# To spur or not to spur!!



## tecara (Nov 28, 2011)

Hello,

I am asking this out of curiousty only and do not want to begin an arguement by no means. Do you believe in spurs for a horse?? If so why, and what kind? If not why and what tricks do you use on those really hard to get moving guys???


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## Ink (Sep 25, 2009)

Spurs can be a useful tool, but should only be used by riders who have a stable enough leg to engage them only when necessary.


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## Iseul (Mar 8, 2010)

I just recently started using spurs. I use them as my "last resort force" with Lucky, because since she's been ridden by her new owner (and I plan to stop leasing her as soon as I find another horse) she doesn't want to listen to leg aids. I use my leg, leg a bit more forcefully, and then I engage the spurs as my last resort. I'm finally confident enough in my leg stability (I was suggested to start using them for refinement, but I wasn't confident enough that I wouldn't accidently jab the horses' sides) that I figured I'd start to use them. I bought a pair of slip on rowels at fair last year for trying out a horse I was looking at to buy because she was ridden in spurs, but I ended up hanging them on the rail and only using heels for reinforcement because she listened perfectly fine without them. They've been sitting in my grooming tote since up until two weeks ago.
Lucky listens absolutely perfect when I'm using them. I cue her with leg, she doesn't listen, I brush her winter fuzzies with the spur and she listens right away, I don't even have to touch her sides with them. She needs absolutely no encouragement to go, as she's very forward. Not that I would use them for forward motion though, that's what whips and crops are for, IMO.

I use 6-point rounded rowels, since that's just what I have, but if I just so happen to be offered a free pair of the little round-tipped "starter" spurs, I wouldn't have any "ego-issues" using them instead. I know a few people that I show with that use sharpened rowels on their game horses because the horses don't want to run or listen (because half of them are made crazy), and I cringe. At fair last year I know a little boy (about 12-14?) who bloodied his mares sides (she loved running and she had no issue running her fastest without encouragement) because his mother decided he should use spurs. That little mare ran her heart out and placed every show in barrels, she didnt deserve a boy who didn't know how to use spurs to be kicking the h*ll out of her sides. My point in that story being, even though riders who know how to use them have to really work to bloody a horse's sides, a rider who has no clue how to use them can do it easily. But, that's just my personal opinion.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

I saw a Julie Goodnight special where she used a bat (crop) when the horse wouldn't move off leg she quickly and sharply swatted him in the barrel. Not on the rump. If on the rump they might buck or kick. This method was very effective and the horse learned quickly to move off when lightly asked.


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## Sophie19 (Apr 13, 2009)

I am a minimalist. I like to use the least amount of equipment possible. But I am not against spurs as a training aid.


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## countercanter (May 18, 2011)

Spurs are an extension of your leg. They allow your aids to be more precise and clear. My horse gets ridden in spurs if we are having a real ride and not just going out for a hack. Spurs should only be used by someone that is advanced enough to know when to turn their spur "on" and "off." Spurs are never to be used as a weapon or punishment, simply for making your requests to your horse more clear and to get a more immediate response.


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

churumbeque said:


> I saw a Julie Goodnight special where she used a bat (crop) when the horse wouldn't move off leg she quickly and sharply swatted him in the barrel. Not on the rump. If on the rump they might buck or kick. This method was very effective and the horse learned quickly to move off when lightly asked.


I've been taught that the whip or crop is there to reinforce leg requests and therefore it is to be applied in the same location where your leg is making the request.

Since I can't reach a horse's rump with my leg, I don't apply the stick there. I apply it to the barrel right by my leg and I do it along with the leg aid if my leg alone is being ignored.


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

Im not coordinated enough to hang on, pull on reins and use a crop. So spurs it is, I have a spooky horse that likes to do the quick spin on occasion, or sees something screwy and decides he wont go, Spurs work like a charm, but its 1,2,3, like every other tool.
Verbal, squeeze and kick, then roll the feet in a bit. I also used them on a clover sour horse. Yeh I just invented that term, sorta like barn sour, but clover sour, when riding if you came to a clover patch the head went down and he refused it move and it was a battle to get his head up, A harsher bit may have helped but I was a real beginner rider and he was really soft mouthed to the point he knew verbal commands, Left and right. Unless there was a clover patch. Spurs worked well.


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## rob (Aug 8, 2011)

i don't climb on a horse without my rockgrinders.i train full time,so they never leave my boots.but like it was stated before,i use them as a training devise.and to get a hard horse to move,first i squeeze.if no response,then i turn my toe out and rake up a ribcage.


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## Fort fireman (Mar 5, 2011)

The only time I don't wear spurs is with a young horse new to a saddle. Once they have about 10 or so rides Ill start wearing them. Just because I wear them however does not mean I use them. I just have them as a reinforcement tool. I very rarely use them for forward motion. Usually use them to get a horse to move more laterally or to bend the ribcage.


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

Fort fireman said:


> Usually use them to get a horse to move more laterally or to bend the ribcage.


That's exactly what they are for in dressage.

