# possible second horse...



## FeatheredFeet (Jan 27, 2010)

Certainly a pretty girl. Looks as though she might be over at the knee. Don't like those long, sloping pasterns. I think she's probably sickle-hocked and might be a bit cow-hocked too. Difficult to tell from the pics. She toes out in the rear. While she doesn't look thin, in the second pic, it appears that her flesh might have fallen away from the backbone, such as we often see in starved horses. Could be just the light or her markings in the pic though. She has a significant dip in front of the wither. She looks older than 5 to me or maybe just out of condition.

Lizzie


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## FeatheredFeet (Jan 27, 2010)

Are both her elbows rubbed clean of fur?

Lizzie


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

Hmm, I can kind of see what you're asking but not at the same time... so I'm really not sure (fur thing). I wish they'd sent pictures of her hind, but unfortunately these are all I've got. If I go to see her I'll definitely take a look at her hinds to see what's up with her hocks. Sickle hock / cow hock are some of the few confo faults I feel confident in judging.

They say she is registered, so they must be right about her age. But she does look VERY under conditioned. She hasn't been started under saddle, I asked if she's lunged much but they haven't gotten back to me yet. 

They say they've only had her for a month or so... so I'm wondering how much they'll be able to answer. Sends up a couple red flags, but it also could be perfect legitimate (say they took her off the hands of a friend who couldn't keep her but don't have time for her themselves).


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## greentree (Feb 27, 2013)

She looks quite short to me. Not exactly hunter material. She is very cute, but looks hard to wake up, yet the girl has the chain over her nose. 

I don't know what horses are going for up there, but down here, $800.00 max.

Nancy


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

honestly, she does not look like a hunter prospect. not saying she couldnt ever do it, but shes not really suited to it, especially if you want to be competitive at shows. you could probably find a decent hunter prospect for just as cheap as this horse probably is. those long sloping pasterns would worry me for jumping.


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## TheLastUnicorn (Jun 11, 2010)

I don't see a hunter prospect here. 

Her LS placement appears to be too far back, her general hindquarter construction just doesn't tell me she has a ton of power back there. 

Even though her croup and wither are close to level, she is downhill built (which is just something you don't really want in a hunter or jumper of any sort)... It could be forgiven a bit IF her hindquarter compensated, but it doesn't. 

In the first photo it looks to me like she might be back at the knee. Another trait you just don't want for a jumper as it increases the chances of early arthritis. The second she is standing under herself, so it is hard to tell for sure. 

She appears to be a large pony (not that there is anything wrong with that... I have a fabulous large pony hunter...But if you are looking for a horse, she seems... Small) 

She is cute and colored, but for a jumping prospect, I think you can find better.


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## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

NOT hunter material. Why is a 5yo mare not started under saddle? That's a red flag for me.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

Corporal, I dont mind that she isn't started under saddle. Many breeders here like to wait. 

Your average young prospect here doesn't go for less than $1500 unless it's fresh off the track, most other breeds closer to twice that. And the seller got back to me saying the girl in the photo is 5'8.

I'll reply to other comments when I am not on my phone.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TheLastUnicorn (Jun 11, 2010)

At 5 many of mine are just starting undersaddle. Frankly, I no longer believe in starting horses under that age... I used to do it, because everyone did... As years go by I have realized that if I wait until around 5 the horses are just plain more physically capable and mentally ready, training progresses faster for me and is happier all around.

Personally, I won't buy a horse under 5 who is "well broke". Different strokes for different folks. 

AlexisChristina... I am 5'8... I still say this mare looks under 15hh. It might be an illusion, but this mare looks roughly the same height against her owner as my large ponies look against me. Again, absolutely nothing wrong with a pony... Good ponies are great mounts, even for adults (even at my height, I am totally at home on a big bodied 14-14.2hh pony) 

Honestly... I don't think I'd pay $1500 for this mare. Probably not more than $800, to be totally truthful, and that totally dependant on her having a sweet, quiet nature.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I do not see sickle hocks at all. If you stand her up square, her rear canon will be vertical when in line with the back point of buttock. 

Neither do I see over at the knee. Her legs look clean to me.
her pasterns are a bit on the long side, perhaps. I think she'd be really cute western pleasure or as a trail horse.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

Oh no, I should have been more clear sorry! She's asking 900 for her, most prospects around here sell for more (so there is lots of interest in this little mare). They said she is coming five in March and seem adamant that she's 15.3 haha so I guess that will be a 'wait and see'. I don't have a problem with ponies, I'm only 5 feet and will be buying as a resale.

Pony club is huge here, lots of room for cute, smaller horses that can show at the lower level (we have a very busy local circuit). 

By no means am I looking to snag an upper level competition horse for that price, just something for the pony club lower levels. Her demeanor sounds perfect for that.

(Again, I'll respond to the critique comments when I am on my computer and can see the pictures properly, but thank you all for the comments).
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TheLastUnicorn (Jun 11, 2010)

If she sticks 15.3, I'll eat horse poop LOL (unless that girl is a lot taller than 5'8") ... She looks closer to 14.3 (if we're going high estimate) 

This mare sticked 14.3 and a smidge, set up properly on level ground with a level stick. That's me next to her. Sorry I don't have one where I'm standing better as a better reference, I'm leaning a bit here which makes it harder to tell









She's walking with another 5'8" person here...


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

Greentree, I'm not going to try to gauge if she's 'hard to wake up' from the photos of her standing. I know Jackson looks like he's half dead in some of the photos we have of him standing ringside, and they did send another picture just of her face and she looks quite bright / expressive.

