# Banning Pit Bulls.



## Small_Town_Girl (Feb 15, 2008)

It was my family's own Pit Bull who busted into my pony's pen
and did a brutal number on her leg, she died not long after.
And no he is not a violent dog and we raised him right...I have
no idea why he did it.  

You hear all the time in the media about vicious Pit Bull attacks
on humans and animals, some of them like our dog...non
violent..or so they thought after they attack another dog,
animal, or an innocent bystander after getting loose.

Just earlier this year, I read a story online that just pulled at
myheart strings, it was a man that was attacked by a Pit 
and literally had to have $1,000,000 worth of surgery done
to his arm.

I love dogs, I am not on any side..I was just wanting everyones 
elses opinion on the matter.


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## my2geldings (Feb 18, 2008)

I honestly don't know anything about the particular breed of dog. Just like horses these poor dogs were bred for fighting and I think unfortunately many of them have a natural instinct to defend themselves or attack when they are put in a certain situation.

Could they be trained to be like your more typical house dog? I think they probably can be trained but I don't know if that's enough to get that behavior out completely.

Just my opinion, I honestly don't know anything about those poor dogs.


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## Small_Town_Girl (Feb 15, 2008)

My2Geldings said:


> I honestly don't know anything about the particular breed of dog. Just like horses these poor dogs were bred for fighting and I think unfortunately many of them have a natural instinct to defend themselves or attack when they are put in a certain situation.


I couldn't agree with you more. Myself, I remain undecided on
the issue.


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## Vidaloco (Sep 14, 2007)

There are countys here that have bans or special laws in place for pit bulls. I wish they could just enforce the dog fight laws instead. I think any dog can be a killer in the right circumstances. I have 4 Scottish Terriers and I wouldn't trust any of them not to bite a stranger or kill another strange animal. They weren't bred to fight but they were bred to kill critters.


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## buckaroo2010 (Nov 7, 2007)

I really dont know bout this on but I know I dont think I would ever want one of them dogs :?


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## barefoothooves (Sep 6, 2007)

I think any dog has the potential to do harm. My mom had a wonderful pit bull (she got it on the side of the road as a puppy thinking it was a lab??? :roll: ) and it was sweet dog.

I was a kid and my own lab bit me (I had it coming and he let go as soon as he did it-I stepped on him in his sleep, so it was accident). And later I had a medium sized mutt of retreiver type blood that attatcked me and ripped up my arm, but I don't think it was a breed thing..it was an owner thing..

i have nothing against people having pit bulls. Just apply the same rules as you would any dog-don't let it roam, teach it manners , FEED it and give it attention and don't fight them.


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## geewillikers (May 4, 2008)

Pit bulls are animal aggressive. They are bred to be that way, and it is very difficult to train it out of them. They are known for killing livestock, small animals and other dogs. It is one of the only American breeds, and it doesn't surprise me that we started to breed such a controversial creature.

However, I have two pitbull mix companions. They are awesome dogs. I think blame for any pitbul attack remains on the owner. As much as your dog is a sweetheart and loves your baby, or loves your kitty, there is no way I would trust a pitbull around them. Pitbulls need to be leashed, behind a secure fence, and socialized under supervision. Just as people misread horse language, people misread dog language, and signs of aggression are obvious if you know what to look for. 

I don't think any dog should be banned. The top dog on the "biting list", that I've seen, is the poodle (toy, standard, mini, whatever). I've never been bit by a big dog, just chihuahuas, min pins and poodles. Golden Retrievers are known for biting also. The difference with Pitbulls is that they are bred to MAUL, not just give a warning nip, like Cattle Dogs are Malamutes. They go in to finish the job. They don't have lock jaw, as many people think they do. They just don't mess around. People need to understand that.

Sorry for the rant. I'm passionate about the issue!


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## Vidaloco (Sep 14, 2007)

Golly geewillikers :wink: You said that so well! My husband corrected me, we don't have bans just very strict leash and containment laws pertaining to pit bulls. Which as you said, is as it should be.


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## geewillikers (May 4, 2008)

My pit bull mix babies, Mr. Mako, and Miss Daisy Duke: 









































The other dog is a Pit/Jack Russel mix


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## my2geldings (Feb 18, 2008)

Another good point. A big deal is made of pits attacking people, but as seen over and over again all other breeds of dogs also attack. I have been attacked by 2 dogs and neither of them were pit bulls.

Something that was recently show on tv. A police officer was on the news for being caught after storing child pornography. Not agreeing with what he did but he was put into the light because of the already attached imagine of what he did for career.

It's the same idea here with the dogs.


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## buckaroo2010 (Nov 7, 2007)

Awww there such a pretty color!


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## geewillikers (May 4, 2008)

> Awww there such a pretty color!


Yeah, the color is called "brindle". Mako showed up four years ago as a puppy, and we adopted Daisy Duke last year from the shelter. We thought It'd be cute to stick to the same color scheme. We call them the Leopard Dogs. Daisy had been at the shelter a year, and since she's a brindle pit (not likely to be adopted) we had to scoop her up before she was put down. She is the sweetest, most submissive lover....


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## Small_Town_Girl (Feb 15, 2008)

geewillikers, ours is brindle too! 

Thanks everyone for your complete honesty, this is not a 
debate, it's just voicing your opinion on the topic.


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## Vidaloco (Sep 14, 2007)

We have a Daisy dog! except she is Miss Daisy. She was a stray that my neighbor claimed. She kept wandering over to our place and we would drive her back. We did that for a week or so and he said we should keep her. Thus we were "driving Miss Daisy" She is a rottweiler mix.


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## Salty_alydaR (Mar 24, 2008)

the pitbulls that get busted for agression are usually the ones who were trained to be agressive. bad dogs are the result of bad owners

heres my pitbull mix, Kona

at my uncles house








me and her being wierd(shes smiling  )








shes the smartest dog i know!


