# wormy belly or something else?



## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Another picture of him taken two or so weeks ago.


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

He looks like my old mare. she has no muscle along her topline and gains all of her weight in her belly. she's twice as old as this horse, though. It could be worms that the wormer you've used is not designed for. I would consult a vet as to which brand of wormer would be best (each one affects certain parasites better than others) or what they think it might be.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Not sure if this changes anything but my sister kinda rescued him. She bought him off a lady who had him on less than an acre pasture with an older 27 year old paint and i dont think he had any shots or worming prior to my sister buying him. They were only fed round bales and only one a week the paint was in horrible shape extremely emaciated and just looked dull. The paint has since gained at least 100 lbs and is looking good Cherokee just seems to be getting a bigger belly but nothing else. Right now he is going to be getting a Bimectrin(sp) wormer


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

Have fecals done, that will tell exactly what the worm count is and they will tell you which class of wormer to use. It's only about $30 or so to have it done. Just bag up some fresh poop and take it into the clinic.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

that shouldnt be too hard as he poops A LOT especially when working


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## squirrelfood (Mar 29, 2014)

Agree with the fecals. I can see that something isn't working nutritionally. Either the worms are hanging in there, or he needs more fat and protein than he's getting. You see bellies like that on horses fed poor quality hay usually. You might also try a good round of probiotics, and check for ulcers, which are common in horses that have been malnourished.


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## verona1016 (Jul 3, 2011)

Have you used one of the wormers that kills tapeworms? There are only a few: Quest Plus, Zimectrin Gold, and Equimax. These all contain the drug praziquantel. If not, then do one of these now. Tapeworms very rarely show up on a FEC (though there is a blood test IIRC)


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Have his teeth been checked or floated?he may not be able to chew well wpenough to get the nutrition .


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## ZaneyZanne123 (Nov 9, 2013)

I would also recommend getting a fecal done (collect at the end of a deworming cycle just before you deworm him again). Write on the bag or container what was used the last time he was dewormed. I can pretty much bet you the Vet is going to recommend a Ivermectin with praziquantel treatment regime (to treat for tapeworms). Follow the recomendations of the Vet. Be careful with cheap dewormers (i'm talking about the knockoff cheap 2.00 dewormers by makers that no one has heard of.) they arent quality controled.


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## KigerQueen (Jun 16, 2013)

I would check for sand. Its prevalent out here and some of the saggy bellies are caused from it. I would talk to your vet because starting him on sillium might cause colic if given in the wrong amount (if he is really full of sand).


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

I don't think there is much sand in northeastern pa
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

I would like to see a picture of this horse stood square, and taken from behind also one taken from the front when stood square, of his chest and forearm. 

The lack of top line and his belly can signify misalignment.


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

danicelia24 said:


> I don't think there is much sand in northeastern pa
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I doesn't have to be sand, any dirt will do. It's only called 'sand' for ease of speaking.


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## Cherrij (Jan 30, 2013)

Check for worms, maybe sand, check his teeth. Then start working long and low to get him working his topline but it also will work his belly muscles and those should start pushing his round belly up too.


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## CLaPorte432 (Jan 3, 2012)

Do you know for sure the age of this horse? Perhaps he is quite older then originally thought to be.

Totally agree with getting a Fecal done. I recently just had an eye opening experience regarding that and I won't deworm without them now. It's cheap and totally effective.

What is the quality of hay he eats? Poor/lower quality can cause a hay belly and poor muscle mass.

Is he lethargic in any way? I might consider blood work as well depending on his personality. Just to make sure there is no ongoing infection, or if there Hct or Hgb is low.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Foxhunter said:


> I would like to see a picture of this horse stood square, and taken from behind also one taken from the front when stood square, of his chest and forearm.
> 
> The lack of top line and his belly can signify misalignment.


He's actually having a massage therapist coming out next week cause he has trouble turning to the left but I will get those pictures for you today
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

CLaPorte432 said:


> Do you know for sure the age of this horse? Perhaps he is quite older then originally thought to be.
> 
> Totally agree with getting a Fecal done. I recently just had an eye opening experience regarding that and I won't deworm without them now. It's cheap and totally effective.
> 
> ...


