# Age to break colt to bit?



## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Two is a good age, bit him out now, get him used to it. I would then leave him over winter and come back to it in the spring...just because that is the way I have always done it..


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

Golden Horse said:


> Two is a good age, bit him out now, get him used to it. I would then leave him over winter and come back to it in the spring...just because that is the way I have always done it..


Okay, thanks. Any specific reason you've always done it that way? 😉


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## enh817 (Jun 1, 2012)

I don't put a bit in their mouths until after they've had a handful of rides in a halter. I don't put a saddle on them, or do much of anything else, until the day I go to start riding them. 
If you're planning on sending the horse to a trainer to be started, they'd probably prefer the horse to have been messed with as little as possible. I know that's how I prefer the horses I start.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

enh817 said:


> I don't put a bit in their mouths until after they've had a handful of rides in a halter. I don't put a saddle on them, or do much of anything else, until the day I go to start riding them.
> If you're planning on sending the horse to a trainer to be started, they'd probably prefer the horse to have been messed with as little as possible. I know that's how I prefer the horses I start.


We certainly won't be sending him off somewhere. I want to be able to monitor what's happening, and keep him home. I want someone who will come to us. Plus we don't have a trailer *blushgrin*


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

LilyandPistol said:


> Okay, thanks. Any specific reason you've always done it that way? 😉


Because that is how it was always done 

It still makes sense to me, their first year you halter break, get them to lead, tie, lift feet etc, the throw them out to play.

Year two, reinforce that early training, add bit and sack them out and saddle them, throw them out for the winter.

Year three, repeat year two, but now you are doing ground work and preparing to ride. In the fall put the first few rides on them, throw them out for the winter.

Year 4, quick run through year 3 and then they are away, going to be riding out, learning new things, but still being respectful that they are babies, so ,mainly flat work.

Many people do it differently, but I have never seen anything to convince me that horses mature any earlier now than they ever did, and many centuries of experience in starting youngsters, led to this wisdom, and it's good enough for me.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

Golden Horse said:


> Because that is how it was always done
> 
> It still makes sense to me, their first year you halter break, get them to lead, tie, lift feet etc, the throw them out to play.
> 
> ...


I think I like this theory. 
But I'm not exactly 100% sure what the term 'sacking out' means. I've heard it several times but what exactly does it mean? Is it like desensitizing?


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

I used to put a bit in the mouth when a long yearling, with either a D ring or loose ring snaffle. Not too thick. There'd be a lot of mouthing going on at first as the colt tries to get rid of this foreign object. We kept them in a box stall and fed them hay. At first, so as not to sore up the gums the bit was worn maybe 20 min. daily for a week then gradually increased. A good sign is when it eats hay. It is better to have the colt wear the bit at least several times weekly to help toughen the gums. A long absence means a tender mouth again.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

^Yes to your last question Lily. You can start getting horses used to stuff at any age really, and on that note, I'd be starting the desensitising a lot earlier than 3rd year, as 'the more the merrier' as far as practice - the sooner you start, the sooner they get solid with stuff. While I might sit on & do some very little riding of a 3-4yo, agree also with Golden that wouldn't be doing any 'real' riding till the horse was at least 4-5yo, for physical reasons.

So for me, *wearing* a bit can be one thing you can start early, but I personally want my horses going really well in a halter/bitless first, both on the ground & ridden, so don't tend to even put a bit in their mouth for a while after that's going well.

BTW, nice looking head, but at first glance, the pic you posted, I thought 'major parrot mouth - going to be hard finding a comfortable bit'.... but it was just that I didn't 'see' the white bit of his bottom lip - thought it ended with the dark bit! Not sure if it was my eyes or brain that did that!


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

loosie said:


> ^Yes to your last question Lily. You can start getting horses used to stuff at any age really, and on that note, I'd be starting the desensitising a lot earlier than 3rd year, as 'the more the merrier' as far as practice - the sooner you start, the sooner they get solid with stuff. While I might sit on & do some very little riding of a 3-4yo, agree also with Golden that wouldn't be doing any 'real' riding till the horse was at least 4-5yo, for physical reasons.
> 
> So for me, *wearing* a bit can be one thing you can start early, but I personally want my horses going really well in a halter/bitless first, both on the ground & ridden, so don't tend to even put a bit in their mouth for a while after that's going well.
> 
> BTW, nice looking head, but at first glance, the pic you posted, I thought 'major parrot mouth - going to be hard finding a comfortable bit'.... but it was just that I didn't 'see' the white bit of his bottom lip - thought it ended with the dark bit! Not sure if it was my eyes or brain that did that!