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## Gingerrrrr (Feb 12, 2008)

you always see on animal planet how they bust people in the big citys and stuff for pit bull fighting. i agree that its the owners fault because they trained the dog to fight. i hear pit bulls have this thing where if they bite something they jaw locks up. i feel bad. they are misunderstood. in Florida i think it is, they banned Pits out of the state completely and if they catch you with one and you are fighting them the DOGS (mostly the aggressive ones) get euthenized. its sad.


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## my2geldings (Feb 18, 2008)

Those photos are just to cute. What a good dog with the treat :lol:


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

How about we start something called the "Small Dog Owners Need To Teach Their Dogs Manners" movement, please? 
I've seen more aggressive small dogs (think poodles, Shi-Tzus.. I have no idea how to spell that..etc.) than big dogs. The owners don't do any training because they can just force the dog around. 
My Rottie is very well trained - but she HAS to be. Any mishaps from her (being an "attack dog" breed) may lead to her being put down, which I couldn't stand, so Rich and I had to lay down a solid foundation on her. 
I still stand firmly on my view that it's not the dog that's the problem, it's the owner. 
HAVING SAID THAT, there are "bad seeds." I believe that animals, just like humans, can be "wired" strangely, and they can be not right in the head. Those dogs can be dangerous... but it can happen just as easily to a Pittbull as with a Lab. 
I personally have heard of more dog bites from "gentle" breeds than "aggressive" breeds.


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## Rachluvshorses4eva (Apr 11, 2007)

It's in their blood to be vicious at some stage. But they just seem to be more vicious than other dogs. They should all be on a leash when out and they shouldn't be able to escape from anywhere. Same goes for all dogs...


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## barefoothooves (Sep 6, 2007)

JustDressageIt said:


> How about we start something called the "Small Dog Owners Need To Teach Their Dogs Manners" movement, please?
> I've seen more aggressive small dogs (think poodles, Shi-Tzus.. I have no idea how to spell that..etc.) than big dogs. The owners don't do any training because they can just force the dog around.
> My Rottie is very well trained - but she HAS to be. Any mishaps from her (being an "attack dog" breed) may lead to her being put down, which I couldn't stand, so Rich and I had to lay down a solid foundation on her.
> I still stand firmly on my view that it's not the dog that's the problem, it's the owner.
> ...


Agreed! And can we teach children how to address strange dogs and not to provoke them? I HATE that parents let kids run up screaming to a strange dog and get in it's face and even if the dog tries to retreat the kid just keeps on and on until the dog finally snaps...I understand kids don't always udnerstand it,, but the parents need to teach them that not all dogs want to be petted and they should ASK to pet a dog before doing and pay attention to their kids. Can we make a leash law for them? LOL 

When I was growing up, Mom didn't let me pet a strangers dog without asking or being offered first. I wasn't allowed to trespass to see a puppy and I wasn't allowed to wake up our own dogs.She told me to think about what I was doing to the dog and ask myself "would YOU want your sister to do that to you? Well, the dog doesn't want it either, so when they try to go away, let them" Or "how would you feel if someone dumped dirt on top of your head? (or whatever dumb thing a kid would do to an animal)" .


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## Moxie (May 28, 2008)

INTRODUCING............ KEENA... THE VICIOUS PIT BULL!!!





Watch her as she bends over almost backwards to lick.. .errr.. chew this baby's face off!!









See her demonstrate feats of docile.. err.. demonic behavior!










Gaze upon her beautiful face.... err... fangs.










STAND BACK! This pup is lazy... err... ferocious! 










Watch as she dozes calmly... err... SPRINGS TO ATTACK MODE!












Alright, enough. I hope I didn't offend or mock anyone with these captions, that wasn't my intention. I am all for pits. Every single pit I have ever come into contact with have always been the sweetest pup. Keena is a 70lb lap dog. She is the sweetest girl ever. 

I would trust Keena around my son MORE than those small little demonic ankle biters. 

Here's a little something I found. Notice the #1 dog, and then where is the pit ranked? Yea, even the Akita ranked higher than the pit.


"Dachshunds were at the top of the list of 33 breeds ranked for aggressive tendencies. According to a study published recently in Applied Animal Behaviour Science, a journal published by the Dutch group Elsevier, one in five Dachshunds have bitten or tried to bite strangers, a similar number have attacked other dogs; and one in 12 have snapped at their owners. The sample group included 6,000 people and their dogs.

According to the study, the top 10 aggressive dogs are:

1. Dachshund
2. Chihuahua
3. Jack Russell Terrier
4. Akita
5. Australian Cattle Dog
6. Pit Bull
7. Beagle
8. English Springer Spaniel
9. Border Collie
10. German Shepherd"


http://art2u.com/critterblog/?p=213


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## BluMagic (Sep 23, 2007)

I've grown up around Pit Bulls. Aren't they also known as the American Staffordshire Terrier? I love the breed. I think they are beautiful. But misunderstood. Human error is what makes some mean.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

barefoothooves said:


> JustDressageIt said:
> 
> 
> > How about we start something called the "Small Dog Owners Need To Teach Their Dogs Manners" movement, please?
> ...


And how! Many children provoke the attack.
There was a whole segment on "When Good Pets Go Bad" on Spike TV - I couldn't watch it. The people who got hurt well deserved it. I don't wish ill on anyone, but I sure as heck won't feel sorry for you when Mr Nice Rottie decides for you that you won't have kids, because you thought it would be cute to teach him a stupid trick.

