddle. Im not sure how all this got wayy off topic. I simply wanted to know if silver fox and derby were any good. There obviously not, there off my list, im moving on to other brands. Im being rediculed for something I never even purchased, im looking at better brand names, while still remaining in a good budget for myself. Im going off the knowledge I've been given from my parents and from when we use to board. I welcome advice, but making me feel like backyard trash because I can't afford $400 or so dollars, isn't helpful. More like hurtful. Im getting the help from the tbs owner who is a h/j trainer, and also my own instructor. All I asked was are these 2 brands ok, and can you show in a synthetic saddle. Then I got told I shouldn't even ride english until I can properly afford it. Im just looking at saddles at a decent price! That there, is telling me, I will not find a good saddle for a low price. Which is bologny. Ive so far seen stubben, crump, crosby and wintecs going for $200-$250. So im sure I can stay within a decent budget, and still get a good saddle.
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## DraftXDressage (Aug 29, 2011)

No one wants to make you feel like "backyard trash." Believe me, I am facing a problem of buying a fifth new saddle for my shape-shifting mare in under three years, so I know pain of budgeting and hunting for an appropriately fitting saddle all too well.

You can absolutely find a good USED saddle on a budget, but the fact of the matter is that you're not going to be able to find something suitable and sound for $100. People aren't trying to be elitist snobs when they tell you that you would be better off not riding English until you can afford something other than the junk brands that are being discussed here. People are speaking from experience with the giant chasm of quality between these started package saddles and decent used saddles that you can pick up for just a $100 or so more. And, in the interest of full disclosure, I got suckered into buying a "starter package" once too. And you know what? It was cheap junk that never fit a single horse I set it on (or any rider who ever sat in it, for that matter), and I ended up selling it basically still brand new for like a third of what I paid for it. I literally found staples securing the leather in the gullet. People are not being flippant or exaggerating when they say that these saddles are not even worth the cost of shipping.

I also wasn't ridiculing you for your use of the term "regular" to describe a tree size. Plenty of saddle makers use that term. The point that I'm trying to make is that, depending on what brand of saddle (and sometimes even what model of saddle within the same brand) you're looking at, regular (or medium, or standard, or some centimeter measurement) trees will fit differently. Some will fit the horse, some will not. That's why people are telling you that just buying a medium tree saddle and assuming it will fit is not the way to go.

I understand that you're just looking and gathering opinions right now. That's a really good thing to be doing. I would just strongly, strongly urge you not to do anything until you actually have the horse picked out.


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## freia (Nov 3, 2011)

I've been watching eBay for the past couple of weeks, helping a friend look for an inexpensive, good, used saddle. I've seen several excellent saddles go for between $100-$200. Not many go for that price, but it does happen. You have to watch and be a clever bidder. These would be Passiers, Courbettes, Stubbens, Crosby, Crumps... The Wintecs and Thorowgoods seem to never get down in the $100-200 range.
Can you borrow a saddle for a little while, so you can save up and get a good, used saddle? I didn't read all the replies. I don't know if somebody mentioned that the cheap starter packages don't often put you in a good position, which really doesn't help you learn to ride english. You'd be learning wrong. A good saddle usually helps put you into the right position.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

Im not buying anything yet, just looking so I make sure this time I can atleast make sure there's going to be a selection of good saddles in my price range. It seems like you always find things when you don't have the money, but as soon as you do, you can never find what your looking for. I have been checking tacktrader, craigslist and ebay daily. I've found some decent saddles, but im not buying anything right now. I really like the look of wintecs, and I heard the interchangable gullets are awesome. I found one on tacktrader for I think 250 and it had CAIR panels.
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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Look on horsclicks there are lots of nice reasonable used saddles


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

churumbeque said:


> Look on horsclicks there are lots of nice reasonable used saddles


I've been on there, but for some reason the site doesn't work on my laptop :/. It doesn't want to load, but it works fine on my moms desktop lol.
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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

What about Thorowgood? Thorowgood England English Saddle Complete for sale in :: HorseClicks << that saddle just looks realllyyy comfortable lol.


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## DraftXDressage (Aug 29, 2011)

Thorowgoods are my favorite of the synthetic saddles. I personally like the way they're made and how they're balanced better than Wintecs. Some of the newer models also have the adjustable gullets, if you think that's something that might come in handy for you in the future. The flip side of that is that the newer models resell used at pretty high price points because they're quite popular.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

DraftXDressage said:


> Thorowgoods are my favorite of the synthetic saddles. I personally like the way they're made and how they're balanced better than Wintecs. Some of the newer models also have the adjustable gullets, if you think that's something that might come in handy for you in the future. The flip side of that is that the newer models resell used at pretty high price points because they're quite popular.


Hmm, I didn't know the newer ones had the adjustable gullet. I've seen a couple for sale, they look really comfortable. I wasn't sure the quailty of them, since I haven't heard of them much, unlike wintec which seems pretty popular.
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## DraftXDressage (Aug 29, 2011)

I think you hear less about Thorowgoods because there just aren't as many of them sold in the States. They're made by an English saddlery that also makes Kent and Masters and another higher end saddle line. Sort of like Bates and Wintec.


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

DraftXDressage said:


> I think you hear less about Thorowgoods because there just aren't as many of them sold in the States. They're made by an English saddlery that also makes Kent and Masters and another higher end saddle line. Sort of like Bates and Wintec.


Oh ok, well im going to keep browsing a little. I was going to bump up my budget because I thought I had my rabbitry sold (I have mini rexs). But the lady just text me tonight saying she's not coming in the morning to get them . Grr, oh well, I just hate when people back out of a deal at the last moment.
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## SullysRider (Feb 11, 2012)

Good luck with your search! And remember deals are out there!


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## Born2Ride (Apr 13, 2011)

SullysRider said:


> Good luck with your search! And remember deals are out there!


Thanks, i agree, im just waiting to strike gold lol.


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## bigbaboo (Mar 7, 2012)

*Starter Saddle*

I'm a saddlefitter, and I agree that both of your saddle options aren't very good choices, both from your horse's perspective and your comfort. I think you would be better off if you wait a bit and find something that costs a bit more but would be more suitable. You can find nice used older style Crosby or Stubben saddles quite inexpensively on eBay or other used equipment websites, and it would be a better option for you. Or if you wanted to try synthetic, used Wintecs are quite inexpensive as well and work well for many horses, and are available in several styles. I have seen a couple of Rivella saddles recently for about $300 in excellent condition, and they are also nice.


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## unclearthur (Feb 25, 2012)

Just for info - the Thorowgood saddles with adjustable gullet are suffixed '3D'. The previous T4 and T6 models (without the suffix), with various tree shapes, were downsizable by 1/2 and 1 tree width using a system Thorowgood called 'Fish', basically plastic inserts which slid into pockets beneath the tree points. These enabled you to buy a Wide tree and convert it to a Medium Wide or a Medium. Prior to this the saddles were fixed-width. 

So you're likely to find a mix of the three types, depending on age, when looking at used saddles.

Cavalrytales Blog


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## CattanWolf (Dec 28, 2010)

as a few people have said, you can get an old, decently cared for saddle for virtually nothing these days. I have one that came with a retired eventer, it's 40 years old and still the most comfortable thing I've sat on that doesn't have a 1000$ price tag attached. 
I'm not sure what's available in america but I found about 10 of these old saddles in a 2nd hand online tack shop in the UK, they were around £50. You may find it cheaper to just get something like that shipped because even new synthetic english saddles aren't worth bothering with.


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