# horse shifting weight in hinds and standing oddly



## anndankev (Aug 9, 2010)

Possibly a gravel type of abscess?


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## JCnGrace (Apr 28, 2013)

Sounds like both hind feet or legs are sore. This would be the reason for the constant shifting. Must not be cold in your area since it looks like you sprayed him so no bruising from walking on frozen ground but have you been riding him on other hard surfaces with no shoes/boots? Abscess brewing as Anndankev mentioned. Been out of work and bringing him back too fast or just working harder than usual? That could cause muscle soreness on both hinds. Laminitis usually strikes the front feet first but not unheard of to be in the hind feet only. Check for excessive heat in the feet. Back out of whack could cause hind end soreness. That's about the most common things I can think of that could be wrong. I would want to have my vet pay a visit in case of laminitis so you can be aggressive in the treatment before it causes permanent damage.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

but, OP said during ride horse felt normal in all gaits. if it were an abcess, he would be markedly off.


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## Elana (Jan 28, 2011)

I think he may have an issue.. higher up. Spine, SI, etc. Have you had a chiro check him? I would go there first.. and then up it to a vet. 

What is this horse's breeding and how old is this horse?

Constant shifting of weight behind is an indication of bilateral pain/discomfort behind. It might be the start of DSLD but would need better photos of him standing square behind from the side NOT resting a foot. A video would be even more helpful. 

There is something else.. about this.. way back in my brain and I cannot quite recall it. Cherie would probably know....................


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

That is a symptom of upset tummy, colic.


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## nessie (Nov 29, 2014)

To answer questions asked so far:

No chiro yet, but I do have a sports massaged scheduled for him next week so hopefully she can feel if he's tight anywhere and I can always do a chiro/vet call from there.

He's approximately 10 years old, QH mix. Likely with Arab but a few people have told me they see TB.

Haven't been working him hard quite the contrary. Im a student so most I have time for is 3-4 times a week at 30 min each ride (including warm-up and cool out). He's only in shape for a 35 minute ride anyways. He started work back up in early January after an 8 week layup. 

I didn't leave that watery/manure mess but very astute comment, definitely not frozen here!(California) He did have an acute laminitic attack a year ago and is IR/has EMS. Feet did not feel hot.


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## trailhorserider (Oct 13, 2009)

That's really strange. I've never seen a horse "knuckle over" like that.


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

I had a horse who liked to stand like that & there was nothing wrong with him. However, he didn't shift his weight back & forth.


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## anndankev (Aug 9, 2010)

trailhorserider said:


> That's really strange. I've never seen a horse "knuckle over" like that.


I have, Solo, a TB mare.

She was very prone to the gravel type of abscesses, and they took an extremely long time to come out. They came out the top of the coronet band and started in the front of the bottom of the foot.

As was explained to me, that is the pattern of a gravel type, It is not a piece of gravel that starts it at all. It is starting at the bottom and going up the front wall, out the coronet band.

Whereas in general, abscesses start higher and more to the back , working out the sole, nearer the back/center of foot.

There is one more I can think of, that burst out the side, in a lateral crack, I don't know if they are called something different.

Anyway, Solo's took literally months, every one was on a front though. She stood like that. The farrier told me it was to relieve pressure within the hoof.

Demonstrated by having me bend down the tip of my fingernail, and seeing a little bit of a bow out on the rest of the nail.


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## nessie (Nov 29, 2014)

I hope it's just him resting his leg oddly, but seeing as I've owned him 7 years and never seen him do it before that concerning. I'll take an abscess over laminitis any day though.


