# How to teach an unexperenced horse to lunge



## rookie (May 14, 2012)

Hi and welcome, 
I guess congratulations are in order so congrats on your new horse. My first thought would be that its a little inappropriate for you to mention how much your horse cost. Thats not information we need nor is it appropriate to give that information online. All the cost of your horse tells us is that your parents are wealthy enough to afford to give their child an expensive gift. It tells us nothing about you as a rider or your horse. 

Now to the question you asked, lunging can go badly with a green horse. They are stronger than you and if things get tangled you can easily be dragged. I would ask your trainer to give you a lesson on how to lunge a horse. I would also ask the trainer to conduct a lesson or two on how to lunge your new horse. Its not a skill you can share online. Lunging is a dynamic process that changes and is adjusted at every moment.


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## canterburyhorsetrailrider (Aug 7, 2012)

*Lunging a horse*

Can someone explain the need or the use of Lunging a horse..?

I see and hear all sorts of folks lunging a horse before getting on it..!

Is this what folks term ground work..?

Are they wanting to wear the horse out....or wear it down before hoping on..?

Is the rider standing in the middle of the lunging circle trying to pluck up the courage by thinking they will wear said horse out first to calm it before hoping on..?

Recently at this persons place I arrived with my horse for a ride with this new rider to find her lunging her horse around and around... both were quiet tense as horse was not doing what rider wanted and was being constantly told off.. she then pulled said horse up. yelled at it then demanded it walk backwards very fast with her tugging on the end of the lead rope...!
She hoped on and the entire ride was a disaster.. her horse played up was fired up and gig joged the entire time...

I just would like to know what the benefit is of it..?


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

canterburyhorsetrailrider said:


> Can someone explain the need or the use of Lunging a horse..?
> 
> I see and hear all sorts of folks lunging a horse before getting on it..!
> 
> ...


Well usually if you do it properly it is really helpful for many reasons: to burn excess energy out of hyper horse, to gain trust and teach the horse ground manners, and it can also teach paitence.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

rookie said:


> Hi and welcome,
> I guess congratulations are in order so congrats on your new horse. My first thought would be that its a little inappropriate for you to mention how much your horse cost. Thats not information we need nor is it appropriate to give that information online. All the cost of your horse tells us is that your parents are wealthy enough to afford to give their child an expensive gift. It tells us nothing about you as a rider or your horse.
> 
> Now to the question you asked, lunging can go badly with a green horse. They are stronger than you and if things get tangled you can easily be dragged. I would ask your trainer to give you a lesson on how to lunge a horse. I would also ask the trainer to conduct a lesson or two on how to lunge your new horse. Its not a skill you can share online. Lunging is a dynamic process that changes and is adjusted at every moment.


I'm truely sorry if I made you think I was a spoiled brat, unexperienced, or immature. I agree 100% about the cost being unnecessary, but I included it because a lot of people like to know that information, don't ask me why, haven't the slightest clue, but to some people it's interesting. 
Also, about the lunging, the reason I asked the question is mainly because I want to teach my horse ground manners, paitience, and gain his trust before jumping on his back. All I was looking for were some names of different exercises I could try with him, like clicker training or something, just some specific names, or youtube videos I could watch. I am definitely going to ask my trainer for help because though I know the basic concept of it, I don't want to injurse myself, Finn, or anybody near by for that matter, and I certainly don't want to overwhelm or stress out Finn.


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## darlaflack (Aug 14, 2012)

Probably a really nice horse--congrats. First off, he is not a baby, so longeing (sorry, but correcting your spelling) has probably been done, so he knows the ropes. If you have a trainer, I would put yourself in his/her hands initially. I also would not be jumping the horse till your trainer has you working basic dressage. You have aspirations which is great, but the steps to get there are steep. If those steps are not climbed one by one the end result is never successful.


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## rookie (May 14, 2012)

Hi, 

Canterbury, I lunge my two horses because its a good place to start with green horses. I have a 4 year old that started out the summer bucking on the lunge and on the circle undersaddle. Not cool for a "trained horse" so we have been working on the lunge and undersaddle. He now bucks in one corner on the first time around the ring and when he is going at a trot or is asked for the trot. This is also the direction that he is weak moving in. Some days I don't feel patient and don't want to get mad that he bucks undersaddle so I lunge him let him get his stupid out. A lunge line can also be great for evaluating movement. In my opinion, lunging is a basic skill that all horses should have. The horses I place in pleasure homes will probably be lunged at some point. So, they should know how to behave. 

