# Barrel Prospects?



## Aesthetic

5 YEAR OLD PALOMINO MARE

Here's her ad


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## Elana

REALLY hard to tell what her back end conformation is. Looks posty through the hocks and possibly sickle hocked. She is quite long through the coupling and she looks very front end heavy. In the photo posted here she is pointing with her left front. It MAY be how she is standing in this one photo but horses that point often have hoof, fetlock joint or navicular lameness. 

In her pedigree it looks like she has Johnny Dial. I had a 1980 mare sired by a AAA son of Johnny Dial (Pat's Jim Bob). She was a barrel horse then went over to being a heeling horse after I sold her. Darn good horse. Her name was Pat's Twin Maple.


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## Aesthetic

Hmmm good catch. I've been looking around and talking to owners


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## Aesthetic

Poco Gay Cee (Talula)

I like this mare. She looks solid, I think she's decent from what I can see


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## lilruffian

The bay is a nicer looking horse i think. She has a nice back end on her, nice back and though her shoulder could be a bit bigger and her chest deeper in my opinion, it has a good angle.
The only thing i dont like about her are her front legs. Nothing severely wrong with them, she just stands under herself.


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## Aesthetic

I really like the bay. I'll be getting more pictures soon and more recent pictures of her. She has been turned out to pasture, so she may be fresh. I don't mind. 
She does stand under herself, could that effect her performance?
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## CLaPorte432

Can you really afford another horse? I get the impression that finances might be tight from your other threads. Your waiting on money for the vet to come out and check out the 14 year old. Waiting to get the money for boots. Can't spend a bunch of money to help relieve arthritis pain in the 14 year old etc. Also...she may have ulcers...ulcer treatment is expensive!

Selling a lame horse...You'll be lucky to give her away. You'll be lucky to get any money for her.

Buying another horse would not be a priority if I was in that position. JMO.
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## Aesthetic

We are taking the mares in next week. We aren't "tight". 
I'm sorry that's the impression you get but we do have to wait to make sure we can do everything without waiting a long time. 
Ulcer treatment out here isn't as expensive as we expected. We've made appointments. The mare we are getting exams who is 8 is already being looked at by a family who wants and easy go trail horse and brood mare. We are waiting on the exam to determine price. 
The boots are expensive, $200 for a set of four. Which we pick up here in a few weeks after we check the mares. The mare goes on supplements for her arthritis, and my family refuses to inject because they don't believe it's a good thing. 
We are financially fine for another horse, what my money is to you is nothing. If my family thought we couldn't afford another horse, we wouldn't be looking for another. 
Thank you.


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## CLaPorte432

I obviously don't know you. But want what's right for all horses involved anyways. 
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## Aesthetic

Money is a touchy subject because we aren't as well off as other but we make things work. I'd sacrifice anything in my world for my horses. 
I'm just preparing for the worse if I sell the mare because she's lame. Which if she's not I may sell her partially because I feel she doesn't have the desire to do what I ask.


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## Elana

I like the Bay more. Sturdier looking and standing up fine. 

Just will add one thing here on the (possibly) navicular horse. Such horses should not be brood mares unless the navicular can be traced to something specific in the horse's life or care. Clearly you have given this horse good care, good farrier work and so forth so that leaves genetic predisposition. There is a good bit of Navicular in Quarter horses.

A lot of ppl will criticize me for this.. but a horse that has a chronic lameness at age 8 (if that is what she indeed has) that will only get progressively worse or that has no cure might be a good choice to put down. Horses are just too expensive to keep around looking pretty in a field and a horse with this issue is worth about kill price. JMO


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## Aesthetic

Elana said:


> I like the Bay more. Sturdier looking and standing up fine.
> 
> Just will add one thing here on the (possibly) navicular horse. Such horses should not be brood mares unless the navicular can be traced to something specific in the horse's life or care. Clearly you have given this horse good care, good farrier work and so forth so that leaves genetic predisposition. There is a good bit of Navicular in Quarter horses.
> 
> A lot of ppl will criticize me for this.. but a horse that has a chronic lameness at age 8 (if that is what she indeed has) that will only get progressively worse or that has no cure might be a good choice to put down. Horses are just too expensive to keep around looking pretty in a field and a horse with this issue is worth about kill price. JMO


I understand where you come from. There are measure that can help your horses navicular but I'm look for an athlete, which IF she has she won't be. 
If she has navicular it's barely noticeable. I notice a limp in the left turn, not bad but it's there. It's nothing close to "oh my gosh" it's the limp a lot of people ride through if they don't pay mind to their horse. 
I will not ride a horse through any limp, even if it's just in a turn or barely noticeable in a straight away. I pay very close attention to their gate and watch them. 
I don't think she will have a severe form of laminitis, but I always fear the worse. Either way, I don't see her sound enough to practice on now. 

Her breeding is all halter. I'll try some research but I won't be able to tell. According to her owners before me she never limped, but she limped when I took her out of the trailer. I have her a few days and it went away but after purchase I noticed it was returning.
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## beau159

I would absolutely pass on the palomino. She is not balanced in the body. Long back. Over at the knee. Possibly post-legged. Hindquarters aren't very rounded. Hocks could be lower to the ground. If you are looking specifically for a barrel racing prospect, I would not choose her. 

Now the bay, I like. It is hard to tell his true confo with the pictures they posted. Appears like his back might be a tish long, but the next picture looks fine. Nice strong looking legs. Hocks could be lower to the ground. Good rounding of his hindquarters. 

Although you do have the potential of the bay having HERDA with her pedigree going back to Poco Bueno. And I would be concerned with the bad habits she's learned from young riders who have already messed with her on the barrel pattern. But confo-wise, I think she looks alright. 




Aesthetic said:


> The mare goes on supplements for her arthritis, and my family *refuses to inject* because they don't believe it's a good thing.


Totally off topic here, but just curious. What are you family's thoughts against injecting?


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## Aesthetic

beau159 said:


> I would absolutely pass on the palomino. She is not balanced in the body. Long back. Over at the knee. Possibly post-legged. Hindquarters aren't very rounded. Hocks could be lower to the ground. If you are looking specifically for a barrel racing prospect, I would not choose her.
> 
> Now the bay, I like. It is hard to tell his true confo with the pictures they posted. Appears like his back might be a tish long, but the next picture looks fine. Nice strong looking legs. Hocks could be lower to the ground. Good rounding of his hindquarters.
> 
> Although you do have the potential of the bay having HERDA with her pedigree going back to Poco Bueno. And I would be concerned with the bad habits she's learned from young riders who have already messed with her on the barrel pattern. But confo-wise, I think she looks alright.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Totally off topic here, but just curious. What are you family's thoughts against injecting?