I'm not 100% sure of his age but his previous owner said she had bought him three years ago as a six year old. I will also get a picture of his teeth. The hay is first and third cut Timothy/alfalfa mix. He is not lethargic in anyway that I have seen
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cherie (Dec 16, 2010)

I would get a fecal done. It is not likely that he has parasites id he has been dewormed that much.

I would cut back on his hay and feed him 1 pound of soybean meal a day. [Obviously work up to that amount gradually.]

He really looks like a horse that over-eats grass hay, is under-worked and needs more 'good quality' protein. When he is worked, make sure he is 'using' himself correctly. That means staying 'in frame' and with good impulsion from behind and good head carriage and position.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Cherie said:


> I would get a fecal done. It is not likely that he has parasites id he has been dewormed that much.
> 
> I would cut back on his hay and feed him 1 pound of soybean meal a day. [Obviously work up to that amount gradually.]
> 
> He really looks like a horse that over-eats grass hay, is under-worked and needs more 'good quality' protein. When he is worked, make sure he is 'using' himself correctly. That means staying 'in frame' and with good impulsion from behind and good head carriage and position.


He is worked for at least 5 days a week and between 3-5 hours each of those days. and he is kind of the bully in the pasture and I only have a run in shelter so i dont have any way to stop how much he eats. I will definetly have my sister get a fecal and bloodwork done. I dont have soybean meal but will look into getting some im currently feeding sweet feed grain and beet pulp mixed together. here is a picture of my sister riding him so you can see how he carries himself.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

CLaPorte432 said:


> What is the quality of hay he eats? Poor/lower quality can cause a hay belly and poor muscle mass.
> 
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


If it was the hay wouldnt it be affecting more than just him? all the other horses look good and are on the same schedule for worming as him. he is the only horse that looks like he does


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## karliejaye (Nov 19, 2011)

Some horses seem to get "hay belly" or "roughage belly" easier than others. I think it may be a combination of hay belly, worms (I like the suggestion to treat with praziquantel for tapes), and underdeveloped back muscles.
Def get a fecal done!


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## Reno Bay (Jul 8, 2012)

The sweet feed might be part of your problem; or at least something different to look into. If it's an inexpensive feed that has high molasses content, then it's basically candy. There isn't much in the way of nutritional value in many sweet feeds.

I agree with getting the fecal done... and pretty much everything that's been said here.


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## 4hoofbeat (Jun 27, 2013)

just from looking at the pictures i would say he's older than you think. and it's amazing what a difference getting the right feed into him will make. It took almost a year for my guy to gain enough healthy weight to look good. 
and like others have said, get his teeth checked, and that fecal. Although he may be on the same worming schedule as the others, the wormers might not be the right wormer for what is affecting him.


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## squirrelfood (Mar 29, 2014)

All horses are NOT created equal. Like anyone, they can have different needs. This guy's needs aren't being met.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Reno Bay said:


> The sweet feed might be part of your problem; or at least something different to look into. If it's an inexpensive feed that has high molasses content, then it's basically candy. There isn't much in the way of nutritional value in many sweet feeds.
> 
> I agree with getting the fecal done... and pretty much everything that's been said here.


The sweet feed has little molasses content and is good quality but also inexpensive.
would this wormer work? Equimax 14.03 Praziquantel/1.87 Ivermectin Paste - Horse.com
I'm adding a picture of him taken in winter








and one of him with the other horses including my 17 year old mare(black) and husbands 5 year old paint/qh








and one of him last fall


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

squirrelfood said:


> All horses are NOT created equal. Like anyone, they can have different needs. This guy's needs aren't being met.


after watching him carefully all winter I realize there was something more he needed which is why I'm asking you all. the vet is coming out later this month for all their yearly shots but in the meantime i will have a fecal test done on him.


