# Quiet or Loud trainer



## Lonannuniel (Jun 13, 2008)

Do you find that trainers who have a very quiet way of being ( little to no talking, quieter speech, slower/less severe reactions, not as much show of affection (i.e don't pet, hug, kiss, etc. the horse for long or as often), and rely on their hands/body language/ect for discipline) have better or worse success than a louder, talkative trainer (who talks to the horse often, speaks loudly, uses vocal tones and volume for praise or discipline, shows the horse more affection, and reacts quicker/more severely)?

Have you found that one type or another gets quicker results from the horse? Or does one type work well with certain horses and not others?

I know alot depends on the horse, but I'm asking just in general


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## beau159 (Oct 4, 2010)

As a general "stereotypical" answer --> I prefer a trainer that is quiet and can get the horse to respond to them with almost invisible cues.


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## DuckDodgers (May 28, 2013)

For me or the horse? If the trainer is riding my horse, then I would prefer someone that rides quietly and effectively as opposed to one using drastic actions. They DO need to be able and willing to escalate their actions if necessary. I don't mean beat or scream at the horse and don't use a drastic action first, but be willing to get after them if necessary. 

Training the rider? I want someone that's able to verbally convey what they're trying to say from across the arena. You may be able to ride beautifully, but if you can't articulate what you're trying to say then it doesn't help much. And if you're soft-spoken and I can't hear what you're trying to say, then we're not gonna get very far. But, I don't want to feel like I'm being shouted at throughout the lesson. Basically, ride quietly and effectively, but be able to amp up the volume if necessary and during a lesson. 

Also, I wouldn't describe a "quiet" person as one that doesn't show affection. Someone may rub all over their horse, kiss them, show all kinds of affection (hopefully they wouldn't be doing tht to their student!) may also be a quiet, soft spoken rider and person.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I have never seen a loud trainer that gets good results from a horse. the horses are always tense and worried in such a situation.


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## disastercupcake (Nov 24, 2012)

In classical or traditional riding, the rider/trainer is always required to be as quiet as possible. 

Horses prefer a quietly confident and disciplined handler. It is true they can cope with a great many different things, but a happy horse is one that is handled with respect.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

If you're going to use verbal commands with a horse (which I do for on the ground training and in first stages under saddle you can't be talking to them all the time or they get confused. It has to be just the cues you're going to use and nothing more
If you use body language its much the same thing - you have to be very 'still' other than when you're using those body cues or the horse is constantly wondering if you want him to do something or not and will easily get stressed and start to overthink your every move


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## Incitatus32 (Jan 5, 2013)

I've had a loud trainer but she can be really quiet when needed with a more skittish animal. Honestly, I think she has and produces better horses than the quiet trainer I work with. She is very boisterous with an animal who is confident in her presence (or misbehaving) but is wise enough to tone it down when she first gets a horse or has a scared one. Heck, with my mare she screams shouts and cusses up one line and down the other and my girl throws her a dirty look. My gelding comes up for training and she's as quiet as a mouse with him. Her riding is very subtle and almost invisible cues believe it or not. 

I don't think 'loud' or 'quiet' makes a better or worse trainer. I think it's the trainers actions that make a good horse. I've seen quiet trainers who beat the holy crap out of their horses and terrify them more than the loud ones. I worked with a quiet trainer once who was just like you described; his horses were scared to death of him. My trainer her horses adore her. I also think it has a lot to do with body language. For example: I can yell at my mare to stop doing something and she just looks at me, I can do the same with my gelding and he gives me the same look. My body posture throughout this is very non threatening despite my voice being loud. So I like the mix between trainers, sometimes horses need a loud reminder and sometimes they need a quiet one but a good trainer is one who can use them at the right time and place for the horse. 

It's become a joke between trainers around here that we're some of the loudest trainers around because we'll be standing in a roundpen and see the horse go to unlock the gate and scream like we're being killed. :lol: The horses just eat their hay and enjoy the show.


