# Do Paint horses move differently than Quarters?



## Tha Horse Slave (Dec 9, 2009)

I recently heard an interesting topic of discussion. I heard from several local horsepeople that a Paint horse moves differently and runs differently than a Quarter horse. I wondered if it were true.
I recently bought a registered paint horse and was wondering why she moves different in the hindquarters. I attributed it to lack of muscling and a slightly goosey rumped conformation along with poor balance and coordination being as that she is 5 and green broke. I have always had quarter horses and am wondering if this is true that Paint horses move different. Some people won't even run their paints against quarters in barrel races around here due to this difference in gait. Would be interested in hearing what other people think on this moving subject.


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## TwisterRush (Sep 8, 2009)

personally yes, i think that they do move different.
All breed's move different probably.
But i find that my dad's Paint, has a smoother gait compared to my dad's QH.
But i dont see why some people wouldnt want their paints up against a QH?
I dont know.. i think ill leave this to other people.


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## Unwoven (Jul 28, 2009)

I don't know about that... but my paint has LOVELY movement..
I've been told by many people he can be a great dressage horse and jumper. :] So if I paint can do that.. no problems there!


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## Painted Hotrod (Dec 3, 2009)

Well, just my opinion, but..
A Paint is just a Quarter with all kinds of different markings.

But, they may move differently.
My Paint moves like a Quarter.
Every horse has a different movement.
Like the personality of a horse. :wink:


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## mayfieldk (Mar 5, 2008)

This is utter nonsense. They have no 'difference in gait'. Some pleasure horses are bred to move slow and soft, barrel racers tend to be quick and sometimes choppy, but a western pleasure QH and paint move the same--just like a barrel QH and Paint run the same.

Take it from me--I went to equine school for western events and they had over 300 QHs and Paints there--I've seen a lot.


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## sillybunny11486 (Oct 2, 2009)

They certainly could have difference in gait, depending upon their breeding. 

But most paints are qh bred, close in the lines, so there shouldnt be a big difference btwn a stock horse build paint and a qh. My paint moves alot like a qh, and my 3/4 qh moves alot like a tb. Even inside the qh breed, some horses move like wp horses, while other like dressage horses naturally.


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## Vidaloco (Sep 14, 2007)

It pretty much comes down to conformation. There is a way to tell how a horse will move (at least gaited ones :wink by comparing the angles between the point of hip, stifle, point of pelvis in the rear and top of shoulder, elbow, point of shoulder in the front and a bunch of other complicated angles. I'm sure it holds true in all horses as to whether they will have a smooth or choppy trot etc.

Here's a book excerpt that explains what I mean- http://books.google.com/books?id=KLIaaLMrp4QC&pg=PA41&lpg=PA41&dq=gait++point+of+hip+stifle&source=bl&ots=FT26Bf7i-L&sig=qbMXYfb2Xv1Z81fo6AVVvQAT-bg&hl=en&ei=9IIyS5K4BtXVlAem0ryqBw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=10&ved=0CDUQ6AEwCQ#v=onepage&q=gait%20%20point%20of%20hip%20stifle&f=false


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## westonsma (May 19, 2009)

No, not all of them will move differently. The only difference between the QH and the paint is that APHA allows a mixture of QH and TB, so depending on what the lineage is and how the horse is built, they may or may not move differently. There are some that are tall and lean, more like a TB, and there are some that are short and stocky, like a QH. There are three different builds in a QH category too, the short and stocky, built like a brickhouse; the slim, athletic "appendix" build, like a running machine; and the big, huge, body-builder type. QHs can range anywhere from 14-16hh, maybe even taller. I know of three types of TB too, those that are heavier boned, built for calvary use (That's the type they use in NY for the mounted patrol); the lighter boned, racing type; and the uphill built, made for jumping. So, all in all, paints can be any mixture of that, and yes, will most likely move differently, but that just depends on what their mixture is.


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## QHDragon (Mar 6, 2009)

Eh, I have to disagree. I think your mare is "moving differently" because of all the things you just listed. IMHO paints are just QHs with spots. A lot of the breeding is the same as QHs in the modern paint horses.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

Agree with the majority of posters. All stock horses, QH, Appy, Paint use the same mechanics when moving and thus the same gaits. They all trot but none of them pace or rack or tolt. They use standard gaits that have the same footfall pattern. Each individual will travel just a little bit different depending on their lineage and their conformation but it has nothing to do with breed. All 3 breeds are pretty much identical in regards to build and conformation because there has been so much crossbreeding. The only difference is color patterning.