And I'll be honest, when my mare has a problem counterbending around corners, rather than forcing the issue with spurs I just ride her harder into connection. Once she's giving me her back, her sides tend to soften a lot.

But she's not green by any stretch of the imagination, so you are probably dealing with a whole different problem.


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## tecara (Nov 28, 2011)

I had never used spurs but while working with the person I bought my Percheron from she had me try them because he would not trot no matter how hard you tried. The spurs would get him into a trot with minimal use. I have not used them sense I brought him home but then again have only worked in the pen with him at a walk and doing lots of ground work, but with spring around the corner plan on getting back out on the trails with him and thinking I may wear them more just in case. I do feel they are a good training tool if used properly. I do fear being new with using them that I may get too heavy footed.


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## GotaDunQH (Feb 13, 2011)

tecara said:


> I had never used spurs but while working with the person* I bought my Percheron from she had me try them because he would not trot no matter how hard you tried. The spurs would get him into a trot with minimal use. *I have not used them sense I brought him home but then again have only worked in the pen with him at a walk and doing lots of ground work, but with spring around the corner plan on getting back out on the trails with him and thinking I may wear them more just in case. I do feel they are a good training tool if used properly. I do fear being new with using them that I may get too heavy footed.


Suggestion...nix the spurs and use a dressage whip at your leg as Mildot said. I use spurs every time I ride, but I use my LEG to get forward from my horse...NOT spurs.


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## kittyd7015 (Feb 20, 2012)

tecara said:


> Hello,
> 
> I am asking this out of curiousty only and do not want to begin an arguement by no means. Do you believe in spurs for a horse?? If so why, and what kind? If not why and what tricks do you use on those really hard to get moving guys???


I hate spurs


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## MHFoundation Quarters (Feb 23, 2011)

As others have said, spurs are for refinement of cues. I always have spurs on my boots but that doesn't mean they are always in use. They are a tool like any other, when used correctly they are a fantastic tool. In the wrong hands or on the wrong legs rather, than can be a huge detriment to training.


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

kittyd7015 said:


> I hate spurs


Oh good grief.........:-?


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## kittyd7015 (Feb 20, 2012)

mildot said:


> Oh good grief.........:-?


Sorry


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## Iseul (Mar 8, 2010)

kittyd7015 said:


> I hate spurs


Why do you hate them?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kittyd7015 (Feb 20, 2012)

Iseul said:


> Why do you hate them?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I just hate the thought of wearing them. But I don't judge others for wearing them. Luckily I've never needed to.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

I don't use spurs. If you saw me ride, you would know why.

Riding ability aside, the only horse I've got who might be OK with spurs is the little mustang. My gelding was spurred quite viciously before coming to us, and still has a large scar on one side where the hole healed, but the hair hasn't fully grown back. (The hole on the other side healed better). With him, I normally just make a kissing sound to go faster. For a walk to canter, kissing plus a squeeze with the calves. The key to getting Trooper to respond is to be as light as possible with the leg. Turns use very light pressure with the calf. I don't think my heel has touched his side for over a year.

My mare MIGHT someday be able to respond to spurs, but I can't really imagine her needing them. When she isn't scared, she is intensely focused on her rider and communication isn't a problem. When she is scared, she is scared. Not disobedient, but scared and not thinking well. When scared, she needs reassurance and a chance to unwind a bit. Her fears are totally real to her. I've just spent 3 months working with a trainer to help her handle her fears in an acceptable way. Using spurs, a crop, or even kicking hard to 'force' her when afraid could undo 3 months of training in 5 minutes. And for her, there are only two settings. Not scared = focused on rider, very sensitive. Scared = trust her rider to care for her, or meltdown.

If I was a better rider, the mustang could probably benefit from spurs. He's level-headed, but stubborn. Right now, he doesn't believe in subtle cues. However, I haven't had him long, and have been busy with the other two horses. I think I can train him to be more responsive.

I think a lot depends on how much you expect out of your horses. For the riding I do, I don't need a ton of cues. Left/right. Move laterally. Chill. Accelerate. Ease off. Stop. Accelerate a lot. That pretty much covers what I need my horses to know. That level of riding doesn't need a lot of refinement. I'd eventually like to teach the mare low jumps (1-2 feet), but none of them are built well for jumping, and my bones are getting a bit old for falling.

So for me, spurs may never make much sense. For others, spurs can be awesome.


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

kittyd7015 said:


> I just hate the thought of wearing them. But I don't judge others for wearing them. Luckily I've never needed to.


So you don't even know how to use them but you hate them.

Gotcha.


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## kittyd7015 (Feb 20, 2012)

mildot said:


> So you don't even know how to use them but you hate them.
> 
> Gotcha.


Just hate the thought that's all. don't hate them or people that use them


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## GotaDunQH (Feb 13, 2011)

kittyd7015 said:


> Just hate the thought that's all. don't hate them or people that use them


I don't understand why you hate the thought; when used correctly there is no harm. I've seen more harm from bits than spurs.


