# OTTB Mare- Low Level Jumping or Eventing?



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

I've been looking at this rescue mare near me. I really like her, but this line worries me about her ad:
'though shes still a bit weak behind (couldnt quite make it over the higher jumps)'
*she came off the track with a very sore hind*
This is after six months pasture rest. They say she appears completely sound, the problem only appears at the higher jumps. If we got her, she'd be very lightly worked on the flat this year with the help of a trainer and only started over jumps next summer (also with a trainer) _if_ she seemed sound for it. (I have a horse for jumping now, she's just on the older side and does get sore very easily). Right now, I'm only interested in the lowest levels and if she can't work past that level when I'm ready to than I'll find a leasee or new owner who could also use her and respect her limitations.
The mare





At the end of the ad, they state that they think she'd be a great dressage or low-level jumping horse. They seem to be honest and straight-forward about all their horses' problems. We'd also be going to meet her in person and get a vet check, but I'd love to hear about any problems you guys have found that we should watch for.

(She's priced at $300 and she's coming 7. If we did purchase her for the given price and for some reason she didn't work out as a jumper, would you see her as easy to rehome for the same price?)


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

I like her. If you're fine with low level jumping, I don't see why she shouldn't be okay. Price is right. If she was closer I'd snatch her up;-) . I would aka what they think the reason for the weakness could be, tho.


----------



## JaphyJaphy (Nov 15, 2012)

What's up with her front legs in the picture? It looks like there is something on her socks...


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

deserthorsewoman said:


> I like her. If you're fine with low level jumping, I don't see why she shouldn't be okay. Price is right. If she was closer I'd snatch her up;-) . I would aka what they think the reason for the weakness could be, tho.


I definitely will! I'm hoping it's nothing serious. They have a chiropractor out on a regular basis for a gelding they have, so I may ask if they can have them take a look (if they haven't already).

She's gorgeous in the photos. I'm already in love  She has a kind eye and looks like a gentle giant in all her photos (she's 16.3 hh)

She also had a poultice on her legs in that photo. I'll ask for more details on that too, but I believe it was right after she came off the track. I think her trainer raced her too hard and she came off quite sore.


----------



## Canterklutz (Jul 20, 2012)

I don't think this would be a horse I would take on as an eventer or expect to have a long term career in lower level jumping. Her soundness issue may be something managable or it could be something that cuts her riding career short. Obviously have a vet take a look at it. If she does turn out to have soundness issues that require a lot of management or limit her riding its going to be difficult to rehome her regardless of her price.


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

So I've sent an email to them, asking for more information and if they don't believe she'd be suitable if they have any others I can look at. Obviously if they say she's suitable, I'll still have her vetted, but if they say she's not, well it's obviously time to move on. Haven't even met the horse yet and I'm in love. Fingers crossed, there's not any real problems there as I'm already sold. :lol:


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

I watched the other videos they have up. Apart from the gelding, she moves the nicest. Don't know how important jumping is for you, which is the most important question, obviously. I personally can live very well without it
What I would do in your shoes, is make sure their contract doesn't say you can't rehome her without their permission, like some rescues do. Ask if they would help with it if need be. 
Then there is a difference, should she really have a problem. Is it fixable with proper care and time, or is it chronic and/or progressive. The low price certainly reflects that there is one, just a matter of finding out what it is. And what you can live with.
Fingers crossed


----------



## maura (Nov 21, 2009)

Ehhh, I don't know. I do love he attitude, but what I see in her hind end is what my old vet called "knifey" movement in her hocks - she brings her hind leg abruptly up, rather than smoothly bringing forward under her body. Watch her move and you'll that her hind legs have a completely different movement and flight path than her fronts. 

This is not what you want in a dressage of any level. OTTBs tend to be a challenge to school correctly in dressage anyway, because of the difficulty in getting them to relax their backs and move correctly back to front, this girl will have some additional challenges.

It will also really limit her scope over fences - 2'6" to 3" should be fine, I think higher will be a struggle for her.

I am quite sure chiro and massage would help her, but please ask yourself if you'd rather pay more money for a sounder horse or less money for an ongoing maintenence problem. If you really just want a pleasure horse and something to lark over low fences, I think she'd be fine, and I commend her sellers for being realistic and straightforward about her prospects. I hope she does find a nice home.

But, if it were my money, I'd pass. There are a lot of free and cheap horses on the market right now, and tons of OTTBs. I would look for something with less potential to be expensive to maintain.


