# Odd swelling...Please help!



## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

My gelding developed an odd swollen large lump right at the top of his scapula. This happened overnight after a non-riding day. This is not a bug bite and is not a saddle issue. 
The swelling is not showing signs of heat and is not changing in size. It is very firm... seems more like a deep tissue swelling.
I have done bute and box rest and cold therapy for a week with no result. He is completely sound, however, he is bothered when I press on the swollen area. 
I am getting ready to contact a vet, however was wondering if 
anyone has experienced this with their horse?? 
Pictures are below, 3 of the swollen side and 1 picture of his regular non- swollen side. The swelling is to the right of myhand. 
Any advice is greatly appreciated!!!


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## draftrider (Mar 31, 2010)

I would call the vet ASAP. I had a rescue horse come in with a similar swelling and it was the fact he broke the tip of his scapula and it was slightly displaced.

Has he had any vaccines or shots there in the last few weeks?


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## Kayty (Sep 8, 2009)

I'd certainly have the vet look asap. However if there is no lameness I would doubt there was a fracture. Have you trotted him up on a hard, level surface? If he's sound trotting up, lunge him on a hard surface on a small circle, known as 'the circle of death' to some haha, it puts a lot of pressure on the joints and will, in the majority of cases, show up any lameness. If he's not lame trotting on a small circle on hard ground, I would put my money on it that there is no fracture present. 
Looks more to me like a haematoma IMO. Often if they get a knock/bite/kick or some kind of impact, even if he knocked against a fence or tree, or rolled on a rock, they can develop into a haematoma. A haemotoma is just a collection of blood which shows the same symptoms as a fracture, and is basically one of the ways the body can slow internal bleeding. Much like a bruise but it comes up as a lump so can be sensitive to the touch. They don't cause any problems and usually dissolve back into the body after some time, although some may continue to grow and will need to be drained. Either way, not a real big deal  


I'd get the vet to check it out anyway, just in case.


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## tealamutt (Aug 21, 2009)

I agree that it is time to get a vet out. I am thinking abscess or hematoma as well. I would hold off on further doses of bute, because if it is an abscess this will keep it from breaking out. Strangles abscesses are usually in the jaw/throat area but they can actually be anywhere on the body (not that I'm saying that's what it is, but it is on the list until proven otherwise.


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## Scoutrider (Jun 4, 2009)

Do definitely rule out anything more serious first, but have you put any fly spray on him recently, or changed brands of anything that would have gone on his shoulder? Two summers ago I tried a new brand of fly spray, and my guys got giant welts just like that, but near their flanks, about at the bottom edge of the ribcage. I thought hematoma (I'd actually fallen off the afternoon I found them, and thought that the stirrup irons had swung back and clunked him...), bug bites, poison ivy, everything I could think of, but it finally turned out to be the new fly spray. Just a thought, hope that you figure out what's going on with him.


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

draftrider said:


> I would call the vet ASAP. I had a rescue horse come in with a similar swelling and it was the fact he broke the tip of his scapula and it was slightly displaced.
> 
> Has he had any vaccines or shots there in the last few weeks?


No vaccines and no new medicatinos/flys sprays, etc.


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

Yes, Thank you!!! I have heard that its most likely a hematoma as well, specifically from a friend that runs a large boarding stable and comes across a lot of bumps, lumps and the like. 

I'm going to take him to the vet next Mon if it is not dissolved on its own by then. I appreciate your thoughtful replies!


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## G and K's Mom (Jan 11, 2008)

If your waiting till Monday I would continue with the cold water and let him move around. Another thing I would suggest is Arnica gel..


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

My Doc O'lena reining stallion use to get knots like that on his neck right behind his pole. Was a muscle issue and I would get my Chiro/bioscan person out to work on him and by the next day or so it would be gone. Then over time depending on work load and what he was doing it would come back. He was never lame or really seemed sore with it. Never hot or anything. Just a big knot in his muscle.

Not saying that is what it is but I personally if he was mine I would get Jackie out and then if that did not work I would call the vet or take him to MSU for x rays. My vet could not x-ray that area.