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## nessie (Nov 29, 2014)

Well just thought i'd update. He has since done the weird leg resting thing twice more. So 3X in a month and week. not sure if thats too concerning since it's not happening that often. Second time also had weight shifting third time didn't which was 3 days ago. (Though for one of the weeks I was gone and another week just turning him out since so couldnt observe it in the cross ties) Though the last two days he's been shifting and kind of flexing his leg in that way for a brief second then resting it normally. Also, he was only resting his right hind the second two times where the coronet was almost touching the floor. He's also been so dang stiff when I first trot. Taking longer to work out of it. He's defaulting to a WP walk jog thing even though hes a dressage horse. Whether it's related who knows. I was dealing with that last year and then got his hocks injected so he may be needing that again. Nothing noteworthy at the sport massage appt. Thinking I may go the chiro route this time then maybe injecting if needed.


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

Sometimes shifting frequently can be related to weakness. Are you feeding him Vitamin E supplements? Both Vitamin E and Selenium deficiency can show up as muscle myopathy which causes weakness in the hind end. I would suspect this if he is stiffer than usual at the trot and/or canter but seems to walk normally and is not lame. I've also seen where horses have difficulty going up and down steep hills.
Hay loses vitamin E quickly, most grain and complete feeds do not contain very much vitamin E, and the only source (other than a multivitamin) for most horses is fresh, green grass. Many horses become deficient over the winter when grass goes dormant. Horses store vitamin E in their muscles which can last for several months. However, some horses have difficulty storing E or need higher doses because they don't seem to process it as well. The minimum recommended dose for a horse not getting exercise is 1,000 IU daily. If you are feeding synthetic vitamin E (dl-tocepherol) instead of natural (d-tocepherol), you need to feed twice this dose.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

nessie said:


> Well just thought i'd update. He has since done the weird leg resting thing twice more. So 3X in a month and week. not sure if thats too concerning since it's not happening that often. Second time also had weight shifting third time didn't which was 3 days ago. (Though for one of the weeks I was gone and another week just turning him out since so couldnt observe it in the cross ties) Though the last two days he's been shifting and kind of flexing his leg in that way for a brief second then resting it normally. Also, he was only resting his right hind the second two times where the coronet was almost touching the floor. He's also been so dang stiff when I first trot. Taking longer to work out of it. He's defaulting to a WP walk jog thing even though hes a dressage horse. Whether it's related who knows. I was dealing with that last year and then got his hocks injected so he may be needing that again. Nothing noteworthy at the sport massage appt. Thinking I may go the chiro route this time then maybe injecting if needed.


 sporadic pain is again most likely a colic/gas episode.


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## nessie (Nov 29, 2014)

hmm thinking it may be in fact the vitamin E. He was on it but it was hard to get him to eat the capsules so I stopped once the vets said I could lower it. He was testing low vitamin E but not crazily low so they had me put him on 4000 IU a day. Due to his other symptoms last year they wanted me to possibly test him for equine motor neuron disease (vit e deficiency related), but it actually improved. It was kind of hard to tell what fixed his lameness issues since we made dietary changes (to fix anemia and low wbc), hock injections, and saddle fit changes all in short order. But yes he is fine at the walk, but also fine at the canter. I'm starting it right away, hopefully it helps!


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

I have a horse who apparently doesn't process vitamin E well either and I have to give her about 5,000 IU or she has all kinds of vague symptoms. It's a difficult one to pin down because some sensitive horses just seem to have behavioral problems until the weakness progresses to where you can notice it. Not sure how your budget is, but my mare takes the pelleted version of Vitamin E you can buy from Smartpak very well. I doubt I could get her to eat capsules but the pellets smell good and apparently taste good to her.


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## nessie (Nov 29, 2014)

Yeah I'm thinking he may be one who doesnt process it well or something. He has been getting 1000 IU in enrich plus each day, but that probably isn't enough. He surprisingly ate the capsules yesterday so I'll just keep trying until it becomes impossible. They're synthetic so I gave him 4000 IU/2 = 2000 IU so 3000 total a day he's getting with the enrich. Perhaps I should add more? When he had this issue before the vets could see lameness in the hinds but it kept switching sides so moreso systemic issue rather than localized. How long do you think it should be until I notice a difference?


