# What level of Rider Am I? Beginner, Novice, Intermediate, Advanced??



## free_sprtd

hmmm well, sounds like you know quite a bit. A good advanced horse owner I think also has time on their side, however that is not always true. I would say you are between a novice and intermediate. Again, I think advanced comes with more experience with different problems and knowing every aspect of horses including the market, showing, training, ect.


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## Jillyann

Personally, i don't think its so much as to _what you know_, but how well you actually can _do_ it.:lol:


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## ILoveGeorgieMyPony

Hmm, well just as Jillyann said, it is as how well you do it, i am also 13 and have been riding for 4 years,and have had 2 horses already, and I am nowhere near experienced, you can never know everything about horses. i would say probably novice-intermediate


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## horseluver50

Well.. I dont really know how I am supposed to describe how well I can do everything  lol... but I could try....

here goes.. lol..::
Walk:
- side pass--- bending to inside, legs on, I am working on keeping her straight,, she likes to swerve off
- collected--- I can do this easily the right way 
- extended--- I can do this easily 
- bending--- have been practicing for approx. 3-4 months now... getting pretty good at it
- serpentines--- have done this for a VERY long time, can do it right 
- figure 8's--- about 1.5 yrs practicing.. on and off.. pretty good.
- 5m, 10m, 15m, 20m circles-- easy as pie 

Trot:
- collected--- correctly
- extended--- sometimes needs an extra push to get her going on extended, but works well across long stretch of arena
- bending--- bends to the inside, for some reason i am alot better bending at the trot than at the walk 
- 2-point--- learnt about a year ago.. havent been doing it much.. sometimes need extra pointers
- figure 8's--- pretty well
- serpentines--- mhmmm
- side pass--- so so. lol... 
- 10m, 15m, 20m circles-- YEAP!
- rising trot-- yes, been doing this since first started riding.. i can pick it up on the right diagonal as well ;}

Canter:
- collected--- working on it
- extended--- easily.... seeing as she is a reining horse, pretty simple to get her going in the canter
- bending--- working on it
- 2-point--- pretty well
- figure 8's---- havent done much....
- 15m, 20m circles--- mhmmm
- knows right lead-- yeah, she is horrible at picking up her right lead though! HORRIBLE!! lol.. thats what makes it tough and challenging.. but by the end of the day, we are perfecting it

Jumping:
- cross rails (two point) cantering--- few times
- ground rails (two point) cantering--- tons
- 2 ft. (two point) cantering--- once or twice

Western:
-spins on forehand, honches--- every lesson pretty much


Other:
- halt-- yeah
- half-halts--- mhmm
- back up (turn, line up between poles)---- few times we did it in lessons
- learning to open gates-- 3-4 times...  yay me!
- tack up with no help, I help my friend alot -- for like 4 yrs .. lol
- Knows horse care (have owned one before, and from trainer)--- yep!!!



OHH!! Also, I am learning flying lead changes.... I perfected it on last weeks lesson  I was soo proud of myself and autumn!

So.. ya.. is that enough info.. ask any questions if needed  I dont bite


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## IheartPheobe

I'm not sure. 
I'd say higher level intermediate. You know a lot, and you seem to have a while of experience... 
I'd say if you were in a show or whatever, you wouldn't be in a very high class for jumping, since you don't jump very high. If you were doing flat, you'd be towards the top but not quite there. But of course, jump height doesn't increase the quality of a rider, so I wouldn't worry, and it sounds like you are quickly on your way to learning enough to be semi-advanced!


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## horseluver50

Oh thanks 
I don't really plan on showing in the next few years... maybe once I'm older..
I haven't really done much on jumping, but flat work is getting pretty boring..

Once, I get my own horse, I will start taking western lessons with another trainer  Im getting kinda bored of english flatwork


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## smrobs

I am with Jillyann, only part of it is actually what you know. I have ridden western/ranch my whole life. I have no experience (except for just fooling around) with showing at all, english, jumping, etc. Yet, I still consider myself an advanced/expert rider because I have ridden for more than 20 years, I have ridden _many_ different types/temperments of horse, and I have successfully trained several by myself with no help at all. I have known lots of people who really did know alot about horse care, riding, and management; but they could not actually do it to save thier lives. I have also met people that would be considered complete novices but had so much natural sense and ability that they were actually very good at performing what little they did know about riding and everything else. 

Just going by what you have said, I would consider you an novice/intermediate rider (maybe better or worse depending on how well you can execute those manuvers).


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## wild_spot

I'm gonna agree with Novice-Intermediate. No matter how much you learn from a riding school, on lesson horses, it's a totally different ball game when you venture into ownership or leasing. Just my opinion though.

I got lessons from 5, worked at a riding school from 8-10, and handled and rode at least 20 different school horses. But when I got my own horse? I was novice as all get out!


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## Joshie

Well, I'd say you're a beginner. You describe a lot of things. But...it's hard to tell, from your words, if you're riding the horse or if you're sitting on a horse going through his paces.

Do you ride anywhere but the arena? Can you train your horse? Have you ever installed buttons on a horse? I think that from the very beginning one should know how to train a horse on the ground as it helps with saddle training later.

Can you ride a horse down a hill? Up a hill? Have you stepped off a 3' drop off? Gone over water? Can you handle yourself on a non-lesson horse? The point I'm getting at is that, in my opinion, is that you have to be able to problem solve in order to advance past the beginner stage.


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## horseluver50

> Well, I'd say you're a beginner. You describe a lot of things. But...it's hard to tell, from your words, if you're riding the horse or if you're sitting on a horse going through his paces.
> 
> Do you ride anywhere but the arena? Can you train your horse? Have you ever installed buttons on a horse? I think that from the very beginning one should know how to train a horse on the ground as it helps with saddle training later.
> 
> Can you ride a horse down a hill? Up a hill? Have you stepped off a 3' drop off? Gone over water? Can you handle yourself on a non-lesson horse? The point I'm getting at is that, in my opinion, is that you have to be able to problem solve in order to advance past the beginner stage.


