# Breeding Pinto w/Racehorse?



## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

My mom said we could breed my sorrel/white pinto to a thoroughbred. This thoroughbred is all sorrel and has fathered a winning, not yet famous horse named Ickabod. I don't want a bad tempered horse. And that is the impression i got from Diamond (stallion). I don't know if that is just how they act. Diamond has a son named Jake, his mother died so he was bottle fed and didn't grow, so to say, to his peek. He is the sweetest geldig in the world. And fast. But not racing material. My pinto mare is sweet natured. I don't want a bad natured half racehorse. Do you think the foal will end up like this?


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Why breed these two horses when you can buy exactly what you want at a fraction of the price (and risk) of breeding? 
Please check out some other breeding threads, especially the ones about breeding quality. It seems as though you don't really have a solid goal for the possible resulting foal. 

Bottom line: if you want something, buy it. Don't breed it. So much can go wrong.


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## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

There is not price in breeding to this horse. Breeding to this horse is free because we are very close friends to the owner. He lives with us most of the time and is like my second father. But thankyou for your input. I will definitely consider it.


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## NdAppy (Apr 8, 2009)

Pretty much what JDI said.


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## NdAppy (Apr 8, 2009)

A free breeding, imo, is not a good enough reason to breed.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

The sperm are the only free part about breeding.

There are a bunch of vet bills associated with breeding that you would not normally have. And that is for a normal no complications pregnancy.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Jess, let me ask you a question. I mean this sincerely, and am not trying to hurt your feelings, just get you to think.

You say you love your mare very much. Would you _willingly_ put her at risk of death, just to get a foal from her?

Many mares die during foaling, or have to be put down afterward due to complications. I have a friend who lost both the mare_ and_ foal earlier this year, and was completely devastated.

She has stated she will _never_ breed another mare, no matter what. She lost her heart horse that day, and it was terribly tragic.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Alwaysbehind said:


> The sperm are the only free part about breeding.
> 
> There are a bunch of vet bills associated with breeding that you would not normally have. And that is for a normal no complications pregnancy.


Exactly.
My thoughts are if this stud is free, he's not worth breeding to. You want to bring a sellable, quality foal into the world - you cannot ever promise a horse a forever home... life gets in the way more times than you can imagine. 
Breeding just to breed (and get a "cute" foal out of your mare) is not a good reason to breed - at all. Breeding to better the breed with a specific tangible goal, and breeding quality horses are what you want to do. 
In my opinion, no you should not breed them. 
You want to better the breed or sport that you're breeding two individuals for. There are TONS of threads on this board in regards to quality breeding, and TONS of threads more about people posting the exact same type of thread as you. 
It seems like you're really wanting to think this through, which is fantastic (kudos!) - please take some time to read through the threads here.


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## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

Well, its not free breeding. That's not why were doing it. I wanted a baby horse and so does my mom. And there will be no vet bills. We aren't gonna go all human pregnancy with this. She's gonna get bred. She will stay with diamond for a week in heat. We will take her home. She will be put out to pasture. 11 Months later if all goes well I will have another horse to love on. Just as simple as that. She stays at my gpas. He raised horses for 20 years. There were never vet bills unless a c section was needed.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

A pregnant mare needs prenatal and postnatal care, so a _good_ owner will have vet bills.

You don't have any plans for this foal other than you want a 'cute baby'?

I'm outta here. I thought you were different, and might actually _listen_ to why breeding just to breed isn't a good idea. My bad, and I won't waste any more of my time. :?


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Interesting. So you've already made up your mind.
No vet bills? In what world? What about preg checks and making sure the pregnancy is going well and smoothly? How about vaccinations and ultrasounds? A vet to come out just after the foal is born to check over both mare and foal, and make sure the placenta was fully expelled and not a single shard retained?
There are going to be vet bills. Potentially large ones. 

You should not breed this mare, and I'm getting the feeling that this thread was created JUST to rile us up.
I thought you were different, that you cared and wanted opinions and to discuss this. I guess not. I'm with SR, obviously wasting time on this thread. 

A responsible breeder you are most definitely _not_. *le sigh* another one bites the dust.
.... and people wonder why the horse market is in the dumps, and why there is a need for horse slaughter. Don't have to look further than this mentality right here.


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

Alwaysbehind said:


> There are a bunch of vet bills associated with breeding that you would not normally have. And that is for a normal no complications pregnancy.


Plus feed, training for the baby, several months off riding for you, etc. And yes, you don't know even the outcome (confo and disposition of the baby). 

Personally I'd buy something already on ground if you really want a baby or 2nd horse.


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## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

Speed Racer. I do love my mare. More than anything in the world. But I also trust my vet and owner of the stallion to do re best they can. I have been informed that it may not work, that being 8 and never bred may cause in no baby due to her age. She may not even take . I haven't bred her yet and now I'm not so sure that I want to. Thank you all. I might just settle buying a weanling. Thanks for the advice
.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

What does trusting your vet have to do with anything when you have already stated you are not going to call the vet?


