# 2nd day in the side reins- CRITIQUE



## LacyLove (Feb 12, 2009)

he looks great! i really like his frame


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## ShowJumpLife (Jan 17, 2009)

your side reins are far far far to low and tight.
especailly for his seacond day in them.
you want them to be there to encorage him to search for a contact not to hold him in one.
This is how they should be fitted. Note though that these are a TAD long as we were trying to get this mare long and low due to being a cronic star gazer.


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## chelssss(: (Jul 22, 2008)

ShowJumpLife said:


> your side reins are far far far to low and tight.


I didnt ad in the discription: he has had them on before. WIth his old owner before he was sent to the rescue i adopted him in. Its the second day with me working with him in them.


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## pepperduck (Feb 14, 2008)

chelssss(: said:


> I didnt ad in the discription: he has had them on before. WIth his old owner before he was sent to the rescue i adopted him in. Its the second day with me working with him in them.


They are still too tight. As it is right now you are basically just tying his head back.


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## MIEventer (Feb 15, 2009)

I agree, they are much to tight, not only that, but he does appear to be ribby.

It isn't about forcing him into a false frame - is it about encouraging him to engage his back end, lift his back, track up and drive into the bridle. 

Many people use side reins incorreclty. They are meant to replace your hands - while you on the ground is meant to replace what you would be doing in the saddle.


> he looks great! i really like his frame


His frame is very incorrect LacyLove. He is inverted, on the muscle, back is dropped, not tracking up, with hind end carried high. He is stiff and using all the incorrect muscles.

It isn't about forcing a frame...............

Side reins have to be used correctly, when used incorrectly - you are essentially going backwards instead of forward in training.

Your horse has to know how to remain at a steady fluid rhythm. You want to encourage their back end to move under them, you want to encourage tracking up, you want to encourage softness, suppleness. All the while, your horse not speeding up.

He has no topline, no hind end muscle. No balance, no ability to carry himself. I would take the side reins off all together, and just work on basic walk, trot, canter at a rhythmical pace.

Is he rideable? If so, I would get out on those trails and help him beef up that way as well.

Proper feed will also help with his physcial condition to become that well balanced, muscled up, centered horse 

He is lovely, he has a big heart and has expressive eyes. He looks to be very intelligent as well. What a sweetheart


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## chelssss(: (Jul 22, 2008)

Well he usually is VERY beefed up, he's a very muscular bodied TB, and he is rideable. But we're trying to expirement with his hind end, trying to engage more in his hip. The pictures are very desieving **spelling** because they were taken at the sunset and with my phone. He has ALOT of muscle, but because of the winter, we cant work as hard because where i live its so its hard to ride in the weather in my area. 

Also, the judges here are very different than in other areas. I was actually working with a professional for the past week with Bayberry, and this is exactly what he told me to do with him.


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## MIEventer (Feb 15, 2009)

But the "professional" should of showed you how to do it, worked with you and showed you how to keep your horse at a steady, consistant rhythm, while you engaged the back end - to lift the back, track up and soften at the poll.

Someone cannot just tell a "greenie" to lunging with sidereins - to just lunge with sidereins. Allot of "damage" can be done when done incorrectly.

It is like all those riders who go around holding their horses faces in while riding - same idea. Nothing good is coming out of it, and wrong muscles formed due to it......now having to take the horse and redo it all, correctly to build the muscles that should of been built in the first place.

Side reins are not for someone who doesn't know what they are doing, or how to do it.

You need someone there to help you - nothing wrong with that, we all have to learn and start somewhere.....

But remember, it is about what is best for your horse. 

What I would do - but I am no "professional" - is learn to ride in the saddle functionally 

seat to legs to hands to soften. And lunge without side reins.

Get out on the trails as well.


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## Skyhuntress (Sep 9, 2008)

I have to agree with the others, I'm afraid. What you've got going on right now with him will develop the incorrect muscles.

However, while I do think the side reins are a bit too tight, I don't think that that's the whole problem. You do want a degree of connection to his mouth with the sidereins, just as if you would when you are riding. Rather, I think that he is lacking any impulsion and forward movement. So what hes' doing is bracing against the sidereins, not lifting his back and just shuffling along. 
So what I would do is loosen them a bit (not to the degree that ShowJumpLife has, because I find that ineffective) but really concentrate on driving him forward. Give half halts through your lunge line. Lots of transitions to keep him off his forehand and if you can set up trot poles, those work great as well 

I also agree that he appears quite ribby and undermuscled. Maybe take a look at his feed-especially if you are working him more now, and tweak it a little bit? 
I think you'll have a lovely horse at the end of it 

(just as a sidenote, you might want to consider putting a saddlepad on underneath. that is exactly how I rubbed the heck out of one of my horse's withers )


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## onetoomany (Dec 10, 2008)

I agree with everyone in saying that the side reins are too tight. He being forced into frame and you can tell in the photos that his hind end is not engaged. He is not stepping under himself to the degree that he should be. In the second picture he is really bracing against those side reins, which he should not be doing. I agree with skyhuntress, do lots of half-halts, transitions and pop in some trot poles.

