# Endotapping to teach a horse to relax, what do you all think?



## White Foot (Jun 4, 2009)

I guess whatever works, but I can do all of that without constantly tapping him. I know for a fact right now that my horse Gunther wouldn't tolerate this type of riding/training. The horses look like they tolerate it but it looks uncomfortable/annoying. What if for some reason they forget to bring the whip and ball? then what? They don't have something to rely on. 

You can probably make one, instead of paying_ $100 for a new one._


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

I have never tried it and probably never will. Seems like a bit much to me.


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

Wasn't there just a thread on this last week?


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## AfterParty (Jun 4, 2010)

I dont think I'd ever try that . I know I sure as hell would get pretty ****ed off if someone continuiously tapped me . There are many other ways to relax a horse .


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## justsambam08 (Sep 26, 2009)

No matter what they say, I think their method is just like desensitizing a horse to any other thing...you do it until the horse relaxes. I don't need a stick/ball thing to do that.


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## Brighteyes (Mar 8, 2009)

To me, the results just aren't worth the training. The traditional way of lengthening strides, stopping, etc. is just easier.


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## corinowalk (Apr 26, 2010)

Seems a bit distracting. Ive tried some goofy things on Nico...I dont think this would go over well...but best of luck to you!


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

Also, couldn't they have chosen some better riders to showcase the method anyway. Nearly all of them were either bouncing all over the place or popping the horse in the mouth every other stride. :?


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## iridehorses (Oct 22, 2007)

I see it as just training a horse to react to a stimulus. You can do it with your hands and seat - to me it's just another gimmick to circumvent the proper way to train your horse.


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## mom2pride (May 5, 2009)

I think there are much quicker and more lasting ways to train a horse...I would get annoyed having to do that all the time...can't imagine how the horse would feel about it!!!


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

Erm...isn't that the name of the method used to lay a horse down? From the same guy I assume? "The Tap" was developed by a guy named Endo, so it's often called "Endo's Tap".

Eh, seems silly to me. What do you do when it's time to show?


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## mom2pride (May 5, 2009)

Not sure if it's the same guy or not. 

I just noticed that the andulusian at the very end wasn't extremely engaged in the rear...to me he seemed to kind of drag his rear along; there was no real reach forward...


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## drafts4ever (Sep 1, 2009)

AfterParty said:


> I don't think I'd ever try that . I know I sure as hell would get pretty ****ed off if someone continuously tapped me . There are many other ways to relax a horse .


exactly. Kind of reminds me of the feeling from a little kid tugging on your shirt or continuously tapping you 'hey, hey, hey, hey, hey,hey,hey, ....." I personally would get pretty annoyed having it done to me but since I'm not the horse I don't think I'd want to spend the time trying to "tap" my horse into responding. My time when I ride is spent working with my horse through my hands and my seat. A stick with a ball and trying to time tapping or whatever it is would be an annoyance and a huge distraction not to mention frustrating. Personal opinion of course. I also know for a fact that my girl wouldn't stand two seconds of that. She'd pin her ears, brace/tense, and stomp stomp stomp, snort, stomp some more and ignore. :shock:


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## ridergirl23 (Sep 17, 2009)

if I even tryed that on my horse, she would turn me into a rocket ship headed for the moon before I could even say the word endotapping. But good luck if you decide to try it! If I wanted one for some reason I would buy a hard- foam ball and poke a hole in it for the whip, then hot glue gun the ball to the whip end, it would cost a dollar ( to buy the ball) and It would be made in a minute or two.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## yukontanya (Apr 11, 2010)

Endotapping was originally started as a way to calm autistic children. There were many scientific studies behind this method.. 

And I have to say I was in the same boat you guys are in, I was totally no a believer and thought it would only bug and **** off the poor horse being "beaten". 

How ever I am open minded so I spent parts of 3 days watching, and wow the way those horses came around, their self carriage, giving at the poll. He had green horses doing side passes in a few hours..

I am totally just a "bush cowgirl" so I know very little about all the fancy riding stuff that you english riders are so good at. But to see horses come around like that including some abused ones.. I think it worth a go.

Also you can replace the whip with your hand tapping later on, its just to teach them to calm down.


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## yukontanya (Apr 11, 2010)

drafts4ever said:


> A stick with a ball and trying to time tapping or whatever it is would be an annoyance and a huge distraction not to mention frustrating. Personal opinion of course. I also know for a fact that my girl wouldn't stand two seconds of that. She'd pin her ears, brace/tense, and stomp stomp stomp, snort, stomp some more and ignore. :shock:


That is something you have to work past, its not just something horse just get, but the tapping releases endorphins, and when your horse finally lowers its head, the endorphins are released into her system (ie they get a feel good rush)... 

The idea is to teach your horse no matter what, or how scared they may get, you wont let them get hurt, and in fact you will make them feel good if they trust you... that is the basic idea behind it (or at least thats how I understand it)


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## mom2pride (May 5, 2009)

Like I said...not a method I would personally choose; if it does work for you, that's great, but I've worked with several abused horses, and never had to use a tap method to get them to relax and trust me. A horse will trust you when you guide him with consistency, and establish proper leadership...


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## yukontanya (Apr 11, 2010)

I have only ever owned "special needs" animals, I know how to make them come around, and build trust. But I am open minded, I am always open to learning something new, and doing whats best for the animal I am working with. My new paint gelding, does not know how to relax even when he is just hanging out in a field being a horse, he is scared of his own shadow (and I mean that).. he needs to learn to be a horse again, to relax. He did live in a herd for the past 2 yrs with minimal human contact, but made the choice to be a loner and avoid the herd unless they were feeding..


