# Someone please help me...



## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

Not the ferrier's place to say & if he knew anything he would have helped you calm him down or get the horse used to him first.
My farrier will spend however long it takesto get a horse's feet done & will actually help & give advice not tell you to sell the horse. She takes her time & knows just what to do when dealing with a nervous horse or a young one.
I would keep working with him if you really want to keep him. Tell your parents not to be so hasty!

Just wondering also when & why your horse started acting up? Was it because hes touchy with his feet or just scared of the ferrier? Were you holding him? Tied? Up against a fence?


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## equus717 (Aug 20, 2009)

SAsamone said:


> I'm in absolute tears, I can't stand it and I need to vent, I need advice, I don't know what to do...
> 
> My rescue Texas did TERRIBLY for the farrier...he was supposed to get corrective shoeing done, and he was so terrified of the farrier, he was rearing and everything else.
> 
> ...


There are things that you can do to help him with his fear of the farrier. What exactly was he doing when the farrier picked up his foot? Try taking your lunge rope around his legs and move it up and down until he gets used to it on all four legs. Then start using your hand to ask for the leg. I would ask your farrier to come out and just spend some time with the horse. If it was a man that abused him it will take time. 

I had a mare that did that with my farrier and I just spent time with her working with her feet and I asked my farrier to come out like once a month in between the feet work and just to stay at a distance while I brought her up to him. She got to the point that she wouldn't react to him at all. 

I would not give up on your horse but it is a commitment that you have to be willing to work through. It took my mare almost a year to be okay with my farrier. You have to be willing to put in the time.

If he goes to auction not to sound mean but he will just end up being passed from one home to another with this issue. I would try to talk to your dad about keeping him and working with him.


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## equus717 (Aug 20, 2009)

Your farrier shouldn't of said that. My farrier spends a while with me. My yearling was just done and she got to acting up some but he talked to her and petted on her till she calmed back down and then continued on the feet. I would change a farrier then if they can't work with your horse to make it feel calm then get another farrier.


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## SAsamone (Nov 5, 2009)

The farrier came last night because I found blood on his coronet band, I wanted him to check it out (abcess or whatever) and plus he needed his feet done, as they hadn't been done AT ALL (probably in months) when I first got him. Tex was anxious last night, but i though it was because I pulled him away from his dinner. 

Today, I was calmly gooming him with him tied under the tree, and AS SOON, as the farrier's truck pulled up, he started going nuts. I'm 96lbs of nothing and couldn't control him, my dad helped me, and he reared up. Then, the farrier put a twitch on him, and he broke that. He hurt my dad's back...it was awful. And now Tex is mad at me- won't come near me, and I think I lost his trust....it's just a nightmare.

And thank you guys, so much- agree...the farrier was hitting him, and making it worse. And even though he's not perfect holding his feet up for me, he won't go NUTS like he was...he's normally so gentle and kind with me, and I hope I didn't hurt our relationship.


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

One of my fillies used to pout & hold a grudge everytime we had a bad day. She would avoid me to up to a week and then give it up & come right back over like nothing had happened 
I wouldn't worry about your relationship with him. He just needs time to settle down and think things over. 
Keep working with his feet. I would suggest working with him on a long rope if the ferrier comes. That way he had get away if he feels he has to but you still have a rope on him & can control him. THe farther away he is when acting up like that the better for everyone around.
When he settles, bring him back to you. Sometimes a horse needs to be able to escape from pressure & get it all out before you can do certain things with them. If he is sensitive, forcing him to cooperate or calm down will only make it worse.


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

Another tip my ferrier gave me when doing the feet of a really nervous horse is to not tie them up. Hold him in a corner with his side up against a fence, that way he can't jump around.
Rub/scratch his withers (it's the spot where horses love to scratch eachother & mamas will rub their baby's withers to reasure them) & even use treats to distract him if that will work.

Another tip she gave when working with one filly who liked to rear, was to have the strongest person sling their arm over his shoulders and put pressure downward when the horse looked like she was about to go up.


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

Well for starters, sounds like you need a new farrier, perhaps one with a brain. I'm lost at how hitting an already frightened horse can help. Sounds like your horse has been smacked around before if he got nervous as soon as he saw the truck. Regardless, your horse needs to learn that is no longer the way things will be.

Start working with him yourself. Pick up each foot and hold it until he relaxes and is not fighting you. Then put it back down. Repeat this exercise over and over again. Once you can hold each foot for a good minute or so without fight, work with him more by tapping on each foot with a hoof pick or something metal to simulate hammering, again only stopping when your horse has relaxed the hoof. You want your horse to associate relaxing with the hoof being put back down.

