# Absolutly Horrid



## Honeysuga

Thank heavens they are!

http://http://www.horseforum.com/horse-talk/so-begins-mo-51822/


----------



## speedy da fish

good! that way they dont have to be trucked to mexico and canada


----------



## themacpack

I am sorry it upsets you, but I do not find it horrid at all. From your screen name, I am not surprised that you would object, but remember that just as you have the right to choose that belief system, others have the right to choose not to object to slaughter, of horses or any other animal.


----------



## farmpony84

I think shutting them down was a mistake. They need to bring them back.


----------



## Snapple122

You know how PETA is all against the Canadian seal hunt? Well. If we didn't do something, we would be overrun with seals. And I'm pretty sure that slaughter houses are more humane than the seal hunt. I'm not pro- seal hunt but if we don't want to be out-populated by them, something needs to be done. It's kind of the same with horse slaughter.. I wish it wasn't necesary, but unfortunately it is.


----------



## kevinshorses

If you are looking for an audience for PETA and HSUS propaganda you are on the wrong forum. To continue the present course in outlawing horse slaughter is cutting off your nose to spite your face. Horse plants can bring jobs and money to communities that desperately need it and help bolster the horse market as well.


----------



## Snapple122

PETA consists mostly of extremist activists who will tell you anything to try and prove a point. And most of the time, what they're saying is so far from the truth.


----------



## JustDressageIt

I'm all for horse slaughter.... as long as it's in a facility designed for a horse's physiology - taking into consideration a very long, movable neck.


----------



## ShutUpJoe

I agree there is a need because there is more horses than homes. It's still sad that we need slaughter houses. : (


----------



## Marrissa

Finally! About time we start getting it overturned. So much unnecessary suffering for the horses caused by people thinking with their hearts and not their minds.


----------



## ridergirl23

im glad, its better then them starving to death in some feild in three feet of mud


----------



## Phantomcolt18

I used to be REALLY, REALLY anti-slaughter.....but after I did a lot of research and actually openned my eyes to see that not every horse has a perfect home where they get food and love it made me think... I would hate to have horses just standing and starving out in fields where people can't or choose not to take care of them and not all horses can have homes especially in this economy...it's the sad and brutal truth but in the long run it's what's best.


----------



## themacpack

I fully support PETA -- People Eating Tasty Animals


----------



## Amir

I think it's a necessary evil.
People in Australia are trying to ban the brumby cull in QLD.
Brumby cull to kill thousands in Carnarvon National Park | Courier Mail
Sure they could probably think of a better way rather than having them all running froma helicopter, but it's still something that needs to be done.
It's the same crap we get from people overseas when we have to cull the kangaroo population. Or when we had to cull a heap of camels in the desert because they were over populating.
It's just not possible for every horse/other animal to be left alive. That's why there's natural selection. It's not nice, but it's better than domestic horses starving in a crappy paddock with no care, just like the cull is better than the brumby's exhausting the food source and starving in the bush.


----------



## ridergirl23

themacpack said:


> I fully support PETA -- People Eating Tasty Animals


 OMG!! i actually burst out laughing at that!!!! it sounds a little cruel, but seriously? its hilarious XD hahaha nextime i hear a PETA person going on about all their crap im going to respond with that comment XD


----------



## rocky pony

I'm not for PETA by any means...but the whole "People Eating Tasty Animals" deal is *extremely* immature and makes you sound like you're about 12....
All I'm gonna say here.


----------



## Dressage10135

rocky pony said:


> I'm not for PETA by any means...but the whole "People Eating Tasty Animals" deal is *extremely* immature and makes you sound like you're about 12....
> All I'm gonna say here.


Oh, don't get your panties in a bunch. It was meant as a joke.


----------



## rocky pony

Yes, a joke at the OP's expense, pretty cool there..:?
It's only a difference of opinion, if people disagree they can shake their heads and leave.
Just sayin.


----------



## themacpack

Cripes, untwist your panties, rocky pony.


----------



## Speed Racer

I have one even worse that I find HEEELARIOUS, Rocky:

_There's room for all God's creatures. On my plate, right next to the mashed potatoes._

Don't be such a sourpuss. Nobody likes someone who takes themselves too seriously, or who seems to be humour impaired.


----------



## rocky pony

I just don't really think it's the nicest thing when people team up on one poster on the forum and poke fun at them when they haven't done anything against anybody.
For some reason people think it is okay to poke fun at people just for their beliefs about animal rights even when they have never pushed anything on anybody or, in this case, didn't even really say anything about it.

I don't feel that that's what this forum is about. I believe it's for serious discussions about these sorts of things and surely not in any way attacking people simply for disagreeing with you. It is supposed to be a place where people behave with respect for each other. The OP did not post anything including any disrespect for anybody on the forum, but simply posted her opinion about a controversial issue. That is not by any means an invitation to poke fun at her beliefs.


----------



## rocky pony

And might I add, I am not taking anybody "too seriously" except for the OP who has not given us any reason not to respect her. :wink:


----------



## Alwaysbehind

I do not think anyone is actually making fun of the OP.
Heck, I have several friends who are vegans. It takes lots of dedication to be a true vegan. So many things you are not an option because their processing involves an animal product when you would never think it would. Like white sugar for example.

I think people are making light of the slaughter debate since we already have several threads discussing it.

The PETA joke has been around a very long time. SR that one is funny. I had heard it before but had forgotten it.


----------



## Snapple122

they're not poking fun at the OP
they're poking fun at PETA which is a joke organization anyway.


----------



## Speed Racer

Exactly, Always and Snapple. 

I'm not making fun of the OP, Rocky. I'm just a little punchy because we've had so many long slaughter threads this past week, and this is the second one concerning the Missouri legislation. I figured we needed a little snarky humour.

I'm not vegan nor would I ever want to be, but I respect someone who has dedicated themselves to eating no animal protein at all. It's not an easy thing to do.

Now, if we can just get all those vegans/vegetarians/ovo-lactos to buy synthetic tack! :wink:


----------



## Honeysuga

Great point SR.^^


----------



## rocky pony

Okay, I'm glad to hear it, then.
And I agree with that thought, actually...all of my tack is synthetic except for small parts of one of my saddles that I didn't know were leather until after I purchased it, which I am working towards replacing as soon as I can afford to.
I don't really understand people who disagree with meat and other animal products but continue to use leather. Doesn't make a hint of sense to me. My horses have done quite well with all synthetic tack. They certainly don't feel any difference and it's certainly much easier on me as far as upkeep goes :wink:


----------



## Kayty

I must admit I had a good giggle at the PETA comment  It's not taking a shot at the OP, or any vegans for that matter, it's just a joke  I think PETA has the right idea, but they don't take into account other factors such as economy when they run around telling us that eating animals is bad.
Fair call when it's an endangered animal (I thought the seals they kill in Canada were endangered??? THAT I don't agree with, and the photo's plastered all over the net of the poor little ******s being bludgeoned to death makes me sick), but for things like the roo culls here in Australia, well there are millions of the ******s hopping around the place, probably more roos than cows, they're certainly not endangered!! And for the brumby culls. YES they do need to be culled. YES they are a part of our heritage, and it would be a real shame to complete wipe them out, but the numbers need to be kept down to protect the native animals who are dying out as a result of the brumbies being there. 

And as for horse slaughter. Well i sure as hell would rather see a sorry looking horse at a slaughterhouse (a respectable slaughter house mind you, there are some real horror houses around which make me feel ill) than standing in a paddock barely standing, skin and bones with no food and water.
And the racehorses. How many thousands of them are bred every year and don't make it to the track?? There's not thousands of homes for them to go to when they don't make it, particularly for the really average ones of real mean ones. It's far better on the horse to get a quick bullet in the head, not know a thing about what's going on it's that quick, than suffer a life time of being shuffled between homes, being underfed, mistreated and confused. 
And what of the injured ones? Do we just shoot and bury, shoot and bury... we'll run out of space! 

Without humans having uses for certain stock animals, they wouldn't be in existence. Cows would have been gone eons ago! Plus, they're going to get slaughtered anyway. So why waste them? Leather may as well get used, the cow is dead, it's not going to have any other use on the planet why not makes it's death useful rather than letting it die in vain and let it rot away? 
Thats my take on it anyway.


----------



## rocky pony

I do mean the use of synthetic by vegans and vegetarians.
Not only is it moral nonsense, completely hypocritical of people to refuse to eat meat and continue to use leather but also thinking deeper into it...
There should be some cows that are not being slaughtered because of vegs (following the rules of supply and demand) but if they are just using leather the demand for leather demand would stay the same...which kind of defeats the whole purpose..I don't know.
I haven't looked too deeply into it but I would think that.

But either way it's nonsense that vegetarians and vegans would be in any way supporting the meat industry...it's hypocritical and makes no sense. Personally I think they're being lazy.

Of course there would be not much point in meat eaters purposely avoiding leather since it is being supplied by their meat consumption.


----------



## Honeysuga

Actually, most leather used unless it is super high end came from cows that died due to natural causes and were sent to a rendering plant, or it is the byproduct of cow slaughter. Very rarely is a cow slaughtered primarily for its hide, that would be very wasteful.

If you went by that same philosophy vegans could not use makeup or shampoo, hairspray,clothing(after all how do you think they test the dyes used to make those cute prints to be sure they wont irritate your skin) bug spray, medicine or anything else for that matter. Somewhere along the lines allll of it has been tested on animals (unless of course it is explicitly marketed as not tested on animals) and is a cause of cruelty to animals, much more than taking an already dead cows hide.

So really all vegans are hypocrites unless they don't take medicine and spring to spend the extra bucks on he no animal tested products.


----------



## rocky pony

Personally, I do use non animal tested products only (they are not always higher prices! Often lower, actually..) and try to avoid taking a lot of pills and such..I go for more natural cures for things when possible and also aim for the off-brand drugs because I'm fairly sure that they do not do testing themselves and just copy existing formulas (though I could be wrong on that one) but either way...
I do take medicine when it is necessary. I do find my own life and well-being to ultimately be most important in the end...besides, how could I save the world if I were ill or dead? :wink:
It's obviously not something I'm happy with and can and will do everything possible to find and switch to better solutions than animal testing, but obviously we have to make compromises when it comes to that sort of thing. Contrary to what many people seem to think...we are not all fanatics. In fact, many of us are some of the biggest enemies of the extremists at PETA. They give us a horrible name, making such a spectacle of themselves and all..

