# convince about dog



## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

Hey, I am looking for advice on how to get my parents to let me get a dog. I don't think I have anything good going for me other than that I would be able to pay for it by myself. :/ We have 2 dogs, one is my mom's and one is my brothers. I want a mini australian shepherd. My mom has had bad experiences with indoor dogs(had two and neither one would accept her 'training' to (go) outside) But, I think that is because she didn't really be consistent. I would.  I could pay for everything but like I said, she has had bad experiences. I have a younger brother that would throw a fit because he wants a dog (can't have one because he doesn't have anyway to provide for it) The other reason they would probably say no is because I already have two cats.:shock: My siblings would throw a fit. But, any advice is welcome and very appreciated! I love love love Mini Australian Shepherds. We had one but she got run over.  I really want one, I will do whatever. Thanks, everyone!


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## 40232 (Jan 10, 2013)

Hmm, you want to breed your mare, fix your sore horse, AND get a dog? :think: You must have a lot of free time and make a lot of money at your age.


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

I do have a lot of free time, I don't do any activities other than my animals, haha. And, I do make quite a bit of money for my age.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I would not allow you to have one, were you my daughter, because you have too much responsibility with the horses, as it is. so, I cannot help you convince your parents of something that I do not think is particularly wise to begin with.

You seem like a very self directed person. my guess is that you can come up with a better argument than even the most creative person here could, since you know your parents, and their weak spots. and your strengths.

what IS your best argument, since you'd like to discuss it?


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

I don't know, Tinyliny, I guess that I am very determined, motivated, and have a love for animals that no one else in my family has (that could be good or bad)


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## Roman (Jun 13, 2014)

Oh boy...hopefully you will have an open ear about this, okay? Please?

You have three horses, two dogs, and two cats. I wish I was that lucky! We had two dogs, now only one. Have two cats too. But I sure wish I had THREE horses! Consider yourself VERY lucky, girl.

The dogs we had were Australian Shepherds. As I take it, Mini Aussies are just smaller. Both of those dogs love to herd. They would chase ANYTHING. Cats, joggers, bicyclists, cows, the horse, etc. Dakota would nip at people. We put in an underground fence. Dakota ended up biting a fireman, and that dog was the most lovable and adorable - he was just very protective. We had to rehome him, but he's living the life on a 600 acre ranch now. XD Bella, though, still chases. She doesn't chase joggers or bicyclists anymore, just barks and shuts up. She still chases cats and will chase the cows if she ever gets the moment, otherwise she knows to stay out of the pasture and hasn't chased the horse. She will however bark at the cows and lurch at the fence if the cows are too close (I guess she's afraid they'll get out :lol. She will go and sit down at the barn, now that we're weaning calves you can find her in the barn by the gate or outside by the gate just watching. If the calves start moving and get close to the gate she'll bark. It's in her nature. We went through training with the two, they were very good but still chased.

If you do not give these kinds of dogs a job, they WILL find one. That's what our dogs did and it was not the kind of job we liked. You should be very careful. It is most likely the dog will be out in the pasture chasing your ponies. And if you get the foal, heh, good luck. 

They will need to be started on training from DAY ONE. We unfortunately didn't start training the dogs until the incident. That was too late. You need to start NOW.

Aussies are also energetic, they have lots of energy. You're going to have to provide exercise like a big backyard and play with them frequently. And be careful with strangers. 



You already have two dogs, two cats, and three horses. That is MORE than enough. Vet bills add up you know! Personally, I wouldn't let you have one. And only because you have so many pets and activities already, seems kind of selfish to want another. And more and more animals too.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

perseverance is the flip side of stubbornness. two sides of the same coin.

I have heard, as Roman said, that Aussie sheppards, both standard and mini, are very high energy dogs.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

What have you done to deserve another animal? Aside from the ability to pay for it yourself... what outstanding achievements of yours would justify your parents giving and letting you get a dog?

Why do you want something so badly if you know it will upset your siblings?


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## Roman (Jun 13, 2014)

alexischristina said:


> Why do you want something so badly if you know it will upset your siblings?


That part there sounds like selfishness.


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## jazzy475 (Sep 18, 2014)

Doesn't sound like you need yet another animal to take care of. My daughter want's alot of things but guess what i say NO. She would love to get a indoor cat not happening already have 2 large dogs, 3 horses and 10 rabbits. 

She has learned no means no so when i tell her no that's end of discussion period. You need to learn there is a limit... can't have everything you want. 

You have horses that need to have vet care,and i don't think getting a dog is a good idea.


