# What do you think



## nybarrelracer (Dec 5, 2006)

I have two mares that i am thinking for breding both paints, 
both mare are layed back and very sweet temperd. i have one stud in mind he is a AQHA foundation breed cremello. i am open to different ides i would like to breed them to a solid stud. 
what kind of stallion would you request. 
i am looking to breed for temperment.
Diesels little rocket 



























http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/diesels+little+rocket 

Inks rebel Cause 




































http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/inks+rebel+cause


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

To be completely honest, I am not fond of either mare for breeding. They are lovely horses with lovely color, but their conformation is lacking my opinion.

I like the sorrel and white more than the piebald mare, but even she does not have traits that I would wish to pass on. She has a nice big hip, but she has a very upright shoulder, along with a short-ish neck and coarse throat latch. She also appears to be a bit downhill and have short pasterns. She is registered, which is wonderful, but I didn't see anything in her bloodlines that really popped out at me. I would personally keep her as a good riding mare and choose another for breeding.

As for the piebald mare, she does not have the hip I like to see in a paint. Her shoulder is very upright, her neck is very short/thick, and her throat latch is coarse as well. She is quite back at the knee in her front legs, and perhaps a bit posty in her back legs, though it is difficult to tell without squared up pictures. Again, her pedigree doesn't have any names that really jump out at me.

*They both seem like very sweet horses with lovely faces and gorgeous color,* I just don't see anything that I would want to pass on to a foal. Conformation is *key *in producing sound,performance-quality animals, and while neither mare has any absolutely horrendous flaws, I personally would not breed them.

Just my two cents.


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## Cat (Jul 26, 2008)

Right on LeahKathleen. I really can't add much to what she said, other than even those breeders with very well conformed horses, outstanding pedigrees and outstanding temperments are still not breeding this year due to the poor economy and horses just not selling.


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## Lily of the Valley (Sep 27, 2009)

I'm also going to agree with LeahKathleen. Please don't even bother breeding these horses. I'm sure they're nice and I'd find them a joy to work with, but there are already billions of horses out there like that.


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## nybarrelracer (Dec 5, 2006)

Diesel is out of a APHA pole beding chapion, that is her father. I dont know any thing about her dam. I have a lot of him for on her father and she is a spitin image of her sire. she is a great mare she has the speed for barrels and poles, i show her in barrels and poles. I have taken her to big time rodeos and she has gotten three 1st and 2nds.
Ink i dont know that much about her pedigree, but i do know that she has had a lot of foals and they have all trund in to good show horses. i tryed to get the square but they would not stand for me that is all i can do. i have shown in pleasure classes, and she places in the top 3 most of the time.


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## nybarrelracer (Dec 5, 2006)

Diesels sire is a APHA pole Bending Champion. she is the spitin image of here sire. She compeets in barrels and poles. and i compet her in the big time rodeos and palce mostly 2nd had a few firsts. 
Ink she has had a lot of foals and they have turnd into show horses. i dont ride her that much my btothers kids do. they show her in pleasure and some gaming.


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

Honestly, I don't believe in breeding unless a horse has something incredible to pass along. Show horses the foals may have been, but conformation is key in producing sound, healthy, happy animals.


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## Eastowest (Mar 26, 2009)

Besides temperament, do you have any other breeding goals? 
Diesel in particular has a pretty nice "speed bred" pedigree for a potential barrel racing/games producer. Inks Rebel Cause has a similar bottom side (whats known of it), but her topside is more what I refer to as "scatter bred"-- some nice lines in and of themselves, but known for different achievements, and kind of odd to see combined in one horse, if you are breeding for anything specific.

Are you looking at local stallions only, or are you open to shipped semen? For Deisel I would go with a proven "speed" performance (like barrels, poles, other games) or racing stallion. Probably would go that way with the other mare as well, since her bottomside and enough of her topside is running bred to warrant it. I see nothing in her pedigree or build that would point toward serious Western Pleasure competition potential in a foal. 

I would not necessarily worry about if the stallion was "Foundation bred" as both of these mares have plenty of TB breeding to make "Foundation" sort of a moot point. I would go with a stallion with proven talent and proven offspring in the direction you want to take the foals-- if he happens to also be Foundation bred that would be a sidelight to me.