I do my best and try my hardest. It is something that's important to me so I am willing to put out a bit of extra effort where I can. I personally feel that I'm making a difference..if even a small one.
I realize that other people have different values and opinions in life and completely accept that...meanwhile I'm also out here for anybody who is interested in more information about vegetarianism and veganism and such.


----------



## roro

I'm not flustered by the humor in here, I just think it's a little odd for you guys to bring PETA up. The article was not PETA or HSUS propaganda-if you checked, it was an article by the 'Missourian'. I don't mind everyone having opinions, but spontaneously bringing up PETA and immaturely mocking it doesn't really seem on topic or fair in respects to the OP.


----------



## Kayty

Ever had a vaccination??? They're developed in eggs  Go figure! 

Roro, no idea how PETA came up, I simply responded to the post previous to me and found the PETA spin off mildly amusing. 
We all need to have a giggle now and then, there are so many racist/sexist/religious jokes around that people laugh at, so why's that one different?


----------



## rocky pony

See explanation above for response to that egg bit. :wink:

And I totally agree, Roro, that was exactly my point. It was soley derived from her username only and the many assumptions people make about vegans...and just really uncalled for either way. :? The OP was just posting her opinion about, basically, a completely unrelated issue.


----------



## Alwaysbehind

Honeysuga said:


> If you went by that same philosophy vegans could not use makeup or shampoo, hairspray,clothing........


The people I know that are vegans do not use any product any where in their lives that are processed or tested using any form of animal.

So yes, that philosophy is accurate. 

There are hair care products, etc that are not tested on animals, they simply cost more.


I do believe they use medicines that were tested by animals but there are not any medicines that are not tested by animals. They do try to avoid taking drugs whenever possible though.


----------



## Trissacar

slightly graphic


----------



## Alwaysbehind

Tris, that video was posted in all the other slaughter threads that are going on right now.

It most certainly does not change my mind.

I have seen a chemical euthanasia go bad. Should we stop doing that too?


----------



## Trissacar

Alwaysbehind said:


> Tris, that video was posted in all the other slaughter threads that are going on right now.
> 
> It most certainly does not change my mind.
> 
> I have seen a chemical euthanasia go bad. Should we stop doing that too?


No this happens all the time not once in a blue moon. You should really go to a slaughterhouse I highly encourage you to do so.
And I didn't know it'd already been posted.


----------



## Alwaysbehind

Do you hang out there to KNOW it happens all the time or are you just believing the likes of PETA?

I am sorry to say that I am unable to visit a slaughter plant that does horses because there are not horse slaughter plants open in my neck of the woods. 

I am guessing, unlike someone who wants to see bad, I will find it to be a relatively smooth running operation. As smooth as any operation that deals with animals can be.

The video you are posting is of a plant outside the US.


----------



## Trissacar

Sooo thats pretty much how they all are. No I just know lots of people that have to deal with slaughterhouses and kill buyers.
It is not humane no matter how you look at it.
And the usualy reason for a problem with euthanasia is how it is administered.
So let me get you straight. You find nothing wrong with stabbing a animal while it is still alive? Seriously I just want to know where you draw the line.


----------



## Alwaysbehind

Yes, and the reason there is sometimes a problem at the slaughter house is how it is administered.

It is OK with you that the vet giving a shot does not always work out right but it is not OK with you that a trained person at a slaughter house shooting an animal does not always work out right?

And again, if the plant is not in the US we have no control over how the animals are treated. If the plant was in the US we could regulate how the animals are treated.


----------



## iridehorses

Trissacar said:


> No this happens all the time not once in a blue moon. You should really go to a slaughterhouse I highly encourage you to do so.
> And I didn't know it'd already been posted.


And how many have you been to where you witnessed what you saw in the video? You can find a shocking video to prove any point you want but the truth of it is, in the case of horse slaughter, they are usually out of our country. Slaughter, as a whole in the US, is highly regulated and hardly what you see in the video. A video like that has a sole purpose of being inflammatory rather then educational.

BTW, I always thought that a vegan was a dietary choice having nothing to do with wearing leather. My DIL is a vegan and wears leather.


----------



## Alwaysbehind

iridehorses said:


> BTW, I always thought that a vegan was a dietary choice having nothing to do with wearing leather. My DIL is a vegan and wears leather.


I think vegan has levels. 
To some it is a dietary choice and to some it is a life style choice.


It does seem contradictory that someone who is against using any animal product for food (unless it is for some health allergy type reason) would be willing to use animal products for other areas of their lives.


----------



## Trissacar

Alwaysbehind said:


> Yes, and the reason there is sometimes a problem at the slaughter house is how it is administered.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It is OK with you that the vet giving a shot does not always work out right but it is not OK with you that a trained person at a slaughter house shooting an animal does not always work out right?
> 
> 
> And again, if the plant is not in the US we have no control over how the animals are treated. If the plant was in the US we could regulate how the animals are treated.


I do not believe it is sometimes. The people who have worked at slaughterhouses have attested to the mistreatment of the horses. I personally don't think it will ever be a humane end for a horse. There is no reason at all why someone who owns a horse shouldn't have the money to euthanize them.
A vet is trained and I CHOOSe my vet. Rarely is the vaccine ineffective. And no I don't trust them with a ten foot pole.





iridehorses said:


> And how many have you been to where you witnessed what you saw in the video? You can find a shocking video to prove any point you want but the truth of it is, in the case of horse slaughter, they are usually out of our country. Slaughter, as a whole in the US, is highly regulated and hardly what you see in the video. A video like that has a sole purpose of being inflammatory rather then educational.
> 
> BTW, I always thought that a vegan was a dietary choice having nothing to do with wearing leather. My DIL is a vegan and wears leather.


I highly disagree I do not think they are highly regulated with the horse's interests in mind at all.


I personally think this is more accurate


----------



## Alwaysbehind

Trissacar said:


> I do not believe it is sometimes.


Believe? Up above you said you knew. Is it believe or know?



Trissacar said:


> The people who have worked at slaughterhouses have attested to the mistreatment of the horses.


Any particular _people_? I must have missed where these _people_ documented all the continuous horribly treatment of just horses.



Trissacar said:


> I personally don't think it will ever be a humane end for a horse.


Why?



Trissacar said:


> There is no reason at all why someone who owns a horse shouldn't have the money to euthanize them.


Please take off your rose colored glasses and look at the real world we live in. Are you not aware that life is not always fair and that bad things happen to good people? People that have to decide between a roof over their families head and food. People that before had a great job and were able to pay for things that now for reasons beyond their control (death in the family, loss of a job, divorce, etc) suddenly are not able to afford the most basic things in life.



Trissacar said:


> A vet is trained and I CHOOSe my vet. Rarely is the vaccine ineffective.


Even a great vet can have a euthanasia go bad. 



Trissacar said:


> And no I don't trust them with a ten foot pole.


Who is them?



Trissacar said:


> I highly disagree I do not think they are highly regulated with the horse's interests in mind at all.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6PBPOgUzMh8


You use the word think quite often. How about dealing with facts instead of emotions?


----------



## Trissacar

Alwaysbehind said:


> Believe? Up above you said you knew. Is it believe or know?
> 
> 
> 
> Any particular _people_? I must have missed where these _people_ documented all the continuous horribly treatment of just horses.
> 
> 
> 
> Why?
> 
> 
> 
> Please take off your rose colored glasses and look at the real world we live in. Are you not aware that life is not always fair and that bad things happen to good people? People that have to decide between a roof over their families head and food. People that before had a great job and were able to pay for things that now for reasons beyond their control (death in the family, loss of a job, divorce, etc) suddenly are not able to afford the most basic things in life.
> 
> 
> 
> Even a great vet can have a euthanasia go bad.
> 
> 
> 
> Who is them?
> 
> 
> 
> You use the word think quite often. How about dealing with facts instead of emotions?


There is also this one pay no attention to the music.
This is a horse slaughter plant which may still exist in NJ IDK if it is still active or not.




I have gone through the facts I'm sorry that I don't have the links to them but I've had many computers break down on me.
And there is no need to get hostile I thought we were having a intelligent debate?


----------



## Alwaysbehind

Um, not hostile at all. More amused than anything else.

You can keep posting videos produced by animal rights groups all day long. It will not change the facts.


----------



## Trissacar

Alwaysbehind said:


> Um, not hostile at all. More amused than anything else.
> 
> You can keep posting videos produced by animal rights groups all day long. It will not change the facts.


We can agree to disagree. Amanda isn't a rights group:???: though....


----------



## rocky pony

Quick note, there are all kinds of reasons for a person to be veg. The ones I refer to when talking about the hypocrisy of use of leather are the ones who do it because of the animals and not soley for health reasons. Of course if they are doing it for health reasons they can do whatever they please.


----------



## Speed Racer

Trissa, that last video you posted showed NOTHING. There were quite a few allegations thrown about, but there was no video of the 'inhumane' slaughter of _any_ animal.

It looked like a one-man operation and may well have been flying under the radar, but it appears that when reported, the authorities took action.

Legal slaughter facilities don't let their employees walk around with no shirts, or without gloves and protective clothing. Regardless of the species being slaughtered, I wouldn't want to buy _any_ meat from that guy. Totally unsanitary.

You want proof from others Trissa, but how many slaughter houses have _you_ actually been inside? 

And saying your computer crashed and you lost all your links to your 'irrefutable proof', is just laughable.

Done correctly, equine slaughter is no more inhumane than any other type of slaughter.

Y'know, I'm tired of talking in circles. All the rabid, hysterical antis have nothing new to say on the topic, and aren't willing to listen to logic or reason.

Go ahead and have your histrionics, but the legislation to reopen the plants is alive and well and gaining steam. 

Without the approval of the citizenry none of this legislation would be able to move forward, so it appears that the majority of constituents _don't_ see equine slaughter as the horrible bugaboo as the antis have been claiming.

I see the reopening of the slaughter plants as correcting the ghastly mistake of the inhumanely long trailer rides slaughter bound horses have been forced to endure since the U.S. plants were closed. 

A little foresight, some cojones, and a _lot_ less listening to the diatribes of the _minority_ would have made those trips unnecessary in the first place.


----------



## iridehorses

Trissacar, I'm still waiting for the videos of the slaughter houses that you allude to visiting - as you suggest everyone should. 

Videos off the internet mean nothing as there is no way to verify the when and where of it - only what the audio overlay says it is. BTW, many of the videos of the slaughter houses do not show cruelty at all but rather meat hanging on a hook.