My advice is that you take it slow. I have played the follow me game where the horse follows me. I focus more on speed transitions and voice commands. Its not a time for the horse to run around like a ninny its time to listen to me.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

darlaflack said:


> Probably a really nice horse--congrats. First off, he is not a baby, so longeing (sorry, but correcting your spelling) has probably been done, so he knows the ropes. If you have a trainer, I would put yourself in his/her hands initially. I also would not be jumping the horse till your trainer has you working basic dressage. You have aspirations which is great, but the steps to get there are steep. If those steps are not climbed one by one the end result is never successful.


Thanks for your comment


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

canterburyhorsetrailrider said:


> Can someone explain the need or the use of Lunging a horse..?



Wow, I thought you were the rehab expert, I am totally amazed that you have never come across lunging, *shakes head* In this case I feel Google really will be your friend


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## Ashsunnyeventer (Aug 17, 2012)

You asked me to look at this post so I did and I can tell you that lunging did wonders for my mare when I first got her (she is 4). She came off the racetrack so she knew how to lunge to the left, but not to the right. Since she had the basics to the left the right was a bit easier. First, I find free lunging so much easier than with a lunge line. I only learned how to properly lunge a horse about a year and a half ago and it's so much simpler not to worry about the rope in the beginning (Since your horse doesn't lunge this might not be a good idea to start HIM off with). If you have a round pen I suggest start in there because you don't have to worry about the size of your circle. Start with walk-halt transitions and work your way up.

*To start*: Point in the direction that you want your horse to go in and give a forward command (click, kiss, whatever..just be consistent). You should be standing in the middle of the ring with your horse by the rail. Stand in line or just a bit behind his shoulder to make him move forwards. If he walks in that direction then praise him and make him halt (next paragraph). If he doesn't go forwards then wiggle or flick the lunge whip at his butt, but you don't have to hit him. Then praise when he walks forward and ask him to halt. If this STILL doesn't work then take a forcefull, commanding "I'm in charge" step/stomp forwards towards him.

*Halting*: Standing in the middle of the ring, step just in front of his shoulder and say "Whoa". Praise if he stops then ask him to walk again. If he doesn't stop, the take an "I'm in charge" step in front of him towards the rail. Obviously don't go where you can get run over, but just out of the center of the ring and so you look like you are going to cut him off (at the trot/ canter, you will probably end up stepping sideways to get in front of his movement). If this doesn't work then you can take the lunge whip in front of him and block him off. remember to always praise if he does what you want.

*Problems*: If he walks towards you instead of forwards lead him back to the edge and try again, but don't stand all the way in the center, just a little closer to him. If he absolutly won't go forwards, then walk him around the arena like you have him on a lead rope and each time you go around, get a little further away from him and closer to the center. I found a big problem with my gelding is that he crowds in on me sometimes and doesn't stay on the rail. You can take the lunge whip and give a little flick towards their girth area paired with a forceful step towards them to tell them "Stay out of my space".

*Tips*: BE PATIENT!! This isn't going to come in a day, probably not in a week, it might take a month for him to really understand and lunge well. Lunging is such a different experience than what they're used to so don't have high expectations. Another important part of lunging is being confident and holding yourself with the belief that you are in charge. I really had a hard time with this because I'm the kind of person that can't say no- kind of like a pushover- and my horse was taking advantage of me. My trainer told me to keep my head and shoulders tall and take control of the situation. Then my horse would stop crowding me and being disrespectful because he knew that I wouldn't take it. Remember to wear a helmet and gloves when you lunge because you don't know how he will behave. My gelding used to buck and crowd me at the canter and it is not a fun place to be in. You might look silly, but it's better than being kicked in the head  When he gets really good at lunging with a line- try free lunging  I find it easier and more fun

If you managed to read all the way through my book-- Good luck and ask me if any other problems arise because I'm sure I left something out


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## Ashsunnyeventer (Aug 17, 2012)

I forgot!! Most horses are lunged at some point in their training. I can't imagine any one would just throw a saddle on the horse and then jump right on with out moving the horse at the W/T/C first. Well, you never know, but... He might know more than you think


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I think this would be a good thing to do once or twice WITH the trainer. I bet you know some about it, but having someone with you will make the first times successful. It's much harder to erase an unsuccessful experience, than it is to take the time and effort to make the first one successful.

