# Getting into Halter



## timonlionking (Sep 28, 2015)

Sometime in the future, I plan on getting into showing Quarter Horses or Paints in Halter classes. The problem is, I know next to nothing... 

I've been finding some horses I really like (looking more into mares and fillies) and doing some research on the names mentioned in their description, but that's not getting me too far.

There are PLENTY of people on here that know a whole lot more than me in the Halter world; so I figured I'd ask you! Here's my questions:

1. What are some bloodlines that I should look for? Who's who in the modern Halter world?

2. Best barn set up for Halter horses? This seems like a weird question, but all I have right now is 400 open acres and an old 4 horse barn that's not in the best shape... if I ever plan to breed this mare, I'd like to have great facilities.

3. What conformation should I steer clear of? I know that the majority of modern Halter horses aren't exactly bred for great leg confo .. I want a mare that I sound in the Halter ring and on the farm. 

4. Buy young or old?

5. How do I find shows in my area and how do I enter? 

I'd also like any other advice you find necessary to give me! Like I said, I'm a newby, just trying to get a good step forward!


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## Avna (Jul 11, 2015)

I may as well be the first to say that many people on this board and off find the practice of breeding horses specifically for appearance rather than any kind of performance standard to be, let's say, unfortunate. There are thousands of halter horses being purposely bred which lack the basic premise of horses -- to be usable. You should look into that a little bit before investing yourself.


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## timonlionking (Sep 28, 2015)

Avna said:


> I may as well be the first to say that many people on this board and off find the practice of breeding horses specifically for appearance rather than any kind of performance standard to be, let's say, unfortunate. There are thousands of halter horses being purposely bred which lack the basic premise of horses -- to be usable. You should look into that a little bit before investing yourself.




Can a horse be successful in Halter AND be functional in every day life? Or do they have to fit a certain type to even be worth showing?


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## PaintHorseMares (Apr 19, 2008)

timonlionking said:


> Sometime in the future, I plan on getting into showing Quarter Horses or Paints in Halter classes. The problem is, I know next to nothing...
> 
> I've been finding some horses I really like (looking more into mares and fillies) and doing some research on the names mentioned in their description, but that's not getting me too far.
> 
> ...


At my age, I'm not up on the modern halter world, but in my time, you always at least took a look at one of the halter standards for QH/Paint, the Impressive line. The Impressive line has been extensively bred over the years, so you want to look at families that continue to pass along typical QH/Paint halter traits, e.g. big barrelled, big butt, well muscled. Do check HYPP status of any Impressive line horse. BTW, my experience is local and there are professional halter folks on this forum that can give you other advice.



timonlionking said:


> 2. Best barn set up for Halter horses? This seems like a weird question, but all I have right now is 400 open acres and an old 4 horse barn that's not in the best shape... if I ever plan to breed this mare, I'd like to have great facilities.


I wouldn't worry about having any special facility for a halter horse different from any other horse. Important to halter horses is good nutrition and a LOT of muscle building exercise. You'll want a ring (or even a round pen) and preferably hills to ride. 



timonlionking said:


> 3. What conformation should I steer clear of? I know that the majority of modern Halter horses aren't exactly bred for great leg confo .. I want a mare that I sound in the Halter ring and on the farm.


Do look at the legs, but there are LOTS of halter horses that have very nice, sturdy legs. 



timonlionking said:


> 4. Buy young or old?


Depending on your time frame and goals, it really doesn't matter. If you want something with show experience, look at 6+ years, and if looking at breeding I would go older to see what the mare's offspring have looked like. Our grandma halter mare is 21 and still looks great.



timonlionking said:


> 5. How do I find shows in my area and how do I enter?


Look for a local/regional FB group, feed stores, and barns that show. In our area there are a set of shows that happen every year that you become familiar with. The show notice will give you contact info and registration information to enter.



timonlionking said:


> I'd also like any other advice you find necessary to give me! Like I said, I'm a newby, just trying to get a good step forward!