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## xJumperx (Feb 19, 2012)

I am for spurs.
I hate crops, really - they look sloppy unless you are a pro at carrying them, they don't work on the shoulder, which is the only place you can reach without grabbing both reins with one hand, and when you do use one hand, you can end up dorpping a rein and then you have a fast horse and no breaks. So yea, I hate them  I do wear spurs on the lesson horses I ride. They are spur-rode, totally broke to them. I don't use them with my Arab, because she would have a fit with them. So really I think it depends on the horse and the rider. The horse has to have a calm enough mind to handle it, and the rider has to have a calm enough leg.
I have been riding for 8+ yrs and I only just started with spurs last year. I just wasn't confident enough with my leg. But now that I know how to control my legs easily, spurs became good for me. I don't think spurs are cruel in any way - I think that -some- people that use them are cruel (ex, the 12 yr old boy Isuel mentioned.)


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## jumanji321 (Dec 1, 2010)

xJumperx said:


> I am for spurs.
> I hate crops, really - they look sloppy unless you are a pro at carrying them, they don't work on the shoulder, which is the only place you can reach without grabbing both reins with one hand, and when you do use one hand, you can end up dorpping a rein and then you have a fast horse and no breaks.


IMO If you aren't coordinated enough to put both reins in one hand to use a crop, you shouldn't use one.


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

kittyd7015 said:


> Just hate the thought that's all.


You have no earthly idea what spurs, when correctly used, do to a horse. But you hate the thought of what they do.

Do you use crops?

Do you use whips?

Do you use bits? If so, what kind of bit?

Do you use a saddle? If so, how heavy is it?

All of those things, including the saddle, are cruel when used or fitted incorrectly.

Can you see where this is going? Can you see how hard it is to take you seriously on this topic?


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## tecara (Nov 28, 2011)

I am meeting with a new trainer tomorrow and am going to ask her opinion on them. I can definitely see that they can be an awesome training tool especially when dealing with a less sensitive horse. I can see also having them on for those "just in case" moments. The last person I was working with said I took to them well and she wasn't afraid of me over using them. I would like to continue to learn more about using them properly and effectively. Not everyone can ride with reins in one hand not because of lack of coordination but because of how their horse is trained. Mac does not neck rein at all and many have said that most drafts don't because of the muscle density they don't feel the light cue of the reins... I'm not 100% convinced of that though, but I know right now he doesn't.


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## countercanter (May 18, 2011)

Just because you hold the reins in one hand to apply the crop doesn't mean you neck rein. It should be a split second thing.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

tecara said:


> Not everyone can ride with reins in one hand not because of lack of coordination but because of how their horse is trained.


A) A dressage whip does not require you to place both reins in one hand to be used correctly. In fact, when carried correctly just a flick of the wrist is all it takes to apply it.

B) A crop does need you to place both reins in one hand while you use it, but as soon as you apply the crop you bring that hand back up and take the rein in it. You don't ride with both reins in one hand all the time.


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

Please don't use spurs until your legs are rock solid and you are 100% sure, as observed by someone on the ground, that you never accidentally spur your horse because your leg flops around.


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## xJumperx (Feb 19, 2012)

jumanji321 said:


> IMO If you aren't coordinated enough to put both reins in one hand to use a crop, you shouldn't use one.


 I never said I use one, now did I? And to add another thing to my list of dislikes about crops, it looks kinda funky in a show. Grab the reins with two hands and pop your horse ... just looks wierd... So really I don't just mean about coordination - though I was implying that with the whole rein drop thing, I also mean that grabbing the reins just looks odd to me...


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

tecara said:


> Mac does not neck rein at all and many have said that most drafts don't *because of the muscle density they don't feel the light cue of the reins..*..


That's nonsense. Ignore whoever told you that. The nerve endings on the skin do not change regardless of the underlying musculature.


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## karebear444 (Feb 3, 2012)

I've never used spurs on my horse, although I don't think they are cruel if you use them responsibly.


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

if you are not co-ordinated enough to put your reins in one hand and use a crop you should practice ! all it takes is muscle memory. 

i am not 100% against spurs, but i do think they are way over used and used by people who should not use them. imo spurs are NOT for forward. or for dull/lazy horses. they are only for refining the aids. if you dont have a great leg, it is easy to accidentally spur your horse. you cant accidentally beat your horse with a crop !


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## Iseul (Mar 8, 2010)

gypsygirl said:


> you cant accidentally beat your horse with a crop !


I disagree.. >.>
I accidently smacked Lucky on the neck/shoulder quite a few times after deciding I was going to attempt to ride with a crop and try to use it..Didn't work very well, lol.
Albeit she wasn't "beaten" by it..but still.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## countercanter (May 18, 2011)

Then you weren't riding with it correctly.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Iseul (Mar 8, 2010)

countercanter said:


> Then you weren't riding with it correctly.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Exactly. Which is why I don't use it in the saddle anymore. My point was, you sure can accidentally "beat" your horse with it if you don't know how to use it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

its hard for me to believe you were actually smacking your horse with it ! tapping maybe.


