# Opinions about buying a horse with arthritis



## DixieKate (Oct 16, 2012)

I've been working towards buying a horse that I have been working with for about 2 months now. We went on a long trail ride in the beginning, and she came up lame. The vet said that she believes she has arthritis due to a positive flexion test. 

The good part of this situation is that this horse belongs to the daughter of the woman I've been leasing from for 3 years, so it is a very informal purchase (or attempt at a purchase)

She is a 10 year old paint mare
She is a teensy bit overweight, which we're working on now
She was broke and spent 90 days with a trainer, and then training continued for the years after that by the woman I lease from (who has owned and trained horses for 40+ years) 
This woman birthed this mare, so I know where she's been for her whole life, which seems to be a good thing based on some stuff I've read on here. 
She's extremely intelligent and very light on the cues. She has wonderful ground manners, comes when she's called from the pasture (even without grain) She's very smooth and she's a total sweetheart. I'm torn because I'm totally in love with her, but I don't want to get into something I can't afford. 

I've been doing massage with her and feeding her apple cider vinegar, and she's been on MSM for the past 3 days. Overall, she's showing improvement every day. The past week or two she has been totally sound, with only slight signs of discomfort at a trot with a rider. However, I can tell she is not limping with a rider, just uncomfortable, so I've been working her lightly at a slow walk instead. 

My use for her would be pleasure riding. The most intense stuff I would ever do would probably be 5-6 hours of trail riding. I mostly like to play in the arena and go for a good lope in the open pasture for fun. I have never shown and don't plan to. 

Am I crazy? She was originally asking $1,500 for her and I said no way. I bargained with her for $1,000 over a 6 month payment plan, but that was before we knew she had arthritis.

In my mind I have a mental goal of having her completely sound, and be able to ride her without discomfort at all gaits by January 1st. We're taking her to a chiropractor/vet to get a second opinion next week. I've been doing massage, and I plan on continuing the MSM and ACV. 

Should I walk away? Can arthritic horses make good trail horses over rough terrain for multiple hours if their arthritis is under control? Should I push to pay less money since she has arthritis? If so, how much should I ask for? This would be my first horse and I feel like I'm fortunate to get to work with her because what if I were to buy another horse that seemed fine and turns out to have arthritis or something worse later? I feel like buying a horse is a little bit of a gamble no matter what...I don't know. :?

I've attached some pictures

Thanks for all the help.


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## Reno Bay (Jul 8, 2012)

Aside from the flexion test, was there anything else done to confirm arthritis?

A horse _should_ take a couple odd steps right after having their legs held. As someone said on another post, think about how you would feel if you had been sitting on your leg for a period of time and then tried to run on it. Now, if the entire run she was moving oddly then I would do other tests to confirm arthritis. I would also be more inclined to pass on a horse that moved perfectly the entire time, as that _could_ point to the horse being drugged.

She's gorgeous.

And even if she does have arthritis, if you take care of her properly it doesn't have to be debilitating. We have two 20+ Andalusian geldings with arthritis at the farm I board at. One of them had a fractured hip when he was younger as well. BOTH of those boys are still getting high 60s in dressage and we never come home with worse than a red ribbon. So if these old guys can still do that, this mare can definitely handle trails.


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## DixieKate (Oct 16, 2012)

I skipped the x-rays because I know they are expensive and I wanted to talk to Pattie (the woman I mentioned previously) about what the vet said and she what she thinks about it. 

Her and I both are fans of holistic type treatments, which is why we're giving her ACV and MSM right now with her grain. In the past 2 months she has only improved, which is why I feel hopeful. Also, she was only lame in her hind left leg and only slightly visible at a trot. She hasn't been lame this week at all though, which is encouraging, and I'm still riding her lightly.

I'm now wondering if I should get the x-rays done to confirm arthritis or show something else. Her joints do pop periodically which is another reason I think it is arthritis. 

About 3 years ago she had an abscess that got REALLY infected and popped open on the leg that she's stiff on, and I can feel the scar tissue, which is something else I wonder about. 

Thank you Reno_Bay for your kind comments.


