# Horse shopping in the Philippines



## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

And this smaller one. Not trained, but well fed. Like to get a better look at this one, 'cause I've got a grand kid on the way.


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## Chevaux (Jun 27, 2012)

I'm just curious: What are horse prices (in general) like where you are, Cordillera Cowboy? Is putting up feed (hay) necessary at any time? Are there vet services available?


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## 4horses (Nov 26, 2012)

Don't discount those walking skeletons. You'd be surprised how quickly they bounce back from starvation. I got in a starved Paso Fino. Just getting him dewormed, and putting him on a good feeding program, and he bounced right back. He was young and otherwise in good health. Just needed calories. If you are looking for something a little bigger, maybe try expanding your search.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

Chevaux said:


> I'm just curious: What are horse prices (in general) like where you are, Cordillera Cowboy? Is putting up feed (hay) necessary at any time? Are there vet services available?


Hello Chevaux,

I'm consistently seeing 15,000 pesos (about $300 US) for untrained horses. The asking price for what they call trained in this area ranges from 20,000 to 25,000 ($400 - $500 US). I did have one person ask for 30,000 for a bag of bones they were afraid to ride. 

Trained, in our very non-horse oriented area, means simply you can hop on it bareback, go forward, left right, and stop without getting bucked off. I don't know anyone with a saddle or bridle. 

I'm corresponding with a fellow who works at a riding stable in a wealthy area. His employer just bought one trained to harness and saddle for 27,000. That's in an area where horses are plentiful. I could go there. But then I'd have to pay to transport the horse about 400 kilometers. I may yet have to, in order to find one 14hh or over. 

One of the attractions of this place for me is that I am free from the eternal quest for hay. So long as I don't over graze, I'll have grass year round. 

Vet services are sketchy. I'm seeing several small animal clinics now. Our dog got his puppy shots and has an appointment for neutering in a couple weeks. The Department of Agriculture has veterinarians in their municipal offices. I have to make an appointment with him before getting our stock branded. So I'll know more about that soon.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

4horses said:


> Don't discount those walking skeletons. You'd be surprised how quickly they bounce back from starvation. I got in a starved Paso Fino. Just getting him dewormed, and putting him on a good feeding program, and he bounced right back. He was young and otherwise in good health. Just needed calories. If you are looking for something a little bigger, maybe try expanding your search.


The good feeding program, by 1st world standards, is problematical here. There are no feeds available locally designed specifically for horses. I can get protein from old bean vines and kamote (yam) tops, but that is catch as catch can. Plenty of coconuts, but I'm still looking for a source of copra. 

I need critters that will thrive on rough forage. Really don't want to start off by playing catch up. I'm planting a more nutritious forage grass that was suggested by the Department of Agriculture research farm here. But that will take a few years to take hold. 

Expanding the search is not out of the question. But I'm not yet sure what the transport costs would be. Or, more importantly, how the horse would handle it. There is a tourist area, famous for horses about 140 kilometers west of us. All on twisty mountain roads through the Cordilleras. Another, about 400 kilometers south, over better roads. But stock hauling vehicles here are a bit scary to put a horse into.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

I had a closer look at the horse in the top photo. It rode calmly in the Ag terminal with trucks and motorcycles all around. Let me pick up all 4 feet without a fuss. Friendly and calm all around. Huge points in its favor. So, pending documented proof of ownership, we will buy it this week. 

It's about 3 years old, 12.3hh, very light framed & dainty looking. I'm small and light enough to ride it for training, but it will ultimately be either for kids or the goodewyfe. 

Turns out the same guy owns the spotted pony. But he is afraid of it. So that's a no go for us. 

Photos to follow.


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## JCnGrace (Apr 28, 2013)

I love a good riding pony! Let us know if you get it and then post lots of pictures of it's cuteness.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

Here's a shot showing the height. The "cuteness" shots will have to wait til we get her on site. 

She's actually about 12.3 hands. by Paul McKee, on Flickr


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## walkinthewalk (Jul 23, 2008)

She isn't too bad in terms of height.

When you get her home, I'd like to see a good side view of her head. 