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## Roman (Jun 13, 2014)

jazzy475 said:


> Doesn't sound like you need yet another animal to take care of. My daughter want's alot of things but guess what i say NO. She would love to get a indoor cat not happening already have 2 large dogs, 3 horses and 10 rabbits.
> 
> She has learned no means no so when i tell her no that's end of discussion period. You need to learn there is a limit... can't have everything you want.
> 
> You have horses that need to have vet care,and i don't think getting a dog is a good idea.


Especially one that'll need vet care, tags, food, water, exercise. And the liability if he were to bite someone or an animal. 

I want a lot of things too. I'd sure love to have several horses, I'd sure love to get rid of the cows and breed horses instead (just a dream, it'd NEVER happen now! Not experienced enough or ready for that), build a big barn and arena, etc. etc.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

alexischristina said:


> Why do you want something so badly if you know it will upset your siblings?



As a young teen, I never concerned myself with my siblings when it came to what I wanted, not when I was 14 and the middle child of 5. they did not concern themselves about me, either. I think that's rather normal, actually.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

tinyliny said:


> As a young teen, I never concerned myself with my siblings when it came to what I wanted, not when I was 14 and the middle child of 5. they did not concern themselves about me, either. I think that's rather normal, actually.


I would agree with you, Tiny... if she hadn't already addressed the fact that it would hurt at least two of her siblings. Clearly she's thought about, and she just doesn't care. _That_ I think is different from not realizing, and I don't think that is normal.


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## CaliforniaDreaming (May 8, 2011)

alexischristina said:


> I would agree with you, Tiny... if she hadn't already addressed the fact that it would hurt at least two of her siblings. Clearly she's thought about, and she just doesn't care. _That_ I think is different from not realizing, and I don't think that is normal.


I think what's going on is a sense of entitlement and a lack of gratitude for what opportunities and blessings are there now, that nothing is ever enough, just more "me, me, me"

My dad always said that you can have anything you want, but you _can't_ have *everything* you want. Real Life requires choices, and sacrifice and saying "no" to something so you can say "yes" to something in return. 

I've never had a dog. Sure would like one, but our old house was small even if it had a big park in front of it. The new house has even more open space nearby, and is much bigger. Still don't know if circumstances are right for a dog, and anyway, I made a commitment to care for my guinea pig until he passes before getting another pet. Doesn't stop me from borrowing a friend's two Corgis now and again to take them for a walk while she's at work. 

Then again, I have 2 horses that are pretty special to me. Pretty darned blessed right there just for that alone.


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

Yup, I am super lucky. I don't know, I miss our other one so much. I wouldn't be getting it right now. I would want to have at least $400 saved up before I even bought the puppy. The deal with my siblings is that both of them are younger than me. One of them has absolutely NO income, so couldn't pay for a fish. The other is really inconsistent. (Talked about her before, loves horses one day, hates them the next) She really really really wants something one day and then mom will say something like, "If you can't even help care for the horses, why would I let you get another pet?" and she will go, "Whatever, I don't care anymore." and go upstairs. (mom says this after she refuses to help out with horses so I have to do it by myself.) I was thinking that I would share with my brother. That way, he could have a pet but not have to pay anything. But, then, I don't know how to make that fair for me. I pay the hundreds for it and then he does...?


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## Roman (Jun 13, 2014)

Ebonyisforme said:


> Yup, I am super lucky. I don't know, I miss our other one so much. I wouldn't be getting it right now. I would want to have at least $400 saved up before I even bought the puppy. The deal with my siblings is that both of them are younger than me. One of them has absolutely NO income, so couldn't pay for a fish. The other is really inconsistent. (Talked about her before, loves horses one day, hates them the next) She really really really wants something one day and then mom will say something like, "If you can't even help care for the horses, why would I let you get another pet?" and she will go, "Whatever, I don't care anymore." and go upstairs. (mom says this after she refuses to help out with horses so I have to do it by myself.) I was thinking that I would share with my brother. That way, he could have a pet but not have to pay anything. But, then, I don't know how to make that fair for me. I pay the hundreds for it and then he does...?


Or just stick with the dogs you have and deal.with.it. 

We've had 7 dogs so far. Dusk and Sunrise have died, Charger ran away, Norton died, Rosie was ran over accidentally and had to be PTS, and Dakota was rehomed. It is not easy getting over some of those things. It was waterworks with Rosie and again with Dakota when he got injured and it was either pay thousands for surgery or PTS. 

That $400 is going to go. That will NOT be enough to care for a puppy. You're going to need food, toys, water, vet bills, etc. You'll have to train it. Keep things away from it. Where is the emergency fund if the puppy were to ever get injured like Dakota? Where is the money in case the dog bites someone and that person SUES you. Good luck finding that money...