Are either of these mare homozygous for Tobiano? If not, if you choose a QH stallion your odds for Paint color could be as little as 50/50. Might not matter to you, if the offspring is a good performance prospect-- just mentioning that in case color was important to your future plans for the foals.

Here is a farm not far from Nashville that specializes in top barrel horse breeding-- 

Shomaker Farms on Barrelhorses.com 

Might be worth a visit (email, telephone call-- in person would be FUN! LOL) to see what they offer for stallions and to see how they think their stallions would cross on your mares. One of their stallions is indeed a palomino, if you like the chance at the cream gene-- not a super "cheap" breeding fee, but one of the hottest barrel/performance lines going right now (his famous sire stands for $5000 for 2010-- Frenchmans Guy Welcome ) and their stallions are also enrolled in futurities, to give the offspring chances at earning money and awards.

Here is a another site for al things barrel horse--
Barrel Racing at Barrel Horse World, Barrel Horses for Sale, Barrel Racing Forums, Equine Health Articles, Western Tack, and more

You might also look at stallions who are proven for siring roping, turnback, rodeo, and related performers-- all of these events require a combination of speed, soundness, and trainability.


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## nybarrelracer (Dec 5, 2006)

Diesels sire is an APHA pole bending champion. She is a pro rodeo horses she gets 1st and seconds every time i show her. She is a top line mare, she compeets in roping, barrels, and team penning. 
Ink is a very good mare i bought her form a local breeder.Ink is a very good mare she is grat for kids and she loves people. 
I want to breed them becuase they are the olny good mares that i own that are full size horses and not ponies. i only have 3 horses that are full size that are rideable. I have a gelding that is in his over 30yrs old and i am not shure how much longer i will have him. i want to have some foals on the farm. I Dont plan to sell the foals. I plan to keep them.


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## nybarrelracer (Dec 5, 2006)

i am looking to breed ink to a lyed back stallion. She is only shown in 4h, i have one stallion in mind for her he is an AQHA foundation breed, impressive free. He is a layed back, very calm, he is a cremello. the other stud is a buckskin that is performance bred. they are both at the came farm and throw very well bult foals. 
here is the link to the cremello
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/kiotesamachohunk

 

 





her are some picture of the other satllion he is peppy sanbagger bred


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

if you want a foal that has the temperment you want, why not go out and buy one? 
That way you'd know exactly what you're getting and you'd still be able to have a foal on your farm.


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## Eastowest (Mar 26, 2009)

I explained why I would go speed/games/performance-bred when looking at stallions for these mares, but obviously there are lots of other choices.

What is it you like about the cremello and buckskin stallions you posted as potential matches to each of your your mares? What good traits do you hope/expect to see from these pairings in your foals? Are there any traits you are hoping to improve on if you breed to these stallions? 

I would really like to see conformation shots of both stallions. Do you have other photos, or a website link for them?

Also, I was visiting your website and saw a pony mare on your sales page, and it said 

_"Stare must go to a home where she will not be bred she did not get bred to Stormin last year and the foal was a throw back. So she can never be bred again."_

What exactly happened? DID she get bred? And the foal was a "throw back"? What does that mean?


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

I really don't see anything in those studs except "ZOMFG KOLOR!" Maybe they'd look better with proper conformation shots, but that cremello makes me cringe - he doesn't have the sort of gait you'd want on ANY stock horse, and that massive neck only serves to make his pathetic hind quarters look even sadder. Your mares have good power in their hind ends, so it COULD balance, but he seems just as out of proportion as your mares.

As for that buckskin, either that picture angle is absolutely messed or he's so ugly he should have been gelded before he was born. He has a jack knife wither, a horribly tied in neck, a really small shoulder and an angular screwy looking hind end.

Again, possibly both could be improved by not having such lousy photo angles, but you're asking for a disaster of a foal breeding your already seriously flawed mares to even more seriously flawed stallions. I'm going to skip the preachy "don't breed those things" spiel since most everyone has covered it and launch right into "if you're serious, stop being cheap and got a PROPER stud in a half-cocked attempt to get a useable foal."