Edited to add:
Note - I do not LET Vikky get into those situations! Although she is well-trained, I put her on leash when another dog comes around in the off-leash area, because I cannot guarantee nothing will happen - the other dog might attack Vikky and she'll defend herself; and she'd get the rap for it because of her breed. I take precautions to not let her get into a scenerio where anything could happen.


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## Harlee rides horses (Jan 13, 2008)

Wow, okay.
Misunderstood much?
Pit bulls were not bred to be vicious to other animals.
Any dog whatsoever can harm any one or thing. It is all in how you train them. My pit bull, Fenway, was trained correctly, and he has never bitten anyone or even given anyone the wrong look. He wouldn't hurt a fly. That dog has children running around him and he could care less.
Its all in the training...
Just like it is with horses, "There isn't any bad horses just bad horsemen."
Can't it be like that for dogs?
If they ban pit bulls, dog fighters will just pick another breed, like rottweilers so to say to fight. Why ban the breed when you can ban the sport? 

Sorry to sound...mean, or whatev, but this is a sore spot with me and my family.


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

I kind of get the same rap with Chief, our German Shepherd puppy. There's a woman that won't even step foot into our store just because she knows there's a german shepherd in here. He's behind a secure counter and he usually just relaxes in his crate anyways.

When i was fostering kittens, there was a poster on an elevator door saying that close to 80% of dog attacks are NOT by pit bulls.
It's all in how you raise them.
I know a woman when i worked in a kennel who has a pit bull, and she's just the sweetest thing, yet there were labs and goldens that were biters and we had to be extra cautious.

I've been bitten by dogs, one was by my own lab, another was by a border collie, and another was by a rottie mix (but that was my fault because i put my hand in the way before she went after a cat.)

It's all how you raise the dog. You could have the #1 dog in america (lab) and train it to bite and everything.
Pit bulls get a bad rap for careless owners who don't bother training them the proper way, or who see them as a way to make money.

I find this to be an interesting article by Cesar Millan.
http://cesarmillaninc.com/features/factspitbulls.php
And if you've seen episodes of Cesar, you know that he has rehabilitated dog aggressive dogs, and has a bunch of pit bulls that were as he calls them "red zone cases" and they are now happily living with other dogs and people can come in there.

Don't judge the breed by the news.
I remember reading about a golden retriever who killed a child, but they don't have a bad rap.

Harlee is right about the horses.
"There isn't any bad horses just bad horsemen." 
If we are all horsemen and horsewomen here, we should really understand this.

just my 2 cents


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## Small_Town_Girl (Feb 15, 2008)

Touched nerves much? :shock: 

Thanks for expressing yourself guys, I agree, I do not think
there should be a ban on the breed, and some of you have
voiced some amazing opinions on the subject, i appreciate it!


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## SonnyWimps (Feb 22, 2008)

I voted no

Why? It's NOT the breed that is bad...it's the way some were brought up. If you mistreat a dog and teach them to be vicious at a young age. then they'll probably attack someone later on whether it is a Pit Bull, Lab, Collie, Pomeranian, or any other breed.
Because of Pit Bull attacks, the media has given the title of "agressive", "mean", and whatever to the breed....but they don't realize that it isn't the breed's doing.

There's a dog rescue that deals in the Bully breeds....Pit Bulls is one of them. Their slogan is "Ban the DEED not the breed". And I agree. There is no need to ban the breed when it can easily start up again yet with another breed like a lab. And it can continue to grow until all breeds are banned.

My boss at work has a 2 year old Pit Bull and he's the sweetest thing ever. Crazy, yes....lots of energy, yes.....aggressive, definately not!! He's the sweetest puppy ever but everyone is afraid of him because of his breed.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

I think the focus should be on who should be allowed to own certain types of dogs??? Here recently in VA an elderly women and her dog were killed by a pack of pitbulls. Anytime dogs are allowed to run in a pack environment, they can become very dangerous very quickly because they feed off of each others agression. In this case the women that owned the dogs was a piece of crap and new there was a problem and did nothing about it and then tried to deny she owned the dogs. She's in jail for manslaughter I think.

Anyway... I believe that the focus should always be on the owner. I had a dog that had issues, she was a siberian husky, I treated her with love and she still was agressive enough that, at the time we lived in a townhouse and I didnt think it was a safe place to keep a dog like that, so I gave her to my brother because he had alot of land and the time to put into her, that's called being a responsible owner, seeing and problem and taking measures to fix it. I live next door to my brother but he still has the evil devil dog... he loves her... 

Anyway... did I mention the focus should be on the owner and not the dog???****...


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## Remali (Jul 22, 2008)

I don't know for sure....but I do believe there are a lot of breeds who "could" be more aggressive than other breeds....you have to look at each breed and research what that breed was bred for originally. Some breeds just take a more experienced owner/handler in my opinion. And there are way too many people these days (i.e.these young boys and men in gangs) that have Pit Bulls for the wrong reasons. Most make great pets!


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## Gangsta (Jul 20, 2008)

My two cents. No breed should be banned for simply being.

Pits were originally bred as protectors....to family and children. People took that protective trait and twisted it to suit their selfish needs...ie fighting. In a study of 100 dogs most likely to attack, the PIt was in the bottom 5%. You hear about more PIt attacks than anything else, because they're the most commonly reported. I don't think it's fair to punish the dog for man's mistake. 'Punish the deed, not the breed.' I have had Pit mixes in the past, and would not be against a full Pit. I think they're wonderful and loyal dogs. People really need to take time to understand the Pit before they talk trash about them. I had my face torn open by a Pit mix when I was younger...and I know full well it was my fault, not the dogs. I tried to step in and break up a dog fight (stupid idea anyway, regardless of the dogs involved) and the dog lunged, I got in the way. my fault. whatever. I will not blame the dog for my actions.

when he was 4, my brother had his stomach ripped open by our neighbors....Cocker Spaniel. one of the most aggressive dogs I've ever met, to date. It charged him, jumped him, knocked him down, and ripped him open. In our own yard.

anyway. there's my thoughts on the matter


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## XxXequinegrlXxX (May 24, 2008)

omg is your brother okay? 

and i agree with what most other people are saying ... its the humans fault not the breed of dog it is.