About the 1st part- of course, I hope to convince Paw to wait until he's at least 3 to start him, and we don't ride that much anyway (lucky if we get to once a week) so I figure maybe start him at 3 and not do much until he's almost done growing.

Second part- I like that idea, but problem is I'm not sure if Paw will allow that. He's very pro-bit, unfortunately.

Third part- Lol! Yeah, Mav is known to be a little trickster! *giggle* He knows he's handsome, but I'm sure he appreciates the recognition! XD Thanks.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

Saddlebag said:


> I used to put a bit in the mouth when a long yearling, with either a D ring or loose ring snaffle. Not too thick. There'd be a lot of mouthing going on at first as the colt tries to get rid of this foreign object. We kept them in a box stall and fed them hay. At first, so as not to sore up the gums the bit was worn maybe 20 min. daily for a week then gradually increased. A good sign is when it eats hay. It is better to have the colt wear the bit at least several times weekly to help toughen the gums. A long absence means a tender mouth again.


Thank yah


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## PaintHorseMares (Apr 19, 2008)

We get the 2 year olds used to the saddle, then the bit, and then leave them alone for the winter. We use a D-ring eggbutt snaffle and start with getting them used to the bridle/bit without reins and then add the reins and walk them around. Some take the bit easily and some don't. Our current 2 year colt was an easy one. After 5-10 seconds of mouthing the bit, he said "OK, what's next?" ;-)


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## enh817 (Jun 1, 2012)

LilyandPistol said:


> We certainly won't be sending him off somewhere. I want to be able to monitor what's happening, and keep him home. I want someone who will come to us. Plus we don't have a trailer *blushgrin*



My same advice still applies. I would wait and let the trainer do it, and ask them to teach you as they go.


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

First the bit
You should use anon leverage bit-thus the snaffle. (can also use a non leverage bittless devise )
No curbs or TT, which is a curb also, though a poor one
Far as when. I never bitted horses until I was ready to start them under saddle
Far as when- most of our horses were started in the spring or fall of their three year old year.
The only horses I started as two year olds, were those aimed at some futurity.
There is no reason to bit a yearling, unless you are pushing towards some reining or other young horse futurity
Whether you chose to use a D ring snaffle, o ring, full cheek or egg butt, depends on personal preference, but you should learn the difference, and why these different snaffles are used, and their slight difference in functioning, beyond all being non leverage
There are only two main types of snaffles, and both can have a variety of design, far as mouth piece.
Fixed mouth piece, like a D ring, full cheek, egg butt
Loose -like an o ring
I do agree that given your experience, wait and let the trainer do it.
Any trainer would rather have ahorse that has not been handled much, versus one that has learned bad habits that must be un taught, before real training can begin
Since you have never started a young horse and are sending him to a trainer, I agree with enh


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

Smilie said:


> First the bit
> You should use anon leverage bit-thus the snaffle. (can also use a non leverage bittless devise )
> No curbs or TT, which is a curb also, though a poor one
> Far as when. I never bitted horses until I was ready to start them under saddle
> ...


Okies, but about that last part, maybe you just typoed but I'm *not* sending him to a trainer, we're getting one to come to us. Plus I think Paw is dead set on training him to take a bit ourselves. And soon. Because when you guys said 2 is an ok age to start bit training I felt super relieved because I probably couldn't have talked Paw out of it anyway.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

enh817 said:


> My same advice still applies. I would wait and let the trainer do it, and ask them to teach you as they go.