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

They recommend giving 5,000 IU if a horse is already having problems. My horse didn't have issues on 2,000 (4,000 synthetic) when I gave her Trifecta vitamins. But since I didn't know about her problem, I stopped the vitamins last year and it took me almost a year to figure out why she had issues all year (they started out minor and kept progressing). So I gave her 6,000 for awhile and now I have her down to 5,000.

The great thing was that I knew it was the vitamin E right away because within 4 days of starting to give it she began to improve. Within 2 weeks she was back to 90% of normal function in her hind legs.


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## nessie (Nov 29, 2014)

Well I am unhappy to report no change yet, he is in fact worsening if anything. After cantering he can trot normally but then switches back to stiffness (whereas before he would stay normal). He seems to be walking slower esp on gravel. Tripped twice today once on his RF, once on his LF at the walk. Not a minor stumble but was able to catch himself. Also his right front had a feeling of giving out/stepping in gopher hole. Also his left hind had a moment of an extremely stiff step but only once, felt like it was going to give out too. Me thinks a vet appointment is unavoidable at this point . Think I'll kill two birds with one stone and have them check his glucose levels make sure his IR is under control still.


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

Hopefully it's not EPM.
Equine protozoal myeloencephalitis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## nessie (Nov 29, 2014)

We tested for EPM at the end of Sept of 14' and test was negative. Though he did display some neuro signs (like not reacting to pen on one side of his body). Don't know if he would still do that.

This is actually nearly identical to how his lameness developed last time.
Symptoms then:
-stiffness worse at trot, front leg gopher hole feeling, hind legs giving out, struggling to pick up leads, lame hind leg switching sides

Then that developed into sudden weight loss, anemia, low wbc, muscle atrophy, lethargy, almost falling over for tail pull test. Then he got better when we changed his feeding schedule (3 /4th time making changes). Gained weight been maintaining ever since.

Now mostly similar symptoms (aside from the weight loss and anemia and all that i'd be freaking out!). Add in shifting weight, resting foot oddly, those two times he tripped,slower on gravel, poor hind hoof quality (chipping), and bad for farrier.


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

I'm wondering about kissing spine which is similar to low back pain in humans. This is seen more often in shorter backed horses. Does he sometimes shuffle when you first walk him out when on the lead?


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## nessie (Nov 29, 2014)

no he's never shuffled. Kissing spines doesnt seem to match from what i've read, but something to keep in mind I suppose. Anyways, I was *this* close to calling the vet but now I'm not so sure. I buted him on monday for my lesson to see if it helped. I gave him .5 g of it at 11 am and then 1.5 g 40 min before my lesson. In my lesson he wanted to go slow but didn't feel stiff and then worked out if it really quickly and was going good. Then I couldn't ride until friday and I also rode today without bute. He also felt not stiff but would preferentially go slower at trot, but would go normal if asked even before cantering. He did swing his head around and threaten to bite when I first got on on both friday and saturday which he has never done before in 8 years of ownership but stood still for mounting. He felt great though when asked to move out, I even thought he was going to take off on me at one point because he was getting really disturbed by the bugs and shaking his head a lot!


maybe the vitamin e is finally kicking in!


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## nessie (Nov 29, 2014)

well just another update. He didnt swing his head around me to bite when I first got on, and I even got on from the ground today=more torque. He also felt so good at all gaits, like better than 110%! He's never felt so good! I shall just be monitoring for now and hopefully he remains well.


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## dhendi (Apr 28, 2015)

Could it be a sign of laminitis? This could maybe help you out 

geeHorse - How to treat laminitis


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## TamandNickP (Mar 14, 2015)

I had an old arthritic gelding that use to rest with his rear hinds like that. He had arthritis in his hocks. He didn't shift his weight as often as you stated, but when he did you could hear the loud cracking sound that his hocks would make.


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