# Nightmare Lease - What Would You Do?



## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

Woah, that poor horse looks like she went through a meat grinder. Thankfully it looks just superficial and she'll heal up fine. I would personally just be glad I got my horse back before something worse happened. These people obviously mistreated & mishandled your horse, guess you could sue them but why bother?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## gssw5 (Jul 30, 2013)

Oh my gosh poor horse, and how awful that she went through that. I would be livid. There are so many ways this could have been handled. I would have them all arrested for animal cruelty and endangerment. 

At a minimum they need to pay the vet bill, and any associated bills.

I hope she heals both physically and mentally.

Hugs and prayers.


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## LoriF (Apr 3, 2015)

Small claims court. Bring the contract, photos of how she looked before, witnesses to state how she used to load on the trailer, and photos of what she looks like now. Also, bring the vet bill, and a statement from the vet wouldn't hurt either. Good luck on reassuring her that the trailer is ok again, if it ever happens.
They should have told you to come and get her before they allowed something like this.

God, I feel so bad about the look in her eye. She seems to be just checked out. Poor baby

Also, Bev's magic salve works wonders on cuts like that. You can find it on the internet


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## edinburgh (Jul 18, 2015)

Thank you waresbear and gssw5.

waresbear - She's sore and traumatized but the vet said her physical wounds should heal quickly. I'm glad nothing worse happened and she's back home where she'll be safe. I agree that sueing them would be a waste of time because we would probably only get the vet bills payed and they have already agreed to that.

gssw5 - I had to leave because I was worried if I stayed any longer I was going to do something I would regret later when I was in jail. I've been looking at animal cruelty laws and the spca website but I don't think anything would be done about the girl since her other horse looked happy and healthy when I went to check on my mare. The physical wounds should heal but I don't think she will ever be the same mentally.

I appreciate both of your responses and input as I try to figure out what I will be doing.


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## edinburgh (Jul 18, 2015)

LoriF - Thank you for the suggestion. I think they are trying to avoid court because they agreed to pay the vet bills when I mentioned it. I don't think I would get anything other than reimbursement for the vet bills if we did go to court. My biggest concern is her being afraid of people for the rest of her life. I don't think I will ever be able to get her back to being calm and relaxed on a trailer but as long as she is safe I don't mind because I have no plans to move her and will definitely never sell or lease her again.


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## anndankev (Aug 9, 2010)

Well, after seeing this I will not lease a horse of mine out offsite. 

Although it can work out well, and has for my daughter in the past, obviously it can go horrendously wrong.


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## LoriF (Apr 3, 2015)

edinburgh said:


> LoriF - Thank you for the suggestion. I think they are trying to avoid court because they agreed to pay the vet bills when I mentioned it. I don't think I would get anything other than reimbursement for the vet bills if we did go to court. My biggest concern is her being afraid of people for the rest of her life. I don't think I will ever be able to get her back to being calm and relaxed on a trailer but as long as she is safe I don't mind because I have no plans to move her and will definitely never sell or lease her again.


Yes, that would be all that you get, didn't know that they agreed to pay the vet bill. That's the least that they could do.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

I feel really bad for your horse. Too bad they didn't contact you earlier and you had been in regular contact with them. You could have helped them load and see what they were doing wrong. in hind sight you should have went and got ton her since they said they couldn't load, be happy with the vet bills and move on. She should come back around in time. She'll remember you and should settle down.


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## edinburgh (Jul 18, 2015)

LoriF said:


> Yes, that would be all that you get, didn't know that they agreed to pay the vet bill. That's the least that they could do.


I should have mentioned that in the original post but forgot. She has been completely checked out all day until someone comes near her when the look in her eyes changes to fear. I have looked into the salve you recommended and will be ordering some. Thank you!


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Horses are amazingly forgiving animals. I suspect that in less time than it takes to get the vet bill out of them, she'll be back to being her trusting, sweet, loading self. 

You and I would have been sitting in the jail saying, "Well, we gave back part of what they gave the horse. Wanna do it again when we get out?".


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## edinburgh (Jul 18, 2015)

churumbeque said:


> I feel really bad for your horse. Too bad they didn't contact you earlier and you had been in regular contact with them. You could have helped them load and see what they were doing wrong. in hind sight you should have went and got ton her since they said they couldn't load, be happy with the vet bills and move on. She should come back around in time. She'll remember you and should settle down.


I feel horrible that this happened to her. I tried to keep in contact with the girl and required updates with current pictures every 2 months but she would ignore my calls and texts. It took almost 2 additional months for me to get the initial 2 month update. I would have gotten her but do not have access to a trailer. Looking back there are things I wish I would have done differently but having regrets isn't going to help Charlie and that is my main focus. I have learned from this experience and know what to do differently if I ever decide to lease out one of my horses, which is unlikely.