As for the holding pen, again, you only have the word of the narrator. For all anyone knows they were horses that were picked up by the SPCA and brought to a rescue. We do not know - only what they are said to be.


----------



## Trissacar

@Speed Racer
I'm sorry I refuse to respond to someone who is going to be nasty.



iridehorses said:


> Trissacar, I'm still waiting for the videos of the slaughter houses that you allude to visiting - as you suggest everyone should.
> I didn't say I visited any. I just recommended it.
> The one I found where the man stabs the horse in the back several time IDK where that link is.
> 
> Videos off the internet mean nothing as there is no way to verify the when and where of it - only what the audio overlay says it is. BTW, many of the videos of the slaughter houses do not show cruelty at all but rather meat hanging on a hook.
> Yes I know
> As for the holding pen, again, you only have the word of the narrator. For all anyone knows they were horses that were picked up by the SPCA and brought to a rescue. We do not know - only what they are said to be.


You are right I've never been I just have friends who deal with kill buyers,the horses,and such.


----------



## goldilockz

Trissa - how is posting graphic propaganda videos any less hostile than words? You're shoving images in people's faces to try to prove your highly misguided point, while chastising anyone who is *intelligently *debating your claims.

You honestly believe everyone can afford to pay hundreds to have their horse(s) euthanized? Oh to live in your world.


I am relieved to see that slaughterhouses are being reopened. Now we can regulate how the plants are run rather than see people stack horses in double decker trucks to drive 48 hours to a location in some obscure place in Mexico.


----------



## Trissacar

goldilockz said:


> Trissa - how is posting graphic propaganda videos any less hostile than words? You're shoving images in people's faces to try to prove your highly misguided point, while chastising anyone who is *intelligently *debating your claims.
> I'm sorry are you calling me stupid?:think:
> 
> You honestly believe everyone can afford to pay hundreds to have their horse(s) euthanized? Oh to live in your world.
> 
> 
> I am relieved to see that slaughterhouses are being reopened. Now we can regulate how the plants are run rather than see people stack horses in double decker trucks to drive 48 hours to a location in some obscure place in Mexico.


I told them it was graphic. So its your choice to watch it or not.
You do realize that people will take your horse if you really cannot care for it right?


----------



## thunderhooves

Can't you people stopfighting? Like it or not, slaughter is nessasary.
Also, being a vegan won't stop the meat from being killed. It's already killed when its at the store. You not buying one just lets somone else buy two 








^^ That looks GREAT! I wouldn't at it,though, because its horse meat, and we can't buy it here,lol. Givin the chance, I may try it,though.......maybe.
But just because its not at the top of my list to eat, doesn't mean people in countries outside the US won't eat it and love it.
I much prefer this cow, right next to my mashed potatoes, living happily.


----------



## Speed Racer

Trissacar said:


> @Speed Racer
> I'm sorry I refuse to respond to someone who is going to be nasty.


Dear child, I haven't even come _close_ to being nasty. I'm merely saying things you don't want to hear, and that makes you mad.

You're just angry because we're not patting you on the head and saying how _right_ you are, and how those meanie doodie head horse killers all need to be shot! 

The _facts_ are that the slaughter plants are going to be reopened, and the majority of the citizenry have no problem with it. I'd even be willing to bet they're looking forward to the boost in their local economies.

Many of the facilities will have to be built or restructured, so that means construction jobs. Once the plants are reopened and running, that means even more permanent jobs. That'll be a wonderful boon to towns whose unemployment now runs in the double digits.

As far as I'm concerned, the _greatest_ wrong to slaughter bound horses was done by the antis, who somehow convinced the government that closing down the U.S. slaughter plants was a good idea. All that did was make their last trip even longer and more inhumane, especially since the U.S. has no authority over plants that are not under our jurisdiction.


----------



## iridehorses

Let's get back on track guys - away from the one on one. I think enough has been said.


----------



## Trissacar

Speed Racer said:


> Dear child, I haven't even come _close_ to being nasty. I'm merely saying things you don't want to hear, and that makes you mad.
> 
> You're just angry because we're not patting you on the head and saying how _right_ you are, and how those meanie doodie head horse killers all need to be shot!
> 
> The _facts_ are that the slaughter plants are going to be reopened, and the majority of the citizenry have no problem with it. I'd even be willing to bet they're looking forward to the boost in their local economies.
> 
> Many of the facilities will have to be built or restructured, so that means construction jobs. Once the plants are reopened and running, that means even more permanent jobs. That'll be a wonderful boon to towns whose unemployment now runs in the double digits.
> 
> As far as I'm concerned, the _greatest_ wrong to slaughter bound horses was done by the antis, who somehow convinced the government that closing down the U.S. slaughter plants was a good idea. All that did was make their last trip even longer and more inhumane, especially since the U.S. has no authority over plants that are not under our jurisdiction.


No I wasn't mad please don't tell me what I am thinking.
 Horse slaughter is wrong period. That is my opinion and conviction.




> Let's get back on track guys - away from the one on one. I think enough has been said.


Aye.


----------



## goldilockz

Trissacar said:


> I told them it was graphic. So its your choice to watch it or not.
> You do realize that people will take your horse if you really cannot care for it right?


You have no idea. I volunteer to help feed and care for horses that were given up to rescues. The rescues are FULL, and with Spring in full swing, more babies are being born which means more unwanted horses will be neglected, abused, and starved. Don't tell me that people will take care of every single unwanted horse in the world because that, sadly, is simply NOT TRUE. There aren't enough people out there with the time, resources, and money to feed every unwanted horse.

And if you honestly thought that what I said was me calling you stupid then I can't help you. Stop twisting people's words and listen to what people are really saying.


----------



## Speed Racer

Trissacar said:


> No I wasn't mad please don't tell me what I am thinking.
> Horse slaughter is wrong period. That is my opinion and conviction.


And I wasn't being nasty, so don't tell me what _*I'm*_ thinking.

You are correct about one thing; your opinion on slaughter is just that, an _opinion_. Many others do not share it.

In fact, since the slaughter houses are being reopened, I'd say the _majority_ do not share your opinion.


----------



## rocky pony

thunderhooves said:


> Also, being a vegan won't stop the meat from being killed. It's already killed when its at the store. You not buying one just lets somone else buy two


Very untrue. Supply and demand.
If every vegan and vegetarian were eating meat, more animals would be killed. People can only eat so much meat. They aren't going to stores and saying "I think someone just decided to be vegan today.....let's make it two steaks!" They buy the same amount no matter what. They do not have some divine knowledge of how many people are veg. Unless every time they go to the store they are just constantly buying all of the meat from all of the shelves....which is unlikely.
Stores try to keep in stock the proper amount of all of their supplies depending on what is selling. They have to buy a lot of some things and a little bit of other things and it changes if they notice things are selling and running out quickly or if no one is buying and adjust how much they keep in stock.
Which goes down the line to the people raising and killing the animals...they can't just go crazy and raise a million animals and try to sell a ton of meat. They have to try to raise and kill the correct amount for what will actually sell...otherwise people are losing money.

It's not a BIG difference, but there IS one, and it's enough to drive me to make this decision for myself that does not affect anybody else. :wink:
Not to mention that the whole idea is a bit gross to me, personally, anyway...which would be reason enough in itself.
And I get some pretty nice health benefits on top of it all, too!


----------



## Trissacar

goldilockz said:


> You have no idea. I volunteer to help feed and care for horses that were given up to rescues. The rescues are FULL, and with Spring in full swing, more babies are being born which means more unwanted horses will be neglected, abused, and starved. Don't tell me that people will take care of every single unwanted horse in the world because that, sadly, is simply NOT TRUE. There aren't enough people out there with the time, resources, and money to feed every unwanted horse.
> 
> And if you honestly thought that what I said was me calling you stupid then I can't help you. Stop twisting people's words and listen to what people are really saying.


Oh I'm hearing what you are saying.
And I'm not talking about rescues I'm talking about like ASPCA ect. They will take them if you surrender them.
I don't believe there are "unwanted" horses.


----------



## Speed Racer

True rocky, everything is based on the supply/demand model.

Restaurants, grocery stores, and any retail outlet has a 'build' that they have to do when ordering supplies. None of those businesses buys anything randomly, and overbuying something eats into their profit margins.

As I said earlier, I admire the conviction of people who have gone vegan for whatever reasons. It takes a great deal of fortitude to remain true to their ideals. 

Just don't try to 'convert' me, 'cause although I don't often eat meat, when I want it, nobody better get in my way! :wink:


----------



## goldilockz

Trissacar said:


> I don't believe there are "unwanted" horses.


:shock:

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand I'm out.


----------



## Trissacar

goldilockz said:


> :shock:
> 
> Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand I'm out.


http://www.homesforhorses.org/myth.php


> And I wasn't being nasty, so don't tell me what _*I'm*_ thinking.
> 
> You are correct about one thing; your opinion on slaughter is just that, an _opinion_. Many others do not share it.
> 
> In fact, since the slaughter houses are being reopened, I'd say the _majority_ do not share your opinion.



Yours is a opinion also which many people do not support as well.
​


----------



## Speed Racer

goldilockz said:


> :shock:
> 
> Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand I'm out.


Now, now goldi, all those abandoned, starving horses are just an _illusion._

All those rescues full to bursting and going under are just _lies_ the KBs are feeding us, so they can get their clutches on all those 'wanted' horses.

Yeah, the disconnect is strong with this one.


----------



## rocky pony

Speed Racer said:


> True rocky, everything is based on the supply/demand model.
> 
> Restaurants, grocery stores, and any retail outlet has a 'build' that they have to do when ordering supplies. None of those businesses buys anything randomly, and overbuying something eats into their profit margins.
> 
> As I said earlier, I admire the conviction of people who have gone vegan for whatever reasons. It takes a great deal of fortitude to remain true to their ideals.
> 
> Just don't try to 'convert' me, 'cause although I don't often eat meat, when I want it, nobody better get in my way! :wink:


Haha don't worry, I'm not at all  Just trying to explain it to thunderhooves who said that it made no difference.
No worries!


----------



## Trissacar

Speed Racer said:


> Now, now goldi, all those abandoned, starving horses are just an _illusion._
> 
> All those rescues full to bursting and going under are just _lies_ the KBs are feeding us, so they can get their clutches on all those 'wanted' horses.
> 
> Yeah, the disconnect is strong with this one.