You're already taking on the expense of three horses and maybe two cats? Where is the money you have to enjoy yourself? Save up for college in order to get a decent job and income? 

Puppies are a handful. We got Bella and Dakota as puppies. Now they were both very adorable at the time, then they hit the chewing stage. They got into EVERYTHING. They ruined pairs of shoes, jackets, they chewed through their nice beds, everything! Bella still chews every once in a while, a month or two ago she got to the coveralls and jackets, and she's almost THREE! 

You have two dogs. There is nothing wrong with them. Enjoy them until they're gone. Then consider another dog.


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## DuckDodgers (May 28, 2013)

You should really rethink whether or not $400 is going to cut it. I can almost guarantee that it won't... I would put the costs as much higher than listed on here, and it doesn't take into account much in the way of vet bills

https://www.aspca.org/adopt/pet-care-costs


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## Incitatus32 (Jan 5, 2013)

Aussies and blue heelers are VERY prone to genetic diseases if not bred right (which unfortunately I see becoming more and more of a problem). I've had both (I now have a heeler/GSD mix) and I've seen plenty that come up with hip dysplasia early on in life or other disorders; OR end up being abandoned because of their high energy and high herding mentality. My family friend has spent close to $6,500 on her two year old aussie as of now. He's got hip dysplasia and a neurological condition, I cringe whenever she tells me her vet bill for the month. 

You have a horse that has back issues, is for all purposes lamed up. Let me tell you, to an untrained herding dog this is a gold mine. It will run your horses to death literally if not trained right. I agree with others that it might be best to wait until both old dogs are gone and you are more stable in your finances and wants for the future. They are high energy dogs and smart as a whip. My dog (though he is a "mutt") can unlock doors and open them, this has led to me having to drop everything and come back to find him chasing someones cows, or having to take him to the vet because he managed to get kicked in the face. 

All in all so far, he's cost me about $900 in VET bills. He's cost me a soon to be $1,000 in certified impulse control training. These are not the types of dogs that are easy to train and keep trained. They NEED a job, they need to constantly be challenged and worked with by a professional. As a puppy he destroyed EVERYTHING. He ate EVERYTHING. He barks, and screams and paws in water, he's a handful and he's never grown out of it. 

I have a close family friend who bought an aussie. She put a few months of training on it and everything was good. Came out one day and the dog was dead in the field. It'd decided to herd a sick horse, broke its training and got its skull caved in. Happens with the best of training. 

They are very much one person dogs. Can I ask you this? What happens if/when the dog isn't yours? They do pick their people! My dog was supposed to be my brothers/mothers. Now I'm the only one he listens to and gives a darn about. What happens if you want it to be your dog, but it likes your brothers/sisters better? Are you going to want another dog then? 

With all the animals you have I think it's best to wait. You love them right? You have to think about the quality of life as well. Just because you can afford all of them in the moment does not mean that you SHOULD have all of them and neglect a healthy emergency fund. I have my fair share of animals, we're in the double digits and counting. However, I have a good $5,000+ saved up for an emergency and I know that I've hit my limit as to how many I can save. So until further notice I find homes for the strays I find or the abuse cases that people bring to me.

*Pet peeve of mine: You don't 'share' animals, animals pick their people. Just because you own it on paper does not mean that that animal has any shred of loyalty to YOU. You're responsible for a life, and ensuring that it's a happy, healthy one. This isn't something to play a game about.


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## SueNH (Nov 7, 2011)

You have plenty.

When my daughter was little she wanted a team of oxen in the worst way. She even had a knack with them. But I knew in a few years she would discover boys. She already had a rocking little horse. Mom didn't need one more thing to take care of.
Thank goodness I never gave in. I'd still be feeding 2 old cows with no hamburger in their future.










She's all grown up now and rarely bothers with that wonderful old horse. Happens to just about every kid.


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## alexischristina (Jun 30, 2009)

I'm having a hard time imagining a family of many young children dividing the pets up in the way OP's family has, it doesn't seem fair to me when you have younger ones who aren't allowed to have pets. What happened to the "family dog"? What's going to happen if any of the animals get sick and none of the kids have the money to pay for it. Ebony, you've already said that your parents are your emergency fund and I'm willing to bet that they're also the emergency fund for your other siblings' pets. In the grand scheme of things you're just not being _fair_, which is hard to grasp at 13 but lets be real... 

You don't NEED to breed your mare.

You don't NEED to be looking at another horse to buy.

You don't NEED to have the horses you already do.

You don't NEED to have two cats.

You don't NEED another dog.

All of those things are privileges- and big ones! Every animal that has come to my house, save for the ones who have shown up at our door, have been the product of lengthy discussions between myself, my sister and my parents. Every other week my sister asks them if we can get another cat or another dog but my parents tell her _no_. You have far more than many, if not most, kids your age have and I think you need to take a big step back and appreciate it. 