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## CattieD (Nov 6, 2012)

It's very odd that she has it at 10 years of age, it only occurs if they've worked very hard. Like constantly turning at high speeds like when you play Polocrosse. I say it's odd cause if she is really 10 she's in her prime. My suggestion would be that if you do buy her keep her in steady work (keeps her joints and muscles firm) and to feed her a supplement. Also in winter I've found it helps to keep their legs wrapped or put floating boots on them (not the ones that go above the knees though) and to not stable them because that will mean they won't move much and stiffen up. Also as mentioned above I'd get someone else's to look at her. Also if you can get her for $1000 you'll have yourself a steal 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cowgirls Boots (Apr 6, 2011)

I probably wouldn't because my mare has it and she is supposed to be ridden or lunged everyday to stretch her out because she gets very stiff. I have her on previcox and cosequin and she's only 13. She's only servicably sound and has her days that are off. She does better if ridden everyday but I haven't ridden her since summer due to a different issue with her hoof. She still tears around the pasture like a maniac but it is quite expensive to keep up so me prepared.

Goodluck!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Kayty (Sep 8, 2009)

I'd get xrays to be sure. They're not that expensive, and definitely worth it for piece of mind!

Which joint/s does the vet think is arthritic? 
If it's only mild boney changes, she may be fine with ACV/MSM and some magnetic therapy (boots). If it's more severe, or combined with bone spurs, then you'll be looking more towards regular IM injections, or joint injections depending on the severity, to keep the joint lubricated. When they're at that stage - ACV and MSM will barely help at all. MSM is also more of a preventative measure, than a treatment. My 2 year old has been on MSM since a yearling as a preventative.


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## DixieKate (Oct 16, 2012)

CattieD said:


> It's very odd that she has it at 10 years of age, it only occurs if they've worked very hard. Like constantly turning at high speeds like when you play Polocrosse. I say it's odd cause if she is really 10 she's in her prime. My suggestion would be that if you do buy her keep her in steady work (keeps her joints and muscles firm) and to feed her a supplement. Also in winter I've found it helps to keep their legs wrapped or put floating boots on them (not the ones that go above the knees though) and to not stable them because that will mean they won't move much and stiffen up. Also as mentioned above I'd get someone else's to look at her. Also if you can get her for $1000 you'll have yourself a steal
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I was thinking that it was odd that she would have arthritis at 10 years old as well. She has only done trails and arena work, and nothing extremely strenuous, and she had never been lame before aside from when she had that infection, up until after the trail ride. I keep wondering if maybe it's something else...like getting kicked and knocked out of place. That's why I'm hoping the chiropractor will help.


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## CattieD (Nov 6, 2012)

Try muscle therapy as well cause it may be both. If you can I would also once you've bought her recommend if its still bothering you and her and you still haven't found out the cause get X-rays. Another thing to remember is she is a mare so you can breed from her. Also do you no for sure what joint it's in?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DixieKate (Oct 16, 2012)

Kayty said:


> I'd get xrays to be sure. They're not that expensive, and definitely worth it for piece of mind!
> 
> Which joint/s does the vet think is arthritic?
> If it's only mild boney changes, she may be fine with ACV/MSM and some magnetic therapy (boots). If it's more severe, or combined with bone spurs, then you'll be looking more towards regular IM injections, or joint injections depending on the severity, to keep the joint lubricated. When they're at that stage - ACV and MSM will barely help at all. MSM is also more of a preventative measure, than a treatment. My 2 year old has been on MSM since a yearling as a preventative.


The hock for sure and I don't remember if she said the stifle or the fetlock. Since she's not consistently lame, could that be a sign that it just the beginnings? Would bone spurs cause chronic lameness with no good days? 

She's kept on pasture for about 8 hours a day, brought in with grain and spends the night in a pen with 2 other horses with plenty of room to move around, just no food. 

Right now, with school and a full time job, I'm out there 3-5 days a week. I get my degree in December, so after that I'll likely be able to go out there every day. She's very playful with the other horses, cantering around in the pasture.

Since the chiropractor is a vet as well, I'm thinking about asking her to do x-rays. She also does acupuncture so I'm going to ask her about that as well, maybe where the scar tissue is from her old wound.


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## CattieD (Nov 6, 2012)

if its the stifle steady work keeps it loose and they are generally fine as long as they stay in steady work. My aunty has a gelding with a stifle problem and he is just uncomfortable if he's not worked and just pulled out of the paddock for a joy ride. It doesn't hurt him he's just not as balanced and it pops sometimes. I'd def. get someone who doesn't no either you or the current owner to take a look. As their less likely to lie to you to promote the buying of the mare. Also they won't have an interest in either the saler or the buyer in the situation. I'd also google different remedies once you know what is wrong. The mare that I have previously posted about that has the one working ovary has ring bone in both her front feet. It doesn't hurt or effect her as long as we roll her toes and feed her a supplement called proflex. We've also had her specially treated where they break away the calcified bone and break it up with a special machine. She is perfectly sound as long as we do these things and keep on top of it. I will attach photos of the mare in a different post


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

She is pretty young to have all these issues, IMO. I guess it depends on how much maintenance you want for the years to come. My old guy didn't really develop arthritis until 18 or there abouts, and he is serviceable sound, just no longer has a left lead(he is uncomfortable and I don't force it). As long as you know the issues and are willing to accept that, that is totally your decision. I think she is young to have the possibility of limited use.


