# Barbed Wire Fencing



## CopperLove (Feb 14, 2019)

I have known people who use barbed wire for horses. I guess when it comes to "can you", you can do anything you want. But I personally wouldn't. If a horse in panic runs into or through a barbed wire fence, it's going to hurt them bad, possibly even kill them. If something happens and the fence is compromised for some reason and the wire is loose or sagging in a place you haven't noticed, a horse's foot could get caught in it, which is a bad situation with fencing in general but the barbed wire would likely cause additional panic and struggle on the horse's part and again cause a lot of damage.

Another thing to keep in mind is that, while they can be vaccinated against this, a horse cut by something like barbed wire can develop Tetanus, which is also life-threatening.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

I wouldn't use it out of choice.
I have kept horses in fields shared with livestock where barbed wire has been used and on the whole the horses have been OK other than destroying blankets/rugs on it.
I've seen some really horrible injuries caused by the stuff though so if I'm fencing purely for horses I wouldn't touch it


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## COWCHICK77 (Jun 21, 2010)

Barb wire is part of life out west.
I have seen injuries from many other forms of fencing; smooth wire, wood boards, pipe, hog wire, electric, panels. 

For me, I think if you are fencing for your own horses at home considering how many horses you are keeping for the area is key. If I lived on 2 acres and had 5 horses I probably wouldn't choose to keep them in a barb wire lot. If I had 5 horses fenced on 200 aces I would go with barb wire. 

Keeping it tight, as with any fencing, will reduce issues.


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## egrogan (Jun 1, 2011)

I would not choose it. Unfortunately our woods and trails are littered with barbed wire embedded in trees and buried under leaves and branches since cows used to roam here decades ago and it was never removed. I'm terrified of getting tangled in it while riding and would not intentionally want horses kept in it. After having to extract one of my horses from a tangle in electrobraid last weekend- and having a very fortunate happy ending- I can't even begin to imagine what would have happened had the fence been barbed wire rather than the braided rope. That incident is making me reconsider whether I'll use the electrobraid when we fence another pasture this summer or go with another option that's not as likely to loop around a leg if the horse somehow ends up in it. There are pros and cons to most materials but barbed wire is one that doesn't really have any pros given the size and set up of my pastures.


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## HombresArablegacy (Oct 12, 2013)

No to barbed wire for horses. Not even if you bubble wrap your horses. I've seen too many devastating injuries and deaths from horses vs barbed wire.


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## mslady254 (May 21, 2013)

I'd avoid it if possible. Yes, it 'Can' and IS used, used a lot in my area, and amazingly, injuries don't seem to happen all that often in my experience at various boarding farms that used it (ususally as only the top strand over other fencing). Sonny never hurt himself, and of ALL the horses at those farms, I only knew of one who did. He ripped the upper eyelid and had had problems with that eye ever since, even though a Vet stitched it , meds, etc. I wouldn't risk it .Good luck.

Fay


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## AtokaGhosthorse (Oct 17, 2016)

We have barbed wire. 40 acres east of our house. 75 west of our house. All barbed wire. BUT. we run cattle too and I can tell you what cows do with horsewire - they walk right through a five strand fence like deer will do. 

The only strip that isn't barbed wire is the stretch of fence directly behind the house and it is horse wire, with a hot wire ran down the same stretch to... dissuade... persistent heifers. (Swimming pool floaties, a fence placed to darn close to the pool, pool floaties, and a windy hill equal spending a fortune in pool floaties every year. I made him tear out the barbed wire and put in horse wire to save the floaties)

SO FAR I haven't had any barbed wire injuries on our horses. I've seen cuts and tears on them from brush, briers, and stobs on trees though. BUT. As others have said - the size of the acreage makes a difference. If my horses spook, they have a long way to run before they hit fence. If they squabble, they don't do it right against the fence, they like to be in the open where they have room to maneuver. 

However. I'd say if you don't have to use it, don't. 



We have no choice really - can't run hot wire around the whole perimeter of both sides of our property - deer bust through it, sticks fall down out of trees and ground it out. We tried, fought it for a year in the creek bottom west of us, and it was a daily patch job. Finally gave up. Cows don't give a fig about horse wire, and steel pipe fencing won't get it done either - the ground is too wet, water table is just three feet below the surface in the low areas of our land.


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## AndyTheCornbread (Feb 3, 2019)

So long as it isn't pasture for cows as well I don't run barbed wire for horses ever out here. The reason is because we have so many bears, cougars, and wolves all of which when they go through their phase of pushing livestock around to see if it is prey or not will run horses through or up against/along fences. I usually catch it before hand when they are still in the just nosing around phase and take care of the issue but to be on the safe side I run smooth wire with a top strand of hot wire to keep the horses from leaning on/over the fences and stretching them out. If I am pasturing cattle in the same place I am keeping my horses then it is going to be in an area that is 40 acres to 1,000s of acres and then it is barbed wire simply because cattle will push down and bust up anything but barbed wire or mutli-strand electric wire with a good solid ground and high output fencer.