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

Iseul said:


> I disagree.. >.>
> I accidently smacked Lucky on the neck/shoulder quite a few times after deciding I was going to attempt to ride with a crop and try to use it..
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Unless your hands are flopping all over the place, I don't see how that can happen.

I ride with a 120 cm long dressage whip every single time. When held naturally, it is impossible to accidentally touch the horse with it.


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## Sphi (Apr 8, 2010)

What's important is if you're going to wear spurs, make sure you always "ask nicely" with just your leg first, then add spur if they don't respond. That way, they always get a chance to respond to leg before they get the spur.


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## st0rmys3as (Feb 27, 2012)

Sure do.

I had a horse who had no respect whatsoever for leg aids and would try things on whenever she could. I could have sat there all day politely asking her to move and she never would have. Hell, I could have sat there all day kicking her until my legs were bruised and bloody and she never would have moved. How is that good? How does that teach a horse to respect leg aids (and you)? All it teaches is they can get away with not doing what is being asked of them.

I eventually bought a pair of spurs and they were a godsend. When I lightly applied the spurs to her she responded in the same way she would to me politely asking her to move, ignoring me completely. I jabbed her with the spurs once, so she knew they had the power to be less than pleasant and that was the last issue I ever had with her ignoring my legs. I tended to wear the spurs whenever I rode however I never jabbed her again, the most I ever did was lightly rest them on her sides if she was beginning to be a pig, so she knew they were there. I lost one of my spurs one day so had to ride without, I was really nervous it would be a terrible ride considering what she had been like pre spurs but she was good as gold with my leg aids, same as she was when I was wearing the spurs. For me they were more like a threat, one that she knew I was more than happy to follow through with.

I highly disagree with riders with unsteady legs using spurs, the whole idea of spurs isn't going to work if you're constantly jabbing the horse in the sides for no reason and could set up way bigger problems than a horse not responding to leg aids. I also think the reason as to why a horse isn't responding to leg aids should be examined and this is something I regret not having done with my horse. Spurs cured her being unresponsive to my leg and didn't set up any issues, but the reason she had no respect for my leg was because she had no respect for me, something she'd never learned. I eventually addressed the root of the problem and all was fine, but if a horse is being unresponsive to the leg you need to look at the bigger picture too rather than just jumping straight into spurs which can act as a bit of a bandaid to respect issues. I haven't had much experience using spurs to refine aids but I believe they are a great help there too, and if possible this is what spurs should be saved for.

The idea of using a crop in the same way as spurs is interesting and could definitely be just as effective as spurs, and I think for riders who have less than steady legs it would be a better option than using spurs as you can control the position of your crop whatever level rider you are (provided you are focusing on what you are doing, and if you can't focus on riding properly and where you are holding your crop, I would question why you are on a horse that requires the use of a crop) and the majority of horses are responsive to crops. My horse wasn't, she hated all whips other than a lunge whip as she'd had bad experiences in the past with whips. She never really got over that, she could tolerate whips but they weren't ever going to be able to be used in the same way as spurs were.

So all in all... I believe spurs definitely have a time and place but shouldn't be a riding staple for all and sundry.


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## trailhorserider (Oct 13, 2009)

I hardly ever ride in spurs although I do own a pair. I have no problem with people using spurs. A couple of my friends just keep them attached to their boots and ride in them all the time. 

The reason I don't is that I ride in tennis shoes. :shock: My prince-of-wales spurs fit on my tennis shoes but I don't want to be walking around the grocery store with spurs on my tennis shoes. So unless I need them I leave them off. :lol:

I do agree you need a steady leg before you wear spurs. If not they could get you in trouble. I actually considered them a liability when I was younger because I didn't have the balance. Now that I do, they don't touch the horse unless I want them to. So I could ride in them all the time if I wasn't lazy and riding in tennis shoes.


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## ilovemymorgan (Feb 28, 2012)

Spurs are just a cheat for not having your horse respect you enough to listen or a cheat to the lack of time some people don't give to their horses. if you do all of the ground work, perpare your horse, let them know you are high horse and understand when and how to reward your horse then their is no need for them. 
this is just my opinion  if you watch some of rick gore's videos on youtube then you will start to see what i mean... that guy knows horses!


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## GotaDunQH (Feb 13, 2011)

ilovemymorgan said:


> Spurs are just a cheat for not having your horse respect you enough to listen or a cheat to the lack of time some people don't give to their horses. if you do all of the ground work, perpare your horse, let them know you are high horse and understand when and how to reward your horse then their is no need for them.
> this is just my opinion  if you watch some of rick gore's videos on youtube then you will start to see what i mean... that guy knows horses!


And you are entitled to your opinion, but based on your post...you really don't understand what spurs are for in the first place.


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

ilovemymorgan said:


> Spurs are just a cheat for not having your horse respect you enough to listen or a cheat to the lack of time some people don't give to their horses. if you do all of the ground work, perpare your horse, let them know you are high horse and understand when and how to reward your horse then their is no need for them.
> this is just my opinion  if you watch some of rick gore's videos on youtube then you will start to see what i mean... that guy knows horses!