She almost looks like there's some Arab in there and that would be great because they are tough and sturdy little things.

Congratulations! I hope you are able to secure her for a fair price


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

walkinthewalk said:


> She isn't too bad in terms of height.
> 
> When you get her home, I'd like to see a good side view of her head.
> 
> ...


Will do! Some Arabian dna is not out of the question. The Philippines has been a crossroad of trade and culture for centuries, if not a few thousand years. Between Muslim traders, and Spanish colonizers, plenty of opportunity for Arabian stock to get here. 

I paid more than she would be worth in an area with more, and better trained horses. But our price includes transportation. That's a big plus.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

Got the little horse home today. All 12.3 hands of her. The Goodewyfe named her Skippy. As requested, here is a profile pic. 

Skippy by Paul McKee, on Flickr

The truck ride through town.

Horse transport, Philippines by Paul McKee, on Flickr

And me riding her onto our place.

Skippy First day at Inner Earth. by Paul McKee, on Flickr


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## egrogan (Jun 1, 2011)

That last picture looks straight out of a movie. I love following your adventures. Cute pony!


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## carshon (Apr 7, 2015)

She is adorable!


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

carshon said:


> She is adorable!


Thanks!! We kinda like her.


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## PoptartShop (Jul 25, 2010)

She's such a cutie. Congrats!  & it really does look straight out of a movie, I have to agree. So wonderful!


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

egrogan said:


> That last picture looks straight out of a movie. I love following your adventures. Cute pony!


Thanks y'all. I do think that it would be difficult to take a photo of that horizon line without it seeming dramatic.


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## walkinthewalk (Jul 23, 2008)

Well ---- I had a my entire post typed and somehow it got eaten --- that was yesterday --- it took me this long to stop pouting

She is a little cutie and a pretty color. If you can get your hands on some high dose feed for her, she could still grow a lot, being as how she is allegedly somewhere in the three year range

While her head doesn't look as Arab as it does in the picture I asked about, I am still willing to say there is Arabian in her DNA. 

My Streeter was only 13.3H. She has his tiny ears, short mouth, and her very petite build reminds me of Streeter's build. Her narrow chest looks just like him. He was narrow-built when I rescued him as a seven year old and he was still narrow built when he passed at 29.



She is a tad too small for you now but, if you can get some "growing food" into her, she may get tall enough for you to ride. At the least she should make a nice cart horse

Arabs like to think things are their ideas and they are smart to their own in-doing. They also eat stuff they shouldn't eat --- Streeter ate the roses, lollol

Keep Skippy out of your wife's newly planted trees


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

A lot of good qualities in her. And I believe she is one of the smart ones. Curious, and so far, not the least bit spooky. We have uneven, stony ground, and she traverses it well. Yesterday, I saw her bump a pumpkin size stone with the leading forefoot. Without missing a beat, she simply lifted that foot higher and kept going. The first day, I couldn't resist riding her the last few hundred meters through our front gate and onto our place. A neighbors cow was picketed along the road. We went to investigate, because I wanted to see how she would react. Ears up and curios. Not a hint of fear. 

Hard, well shaped hooves. I ran a rasp over the edges of the fronts yesterday, not a bit of resistance from her. I'll do the backs tomorrow. Mostly because I'm out of shape. Been well over30 years since I did any farriery. 

Did a string test. My measure, knee to coronet band was 12 inches. She's already 12.3hh. I'm leery of the feeds here. There's nothing formulated for horses. Lots for quick weight gain on hogs and some of the same for cattle. And feed corn is one of the money crops hereabouts. I'm terrified of founder. We're feeding rice bran and salt. I've instructed our caretaker to feed bean vines and camote (yam) tops as those crops are harvested. We have an experimental plot of peanuts in. If they work out, and more are planted, That's another potential protein source. 

I let her wear a snaffle while I was working with her yesterday. Didn't seem like a big deal to her. 
I let Skippy wear a snaffle for a while today. by Paul McKee, on Flickr


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## JCnGrace (Apr 28, 2013)

She has the sweetest expression on her face. Congrats, I'm glad you were able to get her.


