# New Barn polices, over the top or not?



## zookeeper1991

A couple of them are the same as our barn, but I would find the hours too limited to ever board there. No after 6:30 pm and no Sundays? I don't think so.


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## kenda

I would never board at a place with such stringent restrictions on when I can see my horse. I work days, so evenings and weekends are my barn time. If I couldn't be on the property after 6:30pm and not able to use the lights during evenings, that would be a no-go for me. 

Also, not being able to jump except in lessons, especially for adults. I'm an adult, if I hurt myself doing something I shouldn't do that's on me. That's what the waivers are for. Same goes for if I want my friend or my trainer to come and ride my horse, as long as they sign the same waiver, than it should be MY responsibility to ensure competency, not the barn owners.

I can understand wanting non-boarders to only visit by appointment. I wouldn't want random people showing up at my barn, possibly hurting themselves, or unintentionally doing damage to one of the horses or the facility.


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## mylilpony4u

yes, the no riding after 6:30 might be hard for me. Im not off work until 5 so by the time I drive over there to get my ride time in there isnt much left. My husband can drop our son off during the week to ride earlier but myself my only day would be Saturday. I not 100% sure this lease will work out in the long run. I'll give it my best and see if not maybe just lessons until we figure something else out.


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## Incitatus32

mylilpony4u said:


> Hello
> 
> 1. All guests must sign a wavier even if not ridding. *I have encountered this rule before, I can't say that it's too terrible restricting or unwarranted.*
> 2. If you don't have a horse on the property you can not be on the property unless you are in a lesson *I wrote my comments for this one on #3*
> 3. For none boarders, all none lessons visits need to be by appointment only, even if coming to watch others ride/say "hi" *I don't really see the problem in someone who doesn't board stopping by to say hi briefly, or even converse with a friend who might board, or heaven forbid ride their horse. Seems a bit extreme to me when if there's a problem with a specific person you can simply be 'alert and aware'.*
> 4. No evening riding even though there are arena lights, you are not allowed to turn on, only trainer can *I'm going to say this bluntly. I pay for a service, I pay for board, I've signed a waiver, and it's my right to come out whenever I please and ride my horse. I can understand saying: "No riding after 11:30pm to provide some down time but honestly, for some of us working class boarders we don't get out to the barn until 10pm!*
> 5. No jumping unless it is in a lesson even with your own horse (adults also) *It's called a waiver for a reason. Oh and I pay money to the facility for it's services. I would jump my horse whenever I pleased so long as it didn't interfere with an ongoing lesson. *
> 6. No boarders allowed to be on property after 6:30pm *This one irks me. I have a right to see my horse whenever. I pay board, so therefor if I'm a good client you cannot tell me what to do with my horse or when to see him. Because he is owned by ME. *
> 7. Sunday barn is closed no one allowed on property *Read above, I would have it out about this one*
> 8. No turn outs in arena *Understandable imo*
> 9. Trainer can move your horse to a different stall if there are manner issues, even if stall costs more if its the only option available.* As I am a stable hand I agree with this one. Sometimes it's the only option for an aggressive horse until another suitable path can be found. *
> 10. Before you have someone handle/ride your horse other then yourself the facility needs to approve first. * It's called a waiver for a reason. It is to my discretion who comes with me to mess with my horse and/or interact with me and it. *
> 11.Guest can only come during lesson times *Please see above. A waiver. WAIVER, and then my discretion. *
> 
> Some of them aren't too bad but I do find some a little over the top, anyone else have to deal with any of these


I find some of them a bit ridiculous, but then again I like 24/7 365days access to my horses. And while I understand keeping a watchful eye on guests I don't agree. As a horse owner I take responsibility for them AND my horse, they sign a waiver and any fall back from horses will most likely fall on me, not the barn. Sad to say any barn that had these rules for me would not have me as a client but that's just how I feel. Then again I've run into barns that had scare tactics rules to keep away troublemakers and then were really lenient. :-|


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## churumbeque

so if you had an 8-5 job and with the traffic in a big city you would not be able to ride your horse during the week. Most barns close at 9pm and I can see the waivers and unexpected guest being a pain, but the hours would be a deal breaker for me.


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## Red Gate Farm

Well, number 2 negates numbers 1, 3 and 11. Number 2 clearly states only boarders and people in lessons can be on the property.


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## mylilpony4u

Red Gate Farm said:


> Well, number 2 negates numbers 1, 3 and 11. Number 2 clearly states only boarders and people in lessons can be on the property.


 what they seem to be telling me is unless you board you need to make an appointment (lesson taker or guest, all the same to them) Seems strange we are not strangers at all been there for years. But now that we are in a lease I am being told that myself and Son can only come on the arranged days or we need to make an appointment. Im confused now, yes I know I can only ride on the days we agreed (horse is used in lesson program still) but if I want to come out and clean my tack or organize my locker, I have to make an appointment. The barn is under new ownership maybe this is why, ugh.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

mylilpony4u said:


> Hello
> 
> *As a barn owner I'll post my comments from that point of view: *
> 
> 1. All guests must sign a wavier even if not ridding *Totally agree with this. *
> 
> 2. If you don't have a horse on the property you can not be on the property unless you are in a lesson *This might be a little strict but sounds like it may have come in response to a past problem. *
> 
> 3. For none boarders, all none lessons visits need to be by appointment only, even if coming to watch others ride/say "hi" *Same as #2. I've never done this but can see with a small place how it might be necessary. *
> 
> 4. No evening riding even though there are arena lights, you are not allowed to turn on, only trainer can *If the lights are touchy, I can see requiring having an employee turn them on & off. I do not agree with the no evening riding restriction for the same reason other boarders have stated. *
> 
> 5. No jumping unless it is in a lesson even with your own horse (adults also)
> *Totally disagree with this. I would agree with no one under 18 doing it without an adult in attendance. *
> 
> 6. No boarders allowed to be on property after 6:30pm
> *Nope again. Not reasonable for working folks. Now, if you want to talk to the BO, I can see her barn hours being from 9-5, but not to restrict owners from their horses. *
> 
> 7. Sunday barn is closed no one allowed on property
> *Again, totally unreasonable.*
> 
> 8. No turn outs in arena
> *This I agree with and can see the WHY behind it. *
> 
> 9. Trainer can move your horse to a different stall if there are manner issues, even if stall costs more if its the only option available. *Nope, not without the BO and Owner discussing the issue first and giving the owner a chance to sort out whatever it is. I would not agree to a clause like this and would not board there. *
> 
> 10. Before you have someone handle/ride your horse other then yourself the facility needs to approve first *Totally agree with this one. I have in my contract that only the owner or barn staff may handle a horse and that boarders are NOT to handle a horse that does not belong to them, without my approval first. *
> 
> 11.Guest can only come during lesson times
> *If this is a huge, busy barn can see why this might be in place. I have never restricted my boarders from bringing friends over. I do require a signed waiver from the guest. *


That's my take on those rules from a BO's point of view.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

mylilpony4u said:


> what they seem to be telling me is unless you board you need to make an appointment (lesson taker or guest, all the same to them) Seems strange we are not strangers at all been there for years. But now that we are in a lease I am being told that myself and Son can only come on the arranged days or we need to make an appointment. Im confused now, yes I know I can only ride on the days we agreed (horse is used in lesson program still) but if I want to come out and clean my tack or organize my locker, I have to make an appointment. The barn is under new ownership maybe this is why, ugh.


What you're saying here would be a deal breaker for me. I can understand needing to set up times to ride, or groom and spend time with a leased horse that is a shared lease, but not for cleaning tack or organizing a tack locker. I'd back out of the lease and go find another lesson barn.


