# Pulling back while leading



## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

For right or wrong all my horses learn to lead by walking behind me, I just prefer them to follow just behind and to one side, ad never had an issue with it.

When Bert first came she could be a bit of a mare, you would be walking with her and she would freeze and refuse to move. I worked her through it by simply pulling her to one side, to get her feet moving, and after a while she gave up freezing and was great to lead.

Ben started to do the same thing, but now has started to escalate by suddenly stopping and pulling back. Being as he is 17hh and with saddlebred blood when that head goes up and he runs back he is a) getting away from me, he is just to strong to hang onto, and b) he is trashing my already bad shoulder.

When he does it he doesn't actually go anywhere, just spooks back at great speed, until I can't hold on anymore, then he stops quite happily until I walk up and grab his rope, then he will walk on with me again, until teh next explosion. They come out of the blue, and I need to solve this now, before he totally wrecks me:-(

Help, ideas thoughts.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

That sounds hard to deal with. One thing, are you using a rope halter? and can you wear gloves when leading, to give yourself all the advantages?

When she backs up, to you try to hold her by pulling downward on the rope? If you can lift and pull upward, with sharp jerks to get her attention, and when and if she takes a step sideways, rather than straight back, you can then pull her off her balance a bit (such as you described as your approach when she just got stuck and needed a little help to go forward.) ONce you have unstuck her feet, then hopefully you can get her moving forward.

Also, when leading, she should NEVER take the slack out of the line. So, when she is walking behind you , if she starts to hesitate, and the slack gets lost as she sags behind, I would firm up your hand held tight against your hip, and say "Walk up!". If she doesn't move foward, you ccan slap your other hip with the extra line and see if that breaks her resistant feet loose, at which time she will hopefully move til she hits the end of the line and them bounce off it and come forward.

Mac used to do this to me, though slightly different. He'd lead up closeer and closer to me, then suddenly , turn at a 90 degree angle and so he'd be facing directly away from me, and could just freighttrain the rope right through my hands and run gaily off to meet the mares, and I'd have to catch him on the 40 acres. I used a chain on his nose for a bit , 'til he pretty much stopped doing that. 

He'd do it during trailer loading, too. He was really sneaky about it, showing no signs that this was what he was thinking to do.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Well let's think about herd dynamics for a minute. Would a horse ever spook away from their herd leader while they were asked to follow? 

Probably not unless the herd leader offered a kick or pinned ears. 

Maybe the way you are leading isn't constructive or productive.

When a horse falls behind, because the handler isn't enforcing they stay at their shoulder, they WILL begin to stop and pull because you aren't there to keep them moving forward. They need to be by your shoulder so you know where they are at all times, and can keep up with them.

The ones you drag behind are probably feeling pressure from the rope on their halter and he's trying to escape it. 

I would be concerned, too, if the horse behind me got scared and bolted right into me! It can happen.

You have to lead in such a way that you encourage the horse to follow you. It's called "Leading" a horse for a reason, not "dragging" you know?

Now you've got to re-program him and yourself. He stays by your shoulder. If he goes infront you halt and back his hiney up without moving yourself (I usually spin the rope infront of his nose.. if they are new to it, it takes awhile and if you need me to explain, PM me or I'll reply here) and then continue on your way. Your horse moves WITH you. If he doesn't, he gets a swap on the barrel or hind end with the end of the leadrope. You don't change your position, you just reach behind with your left hand (if leading left) and swat them. As soon as they move, you move. When you stop, slow down before you stop and they should in turn slow down.

I respect you, GoldenHorse but I honestly believe that your method of leading is creating problems and you need to be more thoughtful about it so you don't get yourself hurt. I know what 17hh of pull feels like and I have a good shoulder :/ 

I guarantee, once you begin to re-think your leading, and it will take some consistency and time, you won't have these problems.

If he doesn't respond to a swat of the leadrope, carry a crop. But they stay AT THE SHOULDER. Not infront, not behind.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Are you meaning, Sky, that the head is in line with your shoulder?


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Just to clarify, I don't DRAG my horses, I lead they follow, on a loose rope, it is the way I do it, *shrugs* it works with everyone, but that doesn't mean I'm not prepared to change if needed, just clarifying:wink:



> I would be concerned, too, if the horse behind me got scared and bolted right into me! It can happen.


