# "Friend" was keeping my livestock and now won't release them.



## jessyedagger (Nov 19, 2014)

I had a verbal agreement with a friend for them to keep my horses and other livestock on their property and I was to pay for feed. For 5 months I paid every time and then I let them know I would be moving my animals at which point they decided to tell me that I owe them $4800 in board, 750 for cleaning and 2 of my animals before I could remove get them. I went with a sheriff to get my animals and when we got there the sheriff told me to go ahead. Ten minutes later the people showed up and the sheriff said that I had to put my animals back in the pens and go to court. They claimed to have a signed agreement from me which they never produced, then they claimed that there is an animal control case which there is not.

I have begun filing a small claims case but am having trouble as the paper work wants to know what amount of money they owe me, I don't want money I want my babies home!

BTW we are located in san bernardino county CA


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## DuckDodgers (May 28, 2013)

Sorry to hear you're going through this :-( An unfortunate prime example as to hwy you need everything in writing to protect yourself and your property. 

I can't be of much help to you at all, but my advise would be to find a good lawyer who specializes in livestock ASAP.


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## kewpalace (Jul 17, 2013)

Lawyers are not allowed to appear for you in small claims court. But they can help you prepare paperwork. Of course, unless they are working for you pro bono (w/out charge) they will charge you. 

You might be able to get some help (but not legal advice) in filing out paperwork at your County's Self Help office (may be in your County's law library or check with the Court).


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

First off, there is no written or signed contract. You will need to produce receipts for the feed.
They could claim an agisters lien , but they will need to show itemization of everything they claim. get Animal control to sign off that there is no complaint filed. 
Also file for court cost. You can google calif law regarding livestock. also google agisters lien.
for your County. They have to Prove their case.  I would do that asap , as now there are the two sheriffs reports. Never keep a horse anywhere without a contract.
write in the cost, the cost of the animals, go to the max amount allowed in small claims.
and then write, the return of my animals. Good luck


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## jessyedagger (Nov 19, 2014)

I have receipts for the feed.


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## jessyedagger (Nov 19, 2014)

Would this be a small claims case? I am sorry I am just really confused.


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## kewpalace (Jul 17, 2013)

Check with your court's self help department/office or the clerk of the Court for the monetary limit of Small Claims. I think it is $5k, but not sure.


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## jessyedagger (Nov 19, 2014)

Small claims here says 10k

This is what I have on the small claims form. Does it look ok?


I had an agreement with ********** for me to pay for the feed for my animals and no boarding costs. After 5 months they suddenly demanded back board of $4800 or they would not release my animals. I went with the sheriff to get my livestock, they told the sheriff by phone that they have a signed agreement (which does not exist)stating I would pay board so the sheriff would not let me remove my animals. If they will not return my animals and my possessions then I need to be payed fair price for them. Honestly I do not want any money I just want my animals and my items returned.


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## Chevaux (Jun 27, 2012)

What you've written seems to have captured what you want, OP. I would like to ask the following to help ensure you've got yourself as prepared as possible:

Are you able to compile a chronological list of the events relating to this -- in other words, when did you first speak with the other party regarding the arrangement, when did you order/deliver/pay for the feed (copies of invoices would be a good thing), how often did you see your livestock? Also, note any subsequent conversations with the other party during this time and, presumably, these conversations would have given no indication that anything was amiss with the arrangement and further money would be required.


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## jessyedagger (Nov 19, 2014)

Yes I can make a list of everything. I have receipts proving I was paying around $1300 a month in feed. Until the last month and a half I was out to see them at least once a week. I have hundreds of text messages and no mention of board until a few weeks ago.

Also what about the place that I am supposed to say I asked them for the money? What do I do there?


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

so ask for the max. If they wont give animals back you may be awarded the max. Also they will need to show that they have been contacting you for rent which they will have no proof.


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## wausuaw (Apr 15, 2011)

Check about small claims court. 

I don't know about where you are, but here, small claims court CAN NOT ISSUE PROPERTY- only monetary value. (I learned this the hard way, and the judge didn't even know until she looked it up while issuing the verdict- it wasn't the same circumstance, but similar) 

That means, even if you win, you only win a monetary settlement and it doesn't have to issue property (unless the person agrees to exchange the property in lei of money- but that is done separately) And, FYI, there is no real way for them to make the people pay you, either.

(my feathers got very ruffled. I won the freakin' case and it still took almost 2 years to get my horse back).

I would highly suggest consulting with a lawyer, especially about what court to go to when livestock is involved. As others suggested- make a meticulous list of dates, receipts, phones calls, names, everything. Also include vet records and anything else that will prove ownership, and what animals are there, any that are expecting, etc. 

Best of luck :/


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Just curious, how many and what kind of animals are you talking about. You bought the feed but did they do all of the work. I saw you are from CA and its very expensive your way.


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

I actually have a date with small claims court a week from today! Our limit is $3K, and yes, monetary only. Here in NY, even if I win, I will likely have to get the sheriff and a lien to get my $$. But-make sure you have everything documented. All of those texts, etc-print them out. Copy all receipts. Add it all up, then sue for that amount plus costs, plus whatever it has cost you since they delayed your departure……

Good luck!


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## kewpalace (Jul 17, 2013)

Per the San Bernardino County Superior Court Website you can seek possession of property in small claims:



> A person who sues in small claims court must first make a demand if possible. This means that you have asked the defendant to pay, and the defendant has refused. *If your claim is for possession of property, you must ask the defendant to give you the property.*


Lots of good info there ...  including a self-help area ...