I use hand, leg aids. NOT just sitting on the horse... how could I get it to do all the things I do, if i just sit there??
I ride on trails too sometimes.. but where I ride, they dont let me go much elsewhere.. only the arena when Im by myself. I don't own a horse. I can ride down and up REALLy steep hills. I have rode non lesson horses. I am definetly more than a beginner! lol


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## Joshie

horseluver50 said:


> I use hand, leg aids. NOT just sitting on the horse... how could I get it to do all the things I do, if i just sit there??
> I ride on trails too sometimes.. but where I ride, they dont let me go much elsewhere.. only the arena when Im by myself. I don't own a horse. I can ride down and up REALLy steep hills. I have rode non lesson horses. I am definetly more than a beginner! lol


From the very first ride with a saddle and bridle, my then ten year old used hand and leg aids. Of course, she rode for months before she was allowed to use either of those things. To me, you need to know how to do some training before you're out of the beginner stage. Problem solving is a huge thing, an important step in becoming a mature horsewoman.

Really, though, we'd need video to properly assess your riding ability.


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## wild_spot

These are opinions, what you asked for. I would stick with Joshie on this one, especially considering you rarely get out of the arena. I would say Beginner/Novice after learning that.

I suggest having a talk to Brookelovesparelli on this forum. She is now 14, and was much the same as you. Took lessons for 8 years, and did as much as they could teach her at the riding school. She recently started riding one of my horses, and now leases a pony who is kept with my horses. She can vouch for the absolute difference in sitting on school horses and riding/handling a non-school horse. I would say that she is currently an intermediate rider, but that has only come about since she began riding outside of a riding school. She can vouch as well that she has learn way more since leaving the riding school than she ever did while there.

Not trying to be mean, but I know SO many kids who are fresh out of riding schools who overestimate their abilities and end up with horses that are way to much for them. They either get hurt, stop riding, or downgrade to a suitable horse until they have the skills they THOUGHT they had. 

Of course it's hard to judge without seeing you ride, but this is my opinion based on what you have written here.


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## Spyder

wild_spot said:


> Of course it's hard to judge without seeing you ride, but this is my opinion based on what you have written here.


 
Perhaps a video can be supplied so we can properly assess the ability of the OP?????????????


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## horseluver50

I will get a video next time I go riding


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## -xx-sally-xx-

I agree with Joshie.. You say it as though you know what you're talking about, but whether you could get on a horse you're not used to thats had minimal training and still be able to get it to collect and jump etc. and you also need to have experience out of lessons. You could be executing these moves perfectly, but the horse may just pick up on what you want him/her to do and just do it himself (because tahts what he's taught to do). I've been riding for 7 years, shown, eventing, dressage days, showjumping days, pony club, endurance, trail, polocrosse, campdrafting,, vaulting.. pretty much if its to try,,I've tried it.. I've had 5 horses (still with my 3rd 4th and 5th) and Im training a 4 year old with NO training whatsoever (as in, didnt know canter aid when i got him) and now im able to get him to collect, lengthen his trot stride, jump a metre high fence, jump ditches and cross country jumps etc. without a blink with an hour of help a week (keeping in mind i've had him for 2 weeks and missed a lesson, but rode a lesson before i got him) but i only consider myself intermediate. So really its up to what YOU think you are. People just starting out may think you're fabulous and expert of everything, yet others that have been in the game a bit longer may think you're only a beginner, as well as those in different disciplines may think you're very experienced or a beginner. It really just depends on what you're capable of doing outside of lesson times.


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## -xx-sally-xx-

a video would help greatly, even if its only for your benefit.. watching a video of yourslef riding is great!! it can work two ways, as either a confidence booster or a pointer to what you might be doing wrong.. its also great for funny moments =)


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## horseluver50

I can't get out of the arena, cause I dont own a horse. So, I take lessons, and have free rides by myself.. but not much out of the arena.. down the road... a bit in the field chasing cows  (Fun stuff)


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## Tazmanian Devil

horseluver50 said:


> So, I would like to know which level of rider I am... here are some details..
> 
> I am 13 years old.
> I have been riding for approx.5 years now. The last 2 years have been alot more serious.
> I have never been to shows before.
> I ride english pleasure mostly... bit of western here and there.. bit of jumping
> I take lessons every week.
> 
> Here is what I know how to do::
> 
> <list deleted to save space>
> 
> So, what level rider do you think I am?
> 
> I have also rode horses that are not suitable for beginners.
> 
> Beginner? Novice? Intermediate? Advanced? What do you think??
> 
> Thanks in advance for anyone who replies


Don't get bogged down in silly labels like beginner/intermediate/advanced. Think about what you want to do. If you can do it and are happy with how you do it - you are where you want to be. If you want to do more or be better at what you know, seek competent instruction.

Five years of riding... there are some people that ride for 20 years and there are some people that ride for one year twenty times.

The list you give... I know horses I can put a relative beginner on and they will be able to do just about everything you list. Other horses, I can put an advanced rider on and they will look like a beginner trying to get most of that out of the horse. A really good horse can make a bad rider look good and vis a versa.

Best way to find out where you are and where you want to be is by expanding your horizons. Ride with different people. Compete in different events - not only at your barn but at places with different people of different ability levels. That will show you new things and expose you to independent judging.

After that, you will have a better handle on where you "are" and also show you what you have to learn. You may decide where you "are" is just fine for you. You may also decide that you have a lot to learn and provide you a goal to reach for.

When you have a really good idea of where you are and where you want to be you will end up realizing that labels like "beginner" and "advanced" are very relative and really don't matter.


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## Spyder

I believe the reason that people here have a problem with what you contend is because of what you say you know and what just does not jive.

This is your post with my comments in red.

here goes.. lol..::
Walk:
- side pass--- bending to inside, legs on, I am working on keeping her straight,, she likes to swerve off
If he/she is swerving off HOW can you claim you are able to bend her like you have done below.
- collected--- I can do this easily the right way 
NO ONE should be working on collection at the walk unless they have everything and I mean everything in place, not just almost there. An good rider/trainer KNOWS this.
- extended--- I can do this easily 
Good for you but only a horse that can bend and be supple can do proper extensions.
- bending--- have been practicing for approx. 3-4 months now... getting pretty good at it
If you are having problems just HOW are you able to do proper serpentines...not possible.
- serpentines--- have done this for a VERY long time, can do it right 
They have to be done without bends then for you would not be saying getting pretty good at them but would be saying that they are perfect.
- figure 8's--- about 1.5 yrs practicing.. on and off.. pretty good.
- 5m, 10m, 15m, 20m circles-- easy as pie 
A good trainer would NEVER be doing 5m circles, certainly not at walk.
Trot:
- collected--- correctly
- extended--- sometimes needs an extra push to get her going on extended, but works well across long stretch of arena
This does not jive as extensions should have been established anywhere and no EXTRA push is needed if trained correctly
- bending--- bends to the inside, for some reason i am alot better bending at the trot than at the walk 
- 2-point--- learnt about a year ago.. havent been doing it much.. sometimes need extra pointers
- figure 8's--- pretty well
If you have trouble with the right lead how is this possible.
- serpentines--- mhmmm
- side pass--- so so. lol... 
If you have all the bending down pat this should not be on a so so level.
- 10m, 15m, 20m circles-- YEAP!
- rising trot-- yes, been doing this since first started riding.. i can pick it up on the right diagonal as well ;}
What I said at walk applies here also and I would hope you can rise at the correct diagonal. What I find missing that really tells me about what level you are at is you have said NOTHING about sitting trot.