When you're an adult, financially secure and living under your own roof _then_ you can have as many cats, dogs and horses as you want.


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

Okay, I won't get one for now. I really miss our other one, though. The two dogs we have: One is my brothers and the other is my moms. My moms only likes her. Everyone else he bites if you even pet him, so he is not much fun. The other one...my brother won't train and gets mad if you try to train her. So, she jumps all over people, if the horses start running, she will run after them, she is not trained at all yet if I try to tell her to get out of the pasture he flips at me. But, I guess I will wait for a dog. Really, though, it is the people that can afford and will take care of the pets can have them. My sister has had a pet and she would go WEEKS without even touching it. My brother has a goat right now but can't get something expensive.


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## Roman (Jun 13, 2014)

Ebonyisforme said:


> Okay, I won't get one for now. I really miss our other one, though. The two dogs we have: One is my brothers and the other is my moms. My moms only likes her. Everyone else he bites if you even pet him, so he is not much fun. The other one...my brother won't train and gets mad if you try to train her. So, she jumps all over people, if the horses start running, she will run after them, she is not trained at all yet if I try to tell her to get out of the pasture he flips at me. But, I guess I will wait for a dog. Really, though, it is the people that can afford and will take care of the pets can have them. My sister has had a pet and she would go WEEKS without even touching it. My brother has a goat right now but can't get something expensive.


I would train the dog anyways. Talk to your parents about how the dog is messing with the horses and can could injure both DOG and HORSE. Then start training it. Ignore your brother if he whines, obviously he won't do anything about it. Correct her every time she jumps on people.


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

I tell her to get out every time she goes in the pasture and she does it about half the time, but she literally yells at me and tells me not to do anything with his dog. He is older than me. His dog is about a year old so well past the time that they are easy to train. Ugh, he bugs me so bad. I love training dogs but he won't even train his even though she obviously needs it!


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## Roman (Jun 13, 2014)

Tell your parents. Tell her if she doesn't get trained it'll be dangerous for people and other animals. And one year isn't too late. Ours were two and did very well.


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

Told my dad and he got mad at him and told him he needed to keep his dog out of the pasture. Don't know that it did much, though. I'll keep on telling her to get out, because she chases my pony around the most and she's going to get kicked in the head. Wisper is already spooky without being chased.


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## sarahfromsc (Sep 22, 2013)

Are these posts real? Or the works of someone's imagination?

Dogs doled out to only the children who can afford them.

Rescuing kittens at one point.

Ponies with bad backs.

Wants to be a trainer, but won't train a horse is she doesn't click with it.

Makes over a 1,000 a month babysitting.

Gives lessons at 13.

Going to have some sort of summer camp with the mother, who won't let kids have pets unless they have a job, and who doesn't know horses.

Really?

Is this real?

It does make good drama, with a splash of comedy.


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## sarahfromsc (Sep 22, 2013)

And I forget breeding ponies she can't ride.

The comedy/drama continues.


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## CrossCountry (May 18, 2013)

Stick with what you have now. Animals are expensive, things happen that you don't expect. We have one dog and are cringing at the amount of money we spend on her health. I've been following a few other posts of yours, haven't posted because I'm not sure what to say. I agree with everyone else that you need to slow down and grow up. Deal with what you have, take lessons, work at barns and prepare yourself for this upcoming foal so that it doesn't end up at a auction. Better off dont breed your mare (or any mare) until you are grown and out of college. Prepare yourself and save yourself the heartache when you find out you can't make the goal your "trick pony". Focus on school, better your horsemanship - both groundwork and riding. Work with the animals you have now and be happy with what you have. If you want to be a trainer you need to learn how to deal with all types of horses, even if you don't "click"

I just bought a horse after we had a vet inspect it (that alone was a good hundred bucks, and he didn't even diagnose the lameness) and then today at the vet (a different one) we found out the horse is dead lame from arthritis at 14. Was I expecting this? No. Am I going to do everything in my power to make this horse useable again? Yes. Just today we spent over $400 on his care, not even including the chiropractic work, joint supplements and specialized care that is soon to come. 

Did I want to breed my mare? Yes. Did my parents tell me I could breed my mare? Yes. Did I breed my mare? No. I knew I was not in a position to train or handle a foal. You may think you know how to train a foal, but what happens when that foal becomes a 800 pound monster? No matter what, they will always be bigger than you and more powerful. Don't underestimate them just because they are shorter than you.