I look at lunging (and by the way, both longeing and lunging are acceptable spellings, just don't use "lounging", ok?) as two seperate things;

one is for "connection" to the horse, meaning mostly for getting connected to his mind. The other is for assessing his movement and for him to practice moving, improve movement, and also , burn off ya-yas.
The first type of lunging is more what you might see done in a Natural Horsemanship type situation. the handler works the horse on a line , usually in a rope halter, that is anywhere from 12 to 22 feet in length, but usually about 15. The horse is not so much asked to go rapidly around in circles so much as it is asked to move away from the handler, yield it's front, back halves, make turns and move around the handler, always keeping a sharp eye and ear on him/her for the next request. the handler is looking for the horse to become soft in his body, ready to bend and step under in the turns and willing to easily let go of external focusses and keep connected to the human in the middle. When this is achieved, lunging is done, as no more can be achieved nor is more needed.

the other type of lunging is more associated with classical riding. it may use a lunge caveson, and or lunge rollers /surcingle, and a longer lunge line. the lunger stands pretty far away from the horse and does not make as many frequent changes and is less concerned with the horse staying immediately focussed and available for rapid changes. the desire is to have the horse move forward , at varying gaits, and given some time, to find a good balance on the circle, work from behind and perhaps relax into the movement and blow off some stress.

Sometimes, when not done well, this kind of lunging become a human in the middle with a horse, counter bent, focussed totally outside of the cirlce, running disconnected to his hindend, braced against the pull of the lungeline, hollowed out inthe back and leaning into the circle and pressing in on the handler with his shoulder . This is BAD lunging and will build in some bad habits. this might be what Canterbury is seeing and objecting to.

that is why having a really well trained lunger give you a few lesson will be invaluable. the well trained lunger can hold and feel that lunge line just as if it were a rein, and the horse will accelerate, collect, slow and bend, just as if a rider were on him. it is an art, and very few people can do it the way it is meant to be done. much harder than it would appear.

I do not see anything wrong with stating his price, though it's rare to do so. you have every right to have a nice horse if you are so blessed. this does NOT make you some kind of spoiled brat. But, I can't help a few pangs of jealousy. sorry. I AM human. anyway, I hope things go well with him. I am sure he is a jewel.


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## Kayty (Sep 8, 2009)

canterburyhorsetrailrider said:


> Can someone explain the need or the use of Lunging a horse..?
> 
> I see and hear all sorts of folks lunging a horse before getting on it..!
> 
> ...


Well, you've shown you have a very limited view of learning. 
"Spurs must only be used by people who don't know how to apply a clear aid, because all they're for is kicking the horse to inflict pain and intimidate it to move". Same theory. 

I lunge my dressage horses. 
Lunging to burn off energy is the most useless, unproductive thing you could do. Maybe it'll wear the horse out the first couple of times - but youll start making it fitter, AND teach it that its ok to run around like a lunatic with a saddle on its back and bit in its mouth. Bad move. 

When I lunge, I expect the horse to work how it would under saddle. It gives me a chance to see how the horse is moving. I lunge to build fitness, to build muscle without the weight of a rider on its back, and for educational purposes. Lunging is a very valuable exercise. 

OP - I consider lunging as much as an art form as riding. There is a difference between sticking a long rein on the bottom of the halter and chasing the horse around until it's puffing and sweating, and lunging with a purpose. 
Anybody can chase a horse in circles.
Most cannot lunge with a purpose. 
Lessons should be taken in lunging as well as riding, as it is just as important to get ride as if you were under saddle. 


Another point to note - I highly doubt you getting on and riding this horse straight away will 'soooooooo freak him out'. When I get a new horse, I ride it the day that it arrives if time allows. I buy horses as competition horses, and they need to be able to deal with being thrown into new situations and keeping their cool. If the horse is thoroughly 'freaked out' in this environment, then the horse is probably not work the effort for me. 
To be honest, I think riding immediately is best. The horse has been in work, it's better to keep the work going than give it time off, then get on when it's fresh and starting to test the boundaries of a new home. 


Since you haven't even got this horse yet, and don't know if you're going to buy it in the first place... I suspect you are getting a little ahead of yourself.


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## canterburyhorsetrailrider (Aug 7, 2012)

Golden Horse said:


> Wow, I thought you were the rehab expert, I am totally amazed that you have never come across lunging, *shakes head* In this case I feel Google really will be your friend


Smilies...

I have seen it done here and there, but it seems pointless.

HOWEVER. reading down further, I do see it has the use in certain situations..


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

I use lunging to teach, test & reinforce a horse responding to me at a distance. I don't *generally* agree with the idea of lunging a horse for exercise or to 'get rid of energy' before riding or such, for a variety of reasons, so won't go there...