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## AtokaGhosthorse (Oct 17, 2016)

AndyTheCornbread said:


> So long as it isn't pasture for cows as well I don't run barbed wire for horses ever out here. The reason is because we have so many bears, cougars, and wolves all of which when they go through their phase of pushing livestock around to see if it is prey or not will run horses through or up against/along fences. I usually catch it before hand when they are still in the just nosing around phase and take care of the issue but to be on the safe side I run smooth wire with a top strand of hot wire to keep the horses from leaning on/over the fences and stretching them out. If I am pasturing cattle in the same place I am keeping my horses then it is going to be in an area that is 40 acres to 1,000s of acres and then it is barbed wire simply because cattle will push down and bust up anything but barbed wire or mutli-strand electric wire with a good solid ground and high output fencer.



Excellent reasons! As much as I love the big North American predators (They are gorgeous, fierce, stunning... but also hell on livestock) I am also glad coyotes and the occasional, but very shy mountain lion, are all we have to deal with here. A loyal pack of cow dogs will usually keep the 'big' predators ran off. 



Now if they can just run off the sound of feral hogs that have moved into our bottom land and are tearing it up that'd be great.


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## PoptartShop (Jul 25, 2010)

It's a huge no-no from me. While it works for others with bigger pastures, I think on an average size farm I wouldn't use it. The size of the acreage definitely matters.

I have heard too many horror stories, & just looking at it makes me cringe. I just wouldn't risk it.


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## JoBlueQuarter (Jan 20, 2017)

If you need to use it, it works. Not ideal maybe but usually it's fine and you can take precautions to make it as safe as possible. Chances are you won't have any issues with it as long as it's maintained well. Horses are generally respectful of their fences - very very unlike cows - even if the fences are loose or whatever. My horse pasture got a makeover last year but before that the fences were really bad; they never had any problems with it though. There is always a chance that injuries will occur, but that's there with all fences. So I would say, get the best fence you can, if that means you have to stick with barbed wire the way I did that's ok, just make sure to keep it in good repair and you're good to go.
Also, if you're setting up a *new* pasture then I would be sure to walk your horses around the perimeter, show them the fence line just as an extra precaution - if they take off running as soon as they're in their new place you want them to have a general idea of where the fences are.


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## ApuetsoT (Aug 22, 2014)

I'm ok with barb wire only if it's perimeter fencing for large pastures. No barb wire separating fields, near water, feeding areas. Lots of space, no dry lots. Dont give them a reason to hang around the fence.


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## Dez4455 (Mar 14, 2019)

No. Just a flat out no for me. 

I had a friend who's mare chased a filly down on a 37 acre pasture, ran her straight through the fence. From her chest down to her knee, the skin was gone and chunks of meat were tore out by the barbed wire. Friend thought she could just have her stitched up but is was so bad, wide, and deep that they just had to put her down. Poor filly was only bout a year old.

I had a big 17 hand gelding who got spooked by a deer, ran into the barbed wire fencing, got hung up in it pretty bad. He was fighting hard as he was scared out of his mind and ended up strangling himself. This was at my old house on 13 acres. 

My aunt had 20 acres and had 4 horses. They were all shoed. The small herd was feeling themselves on a real pretty cool day and one of them kicked out, got its shoe stuck in the barbed wire fencing, and ripped his shoe off along with 87% of it's hoof. Had to be put down.

I could go on and on with the things I've seen happen with barbed wire but I'm sure you get the idea. I prefer Wood fencing. Boards close together so nothing can get caught and I leave halters off. Always a risk with any fencing but barbed wire? I've had the worst luck with it.


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## my2geldings (Feb 18, 2008)

Equilibrium said:


> Can you use barbed wire fencing for horses?
> Some say it's perfectly fine.
> Some say it's too dangerous.
> 
> So...?


Generally speaking it's not my first choice for fencing, but if you have a herd of horses that get along, there is no reason to not use it. Issues come up once you have a horse that is being bullied or pushed around and ends up running through the fence to get away, or gets chased into it.


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## cbar (Nov 27, 2015)

I despise the stuff, but that is b/c I tend to get more injuries from it than any of the animals do. 

We live in cattle country, so most people around here run barbed wire. Our acreage was nothing but, and over the years my horse paddocks have been replaced with lumber instead of wire. But the 1/4 section is all barbed wire b/c of the cows. My horses are out there all winter and I have never had a scratch on them from it. 

Not my first choice, but it is the most practical out in these parts. Larger fields the horses are fine, but I would never use it for smaller paddocks.


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## Hondo (Sep 29, 2014)

An electric rope strung across the top makes barbed wire safer when it's already there. Some claim an electrified strand makes any fence safer as the horses tend to steer clear of it after a zap or two.


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## AndyTheCornbread (Feb 3, 2019)

Hondo said:


> An electric rope strung across the top makes barbed wire safer when it's already there. Some claim an electrified strand makes any fence safer as the horses tend to steer clear of it after a zap or two.



Yes, I run smooth wire for my horses but the top strand above everything else is galvanized electric wire hooked up to a 15 or 30 mile fencer that has twice dropped me on my knees when I bumped the wire on accident. It gives a really good jolt. The horses only ever try to lean over or into the fence once or twice and after that they never go near it again. I had a turd of a gelding for a while that would paw the bottom wire when he got impatient and he would sometimes rip off a shoe doing that so the section where he pawed I changed to electrified wire and boy let me tell you the pawing stopped immediately.