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## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

I'm not breeding her just to get a baby. I'm breeding her to get a fast barrel horse.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

JessPintoMare said:


> I don't want a bad tempered horse. And that is the impression i got from Diamond (stallion). I don't know if that is just how they act.



Oh, and good - the stallion is bad-tempered to boot. No, it is NOT "just how they are," and YES that can most definitely be passed on.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

If you want a fast barrel horse then buy a fast barrel horse. Far less risky than breeding your mare and hoping you get a fast barrel horse.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

JessPintoMare said:


> I'm not breeding her just to get a baby. I'm breeding her to get a fast barrel horse.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



Then buy one with the traits you want. Breeding is a crapshoot in the best of times - breeding these two is ... well I don't really have words.


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## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

Ok first off. The stallion is worth breeding to. He is NOT worthless just because it is free for us to breed him. He has sired plenty of beautiful, fast foals. Now i would appreciate if you would please quit calling me irrisponsible. All i wanted was advice. I will have vet bills. Not ultrasound though. I live in a small town in MO. When we breed a horse we dont go all out like we do for humans. If i could spend all my money making sure she would be ok I would. But i dont have that kind of money. And i dont know why some of you are being so rude. And plus, just because a horse is not bred for a certian reason , does not mean they are pointless. Just because they are not pure bred does not mean its the end of the world. Sorry if i sounded rude.


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## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

And i am Not a troll. I am also NOT stupid. All I wanted was advice. Not an intervention for something i havent even started.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Did anyone say you are stupid?


Go back and read your posts. You say one thing and a few posts later you say the opposite.


You asked our opinion on breeding your mare to a TB stallion. That is what people are giving you, their opinion on it.


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## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

I didnt mean someone posted i was stupid. I was just making a point. Sorry:/


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## dullylover (Jun 19, 2011)

JessPintoMare said:


> I didnt mean someone posted i was stupid. I was just making a point. Sorry:/


ur breeding for a non reg. horse...wow..buy a foal?


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

I'm sorry, I'm going to be blunt here: you are most certainly not being a responsible breeder.
It is doing your mare a severe injustice to not take advantage of fantastic veterinary care throughout the pregnancy. Ultrasounds are very routine, and VERY important - you NEED to know if there are twins, as that is a very dangerous situation for both mare and foals, and one will have to be pinched. The mare will need vet care. You will need to do more than just chuck her out to pasture for 11 months. You will need a vet out soon after birth to examine both mare and foal, and the vet needs to examine the placenta and afterbirth to make sure none is retained. This is not something you (an inexperienced breeder) can check yourself. Very few experienced breeders feel comfortable checking the afterbirth themselves, and have a vet out to make sure it's a-ok.


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

I find it interesting to hear you say" we don't go all out like we would with a human" Excuse me, since when is normal vet car going all out? Since when is an ultrasound going all out? Those are just normal things. You are going to breed her, then toss her out in a pasture for 11 months and hope you get a baby. 
You are not even close to being a responsible horse owner. I work for a vet and we just had a mare and foal die because they were "thrown" out in the pasture to let nature take its course. The mare foaled early in the night, the foal was dead and the mare bled to death. We have had mares pregnant with twins, both twins died , they didn't even know she had twins, no ultrasound. Foals die after being born. Mares die during birth. 
No prenatal care, no vet checks? I pity your mare for you just thinking of her as a "cute baby making machine". A grade mare bred to a race horse WILL NOT give you a fast baby. It may, it may not. Go buy a barrel horse already trained or at baby on the ground with the bloodlines you want.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

My advice would be to not breed this foal, and while you're at it, don't buy one either and potentially sell your horses while you're at it because words don't even begin to describe what kind of a selfish human being you have to be to profess to "loving your mare" and thinking she's not worth the vet bills involved in producing a healthy foal and mare.

And no, I don't give a flying hoot if I sound rude because you don't deserve to own horses if you think they're somehow not deserving of proper veterinary attention.


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## Spastic_Dove (Oct 4, 2007)

JessPintoMare said:


> If i could spend all my money making sure she would be ok I would. But i dont have that kind of money.


With this quote, it does not matter if you are breeding two spectacular horses who are going to produce the next Scamper. What happens if your mare needs veterinary assistance birthing? What if the foal has defects? What if there are twins are a retained placenta? If you have some sort of plan in place for these very real threats, I'm sure you would receive much more sympathetic responses. 

No one is trying to be rude, but many of us have seen what can go wrong with a seemingly simple pregnancy or lack of proper care, training, and maintenance of foals that were bred because people wanted 'a baby' that they could easily buy.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

I missed that quote, Spastic. I really hope that this mare isn't bred, for her (and her potential foal's) sake. 
I'm quite agitated by this post, and fully admit to being a bit rude. The OP seems to need a bit of a rude shock. So much can go wrong, even with a person willing to provide adequate veterinary care. Someone who admits NOT even *able* to provide adequate veterinary care is ... well it's beyond my words. Poor mare.