What if you don't click with the new foal? What happens if something goes wrong during labor and you lose the mare and foal or maybe even both? Have you prepared for the possible consequences of breeding? Do you have several thousand dollars on hand in case of an emergency? That's not even including the vet checks, supplemental feed, stud fee and so many other things that go into breeding. 

Take this as a lesson and stop thinking about what you can do next, improve your horsemanship with the horses you have now. Live life NOW, stop thinking about the future and wasting the present. If you can't deal with the horses you have now, and your family isn't EXTREMELY supportive of you and your animals; then you have absolutely no place to be breeding your mare or getting another dog. Please don't push all these comments aside because "you know better". We are all trying to help, it may seem harsh but we've been in the same mindset as you and it has bit us in the butt. We're just trying to save you the heartache.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Roman (Jun 13, 2014)

Ebonyisforme said:


> Told my dad and he got mad at him and told him he needed to keep his dog out of the pasture. Don't know that it did much, though. I'll keep on telling her to get out, because she chases my pony around the most and she's going to get kicked in the head. Wisper is already spooky without being chased.


Chase that dog out with a lunge whip! And tell your parents that if your brother or you doesn't start training the dog, that dog is going bye bye and NOT in the way you'd like.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 40232 (Jan 10, 2013)

Roman said:


> Chase that dog out with a lunge whip! And tell your parents that if your brother or you doesn't start training the dog, that dog is going bye bye and NOT in the way you'd like.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Or respect her parents and listen to what she is told. If I dared to tell any of my parents what you suggested, I would be slapped across the room almost as fast as my horses are sold.


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## PrivatePilot (Dec 7, 2009)

sarahfromsc said:


> Are these posts real? Or the works of someone's imagination?


Sadly, no. I've had lots of headshaker moments since reading one of her first threads where it was pretty clear from the onset that she was in over her head and needed assistance.

I'm all for trying to help people with their problems, but the trend here is to just create more and more problems whilst leaving a trainwreck of the previous ones smoldering in the background.

I hate to be blunt, but....wow, just wow.


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

That mare in the thread you linked to, PrivatePilot, was Belle. I have been working with her for the 2 years we have had her and now we ride her bareback, jump, catch her in seconds, etc etc etc. *I'm not getting the dog!* This is what I have been talking about...I took advice and ruled out getting a dog and people are still getting mad about other things. :/ Sarah, not $1000 from babysitting, haha. $1000 from day camps, riding lessons, pet sitting, AND babysitting. I think it is really rude for you to say what you said, btw. And, I guess what everyone posted about just wanting to make me a better owner etc etc goes out the window with what you just said. That was plain out rude. People told me to get a trainer with Belle, I didn't. I worked with her day after day, hour after hour, but now, she walks right up to you and knows that if she bites anyone she is not going to like it. She respects me. She respects my sister. She knows that I am the boss, no trainer. Just me. And that was 2 years ago. No, I am not a super awesome, super talented, horse whisperer, but I think that my determination makes up for it. Just in the last day, though, I ruled out getting the dog because people on here thought I shouldn't. I got a chiro out because people on here though I should. In one day, pretty sure that's not me blowing you off, but what was said on this thread AFTER I said no to the dog, is ridiculous!!! I said NO, because people on here wanted me to and yet I still get made fun of, hated, and ridiculed? So no matter what I do, people are just going to ridicule me? I'm sorry. If you met my cats and my horses, they would be just as well looked after as anyones. You wouldn't be able to tell them apart from any other member on here.


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## PrivatePilot (Dec 7, 2009)

I read your posts, but FWIW I refrain from responding to most of them.

I was glad to see you had a chiro out for your horse, and it's nice to hear that your problem mare has improved, but your post and new thread history shows that you still have your fair share of problems, projects, worries, and issues going on right now, not all of which are minor, and not all of which you are necessarily taking the advice being offered. 

It frustrates a lot of people here who are following your stories, because lots of them (like myself) see a trend towards rushing from one "situation" to another, all while wanting to toss more things into the mix that will only muddle things up even more.

Your parents are quite likely footing most of your bills right now and honestly you are blessed beyond the wildest immaginations of most kids your age...which you probably don't realize. 

At some point you need to step back and realize how good you've got it and focus on what you have, not what you want. And start taking peoples advice - there are people here who have forgot more than some people will ever know about horses - literally thousands of years of combined experience based on tried and true textbook methods and experience, but you don't want to accept it.

Attitude is everything, as is realizing when you need to check yours at the door.


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

I haven't taken some of the advice because it is things like selling Wisper. Or, not breeding her, which I have my heart set on. I know I am lucky. That is partially why I do riding lessons, so I can share what I didn't have for so long with people like me that love love love horses but couldn't have them. If I had been able to do what I am allowing them to do before I had horses, I would have been jumping up and down everyday I got to go.


