# Let us put this to rest shall we?



## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

I take it you don't know his parents' colors?

I almost want to say smokey black, to be honest. If he had the cinnamon soft points, I'd say he was a brown. But, with the way he seems to kind of "fade", I think he very well could be a smokey black.

Interested to see what the real color gurus have to say...


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## Pidge (Sep 5, 2009)

No he has no papers, no clue as to parents or heritage. Best guess is he is an appendix...

Smokey black...hmmm...interesting...cant wait for more replies!!!


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Morgan Colors- Smoky Black Morgan Horses

Just as an example of how smokey blacks can vary...


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

seal brown.  smokey black.


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

stevenson said:


> seal brown.  smokey black.


Those aren't the same color, though. 

Genetically, seal brown is a variation of the agouti gene, represented with E__At__. Smokey black is a black-based horse with one cream gene, represented E__Crcr.


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## Chiilaa (Aug 12, 2010)

I don't see smoky to be honest. I see a fading black. However, the only way to be 100% that cream is not there is to test for it.


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## haviris (Sep 16, 2009)

From reading the description I expected brown, but just looks like a black to me, faded at times, but still black.


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

I would say black too……much the same color as my guy, who bleaches some in summer, but I am no guru.


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

I'm seeing black, fading black.


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

I see black or smoky black. If you're truly interested, test him for cream and that should solve your dilemma My original thought was brown, but he has no real brown points that don't look more bleached black than anything else.


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## paintmered (Jul 27, 2014)

He is black. As you can, in the winter, when he's not outside as much, he is really dark. But as soon as spring and summer roll around, he is brown on his back. He gets sun bleached! Its nothing to worry about its just like when our hair gets lighter in the summer. The only reason I can to this conclusion is because his nose is black and not brown.


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## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

For a grade horse, the color isn't that important on your Coggins. It just needs to be close enough to the color with a winter coat and with a summer coat so that somebody else can identify the horse. It's a lot like approximate weight on your driver's license. Nobody is gonna make you stand on a scale if you were speeding.
Color is an intensive argueing point among breeders, but that is bc foal color is worth money, so they want to be able to predict what _that_ foal will throw if bred in the future.
I say, call him "black". My "Black" horse changes colors like yours. =D


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

i guess i should have use the word OR . I was not implying they were teh same color. of course seal brown is not any shade of black.


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## Zexious (Aug 2, 2013)

Black.


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## squirrelfood (Mar 29, 2014)

If the muzzle is black, and there are no brown hairs in the flank area, (most of the time) then he is black. It isn't unusual for black to fade out like that.


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## Pidge (Sep 5, 2009)

Thanks guys! I have just heard so much variation! Black, black bay, brown, I even got liver chestnut once (crazy lady) lol I was curious what the opinions were. I put Black bay on his coggins so that in the winter when he is black it works and in the summer when he looks bay it works.

Since the majority says fading black or black I will take it!


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## Zexious (Aug 2, 2013)

Liver chestnut can actually get so dark that it appears black xD So not /too/ crazy


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## KigerQueen (Jun 16, 2013)

looks like my fiance's gelding. id say fading black.


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## Blue (Sep 4, 2011)

Fifty shades of....... Black?:rofl:
Seriously, where I'm from we'd say black


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