Quit looking at color. Color means nothing when the foal is so hideously deformed you couldn't sell it to an eccentric millionaire collecting every cream colored foal he can find. Your mares have very VERY little to offer in the way of breeding, don't make it worse by thinking color can fix everything.


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## nybarrelracer (Dec 5, 2006)

ok i have looked at a lot of horses. i have found a few good stallions that i have liked. but then i look at their pedigreeand they have inmressive in them. All of my horses are impressive free. i know both of the studs that i put up.They are both impressive free both thorw foals that are nice and they have grat conformaion and have a great temperment. It is hard to find satllions in NY that are impressive free, and that have a great comformation and a great temperment. I dont have the money for shiped semen. i have to send my mares to our vet and that will cost me more that breeding and vet fees. My vet is aprt of a collage, they charge about 1000 to do that. 
with star she got breed by my pony stallion, since both horses had big geens. The vet said that that foal was a throwback. The foal ended up getting two big geens one from each parrent. so the foal was the size of a full size foal. our vet said that happends a lot in horses.


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

Look, clearly you haven't changed your mind about wanting a foal - GO BUY ONE. Creating a foal with less than mediocre conformation is irresponsible. Those stallions do not have desirable conformation, and breeding them to your mares who are also lacking in that department will certainly throw and awkward unsound foal. That's not fair to that baby. 

Go buy a foal that needs a home, and imprint it however you want. A colorful, registered foal, for SO much less than you'd spend on breeding. Breeding is NOT an inexpensive way to obtain a horse. Go purchase one that needs a home. No gambling, so chances, get what you want without guessing and hoping that one of the horses you are breeding has some hidden "good conformation" gene somewhere.


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## nybarrelracer (Dec 5, 2006)

ok look, if i could just go out a buy a nice foal i would. yea i can pay 100 of one that is wiled, i have one like that he is 2 now and really people firendly. he is not registerd. if i want t good foal with a good foundation pedigree and impressive free i would. But where i am from you can't. I have not found a single foal that i like that has the attitued that i like. i know alot of stallion in NY they are mean and nasty. the stallions i have in mind are not that way. They are very sweet, if you can find people that have a stallion that is not mean and is impressive free then that is different. Now most of the foals that i have looked at have no buld to them they are bulit like a TB. I am looking for horses that are bulit like the old fashion QH. You can't find any thing like that areound me.


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## reining girl (Jan 30, 2009)

DreamHorse.com Horse ID: 1468136 - Youdon\'tknowjackzip

Grandson of Easy Jet Standing at Stud 

Foundation Bred QH Stallion

These are the only ones i could find in New york that i even somewhat liked. Hope it helps. O and here is that second studs pedigree http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/rr+so+far+just+dandy He is race bred and has sired some barrel winners, so maybe he is your ticket???


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## Mooseracing55 (Oct 6, 2009)

This is not away for my soon to be wife to deal with. She want to breed the horses. We are trying to fine a horse where her 2 mares can. We do not want to buty a foul she wants to have her own. I am sick of this. I post alot on one of my race sites and they hate it when my home track get bashed so stop bashing her and help her i am tired of it


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

Can I ask why you are so anti-impressive?
I know HYPP is something that should be considered (IMO, HYPP positive horses should not be bred at al) but there are a lot of Impressive Hypp negative horses out there.

If you cannot afford to have semen shipped in, why not put the breeding on a back burner until you find a stud that you like, and save up your money so you can get his semen. That way you are opening up so many doors.

If you want a foal within the next year, maybe broaden your distance a bit. I dont know where in NY you are, but there's PA, NJ, CT, RI, NH etc etc that could have studs that fit the criteria you want.

I still think you should ditch the whole breeding idea and buy a foal. I find it hard to believe that there are no foals around you that don't have the breeding/personality you want. And even if you were to breed, you'd be able to get the breeding you want, but for personality...well who knows. You could breed your sweet mare to a sweet stallion and get a foal that is like a fire breathing dragon.

just my 2 cents

ETA: Mooseracing we are not bashing your wife. She asked us what we thought, so we are giving her our opinions. No one says she has to agree or even like what we are saying, but when you come to a public forum and ask for people's opinions, you are going to get that.
If you two really want a foal, why ask us what we think?