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## STT GUY

mylilpony4u said:


> Hello
> 
> My son and I have been riding at a Hunter/Jumper barn for over two years now and taking lesson 2-3 times a week.
> We just started leasing a horse so was going over the agreement and new barn polices.
> We are no stranglers to the barn, everyone knows us and we know all them and the horses.
> I was wondering if anyone else barn has these polices and/or what you think of them.
> I have ridden at many public and private facilities but this is the first time some of such polices have been brought to my attention.
> 
> 1. All guests must sign a wavier even if not ridding
> 2. If you don't have a horse on the property you can not be on the property unless you are in a lesson
> 3. For none boarders, all none lessons visits need to be by appointment only, even if coming to watch others ride/say "hi"
> 4. No evening riding even though there are arena lights, you are not allowed to turn on, only trainer can
> 5. No jumping unless it is in a lesson even with your own horse (adults also)
> 6. No boarders allowed to be on property after 6:30pm
> 7. Sunday barn is closed no one allowed on property
> 8. No turn outs in arena
> 9. Trainer can move your horse to a different stall if there are manner issues, even if stall costs more if its the only option available.
> 10. Before you have someone handle/ride your horse other then yourself the facility needs to approve first
> 11.Guest can only come during lesson times
> 
> Some of them aren't too bad but I do find some a little over the top, anyone else have to deal with any of these


So half your weekends are "no ride? time?!!! To heck with that, I'd move.


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## mylilpony4u

Maybe I should have seen this coming with the new BO. Few months ago a lady came to the barn looking around and asking people there about training. One of the boarders called the BO and she came down from her house (she lives on the property) The BO started asking (more like grilling) the lady as to why she was there and didn't call her first and just "showed up". The lady explained that she was in the area and stopped by to see if anyone was there because it was convenient. The lady never came back to train with us, for some reason the new BO isn't very friendly and seems to be treating it like just her own personal facility. Why open it to outside boarders if you don't seem to want people on the property.

I called my trainer after starting this thread/ helpful comments and she has explained there is nothing she can do with the BO and we have to deal with it. She said if I wanted to in fact continue forward with the lease I need to abide by all the BOs rules. She informed me that earlier in the year a man in the lesson program for over a year was asked to leave. He had shown up without an appointment to pick up something for a fellow rider (who he rides with all the time) out of their locker because he drove by the barn on his way home from work. The man went into the locker and removed a saddle pad as requested but on his way out feed a few carrots to the fellow rider's horses and the horse stalled next store. A client that was there (who must not care for him) called the BO and told her. The BO the follow day told the man he broke the barn polices and was asked to leave. Now this is not a small or huge barn (20-30 horses) but we all know each other. I would have never thought twice to do what this man did. But now I'm worried I have to ride on egg shells when I'm at the barn, lease or no lease.


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## churumbeque

mylilpony4u said:


> what they seem to be telling me is unless you board you need to make an appointment (lesson taker or guest, all the same to them) Seems strange we are not strangers at all been there for years. But now that we are in a lease I am being told that myself and Son can only come on the arranged days or we need to make an appointment. Im confused now, yes I know I can only ride on the days we agreed (horse is used in lesson program still) but if I want to come out and clean my tack or organize my locker, I have to make an appointment. The barn is under new ownership maybe this is why, ugh.


 So if you are on a partial lease they are probly trying to keep loitering down to a minimum. A regular boarder may have "normal Rules" I can see them being stricter with a partial lease or it could get hectic or they dont need you watching them give a lesson to someone lesson "your" horse. I re-read another post and it sounds like this only applies to those that are not regular boarders. Makes total sense.


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## BugZapper89

They are all pretty common. At my barn it's my way or the highway and I don't tolerate anyone not following the rules.


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## mylilpony4u

I understand where the new BO is coming from its her barn so she can make any rules she wants. Its just hard to understand my trainer who was here before the new owners. She tells me just deal with it but then says she cant stand the new rules or how the place is run/taken care of. The trainer knows you are not allowed to turn horses out in the arena but she knows when the BO isn't around and will still turn peoples horses out. Maybe its an issue with both the trainer and the BO at this point. The BO is gone during the same time each day during the week and my trainer knows this. She has people that don't ride or board there come by the barn all the time to keep her "company" during slow hours. Sometimes this is during my sons lessons. I didn't think much of it until she showed me the new policies I don't want to say anything to the BO that's not my place. But then again she is the trainer so maybe she can have whoever she wants come by and hang out. I think she is playing cat and mouse with the BO though.


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## NBEventer

I find a lot of them over the top. 

I have boarders and I require anyone who steps foot on my property that wants to go near the horses, riding or not, to sign a waiver. Even family. Covers my own butt and I've heard of family spats where someone's horse kicked their mother and mother sued.

No strangers on my property unless they come with a boarder and have signed a waiver.

No jumping unless I am around or you are in a lesson. This one boils down to insurance. Insurance requires a coach to supervise jumping, even adults. 

My barn "closes" at 10pm unless you ask. 9 times out of 10 I'll say it's ok. But I like knowing who is around when. I also require people to text me if they are coming out to ride alone so I know, just in case someone gets hurt.

I run a small barn, only 2 or 3 boarders and one kid who leases one of my horses. So I like to know what is going on. Mainly for safety.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NBEventer

FTR I can only think of a handful of barns that allow jumping without a coach due to insurance issues. Maybe it's a Canadian thing? But I also know trainers who do not approve of jumping without being in a lesson. Mainly this is in big show barns though where people are taking 2 or 4 lessons a week.

The no jumping without a coach became very popular after a girl was killed when her horse ran off with her after landing and she was killed when her horse ran into a fence.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## frlsgirl

I get the no jumping rule; it's the same at our barn and it's just for everyone's safety.

The other restrictions seem a little ridiculous!


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## DancingArabian

Items 4-11 are not acceptable to me. I'd move in a hot minute. Though from the sound of it, you might need to make an appointment and ask for permission first!

Edited to add: I bet their barn insurance is sub-par hence all the rules.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## churumbeque

mylilpony4u said:


> I understand where the new BO is coming from its her barn so she can make any rules she wants. Its just hard to understand my trainer who was here before the new owners. She tells me just deal with it but then says she cant stand the new rules or how the place is run/taken care of. The trainer knows you are not allowed to turn horses out in the arena but she knows when the BO isn't around and will still turn peoples horses out. Maybe its an issue with both the trainer and the BO at this point. The BO is gone during the same time each day during the week and my trainer knows this. She has people that don't ride or board there come by the barn all the time to keep her "company" during slow hours. Sometimes this is during my sons lessons. I didn't think much of it until she showed me the new policies I don't want to say anything to the BO that's not my place. But then again she is the trainer so maybe she can have whoever she wants come by and hang out. I think she is playing cat and mouse with the BO though.


 Out of respect for you she should not have company during your lesson. Nothing is more irritating than someone taking her focus away from the paying customer.


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## gingerscout

personally I would say no way and leave, some of those rules are just dumb, I know #4-7 would be dealbreakers for most people I know, basically these people are like give me money and stay the heck off my farm and leave me your horse, and never see/ ride it.. sounds like they need a profession change, and not run a boarding barn..lol


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## Katz1411

Seems extreme to me - the no Sundays and closed at 630p would be deal breakers, my lessons are 6-7pm. Fortunately Colorado law recognizes there are inherent risks with horses, similar to skiing, and states that owner /operators are not liable. I haven't seen any real draconian rules at the places I've looked at, and all of them post this prominently on their property, sometimes in multiple places:

Wording: WARNING UNDER COLORADO LAW, AN EQUINE PROFESSIONAL IS NOT LIABLE FOR AN INJURY TO OR THE DEATH OF A PARTICIPANT IN EQUINE ACTIVITIES RESULTING FROM THE INHERENT RISKS OF EQUINE ACTIVITIES, PURSUANT TO SECTION 13-21-119, COLORADO REVISED STATUTES.

I assume this wouldn't apply to obvious gross negligence, but it should help avoid a lot of "just give me some $$ to go away" lawsuits.


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## NBEventer

That only applies if a person has signed a liability waiver. If random Joe Blow walked onto your property and your horse kicked him and he was injured he would be allowed to sue unless he signed a liability waiver.


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## Katz1411

NBEventer said:


> That only applies if a person has signed a liability waiver. If random Joe Blow walked onto your property and your horse kicked him and he was injured he would be allowed to sue unless he signed a liability waiver.


