# Signs of Horse Releasing Stress?



## livelovelaughride (Sep 13, 2011)

I was surprised to see my boy shake vigorously, twice, while walking back into the barn from our dinky little half hour ride today. In our ride, the only thing I did differently was ride him in a bareback pad. Hardly even cantered him because he's so narrow and I was trying to keep relaxed but no grip with my legs. Funny, it didn't occur to me that something I did was causing him to become anxious. He didn't appear anxious. Maybe he internalizes?? 

I've seen horses yawn after receiving chiro, massage, and zero balance therapy. I consider these 'working signs' in therapy as they suggest relaxation or some sort of release...sighs, snorts, deep breaths, glazed eyes, 'camera-shutter' eye blinking, penis dropping, head down, ears lopped. What else do you notice when your horse is relaxing?


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## Laffeetaffee (Dec 5, 2012)

The first thing I usually notice is a horse licking and chewing. Often the horse takes in a deep breath and lets it out slowly too.

I sometimes work with a very nervous horse who just loves to be nervous. He's a Morgan with very tiny eyes, go figure, so he's always got his head straight up in the air like a pole, and it doesn't come down for anything. I'll just do some light join-up and walk him around a little bit because I'm working with two other horses and don't have much time for him. It's so funny because you can see him start to calm down. He lowers his head a little bit, breathes out, and licks, and then suddenly he realizes what he's doing and bam, his head goes straight back up and he's scared again. Then it slowly lowers, he breathes out... and _bam_, head straight back up and body tense. Poor guy has been terrified most of his life he doesn't know how to relax and it's like he scares himself when he relaxes.


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

My arab would do that if his back was itchy. Instead of rolling he'd utilize the saddle or bareback rider to scratch his back. Laffeetaffee, your horse is zoning out when his head is high. It becomes a very comfortable place to be. When such a horse returns to reality they invariably spook as they haven't been paying attention as to what has been going on. I spent months with such a horse and when the breakthro came he began working his lips, blinking his eyes and shaking like a wet dog. When it stopped he was a different horse. The best thing to do with this horse is any time he lowers his head, immediately back up a few steps and turn your back to him. Give him 10 or 15 seconds then do again what you'd asked him to do. He'll get to thinking aha, I drop my head and she leaves me alone.


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## Laffeetaffee (Dec 5, 2012)

Saddlebag said:


> My arab would do that if his back was itchy. Instead of rolling he'd utilize the saddle or bareback rider to scratch his back. Laffeetaffee, your horse is zoning out when his head is high. It becomes a very comfortable place to be. When such a horse returns to reality they invariably spook as they haven't been paying attention as to what has been going on. I spent months with such a horse and when the breakthro came he began working his lips, blinking his eyes and shaking like a wet dog. When it stopped he was a different horse. The best thing to do with this horse is any time he lowers his head, immediately back up a few steps and turn your back to him. Give him 10 or 15 seconds then do again what you'd asked him to do. He'll get to thinking aha, I drop my head and she leaves me alone.


That's a good idea, I could try that when I take him out again, but I'm not sure if I even want to bother with this horse. He's not mine, I got two other horses I'm training with a lot of success, but I don't know how to work with horses that are as terrified of everything as he is. The way he acts makes me think he was beaten because he is absolutely completely terrified of everything I do around him, but he locks up and won't move for anything. If I stuck a paper bag in his face (haven't, but if I did), he would become extremely terrified, not move his body at all, and if I move he would probably bolt blindly into a fence (he HAS done that). Says to me that someone has probably beaten him so his way of staying safe is to not do anything at all, and if he does run he's going to get the h*ll away from me so I can't hurt him.


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## usandpets (Jan 1, 2011)

Saddlebag said:


> My arab would do that if his back was itchy. Instead of rolling he'd utilize the saddle or bareback rider to scratch his back. Laffeetaffee, your horse is zoning out when his head is high. It becomes a very comfortable place to be. When such a horse returns to reality they invariably spook as they haven't been paying attention as to what has been going on. I spent months with such a horse and when the breakthro came he began working his lips, blinking his eyes and shaking like a wet dog. When it stopped he was a different horse. The best thing to do with this horse is any time he lowers his head, immediately back up a few steps and turn your back to him. Give him 10 or 15 seconds then do again what you'd asked him to do. He'll get to thinking aha, I drop my head and she leaves me alone.


Clinton Anderson did something like that on one of his tours. It was on one of his televised shows. He hadn't done it before but wanted to try it as an experiment. 

