# AZ Horses need our help!!



## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

So how many of these horses have you_ personally_ seen that have actually died?


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

AL, from my understanding if you start a petition and get certain number of signatures under it, you can then submit to the governor for consideration. I _believe _something similar was done in past here in MD. However I also remember number of signatures was something quite ridiculous (measured in thousands). 

If you are concerned and the situation indeed is very bad you can try to involve local rescues and TV/radio to bring the situation to the people attention.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

"I have not been proud to live in Arizona for many years now..."

Well, I live here and am proud of my state. My horses use their shades for shelter from rain & snow. Most of the afternoon, they are out in the sun by their own choice.

California law is written in California, where they regulate everything to death. Having lived in Tehachapi, I think most of the state is fine, but SF & LA control the politics - emphasis on CONTROL!

Do I think all horses should have some sort of shelter? Yes. Do I think I need to pass laws to make it so? No. 

BTW: "Cost of Education may be high, but try ignorance!"

In my 53 years, I've seen no sign that formal education reduces ignorance. I think the $4500 I'm paying in property taxes this year is PLENTY. That is 1/12 of my income going almost exclusively to schools in Arizona, and it doesn't include the extra $300 I have to pay each year for fire protection. :shock: It also doesn't include my state income tax. Consider me Taxed Enough Already...and Mia agrees.

She has to. Otherwise, no hay!


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

bsms said:


> I think the $4500 I'm paying in property taxes this year is PLENTY.


****! How many acres do you have?? I always thought AZ is pretty cheap state when it comes to land...


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

kitten_Val said:


> ****! How many acres do you have?? I always thought AZ is pretty cheap state when it comes to land...


It depends on where you live, KV. Down by Phoenix and Tucson (in the cities), the property taxes are WAY higher than they are up north (about an hour and a half south of Flagstaff and two hours north of Phoenix) where I live.


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## Rowdy Girl (Aug 1, 2011)

I know of these horse's the OP posted and have seen them too many time's to count... and NO ! I dislike that our Animal Control does not cover this or ski's for hooves as well...... as long as there is hay and water, the owner is doing thier job to care for these horse's. And yes, I have called them in as well... and no, I have not seen dead livestock, but it is hard to tell if they are laying down if they are resting or dead... actually not to long ago, that rancher's hand was killed checking the fence line, by an auto that honked and the AVT he was riding hit a cattle guard skidded out of control, wasn't pretty, nice young fella...but that gives you the idea of how close some of these pen are to the road...I too am not proud of how horse's are taken care of in this state...but horse's are not the only one's suffering... all animal's and it's only gonna get worse..sadly It's very hard to turn a blind eye. 

Taxes, well I'm in the Mtg industry and I have a 2 acre lot and we pay less than 900 yearly , and I live in N.
Phx...I can say I have never seen taxes as high as $4500.00, but, then again, I do not do commerical loan's...if you have a lot acreage.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

Taxes:

My check for nearly $2200 covered the first half of this year's property taxes. My house is valued at under $250K ($2500/year), and I have two acres nearby where we hope to someday build a house ($1800 per year). The local schools get most of the money. And yes, fire protection costs extra, on top of the property taxes and state income tax.

I just checked Pima County's website, and my sister's house on the east side of Tucson - the house we grew up in, built in 1970 - is assessed at $130K. Her tax bill was $1,763.27 this year ($881.63/half). So in proportion, I'm paying less than the folks in Tucson, I guess...for my house alone. The two acres I want to build on are taxed at a higher rate.

Pima County has high property taxes. It also has twice the debt of all the other counties in Arizona combined. I would cry for joy to only pay $900/year in property taxes!

Horses:

I think all horses should have shade and shelter. However, I don't think they will die without it. My gelding was from a ranch in Utah. Any shelter was from trees, and there were not many of them. It hits 100 in Utah too, and drops to well below zero.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

kitten_Val said:


> ****! How many acres do you have?? I always thought AZ is pretty cheap state when it comes to land...


