# HYPP Status - Just Impressive?



## Peppy Barrel Racing (Aug 16, 2011)

Glynnis said:


> Hi there everyone,
> 
> There have been a lot of threads lately about Lethal White and how the frame gene can sometimes "hide" in horses that express no frame type markings. Since I'm breeding my mare in the spring, I started thinking about HYPP.
> 
> ...


HYPP is restricted to horses only who's breeding contains Impressive. If the only horse that is related to impressive is confirmed N/N you don't need to worry about HYPP. I'd have the stallion owner show proof of his HYPP status though! Is the stallion listed on allbreed for us too look at his pedigree?


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

Whew! *Wipes sweat off of brow* I have done so much research and reading about different disorders and possibilities that I had an "oh no!" moment, thinking that I may have possibly overlooked something! It might be time to read about something else for a while...:shock:

Yes, the stallion owner provided me a copy of the HYPP test showing N/N. The stallion is also on All Breed. Link is below. 

Painted Coos


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## Peppy Barrel Racing (Aug 16, 2011)

Glynnis said:


> Whew! *Wipes sweat off of brow* I have done so much research and reading about different disorders and possibilities that I had an "oh no!" moment, thinking that I may have possibly overlooked something! It might be time to read about something else for a while...:shock:
> 
> Yes, the stallion owner provided me a copy of the HYPP test showing N/N. The stallion is also on All Breed. Link is below.
> 
> Painted Coos


I love his black and white paint coloring! I don't see any Poco or King lines so you seem to be safe from HERDA as well. Should be a pretty baby I'm sure!


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## NdAppy (Apr 8, 2009)

Like said above... only horses with Impressive can be HYPP positive. 

Now to scare the crap out of you... There are people who have substituted papers and end up having horses with HYPP that "on paper" don't trace to Impressive, but in reality, they are Impressive bred. I also recall one stallion owner that had their stallion's pedigree on Allbreed, changed the one line that traced to Impressive, but still said he was N/H "but not Impressive bred!" Personally with so many unscrupulous people out there I would be testing everything.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

all breed pedigree is not what I would consider to be a reliable source only because information can be entered by just about anyone.


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

I am having the 5 panel run on all of my horses Dually is done and N/N on everything imo it adds to their value as breeding horses and helps one make a better educated decision when deciding on who to breed to....esp if their horse is a carrier for one they know its safe to breed to a n/n horse


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## NdAppy (Apr 8, 2009)

No Farmpony it isn't, but it is a go to source for a lot of people out there looking at horses and wanting to know what their lines are and that do not have access to the registries for whatever reason...


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

Herda and HYPP arent the only genetic problems out there GBED and PSSM these are just as nasty. The carriers of GBED have been narrowed down to certain carriers but I'm not in the loop as to who they are its better to be safe than sorry.


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

Thanks Peppy! When I was looking for potential stallions, he stood out for sure.

I just read about GBED and it said they had linked it to the QH sire "King". PSSM is mostly associated with draft breeds, but from what I've read has been found in other breeds as well like Arabs & QH's. 

I realize ABP is not a reliable source, it was just what I thought of for a late night scan. It's kind of like the Wikipedia of the horse world.  I have access to the AHA registry through Lilly's dam's side, but not APHA or AQHA. Unless there is a way to access them without being a member that I'm not aware of. 

I do have a copy of Lilly's sire's papers and I think they go back 3 generations? Maybe 4? I haven't looked at them in a while. So I can see for certain at least to a certain point that he does not go back to any Impressive lines. If there is a way to look up in the breed registry without being a member, I will certainly do that, however, I haven't seen where there is the option of doing so.

What is a 5 panel? I assume it's a test done for genetic disorders, but which ones in particular?

So many things to think about.... :hide:


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

The 5 panel consists of GBED,Herda,HYPP and PSSM1 I use Animal Genetics.


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## NdAppy (Apr 8, 2009)

That's only four :lol: You forgot MH.


