# Front Leg Conformation Paint Gelding



## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

He's 11 years old, and i'm mainly looking at his knees where he appears to be tied in? I rode him before I bought him and he is a stunning mover. He worked on a ranch for cattle work and i'm wanting to do low level barrel racing with him. He is actually slightly underweight and definitely not filled out the way I'd like him to be. but take a look at these front legs for me guys. Is he tied in? Or is there some kind of illusion going on?


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Also on the grossness of that pen, it's an introducing pen and I haven't used it in about. . a year. The owner of the previous horse left her halter there. The fly spray is mine. Sorry about the horrid pen.


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## soenjer55 (Dec 4, 2011)

he might be back at the knee, but otherwise I actually like his legs. They look pretty nice and straight to me, but I guess we'll just have to wait for one of the more experienced people on here to come by, because I'm an amateur. He's very pretty, I love his markings!


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

He's a little bit tied in and a touch over at the knee, but I think what makes it look worse is that he's pretty light on bone in his legs, but that's fairly typical of stock horses these days.

I don't see anything that indicates he couldn't be a decent barrel racer, maybe even a good one depending on his attitude, ability, and training.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

soenjer55 said:


> he might be back at the knee, but otherwise I actually like his legs. They look pretty nice and straight to me, but I guess we'll just have to wait for one of the more experienced people on here to come by, because I'm an amateur. He's very pretty, I love his markings!


Thank You! I'm just sittin here waiting for what people have to throw at me I always need the input! His markings are adorable!! His bald face makes him look like a little demon, adds to his spirited personality!


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

smrobs said:


> He's a little bit tied in and a touch over at the knee, but I think what makes it look worse is that he's pretty light on bone in his legs, but that's fairly typical of stock horses these days.
> 
> I don't see anything that indicates he couldn't be a decent barrel racer, maybe even a good one depending on his attitude, ability, and training.


Thank You, I went out and looked and he does look a bit over the knee as well. He's legs aren't to thin, just mainly his front. I have his bloodlines but haven't really looking into the breeding and their conformation either.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

From what I've read on conformation (mostly by Dr. Deb Bennet and her books on conformation), correct knees may be often seen as "over", when in actuality they are not. The humerus bone (from elbow to knee) has a curve built into it, so when it is correctly postioned, it will give the knee/leg a slightly convex appearance, such as this horse, when it is actually Correct.

he does seem to be of light bone, as Smrobs said, but from what one can see from that angle (not a good confo crit, photo) , he is a nice looking horse.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

tinyliny said:


> From what I've read on conformation (mostly by Dr. Deb Bennet and her books on conformation), correct knees may be often seen as "over", when in actuality they are not. The humerus bone (from elbow to knee) has a curve built into it, so when it is correctly postioned, it will give the knee/leg a slightly convex appearance, such as this horse, when it is actually Correct.
> 
> he does seem to be of light bone, as Smrobs said, but from what one can see from that angle (not a good confo crit, photo) , he is a nice looking horse.


Really? So if they seem similar, correct and over, is there a way to tell a difference? So his knees are correct? Once he calms down I'll get him square. He doesn't like to stand very still. But thank you, I'm going to look into that Dr. Deb Bennet. Sounds very intelligent.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

she has a series about conformation, I think it's three small books. They are kind of hard to find, but its a fascinating read. here is one of her books:


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

tinyliny said:


> she has a series about conformation, I think it's three small books. They are kind of hard to find, but its a fascinating read. here is one of her books:
> 
> Principles of Conformation Analysis: Equus Reference Guide: Deb Bennett: 9781929164608: Amazon.com: Books


Thank you very much!


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

He looks to be back at the knee. hard to say in this photo. But.. consider this, a horse that would rate 100% conformationally correct, would not be useable.
And for those who immediately wish to disagree, then explain why Halter horses, whom are soo pretty to look at, are not used for hard competions.
He looks to be a cute nice horse. Some groceries and muscles and he could be really nice. Also, i do have to comment, whats with the tiny buckets on the fence, I do hope you have a larger water trough !


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

stevenson said:


> He looks to be back at the knee. hard to say in this photo.
> 
> Definitely not back at the knee, he's actually very slightly over at the knee.
> 
> ...


Halter horses are about a billion light years away from having correct conformation. They have been bred for decades for nothing but muscle mass and tiny heads...at the expense of their bone mass, their feet, their hock/pastern angles, their shoulder angles, and their usability.

If you ask any real horseman that doesn't make their money from breeding/selling halter bred horses, they'll tell you the same.