Canter:
- collected--- working on it
- extended--- easily.... seeing as she is a reining horse, pretty simple to get her going in the canter
You may get her going at a canter but speed does NOT = extended.
- bending--- working on it
BIG problem here for you SHOULD be able to do this if all that you say you can do, you can.
- 2-point--- pretty well
- figure 8's---- havent done much....
- 15m, 20m circles--- mhmmm
- knows right lead-- yeah, she is horrible at picking up her right lead though! HORRIBLE!! lol.. thats what makes it tough and challenging.. but by the end of the day, we are perfecting it
By this point you should be picking up both leads easily and even should have the flying change established already..again if all that you say you can do, you can.

Jumping:
- cross rails (two point) cantering--- few times
- ground rails (two point) cantering--- tons
- 2 ft. (two point) cantering--- once or twice
To go beyond beginner you would be jumping 3'easily.
Western:
-spins on forehand, honches--- every lesson pretty much


Other:
- halt-- yeah
- half-halts--- mhmm
- back up (turn, line up between poles)---- few times we did it in lessons
- learning to open gates-- 3-4 times...  yay me!
- tack up with no help, I help my friend alot -- for like 4 yrs .. lol
- Knows horse care (have owned one before, and from trainer)--- yep!!!

So.. ya.. is that enough info.. ask any questions if needed  I dont bite


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## Solon

I think the level of riding applies to being able to ride other horses rather than just one too. Each horse is different and brings a whole new game and being able to ride and handle different horses can speak to your experience.

Spyder had really great input, review and work on those things as they will help you become a better rider.


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## Equuestriaan

Ooh Spyder, very good analysis there!
I'd say it's very hard to judge without pictures or video, but I am highly interested in seeing some. =)


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## horseluver50

Thanks for replying with all this info and taking your time... but alot of your analysis is incorrect... I will write mine in blue..
Walk:
- side pass--- bending to inside, legs on, I am working on keeping her straight,, she likes to swerve off
If he/she is swerving off HOW can you claim you are able to bend her like you have done below.
So sorry, I totally mixed side pass up with leg yeild... I forgot what it was called...
- collected--- I can do this easily the right way 
NO ONE should be working on collection at the walk unless they have everything and I mean everything in place, not just almost there. An good rider/trainer KNOWS this.
Well, we work on collection...
- extended--- I can do this easily 
Good for you but only a horse that can bend and be supple can do proper extensions.
The horse I ride can do it, and I know how to ask for it..
- bending--- have been practicing for approx. 3-4 months now... getting pretty good at it
If you are having problems just HOW are you able to do proper serpentines...not possible.
What problems??? Where did I state I have proplems?? I can do bending...
- serpentines--- have done this for a VERY long time, can do it right 
They have to be done without bends then for you would not be saying getting pretty good at them but would be saying that they are perfect.
??? doesn't make sense to me....

- figure 8's--- about 1.5 yrs practicing.. on and off.. pretty good.
- 5m, 10m, 15m, 20m circles-- easy as pie 
A good trainer would NEVER be doing 5m circles, certainly not at walk.
Why not?? Why especially at the walk?? Why, itd be better to gallop them on a 5m!?
Trot:
- collected--- correctly
- extended--- sometimes needs an extra push to get her going on extended, but works well across long stretch of arena
This does not jive as extensions should have been established anywhere and no EXTRA push is needed if trained correctly
how is it my fault if the horse isnt trained correctly??
- bending--- bends to the inside, for some reason i am alot better bending at the trot than at the walk 
- 2-point--- learnt about a year ago.. havent been doing it much.. sometimes need extra pointers
- figure 8's--- pretty well
If you have trouble with the right lead how is this possible.
I don't have a clue what ur getting at... It's trotting!!! You don't have leads in the trot!
- serpentines--- mhmmm
- side pass--- so so. lol... 
If you have all the bending down pat this should not be on a so so level.
mixed with leg yield again..
- 10m, 15m, 20m circles-- YEAP!
- rising trot-- yes, been doing this since first started riding.. i can pick it up on the right diagonal as well ;}
What I said at walk applies here also and I would hope you can rise at the correct diagonal. What I find missing that really tells me about what level you are at is you have said NOTHING about sitting trot.
I can do sitting trot as well.. I prefer that  but, my trainer makes me do rising 

Canter:
- collected--- working on it
- extended--- easily.... seeing as she is a reining horse, pretty simple to get her going in the canter
You may get her going at a canter but speed does NOT = extended.
I know that, but it is alot easier... much easier than some lazy horse that doesnt even wanna canter..
- bending--- working on it
BIG problem here for you SHOULD be able to do this if all that you say you can do, you can.
??? Where did I say thats all i can do?? And, whats wrong with learning?? 
- 2-point--- pretty well
- figure 8's---- havent done much....
- 15m, 20m circles--- mhmmm
- knows right lead-- yeah, she is horrible at picking up her right lead though! HORRIBLE!! lol.. thats what makes it tough and challenging.. but by the end of the day, we are perfecting it
By this point you should be picking up both leads easily and even should have the flying change established already..again if all that you say you can do, you can.
Why should I be?? It's the horse, she is sooo hard to get the right lead on! Even my trainer has troubles getting her on the right lead... We just started flying changes.. wow.. a way to make someone feel bad.

Jumping:
- cross rails (two point) cantering--- few times
- ground rails (two point) cantering--- tons
- 2 ft. (two point) cantering--- once or twice
To go beyond beginner you would be jumping 3'easily.
Why should I be??? I'm not in hunter jumpers! I am in english pleasure/dressage... I was just stating what I have done. Also, it isn't how high you jump. It's about how well you can do it... so are you saying that western riders should know how to jump over 3'??