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## Gangsta (Jul 20, 2008)

he was fine, thankfully. a trip to the hospital and stitches and that was that. he still loves dogs and wasn't emotionally scarred from the incident. it was scary, though.


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## DashAwayAll (Jul 19, 2008)

Trying to get a breed "banned" is an old game. In the 60's and early seventies it was Shepard's. In the eighties it was Rotties. Now Pits. I have only know three rotties in my life, and there are all the biggest lovebugs!

I truly believe that 80% of the time the owner is at fault, 19% of the time the person/bite-ee is at fault, and 1% of the time it is the dog. I mean, train your dog. Be kind. Keep in mind breed characteristics. ( if you live next to a chicken farm, don't have a herding dog.) Teach your kids not to run up to a strange dog.

When Dashie is Supreme Ruler of The Universe, there will be a mandatory education class for animal owners. And parents to be. If you don't pass the class, no pet. Or kid.

Oh, and people convicted of puppy mill crimes will be used as donors for stem cell research. Not that I have an opinion, you understand.


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## ilovemyhorsies (Mar 9, 2008)

i used to have a pit bull but we had to give her away to a pit-bull owner/breeder.

when we bought ner we didnt even know she was part-pitbull. her name was toffee (named after her toffee colour) she was adorable and such a sweetie but after havin her for about 6 months or so we had to let her go. she had started snapping and growling at my little sister and when we took her to the vet to have an aggression test she failed and the vet told us we should either have to put down or give her away to an owner who was better experienced with pit-bulls.

i'm not exactly sure about this but the vet we went to said that the golden/toffee colour is the more vicous strain of pit-bull but dont take my word for it....i got her about 3 years ago...


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## DashAwayAll (Jul 19, 2008)

Certain breed you definitely have to be firm with. If they did not have excellent training when they were a youngster, you were in trouble. i don't mean that the owners were bad or anything... just certain animals require more., That doesn't mean the dogs weren't lovebugs.... they just had a real alpha side. Chesapeake bay retrievers and Chows come to mind. I saw the difference when I worked at a vet's office years ago.


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## FlutingRider (Aug 12, 2008)

Pit bulls were originally bred to be fighting dogs. Attacking, sometimes for no good reason, is hardwired into their brains. With some dogs it comes out, and with some they'll be a normal family pet up until the day they die... I like 'em though.


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## Snapple122 (Aug 8, 2008)

I am a little undecided on this, I would probably never want to own a pit bull. 
they *are* agressive by nature, you can't train it out of them.. it's their breed.. 
we used to own a border collie, and they're bred to herd, it is in their blood, well out border used to always try to herd our horses, we didn't ever train her for anything like that, but she just did it by nature.


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## Kentucky (Aug 2, 2008)

I vote no for the ban. I don't own one and won't be buying one ever. It is an aggressive breed, but not the most. The Catahoula is much more agressive. The Cane Corso Mastiff is the breed (I think) that killed the school teacher in S. F. a few years ago, becuase of her perfume. 
All terrier breed are more aggressive than hounds or other dog breeds. 
I own a German Shepherd he is the loyalest dog I've ever seen. If I was attacked, I have no doubt, he would attack, whoever did it.


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## KiwiRyder (Aug 14, 2008)

Misunderstood breed don't compare the breed of dog to dog fighting it isn't fair those dogs are aggravated into fighting. I think any dog that is put thru what "fighting" dogs are put thru to fight would fight & be a nasty dog. They get put thru hell kept in small crates basically get "roughed" up to fight. I reckon a poodle would turn into a "fighting dog" in the circumstances that a fighting dog is kept.
But I also own a lovely pitty girl yes we have only just started our journey together I am I working really hard to make sure I bring up a well round dog because of the stigma attached to owning a pitty. But I am confident she will be lovely. I used to own a english bull terrier (RIP) she was also a lovely dog. But many judged her by her cover & considered her dangerous.


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## Dumas'_Grrrl (Apr 2, 2008)

Ummm....Please don't flog me..... :shock: 

I voted yes they should be banned...as in city dwelling... 

I think that most dogs of any breed are born "good" but people in general are stupid! 

When concidering a ban on the animals we are looking for a soloution to protect the community as a whole. When you get a bunch of people jammed together in a city you get a whole lot of stupid jammed together too. 

Unfortunately you can't pass a leash law on kids under 11...You can't pass a law requireing screenings for wanna be rap stars, ********, drug dealers and ego-maniacs wanting to be tough and all the other crappy owners that pits seem to attract. And you can't pass laws requiring the dogs prove themselves in a barrage of tests designed to reproduce everyday stupidity.

For the community at large a ban is the safest choice.

I have known several pits and they have all been "nice" but a few have been aggressive...*sigh* I applaude all of you for taking the time and energy to own a pit...something I would never do. I did own a rottie...she was a gift from my sister, best dog I ever had but I will not own another for the very reasons JDI wrote about. 

Humans have been breeding dogs for hundres of years to "create" breeds to serve a purpose. Anytime you take that purpose away from the dog, the dog need to be repurposed and taught something else. Like the weiner dogs that top the list of aggressive behavior...They were bred to dig into rodent holes and get the critter...Rats, and other large rodents are very aggresive when being attacked. Weiner dogs needed to be tough...now that they are warming couches all over suburbia that aggression needs to come out somewhere. Same thing with pits. and every other breed. 

