# OTTB Critique



## Halcyon (May 25, 2014)

I would love critique on this guy. Sorry they're not the best shots in the world.


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## elisie (Jun 30, 2014)

Aw, he's got such a sweet face! His pasterns (front especially) look a little long to me...I like his front shoulder. His right back leg looks like it could have the tendency to turn in, but it may just be the angle because in the close-up shot it doesn't look that way. Overall, I think he's a real cutie.


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## Halcyon (May 25, 2014)

Thanks  He's a darling horse, especially considering he's recently off the track--his behaviour is really pretty good. Here's a cute face shot:


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## Halcyon (May 25, 2014)

anyone else?


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## bitinsane (Jun 5, 2013)

Long pasterns, short neck, and he looks to be standing camped out in the back. Other than that I like everything else about him


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## Halcyon (May 25, 2014)

What does "camped out in the back" mean? Thank you!

ETA: Okay, just googled it. It may be the way he's standing just then; I will have to watch him and see if I notice it as a regular thing. Could this be related to his injury? (fractured sesamoid right front leg which is healing. Happened about 3-4 months ago)


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## Halcyon (May 25, 2014)

Does he look camped out in this photo? Will post a few more.


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## bitinsane (Jun 5, 2013)

Yes, a bit. something doesn't look right back there. It looks like he has a roach back which is making his hind end weak, but I'll wait and see what others think as well. No, I do not believe a fractured sesamoid on the right front would cause a horse to be camped out in the back.


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## Tryst (Feb 8, 2012)

I think in reality he is somewhat sickle hocked- so when he positions them behind himself it makes him look camped out (like in the first photo). 

He is moderately downhill with a fairly upright shoulder. Neck is on the shorter side. Good length of topline and strong coupling (I see a strong coupling rather than a roach). Front pasterns on the long side. Hooves are typical OTTB- long toes under run heels.


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

^This

Just wanted to add, he MAY have a very slight roach, it's hard to see from the pics I think. Nothing drastic either way. Nice short coupling though.

Specifically- I feel his rear pasterns are very upright and am surprised no one else said so.. maybe just the way he stands due to the angle of his back legs?

He's cute but I wouldn't do anything stressful with him.


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## Tryst (Feb 8, 2012)

I noticed the rear pasterns in the first shot, but in the grazing pics they don't look as upright to me, so kind of felt when he held his legs more under himself (which I am guessing is his normal stance) then the pasterns don't seem as upright, but agree they could be a point of concern.


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## Halcyon (May 25, 2014)

so upright pasterns mean what--i mean, what injuries might result from that? And does anyone else think he is sickle hocked?


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Halcyon said:


> so upright pasterns mean what--i mean, what injuries might result from that? And does anyone else think he is sickle hocked?


He does strike me as being sickle-hocked.

Pasterns are the horse's natural shock absorbers. Upright pasterns mean that less of the shock of cantering, running, landing after jumps, is absorbed by the pasterns (as it should be) and is then transferred up the cannon bone to the next available joint, which would be the hock. This puts more stress on that joint. 

As you can see, this gelding's pasterns are short, but upright in the rear (this is my old arab/NSH gelding). He was started jumping too early (18" crossrails as a 2.5yo) and jumped too much (competed aggressively until he started refusing fences at 5) and he ended up with horrible arthritis in both hocks. This is because all the shock and stress was transferred from his upright pasterns into his hocks. As a 11yo, he is now only sound as a VERY light trail horse (maybe once a week for an hour) for a very light rider.


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

Yes he is sickle hocked.





I do not like his legs (pasterns/angle of hind legs mostly) and would not do anything strenuous with him.

I don't like his shoulder/neck but those aren't so much soundness issues, so less important imo. The legs are a biggy.


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## ZaneyZanne123 (Nov 9, 2013)

I can put him on my grid but I need a good photo for that. I need him standing as square as you can get him esp in the front. Take the photo dead center of his body (between the withers and the point of hip bisecting him in the center.) make sure there are no shadows on the horse (light should be behind you.) Make sure is head/neck is not down, turned away or towards the camera nor raised but at standing level profile. Do not angle the cameras upwards or down wards. The more level you are to the horse the better. Be sure to include the entire horse. You might need to have someone hold him. Have fun.


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## ZaneyZanne123 (Nov 9, 2013)

With out putting him on a grid I can point out some of the things that show up visually .

yes he is a little sickled hock and his hock are a little small but they seem to be blemish free. I have seen worse. This is a weakness and are are predisposed to injury. 

His neck is a little short and is a little thick in the throat. But over all the head comes off of it rather nicely. He will be a little tight in the throat upon flexion but he shouldnt have that great of difficultly doing so. Now counter balancing in the neck will be a bit more of a challenege due to its length. At least the neck isnt over thick or thinnore is it ewed. It does come off the withers nicely though. He actualy has a decent TB head with well set eyes. 