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## Northernstar (Jul 23, 2011)

I think you're taking this very responsibly, and good for you! I had a "whew!" moment while in the works for getting Star (Ms Northern Star), she is an Impressive granddaughter, but thankfully, n/n


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

Thank you. I always knock other people for getting themselves into situations that are completely preventable with a little research. In my opinion, with information being so easily accessible now, there is absolutely no excuse for not making yourself knowledgeable on a subject. It's not like you have to go to the library or order special veterinary books to find this stuff out. I do most of my research from the comfort of my living room couch! Plus, this is the life of a future foal and possibly the life of my mare that could be put at risk if I'm negligent. 

Now, back to the original conversation. There are a few things I need to consider before getting Lilly tested.

She doesn't go back to Impressive or Poco Bueno so I'm not sure if there would be a point testing for HYPP or HERDA. Upon further digging on her sire's side though, she does go back to King about 8 generations back. Would you suggest, with that knowledge, that it would be a good idea to test her for GBED along with MH and PSSM1?


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

Although, looking at the cost, it's about $10 cheaper to just test for all 5. Although, I'm not sure that $10 is really worth worrying about when the cost of shipping, etc. all come into play. What do you guys think?


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## Northernstar (Jul 23, 2011)

I have to be honest and say I'm not entirely familiar with the other tests as HYPP in my QH was my only concern. I'd go with whatever your vet suggests though, and your own instincts. Best of luck!


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

Well, I thought about it. When in doubt, I always weigh the pros and cons. The pros of getting her tested is I would know without any doubt if she is a carrier for any of these. The only con I can think of is I'll be out $95.00 + about another $80.00 on shipping... so estimating about $175.00. In the whole scheme of things though, what's $175.00 compared to potential vet bills if Lilly is a carrier of any one of these and I get a foal that inherits a genetic disorder?

I've put money aside specifically for Lilly for any medical costs that might be incurred with this foal, so I think this would be considered proactive medical spending.  The more I think about it, the more I can't see why I shouldn't have her tested. I would rather spend the money and know for certain that she doesn't carry anything than not and face the ramifications later. 

Thanks LuvMyPerlinoQH for the information on Animal Genetics. I have downloaded the forms and will be going to see Lilly this weekend for some more hair pulling! Luckily, she's got a mane that can be likened to that of a Shetland Pony, so no shortage of hair!

I appreciate everyone's input on here! It's nice when others can offer advice to help me not make any preventable mistakes.

EDIT - if she tests positive for anything, I will NOT be breeding her.


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

NdAppy said:


> That's only four :lol: You forgot MH.


**** yep hey its been a long day nothing like cutting hair with the flu


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## Peppy Barrel Racing (Aug 16, 2011)

Glynnis said:


> Well, I thought about it. When in doubt, I always weigh the pros and cons. The pros of getting her tested is I would know without any doubt if she is a carrier for any of these. The only con I can think of is I'll be out $95.00 + about another $80.00 on shipping... so estimating about $175.00. In the whole scheme of things though, what's $175.00 compared to potential vet bills if Lilly is a carrier of any one of these and I get a foal that inherits a genetic disorder?
> 
> I've put money aside specifically for Lilly for any medical costs that might be incurred with this foal, so I think this would be considered proactive medical spending.  The more I think about it, the more I can't see why I shouldn't have her tested. I would rather spend the money and know for certain that she doesn't carry anything than not and face the ramifications later.
> 
> ...


I think that's the best way to think about it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

Glynnis said:


> Well, I thought about it. When in doubt, I always weigh the pros and cons. The pros of getting her tested is I would know without any doubt if she is a carrier for any of these. The only con I can think of is I'll be out $95.00 + about another $80.00 on shipping... so estimating about $175.00. In the whole scheme of things though, what's $175.00 compared to potential vet bills if Lilly is a carrier of any one of these and I get a foal that inherits a genetic disorder?
> 
> I've put money aside specifically for Lilly for any medical costs that might be incurred with this foal, so I think this would be considered proactive medical spending.  The more I think about it, the more I can't see why I shouldn't have her tested. I would rather spend the money and know for certain that she doesn't carry anything than not and face the ramifications later.
> 
> ...