Think about it how many people breed their horses on "accident"?


----------



## Snapple122

thunderhooves- that is *always* what I have said! I don't understand how people rationalize, that beef that you're not going to eat because you're vegetarian? Yeah, well it was already killed. Ranchers don't go around counting the vegetarians and subtracting the number of cows/pigs/chickens, etc. that they're going to send to a slaughterhouse, sorry to burst your bubble. I wasn't talking about you thunder. I was speaking figuratively.


----------



## Snapple122

> Think about it how many people breed their horses on "accident"?


Those "accident" horses are not the only ones going to slaughter.. Backyard breeders are a much bigger problem. Do you know how many horses there are in the world? Do you honestly believe that we can go around to every single unwanted/sick/ etc horse and euthanize every single one of them? Sorry, but it's not possible. It's just not. Do I love slaughterhouses? Absolutely not. I actually think they're disgusting. Do I think they are necessary? Unfortunately.


----------



## roro

Snapple122 said:


> thunderhooves- that is always what I have said! I don't understand how people rationalize, that beef that you're not going to eat because you're vegetarian? Yeah, well it was already killed. Ranchers don't go around counting the vegetarians and subtracting the number of cows/pigs/chickens, etc. that they're going to send to a slaughterhouse, sorry to burst your bubble. I wasn't talking about you thunder. I was speaking figuratively.


I'm pretty sure they know it's already dead, don't you think? :roll:

It's supply and demand. A grocery store isn't going to pay for 1000 lbs of beef if only 400 lbs is going to be used, that would be stupid. They will only pay for 400 lbs. The slaughter house then has to downsize because of the profit loss. One vegetarian won't hugely impact the market, but where I am, the beef section is smaller than the soy/health food area, because that is where the demand is in my area. Also, with growing health concerns, omnivores are drifting away from too much red meat, and thus lowering demand.


----------



## rocky pony

Exactly, roro's got it.


----------



## thunderhooves

Eh, I still like my meats. Actually, the 3 main meat groups are( for me) :
chicken, beef, and pork.
nummy


----------



## paintsrule

I only really like chicken, not a fan of the cow or pig variety *blech* but I do love me some salad and pasta, hehe.


----------



## horseluver50

I have been reading slaughter threads for a while now. I have changed my opinions many times. A while ago, I thought it was necessary and humane. Now, I have changed my mind while researching on it.
Horses are treated *inhumanely. *Do you think that cramming hundreds of horses in a trailer and traveling hundreds of miles away to an unknown place is humane? Do you think that having the horses be in a building hearing other horses screams and blood is humane? They are frightened waiting for their death. How can some people say a horse is useless? No horses are useless. Horses that are beyond help (injured severely) should be euthanized peacefully and not put through the terror.

I disagree with slaughter of all animals, not just horses. All you people that say slaughter is good.. hmm well have you ever been through what the animals have? Maybe if you were in that position, you wouldnt think the same..

Slaughter may be humane with the captive bolt, BUT everything that happens before death is what is not humane.


----------



## equiniphile

Consider this: What would REALLY be happening behind the backs of the government and animal protection societies if they stayed closed? Animals would not be put down humanely, they would be starved, hung, butchered brutally, slowly, etcetera, plus being shipped all the way to Mexico where they stay packed 20 to a stock trailer in 130 degree weather, where half of them die just from the trip TO Mexico! Now, as bad as it is for them to be slaughtered, they won't be subjected to the horridness of that journey to Mexico, and/or what any owner might think up in terms of killing their horses.


----------



## thunderhooves

horseluver50 said:


> I have been reading slaughter threads for a while now. I have changed my opinions many times. A while ago, I thought it was necessary and humane. Now, I have changed my mind while researching on it.
> Horses are treated *inhumanely. *Do you think that cramming hundreds of horses in a trailer and traveling hundreds of miles away to an unknown place is humane? Do you think that having the horses be in a building hearing other horses screams and blood is humane? They are frightened waiting for their death. How can some people say a horse is useless? No horses are useless. Horses that are beyond help (injured severely) should be euthanized peacefully and not put through the terror.
> *Do you think that cramming them into a trailer and driving hundreds of miles to be killed even more inhumanly in Mexico is better?*
> I disagree with slaughter of all animals, not just horses. All you people that say slaughter is good.. hmm well have you ever been through what the animals have? Maybe if you were in that position, you wouldnt think the same..
> *If i were in that position, I wouldn't be here :wink:*
> 
> Slaughter may be humane with the captive bolt, BUT everything that happens before death is what is not humane.
> *Think of all the things that happen to us before death.*


........


----------



## horseluver50

> Consider this: What would REALLY be happening behind the backs of the government and animal protection societies if they stayed closed? Animals would not be put down humanely, they would be starved, hung, butchered brutally, slowly, etcetera, plus being shipped all the way to Mexico where they stay packed 20 to a stock trailer in 130 degree weather, where half of them die just from the trip TO Mexico! Now, as bad as it is for them to be slaughtered, they won't be subjected to the horridness of that journey to Mexico, and/or what any owner might think up in terms of killing their horses.


I understand that you have made some good points, all which are true. I agree. But I still do disagree with slaughter. Is it even possible to agree with it!? :S



> *Do you think that cramming them into a trailer and driving hundreds of miles to be killed even more inhumanly in Mexico is better?*


I don't see where I stated that it is better. I disagree with *any *slaughter. It may be necessary and a tiny bit more humane to do it here, but it is still horrible, and when I talk, I talk to all the people who "agree with it" and think it is "humane". 



> *If i were in that position, I wouldn't be here :wink:*


I know you wouldn't. I am talking about those people who think slaughter is humane. It will never happen (hopefully), but just put yourself in that position and think about it. Just because you aren't in that position doesnt mean you shouldnt care!
Maybe you arent starving and thirsty like some children and africa.. but does that mean you can't help them or just ignore what is going on? You can ignore it and just think " well I am not starving and thirsty, so who cares ".. I hate that attitude. >_< You know what I am talking about, so stop being immature.



> *Think of all the things that happen to us before death.*


Umm.. can you clue me in? Do we watch other humans be slaughtered and skinned alive? We hang out with our families, have fun with friends, live life to the fullest. Maybe a boyfriend dumped you.. Seriously most people do not undergo anything like what millions of horses go through.

I dont really understand any of your opinions, they show that you don't really care what happens to anyone else, because if its not happening to you, then screw it apparently :/


----------



## Snapple122

> I dont really understand any of your opinions, they show that you don't really care what happens to anyone else, because if its not happening to you, then screw it apparently :/


Well, first off, stop putting words in our mouths. We said nothing about "not caring" because I think we all actually do care. If we didn't care, we wouldn't be having this argument. Everyone here cares about horses which is why we are on this thing called the Horse forum. Funny how that works, isn't it? 
We're also not saying that we "like" horse slaughter, however, we do agree on the fact that it is an unfortunate necessity. And please don't say that we don't care about Africa and starvation. My best friend and her mother do not have much money and have gone through more suffering at the hands of her father than you can probably ever imagine. And they still sponser *3 *kids in Africa when they can hardly afford to put food on their own table. So the next time you go around self righteously accusing people of things, please think twice.


----------



## horseluver50

> Well, first off, stop putting words in our mouths. We said nothing about "not caring" because I think we all actually do care. If we didn't care, we wouldn't be having this argument. Everyone here cares about horses which is why we are on this thing called the Horse forum. Funny how that works, isn't it?
> We're also not saying that we "like" horse slaughter, however, we do agree on the fact that it is an unfortunate necessity. And please don't say that we don't care about Africa and starvation. My best friend and her mother do not have much money and have gone through more suffering at the hands of her father than you can probably ever imagine. And they still sponser *3 *kids in Africa when they can hardly afford to put food on their own table. So the next time you go around self righteously accusing people of things, please think twice.


Oh noo nono no! I was talking to thunderhooves only! Everything I posted was a response to what she posted. So sorry for the confusion!

Also, I was just stating my opinion, I wasnt meaning it towards any horseforum members when i was talking about people who agree with it. I was just talking about everyone outside of hf too


----------



## Snapple122

Well, yes of course you are allowed to have your own opinion. What I was saying though, is that we are just stating facts and also our own opinions. Life is not perfect. And bad things happen to good people (and animals). 

And, I'm sorry for getting so defensive. I thought you were speaking to everyone in your post. I misunderstood.


----------



## thunderhooves

We NEVER(at least I) said slaughter was humane. it's just necessary.


----------



## horseluver50

> Well, yes of course you are allowed to have your own opinion. What I was saying though, is that we are just stating facts and also our own opinions. Life is not perfect. And bad things happen to good people (and animals).
> 
> And, I'm sorry for getting so defensive. I thought you were speaking to everyone in your post. I misunderstood.


Yeah very true  Thats alright, I understand why you thought I was speaking to everyone, as the way I worded it sounded like that. 



> We NEVER(at least I) said slaughter was humane. it's just necessary.


I know you didn't. It is necessary at the time. Actually, I think what everyone should be focussing on, instead of trying to shut down slaughter.. is to reduce the amount of horses being bred, horses being abused etc. etc. 

By ranting all the time about slaughter, it isn't going to stop abuse and neglect. I respect everyones opinions on here and I am so sorry if I offended anyone in a previous post!


----------



## iridehorses

horseluver50 said:


> Yeah very true  I think what everyone should be focussing on, instead of trying to shut down slaughter.. is to reduce the amount of horses being bred, horses being abused etc. etc.


I'm afraid that as long as there are backyards and morons, there will be backyard breeders. Society always has to go in a clean up the mess made by those types.


----------



## thunderhooves

Or instead of trying to reduce the number of horses being bred(not gonna happen), they should make the slaughter houses NICE. Accommodating to the horses room needs, making it calm and peaceful, maybe taking some quality foals from the pen and selling them to make some extra $$, and being gentle when they take their last breaths.


----------



## roro

Or we could euthanize them/gun to head.


----------



## themacpack

The surplus is not just from backyard breeding. In fact, one could make a pretty good argument that a large part of the overpopulation is the "mass production" approach taken by certain areas of the horse industry where breeding huge foal crops in the hopes that just a few of that year's babies might actually turn out to be "the one" and the rest, well who cares where they end up.........


----------



## equiniphile

Okay, OP, maybe you never stated it was any better, but the fact of the matter is, you stated that opening up that one slaughterhouse is BAD. And I told you that horses traveling to Mexico was even worse, which is what would have happened even more if that slaughterhouse had stayed closed.