True but the combination of the law and the waiver should help deter nuisance lawsuits; it's worked that way for ski injuries. I've seen criticism in both cases that it protects operators too well. But at least it recognizes that some activities cannot be made risk-free, and participants are made to acknowledge it.


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## TessaMay

The BO has the right to set whatever rules she wants, but I would not stay there for a minute.


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## Saddlebag

BOs seem to have to fight to protect their privacy when there are boarders. They do need time away from the barn for family, housework maybe, bill paying, arranging for feed deliveries, etc. I can understand her getting upset when that lady dropped by at her convenience with a courtesy phone call. And I can understand her not wanting stranger on the place, there's too much tack that someone could be eyeing up to steal at a later date.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

BO's have a right to time off and privacy, thus set some "office" hours and days. But, I can't imagine owning a boarding facility and not expecting to have your time cut into a lot, and to not expect to be inconvenienced. I don't do it on a big scale, just 1 or 2 boarders if I really like the people and their horses, but I know I spend a LOT of time with the people and the horses. I can't imagine closing up at 6:30 in the evening unless it's winter and dark already. And actually, some of our best times have come on a winter night after we've gotten all the horses bedded down, fed and we're sitting on hay bales in the dim aisle light, talking, having a hot cocoa and listening to the horses munch. We've shut the doors tight to block wind and snow and we just sit and BE. It's amazing! I would be very sad to miss those occasions. 

Of course, we joke around that I've never had a boarder who didn't get adopted into the family, and it's pretty much true. So, even though they're clients, they're friends too and I tend to blur the line between client time and friends time, a little.


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## churumbeque

I think what we are forgetting is that the Op is not boarder. it sounds like she is just doing a part-time lease and doesn't have the right to be there on the days that she is not leasing that horse
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## thesilverspear

While barn hunting when I moved to a different city, I looked at a barn that was closed to boarders after 5pm, was closed on Sundays, and didn't allow jumping without one of their instructors present. So it's around. Needless to say, my horse is not there (the barbed wire fences around their paddocks were also somewhat off-putting). I'm aware of other barns with the jumping rule, but just as many that don't have it, and it makes a breaks a decision for me as to whether I will board somewhere. I don't jump a lot but I want to do it when I bloody well please.

At barns I've boarded at where they ran fairly extensive lesson programs, students could stop by whenever, outwith their lessons, to meet someone, pick something up, drop off something, whatever, and anyone who leased a horse -- even a part-lease -- was certainly free to come and go as they pleased. These were not random strangers wandering around the barn, but students and leasors. These rules described by the OP, especially as they pertain to students and leasors, seem pretty bonkers. If one student has been a problem (in my experience, this has never happened, but I'm sure it has somewhere), you deal with that person, rather than make daft barn rules that treat every student and leasor like they're guilty. I'd run a mile from the OP's barn.

Plus, it sounds as if there are some hinky politics between the OP's trainer and the BO. That's a red flag, as dealing with it just sours the whole atmosphere, and it might well result in an eventual blow-up between trainer and BO, and I doubt OP and her son want to be caught in the middle of that barn drama.


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## churumbeque

if I was only leasing a horse Part time I would not want the other half coming out on my days it would seem intrusive and nosy.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BugZapper89

churumbeque said:


> I think what we are forgetting is that the Op is not boarder. it sounds like she is just doing a part-time lease and doesn't have the right to be there on the days that she is not leasing that horse
> _Posted via Mobile Device_





I agree, it looks like she is setting up a well run schedule, so everyone has "their time" with the animal. You cant have a free for all going on. It is a business and certain days are closed. Those days are up to them. 
I do not allow anyone , except the OWNER of a horse on my property. The only exception to this, would be the stallion managers and/or trainer of said stallion that is coming and going for collections. My place is not a playground and I dont want it turned into one. These days you have to protect yourself for the stupid ones and if it wasnt for the insurance risks, I would much prefer to let the stupid ones extinguish themselves. Sadly thats not the case.


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## Katz1411

churumbeque said:


> I think what we are forgetting is that the Op is not boarder. it sounds like she is just doing a part-time lease and doesn't have the right to be there on the days that she is not leasing that horse
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The rules the OP quoted referred to 'boarders'.


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## Katz1411

At the risk of sounding like a codger reminiscing about the 'good ol' days', this is so different than when us old folks started riding . When I started as a kid, I was dropped at the barn in the am or right after school every day, picked up in the evening after feeding time. We rode our horses hell-bent-for-leather all over the property and jumped everything in sight, in almost any weather. After we rode our horses and did all the grooming/tacking and untacking we'd spend the day exercising and grooming the BO's obnoxious ponies, cleaned stalls, cleaned tack, set up jumps, etc. and had slumber parties in the hayloft. We'd hang around and watch shoeing, worming, foaling and gelding. We went to shows, clinics, pony club rallies pretty much on our own. I had pony club once a week and a private lesson once a week but was otherwise unsupervised. Even so, I can't imagine our parents suing over a fall/injury, and there were no waivers to sign. It's too bad it's now otherwise - some parents want guarantees and to bubble-wrap their child, other parents/riders just want to win the lawsuit lottery or get vindictive and want some sort of revenge for the least bump or scrape.


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## BugZapper89

Katz, you said a mouthful. However, I am sure you remember, that if you stepped out of line the thought of having to face your parents after the barn owner was done with them, would have been as bad as jumping out of a plane and being afraid of heights. The poor raising of todays youth has created chaos. I am of the time, when children where seen but not heard. I have raised my girls the same, they would never challenge an adult. They do have a fear of their teacher , in my case mostly Nuns ). As I have put it many times, if an adult says my child did XYZ, they are presumed guilty and will be punished as such.


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## Katz1411

Oh definitely, if I did something stupid at the barn it was on me, and I'd face the consequences at home. And yet even with all we did we all survived; two of the girls I rode with went on to become professional riders and trainers.


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## BugZapper89

Katz, these days I really wish some of the kids/young adults would remove their helmets, as they really do need a good pile driving to knock some sense into them, or knock the attitude out.


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## Zexious

Like someone else mentioned--the BO has every right to set whatever rules she wants. That said, this does not sound like a place I would want to board, or even participate in a lease.

1. Fine. I've ridden at barns that have this rule.

2. So I can't have people come watch me ride? No parents? Significant others? Friends? Does this facility never hold shows? Vets? Farriers? Or do all of the above people own horses here, too xD This makes no sense to me.

3. I guess I'm ok with this... It seems stringent, but not totally ridiculous.

4. If I pay board, I should be allowed to turn on whatever lights I please xD If I want to light up the barn like a Christmas tree because I'm scared of the dark, you can bet I'm going to do it.

5. I am also ok with this. Insurance, and all that.

6. Uh... no. Many people (I am not one of these people) work 9-5, Monday-Friday jobs. If the barn is also closed on Sunday, the BO is basically telling me that I am allotted one day to ride my horse. No thank you.

7. Again, no. 

8. This one is fair, as it can clog the arena. I wouldn't have it at my barn, but I see where BO is coming from... provided that there are other places that turnouts are acceptable.

9. This is fair... temporarily. If there is an issue with my horse and he is endangering others or himself, by all means do what you have to do. Other than that, this is something that needs to be discussed, I think.

10. Hahah... hah... Funny. No. It's my horse, and if I want my Boyfriend or Friend with no riding experience (provided they sign a waiver) to ride them, it's going to happen. 