I suggest you find some local shows to visit before finding a halter horse. That will give you a good idea of how different horses place in your local judging and a better idea of what to look for.



timonlionking said:


> Can a horse be successful in Halter AND be functional in every day life? Or do they have to fit a certain type to even be worth showing?


Yes they can. Halter horse require lots of exercise to maintain their desired muscling. I much prefer riding to hours of ground work. You can also train to drive. All ours are good general, trail horses.

Our 3 generations of halter horses.

"Mandy", the grandma and her pedigree.



















Her daughter, "Lady"










and grandson, "Buckshot" (3 years old)


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

There are different schools of thought on halter. Some will say that if they're halter bred, they're useless (my trainer is one of those but he's getting his mind changed) and some will say that they can still be useful. My personal experience is, they can be useful but they will not be athletic enough to be at the top of any one performance game, most of the time. Obviously, there will be exceptions to that rule. 

My trainer is a die hard roper/working cow kinda guy. I am so totally NOT into any of that it's not funny. I'm also not at all into halter. But I do like an athletic, pretty, nice horse. I've been having a fair amount of success with Skipper W/Impressive lines, N/N for HYPP or not used in anything I do. My trainer who is very well known to say, " I HATE his pedigree, but I'm sure loving riding this horse.", has been saying the hate the pedigree thing less and less over time. That cross is not going to spin a hole in the ground and will probably be outrun by a fast cow from the roping chute, but there's not much that phases them out on the trail or in the show pen. The temperament has been outstanding with every single one of them, starting with the stallion. They have try, heart and a willingness to give 110% every single time you ask. And they all LOVE attention. They will leave food to come see a human. 

I have a 2 y.o. gelding who is linebred Skipper W. He's big, he's pretty, and he just went Reserve High Point at the Ranch Horse Congress, much to our suprise and delight. So pretty is, and pretty can do, it just takes a little work. 

We don't have a fancy facility, just an old 8 stall pole barn and a couple of foaling stalls. We have a small arena (20 M X 40 M) and no special equipment. Main thing is, it's SAFE. Or, I should say, as safe as it can be given horses propensity for trying to kill and maim themselves.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

I forgot to say something about "Buy young or old". It depends on your focus. Are you wanting to show halter with this horse? If so, then I say go for a very young incentive fund weaner and start from the bottom up in the show ring. If you're wanting to breed your own horses to show, then buy an aged broodmare who has an impressive history in the show ring, in foal to a stallion who is a top name. Then you can show the foal and put her back in foal to a top stallion for your own breeding prospect. You can get a much higher quality mare if you buy one that is older and that you may only get 1 or 2 more foals from, for a lot less than you'll spend on a top mare in the prime of her life.


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## timonlionking (Sep 28, 2015)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> I forgot to say something about "Buy young or old". It depends on your focus. Are you wanting to show halter with this horse? If so, then I say go for a very young incentive fund weaner and start from the bottom up in the show ring. If you're wanting to breed your own horses to show, then buy an aged broodmare who has an impressive history in the show ring, in foal to a stallion who is a top name. Then you can show the foal and put her back in foal to a top stallion for your own breeding prospect. You can get a much higher quality mare if you buy one that is older and that you may only get 1 or 2 more foals from, for a lot less than you'll spend on a top mare in the prime of her life.




My end result is going to be breeding, but when buying, I want a well behaved, seasoned horse. Until I learn the basics and get some experience, at least. I guess a middle aged mare (just past her prime maybe?) would be ideal? I could still breed her, but she'll know enough about Halter that I can learn there... if this is a bad idea, let me know. 

I would love to raise my foals to show, but I don't know the first thing about showing, so I wouldn't know how to train. 

Would a weanling or yearling have enough experience to pull me through?


