# Do you Push or do you Pull?



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

When you drive your car, do you pull the steering wheel toward you, or do you push it away from your body? 

I am reading this small booklet by Tom Nagel about body balance and riding and in particular, the use of the deep core muscles called the Psoas muclses. In one chapter he speaks about having a revelation that all accomplished riders he has spoken with ride with a feeling of pushing the horse out with their arms and hands, with their intention emphasizing a forward movement in the horse, which allows for it stretch and recylce energy better than when the rider holds or "pulls" the hrose back to the rider's body. Pushers and Pullers.
And the accomplished riders who used pushing arms, also drove their cars with that same sort of push on the steering wheel.

So, I tested myself and of course , I do pull on the steering wheel, and I think I often ride with too much pull (too much front to back riding ). So today I rode Zulu with contact, a following contact, but kind of imagining that my reins were solid so that I could actually "push" him into a nice , forward attitude and stretch of his neck. It felt cool and it required MORE core engagement from me because I need my core to push from.

What do you think about this? Are you a pusher or a puller?


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## Northern (Mar 26, 2010)

Neat, tiny, that you're experimenting & learning! I don't push OR pull on my steering wheel, iirc!


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## soenjer55 (Dec 4, 2011)

I push more than I pull, but it's closer to the middle-- this is a really interesting bit of information!!


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

Well, if anything I push on the steering wheel, but I absolutely know I don't ride that way! Interesting. I'm going to try to remember that this weekend, supposing that Lisa isn't full of **** & vinegar due to the fresh winter air!


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## flytobecat (Mar 28, 2010)

That makes sense. I'm a puller.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

I rest my arms on the steering wheel. It isn't going anywhere.

That tends to be how I ride, too - but no one would mistake me for an accomplished rider.


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## Allison Finch (Oct 21, 2009)

I'm more like Bsms. My hands tend to move with the horse and neither push or pull overmuch. It is my legs and seat that do the pushing. My hands try to maintain even pressure that remains consistent, no matter what the horse does. Brief half halts don't pull as much as they hold.


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## COWCHICK77 (Jun 21, 2010)

Depends.... I find no matter if I am driving or riding, I push when I am relaxed and pull when I am nervous or tense.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I dont' really mean push, but he talks more about how it's a matter of either pulling energy toward yourself or pushing it outward , with a forward intent. He talks about how other activities are either pushing or pulling activities, and how people are usually predominantly pullers or pushers. 
Pulling is learning, thinking, eating , listening, reading, watching , procrastinating.

Pushing is teaching, doing. cooking, talking , writing, participating, practicing.

And , he says horses are pushers. The sort out their relationship to each other always with pushing. If you "pull" on a horse, he will push into your space.


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## MHFoundation Quarters (Feb 23, 2011)

Interesting. I push when driving. I'll have to pay attention to that when I ride tomorrow and get back to you.


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## COWCHICK77 (Jun 21, 2010)

tinyliny said:


> I dont' really mean push, but he talks more about how it's a matter of either pulling energy toward yourself or pushing it outward , with a forward intent. He talks about how other activities are either pushing or pulling activities, and how people are usually predominantly pullers or pushers.
> Pulling is learning, thinking, eating , listening, reading, watching , procrastinating.
> 
> Pushing is teaching, doing. cooking, talking , writing, participating, practicing.
> ...


OHHHH, I see mentally, not physically...I get it now!


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

HAH, interesting! I find myself pushing on the steering wheel a lot and never knew it had any relation to riding a horse. I do push my horses on because I'm always trying to get them engaged behind and driving from behind and through my hands. INTERESTING!


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## Courtney (May 20, 2011)

When I drive, I rest the palms of my hands on the steering wheel and push it in the direction I want to go. My boyfriend has commented that I'm 'too gentle' when driving. Heh. My hands are never tense, I never really grip the steering wheel... I just guide the car where I want it to be. I ride a lot like that... I don't pull, but I guide in the direction I want the horse to move. I'm not very forceful, but I use an even, soft pressure.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

This is where most guys go nuts. My hands do what they do. They don't have pushing energy or pulling energy. In the time-space continuum, I try to keep a little slack on the reins unless I need to fine-tune a turn or a pace.

If the pace is a bit too fast, I'll settle in my seat and slow my seat down. Then make sure there is no squeezing of my legs, then my little finger pulling by itself on alternating reins, depending on the horse's front leg movement.

Actually, I normally start with whispering, "Ease up a bit boy". If he isn't excited, that will do. If he is excited, it won't be enough.

If he is charging, we may end up with a 'pulling rein' - but we will work thru the steps first!