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## nybarrelracer (Dec 5, 2006)

ok , i am going for the old foundation look. nice big bulid. I dont like the new lok of the QH. I hate horses that are light bulit they are noo good for cow work. Ok th back and white mare got breedRr So far just Dandy to him and she did not take to him. pluse he dose not look that good i have see him in person. now if you can find one that is bulit like that cremello then i will consider.


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## Spastic_Dove (Oct 4, 2007)

You can breed to a horse with Impressive on his papers if he is N/N. 

If you don't have enough money to deal with the things that could go wrong with breeding, don't breed. It'd probably be cheaper to go make a drive to get something (Or a few drives) than it would be to breed (And you know what you're getting).

I don't really think either of those mares is breeding worthy. Same goes for the studs you posted (At least from those shots)

If you absolutly have to breed, r_g posted some better looking stallions for you.


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## Spastic_Dove (Oct 4, 2007)

That cremello is built like crap and I love foundation quarter horses. 

Save up to get shipped semen like suggested if you have to breed. There are far better horses than that thing (Including Cremello's and other such coloured things)


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## Spastic_Dove (Oct 4, 2007)

Sandy Hill Quarter Horses' Stallions

Anderson Quarter Horses

Anderson Quarter Horses

Those are good working built qhs in your area. N/N


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

nybarrelracer said:


> ok , i am going for the old foundation look. nice big bulid. I dont like the new lok of the QH. I hate horses that are light bulit they are noo good for cow work. Ok th back and white mare got breedRr So far just Dandy to him and she did not take to him. pluse he dose not look that good i have see him in person. now if you can find one that is bulit like that cremello then i will consider.


Neither of the stallions you posted have that build. They have no hips at all. The cremello has awful gates and one of the weakest hind ends I've seen on a "working" horse. The buckskin has an awful neck to go with his awful hind end. You will not be satisfied with the foal that you create if you breed those mares to those stallions.

We're not trying to bash you, we're trying to give you advice that will possibly save you from being horribly disappointed with the result.

If you MUST breed your mares, here's what you need to be looking for in a stallion:

-Balance. Evenness. You don't want withers higher then the butt, or the butt higher than the withers. You also don't want a thick neck and no hip, or a huge hip and weak shoulder. Everything must balance.

-Straight legs. You want there to be a straight line from the point of the shoulder, to the knee, to the pastern. You want toes to face forwards.

-Sloping shoulder. An upright shoulder will create a choppy, uncomfortable gait, for both you and the horse.

-Strong hip. You need a big hip on a working horse to be able to have your horse properly work from his hind end. A horse with a weak hip will never excel is any kind of performance, be it ranch work, barrels, or reining.

Please pick up and read thoroughly a conformation guide before bringing another horse into this world. Conformation is key. It will maintain healthy joints, legs, hips, and shoulders. You will save yourself vet bills. You will save your horse pain. You will save yourself time trying to balance the gaits through training with a horse who has a natural balanced gait.

Please consider the well-being of the foal you plan to create, and study conformation and its importance before bringing another foal into the world.


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## nybarrelracer (Dec 5, 2006)

ok, i am still looking but, i am looking for a big hiped horse. I am looking for horses that are bulit for roping barrels, teem penning, cutting and that can be a pic up horse. I do big rodeo's so i need a good pic up horse. I am in need of old fashion horses. I am not like a lot of you prisssie people that do stuff for the money i do it for fun. I am a person that wants a horse that any one can ride. not just one person. I could breed to my pinto stallion before i geld him. this stud is not registerd at all.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

If you want more big hiped horses, then why on earth are you posting pictures of stallions that couldn't be anymore further if you tried? This alone tells me you simply do not have the qualifications to be a successful breeder.


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## AlmagroN (Jul 19, 2009)

nybarrelracer said:


> I am not like a lot of you prisssie people that do stuff for the money i do it for fun.


 thats so nice to say. come on for advice then insult people. :roll: classy. do yourself and your mares a favor and dont breed. you obviously know nothing about what you should be looking for. and if you cant afford to ship semen, you cant afford to breed. how are you going to afford any vet bills? what if something goes wrong? how can you afford that if you cant afford to even ship semen? i dont like your mares conformation, i dont think its very good at all. but apparently because youre not a "prissy person" and its all fun and games to you, i guess its ok to breed poorly conformed horses and let the HORSES suffer over it.