Bad habits I can handle, I'm will to take her back to the beginning. 

My family doesn't agree with injections for several reasons. 
They don't like that after you inject you need to keep up at a pace of $700. Not only that but the boost in metabolism we've heard is hard to handle with weight. Now I don't mind injections if the horse is older. I was actually just look at a three year old filly who has great potential, who has already been injected at 3. That's a no no for me. 
Also my parents have heard people call injections nerve blocking. Which we both would not do. I know they aren't nerve blocks, it's a fluid correct? To cushion the joint?
I did talk to my parents last night and we came to conclusion that if she absolutely needed injections, we would get them for her. It's just a far option for us.


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## Elana

The injections replace the fluid cushion in the joint. 

Nerve blocks or even nerving by cutting the nerves is another issue. Some people used to "nerve" (have the vet cut the nerve to the rear portion of the foot) on bad navicular horses. It has allowed some horses to live comfortably and continue to work. However, some horses develop terribly painful granulomas at the severed nerve end. Some vets would drill a hole in the cannon bone and put the end of the nerve in there to prevent this. It worked some of the time. 

There are also cases of Navicular that have been fixed with proper hoof trimming. Loosie on this forum can tell you more about that. Sometimes Navicular can be corrected by a change in the trimming.. and that is awesome.


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## beau159

Aesthetic said:


> Bad habits I can handle, I'm will to take her back to the beginning.
> 
> My family doesn't agree with injections for several reasons.
> They don't like that after you inject you need to keep up at a pace of $700. Not only that but the boost in metabolism we've heard is hard to handle with weight. Now I don't mind injections if the horse is older. I was actually just look at a three year old filly who has great potential, who has already been injected at 3. That's a no no for me.
> Also my parents have heard people call injections nerve blocking. Which we both would not do. I know they aren't nerve blocks, it's a fluid correct? To cushion the joint?
> I did talk to my parents last night and we came to conclusion that if she absolutely needed injections, we would get them for her. It's just a far option for us.



Maybe first we should clarify. What sort of injections are you talking about? 

Adequan: my vet quoted me $405 for 10 doses. You do have to start with a high loading dose of 7 treatments in the first month, but then it goes to simply once a month after that to maintain.

I'm not sure how expensive Legend is but it may be similar.

Adequan and Legend both act in different ways, but they are both for overall joint health. They do not get injected directly into a joint. Adequan will help stop the degradation of hyaline cartilage (some will argue that it regenerates it) and maintain joint spaces. It is more for long-term maintenance. It is given in the muscle. There's research going on now about a "generic" Adequan called Pentosan which might have the same effect for a much lower price tag.

Legend is more for short-term treatment to reduce inflammation and stimulate HA production. It is given IV. And in recent news, supposedly there is a drug being released soon with FDA approval called NexHA that is supposed to be similar to Legend. 


I just had my horse's stifle injected last week as he has a catching stifle problem. She used high molecular hyaluronic acid (hyvisc) and a small dose of triamcinolone, injected into the joint. It cost me $100 plus sedation .... which he needed anyway to get his teeth floated. My horse is 8. 

He may need another one in 3 to 6 months. He might not. We are going to watch him and see how he does. 

My vet said that they would see stifle problems all the time in Texas when she did her residency. Usually in young horses who were started in cutting or barrel training for futurities. 

There are many horses where they only need injections once, or for a very short time, and then don't need them anymore. Might be a hock. Might be a stifle. Might be a sacroilliac joint. Etc. Injections are not always life-long.

In your example of the 3-year-old filly, I'd want to know why she was injected. It may or may not deter me from looking at her because it might have been something that only needed an injection one time and now she's fine. Or it might be something she just needs a maintenance injection on once in a while, which I would be fine with. 

Anyway. I don't mean any disrespect but to me it sounds like your family doesn't have a true understanding of all types of injections and what exactly it is that they do. Nothing wrong with choosing to NOT do something, but then do your homework so you can actually make an educated decision.

Nerve blocks and injections are totally different. When a vet does a lameness eval, they will often do nerve blocks to isloate the area of the leg that is in pain. It is a diagnostic injection. Depending on WHAT is lame, a treatment injection may or may not be an option.


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## Elana

Great post Beau159!!


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## Aesthetic

beau159 said:


> Maybe first we should clarify. What sort of injections are you talking about?
> 
> Adequan: my vet quoted me $405 for 10 doses. You do have to start with a high loading dose of 7 treatments in the first month, but then it goes to simply once a month after that to maintain.
> 
> I'm not sure how expensive Legend is but it may be similar.
> 
> Adequan and Legend both act in different ways, but they are both for overall joint health. They do not get injected directly into a joint. Adequan will help stop the degradation of hyaline cartilage (some will argue that it regenerates it) and maintain joint spaces. It is more for long-term maintenance. It is given in the muscle. There's research going on now about a "generic" Adequan called Pentosan which might have the same effect for a much lower price tag.
> 
> Legend is more for short-term treatment to reduce inflammation and stimulate HA production. It is given IV. And in recent news, supposedly there is a drug being released soon with FDA approval called NexHA that is supposed to be similar to Legend.
> 
> 
> I just had my horse's stifle injected last week as he has a catching stifle problem. She used high molecular hyaluronic acid (hyvisc) and a small dose of triamcinolone, injected into the joint. It cost me $100 plus sedation .... which he needed anyway to get his teeth floated. My horse is 8.
> 
> He may need another one in 3 to 6 months. He might not. We are going to watch him and see how he does.
> 
> My vet said that they would see stifle problems all the time in Texas when she did her residency. Usually in young horses who were started in cutting or barrel training for futurities.
> 
> There are many horses where they only need injections once, or for a very short time, and then don't need them anymore. Might be a hock. Might be a stifle. Might be a sacroilliac joint. Etc. Injections are not always life-long.
> 
> In your example of the 3-year-old filly, I'd want to know why she was injected. It may or may not deter me from looking at her because it might have been something that only needed an injection one time and now she's fine. Or it might be something she just needs a maintenance injection on once in a while, which I would be fine with.
> 
> Anyway. I don't mean any disrespect but to me it sounds like your family doesn't have a true understanding of all types of injections and what exactly it is that they do. Nothing wrong with choosing to NOT do something, but then do your homework so you can actually make an educated decision.
> 
> Nerve blocks and injections are totally different. When a vet does a lameness eval, they will often do nerve blocks to isloate the area of the leg that is in pain. It is a diagnostic injection. Depending on WHAT is lame, a treatment injection may or may not be an option.


