# The Carrot Stick



## goldilockz (Aug 1, 2008)

Why is it called that? Anyone know? It looks like a crop to me...


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## Scoutrider (Jun 4, 2009)

I think I read somewhere that Pat Parelli coined the term in honor of the "dangling the carrot in front of the horse to get him to move" trick. Like the Little Rascals.


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## Spirithorse (Jun 21, 2007)

Pat named it the carrot stick, not because it's orange, but because he wants people to be "extreme middle-of-the-roadists." Meaning you aren't just a stick person (like using a whip to force a horse to do something) and you aren't just a carrot person (like using treats to bribe and using all love).....you are a "carrot stick" person. You use love, language and leadership in equal doses, not just love love love and not just leadership and dictatorship.


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## Scoutrider (Jun 4, 2009)

Spirithorse said:


> Pat named it the carrot stick, not because it's orange, but because he wants people to be "extreme middle-of-the-roadists." Meaning you aren't just a stick person (like using a whip to force a horse to do something) and you aren't just a carrot person (like using treats to bribe and using all love).....you are a "carrot stick" person. You use love, language and leadership in equal doses, not just love love love and not just leadership and dictatorship.


That makes way more sense than what I'd heard. No idea where I read my explanation...


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## Misfit (Jun 29, 2009)

You can also just buy a cattle stick at any tsc for a fraction of the cost.

Just a little hint.


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

SpirtHorse Got it  

I use Half Circle Ranch "carrot" sticks


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## FlitterBug (May 28, 2009)

Spirithorse said:


> Pat named it the carrot stick, not because it's orange, but because he wants people to be "extreme middle-of-the-roadists." Meaning you aren't just a stick person (like using a whip to force a horse to do something) and you aren't just a carrot person (like using treats to bribe and using all love).....you are a "carrot stick" person. You use love, language and leadership in equal doses, not just love love love and not just leadership and dictatorship.


 
That guy just keeps cracking me up! I thought myself and my horse were supposed to show that to people, not the overpriced "stick" I carry!

Definately not the impression I get from people when I see them carrying around a big orange stick......


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## Spirithorse (Jun 21, 2007)

And the point of your post FlitterBug was....? This is the NH part of the forum, and the OP didn't ask for your opinion on the name or why it was named that, so keep things like that to yourself.


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## Marecare (Jan 1, 2009)

I might be imagining things,but it seems that there are a few here that have a real problem with the word "Natural".

Share your pain with me and set it free!

Ha!


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## goldilockz (Aug 1, 2008)

Nevermind. I just don't have the energy :lol:


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## Marecare (Jan 1, 2009)

Picture of an "Unnatural" horse.


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## goldilockz (Aug 1, 2008)

Why are you even in this thread? You are contributing nothing, and you're being rude and condescending.


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## FlitterBug (May 28, 2009)

I was just making conversation. I wasn't being negative, I honestly thought it was funny. The marketing behind it is just down right amazing to me!

Oh, btw marecare, I have no problem whatsoever with "natural horsemanship". Actually, most of my business comes from NH people. I only have a problem with people that think "I have to buy this to achieve that" and people that worship equestrian figures that have a way with words.

Good horsemanship is achieved through communication and understanding the horse. Consistency, accuracy, knowledge, compasion, yet solid guidance, is what makes a good horse. When I see the horse and how they interact with their person, I know that the time has been taken and emotions understood. An orange stick tells me none of this, it just looks like an orange stick. I would honestly much rather hear that he called it carrot because he liked the color orange rather than all of that other brain washing mumbo jumbo.

I wish I could post a picture of one horse communicating with another using an orange stick, You know, to display the "natural".

Sorry to be sidetracked on your thread Goldilockz, I will be done now.


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## goldilockz (Aug 1, 2008)

No need to apologize, FlitterBug


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## Marecare (Jan 1, 2009)

FlitterBug said:


> I was just making conversation. I wasn't being negative, I honestly thought it was funny. The marketing behind it is just down right amazing to me!
> 
> Oh, btw marecare, I have no problem whatsoever with "natural horsemanship". Actually, most of my business comes from NH people. I only have a problem with people that think "I have to buy this to achieve that" and people that worship equestrian figures that have a way with words.
> 
> ...



This sounds like envy and being negative to me.


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## goldilockz (Aug 1, 2008)

Again, Marecare, I will ask. Why are you in this thread?? You have contributed nothing except being rude and condescending.


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## Marecare (Jan 1, 2009)

Thank you for you opinion.