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## Chevaux (Jun 27, 2012)

I think she's hit it lucky with you, CC.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

Chevaux said:


> I think she's hit it lucky with you, CC.


I think we hit it pretty lucky with her. Calm disposition, likes people, alert, willing, and easy to control whole being ridden. Even in the US, a horse like that is difficult to find. Her only fault is her size. We'll feed her the best we can get, and get her plenty of exercise to muscle her up. I'm thinking she will make a dandy horse, either for the goodewyfe of the grandkid.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

In other news. We're still looking for more, and larger horses. So far, it's been more folks trying to unload their uncut male critters on us. I haven't yet checked on what it would cost to geld one. It's not normally done here. There is one fellow selling a pair, male and female. He wants to sell both together. If the mare checks out, and he will make a good deal, I may pick them both up and sell the male ASAP at the ag terminal.


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## walkinthewalk (Jul 23, 2008)

I agree she has a very sweet and kind face. Sometimes I think certain horses know they have a place to be and are just waiting for the human to find them. She has found her people and her place

You are pretty much dependent on yourself for any sort of equine care aren't you. That is the one thing I wouldn't like about living off the grid. However, I think you have a good diet plan for her --- Yams are supposed to be really good and the peanuts would be good protein.

If watermelon would grow, the citrulline in watermelon rind is supposed to be good for keeping laminitis at bay and lowering insulin. There have been a few clinical studies; while they lean toward inconclusive, they do feel the citrulline can aid in reducing the severity of laminitis.

I've had both my horses on 1/2-3/4 cups twice daily, since last May. I chop the rinds to fingernail size as I worry about choke.

Also, perish the thought Skippy would become laminitic --- Google "Ting Points". Cavallo Hoof Boots web site should come up to their page that talks about ting at the coronet bands. My hollistic vet/chiro once did that to Joker and it worked. She was going to show me how, but at the time I chickened out, lollol. It is something you could easily do, just be sure the needles are sterile


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## Werecat (Aug 23, 2015)

She looks incredibly gentle. Great find!


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## boots (Jan 16, 2012)

Cordillera Cowboy said:


> In other news. We're still looking for more, and larger horses.


I'm guessing you do know you have polo on the island. At least 5 fields, maybe 7. Occasionally, no, always, owners are looking for homes for average-sized horses who don't make the grade. And you are aware those owners are not easy to find. 

I don't know if your forage would support a 15 hh horse, or if you are willing to purchase, ship, and/or ride one to your home.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

boots said:


> I'm guessing you do know you have polo on the island. At least 5 fields, maybe 7. Occasionally, no, always, owners are looking for homes for average-sized horses who don't make the grade. And you are aware those owners are not easy to find.
> 
> I don't know if your forage would support a 15 hh horse, or if you are willing to purchase, ship, and/or ride one to your home.


Yes, those playgrounds of the rich and famous dot the archipelago. All are about a days drive over mountains. And just locating the actual owner of a horse or a cow locally is an adventure. Somewhere I recall mentioning having to go through multiple layers of "people who know people" here. There are lot of absentee owners on the polo and racing circuits. I've met a couple of folks who brag that they own a share in a race horse. But, I relly don't need or want a hot blooded horse. 

For now, I'm concentrating my search locally. I'll sacrifice height for sturdiness. If I keep my tack light, I could get by with a horse in the eight to nine hundred pound range. I put one of those girth measure estimaters on this little one. Came up about 448 pounds.


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## carshon (Apr 7, 2015)

Do they have donkeys or mules on the island? They tend to be able to carry heavier loads compared to their size. 

I enjoy your posts - it is always good to get a different perspective of horse ownership


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

Carshon, I've never seen a donkey or mule here, though folks seem to be aware of what they are. Equines of any sort are somewhat rare in our little area. The ones here seem to be kept as novelty status symbols more than anything else. 

Glad you're enjoying the posts.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

Todays find. Short, about 12 hands, but sturdy looking. They said it could be ridden.... sometimes.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

Looks like we may have made a package deal on the 12 hand bay pony, and a smaller white one. The seller rode the white one for us. She's skinny, maybe 10 or 11 hh, and may have some age on her. 