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

If you need to, do a separate case for each animal. If you file 3-5 cases for the max amounts
then state in lieu of the money you will take the animals. If you win max dollar amount, you may have to prove the animal is worth that amount, Not sure on that. 
Or you could take the animals as part payment to teach them a lesson. Or be kind and just take back your animals.


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## Blue (Sep 4, 2011)

Subbing. This is very interesting. I may or may not be in a similar situation at some point in the future.


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## chinoerika (Jun 10, 2013)

Were you, or the land owner responsible for the feeding and watering of the animals? I only ask because as you know that can be a lot of work on the part of the land owner even if he/she is a good friend. Not to mention cleaning up after them if they were in a barn. Hope it all works out for you. Best of luck.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

stevenson said:


> If you need to, do a separate case for each animal. If you file 3-5 cases for the max amounts
> then state in lieu of the money you will take the animals. If you win max dollar amount, you may have to prove the animal is worth that amount, Not sure on that.
> Or you could take the animals as part payment to teach them a lesson. Or be kind and just take back your animals.


i don't recomend this unless you have a lot of time. The courts will see you have several claims and combine them. The only way this would work is if you did one case and when it is resolved file the next one.


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

First, call your court house to find out what constitutes small claims. If your claim exceeds that you might want to talk to a lawyer and his costs will be added on to the claim plus lost time at work for you if you lose time and wages at work. Once the fellow is served notice to appear in court he may change his mind and give you your animals back.


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## jessyedagger (Nov 19, 2014)

We filed small claims. Now they send me an email giving me until the 24th to pay them $6174 or they say they will turn them over to animal control as abandoned.


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## Blue (Sep 4, 2011)

When did you file? Can you speak with someone at animal control and get their input?


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

jessyedagger said:


> We filed small claims. Now they send me an email giving me until the 24th to pay them $6174 or they say they will turn them over to animal control as abandoned.


They wouldnt have gotten the small claims yet I doubt. In my county Once they get it by registered mail they have 20 days to respond to the court. I hope you are getting some legal advice. You might need to do something to prevent them from getting rid of the animals. you havent answered any questions about how many, what kind , and what care they have given.
If they really did alot of work and saved you alot of money maybe you should offer them $$$ to get your animals.


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## jessyedagger (Nov 19, 2014)

4 horses, 1 cow and 10 goats. I have paid for feed and cleaning. Plus they were to get 5 baby goats.

I offered them all but 3 of my goats, one of my horses and my livestock panels which they declined. They said they want all everything except 3 of my horses.


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

they must send everything registered mail. Tell them to show proof with a contract. 
you need to get an attorney. Do not offer them anything.


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## 4horses (Nov 26, 2012)

Do not offer to pay them anything! Otherwise they will use that as proof you owe them money. Do not agree to any payment or offer them your animals. The judge will read that as guilt and think you owe them money!


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

With "friends" like that, who needs enemies?

I hope you get your babies back.


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

Jessey .. what is the latest ?


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## jessyedagger (Nov 19, 2014)

As of today they want are letting me get my horses but not my other livestock. Trying to find a local hauler.


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

I would be leading them off that property if I had to. I would still be filing small claims for the goats and cow. If you promised them 3 goats, I would leave them 3 goats.


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

They are trying to screw up the legal process by offering part. Be careful how you proceed. If you decide to take the horses, try to have someone from the sheriff's dept. accompany you.


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## Chasin Ponies (Dec 25, 2013)

jessyedagger said:


> Yes I can make a list of everything. I have receipts proving I was paying around $1300 a month in feed. Until the last month and a half I was out to see them at least once a week. I have hundreds of text messages and no mention of board until a few weeks ago.
> 
> Also what about the place that I am supposed to say I asked them for the money? What do I do there?


 Do you still have the texts on your phone? Hopefully you have a "super back up" app running on your phone-this will save all of your texts every couple of days and you can go on your computer and print out any "conversation". This is legal documentation! 

Since you did not ask them for money, put N/A (not applicable) in that spot. While it's true that you cannot take an attorney with you to small claims court, you certainly should look for an area "legal aid" society in your area. They will provide free legal help.

Good luck and keep fighting!! But do it quickly, you don't want them punishing your horses.


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## Roux (Aug 23, 2013)

Small claims court is a court of "law" not "equity" meaning that the only remedies you have available are monetary damages. 

If you want the court to order them to "do something" ie. give you your property back you need to go to a court that can award "specific performance" or and injunction to give the animals back. 

Law = money
Equity = performance 

I believe that in small claims court the only outcome will be you are asked to pay them or they are asked to pay you for the value of the animals they now have. They do not have the "power" to order the return of the animals.

Also while getting a contract in writing is always best in most states it is NOT required and a verbal agreement does not disqualify a contract or relieve any one of their duties under the contract. The difference is that is it harder to definitively pin down exactly what the contract does. 

I would highly suggest that you find a private mediator that will help you ALL come to an agreement. Sometimes you can find them at your municipal or metro court and you pay by the hour. Or you find a private one. Resolving this through mediation will be the BEST, cheapest, and fastest rout to a resolution AND you are more likely to receive a positive outcome.


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## kewpalace (Jul 17, 2013)

Roux said:


> If you want the court to order them to "do something" ie. give you your property back you need to go to a court that can award "specific performance" or and injunction to give the animals back.


Small claims in CA _can_ order return of property.


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