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## jamesqf (Oct 5, 2009)

Couple of questions here. You said you went on a long trail ride in the beginning. Was she used to that level of work? Think how you might feel if someone sent you out on a 10 mile hike with a 40 pound pack on your back, when you had just been lounging around home for the last few months. Wouldn't you feel pretty stiff & sore? 

And if she was out of shape, did you tell the vet about the long ride?


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## DixieKate (Oct 16, 2012)

She was doing that kind of work for a long time, and then she sat in a pasture for 6 months. I worked with her in the arena, lungeing and riding between a walk and a canter for about a week before the trail ride. I probably should have worked with her more, but we weren't planning on doing such a rough trail. We found some other riders and they showed us some new trail that was a little rougher than we had planned for. 

I did tell the vet about her time off, how much I worked with her before the trail, and the long trail ride.


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## PaintedMare (Nov 7, 2012)

if arthritis is confirmed i would walk away. arthritis doesnt go away and later on will end up spreading. the long trail rides could be too much for a horse with arthritis plus in a few years youll have to get more supplements and probably shots once a month from the vet to help with it. the only reason i would get her is if she was what i call a love horse. a horse that you have a relationship with that you wouldnt want to loose.


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## DixieKate (Oct 16, 2012)

PaintedMare said:


> if arthritis is confirmed i would walk away. arthritis doesnt go away and later on will end up spreading. the long trail rides could be too much for a horse with arthritis plus in a few years youll have to get more supplements and probably shots once a month from the vet to help with it. the only reason i would get her is if she was what i call a love horse. a horse that you have a relationship with that you wouldnt want to loose.


That's the problem I'm having. I'm absolutely in love with her. We have this bond that's unlike any other horse I've ridden, and if that wasn't there, it would be easier for me to walk away.


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## SlideStop (Dec 28, 2011)

10 is awfully young to have arthritis. If your worried about negotiating $500 price difference I would pass on this horse. The maintenance is expensive! Supplements, joint injections, x-rays, bute, magnetic devices, led light blankets... The list goes on. Then when she is to arthritic to be ridden? She will still need somewhere to live, food, shoes, supps, meds, etc. Then will you be able to afford another while paying for the maintenance of this one? 

A horse with visible arthritic changes this young is probably going to be a money pit! If you dead set I would get set if xrays on not only the joints that are effected but on the ones that aren't as well.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jamesqf (Oct 5, 2009)

DixieKate said:


> She was doing that kind of work for a long time, and then she sat in a pasture for 6 months. I worked with her in the arena, lungeing and riding between a walk and a canter for about a week before the trail ride.


I'm not a vet, but translating human experience into horse muscles, I would GUESS that it's a lot more likely to just be soreness from overwork.


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## DixieKate (Oct 16, 2012)

Thanks for the advice.


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## DixieKate (Oct 16, 2012)

jamesqf said:


> I'm not a vet, but translating human experience into horse muscles, I would GUESS that it's a lot more likely to just be soreness from overwork.


This is what I'm wondering as well. Could joint misalignment (she's a little crooked) and overwork cause joint pain and popping temporarily?


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

Could you lease her or would the owner allow you to work with her and condition her? That might help you sort it out better, unless you want to get films done.....If she is "crooked" I would call a chiro to look at her and help sort it out. Can't hurt. I have a chiro who I actually prefer to a vet for lameness issues. She is much more astute at seeing the slightest gimp, ones that are imperceptible to me for sure.

Too bad you are so far away-she travesla LOT, but I think she sticks to the East Coast, perhaps Ohio.......


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## DixieKate (Oct 16, 2012)

franknbeans said:


> Could you lease her or would the owner allow you to work with her and condition her? That might help you sort it out better, unless you want to get films done.....If she is "crooked" I would call a chiro to look at her and help sort it out. Can't hurt. I have a chiro who I actually prefer to a vet for lameness issues. She is much more astute at seeing the slightest gimp, ones that are imperceptible to me for sure.
> 
> Too bad you are so far away-she travesla LOT, but I think she sticks to the East Coast, perhaps Ohio.......