So.... as it's about all the basics at a distance, simply, the way I go about teaching them is to teach them those basics up close first really well - eg. yielding to direct & indirect(implied, bodylanguage) pressure in all ways. Then I just use a long lead & teach/reinforce the horse for responding to me at gradually increasing distance, until it's 'lunging'.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

Ashsunnyeventer said:


> You asked me to look at this post so I did and I can tell you that lunging did wonders for my mare when I first got her (she is 4). She came off the racetrack so she knew how to lunge to the left, but not to the right. Since she had the basics to the left the right was a bit easier. First, I find free lunging so much easier than with a lunge line. I only learned how to properly lunge a horse about a year and a half ago and it's so much simpler not to worry about the rope in the beginning (Since your horse doesn't lunge this might not be a good idea to start HIM off with). If you have a round pen I suggest start in there because you don't have to worry about the size of your circle. Start with walk-halt transitions and work your way up.
> 
> *To start*: Point in the direction that you want your horse to go in and give a forward command (click, kiss, whatever..just be consistent). You should be standing in the middle of the ring with your horse by the rail. Stand in line or just a bit behind his shoulder to make him move forwards. If he walks in that direction then praise him and make him halt (next paragraph). If he doesn't go forwards then wiggle or flick the lunge whip at his butt, but you don't have to hit him. Then praise when he walks forward and ask him to halt. If this STILL doesn't work then take a forcefull, commanding "I'm in charge" step/stomp forwards towards him.
> 
> ...


Thanks you sooooo much. Haha I guess I do have a little bit of high expectations because my quarter horse gelding knows how to do it. That's actually why I wanted to teach Finn how to lunge, because Cash(my quarter horse's name) and I gained a lot of trust, and really bonded well from me always lungeing him( i looked it up and it said you could spell it longeing or lungeing weird...but whatever). It got to one point that when I was done he would halt and look right at me, I would walk up and praise him and he would follow me back to the gate! That's how his follow the leader aspect was created lol now he follows me everywhere:when I set up jumps,cones, in the stall,or just walking around the arena. lol It's so cute and I love how he learned to do that just from some simple lungeing. That's why I thought it would be good for Finn because it would teach him: ground manners,patience, gain trust, improve stablility and flexibility.  
Thanks for your post, it really helped.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Kayty said:


> Lunging to burn off energy is the most useless, unproductive thing you could do.


:rofl: Yeah, that was really driven home when I bought my first Arab


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

tinyliny said:


> I think this would be a good thing to do once or twice WITH the trainer. I bet you know some about it, but having someone with you will make the first times successful. It's much harder to erase an unsuccessful experience, than it is to take the time and effort to make the first one successful.
> 
> I look at lunging (and by the way, both longeing and lunging are acceptable spellings, just don't use "lounging", ok?) as two seperate things;
> 
> ...


Did I accidentally say lounging? I always use lungeing because though longeing is acceptable, most people would think I spelled it incorrectly so I don't even bother with it....But yes I agree, longeing and lungeing are both correct.
Thank you for posting, I really liked the things you said, especially when you said lungeing is an art. And thank you for saying that you didn't care about the whole price thing, I totally understand the jealousy, like you said: you are human. I just don't like people nagging on me whenever I state his price, especially because they think I'm a spoiled brat. Though some would agree I'm spoiled but I'm definitely not a brat. I work *extremely *hard to get things. Some people say it doesn't matter but my school work ethic is outstanding(trying not to brag here, but just trying to prove that I'm not a spoiled brat), and I don't have below a 95 in any of my classes, so I earn absolutely everything I get. 
I'm sorry if I came across as narcissistic or conceited in this post but I don't want people thinking that I just bat my eyelashes at my parents and automatically get whatever I want...... because I don't.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

Kayty said:


> Well, you've shown you have a very limited view of learning.
> "Spurs must only be used by people who don't know how to apply a clear aid, because all they're for is kicking the horse to inflict pain and intimidate it to move". Same theory.
> 
> I lunge my dressage horses.
> ...


It's good to be prepared rather than ending up with a horse and not having a clue where to start.


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

finn113 said:


> *Main Question:* So for first starting out with him, I don't want to just jump on his back and ride him, that would soooo freak him out! I want to start out with ground manners, gaining his trust, and getting him used to the new barn and new surroundings.  So for my first ground exercise, I want to expose some lunging techniques to him. I have another horse (16 year old quarter horse) that I lunge, but he was already familiar with it before I bought him. _*So I want to know some easy, stress free, lunging exercises with him, so he can get used to being lunged, while also learning to trust me.*_



Well, if your parents are paying $10,000 for that horse then they are bring done. 
He is an OK horse but has no movement. He is not even tracking up trotting around and has no movement from the shoulder. His stride looks short and choppy to me. His head has been fixed to drop down from the riders hands and not from their legs. 
He is a good solid type - far to big for you at the moment. You do not have the experience, size or strength to correct his schooling.