11. Ya know... a lot of these rules contradict each other o,o


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## mylilpony4u

2. So I can't have people come watch me ride? No parents? Significant others? Friends? Does this facility never hold shows? Vets? Farriers? Or do all of the above people own horses here, too xD This makes no sense to me

You can as long as they come during a lesson so they can sign a wavier with the office


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## DuckDodgers

No way would I consider boarding or leasing from a barn that closes at 6.30 or doesn't allow you on Sundays. I don't jump so it doesn't affect me, but I would not board at a facility which doesn't let me jump on my own if I did. The guest rules don't seem unreasonable...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PaintedHeart

Around here the ''no jumping outside of lessons" is pretty standard, due to insurance and liability issues. Some of the others are a little strict but *mostly* reasonable, but it's the no riding after 6:30 and no riding on Sundays that would be a deal breaker for me. My lessons are usually later in the evening (7 or so) or on the weekends due to scheduling conflicts/work/school.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

churumbeque said:


> I think what we are forgetting is that the Op is not boarder. it sounds like she is just doing a part-time lease and doesn't have the right to be there on the days that she is not leasing that horse
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm not forgetting. She's being made to follow the boarder's rules and she's 1/2 leasing a horse (I'm assuming she's paying for 1/2 care...so she's 1/2 boarder?) and taking lessons on the place. I just feel like it's odd to tell her she can't come out and clean tack, organize her tack room, stuff like that. If the other 1/2 lessor is out with the horse or taking a lesson, then I would make it very clear she and her son are NOT to disturb that person or that person's time with their horse in any way and I'd react accordingly if they did. Again, the atmosphere that I'm used to is very different than this barn's and I wouldn't care for it. 

I still take lessons and when I do, I'm welcome to hang out all day if I want to. Or if I want to talk to the trainer on a non-lesson day, I'm always welcome at the farm. 

I've never had appointments required just to visit. ESPECIALLY if I have a horse in full time training, I insist on being able to drop in and watch the training, unannounced. Anyone who will not allow that, will not train my horse. It's a HUGE red flag for me that a trainer cannot be trusted if I can't drop in unannounced.


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## EdmontonHorseGal

this thread reminds me of a blog i read recently, and one sentence in that blog jumped out and hit the nail on the head as far as how stables used to be:

""when I got my first horse I was completely unsupervised. I was a feral child at the public boarding stable"

here's the blog in case anyone wants to read it. i had me a good giggle on some parts: Life with Horses: And I Lived to Tell About It

As for the OP's barn rules, i'd not even take lessons there personally. If i can't even stop by without appointment to grab my phone that i may have forgotten in the tack room earlier in the day or the day prior when i was there for a lesson, that's a bit ridiculous. if i can't come see my horse on a tuesday evening after work because i work til 5, come home and make supper for my family, then want some barn time, i can't. nope, i would not board there.

i understand the no jumping, everyone signs a waiver, etc rules, those are in place due to the sue happy society we have become. sad but true.


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## Corporal

When I ran my riding business, NOT on my property, DH (atty) wrote me a 1/3 page waiver for students. It quickly grew to one page. I won't ever teach lessons on my own property bc of fear of legal retaliation. You are lucky that anybody is gracious enough to let you keep your horse on their property.
That being said, Once you start delineating all of the things you do not want boarders to do, it's easy to miss the one that could have been listed and it is how someone is seriously injured. How about, don't touch, play, get anywhere near where extra jump equipment is stored. Someone retrieves say, a glove, that was tight and snapped off and flew into the storage area--yeah, that CAN happen, at least to me--then reaches down to retrieve, pulls back and rips the back of their hand open on a pin that holds a jump cup. THAT wasn't in any of your list of rules.
I'm with DreamcatcherArabians. List and post your rules everywhere, everybody signs waivers, but "Ride at your own Risk" is the most important rule of the barn.
If I was that worried about people visiting my property I wouldn't have 25+ friends/relatives coming to my October 11th "Salsa Party", where we drink heavy, graze all day, and stay up til we drop, AND burn a big pile of wood stuff. Nobody signs any waivers...but dogs are welcome.


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## stevenson

some of these new rules may because of insurance compliance. not all states have good laws to protect a trainer or property owner and thus the reason for no riding after dark, no jumping unless with a trainer . There are barns here closed for 2 days in a row usually sun and mon, BO needs time off. It also sounds like there have been some past issues and maybe some law suits at this place. Could have been some thefts from visitors, or an outside trainer insulting someone. This is strict, and if you cannot abide by the rules, then you should find another horse to half lease at another barn.


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## mylilpony4u

The BOs comments are that since it is a hunter/jumper show barn there are people there with show horses ($$). And they cant have people just coming on to the property as they wish (yes, I understand you dont want people that dont ride there, but i have been there for years). Even though I 1/2 lease the horse I am only leasing him for Tues/Thur/Sat so those are the only days I pay to be allowed access to the barn. Yes I know I don't have access to the horse on other days that's a given. But if I want to do other things (clean, enjoy watching others..) on Mon or Fri since I don't have time after work other then to ride because they close early they why cant I. We will see how this all goes


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## Zexious

^I have ridden at a number (Ok... 3... xD) of pretty prestigious (A/AA) H/J show barns, and none of them have had rules as stringent at this. I think they are just being anal...


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## churumbeque

mylilpony4u said:


> The BOs comments are that since it is a hunter/jumper show barn there are people there with show horses ($$). And they cant have people just coming on to the property as they wish (yes, I understand you dont want people that dont ride there, but i have been there for years). Even though I 1/2 lease the horse I am only leasing him for Tues/Thur/Sat so those are the only days I pay to be allowed access to the barn. Yes I know I don't have access to the horse on other days that's a given. But if I want to do other things (clean, enjoy watching others..) on Mon or Fri since I don't have time after work other then to ride because they close early they why cant I. We will see how this all goes


that's The point Maybe others don't want you watching them. lessons are private and not for just anybody to watch. My guess is the tack goes with the horse so you wouldn't have access to it on the opposite days. I also don't believe you clarified if these rules apply to reg. Boarders. My guess is they dont.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mylilpony4u

no tack does not go with the horse we have our own for both of us. people watch me ride all the time it is a arena with no walls...


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## franknbeans

OP-since the BM/trainer is not obeying the rules (i.e. turning horses out in the arena when BO is not looking) it is my opinion that there WILL be a blowup, trainer will be shown the door, and you and son will have a 1/2 lease and no trainer. Personally-I would shortcut the process and leave sooner, rather than waiting until the stuff hits the fan and you are forced to.


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## DuckDodgers

mylilpony4u said:


> what they seem to be telling me is unless you board you need to make an appointment (lesson taker or guest, all the same to them) Seems strange we are not strangers at all been there for years. But now that we are in a lease I am being told that myself and Son can only come on the arranged days or we need to make an appointment. Im confused now, yes I know I can only ride on the days we agreed (horse is used in lesson program still) but if I want to come out and clean my tack or organize my locker, I have to make an appointment. The barn is under new ownership maybe this is why, ugh.


Now that I have a chance to read this thread in its entirety, the rules are sounding even more restrictive. I would definitely not stick around at this place, though the hour restrictions would have ruled it out to begin with. Just because you're "only" half leasing a horse (still paying a ton of money!!) doesn't mean that you're a second class citizen. Whoever is riding the horse in the lesson program is entitled to their privacy and their right to spend time with the horse, but you being on the property doesn't necessarily inhibit that. So, you give them their space when you're there. What if you want to stop by and pick up your saddle to clean for a show? You should be well within your right to do it without having to make an appointment! If it were me, I would back out of the lease and move to a new lesson barn. If I was boarding my horse there I would be leaving as well. I would let them know that their regulations are too strict for my liking, so I'm needing to move to a more relaxed atmosphere.


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## KigerQueen

where my fiance works EVERYONE has to sign a waver, but they are out at the barn so its a nonissue. During the summer everyone needs to be out by 9pm because of the lights being on (people complain about the lights after a certain time). 

No one cares what anyone dose in the arena. If you kill yourself or your horse, thats on you. Most people are weekend worriers though so thats a nonissue as well.

My fiance is the stable manager and he CAN move the horses. He wont move them to a more expensive stall but he can move to a cheaper one when it floods (in az we get no rain but when we do its fetlock deep).


where im at there are "rules" but no one fallows them. the barn is self governed so that can fix and cause issues. The only turnouts at both places IS the arena but where im at im lucky to get the arena to ride. So i agree with the no turnout in arena. BO also dose not care when you come out to see the horses. I can come out at 1am and he could care less, just dont wake him up.