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## AtokaGhosthorse (Oct 17, 2016)

AndyTheCornbread said:


> Yes, I run smooth wire for my horses but the top strand above everything else is galvanized electric wire hooked up to a 15 or 30 mile fencer that has twice dropped me on my knees when I bumped the wire on accident. It gives a really good jolt. The horses only ever try to lean over or into the fence once or twice and after that they never go near it again. I had a turd of a gelding for a while that would paw the bottom wire when he got impatient and he would sometimes rip off a shoe doing that so the section where he pawed I changed to electrified wire and boy let me tell you the pawing stopped immediately.



Shouldn't be funny, but I laughed and only because Oops pretends to have her foot 'hung' in the bottom wire all the time. She'll carefully, deliberately, stick it through the wire, lift it so the wire hangs her at the fetlock, then tug and tug and look helpless until you rescue her. She's done it so often, with so much enthusiasm, she'd popped the fence clips on the t-posts. Not a good idea, I think we can all imagine all the horrible horribles that could actually happen.

Hubs fixes the clips on the fence a couple of weeks ago... He casually flips the energizer on.

She casually sticks her leg through... gives the wire one tug, then another. Then BZZTTTTTT. 

AMAZING how fast she can extract that leg without harm to herself and get away from the offending hot wire at the same time. She has never done it again.


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## JoBlueQuarter (Jan 20, 2017)

AtokaGhosthorse said:


> Shouldn't be funny, but I laughed and only because Oops pretends to have her foot 'hung' in the bottom wire all the time. She'll carefully, deliberately, stick it through the wire, lift it so the wire hangs her at the fetlock, then tug and tug and look helpless until you rescue her. She's done it so often, with so much enthusiasm, she'd popped the fence clips on the t-posts. Not a good idea, I think we can all imagine all the horrible horribles that could actually happen.
> 
> Hubs fixes the clips on the fence a couple of weeks ago... He casually flips the energizer on.
> 
> ...


Ahaha that's what Heidi does. I've caught her in the act a couple times - a yell to "cut that out!" and she cheekily pulls her foot out from in-between the wires, only to try again as soon as I've turned my back. I have barb wire all around but that doesn't deter her at all, she goes slowly and carefully, avoiding the barbs, very alert and knowing of what she's doing and then gently paws, stretching it out. I have one smooth wire running along the top of the fence (not electric, but maybe I should set that up sometime!) and whenever she's bored she'll pluck at it. Gently take it into her mouth and then pluck like a guitar string - it is so loose by now! This pony's something else lol, especially compared to my others. At least with all her comfort around wire and having her legs _in _it she's not likely to panic if she ever does get tangled (which is my worst horse nightmare).
That one time when they had a short fence line with two, low wires, she actually got her hind leg... over the fence. So it was like between her back legs and then out on her left side if that makes sense. When I ran out to rescue her she was standing there with an interested, curious look on her face while she gently pulled against it to check if it would give to pressure. She stood there calmly while I got her out, really couldn't care much less though she seemed a little quiet after, she hid her head in my chest once she was out if I remember correctly lol. No blood, I checked. Maybe it was all a master plan to reach that itchy spot, smh.

Funny story: the other day, I'd just fed the horses (and they get their hay in half a round bale feeder, it’s about up to their chest, a lil higher, open half pushed against the fence for easy feeding), and I went about checking Heidi’s hooves while she ate. Didn't have a pick and she wasn’t haltered/didn’t have a rope around her neck or anything, but she’s trusting enough to let me do that. So picked up her front right, she didn’t try to leave but wasn’t thrilled about it and tried to get out of my grasp. I wouldn’t let go when she leaned down, going down on one knee, so she did that half-rear/jump high-paw thing. That one worked… partially. She came down with her leg over the side of the feeder. The look on her face was comical, she sniffed at her leg then looked at me like “what just happened?!”. (luckily the feeder isn't high enough to break a leg or anything, she could stand with one leg up and over, lying on the top rail, but it was an uncomfortable strain)
I told her she could get herself out of that one but she gave a half-hearted attempt and looked back at me. So I went in there, straightened her leg, picked it/her up and freed her. I thought she wouldn’t try that one again, but by the time I came around to her left she tried it again. Didn’t get hooked up again though lol.


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## Chevaux (Jun 27, 2012)

Barb wire isn’t my first choice but in order to give the horses a couple of good sized pastures, that’s what I have to use (the corrals are post and rail). It’s three wires on the perimeter and two wires on the shared line. I keep the wire as tight as possible. I have the bottom strand as far off the ground as possible which works fine for full size horses but I strongly suspect makes it significantly easier for minis or small ponies to leave the premises.

It’s been my observation that leg injuries tend to happen (if they’re going to happen) because of the lower wires which is what you need if you are pasturing cattle (around here that means four to five strand barb wire). I have seen horses hit a tight three strand wire fence straight on and when they hit it the front legs shot forward a bit and because there was no bottom wire there was nothing to catch the legs. They then just kind of bounced back off the fence with no injuries other than a few very minor ***** spots, as you might expect, from the barbs on the chest areas. It’s also been my observation that the bigger the pasture with plenty of roaming and grazing space the less you have to worry about fencing material.

In the perfect world, I’d have beautiful split rail fence throughout....sigh.


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## boots (Jan 16, 2012)

For large pastures I have no problem using barbed wire. Like 700 acres and up. Those are areas where cattle will likely be in at some time, too. 