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

You say you're looking for a horse with a big hip - neither of those studs have the hip you want on a cow horse. The cremello lacks impulsion from behind and he is not working through his back at all. He is hollow and on the forehand. You'll never get a good working roper/penner/cutter/reiner/riding horse like that. Please show me where on those studs you see a big working hip, or where you see balance, or where you see "old fashioned." Those studs are the result of poor breeding choices.

Impressive bred horses, for the most part, are going to be halter bred horses. As long as the stud is HYPP N/N, you are fine. They don't carry the gene.

Whether the horse an be ridden by more than one person has nothing to do with its conformation or whether or not you ride for fun or to win jackpots. That'll be in the way the horse is trained. Temperament is a factor, sure, but ultimately, the ridability of the horse will be in its training. 

However, if you choose to persue rodeo games and high-stress speed and cattle events, you REQUIRE a well conformed animal. You need power from behind (hip) and sturdy legs. Legs that are not straight will be destroyed during high-stress rodeo events. 

There is so much to consider when breeding. It is, in the end, your choice, but think about every apsect of this decision. This foal will not have chose to come into the world with crooked knees or a weak hip. Just think about it all.


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## kelliannejoseph (Sep 26, 2009)

nybarrelracer, go wih your heart. You pick the stallion you feel would be the best for your mares, and would make the best foal that will fullfill, you hopes and dreams. Do not listen to everyone on here. I do not know why everyone is getting so up tight about this, you simply just asked for a little help. NOT FOR PEOPLE TO BASH YOUR HORSES. I THINK THEY ARE BOTH GORGEOUS  I wish you the best of lucky!!!


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## AlmagroN (Jul 19, 2009)

kelliannejoseph said:


> nybarrelracer, go wih your heart. You pick the stallion you feel would be the best for your mares, and would make the best foal that will fullfill, you hopes and dreams. Do not listen to everyone on here. I do not know why everyone is getting so up tight about this, you simply just asked for a little help. NOT FOR PEOPLE TO BASH YOUR HORSES. I THINK THEY ARE BOTH GORGEOUS  I wish you the best of lucky!!!


 she asked for an opinion, thats what shes getting. no one is bashing her. why do people need to get so bent out of shape with this? there are a lot of people on this forums who dont want to see more poorly conformed horses brought into this world when there are SO many foals that need a home and that would be just as good, even better, than breeding one of your own, especially to horses whos conformations isnt that great. no one wants to sugar coat things here, there is no reason for it. breeding isnt something to do on a whim JUST because you want to and it would be fun.


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## nybarrelracer (Dec 5, 2006)

ok you try to save yup for shiped semen on a small paycheck. I am not trying to dis people but i cant save up for shiped semen i am in the process of paying off a new mare, a truck, school. Pluse i am paying people to help take care of the horses when i am in school. I chose those two stallion because they had the big hip lines and look. I know the owner and i am geting a reduced breeding fee. the reason why i will not breed impressive is because i have had people what foals out of my horses and they dont like the impressive line. I dont like the impressive line eather. But with a limited pay and with me in school it is hard. I am not breeding the mares till am out any way. now i might just breed Diesel to Smokin who is an unregisterd stallion if i dont geld him right away. He is a big and beautiful paint. 
































here are some pic of smokin. this is all i can do when i took the pics he had been stalled becasuse of the wether so he just wanted to get out and run. now if he is not gelded when i do go to breed i might just breed to him.But them other studs are the closets that i could get to the look i am looking for, they have a sweet temperment and they are not mean and nasty.


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## Mooseracing55 (Oct 6, 2009)

Ok this is what is going to happen now. We can't buy a foal at all right now. I am trying to get my son from my ex. My wife want to do what she wants to do since I am going to help her with her Mares because they are the most loving horses. Both those Mares will not let me leave the barn. Now my wife wants a big horse with big hips so let her. Now stop doing what ur doing to my wife I am tired of the post like this because I have to deal with this when i am on the race site i am on


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## Spastic_Dove (Oct 4, 2007)

Well that black and white stud certainly reminds me of your mares so at least there's that. Maybe luck will strike you and from those you will get a well put together baby! 
Moose, sorry but you're out of luck. If you post about breeding a mediocre mare to a fugly stallion while also saying you don't have enough money for x y and z these are the kind of responses you are going to get. If you want honest opinions, you have got them. If you want : OMG She Is sO PreTTy!!!1111 Babiez!!!!!1111 go somewhere else. 