I own a Lab. He is the best doggie ever. BUT If we don't play fetch with him and take him for long runs and to the creek for swimming he gets all bound up and releases that energy by knocking over trash cans and chasing the cats, cows and chickens....which he KNOWS he isn't _supposed _to do. 

Enough to my speech..Hope it made sence.


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## geewillikers (May 4, 2008)

> You can't pass a law requireing screenings for wanna be rap stars, ********, drug dealers and ego-maniacs wanting to be tough and all the other crappy owners that pits seem to attract.


This is HIGHLY offensive. Please watch your generalizing and stereotyping. Thanks!


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## Malorey (Aug 14, 2008)

American Pit Bull Terriers are my heart breed, and if I wasn't allowed to own one I would literally die.


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## Dumas'_Grrrl (Apr 2, 2008)

geewillikers said:


> > You can't pass a law requireing screenings for wanna be rap stars, ********, drug dealers and ego-maniacs wanting to be tough and all the other crappy owners that pits seem to attract.
> 
> 
> This is HIGHLY offensive. Please watch your generalizing and stereotyping. Thanks!


I do appologize if that statement offended you. It was not my intentions to do so. I was not generalizing I was refering to a few people that I know that have or have owned a pit bull for the wrong reasons. Again, I meant no offence towards you or anyone else for that matter. I was drawing upon my personal experience with the subject at hand.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

My neighbor has a pit. It's very kind and well trained. BUT - I dont' let it near my kid. And one day it came over and attacked my hound who NEVER fights. Completely unprovoked. There are certain breeds I don't trust and that is one...

http://www.dogexpert.com/FatalDogAttacks/Criminal prosecutions/VA verdict 2005.htm


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## KiwiRyder (Aug 14, 2008)

geewillikers said:


> > You can't pass a law requireing screenings for wanna be rap stars, ********, drug dealers and ego-maniacs wanting to be tough and all the other crappy owners that pits seem to attract.
> 
> 
> This is HIGHLY offensive. Please watch your generalizing and stereotyping. Thanks!


Yeah totally agree!


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## Snapple122 (Aug 8, 2008)

I don't see it as highly offensive.. she wasn't talking about you guys in particular. 
Pit bulls can turn on you in a second. I've heard stories of pits attacking their own owners, without being provoked in any way. 
I saw a few pictures on this thread with a baby on the floor with a pit bull.. it almost made me sick. 
That dog could have attacked that baby in a second. 
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/local/baltimore_city/bal-md.ci.pitbull23oct23,0,7163330.story
read this story and you'll think twice about trusting a dog like that with a baby
Pit Bulls are bred to fight.. it is not the owners fault.. it is in their blood.


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## Snapple122 (Aug 8, 2008)

I don't think a pit bull ban is the answer though.. I'm not sure what that is going to accomplish
pit bulls are not the only dangerous breed out there, so I don't think only one breed should be banned.


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## KiwiRyder (Aug 14, 2008)

Do you own a dog Snapple? If you owned a breed that was all of sudden considered dangerous would you defend your dog & their breed. Or get rid of your dog & jump on the dangerous dog band wagon?


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## Snapple122 (Aug 8, 2008)

Uh, does that have anything to do with the subject? 
I would never own a pit bull to begin with, because yes, they are vicious dogs.. it is in their blood. 
But to answer your question, I would defend *my* dog, but I wouldn't defend the breed, because that would be ignorant on my part, if I knew the breed was dangerous


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## geewillikers (May 4, 2008)

Pit bulls are NOT vicious...

vi·cious 
–adjective
1.	addicted to or characterized by vice; grossly immoral; depraved; profligate: a vicious life.
2.	given or readily disposed to evil: a vicious criminal.
3.	reprehensible; blameworthy; wrong: a vicious deception.
4.	spiteful; malicious: vicious gossip; a vicious attack.
5.	unpleasantly severe: a vicious headache.
6.	characterized or marred by faults or defects; faulty; unsound: vicious reasoning.
7.	savage; ferocious: 
8.	having bad habits or a cruel or fierce disposition
9.	Archaic. morbid, foul, or noxious.


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## o0hawaiigirl0o (Aug 8, 2008)

No, I think that's stupid. Why pick on one breed? I understand that they're often bred to fight(which I believe is now illegal in all 50 states), but other breeds of dogs also attack people. My sister was attacked by a random mixed breed dog.

I still firmly believe that it's our fault, us being humans. We're the ones that train the dogs to be killers and to have killer insticts. We're the ones that breed them so that their temperment isn't at all stable. I've known perfectly sweet pit bulls and pit bull mixes and I've seen fighters. Basically humans are the problem. We need people to realize that fighting dogs is wrong, inhumane, and cruel. Their kids are watching them fight these dogs and those kids are going to do the same thing when they're older. Is that the kind of sport you want them to be doing/watching? I think that more steps need to be taken to completely wipe out dog fighting. That way, we won't be breeding pit bulls to fight anymore and all agressive traits can slowly be diminished. And they can be a "normal" dog without all the issues.


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## Kentucky (Aug 2, 2008)

o0hawaiigirl0o
I agree with about 50% of what you are saying. We didn't train dogs to be killers, God did, any species of wild dog is a killer. I could add most breed of dogs can and will kill, toy breeds I'm not so sure on. A beagle (one of the gentlest breed) will kill rabbits and rats if given a chance i owned one and never took him hunting.. 
*You can't breed out insticts totally, min. or max yes.* 

We harnessed the traits we needed and breed them to dogs. Hounds, Working breeds and any other breed type are gentler than terriers (the pit bull is one). Terriers were bred to kill game after, the chase of the hounds. . [/b]


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## RedHawk (Jun 16, 2008)

I don't think it's the breed so much as the individual dog itself. There can be really sweet pits and ones that are more aggressive. If i was getting a pit bull i would just be careful of the puppy that i picked, but then again that's important with any dog.