So far, the owner has given me freedom to work her as I please, which is what I have been doing. We have a chiropractor appointment on Thursday next week, to have her checked out. This woman is well known for her abilities, as she is also a vet and does acupuncture. Many people have recommended her, including the farrier. I've emailed her about also doing x-rays while we are at the clinic. My plan is to have her "adjusted" and have some x-rays to either confirm or deny arthritis. If she does have arthritis, I'm going to walk away, but I'll likely keep working with her until I get a horse/the owner sells her to someone else. Hopefully, it is all related to being misaligned and overworked and pulling a muscle or 2 and straining a joint. We'll find out for sure next Thursday. I know x-rays are expensive, but so many people said they would walk away from arthritis, that it is better to have a clear cut answer and to remove all speculation, and to know that yes, she has arthritis which is more than I can afford, or no she doesn't, and it is safe to move forward.


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## Kayty (Sep 8, 2009)

DixieKate said:


> That's the problem I'm having. I'm absolutely in love with her. We have this bond that's unlike any other horse I've ridden, and if that wasn't there, it would be easier for me to walk away.


Get her xrayed before making ANY decisions. Honestly, it's a fw dollars out of your pocket but will save you years of heart ache. 
I just wish that I'd had my previous horse xrayed. He came up sound in a flexion test, and 6 months later was lame, had xrays and found to have bone spurs and arthritic changes in his hock. I ADORED this horse, I've had many horses previously, but Hugo was definitely my favourite. 
I spent over 18 months trying to 'fix' him, and close to $10 000 in the process on various treatments. 
In the end, he ruptured his suspensory ligament in the paddock, and while on box rest, within only 1 1/2 weeks of having to weight bare more on his hind legs, his hock swelled up and became problematic again. I ended up having to put him down. 

Just get this horse xrayed and don't make a stupid mistake like I did, buying with my heart and not my head. Hugo was only 6 when I bought him, but had had 32 starts on the track. I was a fool to not xray him. 
Don't make the same mistake, or you will end up broken hearted and very much out of pocket. There will always be another horse that you 'click' with. My 2 year old is that horse for me.


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## CLaPorte432 (Jan 3, 2012)

I personally would never buy a horse knowing it had arthritis. It wouldn't even matter if it was very minor and barely affected the horse.

I have a 5 year old that has a severe onset of arthritis and a part of her bone is now gone. Her athletic ability has been diminished. I bought her as a barrel horse, and chances are, she'll never step foot into an arena because of this.

I did not buy her this way. She was injured (kicked perhaps) and an infection took over, then arthritis set in.

She is on weekly/biweekly/monthly IM injections of Pentosan, and gets oral meds to help with any pain. (MSM/Gluclosamine/Chondroitin) She's on 6 months of rest before I can *maybe* ride her.

It's NOT fun dealing with this type of horse and it costs A LOT of money...I have put thousands of dollars into this mare and I've ridden her 5 times and owned her since August 31. It's not the type of situation I wanted, or would ever wish on anyone else.

Seriously, GET XRAYS. If they come back bad, WALK AWAY. No matter how much in love with this horse that you are.


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## busysmurf (Feb 16, 2012)

Ok, I'm just going to tell you my experience w/ my horse who has arthritis and you can take what you need out of it:wink:

I bought Odie as a 3 yr old as an all-around horse. We showed strictly all-around for 2 years and then switched to barrels when I realized that he was NEVER going to shorten his stride for WP. Because I was serious about running, and he was having diffuculty turning to the left, I started having a chiro come out. His pelvis was "locked", she would "unlock" it, but it never got better. So we took him in for x-rays. The x-rays showed that his left femur is a few cm shorter than his right, BUT his illium is cm longer on the left than the right. Basically, his legs are the same length, but the joints aren't even so they break at different points. Because this is how he was born, arthritis had started to develop. 

The diagnosis ended his barrel career, because his butt would never be able to handle the stresses of racing. However, he is perfectly able to continue as a huntseat horse.

He's almost 22 now and has NEVER EVER taken a lame step due to the arthritis outside of a flexion test (then he will take 2 missteps, and then he's fine). Now that he's older, he does take awhile longer to warm up and get all the stiffness out, but he's 110% rideable.