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## Spyder

The only thing I made a mistake on was the figure 8 which i had thought you had put in the canter part.

All the rest I stand behind and there is a sequence of learning that certain things are done first to built up to what comes next. Much like a house of cards.

Here is my analysis

Beginner beginner--has laid two or three cards down but not sure where to place them

Beginner medium--has figured out the first errors in card placement and has been able to add more cards to the point it is looking like something but any wind will disturb the whole set up.

Beginner advanced--has laid all the cards down but is in serious danger if a strong wind came up.

Intermediate beginner-- has started to built the walls but a strong wind will put it in danger but a breeze will have no effect

Intermediate medium--has almost all the walls up and can fix the odd error from the first set and breezes are nothing at all

Intermediate advanced--has all the walls up and capable of forming spaces within the structure based on knowledge attained

Advanced--beginner--started to complete the roof and has the knowlegde to see structure problems and fix most of them

Advanced medium--finishes the roof and able to add the more delicate structures like curtains and wiring and other internal structures

Advanced advanced--can look at the whole structure and imediately know where the problem is and fully capable of fixing anf only and outright F 5 storm that comes frome left field can topple this structure.

I would put the OP between _Beginner medium_ and _Beginner advanced_.


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## ilovemyPhillip

Higher level intermediate.


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## Solon

No way on the higher level intermediate.


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## 1dog3cats17rodents

I say there is NO way to tell without a video or at least pictures. I mean, I could have never ridden a horse before and just go google "leg yield, side pass, etc." and get great descriptions (not saying you did this). And I have a hard time believing you actually know what collection is if you believe it is easy. Collection is something people work year to acheive. It is not going slow, it is properly balancing the hore and getting the weight on to the hind end, well, honestly I've been riding for 8 years and I cannot explain it. It is never easy.


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## Solon

Some people confuse collection with head set too, that might be it.


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## wild_spot

Ok, nearly wrote something sarcastic that would probably sound mean, so, sorry for what I almost wrote :]

Will just watch this thread for a while.

Spyder, good posts.


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## Equuestriaan

Spyder should analyze my level. -nod-


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## Joshie

horseluver50 said:


> I can't get out of the arena, cause I dont own a horse. So, I take lessons, and have free rides by myself.. but not much out of the arena.. down the road... a bit in the field chasing cows  (Fun stuff)


In my opinion, much of the time arena-only riding has more to do with sitting on a horse than riding. Have you considered taking lessons elsewhere? Have you considered going to a small, private facility? I ride one of my instructor's horses....and I rarely do it in an arena. 

If you look at Spyder's list she's describing each level by the rider's ability to problem solve. It's very difficult to learn to face problems when you do not experience problems. How do you confront a problem that doesn't happen in an arena?


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## horseluver50

Well, I am taking english pleasure lessons, and no... we can't go out of the arena, cause they've got nowhere else... I have considered taking lessons at a western place and learning western... Once I get my own horse, I am boarding it right close... so I can learn western  Also, I will mainly be riding trails...
The only reason I am wondering what level rider I am.. is cause when I talk to owners of horses for sale, they ask what level I am... I normally say low intermediate... but I dunno whats right...

I am confident at riding, and am not afraid of horses whatsoever. Once, about 2-3 yrs ago, I was riding one of the higher sprung horses... as I was riding her.. she layed down.. I was like "Oh crap!", I pulled my feet out of the stirrups and hopped onto the ground just as she started rolling.. close call 

So ya. I will have to get videos sometime


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## -xx-sally-xx-

How come you've said that you dont own a horse but futher up you said "i ahve owned one before"...? Not meaning to be critical but im just confused...


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## Equuestriaan

horseluver50 said:


> as I was riding her.. she layed down.. I was like "Oh crap!", I pulled my feet out of the stirrups and hopped onto the ground just as she started rolling.. close call


That happened to me once! Second time I rode this horse and he just eased on down  I didn't realize what he was doing until he was on his knees, butt in the air, waiting for me to jump off before he rolled!


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## horseluver50

-xx-sally-xx-- I have owned a horse before... I got her when I was about 9 1/2, but we sold her early last year...


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## -xx-sally-xx-

Good analysis spyder, and horseluver50, you asked for our opinions and we gave them. You cant get angry at someone for just speaking their mind. I belive most of what spyder said is true, most of it is based on what you've already said you CAN do, but then the "step 1" before it, you say you're having trouble with. Rather than get a bunch of online riders from around the world to assess your risding capabilities, why dont you ask a few riding members at your barn or a couple of instructors to asses your ability and take an average of all the answers? Because they're the ones that know what the horse is capable of, and which parts the horse is a bit rusty on.. they also have the chance to watch you ride which is vital in an assessment like this. =)


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## horseluver50

> Good analysis spyder, and horseluver50, you asked for our opinions and we gave them. You cant get angry at someone for just speaking their mind. I belive most of what spyder said is true, most of it is based on what you've already said you CAN do, but then the "step 1" before it, you say you're having trouble with. Rather than get a bunch of online riders from around the world to assess your risding capabilities, why dont you ask a few riding members at your barn or a couple of instructors to asses your ability and take an average of all the answers? Because they're the ones that know what the horse is capable of, and which parts the horse is a bit rusty on.. they also have the chance to watch you ride which is vital in an assessment like this. =)


Where exactly was I getting angry?? I just answered questions. That is a good idea to ask my intructor and such... thanks


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## Cowgurl060405

I never got the impression that you were angry but maybe I missed something  Personally I won't comment on this without pictures or video. You can say you know how to do something, but it's different to actually see it. Take me for example...I can write out in detail the correct way to jump. Ask me to execute it though and you will be rolling on the floor laughing  I don't judge people anymore until I see them actually ride.


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## Sharpie

I loved your response Cowgurl! I'm the same way! I can describe, in detail, what I _should_ be doing, but actually making it happen, especially if the horse has other ideas, can be something else all together!  Today I got lectured for elbows, elbows, elbows. Last week it was my head and neck over and over again. The week before that it was hands. And so on and so on. I mean, I know this stuff in my head, but I haven't quite convinced my body to perform it all together yet. I can sit on a broke horse and do a trail ride or arena exercises, but actually riding as in the active verb 'to ride' is still something I'm working on!