The loins (lumbar region) are not roached but has an ever slight curve to them and seems to be evenly coupled with out excessive length. They seem to have good depth and are not weak. The hips are high with a tilted pelvis puting his femur at a steeper angle thus putting the entire hind end angled under and forward. His croup angle is actualy not bad at all. He should be able to get underneath himself pretty well. His stifle are a little high. His range of motion underhimself will be limiting. If they were lower he would have a very good triangular system. Albeit slightly angled forward but well enough. His short gaskin and high stifle makes the hind quarters APPEAR weak but they are in porportion to the body by my visual inspection. The grid lines can tell me more in specifics. For high set stifles dont appear to be tight. A good hind shot (with the tail braided up or knoted) can tell me more about the stifles tightness.

His shoulder is a bit upright wich pushes his leg back a little. If you draw a line from the point of elbow straight up past the withers you will find that the leg sits just behind the front of the withers. If the horse was standing square in the front I could put a line on his front leg to see how straight it actualy is. By visual examination (based on set and angle) I say the legs are pretty straight with a good clean flat knee. He has a prominant accessory carpal bone (the boney protrusion behind the knee) behind his knee and an uneducated or inexperienced person might make the mistake and say he is tied in behind the knee........he is not for the tendon shows even through out its length even by my visual inspection. He seems to have efficient amount of bone depth. His pasterns are a tad long but I dont see any furture problems. Does appear to have something going on with the right fetlock joint, it seems fuller esp towards the rear. Arthritic changes?????? Its subtle but its there. Just something to look into....it might just be a shadow. 

Over all not bad, seems to be pretty level built with perhaps a tad downward build but who can complain in that regard. Be glad of it. The grid can tell me more in that regard.


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## ZaneyZanne123 (Nov 9, 2013)

DraftyAiresMum said:


> He does strike me as being sickle-hocked.
> 
> Pasterns are the horse's natural shock absorbers. Upright pasterns mean that less of the shock of cantering, running, landing after jumps, is absorbed by the pasterns (as it should be) and is then transferred up the cannon bone to the next available joint, which would be the hock. This puts more stress on that joint.
> 
> As you can see, this gelding's pasterns are short, but upright in the rear (this is my old arab/NSH gelding). He was started jumping too early (18" crossrails as a 2.5yo) and jumped too much (competed aggressively until he started refusing fences at 5) and he ended up with horrible arthritis in both hocks. This is because all the shock and stress was transferred from his upright pasterns into his hocks. As a 11yo, he is now only sound as a VERY light trail horse (maybe once a week for an hour) for a very light rider.


 
This is also a good example of sickeld hocks with upright paterns. I can see arthritic changes in his right fetlock joint and the hocks angulation prediposes horse to excessive stress and breakdown. This horse's biggest problem wasnt only his pasterns but the hock angulation also. Drop a plumb line from the point of hock to the ground and one can definatly see the closed angulation of the hocks. Sickled hocks are not good on jumping horses. Sickled hocks with short upright pasterns are even worse.


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## Halcyon (May 25, 2014)

Thank you SO MUCH.. THis is all so extremely informative. I will try and get a better shot today--maybe bring a friend by so she can hold him. His father is an Irish warmblood--big winner on the tracks so he's definitely more muscley than a typical thoroughbred. Do you think that "thing" you see on his right fetlock could be a result of his right front sesamoid break? Thank you so much--you are very, very helpful.


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## Halcyon (May 25, 2014)

And by "nothing strenous" -would trail riding, ground work and no jumping be okay? Low jumping? He can't do anything now due to his injury--anything more than a walk and he starts limping, so we've got about 6 months or more of recovery time ahead of us.


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## Halcyon (May 25, 2014)

okay...i am hoping this is a better shot. lus I got a butt shot. thanks!!!


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## .Delete. (Jan 7, 2008)

Yogiwick said:


> ^This
> 
> Just wanted to add, he MAY have a very slight roach, it's hard to see from the pics I think. Nothing drastic either way. Nice short coupling though.
> 
> ...


This is the first thing I thought of. The fact that his angle of front to back pasterns are different is concerning. His back pasterns are very very upright. Where his front aren't so bad, they are also longer upfront.

His rear end looks uncomfortable.


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

ZaneyZanne123 said:


> This is also a good example of sickeld hocks with upright paterns. I can see arthritic changes in his right fetlock joint and the hocks angulation prediposes horse to excessive stress and breakdown. This horse's biggest problem wasnt only his pasterns but the hock angulation also. Drop a plumb line from the point of hock to the ground and one can definatly see the closed angulation of the hocks. Sickled hocks are not good on jumping horses. Sickled hocks with short upright pasterns are even worse.


Saddest part was that he LOVED to jump. He was trained as a hunter and if we had crossrails set up in the arena when we turned him out, he would jump them on his own. Poor guy is now basically a pasture pet (doesn't help that his owners insist on keeping him obese and consider him "skinny" when he's in good weight).


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## ZaneyZanne123 (Nov 9, 2013)

DraftyAiresMum: That is a case of good temperment, willingness and loats of heart and desire but lacks the conformation for the ong term. Its sad that ppl either refuse to educate themselves or ignore about teaching/training a horse (not jumping them so young) and not taking consideration of thier horse and keeping him within his physical level for the long haul. Esp with faults that can be detrimental when the horse is mature let alone stressing them when they are young.


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