Yup, it can happen, but also when a horse is walking behind you and spooks sideways you don't get run into, it's kind of swings and roundabouts to me.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Yes but even if it's loose, there is still pressure pulling them along forward because of the weight of the rope. It's small, but if they get no release (if they're by your shoulder, the rope hangs down so there isn't pressure) then they're going to try and FIND release. Hence him trying to stop, and now running backwards. 



tinyliny said:


> Are you meaning, Sky, that the head is in line with your shoulder?



No, shoulder to shoulder. If their head is at your shoulder, then they can still slam on the brakes and you cannot reach them. If you are by their shoulder, you control their feet and can do something about it when they baulk or try and run off.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

That opens the discussion of where do you lead your horse? I lead with horse's head about 4 feet behind me and about 3 or 4 feet off to the side, so at an angle, behind. If the horse spooks, it will run forward, but since I am at the side, it should run into that open area. I can see it out of the corner of my eye if I cock my head that way a bit. If it spooks sideways, I won't get my feet stepped on.

I dont' know, this is just the way I learned. I use the line to remind the hrose to stay off and at an angle to the side. I never drag any horse, but I do sometimes have to add a bit of energy to their step, if they get "saggy" on the line.


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## Cat (Jul 26, 2008)

Hmmm...I was always taught to lead the head at your shoulder. If you are shoulder to shoulder the horse is too far forward for effective leading.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Skyseternalangel said:


> Yes but even if it's loose, there is still pressure pulling them along forward because of the weight of the rope. It's small, but if they get no release (if they're by your shoulder, the rope hangs down so there isn't pressure) then they're going to try and FIND release. Hence him trying to stop, and now running backwards.
> 
> There's as much release off the rope as they get in any kind of lead rope ground work, such as backing them off the rope or lunging; you drop your hand, the rope sags , so it's not pulling, but it still has its' own weight, yes. It has a very small "feel" to it, but it's a neutral feel. There is not so much slack that it would take a lot of pull on the rope to bring it to tautness, but there is enough slack that the horse can lag a step or two before he removes that slack and feels his body weight hit the rope.
> 
> ...


I do not want to lead him horse next to me where his front feet are right next to my feet, and his head is past mine.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

tinyliny said:


> That opens the discussion of where do you lead your horse? I lead with horse's head about 4 feet behind me and about 3 or 4 feet off to the side, so at an angle, behind. If the horse spooks, it will run forward, but since I am at the side, it should run into that open area. I can see it out of the corner of my eye if I cock my head that way a bit. If it spooks sideways, I won't get my feet stepped on.
> 
> I dont' know, this is just the way I learned. I use the line to remind the hrose to stay off and at an angle to the side. I never drag any horse, but I do sometimes have to add a bit of energy to their step, if they get "saggy" on the line.


Everyone learns things differently but in my experience (and remember it's limited) if you let the horse fall behind your shoulder, then you can't really see them, their feet are behind you and you can't control them, and if they get too slow or baulk, you can't do a thing about it.

When I lead my shoulder and the beginning of their shoulder are lined up. I can see the horse, I can let them know if they need to speed up or slow down, I know where their feet are, and if they spook, I can easily direct their bodies around me rather than through me. Again.. experience with nasty spooks while being lead from my very own Sky lol.

I've had this experience with 3-4 year olds, I've had this experience with my own horse, and I've had this experience with mature horses because they try and test their handler.

I've never gotten hurt leading a horse, ever. Never been trampled or knocked over or slammed into a gate. Nothing.

The horse's head isn't what you want to worry about, it's the rest of the horse. Those powerful hind legs, their feet, and the heavy weight of their bodies. I want to be able to control that so I don't get hurt.

Also.. your feet aren't lined up with their feet  That is too far back. That's behind their range of motion, and behind their shoulder IMOP. Your shoulder, lines up with the beginning of their shoulder (not your body is in the middle of their shoulder, if that happens, horse needs to back up.)

~~

But this is the way I do it. It's not the only way, but I do think leading a horse behind you is asking for trouble as you cannot correct their speed because walking faster isn't a universal cue for "walk faster with me" it creates more distance and then you get the horse that begins to baulk or pull back.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

I'm with Tiny on this one, I don't want to lead him with my feet next to his, I have been stepped on to often, and flattened by someone spooking sideways.

I think I'll start a thread with a poll about where we prefer our horses to lead!