I know some on here list a large amount of meds, treatments, etc for their arthritic horses. And I've worked with horses like that as well, BUT as maintenance for Odie's arthritis I pay a grand total of.....wait for it....wait for it...$36 on a senior supplement w/ xtra arthritis stuff in it. Next summer it will go up a little because I'm going to start having a chiro come out so my daughter can ride/show.

So in a nutshell, *in my experience* even a young horse can get arthritis, but still be considered sound (if I hadn't gotten x-rays, and just stayed w/ all-around I still wouldn't know he has arthritis). Definately get the x-rays, BUT even if they show some arthritis, ask the vet about the prognosis. Having arthritis isn't always a death sentence. 

Just my 2 cents on the topic:wink::wink:


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## Gaberto (Nov 13, 2012)

*A lot of good points made here*

Thanks for the input even though I didn't ask the question. I am looking at the same situation with purchasing an older horse.

I am also trying to get my 5 posts so that I can actually contact someone about a horse i am interested in.


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## DixieKate (Oct 16, 2012)

I contacted the vet who came out to do her lameness exam and I told her that Rain has been doing better and has been sound for about 2 weeks. I asked if she would come do a pre-purchase exam and take x-rays so that I would have a clear picture of what is going on. I told her I like evidence and I would feel better about walking away if I had real hard evidence, rather than speculation, even if it was more money than I intended to spend. Hopefully I'll know by next week.


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## jamesqf (Oct 5, 2009)

DixieKate said:


> This is what I'm wondering as well. Could joint misalignment (she's a little crooked) and overwork cause joint pain and popping temporarily?


Don't know about horses, but it sure can for me


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## jamesqf (Oct 5, 2009)

Just to add that I think I can second busysmurf's experience. Ellie (now 19) was diagnosed as having a bit of arthritis and a malformed hip joint a couple of years ago (in addition to a serious leg injury), yet I started riding her this spring. We've worked up to maybe 8-10 mile trail rides. Once she's warmed up, she wants to trot a lot, canter some, even worked up to a bit of a gallop last weekend. Then when she's unsaddled at home, she'll go running up the hill in the corral to get to her rolling spot, So she surely isn't crippled, She gives every evidence of enjoying our rides, even though I'm an absolute beginner, and (at 6' and close to 200 lbs) not by any means a light weight for her to carry.


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## Prinella (Jul 12, 2011)

My qh mare was 14 when diagnosed. She's now 17. I found the right supplement (technyflex) and she's perfectly sound. I can take her out for 4-5 hours lots of hard riding over hard ground and she's fine. She pulls up better then I do that's for sure!

She jumps no problem though not sure she'll ever do 5ft again. 

I'd definately get the vets opinion on this one though!


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## PaintedMare (Nov 7, 2012)

If u have that bond then i would get her. Itll take a little more upkeep but it will be worthit. If my mare had problems before i bought her i would have bought her anyway. Shes in my care and as long as im alive she will have everything she needs even when she gets to the point she cant be ridden. That bond is hard to find and worth every bit of work that comes with it.


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## DixieKate (Oct 16, 2012)

So, I've made my decision. She has been sound for the past two weeks, so I was going to schedule x-rays and get a clear cut answer. Well, I grabbed her from the pasture today and tacked her and warmed her up on the ground and she was worse than ever. So lame today, and she's been at pasture and didn't do any work yesterday. I've been doing a lot of inner reflection and I'm so busy that if I'm going to own a horse, I want to be able to ride as much as I want for as long as I want every time I go out there. There is no point in having a horse that is lame half the time I want to ride, with expensive upkeep, and unable to ride trails like I want to do. I told the owner and she said she totally understood. So the search continues...I'm going to keep exercising her when she's sound until I find a horse/the owner sells her. It sucks but I feel like I'm making the right decision.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

I think you're making the right decision too. You can still mess with her whenever you want, right? So that's something. One thing that I was going to mention before you made your decision is that 10 is awfully young to have a consistent mechanical lameness, regardless of whether it's from arthritis or something else. There are a lot of horses her age and younger that have arthritis from being used hard, but it doesn't cause lameness in them, only a slight hint of stiffness before warming them up.

For her to have such problems that don't work themselves out within just a few minutes of warm-up, then it's something more serious than just slight arthritis and would likely require extensive and expensive treatment to keep her sound...if you could keep her sound at all.

I'm sorry that you aren't able to get her, especially since she's such a nice horse, but you are making the right decision for the long term.


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