For paddocks and holding pastures (2 - 50 acres), I prefer smooth wire. 

Last summer I lease a place with three decent sized paddocks, or small pastures, with "floating fence" using electric tape. That was high maintenance. The wind blew the floating posts between the solid posts and I had to reset them too frequently. The deer and elk crossing the fence stretched out and I had to re-tighten the electric tape a few times.


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

Our internal fencing is mostly visible electrified polybraid, the perimeter fencing is barbed wire, as this is a cattle property and that's how it came. @COWCHICK77 made the excellent point that the space horses have in a paddock is very much related to their safety with fencing. In small yards and paddocks, they frequently tangle with fences. In large pastures, 5 acres up, I've only ever seen one fence tangle here in nine years, and that was in polybraid, with a silly horse who kicked at it (and never did it again).

Also, fences are dangerous until the horses know where they are, which they may not work out easily when they're going at speed and it's plain wire fencing - so I always run broad white tape as the top strand of plain wire electric fences, so the horses can see it clearly. On the perimeter barbed wire fencing, we used outriggers that run a broad white electrified tape about 1.5 feet inside the fenceline, to keep the horses' legs away from the stuff. If there are horses on the other side of a fence with a neighbour, I erect a polybraid fence about 6 feet from the barbed wire fence, to keep the horses from tangling with each other and the fence.

We also plant shelter belts alongside fencelines, to provide an additional visual cue.



I'd never build horse-specific enclosures from the stuff, and especially small constructions. But, on large pastures with plenty of room, with an electrified tape running on outriggers to keep horses away from the barbed wire, and no horses across fences from each other, you'd have to be really unlucky to have a problem.

Here's an example from the Internet, but ours are spaced wider and use broad white electric tape:










Our internal polybraid in the 5-acre paddocks:



Two new horses a few years ago having no problems at all working out the boundaries:






Electrified white tape on top of "invisible" plain wire electric fence:




A parrot perching on such tape:




Barbed wire perimeter fence with electrified white tape well inside it on outriggers:




Why we have them:






Cattle will break through polybraid occasionally (when there's a fence fault), but not generally through barbed wire. Having a cow in the wrong paddock is an easier fix than having a cow outside your property, on a road etc.


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## mred (Jan 7, 2015)

I use some barbed wire because of size of pasture. Wood paddocks and wood next to water and barn. Any new wire fence that was put up, I tied flagging around the top wire every few feet. This let the horses see it better. They have never been cut on it. It is 4 wire, with the bottom wire being barbless, so deer and dogs can go under without being cut. Also the top two wires are 13" apart. This is to help any deer jumping and not clearing the top wire to not hook foot into the 2nd wire.
I once had a horse the got caught up in barbed wire. It was some old wire(before me) that was from a very old fence in the woods. The horse had it around its front feet. I found it at feeding time when it did not come up. It stayed still. I went to get cutters. I cut wire from around feet. It did not move until I led it away. No cuts, only a few scratches. Due to people before me, I find short pieces of fence and metal every few months.
With a large pasture and wooded areas, they get scratched on branches but not on the wire. Also, it should always be tight.


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## beau159 (Oct 4, 2010)

Equilibrium said:


> Can you use barbed wire fencing for horses?
> Some say it's perfectly fine.
> Some say it's too dangerous.
> 
> So...?



You "can" use any type of fencing for horses. But whether you "should" is the question.


Honestly, barbed wire is NOT an ideal choice for horses. If a horse should get caught in the fence, those barbs will really dip/rip into skin, muscle, tendons, etc much much much worse than equivelant barbless smooth wire. Smooth wire will still cut them up too, but it won't "saw" on them like the barbs will. 



I live in cattle country so you do commonly see horses fenced with barbed wire, if that person also has cattle that they tend to. Since cattle have thicker hides than horses, barbed wire works better for cattle to get them to respect it better, and most ranchers aren't going to electrify all lengths of all their fences (that would just be too many sheer miles of fencing). 



But, if you only have horses, and not cattle, and you have options for other fencing, then DO NOT use barbed wire. So are so many other better options.


I have 130 acres that we just paid someone to update the perimeter last year. We ripped out the old fencing and barbed wire, and replaced it with new T-posts and 3 wires of "barbless" smooth wire with the middle wire going to be electric to encourage the horses to say the heck away from it, and the bottom wire a reasonable distance off the ground b/c that tends to be the wire a horse will get it's leg through. I have all the internal pastures to fence yet once we get the house done this year, but they will probably be similar, with the corrals going to be pipe fencing.


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## Joel Reiter (Feb 9, 2015)

I absolutely would not have any barbed wire on my place for any reason. On the 160 acres dairy farm where I grew up, over 20 years or so, two of our horses were badly scarred. One of them would certainly have been dead if it hadn't been a level-headed old roping horse that stood quietly until somebody freed it. All that barbed wire is long gone now. My brother-in-law runs over 100 head of Angus on that and adjoining land, and all his fences are high-tensile smooth wire electric.



I use the same fencing for my horses and cattle, Premier Intellibraid. Once the cattle are trained to respect the fence, they don't challenge it. The only fence problem I have with the cattle is Scottish Highlands have such long horns that they have a tendency to lift a rope off an insulator every once in a while.


