# Its Been a While [English Flatwork Video]



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I think that was a good ride, too. I can see that he is tense. you ride very well and your lower leg looks quiet and solid. I see tension in your body, too, though and I think you may have been able to slow him down gradually by breathing a bit deeper and slower yourself, sitting more down onto his back (it looked like you were in half seat much of the time) and making yourself a bit "heavier" for him to anchor him a bit with your seat and your breath. He seems to want to run out from under himself a bit, but I really like the way he moves . He has good , rythmic drive from behind, which would be awesom in dressage. I really like him a lot!
You could take more advantage of this by encouraging him to reach down and forward. He is up and tense against the bit and hollowing out just abit, where as I think if he were able to reach down and out more, his back would start to swing more.
I would work at that at walk and trot, and at the canter, for a bit , let him go fast if he likes. I did miss yoiur warm up, as you said, so maybe you already did lots of long and low. 

I think you , as a rider, looked very good.


----------



## Allison Finch (Oct 21, 2009)

I see HUGE improvement from the videos I saw a good while ago. You have done a really good job. The gait that I saw that was the most problematic, and probably the most difficult to improve, was the walk. He was moving somewhat laterally, which is a problem. You need to half halt, release, and repeat. He needs to slow down his rhythm so that he can move his legs in a purer four beat tempo. 

In his trot work, he occasionally goes hollow. This was his attempt to "back out of the bridle" and go heavier on his forehand. Even though he can get hot, you need to urge him forward (carefully) to move him back into that bridle. This will encourage him to use his haunch a bit better, lightening his forehand. Since he is such a hot guy, you can use more seat to help influence his forward impulsion.

I remember how hollow he used to be!! He is starting to move into the bridle and use it nicely. He holds it for a bit and then backs out. Just keep urging him forward and let him know when he is doing a better job (this is SO important to encourage a horse, IMO).

His canter was a bit hot and hollow. Hollow means not enough haunch engagement. Even though the last thing you want to do is put your leg on a hot horse, that is what you need to do. He is too fast and tense. You need to half halt him, and then send him a release to help him relax. You will probably need to use a small half halt every other stride along with a slight squeeze with your leg. The leg says "go forward" the half halt says "but don't go faster". The release between every three or four half halts says "I am relaxed, so you can be too".

You and I have discussed this before and you have already used these tools to achieve excellent advances. Just keep up the good work.

Really start working on the walk, though. It is the easiest gait to mess up and the HARDEST to fix. Slow him down, give him release after half halt and use your seat to give him a definite four beat rhythm. Think of the horse's legs as if he was moving to a metronome. Resist with your seat so that he doesn't rush the walk so much. Your seat, at the walk was really stiff and "still" not helping with any relaxation or rhythm.


You need to unlock those elbows. This will allow you to raise your hands a tad. When you do this, you will be able to move with a much more consistent contact. I see a little bobbing of the reins from the stiff arms/hands. This will make Jake less likely to use the contact constructively.

As for the new facility, you just need to let him settle. It takes some horses longer than others. Don't accept "booger spots". If he has a place he doesn't want to go into, insist he does. Use your leg to push him toward the places he seeks to avoid.

More videos!!!


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

tinyliny said:


> I think that was a good ride, too. I can see that he is tense. you ride very well and your lower leg looks quiet and solid. I see tension in your body, too, though and I think you may have been able to slow him down gradually by breathing a bit deeper and slower yourself, sitting more down onto his back (it looked like you were in half seat much of the time) and making yourself a bit "heavier" for him to anchor him a bit with your seat and your breath. He seems to want to run out from under himself a bit, but I really like the way he moves . He has good , rythmic drive from behind, which would be awesom in dressage. I really like him a lot!
> You could take more advantage of this by encouraging him to reach down and forward. He is up and tense against the bit and hollowing out just abit, where as I think if he were able to reach down and out more, his back would start to swing more.
> I would work at that at walk and trot, and at the canter, for a bit , let him go fast if he likes. I did miss yoiur warm up, as you said, so maybe you already did lots of long and low.
> 
> I think you , as a rider, looked very good.