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## myhorsesonador

I didn't read all the comments so I'm sorry if I say some thing thats already been said but...... I would say novice. You might say that you can do all that and you might I dont know because I dont know you. but if that horse spooks will you stay on? can you ride bare back (W/T/C/) ? What happens if the horse stops before a jump will you stay on or will you go flying. This is just my opinioun but if your trainer has trubble getting a horse on a hard to get lead then there not a very good trainer. and where I'm from a riders level isn't just judged in the saddle. Can you groom a horse with out cuting corners (geting lazy and skiping stuff) can you aply the right kind of first aid to a horse? or if its bad could you tell the vet what part of the body it was on? can you take apart a bride and put it back together? Do you know what to feed a horse depending on age, breed, level of work, and level of weight? Can you clip a horse? and I dont mean to sound mean but any one can get a book or go on the internet anf find out how to do all that stuff. And do you have a good position when you do this stuff? I'm definatly not an exspurt so if any one does not agree with any thing I've said than please let me know.


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## Jillyann

horseluver50 said:


> I have considered taking lessons at a western place and learning western... Once I get my own horse, I am boarding it right close... so I can learn western  Also, I will mainly be riding trails...




Hmm, In my honest opinion, I would take MANY more lessons before you buy your own horse. Maybe even lease a horse first to see if you're really ready. By the sounds of it, I would say beginner. But because there is no video or even pictures of you riding, it makes it very hard to tell.:?Thats just my $0.02.


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## Joshie

horseluver50 said:


> Well, I am taking english pleasure lessons, and no... we can't go out of the arena, cause they've got nowhere else... I have considered taking lessons at a western place and learning western... Once I get my own horse, I am boarding it right close... so I can learn western  Also, I will mainly be riding trails...
> The only reason I am wondering what level rider I am.. is cause when I talk to owners of horses for sale, they ask what level I am... I normally say low intermediate... but I dunno whats right...





horseluver50 said:


> -xx-sally-xx-- I have owned a horse before... I got her when I was about 9 1/2, but we sold her early last year...


I admit that I ride Western, not English. But I am pretty sure that English riders are not limited to arenas. For the life of me, I cannot understand how anyone could stay awake if they only rode around in stinkin' little circles. Anyway, I'm pretty sure that the English Riding Rule Book (ERRB) doesn't contain a prohibition against riding _out_side an arena. Heck, I'm usually a pretty law abiding citizen but I say....this is one rule you can break! :shock:

Instead of telling sellers you're at a particular level why don't you tell them where and how long you've taken English riding lessons?

It sounds like your family owned a horse. That's totally different from owning a horse yourself.


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## Jillyann

Joshie said:


> I admit that I ride Western, not English. But I am pretty sure that English riders are not limited to arenas. For the life of me, I cannot understand how anyone could stay awake if they only rode around in stinkin' little circles. Anyway, I'm pretty sure that the English Riding Rule Book (ERRB) doesn't contain a prohibition against riding _out_side an arena. Heck, I'm usually a pretty law abiding citizen but I say....this is one rule you can break! :shock:


Joshie you're very right! English riders _can_ ride outside an arena! I rode english for almost 3 years, and we went on trail rides, on the road, shows, ect. ect. Youre NOT limited to an arena. And in my opinion, riding in an arena every single time you get on a horse is pretty boring. I would not like doing that every lesson.:lol:


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## Equuestriaan

Well you can be limited to a riding arena if you take lessons, due to insurance issues. My barn only allows lessons in the arena.


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## Jillyann

Yeah that is true I guess, but I dont really take lessons anymore because Im leasing a horse. So I am not restricted. 

But when I did take lessons, we went on trail rides, rode on the road, and trailered the horses to shows and rode there just for experience. I guess it just depends on where you live??


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## horseluver50

I can ONLY ride in the arena.. it is liabilty.. no bareback.. no trails (without trainer), no pasture riding, unless in sight of them... also, the fastest we're alowwed to go is a slow trot 

It gets pretty annoying to only ride in the arena, I LOVE herding cows, but I can never do it.. only once we did it! 

Thats why I want my own horse, and board it elsewhere..,at just a pasture, so I can go ride and ride bareback, trails etc. without being worried about staying within seeing distance..


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## Jillyann

horseluver50 said:


> I can ONLY ride in the arena.. it is liabilty.. no bareback.. no trails (without trainer), no pasture riding, unless in sight of them... also, the fastest we're alowwed to go is a slow trot



Woahhhh, How do you know how to do all those different exercises at the canter when the fastest you can go if a slow trot?:?


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## Equuestriaan

I think she meant no more than a trot in the pastures. But anyways, I'd really like to see video or pictures. Do you have any?


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## horseluver50

Yeah, I meant in the pasture ;P

I have some pictures.. I will post them in a sec.. they are from quite a while ago though.. they look horibel  But i will post them soon..


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## horseluver50

Here are some pictures::

These ones on autumn are horrible... i did so bad that day..

I need to keep my eyes forward, I think I was seeing if my reins were even... also, my toes need to be pointed in more.. looks horrible!!







I need my legs bend farther back more, and my toes in. argg!


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## horseluver50

Untacking Autumn::





















Riding Decoder:: (also, these were taken quite a few months ago, i have worked on lots since then, now my arms are not like that, and my toes are pointed in. heels down.














I need my arms more bend, looks horrible:








So ya.. thanks everyone!


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## Spyder

horseluver50 said:


> Riding Decoder:: (also, these were taken quite a few months ago, i have worked on lots since then, now my arms are not like that, and my toes are pointed in. heels down.
> View attachment 8376
> 
> View attachment 8377
> 
> I need my arms more bend, looks horrible:
> View attachment 8378
> 
> 
> So ya.. thanks everyone!


If you are riding in the arena due to liability issues.........just what sort of footwear are you sporting in these pictures.

Also just from the way you are riding you really do not have any idea of collection....maybe slower but not collection.


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## horseluver50

As I said, these pictures were taken quite a long time ago. I have proper footwear and pants now... as you see when I ride on Autumn...

I was horrible in those pictures, and I kinda suck without lessons... this was a free ride. 

I can do quite good in lessons


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## horseluver50

I'll get my mom to take vids and pics in my next lesson..


