# Unsure of ownership



## Delbozz (May 20, 2017)

Just over three years ago we adopted a horse from a non-profit rescue. There was a 1200 dollar adoption fee and on the check the proprietor wrote "donation" on the memo line, then cashed the check. There was no contract, none. Nothing was signed by either party,nor is there any mention to or refrence of a contract or ownership issues on their website.

There was a verbal assurance that, if at any point we could not care for the horse we could return him to the rescue. Fast forward three years. We have paid in full all vet bills and boarding bills. Keeping the horse is not a finacinal burden at all, but the opportunity has come up to sell him. 

The owner of the rescue saw the Facebook page with his offer and immediately started texting us what we were doing was illegal and if we no longer wanted him we were under obligation to return him and that we never actually had ownership. We have all of his paperwork, paid for him and signed no contract. So I'm confused as to how this person can claim ownership.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Look at the website of the rescue. There's probably an "Adoption Application" that spells out the terms, and you probably filled that out before you got the horse. You've run afoul of one of the biggest scams in the industry. When you "adopt" from a rescue, you never own the horse, you just have filled out paperwork to foot all the bills from now on. On the Website, there's probably a statement that the horse must go back to the rescue in the event you no longer want him. 

Here's some sample language from Blaze's Equine Rescue here in OK. They are actually a bit more flexible than most when it comes to rehoming. 
"Adopter agrees and understands that under no circumstances is an adopted horse/s to be sold at an Livestock Auction or to Slaughter. If adopter can no longer care for such adopted horse/s and wishes to transfer ownership, adopter agrees to place such adopted horse in an humane environment and to approved home, or returned to Blaze's Tribute Equine Rescue.

The Adopter agrees to notify Blaze's Tribute Equine Rescue if you intend to sell or transfer the horse/s."

And about the 'donation'. 

"* Adoption Donation: Concurrent with the Signature of this Agreement, Adopter has
paid a non-refundable adoption donation in the amount of ____________________ and
00/100 Dollars($____________) to Blaze’s Tribute Equine Rescue. Payment in full of
the adoption donation is required before removal of the adopted animal from Blaze’s
Tribute Equine Rescue’s facility. This adoption donation may be tax deductible by the
adopter, although Blaze’s Tribute Equine Rescue makes no representation or warranty in
that regard. Adopter should consult his/her independent tax advisor to determine deductibility.

* Prohibited Uses: ADOPTER AGREES THAT UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES SHALL
THE ADOPTED ANIMAL BE USED FOR BREEDING PURPOSES.
Adopter’s Initials: _________________________"


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

You would want to look up your state laws and consult a lawyer to see what your legal rights are but if there was no signed contract, ownership was not covered on their website and you have covered full expense for the horse and the horse is being adequately cared for then I can't see how they can make that claim. What do you mean by "all of his paperwork"? Is that the expenses incurred or registration papers transferring him into your name? Bill of sale? The only thing that I can see that would be questionable and imply you do not own him is that they wrote donation on the check so there is no record of you "paying" for him. Had they written adoption fees that could imply there was an agreement between parties as to ownership.


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

Cross posted with Dreamcatcher. Even if they updated the website you could still have a case for ownership if you have not signed anything but the check. If you did fill out adoption paperwork then hopefully you have the original to reference to. If it has no mention of the agency retaining ownership then you could have a case against them if they try to reposses if it does then you would be out of luck and could not sell only keep or return to agency.


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## Delbozz (May 20, 2017)

There is nothing on their website about a contract, nothing to fill out even, no forms or applications. We actually found him thru a post on facebook about him being up for adoption. The no bill of sale thing worried me though as did the labeling the payment as "donation." I'm inclined to just not sell the horse at this point but then if he's not ever going to truly be ours, why would we want to keep him and, you know, keep paying all the bills.

Edit:There was no paperwork filled out at all. Not on the website or with the proprietor either electronic or in physical paper form. Our signature is on nothing. We actually asked for a copy of the "contract" we supposedly filled out (knowing there was none) a week ago and was told it would take them a few weeks to find the old paper work.

Does anyone have the name of a decent equine lawyer in texas that does consultations?


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## Avna (Jul 11, 2015)

I don't think you need an equine lawyer. The horse is considered property. Any lawyer versed in property law may be able to help you. 

As far as I can tell, if you have the vet invoices etc that state you are the horse's owner, for some years, you probably have a good case for ownership, even if you signed nothing. You have the proof of your donation, I hope. What the rescue organization would need to prove their own claim of ownership would be some kind of original purchase contract from wherever they got him. Sounds like there's a good chance they don't even have that. They may be totally blowing smoke. 