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

nrhareiner said:


> My Doc O'lena reining stallion use to get knots like that on his neck right behind his pole. Was a muscle issue and I would get my Chiro/bioscan person out to work on him and by the next day or so it would be gone. Then over time depending on work load and what he was doing it would come back. He was never lame or really seemed sore with it. Never hot or anything. Just a big knot in his muscle.
> 
> Not saying that is what it is but I personally if he was mine I would get Jackie out and then if that did not work I would call the vet or take him to MSU for x rays. My vet could not x-ray that area.


 
Thanks for the info, but who is Jackie?? We live in Las Vegas so MSU would be a long haul


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

Jackie is the lady who does my chiro/bioscan work. She does get out that way every few months though. Normally Arizona I think?? Would have to ask again. Not sure were else she goes. In between times I use my bioscan pads which really work well.

Ya MSU would be a haul. I would think there would be a vet collage around there that could do the work if needed. Maybe even a larger clinic if they have a larger x-ray machine.


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

Thanks again, I hope it will not be necessary to call in anyone or haul out of state. We have a full service equine hospital here in Las Vegas. We have an appointment there tomorrow. 
I appreciate everyone's input for the mysterious swelling. I will post the diagnosis, hopefully it will serve as a learning opportunity for all!


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## aforred (May 12, 2010)

Please let everyone know what they say, and I hope it's nothing serious.


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

My gelding's diagnosis is far from complete, Nrharainer you are correct, this is a terrible anatomical spot for doing xrays. My vet opted for an utltrasound. It showed no blood clots or fluids so a hematoma was ruled out. The swelling is all muscle mass. The ultrasound is very difficult for determining exactly what is going on however he said its either a slight chip in his scapula and/or muscle/tendon pulling or tearing from the scapula bone. 

Again, these are only speculations as we were unable to do an x-ray. The mystery in this situation lies in the fact that this type of injury had to be incurred from hard force or blunt trauma. The problem is he was not exposed to anything which would make succeptible to this kind of injury the day or night preceeding the swelling. It was a non-riding day and he was by himself in his stall without other horses to injure him. 
Something must of happened in the night, that is the only feasible explanation, but again, he showed no marks on his body if he did fall, or perhaps got cast under the pipe corral. Now...all I can think is I really wish I had a night vision camera to monitor what goes on when I'm not around!!

He is sound for the most part so he will have 2 weeks off and then light walking for the following 2 weeks, I hope by then the mysterious mass dissapates on its own. 
Thank you all for your interest and I wish the best of health for your equine partners! ** Please let me know if you have any additional advice for his re-hab!


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## ilovestitch (Dec 22, 2006)

Jt my gelding has this EXACT same thin on his shoulder right now.


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

ilovestitch said:


> Jt my gelding has this EXACT same thin on his shoulder right now.


Really?! Wow, what is the diagnosis that he has been given? (if you have seen a vet).
My gelding is still swollen, no change within 3 weeks, but he is sound and has been sound from the get go. how about your boy? Is it only on one side as well? 
-I'm the "T" part of JT


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## G and K's Mom (Jan 11, 2008)

Have you tried Arnica gel rubs daily?


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

Hmmm, no, I have not heard of arnica. Is it available at the feed store? DO you mix it with dmso? 
Thanks for the input!


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## G and K's Mom (Jan 11, 2008)

I don't think a feed store would carry it, but a health food store would.

Arnica


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## ilovestitch (Dec 22, 2006)

I have my vet coming out this Friday. It has been 6 days since the swelling popped up. Yeah he is as sound as every but I have only been lounging him because i dont want the saddle rubbing on that if i dont know what it is. Yes it is only on his right side, his left side is completely normal. I will post what my vet says after my apt with him. But 3 weeks... yikes. thats no good. I am not keeping very hopeful.


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## moonflower (May 21, 2010)

*moonflower*

Hello. I have seen alot of these. It is a hematoma. Use the water hose with cold water on it several times a day to stop the bleeding that is occuring under the skin. If he will let you, you could use ice on it for 20 min intervels. It will dry up and go away. If he was in the pasture with other horses, he probably got kicked. Anyway, it is a very bad bruise.