Sky, I really am struggling to see how the weight of the rope hanging is causing pressure on him, by that argument surely when a horse is tied up they would never find release either, unless you tie really short? Again I loke my horse to follow behind and to the side as Tiny describes.

Now when and if I am going to have a horse who I show I will reach to lead from the shoulder, also when I was working in riding schools, riding for the disabled etc, then we led at the shoulder, unless of course it was a rider who needed side walkers, in which case of course you are back to being in front.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Here we go, a place to discuss the advantages of leading from the front, the head or the shoulder http://www.horseforum.com/horse-training/leading-do-you-lead-front-side-126462/#post1539966

Any more ideas on helping me save my shoulder from more damage?

BTW I always lead on a rope halter, but I need to get a longer rope for it maybe


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

The horse has the responsibility to stay between the "too far ahead, and too far back place" If he goes too far ahead, (which means his head passes my shoulder and is thus in front of my body), I lift the line and give a little wiggle. I keep walking but I use the wiggle of the line, which always means move away from this bad feeling, to cause him to wait while I go ahead. If he gets too far back, and I feel drag in the line, I use a little swing back of the lead line, or I jsut kind of swat it agains my offside thigh to indicate that he'd better move up, now! he can saty anywhere he wants between those two points, as long as he is not directly behind me and not crossing over to the other side.

If the horse is prone to spooking, I would shorten the rope and have him closer but more off to the side. But I don't have a lot of experience leading horses that are like that. 

If they are going to spook right past me, then so be it. They can go past me. I can just turn around and they will be in the "following " position. Or, I can stop them, and move them so that they are back into the following position. I dont' try to "hold" them so they are at my shoulder, since I could never hold a horse that needs to jump forward. I am not that strong.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Golden I am trying to help you, that was my purpose here. You asked me to clarify and I am. Thus it's on topic.

Okay we're obviously not on the same page. Attached it a picture of where I would stand (at the shoulder) to clear the muddy waters. I took a step and Sky wasn't paying attention but that's about where I'm at.



Golden Horse said:


> Sky, I really am struggling to see how the weight of the rope hanging is causing pressure on him, by that argument surely when a horse is tied up they would never find release either, unless you tie really short? Again I loke my horse to follow behind and to the side as Tiny describes.


You know how when you pull back on a horse's halter under their chin and pressure is placed on the noseband, coaxing them backwards?

So when you pull on a rope from the front, the throatlatch puts pressure on them to move forward.

Now any halter, regardless if it's rope or leather or nylon, will put pressure on a horse if it's pulled. 

Now if you don't pull the rope either direction, it just hangs then a horse is content standing there. 

When you lead and you are in front, like I said, you have no control over their feet and problems arise since you cannot correct their speed from where you are at (they are too far back.)

The rope is loose, but when they begin to baulk, pressure is added. Your boy has learned that baulking and running backwards, that pressure will be released. He tested you, and now it has escalated. From where you like to lead, you cannot correct him. You're along for the ride and he gets away with it because you didn't correct his baulk or his one step of backwards.

if I were leading him and he baulked, since I'm at his shoulder I can swat him at his barrel and send him forwards, if that didn't work, I could take a step back and "send" him forward. If he's too far behind, I cannot correct efficiently and I risk injury to me.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

That is real close to waht I would do. I just would not have the horse's head in front of me, at all.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

And that's fine, you lead how you lead 

But if a horse is trying to misbehave when leading, you need to correct them right away. The faster and accurate that you do the correction, the quicker they catch on that baulking or bolting backwards is NOT okay and forward with thoughtfulness is better (as in not dragging you, getting in-front, bolting forwards, etc.)


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## Cat (Jul 26, 2008)

Yikes -looking at that photo I'm just itching to correct that horse to move back some. Too far forward. If you have a horse that bolts forward like I have had to deal with in the past the horse is too far forward for you to effectively get control of the head. You'll end up with rope burns at best. 

I don't like horses trailing behind, but I would rather have the head just a bit behind than ever ahead of my shoulder.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Cat said:


> Yikes -looking at that photo I'm just itching to correct that horse to move back some. Too far forward. If you have a horse that bolts forward like I have had to deal with in the past the horse is too far forward for you to effectively get control of the head. You'll end up with rope burns at best.
> 
> I don't like horses trailing behind, but I would rather have the head just a bit behind than ever ahead of my shoulder.


Haven't had a problem. That's how I lead, I can keep him slow or ask him to get quicker.

