# Is my horse ready for the cart?



## ounominece (Nov 10, 2012)

hi guys, I have a high strung 2 year old colt who has been working on harness for the past few months. On Sunday we are going to buy a cart and my dad thinks I am going to die from him. well when we bought the harness I might have believed him because he was 1 then and did not know the controls and always tried to over power you. well I took care of that. I slowly thought him the comandes and now he knows them nicely, and for the over powering I put a bit on the harness. no he doesn't dare try pulling away because of a pull on his jaw. now he has manners with the harness but the only problem I have is he rubs his head on every thing so it is running the bridle. any suggestions?

My dad also thinks he will take off with me in it and I won't be able to stop him. once again, the bit. Times I would have lost contol I have been able to stop him within about 10 feet. any thoughts?

Last I would like to shoe him in jumping next year or cart in 2 years because he is good in both.(he once jumped his run ins barn gate with was 3 and a 1/2 feet high I did not know he did it til he ran past me so he did not hit it and he will not jump it again.) I live in mid Michigan and need someone to help me for little or nothing. ( i know it probably wont happen if they could do it for money, but I really would like it) just let me know if you know anyone who is willing to come to my house and do it.


Thank you!


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## Clayton Taffy (May 24, 2011)

Your horse is probably not ready for a cart yet.

You need to do some more ground driving him, and pulling some stuff on the ground, like tires or logs.
You need to also work with him in "pretend shafts" made out of PVC pipe or 2X2's, put the pretend shafts on him and work with that quite a bit.
If your horse is not totally ok with the cart it will be disaster.

You might consider getting him gelded, that would calm him down a lot. You know the saying, "An okay stallion makes a great gelding"

He is still young, Keep ground driving him through the cold winter up in MI, and you might be ready in the spring.

I don't know anyone in MI, maybe you could look for a driving club in your area to learn some information from. MI clubs are listed at the bottom of this page:
American Driving Society

As for jumping, it sounds like you have a nice horse. To help keep him nice and his legs healthy, I wouldn't ride a horse till it is almost 3 and you deffinatly should not jump a horse till 4 or 5.

Good luck to you and your horse!


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

I started my arab with a home made travois, an old Indian drag that the horse pulled when they moved camp. Two small diameter poll slide thro the loop then widen as they reach behind the horse to the ground. They need to be about 12' long. I just used poplar trees and nailed an 18" piece of plywood across, behind the horse so his heels won't strike it, and not touching the ground. I walked beside it ready to slip it out of the loops if he panicked. It get them used to feeling confined between the shafts and the noise of it dragging on the ground. The traces are looped over the horse's back and secured as you don't want to use them at this time. The first time you ask him to turn it could get a little touchy as he feels the shaft press against his ribcage so make the turns wide. If you have to haul on his mouth to get him to stop, you're doing it all wrong.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

I agree you are not ready. He shouldn't be running off for 10' and you shouldn't be allowing him to rub on things. When you have a cart and he is scared and the adrenalin is rushing the bit won't matter.


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## ounominece (Nov 10, 2012)

Taffy Clayton said:


> Your horse is probably not ready for a cart yet.
> 
> You need to do some more ground driving him, and pulling some stuff on the ground, like tires or logs.
> You need to also work with him in "pretend shafts" made out of PVC pipe or 2X2's, put the pretend shafts on him and work with that quite a bit.
> ...


One thing is, he is a mini that is almost 10 hh. he is a monster to the other stallion who is only 28''. Everyday I work him out weather it might be in jumping or harness and when he jumps it has to be loner than 6 inches and over 2 feet high before he becomes interested in the jumps. and for the harness, if he cant find something to rub on within a heads distant he rubs on me if I get close to his head for some reason. Also I just don't relay on the bit alone, the bridle has a nose band so it pulls an that more than the bit.


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## ounominece (Nov 10, 2012)

maybe later today I can get a pic of him in the harness, I took the bit off a few days ago so I could use it on the other stallion who has k9 teeth. (they grew in in the spring) and I forgot to say I wont geld him because of his amazing bloodline. His Great grand father is Boones Little Buckaroo and his grand father Little Kings Black Velvet. And his fathers name is Knells Velvet Winning Ways who had won a few local shows
*
*


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

you shouldn't allow him to rub on you you need to learn how to teach them some ground manners and that will help your driving also


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## ounominece (Nov 10, 2012)

this is him as of dunning summer


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## ounominece (Nov 10, 2012)

I got the cart last night and hooked him up. he was great! he did not fight it at all! But he always wants to go slow, and when I get him going in a canter he slows down to a trot at the slightest command, but when we are at a fast trot he wants to keep going, same when he stops he just doesn't want to.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

ounominece said:


> I got the cart last night and hooked him up. he was great! he did not fight it at all! But he always wants to go slow, and when I get him going in a canter he slows down to a trot at the slightest command, but when we are at a fast trot he wants to keep going, same when he stops he just doesn't want to.