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## Cherrij (Jan 30, 2013)

Ask the vet to check his teeth for age too! Or get good pics and the gurus here will help. 
He does look a lot older, and must agree that his needs are not being met. Ditch the sweet feed and work with beet pulp, rice bran, wheat bran, sunflower meal, flax meal, oil!.. there are many things that are easy to digest and bring up condition and increase overall health and make the coat shine. Ofc, proper riding helps too.. 

No offence to your sister, but he seems to be bracing against her in the pic, he needs to work more down and more hind leg movement!


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## Kayella (Feb 11, 2012)

He does look a lot older than 10. I would also look into the possibility of Cushings. He just has that look about him, imo.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

ok i got some conformation pictures of him and pictures of his teeth today. And in the pic of my sister riding he does tend to hang on the persons hands if they are too tight and they were also on a bit of a hill in that pic.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

and here are his teeth


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## Cherie (Dec 16, 2010)

His teeth look about 13 to me. He is also showing wear on the central incisors that looks a lot like he is a cribber.

As ribby as he is, he is definitely not getting the nutrient requirements he needs. 

I would still go with a pound of soybean meal a day. To be very honest with you, grain and sweet feed have fed thousands of healthy horses for decades. I would make sure the grains are rolled and that his teeth have been done. I know it is now the popular thing to feed low starch, low sugar feeds, but unless a horse has a metabolic problem or is too fat, there is nothing in the world wrong with them. Horses have been fed them for decades without any problems until people started stalling and penning horses and over-feeding them.

If your horse is being ridden that much, sweet feed is not going to hurt him, but a pelleted feed will be much more digestible. You might also look at his manure. I would almost bet you will find undigested grain particles. This may be partly from teeth, but more than likely from an inefficient digestive system. Deworming too frequently can exacerbate that problem more than helping it.

I am feeding 50 horses and the ones getting grain are getting a rolled corn / wheat midd pellet mixture that has added soybean meal, calcium and a vitamin A-D-E premix in it. I have 1 horse out of 50 that cannot eat a high starch diet. 

I would also put him on a good vitamin supplement. 90-95 % of all horses do not need any supplements. That other 10% just will not do well without them. We 'kick-start' one like him with weekly ORAL doses of injectable Vitamin A and inectable Vitamin B Complex. We just squirt 5 cc of each into a horse's mouth just like a dewormer.

We also make sure they have access to a good probiotic. He already has one in the form of fresh manure from one of the fat healthy horses he is running with. If he needs it, he will eat it. I would take him out by himself to feed him a high quality pelleted grain mix with added soybean meal once a day and let him eat with the others any other time he is fed. I wouldn't worry about cutting back his hay. If you get better quality protein in him, and get him on a good Vitamin, you will find that he will not want as much hay. Right now, he is trying to fulfill his needs with what is available. 

He is not going to be an easy keeper -- for a while anyway. I would watch him after he eats to see if you spot him cribbing. If he is, that could also indicate ulcers, although they are not common in horses eating that much hay free choice. 

The riding I see is not helping him at all. It is probably contributing to the problem. He is not engaged at all, his neck is raised without any arch and his nose is out too far to let him use his back or strengthen his stomach muscles. A horse has to round his back, pull up his stomach muscles and engage his hind end. In order to do this, he has to round his neck and tuck his chin. A vertical face is part of it, but a horse can have an artificial 'head set' and still travel with a hollow back like he is if they are not being pushed from behind.

Good luck with him.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

as far as i know he has never cribbed while he has been with me and he gets wormed every 6 weeks...is that too much? And when they are fed grain each horse is tied up so there is no horse pushing each other off their grain although he would be the one to do so. I will also have my sister cut back on riding but when she does ride make sure to get him to engage all of his body.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Do you really think he may have Cushings? I was looking at symptoms and he does have a weird really long coat even though today it was 80 and all the other horses have almost completely shed out their winter coats


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## Cherrij (Jan 30, 2013)

danicelia24 said:


> as far as i know he has never cribbed while he has been with me and he gets wormed every 6 weeks...is that too much? And when they are fed grain each horse is tied up so there is no horse pushing each other off their grain although he would be the one to do so. I will also have my sister cut back on riding but when she does ride make sure to get him to engage all of his body.