Thats one reason I am excited to be working with a trainer. I don't notice how tense I get until someone tells me or I watch the video. I have a hard time staying loose in my arms/back while trying to let him know that running around like a giraffe on a red bull is a no-no. I also pitch forward, and get into half seat without really noticing. =\ He is sensitive enough that he responds to slower post, I just got to remember to stop just going with him. I hope to eventually get into some eventing so dressage is a step we will be taking. =)

His warm up was pretty much the same mind set as all of these clips. I just haven't been able to get him to relax yet. Before I moved he was working really well in a long and low. I'm hoping it will only take a week or so more to get it back. Thanks for the critique Tiny.


----------



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Well, he's an unusually nice horse and you just find that balance between letting him have so GO! and then getting him to trust that you really DO want him to stretch. There's a little bit of conflict between what your body is saing (being forward and a bit tense) and what your hands are saying. Try going more to each side of the extreme ; more cowpoke lazy riding from you at times, and try to sometimes let him move on the buckle, and then sometimes let him Whee! and go and open it up in front. Then he'll be happier about working for you in the gray area in between.

But, seriously, I think you 're doing really well.


----------



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I just read Allison's reply and I totally agree with the need to move the horse even more so he won't come behind the bridle. I forgot about that part. I dont' remember previous videos so can't make a comparison.


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

Allison Finch said:


> I see HUGE improvement from the videos I saw a good while ago. You have done a really good job. The gait that I saw that was the most problematic, and probably the most difficult to improve, was the walk. He was moving somewhat laterally, which is a problem. You need to half halt, release, and repeat. He needs to slow down his rhythm so that he can move his legs in a purer four beat tempo.
> 
> In his trot work, he occasionally goes hollow. This was his attempt to "back out of the bridle" and go heavier on his forehand. Even though he can get hot, you need to urge him forward (carefully) to move him back into that bridle. This will encourage him to use his haunch a bit better, lightening his forehand. Since he is such a hot guy, you can use more seat to help influence his forward impulsion.
> 
> ...


His walk has gone down the drain! He had it down good before we moved. He was feeling ****y today, I have been working on lateral work the day before, and he decided that he was going to spend the day working off imaginary cues. He kept randomly doing haunches in and side stepping. I was having a hard time keeping him him straight. I am unsure as to how to slow down his walk. He either ignores my seat, or comes to a complete stop instead of slowing down. If I hold him in tight I can manage to get a 4 beat walk, but that isn't what we want. Trying to get his attention, circles or anything just frustrate him and make him take shorter, faster steps. Even if I tighten up my body ask for the slow down, pull him in, then release him as soon as he is 'walking' he instantly propels forward into his speed walk. I have done that routine for 20 consecutive minutes to no results. He fails to understand that it is the 4 beat walk that is getting the reward. 

He wasn't being very sensitive today. I had to grab a dressage whip to get him to move off my leg. He was ignoring all my cues to get him to move up into the bridle. I barely had to tap him with it, which he would then respond off my leg too much, upset by me using the whip. He has been resisting actually working and picking himself up. Which I'm not sure how to really get him to push into it because, if I get too aggressive with getting him to move forward then he gets frustrated and his mind goes to mush, I might as well call it a day. He swings into hyper energy mode, and I would barely be able to get him to do anything other than jig. Trying to find that line is proving difficult. 

I'll work on the half halts at the canter. I was just happy he wasn't pulling me into the speed increasing canter. He was staying somewhat consistent at that pace, which was hot and hollow. It had no fight to it, which I really liked. 

As for booger spots. He doesn't have any area he doesn't want to go, but he has his hot spots where he starts to get up, hollow and speed up. Those right now are heading towards the gate and around the gate. If he's heading towards the gate, he wants to do it fast, and looks for a fight from me. He tries to fight any cue I give. He has no problem with leaving the gate, he relaxes and when not facing it and happily goes along till we are facing it again.

I'll work on bending the elbows too.  I think that is one thing I have to be thinking, relax and bend, relax and bend....It feels so unnatural. Its also hard that Jake throws a small temper tantrum when I raise the hands at all. He gets tense, raises his head and hollows and will refuse to work on the bridle. :?

Thanks Allison. I'll try to keep the videos coming. =)


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

tinyliny said:


> I just read Allison's reply and I totally agree with the need to move the horse even more so he won't come behind the bridle. I forgot about that part. I dont' remember previous videos so can't make a comparison.