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

timonlionking said:


> My end result is going to be breeding, but when buying, I want a well behaved, seasoned horse. Until I learn the basics and get some experience, at least. I guess a middle aged mare (just past her prime maybe?) would be ideal? I could still breed her, but she'll know enough about Halter that I can learn there... if this is a bad idea, let me know.
> 
> I would love to raise my foals to show, but I don't know the first thing about showing, so I wouldn't know how to train.
> 
> Would a weanling or yearling have enough experience to pull me through?


In your case, no show experience/no experience with foals, I would recommend a GELDING that's a few years old, maybe 5 or 6, with extensive show history. This wouldn't be a cheap horse, but he would see you through showing while you learned enough to be able to know for sure if you want to breed. 

No, weanlings and yearlings aren't going to be educated enough to educate you too. 

Really, what I'd truly recommend is to find a halter trainer who can teach you how to show, groom and all the ins and outs of the show pen. You could do a lot of things with this gelding and then when ready, you could sell him and move to a mare.


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## timonlionking (Sep 28, 2015)

I had thought about a gelding. And I don't know how I would find a trainer. Not many people in my area (at least that I know of) show in Halter... the closest place that holds shows is 3 hours away from me. 


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

http://www.moqha.com/ProfessionalHorsemenMissouri2016.pdf

If the ones that specify halter as their discipline are close, I'd call them. Otherwise, call the ones that specify Amateur, Youth and All Around. If they don't do it, they'll know who does. And all of them will know about shows that are fairly local to you.


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## Avna (Jul 11, 2015)

timonlionking said:


> I had thought about a gelding. And I don't know how I would find a trainer. Not many people in my area (at least that I know of) show in Halter... the closest place that holds shows is 3 hours away from me.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Go to a show, and talk to the winners about who they train with or maybe they can train you themselves.


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## beau159 (Oct 4, 2010)

timonlionking said:


> 5. How do I find shows in my area and how do I enter?


At what level do you want to show?
Open shows?
Breed shows?

Deciding what you want to do will help you "hone in" on where to find shows. 

I do a little bit of showing myself but it's just for fun and it's just local. If I ever would do a breed show (AQHA), I probably would do halter just to do it.

Google and Facebook can be resources to find shows. I see you list that you are from Missouri? Check these out:
Welcome to the Missouri Quarter Horse Association
MPHC~Missouri Paint Horse Club

Word of mouth will probably best the best way for you to get started. Start going to shows, watching, and talking to people!


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

Let me give you a different perspective
Your question is, can halter horses also perform, and the answer is , yes, depending on the line, and at what level, and whether they were pushed to early maturity, like young halter hroses are, which plays a huge part, far as halter horses having soundness issues.
Young futurity performance horses ,pushed towards some futurity, have the general acknowledgement that soundness issues arise from that training speed and demand, but that extra weight, piled on halter horses, on young immature skeletons, shoing them even as yearlings, to\stand them up, treadmill work, ect, are all every bit as harmful as pushing a young horse under saddle, and one has to take that into account, far as associated leg problems.
So, yes, some halter horses ride, but many lines have not had their mind tested under saddle for generations, nor have they often been tested, far as \form to function

A better question, far as I'm concerned, is, can a pretty performance hrose halter?
The answer is a definite yes. In other words, you don't need ahorse specifically halter bred, to show successfully at open shows and at regional breed level. So, unless you wish to show at some major breed shows in halter, where I doubt you would be starting at, makes much more sense to buy a nice attractive performance horse, that you can show at halter, and then goes on to ride
You then know you have the breeding for good movement, willing mind, and an attitude in a discipline
I have shown quite a few of my performance bred horses, at halter, including as foals and yearlings, and then as adults, while showing them under saddle also
I have won many open halter and breed level regional halter, with my performance bred horses


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## timonlionking (Sep 28, 2015)

What does everyone think of this girl? I don't have the money (or the knowledge) to buy her at the moment, but she's EXACTLY what I'm wanting when I do look to buy. All for the N/H and the spot in her eye. Is that caused by HYPP? 


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

HYPP N/H is a no sale for me. Wouldn't touch her.


