# Saddle size conversion....



## Muppetgirl

Ok, can someone give me a 'list' of comparative sizes between English and western saddles? For example a 17" English saddle is equivalent to a ?" Western saddle......

Also, can anyone give me a good explanation of the different tree sizes in English saddles.......

It's been a long time since I've sat in an English saddle and was thinking of getting a GP saddle to pop on my horse every now and again for a change.....

Can anyone recommend tree size for a wide shouldered/low withered horse? 

Just to give me an idea of what I might or might not want. My horse was difficult to fit a reining saddle on, so I suspect an English saddle might give me the same grief

Thanks!

Ps. Must add, have spent many many hours in English saddles......only ever had to buy two of them.....about 15 years ago!!!! I've gone blank!


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## SorrelHorse

Well, I'm not sure what the exact measurement is...

I need a 15'' reining saddle, a 13.5 barrel saddle, and a 15.5 english saddle suits me fine if that helps!

Also subbing because I'm curious about the real conversion formula. :lol:


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## waresbear

A 17" English saddle would be equal to a 15" Western, generally speaking.


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## SorrelHorse

...
:rofl: Wares, I'm way off then.


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## WildAcreFarms

Yep that was my thoughts 17" english is the same is a 15" western which normally fits kids or very slim adult women. 17.5 is the standard size average English seat
and 18 is a larger seat (16" western) for larger ppl taller men heavier ladies 
plus size english riders usually get a 19" seat and many tall slim riders will get a 19" in a jumping saddle....


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## franknbeans

Well, I also don't fit the mold-I have a 16" reining saddle and my AP English was a 17". Same goes for my BO.......

As far as fitting a wide horse-I had an older Stubben for years-medium/wide tree and it fit my Clyde cross.......then I got a Bates CAIR, which was great also, since it was adjustable.


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## Saddlebag

The better english saddles are easier to fit than western because they are available in a wider range of widths than western.


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## freia

Generally, you add 2" to your Western saddle size to get your English size. That's ballpark.

For tree widths: A medium tree has a tree-point angle pretty close to 90°, medium/narrow and narrow have tighter angles, and med/wide and wide have more open angles. Some saddle-makers also have x-tra wide and XX wide sizes.
Keep in mind that in addition to the tree angle, you also have various widths of the gullet. So a medium tree in one brand may fit tighter around the withers than a medium width in another. I have a medium Passier and a medium Kieffer. Both have a 90° angle between tree points. The Passier has lots of width for the withers, while the Kieffer tens to sit much narrower and higher up.
Also, when you're shopping, keep in mind that what one saddle-maker calls a medium can be very different from what another calls a medium. There is no standard. People often will know that their horse takes a 31cm tree (med/wide) in a Stubben. That doesn't mean that they can go out and buy a 31cm tree or a med/wide in another brand and have it fit, because another brand's 31cm tree may have shorter or longer tree points, making the angle different, or their idea of a med'wide may have a narrower gullet, making it pinch, etc.


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## Muppetgirl

Ok thanks everyone, that info will work 

One question here, my reining saddle is 17", I can ride in a 15" but I've always liked the extra room in a saddle, that's why I bought a saddle with a bigger seat as I don't like the feeling of being held/locked in, I like to be able to move

Wanting a more open seat in an English saddle, I'd probably be better looking for a jumping saddle with a lower cantle right? As I love the lower cantle in reining saddles. I would like to jump my guy for fun at some point


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## freia

Muppetgirl said:


> Ok thanks everyone, that info will work
> 
> One question here, my reining saddle is 17", I can ride in a 15" but I've always liked the extra room in a saddle, that's why I bought a saddle with a bigger seat as I don't like the feeling of being held/locked in, I like to be able to move
> 
> Wanting a more open seat in an English saddle, I'd probably be better looking for a jumping saddle with a lower cantle right? As I love the lower cantle in reining saddles. I would like to jump my guy for fun at some point


In an English saddle, you do not want to go with a seat that's too big for you. It won't support you well, and will mess up your position. So if you like a more open feelm then a flatter seat will probably be your thing. the jumping saddles do have the flatter seats. It's really difficult to get out of the seat and into the correct jump position in a deep-seated saddle. Many A/P saddles also have pretty flat seats, especially the older ones. Don't rule out an older German, English, or Swiss A/P saddle.