Sky was a mess and can be a lot to handle but this works for him. 

Next time PM me, this isn't a "critique my leading" this is a "Help Goldenhorse prevent her horse from spooking backwards on the leadline and hurting their handler."


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## Cat (Jul 26, 2008)

Skyseternalangel said:


> Haven't had a problem. That's how I lead, I can keep him slow or ask him to get quicker.
> 
> Sky was a mess and can be a lot to handle but this works for him.
> 
> Next time PM me, this isn't a "critique my leading" this is a "Help Goldenhorse prevent her horse from spooking backwards on the leadline and hurting their handler."


Why would I PM you if the information provided could lead to another problem in her horse and I want her to be aware of it? I would hate to see RM correct one problem only to create another. And you may not personally have had issues with it, but that doesn't mean everyone else's experience has been the same. And part of a forum is sharing what we have experienced to help others.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Cat said:


> Why would I PM you if the information provided could lead to another problem in her horse and I want her to be aware of it? I would hate to see RM correct one problem only to create another. And you may not personally have had issues with it, but that doesn't mean everyone else's experience has been the same. And part of a forum is sharing what we have experienced to help others.


She doesn't have to do it my way, I was clarifying when tinyliny asked shoulder at head or shoulder to shoulder.

The point I was making was if the horse is too far behind, then she can't correct him efficiently. I can see how my original post may have been "this is the right way" but I was using the way I lead as an example. 

My post was posted to offer her some food for thought. That she needs to consider that her way of leading isn't as productive or a good way to go about it if she is having these problems. Maybe the horse needs to be less behind and more "with" her.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

OK, QUIT on this discussion here and take it to the other thread, please.

Sky I am not saying you are wrong, but I want more ideas, and so far I only have yours.

At this stage I am information gathering, I want stuff to think about and work out, there is more than one right way


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## Silent one (Aug 22, 2011)

Ok I'm going to jump in here with a totally different approach. To me, it doesn't matter, if I'm in front to the side or whatever, that horse better be trained to GO WITH ME when I have the lead rope. Anything else is not going to be an option.

Here's what I would do, when he bolts backwards I would keep him moving backwards, FAST. I would be on him like stink on you know what and we would back.....and back....

Backing up, especially fast, is pretty uncomfortable if they have to do it long. I bet he would get the idea pretty quick. May not work for everyone, works for me!


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

AHA, I did try that on Thursday, it seemed logical, but I wasn't sure if it was a good approach to try. 

I'm wondering if I find a longer rope to go on his rope halter, then I can let him start back, but can get after him and keep him moving back without him ever getting to actually pull on me.


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## Silent one (Aug 22, 2011)

Golden Horse said:


> AHA, I did try that on Thursday, it seemed logical, but I wasn't sure if it was a good approach to try.
> 
> I'm wondering if I find a longer rope to go on his rope halter, then I can let him start back, but can get after him and keep him moving back without him ever getting to actually pull on me.


Yep, that's a good idea. And when you are making him back, go fast and make sure he backs up long enough to get uncomfortable.


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## Allison Finch (Oct 21, 2009)

Sky, that is how I lead as well. I always stand at the shoulder. I present many horses in warmblood inspections and this is how they EXPECT a horse to be presented. It minimizes the sight of the handler and allows full view of the horse. Also, as Sky said, it allows instant and appropriate correction, if the horse goes poorly.

Inspection photos































Obviously, to each...their own. BUT, I was taught this way and it is what I teach.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Totally understand it for in the ring, there is no other way, obviously, for all sorts of good reasons.


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## DriftingShadow (Jun 4, 2012)

Drifter is also almost 17hh. I lead him with his head by my shouler. If I ask him to "ho" he will stand until given permission to continue walking. Whether I walk in front of him to un do a gate or whatever.

Back to your original question/issue OP...get a rope halter. Drifter had learned to break all halters and therefore "Escape". A rope halter cured this. I would also do some groundwork like others have suggested


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Drifting, yah, I always work Ben in a rope halter, no worries on that one.

Todays report, weather sunny but very very windy, under foot conditions, some dry areas, lots of puddles, large amount of slick.

Switched out to a halter made of narrower rope, and took off the standard rope, added a much longer one.