If I was paying that sort of money for an 8 year old horse I would not expect it to freak out. He looks well ridden and quiet enough. 

Lungeing is a good balance exercise and I would say that he knows what it is about. If he doesn't then you are paying through the nose for him.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

Foxhunter said:


> Well, if your parents are paying $10,000 for that horse then they are bring done.
> He is an OK horse but has no movement. He is not even tracking up trotting around and has no movement from the shoulder. His stride looks short and choppy to me. His head has been fixed to drop down from the riders hands and not from their legs.
> He is a good solid type - far to big for you at the moment. You do not have the experience, size or strength to correct his schooling.
> 
> ...


I have a trainer, she can help me with him. Of coarse he is not perfect, that's why he is green. I am only 13 years of age, I'm not looking to go to the olympics with him, even those horses aren't perfect. I just want a horse that I can love and have a special bond with. I think that's why anyone should get a horse, you can't just expect a horse to win a show right after you buy it. I am a good rider for my age, obviously I'm not as good as you or anyone else of this forum because you have been riding for probably at least 20 years, so you may think I might not be able to handle this horse but I'm determined to make this horse what I want, not what anyone else wants. I'm one of those people who if I don't feel a connection with the horse whether I ride it or not, then I don't want it, because I love bonds!

Yes, I will definitely go to shows with Finn, but not for a year or two, by then he will have excelled and progressed sooooo much that I guarentee you that we will be winning very high ribbons.

Yes, I may not be able to handle him right away, but I'm positive that after a year or two of training we will adjust and adapt to each other. 

Has anybody every realized that the main reason for riding and having a horse is just to have fun? I mean winning some ribbons and money is just a bonus. But I feel that if you love what your doing and your just having fun, those are the only rewards you should ever need.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

finn113 said:


> coarse


 that should be course


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

You'll have to color me confused at this point.

Finn, I totally agree that the main point of having a horse is to love them and have fun, that is why I had an $800 horse, because he was fun, there is no way on this earth that I would drop $10000 on a horse to hang around with.

I don't know different people different budget, but I sold my $800 mount because I want to compete, and was totally lucky to get a screaming deal on a mare who I can compete with, and if I put the same as I paid for her into a few months training she would be one awesome competitor next year, but we still wouldn't be half way to your budget.

At that price, hell yes I would want to ride straight into the ring and compete.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Where is it that Foxhunter is seeing the movement of this horse in order to critique it?


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Here you go Tiny


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

tinyliny said:


> Where is it that Foxhunter is seeing the movement of this horse in order to critique it?


Go to YouTube and type in t1mmycak3s finnegan and it should come up. But it won't work on iPad or iPhone cuz it has music


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

finn113 said:


> I'm not looking to go to the olympics with him, even those horses aren't perfect. I just want a horse that I can love and have a special bond with. I think that's why anyone should get a horse, you can't just expect a horse to win a show right after you buy it.


 I don't see why not. I know plenty of people that buy finished horses and show them the same month, even *gasp* the same week that they purchase them. If your only qualification for buying a horse is to have a speshul bond with him, why buy a 10k horse? For that many zeros, I would expect a horse that I can go out and show the very next day after the money changes hands.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

Golden Horse said:


> You'll have to color me confused at this point.
> 
> Finn, I totally agree that the main point of having a horse is to love them and have fun, that is why I had an $800 horse, because he was fun, there is no way on this earth that I would drop $10000 on a horse to hang around with.
> 
> ...


I agree, he doesn't need THAT much training but I want about 6 months-a year to create a special bond and have him get used to me. What I'm saying is yes I could definitely ride into a show and win a lot of blue ribbons with him but I just don't think it would be fair to him to not give him some time to adjust to his new surroundings. He is a wonderful horse and I love him very much and I know that we will go far together I just want to take some time. 

And if you saw the video what do you think of him and my equitation?


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

To be honest Finn I actually haven't watched it yet, I see it was taken 2 months ago, though and there were other people interested then, so what is the deal now?