Your mare is gorgeous by the way.


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## Eastowest (Mar 26, 2009)

_>>>> Agree with the majority of posters. All stock horses, QH, Appy, Paint use the same mechanics when moving and thus the same gaits. They all trot but none of them pace or rack or tolt. _

Gotta disagree. All of the aforementioned breeds CAN be very similarily bred and as such, MANY move the same way, however, especially in Appaloosas, there are a few older bloodlines that have not had much if any QH influence, and horses from these lines are usually more warmblood-type moving-- bigger, rounder, loftier, more elastic gaits. 

There are also DEFINITELY gaited Appaloosas-- I owned 2 mares that had intermediate four-beat gaits, one did what a foxtrot trainer/breeder told me was as close to a foxtrot as she had ever seen in a horse who wasn't a MFT, the other mare "racked" in her opinion. 

This is not a huge surprise-- after all, Appaloosas share the same early American and Spanish roots as the gaited breeds developed here, and in fact the ApHC allowed crossing to TWH, Saddlebred, Morgan, and Standardbred (as well as allowing unknown breeding) for the first several decades of the registry's existence. ApHC was founded in 1938, and until 1973 allowed TWH blood and it was up into the 1980's for the other breeds. 

There are even ranches that are specifically collecting and breeding registerted Appaloosas with a 4-beat gait-- gaitedness being commonly and broadly referred to in Appaloosas as the "Indian Shuffle".

FWIW I have also ridden an appendix QH mare who had a 4 beat gait, and a paint gelding who "ambled"-- but this was much more unusual/unexpected considering their bloodlines, and in the case of the Paint's breeder, they were horrified, because he was bred to be a halter and all-around westwern horse and they couldn't keep him in a jog-- he would fall into that 4 beat gait unless they pushed him into a long fast trot.


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## mayfieldk (Mar 5, 2008)

Any horse can be gaited; no two horses usually move exactly the same.

But if you spray painted two horses black and watched them move, you wouldn't be able to tell which was the QH and which was the Paint. There is no _breed characteristic_ that makes them move different.


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## Vidaloco (Sep 14, 2007)

Eastowest said:


> _>>>> Agree with the majority of posters. All stock horses, QH, Appy, Paint use the same mechanics when moving and thus the same gaits. They all trot but none of them pace or rack or tolt. _
> 
> Gotta disagree. All of the aforementioned breeds CAN be very similarly bred and as such, MANY move the same way, however, especially in Appaloosas, there are a few older bloodlines that have not had much if any QH influence, and horses from these lines are usually more warmblood-type moving-- bigger, rounder, loftier, more elastic gaits.
> 
> ...


That's what I wondered, wouldn't any horse with old early American lineage have the Spanish mustang easy gaited breeding in them? I have heard stories about cavalrymen and cowboys choosing the wild mustangs that showed these characteristics from the herds brought in for sale because they would be easier to ride for long marches or cattle drives. Those are all in the QH and paint horses. Although through years of selective breeding its not as noticeable. 
I stand by my conformation is key comment :lol:


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## Eastowest (Mar 26, 2009)

_>>>That's what I wondered, wouldn't any horse with old early American lineage have the Spanish mustang easy gaited breeding in them?_

To a certain extent, yes, there are some Spanish roots in American-developed breeds--breeds developed here in America might also have some shared gaited ancestry through the Naragansett Pacer, the Breton, and etc. 

However, there is generally a huge amount of Thoroughbred influence in the pedigrees of Quarter Horses and other stock breeds such as Paints and Appaloosas (not all lines of course, but there are many shared lines among them) and it has been generations deep-- in fact some horses registered with the fledgling AQHA were pretty much all TB. So the gaitedness in horses with the more TB-influenced lines is more sparse, and many generations back, if its there at all, and IMO is not likely to pop back up very often.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

Hmm, I didn't think about that, eastowest. All of the appys that I have ever been around were heavily QH influenced. I didn't even consider that some of the foundation appys were from spanish roots and I wasn't aware that they registered gaited crossbreeds for a while. Learn something new every day.


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## AQHA13 (Apr 19, 2017)

uhh.. most likely not, however it is possible because a paint is a Quarter Horse OR throughbred with markings. Maybe if the paint had more TB breeding then it could have a longer stride but that would not be definite... For the most part the two breeds are built very similarly and it doesn't change that gaits at all, just how big of a stride ect. that they take. You said that some people wouldn't race their paints against QH's but I think it's their way of trying to improve the odds of them winning.