My family knows barely anything about horses. I'm the one who does all the study and research, but my parents make mistakes of listening to those with the wrong information. 
As I said, if she absolutely needs it I will get her hocks injected with whatever the vet recommends. We are going to Dr. Heite at Equine Sports Medicine in tomball Texas. I've had many people tell me that he's the absolute best. 

Either way the eight year old will probably be sold.


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## Aesthetic

Black Roping Horse

I've been talking to the owner of the bay mare, and so far we are considering her. I'm still looking around in case we can't get the horse or she's sold. I found this gelding. His pictures are really dark but I'll try to get more. Take a look at him. What do y'all think of the price as well? $2700 for a gelding who's only been roped off of?


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## CLaPorte432

The black looks decent. I wonder exactly how "slim" he is now..? Looks like he may need some extensive retraining by the way those people ride. They are all over his mouth in that big bit. :-( I'd certainly go and look at him as he looks like a capable little horse. With a nice butt too!
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## Aesthetic

CLaPorte432 said:


> The black looks decent. I wonder exactly how "slim" he is now..? Looks like he may need some extensive retraining by the way those people ride. They are all over his mouth in that big bit. :-( I'd certainly go and look at him as he looks like a capable little horse. With a nice butt too!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


If they ride as bad and rough as it looks in the pictures, I bet he will enjoy a softer change! 
I asked if they have any recent pictures and I'm waiting for a reply. I don't want to have to put 300 to 400 pounds on a horse I'm paying that much for. He looks nice, I do like his butt!


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## Natalierose

I like the bay mare!!


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## sarahfromsc

I like the gelding. But that could be due to the fact the gelding really needs an upgrade.


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## Aesthetic

Sadly the black gelding isn't for sale anymore. I did find a three year old that stole my heart. Here is her ad. AQHA ~ Grullo Mare
Here is her ad on the breeders website 
SALE BARN - JLS Performance Horses
Go down to "Pocos Primadonna" 

Here is a video 





Her pedigree. www.allbreedpedigree.com/gc+pocos+primadonna

She isn't broke yet, but the man said he would start her under saddle if I would like with extra charge while I'm waiting to sell my mare that's for sale. My parents and I are possibly going to take a trip to see her here soon to decide if we would like to go through with that. The man seems extremely trustworthy. This is his business and life, he's been extremely understanding and helpful. He offered to show me up to seven horses in one visit which could all be prospects for rodeo events. 

Thoughts?


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## Tryst

Pretty color, seems sensible minded. Hard to critique her conformation from anything posted. She looks much smaller than 15.2 in the video. Price seems extremely high for an unbroke horse without a notable pedigree in the first few generations. Also she should be tested for HERDA since she goes back to Poco Bueno at least four times! Around here an unbroke horse with her type of pedigree would be not more than $1000 (max). I don't think it is a bad thing that she wasn't started too young, but do you have the experience to bring along a young horse? Or the $$ to send her to a trainer. Also she probably won't be really ready to do barrels for at least a couple more years. Just things to think about.


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## Aesthetic

Tryst said:


> Pretty color, seems sensible minded. Hard to critique her conformation from anything posted. Moshe looks small. Price seems extremely high for an unbroke horse without a notable pedigree in the first few generations. Also she should be tested for HERDA since she goes back to Poco Bueno on both sides of the pedigree. Around here an unbroke horse would be not more than $1000 (max). I don't think it is a bad thing that she wasn't started too young, but do you have the experience to bring along a young horse? Or the $$ to send her to a trainer. Also she probably won't be really ready to do barrels for at least a couple more years.just things to think about.


He's going to break her, just start her under saddle. I have experience with young horses but have never broke a horse. She's almost three, and she won't be started in the pattern for another month or two after I get her and she won't be running for a long time. I see plenty of horses around at the age of 2 and 3 loping the pattern. Of course if get a vets advice before I do that. 
She's $2000 probably because it's a business. I've noticed ranches who breed their horses to sell normally sell then for more than the norm. I'll ask him if she has been tested, or if the parents are N/N. I see a lot of green or unbroken horses out here at $1500 or so depending in who sells them. 
I showed her pedigree to a trainer out here and he really likes it. He said she has some good foundation breeding.
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## Aesthetic

Tryst- I asked if they have been tested and he said he doesn't think any if them have. I can order a test and send it to him and he will test her for HERDA. Should I test her in a 5-panel as well or really only worry about HERDA?


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## Tryst

5 panel wouldn't hurt if you think it is a horse you are seriously interested in. I am not super knowledgable about some of the diseases that the 5-panel covers. I didn't see any Impressive in the pedigree, so think you are ok regarding HYPP, but I don't know much about the other three diseases.

And as far as I know HERDA is only a problem if homozygous, but good to know if you ever plan to breed, and since she has the potential to be homozygous (though unlikely) good to know.


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## Aesthetic

I'm sure either. We go visit her Saturday and discuss all the tests/training/prices and what not. I get to meet this mare and several others he has for sale incase I'm interested in another horse. 
This Thursday the mare I'm selling gets her lameness exam so we should be set to sell and if this mare I'm visiting is great I'll probably buy her after some training and my mare is sold. I'll take pictures for y'all 
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## cowgirl4753

Either that video is old and she's grown up some or that man is huge! Haha 
She doesn't look bad but I would still go for the bay 
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## Aesthetic

cowgirl4753 said:


> Either that video is old and she's grown up some or that man is huge! Haha
> She doesn't look bad but I would still go for the bay
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I haven't heard a word from the woman with the bay. And the video is new. They just brought her and several other fillies to the ranch to train and break. The man is also very tall, up next to the fence she looks average height but the man so seems to have very long legs and a long torso
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## Aesthetic

He sent me this today. Her first time wearing a saddle and sent me a nice video of her lunging with the saddle 😊


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## CLaPorte432

First time with a saddle and he's tying her head down? Good lord...that's a recipe for disaster.
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## Rideordie112

CLaPorte432 said:


> First time with a saddle and he's tying her head down? Good lord...that's a recipe for disaster.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Just what I was thinking.
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## Aesthetic

She's still his horse and he's the trainer, so I don't know what or why he does it. In the video her head was high so I don't think she had the side reins on in the video. 
Whatever he does I'll let him do it, I'm not knowledgable enough in breaking horses to criticize him.
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## beau159

I personally am NOT a fan of tying a horse's head around. To me, it is the lazy way to teach a horse to give to the bit. IMO I would pass on her. 

It could also be the angle of the picture, but it appears like they have the saddle on her way too far forward and it is restricting her shoulder movement. 