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## SilverMaple (Jun 24, 2017)

It's one of those things that you use if you have to, but if there are other options, then no.

'Barbless' barbed (twisted) wire is the same price as barbed wire. While still not great, it's slightly safer for the same cost if you are installing new. If you use either of those, reinforce it with electric so the horses stay away from it, and keep it humming tight. Most severe barbed/twisted wire injuries seem to be from saggy wire. Animals on a lot of acreage tend to leave the fencing alone. If your fences are enclosing 1000-acre fields, then yeah, you can get away with it in most cases provided the animals can see it.

Hi-tensile is popular here-- is it really all that safe? No. But it's better than barbed wire and cost for installation isn't all that much more. Some horses manage to hit it hard enough to 'cheese slice' themselves to pieces, but I know at least a dozen people here that use it, and nobody has ever had a serious injury. Hi-tensile is usually electric on the top and second-from-the-bottom strands. It's main safety issue if you keep it tight is that it's invisible. My horses are kept in with hi-tensile, but they know where the boundaries are, and it's reinforced with electric tape so it's easier for them to see. 

If you can afford it, post and rail, vinyl fence, post and board are ideal, but rarely found here. A few places have no-climb, but the amount of snow that and other mesh fences stop make those less common than rail or wire fences. Mesh fences will drift over with the first snowstorm, then your pastures are unusable all winter unless you reinforce it with higher posts tacked on, and electric, or scoop/snowblow around the inside to keep the animals from walking out over the drifts. 

Electric options are common and relatively inexpensive. They are relatively safe provided they are kept tight and maintained, the animals can see them, and the charger works reliably.


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## secuono (Jul 6, 2011)

Neighbor's fence was barbed wire, before we bought the land and removed it.
He allowed another neighbor to use the land for 3 horses.
Those 3 always had new cuts & scrapes at the right heights for the fence. One even ripped up its right eyelids on the fence one day. 
So, my vote is it's not worth the risk.


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## Avna (Jul 11, 2015)

When I was a kid my sister and her pony got tangled in some barbed wire buried in grass. She said she has rarely been so scared. They came home dripping blood, and shaking, both of them, and they were lucky they only needed stitches. She bears the scars to the day, and if the pony was still alive after all these years, he would too. 

The first thing we did when we moved here was take down all the barbed wire fences and replace them with electric braid.


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## SilverMaple (Jun 24, 2017)

A family down the road from where I grew up always had 15 horses or so contained by rusty, saggy, horrid barbed wire fence. In all the years we lived there, they never had a horse injured on the fence-- even brand new foals.


About 5 years ago, they came into some money, ripped all of that out, and put in welded pipe fencing around the barn area and electrobraid around the pastures. Since then, they've lost two horses to fence injuries. One old gelding slipped, fell in a corner, and put his rear legs through the pipe fence. He broke his pelvis struggling before anyone saw him. The other was a 2 y.o. that tried to jump the electric when his buddy was trailered away, slipped and fell on it, got tangled and broke his neck struggling from the current shocking him. She saw that happen-- in the minute it took them to run to his aid, he was dead. 



Murphy's Law and all that....


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

On a large acreage where the horses don't congregate like a fence or a water trough area, it's less of a risk. I have a small acreage only 10 acres and I don't have any barbwire. There is some at the very bottom of the pasture where the neighbors has cows. I left it up obviously for their cows but I paralleled my own fence line with horse safe fencing. Even if I had a large acreage I probably wouldn't choose barbwire if I was running just horses. If it was already up I would tighten it and make sure it's not around an area where horses congregate.


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## ChieTheRider (May 3, 2017)

Ideally, barbed wire is a no, but if it was on a huge property then I'd worry less. If money wasn't a consideration (because horse grade fencing is EXPENSIVE) I'd rather choose safer stuff. 

But cattle will pretty much break through anything that isn't barbed wire, so for any place with cows it's almost a must. It works. the only thing that will straight up barge through barbed wire and not be badly harmed is a feral hog.


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

At one time, we had a small herd of Texas Longhorn cattle. The bull learned to take his horns and rip 5 strands of barbed wire loose in just a few seconds. Then the whole herd would come marching up the road to our house. I'm glad we got out of the cattle business.


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## bayleysours (Apr 1, 2019)

I would not use it as my fencing of choice, but a lot of people do. You have to keep it really tight. Also if you're going to be keeping them out at night in it I'd put something on it so they could see, maybe an orange flag or something. One of my old mare's was from out west and had gotten tangled in barbed wire and had a huge scar all around her neck, if it was too much higher up it would have hit her artery.


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

Celeste said:


> At one time, we had a small herd of Texas Longhorn cattle. The bull learned to take his horns and rip 5 strands of barbed wire loose in just a few seconds. Then the whole herd would come marching up the road to our house. I'm glad we got out of the cattle business.


I'm glad we've got polled or de-horned cattle only! 

Texas Longhorns look amazing, but I've always wondered how on earth you'd get them up a loading ramp with those horns, or if they'd puncture each other on a truck. @Celeste, you are in a position to enlighten me on this subject! inkunicorn:


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## Chevaux (Jun 27, 2012)

One thing I’d like to note is when it comes to perimeter fencing, there should also be consideration to keeping livestock out. In that case, depending on the neighbourhood four footed population, one may need to go with something like a sturdy barb wire fence as loose cattle (which has happened where I am) tend to ignore electric or a lightly built fence that horses may respect. 