LOL :lol:......Rick Gore......LOL :lol:


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## MHFoundation Quarters (Feb 23, 2011)

ilovemymorgan said:


> Spurs are just a cheat for not having your horse respect you enough to listen or a cheat to the lack of time some people don't give to their horses. if you do all of the ground work, perpare your horse, let them know you are high horse and understand when and how to reward your horse then their is no need for them.
> this is just my opinion  if you watch some of rick gore's videos on youtube then you will start to see what i mean... that guy knows horses!


I respectfully disagree. All the ground work in the world will not put the finesse on a show horse under saddle. That has nothing to do with respect. Spurs are not meant for horses without respect, they are for refinement of already existing cues. Spurs allow for spins, sliding stops, flying lead changes, etc. with minimal rider interference. I can ride several of mine without a thing on them and put them anywhere I'd like at any speed I like and execute advanced maneuvers. That comes from fine tuning and precision training that involved using spurs.


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## busysmurf (Feb 16, 2012)

ilovemymorgan said:


> Spurs are just a cheat for not having your horse respect you enough to listen or a cheat to the lack of time some people don't give to their horses. if you do all of the ground work, perpare your horse, let them know you are high horse and understand when and how to reward your horse then their is no need for them.
> this is just my opinion  if you watch some of rick gore's videos on youtube then you will start to see what i mean... that guy knows horses!


I'm going to have to say I STRONGLY disagree. Spurs are an attachment to your leg, same as a crop as long as you use them properly. 

May I ask, do you use a lead rope when walking your horse? If you do, then based on your above statement you are cheating for not having your horse respect you enough to follow your body language. I know that my horses follow my body language and stop when I stop, move away from my body when I walk towards them, follow my body when I move away from them, etc. But I still will NEVER walk my horses w/o a lead rope. That lead rope is an extension of me, it's there if I need it.

I don't know who this Rick Gore guy is, but there's a lot of ppl who are more well known, more proven, and I'm guessing more respected that also know horses....and they use spurs/crops if needed.


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## Prinella (Jul 12, 2011)

My only issue with spurs is when they are used by a) jackasses b) people that do not have the leg control. In my eyes you must be able to cope with a horse taking off without a thought of grabbing with the legs before they are thought of. I have seen too many times the horse takes off people grab with legs in my mind spurs would cause carnage. 

I did ride with them when I was younger on school horses and my own mare. These horses had little respect for leg so by adding a short blunt spur ( about 1 cm) it corrected this.

Like everything else as long as used correctly they are a wonderful tool.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## busysmurf (Feb 16, 2012)

I ONLY ride in knob ended spurs. Funny thing with me is my legs are so long that even on my 16.2hh horse I have to heel up and back to reach looks kinda bad so even though I always have them on, I hardly use them. It's just way to much effort to move my legs that way, LOL


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## rob (Aug 8, 2011)

babysmurf,i assume you ride english.have you tried raising your stirrups a little and keeping your heels down?


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## busysmurf (Feb 16, 2012)

rob said:


> babysmurf,i assume you ride english.have you tried raising your stirrups a little and keeping your heels down?


I officially ride both, but I try and avoid riding english if I can (just can't get into it)

For my english saddle I have the leathers one hole past "correct" length, which still doesn't work well for me. (My knees are shot, and will cramp up if I have them at the "correct length") But like a good horsey person, I suck it up, LOL

I have a 38" inseam, so my legs are kind of on the long end of the spectrum. And not to sound self-promoting, but keeping my heels down is actually one of the things that I do really well. At the correct length, if you are level and looking at me, my heels are even with the bottom of the barrel (haha, that sounds funny:lol anyway, to make contact I have to bring my leg back and heels slightly up otherwise my feet are at a really sharp angle, which stinks with field boots on. I use longer spurs (@ 2") which are curved in and has helped close that gap.


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## rob (Aug 8, 2011)

babysmurf,i understand.i ride cutter's and i suffer with the pain so i can turn my toes east and west and my stirrups are up so i can squeeze and get into a horses ribcage.


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## jumanji321 (Dec 1, 2010)

busysmurf said:


> I officially ride both, but I try and avoid riding english if I can (just can't get into it)
> 
> For my english saddle I have the leathers one hole past "correct" length, which still doesn't work well for me. (My knees are shot, and will cramp up if I have them at the "correct length") But like a good horsey person, I suck it up, LOL
> 
> I have a 38" inseam, so my legs are kind of on the long end of the spectrum. And not to sound self-promoting, but keeping my heels down is actually one of the things that I do really well. At the correct length, if you are level and looking at me, my heels are even with the bottom of the barrel (haha, that sounds funny:lol anyway, to make contact I have to bring my leg back and heels slightly up otherwise my feet are at a really sharp angle, which stinks with field boots on. I use longer spurs (@ 2") which are curved in and has helped close that gap.


 
Maybe try swan neck spurs, they are made for long-legged riders and won't require you to rotate your ankle as much.


