# ****-footed horses: do's and don'ts



## Kayella (Feb 11, 2012)

Has he been diagnosed with DLSD? I know it's a degenerative disease. I would consult with your vet and see what he/she says. If diagnosed with DLSD, radiographs can be taken to see the current extent of the damage. 

If the horse just has naturally low pasterns, excessive exercise will definitely be hard on them. I would NOT jump a horse with such weak pasterns, that is just asking for trouble.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## existentialpony (Dec 4, 2012)

In my experience, if the horse is truly ****-footed (not suffering from a disease like DSLD), do your best to build up the strength of those suspensory ligaments without stressing them (eg. flat work without boots), and find a good farrier to make sure that the suspensories are supported and not stressed by the hoof structure. There's no point in babying a horse's legs in that situation, IMHO, although I'd avoid jumping a ****-footed horse.


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## Dreamcatcher5 (May 15, 2012)

The vet is hopefully coming in a few weeks, but when we got Syd (horse) the last owner told us that it's his heel that doesn't grow, just his toes, making his legs look so wonky. Here is a pic of him:

http://i1168.photobucket.com/albums/r498/fuphotob/51be7d6416479e87bed5ae274a3257e9_zps067a4a3f.jpg
My sister is riding him. Yeah, I know the stirrups are too short....we lengthened them after we noticed.:lol:

So...is he truly **** footed? Or might there be something else up with him? When he stands, he is also over at the knees...VERY over at the knees. 

We're currently just doing some flat work (walking trotting cantering) to get him back into shape, as he is a bit chubby. He's 15-17 years old, by the way. My sister weighs 36kgs and I weigh 38kgs, do you think he can manage that? He's 15hh.


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## Kayella (Feb 11, 2012)

It could just be a bad trim. And no, his heels definitely grow. They just grow shooting forward under his feet because his toes are so stretched forward. A horse's feet don't grow down, they grow forwards. Not keeping that toe backed up will under run their heels. And that can put a lot of stress on his joints. If you can get a farrier to cut that toe back and get his heels up under him, it may get his pasterns at the angle they should be. Is there any way you can get some pictures of his feet on flat, level concrete/something other than grass?


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## Dreamcatcher5 (May 15, 2012)

Yes, I could do that when I get home from school today. And it probably wasn't just a bad trim, because he was already like that when we got him and after the trim he got when we got him he seemed a bit better. I think they're due to be trimmed soon anyway so I can ask the farrier about that. And he's definitely not lame and never was ever since he's been with us and he wasn't lame when we got him either. So yeah, Ive got ONE pic of him on concrete, but he's WALKING in that pic...
Here it is:
http://i1168.photobucket.com/albums/r498/fuphotob/b6c0d6386773636358515622cded5324_zps591a2e8e.jpg

I will get a standing one today.


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## Kayella (Feb 11, 2012)

Yes, underrun heels don't happen from just one bad trim. Sorry if I worded that confusingly  It takes weeks/months for hooves to get underrun depending on how quickly your horse's feet grow.


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## Dreamcatcher5 (May 15, 2012)

So he might not be **** footed at all?


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## Kayella (Feb 11, 2012)

It depends. It could be his feet, or it couldn't be. Hard to tell at this point, but pictures will definitely help


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## Dreamcatcher5 (May 15, 2012)

Cool, I'll get some as soon as I get home.


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## existentialpony (Dec 4, 2012)

I personally don't see a ****-footed horse at all! But I'll wait to see pictures of him squared up.


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## Dreamcatcher5 (May 15, 2012)

It's so hard to keep this horse squared up...but this is the best I could manage! 
Excuse the mud and cover....it was seriously FREEZING out there! 

Just the 4 legs:
http://i1168.photobucket.com/albums/r498/fuphotob/070f1335f84d609df95434d49888560c_zpsbbe44cab.jpg
Just the front legs:
http://i1168.photobucket.com/albums/r498/fuphotob/6caa155ce0108be58ce74ac374bf7cfe_zpsc602a1a4.jpg
The whole horse (my sister is one happy girl in this pic lol)
http://i1168.photobucket.com/albums/r498/fuphotob/3a5658990d77b5b5ea3b968f493ac7a6_zps87ceeb73.jpg

So...what do you think? The second picture looks so....extreme :shock:


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## existentialpony (Dec 4, 2012)

The horse isn't completely square and seems to be standing under himself, but I actually see a horse who is back at the knee (quite a bit) and has longer sloping pasterns. I'm not convinced that he's **** footed... he more strikes me has having long, "weak" pasterns that are affected by his leg conformation, but it might be a little of both.

This is what I would describe as **** footed (the drawing is a less severe illustration):


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## Dreamcatcher5 (May 15, 2012)

When he walks with a rider on his back, his forelegs look EXACTLY like the first pic! :shock:
He probably used to have stronger pasterns but he hadn't been exercised AT ALL for 4 years when we got him, so maybe if we exercise him properly, his legs might become stronger? I don't know....maybe


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## Dreamcatcher5 (May 15, 2012)

and yeah, his confirmation is...*cough*...um..well...less than striking.
But he's got a great personality to make up to it!


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## existentialpony (Dec 4, 2012)

Fetlock flexion is normal during weight bearing/movement. . I'd focus on slowly bringing him back into work/shape and strengthening those tendons and ligaments. I bet he'll be just fine! A tendon/ligament/muscle support supplement never hurts, if you're very worried.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

I don't see a **** footed horse. I see a horse with longer pasterns and very bucked knees (better bucked than calf-knees though). Truthfully, I think if you just keep his feet balanced and don't overstress his legs without proper conditioning, then he'll be fine.

