# 20 Months



## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

Looks ok to me...except for that stupid map of Australia someone painted on his left side...:rofl:

As a former breeder, I've raised a ton of youngsters. A large percentage of them don't grow too much in their second year. He's still butt high, and probably will be for a while, so his growth will pick up one of these days. As long as he is getting free choice hay, I wouldn't worry much about what kind of feed he is getting - after they are a year old, most do just find on hay alone with maybe a little grain or feed as a supplement...


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## csimkunas6 (Apr 18, 2010)

Faceman said:


> Looks ok to me...except for that stupid map of Australia someone painted on his left side...:rofl:
> 
> As a former breeder, I've raised a ton of youngsters. A large percentage of them don't grow too much in their second year. He's still butt high, and probably will be for a while, so his growth will pick up one of these days. As long as he is getting free choice hay, I wouldn't worry much about what kind of feed he is getting - after they are a year old, most do just find on hay alone with maybe a little grain or feed as a supplement...



Thanks faceman! Makes me feel a lot better!! The guy was just telling me that, like you said, they grow a lot from their 2 year old year, and up...but he was telling me that I better do something different as soon as possible, and that it might be too late, and that his growth is probably stunted, and that might be as tall as he will get period. But then again, this was the man who told me I could start riding him 4 months ago, so I guess I should really take what he says with a grain of salt 

Thanks again! haha, thanks for pointing that out, Ive been trying to figure out where Ive seen that shape before, ****


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## Elana (Jan 28, 2011)

He appears to have a very straight hind leg and long, weak, pasterns (especially the front). He is.. weedy looking... has "poor lines" along the hindquarters along the back of the buttock.. and a bit of a belly. It is like he is being fed a lot of poor qulaity roughage (hay) and that is trying to be made up for with grain. That being said.. I would prefer to see him a bit thin than too fat (for growth plates and the fear of osteochondrosis). 

Looking at this horse I would first check him for parasites. If he is out with a lot of other horses I would get him on a pretty tight parasite control program. If he is competing with other horses for roughage I would separate him part of the day so he can eat in peace. I would also run an analysis on the hay being fed to see what the NDF is as well as the ADF and the Protein and Energy including AVAILABLE nutrients. I think that his hay is poor quality and you may need to get him some better hay. Horses on poor hay tend to eat a LOT of it and get little out of it and end up looking like this boy. 

I would not be real eager to increase the protein and energy of the grain (I do not know anything about the product you mention). I might be tempted to add corn oil to his feed or some wheat germ oil (for dense calories). If you add corn oil you need to add Vitamin A since it can make that nutrient less available to the horse. 

It looks like he has had a surcingle on him.. maybe from lunging? IMO he is a bit young for lunging (puts too much pressure on the joints). OTOH if the surcingle mark is from ground driving I highly approve.


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## FGRanch (Feb 9, 2008)

I agree he is pretty weedy looking, I would like to see him more fit, some added muscle, but not fat.


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## brighteyes08 (Jan 20, 2010)

hes just at a weird stage, the summer after my boy turned two, boy wasnt he funny looking, from 2 to three they start looking more like a horse.. he will be finee


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

csimkunas6 said:


> Thanks faceman! Makes me feel a lot better!! The guy was just telling me that, like you said, they grow a lot from their 2 year old year, and up...but he was telling me that I better do something different as soon as possible, and that it might be too late, and that his growth is probably stunted, and that might be as tall as he will get period. But then again, this was the man who told me I could start riding him 4 months ago, so I guess I should really take what he says with a grain of salt
> 
> Thanks again! haha, thanks for pointing that out, Ive been trying to figure out where Ive seen that shape before, ****


There is no way his growth is stunted. There has to be a very serious lack of nutition to cause that. It is arguable whether his nutition is ideal, but it is obviously not so lacking as to inhibit growth.

I don't agree with the "weedy" comments at all, although everyone is entitled to their opinion. He is 20 months old...a fat 20 month old is an unhealthy 20 month old. He is still putting on height, and is no where near the age when he will start filling out. He shows no rib, the tailhead is not showing fat, but is not showing underweight either, his rump is round and his flanks are normal, and his withers are quite convex. He is a leggy, lanky 20 month old - hardly what I would term "weedy". If he looks the same a year and a half from now, I would term him "rangey", same as "weedy", but that is a long way off...


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## Elana (Jan 28, 2011)

The Weediness I refer to has not to do with him being over all underweight.. but underweight in the wrong places.

No more weight should be added.. needs the weight he has distributed better (calories from a better source I am thinking). Poor hay gives this look because the horse must eat a LOT of it to get enough out of it.


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## csimkunas6 (Apr 18, 2010)

Elana said:


> He appears to have a very straight hind leg and long, weak, pasterns (especially the front). He is.. weedy looking... has "poor lines" along the hindquarters along the back of the buttock.. and a bit of a belly. It is like he is being fed a lot of poor qulaity roughage (hay) and that is trying to be made up for with grain. That being said.. I would prefer to see him a bit thin than too fat (for growth plates and the fear of osteochondrosis).
> 
> Looking at this horse I would first check him for parasites. If he is out with a lot of other horses I would get him on a pretty tight parasite control program. If he is competing with other horses for roughage I would separate him part of the day so he can eat in peace. I would also run an analysis on the hay being fed to see what the NDF is as well as the ADF and the Protein and Energy including AVAILABLE nutrients. I think that his hay is poor quality and you may need to get him some better hay. Horses on poor hay tend to eat a LOT of it and get little out of it and end up looking like this boy.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the reply! He is on a 2 month worming program suggested by the vet at the barn I board him at. He is only out with one other horse, so I dont think he is competing for hay, as they give them several different piles to eat from, but it very well could be hes not getting enough of what he needs. Not sure how realistic getting the hay tested will be for me, to be honest, the barn I have him at doesnt seem to be too knowledgeable about that kind of stuff, and they think their hay is perfectly acceptable.