Sooo would i ever board at that barn? HELL NO! 6:30pm is WAY to early to close up! i can understand 10pm but 6? and i dont like the idea that i cant see my horse on a sunday, that is weird to me.


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## farmpony84

A lot of it sounds like insurance purpose but some of it would have me walking away from the place.



mylilpony4u said:


> Hello
> 
> 1. All guests must sign a wavier even if not ridding
> Sounds like insurance reasoning
> 
> 2. If you don't have a horse on the property you can not be on the property unless you are in a lesson
> A little over the top but ... ok ... barn rules
> 
> 3. For none boarders, all none lessons visits need to be by appointment only, even if coming to watch others ride/say "hi"
> A little over the top but ... ok ... barn rules
> 
> 4. No evening riding even though there are arena lights, you are not allowed to turn on, only trainer can
> This would irritate me. If I'm paying to board at a facility, I want to ride when it's convenient for me. Day or Night. I did board at a place that had a lights out at 8PM rule, however the owner did let us bend on occasion.
> 
> 5. No jumping unless it is in a lesson even with your own horse (adults also)
> This would irritate me for the same reasons above. I could see them asking a person to test out to be allowed to jump.
> 
> 6. No boarders allowed to be on property after 6:30pm
> Nope. I'd never board at a place that didn't allow me to see my horse anytime I want, especially since most people work a full 40 and would have very little time to ride before 630
> 
> 7. Sunday barn is closed no one allowed on property
> Nope. I'd never board at a place that didn't allow me to see my horse anytime I want, especially since most people work a full 40 and would have very little time to ride before 630
> 
> 8. No turn outs in arena
> I've seen this before.
> 
> 9. Trainer can move your horse to a different stall if there are manner issues, even if stall costs more if its the only option available.
> I guess I can see this one
> 
> 10. Before you have someone handle/ride your horse other then yourself the facility needs to approve first
> This one seems stupid, but I can see it. Insurance and fear of being sued is probably the reason behind it.
> 
> 11.Guest can only come during lesson times
> ...Ok... I guess


 This barn would be a no for me.


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## STT GUY

Corporal said:


> When I ran my riding business, NOT on my property, DH (atty) wrote me a 1/3 page waiver for students. It quickly grew to one page. I won't ever teach lessons on my own property bc of fear of legal retaliation.* You are lucky that anybody is gracious enough to let you keep your horse on their property.*
> That being said, Once you start delineating all of the things you do not want boarders to do, it's easy to miss the one that could have been listed and it is how someone is seriously injured. How about, don't touch, play, get anywhere near where extra jump equipment is stored. Someone retrieves say, a glove, that was tight and snapped off and flew into the storage area--yeah, that CAN happen, at least to me--then reaches down to retrieve, pulls back and rips the back of their hand open on a pin that holds a jump cup. THAT wasn't in any of your list of rules.
> I'm with DreamcatcherArabians. List and post your rules everywhere, everybody signs waivers, but "Ride at your own Risk" is the most important rule of the barn.
> If I was that worried about people visiting my property I wouldn't have 25+ friends/relatives coming to my October 11th "Salsa Party", where we drink heavy, graze all day, and stay up til we drop, AND burn a big pile of wood stuff. Nobody signs any waivers...but dogs are welcome.


Business owners aren't lucky to have customers, we keep them in business and having customers is a privilege, not a burden or nuisance. 

I understand the liability thing, my wife and I owned a business which taught high-performance motorcycle riding on racetracks where speeds of over 150 (and that's MPH for you metric folks) were the norm. However we remained sensitive to the needs of the customer and placed them before our own...and retired at 46. The closed on Sunday thing is just **** poor customer service. I'd organize everyone in the barn who is unhappy over this and pressure the owner to modify the policy or leave for greener pastures.


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## Iseul

I wouldn't board there, I don't care if it cost me $5/month.

I don't get out to the barn until 7 and don't leave until 9-10. Sometimes I work until 9 and I'll go out after. As long as no one gets woke up and I'm not being obnoxious, I will go to the barn anytime I please. For the most part though, I do try to avoid going at ungodly hours.

If I want to jump my horse, I will do so. I'm not a jumper and neither is my mare, but she is MY mare, and I'll do what I please with her.

Also, if I want to bring a newbie friend with me (or anyone for that matter), I'm okay with a waiver (almost expect it) and a text or call letting BO know I'll be bringing someone out, but for the BO to approve them using MY horse? I don't think so, I'll put whoever I wish on my horse, she is mine.

I'm surprised there isn't a helmet rule along with all that. I won't board where adults are mandated to wear a helmet, it is my head after all.

I'd be gone before I was ever there with those rules.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Golden Horse

Katz1411 said:


> At the risk of sounding like a codger reminiscing about the 'good ol' days', this is so different than when us old folks started riding . When I started as a kid, I was dropped at the barn in the am or right after school every day, picked up in the evening after feeding time. We rode our horses hell-bent-for-leather all over the property and jumped everything in sight, in almost any weather. After we rode our horses and did all the grooming/tacking and untacking we'd spend the day exercising and grooming the BO's obnoxious ponies, cleaned stalls, cleaned tack, set up jumps, etc. and had slumber parties in the hayloft. We'd hang around and watch shoeing, worming, foaling and gelding. We went to shows, clinics, pony club rallies pretty much on our own. I had pony club once a week and a private lesson once a week but was otherwise unsupervised. Even so, I can't imagine our parents suing over a fall/injury, and there were no waivers to sign. It's too bad it's now otherwise - some parents want guarantees and to bubble-wrap their child, other parents/riders just want to win the lawsuit lottery or get vindictive and want some sort of revenge for the least bump or scrape.


Ahh the good old days right enough, taught us to work hard, play hard and stick on anything like glue. I never had my own pony so competition was great to be the hardest worker, or the best rider, because then you got picked to go to shows, or BLISS, the ponies were hot shod a couple of times a year, and that was before mobile forges, so we got to ride to the forge, 2 hours, hang around all day while they were shod, in that fairy land place of smoke, black walls, low beams, and roaring furnace, then ride 2 hours home again all for free!!!


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## stevenson

I did not allow outside riders at my place when I boarded horses. I am not training barn etc, and liability ins to costly to allow any yahoo friend of the boarders out here. She could lead the horse off the property and let whomever ride. 
I came home one day to find her , her sister, mother, etc, Parked in an area that there was to be no vehicles , My chairs drug all over the place, because they could not walk the 200 ft to the arena do to being obese. I don't care who they were, may chairs got broken not replaced, she cracked an irrigation line , hanging on the gates , riding and jumping with no helmet or saddles , chasing other horses in the arena. Slapping at my dogs with sticks. 
She was gone. I will never let another person on my property with an attitude that they don't have to follow the rules, or that it's their horse and they will do what they want. Not on my property.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

Iseul said:


> I wouldn't board there, I don't care if it cost me $5/month.
> 
> I don't get out to the barn until 7 and don't leave until 9-10. Sometimes I work until 9 and I'll go out after. As long as no one gets woke up and I'm not being obnoxious, I will go to the barn anytime I please. For the most part though, I do try to avoid going at ungodly hours.
> 
> If I want to jump my horse, I will do so. I'm not a jumper and neither is my mare, but she is MY mare, and I'll do what I please with her.
> 
> Also, if I want to bring a newbie friend with me (or anyone for that matter), I'm okay with a waiver (almost expect it) and a text or call letting BO know I'll be bringing someone out, but for the BO to approve them using MY horse? I don't think so, I'll put whoever I wish on my horse, she is mine.
> 
> I'm surprised there isn't a helmet rule along with all that. I won't board where adults are mandated to wear a helmet, it is my head after all.
> 
> I'd be gone before I was ever there with those rules.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


As a barn owner, you wouldn't last a month on my place, simply because of your attitude. The first time I saw someone besides you on your horse on MY PROPERTY where I pay HUGE insurance already, I would let you know that your stall was no longer available to you and that you needed to move. I don't permit outside riders either and it's because of the liability for that person's injury. You're welcome to take the horse off the end of the driveway and let your friend ride all over the neighborhood, but if they don't own a horse and board with me, they may not ride on my property. PERIOD.