I haven't watched because I was studying this video






And reading the comments, yes I will have to go and watch the sale video, but the girl I'm watching in the jumping video has an awful lot to learn, I appreciate that it is a year ago, and I'm sure that you have come a long way since then.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

equiniphile said:


> I don't see why not. I know plenty of people that buy finished horses and show them the same month, even *gasp* the same week that they purchase them. If your only qualification for buying a horse is to have a speshul bond with him, why buy a 10k horse? For that many zeros, I would expect a horse that I can go out and show the very next day after the money changes hands.


I agree that there are a lot of people that just buy a horse and right away compete with them. Though you wouldn't really know by just watching the video but Finn is good enough to compete right away with. We both are, it's just, like I said I want to spend time adjusting and adapting to each other for a little bit. I am definitely going to compete with him, I agree that it would be a total waste of money to buy a 10k horse that I'm just going to "hang out" with, that is definitely not the case, im 100% planning to compete with him. I just have to work out the tweaks with my school schedule.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Now I have gone and watched the video, and I agree 100% with Foxhunter.

He IS a very nice horse, but from what I'm seeing on the video, he is a nice $2000 playing with horse, I'm sure he would be a steady and fun horse to own, but he is not showing anything special.

I also agree with FH that he is currently to big for you, he looks like he will need a rider strong enough to generate some OOMPH, and talented enough to harness it, in the video he was just toodling around neither really bent on the circle, or bent between leg and hand. 

If I was shopping for you, depending on what your goals are, I would be looking for something around 15.2hh, who has already got their shape and frame sorted out.


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

Golden Horse said:


> To be honest Finn I actually haven't watched it yet, I see it was taken 2 months ago, though and there were other people interested then, so what is the deal now?
> 
> I haven't watched because I was studying this video
> 
> ...


:shock:
I think you need a new instructor. First of alll, no reputable instructor that I know of would let a student take a lesson in shorts. Second, a lot of the equipment is set up haphazardly, with wheelbarrows and hard-to-see branches. She also never tells you in the video how to correct your mistakes. All I hear is "Good!" and "No, that wasn't good." Your horse is, quite frankly, not jumping because he knows he can get away with stopping and running out, or because he's becoming sour to jumping. He gets no direction and no guidance from you.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

Golden Horse said:


> To be honest Finn I actually haven't watched it yet, I see it was taken 2 months ago, though and there were other people interested then, so what is the deal now?
> 
> I haven't watched because I was studying this video
> 
> ...


I have come a very long way since then, and that's my quarter horse cash, he too has come a very long way with my training it may not seem that way because I live in a different state 9 months out of the year, and then I got to my grandparents for 3 months, and that is where cash lives so I only get to "train" him for 3 months, actually this year it was three months but usually only two, and nobody rides him during the year. Don't ask me why I have a horse that I never really get to ride, it's a big family issue that would take way too long to go into. But yes, I have improved A LOT, even since me riding finn.

And the deal with Finn is that I'm pretty sure I got him and my mom is going to surprise me, but again another really long family issue.

And please tell me if you think I'm good enough for Finn, even when I was just trotting him, people have always told me that I have a really nice arched, straight back. Thanks for your feedback


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

^ It's hard to say. Good enough to sit and look pretty? Yes, but a proficient enough rider to engage this horse, move him forward, reach under with his hocks....I don't think so. At this point, it looks like you're focusing largely on your form and equitation, and that's fine. Good equitation is a great base to have. However, from what I've seen, it does not look like you have the ability to further this horse's training.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

equiniphile said:


> :shock:
> I think you need a new instructor. First of alll, no reputable instructor that I know of would let a student take a lesson in shorts. Second, a lot of the equipment is set up haphazardly, with wheelbarrows and hard-to-see branches. She also never tells you in the video how to correct your mistakes. All I hear is "Good!" and "No, that wasn't good." Your horse is, quite frankly, not jumping because he knows he can get away with stopping and running out, or because he's becoming sour to jumping. He gets no direction and no guidance from you.


That's not my instructor. If you read what I said to golden horse you know my situation, that's not where I live, I only see my horse 2-3 months out of the year then I go back home where Finn is going to be.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

equiniphile said:


> ^ It's hard to say. Good enough to sit and look pretty? Yes, but a proficient enough rider to engage this horse, move him forward, reach under with his hocks....I don't think so. At this point, it looks like you're focusing largely on your form and equitation, and that's fine. Good equitation is a great base to have. However, from what I've seen, it does not look like you have the ability to further this horse's training.