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

Glad to hear everyone's opinions! This is their other horse that I'd be interested in. The gelding will be expensive to maintain for sure as he's already visited regularly by a chiropractor.

This is an 11 y/o black mare. She's 15.2 hh. Retired sound and restarted.
A Picture
Dory Video

And this is another mare, but right now I'm not too interested in her.
She's a 9 y/o bay. 16.2 hh. Not restarted but was retired sound 4 years ago. Been a broodmare since.
First Picture
She seems _very_ narrow
Debbie on Lunge


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Dory has a very strange trot...like she's trotting on hot coals....hard to explain, and might be completely different in person, but from the video.....not for me.
The other mare...narrow, yes. Not the most flattering pics of her.......


----------



## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

The first mare is the nicest of the three by far, but I still wouldn't take her if it were my money. Her hind legs have really abrupt action, and the soreness problems would worry me. However, if you really like her and she vets sound, I think she could be a great little mare for pleasure and low level jumping. 

I would pass on both horses you just posted. The first mare has very choppy trot and sub-par movement, and the second horse's conformation doesn't impress me. I wasn't able to watch the video of the second, but of these two, she's my favorite. 

That being said, I think if you keep searching you can find a lovely OTTB with good conformation, sans soundness issues. They're a dime a dozen right now--you just have to know where to look.


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Re: the hindend movement....does she have a history of tying-up? I'm thinking EPSM/PSSM here.....or the like. That jerking and "weakness behind"......possible.


----------



## PreciousPony (Feb 15, 2013)

I would not get any of them. The issues with the first horse would reeeaally worry me. It sounds like it could be a very deep issue that (for now) doesn't show up until she jumps high, but things that that only get worse over time.

The black mare has reeeaally weird movement. I agree with whoever said it seems like she's trotting on hot coals. Not impressed.

I actually like the bay mares trot best of all- floaty and balanced. The canter is a whole nother story... BUT it also seems like she was really spooked/had never been lunged? She seemed really nervous. I'd like to see her canter in a more relaxed manner.

But I still say I would pass on all three.


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

With all your guy's advice, I‘m going to pass on all three (it‘s okay, as only the first one really caught my eye and I was already worried. Something about her trot in the video seemed off to me). I am going to give the rescue an idea of what I‘m looking for and ask them to keep a look out for me. Have any of you gone to the track to pick up an OTTB before? What should I expect if I go? Any way, this is what I‘m looking for:
I prefer geldings, but am open to any mares. Height is unimportant. I prefer bigger, but as long as he can get me over the jumps cleanly, safely, and comfortably (I‘m 5‘4“ and roughly 125 ibs) than I‘d be willing to give him a chance. The right personality is a must. I don't want a huge hothead, but he has to have some life to him. I‘d be willing to consider a horse who retired unsound as long as his problem isn‘t chronic or deteriorating and can be treated.
^Is that too much to ask the rescue (they do seem to get quite a few good ones like the above in during racing season)? I‘m fairly certain picking up a horse at the track will be more difficult.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Picking up at the track is risky unless you have a very reliable source, like a farrier or vet who work there and you trust( I had a farrier). Taking from the rescue might be the better idea. They have already evaluated the horse, it had some time off already. They also know people on the track, might hear of something available.
Good Luck, and keep us informed;-)


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

deserthorsewoman said:


> Picking up at the track is risky unless you have a very reliable source, like a farrier or vet who work there and you trust( I had a farrier). Taking from the rescue might be the better idea. They have already evaluated the horse, it had some time off already. They also know people on the track, might hear of something available.
> Good Luck, and keep us informed;-)


That was what I was thinking. My mom did quite a bit of work with OTTBs when she was young and I think my trainer would come with. And of course we‘ll have a track vet take a look. I‘d still prefer the rescue, but if nothing comes up, I‘ll give the track a chance. I‘m not eager to pour my money into a horse that's not suitable so I‘m trying to be as nit picky as possible. If he‘s not exactly what I need, I‘ll have them drag me away haha
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

Another horse for sale somewhat near me. She's not an OTTB (or not recently at least) but did have some jumping/dressage training in 2010 (am I the only one thinking starting a 3 or 4 y/o over fences or schooling dressage is too much?)
I may send the owner an email and ask for a better confo shot and a movement video. I have time to be picky :lol:
Anyway this is the ad:
Chestnut Mare
She has flaws, but I'm willing to take flaws, as long as the horse is sound and level headed. The benefit of her is I would [hopefully] have less 'retraining' work and more conditioning and then I could really start working her hard.