Just because someone makes a buck or two on "horse stuff"does not set me off on a rant about overpriced gear.

If you don't like the gear then don't buy it.
PP also sells a saddle for over $4000 dollars that is suppose to help the conformation of the horse.
The world is filled with all kinds of claims and boasts,so what?

Do you want to talk about training techniques or complain about the cost of gear?


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## goldilockz (Aug 1, 2008)

What I wanted to talk about in this thread was whether or not the carrot stick was something different from what it looked like.

I didn't want someone coming in and picking apart everyone else's opinions, trying to start a fight with people who may disagree with Natural Horsemanship.


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## Marecare (Jan 1, 2009)

I believe the "carrot stick" is a buggy whip (a little shorter) and it is orange.


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## Doc (Jun 12, 2009)

Flitterbug, I agree with all that you have said, and saw nothing in any of your posts that was offensive. You expressed your 'observation', just as the original poster asked for an observation from others (and also expressed an opinion- "It looks like a crop to me... "), by asking the initial question.

That being said, and having experience with both the carrot stick and a light lunge-whip, as well as a sorting stick, I would tell a beginner that a carrot-stick is nothing more than a sorting stick for cattle that is orange...and if they don't know what a sorting stick is, then I would tell them that the carrot stick would resemble an orange 10-foot lunge-whip with the last six feet chopped off, leaving the handle part to use.

Both the carrot stick and the lunge-whip serve the same purpose, used correctly...it becomes an extension of the person using it to assist in training.

As to how it (the carrot stick) got its name...I did not have the answer for that, although it was answered in previous posts, so I apologize for not answering the original question.


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## Spirithorse (Jun 21, 2007)

Horses have long bodies, people have tall bodies. To communicate effectively, we need to be able to be as tall and as long as the horse at any given moment, which is why we use the carrot stick.

The Parelli saddle does NOT claim to improve CONFORMATION. Conformation is skeletal and can not be changed. However, the saddle will help the horse's POSTURE. Conformation and posture are two completely different things. The saddle is legit as far as I'm concerned, I've had the priviledge to ride in it and my horse moved so much freer and it really improved everything overall. But lets not get into a debate about the saddle, shall we?


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

Will people who are against PNH or NH in general PLEASE stop coming to this part of the forum!


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## Marecare (Jan 1, 2009)

HorsesAreForever said:


> Will people who are against PNH or NH in general PLEASE stop coming to this part of the forum!



I agree


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## goldilockz (Aug 1, 2008)

HorsesAreForever said:


> Will people who are against PNH or NH in general PLEASE stop coming to this part of the forum!


We're not allowed to ask questions? And I'm not allowed to get opinions and views from EVERYONE, including non-NHers? You'd think you would be excited to have someone asking questions in "your" part of the forum so that maybe someone would be more open to your methods.

But the attitudes expressed toward those who are not obviously NH followers just drives more and more potential NHers away. Good job.

I'm on the fence. Metaphorically, I DID have one leg on each side of said fence, but lately, with the rudeness expressed toward "non-NHers" I'm leaning more away from that particular method.


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

HorsesAreForever said:


> Will people who are against PNH or NH in general PLEASE stop coming to this part of the forum!


Wow, and here I thought this was an open and welcoming forum. Sad to see this kind of attitude expressed on my second day here.

For the record, I actually embrace a lot of the NH techniques and ways of thinking and I still find what you said to be very rude. Ironic that you are directing it at non-NHers, and yet you make even those who do embrace NH feel uncomfortable/unwelcome in "your" forum (that is how you make it seem)


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## Marecare (Jan 1, 2009)

I have not problem discussing the theories and ideas of such behaviorist and fine horseman as 
Tom and Bill Dorrance,Mark Rashid,Jack Brainard,Ray Hunt,Dr. Robert Miller,Leslie Desmond,Gawani Pony Boy,Curt Pate,Stacy Westfall and many,many others that have contributed so much.

The above names deserve a great deal of respect for what they have accomplished in the horse world and poking fun at carrot sticks and saying that they cost too much is not the best opening to the topic.

In my humble opinion.


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## goldilockz (Aug 1, 2008)

You're accusing me of poking fun at carrot sticks now? Because I asked a question? Since I am the one who opened the topic, I take that to be your meaning.

Please exit the thread already. You are just picking fights left and right, and I'm tired of it.


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

So, asking questions in an attempt to learn about something you don't understand = bad, gotcha.


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## Marecare (Jan 1, 2009)

I did not mean that you the OP was attacking.
I did mean that others are!