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## Tennessee (Dec 7, 2008)

Oh my god. This thread is a key example of why the horse market is in the crapper. 

First off, you don't care about your mare. I don't care how much you say it, you are absolutely wrong about that part. People that care about their horses don't put them in life threatening situations on purpose. People that love their horses give them regular vet care, and consider their animal's needs over their selfish wants. 

Second off, as I work on a farm that breeds speed horses, just because you breed two fast horses (and this assuming that your mare and this "racehorse" are even fast) does not mean the foal will want to run and go fast all of time. Example being that one of the most well bred horses I've ever seen was bred where I work out of the top barrel horses around and guess what? He's a lazy poot that would rather carry around children than look at a barrel. I hate to say it, but that's just how it goes.

Third, what kind of person breeds to a bad tempered stallion and expects that the foal won't turn out that way? Are you kidding me? I will give you the benefit of the doubt that the mare's temperment usually has a bigger toll on the foal's temperment, but genetics are in favor as far as the stallion goes too. 

Fourth, did you make this post for a purpose or are you just trying to cause trouble? You've been given some great advice, that well experienced people were kind enough to take the time and type out for you, and you ignore it. Do you know that crappy that is? I do, and I don't like it. 

So, go ahead and breed your mare. Personally? I don't care. It's not my horse to care about (and thank goodness she is not...). Just don't come whining to us when she ends up dead because you want a coooottt baabbbeehhhh.


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## bubba13 (Jan 6, 2007)

I live in a small town in MO, too. My neighbor is an equine repro vet, who stays VERY busy installing foal-alert systems, and doing preg check ultrasounds, and monitoring heat cycles closely (administering hormones as needed), and scrambling for colostrum for orphan foals, and assisting with difficult births at all hours of the night....

Every year I hear her horror stories. Mare and foals dead, and frequently even when owners DID pony up the money. $#!+ happens.

Breeding (or even owning) horses with the monetary situation you have described is irresponsible. Hoping for the magical fantasy barrel horse from this mishmash mating is delusional.


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## A knack for horses (Jun 17, 2010)

Well this is what I see:

You want to breed your 8 year old virgin paint mare to a bad tempered TB racehorse for a fast barrel horse because the breeding is free and you want a baby horse. IF your mare gets pregnant you are going to throw her in a pasture for 11 months and hope for the best. You're not going to pay for any kind of prenatal care for momma or baby, but you love this mare with your heart and soul.

^NOTHING in what you have said screams any logic to me. In my opinion, that is irresponsible horse ownership. You are breeding for all the wrong reasons and don't have good plans for this breeding either. Breeding is a huge risk, both physically and financially. 

You claim this mare is your heart and soul. Would you put a pistol to her temple and play rush and rulet with her? Probably not in a million years, am I correct? If you choose to breed her and throw her in a pasture with no prenatal vet care whatsoever, that is EXACTLY what you are doing. You are putting your mares life at extreme risk, as a million things could go wrong with her pregnancy that could kill her and the foal.
Even if you did get the thousands of dollars of vet care a normal pregnancy needs, there still is a good risk of you losing both mare and foal. If you can't afford the basic care your mare needs for a pregnancy, you have no business breeding her. 

I hope you heed the advice myself and the others on this thread have given you. If not, I pray for your mare and her potential foal.


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## Equus_girl (Jan 25, 2009)

I used to think exactly like you before I got my own horse. When I was younger I always thought that if I ever got a mare of my own I would want to breed her and have a foal. Foals are adorable, fun and cute and that was my "plan". However, not long after that I joined this forum and started reading threads a lot like this one. I then did some more research on the internet, read books and came to the conclusion that there is a lot more to be considered when breeding then just wanting a "cute" baby.

I got a mare of my own just over a year ago. She was 18 at the time, she is technically grade as I don't have her papers, I don't have the kind of money for the vet bills that go with breeding and a potential emergency and she is a maiden mare, so that would be extremely risky to breed her for the first time. I will never be breeding her.

However, I am not going to give up my dreams of having a foal someday! I plan on waiting till I have a better paying job so I can save up the necessary money, buying a well conformed, registered mare that is either in foal to a registered stallion or breed her to a registered stallion that has good confo, good temperament and compliments the mare. Grade horses are wonderful, but for breeding I think it is important that they are registered as it is so much easier to sell them if you ever have to. You can also trace for genetic diseases that way.

My advice is that you wait and if you want to breed, do it up really right. Vet checks are important! Especially checking for twins, and the check after foaling. Those are must haves! 

There are many very knowledgeable people on this forum and my advice to you would be to listen to it, evaluate it and then decide if what you have been thinking is really what should be done, or if you should reevaluate.


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## apachewhitesox (Dec 9, 2010)

Wow all I can say is sorry but you are irresponsible OP.