For boarders who work late and want to swing by after 9 pm, when I close for the night, I'm perfectly ok with that as long as we've arranged it before the first time. After that, it's arranged, it's not a problem. Same thing for those who'd prefer to come at 6 am, just arrange it first.


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## tinyliny

BugZapper89 said:


> Katz, these days I really wish some of the kids/young adults would remove their helmets, as they really do need a good pile driving to knock some sense into them, or knock the attitude out.



we all know how great a concussion works to sort out a bad attitude. Was that your personal experience?


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## franknbeans

Iseul-I sure hope you have your own liability insurance as well, since even tho they are your "friends" I will guarantee that if something happens you will be on the hook, waiver or not. They have no control who their insurance company goes after, and in many areas waivers are not worth the paper they are written on when something tragic happens.


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## NBEventer

You're darn right I need to approve who gets on someones horse. As the property owner, even with a liability form signed I can still be sued if someone gets hurt. 

I'm also not going to be sued because you want to jump your horse outside a lesson and get hurt. 

A lot of these rules come down to insurance. Do you know how much extra insurance is for someone to jump outside a lesson? Unless you want to cover that extra few thousand a year for me so you can jump outside a lesson or let Joe Blow ride your horse, you will be following the rules I have in place because of insurance.

I'm not going to get onto the topic of the helmet thing. But that comes down to insurance as well.


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## jaydee

In todays 'sue them' for everything society I can understand a lot of the rules they have in place - sadly we no longer live in 'The Good Olde Dayes'
The hours - no entry after 6.30 or on Sundays would make it a big no for me and the only reasoning I can see for that is that the BO wants that time for herself which is never going to work in the horse boarding business when you can be on the yard from the early hours of the morning till late at night to accommodate clients if you want to make a living out of it. I assume her insurance states that the owner or a manager/person in charge in her absence has to be in the barn whenever boarders or riders are there
OP - Unfortunately she is the one that makes the rules which she'll either sink or swim by - you probably have only two options - 'Put up and shut up or move' 
I would be moving


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## sunnyone

It does sound like you are in a bit of a pickle. I boarded for over 20 years in many different places. It sounds like the new owners are worried about liabilities. I also would need evening hours and another part that would bother me is that the trainer can move your horse to another stall even if it costs more. I have boarded at places where Monday would be a day off several times because I really liked the facility, but eventually it ended up bugging me.


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## DuckDodgers

One thing that comes to mind on the topic of barn closing hours... A friend of mine recently had a horse with a fungal infection in his eye that required treatment with eye drops four times a day for at least two months (I don't remember how long exactly). Going from 6.30 in the evening until when the barn manager did the meds in the morning and it's likely that the infection would have taken twice as long to heal if it even healed at all. Not being able to do them from 6.30 on Saturday night until Monday morning just wouldn't fly. She was there after 10 on a daily basis to give him his meds, and on many occasions came by after midnight when her late evening shift got off at work to do them. 

Now, that barn is pretty laid back and never had a closing time, though people have always been reasonable about showing up at strange hours to ride their horses. The latest my friend would ever get there to ride was at 8 and leave by 10 as a courtesy to the family. The barn owner would come out to check on things when someone got there late, so my friend informed him that she would be out late for the next few months. No big deal. I like to think that most barn owners would be reasonable and understanding about the situation and allow a boarder there after hours for that kind of thing, but I wonder if these crazy folks would... 

Also, I agree with STT Guy about the "privilege" thing. If you're running a boarding business then your livelihood is based on your clients and their business. If you want your weekends and evenings free to chill in the barn in your underwear, then a boarding/training business doesn't sound like the place for you. It's one thing to have a reasonable expectation of privacy (no boarders snooping around in your house) and to not have people yelling and blaring music in the arena at midnight when you're sleeping, but otherwise you need to be reasonable. Rules in place for insurance reasons are one thing (though I would still avoid a barn because of some of them), but catering to your customers' needs is necessary in all businesses. Horse boarding is no exception.


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## verona1016

Wow those are definitely some strict rules. I recently went to go look at a barn that I thought was strict (arena closes at 7:30pm, barn closes at 8pm, closed all day Monday, must clean your tack after each ride) but this one really takes the cake. I'd only board my horse there if there were no other option.


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## Iseul

Dreamcatcher, I've talked to three of my previous barn owners and along with the signs, waivers, and their insurance anyone can ride on their property, and jump.

I didn't ask how much they paid, but the majority of barns around my area do not have very many rules at all. I'm sure if it all came down to insurance it'd be costly to allow boarders use of the trails due to whatever is out there.

I don't have an attitude about it (or maybe I do because this is how I grew up and how it still is in my area), but it is my horse and I pay to use the facilities, be they for me or a friend. Of course, I'm not going to be sending a non-rider over 4ft jumps on my mare, but there's nothing wrong with putting them on the lungeline or letting them walk around a little bit in an arena.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DuckDodgers

Iseul said:


> Dreamcatcher, I've talked to three of my previous barn owners and along with the signs, waivers, and their insurance anyone can ride on their property, and jump.
> 
> I didn't ask how much they paid, but the majority of barns around my area do not have very many rules at all. I'm sure if it all came down to insurance it'd be costly to allow boarders use of the trails due to whatever is out there.
> 
> I don't have an attitude about it (or maybe I do because this is how I grew up and how it still is in my area), but it is my horse and I pay to use the facilities, be they for me or a friend. Of course, I'm not going to be sending a non-rider over 4ft jumps on my mare, but there's nothing wrong with putting them on the lungeline or letting them walk around a little bit in an arena.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think that the cost and availability of insurance may depend on the poster's area. Around here I also know of almost no barns that forbid jumping outside of lessons.


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## Bo20

For many reasons, that wouldn't be the barn for me. I don't like a single day away from my horse and I wouldn't like any full closing days. Closing times can be reasonable. My barn closes at 9/10 p.m. However I know I can check on my horse any day I want. I would run from that place, OP.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

Iseul said:


> Dreamcatcher, I've talked to three of my previous barn owners and along with the signs, waivers, and their insurance anyone can ride on their property, and jump.
> 
> I didn't ask how much they paid, but the majority of barns around my area do not have very many rules at all. I'm sure if it all came down to insurance it'd be costly to allow boarders use of the trails due to whatever is out there.
> 
> I don't have an attitude about it (or maybe I do because this is how I grew up and how it still is in my area), but it is my horse and I pay to use the facilities, be they for me or a friend. Of course, I'm not going to be sending a non-rider over 4ft jumps on my mare, but there's nothing wrong with putting them on the lungeline or letting them walk around a little bit in an arena.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I don't have jump materials here on the farm, but if I were that kind of barn, unless my insurance specifically forbid it I would not care when a person jumped. Under 18 would have to be supervised, but that's pretty much required for under 18 on a horse anymore. But my insurance specifically states I'm not insured for outside events or riders, so in my rules it says, "NO outside riders.". It's not negotiable and I make it very clear right from the beginning. If someone has a problem with it, this isn't the place for them. The first time I saw a boarder with someone who didn't also board here up on their horse, they would be asked to leave. PERIOD. I'm not losing my whole farm because someone decided to break the rules and their friend gets injured and sues ME because I own the place and have deeper pockets than the "friend" who put them up on the horse in the first place. 

So when you say, "I Pay for it and I'll do whatever I please", that's an attitude and you would not be welcome here. I hand pick my very few boarders and I'm very particular who I allow to bring their horse here. We have no drama and everyone gets along and follows the rules. In return, their horses get very well cared for and I'm almost always available to help them if they run into a problem.


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## mylilpony4u

Thank you everyone for all the comments and insight
I think we will try it for the next few months and see how it goes
Maybe the BO will change a few things or not. The barn is one of the more pricey ones in the area.
The grounds and stables are amazing but it is at least 50% empty right now, so there might be a reason.
If we were to lease another horse and take a weekly lesson just a few miles away it would be around $125 less.
Plus that barn is open 7 days a week and evenings riding/lesson, which is nice when its hot hot hot in TX!