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## geewillikers (May 4, 2008)

Snapple122 said:


> I don't see it as highly offensive.. she wasn't talking about you guys in particular.
> Pit bulls can turn on you in a second. I've heard stories of pits attacking their own owners, without being provoked in any way.
> I saw a few pictures on this thread with a baby on the floor with a pit bull.. it almost made me sick.
> That dog could have attacked that baby in a second.
> ...


YES, what was said was racist, and prejudice. I am highly offended. It doesn't matter if someone is targeting you specifically with a derogatory word, or racial slur. The term "*******" is racist. Categorizing pit bull owners as drug dealers, ********, and wanna-be rap stars needs checking. Labels are what keep this country in the racial and prejudice divide. If you group people into stereotypes, and call them "crappy" you need to be checked. Everyone is entitled to their opinion on the thread, but the thread did not ask "List all the racial and stereotyping associated with pit bulls". You, of course, are welcome to having ill feelings about pit bulls. No problem there, But, defending such comments, especially form a moderator, is in my eyes, ignorant.


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## BrwnEyedGrl (Jul 4, 2008)

I admit I did not read everyones reply but I did want to put my two cents in for those who wanted to hear & started the poll.

I think ANY dog can go "wild" (for a lack of better words) rather it be a pit bull or cocker spanial. Growing up we had a Sibrian Husky and he was the meanest lil $hit you ever met. He would bit you in a heart beat & chase after anything. I was never so happy when he finally got put down. (Due to old age.) Everyone else I know that has ever had a Husky has nothing but good stuff to say about them. My point being that my bro has a Pit & a good friend of mine has 2 and they are one of the nicest dogs I have ever come across. They are all very loveable. What makes a dog (any dog) go *wild* like that one will never know... it may be the way it was raised or in other cases it was just in their heads & blood. Should be ban a Pit or any other "scary" dog just because of its known past & history. No. 

With that being said I can see & understand where a neighborhood, apartment complets or other community wanted to know what type of "animals" you had to make that info public to others living in your same area. I can understand that but regardless we (as homeowners) should be able to choose to have what animal & what type of any animal we want with in the legal limits of course. Snake ~ no thanks for me but if that is your thing then go get a snake. 

Just my two cents! Thanks 4 letting me share!


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## Snapple122 (Aug 8, 2008)

Well, I live in Canada and we are referred to as red necks all the time.. in fact, we refer to ourselves as red necks.


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## Small_Town_Girl (Feb 15, 2008)

STOP ARGUING!!!!! :evil: 

I can't stand it when a simple poll and voice of opinion gets out of
hand! 

Also, Dumas apologized for her statement and
meant no harm by her comment, though it seemed
offensive, me and Dumas are both from Arkansas, so 
were referred to as "********," all the time. Not trying
to offend anyone either, just trying to set things right!

Can we get back on topic, PLEASE?! :wink:

In conclusion, I do not agree with the banning of the breed, I just
think those dogs...any dogs that cause harm should be dealt with
individually!


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## Dumas'_Grrrl (Apr 2, 2008)

Dumas'_Grrrl said:


> geewillikers said:
> 
> 
> > > You can't pass a law requiring screenings for wanna be rap stars, ********, drug dealers and ego-maniacs wanting to be tough and all the other crappy owners that pits seem to attract.
> ...


Again...I was drawing from my own experience. I meant no offence to anyone here. Whether or not you want to label people or not...we all have labels. I personally don't care what religion you are, what color you are, or what your background is. A good human being is a good human being. Labels are nothing more than a way for me to convey who I was talking about. If it were pop star princesses who were flaunting these dogs then I would have said that. Nothing that I wrote was directed towards one race. I was simply referring to the fact that some people believe that pit bulls will help them look tough or cool or protected or what ever misconception they have of the animal....they are wanting the dog because of the stereotypical nature of the dog to further personify themselves....and their label. They are owning the animal for the wrong reasons. Now if we did have a screening and the owners of whatever label passed, that would be fantastic and the breed would be the winner. 

I am trying to extend an olive branch of peace to you and I hope that I have explained my comments sufficently for you to understand that i was not bashing anyone on race. I was wanting to bash the ignorant people that own pitbulls for the wrong reasons.

I understand that you feel the term ******* is racist. OK...I'll respect the fact that you feel that way. Please understand that where I am from it is in no way shape or form racist. 

I know that a lot of time tone is really hard to convey on these massage boards and I want you to know, Gee, that I am not being snarky or ugly towards you. I respect the fact that you said something and I would like to think that you will accept my appology for offending you.


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## Snapple122 (Aug 8, 2008)

Small Town Girl-- I completely agree with you.

I also agree about Duma.. she apologized, she didn't mean anything by it, so just let it go. 
And yes, I agree about the ******* thing.. it's not that offensive of a word (there are so many words that are waay worse) and in Canada, we are referred to as ******** a lot..
And I'm not trying to offend anyone either, just saying that this pointless bickering should stop, and we shouldn't be going off topic like this.


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## Small_Town_Girl (Feb 15, 2008)

Snapple122 said:


> Small Town Girl-- I completely agree with you.
> 
> I also agree about Duma.. she apologized, she didn't mean anything by it, so just let it go.
> And yes, I agree about the ******* thing.. it's not that offensive of a word (there are so many words that are waay worse) and in Canada, we are referred to as ******** a lot..
> And I'm not trying to offend anyone either, just saying that this pointless bickering should stop, and we shouldn't be going off topic like this.