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## horseluver50

Oh, Spyder... did you see page 5? It has me riding autumn.. not much better.. but a bit.. lol.. and she is alot harder to ride


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## saraah20010

*Riding level*



horseluver50 said:


> So, I would like to know which level of rider I am... here are some details..
> 
> I am 13 years old.
> I have been riding for approx.5 years now. The last 2 years have been alot more serious.
> I have never been to shows before.
> I ride english pleasure mostly... bit of western here and there.. bit of jumping
> I take lessons every week.
> 
> Here is what I know how to do::
> 
> Walk:
> - side pass
> - collected
> - extended
> - bending
> - serpentines
> - figure 8's
> - 5m, 10m, 15m, 20m circles
> 
> Trot:
> - collected
> - extended
> - bending
> - 2-point
> - figure 8's
> - serpentines
> - side pass
> - 10m, 15m, 20m circles
> - rising trot
> 
> Canter:
> - collected
> - extended
> - bending
> - 2-point
> - figure 8's
> - 15m, 20m circles
> - knows right lead
> 
> Jumping:
> - cross rails (two point) cantering
> - ground rails (two point) cantering
> - 2 ft. (two point) cantering
> 
> Western:
> -spins on forehand, honches
> 
> 
> Other:
> - halt
> - half-halts
> - back up (turn, line up between poles)
> - learning to open gates
> - tack up with no help, I help my friend alot
> - Knows horse care (have owned one before, and from trainer)
> 
> So, what level rider do you think I am?
> 
> I have also rode horses that are not suitable for beginners.
> 
> Beginner? Novice? Intermediate? Advanced? What do you think??
> 
> Thanks in advance for anyone who replies


Hi,
by the sounds of it, it sounds like
you would fall in to the Advanced rider/intermediate, as you can do 
most of the things that Advanced riders can do :lol:,
hope this helps.


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## dantexeventer

I would say advanced beginner or lower intermediate. You sound like you're definitely on the right track, keep up the good work!


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## Joshie

horseluver50 said:


> I can ONLY ride in the arena.. it is liabilty.. no bareback.. no trails (without trainer), no pasture riding, unless in sight of them... also, the fastest we're alowwed to go is a slow trot
> 
> It gets pretty annoying to only ride in the arena, I LOVE herding cows, but I can never do it.. only once we did it!
> 
> Thats why I want my own horse, and board it elsewhere..,at just a pasture, so I can go ride and ride bareback, trails etc. without being worried about staying within seeing distance..


Owning your own horse is a huge step. Wouldn't you be better off taking lessons at a small, private barn where you can trail ride?


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## Qtswede

Oh, Spyder - I just love you.  Always great commentary & critique. 
I agree with Joshie too - you two have covered everything pretty solidly IMHO.


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## TroubledTB

Well you have already stated that you are not a beginner so I guess I wont argue, but what I think everyone is trying to say that you have learned how to ride one horse well. This is a great step in starting a foundation for riding well. I hear some people criticize arena work, but I've seen plenty of trail riders who just walk down the same pathway everytime, and I can't say that makes you any more advanced because you have stepped out of a confined area. Most horses accustomed to the trail wont put up much to troubleshoot when walking a pleasant trail on a nice day. I don't think where she is riding has as much to do with her skill level as her skill level is limiting where she is allowed to ride. Some trainers will try to be diplomatic about discussing a students skill level because insulting them outright could result in loss of a vested interest. Maybe if you were a truly advanced rider it wouldn't be a liability problem A liability problem on really starts to exist if someone falls off or gets hurt right? So if you are an advanced rider on an average lesson horse, the chances of falling off and getting hurt on the trail is about zilch The point is, it does not matter what skill level you really believe you are at, someone will always be there to debate you. Believing you are an advanced rider doesn't affect your riding for squat. Just your pride. Sometimes trainers have to really praise a student to keep them feeling good about their riding, other people don't feel they really got a lesson unless the trainer really laid in to you about your downfalls on your horse. Originally you sounded more advanced but when I heard you had never w/t/c bareback I immediately demoted you. I think you feel you have advanced really really really far on your horse you feel deserve a higher ranking. There are plenty of horses who could prove any rider is still a beginner. For me, it's really really big warmblood three year olds who can jump and buck really big. Yeah, in that sceanario, I'm a beginner. Your advancement could benefit most greatly IMO from two things:
Riding bareback a lot- this includes challenging yourself to be able to accomplish everything bareback, even jumping. I've personally jumped bareback about 3 ft. but even attempting to post or two point bareback is such great strength building, then you are so tired from the strain you just melt at the canter and really learn how to sink in and ride. Since you have stated that you are not allowed to ride bareback, ride for two weeks without the stirrups on your saddle, you will really improve at the end of it.
Galloping a trail- Many people I come across really confuse the gallop and a good click at the canter. When you really gallop a trail (one with decent footing and no cliffs you can fall off) you learn about staying with your horse and really feeling what power is underneath you. I took a big strided but very lazy OTTB on a trail like this and man did he open up. I couldn't have gotten that speed or stride length in the arena, he wasn't motivated. But when the Trakehner mare galloping next to him kicked in a racing instinct he really kicked it into turbo drive. I was only worried that if a deer or coyote jumped out and he bolted sideways, I might not stay on, luckily the situation never presented itself. It was fun but there were some twists and turns that weren't so easy, a few really intense head to head moments, and some branches that required serious ducking/going through. With all these obstacles coming at you that fast you can start to access how well balanced you are on a horse. Surviving the first one is only a steping stone too, usually because you should tag behind someone more experienced to control the pace overall. Be advised, this can be hard on a horse if done every day, I recommend about once a month to stretch your horses legs out.
I think the question you should be contemplating is not what level you are riding at, but whether or not you have advanced beyond your horses capabilities and should look for a novice/intermidiate horse to ride. I think that most riders should spend some time taking lessons on horses that are of each level. A rider should ask what level of horse am I ready for, not what level do I ride on the horse I have practiced really hard on.
Oh I'm guessing Noviceish, def not Intermidiate until you have accomplished the above(just my opinion) and it doesn't end there, those are just two challenges that may reveal serious holes in your riding.


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## wild_spot

^^ Very good post!

I agree, a lot of bareback riding really solidifies your position and forces you to become secure in your seat and develop independent seat and hands. My pony girth galls, so I spent months at a time riding bareback, trails, jumping, stockwork, pony club, everything. Valuable experience, it makes me wish I still did it more! But the type of schooling I am working on now isn’t so conductive to bareback, lol.