After you find a farrier who is sensitive to your horse's fear, the day you schedule the visit, work your horse first. Get him good and tired. You don't want to give him any excuses to act up. Also this way, if he does start to act up, you can put the already tired horse on a longe line and work the snot out of him for a good 5 minutes and then bring him back to the shoeing. Maybe that way the horse will learn that standing still for the farrier will equal rest and come around. 

Sorry you're in this situation. Good luck.


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## SAsamone (Nov 5, 2009)

All of you are saying exactly what I said and I'm SO Pleased about that.

This farrier is "an old cowboy" he told me to tie him up to a tree for a couple days to teach him patience. As much as I do agree that the technique can work on SOME horse is SOME instances, I'm not doing that to a skinny rescue horse, are you NUTS?!?!? And like I said he kept hitting him, and jerking the lead rope and yelling at him...bad energy, and I know Tex is good about picking up energy- he does it with me all the time. I tried to remain as calm as I could, but it was so hard. If I didn't know the guy, I would have cussed him out and hit HIM to see how he liked it...not to mention my dad was there...

Thanks guys for getting my head cool...I needed it so badly...for a while there, I thought maybe I was foolish to think that I had him, but deep down I know that I can get him to where he needs to be- with his feet and all. He's very good with me, most times, and I think if I keep working with him, since I know how to do it, I might even do his feet myself or take my buddie's trailer up to Sarasota or somewhere and find a good farrier that will be patient since he really needs a professional right now....


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

Sounds like your horse got lucky when he found you. That sounds like a good plan taking him to your friend's farrier next time.

My horse likes to initially pull his back legs back when you first pick them up. It only takes him a few seconds to relax and then you can do what you need to do. One farrier I used would immediately jerk his leg back upon picking it up instead of waiting the 3 whole seconds for him to relax. Once he pulled on it so hard, my horse was lame for a few days after. To this day, if my horse sees that farrier, he gets tense. The good news is, they know the difference between the one who hurt them and the rest.


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## SAsamone (Nov 5, 2009)

Funny, because that's exactly one of the things that was happening. I sure hope he knows the difference between farriers- Wish us luck!! My mom talked to my dad, and they said they aren't going to force me to sell him, but dad is hot and very unnervy about him. He sais he could kill me, which I agree could happen, but it was the situation that caused this, not the horse itself. It's hard enough to convince them since they aren't horse people- I'm lucky I even have horses. I just hope it goes more smoothly these next couple days. I want to go out there and give him a huge hug and a kiss and tell him he's got a forever home now, and it's all going to be okay.


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## Northern (Mar 26, 2010)

You need to have your dad read these posts.

You need your dad to learn that hitting a scared horse is CRUEL & INEFFECTIVE. (I guess dad saw that it was ineffective?)

You therefore need a new farrier, NOT of the OLD COWBOY school.

This is totally fixable, approach & retreat on horse's legs, NOT trying to pick them up, but rather trying to keep them in contact with terra firma, at first. Massage, stroke, FRIENDLY GAME. Only after it's established in horse's mind that you're not going to hurt/trap his feet & legs, do you go to looping a rope around the pastern & picking it up a tad, then progressing to setting it down in a bit of a different place then it came up from, & so on.


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## SAsamone (Nov 5, 2009)

My dad loves the horses, and he's never had a problem with Tex until he saw him acting up today. He only wants the best for me, but I agree, I want him to see that others, too, say that it can be fixed and that he's not a monster like that guy made him out to be. 

I will definately be playing, like you said, a fun game with him, with the feet...offering treats and whatnot. He's a very sensitive boy, I noticed, and immediately gets defensive with hitting. I feel awful, like I put him in a bad situtation, and I did- I'm responsible. But it's NOT going to happen again like that, I am determined.


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

Just be careful about making the distinction between not making fearful and not getting his respect. Yes, your horse needs to understand there is nothing to fear, but if you ask for his foot, he is to give it to you and he doesn't get it back until he is standing there relaxed. Be very clear and consistent with you. Horses respect leadership. Friendship is for humans.


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## Northern (Mar 26, 2010)

Great! There's nothing worse than not being able to rescue a horse who's being mistreated; I sympathize with what you went through. 

Hopefully, you can get dad on the same page & the both of you will prevent any further mistreatment of the horse. Good Luck! 

A carrot stick/reasonable fascimile thereof is invaluable for staying safe while playing Friendly Game with a horse's feet & legs! The string on the end can be wrapped around the leg loosely, with your toss, then smoothly unwound, for excellent desensitization/whatever word you want.

p.s. I suggest a helmet & perhaps body protector, when you're handling him from the ground as well as when riding. 96 lbs? !!


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## RodeoLoco (Mar 11, 2011)

I have to say. Using a twitch wasnt the best idea for the farrier. My mare had one on when she was a yearling. She is 7 now, and it caused her major problems. (attitude wise). 
Hitting is sometimes the only way to go. I had a couple times where the only way I could get out of it was a good smack, or slap. It works. 
I would do the game thing, and start practicing by touching his legs with a crop, lung line, etc.