Now, I cant get the old song, "The Pony Man" by Gordon Lightfoot out of my head.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

the skinny white one added for a bonus.


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## walkinthewalk (Jul 23, 2008)

Well, my goodness ----------- BUT ----- she will plump up and become a "goodun" as we say in Western PA and TN

Is it me, the camera angles, or do all these little horses have heads that seem like they should all be taller??? I am always surprised when you say they have some age to them


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## 4horses (Nov 26, 2012)

Just having access to pasture will put weight on. If you have access to grain, canola oil from the grocery store will put weight on.Shouldn't be too hard to put weight on them, given their small size. Ponies tend to be really hardy and easy keepers. Congrats.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

walkinthewalk said:


> Well, my goodness ----------- BUT ----- she will plump up and become a "goodun" as we say in Western PA and TN
> 
> 
> Maybe so.
> ...


 

Could be a bit of both. It's possible that some of these would have been larger, if not taller, if nursing mares and youngsters had better access to higher protein forage.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

4horses said:


> Just having access to pasture will put weight on. If you have access to grain, canola oil from the grocery store will put weight on.Shouldn't be too hard to put weight on them, given their small size. Ponies tend to be really hardy and easy keepers. Congrats.


 
We're supplementing our grass with rice bran and salt. I think I've seen canola oil in the stores here. Does it provide "cool calories"? I've been looking, unsuccessfully, for copra. Corn is easily available here. But I don't even want it on the property, for fear that someone will give a horse a bucket full of it.


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## SilverMaple (Jun 24, 2017)

I'm waiting for you to find the perfect horse on the other side of the mountain or from the touristy area, and chronicle your adventures riding it home


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## ShirtHotTeez (Sep 23, 2014)

Is copra good for horses? We feed it to cattle here but I know there has been some debate about it. It is very course and the manure of a cow on copra seems grainy and smells of copra, never seemed right to me. And a cow gets two chances to digest it. Looking for feedback here, cos I don't know.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

All I know of copra is what I've read while researching feeds that may be available to us here. I've seen it recommended as a calorie source for horses in work. I may not find out. Seems I've run into the realities of 3rd world economics. The Philippines is one of the top exporters of coconuts. You'd think that coconut by products would be common here. Turns out, the coconuts are exported to countries that manufacture the coconut oil. So both the oil and copra are imported products. 

Got a lead on another little horse today. A stocky little dun that looks to be 13hh or so. Said to be 4 or 5 years old. If this one pans out, we'll probably pass on the toofer0 deal with the smaller ponies.


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## SwissMiss (Aug 1, 2014)

ShirtHotTeez said:


> Is copra good for horses?





Cordillera Cowboy said:


> All I know of copra is what I've read while researching feeds that may be available to us here. I've seen it recommended as a calorie source for horses in work.


If memory doesn't fail me completely @its lbs not miles feeds his horses a mix of copra and beet pulp...


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## PoptartShop (Jul 25, 2010)

I hope she beefs up quick!  She'll look nice once she does, poor girly!


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## its lbs not miles (Sep 1, 2011)

SwissMiss said:


> If memory doesn't fail me completely @*its lbs not miles* feeds his horses a mix of copra and beet pulp...


Your memory works fine )). Copra is an incredible feed. Very low NSC and super digestible. Most of it is digested and absorbed in the foregut. Beet pulp very digestible, high fiber so it's text book for what's needed in the hind gut and has a much higher nutritional value than the best hays while having a very low NSC which tends to be the downfall of the rich hays most people feed their horses. Just be sure to get copra for a reputable equine feed source. Poor practices can result in contamination from mold or other things. I use Stance equine feeds out of Australia for my copra needs.