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## jmike (Aug 21, 2013)

wish mine was a little louder -- hard to hear her over the creaking/squeeking of my saddle


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## paintedpastures (Jun 21, 2011)

I think a trainer that is quiet in their demeanor is better working with horse than the loud more abrupt. My trainer is quiet & slow working around horses . Able to read & communicate with them well. She definitely can become assertive/firm with them when necessary to gain respect,know cause my filly has seen that:lol: As a coach I have learned alot, but do find at lessons she can be too quiet at times, sometimes have trouble hearing her directions:lol:


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## EliRose (Aug 12, 2012)

DuckDodgers said:


> For me or the horse? If the trainer is riding my horse, then I would prefer someone that rides quietly and effectively as opposed to one using drastic actions. They DO need to be able and willing to escalate their actions if necessary. I don't mean beat or scream at the horse and don't use a drastic action first, but be willing to get after them if necessary.
> 
> Training the rider? I want someone that's able to verbally convey what they're trying to say from across the arena. You may be able to ride beautifully, but if you can't articulate what you're trying to say then it doesn't help much. And if you're soft-spoken and I can't hear what you're trying to say, then we're not gonna get very far. But, I don't want to feel like I'm being shouted at throughout the lesson. Basically, ride quietly and effectively, but be able to amp up the volume if necessary and during a lesson.
> 
> Also, I wouldn't describe a "quiet" person as one that doesn't show affection. Someone may rub all over their horse, kiss them, show all kinds of affection (hopefully they wouldn't be doing tht to their student!) may also be a quiet, soft spoken rider and person.


^Basically my opinion as well. Trainers who are just loud in general (both riding cues, actions, and voice) never seem to be very good. I think a trainer needs a sense of humor, though. Both with green horses and students. I can't stand trainers who get ****ed at the slightest mistake. Ugh!


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## ~*~anebel~*~ (Aug 21, 2008)

Honestly it's whatever gets the job done.

Personally, I can go all day at the barn without saying a word  but I know others who are constantly talking to their horses.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

There's a difference between loud and commanding
I worked for a tiny elderly lady that could say 'jump' in such a way that even the barn rats would be asking 'How high?'


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## Zexious (Aug 2, 2013)

I have lessoned for many years, and with a whole variety of trainers.

Frankly, I'm with anabel. I really like an authoritative figure in the ring. If they are capable trainers, and I am learning, I don't care how they get the job done. I've had reasonably quiet trainers, and I've had some that acted like they were ready to kill someone. xD


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## DanielDauphin (Mar 11, 2014)

People who talk to horses, out loud, are doing it for their own benefit. It doesn't really affect the horse one way or the other. I know plenty of both types who are quite good, and I know plenty of both types who aren't very good at all. There is a lot to be said for the matching of the horse's personality to the rider's personality. No matter how talented or skilled a trainer, there's a certain type of horse that they click with and another type that they don't get along with nearly as well. That matters way more than talkativeness.


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## spirit1215 (Mar 11, 2014)

I have seen a quiet trainer work miracles with horses however, if a horse is aggressive or dangerous, I'd want a loud trainer to nip the behavior in the butt. It all depends on the horse, but I prefer a louder trainer to train ME so I can get things right


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## TrailTraveler (Jan 4, 2014)

My trainer is hard of hearing and speaks quite loudly. So loudly that I've opted to take private lessons because I don't like being corrected quite so loudly in front of other riders. And yes, I need a lot of correction, so it seems like she is constantly yelling at me. 

But I always go back for more because she is awesome as an instructor! Tough as nails, but incredibly effective. Three lessons with her have brought me farther than three months at the facility where I previously boarded. My feeling: Go ahead and yell -- as long as it's instructive and not abusive.


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## Zexious (Aug 2, 2013)

Daniel--I'm not sure that's true. Unless I'm not understanding what you're saying? What about verbal cues?


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## DanielDauphin (Mar 11, 2014)

Verbal cues are fine, and can be quite effective. I guess I was taking her to mean people who "talk" to horses. People talk for their own benefit. They are either self soothing, or explaining to an imagined, or real audience, but either way it's of no concern or benefit for the horse. Not good. Not bad. Not important either way. If you like to talk you way through things, fine. Just don't talk yourself into believing that it helps the horse. That being said, if talking keeps you calmer or more focused, then your perceived state will benefit the horse, but again, it's because of how it affects you, not the horse.
Here's a good video on the topic.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0v-mvgEt6MQ

Everyone knows the the natural language of the horse is Portuguese anyways, so unless you're in Portugal or Brazil, it's just a waste...


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## DanielDauphin (Mar 11, 2014)

If you want to learn how to be effective in your communication with horses, the best teacher is horses themselves. People tend to really want all of this stuff to be super gentle and smooth, but in reality the language of horses is not a vocal one at all, and it is absolutely full of threats and violence. 
If you don't believe me, let's put ten unfamiliar horses in a nice safe enclosed arena and place one bucket of feed in the center, and we'll come back tomorrow and check on them. You and I both know that they would have less hair on them tomorrow than when we turned them loose. THAT is the language of the horse. 
Not that I am suggesting that we need to beat on our horses to get things done. Merely that we be realistic about what horses really are. I don't ride unicorns, I ride real horses.