Even I a new to horses 17 yr old know better then that. I feel sorry for your mare and hope nothing happens to her and that you do not go through with this. Especially if you don't have the money to pay for this. 

I was offered a cute little foal awhile ago as a horse. I new the mare and she was beautiful great breeding, so was the potential stallion. It would have been a purebred with papers. I seriously thought about it but even I knew I couldn't have it. I didn't have the experience or the money to go into all the training. Simple as that.

YOU SHOULD NOT DO THIS there are too many possible complications! If you are still even there.


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## Rachel1786 (Nov 14, 2010)

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Anyone else? There are no words...


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## Lis (Oct 29, 2009)

^ Wow.

I have nothing new to add but echo what the others have said. Racehorses don't always pass on their speed to their offspring and you haven't said if your mare is already a barrel racer or not (if I've missed it I apologise) so it really is a stab in the dark.


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## Katesrider011 (Oct 29, 2010)

Just don't come back to this forum months from nowand whine about how you ended up with a horse you couldn't handle and having to sell. That's all I have to say.


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## SeeingSpots (May 29, 2011)

I as a horsewoman for 13 years work at a breeding facility. We ONLY breed good tempered, show proven horses. And we breed only 1 (Maybe 2) foals every other year, we train them and show them and then sell them. We keep like 1 every 5 years or so. 

I am just now breeding my mare, she has proven herself in the show ring and has the BEST temperament in the world I have put a 3 year old on her and she is as careful as can be. The stallion is an amazing horse, good in shows, well mannered, and is an amazing proven stud whose foals are all around the world. 

When I considered breeding my mare I thought of everything! No exceptions I saved up a few thousand dollars for vet bills etc... 

I foal mares and let me tell you I have seen foals born that had to be put down right then and there mares too. I have had to nurse a foal because the Dam abandoned it and I have had both mare and foal die. I would NEVER in a million lifetimes consider breeding a mare, 1. to a bad tempered stud 2. throwing her out to pasture or 3. Not having the vet check on her. 

I am sorry if you think that I am being rude I am not. It is just that I do not think that you have thought of everything just yet. You need to plan out every day/moment from the time the mare is bred to 5+ years into the future. What you have said/explained sounds ridiculous. 

You sound like all you are thinking about is your foal that you will get. You do NOT sound like you are thinking about your mare at all or about the foal future. I am sorry I think that you need to experience the things that can happen while a mare is being 1.bred and 2. giving birth before doing it to your mare. 

SS

Please think of the mare and the foal before yourself. If you TRULY love your mare then you will think through this more. I just don't want to see a fellow forum member get hurt and have to read a post about a mare and/or foal dying. Trust me this is not an easy decision.


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## apachewhitesox (Dec 9, 2010)

Rachel1786 said:


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> ...


Very good I don't think I could have taken the time to do that.


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## Katze (Feb 21, 2011)

Every remark I could have made has been stated. To the OP, reading posts by irresponsible horse owners like you make my eyes bleed, horse economy is in the crapper do to back yard breeders like you. The studs owner supposedly owns a "fast" TB who is papered but he (the owner) lives with you sometimes and the horse lives where...?...seriously....?


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

I noticed in your second or third post you stated the breeding was free cause the owner of the stallion almost lives with you. Then the next post you say" its not a free breeding. So, which is it? I am also curious about this fast racehorse who has not really proven to sire fast horses, what makes you think you will get a fast horse? I have seen alot of race horse breedings that the owners took months to decide who to breed their well bred race mare to and still end up with a foal that was not a race horse. Ever heard of OTTB horses? Those would be horses from race breeding that were not fast enough to race and win, yet you are breeding a pinto to a race horse and expect to get a fast barrel horse.... 
My biggest question is : you said your grandpa has raised horses for twenty years, and there have never been vet bills except for c sections. So, who takes care of these horses he has raised for twenty years when there is something major going on? Your grandpa? Is he a vet? Can he suture wounds, stop a horse from colicing? How many of his horses have died because they did not get proper care? Who will train this cute foal that is being born so you can love it? What happens if a foal is born, your grade mare dies and you have to bottle feed it for months, then it is as slow as molassas? Will you still keep it or dump it for a fast barrel horse?
I think you need to rethink your attitude and quit "making cute foals" to love and just keep your horse that you have. 
By the way, have you ever run barrels? What are your times? I also wonder, since your attitude is so 'know it all" to everyone how old you are?


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

^

My grandpa raised horses on barbed wire and sweet feed for 50 years, and we only ever lost one horse to the barbed wire (dog ran it through) and never had a single instance of colic. I guess that means barbed wire and sweet feed = good horsemanship right?


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

wyominggrandma said:


> I also wonder, since your attitude is so 'know it all" to everyone how old you are?


She has a journal in the member journal section, where she states that she is 14. 


To the OP, in that journal you said that you fell off your horse and were too nervous to ride for a while, everyone falls off, and nerves are understandable, but it does suggest that you would not have the skills needed to train a foal. 