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

Ok, yes sounds exactly the same! please keep me updated. My vet did an ultrasound because he could not xray that area! The ultrasound was not very clear so unfortunately his diagnosis is a speculation. I started riding him this week lightly. He seems fine, I'm just using my english saddle and riding bareback instead of using my barrel saddle.let's keep our fingers crossed its nothing serious!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

moonflower said:


> Hello. I have seen alot of these. It is a hematoma. Use the water hose with cold water on it several times a day to stop the bleeding that is occuring under the skin. If he will let you, you could use ice on it for 20 min intervels. It will dry up and go away. If he was in the pasture with other horses, he probably got kicked. Anyway, it is a very bad bruise.


Hi moonflower! No this happened in his stall so he did not get kicked. I'm pretty sure hematoma is ruled out, well at least per the vet. He said there is no fluid in there. The ultrasound showed muscle mass (swelling). I did cold water & ice therapy the first 2 weeks with no improvement 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

ilovestitch said:


> I have my vet coming out this Friday. It has been 6 days since the swelling popped up. Yeah he is as sound as every but I have only been lounging him because i dont want the saddle rubbing on that if i dont know what it is. Yes it is only on his right side, his left side is completely normal. I will post what my vet says after my apt with him. But 3 weeks... yikes. thats no good. I am not keeping very hopeful.


Ok, yes sounds exactly the same! please keep me updated. My vet did an ultrasound because he could not xray that area! The ultrasound was not very clear so unfortunately his diagnosis is a speculation. I started riding him this week lightly. He seems fine, I'm just using my english saddle and riding bareback instead of using my barrel saddle.let's keep our fingers crossed its nothing serious!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ilovestitch (Dec 22, 2006)

I have dealt with hematomas before. There is no heat what so ever in his shoulders, hematomas usually present with heat. 


here is a picture of the swelling from behind to compare.


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

ilovestitch said:


> I have dealt with hematomas before. There is no heat what so ever in his shoulders, hematomas usually present with heat.
> 
> 
> here is a picture of the swelling from behind to compare.
> ...


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## moonflower (May 21, 2010)

Hi again. Since the vet ruled out hemotoma, and it was from inside the stall---I have also seen when a horse is rolling, he gets stuck in a corner or puts his leg thru a board and then twists his shoulder severely while trying to get up. Did the vet take a xray? On a shoulder there is no where for the fluid from swelling to go othere than above the bone and this causes a pool of fluid like this. Still hose it regurely, limit excercise--only leading him if you do and usually Bute is good for pain and inflamation. There is a mixture I have the vet make up for pulls and strains where swelling starts, and that is: Cortosone and DMSO combined. Apply it once a day. See if you can get that.


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

JTranch said:


> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You know what...that was somebody elses reply about the hematoma. I was trying to reply to your post but replied to theirs on accident. Hematoma is definitely ruled out!! There is no fluid or heat. Just a hard muscle mass in my case. I see your pictures. They look very similar to our "lump". Please keep me updated what the vet says on Friday. I had my vets diagnosis posted in a prior post if you have not seen it. I am very curious what they say in your case!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

Sorry I am terrible with replying from my phone, nothing ever goes in the right place! I was replying to ILOVESTITCH>>"I have dealt with hematomas before. There is no heat what so ever in his shoulders, hematomas usually present with heat."


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

moonflower said:


> Hi again. Since the vet ruled out hemotoma, and it was from inside the stall---I have also seen when a horse is rolling, he gets stuck in a corner or puts his leg thru a board and then twists his shoulder severely while trying to get up. Did the vet take a xray? On a shoulder there is no where for the fluid from swelling to go othere than above the bone and this causes a pool of fluid like this. Still hose it regurely, limit excercise--only leading him if you do and usually Bute is good for pain and inflamation. There is a mixture I have the vet make up for pulls and strains where swelling starts, and that is: Cortosone and DMSO combined. Apply it once a day. See if you can get that.