In the video, she may have never been lunged before (that's possible) but I did not like how he never once STOPPED moving the whip at her. If you don't give a horse release, they won't know what they did right. 

Personally, not a fan. 

Nice lookin' horse though.


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## Aesthetic

beau159 said:


> I personally am NOT a fan of tying a horse's head around. To me, it is the lazy way to teach a horse to give to the bit. IMO I would pass on her.
> 
> It could also be the angle of the picture, but it appears like they have the saddle on her way too far forward and it is restricting her shoulder movement.
> 
> In the video, she may have never been lunged before (that's possible) but I did not like how he never once STOPPED moving the whip at her. If you don't give a horse release, they won't know what they did right.
> 
> Personally, not a fan.
> 
> Nice lookin' horse though.


You would pass because the guy isn't doing something right? She was fresh off a ranch, she hasn't been messed with that much. Why pass on person fault rather than horse? Habits can be fixed. I am seeing her tomorrow and I will see then. 

I'm not a trainer and I can't tell him what and what not to do.
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## CLaPorte432

Aesthetic said:


> You would pass because the guy isn't doing something right? She was fresh off a ranch, she hasn't been messed with that much. Why pass on person fault rather than horse? Habits can be fixed. I am seeing her tomorrow and I will see then.
> 
> I'm not a trainer and I can't tell him what and what not to do.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I would pass on a horse I liked...because I don't like the owners/trainers. I will not support someone that isn't kind to their animals or has a shady way of training (like I think this guy does) Same goes with a backyard breeder, I'm not going to support poor breeding/stupidity.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

Well if I like this horse, I won't pass. A trainer is a trainer, all have different methods but if there's a problem it can be fixed. We don't know if he isn't kind or if he is. I will find out tomorrow.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

Today is the day! Gonna grab tons of pictures and videos of her. More information and what not.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

Here she is. 

My what a phenomenal little filly?? She is calm and loving. She barely flinched at the saddle. She took the bit and I watched them work her. I picked up her feet and ran my hands all over her. 
I thought she might have long sloping pasterns but I may be wrong. I'll post a video of her being drove. 

I will tell you, the man and his helper know what they're doing. They work slowly and nice with their horses. The side reins were used to keep her nose in. She works normally in a loose rein and martingale. She has a beautiful headset and stops and backs nicely. Give me a bit to post a video of her


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## livelyblueyes

On the little Grullo. I would personally pass. Not judging and we each have our own opinion. Mine is not based on the man but on her. Her hind end is so much higher than her withers. Her feet need work and do not seem to be sitting correctly. ( I am basing this off the most recent picture I see). Her neck connection is also pretty high. In all truth I cannot pinpoint the exact thing but something just screams "No" at me. I could well be wrong. Whatever you decide to do I wish you the best with it.


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## Aesthetic

livelyblueyes said:


> On the little Grullo. I would personally pass. Not judging and we each have our own opinion. Mine is not based on the man but on her. Her hind end is so much higher than her withers. Her feet need work and do not seem to be sitting correctly. ( I am basing this off the most recent picture I see). Her neck connection is also pretty high. In all truth I cannot pinpoint the exact thing but something just screams "No" at me. I could well be wrong. Whatever you decide to do I wish you the best with it.


She's been on a pasture with 30 head of horses for two years. Meaning she's had no human contact. I see a little bit butt high but nothing severe? Farrier issue was addressed today. She's been out of the pasture for two weeks and the farrier visits soon. I see what you mean on the neck tying in high but would that make her any less of an athlete or is it just not "pretty?"


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## livelyblueyes

On the neck it's not about pretty. It's more about really being able to get down in and dig through. It's hard for me to explain it. With a higher connection they tend to move with their heads more up as opposed to low and in line with the rest of the body. I guess you could say it is a balance thing. Honestly, nothing I said was about being pretty. It is all about utility. When she is finished filling out she will be a very pretty horse. However, pretty does not always make the best athlete. Not saying she isn't pretty now. Do I think she could be just fine as a barrel horse? Yes.. would I expect great things? no.

Edited to add- I would go with the bay. As I said not about pretty it's about build.


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## Aesthetic

livelyblueyes said:


> On the neck it's not about pretty. It's more about really being able to get down in and dig through. It's hard for me to explain it. With a higher connection they tend to move with their heads more up as opposed to low and in line with the rest of the body. I guess you could say it is a balance thing. Honestly, nothing I said was about being pretty. It is all about utility. When she is finished filling out she will be a very pretty horse. However, pretty does not always make the best athlete. Not saying she isn't pretty now. Do I think she could be just fine as a barrel horse? Yes.. would I expect great things? no.
> 
> Edited to add- I would go with the bay. As I said not about pretty it's about build.


Obviously it's not about pretty. I've never heard of the neck benefiting getting down and low. I don't care about pretty, I asked of the neck would decrease her athletic ability. 
As for the bay, I can't go with a horse I get no contact with the woman on. I have heard nothing from her. 

In other words, would the GRULLA make a nice athlete. If the neck is her only problem, I can deal with that. I don't think her neck tying in a bit high would greatly decrease performance.
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## livelyblueyes

I gave you my answer. I said she would be fine but not to expect anything outstanding. You have a very combative demeanor when I was simply trying to give advice that you asked for. If the Grulla is what you want then go for it. I am not saying she will not work. I simply stated I do not see her becoming an outstanding prospect. As far as the neck tying in not being a factor... that's hogwash. How each and every bone/muscle connects makes a difference. A neck that is tying in lower is more easily held in that position not to mention more naturally. It is something that she will naturally do it should not need to be taught. AT any rate that's my 2 cents. I believe I have answered your questions. If you dislike my answers then that is your choice. I simply stated from my perspective. I will make a note to self to avoid future topics where you ask for advice though if you are this combative to people who are answering questions you asked. Have a nice day and best wishes. Also last note- as for her feet I said they did not seem to sit right. Hard to tell exact in that pic. I did not say it was simply a farrier matter.


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## Aesthetic

Whatever you say. I see very many great athletic horses running pro with high tied necks then. Since you said that I've been doing research. Thank you for your advice, but I've never heard a horses neck tying in high or low throws off how they sit their butts in the dirt.
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## livelyblueyes

I don't understand why you are so very combative? AS I said we each have our own opinions on things. I am happy to agree to disagree.


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## Aesthetic

I'm not being combative, I just pointed out things I thought were odd or wrong. Sure thing, agree to disagree.


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## Aesthetic

I am wondering about the mare. Even at three I'm concerned about starting her on pattern even at a trot or a lope until she's four. I might start looking again to find a 4-6 year old. 