Like existentialpony said, it's normal for the fetlock to drop during movement when that leg absorbs the weight of the horse.


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## Dreamcatcher5 (May 15, 2012)

Phew, I'm really glad to hear that! One question: what would be the highest level of exercise that he could manage? Because he's my sister's horse and she wants to do general riding and maybe VERY low level jumping. But I don't know...what do you think?


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Hi, haven't read all replies, but your pics don't appear to show a '**** footed' horse(tho better pix, straight after a trim needed to be sure) but one with quite long toes, long, run forward looking heels, and I'm guessing very sensitive frogs/heels, with how over at the knee he is. I'd want to get him comfortably standing & moving properly first & foremost, at least standing comfortably with working stay aparatus(or else he can't rest standing) and heels padded before riding.


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## Dreamcatcher5 (May 15, 2012)

His hooves are actually quite strong, when he walks on gravel he doesn't flinch AT ALL :shock: And loosie, what do you mean by "padded heels"?


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Dreamcatcher5 said:


> His hooves are actually quite strong, when he walks on gravel he doesn't flinch AT ALL :shock: And loosie, what do you mean by "padded heels"?


Good if he has strong hooves. But horses can be incredibly stoic & lack of obvious difficulty doesn't necessarily mean there isn't any there tho. Unless he's grown up doing miles daily, living in rough, dry terrain, I'd expect he should be flinching on gravel and I wouldn't expect his feet to look like that if he had. I suspect he is landing toe first, avoiding weighting his heels, which is(at least was originally) the likely reason for his legs not straightening. This is why I suggested padding his heels(r booting, etc) to see if that allows him to be comfortable enough to relax into his heels. He may also have some serious & painful thrush that needs treating, which is why he's not comfortable on his heels.


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## 4horses (Nov 26, 2012)

He doesn't look like he has DSLD, but he is VERY over in the knees. Looking at his legs, I would be concerned about his future soundness. 

In case this was DSLD, I would monitor his front and back ankles for any sign of swelling or thickening. I would take pictures of him standing and watch his pastern angle, as his pasterns will drop with DSLD. If he shows any lameness, it could very well signal that he is developing DSLD.

The problem with DSLD is it can develop very slowly in some cases- so slowly it takes years before it becomes obvious (or it can come on very rapidly). So he may not have DSLD now, but in a year or two or 5 might start showing signs. What you see may be a horse over in the knees, or he may be over in the knees with DSLD. I can't tell you for sure. 

I would not be jumping him over 18 inches. I would try to limit canter work, and extension work/ collection as that will strain the ligaments. Regardless whether he has DSLD or not, his conformation alone could cause soundness issues. 

At his age, his legs aren't going to get any better with work. Work might help improve the muscles that support the legs, but it will not fix the underlying problem. 

Next time the vet is out have the vet watch him move and see what she thinks- it is very possible that he has DSLD. Just the angle of his legs with his long pasterns is going to place stress on those ligaments. He is in the right age range for DSLD to develop- very common in older horses. 

With proper care, even a DSLD horse can stay sound for years. I would not worry to much if he is sound now, but it is good to get a diagnosis so you know what level to work the horse at. :wink:


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## existentialpony (Dec 4, 2012)

I just wanted to add... (1) DSLD is almost certainly a genetic disorder, so most cases come from "back yard breeding" or breeding before DSLD becomes apparent in a sire/dam, or more frequently in breeds where DSLD is common (Paso Finos, for example). The other thing is that (2) some vets will insist that DSLD is almost impossible to conclusively diagnose until postmortem (or obvious bilateral loss of the suspensory elasticity), but there are signs (swelling, thickening of the suspensories, mysterious recurrent lameness... Some claim that biopsy of a nerve in the neck is a relatively solid diagnostic tool). I guess I'm trying to say that DSLD is a tricky disease to diagnose and hopeless to treat, so IMHO if a vet hasnt brought it up don't even worry about it. I also think it is not DSLD, but an opinion is only worth what you pay for it! I just don't want you to get all worked up over nothing, as happened to me when I first bought my horse!

I am a little off-put by his front leg conformation, but I have know lesson horses with that same issue who have remained sound through the years.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 4horses (Nov 26, 2012)

I don't think DSLD has anything to do with backyard breeding. 

For many horses DSLD is a degenerative disease of aging. So any horse can be a carrier. My horse wasn't diagnosed til age 20, one horse I know developed it at 17, a friend's Paso has it at age 16-18 and he is still sound. Another friend just had her 24 yr old horse diagnosed with it. By the time it is diagnosed, these horses have already had a show career, been bred, and had foals. Any breed can be affected. 

I believe it is much more common than people realize. Most people do not spend big vet bills to diagnose a lameness problem in an older horse. With onset at such an old age it is impossible to remove the gene(s) from the population. They haven't even determined mode of inheritance. 

There really is no point in fancy diagnostics except for research purposes. I would have your vet watch him move, and have your farrier look at him. My farrier was the one who diagnosed my mare, before the vet even noticed it. 

Given your horses conformation (regardless of DSLD status), I would avoid anything overly strenuous (galloping/jumping)- especially if this is a horse you want to keep riding up to his late 20's. Other than that enjoy him and don't worry about it.


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## Dreamcatcher5 (May 15, 2012)

He's definitely not going to jump over 18 inches...he is just going to be a pleasure/trail horse. He is a horse who just wants to go go go, I thought he would be slow and calm under saddle but he's just like a young, hyper horse :lol: His parents were all very sound horses, but yes, I'll ask the vet about it and I'll keep my eyes on those wonky legs.


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