 So you ask for advice if he was ready to hitch and not one person thought he was. So you hitch anyway and you ask him to canter the 1st time hitched? This thread is ridiculous and I think you 
are full of it.


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## Endiku (Dec 6, 2010)

O_O ^ agreed. I have been driving my four year old miniature horse mare for almost a year now, and she's been out to drive a total of 43 times now. I STILL haven't even BEGUN to ask her to canter yet, and really don't even ask her for more than a nice, even, rounded trot for more than a minute or two. I probably still wont ask her for a canter for another four or five months because I dont feel like she can handle it mentally (we're still working on flexation and driving off of her hind end, not her shoulders) and she doesnt have the right muscle yet for it physically. No way I would of cantered her TWO YEARS AGO. Heck, I hadn't even started ground driving her yet at that point!

If your colt is only two years old and still doesnt respect you, I'm suprised he didn't kill you last night when you hooked him up. I'm on the side of your father, and wish that he wouldn't have bought you the cart. Your horse is a baby. I personally dont think that two year olds should even be hooked up to a cart, much less actually driven by someone, much less driven at a canter.

I very much hope that you or your colt don't get hurt, but it you continue in this way it is inevitable at some point...


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Endiku said:


> O_O ^ agreed. I have been driving my four year old miniature horse mare for almost a year now, and she's been out to drive a total of 43 times now. I STILL haven't even BEGUN to ask her to canter yet, and really don't even ask her for more than a nice, even, rounded trot for more than a minute or two. I probably still wont ask her for a canter for another four or five months because I dont feel like she can handle it mentally (we're still working on flexation and driving off of her hind end, not her shoulders) and she doesnt have the right muscle yet for it physically. No way I would of cantered her TWO YEARS AGO. Heck, I hadn't even started ground driving her yet at that point!
> 
> If your colt is only two years old and still doesnt respect you, I'm suprised he didn't kill you last night when you hooked him up. I'm on the side of your father, and wish that he wouldn't have bought you the cart. Your horse is a baby. I personally dont think that two year olds should even be hooked up to a cart, much less actually driven by someone, much less driven at a canter.
> 
> I very much hope that you or your colt don't get hurt, but it you continue in this way it is inevitable at some point...


I don't even believe it's the real post . at first they can't spell and then the last poster spelling was very good


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## Endiku (Dec 6, 2010)

That is true...well for their sake, I'm hoping you're right. >.>


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## ounominece (Nov 10, 2012)

churumbeque said:


> I don't even believe it's the real post . at first they can't spell and then the last poster spelling was very good


ok sorry typos, I did not see them till I posted it.


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## ounominece (Nov 10, 2012)

Endiku said:


> O_O ^ agreed. I have been driving my four year old miniature horse mare for almost a year now, and she's been out to drive a total of 43 times now. I STILL haven't even BEGUN to ask her to canter yet, and really don't even ask her for more than a nice, even, rounded trot for more than a minute or two. I probably still wont ask her for a canter for another four or five months because I dont feel like she can handle it mentally (we're still working on flexation and driving off of her hind end, not her shoulders) and she doesnt have the right muscle yet for it physically. No way I would of cantered her TWO YEARS AGO. Heck, I hadn't even started ground driving her yet at that point!
> 
> If your colt is only two years old and still doesnt respect you, I'm suprised he didn't kill you last night when you hooked him up. I'm on the side of your father, and wish that he wouldn't have bought you the cart. Your horse is a baby. I personally dont think that two year olds should even be hooked up to a cart, much less actually driven by someone, much less driven at a canter.
> 
> I very much hope that you or your colt don't get hurt, but it you continue in this way it is inevitable at some point...


my horse is probably much bigger that your mare, remember? 10 hands? since that picture he got a lot more musle. I built it by troting for about 100 yard at a time. ans we have to hills, one is steeper than the other but the ohther on is longer. I built it by running up the hills and also jumping helped to. (when I did this he did not even have the harness on.) and also i did not canter him till the 3rd and last work out on the seaconed days. and when he did it was only for about 30 seconds. It was only about 200 feet. and I just got in ffrom working whith him and the cart, not one thing did he refuse to do. At the slightest command he did what was asked.


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## Endiku (Dec 6, 2010)

Muscle and height have nothing to do with it. My mare is 9 hh, not much smaller than yours. Your horse is still very much a baby at 2 years old and in comparison to the amount of muscle he will/should have as an adult, he has very litte. 