Thoughts?


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## Peppy Barrel Racing

If you are wanting to get started on the pattern with a horse a 4-6 year old is your better option because physically it's not as hard on them. The age you chose depends on how quickly you want to work on the pattern and how much training you are wanting to start with.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## beau159

Aesthetic said:


> You would pass because the guy isn't doing something right? She was fresh off a ranch, she hasn't been messed with that much. Why pass on person fault rather than horse? Habits can be fixed. I am seeing her tomorrow and I will see then.
> 
> I'm not a trainer and I can't tell him what and what not to do.
> _Posted via Mobile Device _


If you want people to continue giving you advice on these prospects, you do indeed need to stop being combative, as livelyblueyes has pointed out. 

I gave you my opinion on her and why. I don't need you to question my reasoning why because I've already stated it. Yes, bad habits can be fixed. Yes, some people don't mind fixing bad habits. As I already stated in my opinion, I do not think it is worth my *time* to fix mistakes on a young filly when I can easily find another one that has not been started or one that has not had mistakes made on her. _Especially when they want $2,000._ It is not worth it to me to spend that much cash on a filly that (in my opinion) hasn't been started right.

It has nothing to do with the fact that she was fresh. I did not like how he handled her in the video and I don't like what I see in the pictures. 



Aesthetic said:


> She has a beautiful headset


Does she TRULY have a beautiful headset? Or has it artificially been forced into frame? Is the rest of her body collected and traveling correctly?

To "set" a horse's head correctly, you have to start in the hindquarters. .... not with the head. 



Aesthetic said:


> Even at three I'm concerned about starting her on pattern even at a trot or a lope until she's four. I might start looking again to find a 4-6 year old.


What are your goals? When do you want to start running barrels?

If you want something you can start on the pattern right away, I'd be looking for a 5 or 6 year old. Their body is physically more mature to handle the physical stress of barrels, if you want to get them going more quickly. 

IMO, I won't even let a colt lope the pattern until they are 4. And even so, it is very light and it is limited. Those joints are so important.


----------



## Aesthetic

beau159 said:


> If you want people to continue giving you advice on these prospects, you do indeed need to stop being combative, as livelyblueyes has pointed out.
> 
> I gave you my opinion on her and why. I don't need you to question my reasoning why because I've already stated it. Yes, bad habits can be fixed. Yes, some people don't mind fixing bad habits. As I already stated in my opinion, I do not think it is worth my *time* to fix mistakes on a young filly when I can easily find another one that has not been started or one that has not had mistakes made on her. _Especially when they want $2,000._ It is not worth it to me to spend that much cash on a filly that (in my opinion) hasn't been started right.
> 
> It has nothing to do with the fact that she was fresh. I did not like how he handled her in the video and I don't like what I see in the pictures.
> 
> 
> 
> Does she TRULY have a beautiful headset? Or has it artificially been forced into frame? Is the rest of her body collected and traveling correctly?
> 
> To "set" a horse's head correctly, you have to start in the hindquarters. .... not with the head.
> 
> 
> 
> What are your goals? When do you want to start running barrels?
> 
> If you want something you can start on the pattern right away, I'd be looking for a 5 or 6 year old. Their body is physically more mature to handle the physical stress of barrels, if you want to get them going more quickly.
> 
> IMO, I won't even let a colt lope the pattern until they are 4. And even so, it is very light and it is limited. Those joints are so important.


If bringing to question what I think is odd or wrong is combative I will continue. Advice is advice, but I also like a reason behind it. 

My here was no force behind her head set, I was very up close and personal. She just varied between leve with her back or slightly below. 

I want to start barrel training after I get the feel and I know the horse. After I see if the horse is ready to start the pattern. I would like to be running by next school year so in august or September to have an easy (not finished) back up horse. Nothing that's running 1D or 2D by then but preferably between 3D and 5D. 
That's why I began to question if her age would suit was I need.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## beau159

Aesthetic said:


> I want to start barrel training after I get the feel and I know the horse. After I see if the horse is ready to start the pattern. I would like to be running by next school year so in august or September to have an easy (not finished) back up horse. Nothing that's running 1D or 2D by then but preferably between 3D and 5D.
> That's why I began to question if her age would suit was I need.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


When you say "next school year" do you mean August 2014 or August 2015?


----------



## Aesthetic

August 2014. That took me a minute.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## GotaDunQH

Aesthetic said:


> Here she is.
> 
> My what a phenomenal little filly?? She is calm and loving. She barely flinched at the saddle. She took the bit and I watched them work her. I picked up her feet and ran my hands all over her.
> I thought she might have long sloping pasterns but I may be wrong. I'll post a video of her being drove.
> 
> I will tell you, the man and his helper know what they're doing. They work slowly and nice with their horses. The side reins were used to keep her nose in. She works normally in a loose rein and martingale. She has a beautiful headset and stops and backs nicely. Give me a bit to post a video of her


Good Lord.....first you cop an an attitude after people see the vid, then you say "they know what they are doing" after you see her? FCS, look at her FEET! They have no clue and it has NOTHING to do with training.

But if you want her for barrels...and DON'T want to listen to anyone on here when you seek advice, then why bother even posting. She's terribly downhill, high hocked, weak loined. So go ahead and buy her for barrels and see what happens. It's obvious you don't want to listen.


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## GotaDunQH

Aesthetic said:


> Whatever you say. I see very many great athletic horses running pro with high tied necks then. Since you said that I've been doing research. Thank you for your advice, but I've never heard a horses neck tying in high or low throws off how they sit their butts in the dirt.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Then go friggin buy her and leave the rest of us alone, and DON'T start a thread if you rag on everyone who gives you a KNOWLEDGEABLE opinion. And for your information....where the neck ties in DOES matter....geesh.

So buy her, come back here in a year and report on what has happened. Good luck.


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## CLaPorte432

If you plan to start running in August, I think your going to end up with problems. 4 months is too fast to move in barrel horse training. You might be...MIGHT be, trotting a nice steady pattern. Loping would be pushing it in that little amount of time...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

CLaPorte432 said:


> If you plan to start running in August, I think your going to end up with problems. 4 months is too fast to move in barrel horse training. You might be...MIGHT be, trotting a nice steady pattern. Loping would be pushing it in that little amount of time...
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Out here a 5D time would be a nice lope on the pattern. I have no intentions of blowing a horse on the pattern. I've seen what happens and I'm currently watching a friend ruin her horse by pushing him after one month of being in the pattern. 
It's just an estimation, whichever horse I get will move at the pace it can move and the pace my...trainer? Helper? I don't know what to call him takes us. 
I dunno, I'm not sure how fast people are moving their horses today. I like to have my slow lope pattern down after 3 months or so. Definitely NOT running.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

GotaDunQH said:


> Good Lord.....first you cop an an attitude after people see the vid, then you say "they know what they are doing" after you see her? FCS, look at her FEET! They have no clue and it has NOTHING to do with training.
> 
> But if you want her for barrels...and DON'T want to listen to anyone on here when you seek advice, then why bother even posting. She's terribly downhill, high hocked, weak loined. So go ahead and buy her for barrels and see what happens. It's obvious you don't want to listen.