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## Corporal

ALWAYS try the saddle before you buy it. Don't take these recommendations, then go online and order a saddle.


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## SaddleOnline

We usually suggest a size and a half to two sizes up (from western to english) based on the rider's height/weight ratio, but the best best is to at least go sit in some before buying online, because everyone prefers a different fit. 

Best of luck!


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## thenrie

You have to be careful with larger sized western saddles. When you start getting past 16 inches, the load gets too far aft on the horse's back and makes the tail of the bars start to poke the loins. Can make a horse pretty uncomfortable. If you need a 19" western seat, you also need a large horse and possibly a custom saddle. A 19" Ralide tree just isn't going to be good for the rider or the horse.

I stand 5'9" and weigh in at 185 pounds, average build. Now that's not huge, but I could stand to lose 15 pounds. I sit comfortably in a 15" western seat. I can sit comfortably in a 16" cutting saddle or roping saddle, but I start feeling a little bit like I'm sitting on a table after that. I prefer a 15" saddle with a tall cantle for most riding. It's a little different for men and women, since they tend to carry body weight in different locations, but the fact remains that when you start getting up into the higher numbers of seat length, you start having saddle fit problems on the horse's back.

There's a great site by an excellent custom tree builder at http://rodnikkel.com. He has put out some great articles, in the form of blog posts, on his site touching all aspects of saddle trees. It's a good read.

But to "plus-one" on the original question, Aussie and English saddles measure the same way, which I believe is between the highest points on the pommel and the cantle, but Western saddles measure seat length from the base of the horn, where it transitions to the pommel, to the seam on the top of the cantle. In general, a 15" western equates to a 17" Aussie or English. Having said that, saddles of the same measurement from different makers may fit differently on a given individual or horse.


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## verona1016

thenrie said:


> But to "plus-one" on the original question, Aussie and English saddles measure the same way, which I believe is between the highest points on the pommel and the cantle,


Not sure about Aussie, but English saddles are measure from the nailhead on the side of the pommel (not the highest point) to the center of the cantle.


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## thenrie

verona1016 said:


> Not sure about Aussie, but English saddles are measure from the nailhead on the side of the pommel (not the highest point) to the center of the cantle.


Thanks for that info, I wasn't sure about that. I've read that Aussie saddles are measured the same way as English, but then there's that pesky poly right there.

When you say the center of the cantle, do you mean the center-top of the cantle or a point in the middle of the seat? Explain it a little more. I'd like to know.


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## verona1016

thenrie said:


> Thanks for that info, I wasn't sure about that. I've read that Aussie saddles are measured the same way as English, but then there's that pesky poly right there.
> 
> When you say the center of the cantle, do you mean the center-top of the cantle or a point in the middle of the seat? Explain it a little more. I'd like to know.


The highest point in the middle of the cantle- a picture's worth a 1000 words  (Not my photo, just one I found on a Google image search)


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## thenrie

Thanks for that. I guess the OP got a $5 answer to a $2 question.


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## Celeste

Thenrie, you are 5'9". I am also 5'9"; however, I suspect that we have different builds. I am female; you are male. You don't weigh all that much more than I do; however, I am most likely more overweight than you are. Another thing, most men have a proportionally taller upper body than women. I am tall, but I am all legs. I wear a 34 inch inseam. So if my legs are longer, our saddle needs will be different. I feel very cramped in a 15" western saddle. I use a 17" western saddle.


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## bonyroany

The difference is about two inches, although I ride in a 15" Western saddle and an 18" English saddle (the English saddle has a really deep seat, so it measures a bit longer).

12" Western = 14" English
12.5" = 14.5" English
13" Western = 15" English
13.5" Western = 15.5" English
14" Western = 16" English
14.5" = 16.5" English
15" Western = 17" English
15.5" Western = 17.5" English
16" Western = 18" English
16.5" Western = 18.5" English
17" Western = 19" English

Hope this helps!


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## franknbeans

WRONG. I fit perfectly in my 17 English, and my 16 western. Sorry-not a good chart.

There are LOTS of 16" western saddle folks-and very very few 18" english. That alone should tell you something.


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