Here are the old videos that I had posted, the Jumping ones are bad. 


The first Critique I had asked for here in March : 





How scary we were jumping (March): 





A bad show, in which after with advice from people here, I stopped jumping and started retraining (July): 





Then in August :


----------



## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

I'd kill for your seat. Your lower leg never moves and you're well into the tack at the canter. You're way above me in skill level. The only thing I can pick out is your contact. I bet if you super slo-motioned your arms, you would have some up/down movement rather than following forward/back motion. It's subtle, but might improve his suppleness to the bit if it were refined more. Love you horse. He looks like fun.


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

MyBoyPuck said:


> I'd kill for your seat. Your lower leg never moves and you're well into the tack at the canter. You're way above me in skill level. The only thing I can pick out is your contact. I bet if you super slo-motioned your arms, you would have some up/down movement rather than following forward/back motion. It's subtle, but might improve his suppleness to the bit if it were refined more. Love you horse. He looks like fun.


Aww, you flatter me. My lower leg has been a challenge that has been a pain in the rear to overcome. Even now, it feels unnatural as I have to think very very hard to keep my leg still, and I only have the muscle to hold it for about 15 minutes before I go wobbly legged. 

I actually went through the footage in slo-mo and you're right, at the trot I have my arms so locked that they rise and fall with my posting. I'm adding that to my list of things to think about when I ride. 

Thank you. He's a fun and frustrating horse all at the same time nothing is easy, but he is the most honest horse I have ever come across. I was thinking about it today and he has never put me wrong. He has never dumped me, never done anything that would make me fall off and has saved my tosh more times then I can count. Unless he's going down too, he tries to keep me up. Never have just fallen off him, though I have took a fair share of tumbles with him. I sure love him though.


----------



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Yeah, I want that horse! (I say that a lot, but he is a good solid all around nice horse)


I can see that you and he have made a huge improvement. That show was scary. I dont' jump, so I get scared easily at jumping shows.


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

tinyliny said:


> Yeah, I want that horse! (I say that a lot, but he is a good solid all around nice horse)


A lot of people online say that, a lot of people in person say that all he is worth is a bullet to the head. 

I guess we have better, open minded people online. :lol: He is one of a kind in every way. He carried me nicely through my gymkhana / barrel racing period. We won our share of ribbons, now we're trying to go the jumper/eventing route. He is a model citizen for the term bomb proof, and tolerates anything and everything. He also has some crazy saddling problems (luckily lying inactive right now), is horribly barn sour, would sidestep off a cliff, he has no awareness of where his body is and his surroundings. He has so much go and he is currently around 23 years old. >_>

I'm stopping myself now...I could talk about him forever.


----------



## Wallaby (Jul 13, 2008)

Completely, completely OT, but:
HDL, can we _please_ start a club called "Crazy Old Horses of HF"? Lacey and Jake could SOOOOOO be best friends. 
I only really watched the "scary show" video and that head shaking/kinda bolting/"turning in a really scary way" stuff is so familiar to me, oh man. :lol:

And his honesty was super familiar too. Lacey's the same way, she'll do everything she can to be as scary as possible (no bucking really, just everything else she can think of), but if I start falling off, it's suddenly model citizen time. 
I think they probably just like scaring the living daylights out of us and then being all "Oh! Just kidding!!" :lol:

I have no critique, at all, for you though. I'm just impressed and amused at how familiar his antics are to me. What a fantastic horse. haha!


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

Wallaby said:


> Completely, completely OT, but:
> HDL, can we _please_ start a club called "Crazy Old Horses of HF"? Lacey and Jake could SOOOOOO be best friends.
> I only really watched the "scary show" video and that head shaking/kinda bolting/"turning in a really scary way" stuff is so familiar to me, oh man. :lol:
> 
> ...


Hahaha. Crazy seniors. It really funny when people can't guess the horses age by just looking at them and their personality. A club should be in order for these extraordinary equines on energy drinks, with no idea to their own age. Horses that have the reckless abandon are quite rare I believe.  

I hope I have that amount of energy when I'm his relative age. We've earned the nickname Reckless and Fearless at the stables I moved to after that show.