As for the surcingle marks, I was using it to ground drive him. As for lungeing, I have done just enough lungeing to where he understands the concept, and no more, as I agree with you, it does add much stress to joints regardless of age. 

Would you suggest some kind of supplement for him? Thanks again!


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## csimkunas6 (Apr 18, 2010)

FGRanch said:


> I agree he is pretty weedy looking, I would like to see him more fit, some added muscle, but not fat.



What do you suggest for adding muscle without stress to joints? Trail walks? THanks



brighteyes08 said:


> hes just at a weird stage, the summer after my boy turned two, boy wasnt he funny looking, from 2 to three they start looking more like a horse.. he will be finee


He very well could be at a funny looking stage, hes gone through enough of them since Ive had him! To add to that, I took pics a week before I took these, and he looked ribby, and thin, and these pics, a week later, he looks completely different. Thanks!



Faceman said:


> There is no way his growth is stunted. There has to be a very serious lack of nutition to cause that. It is arguable whether his nutition is ideal, but it is obviously not so lacking as to inhibit growth.
> 
> I don't agree with the "weedy" comments at all, although everyone is entitled to their opinion. He is 20 months old...a fat 20 month old is an unhealthy 20 month old. He is still putting on height, and is no where near the age when he will start filling out. He shows no rib, the tailhead is not showing fat, but is not showing underweight either, his rump is round and his flanks are normal, and his withers are quite convex. He is a leggy, lanky 20 month old - hardly what I would term "weedy". If he looks the same a year and a half from now, I would term him "rangey", same as "weedy", but that is a long way off...


What do the terms "weedy" and "rangey" mean? I honestly dont think Ive really ever heard of them before. As for him being leggy, there is no doubt he is leggy, has been since I got him!! And he is pretty narrow, def nowhere near to being filled out, or even starting to fill out, he is still adding height for sure! 
Thanks!


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

I agree with Face, he's just a bit gangly (same basic description as weedy and rangey) right now but that can be expected of most horses his age with similar breeding.

As for stunted growth...what a bunch of hooey. He's just as tall, maybe taller than my half-_draft_ colt that is only 2 months younger.

If he were mine, I would probably want to put him on a feed that was a little higher in protein (the Omolene only has 10%), but he still doesn't look bad at all.


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## csimkunas6 (Apr 18, 2010)

smrobs said:


> I agree with Face, he's just a bit gangly (same basic description as weedy and rangey) right now but that can be expected of most horses his age with similar breeding.
> 
> As for stunted growth...what a bunch of hooey. He's just as tall, maybe taller than my half-_draft_ colt that is only 2 months younger.
> 
> If he were mine, I would probably want to put him on a feed that was a little higher in protein (the Omolene only has 10%), but he still doesn't look bad at all.



Thanks smrobs! I really appreciate it! Like I was just telling a friend on fb, being told that my horse looks horrible, made me feel as if I wasnt doing my job as his owner. But then again I think, since I have had him, as you, and many people know, he has gone through some VERY wonky, funky, and not to mention fugly stages!!! So it very well could just be a stage hes going through. I have also asked the BO to put him on a higher protein feed, which the feed they suggested has 14%, so we'll see if that helps him out a bit. 

Thanks a lot to everyone that has posted!!


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

csimkunas6 said:


> What do you suggest for adding muscle without stress to joints? Trail walks? THanks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Rangey means lean and lanky with a light build rather than stocky. Elana is referring to weedy a bit differently, more site specific as she explained. IMO a body mass distribution assessment is not relevant to a long yearling, but everyone has their own opinion. You can't measure a horse by adult, fully developed criteria until it is grown and fully developed. You can assess his basic conformation, but you said you didn't want that.

At his age you should be preparing him for training, but not actually training...that means exposing him to the training that will come later and getting him mentally prepared. What with trailer training, desensitizing, and building his trust and confidence, there is lots to do with him in his second year. The key to training a youngster is patience, patience patience. Horses that are trained too fast are trained poorly. Honestly he is way too young to worry about trying to muscle him up. Let him develop naturally and worry about harder ground training and building muscle after he turns 3, or is at least close to it. We all get anxious and want to get them trained and ride off into the sunset or do whatever it is we want to do with them, but trying to accelerate the process is counterproductive in the case of horses.

Just my personal opinions, of course...


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## csimkunas6 (Apr 18, 2010)

Faceman said:


> Rangey means lean and lanky with a light build rather than stocky. Elana is referring to weedy a bit differently, more site specific as she explained. IMO a body mass distribution assessment is not relevant to a long yearling, but everyone has their own opinion. You can't measure a horse by adult, fully developed criteria until it is grown and fully developed. You can assess his basic conformation, but you said you didn't want that.
> 
> At his age you should be preparing him for training, but not actually training...that means exposing him to the training that will come later and getting him mentally prepared. What with trailer training, desensitizing, and building his trust and confidence, there is lots to do with him in his second year. The key to training a youngster is patience, patience patience. Horses that are trained too fast are trained poorly. Honestly he is way too young to worry about trying to muscle him up. Let him develop naturally and worry about harder ground training and building muscle after he turns 3, or is at least close to it. We all get anxious and want to get them trained and ride off into the sunset or do whatever it is we want to do with them, but trying to accelerate the process is counterproductive in the case of horses.
> 
> Just my personal opinions, of course...



Thanks faceman! I think Im on the right track with his training to be honest.....heres a post I started a few days ago....http://www.horseforum.com/horse-training/need-new-ideas-105168/


Thanks again!


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