He had the horse stand still and if the horse raised its head above the whithers, the crowd made noise. As soon as the horse dropped its head, the crowd became silent. The horse eventually wanted to keep its head down. 

Six main signs I look for that a horse is relaxed are licking/chewing, sighing, cocking a back leg, head lowering, blinking, or standing still for 15 seconds. 

One sign I think that a horse is relaxed in its surrounding (not dealing with working with them) is that they will remain lying down while you walk around them. If they are nervous about the surroundings, like possible predators, they won't lay down. If they are nervous about you, they will get up if you come near them when lied down. Just from personal experience.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

A few things about this subject. In reference to head position, a low head = a calm horse, it's a grazing or napping positions. A high head = an alert horse, looking for potential danger.
Yawns = stress, it's a way of releasing stress, but it means the horse is/was just stressed. Repeated yawning = very stressed or sick (physical stress). IME.
It's interesting CA's experiment it shows two things, horses don't like loud noise, and horses learn from release of pressure - that's all really though. When his head was up 'pressure was on' with the noises the horse didn't like. When his head was down it relieved the pressure. Unless he put a cue to this act I don't see it helping much, unless he hopes the horse will keep his head down for the rest of his life?
"Put your head down" is a cue I teach _every_ horse. You can do this many ways - CA's crowd noise clearly worked, but you could also just use pressure on their poll (by pulling straight down on a lead rope) releasing pressure when they move their head down or (what I use) Clicker training. But however you teach it the cue "put your head down" teaches them to do just that. This skill does more than make their nose closer to the ground, it helps horses 'shift out of flight mode'.
I am working with an Arabian mare who's been mildly handled for the 23 years of her life so far. She leads and is relatively easy to handle - but does no form of work and is never expected to do much, after kicking her owner 3 times no one besides me and her owner can handle her - each kicking incident was out of fear (clear fear, like a plastic bag rattling that spooked her and such). She has no aggression in her, but her fear takes her over more than she can control herself. 
I recently started working with her with Clicker Training, just for fun to keep her mind busy. First I taught her that when I don't ask anything of her her nose should be down. So when I'm not doing anything, her mind is in 'neutral' - not looking for danger. Now she's learning several other skills including targeting, backing, touching 'scary' things and putting scary things on her back and head. She's progressing faster than I ever imagined. She's gotten to the point where when I present an object that makes her nervous, she puts her head down, if I ask her to touch it, she'll muster up all her courage and touch it. She knows now that I present all sorts of silly things she will be expected to touch, and none have ever hurt her.
She's working up to riding and coming along quite well, faster than any other horse I've worked with - but I'm staying slow making sure every step is solid, with her history I want to be careful.

So point is, teaching the head down skill is great for shifting horses into a calm spot. And Clicker Training works great for nervous horses, it just gives them confidence.


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## usandpets (Jan 1, 2011)

CA's experiment was just to show an example of pressure(noise) and release(silence). It wasn't really to teach the horse. Saddlebags post just made me think of it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## usandpets (Jan 1, 2011)

I've never heard that about yawning. One of ours, my wife's horse, will yawn or sometimes cough if he thinks you are coming to get him to ride. He is a character though. 

I've also seen some yawn 6 or 7 times just standing out in a pasture.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

usandpets said:


> I've never heard that about yawning. One of ours, my wife's horse, will yawn or sometimes cough if he thinks you are coming to get him to ride. He is a character though.
> 
> I've also seen some yawn 6 or 7 times just standing out in a pasture.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Something may be upsetting him in the pasture, bugs, another horse, a tummy ache - or he may just have something stuck on a back tooth he's trying to lick out.
Here's some info on yawning in general  I learned this when training dogs, ever notice that dogs will often yawn when being yelled at? They aren't bored - they're stressed. 
Yawning Caused by Anxiety « Calm Clinic


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## livelovelaughride (Sep 13, 2011)

I'd forgotten about some other signs of lack of relaxation or stress.

I've seen in my gelding: chin looks tight; jaw angrily chomping, not chewing the bit; nostrils expanding or contracting, hard eye, lips look tight or pursed. Tensing in anticipation of something 'undesired' under saddle.

Releasing: lop ears, lower lip hangs, way soft eyes, heavy eyelids/falls asleep, chin droops, blows, snorts, shakes like a dog, hangs head.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

livelovelaughride said:


> glazed eyes, 'camera-shutter' eye blinking, ...