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## Allison Finch (Oct 21, 2009)

You've been given good advice on how to get him familiar with consistent and frequent leg handling and praise. In the meantime, the horse needs his feet done. There's nothing better than some good drugs to get some immediate compliance. Get his feet done with sedatives, and then spend the time getting him used to the handling.


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## RodeoLoco (Mar 11, 2011)

Allison Finch said:


> You've been given good advice on how to get him familiar with consistent and frequent leg handling and praise. In the meantime, the horse needs his feet done. There's nothing better than some good drugs to get some immediate compliance. Get his feet done with sedatives, and then spend the time getting him used to the handling.


Another thing we did for a cranky, huge, Belgian mare. We put her in a metal hold, buted her up, looped a strap around her foot, threw the rope over a beam, and hoisted her foot up. It worked.


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## SAsamone (Nov 5, 2009)

I suggested sedatives too, but the farrier said the vet had to be out for that. Do the on-market ones work? Like the ones they use to quiet really hyper show horses?

And Loco, what attitude problems did your horse come up with after that? I want to know so I can look for them, and hopefully catch them before he gets anything like that.

And Northern, LOL, yes 96...another reason why my parents are so worried. My other mares are more my size, about 14.3 hands. Texas is around 16hh.


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## RodeoLoco (Mar 11, 2011)

SAsamone said:


> I suggested sedatives too, but the farrier said the vet had to be out for that. Do the on-market ones work? Like the ones they use to quiet really hyper show horses?
> 
> And Loco, what attitude problems did your horse come up with after that? I want to know so I can look for them, and hopefully catch them before he gets anything like that.
> 
> And Northern, LOL, yes 96...another reason why my parents are so worried. My other mares are more my size, about 14.3 hands. Texas is around 16hh.


She bites a lot. But I am working with her now. She just became nasty. An answer to your first question. Just buy a box of bute from you feed store. Its 20 bucks where I live.


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## SAsamone (Nov 5, 2009)

Will bute hurt him, with him still being so skinny? I've heard good and bad about it, so I don't use it.


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## RodeoLoco (Mar 11, 2011)

SAsamone said:


> Will bute hurt him, with him still being so skinny? I've heard good and bad about it, so I don't use it.


No. Most horse traders use bute on abused horses so that they seem calm, and nice, so people will buy them. I have also used it on a nasty high strung emaciated arabian mare, that I rescued. She did fine, I used it to get her teeth done.


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## SAsamone (Nov 5, 2009)

Cool, good tip- thanks!!


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## Allison Finch (Oct 21, 2009)

Bute is horse "aspirin", not a sedative. The over the counter paste calmers will do little to calm this horse. It needs good 'ole I.V. ace or some other high powered sedative. Either get a vet out or find someone who can give the shot.


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

Bute is very hard on the stomach, much like aspirin. I wish people would stop giving it to their horses like candy.


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## apachewhitesox (Dec 9, 2010)

I just want to say SAsamone that I hope he improves with you and good luck. That isn't very good that your farrier is like that. I was lucky and found my farrier through word of mouth. Whenever mine have a silly moment (once involveded him nearly being trampled) and he just says I've had worse and waits for me to get the horse settled and ready again.


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## Elana (Jan 28, 2011)

Bute is NOT a sedative. It is an NSAID (non steroidaly anti inflammatory) and can cause ulcers in horses. It is Rx. ACE (Acepromazine) is a sedative and can be given in the feed or IV. It is much more effective given IV and the effect is almost immediate. There are other drugs as well (Rompun etc.). 

I will add that while these drugs do make a horse dopey, they do NOT change the horse's reaction time... and are dangerous for the inexperienced to use. I have seen a horse doped up on Rompun stand quietly for X rays until the plate rattled and she kicked that plate to the next county with lightning speed. Just sayin'

I agree that your farrier was a rough old cob but that being said, handling a horse's feet has its own danger. I will add that while my farriers worked with me if I had a young or untrained horse, their patience for crap was limited to one or two visits and then you better have your horse trained. They are trimming and shoeing horses for a living.. and they really do not need to deal with bad actors. It is dangerous and if they are laid up, they can lose their business and everything with it. Just keep that in mind.

I suggest you find a farrier who will help you work with the horse and OFFER UP FRONT to pay EXTRA for his time IN CASH. Explain the situation. 

Meanwhile, getyour horse quiet about handling his feet. Get him good with you (and include getting him to allow you to put his feet between your legs in front and on your legs behind). If you are not experienced enough to do this yourself, find someone who IS experienced. When YOU can do this, get someone else who is experienced to do it as well (trying to generalize his new training to pick his feet up between handlers). 