Caught him OK, and he walked great across the paddock into the round pen, started leading around the round pen, with his head by my shoulder, he 'thought' he heard something and spooked back, I went with him and drove him back around the pen, then led him back up around, and we went past the invisible dragon with buggy eyes and snorts, but little or no hesitation. Spent 10 mins or so just walking and changing direction without further issue.

Took him out of the round pen to lead him the 50 yards to the barn, got about 10 before he slammed into reverse, once again immediately switched and went with him, driving him back at high speed. Walked back up, got a bit closer to the barn before he slammed back into reverse, so off we go back again. Now he is getting to get very light in the front end and is threatening to stand up, so change tactics a little, for the next attempt, only back him 10 yards or so, then put him onto trot circles on the long rope.

I didn't take note of the time, or the attempts, but it took us a while to reach the barn on the first attempt. Once we got there, got him to relax, and we chilled for a while, then walked back to teh round pen gate and started all over again.

I think we had to do it around 5 times before he would walk from round pen to Barn without a mistep. Once he managed it, tied him up, gave him a good grooming, a handful of feed in a bucket and once he was done put him back out. All in all a good attempt, and I was pleased with his progress, and not once did I have pull on my shoulder, result.:thumbsup:


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## HagonNag (Jul 17, 2010)

Tossing my 2 cents in here: My horse came to me with a heads up...MAKE ME DO IT attitude. He wouldn't lead. So...using the theory that you make the right thing easy and the wrong thing hard, I backed him up. Continually. We backed into the stall. We backed out of the stall. We backed into the paddock, pasture, round pen. We backed everywhere. At the end of a few days that horse was PATHETICALLY grateful to go forward. I've owned him 7 years now and the issue has never cropped up again. He leads beautifully.

They're bigger than we are so we have no choice but to be smarter! LOL


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Glad that worked for you; great attitude.

Just gotta be careful that you don't cause a horse to rear since they can't go forward and may feel trapped going backwards.


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## HagonNag (Jul 17, 2010)

Thanks, Sky. Yep, I thought about that, but Mr. Big Stuff is all bluff. He likes to think he can bully people. He doesn't kick, he's never reared, but if he thinks he can intimidate you.... You're lost. He used to bite and then he used to pin his ears and swing his head. He USED TO. LOL Once he learns you've got his number he can be pretty easy to handle. He'll never be a horse for beginners or children, and I'm often asked why the He77 I keep him since he tries EVERYONE... but on the trail he's safe and totally fearless. You point: He goes. It took awhile to get there, and in the process I got sort of fond of the little ******. He's a PITA...but he's my PITA! LOLOL No one else would put up with him.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Skyseternalangel said:


> Just gotta be careful that you don't cause a horse to rear since they can't go forward and may feel trapped going backwards.


Yeah that was getting close with Ben yesterday, which is why I switched up my approach.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Golden Horse said:


> Yeah that was getting close with Ben yesterday, which is why I switched up my approach.


Any improvements or updates?


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Nothing so far today, going to try and grab some time in a little while, especially as his new saddle has arrived, got to go try it, but need to finish up some stuff first.


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## Oldhorselady (Feb 7, 2012)

I agree...shoulder to shoulder....language between horse and human is very clear there. It is like a dog to heal. You don't see well trained dogs behind or in front of their human...why should a 1000 pound horse, that can really hurt you?

If your horse begins to speed ahead of you, back him up with the end of your lead rope across the chest....if your horse starts to drag behind then push him forward with the end of the lead rope from behind. He will need to understand what the lead rope means at first with training or using other aids...but eventually the language will be that light. As soon as the horse feels any pressure on the lead rope from going too far forward or behind, he should slow his pace down too. Never put pressure on the lead rope when he is where he needs to be. The horse should be trained to respect you and always reading your body language....just like he does with his mother or the herd. You need to think 'horse'. If my horse was to balk and back up...I would give him the same energy backwards and past where we started...then lead again...rewarding him with calm energy as long as he is with me....shoulder to shoulder.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Can we really make comparisons between dog and horse? I think not their instincts and reactions are completely different so I don't think this is to relevant.