Wish I could but Pawreally wants to go ahead and do it. Plus, I don't think he's much gonna want to get out a trainer until we have to. Sadness.  He likes to do stuff himself. If you want to know how much so, one day I mentioned that maybe we should get some trainer help with something with Pistol (not Mav, different horse) and when I told him most people wind up needing a trainer now and then, he was like, "Yeah, but I'm not most people." Even though I was the one who took lessons for a while and tried to keep in touch with the equestrian community and he didn't, apparently my word is still to be taken as a grain of salt... But whatever. I hate how (most, not all) adults normally just ignore kids because they think we don't know anything. Look, I don't know everything, I know, but that doesn't mean people should not even consider anything I say just because I'm a minor. Rant over.


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

yes, it must be tough, asking advise, and getting advise that is helpful, but not being able to act on it, because you are a minor!
The consultation being, you won't always be!


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## enh817 (Jun 1, 2012)

Yes, sometimes being a kid stinks! I commend you for trying to educate yourself though and do what's best. 

Like I said, I don't hang a bit in their mouth until after they've been ridden a handful of times. I start everything in a halter. 
Other people do things differently though.


Also, something to realize is that it's probably going to cost you more money to have a trainer come out to you, because they have to take the time out of their day to load up all their equipment, drive to you, talk to you for a while, do what they need to do with the horse, talk to you some more, then drive back. They are going to want to be compensated not only for the work they do with your horse, but all the other time out of their day when they could've been riding other horses, and the miles they had to drive to get there. 
I charge $750 a month for training, which includes feed and board. The horse gets ridden 5-6 times a week, so that's 20-24 rides in a month. If someone wanted me to go out to them (which I probably wouldn't even do), I'd charge at least $50 a ride (maybe more, if it was going to take a lot of time out of my day) plus mileage, so that would be less than 15 rides for $750, and no feed or board included.


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

The going rate here, for a respected trainer, is $1000 a month, or more, with horses on cattle, costing more. Board and feed included
There are 'trainers' that come out to an individual' place, but most of these are pretty low level, not having a training barn of their own.
Established trainers will put on clinics, but don't come out to do 'custom barn call training'
Some of these trainers that come out,a round here, are more along the line of someone that has taken some horse coaching course, but are not even capable of starting that horse themselves. The total cost, then , is less, with the odd lesson, but the results are dismal, compared to having that horse in a good training 
program
Perhaps that is different, where you are


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## MomH (Sep 27, 2015)

Some good advice already offered. The only other thing I would add is to have an equine dentist check his mouth. Sometimes wolf teeth can be an issue and the dentist ought to be able to determine that. I know a lot of horses are probably bitted without this with no issues, but I've known the odd one where it was a concern.


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## enh817 (Jun 1, 2012)

Smilie said:


> The going rate here, for a respected trainer, is $1000 a month, or more, with horses on cattle, costing more. Board and feed included
> There are 'trainers' that come out to an individual' place, but most of these are pretty low level, not having a training barn of their own.
> Established trainers will put on clinics, but don't come out to do 'custom barn call training'
> Some of these trainers that come out,a round here, are more along the line of someone that has taken some horse coaching course, but are not even capable of starting that horse themselves. The total cost, then , is less, with the odd lesson, but the results are dismal, compared to having that horse in a good training
> ...


Yep, prices are about the same here. My boss charges $1000 a month, which includes board and feed and one lesson a week. I doubt he would ever make barn calls, unless someone was willing to pay a boatload of money. I would only consider it, because I am just starting out as a professional and don't have too many horses to ride at the moment. If I were as busy as my boss is, I wouldn't consider it without very good compensation.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

That is a pity that good trainers over there won't travel. I do understand why - it's easy for them to sit back at their own place & reap it in, not have to travel. And not have an 'audience', so they can do what they like, spend as much or little time as they like with the horse, charge agistment & feed on top of training... 

There are too many bad egs of horses being 'sent to trainers' only to be right royally stuffed up(my own horse being one of them years ago when I was too... pregnant & babified to train, & I thought I'd done enough research, checked him out with other horses - he was on his best behaviour obviously, turns out his 'apprentice' was the one that worked with my horse anyway!), so there are a lot of people who are very reticent to send a horse away anyway, and then there are the 10000's of people that do send their horse to a trainer, only to have problems when they return & they have no idea how to continue training their horse.... that I end up working with. I used to buy horses to 'retrain', but I wasn't interested in working with someone else's horse if they're not interested in being present, being part of it.