I hate that we have put the world's horses into such torture that we are sending them off to be killed when there's too many of them. I hate it. But a quick end is better than a slow, painful suffering. We don't want horses to be starved, do we?


----------



## tealamutt

roro said:


> Or we could euthanize them/gun to head.



though completely humane, this still presents a HUGE problem of how to dispose of the bodies. Dumps are no longer taking carcasses in most cases, zoos must do expensive testing and won't accept horsemeat unless it was dispatched with a gun, and horses euthanized with chemicals must be buried very deep, requiring a costly backhoe job. Thank GOD slaughterhouses are slowly being reopened.


----------



## patches

It is a whole lot better than seeing someone starve a horse.I rescued one that had no food or water for almost 8 days, had gotten loose, ran the streets of a town, was chased by cars, 4 wheelers and came here a basket case. After a month she still shakes when you touch her. But, she is getting a good coat and gaining weight. Not everyone would take a basket case like her. Hopefully she will pull out of it.


----------



## veganchick

themacpack said:


> I fully support PETA -- People Eating Tasty Animals


haha, that one is actually pretty good . I can't stand PETA actually because they make every vegan seem like them. The thing is, More ex-racehorses will be slaughtered instead of humanely euthanized now. Which really sucks. I am sorry I offeneded people. It was not at all intended. I just think its wrong to kill these animals that way if there is another option, but you don't have to agree


----------



## veganchick

Speed Racer said:


> Exactly, Always and Snapple.
> 
> I'm not making fun of the OP, Rocky. I'm just a little punchy because we've had so many long slaughter threads this past week, and this is the second one concerning the Missouri legislation. I figured we needed a little snarky humour.
> 
> I'm not vegan nor would I ever want to be, but I respect someone who has dedicated themselves to eating no animal protein at all. It's not an easy thing to do.
> 
> Now, if we can just get all those vegans/vegetarians/ovo-lactos to buy synthetic tack! :wink:


All my tack is synthetic! Your not a real vegan if you buy leather


----------



## veganchick

patches said:


> It is a whole lot better than seeing someone starve a horse.I rescued one that had no food or water for almost 8 days, had gotten loose, ran the streets of a town, was chased by cars, 4 wheelers and came here a basket case. After a month she still shakes when you touch her. But, she is getting a good coat and gaining weight. Not everyone would take a basket case like her. Hopefully she will pull out of it.


I have seen many starved horses. I have never been to a horse slaughterhouse, but I will be taking a trip to the net one to open up in the US . I have, however seen many cows slaughtered, and if horse slaughter is anything like that, well I think horses would rather starve to death.


----------



## Tasia

veganchick said:


> I have seen many starved horses. I have never been to a horse slaughterhouse, but I will be taking a trip to the net one to open up in the US . I have, however seen many cows slaughtered, and if horse slaughter is anything like that, well *I think horses would rather starve to death*.


Do you know how painful starvation is compared to a small bullet to the head? When horses starve there immune system weakens, therefore opens the doors for disease=sick,helpless horse and ontop of that the disease spreads. Its a chain of events. 
anyways not a whole lot of slaughter houses in my Area (Canada). But they do need to open some more in the US and they seem to be doing :clap:


----------



## ~*~anebel~*~

Humane slaughter of unwanted horses is essential to the business and is a fact of life.
As long as there are people backyard breeding these AppyxShirexTBxpaint things because "foalz r sew cyoote!", we will need a manner of disposing of them after they have undoubtedly also been taught to rear and nip because "OMG cyoote foally!!".
Restrict the breeding of horses to a reasonable level and you will negate the need for slaughter. As a result, owning horses may become unattainable to some people.

Everything is action-reaction. 
As soon as slaughter was banned in the states, there was a huge influx of horses being shipped for even longer periods of time to Canada and Mexico in even poorer conditions and far more horses standing in barren fields starving to death. Personally I would rather see horses humanely shipped for shorter periods of time to slaughterhouses than loaded onto cattle trailers for 20 hours to get to one in Canada/Mexico.


----------



## justsambam08

As long as no one is bashing horse heads in as a means of slaughter or something equally unneccessary and painful, I can agree with it. The US regulates the crap out of everything else, so why not just do the right thing and regulate this too?

Also, think of all of the hungry children you're feeding. Overseas, lots of people eat horse meat.

Also, in response to vegan chick; have you ever woken up REALLY hungry, to the point where it hurts? Imagine that, combined with not being able to move because you're muscles have wasted away and your arm is just too heavy to reach for that cup of water on the table next to you, so your mouth is dry and you can't speak or swallow, and it hurts to almost breath because your diaphram isn't working right anymore and even the weight of your own body seems to be too much for you to handle. You have NO idea what its like to be starving, and certainly you have no idea of the mechanics of how painful it is for your body to break down while you can still feel it. If you think animals will feel the pain of being shot in the head, I suggest you choose your words more carefully, and perhaps maybe take a six month sabbatical from eating, just to get an idea.


----------



## veganchick

~*~anebel~*~ said:


> Humane slaughter of unwanted horses is essential to the business and is a fact of life.
> As long as there are people backyard breeding these AppyxShirexTBxpaint things because "foalz r sew cyoote!", we will need a manner of disposing of them after they have undoubtedly also been taught to rear and nip because "OMG cyoote foally!!".
> Restrict the breeding of horses to a reasonable level and you will negate the need for slaughter. As a result, owning horses may become unattainable to some people.
> 
> Everything is action-reaction.
> As soon as slaughter was banned in the states, there was a huge influx of horses being shipped for even longer periods of time to Canada and Mexico in even poorer conditions and far more horses standing in barren fields starving to death. Personally I would rather see horses humanely shipped for shorter periods of time to slaughterhouses than loaded onto cattle trailers for 20 hours to get to one in Canada/Mexico.


Everyone is acting like it is just a simple method of humane euthanasia...... Its not. The horses must endure up to 24 hours in a cattle trailer. Some of the horses fall over in there and are trampled on and killed. They arrive at the slaughterhouse and listen to the other horses scream in terror as they are taken into the kill box. They smell the blood and death. They are then take into the kill box. Only 60% of horses get stunned on the first try when a stun gun (" The most Humane Method") is used on them. Oftentimes they are shot again and again because they are unrestrained and ALL feel severe pain and agony during this proccess


----------



## veganchick

justsambam08 said:


> As long as no one is bashing horse heads in as a means of slaughter or something equally unneccessary and painful, I can agree with it. The US regulates the crap out of everything else, so why not just do the right thing and regulate this too?
> 
> Also, think of all of the hungry children you're feeding. Overseas, lots of people eat horse meat.
> 
> Also, in response to vegan chick; have you ever woken up REALLY hungry, to the point where it hurts? Imagine that, combined with not being able to move because you're muscles have wasted away and your arm is just too heavy to reach for that cup of water on the table next to you, so your mouth is dry and you can't speak or swallow, and it hurts to almost breath because your diaphram isn't working right anymore and even the weight of your own body seems to be too much for you to handle. You have NO idea what its like to be starving, and certainly you have no idea of the mechanics of how painful it is for your body to break down while you can still feel it. If you think animals will feel the pain of being shot in the head, I suggest you choose your words more carefully, and perhaps maybe take a six month sabbatical from eating, just to get an idea.


 Poor people can't afford horse meat. Its a delicacy. More poor people could be fed if everone went on a vegetarian diet though. GoVeg.com // Meat and World Hunger
I have gone a week without eating to prove a point, and sure it didn't feel good but it was a heck of alot better than getting shot
The US make regulations, but they are never really followed correctly. Trust me, I have been to a cattle slaughterhouse and they definitely did NOT follow the "strict" regulations that are supposed to be followed.


----------



## DakotaLuv

Thank goodness! We need slaughterhouses back. I am ok with it as long as it is done it in a humane manner not like they do in Canada or Mexico especially. They never should have been shut down in the first place. Instead of trying so hard to close them anti slaughter people should have been working on making them humane or more humane.


----------



## veganchick

~*~anebel~*~ said:


> Humane slaughter of unwanted horses is essential to the business and is a fact of life.
> As long as there are people backyard breeding these AppyxShirexTBxpaint things because "foalz r sew cyoote!", we will need a manner of disposing of them after they have undoubtedly also been taught to rear and nip because "OMG cyoote foally!!".
> Restrict the breeding of horses to a reasonable level and you will negate the need for slaughter. As a result, owning horses may become unattainable to some people.
> 
> Everything is action-reaction.
> As soon as slaughter was banned in the states, there was a huge influx of horses being shipped for even longer periods of time to Canada and Mexico in even poorer conditions and far more horses standing in barren fields starving to death. Personally I would rather see horses humanely shipped for shorter periods of time to slaughterhouses than loaded onto cattle trailers for 20 hours to get to one in Canada/Mexico.


Oh, also contrary to your beliefs, horses other than those perfect little purebreeds are actually worth something and we don't need to go around cutting them up and eating them just because they aren't freaken "pure". They can plow feilds, too. They can jump, too. They can do dressage and cutting and reining and parrelli and barrels..... But you wouldn't know that because you don't give them a chance. You think its nicer for us to just send them to a butcher, shoot them, slaughter them, and send them accross seas. Makes perfect sense!


----------



## wild_spot

> Everyone is acting like it is just a simple method of humane euthanasia...... Its not. The horses must endure up to 24 hours in a cattle trailer. Some of the horses fall over in there and are trampled on and killed. They arrive at the slaughterhouse and listen to the other horses scream in terror as they are taken into the kill box. They smell the blood and death. They are then take into the kill box. Only 60% of horses get stunned on the first try when a stun gun (" The most Humane Method") is used on them. Oftentimes they are shot again and again because they are unrestrained and ALL feel severe pain and agony during this proccess


I don't understand why the US/Canada has such trouble maintaining the regulated standards. We have both knackeries and two slaughterhouses here in Australia, and all process horses. Why do none of the propaganda videos come out of Australia? Does that mean that we do it right and it actually is quite a humane process? We don't have double deckers. There is a vet on site at all plants during daylight hours and if a horse comes off a truck injured, they are put down or euthanized where they lay and only then moved for processing. 

Because we have horse slaughter we don't have the glut of unuseable horses that you guys do. At auctions, it really is only the broken, the badly conformed, or the untrained that go to the meat man. Prices for meat horses are generally $500 or higher.



