# Breeding (sunbleached) black mare to palomino paint stallion?



## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

Depending on the individual genetics of both stud and mare (assuming they are heterozygous for pretty much everything), there is a chance for a chestnut, palomino, black, bay, brown, buckskin, or smoky black from that combination. For the chances of a pinto foal, it would depend on the stud's zygosity. If he was homozygous, then the foal _would_ carry the pinto gene, if stud is heterozygous, then there is a 50% chance of a foal with the pinto gene. 

However, carrying the pinto gene does not guarantee flashy markings.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

*Offspring Color Probability* 

8.33% - ​*Smoky Black Overo *8.33% - ​*Smoky Black *8.33% - ​*Buckskin Overo *8.33% - ​*Buckskin *8.33% - ​*Black Overo *8.33% - ​*Black *8.33% - ​*Bay Overo *8.33% - ​*Bay *8.33% - ​*Palomino Overo *8.33% - ​*Palomino *8.33% - ​*Chestnut Overo *8.33% - ​*Chestnut *

Since the sire is alive and overo, then he's got to be heterozygous. Here are the possibilities with a palomino frame overo stallion and a black mare, all other options marked as unknown.


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## Chiilaa (Aug 12, 2010)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> Since the sire is alive and overo, then he's got to be heterozygous.


This is not a valid assumption. "Overo" does not equal "frame". This is the EXACT reason why people with a sound genetic knowledge all advocate for the dumping of the word "overo". It is too vague, a catch-all term that really means "my horse isn't tobiano, and I can't work out what white pattern is there, and don't want to test, so I am just going to use this lazy, ambiguous word and hope no one notices".


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

I will bow to your superior knowlege. I have never heard of an overo who was NOT frame however, that's not my field of study. I took the info off the genetic labs testing calculator and the only overo option they offer is FRAME OVERO. They show Frame as an option on other patterns to be sure, but no overo without frame.


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## Chiilaa (Aug 12, 2010)

"Overo" can mean frame, sabino or splash. They can be on their own, or combined with each other.


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## Tryst (Feb 8, 2012)

Also make sure you test your mare for frame before breeding, as it is known to hide very well and has been found even on solid colored horses.


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