Excuse you? I definitely know who I'm not listening too. Goodbye.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

Anyways.

I'm beginning to search for..hmmmm 5-8 year olds? A lot harder to find a nice one out here that's broke and not started on a discipline of some sort already. I never realized that adding "barrel" in front of a horses name caused it's price to skyrocket about 6k! 
Woo! I guess breeders are calling me.... 15k for a mare just STARTED on the pattern.... Ouch.


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## Aesthetic

NICE SHAPELY DAPPLE GREY REG. GELDING Quarter Horse for sale in Carbon, Texas :: HorseClicks

This grey seems nice but something seems off about him. He has a long back IMO but do his hocks seem okay? Seeing something somewhere I'm not liking but then again I'm seeing things I do like. (I'm beginning to search and create a list) I may try again to talk to the lady with that bay mare. I messaged her, and I'm waiting on a reply. 

Anyways. I just saw the worst thing. I man trying to sell a coming toe year old. Here's the catch, he's broke. THAT is what infuriates me.


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## GotaDunQH

Aesthetic said:


> Excuse you? I definitely know who I'm not listening too. Goodbye.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 
LOL....I won't lose sleep over it, so don't worry and get all jammed up over it. You are very young, with SO MUCH MORE to learn. Hopefully, when you ASK for advice.....you'll listen and won't get all worked up and immature about when you hear the reality from others. Good luck in your horse endeavors.


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## Aesthetic

GotaDunQH said:


> LOL....I won't lose sleep over it, so don't worry and get all jammed up over it. You are very young, with SO MUCH MORE to learn. Hopefully, when you ASK for advice.....you'll listen and won't get all worked up and immature about when you hear the reality from others. Good luck in your horse endeavors.


Goodbye, you are on my ignore list. What's young, was the way you responded and handles your response in the post. Thank you.


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## Aesthetic

Any opinions on that grey above??


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## princessfluffybritches

I think that Barrel Racing is a very tough sport on a horse's body, but it's not the only one.

I would first be screening for a younger age (under 8), a short horse that can include being sickle hocked (for reach under). Smaller horses can whip around a barrel faster. I would not want a horse that can't do simple things like have his feet handled. I would have him vetted to rule out present problems. It would be nice if an owner allowed you 30 days to make up your mind. Or showed you what the horse can do. 

But you should narrow your list down to what type of horse will be up to the job.


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## Aesthetic

princessfluffybritches said:


> I think that Barrel Racing is a very tough sport on a horse's body, but it's not the only one.
> 
> I would first be screening for a younger age (under 8), a short horse that can include being sickle hocked (for reach under). Smaller horses can whip around a barrel faster. I would not want a horse that can't do simple things like have his feet handled. I would have him vetted to rule out present problems. It would be nice if an owner allowed you 30 days to make up your mind. Or showed you what the horse can do.
> 
> But you should narrow your list down to what type of horse will be up to the job.


This is exactly what in doing, you just worded it about 10x better than I could!! Thank you haha I'm looking between 5 and 9. Possibly 10.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## beau159

princessfluffybritches said:


> I would first be screening for a younger age (under 8), *a short horse* that can include being sickle hocked (for reach under)._ Smaller horses can whip around a barrel faster._


I disagree. 

There are world champion barrel horses of all sizes. Yes, a small horse may be able to take a turn tighter, but they can't cover as much ground as a large horse can in-between the barrels. Size doesn't matter. The horse's individual talent and ability do. 

Individual riders will also have preferences on what type of horse suits them best. Some people like the way large horses run (like myself) and others prefer smaller horses. Some people like free-runners and some people like ratey horses. 

I would not narrow my search to short horses only. 



As far as the grey horse, the pictures won't display properly for me so I can't get the greatest look at him. Back is long, neck comes out very high, appears cow-hocked, I wish his hocks were lower to the ground. But you could take a peek at him in person and see how he looks.


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## Aesthetic

beau159 said:


> I disagree.
> 
> There are world champion barrel horses of all sizes. Yes, a small horse may be able to take a turn tighter, but they can't cover as much ground as a large horse can in-between the barrels. Size doesn't matter. The horse's individual talent and ability do.
> 
> Individual riders will also have preferences on what type of horse suits them best. Some people like the way large horses run (like myself) and others prefer smaller horses. Some people like free-runners and some people like ratey horses.
> 
> I would not narrow my search to short horses only.
> 
> 
> 
> As far as the grey horse, the pictures won't display properly for me so I can't get the greatest look at him. Back is long, neck comes out very high, appears cow-hocked, I wish his hocks were lower to the ground. But you could take a peek at him in person and see how he looks.


I will definitely, if the woman responds. 

Anyways! I don't have very good pictures, but I may slip down to a four year old and just start him easy. I'm contemplating what I'm doing for a while. I'm stuck between wanting to start, or working my way up. This boy was owned by a family who used a barr trainer so he's had some training. The daughter has been paying no attention to him so the grandparents are selling him. I see him tomorrow hopefully. I'll post pictures if I do. This is still very iffy on my shoulders.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

Here's the four year old. 

He has very nice ground manners started with the Clinton Anderson method. He's not very spooky, stood for a swinging whip all about him and a darting rabbit. He took the saddle and bit nice. He's a bit lazy unless you wear spurs (the trainer who started him used spurs immediately which IMHO is ridiculous) and the owners said when they first got him he had the need for speed. 
He is a little hard to get into a lope but he listens very well. He stops and backs great. 
I have a little work to do when I get him, side passes, yielding to legs, and sitting his booty down a bit more. 
He's an absolute lover with great manners and started nicely. Now how about his conformation?


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## Aesthetic

Front legs


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## Aesthetic

He gets his feet trimmed Wednesday. They are fairly long


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## beau159

Aesthetic said:


> I don't have very good pictures, but I may slip down to a four year old and just start him easy. I'm contemplating what I'm doing for a while. I'm stuck between wanting to start, or working my way up. This boy was owned by a family who used a barr trainer so he's had some training. The daughter has been paying no attention to him so the grandparents are selling him. I see him tomorrow hopefully. I'll post pictures if I do. This is still very iffy on my shoulders.