You asked for our opinions, you got them.


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

nybarrelracer said:


> ok you try to save yup for shiped semen on a small paycheck. I am not trying to dis people but i cant save up for shiped semen i am in the process of paying off a new mare, a truck, school. Pluse i am paying people to help take care of the horses when i am in school. I chose those two stallion because they had the *big hip* lines and look. I know the owner and i am geting a reduced breeding fee.





Mooseracing55 said:


> Ok this is what is going to happen now. We can't buy a foal at all right now. I am trying to get my son from my ex. My wife want to do what she wants to do since I am going to help her with her Mares because they are the most loving horses. Both those Mares will not let me leave the barn. Now my wife wants a big horse with big hips so let her. Now stop doing what ur doing to my wife I am tired of the post like this because I have to deal with this when i am on the race site i am on



Will someone please SHOW me where this a BIG HIP on EITHER of those stallions? Please? They both have the most lacking hind end I've seen on a QH is years.

You don't have enough money for shipped semen? What about vet bills? What happens when something goes wrong? The foal is breach? Your mare has complications. Excessive bleeding?

WHAT ABOUT THE BASIC COSTS OF BREEDING?



*EVENT* *COST *

Transport mare to Stud $50 to $450.00 X 2 *$100 to $900.00* 

Stud Fee *$850.00* 

Stud costs, grazing, vet bills etc *$240.00 *

Grazing for mare 12 months $!2.50 plus gst per week *$731.25 *

Post-natal care, vaccinations* $80.00* 

Blood-typing dam *$112.50* 

*Membership NZAHBS *$100.00 *

*Registration fees * $30.00* 

Gelding *$300.00* 

*Vet Signature on Regist. Certificate *$50.00* 

Grazing for three years $12.50 per week *$2193.75* 

Hoof care $30.00 each X 4 *$120.00* 

Drench, etc $200.00 per year *$600.00 *

Supplementary feed, hay etc:

Mare - *$100.00 *

Mare and foal - $50/month x 6 *$300.00* 

After weaning at 6 months - $30/month x 30 *$900.00 *

Cost of Training to Saddle - $600 to $1200 *$900.00 *

*Total* *$7807.50 to $8707.50* 

Additional:

Animal Health (accidents, colic respiratory problems etc) * Infinite *

Professional Foaling *$500.00* 





Think about it. Please. For the love of horses and horse health. Please think about this.


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## CheyAut (Nov 26, 2008)

nybarrelracer said:


> ok you try to save yup for shiped semen on a small paycheck. I am not trying to dis people but i cant save up for shiped semen i am in the process of paying off a new mare, a truck, school. Pluse i am paying people to help take care of the horses when i am in school. I know the owner and i am geting a reduced breeding fee. But with a limited pay and with me in school it is hard.


 
Let me share some breeding realities with you. I had 5 mares due this year. 4 were minis to my own stallions. 1 was an Arab cross to a champion halter, liberty and endurance Arab. Lots of money in stud fee, mare care, ultrasounds. She didn't take the first time, so more money in mare care and ultrasounds. She aborted at 4 or 6 months, so I was out all that money, plus the vet fees to make sure she was ok due to a retained placenta. I chose not to rebreed her. Another mare also aborted (unrelated, and vet doesn't know why they did, the arab mare's foal was not right, but the mini foal looked perfectly normal) a 4 or 6 months (I forget which was 4 and which was 6 months).

First mini mare due, red bag and dystocia. If you don't know what that means, you have a LOT of learning before you EVER breed. Me, 3 vets and 3 vet techs could NOT reposition the foal in my LARGE mini (small foal, too.. mare was a large 37.5" mare with plenty of room to "get inside."). Ended up doing a fetotomy and she speant days/nights at the vets to pull her through. $2500 alone for that and no foal.

