# Tom Thumb Bit, Bad? why?



## kewpalace (Jul 17, 2013)

Here ya go: The Trouble with Tom Thumb.

And I'm sure others will chime in....


----------



## Kcates11 (Dec 29, 2014)

I've read this article, and I completely agree with it, but this friend I'm talking about is much older than I am, and I'm not quite sure how to tell her that the bit is the reason she has had problems with him all these years. Thank you for this though, I want her to know that this isn't just my personal opinion about the bit, I want her to know that I'm trying to help her.


----------



## kewpalace (Jul 17, 2013)

So print it out and give it to her and tell her you agree with Mark Rashid's assessment of the bit. Mark Rashid is a respected clinician/trainer. It may take her a while, even after hearing others opinion, to change her mind. And then again, she may never change her mind. Some people actually think there is no problem with the bit.


----------



## Kcates11 (Dec 29, 2014)

Thank you so much! I really hope that she realizes that she shouldn't be using this bit very soon, because it kills me to see her using it on a horse I love so much. His name is T.J.


----------



## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

Some people have excellent success with Tom Thumb bits. Some horses go great in them.

Some of what Mark Rashid wrote simply does not happen. For example:

"pulling on the rein results in the shank turning and tipping into the left side of the horse's face"

Does not happen. When you pull back on the left rein, it tightens on the left side first. It does not dig into the left side of the face. If you pull out on the left side, it pulls the bit to the left. The shank does not swivel with the top of the shank turning into the face. If you stand next to your horse's face and watch, you can see for yourself that Rashid is incorrect.

"If this wasn't bad enough, tipping the shank also results in the tightening up of the curb strap that is under the horse's chin."

This also does not happen. Not with a pull away. A pull back will tighten the left side and also tighten the curb strap on that side, but you probably should not be relying on big motions of direct reining while using a curb. Small motions will be OK.

"However, because the Tom Thumb has so many moving parts, even the lightest pressure during neck reining with it often results in the shifting of the bit. Again, the shanks tip and turn causing the curb strap to tighten, the mouthpiece to collapse and the horse to become confused."

Again, this does not happen. I've tried it and could not replicate it.

"If you are currently using a Tom Thumb snaffle or any other type of similar bit and you are happy with the way your horse is responding, then by all means, don't switch it."

I'll agree with that. If the horse is happy with bit X, be happy for the horse.

That doesn't mean I love Tom Thumb bits. They are straight bits, with no curve to the shank. If the horse rides with his face vertical, it will be a balanced bit. If the horse rides with his face at a 45 deg angle, and many western horses do, then the weight of the reins will rotate the shank 45 deg so their weight is directly below the mouthpiece.

This means all the slack in the curb is removed by the weight of the reins. The curb strap is snugged against the horse's jaw, and any movement of the reins will apply pressure to the horse's mouth.

If the shanks are bent, such as is sometimes called a grazing bit, then their weight will leave them in the neutral position. There will still be 45-60 deg of rotation by the shanks prior to the curb strap tightening. That is important because it give the horse warning. It is a precise cue - a rotating mouthpiece - that does not apply pressure - not until the curb strap tightens. Used properly, you can teach the horse to respond in this 'no pressure' range, and be cued for a stop by a few degrees of rotation. It is one of the best features of a western curb, but the Tom Thumb takes that away (if your horse's head is not carried vertically).

A neutral balance to the bit - the weight of the reins hold the bit in the un-rotated position: 










You say, " the bit is the reason she has had problems with him all these years". Maybe. Maybe not. A rider who tries to hold their horse back with the reins can cause problems in ANY bit, including any snaffle. A rider who doesn't give release as quickly as possible when the horse gets the right answer will cause problems. When I started riding, I made a mess of my horse's mouth with a simple snaffle. Switching to a curb combined with proper use of the bit fixed her. 

She'll now go fine in a simple snaffle, but the problem wasn't the bit. The problem was how I used the bit.

However, if you think the TT is making the problem worse, you might try a positive approach. Rather than telling her it is bad, try telling her a different bit might be better - that some horses really click with a certain style of bit.

My horse, for example, clicked with a Billy Allen curb bit. It was as if a light came on. Some horses like more room for their tongue. Rather than risk getting her upset by saying she is using a bad bit, perhaps you could simply recommend trying a bit with more tongue relief:










Saddles Tack Horse Supplies - ChickSaddlery.com Francois Gauthier Antique Hinged Futurity Bit

Others, like my mare, prefer pressure on the tongue to pressure on the bars. She does great with this:










The bit above is mechanically better than a Tom Thumb. Besides the bend in the shanks, it swivels easier and cleaner. It does not ever bend in the middle, making any poking impossible. It will not pinch her lips. It will also never, ever catch the horse's cheek between the bit and the molars, which a Tom Thumb can do.

Saying, "Your bit is bad" is a lot like saying, "You're a bad rider". It puts the person on the defense. A positive approach, such as, "I've heard a lot of folks have had good results with this bit" gives nothing to be defensive about. Tom Thumb bits are not total evil, but there are much better bits available.

But a lot depends on how she uses the bit. Both of the bits I showed can give terrible results if used incorrectly, as can a snaffle.

This is an excellent thread (and a 'sticky'). It can give you ideas of a lot of bits that are better than a Tom Thumb. Since better ones exist, there is only one reason to stick with a Tom Thumb - and that is if the horse goes well in one.

http://www.horseforum.com/horse-tack-equipment/bit-information-curb-western-type-bits-69588/​


----------



## Kcates11 (Dec 29, 2014)

Thank you! I know I should have worded that better, Its not because I'm automatically blaming it on the bit, there are several factors that I have put together that have helped me to conclude that the bit is most likely the issue at hand. She has soft hands, but is using the tom thumb as a contact bit, and the only time her horse gives her trouble, is when she rides him in the tom thumb. He goes great in a snaffle (in my opinion) but she is nervous while riding him, and im not, which I think is a big contributing factor.


----------

