# Update & Better Pictures - Peeling Hooves



## FaydesMom (Mar 25, 2012)

Is there any chance you have a black walnut tree on the property, or maybe used shavings from a local mill that may have had black walnut go through the mill?

Black walnut is highly toxic to horses and can cause laminitis like issues. 

That's the only thing you didn't mention that I could think of. That sure is some strange stuff you poor horse is going through, hope you guys get it figured out.


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## Lakotababii (Nov 28, 2010)

Well there are not trees in his pasture, but there are some around. Could that be a possibility? Does it need to be ingested to cause issues?

I haven't had him on any wood shaving or bedding. He has a dirt paddock with a shelter and then full pasture, sectioned off. 

Thank you for the response. I am hoping I can get this figured out soon.


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## AmazinCaucasian (Dec 10, 2010)

Lakota-In my experience, it's not selenium deficiency you need to worry about as much as a selenium overdose.

And no, horses founder from walking on the walnut hulls. Commonly there's a problem when the only shade is a walnut tree, and they stand under it. My own horses went through this once. Walnut isn't the only toxic tree, but the most common where I live. 

Your horse doesn't look all that bad though, and to me those rings aren't prominent enough to suggest Laminitis. Looks like what we call "manure burn", which is common in horses that stand in manure and urine in a stall or lot.


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## Lakotababii (Nov 28, 2010)

Oops typo. I was indeed talking about too much selenium, not a selenium deficiency. Vet said not to worry about it here though. We tend to be selenium deficient, not the other way around. 

As far as manure burn, I guess I could see that. We have been fairly dry around here though, and his dry lot is a good size with not much manure in it.

I have dealt with laminitis before, I am pretty positive this is not laminitis. He is not sore, nor does he display any tenderness at all in the hoof or leg. So I think you are right about it not being that. I am a freak about preventing laminitis, and have been very careful monitoring his food and water intake (and output) to prevent it. That and colic scare the crud out of me, so I tend to be really careful during the whole springtime transitioning.


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## AmazinCaucasian (Dec 10, 2010)

Honestly I'd take a finishing rasp, sanding block or sandpaper and smooth it up. It doesn't look like anything unusual to me. Definitely isn't going to cause lameness, I wouldn't sweat the small stuff.


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## GreySorrel (Mar 5, 2012)

AmazinCaucasian said:


> Honestly I'd take a finishing rasp, sanding block or sandpaper and smooth it up. It doesn't look like anything unusual to me. Definitely isn't going to cause lameness, I wouldn't sweat the small stuff.


They honestly don't look bad to me either...try putting some plain ole vaseline on the outside of the hoof, rub it in good and do that a few times a week for a few months and I bet you will see a difference. Not all horses have perfectly smooth hooves, yours may be one of them. 

Please let us know if you do find a reason...but relax, as long as your horse is healthy, sound and alert...go out and ride and enjoy them!


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

If you look at her previous thread, there was a concern that the hoof wall was peeling off and one of the pictures there kind of looked like was. These pictures don't show that. Also she was advised to clean the hooves and when she used peroxide to do that it bubbled. Odd.. 

Lakotababii -- does it still seem like the hoof wall integrity is compromised just below the periople?


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## GreySorrel (Mar 5, 2012)

NorthernMama said:


> If you look at her previous thread, there was a concern that the hoof wall was peeling off and one of the pictures there kind of looked like was. These pictures don't show that. Also she was advised to clean the hooves and when she used peroxide to do that it bubbled. Odd..
> 
> Lakotababii -- does it still seem like the hoof wall integrity is compromised just below the periople?


Many vets are advising to NOT use hydrogen peroxide to clean anything, it compromises the wound. If she is using it to clean the hooves, of course it is going to bubble, hooves are dirty!  Many people use hydrogen peroxide as a wound cleaner. However, peroxide kills very few bacteria and is actually toxic to cells, which results in delayed healing of that wound.


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## Horse Poor (Aug 20, 2008)

It kind of looks like hoof abrasion from walking through or standing in sandy mud (pastern deep or deeper)…then drying out.


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## Lakotababii (Nov 28, 2010)

GreySorrel said:


> Many vets are advising to NOT use hydrogen peroxide to clean anything, it compromises the wound. If she is using it to clean the hooves, of course it is going to bubble, hooves are dirty!  Many people use hydrogen peroxide as a wound cleaner. However, peroxide kills very few bacteria and is actually toxic to cells, which results in delayed healing of that wound.



Well my vet must be weird then, he advised exactly that, to use the peroxide.

And the rest of the foot did not bubble or fizz, only the area that had peeled away.

Amazin-I am hoping it is artificial and just an eye sore. I was just concerned because they were slightly warm the other day, and he just got over thrush and a fungal skin infection. 

GreySorrel- I have had him a year, and his feet have never looked like this. If you look closely, the entire outside is bubbling, and looks like the outside layer is going to peel and fall off. I will try to find some pictures of what his feet looked like before he got this, BIG difference. 

NorthernMama - no, the hoof integrity seems okay under the periople. It is still hard and seems okay. 

HorsePoor - I have no sand in this pasture. I live in middle Illinois, it is rich thick black topsoil. He lives right next to farmland. But I could definitely see that if he was in sand. 

My main concern with all this is that, although right now it is a small layer that is peeling off, there is obviously a reason for it. I am also cautious as I do not want it to go any deeper and start sloughing the entire hoof completely.