Next foal, delivery was fine but a dummy foal. He speant 36 hour at the vet being tube fed, had to have plasma transfusion, ect. Another $2500, but luckily he is just fine now.

Luckily the final foal, no problems.

But if you think a breeding fee for AI is out of the question due to finances, then I'm sorry, but BREEDING is out of the question. It's MUCH MUCH MUCH cheaper to buy a foal, and you'll get what you want vs gambling.

End of lesson in the realities of breeding horses.


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

Listen to CheyAut. This is her profession. She is not someone who breeds "to have a forever foal."

She knows what she's doing, and you need to listen.


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

Mooseracing55 said:


> Ok this is what is going to happen now. We can't buy a foal at all right now. I am trying to get my son from my ex. My wife want to do what she wants to do since I am going to help her with her Mares because they are the most loving horses. Both those Mares will not let me leave the barn. Now my wife wants a big horse with big hips so let her. Now stop doing what ur doing to my wife I am tired of the post like this because I have to deal with this when i am on the race site i am on


Seriously? You joined and posted because you think people are picking on your wife?


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

Mooseracing55 said:


> We can't buy a foal at all right now.



If you can't buy a foal right now, and they are going for pretty cheap at local auctions. How are you able to afford the stud fee, the vet care and the everyday cost of having a horse.. plus your other ones.

If you have all these payments to make (truck, school, etc) and you are living off a small paycheck and cannot save up money to have semen shipped, maybe its time to reduce your herd and not add more to it. Don't mean to sound rude here, just giving my 2 cents.


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

appylover31803 said:


> If you can't buy a foal right now, and they are going for pretty cheap at local auctions. How are you able to afford the stud fee, the vet care and the everyday cost of having a horse.. plus your other ones.
> 
> If you have all these payments to make (truck, school, etc) and you are living off a small paycheck and cannot save up money to have semen shipped, maybe its time to reduce your herd and not add more to it. Don't mean to sound rude here, just giving my 2 cents.


Very valid points, appylover.


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## AlmagroN (Jul 19, 2009)

WAIT WAIT WAIT, BACK UP HERE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

guys, read under the avatar photo she has. it says shes "in school and cant waight to get her new mare who is in foal" (by the way its spelled, WIAT, not waight)

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! anyone see a problem here? she supposedly getting a mare whos in foal, AND she wants to breed hers, AND SHE HAS NO MONEY FOR IT! this is rediculous.... not to mention her husband who is posting to tell us to be nice to her.... (how old are we?)
BTW: i noticed her "husband" and her type VERY similarly??? missing letters on the ends of words, improper grammar.... plain old missing words.... hmmmmmmm this is all making me wonder what the heck this is all about here...


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## Spastic_Dove (Oct 4, 2007)

I noticed that AlmagroN


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

So...you're trying to get your son back and yet you don't even have enough money for a proper breeding or to buy a foal? I don't know if I feel more sorry for the horses or your poor kid.

Proof that it's not just animals that should have licenses to breed.

Fact is, your animals are PERFECT representatives of exactly what happens when idiots make KYOOT BABIES! Good luck getting anything more then $50 from a kill buyer from them at auction - which, from the sounds of your awesome common sense and unlimited financial freedom, should be happening very soon.

I guess SOMEONE has to supply the illegal Mexican slaughter industry.


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## Haley (Aug 18, 2009)

MacabreMikolaj said:


> So...you're trying to get your son back and yet you don't even have enough money for a proper breeding or to buy a foal? I don't know if I feel more sorry for the horses or your poor kid.
> 
> Proof that it's not just animals that should have licenses to breed.
> 
> ...


QTF.

If you can't afford to buy a $50 foal from a local action (which I can guarantee you, any resulting foal from breeding either of your mares will go for the EXACT same price) you will in NO WAY be able to pay for the proper care of the mares or their foals.

For the sake of the foals, please do not breed either of these mares.


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

Oh, and is she your "soon to be wife" or your "wife" - you have a total of two posts on the forum and contradict yourself in them. Sorry, I always have to question the true identity of the friend/spouse/sibling/SO that rides to the rescue when someone starts thinking they are being picked on (which, funny thing is - no one is even picking on the OP, only pointing out the truth of the situation).