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

Oh wow, Tiny. Way too deep for me.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

NOw, this is not just woo -woo garbage. I DO pull on the steering wheel. I mean that there is tension from my hand to my body, I can feel a great difference when I push , and steer by creating postive support. It makes me sit up and take responsibility for keeping my own spine vertical and supporting my head, just as one should in the saddle. If a rider rides by pulling, the focus of their connection to the hrose becomes the horse's mouth, and it' like they try to bring hands to body. By thinking of almost pushing the horse's head away and forward, you bring your seat to the hands. 
I know it sounds funky and believe me, I am not a woo woo person, but when I rode with this thought in my head, I found myself more aware of being independent , seat from hands. I was not hanging onto the rein or using it to support myself, but rather I was supporting my body so that I could give forward more with my arm and hand and be less of a block to the hrose's energy.

In all honesty, a large part of being a good rider is just learning to NOT be an impediment to your horse's movement. 

Anyway, I am trying to push against the steering wheel some, keep my core engaged and see how that feels, even while just driving (I do a lot of driving!)


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

Tinyliny, if it works for you I'm all for it. Centered Riding helps a lot of folks with the imagery in the book. I keep planning on taking my copy out for target practice, or maybe emergency toilet paper. But a lot of folks have been helped by a book I cannot stand...so whatever helps you to work with your horse, I'm glad for.


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## ThursdayNext (Oct 18, 2011)

hahahaha...I twirl my steering wheel lightly with my fingertips and control my stick-shift the same way. AND I've been persistently doing this with my reins, too, and my trainer has been ON me for ages to close my fingers, HOLD the reins, and take up the contact. I don't know if it's useful for the push pull thing but I definitely try to use the reins the same way I use the steering wheel.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

bsms said:


> Tinyliny, if it works for you I'm all for it. Centered Riding helps a lot of folks with the imagery in the book. I keep planning on taking my copy out for target practice, or maybe emergency toilet paper. But a lot of folks have been helped by a book I cannot stand...so whatever helps you to work with your horse, I'm glad for.


YOu know what they say, Bob, the things that bother us most in other people/things are usually the things that bother us most about ourselves.
Maybe the "Truth" is waiting for you inside Sally's little book, but you are scared to look it in the eye. Huh? Whaddaya think?

(Late night mod to mod teasing folks. Pay no mind)


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

ThursdayNext said:


> hahahaha...I twirl my steering wheel lightly with my fingertips and control my stick-shift the same way. AND I've been persistently doing this with my reins, too, and my trainer has been ON me for ages to close my fingers, HOLD the reins, and take up the contact. I don't know if it's useful for the push pull thing but I definitely try to use the reins the same way I use the steering wheel.


I think there's a lot of similarities between the way we drive and the way we ride, and in general, they can support each other. Driving requires us to have our attention focussed broadly but shallowly, and to both move through space, plan ahead, while at the same time operate a maching by foot and hand, and maintain an everchanging feedback loop. Sounds a bit like riding to me.

I know that I am a better driver for becoming a rider, though now that I am middle aged, it's all going out the window.

Anyway, I really think it's something to think about; how you hold the steering wheel and how you hold the reins.


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## bubba13 (Jan 6, 2007)

If I'm going slow on a "safe" street, I steer with my knees. So what does that tell you?


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Bubba, that's for you to figure out, not me.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

It tells me the steering wheel needs to be raised. :shock:

That darn literal interpreting strikes again...


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## thesilverspear (Aug 20, 2009)

I've known people who will play a tin whistle while driving with their knees. They're not horsepeople. Based on your theory, this is probably a good thing.


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## egrogan (Jun 1, 2011)

Very interesting-I'm a wild, road-rage type of driver (so I'm _gripping _the steering wheel while trying to will the car forward around some Sunday driver-hogging the two lane country road going 45 in a 60-type of person). But riding, I have been told repeatedly that I am too complacent & comfortable with the horse easing out of the forward gear, and I constantly need to convince myself that forward is where *I *want to be before my horse will ever get there.

Wonder what he says about those of us with this split personality??


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## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

When traffic is light, and there's no stress, I push the steering column away from me. HOWEVER, when they roads are horrible or traffic is crummy I pull it towards me and hold on tight!!
Then, I take a good nap after the animals are taken care of!! lol


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

I always rest my hands on steering wheel. Definitely never pull, _may be _push in the emergency stop. With horses - don't know. I try to keep my attention on not pulling and try to follow (not saying it's always successful :wink: ).


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

bubba13 said:


> If I'm going slow on a "safe" street, I steer with my knees. *So what does that tell you?*


That either car is too small for you or you are very tall. I can't get my knees to the wheel even with all my height (besides driving manual for years with long every day commute kinda made a habit of keeping legs long and relaxed when I drive).