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## busysmurf (Feb 16, 2012)

jumanji321 said:


> Maybe try swan neck spurs, they are made for long-legged riders and won't require you to rotate your ankle as much.


But that would make sense, why would I want to do such a thing:lol: I just started turning mine upside down, works well enough:wink:


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## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

Spurs are an aid.
If you cannot control your lower leg you have no business riding with any kind of spur.
I use 2 kinds of spurs, but not every time I ride. I have a set of Cavalry repro brass spurs with short rowels. I also have a set of Prince of Wales blunt spurs.
The rowels are best used (for MY needs) with a finished horse. I may ride all day with the spurs on and never use them. Or...I might have to move my horse out quickly and then I'm glad I didn't leave them at home or camp that day.
The blunt spurs are excellent for schooling young, sensitive horses.
It's not safe under any circumstances to pull your leg way out and kick a horse who isn't listening. You can easily lose your balance that way and fall off.
To use any spur correctly you rotate your toe away from forward and brush the spur on the horse's side. He will feel that.
We should really understand humane vs. inhumane behavior. Wearing spurs isn't inhumane.


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## tierneylove09 (Mar 4, 2012)

I've trained my horse off of ball point spurs. He has a spur stop and if I tap both lightly at the same time he backs. tap just the right he pivots to the left and vice versa. I never use them hard unless he's ignoring the aids. But by teaching him this way I rarely have to touch his mouth.


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## rob (Aug 8, 2011)

very good t.i always say ,if your legs are there,why not use them.and it's better than tearing up his mouth or wearing out your shoulders.


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## tierneylove09 (Mar 4, 2012)

I just don't think spurs are cruel unless you make them that way. If you get a nice rounded spur rather than a rowel it's far less harsh. Obviously don't go jabbing their sides, but if they are ignoring you or don't quite get the hint that leg means go a little reinforcement isn't going to kill them. Hopefully eventually you will have to use the spur less and less if that's the route you're looking to go in. I just don't think they are any more cruel than a crop or a whip unless you abuse them.


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## puppluuv (Mar 7, 2012)

OK I am new to the forum, (somewhat new to riding) so go easy on me. I have a 15.4 QH that is as stubburn as a mule. I am a larger person, but he is a large very well fed horse so that should not be the problem. I have done all sorts of ground work, spinning, serpintines, Etc. Jordan is just extremely slow and will not pick up the pace with anything I do. He will decide to take off at a run for no reason, so I know he can do it. Because he is semi unpredictable I do not want anything else in my hands, i.e. whip. I see a lot of you believe in the spurs, have you had any problems with using them on horses that have never had them used on them? Bucking, rearing, that kind of thing? I know its more of a grazing touch and not a stabbing. Just wanting to know what to expect.?


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## tierneylove09 (Mar 4, 2012)

when I got my horse he had hardly had a person on him, let alone spurs. All he did when I used them for the first time was move forward very quickly. I wouldn't say he took off, but it was fast haha but I'd think that some horses might buck. I wouldn't think they'd rear, but all horses are different.


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## puppluuv (Mar 7, 2012)

tierneylove09 said:


> All he did when I used them for the first time was move forward very quickly. I wouldn't say he took off, but it was fast



I believe most toddlers walk faster than he does at this point in time, so anything has got to be better. I am just stuck and frustrated!


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## busysmurf (Feb 16, 2012)

puppluuv said:


> OK I am new to the forum, (somewhat new to riding) so go easy on me. I have a 15.4 QH that is as stubburn as a mule. I am a larger person, but he is a large very well fed horse so that should not be the problem. I have done all sorts of ground work, spinning, serpintines, Etc. Jordan is just extremely slow and will not pick up the pace with anything I do. He will decide to take off at a run for no reason, so I know he can do it. Because he is semi unpredictable I do not want anything else in my hands, i.e. whip. I see a lot of you believe in the spurs, have you had any problems with using them on horses that have never had them used on them? Bucking, rearing, that kind of thing? I know its more of a grazing touch and not a stabbing. Just wanting to know what to expect.?


Welcome to the forum!! As for your question, it depends on a few things. In my opinion, since you say you are fairly new to riding I would wait on using spurs. Before using either, I would find a local trainer and maybe take a lesson or 2, with someone who can see how you 2 are interacting and give you a few pointers & excercises.

Even though holding a whip in your hands may seem like more of a problem right now, I think it would be a good idea for you to try. If you hold on to the whip/crop correctly it shouldn't hinder use of your hands at all (When I first started, I thought the same as you about them getting in the way). Another reason I would try it in your situation to use a whip instead of spurs first is if your horse were to act up suddenly, you are probably more likely to try to hang on with your legs and feet. And if you're inexperienced you may inadvertently spur him. Whereas, if you are using a whip and need to rely on your hands as well as your legs to hang on, you can either drop the whip as you grab to hang on or most likely the whip will end up pointed away if you hang on. Basically, you can always let go of the whip if you need to, but spurs are on until you take them off.


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## karebear444 (Feb 3, 2012)

I've never used spurs on my mare, though I'm not against anyone using them responsibly.


