# Ulcer: Scope or just treat?



## Rain Shadow (May 1, 2014)

Our 10 year old QH gelding Harley has been off the last three weeks. No major problems, but added together aren't good. Our vet is suspecting ulcers, and I have the option of just treating for them, or scooping. This is a bit long, but I want all the information in the post. 

He's UTD on shots. His teeth are due in two months, but the vet checked and said they are pretty good. 

On and Off grain: He eats. 1lb of ration balance, 1/2lb of beet pulp, and 1lb of Timothy hay pellets. all measured out, and then soaked. Fed in three meals. Some days he wolfs down his food, other days he sorta picks at it. 

Weight Loss: He's lost some weight, nothing major, but enough that you can see it. He recently went back into work after some time off, so I blamed that. 

Hay intake: He's wolfing down hay. Normally he gets a slow-feeder hay net in the morning, and then another before bed. Usually he is just finish up, or has a little hay left when I switch hay nets, but lately he's running out faster, and I had to add a third hay net in the afternoon. 

Two weeks ago he coliced. He had some sand in his poop, so the emergency vet suspected sand colic. We treated for sand and he perked up and seemed fine. 


6 days ago, he was again showing signs of colic. I had the emergency vet back out, and this time it was blamed on the weather. 

This morning I went out to feed and he was down in his paddock, refusing food. Again I called the vet, and this time I finally got my usual vet. 

He came out, and instantly said ulcers. He says the symptoms all add up to ulcers. He wants to put him on a 28 day course of Ranitidine. 11 300mg pills, 3x a days and a diet change. 

2lbs of Alfalfa pellets, 1lb of ration balancer, and then 2 cups of Aloe Vera Juice a day. 

Or I can scope. Which we really can't afford (looking at having to haul to the university since my vet doesn't do it, and about 500 bucks.)

What do you guys think?


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## NBEventer (Sep 15, 2012)

That is a lot of money for a scope! I'm having a mare scoped on Friday and its around $200.

Anyway the mare I am dealing with, alfalfa pellets have made her feel worse. So I am surprised they want to add alfalfa pellets to the diet for treatment.

I would go the course of treatment but I would take diet back to bare basics. Hay and oats until the ulcers have healed. I can't remember the name of the medication that my vet said we will start the mare on that we are scoping but basically they help the body heal the ulcers over the course of 21 days. It costs roughly $10 a day. The mare we are scoping is pretty serious. She is in horrible pain, colicy 24 hours a day. Hasn't shown any signs of relief until I took her back to just oats and hay and added gastric shield to her oats. 

I would do the scope if you can. If you can't then go through the treatment. But I really question the treatment as it sounds a bit off from any i've ever heard of doing. You should see signs of relief around 6 days. If there is no relief then usually either the treatment isn't working or its not ulcers.


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## verona1016 (Jul 3, 2011)

For $500 I'd start treating and see if you notice a difference. Not sure about ranitidine, but with omeprazole (UlcerGard/GastroGard) $500 would cover half a month of treatment and you would expect to see a difference by then. IIRC there are no negative health effects to treating a horse that doesn't have ulcers.


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## Rain Shadow (May 1, 2014)

I love my vet, I do, but he's very old school and is sorta stuck in his ways. The alfalfa pellets are for the calcium, which has a tums effect on the ulcers. 

I'm leaning towards just treating. Part of the problem is my local vets don't scope, which means I'm going to have to travel, and I don't own a trailer, which means renting or hiring someone to haul him which is more money. 

Has anyone used the Omeprazole from this site? 

Ranitidine is going to be $75 dollars a bottle and he will take 4 bottles to do the full 28 days of treatment. So this is alot cheaper, not to mention easier where its once a day vs every 8 hours. 

Abler | Abprazole - Omeprazole Granules | Prevention and Treatment of Equine Gastric Ulcers | Affordable, Effective and Easy to Use Horse Medication


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## beau159 (Oct 4, 2010)

You could certainly just treat. 

If he gets better. then you know it is probably ulcers. 

If he doesn't, then you can think about scoping anyway or looking at other reasons. 

Certainly isn't going to hurt him to treat them. Besides, the only ulcers you can see with scoping are gastric ulcers (in the stomach). If he's got hindgut ulcers (in the colon) scoping can't see those anyway. But they will get better with the appropriate treatment.