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## bubba13 (Jan 6, 2007)

I have to pull my left leg close to me and bend it to reach. I'm certainly not using the pedal foot! Side effect is that it makes my back hurt less, which is why I adopted the pose in the first place.


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

My drive home is 90 minutes. For the most part, I'm dead neutral, no push or pull. When I do anything, it's definitely push. I tried pulling on the steering wheel and couldn't even do it. Very strange feeling.


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

I am a pusher, I push the wheel, I push the gas pedal, I even notice I push my foot against the rest. Never paid attention to that until I read this here yesterday. Maybe a good thing while riding the horse but I don't know about driving?


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

If I cuss steadily and fluently at the cars in front of me, does that make me a pusher?


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

bsms said:


> If I cuss steadily and fluently at the cars in front of me, does that make me a pusher?


In my part of the country, that just makes you a typical commuter.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

you guys! This is supposed to be sort of esoteric thought provoking stuff .


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

My take is the bigger the road rager, the better the rider, no?


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## thesilverspear (Aug 20, 2009)

If you don't push the gas pedal, I don't imagine you'll get very far!


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## ConfusciusWasAGreatTeachr (Oct 29, 2011)

Wow. Interesting to read all this. If it's mostly a mental thing, wouldn't it most surely be more about 'pushing' because you are essentially the dominant one in either situation and you are 'moving and directing' the object? Be it a horse or car...?
BUT then there surely would also be moments of pulling aswell depending on the action and movement of the object/situation?
Arghhhh - it's mind boggling having to think about it because it's something you are having to consciously think about when it's an activity you have become unconsciously competent about doing.

Or have I completely misunderstood the whole idea??? lolololol


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

MyBoyPuck said:


> My take is the bigger the road rager, the better the rider, no?


Usually the bigger car = the worse driver (around here in DC). (I'm not talking about work vehicles like pickup trucks and working vans and so on, of course)


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

When I drove back when, I used to push the steering wheel reaallllly hard to the point where my hands hurt, and I was told by my instructor during this same phase that I was "trying too hard" and riding "isn't this hard"

I haven't driven much since then so I can't give you an update. But my riding has improved 110%


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## OuttatheBlue (Dec 8, 2011)

Hmm interesting... I push on the steering wheel around turns but sort of 'rest' on it the rest of the time. When I ride I do try to push forward into contact rather than pulling back.


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## Cinnys Whinny (Apr 10, 2010)

Odd, Id on't push or pull my steering wheel, nor do I grip it like other people I ride, I just sort of let it hold my hands. I wonder how this factors in.


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## Tymer (Dec 28, 2009)

When I'm not turning, I quite literally hang my thumbs on the wheel. I sort of push into it, I guess.

I think more important to my riding is my "road rage." Whenever I get nervous while driving, regardless of the company in my car, I quite literally go "shhh....shhh..." exactly the way I do with a frustrated or anxious pony. When I get angry on the road because of stupid drivers (or misunderstandings or whatever (side note: I live in New Jersey. Driving is an INTENSE experience...)) I spend about 10-30 seconds raging and cursing and plotting their demise. Then I calm down and think about how _I_ probably was the cause of the issue anyway, and how I've done exactly what they just did in the past. Then, sometimes, I'll do something stupid like cut someone off and try to justify it. "But I HAD to! Otherwise I would have had to wait a whole minute!" Once I'm done whining I'll look back and tell myself exactly how stupid that decision was, making sure I know not to do it again.

Now that I think about it, I ride the same way. When pony acts up and does something stupid I think, "Now why did you need to do that? You're a butthead." When I think about it, I realize it was probably my fault anyway, and 99% of the time it's my fault in some way.


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## Ladytrails (Jul 28, 2010)

I will have to observe tomorrow while I'm driving, but I think I rest the weight of my arms on the steering wheel except when I'm turning. Don't know if that's pushing or pulling.

BUT -- when the roads are bad, I hold the steering wheel lightly, feeling the wheels through my fingers, trying not to grip too hard but ready to feel a skid and react quickly. I'm also sitting a little forward when I do this and am definitely trying to stay relaxed and breathe. This is, I realized, the same thing I do when I'm riding my horse over obstacles (not jumping, just trails) or through ditches, or trying to get her go through mud puddles that she doesn't want to go through. 

Tiny, you're making us think. 

Bob, I asked for Sally's book for Christmas. If Santa doesn't deliver, may I have yours? (Before you start the target practice and the other plans you had for it...!)


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

Next time you're all at a traffic light, watch the people making left turns. Most of them lean into the turn as if they're helping the car. It's pretty funny to watch, but I always equate that to cantering and having the horse fall in on the circle as a result of the rider not sitting square.


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