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## irydehorses4lyfe (Sep 8, 2009)

mayfieldk said:


> This is utter nonsense. They have no 'difference in gait'. Some pleasure horses are bred to move slow and soft, barrel racers tend to be quick and sometimes choppy, but a western pleasure QH and paint move the same--just like a barrel QH and Paint run the same.


I must agree with you. I've ridden numerous Paints and Quarter Horses and the only difference I have known in the feel of the gaits, was that some were trained in Western Pleasure; thus have what I would call, a fake canter, as I am not a Western Pleasure person and personally do not enjoy riding horses who are trained in such. So to me it felt like the canter was 100% different than most horses I've ridden who haven't been trained in a specific discipline, if anything, were trained English, and trained to have full body movement and extension. 
So the feel may be different, and allowing the rider to possibly think that the gaits are different, when really it may just be in the training, and bloodlines and conformation that make for the ranges of moment to differ.


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## Attitude05 (Nov 11, 2009)

*i agree with mayfieldk, no two horses are exactly the same, so therefore no two horses will move exactly the same. becaus epaints and qh's, like everyone said, have all the same bloodlinage etc. they are very SIMILAR in build and conf, so therefore move very similarly. But you could get a QH that moves like a tb, if its trained to do it. it just takes time and patience*


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## SouthCreekPaints (Dec 26, 2009)

I study genetics on a college level and to put it simply...a Paint is a Quarter Horse with spots. Genetically there is no difference other than the Paint has the dominant O (overo pattern) or T(tobiano pattern). The Paint has been so influenced by the Quarter horse and the Quarter horse and Paint registries flow together. Same as palomino and buckskin. There are "Hunter type" QH and Paints and for the most part they are more Thoroughbred than anything. Your reiners, cutters, barrel racer...they are all "stock" type and it doesnt matter whether they are Paint or QH. They are bred the same way and if you look at pedigrees they will be very similar. A Paint was thrown in their somewhere for some color but most of your Paints are Quarter horses genetically there is no difference. If you have a slow Paint its just because that particular horse is slow. There are plenty of slow QHs out there but sence there are more QHs then Paints people assume the QHs are faster.


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## Eastowest (Mar 26, 2009)

I agree with the general thought that Paints are basically QHs that also bred for color, and registered elsewhere. Their "type" of movement would be the same as the corresponding type in the QH breed-- QH and Paint WP horses have the same type of movement, QH and Paint HUS horses have the same type of movement, QH and Paint race horses have the same type of mvement and etc. 

They are also judged on almost identical standards in each discipline-- often by judges who are multi-carded with most or all of the stock breeds.

Some differences might occur when looking at overall QUALITY of movement, skill, speed, and etc. when comparing the two-- in Paints it will be natural to find fewer at the top of each discipline for 2 simple facts-- 1. there are wayyy less Paints registered each year as compared to QHs, so there is a much smaller pool of potential talent to draw from and 2. With Paints you have to factor in selecting not only for talent/type/movement every time you breed, but also selecting at least somewhat for color-- (if it comes out solid, the animal could not be shown in the bigger more meaningful "regular" classes at paint shows.) 

This becomes especially important as trends in movement change, gaits are refined, level of difficulty of movement/maneuvers/competition rises in a population, and etc.

Anytime you add a selection criteria, it can make it harder to get highest expression of both-- ie. if you select most strongly for speed it can be tougher to get a certain color pattern, or if you select most strongly for a certain pattern its can make it less likely you get top speed.... 

So arguably, even though Paints and QHs are generally of the same type and will move the same way as their cousins in corresponding disciplines, Paints are often thought of (and sometimes, somewhat justifiably so) as being, overall, slightly "behind" the QH. (Of course there are some individuals that are on par or better here and there, I am talking about overall.)


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## xeventer17 (Jan 26, 2009)

I tend to agree with others in the sense that every horse moves differently and that pedigree, conformation and training all play huge factors in how the horse will express its movement. 

I mostly just wanted to post here to say that I've learned some very interesting things about pedigrees and registries that I didn't know about. So, thanks! ;]


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## PaintsPwn (Dec 29, 2009)

Pedigree and conformation are definitely what makes a horse move. Cowboy has a heavy Thoroughbred influence just off his papers, and it shows in his stride. However, Tuff has a lot of western pleasure influence, and therefor, he's slower and not as flashy when he moves out. Turd is a halter horse and moves like... an accident waiting to happen. Coordination is not her middle name LOL.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

Off topic, but.....

You have a horse named Turd? Hahaha, that is too funny.