Oh,ok thanks for your feedback


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

I appreciate everyone's comments, I will take them into consideration


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## rookie (May 14, 2012)

At the risk of wading into a bit of a snake pit I am going to say this. Its not our place to judge the cost of the horse. Its not my bank account so I don't care. It's also not my place to say your not enough of a rider. I do think that in the one video Finn did not look like he was really working well. I also go chaffed just watching you ride in shorts (ouch!). I don't think that you need to spend a lot of money to get a great horse. Or that spending a lot of money means you get a show horse. I think Finns ability to show within the first year you have him depends on the level you wish to show at. The expectation for a local 4-H show is different then the expectation at the World Equestrian Games. In the video, Fin was being a steady eddie but we only saw his behavior at a walk and a trot on the flat. I have seen horses that are great walk/trot and loose it at a canter. 

There is nothing wrong with wanting to have a special bond with your horse. Heck, if we did not think we all had a bond with our horses then we would probably not be riding them. Likewise, I think we have all been in a situation in which a horse has responded to our intention rather then our cue. I think you can only attribute that to a bond. The issue is how you get that bond. A lot of people spoil their horses thinking that treats, praise and hugs get them a horse that responds. They end up with a horse thats dangerous and they interpret its behavior as anything but dangerous, i.e., its never the horses fault and by extension their own fault. He nips because he wants treats and he loves them. Not he nips because he wants treats and they have rewarded the food seeking and thus taught the horse that its okay to bite and use your mouth.

That all being said you are 13 and you have ideas and feelings about horses that are very age appropriate. I my opinion at 13 and horse crazy you are going to bond with any horse no matter what. Just look at the threads dedicated to horse behaviors problems in which the owner says something to the nature of "I am ---teen years old, this is my first horse and I will NEVER sell him." I wish you luck with him.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

rookie said:


> At the risk of wading into a bit of a snake pit I am going to say this. Its not our place to judge the cost of the horse. Its not my bank account so I don't care. It's also not my place to say your not enough of a rider. I do think that in the one video Finn did not look like he was really working well. I also go chaffed just watching you ride in shorts (ouch!). I don't think that you need to spend a lot of money to get a great horse. Or that spending a lot of money means you get a show horse. I think Finns ability to show within the first year you have him depends on the level you wish to show at. The expectation for a local 4-H show is different then the expectation at the World Equestrian Games. In the video, Fin was being a steady eddie but we only saw his behavior at a walk and a trot on the flat. I have seen horses that are great walk/trot and loose it at a canter.
> 
> There is nothing wrong with wanting to have a special bond with your horse. Heck, if we did not think we all had a bond with our horses then we would probably not be riding them. Likewise, I think we have all been in a situation in which a horse has responded to our intention rather then our cue. I think you can only attribute that to a bond. The issue is how you get that bond. A lot of people spoil their horses thinking that treats, praise and hugs get them a horse that responds. They end up with a horse thats dangerous and they interpret its behavior as anything but dangerous, i.e., its never the horses fault and by extension their own fault. He nips because he wants treats and he loves them. Not he nips because he wants treats and they have rewarded the food seeking and thus taught the horse that its okay to bite and use your mouth.
> 
> That all being said you are 13 and you have ideas and feelings about horses that are very age appropriate. I my opinion at 13 and horse crazy you are going to bond with any horse no matter what. Just look at the threads dedicated to horse behaviors problems in which the owner says something to the nature of "I am ---teen years old, this is my first horse and I will NEVER sell him." I wish you luck with him.


Thank you for not judging harshly, after all, it was only 1 video.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Rookie you are right, in some respects, it is not our bank account, but the OP brought up the value horse, so it then becomes relevant.

There is also maybe a responsibility that says, based on the evidence of that video that is not a $10000 horse, and I would be sad if a well meaning parent paid that sort of cash for a horse that is not a great match for their daughter.

The point for me is that $10000 is a huge chunk of change in most people's world, and you could invest that money far more wisely in a horse that actually matches closer the ops ability.

Equiniphile had it right, Finn has the ability to sit pretty, but has not yet learned to really ride and work at it, HUGE difference.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

Golden Horse said:


> Rookie you are right, in some respects, it is not our bank account, but the OP brought up the value horse, so it then becomes relevant.
> 
> There is also maybe a responsibility that says, based on the evidence of that video that is not a $10000 horse, and I would be sad if a well meaning parent paid that sort of cash for a horse that is not a great match for their daughter.
> 
> ...