Yes, I agree, the only tangible answer would be if he got cast at night. But who knows! The only thing I can say is that it is definitely not fluid in there. They were able to determine this with the ultrasound. 
To further answer your question, they could not take an xray of the shoulder, there was no way to isolate that area, they would haveto sedate him and xray his whole upper torso area which they did not even offer. 
He's back under saddle, this is his 3rd week of swellling. The vet said to ride him just watch that the saddle does not rub that area. He was off the bute after a week, it really did nothing, he doesn't seem to be in pain and the anti-infalmmitory properties did not do their magic!! So we are just waiting to see what happens. I hose him down however there is no heat, so its definitely proving to be a tricky problem to treat. Thank you again for the dmso/cortisone suggestion.


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

ilovestitch said:


> I have dealt with hematomas before. There is no heat what so ever in his shoulders, hematomas usually present with heat.
> 
> 
> here is a picture of the swelling from behind to compare.
> ...


You know what...that was somebody else's reply about the hematoma. I was trying to reply to your post but replied to theirs on accident. I have trouble posting from my "crackberry." You are correct, hematoma is definitely ruled out!! There is no fluid or heat. Just a hard swollen muscle mass. I see your pictures...they look very similar to our "lump". Please keep me updated what the vet says on Friday. I had my vets diagnosis posted in a prior post if you have not seen it. I am very curious what they say in your geldings case!


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## ilovestitch (Dec 22, 2006)

Well my write p from my apt says:
Swelling at dorsal aspect of right shoulder. Diffuse swelling of dorsal aspect of infraspinatus muscle. Painful to deep palpation of muscle belly. Consistent with muscle strain. 

Well my vet said we will try this route first and see what becomes of it....
Bute for 5 days with cold soaking 2x daily for 7-10 days. If not better then he recommends an ultrasound. 

Ug. I hope we figure this out sooner rather then later. It has been 2 solid days of the bute and cold soaking with maybe a bit of improvement (but maybe i am just being too hopeful i dont know)


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## draftrider (Mar 31, 2010)

I think your horses would probably benefit from some therapeutic massage, chiropractic work and maybe acupuncture. There is something going on here under the tissues you can't see- I think a chiro would be a good place to start.


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## ilovestitch (Dec 22, 2006)

He already has had the chiro out.


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## moonflower (May 21, 2010)

Yes you do have a odd problem. If there is not any fluid in it or heat, then maybe it is the remainder of a hemotoma which will have the remains of dried blood in it and it takes quite a while for that to disolve. I would still stick with hoseing him as often as possible and with the most force of water that you can use--like a adjustable nozzle that sprays different pressures because this will make the new blood go to the area and with good circulation, the body will dissolve this on its own. The DMSO/Cort sure wont hurt anything or maybe even Bengay just so that the body will put more circulation there. If you use the DMSO--try not to get it on yourself, only because you will immediatey have a strong taste of garlic in your mouth for quite a while and if you get lot on your skin, you will also have the garlic smell coming from your body. Good luck


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## JTranch (May 11, 2010)

*Diagnosis*



ilovestitch said:


> Well my write p from my apt says:
> Swelling at dorsal aspect of right shoulder. Diffuse swelling of dorsal aspect of infraspinatus muscle. Painful to deep palpation of muscle belly. Consistent with muscle strain.
> 
> Well my vet said we will try this route first and see what becomes of it....
> ...


Hi again, well sounds like the same diagnosis and treatment, however the bute and cold therapy didn't do anything for my boy. Its been about a month and the swelling is still there. But on the bright side, my vet said to ride him since he is completely sound. I have been working him again with some saddle modifications so that that area of the soulder is not being rubbed. We even trailered him for about 6 hours and I rode all weekend long and he is still sound with absolutely zero change in the sweling. 
The ultra sound only cost me $50 at my vet clinic, of course in addition to the exam fee. Well, definitely keep in touch and let me know his progress and I will do the same. Just wondering, is your boy sound as well? Did the vet do a lameness check to see if he favors that side? Also, how old is your gelding? I will send you a private message with my email.


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## jmanner (Oct 18, 2013)

My daughters horse has the same symptoms. How did yours end up healing?


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## Layne S (Dec 29, 2020)

Please let me know how this went. I just found a similar one on my mare tonight. We are going to magnawave the spot.


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## Layne S (Dec 29, 2020)




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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

MOD NOTE

Closing this one. Another ancient thread resurrected. Posters PLEASE take not of start dates of threads before replying to 'Recommended Reading' threads.


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