There's glazed eyes & glazed eyes, IME & I can't really spell out the difference in writing, except to say it's a combo of bodylanguage, not just eyes that tell me the difference. Breathing is one big one. But horses can go very 'quiet' or still, head low & eyes glazed when they're 'shut down' - that is, mentally things have got too much for them - & you want to be very careful, as it's these types that internalise their fear & don't show it obviously, until 'suddenly, for no reason, out of the blue....' big explosions!



> That's a good idea, I could try that when I take him out again, but I'm not sure if I even want to bother with this horse. He's not mine, I got two other horses I'm training with a lot of success, but I don't know how to work with horses that are as terrified of everything as he is. The way he acts makes me think he was beaten because he is absolutely completely terrified of everything I do around him, but he locks up and won't move for anything.


Poor boy! Yes, horses like this can be a real challenge, but IMO they're SO worth it, when you finally get through to them that they're safe & can relax.:wink: He sounds 'shell shocked', suffering something like 'post traumatic stress syndrome'. Perhaps, as I mentioned above about horses that internalise their fear, he's one of those, but he's been conditioned to it from previous bad treatment. Extra Mg in his diet would probably help him too.



> He had the horse stand still and if the horse raised its head above the whithers, the crowd made noise. As soon as the horse dropped its head, the crowd became silent. The horse eventually wanted to keep its head down.


Good demo, but wouldn't want to do that to a frightened horse. Reminds me of a story my dad told me when he was studying behavioural psychology - they thought it would be fun to 'experiment' with one of their lecturers... So they'd noticed the lecturer tended to step forward when he discovered anyone really interested in what he was saying, so the whole class conspired to see how far they could go with it - looking fascinated at all the guy said, eventually he got carried away & fell off the podium!:twisted:

This thread also reminds me of the other day when we had an autistic boy over - he's a bit of an anxious type with people, not being great with communicating & he went & hung out with the horses(I was supervising) & I noticed my pony, who's usually a happy, playful, cheeky type, just wanted to stay close to him & kept yawning. If I didn't know better I'd think the kid slipped them both a sedative as I've never seen the pony(or boy) quite so relaxed & I thought pony was going to actually fall asleep when the kid hopped on!

So this discussion has reminded me that yawning & other 'calming' bodylanguage is also used in communication, definitely with dogs, to convey to other dogs that it's all OK(I've actually used it repeatedly to get dogs over fears), so I wonder if pony was telling - & showing boy how to relax??


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## Connie Weirick (Mar 18, 2013)

Our Eldest (13 yr Paint Qtr), came from a hard background and was very spooky when we got him. Typical flight/fight alarm signs head high, nostrils wide, ears perked, tightened muscles, quick movements. I always walked him away from whatever the source - wind, people, to a more secluded area and started w/ a pat, whilst talking and rub from his ear down alongside of his eyes, bringing his focus on me, lowering my voice and reassuring him. It's how I re-ground trained him. He's bomb proof to voice now. Our colt, jesus nothing scares him-he pushs my front door open. Constance Weirick


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## usandpets (Jan 1, 2011)

PunksTank said:


> Something may be upsetting him in the pasture, bugs, another horse, a tummy ache - or he may just have something stuck on a back tooth he's trying to lick out.
> Here's some info on yawning in general  I learned this when training dogs, ever notice that dogs will often yawn when being yelled at? They aren't bored - they're stressed.
> Yawning Caused by Anxiety « Calm Clinic


Ok. Anxiety/stress can cause yawns but yawning does not mean there is stress or anxiety. 

A depressed person likes to sleep. Does that mean everyone that sleeps is depressed? No. 

A person that smokes weed gets the munchies. Does that mean anyone that gets munchies is smoking weed? No. 

Yawning can be a symptom or indicator of anxiety or stress but it can also be because the you are tired or bored. Or you saw someone else yawn.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

I just want to say, the spooking/fear does get better the more that you address this particular thought to the horse:

Things can happen around you, at you, to you (being hosed down, having a dog run between your legs, seeing a deer flee in the distance) and you'll still be safe with me.

My horse... man I really should have taken video. He would rip things apart to get away from just about anything at any time. Now I can literally throw the mounting block around and he stands without any tension lol.

Consistentcy.


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## iRide Ponies (Aug 10, 2012)

The biggest sign for me of relaxation is a loosening and softening of the jaw. Easy to feel on horseback, hard to hide in even the most introverted horse.


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

Laffee, don't quit on this horse even if it's not yours. The knowledge you gain is invaluable. For months I thought I was teaching my horse then one day it dawned on me that he was teaching me and he's been a patient teacher. If you get stuck,pm me and I'll see if I can get you thro it.


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