----------



## Clava (Nov 9, 2010)

In the top video (I can't watch the others as my computer is too slow), your lower leg is too far forward and this is seriously putting you out of balance and behind the horses's motion which does look rather stiff (as you mention). Riding without stirrups would really help bring your leg back under you.


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

Clava said:


> In the top video (I can't watch the others as my computer is too slow), your lower leg is too far forward and this is seriously putting you out of balance and behind the horses's motion which does look rather stiff (as you mention). Riding without stirrups would really help bring your leg back under you.


The top video is the only one that is important. The others are just old ones to compare to.

Riding without stirrups hasn't helped me, I tend to go into a more chair seat and grip with my knees. That feels more natural then having my legs back. I think more than bringing my legs back, (which I think are in a correct place on the horse, just behind the girth) its more of I need to sit farther up in the saddle instead of back against it. I believe I should also drop a hole for my flat work. Try to line it up a little better.

Correct me If I'm wrong. That is just what I see think of for placement. Thank you for the critique though.


----------



## Clava (Nov 9, 2010)

Horsesdontlie said:


> The top video is the only one that is important. The others are just old ones to compare to.
> 
> Riding without stirrups hasn't helped me, I tend to go into a more chair seat and grip with my knees. That feels more natural then having my legs back. I think more than bringing my legs back, (which I think are in a correct place on the horse, just behind the girth) its more of I need to sit farther up in the saddle instead of back against it. I believe I should also drop a hole for my flat work. Try to line it up a little better.
> 
> Correct me If I'm wrong. That is just what I see think of for placement. Thank you for the critique though.


Sorry riding without stirrups hasn't helped,that is a trusted old favourite for getting a good heel, hip, shoulder line. Lengthening your stirrups probably will help, but don't go so far that you are reaching too much as that will make you more insecure. If I was standing next to you, I'd grab your thigh , lift it,turn it slightly and bring it back (My RI does this beautifully). I don't think moving your body forward will help much, it is more about bring that leg back so that if the horse magically disappeared, you would land standing up. Hope that helps and good luck.

Edit - just watched it a bit more - you are pushing your leg forward as you push your heels down, lengthen your stirrups a bit and hold your foot level and bring it back under you. Your heel should be springy and more level and not rammed down.


----------



## Clava (Nov 9, 2010)

Just watched it a bit more - you are pushing your leg forward as you push your heels down, lengthen your stirrups a bit and hold your foot level and bring it back under you. Your heel should be springy and more level and not rammed down.


----------



## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

First, I really like your horse. Not only is he sweet-natured and calm, but he also knows his cues well AND he's flashy!!
I think we should all remember that riding is a very physical activity. Many of our muscles need to be strengthened before we can isolate our arms and legs from our torsos. 
I agree with half-halts, and I use them always on my horses, if for no other reason then to remind them I'm in charge!
I'd like to suggest that you strengthen your abs and legs by riding the walk and canter with some slack for awhile. Your horse is trying to keep constant contact on the bit, but your contact isn't steady. If he rushes, you're already in an arena, so just push him faster and tire him out. I don't see him rushing in this video, however, ??
Try posting the trot with your knuckles on his neck right in front of the pommel. If he sighs, you'll know that you were bumping him in the mouth.
Try warming up by riding the walk without stirrups and *LET YOUR LEGS HANG* and wait to speed up until you feel VERY HEAVY in the saddle. It may take a good hour the first time you do it. A good striding walk will warm him up without stressing him, and you'll be more relaxed, more weighted. Keep your thumbs up and push your arms away from you--think straight elbows. This will teach your body to not pull up your knees, pull in your arms and adopt a fetal position, bc that makes you stiff. If he is heavy on the forehand, break up the track by periodically riding over the poles, so he has to raise his forehand and use his haunches.
One more thing--I've picked you apart, but I really do like your horse, and if you can find a fun cross-training activity to do with him so you're less concerned about your form, I think you'll both improve your riding and improve on your relationship with your horse. =D


----------



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Corporal said:


> .
> Try warming up by riding the walk without stirrups and *LET YOUR LEGS HANG* and wait to speed up until you feel VERY HEAVY in the saddle. It may take a good hour the first time you do it. A good striding walk will warm him up without stressing him, and you'll be more relaxed, more weighted. Keep your thumbs up and push your arms away from you--think straight elbows. This will teach your body to not pull up your knees, pull in your arms and adopt a fetal position, bc that makes you stiff. If he is heavy on the forehand, break up the track by periodically riding over the poles, so he has to raise his forehand and use his haunches.
> One more thing--I've picked you apart, but I really do like your horse, and if you can find a fun cross-training activity to do with him so you're less concerned about your form, I think you'll both improve your riding and improve on your relationship with your horse. =D


 
I am baffled about that. "straight elbows"? You mean no bend in them? To me, that is what promotes the before mentioned problem of having the hand move up and down with the posting rythm, because of a rigid elbow.