And again, galloping is a big one. I agree; lots of people underestimate what a true gallop is. A true gallop will also teach you a lot about your horse… Often they will get excited and toss in a pigroot, or object about slowing down. Good things to know and work on. I tend to let my horse/horses have a good, true gallop with friends on a trail at least once a month, if not every few weeks. They love it, I love it, it’s good for their cardio fitness… Win/win/win!

Looking back, I can more clearly see my own progress. I took lessons for three years and worked at a riding school as a junior staff for another two. I rode all the school horses and handled them all weekly; I could do all the things you can now. But, I was still very much a beginner, as I found out when I leased a pony then bought my first pony. Both were not the best matches, but both taught me invaluable amounts about staying on and developing good arm and leg muscles! By then I would say I was beginner/intermediate. I then bought my boy I have now, who at the time was a 5yo Arab gelding, much more suited to my ability than the two ornery ponies I had just moved on from. Riding Wildey over about 5 years I learnt a ton; As well as riding as many other horses as I could. Throughout my time riding Wildey full-time I would say I moved from beginner/intermediate through to an intermediate/advanced rider. Now after having owned and leased 5+ more horses and worked on their individual issues, plus having ridden 50+ horses through my mounted games career, I would say I am somewhere within the advanced category, but nowhere near as good/experienced/knowledgeable as I can and want to be.

You will be better off in the long run by underestimating your ability rather than overestimating it.


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## horseluver50

I have walk/trotted bareback a long long time ago, when we were allowed, but now they wont let us.. 

I have galloped tons before..
I am taking reining right now, sliding stops, galloping etc.

Lately, I have been leasing the horse, and I went out on lush pastures, and galloped xD
soo much fun!!!

At my stables, EVERYONE is the same.. there is one girl who is an advanced rider, and she isnt allowed to ride bareback, or go on trails by herself...

I'm positive I'm not allowed to gallop or canter in the fields, but I do anyways ;P

I started western about 1 month ago, and I absolutely LOVE IT!!!

I am soo much better at it than english riding... I feel I have advanced soo much 


I found a horse I am really interested in..
he is 15hh qh/morgan gelding.. 10 yrs old, used on trails with previous owner.. only ridden about once a year with these owners, as they train warmbloods.

get on off the field, and go..

They arent sure if he has ever been ridden bareback, but they said he is really great, loves kids, and would be willing to do almost anything 

Thanks again guys


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## horseluver50

Also, once I purchase my own horse, I will ride ONLY bareback 

I am hoping to become a natural horsemanship trainer when I graduate, so I need some practice 

bareback: barrel racing, trails, swimming, roads, jumping etc


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## equiniphile

Watching a video of you riding would help a lot. A lot of people can say they ride horses, but not all of them ride right. You sound like you know quite a bit, but it would help to see a video


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## Valentina

Without seeing a video we can't really tell - you say you can do a "side pass" (do you mean half pass or leg yield??) - but how well do you do it? My horse will walk sideways with anyone on it's back BUT she'll only do it correctly if the rider knows how to ask her correctly.

Are your leg yields straight? Slanted? Crooked? 

So based on your questions (and it's turn on the forehand not forehand spins, and turn on the haunches not honches) I'd say beginner.


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## savvylover112

great posts spyder and joshie and videos would be great and in writing what i could do puts me high enough but i cannot do most of it correctly and so wouldnt put myself high or wouldnt ask wat level i am at i just concentrate on were i am trying to go with my horse and what we are trying to do at the time being


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## victoriaaa

I agree with what other people have said about needing a video.
Also if that horse has only been rode once a year are you sure that is going to be suitable? It could be very green. You seem to have covered alot of work but from my own experience, your horse is going to be totally different to school horses, unless you get a schoolmistress of course. Try riding other horses before you make a decision. Im really late on this post.. i wonder how it went?


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## speedy da fish

I wouldnt say you were a begginer, just for the fact that your have been riding for 5 years. I would say Novice because you dont know that much and I have no idea how you ride all the stuff you said you  Maybe we could see some pics/vids? Flying changes are quite advanced though  although the horse needs to know what they are doing more than you do.


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## PechosGoldenChance

I ONLY ride bareback!!! I love it, and as wild spot said, it helps you find your center of gravity, feel secure in your seat etc. Now, I should clarify, I do ride in a saddle, but most of the time, it's bareback.

As for your riding level, I'd say novice since there are no videos or anything to actually see how you ride. Anyone can say how they ride, what they do, but it's a whole different story when you're actually riding. Try to post a video.


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## Smarby

As many have said - it's not on what you can do, it's the way you do it.
And also the horse you do it on! I considered myself a compenent rider before i owned my pony but he threw me at the deep end. Before i got him i had never experianced a proper rear, large bucks, bolting or bad spooks and he did the lot! He has brought me on a huge amount but also proved that being able to do all the 'stuff' in the school on a riding school pony is quite different to being in situations that require quick thinking and skilled handling, and that's it's actually a lot harder than you think it is.
It would probably do you a lot of good to ride a wide variety of horses with different temprements and abilities as this will give you a taste of what riding is really about, as well as hacking out rather than plodding around an arena. Are there any other riding schools nearby?


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## roro

Are you sure on your definitions of collected and extended gaits? Extended gait doesn't just mean 'getting her going'. That's a fast gait.

PS. Old thread guys!


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## Sunny

It sounds to me like you just wanted an ego boost. As soon as someone called you an advanced rider, you basked in your glory and said, "Thanks!" but as soon as someone called you a beginner, you said, "No way, I am so not a beginner." I was a thirteen year old once, I know how it goes.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PechosGoldenChance

Sunny: haha thats funny. Yet true! When I was around that age (im 21) I thought the same thing, as soon as someone called your bluff it's like, "Wait a minute, thats not true." lol Good point!


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## dantexeventer

Without reading all the replies, I'm going to say strong beginner. As far as I'm concerned, a true advanced rider can get on any horse and ride it sympathetically with good results, can diagnose and treat basic medical/lameness issues, has worked under several highly respected professionals, has ridden several disciplines, has a truly independent seat and hand, is calm and confident in every situation, has taken every learning opportunity out there, and has come to the point in his riding where he recognizes that the internet's opinion of his horsemanship is not the end goal.  Of course, there are other factors, too. 
According to Denny Emerson, you're not a good rider until you've spent 10,000 hours - which, no matter how you slice it, can't be accomplished before you're about 25.