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## Kay Armstrong (Jun 28, 2015)

Anybody have suggestions for how we find good "colt breakers"? I won't be in the market for a couple of years, but I'd like to start looking for a good one.


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## Saranda (Apr 14, 2011)

I didn't read all the answers, sorry.

Personally, I don't start with the bit itself. At the age of this colt, I'd play with his mouth with a thumb in the corner of his mouth, then a soft rope in his mouth as a bit, holding it softly for a few seconds and letting him chew on it, then releasing at a moment of relaxation. When a colt is okay with a rope, I proceed to a bit, holding it in my hand an letting them explore, introducing it only very gently, without a bridle first. 

Only after they are willing to take it without a bridle, I'd actually bit them in a full setup. When they are ready for that, I like bridling them, putting a halter on under the bridle, leading by the halter then and going for long walks, in which they can play with the bit and chew on it without being interfered. 

Ideally, I'd leave them alone after that for at least while the winter lasts.


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

loosie said:


> That is a pity that good trainers over there won't travel. I do understand why - it's easy for them to sit back at their own place & reap it in, not have to travel. And not have an 'audience', so they can do what they like, spend as much or little time as they like with the horse, charge agistment & feed on top of training...
> 
> There are too many bad egs of horses being 'sent to trainers' only to be right royally stuffed up(my own horse being one of them years ago when I was too... pregnant & babified to train, & I thought I'd done enough research, checked him out with other horses - he was on his best behaviour obviously, turns out his 'apprentice' was the one that worked with my horse anyway!), so there are a lot of people who are very reticent to send a horse away anyway, and then there are the 10000's of people that do send their horse to a trainer, only to have problems when they return & they have no idea how to continue training their horse.... that I end up working with. I used to buy horses to 'retrain', but I wasn't interested in working with someone else's horse if they're not interested in being present, being part of it.




Yes, there is that danger, sending a horse out, but well known trainers here, as mentioned, after the first month ,offer one lesson a month, along with that training fee. One can also ride/work with that trainer on a regular basis, along with the horse, and many serious non pros do so
We have have real winter,and along one. Trainers have indoor arenas, stalls etc, which many owners do not have.
Yes, at one time I started colts just out in a pasture, but those were my own horses, and I would not expect any trainer to use whatever ground some some might have
Then there is the fact that good proven trainers have more than enough horses to work with, and the good ones can ever be selective, as to which horses they even take for training

Also, most of those trainers don't even put that first month or so on horses, but ride them when they are ready for more advanced training. They have apprentices riding those colts, same as an intern or resident medical program I have a ;friend;, that took a horse coaching clinic,and that makes money travelling around, helping beginning riders with their horses, but that doe snot mean she really 'trains any colts, or gets on those green horses

If you are truly making a living training horses, to how many different places can you travel each day, working with one individual and their horse, and make a living


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

Kay Armstrong said:


> Anybody have suggestions for how we find good "colt breakers"? I won't be in the market for a couple of years, but I'd like to start looking for a good one.


I second that question!


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

I'm with Loosie here. I still would prefer a trainer to come out to us, rather than the other way around, unless I knew them very well and could be sure they would take their job seriously- and that my horse was being cared for while being trained.
One of the things about sending him away would also be, it would break my heart to have to. There's something about that that I don't like. 
Besides all that, I actually know a person who may have started colts before (I'm not 100% sure) and if she has, she would be a good person for the job- she is pretty deticated, and I know she wouldn't do anything questionable- and if she did, she'd probably have a reason. Anyway, I've never actually known her to accept horses coming to her barn to train, but she has been out before to train Pistol (different horse.) Which means she wouldn't mind coming out, most likely. But I'd have to ask her if she has started colts before. She's mentioned it but she may have just been mentioning it in general. 
She also happens to be Pistol's (not Mav's) previous owner.

The best thing about if she could do it is that she doesn't mind teaching the owner what she's doing.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

Is this an acceptable bit to start off trying?
https://thecowboyshoponline.com/det...ee--3Piece-Sweet-Iron-Snaffle-with-Roller.htm 
I like the fact that it has a roller. Maybe that will help him like wearing it.
I tried the snaffle I own (which is actually a d-ring :O) on him and he did really well, IMO. He took it in about 5 sec, but he did chew on it a lot.


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