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## Zexious (Aug 2, 2013)

Daniel--How is the natural language of the horse Portuguese? If horses had any aptitude to actually learn language, it would be regional. It would be no different than any other animal, or human. No different than how German Shepherds are taught German commands in Academies, but can learn and respond just as well to English commands depending on where they are taught.

I also don't think it's unreasonable to believe that the sound of a familiar voice can soothe a horse. If it is of no consequence, why do they 'listen' at all?

I feel this is all pretty off topic anyway, since the question retained to a trainer speaking to a student, not a horse.


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## DanielDauphin (Mar 11, 2014)

Zexius May I offer you the original question? 

"Do you find that trainers who have a very quiet way of being ( little to no talking, quieter speech, slower/less severe reactions, not as much show of affection (i.e don't pet, hug, kiss, etc. the horse for long or as often), and rely on their hands/body language/ect for discipline) have better or worse success than a louder, talkative trainer (who talks to the horse often, speaks loudly, uses vocal tones and volume for praise or discipline, shows the horse more affection, and reacts quicker/more severely)?"

I don't know why I thought the OP was referring to how a trainer relates to a horse. My mistake. 
The Portuguese thing was an apparently non-universally understood attempt at sarcasm... Sorry for confusing you. 
You can continue to challenge away, but I'm done...


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## xJumperx (Feb 19, 2012)

I agree with many others - I want a trainer that will get after ME and whip ME into shape, but when it comes to my horse, I want them to have the softest cues possible.


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## Zexious (Aug 2, 2013)

Daniel--I wasn't trying to challenge anyone, just having a conversation about the subject at hand xD

About missing the sarcasm--my bad. I'm never good at reading it over a computer screen /apparentlydumb xD


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## Maisie12 (Apr 16, 2013)

A lot of instructors fail to identify the difference between 'shouting' and 'projecting' their voice. Big difference, but to a lot it means the same thing. A good trainer will effectively project their voice in any environment, communicate & engage in constant feedback with the rider and ensure the coaching environment is safe and promotes learning. You can't achieve any of that if you are loud, shouting and reactive. Also there's a massive difference between reacting and responding. Another detail which is sadly overlooked by many.


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## ZaneyZanne123 (Nov 9, 2013)

How about one that uses both (depending on the situation at hand.)? I am quiet and I beleive that being quiet and deliberate with actions and, most important consistantcy, gets more results. Be loud when being loud is nessesary otherwise be quiet and use body language, specific cues, and actions without much voice. Now I do pet and spend time with the animal but I am not much on verbal language and beleive that its not nessesary esp since horses rely more on body language than verbal language. I have observed that low tones are more effective than higher tones. Example if I am lunging a horse and want him or her to trot or walk or what have you then I simply state "trot" in a low tone, one sylable and I enunciate the word. If the horse doesnt know the verbal comand then I put in action (ie driving him/her from the rear or use a lunging whip behind the hip not hitting the animal, just to encourage a faster gait) along with the word "trot" in the same tone. When the horse trots then I back off and relax my body movement and etc. This is the reward. If the animal drops back to a walk out of the trot I repeat the process then back off when I get the result thus reward. 
I have seen what screaming or yelling or loudness can create.....a nervous horse (esp if the person is inconsistant). Shrill voices and unessesary noise is nerve wracking to me so I can only imagine what an animal who's life is based on mostly body language can feel. In a herd, at liberty horses are generaly not loud. A well managed herd where pecking orders have been established and no danger is lurking about it is quiet calm and relaxing. Horses like that is signifies harmony. Excessive noise and movement causes disharmony and can signifie danger to an animal that of prey. It also expresses confusion. I will use a sooting voice and slow deliberate actions when I am trying to calm a horse down. 
Sometimes I will yell if the horse is misbehaving (along with action). I want a horse to think he is going to get killed if he repeats the behavior again (ie biting) If he/she bites I use immediate action with a booming voice. I want him/her to think "Oh crap I bit that person and I am going to die". Self preservation is a HUGE motivation to change behavior quickly esp with such behavior issues like biting. Of course this is limited to serious behavior issues such as biting and the likes not for every day training issues.

So I believe be loud when nessesary otherwise be quiet. 

As far as teaching a rider, excessive loudness can create nervousness also. Assertive action, yes for you want to convey the message but barking out orders to me is not nessesary. I do occasionaly get more firm and "growl" when I need to otherwise I just dont find it productive. I rarely have to bark or get realy agressive. The only time I had to get agressive was when a student's friend was on the side line yelling out to the student repeating everything I had said and was being EXTREMELY annoying.