If she tests positive with herda or gbed thats not an end all you can find a tested stallion thats N/N and safely breed. However if she is positive for PSSM1 do not breed her its a dominant and only takes one copy to pass on its nasty stuff.


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

Hmm, that's true. The stallion owner only gave me copies of the HYPP & OLWS tests. I'm not sure if he's been tested for anything else, but if I get the tests back with positive outcomes, I will definitely inquire about his status on those as well. The only one I am really concerned about is GBED because she does go back to King and there is strong evidence to suggest it originated from him and his progeny.

If I wasn't so cheap, I would send this on an urgent, express next day delivery courier first thing on Monday morning after I've collected her hair samples. But... regular post will get there too. *sigh* It's the ol' impatience vs. practicality war I wage with myself constantly!


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

Glynnis said:


> Hmm, that's true. The stallion owner only gave me copies of the HYPP & OLWS tests. I'm not sure if he's been tested for anything else, but if I get the tests back with positive outcomes, I will definitely inquire about his status on those as well. The only one I am really concerned about is GBED because she does go back to King and there is strong evidence to suggest it originated from him and his progeny.
> 
> If I wasn't so cheap, I would send this on an urgent, express next day delivery courier first thing on Monday morning after I've collected her hair samples. But... regular post will get there too. *sigh* It's the ol' impatience vs. practicality war I wage with myself constantly!


 
I think once they get it you can log on and see your results in 2 days so that is pretty fast to me.


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

LuvMyPerlinoQH said:


> I think once they get it you can log on and see your results in 2 days so that is pretty fast to me.


Haha, yes I know... but I want to know yesterday!


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## Palomine (Oct 30, 2010)

Peppy Barrel Racing said:


> HYPP is restricted to horses only who's breeding contains Impressive. If the only horse that is related to impressive is confirmed N/N you don't need to worry about HYPP. I'd have the stallion owner show proof of his HYPP status though! Is the stallion listed on allbreed for us too look at his pedigree?



HYPP has been found in horses that are related to the dam of Impressive, that do not trace to him directly. Horses that trace back to Glamour Bars have been tested and found positive.

Hyperkalemic Periodic Paralysis (HYPP) in Horses


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

Well I don't see that in her pedigree either, but nonetheless I'm still getting her tested for all 5 mentioned above, just to be on the safe side.


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

Palomine said:


> HYPP has been found in horses that are related to the dam of Impressive, that do not trace to him directly. Horses that trace back to Glamour Bars have been tested and found positive.
> 
> Hyperkalemic Periodic Paralysis (HYPP) in Horses


Don't believe everything you read on the internet. The website you linked to said...



> I've heard accounts of at least 2 horses that tested positive for Hyperkalemic Periodic Paralysis at UC Davis without having Impressive in their pedigree


.

However, this is from the UC Davis website. If they had tested horses not descended from Impressive positive for HYPP, they would not have made the last statement I hilighted...



> Hyperkalemic Periodic Paralysis (HYPP)
> Introduction
> Hyperkalemic periodic paralysis (HYPP) is an inherited disease of the muscle which is caused by a genetic defect. In the muscle of affected horses, a point mutation exists in the sodium channel gene and is passed on to offspring.
> Sodium channels are "pores" in the muscle cell membrane which control contraction of the muscle fibers. When the defective sodium channel gene is present, the channel becomes "leaky" and makes the muscle overly excitable and contract involuntarily. The channel becomes "leaky" when potassium levels fluctuate in the blood. This may occur with fasting followed by consumption of a high potassium feed such as alfalfa. Hyperkalemia, which is an excessive amount of potassium in the blood, causes the muscles in the horse to contract more readily than normal. This makes the horse susceptible to sporadic episodes of muscle tremors or paralysis.
> This genetic defect has been identified in descendents of the American Quarter Horse sire, Impressive. The original genetic defect causing HYPP was a natural mutation that occurred as part of the evolutionary process. The majority of such mutations, which are constantly occurring, are not compatible with survival. However, the genetic mutation causing HYPP produced a functional, yet altered, sodium ion channel. This gene mutation is not a product of inbreeding. The gene mutation causing HYPP inadvertently became widespread when breeders sought to produce horses with heavy musculature. *To date, confirmed cases of HYPP have been restricted to descendants of this horse*.