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## ofcol (Jan 18, 2009)

while the sorrel mare you posted is better than the black, neither mesh well with the stallions you have chosen, and you have chosen for what I would call largely uninformed reasons. 

A big hip line? That should be only a fraction of your decision. I've seen other pictures of the cremello online -- he lacks balance and sports a bred-for-color-and-percentage-and-little-else type of a pedigree. Your lack of knowledge and prejudice regarding Impressive shows that you have not done enough research. What about HERDA? Your stallions you have in mind no doubt trace to Poco Bueno, and I think your mares might as well -- what about testing for that? And how about OLWS, GBED, PSSM? You could be unwittingly passing on serious genetic flaws.

The offspring of every foal, and that foals offspring, is always a consideration. Think of that.

Read this months AQHA journal about informed, responsible breeding. Even casual, small-scale breeders make a difference in the amount of unwanted horses. The days of 'breeding for temperament' without considering ALL the factors available are long gone. 

Buy a foal. Well-handled, halter-broke, colored, registered stock horse foals are going for $250 apiece in every state.


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

Well-spoken, ofcol.

nybarrelracer, pick up any copy of any equestrian magazine. You'll see front page articles about the overpopulation of unwanted horses - quality still sells. Backyard breeders' forever foals don't.


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## Hali (Jun 17, 2009)

Wow, this is THE epitome of an irresponsible breeder.


In the name of all that is sacred, do not, for the love of God, breed your mares.

It baffles me that these horse 'breeders' are ok with contributing to our already troubled horse market. In fact, they will deliberately close their eyes to the FACTS and continue to breed their crap with other crap to produce more crap that ends up as dog food.

Makes me angry.


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## Hali (Jun 17, 2009)

I don't think she should even get a second foal. They clearly can't afford it.


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## Spastic_Dove (Oct 4, 2007)

Probably not, but at least it's better than breeding for a foal.


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## LeahKathleen (Mar 5, 2009)

Buying is better than breeding. None of her horses appear underfed in any way, and seem to have decent farrier upkeep.

Obviously we'd prefer that no one take on more horses than they can handle, but it is better than creating more horses, IMO.


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## Eastowest (Mar 26, 2009)

To the OP-- 

I posted early on in this thread with recommendations for speed and barrel racing stallions--None of stallions at the links I posted had Impressive bloodlines. 

I didn't realize that you were in NY-- your forum location says Nashville TN-- so the stallions I sent links to were in the Nashville area so as to avoid shipped semen. Sorry bout that. 

But I DO still recommend speed/performance blood for the best "nick" on your mares, based on their pedigrees and builds, for offspring that will do rodeo work as well as barrels and games, which it appears you are involved with as well. 

I also asked if you had any conformation photos (side view, standing) photos of the cremello and buckskin stallions, since the photos posted show very very little of their actual build. Also do you know if any of their offspring are out performing in the sports you want your potential foal to perform in?

You came on posting for advice about what stallions to choose, but it seems like you have already chosen the stallions and don't want to look at anything else-- I am confused. I was honestly trying to find some good potential matches because you asked. I would continue to look in NY and surrounding areas for similar stallions that I feel would work well with your mares, and post them for you, but if you have already decided, please let me know so I don't waste my time.

(PS I am still curious about what a "throwback" is-- you mentioned on your website that a pony of yours had a throwback foal so should never be bred again-- please please explain!)


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## reining girl (Jan 30, 2009)

ya i totally agree, none of your horses should be bred, why would you even keep an unregistered horse a stallion anyways! This is the complete makings of a lovely back yard breeder. Geld the sucker!!!!


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## New_image (Oct 27, 2007)

Broken record time - 
I agree, neither mare looks like "breeding quality" to me. 
If you want to pick one to have a baby from to keep a part of her forever, SURE, however there are tons of horses in the market like these mares - No need to ad to an over populated situation.


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## whitetrashwarmblood (Aug 24, 2008)

reining girl said:


> ya i totally agree,* none of your horses should be bred*, why would you even keep an unregistered horse a stallion anyways! This is the complete makings of a lovely back yard breeder. * Geld the sucker!!!!*



Ditto!


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