If you did want to sell him, you would need to establish your legal claim to him, because otherwise it seems like there's a good chance these incompetent nutjobs would go after the new buyer and you'd have a nasty mess.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Personally, I would give them 15 days from the date they contacted you about it being 'illegal to sell' that horse to come get him off your property or you will consider him abandoned. Get it in the mail on Monday, certified, return receipt. Advise them that if they truly consider the horse their property they need to come get him by that date and start charging them board. Then if push comes to shove, you can go to small claims and a judge will settle it.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Delbozz said:


> The owner of the rescue saw the Facebook page with his offer and immediately started texting us what we were doing was illegal and if we no longer wanted him we were under obligation to return him and that we never actually had ownership. We have all of his paperwork, paid for him and signed no contract. So I'm confused as to how this person can claim ownership.



You say we, who is we. Who actually entered into this agreement? What paperwork? What does it do to prove or disprove ownership?


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## AnitaAnne (Oct 31, 2010)

I doubt their claims would hold up in court. You paid a fee and have housed and cared for the horse for three years. That makes the horse your property. 

Offer to let them "adopt him back" for your asking price or the original adoption fee. 

BTW, have never had anyone I gave a check to fill out the memo line. That is where I write down any info I need.


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

If you signed nothing, and they let you take the horse in exchange for a donation to their rescue, the horse is yours, all yours, you can do whatever you want with. If they can produce nothing you signed agreeing to not sell the horse, tell them to stop harassing you, or you will get a restraining order against them. That should end it. Make sure you save communications between you and them in case you do need to take out that restraining order.


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## Delbozz (May 20, 2017)

Yeah my wife and I (the we) checked all the paperwork we have with a friend of ours that has been in the horse training/eventing and selling business for almost 30 years. We have his dna tests, breed reg, eventing regs, vet bills, boarding bills all in my wifes name as the owner. We also have the paperwork for the original owner. no where in the vast amount of paperwork for the horse is there a single mention of the rescue owners name or organization, just that at one time we made a generous donation to their org (the adoption fee they marked as a donation). Our friend said by all accounts this is our horse and there is no way to prove it is not with the paper trail we're accumulated. Thanks for all your advise folks. It's been a big help!


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

That sounds like a very shady "rescue". Are they even 501c3? Sounds like they need to lose their status if they are.


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## Linda G (Aug 23, 2016)

I can kind of see where the rescue is coming from. If you buy a horse you can sell it if you want. If you adopt a horse from a rescue, they don't want people "flipping them for profit". They probably want the adopter to be a forever home and if you aren't going to be that forever home then they want the horse back. I do agree though that they were not clear on their policy at all and there should be a contract.


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## Chasin Ponies (Dec 25, 2013)

Delbozz said:


> Yeah my wife and I (the we) checked all the paperwork we have with a friend of ours that has been in the horse training/eventing and selling business for almost 30 years. We have his dna tests, breed reg, eventing regs, vet bills, boarding bills all in my wifes name as the owner. We also have the paperwork for the original owner. no where in the vast amount of paperwork for the horse is there a single mention of the rescue owners name or organization, just that at one time we made a generous donation to their org (the adoption fee they marked as a donation). Our friend said by all accounts this is our horse and there is no way to prove it is not with the paper trail we're accumulated. Thanks for all your advise folks. It's been a big help!


 
It sounds like you are the ones with all of the legal proof that you own the horse and I agree, this "rescue" sounds very shady. I've never known a legitimate rescue that didn't require tons of paperwork very much as Dreamcatcher Arabians quoted. If they are not a registered 501c, then they are not non-profit. We have little backyard "rescues" pop up all the time around here begging for money, and then they suddenly disappear.

One thing that probably isn't a good idea is advertising a horse on Facebook especially a horse like this. You can see how quickly someone sent your post to the "rescue". Then it can easily become a nasty public war. I know people seem to think they can safely put anything they want on social media but if you want to sell this horse with no hassles, I'd advise keeping it a bit more anonymous and private.


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

If they gave you all of his paperwork and the transfer papers signed by the original owner (the one before the "rescue" received him) then he is yours and they received a very generous donation for their part in finding him a good home. Around here you don't get the registry papers if the horse is adopted through an agency. They sound very sloppy and are possibly looking to be able to rehome him for another generous fee since you have put all of your time into him.


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