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## PrivatePilot (Dec 7, 2009)

Ebonyisforme said:


> I haven't taken some of the advice because it is things like selling Wisper. Or, not breeding her, which I have my heart set on.


Having your heart set on something doesn't make it right. Or realistic. Or wise. I agree with everyone else that breeding your mare is just going to open another can of worms for you when you have plenty already. 

You're lucky you have parents who are apparently willing to indulge your whims and pleasures no matter how unwise, irrational, or expensive they appear to be, _but there will come a day when that will end_. It's the proverbial straw the breaks the camels back - A lot of parents would have cracked by now, said "enough!" and sold everything, but you haven't reached that point yet and are still piling straw on the camel. Do you want things to end catastrophically when your parents reach their breaking point, or is perhaps taking a step back and saying to yourself "I have things pretty darned good right now!" a better decision?

Again, step back. Take a deep breath. Accept that many people here speak from levels (and years) of experience you can't begin to understand, but with few exceptions people are giving you GOOD advice. 

Your unwillingness to accept it because of unrealistic expectations, uneducated actions, and rose-colored-glasses dreams remains frustrating.


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## gingerscout (Jan 18, 2012)

Ebonyisforme said:


> I haven't taken some of the advice because it is things like selling Wisper. Or, not breeding her, which I have my heart set on. I know I am lucky. That is partially why I do riding lessons, so I can share what I didn't have for so long with people like me that love love love horses but couldn't have them. If I had been able to do what I am allowing them to do before I had horses, I would have been jumping up and down everyday I got to go.


 yes people ARE going to fight you against breeding your horse, because you are the only one who thinks its a good idea, and since everyone is going to tell you what you don't want to hear, you are throwing a tantrum like a 4 year old, and playing the pity game, I'm sorry you are way more blessed then most ADULTS I know, you have enough on your plate, and wanting to breed your horse just to do it, for no other reason than having a baby is childish and dumb,sorry to be blunt, but it is. You clearly are just here to get people to either support dumb decisions, or fight with you.. either way..have fun and good luck


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Ebonyisforme said:


> I haven't taken some of the advice because it is things like selling Wisper. Or, not breeding her, which I have my heart set on. I know I am lucky. That is partially why I do riding lessons, so I can share what I didn't have for so long with people like me that love love love horses but couldn't have them. If I had been able to do what I am allowing them to do before I had horses, I would have been jumping up and down everyday I got to go.



you have asked for advice quite a few times, indeed, what seems like every time a new whim comes along. is there any advice that has been to your fancy?


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

It's not the stating what you think, it is how you do it. I don't mind that other people have other opinions about things, but when you say them the way people have been saying them on here....


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## Mulefeather (Feb 22, 2014)

Generally it is considered poor manners and bad form to tell someone outright that their advice is no good to you, or that you plan on doing something that flies in the face of what everyone is saying. It's a very quick and efficient way to upset people. 

This forum is a vast sea of knowledge and advice, and the best part about it is that it's all FREE. People have taken time out of their day and their lives to come on here and talk about their own experiences, and to offer knowledge and teachings that could be helpful to someone else. 

As horse people, our most important and treasured possession is our knowledge. No tool, bit, saddle, whip, or rope is more valuable than what's between our ears. 

When people give you advice, it is saying "Here is something I think is incredibly valuable to know. Maybe it will help you." They have NO OTHER REASON to help you than the fact that you asked a question. 

Telling them "Well that's not good enough because it's not what I want to hear" is akin to saying "This gift sucks." 

Imagine how bad you would feel if you went to a party with a present, maybe something you made just for that person. And when they open it, they look like you handed them a bag full of dog barf. You'd feel pretty horrible, wouldn't you? 

When given advice, even if it's something you plan on never doing, "Thank you, I'll consider it" is the best and politest response to give.


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## anndankev (Aug 9, 2010)

Ebonyisforme said:


> It's not the stating what you think, it is how you do it. I don't mind that other people have other opinions about things, but when you say them the way people have been saying them on here....



And visa-versa Ebony

It's not the stating what you think, it is how you do it. I don't mind that you have other opinions about things, but when you say them the way you have been saying them on here ...


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Ebonyisforme said:


> It's not the stating what you think, it is how you do it. I don't mind that other people have other opinions about things, but when you say them the way people have been saying them on here....


I absolutely agree with that. However I can understand why some peoples response is not stated as nicely as it should, becausefrom what I've seen of your threads, it seems that you are not really asking for advice, but rather just wanting to talk about things that you want to do. The people who offer up advice, some more nicely than others, feel like they are wasting their time because you don't seen interested in advice of any kind. Maybe you should just talk about what you are planning on doing without soliciting advice that you probably would not take into account anyway.