> Oh, also contrary to your beliefs, horses other than those perfect little purebreeds are actually worth something and we don't need to go around cutting them up and eating them just because they aren't freaken "pure". They can plow feilds, too. They can jump, too. They can do dressage and cutting and reining and parrelli and barrels..... But you wouldn't know that because you don't give them a chance. You think its nicer for us to just send them to a butcher, shoot them, slaughter them, and send them accross seas. Makes perfect sense!


You need to read posts without your pretty rose colured glasses on. Anebel made no mention of these mutt horses being 'inferior' - Though they generally are. Of course they can still do most things, but thery can't do most things as well as a horse who was purpose bred for that job. Then you get the horses so badly bred that they end up with conformational issues that prevent them from doing normal activities.

Condemning a horse to starvation and neglect because being shot offends your sensibilites is horrific - Even if pain is felt, it is only for a split second. A horse starving to death is in pain, constantly, for days while it's body shuts down one organ at a time. I can't respect anyone who would wish that fate upon anything, personally.


----------



## DakotaLuv

I'd rather be shot and die quick than starve and die slow.


----------



## justsambam08

veganchick said:


> Poor people can't afford horse meat. Its a delicacy. More poor people could be fed if everone went on a vegetarian diet though. GoVeg.com // Meat and World Hunger
> I have gone a week without eating to prove a point, and sure it didn't feel good but it was a heck of alot better than getting shot
> The US make regulations, but they are never really followed correctly. Trust me, I have been to a cattle slaughterhouse and they definitely did NOT follow the "strict" regulations that are supposed to be followed.


Supply and demand. The more meat there is to go around, the cheaper it will be. Thats basic economics. I have a hard time believing that a vegan diet would be cheaper, especially with global warming...how much is a crate of tomatoes up to these days? 100 bucks?

Getting shot is quick. You feel something, but the faster the blood leaves your body the quicker you die. Starving works opposite of that. 

Did you report these violations you saw? Did you take pictures and send them in to whatever governing body is responsible for regulations?


----------



## veganchick

This earth sucks and some humans are heartless. Starving horses and slaughtering them is horrific and wrong. I'll leave it at that since you guys want to beleive what you want to believe and won't open your eyes. I have looked long and hard at both sides of the story, and I came upon the conclusion both are wrong, but slaughter is worse. Believe what you want to believe and advocate what you want to advocate. I can't change the whole world, I can't change most minds but I can make a difference. A small difference, but a difference nonetheless. From here on out I will retire myself from making posts on this topic because it is getting out of hand. I just hope you realize over 15% of horses that would have ended up at rescues will be slaughtered if the new slaughterhouses open. They will ruin the chance that thousands of horses have only to brutally kill them. 15% of the horses gone to slaughter would have been saved. Remember that.


Rant over


----------



## wild_spot

> I just hope you realize over 15% of horses that would have ended up at rescues will be slaughtered if the new slaughterhouses open.


Why? What proof do you have to back up this statistic? 

Yep, the world sucks, it isn't fair. There isn't one of us i'm sure that doesn't wish slaughter wasn't needed and starvation, abuse and neglect didn't exist. However, we have to make do with what we have. 



> I'll leave it at that since you guys want to beleive what you want to believe and *won't open your eyes*. I have looked long and hard at both sides of the story, and I came upon the conclusion both are wrong, but slaughter is worse.


Why do you think our eyes are closed simply because we see it differently than you? 

And this is a fact - Physically, starving puts a horse through more pain for much, much longer than being shot. You simply can't argue with it - It is clear as day. And knowing that, again, anyone who would condemn a horse to such a fate because shooting isn't pretty, rates pretty low in my books. We have to do what is best for the horses - Not what is best for our peace of mind.


----------



## wild_spot

Double Post.


----------



## Crimsonhorse01

wild_spot said:


> Yep, the world sucks, it isn't fair. There isn't one of us i'm sure that doesn't wish slaughter wasn't needed and starvation, abuse and neglect didn't exist. However, we have to make do with what we have.
> 
> * We have to do what is best for the horses - Not what is best for our peace of mind*.


In a perfect world we wouldn't have to kill plants or other animals to survive. Plants do live as well you know.

Totally agree with you on the bolded part.


----------



## Tennessee

I usually try to avoid slaughter posts because most of them have a bunch of bullsh*ters who believe that swatting a fly is equivalent to killing a human.


I've been to three different slaughterhouses, horse slaughterhouses mind you. I used to be one of those people who was anti-slaughter because "all de pretie ponehhs r bein miztreatd" or whatever. I've been to two in the US, and one in Mexico. With that being said, we screwed up. Big time. The way the horses were treated in the plants in Mexico were nowhere near comparable to the way the horses we treated in the USA. I would much rather legalize plants in the US and put up with the stupid activists who are ignorant about everything that goes on because crap organizations like PETA have filled their heads with nothing but biased nothings than to have thousands of horses shipped to Mexico where they are actually being abused.

I wrote a really long essay somewhere about the way slaughter horses actually work (which are nothing like the way PETA or HSUS portrays them). I should find it sometime.


----------



## DustyDiamond

it is sad that we slaughter horse but its better they be sent to slaughter houses than is someones backyard getting no attention and starving, that is way worse than them getting slaughtered and even though its sad, im sure they would rather have their lives end than suffer and it is not fair to have horse go starving thats just wrong, sllaughter houses are needed.


----------



## DustyDiamond

veganchick said:


> This earth sucks and some humans are heartless. Starving horses and slaughtering them is horrific and wrong. I'll leave it at that since you guys want to beleive what you want to believe and won't open your eyes. I have looked long and hard at both sides of the story, and I came upon the conclusion both are wrong, but slaughter is worse. Believe what you want to believe and advocate what you want to advocate. I can't change the whole world, I can't change most minds but I can make a difference. A small difference, but a difference nonetheless. From here on out I will retire myself from making posts on this topic because it is getting out of hand. I just hope you realize over 15% of horses that would have ended up at rescues will be slaughtered if the new slaughterhouses open. They will ruin the chance that thousands of horses have only to brutally kill them. 15% of the horses gone to slaughter would have been saved. Remember that.


Well obviously the horses that are being mistreated and abused and starved...most people that own those types of horses aren't going to send them to a rescue, if they show the rescue people what conditions they made them live in, it will make them look bad. Believe what you want. You can say you are veganchick firm believer in all that stuff, well then you would know slaughter houses are much better. Unless you are going to go out and save every horse out their(which is impossible) then don't act like your opinion is more dominant or better than everyone else. If you "love" horses so much and your a vegan you would know what is best. Slaughter I will admit is sad but not as sad as some conditions some horses out there are living in, but go ahead and live in your fantasy world and think that every horse can be saved when it is virtually impossible to achieve that goal. Believe me I would save every horse if I could but i can't and neither can anyone else. But by all means,...keep living in your perfect world where everyone that believes horse slaughter is necessary is wrong.

Bravo to you for standing up in what you believe in, but don't put down everyone that doesn't have the same opinion.

So there you go I did rant over that because that is what you asked for


----------



## Alwaysbehind

Tennessee said:


> I wrote a really long essay somewhere about the way slaughter horses actually work (which are nothing like the way PETA or HSUS portrays them). I should find it sometime.


I would love to read that. Please look for it!


----------



## Tasia

DakotaLuv said:


> Thank goodness! We need slaughterhouses back. I am ok with it as long as it is done it in a humane manner not like they do in Canada or Mexico especially. They never should have been shut down in the first place. Instead of trying so hard to close them anti slaughter people should have been working on making them humane or more humane.


 Excuse me? Since when is Canadas regulations not as good as USA's? There VERY strict rules just as America in slaughter houses believe it or not. Sorry just wanted to clear that up.


----------



## DakotaLuv

Tasia said:


> Excuse me? Since when is Canadas regulations not as good as USA's? There VERY strict rules just as America in slaughter houses believe it or not. Sorry just wanted to clear that up.


Sorry, I was tired when I wrote that. Canada and US plant regulations are pretty comparable. I was meaning to say just Mexico, not sure why I added Canada...I think I was thinking of the long haul to Canada. I do appologize.


----------



## Tasia

DakotaLuv said:


> Sorry, I was tired when I wrote that. Canada and US plant regulations are pretty comparable. I was meaning to say just Mexico, not sure why I added Canada...I think I was thinking of the long haul to Canada. I do appologize.


 okay sorry for the spazz it was also late here lol. Yes the trek can be quite hard on them.


----------



## horseluver50

I totally 100% agree with veganchick's posts. 
You guys are saying that its better than starving to death.. you think that all of the horses that are sent to slaughter are otherwise going to starve to death? Some of them maybe, but I have heard in the news of peoples horse being stolen for slaughter, and many times really good horses are sent to slaughter, because the owner sent them there, and they otherwise could've been bought by someone and taken care of.

I don't think slaughter is more humane. Horses don't starve here in canada and usa anyways, we have spca and humane societies, if they see starving animals, they rescue them.

You say its good for the horses best interests? uhmm.. you think killing them if good? If only you could just say that for people.
There are many starving people in the world, why is it any different?

I just don't understand all these horse lovers on here, can be so close minded about it. Think of your horse going through days of in a crammed trailer with other horses screaming, being trapped in a space, hearing the other horses dying and screeching, smelll of blood etc. Broken bones and everything. 

I would NEVER want that to happen to my horse. I wouldn't let anything bad ever happen to my horse.

I realize that something must be done.. But I think euthanizing a horse would be so much kinder. Or if they made slaughter a million times more humane. Not take as many horses, and do it kindly.. let their last moments be relaxing and happy. They should have people who are kind and gentle working at the slaughter facilities, and larger pens.

My honest opinion, and it will not change to what your opinion is. I just KNOW that it isn't right for us to decide the horses fate.


----------



## wild_spot

> Horses don't starve here in canada and usa anyways, we have spca and humane societies, if they see starving animals, they rescue them.


*snort*

Open your eyes and smell the dead horses. Have you ever read Fugly? Horses starve everywhere there are people. It's the sad truth.



> I just KNOW that it isn't right for us to decide the horses fate.


If you truly thought this then you would be against euthanasia and be one of the extremists who think horses should be let free to fend for themselves - Or in other words survive as long as they can before injury, illness, infection, or a predator claims them.