I would also agree with everyone in saying he is ribby. I doubt those photos are deceiving as a camera phone would reduce the clarity of what is captured, not increase depth and contrast. Plus he is bending to the inside and if you can see the ribs to the inside when he is bending to the inside, that is a good indication he needs weight. Also he appears to have a decent winter coat, another factor that should decrease the appearance of ribs.


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## morganshow11 (Dec 19, 2008)

I too agree with the others. It is FAR to tight.


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## cfesnoux (Dec 29, 2008)

Excuse me from straying from the topic but ShowJumpLife, I noticed not only your good looking horse but also the background! New Zealand eh? I am making it a goal to soon go there!! Looks like a fabulous place!


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## Spastic_Dove (Oct 4, 2007)

I also agree. Far too tight and defeating the purpose. Just because someone trains horses professionally doesn't mean they're doing it right  
Cute horse though


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## GSJCCrider (Feb 17, 2009)

And please, get a proffesional out to help you, before you injure you're horse!...


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## MIEventer (Feb 15, 2009)

She isn't injuring her horse at all. Come on guys.

She is only doing her best, and doing what she was told to do. She just needs help on how to do it differntly.


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## ~*~anebel~*~ (Aug 21, 2008)

It looks to me like the side reins are the correct length, they are just placed about 18-24 inches too low. Depending on the fitness of the horse and what you are trying to accomplish by lunging the horse you may want to re think your equipment choice.
I use side reins attached up near the withers in order to help my horse's feel of contact while lunging. I also use them a little lower when I'm working on developing higher collection like half steps and long lining work. He is already very strong and fit and the ground work I do with him is just to re-enforce what I'm doing in the saddle, so side reins are appropriate.
For this horse it looks like you are trying to develop muscle. For this the best thing is riding correctly from back to front and working on transitions transitions and balancing from the leg about 3-4 days a week with at least one half hour of forward, marching walk on a contact each day. Another day a week I would be using the Pessoa system adjusted as snug as comfortable and working on developing the stride length of the horse and his balance by doing many forward and back transitions and playing with circle size and trot-halt-trot transitions. Still another day a week, I would work in a side rein lunge line combo with the side reins attached very high, and just tight enough to maintain contact with a vertical head and then run the lunge line through the surcingle to the bit to work on bend and conditioning the horse's topline. This day the work out should be limited to around 15-30 minutes because you are muscle building. If the horse braces back, like he is doing in the pictures then send him forward and praise him for coming into the contact and bring him back to working paces.
Good luck! And with your training regiment be sure to feed correctly, and monitor joint health carefully. Walk is crucial to maintaining good joints. Try to walk you horse as much as possible in a marching walk on the contact.


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## boxer (Feb 20, 2009)

Is it just me or is the surcingle too far forward. no-one else has mentioned it but to me it looks like it is digging into the withers and the shoulder muscle so it is not giving free movement to the forelegs. I would also use a pad under it. The placement of the surcingle in the photo of showjumplife's horse seems more appropriate to me. also I would move the reins up to the next d-ring on the surcingle and let them out a hole or two.


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## Dressage101 (Dec 20, 2008)

MIEventer said:


> I agree, they are much to tight, not only that, but he does appear to be ribby.
> 
> It isn't about forcing him into a false frame - is it about encouraging him to engage his back end, lift his back, track up and drive into the bridle.
> 
> ...


 
I agree with most of your top suggestions. The frame is definitely forced. Loosen them like showjumpinglife's pic. to start. Even if he has had work in side reins you will need to start with them loose anyway because you don't want to cause resistance or muscle spasms. But, about this [I would take the side reins off all together, and just work on basic walk, trot, canter at a rhythmical pace.] I would not shy away from the side reins just work with them looser. These things can be achieved more properly in side reins.

A horse that is polished in said reins should have his nose very slightlyin front of the vertical seeking the bit.


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## Dressage101 (Dec 20, 2008)

boxer said:


> Is it just me or is the surcingle too far forward. no-one else has mentioned it but to me it looks like it is digging into the withers and the shoulder muscle so it is not giving free movement to the forelegs. I would also use a pad under it. The placement of the surcingle in the photo of showjumplife's horse seems more appropriate to me. also I would move the reins up to the next d-ring on the surcingle and let them out a hole or two.


This is probably caused by the said reins being too tight and it is getting pulled up onto the withers.


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## starlinestables (Nov 24, 2008)

The position of the surcingle is too far forward probably because the side reins are too tight. Also I advise using a pad underneath because if the surcingle is uncomfortable he will never raise his back up and move his shoulder out. So basically what boxer is saying. If you are struggling with the surcingle staying back in the proper place you could always try a crupper (sp?).


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## LacyLove (Feb 12, 2009)

sorry bout my post back in february, i was stupid back then =P


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