It is your choice whether or not you breed, it is your horse, but you asked for opinions and frankly as everyone has said it is not a good idea. When breeding you want to try to find the very best possible combination of stallion and mare. As this stallion has a nasty personality, you may well not get the cute foal you are looking for. 

If you do not provide adequate vet care for your mare, you are increasing the likelihood of her death and/or the foals significantly. 

Please reconsider this decision, as it is not a good one.


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## faye (Oct 13, 2010)

I read some statistics a few weeks ago that shows that only 1 out of every 4 foals bred makes it to 4 yrs old alive, the vast majority of those that die either die before, during or immediatly after birth normaly along with the mare.

Sorry but unless you have the facilities, money, experiance and time to breed horses then you shouldnt do it.


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## Susan Crumrine (Oct 5, 2009)

I would like to suggest the OP go on Camelot weekly's horse ads, the horses there are all going for meat. Look carefully, some are young, registered, and trained. Do you want to add to those numbers??? Better yet, pick one out and save it from the truck.. couple hundred dollars, some groceries, and you will be riding, not waiting five years....please dont produce another foal when there are too many horses in uSA already..


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## horsecrazy84 (Mar 20, 2011)

First, can anybody actually COMPREHEND what is being said when you read anything other than what goes along perfectly with your way of thinking? Some have said she's saying one thing and then saying another completely different..NOOOOO you just aren't understanding.
Grandma said she at first said it was a free breeding then later said no it wasn't, but she apparently didn't read the rest...the free breeding is not the OP's reason for breeding.
And the OP also very clearly said there would be vet bills, just no ultrasound. MANY people who breed, I don't care if they are "backyard" breeders or breed and sell foals every year, don't get an ultrasound done. It may be from the owner choosing not to, which is their RIGHT to do so, and it may be that there's not a single vet nearby who could do it.
I think the "well respected long standing members" need to stop attacking people. You can make your point without being rude!
I'm sure she understands the risks and I agree that just because a stud is free does not mean he's worthless. Here a while back a very nice looking former 2x world champ Paint stallion was being offered at stud entirely free. He was great natured and the only reason he was free to breed is because he is an older stallion who the owners wanted bred a little more. There was nothing wrong with him.
And I'm sure she wasn't going to just toss her horse in the pasture and leave her, she probably meant she'd be taken out of work.
If the OP wants a baby with the dam's DNA and traits how is going out and getting a foal the same thing? Nobody knows how a foal will turn out and plenty of high dollar registered horses turn out clunkers for foals that aren't worth a penny. Considering how many mares are bred every year the number of deaths are relatively low. Even with vet care and prenatal checks **** happens.


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

To say there are no vet bills is just plain foolish you should at a minimum do a pre birth check and the post birth check on the mare and the foal anything less is careless and NOT in the mare and foals best interest. IMO I dont think you are mature enough for this. Your breeding a grade mare to a tb what do you do with your horse what are you intending to do with this foal. Foals are alot of work its not like a puppy.


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

Breeding to this horse is free because we are very close friends 
Well, its not free breeding. She will be put out to pasture. 11 Months later if all goes well I will have another horse to love on. Just as simple as that.

horsecrazy84, the above written in red is EXACTLY what the OP wrote. I KNOW what I read and read it all. I never said the free breeding was the reason she was breeding the mare, I said she was changing her story. Please do not go around telling me what I have commented on. When others post, they don't need to try to teach us all a lesson on how not to be "rude", just state your opinion and don't try to school everyone more experienced And you, horsecrazy 84, get into the conversation and tell other members what they said is wrong and that obviously we did not read it all the way you have and try to explain how our comments are all wrong and not said correctly
As stated above, this is a little girl who wants a "foal to love" and figures that breeding her pinto mare to a nasty TB stallion, she will automatically have a fast barrel horse. I don't believe she has a fig of an idea of the costs of raising a foal, much less taking care of a mare that is in foal. I don't think she has an idea how many years it will be before she can ride said foal, if she can even figure out how to train one. As far as fences, injuries and vet care, I brought that up because her attitude was one of "my gpa has raised horses for 20 years and he never used a vet". Again, the attitude of nothing will happen to my mare, I am to smart for that.
The reason the "well respected long standing members" make statements is because they have been around horses for YEARS and have the experience to make these statements. I don't post alot, have not been on the forum for years, but at my age, I have been around many years with many many years experience also. Then the "little girls" get on board and write about wanting a "foal to love" and will be breeding their mare to a nasty stud and want to know if the foal will be fast and sweet. If someone knows so little about genetics and temperament issues and how they are passed on, then they probably should not be breeding horses. They ask for advice, are given it by members much more experienced than they are and then get all ****y and mad because they are not told what they want to hear. 

When the OP asks for advice you are going to get it. If it is not what you want to hear you don't fight back acting all experienced and tough, you act like a grown up and listen.