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## timonlionking (Sep 28, 2015)

Same here! I'm not planning on buying her. She just caught my eye. How does the HYPP work? If a gelding has no symptoms would he be worth buying? I know it's a no go with any horses you plan to breed. Could symptoms arise in a gelding later in life? 


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## beau159 (Oct 4, 2010)

timonlionking said:


> Same here! I'm not planning on buying her. She just caught my eye. How does the HYPP work? If a gelding has no symptoms would he be worth buying? I know it's a no go with any horses you plan to breed. Could symptoms arise in a gelding later in life?


Here's one link from UC Davis to educate yourself. It's a muscle disease.
https://www.vgl.ucdavis.edu/services/hypp.php

Do not buy any horse that is N/H. They carry they gene and *they have the disease*. Yes, symptoms can show if they are N/H.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

timonlionking said:


> Same here! I'm not planning on buying her. She just caught my eye. How does the HYPP work? If a gelding has no symptoms would he be worth buying? I know it's a no go with any horses you plan to breed. Could symptoms arise in a gelding later in life?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I, personally, would not buy an N/H horse, regardless of sex or showing symptoms. N/H can vary from very affected to not at all affected and most can be managed with diet and Karo corn syrup. The down side is, they can have pretty severe symptoms and it can be really upsetting for human and horse when they have an episode. Having worked for a halter trainer who had nothing but N/H and H/H (before they quit registering those horses), I won't go near another one.


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## carshon (Apr 7, 2015)

Debbie Downer chiming in here. Your location would be a deterrent to many future buyers of any mare's off spring. Impressive bred horses are still popular in the show ring. That being said the BIG and Typey horses like the one in your post are not known to be multifunctional. We owned a daughter of Concluded (who was a son of Impressive) she was ranch bred on the bottom. The mare was bred to be an "all around"horse. Unfortunately her size made her heavy on the forehand and not quick on her feet. We were able to purchase her and rode her as a trail horse. We bred her to a working cow horse Appy and got a beautiful colt out of her. he was large and bulky like her and saddle fit was always a huge issue. In fit condition this horse weighed 1300lbs! Was 16.1H but he was like riding a lead sled. Heavy Heavy Heavy!

Go to some horse shows - talk to folks - make a trip to Congress. Many halter horse blood lines change - it is better to buy a started horse or one already on the ground.

I for one am against buying to breed in hopes of making a profit. It is really hard to do and for top dollar horses you have to have top dollar trainers - Do you have halter horse trainers in your area? Anyone that can mentor you when you start to show?

My advice - start small. Buy a horse you can ride now and compete locally - get familiar with show rules and the true cost of showing and owning a show horse. Buying the horse is going to be the cheapest part of that process.


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## Avna (Jul 11, 2015)

The mare is what, six years old, and apparently there is no intention of training her to ride. They feel she's an excellent broodmare prospect although they haven't any clue what she is like to ride. To me this is . . . we'll say, odd. I could use stronger words.


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## timonlionking (Sep 28, 2015)

Okay. So I've been doing research. I'm not sure I'd had the time to fit them and get them groomed up for shows... I could hire someone but I'm not sure how I'd find someone. 

If I was to just get into breeding high end Halter horses, how would I go about that? 


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## Avna (Jul 11, 2015)

timonlionking said:


> Okay. So I've been doing research. I'm not sure I'd had the time to fit them and get them groomed up for shows... I could hire someone but I'm not sure how I'd find someone.
> 
> If I was to just get into breeding high end Halter horses, how would I go about that?
> 
> ...


To be good at anything that doesn't support you (the above would qualify, at least for a long time), you need some combination of three things: passion, time, and money. 

If I had your desire, I would find the winningest breeder within a 500 mile radius of me and go apprentice with them. Buy an old RV and park in their field and be there 14 hours a day, working your butt off. After a few years of this, you'll probably have some sense of how to proceed toward your goals.

Or, buy a breeding farm and hire a top winning breeder to work for you full time. 

There is no easy cheap internet-communicable method to succeed at this or much of anything else.


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