I'm not so worried about his muscles though, as I am worried about his BONES. Two year olds are not done growing, even if they aren't getting taller. Their knees haven't closed up, their hips aren't done growing, and their spine isn't closed either. Putting stress on them can cause a lot of problems and may make him lame at a later age.

Honestly you really arent even supposed to jump them as two year olds. Again, bevcause of the bone.

It doesnt matter if he behaved beautifully (by the way, I think you're very lucky that he responded well to you) when you took him out. What matters is the damage that you might be doing to him by moving so far with him, and what might happen because he has holes in his training. Horses are unpredictable, and even a 10hh colt can do a LOT of damage. Its great that he's listening to you but you have to realize that by asking him to do SO MUCH as a baby, you're shortening the time that he'll be able to work well for you.. You're also depriving him of 'baby time.' Two year olds are very much like preteen humans. Work them too hard too fast and you'll ruin their love for work and learning. 

I can't make you listen to me, but believe me. Letting him do fun baby things and enjoying him while he's young will make it so much better later on. Working him hard now though with cause bad habits, physical problems, and likely even mental problems.

If you really want to drive him, hook him up and take a leisurely stroll. That probably won't hurt him too much, as long as you're careful. Work on how sensative he is to your aids, turning, backing up, etc. Also work on ground work and playing horsemanship 'games' with him. I guarentee that you'll have a much better horse in the long run.


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## charming (Aug 21, 2012)

I smell a troll...


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

charming said:


> I smell a troll...


 And alas the poor spelling returns.


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## ounominece (Nov 10, 2012)

Endiku said:


> Muscle and height have nothing to do with it. My mare is 9 hh, not much smaller than yours. Your horse is still very much a baby at 2 years old and in comparison to the amount of muscle he will/should have as an adult, he has very little.
> 
> I'm not so worried about his muscles though, as I am worried about his BONES. Two year olds are not done growing, even if they aren't getting taller. Their knees haven't closed up, their hips aren't done growing, and their spine isn't closed either. Putting stress on them can cause a lot of problems and may make him lame at a later age.
> 
> ...


I do this stuff with him all the time (I mean the games and letting him play and run.) and your acking like im sitting in the cart. I have not yet and I do not plan to for a while. The only thing we ever had in the cart was my friends 4 pound dog.


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## michaelvanessa (Apr 25, 2012)

*ground work*

i think you need a bit of ground work to bring him on long line him and get him to listen to you.
i think you gambled a bit weather he would bolt with you rule of thumb keep to a walk and a trot and when he has got all your comands and you can stop him with walk and woah and stand.
if you was on a highway would worry at that stage at canter as you both need to jell to geather in trust also cantering on hard ground with a young horse will dammage his joints and tendons in the future.
and also to take in acount as he is a 2 year old colt and he has still got to grow.
with a stallion you need to keep at him and give him a lot of training so you have a well mannored stallion with impecable mannors if you dont and a mare is near all hell could brake lose.
i use to drive tandem with vanessas mare and my gilding she was in the shafts as the wheeler and he was the leader there was loads of tracks in the forest here and i use to canter on the soft tracks.
i have some pictures in my albms of them in the indoor school.
before thay were driven on the highway ground work was done in the indoor school just my voice was used no wips at all and thats were ground ground work pays off.
the time was right and thay was working as a unit with no problems i decided thay were ready to go out in the wide world driveing in tandem.
and thay were driven singleley as well and thay both had impecable mannors as well.
im going to be working on my new big horse soon i have been long lineing him as well and he has impecable mannors to and i wont settle for less we all know were we stand and dew to ground work we both understand each other and what is required as pony horse and human working togeather.
and educateing each other.


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## michaelvanessa (Apr 25, 2012)

*cantering a colt*

sorry did you say the only thing driveing 200 yards was a dog.
was your colt loose was well ? you must be very fit running beside him in canter longlineing.
i think you have lost us a little.
long line him and handle him let it be fun and educational and feed him tit bits as well.
i will say this again he is young and needs to grow.
and like the other drivers have said he is still a baby as thay have said as well as me if your driveing him at that age problems in later life will occure.
take it from me tammy was 34 years old when i lost her.
and my gilding tricky is nearley 28 years old and he will live to a ripe old age he was broken to harness at 3 years old that was long lineing in walk with him in harness ocasionley on a quiet blocked street and that was rewarded with titbits and in the shafts work time was limited to 15 minuits in walk in the shafts with me long lineing beside him giveing him comands and tit bits and all ways left the class educating him on a good note. 
as a reward he had his play time. 
i would not get him to jump as could make problens whilst in the shafts.
and jumping him could jar all his tendons and joints as well.
he needs to develop a lot more.


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