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## edinburgh (Jul 18, 2015)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> Horses are amazingly forgiving animals. I suspect that in less time than it takes to get the vet bill out of them, she'll be back to being her trusting, sweet, loading self.
> 
> You and I would have been sitting in the jail saying, "Well, we gave back part of what they gave the horse. Wanna do it again when we get out?".


I hope so! She seemed to calm down a little and would tolerate me standing quietly in the corner of her stall by the time I left (8 hours after she arrived) but was still skittish when I moved.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

edinburgh said:


> I hope so! She seemed to calm down a little and would tolerate me standing quietly in the corner of her stall by the time I left (8 hours after she arrived) but was still skittish when I moved.


It's going to take some time and some TLC but she'll come back around. The good news is, they only had her a few months, so they didn't get to abuse her for long. All these horror stories is why I have never and won't ever consider an off site lease.


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

I think that you are a very generous and kind person. I can tell because you are not in prison. Poor baby!


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## Mulefeather (Feb 22, 2014)

So glad you have her back! Frankly, if I had to hunt them down for a 2-month update (especially when agreed upon in writing) I'd be calling them and telling them I was coming to pick the horse up since they broke their contract right out of the gate. 

I'm glad they agreed to pay the vet bill - I would make ABSOLUTELY sure that it gets paid within 30 days. 

I would not wait to get her back to practicing loading, either- as soon as she's healed up I'd be back out there working on it. Even if you just have to take baby steps in the beginning, such as getting her to stand quietly near a trailer while you groom her, or even look inside it, I think that will go a long way to helping her reclaim her confidence in both trailers and the people putting her on them. I think too long of a gap and she may decide "Nope, not me, NO WAY!" is her only answer.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

I'd wait to get the vet bill paid before doing anything else - if they do pay it then they've maybe admitted responsibility in the eyes of the law but realistically you might not get another $ out of them and could spend a lot of money for no return
I'm sure she'll get over it in time
It's sad that people think that getting rough with a horse is the way to go, if only they'd called you when they needed help loading


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## Bluediamond (Oct 7, 2015)

Wow, that poor horse. I'm glad she is back with such a good owner that will help her heal, and that the cuts aren't too deep. Those people...I don't even know what to say but I'm glad she's not with them.


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## LoriF (Apr 3, 2015)

How's your little mare doing after her ordeal?


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I would also make sure it is known around the horse world in your area that they are not to be trusted with a lease. not wanting to suggest libel, but facebook is your friend.


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## DuffyDuck (Sep 27, 2011)

I'm going to play devil's advocate here.

The wounds, as bloody and awful as they look, are superficial. They will heal in time, and they are willing to pay the vets bill.

They are all fresh, so most likely cause would be from trying to trailer her.

If you knew they were having problems loading, where you had none previous, why did you not go and pick her up?

Their other horse was in good condition. How is her overall body condition? Has she dropped a significant amount of weight? More than could be considered for stress? As in, they just didn't feed her?

Secondly, they may have been in completley over their heads, everyone has different ways of training and owning. If they couldn't get her on and had to call a "cowboy" to load her, who is to say they didn't have enough experience to deal with her (and I am not insinuating your horse is badly behaved, or the issue, but there are many people including myself who fit with certain horses and not others and become over horsed) so had outside help, which is why she's still acting stand offish.

At the end of the day, the wounds are fresh, they're paying the bill and you have your horse back.

Once she's healed up, carry on with her before and give her the routine she knows and I am sure she will settle down.

As for anything else, I would leave it. They're aware the horse was injured whilst they were caring for her, and obviously realise it's unacceptable because otherwise they wouldn't have held up their end of the contract and pay the bill.

Walk away and take it as a lesson learned. If anyone approaches you and says "Didn't this person loan your mare? What were they like, I'm looking to loan a horse to them" then tell them what happened. Do not put yourself in a battle of slander and libel.


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## edinburgh (Jul 18, 2015)

LoriF said:


> How's your little mare doing after her ordeal?


She's doing really well! The cuts are healing well and she is doing much better mentally. After about the third day she was back to her old self and is loving all the attention she is getting from everyone at the barn.


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## edinburgh (Jul 18, 2015)

DuffyDuck said:


> If you knew they were having problems loading, where you had none previous, why did you not go and pick her up?
> 
> Their other horse was in good condition. How is her overall body condition? Has she dropped a significant amount of weight? More than could be considered for stress? As in, they just didn't feed her?


I do not own a trailer so I would've had to rent one. I'm only 17 so my parents would've had to get the trailer and pick her up. I asked them to but they couldn't. When my parents say no it mean no so I didn't push it and left it at that.

Charlie dropped some weight but most of it was from muscle loss. I don't think they had any bad intentions but, like you said, were over horsed and didn't know how to handle her.


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

Saying they will pay the vet bills may be a ploy to stay out of court. Court means someone has to take time off work and may lose a day's pay. Send them a copy of the bill and send it Registered mail. Give them 7 days to respond with the money. Don't mention court. No payment by the given date, take them to court.