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## soenjer55 (Dec 4, 2011)

smrobs, I'm curious, could you possibly show me how he's slightly over at the knee and not back? I thought he was back at the knee too, and would like to know where my error was. I'm not questioning you or anything, I'd just really like to know what I was seeing wrong so that I can be more accurate in the future.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

No, it's all good .

The more I think about it though, the more I think it may just be a difference in terminology/understanding.

This is what I consider "back at the knee", AKA "calf kneed". The front of the leg has a convex profile where the knee is behind the line from fetlock to the center of the elbow joint.










And this is what I call "over at the knee" or "buck kneed", which is what I see to a slight degree in the OP's horse. That's where the knee is in front of the elbow/fetlock line


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## soenjer55 (Dec 4, 2011)

I see! I always thought that "back at the knee" was when that part behind the knee stuck out more than normal, if that makes sense... I googled it though and it was a stupid mistake on my part . I don't know where I got that LOL. Sorry OP!


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

smrobs said:


> No, it's all good .
> 
> The more I think about it though, the more I think it may just be a difference in terminology/understanding.
> 
> ...


In person he looks way more like horse 1. Let me get a better picture. Hold on.


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

the photos show the back at knee ... the OP horse is slightly back at the knee.
The halter hosrses are sposed to be the cream of the crop the ideal horse, the horses for cutting are bred tiny legged and butt high.. also tiny footed .
a lot of them are barely 14 hands , or at least the ones in this area, and are the HOT ticket. Breeders breed for what sales for what is popular and latest fad, or they would not be in business,


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## Honeysuga (Sep 1, 2009)

I agree with smrobs, over at the knee.

I also disagree that halter horses are bred to be perfect. They are bred to fit current fashion, i.e. huge bodies with a large amount of muscle mass and tiny babydoll heads with fine legs and itty bitty feet. Fat and dainty, hmmm? rofl


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

Maybe a diff photo. I still dont see Over. 
horses today, are bred for what the people find appealling or in style and if the breeders dont go with what is popular then they would be oob


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## Elana (Jan 28, 2011)

This horse has correct knees.. Perhaps slightly over. Nothing wrong with this horse's knees. I would not call him tied at the knee either. The knee joint has a Boney process that is more prominent in some horses than others. This horse is prominent. Tied at the knee shows a noticeable narrowing from fetlock to knee. That is not going on here. 

I would like to see better photos of this horse. He looks to be a bit light in bone and to stand over a lot of ground. Lovely low hocks and knees and an adequate shoulder. Neck appears to tie in nicely at the top and he has nice withers. Looks a good one... But show us more please.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

I will post more when i get home. My phone wont let me. Ill pull him out and get his as square as i can. He is very impatient. And as for halter bred horses, they are bred for muscle mass and stright lines through joints. My family friend bred them. Theu are no where near the ideal riding horse. They are bred for looks. Work horses such as quarters or english horses like oldens or hanoverians are bred for strength and grace alone with speed. There are two totally different types of breeding. If you look in a judging book from an actual equine judging professional, halter horses are far off from what is considered ideal.


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## Honeysuga (Sep 1, 2009)

Meant to add in my op, he sure is a cutie! Love his bald face! What are his lines?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Gold Bold Moon Paint










This is the best I could get him square. Yes he's saddled, I forgot about the picture until after I saddled him but i'm looking mainly for legs. He does need his top line built up a lot too.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Anyone???


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## Elana (Jan 28, 2011)

He is a bit straight through the hocks and his stifle is a bit high. He looks like he really needs a farrier visit. The front hooves appear chipped and the right front (that you can see) is VERY steep.. almost clubby. He may be standing on a stone that raises his heels a bit.. but I don't think so. He is quite short in the pasterns. 

His rear is a bit light. 

I still like him. He does stand over a lot of ground so may be a bit long through the coupling. 

Nice horse. Get him a farrier appointment and keep after his feet.. he will be even nicer.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Oh yee his eet were done before we bought him by somebody who had no idea what they were doing. Im working on building muscle with him, he is fresh and has not been rode in forever lol. He is standing funny, whrn i tighten his girth he gets ****y. thanks Elana


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

I dont see a major fault with his knees. he may be a tad sickle hocked others call it camped under .. 
He is a cute one. The right front.. may be a club foot or **** foot depends on what you call it,
I would have him checked on that with the new farrier.. that foot appears to dish .. if so , the navicular and other bones in the hoof could be rotated.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

He isnt clubbed foot, i sent a pic to my farrier. he said whoever did his feet didnt trim the heel period. Yeah, he looks a wee sickle hocked. Im getting his feet done, apparently his feet are trimmed completely wrong. So he is coming out. Once he gets his feet done i will square him up and get them fixed.


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