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## NBEventer

No one is allowed to sit on or handle a horse on my property unless they have their provincial insurance. Not even my own family. Provincial insurance covers them if they get hurt, and covers my butt if they get hurt.

My insurance policy is much more manageable because of this rule. My insurance does not cover people jumping outside a lesson.

I run a pretty laid back and easy going place. But these few rules are deal breakers. You break them, you are gone. Its a one strike, you're out. I have it written into my board agreement so its not like people are unaware.

As Dreamcatcher said, these are things that cost the BO money, not the boarder. If someone wants to sue it comes down on the barn owner. If you don't want rules, then buy your own property.


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## AQHSam

If I am understanding the OP correctly, it appears that the rules may have changed since they started leasing a horse, opposed to taking lessons on a lesson horse. While I think (most of) the rules are completely out of line, I wonder if the rules in this case are because of the lease horse itself. Maybe it is not a full lease? A shared lease? Continued lesson horse? Maybe these specific rules have more to do with the property of the horse and less about the barn itself.


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## DuckDodgers

AQHSam said:


> If I am understanding the OP correctly, it appears that the rules may have changed since they started leasing a horse, opposed to taking lessons on a lesson horse. While I think (most of) the rules are completely out of line, I wonder if the rules in this case are because of the lease horse itself. Maybe it is not a full lease? A shared lease? Continued lesson horse? Maybe these specific rules have more to do with the property of the horse and less about the barn itself.


If I interpreted correctly, she's been riding in lessons at this barn and started half leasing a horse. The place went under new management after the lease started, and then these crazy rules were put in place. I also gathered that these rules apply to everyone who does not own/have full control over a horse in the barn.



mylilpony4u said:


> Thank you everyone for all the comments and insight
> I think we will try it for the next few months and see how it goes
> Maybe the BO will change a few things or not. The barn is one of the more pricey ones in the area.
> The grounds and stables are amazing but it is at least 50% empty right now, so there might be a reason.
> If we were to lease another horse and take a weekly lesson just a few miles away it would be around $125 less.
> Plus that barn is open 7 days a week and evenings riding/lesson, which is nice when its hot hot hot in TX!


I would be willing to bet that these rules are why the place is empty. Was it filled before the rules were put in place? If so, that speaks for itself. If I was at a barn that suddenly said I wasn't allowed out on Sunday then I'd be out in a heartbeat. Doesn't really matter how good the place is unless I had nowhere else to go! Since you're limited in what days you can ride due to it being a half lease that may not be a deal breaker for you, but maybe so.

Does the new barn have comparable, or at least adequate, facilities to suit your needs? If so, I'd consider going over and talking to them. Perhaps sign up for a few lessons and look into potential leases. Ask them about what rules they have for people who board, full lease, half lease, and take lessons. If you like the place, then think about making a move. If you're really interested in giving this place another chance then I'd sit down and make a list of the problems you have with it. Think about what rules you can live with, and what rules you can't live with. I'd then arrange for a conversation with the new barn manager to talk about the new rules. Don't be rude or hostile about it, but bring up the issues you have with the rules you can't live with. Remember, some of them will likely be non negotiable such as the jumping outside of lessons thing. If she gets mad and blows up at you then that would make my decision to leave. If she won't budge in the areas where you aren't flexible, then think about leaving. If she's willing to work with you, then you may have hope.


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## Chasin Ponies

Agree with others that this barn is probably half empty because of these excessively strict rules. That, and being one of the most pricey stables available! Sounds like a control freak is making the rules and they will continue to lose business-maybe they will figure it out, maybe not.

If I were you I'd cancel the lease and find a different stable. Let them know that with the new restrictions you are no _longer getting your money's worth_. Barn owners often forget that we are into horses because it's our relaxing, down time, _not _to be watched, mis-trusted and nagged at all the time! They also sometimes forget that they don't _own_ the horses they board.

Look around at the other stables in your area. Change is always scary but once you move you'll probably realize how ridiculous and restrictive the rules at this other barn are.


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## cebee

While I understand the BO needing time and privacy ( I am guessing that accounts for the No Sundays or After 6:30pm rules) in my experience ( and I have boarded at 3 places over the years...) if the BO was out and about, that was the time to make horse chit chat, talk about non-emergency stuff... if they were in the house, or their back yard... I only interrupt them for something that needs to be talked about NOW. If that is their issue, maybe a rule specific to evenings and Sundays they are not to be disturbed except for things that cannot wait. ( of course to some people, a missing girth falls into the 'cannot wait' category..)

I leased ( briefly ) and do remember the girl ( maybe 10?) that 'shared' the other half of his lease, being very annoying, in the way that only 10 year old know everything girls can be! =) She was apparently at the barn.. always... all summer. Corrected every thing I did with the horse. So I kind of understand the rule about only being at the barn during YOUR lease times. YOU may feel you are only hanging out, cleaning tack, but i am sure having people there during their non-lease times can crowd things up. 

I expect some of these rules were made as a result of situations that arose at some point. But definitely over kill, and I would not stay there. Do we know if the rules are enforced? Or are they just there ' in case'?


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## HorseyHappy

mylilpony4u said:


> Hello
> 
> 1. All guests must sign a wavier even if not ridding
> 2. If you don't have a horse on the property you can not be on the property unless you are in a lesson
> 3. For none boarders, all none lessons visits need to be by appointment only, even if coming to watch others ride/say "hi"
> 4. No evening riding even though there are arena lights, you are not allowed to turn on, only trainer can
> 5. No jumping unless it is in a lesson even with your own horse (adults also)
> 6. No boarders allowed to be on property after 6:30pm
> 7. Sunday barn is closed no one allowed on property
> 8. No turn outs in arena
> 9. Trainer can move your horse to a different stall if there are manner issues, even if stall costs more if its the only option available.
> 10. Before you have someone handle/ride your horse other then yourself the facility needs to approve first
> 11.Guest can only come during lesson times
> 
> Some of them aren't too bad but I do find some a little over the top, anyone else have to deal with any of these


Sound to me like 1 & 2 contradict each other, 1 states guests must sign a wavier even if not riding and 2 says it not riding and dont own a horse you cant be there!? As for 4,5,6,7 & 10 I would see them as personal choices that you as the horse owner can make. The hours are very restrictive as are the riding restrictions. Cant say i would want to keep a horse there.


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## luvmydrafts

yes some of the rules seem way over the top to me but there is something way worse than the rules themselves, they are not the main problem they are only a symptom of the real problem and this is your new BO...

these rule changes and the BO's unfriendliness is a huge red flag that you got to get out of there ASAP... things are going to get ugly with someone like this in charge...This is the kind of BO that can become...no not become, IS... a witch and drama queen...you already saw how she treated that one guest...that was a potential customer any normal sane business owner would be falling over backwards to be courteous as soon as they saw she was legit but look how she acted...she sounds to me like a control freak and a micromanager, the kind you avoid like the plague...you couldn't PAY me to keep my horses in a place like this...biggest warning sign in the world...There is going to be trouble if you stick around, just wait for it...ppl like this BO make everyone in their domain miserable and scared...except maybe their few favourites, and these can change...


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## NBEventer

She sounds like a BO who only wants the boarders who are "kept women" and don't need to work. They show up, ride their pretty ponies their husbands bought them to keep them entertained while they are away on business doing goodness only knows what. Hence the hours and crazy rules. She doesn't want kids around, and she doesn't want lesson students around.


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## LadyChevalier

The two rules, #4 and #6 seem to clash. If horse boarders/horse owners cant be on the property after 6:30 then why bother say they cant ride in the evening even if the barn lights are on? It makes no sense to me, the only time it gets dark before 6:30 is in the winter when days are shorter. And if i was boarding there and in the winter i couldnt ride my horse at five cuz it was dark out, it would seriously peeve me... and i would probably leave almost immediately if i could.

Anyway I agree with everyone else. These rules are just too restrictive to be able to really enjoy your horse. OP i say you should end your lease with this horse and find a new barn, im sure you and your son will be happier with a barn that is less restrictive on visitation and facility usage. 