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## thunderhooves (Aug 9, 2009)

Every horse is different. Of coarse they move differently! And, like the others said, it depends on whatthe horse is/was trained in. I can't beleive no one pointed it out yet, but the ppeople who say they won't run their Qh aginst a Paint, or their Paint against a QH are just afaid their horses will be whooped, like they probably have before, and blame it on the difference of gait, thus calling it "unfair". At our gymkhanas, people run their ARabs against QH, Paints, and the occaisonal Morgan. You shouldn't be barrel racing if you can't go against horses that might be better, or way different from yours. If you lose, their is always another day. Oh, and one thing every big time shower should remember: * Horse are a hobby, know that you're lucky to have a horse, weather it's well trained or green.* << that was just a side note, lol! And is your horse really named Turd? If so, please say that on my page becuase I prob won't come back to this thread.  Happy New Year!


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## irydehorses4lyfe (Sep 8, 2009)

thunderhooves said:


> Every horse is different. Of coarse they move differently! And, like the others said, it depends on whatthe horse is/was trained in. I can't beleive no one pointed it out yet, *but the ppeople who say they won't run their Qh aginst a Paint, or their Paint against a QH are just afaid their horses will be whooped, like they probably have before, and blame it on the difference of gait, thus calling it "unfair".* At our gymkhanas, people run their ARabs against QH, Paints, and the occaisonal Morgan. You shouldn't be barrel racing if you can't go against horses that might be better, or way different from yours. If you lose, their is always another day. Oh, and one thing every big time shower should remember: Horse are a hobby, know that you're lucky to have a horse, weather it's well trained or green. << that was just a side note, lol! And is your horse really named Turd? If so, please say that on my page becuase I prob won't come back to this thread.  Happy New Year!


Yeah, as a side note, around here, there are 4H shows for reining and sorting, and cutting, and my friend has the only Arab who does Western competitively. She usually goes to them and competes for fun, for the sole fact that because Bacardi moves differently than the Quarter Horses and Paints who sort, rein and cut, that she never gets judged fairly. Although, all these horses may be trained in the same prospect, because 'Cardi is a Arab, and has a much faster, accelerated pace, she never ranks out on top in the Western events...and just to show how much people just rely on one breed moving 'better' or 'differently' than others...Bacardi and her sorted 8 cows in 3 minutes at one event, and just because she got twice as many cows as the rest of the Quarter Horses and paints, she got first, mind you, the only time she has ever placed higher than 4th in a Western even, just for the fact that she was better. And to this day(this is two years later), she and Bacardi are still known as 'that Arab pair who beat us' at the local Western shows...
It's not just training, the breed, and just general 'breedism,' if you will, contributes greatly to what people think about how a breed or horse moves, when comparing to another horse.
....sorry, I may have gone on a slight rant. :lol:


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## SmoothTrails (Oct 1, 2009)

I think it all depends on conformation. We have 5 Qhs that are all full or half siblings. They al move a little differently. Some have a pounding trot, some have a very soft flowy trot, and one has a very floaty trot. It's really funny because unless you knew the horses you would have no idea they were kin. They are all barrel bred, and that is what they have in common. They can RUN!! Generally they are pretty nice on trails too.


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## my2geldings (Feb 18, 2008)

I don't think the breed really matters. It's more of a conformation issue than anything. I've seen warmbloods with horrandous movement and have seen horses such as QHs or paints with phenomenal movements.

Each breed has been build and bred with a certain purpose in mind which means that depending on that, a horse may or may not be as likely to have good movement.

When it comes down to it, it's really horse dependant.


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## PaintsPwn (Dec 29, 2009)

Yes I have a horse named Turd. She is one. The name suits her 110% n___n


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## my2geldings (Feb 18, 2008)

SouthCreekPaints said:


> I study genetics on a college level and to put it simply...a Paint is a Quarter Horse with spots. Genetically there is no difference other than the Paint has the dominant O (overo pattern) or T(tobiano pattern). The Paint has been so influenced by the Quarter horse and the Quarter horse and Paint registries flow together. Same as palomino and buckskin. There are "Hunter type" QH and Paints and for the most part they are more Thoroughbred than anything. Your reiners, cutters, barrel racer...they are all "stock" type and it doesnt matter whether they are Paint or QH. They are bred the same way and if you look at pedigrees they will be very similar. A Paint was thrown in their somewhere for some color but most of your Paints are Quarter horses genetically there is no difference. If you have a slow Paint its just because that particular horse is slow. There are plenty of slow QHs out there but sence there are more QHs then Paints people assume the QHs are faster.


Great post. I always wondered about that so I'm glad you posted your response.


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