Gypsy what do you mean by 'not a hunter prospect'? Bearing in mind that in no way am I expecting to take her to rated shows. I'm looking for something pony club / local / kiddie level. I know her colour works against her (which is where being a pony would help :wink: our pony divisions are full of cute coloured hunters that clean up, even in rated divisions I find that most of the judges here tend to be more open minded). 

Now I'm tempted to go see her just to see what she sticks at :lol: unless there's a serious slope to the ground I'm also not seeing 15.3 but hey, you never know, could be a giant in disguise :wink: 

Overall I agree with Tiny in that, aside from her pasterns, I'm not hating her legs. To my untrained eye the only serious 'fault' I saw was her pasterns and maybe being built a little downhill. 

All that said, I think I'm going to let the add sit for awhile. I have a feeling someone is going to snatch her up pretty quick with the market the way it is (it's rare to see a decent horse in the triple digits) but if I was to go to look at her I'd probably offer $700 cash and pick her up right away.


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

she just isnt type-y for it and i cant see her making it down the lines, for example. you never know. she looks like [just from these pictures i obviously havent seen movement and dont know temperment] she could be a good pony club type, but that is totally different than a hunter prospect, except maybe at small schooling shows. that doesnt mean dont get her, but if you are going to get her, dont get her because she is a hunter prospect. [im not trying to be rude btw, just my opinion]

i also would put her at about 14.3hh based on the photos.

as a side note, i have NEVER seen color discrimination in hunters. i think that is a lot of peoples excuse for why they dont win even though they missed their strides, leads, changes, distances, etc...


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

I have to agree with you Gypsy, I was told to sell my previous horse because he would never ever ever be competitive... BEFORE the lady (a so-called 'expert') had even seen a picture of him. She heard 'red roan Appaloosa' and said 'get him out of here' lol. 

I've only ever seen 'discrimination' in the club-run shows here, where the 'judge' is a member and all the club kids place before any outsiders.


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## TheLastUnicorn (Jun 11, 2010)

I had a fabulous jumper who was also a red roan Appy... I think he wound up in a hunter/jumper barn's lesson string. (Actually, most Appies I know have been tidy jumpers) 

I'm not judging this mare on her color at all... It is how she's built. 

A really good jumper will usually be built at least level, if not uphill, their LS placement will be even with their hip or ahead of it, and they also usually have a bit more leg than this mare offers, from these photos I think she might have to really stretch to hit strides (not always though, especially if she is actually pony sized) the neckset will often be a bit higher (again, not always). 

With that said though, most horses are capable of doing some pony club, I have seen some real trainwrecks doing their best to pack their kids around, they don't often do WELL... I'm not sure where you are in BC, but I am also in the province and I know there are some here that would be more likely candidates, and most you can talk owners down right now, in my own opinion of course. 

My very first horse was a 14.3hh Appy mare, albeit one who was very different in conformation to this mare, who was able to extend enough to make her lines without coming too far on the forehand to clear her front end. I must say, my job was easier when we were allowed to use pony lines though (which was done in our lessons more often than not). We bumped along alright, but in hunters we never ribboned. (Jumper classes were a bit different and we did somewhat better) 

So it isn't impossible, but then again... Why settle for a horse who doesn't quite meet your desire when the market will allow you to find something better suited for roughly the same money if you aren't in a real hurry? 

I'm also not saying don't buy this mare... Just saying, I don't see the prospect your OP seemed to indicate you were looking for.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

Out of curiosity, where are you looking? I'm located in the Fraser Valley, and while I see LOTS of great prospects, I'm not interested in TB's and that seems to be what is 'hot on the market' right now. There was an amazing looking jumper, beautifully built, tall, trained, sitting at $400 for ages because nobody is buying them. It's a shame, really.

I know when you get out of my area you can find some excellent prospects, but the distance is a pain.

(Although I'm not actively looking, just seeing what falls in my lap).

I do see what you mean about her build, and I did make it seem like hunters was my main interest but it really isn't. I did hunters successfully for a little while and while it's nice to have a horse able to DO hunters, it certainly isn't my biggest focus.


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## TheLastUnicorn (Jun 11, 2010)

I am on Vancouver Island, but I routinely check out the rest of the province... And AB too (I think it's a sickness of sorts.... LOL) 

I know of at least one 13hh Welsh pony available and the owner has mentioned taking offers. I looked at them for my kids (who really are leadline age), but she had a bunch all either very green or unstarted ponies (ranging 12.2 -13.2 hands), but she was reasonable about her asking prices for them. In the end I went with a pony with more training, but all her Welshes were nice looking. 

I have also stumbled across a few off and on of a variety of breeds in horse heights that had me reminding myself I do NOT need another horse!


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

I just sold a Shetland to the island :lol: 
I would love to eventually take on small pony prospects, THAT is where the money is. I'd like to lose a couple more pounds first though.

Is she a breeder and is she on the island? I haven't seen any small ponies up for sale but I must just not be looking in the right places...

and believe me it IS a sickness. I've been known to look as far as Montana :lol: I keep saying to myself 'gee, with these American prices it'd be worth it to load up a stock trailer and bring a whole bunch home'


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## TheLastUnicorn (Jun 11, 2010)

Yes she is a breeder (and looks like she is downsizing)... I found ads on craigslist... I know small and medium ponies are a good market that's why I mentioned it.

Here is one of the ads... She has a few, I believe her stable name is Mariposa Ponies

Are your youngsters looking for a Welsh Pony? - Nanaimo Livestock For Sale - Kijiji Nanaimo


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