----------



## ridergirl23

horseluver50 said:


> I totally 100% agree with veganchick's posts.
> You guys are saying that its better than starving to death.. you think that all of the horses that are sent to slaughter are otherwise going to starve to death? Some of them maybe, but I have heard in the news of peoples horse being stolen for slaughter, and many times really good horses are sent to slaughter, because the owner sent them there, and they otherwise could've been bought by someone and taken care of.
> 
> 
> I don't think slaughter is more humane. Horses don't starve here in canada and usa anyways, we have spca and humane societies, if they see starving animals, they rescue them.
> the humane societys put down horses when they are to filled up to.
> You say its good for the horses best interests? uhmm.. you think killing them if good? If only you could just say that for people.
> There are many starving people in the world, why is it any different?
> 
> 
> I just don't understand all these horse lovers on here, can be so close minded about it. Think of your horse going through days of in a crammed trailer with other horses screaming, being trapped in a space, hearing the other horses dying and screeching, smelll of blood etc. Broken bones and everything.
> 
> I would NEVER want that to happen to my horse. I wouldn't let anything bad ever happen to my horse.
> 
> I realize that something must be done.. But I think euthanizing a horse would be so much kinder. Or if they made slaughter a million times more humane. Not take as many horses, and do it kindly.. let their last moments be relaxing and happy. They should have people who are kind and gentle working at the slaughter facilities, and larger pens.
> 
> My honest opinion, and it will not change to what your opinion is. I just KNOW that it isn't right for us to decide the horses fate.


 I just thought i would show you our way of thinking, just because they go to slaughterhouses, doesnt mean theyre life is raindbows and butterflys

*fact is, when theyre places overflow, they have to put horses down. lets face it.*
*Picture horses standing in a pasture with mud up to their knees, havent eaten for days, halters that are rubbing theyre faces raw, theyre heads drooped low. Thats what so many horses go through everyday because they cant go to slaughterhouses. Now, we ALL want slaughterhouses to be more humane, that would be fantastic!! but banning them means even more will die alone in some muddy pasture, or be beaten to death or soemthing bad.
* look at the middle of your post where you say you wouldnt ever let anything happen to your horse... your deciding his fate right there.*


----------



## horseluver50

Its hard to explain what I mean.. its hard to put my thoughts in writing.
What I mean by deciding the horses fate, is that when you say "Oh, well slaughter is better for the horse".. I dont really mean "fate", something else that I cant really explain :S

The main idea is that I don't understand how people can be "for" slaughter. Its just not logical. You cant LIKE slaughter. (unless your a heartless person) The people that are for slaughter, aren't actually really, they just believe it is a better alternative. I am sure all of you would like no starving horses and no slaughter, hopefully :/ 

I don't really know how these threads survive, because nobody is really "for" or "against" slaughter... we all just don't want it to come down to this at all.
The world needs to change. Instead of posting here, we should make a difference to help change the bigger picture. Everything helps!


----------



## wild_spot

> The people that are for slaughter, aren't actually really, they just believe it is a better alternative. I am sure all of you would like no starving horses and no slaughter, hopefully :/


Definately true. None of us like the idea of slaughter, rather we see it as a necessary evil.


----------



## themacpack

Pssst..........you "decided a horse's fate" the moment you chose to impose your will on them by riding and keeping one


----------



## Sissimut-icehestar

_(I'm probably gonna get flamed but...)_
Why is it so much worse to slaughter a horse than a cow? I'm sure many of you like beef and therefore "like" slaughter as a result so why can't I like horse meat and "like" slaughter of them as well without being heartless? I don't like it any more than the next person to see anything at all suffer, from cockroaches, to horses, to humans, but I also don't see a painless death as a bad thing. What's so bad about it? You're dead, you can't think or suffer or anything! Not such a bad state, I think.
Maybe it's just cultural differences or something. I often joke and say I like everything about horses, even their taste.


----------



## goldilockz

horseluver50 said:


> Horses don't starve here in canada and usa anyways, we have spca and humane societies, if they see starving animals, they rescue them.


Are you serious? Please tell me you don't seriously believe that no horses are starving in this country.


----------



## Alwaysbehind

Sissimut-icehestar said:


> _(I'm probably gonna get flamed but...)_
> Why is it so much worse to slaughter a horse than a cow? I'm sure many of you like beef and therefore "like" slaughter as a result so why can't I like horse meat and "like" slaughter of them as well without being heartless? I don't like it any more than the next person to see anything at all suffer, from cockroaches, to horses, to humans, but I also don't see a painless death as a bad thing. What's so bad about it? You're dead, you can't think or suffer or anything! Not such a bad state, I think.
> Maybe it's just cultural differences or something. I often joke and say I like everything about horses, even their taste.


No flaming here!

I agree. 

I totally do not get why someone can think it is OK to slaughter a cow or pig or any other livestock but it is not OK to slaughter a horse. 

I also do not get why people feel it is their duty to impose their dietary ideas on others. Horse meat is meat..... and for the people that like that type of meat, it is their business. Not mine.

If I could buy a horse steak I would be glad to try it.


----------



## Speed Racer

Sissimut-icehestar said:


> I don't like it any more than the next person to see anything at all suffer, from cockroaches


Raises hand.

I take exception to cockroaches. Shudder. Nasty things! I do kill them quickly, but I'm hardly concerned with whether or not they suffer.

Wasps and bell hornets also give me the heebie jeebies, and I'm particularly evil when I kill them. It does my heart good to see them DIE.

Larger life forms, I agree wholeheartedly with you.


----------



## Sissimut-icehestar

Speed Racer said:


> Raises hand.
> 
> I take exception to cockroaches. Shudder. Nasty things! I do kill them quickly, but I'm hardly concerned with whether or not they suffer.
> 
> Wasps and bell hornets also give me the heebie jeebies, and I'm particularly evil when I kill them. It does my heart good to see them DIE.
> 
> Larger life forms, I agree wholeheartedly with you.


I don't particularily like them and thankfully don't have to deal with them at home, but when I see a half squished cockroach on a sidewalk abroad I do feel bad for them.


----------



## kmacdougall

horseluver50 said:


> I don't think slaughter is more humane. Horses don't starve here in canada and usa anyways, we have spca and humane societies, if they see starving animals, they rescue them.


Fellow Canadian stepping in here. I'm gonna encourage you to pick up a newspaper every once in a while. In fact, in your own province last year there was a case of 30 horses starving to death on a ranch.
Horses are starving in Canada.
Horses are starving in the USA.
If there were poor people and horses in Antarctica, you could bet your last dollar they'd be starving there too.

Welcome to the real world. Get rid of the kill pens? Nope, we need more, and we need them dispersed so that the haul is far shorter.


----------



## WSArabians

horseluver50 said:


> Horses don't starve here in canada and usa anyways, we have spca and humane societies, if they see starving animals, they rescue them.


This has got to be one of the most ignorant comments I have ever read in my life.


----------



## horseluver50

Around in BC, I read the news ALL the time, and when was the last time I ever heard of horses actually starving to death, a loooong time ago. Horses are sent to slaughter everyday! 
I have read many articles of starving horses that were rescued and taken care of.

Also, about the cow slaughter, I am against that as well, I am a vegetarian for that reason.


----------



## paintsrule

horseluver50 said:


> Around in BC, I read the news ALL the time, and when was the last time I ever heard of horses actually starving to death, a loooong time ago.QUOTE]
> 
> Thats because no one ever reports it, because it is SO common that its not news worthy. Its just a fact of life; horses starve (and slaughter could fix that0. People arent gonna waste time/money reporting on something so everyday.


----------



## horseluver50

> Thats because no one ever reports it, because it is SO common that its not news worthy. Its just a fact of life; horses starve (and slaughter could fix that0. People arent gonna waste time/money reporting on something so everyday.


Uhmm.... ??? someone just said to read the news because its in there, well its not. That doesn't make sense. How do you KNOW that it is so common, if it never is posted anywhere? Are they all your neighbors?


----------



## ridergirl23

horseluver50 said:


> Uhmm.... ??? someone just said to read the news because its in there, well its not. That doesn't make sense. How do you KNOW that it is so common, if it never is posted anywhere? Are they all your neighbors?


 Its posted on the enternet, in smalltown news, but theres so many other things going on in this world today, animals starving and abuse isnt in the news anymore because it happens so often, which is sad :[ but when they make big rescues its in the news because its a happy story for once.


----------



## wild_spot

Horseluver50 - Go ahve a look at the blog called Fugly Horse of the Day. She chronicles numerous starvation and abuse cases and follows the rehabilitation of many of the horse who are rescued. However, there are many who aren't. Many of her blogs mention that one or two or more of the horses died or had to be euthanised and only one or two survived to be rehabbed.


----------



## WSArabians

horseluver50 said:


> Around in BC, I read the news ALL the time, and when was the last time I ever heard of horses actually starving to death, a loooong time ago. Horses are sent to slaughter everyday!
> I have read many articles of starving horses that were rescued and taken care of.
> 
> Also, about the cow slaughter, I am against that as well, I am a vegetarian for that reason.


British Columbia:

CBC News - British Columbia - Rescue begins for starving horses on B.C. reserve

BC SPCA: Photo of starving horse compelled veteran volunteer to help

Horses found dead, starving, on B.C. reserve

Two B.C. residents charged with starving, hanging horse - Care2 News Network

Starving Horses, Donkey, Rescued in Cedar, BC - Barnmice

CBC News - British Columbia - Volunteers free horses trapped by snow on B.C. mountain

The Horse | Horses Starving in British Columbia Owned by Veterinarians

Alberta:

SPCA seizes 100 starving horses from Alberta ranch

Herd of starved horses seized by SPCA | Alberta | News | Edmonton Sun

Dead horses near Edson starved: Official | Alberta | News | Edmonton Sun

Woman says she starved her horses by accident | Canada | News | Calgary Sun

AR-News: (CA) Woman admits starving horses

Rest of Canada:

PARADISE STABLE HORSE RESCUE - **Horses Being Starved in North Battleford, SK District-

Herd of starved horses seized by SPCA - The Sudbury Star - Ontario, CA

Horses starving in northern Ontario, Nothing being done to s... - Care2 News Network

http://ultimatehorsesite.com/horseboard/index.php?showtopic=33402&pid=688386&st=0&#entry688386

Rescue mission: Caring for sick, starving thoroughbreds - thestar.com

These are all a year or less. All different cases. 
Would you like me to go on? I could, you know, but to honest I got sick of looking at it.


----------



## horseluver50

WS Arabians -- Most of those news articles are about horses being rescued or seized, only a few were where the horses died. Comparing those few incidents to the hundreds of thousands of horses sent for slaughter is different.