I think you need to decide what you want to do, before you continue looking at a bunch of horses. It's not really fair to the sellers, who are taking time out of their day to show you a horse that you aren't really serious about. 


If you want a horse you can be **maybe** loping the barrels this fall, then you need to find something that is at least 5 years old, IMO. 


Especially the 4 year old you posted, I would absolutely not be loping on him this year. I can't pinpoint exactly what it is, but something bothers me about his back. Looks long, or weak, or both. Or maybe it's how his neck ties in strange with a dip on front of the withers, and because his neck is short in comparison to his body. His shoulder is extremely steep (one could argue that he won't be smooth, but should be fast). I'd like his hocks a tish lower to the ground, and I'd like his hindquarters more rounded. Not the worst looking 4 year old I've ever seen, by any means, but I've certainly seen better. 

Besides, you'd have a lot of general basic training that he would need for a couple months to get solid on riding in general, before you'd even put him on the pattern. Again, just not a good choice if you want a horse you can lope a pattern in August, which is less than 4 months from now.


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## Aesthetic

beau159 said:


> I think you need to decide what you want to do, before you continue looking at a bunch of horses. It's not really fair to the sellers, who are taking time out of their day to show you a horse that you aren't really serious about.
> 
> 
> If you want a horse you can be **maybe** loping the barrels this fall, then you need to find something that is at least 5 years old, IMO.
> 
> 
> Especially the 4 year old you posted, I would absolutely not be loping on him this year. I can't pinpoint exactly what it is, but something bothers me about his back. Looks long, or weak, or both. Or maybe it's how his neck ties in strange with a dip on front of the withers, and because his neck is short in comparison to his body. His shoulder is extremely steep (one could argue that he won't be smooth, but should be fast). I'd like his hocks a tish lower to the ground, and I'd like his hindquarters more rounded. Not the worst looking 4 year old I've ever seen, by any means, but I've certainly seen better.
> 
> Besides, you'd have a lot of general basic training that he would need for a couple months to get solid on riding in general, before you'd even put him on the pattern. Again, just not a good choice if you want a horse you can lope a pattern in August, which is less than 4 months from now.


I see what you mean. Could proper work and exercise help him even out? His hocks are a little high, but not too bad?? I've been talking to my dad and we are doing anything and everything to insure soundness for my main barrel horse. 
As of now it looks like I'm basically finding a prospect to work with. 
I think it was mentioned before that loping a pattern in four months is a rush, I'm just going to back off, find a prospect, and take it slow. 

With work with his haunches round? Or is it just the way his hip is built? For a steep shoulder he has a very smooth gait, must be something he has that's making up for it haha! 
His back is a little long but he is about 15.3 to 16.0hh. He's a tall fellow, but I'll look and see if I can pinpoint what you're seeing that looks awkward


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## Peppy Barrel Racing

I'm with beau something about the way the back ties into the hip isn't quite right. What speed level are you wanting to get into? (You've probably said this somewhere already sorry) if you are looking for a 1D/2D I'd say pass. He's also kinda immature for a four year old I wouldn't plan on loping him anytime soon and if you are planning on loping I would invest in something a little older and more finished. There's a lot of ground work I'm sure this horse still needs even before it needs to see the pattern yet. If you really want to start a young horse like this and really work the pattern your training goal needs to be more on a year plan then a few month plan to be sure. Taking a barrel horse very slowly is the key to a sane confident barrel horse. People get in too much of a hurry and blow them up before they are even ready. It doesn't take much surprisingly. So I agree with beau that you need to make a list and evaluate what you really want.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BlueSpark

If you want a barrel prospect that will be sound for a long time and immediately ready for training, look at a 5 year old that has been lightly started and is very well built. Barrels are an extremely hard discipline to keep a horse sound in for any length of time, so picking an older prospect with fantastic conformation is your best bet. I don't like the last guy, as was mentioned, something funky with his back. Don't like the extremely butt high grulla either.


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## Aesthetic

Peppy Barrel Racing said:


> I'm with beau something about the way the back ties into the hip isn't quite right. What speed level are you wanting to get into? (You've probably said this somewhere already sorry) if you are looking for a 1D/2D I'd say pass. He's also kinda immature for a four year old I wouldn't plan on loping him anytime soon and if you are planning on loping I would invest in something a little older and more finished. There's a lot of ground work I'm sure this horse still needs even before it needs to see the pattern yet. If your really want to start a young horse like this ans really work the pattern your training goal needs to be more on a year plan then a few month plan to be sure. Taking a barrel horse very slowly is the key to a sane confident barrel horse. People get in to much of a hurry and blow them up before they are even ready. It doesn't take much surprisingly. So I agree with beau that you need to make a list and evaluate what you really want.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Since you were probably typing or hasn't refreshed when I posted, take a look above and if there's something I didn't address let me know


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## Aesthetic

BlueSpark said:


> If you want a barrel prospect that will be sound for a long time and immediately ready for training, look at a 5 year old that has been lightly started and is very well built. Barrels are an extremely hard discipline to keep a horse sound in for any length of time, so picking an older prospect with fantastic conformation is your best bet. I don't like the last guy, as was mentioned, something funky with his back. Don't like the extremely butt high grulla either.


I'm passing the grulla. I'm still looking about but some 5-6 year olds I'm seeing either don't look nice to me or have already been started and are out of the range I can pay. 
I'm slowing down and thinking things through, read my last response to Beau. I'll continue looking as well.


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## Aesthetic

Here's what I see with his back Beau: 

It looks long, and your right, slightly weak coupling. But it looks like his neck ties low in his withs and his withers are a tad long. Is that kind of what you see? His hip looks decent to me. His booty looks nice. For starting slow and taking time to work with a horse and make him a prospect and project for myself, would he work? Or does something absolutely scream pass?


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## beau159

Aesthetic said:


> Or does something absolutely scream pass?


You can do what you want, but if I were you, I would pass. And I would look for something older that can meet the goals you want to achieve. 