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

Well said Wyoming.


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

AlexS said:


> She has a journal in the member journal section, where she states that she is 14.


 Oh goodie, another kid grandfathered in. It looks like she joined in May, so the 15-and-up rule wouldn't have been in place by then.

To the OP, I'm sorry. Sorry that your mother won't step in to stop this but is, in fact, encouraging this breeding. Your "foal", should he live through 11 months of dangerous no vet care, has as much a chance of becoming a solid barrel horse under your training as he does of becoming the next Secretariat. That is, to say, a very low chance.


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## Mike_User (Oct 24, 2006)

equiniphile said:


> Oh goodie, another kid grandfathered in. It looks like she joined in May, so the 15-and-up rule wouldn't have been in place by then.


Members under 15 can still start threads in any forum they want to, they just cannot reply to other members' threads in certain forums unless they have been exempted. Anyone who does not want to see threads started by members under 15 can hide them by setting "Show threads started by members under 15" to No via their User CP, http://www.horseforum.com/profile.php?do=editprofile.

You may have been thinking about the other age related policy change which now restricts anyone under 13 from registering.

I am going to follow up with the OP regarding any conflicting statements she may have made about her age.


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## dullylover (Jun 19, 2011)

if must breed...FIND A NICE STUD!


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## Spyder (Jul 27, 2008)

We had a long long thread about people asking about breeding that Mike (Admin) had some input in about NOT attacking EVERY member that asks about breeding without asking some background information FIRST.


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

I don't care if people breed their mare or stud, its their animal after all. What I care about is having enough knowledge about breeding, breeding soundness and the outcome of such breeding before they do so. To breed just to produce a "foal to love" if all goes well after 11 months is not a reason to breed. There are lots of foals that need homes that are a cute as can be, if I was looking for a foal, I would certainly go buy one instead of breeding my mare(who is spayed) waiting for almost a year, foaling a healthy foal, waiting another two years at least to ride it, and all the stuff that goes in in between. And that is just the tip of the iceberg. 
I think the right to breed is your own right, but the knowledge to have a good pregnancy, a healthy mare and a healthy foal doesn't come with just wanting a cute baby to love.. You have to know basics and be ready and willing to learn from the more experienced people, not get mad when their replies are not what you want to hear. Should everyone breed? In my opinion no because there are plenty of horses that need a home, and too many people go at it wrong and instead of a healthy foal end up with a dead one or a dead mare or both.


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## A knack for horses (Jun 17, 2010)

wyominggrandma said:


> I don't care if people breed their mare or stud, its their animal after all. What I care about is having enough knowledge about breeding, breeding soundness and the outcome of such breeding before they do so. To breed just to produce a "foal to love" if all goes well after 11 months is not a reason to breed. There are lots of foals that need homes that are a cute as can be, if I was looking for a foal, I would certainly go buy one instead of breeding my mare(who is spayed) waiting for almost a year, foaling a healthy foal, waiting another two years at least to ride it, and all the stuff that goes in in between. And that is just the tip of the iceberg.
> I think the right to breed is your own right, but the knowledge to have a good pregnancy, a healthy mare and a healthy foal doesn't come with just wanting a cute baby to love.. You have to know basics and be ready and willing to learn from the more experienced people, not get mad when their replies are not what you want to hear. Should everyone breed? In my opinion no because there are plenty of horses that need a home, and too many people go at it wrong and instead of a healthy foal end up with a dead one or a dead mare or both.


Well said WyomingGrandma :clap:


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## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

Read the last comment in my journal. I apologized for everything.


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## chelsealorio92 (Mar 22, 2010)

wow, so I didn't take the time to read all the replys on here, it seems that everyone has gone a little "over the edge" on this one. I believe nobody answered the question like you wanted so here is trying to answer your question. If you want a baby out of your mare, and think a cross would be what you want then go for it. The baby will have a little more spirit from the dad's breeding, but since it will grow up with the mare, it will most likely act like your mare. If your mare is calm all the time, the baby will realize there aren't many "spooky" things in the world and most likely be calm as well. there are many non registered crosses between QH/Paints with TB's and they turn out to be great athletes. BUT, do make sure it is something you are ready for and can afford. Like i said I did not read all the other replies but a few, regular vet care is important, and talk with your vet to see what exactly it will cost for the care of during pregnancy and if anything should go wrong. As long as you are prepared for possible extra vet expenses visits then breeding your mare doesn't seem like a bad thing to me. I personally love crosses with TB's. hope it helped a little?


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## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

Thanks so much chelsealorio92! That did help a lot.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

Spyder said:


> We had a long long thread about people asking about breeding that Mike (Admin) had some input in about NOT attacking EVERY member that asks about breeding without asking some background information FIRST.



I fail to understand how we didn't obtain the background information first. It was all spelled out plain as day what her intentions were.

If you don't want honest opinions, _don't ask for them on public forums. _I really don't understand what is so difficult about that concept.