Is there any reason why you think you need to deworm every 6 weeks? Do you have feral animals running around your pasture? Or any other source of worms?


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## verona1016 (Jul 3, 2011)

danicelia24 said:


> would this wormer work? Equimax 14.03 Praziquantel/1.87 Ivermectin Paste - Horse.com


Yes, that's a good one for tapeworms


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

there are a lot of wild animals around yes such as coyotes foxes bears deer bobcats...also there are quite a few amish dogs that run all over so i do it as a precaution.


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## amigoboy (Feb 14, 2014)

Foxhunter said:


> I would like to see a picture of this horse *stood square, *and taken from behind also one taken from the front when stood square, of his chest and forearm.
> 
> The lack of top line and his belly can signify misalignment.


Nice to hear some old time words.


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## amigoboy (Feb 14, 2014)

lots of good tips.
I´d forget the fecal test and put the money on a vet to go over the horse. Those test are unreliable and the horse is going too need deworming anyway.
Equimax, Zimectine Gold and Quest Plus are broad spectrum wormer and takes everything.
Some info.
Equimax

PS.
I´d put the age at about 15-16 yrs.


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## ZaneyZanne123 (Nov 9, 2013)

This horse is definatly about 13 years old (Galvayne's groove has not made to the halfway mark but the 7/11 year notch is gone putting him at about 13 yrs old). He looks to be either a chewer (like fence chewer) or a mild cribber due to the wear of his front teeth. He may infact need to be floated (by a professional) and I would still get a fecal done regardless. He's not bone thin but does seem to need a more formulated for him type of feeding schedule. Hay does not cause a hay belly but the lack of muscle tone in the gut area which causes the belly to sag. With the proper muscle work this can be eleviated. If his teeth are a problem then this could be the root cause of his problem. However his coat is dull and though improper nutrition causes this so cant parasite infestations and other illnesses. Before I go shoving more food into him and changing things I would get his teeth looked into for that might just be the only cause. Afterwards if nothing changes then looking into diet changes (granted he is not full of parasites) will more than likely help. 
There is a plethera of different feeds being marketed out there and there is alot of misconceptions and misinformation about feeding. Since I cannot evaluate your horse and his current nutirtional intake I do not put any recommendations or consultations on feeding schedule over the forums openly, HOWEVER I will say that begin with least invasive then work upwards to more invasive. Good quality hay or forage (ie grazing) is extremely important. I usualy fed a mixed hay that comprised of primarily thimothy, blugrass, orchard and a touch of legum like alfalfa or red clover (mold resistant). Most times with decent quality hay and or grazing if available, feeding a concentrate was not nessesary under light to medium work load. To much carbs can be just as detrimental than not enough and the same goes with protein. Its been along while since I have set up a feeding schedule and cannot remember on the top of my head how much protein (in lbs) that a horse in light to medium works requires in a day. I know its not much. Many believe that one MUST feed a concentrate or a sweet feed to a horse and that is not so. However some do require more to keep up with nutritional demands (esp in heavy work load demands). There is a ton of commercial pre balanced mixed feeds out there on the market. From senior feeds (which some hard keepers do well on regardless of age) to carb sensitive feeds to your basic sweet feeds and pelleted versions. Its endless realy. I have fed Strategy for years and its a pelleted feed and I have fed Buckeye/Purina Senior, to Purina Omalene 100 sweetfeed concentrate and a local basic mix for those easy keepers duriing the winter months when good hay was not that easily to come by. 