My coming 3-year-old looks nicer than that 4-year-old you posted. :wink: (although I may be biased)


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## Aesthetic

beau159 said:


> You can do what you want, but if I were you, I would pass. And I would look for something older that can meet the goals you want to achieve.
> 
> My coming 3-year-old looks nicer than that 4-year-old you posted. :wink: (although I may be biased)


He's one of the nicer ones, hate to pass. I'll look some more but for some odd reason all the really nice looking 5-7 year olds are very expensive or no longer for sale :,(


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## Peppy Barrel Racing

Aesthetic said:


> He's one of the nicer ones, hate to pass. I'll look some more but for some odd reason all the really nice looking 5-7 year olds are very expensive or no longer for sale :,(


Keep looking. As someone currently shopping barrel horses myself I personally would pass on this guy. Don't get in a hurry the right one will come along. I agree that for what you really seem to be wanting a 5-7 year old would suit your wants better.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Aesthetic

Peppy Barrel Racing said:


> Keep looking. As someone currently shopping barrel horses myself I personally would pass on this guy. Don't get in a hurry the right one will come along. I agree that for what you really seem to be wanting a 5-7 year old would suit your wants better.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Here's the horse I'm looking at. I sent him to Beau and she likes him more. Deecomet, Sorrel AQHA Quarter Horse Gelding, Big Smooth Riding AQHA Gelding in Texas - DreamHorse.com Horse ID: 1927461


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## Peppy Barrel Racing

I like him better too though I'd like to see him without the saddle but the breeding is right.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Aesthetic

Peppy Barrel Racing said:


> I like him better too though I'd like to see him without the saddle but the breeding is right.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm contacting the owner and hopefully going to get more pictures


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## GotaDunQH

Peppy Barrel Racing said:


> I like him better too though I'd like to see him without the saddle but the breeding is right.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Agree....this one is bred for speed and barrels and built for it. He has better bone, short cannons, love the pastern length and angle, nice roomy hocks, his hip shows power...same with the shoulder, and he's pretty darn fit. I too, would like to see him without a saddle.


----------



## Aesthetic

The owner of the sorrel I most recently posted has not answered calls or emails, ALSO it seems as if we are being denied the call. It rings about 6 times ones, three times, one time. I've called three times today with about 4 hours in between calls. I'll call against tomorrow or the day after.
Since i've had no answers i'm looking at this boy. 
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10202788913956581&set=pcb.1492195837668407&type=1&theater

Not the best shot but tear him to pieces. I'm asking for more pictures as we speak. He looks decent to me, maybe a long neck. Slightly long back, his hip looks a little small..


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## Aesthetic

Goodness goodness. Owner of the palomino refused trial, I do not buy horses without a trial.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## beau159

Aesthetic said:


> Since i've had no answers i'm looking at this boy.
> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10202788913956581&set=pcb.1492195837668407&type=1&theater


Can't see it. 



Aesthetic said:


> Goodness goodness. Owner of the palomino refused trial, I do not buy horses without a trial.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Not uncommon. At this point, I have never sold a horse with a trial and never plan on doing it. Too much grey tape on who would be responsible for what if the horse got hurt, or potential bad habits the new "owner" would create in the horse if it got returned, etc. 

I know some sellers that do trials, and some that don't, like myself. 

It seems to me, at least in my area, most people who sell a horse will not allow a trial.


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## skiafoxmorgan

****. That sorrel is my type of horse. I had a grandson of Easy Jet in my youth. Really sound mind on that horse. His full brother was a state barrel champion at the time. I'd be knocking down doors to go look at him.


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## GotaDunQH

beau159 said:


> Can't see it.
> 
> 
> 
> Not uncommon. At this point, I have never sold a horse with a trial and never plan on doing it. Too much grey tape on who would be responsible for what if the horse got hurt, or potential bad habits the new "owner" would create in the horse if it got returned, etc.
> 
> I know some sellers that do trials, and some that don't, like myself.
> 
> It seems to me, at least in my area, most people who sell a horse will not allow a trial.


 Agree again.....I would never do a trial either...never have, never will. The prospective buyer can come look at the horse as many times as they want, do a lease at the barn for a couple weeks....see if it's going to work. But the horse would never leave my property without full payment in my hand.


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## Peppy Barrel Racing

Aesthetic said:


> Goodness goodness. Owner of the palomino refused trial, I do not buy horses without a trial.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


There's a lot of legal liability not only for the owner but for you as well if you trial a horse. Because there is so much that could go wrong. To properly let a stranger trial a horse you own requires a lease agreement because that's what you are doing leasing the horse for a short time. I am about to do a 15 day trial on a finished barrel horse. Like with any finished horse there are physical things that need to be checked out and the owner of the horse is being nice and leasing him for a trial to see if we're the right fit. But she really is only doing this for me because we have mutual friends and I just sold her a nice kid safe barrel horse. I think riding a horse and maybe having the vet check out a horse you are interested in is probably more realistic and less liability for you as well. I think you will find the majority of people aren't going to let you trial there nice barrel horse becaus there is a lot of potential loss that could occur.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

beau159 said:


> Can't see it.
> 
> 
> 
> Not uncommon. At this point, I have never sold a horse with a trial and never plan on doing it. Too much grey tape on who would be responsible for what if the horse got hurt, or potential bad habits the new "owner" would create in the horse if it got returned, etc.
> 
> I know some sellers that do trials, and some that don't, like myself.
> 
> It seems to me, at least in my area, most people who sell a horse will not allow a trial.


Blah. Here I'll go pull him up on the website. 

I understand that, but we sign agreements legally to make an owner feel better. Includes we are fully responsible for the horse while we trial, vet bills are to our expense, no harm ect.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fuL-0iTzkJg&feature=youtu.be

This guy


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## BlueSpark

I will NEVER trial a horse. My BO has done that and had horses come back with their tails hacked and manes roached, skittish of people, etc. Too many people that are liars and looking for a free horse for a few weeks, or for a show while their horse is lame, etc.

I agree, multiple visits, fine, but too many awful things can happen during a trial, I will only ever trial a horse to a trusted friend.


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## beau159

Aesthetic said:


> http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fuL-0iTzkJg&feature=youtu.be
> 
> This guy


Riding-wise, he looks nice and quiet and willing to please. He doesn't look really soft in his cues (you can obviously see that she is cueing him strongly) but that's something that can be worked on. 

Confo-wise? He looks "light" in his build. (I honestly have a hard time believing he is 5 for how young he appears to look.) Not much muscle. Hocks are high and sickle-hocked. I'm not sure if he is underweight but he's got very prominent withers and a large dip in his neck in front of the withers. Shoulder is steeper than his hip. Back is a smidge long. 

On an off note, I'm not a fan of someone who rides in shorts :lol: but it does look like she's put a lot of time into him.

Not a huge fan of his confo but he does seem well-mannered and quiet. Personality is important, but so is confo.

My only other concerns is that they say he "KNOWS play day events." ...... Has he already been *run*? To what extent does he know the events? He's only 5. :? That would be my question.


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