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

OP, I'm not sure what you would like advice on if you've already made up your mind about breeding....


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## chelsealorio92 (Mar 22, 2010)

You're welcome. Most foals take after the mannerisms of the mare, because they are around them their first bit of life. If the mare is spooky and runs around the foal learns to do the same thing, if the mare is calm and quiet, the foal will learn that he/she can be calm and quiet and not scared of "monsters" everywhere. lol good luck on your decision, and if you do decide to breed her keep us, or well at least me, posted on how well things go and how the foal turns out!


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## chelsealorio92 (Mar 22, 2010)

equiniphile, i think she was wanting to know if the foal would turn out to be bad/more like the stallion/sire or turn out to be better mannered like her mare, i think that's what she was wondering anyways?

or maybe i read it wrong


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## SeeingSpots (May 29, 2011)

If you do breed let me know! I would love to get updates on mom and foal.


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## faye (Oct 13, 2010)

chelsealorio92 said:


> . Most foals take after the mannerisms of the mare, because they are around them thier first bit of life. If the mare is spooky and runs around the foal learns to do the same thing, if the mare is calm and quiet, the foal will learn that he/she can be calm and quiet and not scared of "monsters" everywhere.


Not true at all.

I know of several stallions who's offspring are well known for being quirky and difficult even when bred from extremely nice and quiet mares.

Infact one such stallion is infamous for breeding absolutly stunning horses that only proffessionals can ride.


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## SeeingSpots (May 29, 2011)

faye said:


> Not true at all.
> 
> I know of several stallions who's offspring are well known for being quirky and difficult even when bred from extremely nice and quiet mares.
> 
> Infact one such stallion is infamous for breeding absolutly stunning horses that only proffessionals can ride.


Why are you arguing? She was just making a point, her opinion. You don't need to prove her wrong or right for that matter.


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## faye (Oct 13, 2010)

seeingspots, I'm not arguing I am correcting a statement that was made. It was not stated as an oppinion but as a fact. A fact that I know to be wrong and have proof of. I am happy to name stallions in Pm's but don't want to put thier names on open forums as the stallions owners are very influential on the show circuit over here


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## chelsealorio92 (Mar 22, 2010)

faye, thank you for your input, that's why i said MOST, but this however is very uncommon. I'm interested in this though, which stallion is this so I can research it a little more, i would love to know!? _I've never heard of every foal a stallion has to be so difficult only "professionals" can ride. What is the stallion and breeding?_


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## faye (Oct 13, 2010)

I will pm you stallions names as I'm not nameing on an open forum


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## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

Thanks Chels and SeeingSpots! And please people really let the thread die! Oh and of you want updates about my girl PM me and I'll letcha know!
-Jess


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## chelsealorio92 (Mar 22, 2010)

please do pm me, that's very interesting. And i agree with you faye, some stallions do pass on tendanc's but you must also agree that it is also fact, many times, there are foals that take after the mare's mannerisms. and if you don't agree then I would have to completely disagree with you on that one.


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## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

Oh and if yall are wondering which horse I'm maybe breeding. My avatar pic and signature. Also you can go to my barn and see her. Her name is Destiny.


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## Spyder (Jul 27, 2008)

chelsealorio92 said:


> please do pm me, that's very interesting. And i agree with you faye, some stallions do pass on tendanc's but you must also agree that it is also fact, many times, there are foals that take after the mare's mannerisms. and if you don't agree then I would have to completely disagree with you on that one.


I would second Faye's opinion. While the mare can have a great deal of influence on the general overall temperament based of the foal tending to be less frightened of things if its dam is laid back about what is surrounding it, there are stallions that seem to pass on a difficult or easy temperament.

As an example in racing there was a stallion called Kennedy Road. Ran very well and was second to Secretariate on Secretariate's last race.

Virtually all of Kennedy Road babies were aggressive and difficult.

The opposite end is my own stallion. I test bred him to a mare you took your life into your hands just going into her stall. Could not go near the foal from that mating. Finally when weaned the foal after a couple of days of calling settled down and that baby is all grown up and used to help the disabled in a special school a friend had.

The best thing is to breed to a stallion that has proven itself to have easy tempered babies on the ground and assume that while the mare had something to do with it, the stud did nothing to create a "monster".


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

My filly was born to an abused and neglected mare, and was nothing like her dam. She was born loving people, and actually taught her dam how to trust people a little bit. I was terrified she would teach her to run, and Zierra would leave her dam immediately upon seeing people to come say hello.

Obviously this is an example of temperament in reverse, but to say the mare's temperament dictates the foals due to influence is just completely naive about how breeding actually works. That's like saying a kid born to a an abusive drug addict WILL become an abusive drug addict, with no consideration about the personality the child was born with. And yes, I know TONS of children in that situation who've grown up perfectly fine.

Personality and temperament are far more genetic then they are influenced. I have known SO many foals born to quiet mares and the foals are difficult as all heck to handle.

