# Lease question



## boots (Jan 16, 2012)

Ugh. Sticky situation. 

If you are in the US, you can put a grass lien on the horse. Not expensive. You file it at your county courthouse. Then she can't sell the horse, legally, without paying what she owes you. It is hard to enforce and you may end up in small claims court, which is also hard to enforce a judgement. You will lose a "friend." The latter sounds like a good idea.

I know there are situations where the person who is pasturing the horse (cow,sheep, goats) can claim abandonment and retain ownership. I have not had to do that. Maybe another member knows more about it.

Too late now, but having a contract isn't just for strangers. It's a good tool for maintaining friendships, too.


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## LoriF (Apr 3, 2015)

I would ask her in text about financially supporting this horse and let her reply in text that she can't afford it. I would try to include in the text about all of the past so it is in writing. What does BASICALLY homeless mean? How is she able to keep her animals and getting more if she has no property or home to keep them?


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## egrogan (Jun 1, 2011)

It does sound messy. It's hard to tell from your post if you want the horse or not. If you do, then I'd text/email her something positive and upbeat, along the lines of, "Thanks for helping me out with Red when I was in a tough spot. I know that now I'm in a better position, and after having him back here for the last 6 months, I'd like to formally take him back for good, which I think might help you out too. Could you send his papers to me at xxx or meet me at time xxx to exchange them? Since he's doing well here on my pasture, I don't see any need for any additional money to change hands at this point. I'll just take his papers to reassume ownership. Again, thanks for what you did to help us last year!"

If you don't want the horse, then I think you just suck it up and pay someone to trailer him back to her. How expensive can it be to trailer a horse 45 minutes one way? $50 or $100, tops??

Either way, I don't think you're going to get any money out of her, and I'm not sure I entirely blame her since the situation about who is responsible for what seems so convoluted.


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## Misslyss31 (Nov 5, 2019)

LoriF said:


> I would ask her in text about financially supporting this horse and let her reply in text that she can't afford it. I would try to include in the text about all of the past so it is in writing. What does BASICALLY homeless mean? How is she able to keep her animals and getting more if she has no property or home to keep them?


All of our conversations have been through text, so I definitely have in writing all the times I asked if she wanted his feet done or teeth done, etc. And she declined each time, along with when she agreed to provide me with hay. 

After she lost her job, she rented out her house but moved into her barn. So she has a place to stay and keep the animals but isnt paying rent and still hasn't gotten a job.


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## Misslyss31 (Nov 5, 2019)

egrogan said:


> It does sound messy. It's hard to tell from your post if you want the horse or not. If you do, then I'd text/email her something positive and upbeat, along the lines of, "Thanks for helping me out with Red when I was in a tough spot. I know that now I'm in a better position, and after having him back here for the last 6 months, I'd like to formally take him back for good, which I think might help you out too. Could you send his papers to me at xxx or meet me at time xxx to exchange them? Since he's doing well here on my pasture, I don't see any need for any additional money to change hands at this point. I'll just take his papers to reassume ownership. Again, thanks for what you did to help us last year!"
> 
> If you don't want the horse, then I think you just suck it up and pay someone to trailer him back to her. How expensive can it be to trailer a horse 45 minutes one way? $50 or $100, tops??
> 
> Either way, I don't think you're going to get any money out of her, and I'm not sure I entirely blame her since the situation about who is responsible for what seems so convoluted.



That is basically what I told her when I offered to take back ownership. My concern is that since she repeatedly turn down regularly upkeep when he was with me, that it won't get done when he goes back and being that she is so far away, I will never know. I would love to have him back. My other concern is that once she gets him back, she will just turn around and sell him or send him to auction to get some money off of him and I would hate to see that. He is a great horse. 

I guess, I would just never consider doing this to someone if it were the other way around.:-S I would have offered to pay her if I couldn't come get him. My fault I know for not making an agreement.


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## Misslyss31 (Nov 5, 2019)

boots said:


> Ugh. Sticky situation.
> 
> If you are in the US, you can put a grass lien on the horse. Not expensive. You file it at your county courthouse. Then she can't sell the horse, legally, without paying what she owes you. It is hard to enforce and you may end up in small claims court, which is also hard to enforce a judgement. You will lose a "friend." The latter sounds like a good idea.
> 
> ...


I was kind of wondering about abandonment as well, since she hasn't bothered to check in on him at all. 

The other annoying part is that she also brought down another gelding(I didn't know she was bringing both until he got here) and left with me, and now she is refusing to take him back, saying that she "gifted" him to me. 🙄 he's already 11 years old, not broke, no manners whatsoever, and rules the roost at my place now. He doesnt even let my bossy mare eat 🙄


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## therhondamarie (Sep 18, 2019)

Tell her that if you return them you will return them both, then create invoices for ALL of the care. Present her with that and tell her she can either go to court with you and fight it out or gift both horses to you. It may be a bluff, but it may be one that works. Have you asked around about attorneys that could give you a free consultation? Most offer one and could advise you of options.


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## AnitaAnne (Oct 31, 2010)

therhondamarie said:


> Tell her that if you return them you will return them both, then create invoices for ALL of the care. Present her with that and tell her she can either go to court with you and fight it out or gift both horses to you. It may be a bluff, but it may be one that works. Have you asked around about attorneys that could give you a free consultation? Most offer one and could advise you of options.


Agree with this. Include your costs for gas picking up the hay...add up every cent paid.

Send the invoice by registered mail and keep a copy.


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## LoriF (Apr 3, 2015)

therhondamarie said:


> Tell her that if you return them you will return them both, then create invoices for ALL of the care. Present her with that and tell her she can either go to court with you and fight it out or gift both horses to you. It may be a bluff, but it may be one that works. Have you asked around about attorneys that could give you a free consultation? Most offer one and could advise you of options.


This might work.


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## therhondamarie (Sep 18, 2019)

Yes what @AnitaAnne said about sending it registered mail. It would be even better if you have receipts from hay purchases or gas, etc.


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## Misslyss31 (Nov 5, 2019)

Thanks all. I finally got her to write me back. I just told her that if she wasn't willing to give me back ownership of hom after this long than she either needed to start paying me for his food and other bills or come get him. She opted to come get him but seems to think I should let her use my trailer 🙄 I hate to see him go. He was my baby and if I could get him back I would. I just hope she gives him the care he deserves.


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## Misslyss31 (Nov 5, 2019)

therhondamarie said:


> Tell her that if you return them you will return them both, then create invoices for ALL of the care. Present her with that and tell her she can either go to court with you and fight it out or gift both horses to you. It may be a bluff, but it may be one that works. Have you asked around about attorneys that could give you a free consultation? Most offer one and could advise you of options.



So after doing some research, it turns out she never even had him transferred to her name with APHA or PtHA(probably ciz she can't afford it). We have been looking into an abandonment claim but not having much luck since we didnt have a written agreement. However, according to APHA, the horse has always been in my father's name even though we thought he was in mine, and he never signed off on the "bill of sale" when I gave him to her, so 🤷‍♀️


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