Yeah, I just don't get the point really of arguing, when I created
this thread it was for individual members to voice their own
personal opinion on the subject, not bash others for their 
opinions or anything else for that matter. I understand if 
someone felt a comment was "prejudice," and confronted
the person to get if off their chest, but their is no reason
on going on about it when the statement was apologized for. 










Here is King Diablo!


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

geewillikers said:


> Snapple122 said:
> 
> 
> > I don't see it as highly offensive.. she wasn't talking about you guys in particular.
> ...


I don't think that comment was at all racist. I understand that some people may have been offended by it. I believe I read 2 apoligies by the poster that included further explanation in the point she was trying to get across and so I think we can all move on. 

I also agree with that post in that there is a certain type of person that is drawn to these and other "tough" dogs for the wrong reasons. Yes, there are kind and loving people that also own these dogs. But... there are alot of bad people that own these dogs, and there are a ton of publicized attacks related to these dogs. I did read yesterday about a boxer/pit mix that saved some kittens... but you don't see that very often. 

As a parent, I'm going to keep my kid safe by not owning a pit, he won't be allowed to play with on either. better safe then sorry. I gave my brother a husky because she was a killer of small animals and a biter. I gave her a good home and good training and she still had issues, because of that one dog, huskys are off my list. never again. Is it fair to the breed? Maybe not. But it's my opinion.


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## FutureVetGirl (Aug 5, 2008)

OK... I did NOT read what everyone wrote before... but I have something to say... NOW:

1. Pit Bulls were never BRED to be killers. They were bred to be extremely loyal to their owners. They were originally bred as protectors and friends. And it was only when the wrong people decided to use them for bull baiting (a cruel sport that is now outlawed everywhere) that they got the name of Pit Bulls.

2. Did you know that Pit Bulls were the most sought after breed up until the 1990's? Now... tell me the truth: was that because the dog was a vicious killer? or because it was a good, loyal, loving dog?

3. I have owned quite a few Pit Bull mixes, and have been around and cared for several pure blood Pit Bulls. Several came from "not so good" homes and backgrounds, and yet, they were still loving dogs.

4. Guess what the most dangerous dog out there is? Dachshund. NOT Pit Bull, Rottweiler, Akita, or one of those dogs. But a Dachshund. Just because a dachshund, chihuahua, or jack russel doesn't have the same bite strength as a pit bull, doesn't mean it's less vicious, or less dangerous.

5. The problem has NEVER been with the dog, but with the owner. Labradors and Golden Retrievers have been known to be VICIOUS and VERY dangerous dogs, in the wrong hands. Oftentimes, people see something that LOOKS dangerous, or something that has had a bad rep in the press due to incompetent training or ownership, and then everyone freaks out, and begins screaming.

6. I watched a show called "Man-Eaters", and it was talking about dogs and dog attacks in this particular episode. When it was talking about attacks... it WASN'T the PITS that were attacking (but labradors, german shepherds, even border collies). In fact, in one of the cases, a Pit Bull had actually saved this kid's life by taking the brunt of the other dogs' attacks, and through that, allowing the kid to escape.

7. Many people blame the dog for complete incompetence. Over half of the attacks (in kind, decent homes) were due to lack of training and control (they let the dog do whatever), and not teaching the kids to stay away from the dog's food or toys. A lot of times, a dog has a specific toy that it likes best, and so it will protect it, just like it would a specific owner. And so, the kid, selfishly, decides that it wants the toy, so it goes over and tries to take it. And then, when the dog snaps at the kid (perhaps getting a bit too close and taking off a bit of skin), the kid screams, so everybody assumes that the dog "attacked" the kid. When in actuality, the kid was the one "attacking" the dog.


I'm not saying that some dogs weren't bred more aggressively, and that you should just pick up any old pit bull mutt off the street, and expect it to be a good housepet. I'm also not saying that dogs need absolutely no handling or training. In fact, quite the opposite. It's never the dog's fault. But the handler's.

Think about it... when your horse acts up, or does something that can't be explained... who do you blaim? Not the horse. You blaim yourself. Yet... when a dog attacks without a "decent" explanation, and the only explanations would be either you're at fault, or the dog is a vicious killer... people always choose the latter.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

FutureVetGirl said:


> OK... I did NOT read what everyone wrote before... but I have something to say... NOW:
> 
> 7. Many people blame the dog for complete incompetence. Over half of the attacks (in kind, decent homes) were due to lack of training and control (they let the dog do whatever), and not teaching the kids to stay away from the dog's food or toys. A lot of times, a dog has a specific toy that it likes best, and so it will protect it, just like it would a specific owner. And so, the kid, selfishly, decides that it wants the toy, so it goes over and tries to take it. And then, when the dog snaps at the kid (perhaps getting a bit too close and taking off a bit of skin), the kid screams, so everybody assumes that the dog "attacked" the kid. When in actuality, the kid was the one "attacking" the dog.


I applaud you for using your moment on the soap box to attempt to educate people as to WHY you are a fan of the breed. Alot of people get mad and scream but don't really lay down argument. I said in earlier posts that I think the OWNER has alot to do with the dogs behavior, although my husky was well trained, she IS well trained, she is just an evil dog. What you said in the above about the child being somewhat responsible for most of the attacks in the home I agree with. As a parent of a small child, I won't consider a dog like that. Because I can't watch him 24-7 and he does stick his little face in there faces. My shephard was harmless, my collie and my hound are harmless. I did TONS of research before buying my collie because I wanted a very safe dog for my son. That's why I picked him. I'm glad that you took the time to actually post an argument in favor of the breed rather than getting angry and screaming... I'm not for banning the breed, but I am for putting some restrictions on who can own certain types of dogs. I just don't think that is something that will ever happen becuase you would have to attend a class or get a certification or ... I don't know.. but in a perfect world, only responsible people would own animals and have children..... but since this world is not perfect.......