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## puppluuv (Mar 7, 2012)

TY for your inputs. I am just trying to figure out what to do next. Walking is only one of his problems, but I believe it is his biggest. I may just have to take a few classes to try to work this out.


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## busysmurf (Feb 16, 2012)

puppluuv said:


> TY for your inputs. I am just trying to figure out what to do next. Walking is only one of his problems, but I believe it is his biggest. I may just have to take a few classes to try to work this out.


That sounds like a very smart plan:wink: Good luck!


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## jumanji321 (Dec 1, 2010)

puppluuv said:


> OK I am new to the forum, (somewhat new to riding) so go easy on me. I have a 15.4 QH that is as stubburn as a mule.


 
Just so you know, a 15.4 HH horse is actually 16 HH :wink:


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## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

If you are going to use extra training aids, in my opinion crops are for forward movement or helping to aid lateral movement from the hindquarters (where I can't reach) While spurs are for turning and lateral movement. 

I ride 80% without spurs so Jake is responsive without needing the spur, but every once in a while I'll put them on to sharpen him up. Then I'll take them back off. At least that is for english, my western boots just always have spurs on them. Though it doesn't mean I use the spurs when I ride. Typically I don't have to touch the spur to the horses I'm riding. If I need it its there though.


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

gypsygirl said:


> its hard for me to believe you were actually smacking your horse with it ! tapping maybe.


In some shows you cannot hit your horse in front of your leg. Even an accidential tap would result in a DQ.


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## GreySorrel (Mar 5, 2012)

I haven't had to use spurs or a crop on my QH at all, my gelding I know that if you do, he would ensure your eating the dirt as somewhere along the way, someone did something to him that he HATES whips or crops of any kind. If he is a little slow a bump with my heels on his side or a squeeze with my leg and a "get up" usually lets him know to pick up the pace. 

As what everyone else has said, they are, when used properly, a good tool for some horses.


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## HarleyWood (Oct 14, 2011)

i use spurs on my moms horse but only at shows or if he wont do what i ask and my horse when i ride him in shows. i dont use a crop because im a barrel racer and im better with spurs. but when i ride my friends moms gelding i will use a derssage whip time to time. and i have a horse that will buck you off if oyu get on with spurs hes bette without


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

puppluuv said:


> I may just have to take a few classes to try to work this out.


That's what you should have done from the start.

It's highly likely that an experienced rider can get on your horse and make him go without spurring him or slapping him with a crop.


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## FirstLightFarm (Jan 20, 2012)

mildot said:


> That's what you should have done from the start.
> 
> It's highly likely that an experienced rider can get on your horse and make him go without spurring him or slapping him with a crop.


Bear in mind the guy telling you this hasn't been riding quite a year yet.

Lessons are a great idea. I think you are wise to realize that refusing to go is just as much of an evasion as rushing off. Since your horse is doing both, you could find yourself in a dangerous situation. So I think lessons and training are a great idea. Spurs - not so much.


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## WSArabians (Apr 14, 2008)

I don't use spurs. If I can't get my horse to move without them, I'm doing something wrong as a trainer. IMO. 
And no, I don't think they're abusive, either.


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## puppluuv (Mar 7, 2012)

Just so it is known, I said kinda new to riding. I owned horses 15 years ago, but have not ridden since. I rode on a daily basis back then and could do just about anything on that mare. I rode western and bareback, she was neck reined and I could control her with just my knees. I have ridden other horses as well, so gentle, some with some attitude. My problem is I have not ridden in 15 years and I now have a super stubborn gelding. Yes I may need a refresher on some things, but I am not a total newbie.


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## busysmurf (Feb 16, 2012)

puppluuv said:


> Just so it is known, I said kinda new to riding. I owned horses 15 years ago, but have not ridden since. I rode on a daily basis back then and could do just about anything on that mare. I rode western and bareback, she was neck reined and I could control her with just my knees. I have ridden other horses as well, so gentle, some with some attitude. My problem is I have not ridden in 15 years and I now have a super stubborn gelding. Yes I may need a refresher on some things, but I am not a total newbie.


Yay for you getting back into it! And even bigger yay to you for accepting you may need a little refresher. Some ppl don't do that & make things a lot worse.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## busysmurf (Feb 16, 2012)

mildot said:


> That's what you should have done from the start.
> 
> It's highly likely that an experienced rider can get on your horse and make him go without spurring him or slapping him with a crop.


Pup is doing just fine, they're recognizing a problem & seeking out positive ways to correct the problem instead of ignoring it or having the mentality that they know everything and put down anyone else's suggestions (like seems to be your style, mildot).
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

FirstLightFarm said:


> Bear in mind the guy telling you this hasn't been riding quite a year yet.


So that makes the advice any less correct?


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## mildot (Oct 18, 2011)

OP, some things to think about:

Is your horse in discomfort from the saddle or tack?

Is he really sensitive to rider balance? Some just flat stop if they feel the rider is off balance, particularly to the front.


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## DuffyDuck (Sep 27, 2011)

Most people I know ride in spurs from the first day they back a horse. 