Big thing is to stay away from grains. All grains are high in NSC and while horses do need some NSC they only need very small amounts. Otherwise it disrupts the natural and healthy function of their digestive system. Specifically the hindgut where the higher starch level causes many of the fiber digesting microbes to die which is one of the factors that can result in of laminitis. Equine nutrition and digestion is rather extensive subject. If time, money and situation permits I would recommend taking university courses in it. People have been killing horses with kindness for centuries. Mostly from diets that rely on grain products which was a very European practice. Grains equal high NSC which is not good. An easy rule of thumb...keep NSC below 15% since nature designed the horses digestive system to healthily process less the 15% NSC. e.g. Oats has 40% NSC which is the lowest NSC rate for grains. Simple math will show that even oats will result in more than double the healthy level of NSC for the equine digestive system. An easy case to show the impact...Secretariat was put down at 19 years of age from laminitis resulting from what most people believe to be a healthy equine diet (mostly oats and rich hay). Nature designed the equine digestive system to work best with large quantities of poor nutritional forage. They'll eat for 12-17 hours per day and live quite healthy on nothing but low quality forage provided they're able to meet their required amino acid and mineral quantity and ratio needs.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

Tthanks, @*its lbs not miles,*

Right now, in addition to the graze, I'm feeding rice bran, salt, and 1/4 cup of coconut oil. Plus an armful of camote (yam) vines. 

There are no commercially available feeds designed for horses around here. Plenty available for fast weight gain on cattle and hogs. those would be a death sentence for a horse. 

Once we're settled in more, I can travel farther afield. I'll visit some of the horse stables in the touristy areas and see what they're feeding. and who their suppliers are. That's about a 6 hour hump over the mountains in any direction. Could be worth it for a pickup truck load of good feed. 

The cash crop here in the hill country is corn. I'm deathly afraid of corn.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

In other horse shopping news. We've passed on the bay pony that could be ridden, sometimes, and the skinny white one. 


The same fellow who sold us the first little horse has another that he says is "bigger" It's a little dun, supposed to be 4 or 5 years old, that may make 13 hands. But, it's in better condition. We have yet to see it ridden. Of course, he wants more for it, because it's "bigger". We've held him off, hoping he will hold it til January. Our budget has been taken up with visiting the grandkid and Christmas stuff. He knows what we're looking for, and keeps calling us, so it may work out.


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## AnitaAnne (Oct 31, 2010)

_Subbing_

Was rather hoping you would take the little skinny one home...might make a perfect pony for the grandkids


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

AnitaAnne said:


> _Subbing_
> 
> Was rather hoping you would take the little skinny one home...might make a perfect pony for the grandkids



Could be. But I've pretty much decided to hold off on any more skinny ones until I see how successful I can be with the one I have.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

Back to the horse search. We're looking at the little dun. she is still available. the guy wants more money for her because she is " bigger" than the last one. Turns out she is the same height, 12.3, but stockier. 


He still hasn't proven that she is broke to ride.


She has the wooly mane of a pony. I'm reminded of a scene from "True Grit". Rooster Cogburn is insulting Ranger Le Boeuf's horse. Something like, "How long you Texas boys been mounted on sheep?"


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

The legs and feet.


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## AnitaAnne (Oct 31, 2010)

Looks cute and sturdy!! Too bad these ponies aren't about 4 inches taller...


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

AnitaAnne said:


> Looks cute and sturdy!! Too bad these ponies aren't about 4 inches taller...


Yes. My target is 14 hands. But I haven't found one yet locally that will break 13. But our neighbors always comment on the one we have now about how big it is. One guy said "That's a big horse. In Baguio, they have big horses too. BIG (He raises his hands near his head.) And LOOONG!"


Baguio is a touristy area about 400 kilometers into the Cordilleras from us.


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## walkinthewalk (Jul 23, 2008)

Cordillera Cowboy said:


> Yes. My target is 14 hands. But I haven't found one yet locally that will break 13. But our neighbors always comment on the one we have now about how big it is. One guy said "That's a big horse. In Baguio, they have big horses too. BIG (He raises his hands near his head.) And LOOONG!"
> 
> 
> Baguio is a touristy area about 400 kilometers into the Cordilleras from us.


That's about 249 miles??? I would make a horse hunting trip when the weather breaks ---- unless that 249 miles is almost impassable-----

The Dun is really cute. If you broke her and Skippy to drive together, they would be near-matching heights. If that isn't a possibility, I dunno ---- I'm only 5'2" and I wouldn't a horse that short.

