# Some colour questions...



## Poseidon (Oct 1, 2010)

White patterns aren't limited to the Paint Horse breed; many breeds have different patterns. However, Paints are a breed whereas any other colored horse is referred to as "pinto." Your boy looks like he could have splash, based on his bottom heavy, "apron" blaze and white on all 4 legs that is fairly even. But the amount of white shown doesn't always reflect genes carried. My mare has less white than your horse and tested positive for frame. 

Graying is weird. It does weird things to colors and the process is different on every horse. The markings on that gelding are referred to as "bloody shoulder" markings. It doesn't mean he has a white pattern, it's just a gray trait.


----------



## minstrel (Mar 20, 2012)

Poseidon said:


> White patterns aren't limited to the Paint Horse breed; many breeds have different patterns. However, Paints are a breed whereas any other colored horse is referred to as "pinto." Your boy looks like he could have splash, based on his bottom heavy, "apron" blaze and white on all 4 legs that is fairly even. But the amount of white shown doesn't always reflect genes carried. My mare has less white than your horse and tested positive for frame.
> 
> Graying is weird. It does weird things to colors and the process is different on every horse. The markings on that gelding are referred to as "bloody shoulder" markings. It doesn't mean he has a white pattern, it's just a gray trait.


So a pinto is just a chestnut with more white, genetically speaking? It would be the same genes causing the white pattern on a pinto as the markings on my boy? It's not genes specific to a Paint? Sorry I'm such a noob, but it's really interesting stuff. 

And yeah, it's really weird - we always said she was grey, but some people do look funny at her markings when she's showing. Bloody shoulder markings? I'll remember that one for next time!

Thank you very much!


----------



## Poseidon (Oct 1, 2010)

All of the genes are the same across the breeds. Paints are just a colored breed of stock horse. 

Pinto is the name referred to any other breed of horse that carries a white pattern. Say you had a mini that was a tobiano. Either you could refer to it as whatever its base color is + tobiano or say it is a pinto. It wouldn't be a Paint because it's a miniature horse. 

The white patterns all include tobiano, frame, splash, sabino (those last 3 are often lumped together as just "overo," which leads to a lot of confusion), dominant white, roan, and rabicano. Disclaimer: I may be missing something, but I am blanking right now.


----------



## minstrel (Mar 20, 2012)

Poseidon said:


> All of the genes are the same across the breeds. Paints are just a colored breed of stock horse.
> 
> Pinto is the name referred to any other breed of horse that carries a white pattern. Say you had a mini that was a tobiano. Either you could refer to it as whatever its base color is + tobiano or say it is a pinto. It wouldn't be a Paint because it's a miniature horse.
> 
> The white patterns all include tobiano, frame, splash, sabino (those last 3 are often lumped together as just "overo," which leads to a lot of confusion), dominant white, roan, and rabicano. Disclaimer: I may be missing something, but I am blanking right now.


Thanks for the info!! We don't really have Paints in the UK, and refer to any white patterned horse just as a coloured. Before I started reading all the stuff on here, I had assumed that being a coloured/pinto was a genetically different thing from something like my bay with his white markings, but I get it now - it's expression of the same genes, just to a different amount. Thanks!


----------



## PaintHorseMares (Apr 19, 2008)

^^^with regard to Paints in the UK check out Home
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## ThirteenAcres (Apr 27, 2012)

Hmm. Grey's are weird, but that's very interesting. I'd kind of wider about it being chemeric with such a weird variation. 

But them, grey is SO weird.


----------



## WSArabians (Apr 14, 2008)

Holy hannah that is one chunky pony! LOL!


----------



## minstrel (Mar 20, 2012)

WSArabians said:


> Holy hannah that is one chunky pony! LOL!


Haha, she's not only a Highland, which are pretty chunky for starters, but she's been a broodmare all her days, so she has that broodmare belly. You'd never guess how fit she was during these pictures - she just looks fat!


----------



## lilkitty90 (Nov 11, 2009)

do you know what her color was before she greyed? from the bloody shoulders it looks like she could have been bay, chesnut, or even possibly buckskin.

the bloody shoulder is just a patch of hair that doesn't ever grey out like the rest of her. they stay the base coat color.


----------



## minstrel (Mar 20, 2012)

lilkitty90 said:


> do you know what her color was before she greyed? from the bloody shoulders it looks like she could have been bay, chesnut, or even possibly buckskin.
> 
> the bloody shoulder is just a patch of hair that doesn't ever grey out like the rest of her. they stay the base coat color.


That's weird though, as her owner has owned her since she was a three year old, and she hasn't always had those patches. She was originally sort of halfway between a mouse and a bay dun, with the telltale grey hairs on the face that say she would eventually grey out, but went completely white grey by the time she was 10. She then went flea-bitten, and apparently the patches really got noticeable by 14 and in this photo she is 18. It is a bit of a mystery to us... she's all black-skinned (Highlands are bred to be all dark-skinned with no white markings).


----------



## Chiilaa (Aug 12, 2010)

They aren't "true" bloody shoulder markings that stay the same colour from birth. They are merely an odd concentration of flea bite spots. Unusual, but not unheard of


----------



## lilkitty90 (Nov 11, 2009)

if thats the case then yeah chiilaa is right  but she's always right because she knows her stuff! can't wait to be that good 

its definitely concentrated flea bites.


----------



## minstrel (Mar 20, 2012)

Cool, great to have that explained! Thanks guys


----------