Otherwise, I totally agree with the advice given.


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

Clava - Unfortunately I rode bareback so much that I have habits that are hard to break. He used to be so sensitive to any leg cues so I always rode bareback with no leg on him at all. I found balance in my seat, I did my best to not grip with anything. A few trainers think its rather odd that I'm able to ride bareback well enough to stay on without any lower leg contact. But who knows. I just know as soon as we start going within a minute I'm back to that position and I can't find out how to get under myself again, have to go to a walk then start again. Though I don't know, I've never watched myself with a saddle without stirrups. Maybe I should try and video tape that next time. 

I have very short calf muscles/tendons. Years of walking on my toes...I'm getting more flexible but just not quite there yet. So in order to keep them from riding up I feel like they have to be shoved down. If I just relaxed my foot is parallel to the ground and I can not keep any sort of balance. 

[[I'm not trying to say your wrong...just explaining what I feel when I try]]

Corporal - If he looks calm then we did a good job! He isn't a calm horse, and he was tense this day. But thank you so much for the compliment on him. I love to hear that he looks calm and knows his cues, because it means all of my training is starting to pay off. He's come a long way from the hot greenish 14 year old I got nine years ago. 

I am hoping to be getting some lunge lessons eventually on a different horse. I agree that I need to work on not depending on my hands. Unfortunately Jake can't exactly be rode on a loose rein in a snaffle. He gets nervous without feeling the bit, and eventually would be galloping full out around the arena. He also tends to run into things/side swing things and motorcycle around turns enough that he has fallen more than a few times. He runs himself into the ground, there is no tiring this horse out. He would run until he collapses, I've tried it a few times and had to give up when he starts tripping at a gallop because he refuses to slow down but couldn't bring his legs high enough to clear the ground. :neutral:

Posting with my hands in front of the pommel created more problems then they solved for me. I had a trainer have me do that for about 5 months. Since then I've been spending many months trying to get rid of my habit of leaning forward, and I still bounced when I raised my hands. So I just have to work on it some other way. 

I'll try the relaxing walk thing, sounds like it would be good for us anyways. EDIT : I agree with Tiny about the straight elbow thing though. Its already straight enough as is, thats something I have to get rid of. 

If I'm not thinking about it I go back to bad old habits. I'm a western/barrel rider gone english. So going back to old habits is bad bad bad. Lol But what do you mean by cross-training?


----------



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Did you used to do barrels on Jake? 
I ask because it occured to me that riding him western for a while might be a good change for the two of you. You'd be riding with a longer leg and more on your seatbones, less in a half seat position, and he'd be encouraged to drop his head and (whenever possible) ride with a loose rein. Riding western helped me a lot. I learned how to ride a horse without having constant direct contact to the mouth, and not clamp with my legs. 
BTW, I don't see a real issue of you jamming your feet forward so very much into the stirrup. it's not obvious to me.


----------



## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

You won't be able to _maintain_ totally straight arms bc your arms will get tired, but you'll get the straight elbow through the reins to the bit if you straighten your arms by thinking "totally straight." I see hands pulled towards the chin with bent elbows as a major riding fault. It makes it impossible to check your horse if he suddenly breaks. It's really a physics question. You need to have leverage and bent elbows take this away. Also, it softens your feel of the horse's mouth. When I direct rein my 5 yo's I am constantly adjusting my rein length according to what my young horse is doing. Try this, too. =D


----------



## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

"Cross training" is just finding a fun activity to do with your horse to either strengthen muscles on both of you, or break up boredom, or just break a cycle where you've both hit a plateau. International athletes cross train. Skiers swim in the summer, runners play soccer--YOU get the picture. Does anybody at your barn have one of those huge horse balls? If so, you could get 3 others together and teach your horses "horse soccer."