There are also countless number of supplements available some are crap and some are decent and worth while. Then you have your basic roughage increasers like beet pulp, chop (chaff) mixed hays to cubed roughages with out the uneeded excessive carbohydrate loads. You have fat increasers liquid form and solid forms, probiotics out the yin yang. Basic plain yogurt has worked many times to jump start a slow gut flora and for those comming out of illness or on a broad spectrum antibiotic. (fed at a rate of 60 ccs two to three times a day for minimum 7 days) foals actually do well with such regime but older horses can and often do. Then you have your more concentrated forms of probiotics. Prebiotics can also be helpful, depending on certain situations. I like to feed a prebiotic before shows or stressfull events Prebiotics feed probiotic bacteria. One item I have used is Focus WT by Source. Then there is Probios and so forth and so on. 
Feeding properly can be a nightmare and marketing applications and ploys only add fuel to confusion. I do and will recommend the book "Feeding Horses" by Story publications. They break it all down in easy to understand segments and can be extremely helpful in custom designing a feeding regime suited to your horses needs. Remember to change slowly and add slowly and give time for the change to work before deciding its not working. Sometimes all it takes is a ration balancer with a good quality hay or grazing. Feed by weight not volume for two diffferent feeds may not weigh the same but take up the same volume.

If you want me to help directly then PM me and we will break everything down and begin a regime based on true and correct information you give me (hay in lbs, or time grazing what type of forage in feilds, and you will need the feed tag from your feed bag if available and I will break out my information calculations and etc from storage. Get my brain working again. When I pulled out of the active horse world and consultations my brain has gone to idle dullness, it needs a workout. Lol.

First and foremost get the fecals and get the teeth taken a look at. He's not old but he's not young either and teeth care esp at this point should be a minimum of a annual event.


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## ZaneyZanne123 (Nov 9, 2013)

Oh wow the pictures finally came up for me. I want to say GREAT profile conformation photo. Conformationaly I would love to put this guy on a grid but right now I am technologicaly challeneged. May I keep a copy of these photos for later analysis? I am pondering on writing a tutorial book on conformation and he might be helpful even if he is a little on the thin side. Looks like Spring is progressing slow there, here trees are almost in full folliage.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

ZaneyZanne123 said:


> Oh wow the pictures finally came up for me. I want to say GREAT profile conformation photo. Conformationaly I would love to put this guy on a grid but right now I am technologicaly challeneged. May I keep a copy of these photos for later analysis? I am pondering on writing a tutorial book on conformation and he might be helpful even if he is a little on the thin side. Looks like Spring is progressing slow there, here trees are almost in full folliage.


Yes you may keep copies of the photos . Spring has always progressed on the slow side we normally have like 5 months of winter starting in late november the hardest times in february and spring doesnt really show till late may early june and by then summer starts. I dont know if they are as good but i also took conformation pics of two other horses yesterday too.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

The wormer seemed to help Cherokee and he seems to be gaining weight in the right places now instead of just his belly still a way to go!


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## ecasey (Oct 18, 2013)

My horse has a somewhat distended belly. I asked my trainer what the cause was, either worms, her breed (half Breton draft) or something else. His answer was (c) something else. He said she was really out of shape when I bought her and her abdominal muscles still aren't as tight as they should be. As she's worked more and in better shape, and I ask more things of her, her ab muscles will tighten, her back muscles will get stronger, and the belly will lift.

???

I'd also second that idea of getting an egg count. It's the only way to really know!


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

I plan on it when the vet comes out


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Cherokee looking better no quite so ribby and his belly doesnt look quite so big.


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

I concur that this horse is older than you think. there is nothing wrong with older horses.
I would get him a senior feed. any brand . He looks like he needs a higher fat content.
You could get some beet pulp soak it first then feed it at night to help him. 
The tape womer products are good. Could there be parasites in that creek/stream ? 
hes a cute guy.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

stevenson said:


> I concur that this horse is older than you think. there is nothing wrong with older horses.
> I would get him a senior feed. any brand . He looks like he needs a higher fat content.
> You could get some beet pulp soak it first then feed it at night to help him.
> The tape womer products are good. Could there be parasites in that creek/stream ?
> hes a cute guy.