----------



## updownrider (Mar 31, 2009)

JaphyJaphy said:


> What's up with her front legs in the picture? It looks like there is something on her socks...


That is poultice that hadn't been washed off yet.


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Kati said:


> Another horse for sale somewhat near me. She's not an OTTB (or not recently at least) but did have some jumping/dressage training in 2010 (am I the only one thinking starting a 3 or 4 y/o over fences or schooling dressage is too much?)
> I may send the owner an email and ask for a better confo shot and a movement video. I have time to be picky :lol:
> Anyway this is the ad:
> Chestnut Mare
> She has flaws, but I'm willing to take flaws, as long as the horse is sound and level headed. The benefit of her is I would [hopefully] have less 'retraining' work and more conditioning and then I could really start working her hard.


Very unhappy looking mare. Poultice on all 4? I doubt "socks" go this far up, should be "stockings".
If she is close enough go ahead and have a look.


----------



## PreciousPony (Feb 15, 2013)

Here's a few nice ones I found off CanterUSA. You'll have to get more info, but they look decent.

Very flashy looking guy
Oliver 6yo 16.2 gelding

Also flashy, definitely get more pictures though
Dixie's Michael 3 yo chestnut gelding

I really like the look of this guy, other than his front leg- maybe he's standing on it funny
Bad Boy 4yo bay

gorgeous color; not sure about him conformationally though
Unbridled Ascent Six year old 16.1 gray gelding

Only $500, nice looking guy. I think he's really nice considering the price!!
Rodeo Tunes 3 year old gelding 16h NEW PRICE!


This ones a little more expensive, but also probably a little further along if that's what you want
Big Poppa D 5 year old gelding


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

PreciousPony said:


> Here's a few nice ones I found off CanterUSA. You'll have to get more info, but they look decent.
> 
> Very flashy looking guy
> Oliver 6yo 16.2 gelding
> ...


I‘ve looked at all of them quite a few times. I think I missed Rodeo Tunes though! (I keep going back to that grey, but dragging myself away). I‘d love to bring this boy (http://www.canterusa.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=7174:holy-armenia-8-yr-old-163-gray-gelding&catid=43:il-trainer-listings&Itemid=348) home but for his age it's just not a good fit. There's also a 9 y/o that looks nice to me, but the age again is a huge turnoff. I‘m curious too hear about why you think Rodeo Tunes is priced so low compared to the others.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

May I ask why the age is a turn-off for you?..... I mean, that's way before prime.....


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

deserthorsewoman said:


> May I ask why the age is a turn-off for you?..... I mean, that's way before prime.....


It‘s not really. All my advice has been to look at 3-6 year olds but I‘m not one to turn away a sound, beautiful 8 or 9 year old with potential. There's two for under a thousand. (Two geldings at least) One has an old suspensory injury which I‘m assuming is a huge no go for anything with jumping 

7 Y/o bay.
http://canterusa.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=6223:whammys-boy-7-yo-bay-gelding&catid=43:il-trainer-listings&Itemid=348

The gelding with the suspensory is here
http://canterusa.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=6397:cartlets-9-yo-162-gelding&catid=43:il-trainer-listings&Itemid=348

And then of course for a pretty penny more, there's Holy Armenia (I‘m a sucker for dapples, but his front legs look... off to me)
http://canterusa.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=7174:holy-armenia-8-yr-old-163-gray-gelding&catid=43:il-trainer-listings&Itemid=348
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## PreciousPony (Feb 15, 2013)

Kati said:


> I‘ve looked at all of them quite a few times. I think I missed Rodeo Tunes though! (I keep going back to that grey, but dragging myself away). I‘d love to bring this boy (Holy Armenia 8 yr old 16.3+ gray gelding) home but for his age it's just not a good fit. There's also a 9 y/o that looks nice to me, but the age again is a huge turnoff. I‘m curious too hear about why you think Rodeo Tunes is priced so low compared to the others.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



I saw Holy Armenia and did not like his conformation at ALL, which is why I didn't post him. Over at the knees, crazy long back, really down hill for an 8 year old, neck ties in super low, very thick throatlatch, etc.

As far as Rodeo Tunes being low priced- only way to find out is to go see! He could be unbroke, high strung, who knows. He's not a conformation superstar either... long back, short neck, down hill (but also is still only 3), slightly steep croup. But I like the overall look of him, and I think he'll be gorgeous with some weight.