The new owners will learn soon enough when their clients start disappearing and their barn is empty that they made a big mistake for being so over the top with their new barn rules or, perhaps this is what they want. Maybe they want their barn to be client free so they can do whatever with the property, who knows.


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## darkpony

1. All guests must sign a wavier even if not ridding*-Understandable. *
2. If you don't have a horse on the property you can not be on the property unless you are in a lesson*-This one also makes sense, but as a boarder of 2 horses, I often have friends come out and ride with me. IMHO NO ONE will tell me who and when I can have someone ride MY OWN horse. *
3. For none boarders, all none lessons visits need to be by appointment only, even if coming to watch others ride/say "hi"
4. No evening riding even though there are arena lights, you are not allowed to turn on, only trainer can*-I work nights, which means I sleep days. No way I would EVER board at a place that has lights and does not let me use them. What am I paying board for if I cant use the lights? *
5. No jumping unless it is in a lesson even with your own horse (adults also)*-No. I will do what ever I please with my horse. I dont own my horse so other people can tell me what I cant/can do. If I wanted that I would not own a horse. *
6. No boarders allowed to be on property after 6:30pm*-Again, I would never board at a place that tells me when I can see my horse. How about I figure out how many hours a month my horse is not accessable to me, then subtract that amount from my board bill every month? *
7. Sunday barn is closed no one allowed on property *^^Sundays too? When can I see my horse? 
*8. No turn outs in arena-
9. Trainer can move your horse to a different stall if there are manner issues, even if stall costs more if its the only option available.*WOW. *
10. Before you have someone handle/ride your horse other then yourself the facility needs to approve first. *I would be so beyond frustrated with this barn. Every thing about these rules is just plain wrong. I would leave and never look back. WAY too many restrictions for me! *
11.Guest can only come during lesson times
*MY guests can come and visit my horse whenever I am at the barn. If these BOs want privacy, perhaps they should think about downsizing to just their personal horses.*

Honestly the only one that is even reasonable is #1.


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## Regula

Yeah, wouldn't be my kind of barn either. I understand rules, and I definitely try to be respectful of other people's privacy (e.g. BO living on the property) and belongings. But I ride because I enjoy it, and if I have to tippy-toe around to make sure I don't get kicked out, that's hardly fun anymore.

I've boarded at quite a few barns, and IMO, each barn develops its own culture pretty quickly. The barns with the strictest rules were certainly not the ones where the least amount of negative things happened.

Insurance is always a good excuse, but if risk mitigation is becoming so restrictive that it stops being fun, there's not much point to owning and paying for a horse.

My current barn has few rules apart from the basic ones, yet things run quite smoothly there. E.g. there are no set barn hours, yet everybody knows the BM lives on site. So if a car were to pull up in the middle of the night, the dogs would start barking (we're at the end of a dead-end road), making it hard not to get noticed. Unless it's an emergency, everyone just naturally leaves by about 9, even though it's not posted. Kind of like as a guest, you know when it's time to leave without the host kicking you out.
I preder to be treated like a guest and cuatomer rather than an intruder.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Palomine

Weekends are sometimes only time owners can get out there. Monday would be a better down day, due to that.

No extra people I can understand slightly, and can understand riding waiver, but they don't mention unruly kids, or dogs?

But most people shut down barn activities at 9pm or so. This does seem over the top.


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## RegularJoe

NBEventer said:


> If you don't want rules, then buy your own property.


Well, I don't think anyone is really saying that this BO can't have the rules she wants. The question is whether you would board there. 

The things that are liability concerns I can understand, but not all of that is liability related. The very restricted hours and Sunday closings would be a deal-breaker for me. When are people supposed to ride?


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## gingerscout

I'm getting the feeling this barn made those rules because the new barn owner was trying to get people to leave to make the barn private, maybe they didn't have the nerve to tell people boarding would be running out or something, so they made some outrageous rules so people would get fed up and leave, but just an idea


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## NBEventer

RegularJoe said:


> Well, I don't think anyone is really saying that this BO can't have the rules she wants. The question is whether you would board there.
> 
> The things that are liability concerns I can understand, but not all of that is liability related. The very restricted hours and Sunday closings would be a deal-breaker for me. When are people supposed to ride?



My comment wasnt directed at the OP. Ive agreed some of these rules are over the top.


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## Houston

Way, way too strict. The no Sunday/Evening riding and no visitors is a HUGE no go for me. I wouldn't consider this barn if it was across the street from my house and free. If my barn picked up these rules I'd be gone within a matter of days (hours?).


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## Acco

I could handle most of the restrictions, but deal breakers for me would be no riding on Sunday or after 6:30, and the no jumping outside of a lesson policies.

I think it is totally reasonable to not allow people to jump *their* horse outside of a lesson - my barn has the same policy for people leasing a school horse, and I understand it - but I want to be able to jump my own horse.

It all depends on what is important to you to determine if any of these are deal breakers.


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## Saddlebag

You didn't say how many boarders are there but it might be time to get everyone together to discuss the rules with the BO, a united front.


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## BreezylBeezyl

lol.

How are working class adults, and even students, supposed get out to ride their horses?

This is just ridiculous, no questions asked.


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## plomme

While I'm sure these rules are logical in some circumstances and some people would be fine with them, I would never board at a place like this. More specific comments:

1. All guests must sign a wavier even if not ridding

Fine, if waivers are always available and you don't have to go hunt someone down for them every time.

2. If you don't have a horse on the property you can not be on the property unless you are in a lesson

Are there people hanging out all the time being disruptive or something? Is it a huge barn? Because at my barn we have visitors come by all the time and it's really nice. I can understand this rule in some situations, but I wouldn't want to board at a place where this was an issue.

3. For none boarders, all none lessons visits need to be by appointment only, even if coming to watch others ride/say "hi"

See above.

4. No evening riding even though there are arena lights, you are not allowed to turn on, only trainer can

So who can ride here? Working adults with regular hours can't. Even most kids need to ride in the evenings because that's when their parents can take them. 

5. No jumping unless it is in a lesson even with your own horse (adults also)

I don't jump, but I wouldn't be okay with any barn owner telling me how I can or can't ride my own horse.

6. No boarders allowed to be on property after 6:30pm

See above re: people with jobs. Unless this place is really trying to corner the independently wealthy/unemployed/night worker/stay-at-home mom market, this makes no sense. My barn is only open on evenings 2 or 3 weekdays and even that greatly limits people.

7. Sunday barn is closed no one allowed on property

Monday is a normal day to close a barn and totally fine. Sunday is not, especially when you already have rules that restrict access for people with standard work hours.

8. No turn outs in arena

What happens if there's an ice storm? If the paddocks are flooded? What happens if a horse has temporary sun sensitivity that means they can't have outdoor turnout? Not having exceptions for these sorts of situations would not work for me.

9. Trainer can move your horse to a different stall if there are manner issues, even if stall costs more if its the only option available.

I agree to pay a certain price and that's it. If you want to raise the price we need to talk about it first. If that's the only stall my horse will be okay in I should be given a month to try to find a different barn if I can't afford the new fee. I don't think it's fair to move my horse and then just hand me a higher bill with no discussion.

10. Before you have someone handle/ride your horse other then yourself the facility needs to approve first

I guess I can see this making sense if it's a riding school with a lot of kids or if people are bringing by their co-worker who's never been on a horse before to 'just try it!' or whatever, but in my barn this would be pretty invasive.

11.Guest can only come during lesson times

Guests of people who don't board, fine. But guests of boarders seems excessive. My parents live in another country and when they visit me we go see my horse just to say hi. If I'm doing some serious grooming sometimes my partner or a friend will come keep me company. I can see this being an issue if a teenage girl is bringing a bunch of friends around all the time but I think that can be handled individually.


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## Peanutbutter

What if I had a horse there who would need wound care on a sunday? What if my horse needed medication 4 times during a 24 hour time periode. 
This barn wouldn't be for me. I have never in my life been to a barn with that strict rules...


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