----------



## Clava (Nov 9, 2010)

I understnd the need to feel balanced with you heels rammed down, but you need to find balance without doing that, by pushing your leg forward you in a braced off balance position and what you need to be in is a relaxed neutral balance. I too have ridden a lot bareback and I also take up a chair seat when bareback, but you have to consciously bring your leg back, no gripping or tensing to avhieve a good position. TBH until your position is balanced you can't really work on hand position or the horses collection. You are so nearly in the correct place, it wouldn't take much to transform how you and your horse goes, find a good dressage instructor and you'll be away


----------



## Clava (Nov 9, 2010)

Corporal said:


> You won't be able to _maintain_ totally straight arms bc your arms will get tired, but you'll get the straight elbow through the reins to the bit if you straighten your arms by thinking "totally straight." I see hands pulled towards the chin with bent elbows as a major riding fault. It makes it impossible to check your horse if he suddenly breaks. It's really a physics question. You need to have leverage and bent elbows take this away. Also, it softens your feel of the horse's mouth. When I direct rein my 5 yo's I am constantly adjusting my rein length according to what my young horse is doing. Try this, too. =D


Sorry, but bent elbows are not a fault (although hands at your chin is lol), there should be a direct line from the elbow to the horse's mouth but not straight arms. Hands should be carried unless opening wide to school a young and green horse. Totally agree that you need constant adjustments though of the rein length.


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

tinyliny said:


> Did you used to do barrels on Jake?
> I ask because it occured to me that riding him western for a while might be a good change for the two of you. You'd be riding with a longer leg and more on your seatbones, less in a half seat position, and he'd be encouraged to drop his head and (whenever possible) ride with a loose rein. Riding western helped me a lot. I learned how to ride a horse without having constant direct contact to the mouth, and not clamp with my legs.
> BTW, I don't see a real issue of you jamming your feet forward so very much into the stirrup. it's not obvious to me.


I did. I do ride western every now and then as a nice break. It fixes a lot of my issues and is a nice relaxing progress, but they don't seem to transfer back and forth between the two. He also likes his western bit more than the snaffle. I use a wonder bit on him for western and he actually does pretty good on a loose rein on that, but its a different finesse for a snaffle and keeping the contact. The wonderbit has _a lot_ of give and take with the large sliding mouth piece. I'll try and get western video too, its hard to explain between the two.


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

> You won't be able to maintain totally straight arms bc your arms will get tired, but you'll get the straight elbow through the reins to the bit if you straighten your arms by thinking "totally straight." I see hands pulled towards the chin with bent elbows as a major riding fault. It makes it impossible to check your horse if he suddenly breaks. It's really a physics question. You need to have leverage and bent elbows take this away. Also, it softens your feel of the horse's mouth. When I direct rein my 5 yo's I am constantly adjusting my rein length according to what my young horse is doing. Try this, too. =D


I'm sorry but personally I'm going to have to disagree. If you don't have a bend in your elbows (I fail to how to be soft and move with the horse) For example when you post you elbow should be folding/unfolding (slightly) to keep your hands in place while your body moves. I have straight arms, and I have troubles keep soft hands while I post and moving with the horse at a walk/canter. Not super bent, but I agree with the straight line from bit to wrist to elbow. 



Corporal said:


> "Cross training" is just finding a fun activity to do with your horse to either strengthen muscles on both of you, or break up boredom, or just break a cycle where you've both hit a plateau. International athletes cross train. Skiers swim in the summer, runners play soccer--YOU get the picture. Does anybody at your barn have one of those huge horse balls? If so, you could get 3 others together and teach your horses "horse soccer."
> Horse soccer - YouTube


Jake is a beast at horse soccer. Just gotta say that. :lol: Unfortunately no big balls at this stables.


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

Clava said:


> I understnd the need to feel balanced with you heels rammed down, but you need to find balance without doing that, by pushing your leg forward you in a braced off balance position and what you need to be in is a relaxed neutral balance. I too have ridden a lot bareback and I also take up a chair seat when bareback, but you have to consciously bring your leg back, no gripping or tensing to avhieve a good position. TBH until your position is balanced you can't really work on hand position or the horses collection. You are so nearly in the correct place, it wouldn't take much to transform how you and your horse goes, find a good dressage instructor and you'll be away


Makes sense, I'll see what I can do about relaxing more. I'm somewhat hoping its a time thing to. I have to work to establish the habit, then relax into the habit with time. I've just started establishing my lower leg control and balance recently. So we will see. 