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## MissH

dantexeventer said:


> Without reading all the replies, I'm going to say strong beginner. As far as I'm concerned, a true advanced rider can get on any horse and ride it sympathetically with good results, can diagnose and treat basic medical/lameness issues, has worked under several highly respected professionals, has ridden several disciplines, has a truly independent seat and hand, is calm and confident in every situation, has taken every learning opportunity out there, and has come to the point in his riding where he recognizes that the internet's opinion of his horsemanship is not the end goal.  Of course, there are other factors, too.
> According to Denny Emerson, you're not a good rider until you've spent 10,000 hours - which, no matter how you slice it, can't be accomplished before you're about 25.


This is a GREAT response! So true.


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## Supermane

I think it really depends on how you execute what you know how to do and who you are doing it on. For example, a flying lead change on a horse that does them is one thing, but teaching them to a horse that doesn't do them is quite another. Over my 8/9 years riding I've ridden (and shown) countless horses (including ones with nasty bucking habits), helped train my first pony from not knowing to jump to doing 3' courses with lead changes, and learned to ride (and win on) my complicated TB gelding.

I still have a lot to learn and a lot I know I could improve on. I still consider myself an advanced intermediate.


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## ponyboy

I can't help but notice... A lot of people are saying you're automatically a beginner/novice if you haven't done any training. But the OP is asking about RIDING level, not training level. That's comparing apples and oranges.

I would put the OP at intermediate as far as people who take lessons go. But it really depends on the riding school. 

One thing I agree with though is that getting experience riding outside of an arena is important. I think riding schools need to start seeing trail riding as educational and do it more often.


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## dantexeventer

Good point, ponyboy, but speaking for only myself here - there is one goal, and that is the goal of horsemanship. If there is no influence on the horse, ie no training, it is merely being a passenger. So to be a rider is to be a trainer is to be a horseman. It all goes together.


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## FlitterBug

Remember that you are always training, whether you like it or not. In my experience, anyone that has to tell me how good they are is not someone who will be able to ride. The only one that can truly tell you how well you ride is the horse. Don't worry so much about other's opinions, because as long as you are focused on your own worries and your own needs, you are leaving out an essential part of your team, the horse. Once you are secure enough in your own riding to begin riding for the horse and not just riding for yourself and your status, then you will begin to become a rider. Once you get to that point, you won't care what level you are riding at. You won't have to ask for opinions, because you will stand out to the point that people will come up and tell you, yet that won't matter, because what you have between you and the horse will be so much more than a "level".


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## Ridehorses99

I have not read all the posts, but it seems logical that the one person who can accurately rate your ability to ride is your instructor. Since you have been taking lessons for quite a while, how does your instructor rate your riding ability?


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## ponyboy

dantexeventer said:


> Good point, ponyboy, but speaking for only myself here - there is one goal, and that is the goal of horsemanship. If there is no influence on the horse, ie no training, it is merely being a passenger. So to be a rider is to be a trainer is to be a horseman. It all goes together.


I agree but it sounded to me like by "training" people were talking about breaking a horse.

It also depends on what world you're in too... For a group of trail riders this might be advanced riding, but in a competitive barn it would be considered beginner.


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## Supermane

ponyboy said:


> I can't help but notice... A lot of people are saying you're automatically a beginner/novice if you haven't done any training. But the OP is asking about RIDING level, not training level. That's comparing apples and oranges.
> 
> I would put the OP at intermediate as far as people who take lessons go. But it really depends on the riding school.
> 
> One thing I agree with though is that getting experience riding outside of an arena is important. I think riding schools need to start seeing trail riding as educational and do it more often.


I was actually mostly talking about the horse you're put on. That's a huge factor in what you can do. I mean, someone at the very same level on a more complicated horse, may not be able to do the same thing. Riding a green horse will affect your performance, while a very broke horse/school master will do as you say (they may even help you).


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## roro

I've seen one too many riders get on a well broke, well bred, good elegant horse and make the horse look awful.


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## Iluvjunior

Guys, I don't think she's going to read this.... You brought a thread back from the dead...let it die in peace again lol


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## JenC

After reading most of these replies, especially Spyder's critique, I have down graded myself to a super negative 40 degrees below zero beginner, lol. 

I'm 26 and I have only been riding a few months, but some how my pride is always hurt when a 10 year old can out ride me. Guess I'm going to have to get over that.


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## farmpony84

Joshie said:


> Well, I'd say you're a beginner. You describe a lot of things. But...it's hard to tell, from your words, if you're riding the horse or if you're sitting on a horse going through his paces.
> 
> Do you ride anywhere but the arena? Can you train your horse? Have you ever installed buttons on a horse? I think that from the very beginning one should know how to train a horse on the ground as it helps with saddle training later.
> 
> Can you ride a horse down a hill? Up a hill? Have you stepped off a 3' drop off? Gone over water? Can you handle yourself on a non-lesson horse? The point I'm getting at is that, in my opinion, is that you have to be able to problem solve in order to advance past the beginner stage.


I've only read the first page but I would go with beginner intermediate. The above questions would help better determine, pictures and videos would be helpful. In the show ring you'd be considered, beginner (first year of showing), Maiden (first or second year of showing), or Novice (wich, depending on the series could just mean hasn't won a blue ribbon).


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## sbe77

Well you can do quite a bit BUT its a riding school horse you just have to push the right button and it does it so I would say novice


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## topcatben

The way i like to measure if someone is experienced, is how many times have you fallen off a horse. Thats really for me a good measure, since its the probably the hardest thing to do properly on a horse, but overall sounds like your intermediate-advanced.


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## Palomine

I'd be thinking more beginner too.

Can you stay on bucking horse, bolting, rearing, and know what to do to stop that? Can you ride a horse that you don't know anything about, other than it is trained to ride, and not run into problems with one that won't leave the barn, or throws a fit over leaving its buddies?

Can you pick up on problems when you are up, such as lameness, bitting problems, soreness?

Do you look ahead to identify potential problems and have it in your head what to do if something happens?

To me, those are just as important as the side passing, bending, and such as you say you can do.

And sadly, at your age? I've seen very few advanced riders, usually those children have parents who are trainers, or are being raised on a ranch where riding horses is as much a part of their lives as breathing. They ridden every single day, and can ride most of the horses on the place. 

They can lead, feed, diagnose, tack, groom, and control all sorts of horses, which is all part of being a strong rider.


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