# Suppose...



## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

Suppose you leased a horse for X amount of money. 
Suppose you paid X amount of money on the horse, while in your care.
Suppose that horse dies, while in your care. 

Would you feel the owner of the horse owed YOU anything for the amount you put in? 

Just curious what your thoughts are on this.


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## dressagebelle (May 13, 2009)

Depends on the what the entire lease agreement was. Honestly I don't think that the owner would owe you anything unless any part of the contract you signed was violated, or you spent more on the horse than was agreed upon because they wouldn't pay, and there was no choice to not pay, for something like say a vet fee that the owner was supposed to pay for, but didn't for one reason or another so you had to shell out that money yourself. But depending on when the horse died, if you just paid for the next month of leasing, they should refund you that money, as you no longer have a horse to lease. If you don't mind my asking, was this something that actually happened, and what is the entire story if you are willing to share?


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## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

The "you" in this situation is not me.


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## kelliannejoseph (Sep 26, 2009)

If you paid to lease the horse for 6 months, and the horse died in month 3 then the owner should give you back 3 months worth of. But since it is a lease that means that you are usaully locked in for that amount of time no matter what happens. But no the own has the option of not returning the money if you are in a lease. Think of it like leasing a house. Its the same idea. If I was the owner i would give back to money that you paid for in advance but I would not return all of it, as the horse did die in your care. You must also remember that the owner in now out of a horse. You should be lucky that the owner is not coming after you for the value of the horse.


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## shortbusgeek (Oct 23, 2009)

Two words: equine insurance

Both you and the person you were leasing the horse from should have insurance. The details should also be spelled out in the lease agreement as to what happens in this scenario. It's not a pleasant scenario to think about while deciding to lease a horse, but there's always the slight possibility that these things can happen, and need to be in any form of lease agreement you have. Have you already leased this horse, or was it leased by a friend? Or were you just saying hypothetically?


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

It depends on what the contract says.

And anyone who leases out their horse (that has any monetary value that they would be that upset about) and does not require the person leasing the horse to carry Equine Mortality insurance with the owner as beneficiary is not too bright.

If there is no contract and it was a simple lease then I can not see the person leasing owing the horse owner anything.


OK, now I re-read the OP and you are asking if the horse owner owes the person leasing anything? The person leasing paid the lease ahead? Or the person leasing wants to be paid back for something else?


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Was the entire amount for the lease paid up front? If so, there should have been a clause in the agreement, signed by both parties, as to what should happen if the horse should pass away.
If not, if you were paying month-by-month, then no, I don't think the owner owes the lessee anything. The lessee has paid for the time she has leased the horse, and no more.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

LadyDreamer said:


> Suppose you leased a horse for X amount of money.
> Suppose you paid X amount of money on the horse, while in your care.
> Suppose that horse dies, while in your care.
> 
> ...



NO the owner of the horse owes you nothing and depending on the reason the horse dies it might be that you owe them money for the cost of replacing the horse. When I lease out a horse there is an understanding that the value of the horse is X amount and if for any reason the horse should die while in the lessors care they must pay X amount for the horse. I always recommend insurance on any horse leased.

What they put into the horse while leasing the horse is what is agreed to and spelled out in the lease agreement. If the lessor did not like that agreement then they should have not agreed to it.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

nrhareiner said:


> NO the owner of the horse owes you nothing and depending on the reason the horse dies it might be that you owe them money for the cost of replacing the horse. When I lease out a horse there is an understanding that the value of the horse is X amount and if for any reason the horse should die while in the lessors care they must pay X amount for the horse. I always recommend insurance on any horse leased.
> 
> What they put into the horse while leasing the horse is what is agreed to and spelled out in the lease agreement. If the lessor did not like that agreement then they should have not agreed to it.


Agreed.


Not to hijack this thread, but I am looking to free lease (partial lease) Denny out -- gosh I'm so scared of things ending badly.


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## BaliDoll (Sep 21, 2009)

No, there is no way that the leasee should get anything unless they paid all months up front, like others have said. If they paid for a year and the horse died after 8 months, then yes, you'd owe them the 4 months they didn't have the horse to use. It should all be in the lease agreement, if it was drawn up fairly professionally...


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

BaliDoll said:


> No, there is no way that the leasee should get anything unless they paid all months up front, like others have said. If they paid for a year and the horse died after 8 months, then yes, you'd owe them the 4 months they didn't have the horse to use. It should all be in the lease agreement, if it was drawn up fairly professionally...


Yes they would not be charged for those 4 months but that will go towards the cost of the horse if it was not insured. If you lease a horse and something happens to it you are responsible to pay for that horse. Unless there is something in the agreement that changes that.


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## BaliDoll (Sep 21, 2009)

^ If you're leasing to own maybe...? What if you are just leasing to ride/show it? When I leased a horse this past year my eventual goal wasn't to buy him so in our contract we just said I would get any money I had paid ahead (which i only did month to month) back if he was out of use for months or what have you, UNLESS he was injured/died while i was with him and/or it was due to a direct result of something I did.

I will say though, the people who I leased from weren't horse folks, they were total newbies who leased him to me because they had their hands full with an intermediate horse... so maybe they didn't do the "usual" thing, but I would set up my lease that way if I were to lease my horse out. It's fair.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

If you are leasing a horse to show there is a reason. Normally it is b/c it is well trained and would cost more then what you could afford to buy. So if something happens to the horse while you are leasing it the cost of replacing that horse would fall to you. This is what insurance is for if you can not afford to cover the value of the horse. If you had bought the horse out right you would still be out the money. Just like you would be responsible for farrier feed care vet and so on while you are leasing the horse.

Now there are some that will not set a lease up like this but this is the norm for show horses. If you lease it you are responsible if something happens to that horse. Basically you brake it you buy it type of thing.


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## BaliDoll (Sep 21, 2009)

makes sense I guess... I have never leased a show horse, only a trail horse. Depends on the lease and quality of horse then, I see.


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