The other thing about perimeter fencing, I think, is that it is sometimes a mistake to rely on electric fencing if one wants to keep horses in an area where it would be especially dangerous (such as by a busy highway) if they got out because electricity failed.


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

This is an excellent point, @Chevaux! And believe me, if we made a financial windfall, we'd seriously consider installing a deep moat around our 150 acres, with hungry piranhas in it! :twisted: And then a nice sturdy fence inside that, not dependent on electricity, with an electric tape running inside on outriggers! We'd have a drawbridge, of course, for nice people...


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## george the mule (Dec 7, 2014)

Horses are disaster-prone creatures; if there is a way for them to get into trouble, they _will_ find it.
I systematically cleared our property of barbed wire (and sundry other debris), and replaced it with smooth "stock" wire during our first season here. I thought I had it all, but after five years in the pasture, Oily found some down by the creek, and got into a fight with it. The wire won.
Eighteen months later, and you don't even want to know how much in vet bills, his hoof wall has mostly regrown, and he is back to doing his "trail dressage" thing for me.
I don't think this would have happened with smooth wire:


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## csimkunas6 (Apr 18, 2010)

Ive seen a few fatal injuries due to barb wire, one when I was in highschool, horse ran thru barb wire, ended up having to be put down from injuries, saw another one last year, rider took her horse off the trail, he got tangled up in a downed fence no one was aware of, horse freed himself and took off running thru more wire, injuries were pretty bad, but he did recover, sadly, the horse was found to have cancer a few months later and had to be put down.

We currently have barb wire fencing, people before us had it up and since we just moved here, well moved here in the winter, we havent gotten around to changing it. Luckily for me, my horse is not a fence tester, if very respectable of fences, they are on 20 acres of open pasture, and their main water/feeding area is in the middle of the pasture. Will be replacing the fencing as soon as Im able to afford new horse safe fencing.


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

I've seen good and bad with barb-wire containing animals, yes including horses where I live.
What to me makes more the difference is age of the wire...
IF, if it is rusted and nasty, old then get rid of it and string the new that if they get cut, it is a clean cut not ragged, jagged and shredded skin.
That is true with all kinds of wire fencing....rust coated is a danger and nightmare waiting to happen.

I'm not a fan of smooth electric wire for the same reasons...when they hit it hard they are cut just like it happens with barbed wire barbed or smooth.
Deep cuts that lacerate through skin, muscle, tendon and blood supply....

You want to run electric, fine...
Give the horse something significant to see also like a top board that is very visible for them to see when they run in blind panic or excitement and _they do _forget boundaries and plow into and through hot wire not seen but seen through...
Hot tape, wide and thick coated wire easily seen is something different hopefully...
For that reason you also will _*not*_ find me using metal fence posts or step-ins that impale so easily...
Have you ever seen the rips of skin from either?
I have, and the horse did it scratching her butt...standing-still.
No, wood posts you won't easily change your pasture shape or size, but my wood posts _*are*_ seen which gives the horse a better chance of avoiding them in my opinion.
Part of why my horses don't crash their fence is they know where it is cause it _doesn't_ change, _doesn't_ move...it is always in the exact same spot and it is seen. :|
Horses can run into wood fence & posts...but just by the type of material it is makes me pretty positive it is better seen and acknowledged than a thin strip of wire and a metal post. :|

By me, the cattle operations run barb wire, with large nasty barbs...
They run wood posts and string the wire on those wood fence posts...
A few use those metal posts...and most of them are the operations that have loose cattle, sagging fences and issues...more and more the wood posts are making their comeback along with new barb wire now also being strung 6 strings closer, much closer spacing between wires also seen. 
Rare that I see any cow putting head forget body between the new strung fence.
From what I notice, fence posts and wire seem changed out to new about every 5 years do to sun-aging I think...sun here is so damaging to integrity of things.

And horses do often graze with the cattle, horses graze next to it, they _don't _challenge the wire tasting grass the other side unless it sags down...they then test and get in trouble! :frown_color:

But to me, wire is wire...protect by being vigilant in replacing knowing the day is coming where the encounter is going to happen.
Reduce the disaster because you are _*not*_ going to totally eliminate it.
If you're going to run wire of any kind, then make darn sure you also protect against tetanus too...
:runninghorse2:...


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## rambo99 (Nov 29, 2016)

It doesn't matter what kind of fence horse's can get hurt on any of them. I've know horse's who broke legs crashing a post and board fence. Horses have severed legs going through smooth wire fence.

If there's a way to kill themselves they will. Barb wire isn't something I would use to fence in my horse's. 

My fences are 4 feet high woven wire with hot wire on top a second strand of hot 2 feet from ground. All hot wire is on extended connectors, so its about 6 inches out from fence.


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

SueC said:


> I'm glad we've got polled or de-horned cattle only!
> 
> Texas Longhorns look amazing, but I've always wondered how on earth you'd get them up a loading ramp with those horns, or if they'd puncture each other on a truck. @Celeste, you are in a position to enlighten me on this subject! inkunicorn:


It was quite a problem. We ended up getting a professional cattle hauler out to help us load them. They were very well aware of their horns and they would try to kill you. They were sweet when they were young. They had no real fear of humans and no respect either.