I don't have any problem with older horses  my mare is 17 and I love her and he does get soaked beet pulp and the creek I'm not sure but it is spring fed and runs into town water so I don't think so


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Cherokee seems to be doing well we have started hill work to try and build up his topline and he is slowly being switched to a senior feed. The vet looked at his teeth and she thinks he is between 14-16 years old.
Some pictures from today:


























Watching the deer:


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

and for comparison

A month ago:









Today:


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## BearPony (Jan 9, 2013)

Consult with your vet to make sure his daily ration (including hay, grain, any pasture) has enough protein to support building muscle.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Update- Cherokee is doing much better and is starting to lose his belly and is gaining muscle due to some hill work and collection/extended work. He also got a haircut cause his mane was looking scraggly. He is due for another round of worming within the next two weeks. My sister was playing around and taking him over little jumps (6"-1'6") and she wanted to see if he could go higher so I bumped it up to 2' and he cleared it with no problem so pushing our luck a little we tried 2'6" and again no problems and he jumped them wonderfully though neither I or my sister were willing to push him any farther. But for comparison....
Two weeks ago:

















Today:


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

he looks better because he has shed his winter hair, he is still thin, I dont think I would be doing heavy riding on him yet, and lay off the jumping until he is up in weight


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## amigoboy (Feb 14, 2014)

This is how he should look after a year of hay - oats - work & TLC


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## RedTree (Jan 20, 2010)

^^^
That horse is fat

He's looking good, still needs more weight, would over do the riding, but a little bit of everything everynow and then can't harm him 

Good luck with him and keep us updated


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Since it's been awhile since I posted on this thread I thought now would be a good time to update you guys on Cherokee. 
After pouring food into him, giving him free choice hay, and giving him the correct wormers after the results of the FEC came back there has been no change for better or worse in him. I am to the point where I think it is Cushings now. He still has long hairs around his belly and girth area. He drinks all the time...my sister took him to a fun show and he must have drank a 5 gallon bucket every hour or so. He still has his pot belly no matter how much hill work we do with him. And he still hasn't gained any weight.


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## amigoboy (Feb 14, 2014)

Have the vet do a blood test.

Here´s some info:
www.horseandhound.co.uk/horse-car/vet-advice/understanding-cushings-disease-2/


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## Trinity3205 (Dec 21, 2010)

That last photo shows a horse that is being ridden upside down. Proper riding and engaging himself properly will help a ton to build topline. its imperative on a hard keeper.


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## CLaPorte432 (Jan 3, 2012)

I'm sorry but he looks in horrible shape. I would not let anyone ride that horse. He is wayyy too skinny.

Have you had the vet look at him recently? Bloodwork? 

There is something SERIOUSLY wrong with him. He is not healthy. He looks by far worse then he originally did when you created this post.

I'm sorry to break the bad news to you. Although I'm sure you can see it... Poor guy.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

the vet actually sent him home from that show as he was having abdominal pain... I realize he doesn't look good which is why I'm so concerned about what is wrong with him. I'm trying to get an appointment scheduled so the vet can to a complete blood profile and see what is wrong. I feel so bad that no matter what we do he just will no gain or lose that pot-belly. Which is why I have the sneaking suspicion he may have Cushings


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

these are the most recent pictures of him i have


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## TimWhit91 (Feb 3, 2012)

That other horse with him looks skinny too. Poor guy, hope he gets some weight on him soon
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

she's actually pretty beefy and if I feed her anymore than what she gets she gets super fat! so its a difficult balancing act with her. and I feel the same way I'm sorry my sister bought him because while he is a nice horse I think she bit off more than she could chew with a first horse...but she felt sorry for him and wanted to rescue him(which he did need...his pasture mate(who was 27) looked like a skeleton with skin on him! He was taken in by a friend who got him up to a really nice weight before he was kicked to death by another horse  )


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## TimWhit91 (Feb 3, 2012)

Must just be a bad picture, I see a few ribs, spine starting to show and hollowed hips (that's not the word I'm looking for, my mind went blank)