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## FlitterBug (May 28, 2009)

Like I always say, don't look at the method, look at whats going on behind the method. Animals, like autistic children, respond to rhythm. Animals are the original musicians. I have often found that setting either a physical or a vocal pattern will relax a horse and allow them to find rhythm. It works amazingly well to use a metronome when working with a horse to find hoof falls and short comings (it will drive you crazy after a while though). However, I have found that giving some people a metronome allows them to find the pattern that animals already know.

When working with a new horse or a skittish horse, I always use rhythm with what I am doing with them, whether its working on teaching a cinchy horse to be unresponsive with rhythmic rubbing of the girth area, or yesterday I was working with an extremely head shy horse that was terrified of her ears being touched. To set a rhythm to any touching that you are doing does help the horse to relax and find a beat for themselves.

So yes, I see how this could work, however you don't need the stick with a ball, you just need to be able to read a horse and know what type of rhythm to set. For a hyper horse, I will set a slower rhythm, for a pokey horse, higher rhythm to get the blood flowing faster.

You also may want to look into the theory of entrainment. I have known several people that have trouble wearing wrist watches if the have an abnormally slow heart rate. The ticking of the watch actually syncronizes with the pulse of the person. Rhythm falls in line with rhythm, if you set the rhythm, you do set the leadership if the horse is falling in line with it.

I am sure that I am not the only person that uses this on a day to day basis with my horses. Most just don't realize it, they see it as a different method that requires something special, however, it is in our regular lives with our horses every day. If your rhythm is not falling in line with the horses rhythm, then the sound and the picture are never very pretty. To recognize the rhythm and be the "conductor" allows the horse to find relaxation and a good learning frame of mind in your presence.


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## NittanyEquestrian (Mar 3, 2009)

I totally agree with Flitterbug. I feel that this method is geared toward amateur riders on horses with huge strides and that have not had a lot of groundwork. If you can get a horse to respond to the repetitiveness of the tapping (rhythm) then they can associate you with calm and safe. Then under saddle if the person has to "tap the rhythm" of the movement it gives them something to concentrate on and chances are they will find the movement and the horse's natural rhythm much easier. Do I think that all that can be done without tapping them with a stick with a ball on the end? Of course. But for some people that lack a good feel for natural rhythm or someone that just needs a little help relaxing themselves I can see where this would help. It is also like the 7 games of parelli for horses. Repetition once they learn the steps is very calming for horses. I feel that all these new "techniques" are geared to the novice riders with the average horses that both have some "problems or training holes". If it's safe and it works for some people then I have no objections but I wouldn't use it because I can get the same results from just riding. But then I've been riding and training for almost 20 years...if I didn't have all that experience under my belt and needed a little help with my horse then I might be singing a different tune.


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## FlitterBug (May 28, 2009)

I agree, repititon is very calming for a horse and for people in many respects. When we can't give them something repeptitve to due, we can give them something to feel or hear.

I came back on here because I just had an interesting experience with just this theory:

I work with a lot of rescue horses, actually, far more problem animals than horses brought up correctly. I was just at a barn that had a recent rescue come in. The horse had been brought in as one of a pair. The second horse was already out, and the gelding in the stall was flipping out. Someone was in there trying to halter him and he had hardly even noticed that the person was there. I went into the stall where he was pacing and rearing up at the back window, screaming, sweating, and a ball of nerves and had the other person get out. I am fully aware of the fact that it is dangerous to be in a small stall with a horse in this state, but it isn't somewhere I haven't been before. To try and touch this horse would have been dangerous, he had no problem slamming people with his weight and was highly reactive to any type of invasion. I started making a low, fast click sound, not a normal "move" sound, just lightly popping my tongue against the roof of my mouth. I got the geldings attention and he slowed down his pacing and started flipping an ear on me. I gradually slowed down the rhythm of my clicks until the gelding relaxed into the beats of the sound. As he slowly lowered his head and considered approaching me, I thought about this thread. To go in there and start tapping him physically would have caused more harm than good, but I still used the same theory and he came to the source of the consistency and comfort, me. He was quietly haltered in no time at all, he is far from fixed, but it was a safe start.

There is a lot more to horses than methods. Could I have caught that horse without making the sound? Sure, its not a magic sound any more than its a magic stick that makes it in the endotapping system. However, in my experience, it is something that I found helpful ever since I sang to the first horse I broke when I was 13 yrs old, a 7 yr old rescued TWH mare that was nearly uncatchable and fearful of people. Believe me, it wasn't my lovely voice that brought that mare around, and if I went to someones barn and broke out in song it may make them think twice. Eventually, I transferred what worked through my voice through to touch and found it equally effective once the horse was ready for the touch. It doesn't have to be for the novice, and it doesn't have to be for everyone, but it does work for me in many different occasions that have been thought to be unsolvable. I still use it to add a little "umph" to a lazy horses gait on the lungeline, or to settle a horse that is ripping around the pasture like a mad man. To each their own, someone once told me that the reason what I do works so well is because I am never compromising my own beliefs when I do it, above all, horses sense honesty and I am always honest with them, its not about the methods, its about what the horse understands behind the creation of the methods.


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## Salila (Jun 9, 2010)

I thought at first this thread would be about Hybrid horsemanship where the process of "tapping" the horse means making it lay down. 

Personally, I think it's just like iridehorses says. Anything could be used to teach a horse to do that, from a tap of the hand, to a nudge of the toe, etc.


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