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## NBEventer (Sep 15, 2012)

Okay I swore I had quit this forum but I got asked to read the last couple threads you have made and im just ready to snap.

First off your heart is set on breeding this pony that is to small for you. Have you considered what you will do if she dies giving birth? This happens more then you think. Have you considered you may end up with an orphan foal? Or the foal and mare could die? Or the foal dies and mare ends up with severe complications resulting in thousands of dollars in vet bills?

Did you know complications in miniatures and ponies is higher risk then horses? Did you know the level of care and experience required for handling a foaling in a pony or minature is higher and almost always requires a vet because it is rare a birth goes problem free?

Did you not recently post a thread about your parents possibly losing the house because of your Dad having issues with work? Yet you still want to keep adding more and more to their plate?

Do you realize how selfish that is?


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## NBEventer (Sep 15, 2012)

One last thing. You swear you love this pony so much. Why are you willing to put her at such a high risk?

My older mare is my heart horse. She has amazing blood lines with a sire who broke world records in show jumping. She has a proven show record and has had a few foals already who are breath taking. I wanted nothing more then to have one last foal from her I could keep. I had her vetted and okayed. I bought the breeding to an amazing stallion. Then realized if anything happened to her I would never forgive myself. This mare has been my rock for years. Why risk it for one last foal that would be my keeper? At her age complications are a higher risk. It just wasn't worth it. I was being selfish thinking of my own wants and needs over my mares best interest. Yes a vet said she was sound and safe for breeding. But that doesn't mean something couldn't happen when she was giving birth.


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

K, so no one should breed their horses, then?


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## Roman (Jun 13, 2014)

Ebonyisforme said:


> K, so no one should breed their horses, then?


Only those who have the *experience*, *money*, *attitude*, & *place*. And those that know what horse to breed to who, based on conformation and temperament, and wouldn't hesitate to call a vet and also knows first aid and able to do something in case of an emergency while the vet is on his way.


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## NBEventer (Sep 15, 2012)

Ebonyisforme said:


> K, so no one should breed their horses, then?


I believe that backyard breeding and senseless breeding outside of purpose breeding programs needs to stop.

I also believe children shouldn't be allowed to breed because their pony is pretty and they feel entitled to have another one.

I also believe until you, yourself have a few thousand saved for emergency vet fees that can, and likely will arise, should not be breeding. 

You are young and inexperienced and rely on your parents to bail you out.

What happens if your parents lose their house? Seeing as that was a fear just a couple weeks ago, that is a valid concern. Also is your Dad not working 2 jobs to support your family? Adding more animals to the picture is not fair.

And you are talking about this camp. Do your parents have insurance on the property for you to run such a thing? It would be considered a day care type facility at that point. What happens if a kid gets hurt and parents sue?


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## NBEventer (Sep 15, 2012)

Your pony is a grade pony yes? Amd you are breeding to a grade stallion? So foal can't be registered. So another grade pony added to the population. Another one at risk for slaughter when you can't support him anymore.


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

Both are double registed, NBEventer. Both are proven. I pay for my horses. Parents only ever pay if I somehow don't have the cash right then. I have been saving for half a month and already have $110


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## NBEventer (Sep 15, 2012)

And you completely overlooked the part where only experienced breeders should be breeding. 

What about if your parents lose their house like the fear was very recently? What will you do then?

And $110 is not even close to the vet fees you are going to need. I wouldn't even consider a breeding until I had $10, 000 in my pocket for emergency vet fees.

You are far to young and far to inexperienced to be breeding.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

before I came here, to horse forum, I never thought that breeding a pet /horse was such a big deal. mind you, I did not own a hrose, but still, I never even considered the total picture. I had no one who had done it before, no one who'd seen it go wrong, and no one who was familiar with the extent of the overpopulation of horses to steer me to a better informed position.

although I have to agree that having a baby foal at home would simply be a fantasy come true, I realize that fantasy's have consequences. If you are not fully prepared for that, not only do you suffer, but the animals in your care do, too.

anyway, this thread is about you wanting folks to help you convince your parents to let you get a dog. 

why are they opposed to one?


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## Roman (Jun 13, 2014)

tinyliny said:


> why are they opposed to one?


Perhaps the OP could go reread my original post on the first page. :wink:


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## PrivatePilot (Dec 7, 2009)

Although it's off on another tangent, I would agree with an earlier response suggesting that running a camp or even giving lessons is an absolutely dreadful idea unless you have proper insurance, and I don't believe I remember you posting anywhere that you had achieved any sort of coaching certification that gives you any qualifications to be coaching /giving lessons to begin with? My insight tells me that this is basically a beginner giving lessons to beginners. 