Glad you guys saved him, hopefully he sees a vet and it is an easy fix and not a big deal
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

yes I hope she calls me back soon and here is another picture of the mare


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## TimWhit91 (Feb 3, 2012)

Funny what bad angles do. Cute mare, she looks fine
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

Don't think his weight is helping the pot bellied look. Idk about Cushings but the vet may have some ideas.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Thanks she's a good girl and it is amazing how cameras can distort things(like i said she's pretty beefy)...I'm really hoping for my sisters sake(who is 14) Cherokee doesn't have Cushings I don't know if she would be able to care for him like he would have to be with a special diet and possible meds... but if he does I know she will try and do her best but I think it would be in his best interest to find a new home that would be able to handle his needs. I would but I have enough on my plate as it is with a pregnant mare and an underweight boarder's TB to take care of.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Yogiwick said:


> Don't think his weight is helping the pot bellied look. Idk about Cushings but the vet may have some ideas.


Well after a quick google search this is a horse with Cushing's and it looks an awful like Cherokee especially when he was shedding.


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

I just don't see it from the pics you posted, but you know him better. 10 is also pretty young for that.


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

Well the previous owner said he was 10 but the vet thinks he's between 14-16


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

What exactly and how much are you feeding him?


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## danicelia24 (Jul 16, 2013)

ok he gets 6 lbs of soaked alfalfa cubes 3 lbs of beet pulp and 4 lbs of grain 2x a day plus two 800 lb round bales to pick and choose from both of which are first cut hay


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

danicelia24 said:


> ok he gets 6 lbs of soaked alfalfa cubes 3 lbs of beet pulp and 4 lbs of grain 2x a day plus two 800 lb round bales to pick and choose from both of which are first cut hay


 Lots of variables here.
Hay may not be the most nutritious.
What kind of grain? 8 pds a day should be good if it is, quality higher fat and calories.

Not sure how big your horse is or breed but needs more fat and higher caloric intake. If it is a thoroughbred then might not be enough food verses a different breed.


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## KsKatt (Jun 2, 2014)

I went through and did my best to thoroughly read every post. Please forgive if I missed something, but these are my questions.

Did you get this horse checked out by a vet in the very beginning?
You said the vet thinks he's 16 or less, did you actually get his teeth floated?
Do you use the same vet every time? It's just that would mean the vet has been watching the progress, or lack of, and I would think he/she would have some ideas.
He is youngish for Cushings, but there are things you can do to be proactive and help a lot. Like- eliminate everything that has sugar/molasses. Alfalfa cubes or pellets are great, look for beet pulp without molasses (I use Sandlee). I was told to give my Shetland Chase tree berry and I think it's been working. I need to get out and take new pics of him.

You, your sister I guess, really need to have a serious talk with your vet. He/she has seen this horse multiple times and should have some ideas. btw- we are talking about an equine vet, right?


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## TimWhit91 (Feb 3, 2012)

First cutting hay can either be good or bad. A lot of the fields around here have a lot of weeds in the first cut because they don't want to spray. If it has a lot of weeds, you won't get much nutrients out of it. First cut should have higher nutrient content than second cut, so he should be gaining a little with free choice.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Tim,
It could also be dusty, moldy, not bailed properly so it could have many issues.


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## Trinity3205 (Dec 21, 2010)

Second and third cutting are horse hay around here. First is cattle hay. First cutting has too much lignin (stemmy) from fast growth and many times it is cut overmature and already seeded due to spring weather. I would stop with the first cut rolls or only leave them out as filler and buy some good quality forage. when you dig your hand into a hay bale, it should not be scratchy, it should feel soft and smell sweet and have lots of grass leaves not the stems. The seed head should be at the just forming stage, not already seeded out. I think you have a forage quality and a riding problem here personally after this new info.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

I would get some blood tests done and rule out anything that's not diet related or worm related. 
Cushings horses tend to not get a real summer coat even when they shed it grows back coarse and thick
IRS horses can struggle to keep weight on once they have it


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

I would also give daily probiotics to both horses. Probios is very inexpensive


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