I've been trying to find one! Unfortunately I've been unhappy with most I have come across, or can't afford the ones that look spectacular or they won't travel to my stables. I'm going to keep looking.


----------



## Clava (Nov 9, 2010)

Horsesdontlie said:


> Makes sense, I'll see what I can do about relaxing more. I'm somewhat hoping its a time thing to. I have to work to establish the habit, then relax into the habit with time. I've just started establishing my lower leg control and balance recently. So we will see.
> 
> I've been trying to find one! Unfortunately I've been unhappy with most I have come across, or can't afford the ones that look spectacular or they won't travel to my stables. I'm going to keep looking.


 
My RI is Mary Wanless trained (Ride With Your Mind) and she is fantastic, make sure you get someone who gets you to sort and balance your body so the horse can perform not someone who just says " make the horse do this or that". Once your body is doing the right things then the horse will want to move into the correct shapes


----------



## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

Horsesdontlie said:


> I have very short calf muscles/tendons. Years of walking on my toes...I'm getting more flexible but just not quite there yet. So in order to keep them from riding up I feel like they have to be shoved down. If I just relaxed my foot is parallel to the ground and I can not keep any sort of balance.


I think, perhaps, you should consider taking an adult ballet or tap or hip hop class. The warm ups are classical dance which will stretch your ankles and strengthen them. You will learn to stretch and relax your body and you will stretch your calf muscles. *ONLY SERIOUS DANCERS need to avoid schooling horses bc they lose some of their ability to hyperflex their legs *but your teacher will not expect this from a beginner. You will be very surpised at how sore and then how fit you'll feel after a class. I know that it will help your riding and I think it will help refresh your riding focus. =D


----------



## rachelgem (Oct 22, 2011)

thats quite good, but remember in english you grip with your knees, not your calfs. if you grip with your calfs your horse may become dead to the leg. you have a better position and securer seat gripping with your thighs and knees.


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

Corporal said:


> I think, perhaps, you should consider taking an adult ballet or tap or hip hop class. The warm ups are classical dance which will stretch your ankles and strengthen them. You will learn to stretch and relax your body and you will stretch your calf muscles. *ONLY SERIOUS DANCERS need to avoid schooling horses bc they lose some of their ability to hyperflex their legs *but your teacher will not expect this from a beginner. You will be very surpised at how sore and then how fit you'll feel after a class. I know that it will help your riding and I think it will help refresh your riding focus. =D


Me...dance? That would be like asking Jake to tie a bow....

Lol, its a great suggestion but I don't have the time or money to do anything like that. >.> So I'm stuck doing my at home stretching.


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

rachelgem said:


> thats quite good, but remember in english you grip with your knees, not your calfs. if you grip with your calfs your horse may become dead to the leg. you have a better position and securer seat gripping with your thighs and knees.


Thank you for the compliment. But you're not supposed to grip with you knee. It promotes a swinging/unstable lower leg. You're supposed to hold with your calf, I have a death grip, which I need to relax a little. A good horse will know the difference between calf and heel. So not dead to the leg. All decent trainers I have been under have me grip with my calf.


----------



## Clava (Nov 9, 2010)

Horsesdontlie said:


> Thank you for the compliment. But you're not supposed to grip with you knee. It promotes a swinging/unstable lower leg. You're supposed to hold with your calf, I have a death grip, which I need to relax a little. A good horse will know the difference between calf and heel. So not dead to the leg. All decent trainers I have been under have me grip with my calf.


Actually you don't hold with your calf, you should gie a snug hug with your thighs:wink:


----------



## rachelgem (Oct 22, 2011)

Yeah, over in the uk, we are taught to hold with out thighs, and we have to learn to keep our lower legs still, not touching the horse. it gives a secure seat, so if the horse was taken from under you, you would be standing up


----------



## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

Hmmm interesting. For me, I can not keep my stirrups or balance that well without using my calf. I'll have to look into it.


----------