All it takes is one kid with litigious parents to fall off and get hurt and decide to sue you (or rather...your parents, since you're a minor) and the entire glass house you have built around yourself is going to come shattering down immediately. Once the lawyers found out that you were a minor, without any Coaching/lesson experience nor credentials, and without insurance on top of it all...things are going to get really nasty really quick and you and your parents could lose *everything*...yes, including your horses. 

That's more well-meaning and totally factual advice that you can ignore now, it's okay.


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## Jessabel (Mar 19, 2009)

You have to keep in mind that until you're 18, you can't legally own anything. All the animals on your property are ultimately your parents' responsibility because they are the owners. There's no "my dog, my brother's dog" nonsense. 

They're already having some financial worries, and the last thing they need is another critter to take care of. It's not wise of you to spend all your money on animals, either. Sooner or later you're going to have car payments, cell phone bills, and eventually rent. Maybe college. What are you going to do with a bajillion animals when it's time for you to move out? 

When you're on your own with a stable income, you can have all the animals you want. For now, you need to go easy on your parents because it sounds like they're having a hard time right now.


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## texasgal (Jul 25, 2008)

I usually don't respond to OP's threads and here is why:

I think she is a typical 13-year-old girl, and instead of going to school and chatting/dreaming/venting with other 13-year-old girls about her animals, her parents, her period, etc; she is coming onto the board to socialize.

She has started 98 threads, over 50 of them since the first of the year.

I think she is young and doesn't have anyone to talk to about all the things that are running around in her mind... so this is her outlet.

She's not in control of her circumstances (hopefully) at age 13, and has a 13-year-old point of view.

I remember being 13 ... don't care to go back.

So to make this reply on topic: OP, we are not the people you need to be asking about the dog. If your parents are opposed, respect their wishes. Be thankful and enjoy what you have.

Breathe.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

please don't use her own thread for pocket psychoanalysis.


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## Shoebox (Apr 18, 2012)

I don't have much to say except $110 is pocket change when it comes to breeding horses. The farm call fee for one single vet visit can sometimes be that much. You have another thing coming if you are thinking a few hundred is all you'll need for that. I am glad you decided against getting the dog, one less thing to throw into the fray.

Keep saving, at that rate in 5 years you might have enough to start considering breeding. And maybe, in 5 years, you'll have realized exactly why it's not a recommended idea and then you have a lot of money to spend on other things.


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

I know $110 is not near enough. I will be saving until July and then keep saving the entire pregnancy.


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## NBEventer (Sep 15, 2012)

Ebonyisforme said:


> I know $110 is not near enough. I will be saving until July and then keep saving the entire pregnancy.


And what if something comes up during the pregnancy? Soooooooo many complications come up during pregnancy.

You are nowhere near ready to be breeding. You are far to inexperienced for breeding. And at this point you are just another random back yard breeder.

Seriously what happens if the mare dies? What happens if she gets injured during the breeding? I've known mares to be kicked during breeding and break a leg. I know of two mares who were killed in the breeding process.


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## Roman (Jun 13, 2014)

I agree with NBEventer. Your parents have a lot on their plate. Supporting several kids, bills, animals. And your dad works two jobs! Whatever happened to your brother that had MS? I think their money should go to a more important cause than silly animals when you have A LOT already. Not to mention the brother who's neck was hurting to the point he screamed and I doubt he got medical attention.

I am a saver. I hardly get anything unless I need it. I'm not an animal or tack collector. I'm content with the animals I have. Would I look 20 horses? Lol, sure!! But I'd be dead broke with no future if I did. I'm thinking ahead. Saving for college, car, and other expenses.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Ebonyisforme (Oct 23, 2013)

That brother is fine. Was exaggerating a kink. Brother with MS is being paid for. I don't know how many times I have said this, but I PAY FOR THE HORSES!!!


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## NBEventer (Sep 15, 2012)

So you have $110 now. What happens when you get a $1500 emergency vet bill?


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## CrossCountry (May 18, 2013)

Sorry but I have a paying job and there is NO way I could pay for our horses without my parents help. I don't believe you do for a second, especially if you've only made $110 in a month and a half.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## anndankev (Aug 9, 2010)

unsubscribing


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## 40232 (Jan 10, 2013)

One day you will wise up and look back at what you are saying, and thinking for that matter, and shake your head.

"I pay for my horses"

Pay for your sore horse to get fixed, the horse that means so much to you, not add another unneeded, backyard pony into this world. 

A single word, that will probably mean absolutely nothing to you:
_priorities._


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

All that could be said has been. time to put this thread away.


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