And I have to remark that I absolutely LOVE when people post on a topic just to freak out about how everyone ELSE is arguing.

1. Get your facts right if you don't want people to argue
2. If you want it to die, you are contributing JUST as much to it staying "alive" as anyone else by posting
3. Stay off forums if you have an issue with people being honest


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## Tennessee (Dec 7, 2008)

MacabreMikolaj said:


> And I have to remark that I absolutely LOVE when people post on a topic just to freak out about how everyone ELSE is arguing.
> 
> 1. Get your facts right if you don't want people to argue
> 2. If you want it to die, you are contributing JUST as much to it staying "alive" as anyone else by posting
> 3. Stay off forums if you have an issue with people being honest


 
Couldn't have said it better myself.


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## Spyder (Jul 27, 2008)

The problem with this argument is that everyone will have had different experiences and will swear to one side of the coin or the other.

Probably the one thing that has not been brought into the equation is the human interaction factor and that may be the biggest influence overall in how that foal turns out temperament wise.


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## JessPintoMare (May 15, 2011)

Thank you for what most of you think are opinions. Now would everyone PLEASE quit commenting on this thread? If you want to argue about breeding and attitudes of foals go to Horse Talk. This is not the place. And quite frankly I am sick of reading comments that have nothing to do with my question.


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## apachewhitesox (Dec 9, 2010)

Spyder said:


> The problem with this argument is that everyone will have had different experiences and will swear to one side of the coin or the other.
> 
> Probably the one thing that has not been brought into the equation is the human interaction factor and that may be the biggest influence overall in how that foal turns out temperament wise.


I agree there. Not to say stallions don't influence. I know someone who breeds a stallion but he has the worst temperament. Apparently in the beginning he is was exellent but he was left then allowed to get away with things now he is almost impossible to get near, he doesn't seem to pass it on the foals though. They seem to be gorgeous little things.

Also at work the people have a big influence on the horses. Almost all the horses I work with are 2 yrs and under. They all start kind of with their own personalities but this one guy a trainer has a lot of influence on how they end up. He can lose his temper and you can tell how much each one has annoyed him I suppose. They all react differently to how he handles them. The more spooky ones are easy to tell they nearly always are just waiting to be hit or they don't ever want their ears touched because he has grabbed their ears to twitch it. Then the ones who turn aggressive because of it. Their idea is I'll get you before you get me. One horse was aggressive, then she was worked with and became rather quiet until I saw a girl standing at the stable door pretending to punch her in the face just because she came up to say hi. Then the horse got defensive and tried to bite because it was confused and the girl got angry?? Any way also the calm ones normally stay calm because they don't freak out and get into trouble. Sorry rambled on and ranted a bit I'm done now.


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## wild_spot (Jan 30, 2008)

> If you want to argue about breeding and attitudes of foals go to Horse Talk.


Wasn't this your exact question?


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## Spyder (Jul 27, 2008)

JessPintoMare said:


> Thank you for what most of you think are opinions. Now would everyone PLEASE quit commenting on this thread? If you want to argue about breeding and attitudes of foals go to Horse Talk. This is not the place. And quite frankly I am sick of reading comments that have nothing to do with my question.


This discussion, whether you wish to participate or not, is a good one and is in fact on topic.


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## A knack for horses (Jun 17, 2010)

chelsealorio92 said:


> If you want a baby out of your mare, and think a cross would be what you want then go for it. The baby will have a little more spirit from the dad's breeding, but since it will grow up with the mare, it will most likely act like your mare. If your mare is calm all the time, the baby will realize there aren't many "spooky" things in the world and most likely be calm as well.


Uhm, no. Being spirited and being spooky are two different things. If a horse is the spawn of the devil, IT DOES NOT mean that that horse spooks at everything. And NO, just because momma is a sweetheart doesn't mean the foal will get her temperment. I've actually been around horses who came out of mare you could throw an infant on, but they themselves are brats to work with. Temperment is a nature thing, not a nurture thing.

And I think a little more thought needs to go into breeding a horse than, "if you want a foal out of your mare..." You are putting the mare and potential foals life into jeporady. There are a thousand things that could go wrong with willy nilly breeding. Besides, there are _thousands_ of unwanted, abused, and neglected horses out in this world because of "If you want a foal out of your mare..."



JessPintoMare said:


> Thank you for what most of you think are opinions. Now would everyone PLEASE quit commenting on this thread? If you want to argue about breeding and attitudes of foals go to Horse Talk. This is not the place. And quite frankly I am sick of reading comments that have nothing to do with my question.


You asked about what the outcome would look like. *scans thread* And 90% of your responses told you that the outcome would not be good. IMO, the people here answerd your question _quite reasonably. _

And if you keep posting on the thread, it keeps bringing back to the top of the new posts list, and therefore attracting more attention. 

I REALLY hope you do not breed your horse. But hey, I'm not the one who is going to end up in way over their head.


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