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## gssw5 (Jul 30, 2013)

I would treat and see if she improves. 

My mom's horse, which is now my horse, suffered from ulcers for years, unbeknownst to her. She always thought he was colicing. 

When I took him I took him to the vet, he said most likely ulcers prescribed some green goo out of a gallon jug, wish I could remember what it was called. It had aloe, apple cider vinegar, camomile and a variety of other ingredients in it. He got 20cc twice a day for a month, it cost $80 for the jug. He also said what I was feeding him alfalfa cubes, beet pulp, and at the time I was using strategy healthy edge, was good. In addition to his coastal hay, and fresh grass. Within a few days he was feeling better, and has had no episodes in years.

Hope your horse feels better soon.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

verona1016 said:


> For $500 I'd start treating and see if you notice a difference. Not sure about ranitidine, but with omeprazole (UlcerGard/GastroGard) $500 would cover half a month of treatment and you would expect to see a difference by then. IIRC there are no negative health effects to treating a horse that doesn't have ulcers.


There is also a 5.00 rebate per tube. Some say 28 day treatment but many are saying 14 days.
There is also a fecal test from Succeed that you test manure for blood and albumin that is an inexpensive tool for diagnosis. The scope doesn't get to the hind gut/colon either. 
Arenus also has some products for hind gut and stuff to help stomache while giving ulcer med. ulcer med is not totally safe as it reduces the acid which horses need to digest food.


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

I would just treat. Even if you scope, you won't know for sure. Ulcers can easily be missed on a scope.


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## Rain Shadow (May 1, 2014)

Thanks guys! I'm going to treat for sure. 

What is your preferred method for preventing ulcers? I honestly can't figure out how he got them. He doesn't show, he's just a trail horse, no diet changes, no new horses, no trailer rides, nothing stressful. He only eats 1lb of grain a day! Not exactly a lot. 

He has had maybe 3 grams of bute in the last 6 months and that was for his arthritis. 

The only thing I can think of is he's now on join meds


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## SarahStorms (Sep 8, 2014)

I am dealing with the same thing right now. My vet and I decided to treat and see if there was any changes and if not we could look at other options like having her scoped. 

From some of the reading i've done, bute and changes in supplements can cause ulcers... But 3 grams in 6 months shouldnt cause that, I wouldnt think!! 

maybe look into the joint supplement? 

Hope he starts feeling better


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## NBEventer (Sep 15, 2012)

What joint med is he on? Some of them can act as an NSAID. Which can be hard on the gut.

Something as simple as weather change can cause ulcers.

In the case of the mare im scoping on Friday, she just came off the track just over a month ago, did a 21 hour trailer ride to come here, went from living in a stall at the track full time and racing weekly to living outside in a herd 24/7... take your pick at what has caused the ulcers lol


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

Omeprazole is fast acting so you should start to see some improvement fairly quickly - obviously finish the course if you do. If no change then you could re-think the scope as it might show up some other problem.
Scoping isn't without risks so I wouldn't do it unless I had too
When I have horses that are stressed for some reason or on NSAID's I add U-Gard to their feeds for a while (or as long as they're on the meds) - always seems to work well
Another thing to consider is encysted worms - they will cause colic, ulcers, weight loss, anemia, digestive upsets and erratic eating habits. Not all wormers will remove them and they don't show up on fecal egg counts


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## Rain Shadow (May 1, 2014)

He's on Dumor Joint. He has mild fetlock arthritis just enough he's uncomfortable during the cold or if he's worked hard. 

DuMORÂ® Joint, 8 lb. - Tractor Supply Co.

If this one isn't good for horses with ulcers, what one should I use? 

He hasn't been wormed recently. I do egg counts and he was fine as of this spring. He's due for another in about a month I believe. I do them every 6 months.

For the encysted worms, what wormer would I use?


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

Nothing in that supplement that should cause ulcers or aggravate them - its not a pain medication
Re. the worming - You should probably discuss that with your vet. Moxidectin is the active considered to be most effective which would make Equest the 'go to wormer' There are some scare stories out there but I've used it frequently with no troubles - I think the problems come when people don't read the label and get the dose wrong
A 5 day treatment with Panacur Power Pack (Fenbendazole) is the other option
Panacur PowerPac Paste Horse Wormer Merck (Wormers - Paste Wormer - Equine - Benzimidazole Horse Wo


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