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

I really don't see all these "bad" things but there is definitely something off FL. Ad says he campi use pasture time.......


----------



## maura (Nov 21, 2009)

Of the ones that PP posted, I *greatly* prefer the first two, Oliver and Bad Boy, assuming that Bad Boy's left front isn't as wonky as it appears in that photo and they just couldn't get him to stand evenly. 

I love Oliver's substance and bone and overall impression of balance. From a hunter ring bias, his neck ties in a little high on the shoulder, but that confo is actually an asset to a dressage horse - he's a good all around sport horse prospect. 

A horse that is racing sound at 6 is a tough, hardy individual. 

If you want younger, then Bad Boy, (assuming the wonky leg is a photo issue) is also a good prospect.


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

maura said:


> Of the ones that PP posted, I *greatly* prefer the first two, Oliver and Bad Boy, assuming that Bad Boy's left front isn't as wonky as it appears in that photo and they just couldn't get him to stand evenly.
> 
> I love Oliver's substance and bone and overall impression of balance. From a hunter ring bias, his neck ties in a little high on the shoulder, but that confo is actually an asset to a dressage horse - he's a good all around sport horse prospect.
> 
> ...


Agree, especially with Oliver. Though I would like vet opinion of the chip.


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

That's funny, because I've been trying to let myself think on it (just sift through them once a day and really study my options. I'd rather miss one than buy the wrong one. I also don't want to waste anyone's time), and today I just went back a really decided that the extra $500 for Bad Boy (possibly less for Oliver?) would be worth it. I really like the look of Bad Boy as a personal preference but Oliver has a more elegant look. The bone chips are the only worrying thing. I think build and type wise, Oliver looks like he has more potential to me, but I'm also here asking for advice on the choice :lol:
Ollie (can I give him a nickname before he's mine?) looks like he's more what I wanted, if those knees won't be a problem. Coming 7 is probably actually a great age. Some of that silly colt behavior is probably gone but he's still got plenty of kick.

Psst... Just look at those flashy socks (obviously not important, but _still_)


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

He's a very handsome fella! The chrome, the build, nicely muscled.
Looking at his front feet, a proper trim with shorter toe would probably be a good idea and help his knees, too. I'd try to see track- vet records on the chip. And what was done about or for it while he raced.


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

As for the "kick".... don't be stuck on age.....my then 22 year old OTTB would kick butt in a group of much younger ones, without any problems. . Health is the key word here


----------



## PreciousPony (Feb 15, 2013)

I agree that you should get the chip looked at no matter what. But honestly, if you stick to lower levels like you originally said was all you wanted to do, I really don't think it will be an issue


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

I really like him.  I keep coming back to him an finding more to like.

Lady from the rescue replied to me too. She recommended I get in contact with a certain trainer. He‘s got two 8 y/o‘s listed at $1500 each. She said the prices are negotiable to a degree. They‘ve both been vetted sound (had PPE‘s) and any interested buyers have open access to all x-rays and the vet‘s report. I‘ll get their pictures and videos up soon. She said they‘ve worked with him to place his retirees before and they're always nice horses.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

I hate my phone :/
Chestnut Gelding
Brown Mare


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Nada horses for me.....shows me who recently uploaded what?????????

Could be my phone, tho....;-)


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

Pretty sure the above links are broken [It‘s my phone I swear]. Here's my second try:
Gelding
Gelding
Mare
Mare
Nope, videos are still broken but photos work. If you Google Hopscotch Ali, you can see the brown‘s video. Can‘t find the gelding, but his name is Just One Spot aka Spot
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Love the gelding's expression
Like his front end, her hind. They're both out of shape, he's a bit plump ( easy keeper, could be a plus). 
All in all, I like him better, although his right hind looks odd. Could be the pic.
Off to find video now.....


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ftv90_wVsX0&feature=youtube_gdata_player

That should be the gelding.
I really like him
IMO he's got way better movement than the mare.


----------



## PreciousPony (Feb 15, 2013)

I definitely like the gelding a lot more than the mare! He's super cute... but I still think Oliver is cuter conformationally/looks in general. I'm dying to see a video of him!


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Yeah, looks and acts like he's a real character.....too bad he's so far away.....he would fit really will in my herd...