Again, I don't want a horse dragging behind, anyone that drags will get chased up, but I am comfortable with someone moseying along behind, and slightly to one side.....if we are going to play the comparison game, like a dutiful wife in such cultures as require the woman to be behind:lol::lol:


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## Oldhorselady (Feb 7, 2012)

Golden Horse said:


> Can we really make comparisons between dog and horse? I think not their instincts and reactions are completely different so I don't think this is to relevant.
> 
> Again, I don't want a horse dragging behind, anyone that drags will get chased up, but I am comfortable with someone moseying along behind, and slightly to one side.....if we are going to play the comparison game, like a dutiful wife in such cultures as require the woman to be behind:lol::lol:


I am not making the comparrison saying that dogs and horses are anything alike...they are actually opposites. What I was saying is that well trained working dogs are taught to walk along side...not drag behind or ahead....and they aren't even capable of walking on top of you and seriously hurting you in the process. Bad analogy maybe.


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## Silent one (Aug 22, 2011)

HagonNag said:


> Tossing my 2 cents in here: My horse came to me with a heads up...MAKE ME DO IT attitude. He wouldn't lead. So...using the theory that you make the right thing easy and the wrong thing hard, I backed him up. Continually. We backed into the stall. We backed out of the stall. We backed into the paddock, pasture, round pen. We backed everywhere. At the end of a few days that horse was PATHETICALLY grateful to go forward. I've owned him 7 years now and the issue has never cropped up again. He leads beautifully.
> 
> They're bigger than we are so we have no choice but to be smarter! LOL


Hahaha! I had that issue once with a filly I was breaking. Only she would lead, she just wouldn't go forward under saddle! She would only go backwards. So ok, backwards it is! After a few sessions of backward riding, she was quite pleased to go forward, LOL! (I'd almost forgot about that till I saw your post, thanks for prompting a funny memory!)


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Good news bad news.

Good news, he was so much better today, couple of hesitations in the round pen, but really good on the walk to the barn.

In fact MORE than good, considering that there was a new 40ft auger that had appeared in the yard, and the JD Gator was parked in the way, he looked, very carefully but barely hesitated, good boy.

Bad news, the new saddle doesn't fit:twisted::twisted: It's to wide, sits down to far and there is like a 2" wither clearance and that's before my fat butt gets on there.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Oh man.. is the saddle returnable? 

I'm glad he was a good boy while leading though!!! Gotta love progress!


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

The saddle stays for now, it may fit one of the girls who are coming home this week, if it doesn't then I've got no worries getting my money out of it again, it was a steal of a deal, it's a lovely saddle:wink:


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

You need to update your horses list ;P


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## Oldhorselady (Feb 7, 2012)

Would a riser pad help?


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Half pad *may* reduce the wideness but not a good idea for long term use. Hopefully it'll fit one of these mysteries "girls" you mentioned..


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Skyseternalangel said:


> You need to update your horses list ;P



Lots of updates when everything is a done deal, I am very excited right now, like a kid waiting for Christmas, 2 more sleeps until they come home:happydance:


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

A Be Nice halter works really well in these situations. When they pull back they put pressure on the poll, when they stop the pressure lets up, saves wear and tear on a bad shoulder. I've had a couple horses that had to have the Be Nice halter on for a few times and they all gave up on pulling back in ANY situation once they'd learned that pulling back gave them sharp, instant feed back.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Well this is truly humbling, 3rd day of addressing the issue instead of kind of putting up with it, and we are already 90% there, don't worry I know we are going to have set backs still. 

Makes you think about good horses gone bad, Ben is very sweet, but very smart, and this could of so easily turned into a real nightmare....


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Golden Horse said:


> Well this is truly humbling, 3rd day of addressing the issue instead of kind of putting up with it, and we are already 90% there, don't worry I know we are going to have set backs still.
> 
> Makes you think about good horses gone bad, Ben is very sweet, but very smart, and this could of so easily turned into a real nightmare....


Excellent news!

See now you know first hand what it is like for someone to experience the two faced horse.

One face is revealed with a trainer or competent handler..

The other face is the face revealed when someone either doesn't know what they're doing (we've all been there, LOL) or they know their handler is a pushover.

You are neither, but isn't it funny how horses are? They just need the right answer consistently given to them and they're fine. Let something slip once, and the other face shows itself! And it's ugly!


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

:thumbsup::thumbsup:

Yesterday I was able to lead Mr G and Ben down to the other field, and Ben was as good as gold. Just shows how easy it is to correct an issue, but also how easy it would of been to wait to long and never be able to fix it.

As to the saddle,  it fits both new girls, as promised, intros on this thread http://www.horseforum.com/horse-pictures/introducing-willow-emmy-lots-pics-126977/#post1548915


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