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## ChieTheRider (May 3, 2017)

Celeste said:


> It was quite a problem. We ended up getting a professional cattle hauler out to help us load them. They were very well aware of their horns and they would try to kill you. They were sweet when they were young. They had no real fear of humans and no respect either.


And it's not like you can chase them off with a stick or whip like you can a horse. Those cattle hides are TOUGH. Nothing short of a 2x4 in the face will deter one coming after you. Even then if they've put their mind to it and have that adrenaline going the best thing to do is get the heck out of the way.


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

If I had cattle like that, I'd have an electric cattle prod for my own safety...


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

SueC said:


> If I had cattle like that, I'd have an electric cattle prod for my own safety...


When I was in school, I worked at a bull research center. One came after me. I used the stock prod. It made him mad. Fortunately, he had no horns and I had cowboys there to rescue me.


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

I think I remember that story, @Celeste! :rofl: You ought to repeat it in full, to give everyone better core strength and therefore improve their riding etc... :Angel:

Speaking of cattle etc, and with an election coming up here in Australia, and the airwaves and TV supersaturated with politicians so that we're avoiding both like the plague and watching DVDs and reading books instead:

How many politicians does it take to milk a cow? 24! Four to hold onto the teats, twenty to life the cow up and down...


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

Celeste said:


> At one time, we had a small herd of Texas Longhorn cattle. The bull learned to take his horns and rip 5 strands of barbed wire loose in just a few seconds. Then the whole herd would come marching up the road to our house. I'm glad we got out of the cattle business.





SueC said:


> If I had cattle like that, I'd have an electric cattle prod for my own safety...





Celeste said:


> When I was in school, I worked at a bull research center. One came after me. I used the stock prod. It made him mad. Fortunately, he had no horns and I had cowboys there to rescue me.


We have T. Longhorns by us,_ lots of them..._
_Seems a cross the ranchers like, they are hardy beasts.
_It is one of the only cattle that I see such caution by the cowhands exhibited...
I don't see the guys arriving with the same numbers or with horse trailers of horses either.
They seem to be very ornery and difficult to predict in reaction, and smart!
Cattle are "dumb"....
Longhorns are smart and crafty...they think and you can see them sizing up a situation.
Cattle prods that I've seen must get you to close to the animal to be of any use...
Some of those horns are feet long and huge spread in width...by me, ones I've seen... horns are every bit of 6' wide and probably 4' - 5' long off the head, razor sharp points and no-way, no-how am I getting near one of them animals..to zap him and make him mad or madder mg:
:runninghorse2:...


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

Increase your voltage enough though, and the nervous system gets stunned - Longhorn or dumb breed alike! ;-)

It seems that this breed requires a zap that renders them unconscious, in case of necessary self-defence. You can see why they're not popularly kept on cattle farms the world over...:Angel:


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## Avna (Jul 11, 2015)

One of the things I particularly hate about barbed wire is how people tack it up to trees or whatever and then wander away, and twenty or fifty years later it's still there, waiting for its opportunity to maim or kill a horse. It is such nasty stuff to work with, especially when it's rusty and sagging and tangled in brambles and the u-nails are grown over into the trees. So people just leave it. It's all over the place around here.


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## Countrylovingmamma (Feb 27, 2019)

When we were first starting to work on our fencing we were wondering the same thing since 2 sides of our property were fenced by barbed wire ( our neighbors have cattle ) and two were unfenced. After talking to several people we were told some horror stories about injuries to horses with barbed wire. So to be safe we decided to go with High tensile wire on all for sides with two strands being a hotwire to help keep out pesky wildlife and help keep the horses from running through it. I would say though unless you have cattle or a neighbor has cattle don't use barbed wire if you don't have to.


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## george the mule (Dec 7, 2014)

horselovinguy said:


> Cattle are "dumb"....


I'm not too sure about this, and true; I don't know too many Bovines.
But the one I know best, the neighbors old Hereford cow named Rosy, isn't stupid. She is kinda slow, but if you look in her eyes, the gears are turning. Slowly, but turning for sure. She seems to be seeking the lowest energy solution to whatever problem confronts her; usually me trying to herd her back into her pasture.
"Yea, if you insist, Human. I'm going; just don't rush me . . ." :-D


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

OK...I agree.
Cattle are _*not* _dumb but some are not so quick in the mental area as others.
The stories told are that they are not free-thinkers but more follow the leader...
If moving in a herd and the first one tips off the cliff edge, there goes the herd unless the mounted cowboys can turn the herd off the cliff edge...
Our horses will try to stop..they may slip over but they _don't _willingly gallop along and not watch where they go...why one horse will spook, spin-off and others not...
Free-thinkers...
:runninghorse2:...


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## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

@horselovinguy "Cattle are dumb".


george the mule said:


> I'm not too sure about this, and true; I don't know too many Bovines.
> But the one I know best, the neighbors old Hereford cow named Rosy, isn't stupid. She is kinda slow, but if you look in her eyes, the gears are turning. Slowly, but turning for sure. She seems to be seeking the lowest energy solution to whatever problem confronts her; usually me trying to herd her back into her pasture.
> "Yea, if you insist, Human. I'm going; just don't rush me . . ." :-D


Some years ago, I got to hang around with a rather astute ox drover. He let me drive a single ox as he gave me a running commentary on working oxen. One thing he said was, that cattle are not dumb, but there is a "wide synaptic gap in there".