Lots of times, the owners take their horse to an auction, and it ends up a kill buyer gets them. The kill buyer doesnt care about the horse, they just care about the money they make.
Most horses sent to slaughter are in perfectly good health, ridable, and gentle horses. Not all of them would have otherwise been starving... most of them would not be. Most of them would have a good home with someone who loves them , if they were given another chance.

Some people just dump their horses at auctions for cheap, because they dont feel like trying to find a buyer, or they dont want the horse anymore and dont really care what happens to it.

There are many different horses that get sent to slaughter, and I am sure most of them are not starving horses.


----------



## wild_spot

Horseluver, those articles are the FEW that get reported and then dealt with. There are many, many horses starving or neglected that are hidden away or just not noticed, that do die.


----------



## Alwaysbehind

horseluver50 said:


> Also, about the cow slaughter, I am against that as well, I am a vegetarian for that reason.


Oh good, at least you are some what consistent. I assume that means you use no leather tack on your horse and your shoes and purses and such are all synthetic material too, right?


Horseluver do you realize that the rescues have basically run out of room? There is not an endless quantity of room and funding to pay for horses whose owners can no longer afford them.


----------



## goldilockz

I just can't believe the "LALALALALAL I CAN'T HEAR YOU" mentality that some take on, refusing to believe there are dying horses out there.


----------



## WSArabians

horseluver50 said:


> WS Arabians -- Most of those news articles are about horses being rescued or seized, only a few were where the horses died. Comparing those few incidents to the hundreds of thousands of horses sent for slaughter is different.
> 
> Lots of times, the owners take their horse to an auction, and it ends up a kill buyer gets them. The kill buyer doesnt care about the horse, they just care about the money they make.
> Most horses sent to slaughter are in perfectly good health, ridable, and gentle horses. Not all of them would have otherwise been starving... most of them would not be. Most of them would have a good home with someone who loves them , if they were given another chance.
> 
> Some people just dump their horses at auctions for cheap, because they dont feel like trying to find a buyer, or they dont want the horse anymore and dont really care what happens to it.
> 
> There are many different horses that get sent to slaughter, and I am sure most of them are not starving horses.


You said, what was it? "Horses don't starve in Canada."
Those horses were rescued because they were STARVING. They weren't rescued because they were being well fed. 
Does it only count if they die to you? 

I've heard of FOUR different situations in the last year that alone have resulted in charges against 100 starved horses. Per case. That's four hundred horses right there. But you want more to make it count?? 

You can try and whine and backpeddle your way out of this one, and I guess I'll be leinient cause you're a young 'un, but you seriously need to give your head a shake. 
If you want to be any sort of positive contribution to the horse world you need to get educated, and stop spouting off crap you know NOTHING about.


----------



## Madyson

If people didn't backyard breed, then there would never be a need for this in the first place!


----------



## Honeysuga

Sure there would, it has nothing to do with byb's. What about the large scale breeding operations that pump out hundreds of market saturating inbreds each year?The racing industry that throws away countless 2+
yr olds that do not make it? Or the old horses that have lost their usefulness? Horses nobody wants? There is always going to be a need as long as humans are humans.


----------



## ridergirl23

Honeysuga said:


> Sure there would, it has nothing to do with byb's. What about the large scale breeding operations that pump out hundreds of market saturating inbreds each year?The racing industry that throws away countless 2+
> yr olds that do not make it? Or the old horses that have lost their usefulness? Horses nobody wants? There is always going to be a need as long as humans are humans.


 exactly. :?


----------



## horseluver50

I didn't post here to argue with people. I stated my opinion and what I believe. I know that there are many horses out there that starve, but do you think that slaughter really makes a difference in that? Most horses purchased are horses that wouldnt be starving otherwise.

Don't you understand!? There is still going to be starving horses with slaughter, because there are uneducated people, who claim that they love their horses and they arent starving.. why would they send their horses to slaughter, when they believe they are fine? 

There is still going to be the same number of horses that are hungry out there. Lots of slaughter horses are good horses that were just in the wrong place at the wrong time.

That is why I disagree with slaughter.

To answer AlwaysBehind's question; No, I do not use synthetic tack. Thats the only stuff I have that is leather. I would rather the skin not be wasted, since they use the meat already.


----------



## paintsrule

horseluver50 said:


> To answer AlwaysBehind's question; No, I do not use synthetic tack. Thats the only stuff I have that is leather. I would rather the skin not be wasted, since they use the meat already.


Hahaha hohoho hehehe, if you cant see anything nice....

Well guess what, I would rather the meat on horses not be wasted when the horse is shot or starving to death anyways because (and YES it does happen :shock no one wanted or wants them anymore. Why cant people eat it instead of throwing it underground? Dead is dead, and we have dominion over all animals anyhoo.


----------



## trailhorserider

Quarter Horse......it's what's for dinner. :-(


----------



## kevinshorses

Mmm Mmm Good!


----------



## Painted Horse

I was in Vets office one day. A fellow was there with a horse that had Navicular. The man had spent a boat load of money trying to keep that horse usefull. I guess he had just returned from a trip to Paris France. He said he tried a Horse steak over in France. Said "if I had known how good horse tasted, I wouldn't have spent all this money trying to save this horse."

Just because we americans choose not to eat horse, and I suspect mostly because we do develope a relationship with a horse over the 15 years that we ride and work with them. Doesn't mean that other cultures and people shouldn't have the right to eat a horse. And since we as America do produce a lot of the worlds food. Why not horse.


----------



## Honeysuga

horseluver50 said:


> I know that there are many horses out there that starve, but do you think that slaughter really makes a difference in that? Most horses purchased are horses that wouldnt be starving otherwise.


A) Yes, less horses, less to saturate the market and sit around unwanted and starving and being beaten and suffering.

B) Exactly how do they get the horses people actually care for and want? Go steal them in the night? NO. They take the dregs and unwanteds, starving and crippled from the auction rings at rock bottom prices and send them off to a much better and more useful fate than sitting around waiting to die. So how would those horses not be suffering and starving and being abused otherwise?

I think you need to stop feeding off the propaganda teat, sit back and think with your own little brain my little friend, I think once you look at it from and unemotional and practical pov, you will see things much differently.


----------



## Alwaysbehind

paintsrule said:


> Well guess what, I would rather the meat on horses not be wasted when the horse is shot or starving to death anyways because (and YES it does happen :shock no one wanted or wants them anymore. Why cant people eat it instead of throwing it underground? Dead is dead, and we have dominion over all animals anyhoo.


I totally agree! It is such a waste of so much perfectly good meat.


----------



## MacabreMikolaj

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INcW26-iyqU&feature=related

Yup. Slaughter is inhumane. :roll: We're such ANIMA...oh right.


----------



## MacabreMikolaj

Ignore this.


----------



## Lovehorsesandrunning

Im not for or against them.I find it horses have to be slaughtered but that mostly our fault. But it was sick when horses had to be trailered all the way to mexico they were already half dead by the time they got there!!!!!!!!!!!! So it makes me really sad when perfectly good horses have to be slaughtered, because thats like a person being murdered, every horse can be used for something, but theres not always a chance for that so some have to be used for slaughter houses


----------



## MacabreMikolaj

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INcW26-iyqU

Third times a charm???


----------



## Honeysuga

Nopes, stil just text Macabre.


----------



## MacabreMikolaj

What the HECK am I doing wrong? :-| This forum isn't hard, you just paste the link!






Testing?


----------



## MacabreMikolaj

Oooooooooooooook, it just doesn't like that link, maybe because it's from the BBC? At least I don't feel so crazy now. :lol:


----------



## Tasia

horseluver50 said:


> Around in BC, I read the news ALL the time, and when was the last time I ever heard of horses actually starving to death, a loooong time ago. Horses are sent to slaughter everyday!
> I have read many articles of starving horses that were rescued and taken care of.
> QUOTE]
> oh for pete sakes! check the bc interior horse rescue! my goodness! look around there is many horses starving around here ! Look in pastures! peoples back yards! Just because my people dont want to send dere pweety horses to slaughter and let them starve instead!


----------



## Tasia

Lovehorsesandrunning said:


> Im not for or against them.I find it horses have to be slaughtered but that mostly our fault. But it was sick when horses had to be trailered all the way to mexico they were already half dead by the time they got there!!!!!!!!!!!! So it makes me really sad when perfectly good horses have to be slaughtered, because thats like a person being murdered, every horse can be used for something, but theres not always a chance for that so some have to be used for slaughter houses


OY!!!! You CAN NOT compare horses and humans there is no relation (yes we are animals to but!) We are so much higher on the chain then horses are this will NEVER change!


----------



## ilyTango

WHAAAAT?! I cannot believe that people are saying they'd rather a horse starve to death than be shot. And THEY say SLAUGHTER HOUSES are cruel! Dear lord.


----------



## Tasia

Exactly!


----------



## alexischristina

We created the overpopulation of horses, so it's up to us to try to control it and fix the problems (too many horses to starve and waste away) that WE created.


----------



## Crimsonhorse01

alexischristina said:


> We created the overpopulation of horses, so it's up to us to try to control it and fix the problems (too many horses to starve and waste away) that WE created.


Ok, you never took wildlife management in class id you? Do you know why there are hunting seasons? Because if there weren't we would be over run by critters we didn't create. They would become over populated and then either starve or die off due to disease. Same with horses. So we have three options. One to let them starve. Two to let them slowly die due to disease. Or three send them to slaughter.
I don't see why its so hard to comprehend.


----------



## alexischristina

...
The whole point of my post was NOT against slaughter, in fact it was for slaughter.
We have to fix the problem of overpopulation by getting a better handle on breeding (which, let's face it, is NOT going to happen) and sending the horses that dont have a better life to slaughter.
I apologize for not making my point clear...


----------



## Erin_And_Jasper

wow. page 17........ im for slaughter. i dont wish it upon any horse but it is necessary. i just read all 17 pages and thought wow, some of these posts are funny. Qh its whats for dinner, PETA People Eat Tasty Animals, etc. its funny. Most PETA people are extremists. i would NEVER eat horse meat but im for horse slaughter. i would rather jasper go to slaughter than to people who would starve and abuse him. i know a horse who prolly went to slaughter bc he had HYPP and no one wanted him. i would have taken him but i have no more room.

Go ahead and tell me my OPINION is wrong, but its my OPINION


----------