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## Lakotababii (Nov 28, 2010)

Okay so sorry for the double post, but I was going to mention something else. If you look at that last picture I posted, you will notice a serious difference in the hoof. If you look at the bottom inch, it had ridges, but is mostly smooth. Up above that part, under the part that peeled, the hoof looks like it is bubbly. That was not there before. Up until this happened, the entire hoof looked like that bottom inch, ridged but smooth. That bubbly part, I can peel it off with my fingers. It chips and falls off fairly easily. The vet took a small farriers knife and touched it to the side, it peeled off. I know that is not normal. Under no circumstances have I ever been able to peel off a significant amount of hoof with my fingernails. So what I am trying to say is that I believe it is moving down, and may continue to peel all the way down the hoof wall, since the outside part that is peeling is soft.


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## Rascaholic (Oct 4, 2010)

Fungus would be my guess. I'd be asking the vet about a fungal infection. It reminds me of old folks toenails when they get a bad fungus.....


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

Rasc -- that's a good idea. 

Lakotababbi -- any new information? Did you have a farrier look at the hooves yet?


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## Trinity3205 (Dec 21, 2010)

Yeah this pings on the fungal radar for me possibly. Very strange. Please keep us updated.


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## Lakotababii (Nov 28, 2010)

My vet still has not called me back, I'll be calling him today again. Onyx is still his normal self, no major changes.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Rascaholic (Oct 4, 2010)

do you have a definitive diagnosis yet??? i am very curious


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## Lakotababii (Nov 28, 2010)

Rascaholic said:


> do you have a definitive diagnosis yet??? i am very curious


Nope. Vet called me and said he thinks it is just superficial. The only thing he could think of is when the hoof gets over-saturated and starts to peel? But he admitted we have not had nearly enough rain, nor has it been wet at all. So we agreed maybe my horse is just weird. His feet have "stabilized" sort of. They are not peeling any further down, now they just look funny.

I blame the weird changing weather. We had 50-60s in January, then it snowed again, and it has been mildly warm (50 ish) since late February. In march we had 80s and now last night we had a low of 33. So maybe it is just the weather messing with him. Lord knows he is shedding out weird too because of all of it. For now I am just keeping a close eye on his feet and general health. I worked with him today a little bit and he was his normal self, his feet look very good minus the peeling.


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## Elana (Jan 28, 2011)

IMO you are being overly concerned. Hooves look hard and dry like the weather has been dry of late and this is a normal hoof. What does your farrier say? I see nothing.. just new growth of hoof wall at the coronary band and then normal hoof horn below it. 

Take a stiff brush and a bucket was soapy water. Scrub the feet off and I expect most of what you are seeing is dirt, older, tough, dry horn, and a normal hoof. They look a bit dry and if you have not had rain, then you are seeing the results of that. 

If you want to you can buy something like "rain maker" and put that on the feet or just use some vaseline. Clean and dry the hooves first (as noted above) and then coat them with vaseline to seal moisture IN the hoof. 

You can also supplement his diet with something like Mirra Coat or a little bit of fortified wheat germ oil. This helps skin and hooves and can make the shedding a bit more uniform and the coat shine.

How long have you owned a horse?


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## Lakotababii (Nov 28, 2010)

Elana said:


> IMO you are being overly concerned. Hooves look hard and dry like the weather has been dry of late and this is a normal hoof. What does your farrier say? I see nothing.. just new growth of hoof wall at the coronary band and then normal hoof horn below it.
> 
> Take a stiff brush and a bucket was soapy water. Scrub the feet off and I expect most of what you are seeing is dirt, older, tough, dry horn, and a normal hoof. They look a bit dry and if you have not had rain, then you are seeing the results of that.
> 
> ...


Did you read the entire thread? I now know that he is "normal" in his own way. The growth, however, is NOT normal, and it is not simply just a dried hoof growing in. I have always used a hoof strengthener on my horses and they have never had any issues until now. My vet confirmed that he agrees this is not normal, but so far is it not detrimental to my horse. So we are keeping an eye on it and letting it grow out. Normal hoof does not have visible layers peeling (which I admit are hard to see in the pictures, but there is an obvious distinction between the 2 layers), it does not bubble when covered in peroxide, and it does not grow in a different color than normal. 

In the picture his hoof is not dirty, it is fairly clean. What you are seeing is not dirt, but hoof wall that has deteriorated. In person, it is obvious, but like I said it is very hard to get pictures that accurately portray what is wrong. 

Why does it matter how long I have owned a horse? Its been 10 years though, and I've worked with or owned horses from ages 6 months to old age.


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## FaydesMom (Mar 25, 2012)

Elana said:


> IMO you are being overly concerned. Hooves look hard and dry like the weather has been dry of late and this is a normal hoof. What does your farrier say? *I see nothing.. just new growth of hoof wall at the coronary band and then normal hoof horn below it. *
> 
> Take a stiff brush and a bucket was soapy water. Scrub the feet off and I expect most of what you are seeing is dirt, older, tough, dry horn, and a normal hoof. They look a bit dry and if you have not had rain, then you are seeing the results of that.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry, but if you see "nothing" but "normal hoof horn below", I would have to ask how long *you* have owned a horse. There is nothing "normal" about the surface of that horses hooves. Even her vet says it's not normal.


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## dirtroadangel (Jan 24, 2012)

GreySorrel said:


> Many vets are advising to NOT use hydrogen peroxide to clean anything, it compromises the wound. If she is using it to clean the hooves, of course it is going to bubble, hooves are dirty!  Many people use hydrogen peroxide as a wound cleaner. However, peroxide kills very few bacteria and is actually toxic to cells, which results in delayed healing of that wound.


Just learned a lil more. I knew peroxide was'nt that good but you clinched it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BoldComic (Feb 26, 2012)

I hate hoof issues more than anything! Hopefully it is something his body is going through that may right itself and he won't have any detrimental effects. 

I do agree with the opinion that peroxide isn't the best. If you want to bleach something, sure it's good. But I'd lean away from it for anything animal related. But it looks like you've already decided to do that. 

I'll be watching to see if anything changes for you.


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