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

A friend runs a few cattle on open range in the west. He tries to remove all of them when his allotment time runs out, but a few are able to hide out. They can stay feral for years. Until caught. Tough to find them and harder to move them.

He had a stallion who disliked being ridden. Disliked humans. But then he discovered working wild cattle! The stallion would wade in to them, biting and twisting and kicking with both rear hooves. My friend said all he could do was hang on. He was certain if he came off, they both would cheerfully trample him to death. In the end, the stallion always won. The stallion loved it! He decided it was OK being ridden in exchange for sometimes getting to go work cattle like that.


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## elkdog (Nov 28, 2016)

At my place the fences do double duty. Keep the horses in, keep everything else out. A heard of elk will run right through everything except barbed wire. They'll even run through that if it isn't maintained. Moose are stupid! If they touch an electric fence they charge into it. I can't tell you how many times I had to go down the road and retrieve the fence.
It's been my experience (and my vets') that T posts injure more horses than the fence. Now all my T posts have caps.
Most fence injuries happen in the corners and it doesn't matter what kind of fence it is. A lot of injuries happen from the horse running down the fence line and slamming into the corner. If we can avoid corners by rounding them off, or angling them we can avoid a lot of injuries.


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

Reading through but not finished, something that jumps out to me is that no matter the size lot you have fenced if you have a horse intent on running another through a fence then it doesn't matter the material there will be injuries unless the animal jumps it cleanly. Any fence can cause injury or death under the right(non ideal) circumstances. It is the owner/manager's job to determine and prioritize an ideal situation. That includes size of turn out, number of animals, which animals can be safely placed together and type of fence. There are situations you can not have complete control over and you do the best you can with what you have. Death had resulted with any type of fence just depends on what happened to cause the two to meet.


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## rambo99 (Nov 29, 2016)

All my fence post are T post no caps, never had a horse injured. I've had some pretty stupid horse's here over the years and never an injury from post or fencing. 

Even the barn sour idiot never got hurt from current fencing. He learned real quick the fence bites..got shocked a good couple of times, it literally set him back on his butt.


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## george the mule (Dec 7, 2014)

elkdog said:


> At my place the fences do double duty. Keep the horses in, keep everything else out. A heard of elk will run right through everything except barbed wire. They'll even run through that if it isn't maintained. Moose are stupid! If they touch an electric fence they charge into it. I can't tell you how many times I had to go down the road and retrieve the fence.
> It's been my experience (and my vets') that T posts injure more horses than the fence. Now all my T posts have caps.
> Most fence injuries happen in the corners and it doesn't matter what kind of fence it is. A lot of injuries happen from the horse running down the fence line and slamming into the corner. If we can avoid corners by rounding them off, or angling them we can avoid a lot of injuries.


Yea, I have had Elk take out our fencing; usually just the top wire, but a couple of months ago, I watched a confused young cow-elk take out about 50ft of the neighbors fence after failing to clear it with a pitiful attempt at a jump. (She then trotted away with no visible damage; yet another argument for smooth wire.) The neighbor horses were quick to take advantage of the gap, and within minutes, all four of them came trotting up the road to visit with/tease mine. They know me, and it didn't take too long to get a catch-string on the Alpha horse "Carlos", and lead him (with his herd straggling along behind, and mine bellowing encouragement across the fence) back home.
Rosy, the above mentioned Bovine, just leans on the fence until something gives. George will sometimes stand on the middle wire until it breaks, and then duck under. I double up on the "stays" in places where he might be tempted to break out. Fortunately, we live in a relatively closed neighborhood, so the animals are fairly safe no matter where they wander. If you are on property adjacent to a busy road, I cannot recommend a single run of wire-on-t-post fencing, 'cause they _will_ go thru it eventually; count on it.

And T-posts. They tend to be kinda sharp anyway, and after driving them in, they often develop razor sharp edges. They will cut your gloves, they will cut you, and they will assuredly lacerate your Equines.

There are a variety of T-post caps available; some are for use with a hot-wire, but unless this is a useful feature, just get the fitted plastic ones:
https://www.valleyvet.com/ct_detail...TlCS5CaOPtPyLTH7EN1PJoaAb3A4JK2oaAry_EALw_wcB

When I put in new wire, particularly if it is in a new place, I always adorn the top wire with a strip of surveyors tape to increase its visibility. This can be removed after a month or two, once the critters have had a chance to learn about the new fence.


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## The Equestrian vagabond (Mar 14, 2014)

Living out in the West on ranches, you've got barbed wire. It's not practical/possible to avoid it out here, unless you're going to keep your horses locked up in small paddocks, which we don't. We did have one mare cut up a hind leg badly in it one year. however, we also had a gelding cut a leg up badly in smooth wire. Some horses will find a way to try to kill themselves on any kind of fencing.


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## AtokaGhosthorse (Oct 17, 2016)

About Cows: What they don't step on, they poop on is true. They have their own kind of smarts, but yes... large synaptic gap there. Some are smarter than others though and I think the truly clever ones are the ones we all think are crazy and sell ASAP.


Hubs: We don't breed cows to be smart, we breed them to eat. We want our horses and dogs smart, not our cows.


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