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## ZaneyZanne123 (Nov 9, 2013)

The words you use dont matter its the tone you use. I can be calling the horse a bag of nag bones and but its the tone I use either way it helps in calming the animal down. Its the tone, pronunciation basic sound of a word not the word itself that the animal learns. For example. If I have trained a horse to trot on verbal command using one sylable in a low tone I can use another word of similarity using the same tone, and one sylable and the horse will respond. I can say the word Fought inplace of the word trot using the same tone and one sylable and a horse that understands the verbal cue will respond. I wanted to know if its the tone (i may not be using the right word in that, phonics if you will) in which a word is said or the word itself that a horse learns. So I took out my trusty steed who was well trained for verbal cues when lunged and I had some "fun". THe observations where intresting to say the least. Since she paced instead of trotted the word of such was taught. I asked her to "pace" verbally. One syllable, no drawl, no warbling and well enunciated. She paced right on. I aksed her to come back to a walk and she did. I then asked her to race in the same tone/phonic and etc as I would the word pace. VIOLA she paced. I then asked her to "mace" and again she paced. I asked her to do several similar words and every time she responded with a pacing gaite. Then I asked her to pace with a long drawl. No response, I use a drawl when I ask for a walk and when I asked her to walk from a pace using one short syllable and abrupt clip I got nothing. I asked for balk using the same drawl, tone and phonic of the word walk that I use and she responded to walking. Its not the word itself but the sound of the word and its association of an action. (learned by repitition and consistancy)in any language one speaks. Humans learn the word itself for one can say it in any manner (language specify) and know what it means. I can say the word walk in a southern drawl but a northern still understands the word, it just sounds funny to them. When an english person says the word "canter ". It sounds different to me but I still understand the actual word regardless of its tone and etc. and its meaning. 

With a horse you can say walk (if he is taught to respond to the verbal command) in spanish but if the tone, syllables and phonic is not the same he/she will not respond. If it is the same then the animal will respond. 

For those with horses that have learned a "verbal command" go out and have some fun and try what I am talking about you might be suprised.


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## Saddlebred11 (Mar 27, 2014)

As my personal like teaching me to ride trainer I would say quiet. As a young person it is important to me that she respects me as much as I respect her. Often I feel that loud trainers that yell don't get respect and don't get any better of a result then a quiet trainer. I want my trainer to be able to give me a disappointed look and have me unhappy with myself. Where as I feel that a loud trainer feels the need to yell or scream to tell you what you did well.
I went through a time in which I had no confidence and a loud trainer yelling would have broken me completely, where as my trainer tried to relate and would occasionally give me that eye roll and look at the ground. That eye roll is enough to get me unhappy with myself. Though some kids maybe don't care as much what their trainer thinks. However I am pretty sure my trainer is perfect lol(not really but pretty freakin close)
However she does baby talk horses quite a bit. SOo she talks to the horses just isn't abrasive or anything in training.
So in all I say quiet, yet respected thaty you can't walk all over but isn't walking all over you.


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## Pagancat (Feb 11, 2013)

Saddlebred11 said:


> As my personal like teaching me to ride trainer I would say quiet. As a young person it is important to me that she respects me as much as I respect her....


I have one of those right now. Not only does she yell, but she will multi-repeat whatever she's yelling in the first place : "elbow, Elbow ELBOW ELBOW!" at which point I either get completely confused or shut down and don't hear anything anyway. I know it's her style, and most of the time I don't take it personally, but there have been at least a couple of times that it upset me.

Because of that and a few other things, I think I'm either going to cut it waaaaayyyyy back or get another trainer, completely. Which is too bad, because she has some excellent points. :?


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## damianabem (Jul 31, 2014)

EliRose said:


> ^Basically my opinion as well. Trainers who are just loud in general (both riding cues, actions, and voice) never seem to be very good. I think a trainer needs a sense of humor, though. Both with green horses and students. I can't stand trainers who get ****ed at the slightest mistake. Ugh!


Couldn't agree more. My last trainer not only didn't respect my limits but also couldn't stand students making mistakes. He use to yell at us, make us whip the horses if they didn't jump and so on. :-(

Find someone who understands and respects your (and your horse) limitations and that encourages you to step up in the right time. Also this person should know when to be quiet and to be firm and totally agree with the sense of humor thing. Studies have shown the good impact of humor when teaching and as I former teacher myself I know it makes a difference. Good luck!


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## Westernpleasurelover (Aug 18, 2014)

I prefer a quite trainer who is vocal only when needed because your end goal is being able to communicate with your horse using undetectable q's.


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