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

Glad the mare is doing better. Most horses are pretty forgiving. Your parents would have take them to court, and they may find it easier to just forget about it . Lesson learned the hard way.
I would make a copy of the Vet bill and ask that they send you the money. 
Her injuries look like they tried to drag her into the trailer, and that she fell a few times.


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## edinburgh (Jul 18, 2015)

*Update!*

Charlie has been back for almost 4 months now. She is doing amazingly well and is almost back to her old self. Yesterday we tried trailer loading for the first time since she's been back. This mare never had any loading problems so it was hard to believe that all the injuries were a result of her not wanting to load. I wasn't sure how she would react to loading since I was told by the girl leasing her that she was crazy and wouldn't load. Charlie walked onto the trailer on the first try with no hesitations. I was carrying a whip but didn't need to use it at all. All I did was cluck a few times and she walked right on. This is the same type of trailer that they used so I don't know why they couldn't get her to load. Below is a link to the video of her loading (first try). Thank you to everyone who gave me helpful advice.

https://youtu.be/oclBYef-JE4


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## egrogan (Jun 1, 2011)

Awww, good girl Charlie! Glad things are looking up for her. Really sorry you had to go through such a terrible situation though.


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## Sharpie (May 24, 2009)

There's a person I know that we lovingly joke "can teach any horse not to load." I don't know what it is, but it seems like they cannot get a horse on a trailer, no matter how well they load to start with. Give it a couple weeks and the horse will be refusing and having a fit. Someone else grabs the lead and can get them retrained just fine... don't know what it is, they just have the opposite of the magic touch. I am glad your mare settled back in without an issue!


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## greentree (Feb 27, 2013)

Could have been the driver, lol! DH almost missed a driveway with Tootsie in the trailer once, and she skidded a bit in the trailer. For a while, it was no problem loading her if I was driving, but if DH was, she would hesitate for a bit. I do not know exactly how she knew......

I am so glad she is doing well back at home!!!


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

What scares me is quite frankly I have "picked fights" with my own horses before and it hasn't been pretty but NO ONE has gotten hurt let alone to be covered in scrapes and blood. I would have had a stroke if I were you!! Glad they were superficial. I would be pointing blame at the "cowboy" not the leasee's. Over and done with and glad the mare is OK!!


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## WestCoasted (Jan 19, 2016)

*I'm calling the cowboy "jerkface"*

I feel so bad for your poor mare!! As others have said, I would have ended up in party at the cell block. You have cool, rational head on your shoulders. 

I think the trailer incident was just the visible side of the issue. If she lost muscle they probably weren't riding her. A responsible lessee would have called you the moment they realized they were over mounted. 

I wonder if they got this "cowboy's" help for more than just loading. I hate using the term cowboy here because most of the cowboys I know treat their horses very well. Does anybody mind if I call him jerk-face, instead? 

This vision keeps popping into my head of some jerk-face whipping her into a frenzy because she's not "behaving". Her sudden fear of people might come from being whipped repeatedly.

I have a major problem with the jerk-face who does this to an equine!!

Okay, I am genuinely angry. lol, I'm all riled up. I'm sure I'd feel better if I could just punch jerk-face with a horse shoe right in his jerk-face.

So what's good punishment for jerk-face? Not in real life of course, but if I were Batman.... Run over by a horse trailer? kick to the gut?


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## Regula (Jan 23, 2012)

Of course it is terrible what happened to you and your horse.

It sounds evil, but in a way I'm glad they were leasing and had the option of just returning the horse. If they had decided to buy a horse and had run into these troubles, it could have ended a lot worse.

I would also like to make another point. Imagine the lessee had come here, say, in the training section, and had asked the question "I am leasing this horse who knows how to load and loaded beautifully for her previous owner, but for me she refuses. What should I do?". I bet the majority of the responses would have been "The horse has your number, she needs a CTJ moment". I think everyone who gives out this advice needs to be aware that "a CTJ moment" CAN lead to something like this...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

Regula said:


> Of course it is terrible what happened to you and your horse.
> 
> It sounds evil, but in a way I'm glad they were leasing and had the option of just returning the horse. If they had decided to buy a horse and had run into these troubles, it could have ended a lot worse.
> 
> ...


My advice would have been to ask the owner for advice...


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## EliRose (Aug 12, 2012)

A CTJ moment leading to cuts everywhere, including the face? o.o


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## Sirius (Aug 12, 2013)

Edinburgh, I hesitate about giving any advice, especially legal advice from a stranger on the internet. Talk to your Dad. Go to a lawyer. Why bother? Look at the pictures again and that's why you bother.I would not correspond with these individuals again unless it's through the lawyer. Get a good professional opinion. I would do it as soon as possible. Take the pictures and the youtube video with you. Don't be daunted or intimidated or "convinced" with inane rationalizations or if you are young, thinking they can pull a fast one.


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