If you cannot get him to behave reasonably within the next 2-3 months, then I think you will need to consider getting rid of him. One of the jobs a horse needs to learn and accept is handling his feet. If you cannot get him trained to accept this, and he is not a stellar individual (racing, Circuit, dressage etc.) then he is a dangerous liability both to you and to his farrier (and probably the vet). 

I know it is about the horse, but these professionals should not be at serious risk for injury due to a horse who cannot be handled safely.


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## sarahver (Apr 9, 2010)

WTH? Since when is bute given as a sedative? Bute really is incredibly overused but I had no idea it was also _mis_used. Loco, please be careful with the advice you are offering, it is not only incorrect but downright dangerous and incredibly misinformed. No idea where you learnt such things. Horse traders may use bute to mask lameness and other sorenesses but certainly not temperament/training issues to the best of my knowledge.

OP: Work with your horse so that he is comfortable having his feet handled. Pick them up, play with them, tap them with a rasp and show him that he will survive all of these strange sensations, noises and feelings. You will probably have to do this every day for a few weeks.

I don't like rough farriers either, however I also don't like horses playing up for them. Farriers are paid to look after our horses feet, not take part in the horses training.

ETA: I just saw Elana's comment about offering a farrier extra money to help with training, that is a great idea!


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## faye (Oct 13, 2010)

RodeoLoco the advice you are giving is not only complete nonsense but is very very dangerous and will most likely lead to even bigger problems.

As others have said Bute is a pain killer. The most common over the counter sedative is ACP here in the UK.

I personaly would go down the route of kicking the farrier off my yard and gettig a new one. My farrier is allowed to give my old boys a smack if and only IF they start leaning on him heavily. Even then it is more a dig in the ribs with an elbow. Disciplining my horse is up to me and my farrier will simply refuse to do a horses feet if he doesnt think it is safe to do so.
I have kicked a farrier off the yard for smacking one of my horses unnessecarily (horse fidgeted because he has artheritic hocks and holding them up for long periods of time is uncomfortable).

Get a decent farrier who actualy knows how to handle a horse with something other then brute force.

Between now and the farrier visit get this horse used to you icking up his feet, the slowly slowly, gently method is very good, start with brushing where the horse is comfortable with you brushing and work towards his feet. stop when a horse has let you go further down its leg then you did the day before. When you can brush the horses legs work on running hands down legs, then work on picking them up, consistantly working on it every day will get you there. Please wear a hat and be careful.

Whilst you are working on this I too would sedate the horse to have his feet done. Distressing him whilst having his feet done will only set you back again if he is sedated he cant get upset


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## ArabGirl (Mar 30, 2011)

Ditto on the Bute thing....it is an anti-inflammatory and a pain killer NOT a sedative. It should be used CORRECTLY and sparingly as it is very hard on a horse's stomach lining.


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## faye (Oct 13, 2010)

Danilon is the new version of bute. It tastes better for the horse and is gentler on the stomach so more suitable for long term use.


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## ~*~anebel~*~ (Aug 21, 2008)

Administration of sedatives should be done by a veterinarian. In some cases it is alright for a horse professional with experience in sedation to administer Ace or Rompin, however there can be some very serious complications.
Both drugs can cause severe allergic reactions, both drugs should be given when the horse's heartbeat is not elevated and with both drugs caution should be taken not to make loud or scary noises as their sound sensitivity is greatly increased. I always like to at least have a vet on call when these dugs are administered. When under the influence of sedative horses are less able to control their body and limbs, making them prone to falling over. For this reason I am not a huge fan of sedating horses for the farrier, many farriers and horses have been seriously injured or killed because of sedation for farrier work.

This said, the horse needs his feet done. I would make sure there is a solid wall and good footing available to "lean" the horse up onto when his feet are being done. I would also have a veterinarian give the sedative incase there is an adverse reaction. And if your horse isn't going to have a fit about it I'd stuff his ears as well. I'm cheap and use sponges, not those weird balls you can buy at the tack store. Just make sure you aren't placing them too far down into the ear.
You might also find some success with an anti psychotic. There are quite a few on the market so I'd discuss what to use with your vet.


Good luck!


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## bellagris (Dec 6, 2010)

i agree with lilruffian, my mare was a terror her first time shoeing, the farrier tuned her up a bit and made her calm enough to get her through it, then every single time i rode her before and after i picked her feet up, banging brushies on the bottom, and once she was safe enough, I had other people pick them up to to get her used to other people around her. 

The arrier came back next time and said she was really well behaved. 

Just takes determination.

It is a working progress and if you really want to keep this horsem i would spend every single day out there working with the horses feet so you can show you dad that there is progress and then end of the week and ask him to give you time.

If you can't do that, then the horse isn't right for you, some progress is better than none and if you get progress, you can get him there.


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