My Arab was 13.3H. Had he been rideable for an adult, I would have been perfectly fine riding him but I would not have wanted him to be much shorter.:smile:


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

Yes, @*walkinthewalk* . We are planning that trip in the future. But the same system we've encountered locally of needing to know people who know people in searching for first the animal, and then the actual owner will also apply there. It will likely require multiple trips. Possibly one or more overnights. 


It's not really very far. It's estimated at 6 + hours in a regular car. But it is 400 3rd world kilometers through the Cordilleras, a range called the Backbone of Luzon The best roads are 2 lane concrete. Even they can be unexpectedly blocked for a day or more by a small landslide. 


Depending on the route, we will have to cross at least one provincial boundary. At each of these is an array of checkpoints meant to control criminal activity and agricultural pests and disease. They are staffed by 3rd world government officials, civil, police, and military. I anticipate being asked for various "fees" before being allowed to pass with an animal considered by most people here to be a luxury status symbol. There may be actual, legitimate fees and paperwork required to pass from one province to the other. I still have to research that aspect. And I want to know what is legitimate, and what may be some local official trying to squeeze a bit extra. 


I won't be too critical though. The Philippines has worked hard to be certified as brucellosis and hoof and mouth disease free by the World Health Organization. the marking and branding system, as well as these checkpoints are part of that success.


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## Chevaux (Jun 27, 2012)

Wow, that’s a lot of hoops to jump through. I’m thinking that dun looks a pretty darn good deal right now.


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

Our first trip up there will be primarily to buy tack. Wright Park Saddlery is the only saddle maker still in operation on the island of Luzon. That is likely our best shot at getting saddles to fit these small local horses. They have told me that they also make pack saddles. They may also be a good starting point for finding horses for sale.


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## walkinthewalk (Jul 23, 2008)

Chevaux said:


> Wow, that’s a lot of hoops to jump through. I’m thinking that dun looks a pretty darn good deal right now.


Yes, many complex hoops to jump thru ---- I agree the Dun is looking pretty good after all:cowboy:


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

I just double checked the mileage from our place to Baguio. Turns out it's only 135 kilometers, or about 83 miles. The calculator estimated 3.5 hours driving time. I've been on that road. I'm highly skeptical of the 3.5 hours. Even so, I calculated the average speed and came up with 38 kph, or 23 mph. That gives an indication of the road and terrain.


I looked for a photo of our last trip there. I only had one saved. It's a level stretch alongside a stream bed. But you can see the volcanic ridges that make up the Cordilleras.


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## walkinthewalk (Jul 23, 2008)

That's kinda what I had envisioned. 

That stretch of road resembles the maintenance roads winding thru the rock hills, where I lived, in Southern California. They made for good horse back riding. 

We always had to watch for Diamond Backs sunning on the road but, in the rock wall areas, we had to really be careful of Sidewinders lurking in the crevices.

Unless you wanted to do an overnighter on a horse that likely isn't well broke and not conditioned, I would think about riding the horse home "just because" :charge::charge::falloff::charge::charge:

Sorry ---- don't do that ^^^^^ --- my brain is still up for a challenged but the rest of me just sits here and talks about it these days:smileynotebook::beatup:


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

LOL. Eighty plus miles through mountainous terrain would be a tad more than an overnight.


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## Zexious (Aug 2, 2013)

Wow, this all sounds like quite the process!

A beautiful little road, though


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## walkinthewalk (Jul 23, 2008)

Cordillera Cowboy said:


> LOL. Eighty plus miles through mountainous terrain would be a tad more than an overnight.


Yes, that's more like a really long weekend, lollol

We used to cover 25-30 miles a day up in the Allegheny Mountains in PA. We always looped back to camp and I couldn't wait to get my horse fed/watered and fall into the tent --- that was already pitched, lollol

Your trek would be more like a wild Wild West ride ---- trying to get out of Tombstone, crossing the Divide and hoping you see Nob Hill again, lollol


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