However, these are people with the ability to say when they do and don't need them. If they're there, then they don't have to fuss with getting off and putting them on.

The first time I rode Duffy at my place it was with spurs. And was until Christmas time when I learnt an invaluable lesson. We had a tester moment, she refused to go forewards, and as I can't carry a whip with her, I asked, then gave her a firmer cue, which she didn't appreciate and threw a buck, then threw a huge buck and I landed in the dirt, on my back. When I got up, the second buck was due to me clinging on with my spurs and I quite literally skinned her.

I took them off and haven't ridden in them since.

Now, my old man, you had no choice. All horse's sides are sensitive- how do you reckon they feel the flies and swat them off?

But he ignored leg aids in the beginning.

As for whips, they can be just as bad, I've seen a horse come of our riding school on more than one occassion with huge welts all over his rump. 

Its not the quipment, but how you use it, and if you aren't responsible, or steady enough- don't blinking use it.
Anyone who wants to say 'its not norma to wear them blah blah blah'... its not 'normal/natural' to ride a horse, so go stick it in a field.


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## kate114 (Mar 13, 2012)

countercanter said:


> Spurs are an extension of your leg. They allow your aids to be more precise and clear. My horse gets ridden in spurs if we are having a real ride and not just going out for a hack. Spurs should only be used by someone that is advanced enough to know when to turn their spur "on" and "off." Spurs are never to be used as a weapon or punishment, simply for making your requests to your horse more clear and to get a more immediate response.





I believe this too. You should only use them an extension of your leg. And only if you are experienced enough of a rider to know when and when not to use them. Personally I always ride with them. Whether I use them or not while I'm riding is a different story. Some times my mare needs them and other times she doesnt.


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## Casey02 (Sep 20, 2011)

Ok i really didnt read much of the replys lol, but i dont think the question is "to spur or not to spur" i think the questions is "can you handle the spurs, and not over use or turn them abusive"

And no i dont think spurs when used correctly are abusive


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## rob (Aug 8, 2011)

so wsa,let me see if i caught that correctly.in your opinion,if a trainer wears spurs,their not doing something right?


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

I ride with spurs with all my horses and start at about the 3-4th ride. They are simply an extention of your leg and as long as they are used for that there is nothing wrong with them. They are not there to make the horse go faster. They are simply there for lateral movement.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

WSArabians said:


> I don't use spurs. If I can't get my horse to move without them, I'm doing something wrong as a trainer. IMO.
> And no, I don't think they're abusive, either.


You might wish to clarify what you mean by this. Spurs are aids. They do not make your horse go they refine your aids. You will be hard to find a reining horse being ridden without spurs. Does that make all those riders and trainers wrong?


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## ArabianChic (Mar 29, 2011)

I have no problem with spurs provided they are used correctly. 

I have never felt the need to use them myself though and I probably won't use them in the future either (I prefer to ride "naked".  ). I have a pair of English spurs that a friend gave to me a while ago and they've just been gathering dust in my tack box...


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## JoJo1950 (Dec 14, 2009)

I also use spurs. However, only to reinforce my leg que and only when necessary. My horse is very good at neck reining so I rarely use my spurs. Mostly they are for show and the cowboy feeling. That said if you are a beginner I would advise bumper spurs to be on the safe side until your confidence improves.


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## IquitosARG10 (Aug 27, 2011)

Ok, I have a question...but I don't quite know how to word it to not sound all crazy. Are there "degrees" if you will, or spurs? Like what type of spur is considered a more gentle spur. My horse doesn't have a lack of go, but I would like to try them when it comes to finer movements, like bending, and lateral movements, etc....for those who primarily ride dressage, what would you suggest?


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

IquitosARG10 said:


> Ok, I have a question...but I don't quite know how to word it to not sound all crazy. Are there "degrees" if you will, or spurs? Like what type of spur is considered a more gentle spur. My horse doesn't have a lack of go, but I would like to try them when it comes to finer movements, like bending, and lateral movements, etc....for those who primarily ride dressage, what would you suggest?


Yes there are A LOT of different type of spurs. Ones that put more surface on the horse will be less severe then those that have less surfece. Like the difference between pushing on your side with your fist vs your finger.

Also spurs are NOT to make a horse go or speed up. They are there to refine cues. Nothing more or less.


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## Valentina (Jul 27, 2009)

Spurs should NEVER be used IF the rider can not keep their legs steady and if rider can not use them only when they want to. 

Spurs are a form of communication with the horse, not always a punishment. In dressage we use spurs for lateral (side ways) work - a scratch or small bump with a spur, even on a hot horse, can be much more subtle and effective than a strong boot with the leg. It also prevents the leg from getting out of position.

Most people should not wear spurs because they don't know how to use them effectively, not when to use them and when not to use them. In my opinion.


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## cowboy bowhunter (Mar 15, 2012)

I always where spurs i dont get on horses without them. Do I use them? Only when needed. I feel they are a tool and a way to get your horse to do what needed. 
I use spurs with big shanks and rowles the size of silver dollars.


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