The website you linked to is informative and useful, but not authoratative. It is a lay site - not a professional site...


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

I also read the UC Davis website, however, if I only test for HERDA, PSSM, MH and GBED, it is $140.00 for testing. If I include HYPP as the 5th one, it is $95.00. If I only test for MH, GBED & PSSM it's $105.00. For the sake of cost alone, I may as well do all 5 and if she's negative for HYPP, well at least I have a piece of paper saying so.


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## NdAppy (Apr 8, 2009)

Just FYI if you test through the registries and use that five panel discount, you can't call to check on the results. You will not get any info on them until the registries release it. You do not own that sample anymore, it belongs to the registry for them to do what they wish with it. It will take longer to get the results back than if you paid for your own testing at full price. People have been waiting upwards of a month to get results back using the five panel tests. People who test on their own usually have results in less than a week from when the lab receives the sample.


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

Hey, thanks for the head's up. I'm not going through a registry, just sending in to Animal Genetics on my own.


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## NdAppy (Apr 8, 2009)

Ahh I didn't realize AG was offering it now without having to go through the registry. Good to know!


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

I know you guys have been on the edges of your seats dying to know this, so I thought I'd share. Lilly's hair sample finally arrived at Animal Genetics and I got her results today. 

I know I didn't need to test for HYPP as she doesn't go back to Impressive, but it was cheaper to do all 5 than each individually. I'm telling you, with all of the things that can go wrong with a foal, it's a load off my mind that I won't have to worry about these. Happy Friday everyone!











:happydance:


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## Peppy Barrel Racing (Aug 16, 2011)

Hurray!!!!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

I know, it's not huge news, but I am a worry-wart and not knowing these things makes me nervous!


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## Peppy Barrel Racing (Aug 16, 2011)

Better to be safe than sorry!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Army wife (Apr 29, 2012)

How cool is that! The only thing I would look into is some sort of genetic disease on her arab side. I know there is one (pretty rare) but I can't remember what it's called. Sorry!


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

The only two tests that I know of for Arabs are Lavender Foal and CA which both need to have one parent as a carrier. I think I`ll pass on those two (for now anyway) since the prospective stallion, as a Paint, most likely is not a carrier.


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## Left Hand Percherons (Feb 1, 2011)

Glynnis said:


> She doesn't go back to Impressive or Poco Bueno so I'm not sure if there would be a point testing for HYPP or HERDA. Upon further digging on her sire's side though, she does go back to King about 8 generations back. Would you suggest, with that knowledge, that it would be a good idea to test her for GBED along with MH and PSSM1?


It's a mute point at this time because you already do have the HERDA results but she does in fact tract to Poco Bueno. Anytime you see a Bueno (sire's maternal side) you better believe that there is Poco Bueno in the extended pedigree. Poco Bueno has been dead for 40 years so it's unlikely you will ever see his name on a traditional 5 generation pedigree.


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## FrostedLilly (Nov 4, 2012)

Oh wow, you are absolutely correct! I did a second look on AllBreed and I missed that. She does indeed go back to Poco Bueno on her sire's maternal side. I'm glad I went ahead with all 5 tests and I think I have done everything I can up to this point to make sure that I don't make any preventable mistakes as far as inheritable genetic disorders go.

The stallion I plan on breeding to is N/N for HYPP and OLWS and so is Lilly (I sent away for colour testing at UC Davis and had her tested for OLWS separate from the 5 I've posted here.) N/N seems to be her thing; despite being half paint, she also tested N/N for any of the testable Paint colour markers!


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

*MOD NOTE*
This is a very old thread so replies to the OP are unlikely to be relevant now


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