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

I also like Ollie better, but over all I‘m leaning towards Spot a little more if we can get his owner talked down on price a little. My reasoning:
-Spot‘s already had his PPE and came out sound. If I spent the $300-$500 (is that about right?) on Ollie and he didn't come out sound, I‘d still be paying the extra five on Spot. If I could get Ollie‘s owner talked down so he paid for at least part of the PPE, it wouldn't be such a big deal
-Spot is a good 3-4 hours closer (and he‘s still 2 away at that). For Ollie, I‘d feel a little more pressured to meet, test, and buy all on the same day. For Spot I could go meet him a few times before really making the decision (and still be saving gas money)
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

He has been vetted and seems to be sound in mind, too. He's been off the track for quite some time. 
He's also been for sale for quite some time.....maybe that will reflect negotiability.


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

deserthorsewoman said:


> He has been vetted and seems to be sound in mind, too. He's been off the track for quite some time.
> He's also been for sale for quite some time.....maybe that will reflect negotiability.


Hopefully. Though it could also be a sign that the owners are very difficult to negotiate with and everyone else walked away. Also, here's another mare. She was just listed. Nothing beyond age (10), height (16 hh), photos, and she‘s been restarted. Also priced at $1500. I‘m pretty sold on Spot, but wouldn't mind seeing this girl move. She's flashy  Can you tell I‘m not in any rush to bring home just any horse? I‘m really trying to explore all my options. It will be the first horse I buy myself, and I plan to have him/her around for awhile.
Black Mare
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

On this trainer's website is one more horse I really liked...Gracie, I think. Bay. She was by far the best. 
The black.....not my cup of tea, don't like that dip of the back, she's got strange feet for a TB.....expression( huge deal for me;-)).
Spot: PPE done. Take 500 off the 1500...then talk them down to maybe 1200. Then you have a decent price, a cute horse with a fresh mind, not potentially messed up already, to train like you want it. MHO....


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

deserthorsewoman said:


> On this trainer's website is one more horse I really liked...Gracie, I think. Bay. She was by far the best.
> The black.....not my cup of tea, don't like that dip of the back, she's got strange feet for a TB.....expression( huge deal for me;-)).
> Spot: PPE done. Take 500 off the 1500...then talk them down to maybe 1200. Then you have a decent price, a cute horse with a fresh mind, not potentially messed up already, to train like you want it. MHO....


I agree, Spot is probably who I‘ll go with (and he needs a new name. I don't like the cute nanes). I like Gracie, but she‘s also $1500 without the PPE
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

TB's have weird names. His is less weird;-) 
I have a Patino. Short "Tino". Didn't fit him at all. Somehow one day "Muffolo" came to my mind. He responded. I had no clue what it meant, or if it meant anything. Well, it does . It's Italian ( I lived there for some years) and is the part between nose and lip of a cow......go figure

I do that all the time....wait what comes naturally as barn name.


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

deserthorsewoman said:


> TB's have weird names. His is less weird;-)
> I have a Patino. Short "Tino". Didn't fit him at all. Somehow one day "Muffolo" came to my mind. He responded. I had no clue what it meant, or if it meant anything. Well, it does . It's Italian ( I lived there for some years) and is the part between nose and lip of a cow......go figure
> 
> I do that all the time....wait what comes naturally as barn name.


Didn't know that word haha. Spot‘s name will be Italian also  I‘ll be getting him just after my year in Sardegna is over. His name will be a little piece of my second home. (My friends want me to name him Paolo for our teacher with a horse face xD)
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Oooohhhhh
Paolino........he's cute, he needs a somewhat cute name....Cucciolo...?...just let it flow kinda......eventually something will come to your mind, just like it happened to me. ;-)


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

deserthorsewoman said:


> Oooohhhhh
> Paolino........he's cute, he needs a somewhat cute name....Cucciolo...?...just let it flow kinda......eventually something will come to your mind, just like it happened to me. ;-)


Want to know what's cute? This:








Squeee  I love his little squiggle <3


----------



## PreciousPony (Feb 15, 2013)

He looks really, really sweet. I understand your reasoning for wanting him over Oliver. And I agree with deserthorsewoman. Not a fan of that black mare. Have you gone to see Spot yet?

Show name: See Spot Run


----------



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

I like See Spot Run

And Kati ....you better hurry and cut the deal....otherwise I'll snatch him up.....vai vai, andiamo......


----------



## Kati (Feb 24, 2013)

Not yet. I‘m hoping this weekend or next. We‘re getting in contact with the owners now. We‘ve been waiting while I‘ve been looking and trying to decide.

P.S. How about See Spot Soar? This boy is going to fly over those jumps 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------