The word "Natural" seems to bring out the reaction from many.


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## minihorse927 (Aug 11, 2008)

Please remember to keep the forum friendly and welcoming so it can grow.


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## Marecare (Jan 1, 2009)

Why not move on with the topic and ask some question about NH and the information that you are looking for.


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## goldilockz (Aug 1, 2008)

Because the topic was the carrot stick and I have the information I was looking for. It could have died after a couple of responses with answers, but you kept it going by trying to get non-NHers to react to your instigating.


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## Spirithorse (Jun 21, 2007)

I think it's great you asked about the carrot stick. It's a good question, and a lot of people don't know the answer to it, but since you asked the question, now people know 



goldilockz said:


> We're not allowed to ask questions? And I'm not allowed to get opinions and views from EVERYONE, including non-NHers? You'd think you would be excited to have someone asking questions in "your" part of the forum so that maybe someone would be more open to your methods.
> 
> But the attitudes expressed toward those who are not obviously NH followers just drives more and more potential NHers away. Good job.
> 
> I'm on the fence. Metaphorically, I DID have one leg on each side of said fence, but lately, with the rudeness expressed toward "non-NHers" I'm leaning more away from that particular method.


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## Spirithorse (Jun 21, 2007)

I forgot to add this in my last post lol. I do think that if a post is not intended to be a "debate" kind of thread, that people need to be careful of what they say....and this includes NHers and non NHers. The reason I responded to FlitterBug's post was because it sounded negative and poking fun and that was not the idea of this topic. 

This is the NH part of the forum where NHers need to feel comfortable coming to talk about their problems and successes, ask questions to fellow NHers to get help, and to have a support community. They don't need to feel uncomfortable posting in fear that they will get slamed or ridiculed or made fun of by others.

However, even though this is the NH part of the forum, non-NHers should feel free to post questions or to gain more insight on how NHers view things. They should not have to worry about people getting after them for not being NHers and should not be treated in a negative way. Each party needs to respect the other, even if we don't agree.

This is just my opinion though


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## iridehorses (Oct 22, 2007)

One of the reasons why the NH forum was created was because there was way too much infighting among members when a question or comment about Parelli was brought up. We decided to give those practitioners of Parelli and others a forum of their own to keep the arguments at a minimum.

As Spirithorse posted, this forum was developed so that there would be a specific place where NH followers could go to discuss among themselves the aspects of NH and for others to learn - not make rude or unnecessary posts.

BTW, when did NH and Parelli become synonymous? There are so many other trainers that practice NH but it always seems to mean Parelli.


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## moomoo (Feb 21, 2007)

Wow, I didn't know about the inbetween a whip and a carrot thing  I thought it was just called that so people didn't think it was just an orange schooling whip :lol: I don't think you were asking to buy/you already have one but if you do buy one you may aswell just buy a schooling whil and some sting / a lunging whip 

Really, there is no point arguing since riding horses isn't really natural anyway, we are predators they are prey. Lions don't ride zebras round :lol:


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

moomoo said:


> Wow, I didn't know about the inbetween a whip and a carrot thing  I thought it was just called that so people didn't think it was just an orange schooling whip :lol: I don't think you were asking to buy/you already have one but if you do buy one you may aswell just buy a schooling whil and some sting / a lunging whip
> 
> *Really, there is no point arguing since riding horses isn't really natural anyway, we are predators they are prey. Lions don't ride zebras round* :lol:


LMBO - now _that_ is excellent! :lol:


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## Spirithorse (Jun 21, 2007)

iridehorses: I think it became synonomous b/c Parelli seemed to set forth a "new age" of NH. He is not the first one to do NH by any means, and he acknowledges that, but in this day and age, at least back when, he seemed to be the first one to come out and bring this idea to the forefront of the equine industry. Soon after you started to see Denis Reis going on tour, Clinton Anderson, and others. So no, Parelli isn't the only NH person out there, but it seems that he may have the biggest following....maybe I'm wrong, but that's what it seems like anyway lol!


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## Spyder (Jul 27, 2008)

moomoo said:


> Lions don't ride zebras round :lol:


 
No they don't..........just horses.


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## moomoo (Feb 21, 2007)

^ I was actually thinking about that picture just after I posted that :shock:


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## Scoutrider (Jun 4, 2009)

_*That*_ is what I call a bombproof horse.


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

I was not saying you cannot ask questions I was refuring to a specfic responses that were made. And that were practically mocking PNH .. The prices on the products are NOT up to Linda and Pat Parelli... 

Sorry if my response was taken the wrong way..


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