Here is an example. I don't know who owns the house, but it is one we looked at buying once some years back so I've been inside. It is an older home, not all that well cared for but in a quiet neighborhood. It is in Corona de Tucson, about 20 miles south of Tucson. It has 1900 sq ft, on 0.25 acres IIRC.

In Sept 2010, it sold for $110K. The asking price was $150K when we looked at it, which is why it was on the market for over a year. The assessed value for 2011 was $156,276 and will drop to $130,666 in 2012. I feel like I ought to mail them a letter on how to challenge their tax assessment, since property values have declined at least 10% since they bought the house - it would probably assess at $100K if they challenged it. 

For 2010, their annual property tax was $2,185.39. For 2011, it has dropped to $1,972.18. This on a house they bought for $110K in Sept 2010. That makes the amount I'm paying seem small in comparison, but they may not actually know how much they pay each year - lots of folks don't know if it is part of their mortgage. If they would challenge it, they could get their taxes and monthly payment lower. By lower, I mean down to around $1400/year - if their challenge was approved.

So no, Arizona doesn't have low property taxes. Each county varies, and Pima has uncommonly high taxes because the voters keep voting for more and more spending - mostly on schools. Frankly, I think nearly $2000 on a house that sold for 110K (and is assessed at 150K) is outrageous!

I also was shocked to see that my sister is paying over $1700/year on a house assessed at $130K inside Tucson. IIRC, it is on a 0.17 acre lot!


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

Aerial photo of my sister's palace (40+ years old, 1700 sq ft):










I suppose it IS half of a corner lot...but that qualifies for nearly $1800 in property taxes in Pima County!


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## MicKey73 (Dec 26, 2010)

Our taxes in AZ aren't that crazy peeps. Ask someone in New York, or another NE state about tax trouble. Also ARS 13-2910 requires animals be provided food, water and shelter. That's all animals, including livestock. Otherwise, it is phrased 'cruel neglect' and is enforceable.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

The biggest problem with Arizona is all the folks from the NE who moved here to get away from the NE, and now are trying to turn AZ into the NE. The second biggest problem with AZ is the folks from California...or maybe that is reversed.

"Cruel neglect" means to fail to provide an animal with necessary food, water or shelter."

13-2910 - Cruelty to animals; interference with working or service animal; classification; definitions

Note the word "necessary".

According to the OP:

"I _have_ contacted the Humane-Society. I _have_ contacted the state and they have informed me that "There is no law that requires these animals to have shade." Are you kidding me???? Why not???"

Given the number of trail ride places that leave 20-40 horses tacked up with out any shade all summer long (which is disgusting, IMHO), I'd have to guess shade is not considered necessary.

I suspect the Humane Society knows the law.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

This is from the Apache Junction website:

"8. What should I do if I am concerned about the welfare of an animal?
All dogs must have adequate shade and shelter available and water 24 hours a day. If you are concerned or would like to report animal abuse, neglect, abandoned or are just concerned about an animal, please call the Police Department at this number (480) 982-8260.

Horses are considered livestock and are not required to have shade, however, if you feel the horse is in distress, please contact the Arizona Livestock at (602) 542-0872."

Apache Junction, AZ - Official Website

I suspect that is your answer regarding the law in AZ...I'd be more concerned about this:

http://tucsoncitizen.com/arizona-ne...vers-grapple-with-county-zoning-restrictions/


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

DraftyAiresMum said:


> It depends on where you live, KV. Down by Phoenix and Tucson (in the cities), the property taxes are WAY higher than they are up north (about an hour and a half south of Flagstaff and two hours north of Phoenix) where I live.


Oh, I see... Taxes seems to be very high everywhere in MD, so I didn't think about it.


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

bsms said:


> Here is an example. I don't know who owns the house, but it is one we looked at buying once some years back so I've been inside. It is an older home, not all that well cared for but in a quiet neighborhood. It is in Corona de Tucson, about 20 miles south of Tucson. It has 1900 sq ft, on 0.25 acres IIRC.
> 
> In Sept 2010, it sold for $110K.


$110K for the house! Now THAT is very cheap! May be I have to move down there. :lol:


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