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## FutureVetGirl (Aug 5, 2008)

haha... thanks. I'm actually planning on owning and rehabilitating quite a few pit bulls in the near future (as soon as I'm off in college, simply because I have no resources or a place to keep them until then), and I'm also planning to get married and have kids during all of that.

I don't look for a dog that would suit my kid... unless I'm buying the dog for the kid. I get the dog, and then train them both together. A lot of people tend to get a dog that is "good" around kids, and then leave them in the room ALONE together. I'm not saying that every dog needs 24/7 supervision. But when you have your dog and your kid together, at least be in the same room with them. Most dogs recognize a kid's weakness, fragility, and their innocence, and try and be kind and gentle around them. But a lot of dogs really DON'T know their own strength.

My dog for example: She's a pit bull x labrador x greyhound x something else mix, and she's semi-big. I can't say that she wouldn't hurt a fly... because she likes catching and eating flies. But she also ADORES kids. For the most part she's very gentle around them, and kids love her. She's not extremely well trained, or even extremely well socialized. She's "good" with kids. But the reason why I don't let her around all of the kids, alone, is because she honestly doesn't know her own strength. She would never bite or intentionally hurt one of the kids, but she has knocked them down quite a few times. All she was doing was nosing them. And the kids screamed. But it never meant that she was attacking them, just that she didn't realize how strong she was, and how much it could effect a little kid.

A lot of people see a dog that is "good" with kids, and then leave the two alone. The dog gives a gentle nip, not realizing how strong it is, and suddenly the kid is screaming, sometimes even punching the dog, making the dog feel threatened even more.

So... I have a few suggestions for people who find themselves in situations similar to this:

1. Never leave your kid and your dog alone together, because who knows what could happen. Not that it'd be your kid's FAULT, or that it'd be your DOG'S fault. But something could happen.

2. If your kid and your dog have to be in the same room together, and your dog gets kind of wild at times, either keep one or the other in a playpen. Or put the dog outside for a while. A lot of times, the dog needs to work off excess energy, and then it's fine again.

3. Find a professional trainer if your dog is just too much for you to handle alone. A lot of times it takes a new environment, and a new handler for your dog to learn.

4. EDUCATE THE DUMB KID!!!!!! Don't let your two year old put his hands all over the dog's bones. Don't let your two year old eat out of the dog's food dish. It's not cute. It's gross, and a disaster waiting to happen.


You don't have to get rid of the dog just because you have a kid. Sometimes it takes just a bit of brains.


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## o0hawaiigirl0o (Aug 8, 2008)

Kentucky said:


> o0hawaiigirl0o
> I agree with about 50% of what you are saying. We didn't train dogs to be killers, God did, any species of wild dog is a killer. I could add most breed of dogs can and will kill, toy breeds I'm not so sure on. A beagle (one of the gentlest breed) will kill rabbits and rats if given a chance i owned one and never took him hunting..
> *You can't breed out insticts totally, min. or max yes.*
> 
> We harnessed the traits we needed and breed them to dogs. Hounds, Working breeds and any other breed type are gentler than terriers (the pit bull is one). Terriers were bred to kill game after, the chase of the hounds. . [/b]


Ah, yes, I see what you mean. Dogs are predators and we can't breed out their insticts to be the hunter, such as we can't breed out the flight instict of horses.


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## geewillikers (May 4, 2008)

> Again...I was drawing from my own experience. I meant no offence to anyone here. Whether or not you want to label people or not...we all have labels. I personally don't care what religion you are, what color you are, or what your background is. A good human being is a good human being. Labels are nothing more than a way for me to convey who I was talking about. If it were pop star princesses who were flaunting these dogs then I would have said that. Nothing that I wrote was directed towards one race. I was simply referring to the fact that some people believe that pit bulls will help them look tough or cool or protected or what ever misconception they have of the animal....they are wanting the dog because of the stereotypical nature of the dog to further personify themselves....and their label. They are owning the animal for the wrong reasons. Now if we did have a screening and the owners of whatever label passed, that would be fantastic and the breed would be the winner.
> 
> I am trying to extend an olive branch of peace to you and I hope that I have explained my comments sufficently for you to understand that i was not bashing anyone on race. I was wanting to bash the ignorant people that own pitbulls for the wrong reasons.
> 
> ...


Cool! Thanks for explaining....


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## Remali (Jul 22, 2008)

I think Dumas has a good point....there are too many "nasty characters" out there who own pit bulls..... Personally, I would not want to live in an area where there was a pit bull. Why? Because, sadly, too many people let their dogs run loose. While it is true that other breeds, like Poodles and Labs, can also get aggressive and bite, those breeds do not have the jaws that a pit bull does....and pit bulls can do some horribly serious damage with those jaws.


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## Solon (May 11, 2008)

What they should do is put a ban on the stupid people that do things to make the dogs viscious.

They are looking to a ban on pits and other similar dogs in another community in Washington state. More and more are coming up with these.

Dumb people are mostly to blame. A dog will do what it's asked to. If that means being aggressive then they will do that. Some dogs are naturally more aggressive than others, but the human element plays a bigger part than most people realize.

There are more pit bulls I'd rather be around than some of those yappy lap dogs that would likely tear you to bits! The dogs I've been chased by while riding my horse, SMALLER dogs. The big dogs on the trail that have obviously dog smart owners LISTEN to their owners.


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## KiwiRyder (Aug 14, 2008)

Solon said:


> There are more pit bulls I'd rather be around than some of those yappy lap dogs that would likely tear you to bits! The dogs I've been chased by while riding my horse, SMALLER dogs. The big dogs on the trail that have obviously dog smart owners LISTEN to their owners.


Yeah that is very true, I have been chased by a team of small dogs on a beach before one was even jumping at the horses throat.


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