It was only 1 video, and it was my second test ride so I was still adjusting myself


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## rookie (May 14, 2012)

Golden I agree with you 10k is a HUGE sum of money to spend on a horse. Is it an amount I would personally spend on a horse, no. That said, I think part of the reason price was mentioned is that the OP is 13. I think its sort of like flashing your money at midnight on the subway, not a great idea but something that is taught not known instinctively. I mentioned in another thread or maybe this thread that I felt it was in poor taste to mention the price. Its not something that is done often in America and it opens a person up for judgement. It also does not tell us much about the OP's riding ability. The videos tell us more. 

I also feel like the time to back out of the sale is gone past. It sounds like the decision is made and the horse purchased. There may or may not be a first right of refusal in the contract. While the horse is not ideal and possibly not worth the asking price, I know people who are asking a lot more of money for horses with much less experience. Ie. a 3 year old with 5 rides on it and they are asking 7,000. Thats based on bloodlines alone for a warmblood.

I also have seen a lot of people buy a green horse for the kid to grow with. The idea being that they will learn together. I don't think its the best idea but its VERY common where I am and where I grew up. I think its a slightly better idea then letting your 16 year old breed their horse to "raise the foal, train it and ride it". Then when they get a boyfriend or go off to college the foal is left off to itself. Then someone gets a 2 or 3 year old with no manners. 

To me the heart of the issue is the safety of horse and rider. I think a lot of people think big price tag means safe, well-bred horse. I know a lot of safe, well trained horses that going for free due to the economy and their breed. I don't know that the OPs parents are as horse-wise as other folks are (forgive me OP if I am incorrect). Which makes them vulnerable in the horse world. Not many 13 year olds who given the chance to own a horse are going to say "no, its not the right fit for me". It does not seem like Finn is an unsafe horse at the walk and the trot. A bit short stepping, and not as supple as he could be but not unsafe or dangerous. This is judging by the dogs zipping around the riding area. Again, only a walk and a trot he might loose the plot at a canter or around a jump. 

Which is all sort of really off topic from the original question posed by the thread and I am sorry for the OP for getting so off topic.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

rookie said:


> Golden I agree with you 10k is a HUGE sum of money to spend on a horse. Is it an amount I would personally spend on a horse, no. That said, I think part of the reason price was mentioned is that the OP is 13. I think its sort of like flashing your money at midnight on the subway, not a great idea but something that is taught not known instinctively. I mentioned in another thread or maybe this thread that I felt it was in poor taste to mention the price. Its not something that is done often in America and it opens a person up for judgement. It also does not tell us much about the OP's riding ability. The videos tell us more.
> 
> I also feel like the time to back out of the sale is gone past. It sounds like the decision is made and the horse purchased. There may or may not be a first right of refusal in the contract. While the horse is not ideal and possibly not worth the asking price, I know people who are asking a lot more of money for horses with much less experience. Ie. a 3 year old with 5 rides on it and they are asking 7,000. Thats based on bloodlines alone for a warmblood.
> 
> ...


Actually you would be surprised, I looked at 40 horses just this year and turned them all down, something clicked with Finn, I know this because I went to ride him a second time. So I am extremely mature for my age for not jumping on the first horse I see. And I have seen his canter, and felt it, he is very quiet, smooth and not fast, he can get fast but that is where the small checks come in. and he is very willing when it comes to jumping, no ducking out, no refusals, he places his strides surprisingly well, you don't have to adjust too much, and though it's probably irrelevant but he has jumped 3ft-6 to 4ft

You are also correct, I am planning to keep this horse fora very long time.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Haven't caught up with all replies, but what on earth has the cost of the horse got to do with anything & why do others feel the right to comment on it??


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

NO way would you get that horse for $2000 where I live. You don't get dog meat for $2000 where I live. Ten thousand is a bit high, but the horse may have some good breeding, and maybe he is especially solid , for younger riders. Parents will put a lot of emphasis on getting a horse that is pretty solid and dependable.

His movement isn't spectacular, but it's rythmic and steady. The young rider has a decent start, and indeed, rides a lot better than most folks here age. I feel that she CAN make a good partner for this horse. 
The sale is done, right? so his price is not longer pertinent. Better to get good training to help the new rider get the best out of the pretty boy.


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

I'm somewhat confused on the stage of purchase with this horse. On some threads you've said you own him, and on others you say you can't post pictures of him because he's not yours. Obviously it's not that important, just curious


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

@loosie- I have no idea how we got off on the whole price thing, as I have been trying to say to everyone else, it doesn't matter but I guess to them it's relevant.

@tinyliny- Thank you for not criticizing "my" horse, I agree with you, and have been trying to tell everyone else that he is a very good horse, but he isn't perfect, no horse is, therefore, it's not that he needs hours and hours of training but someone to come out 3-5 times a week(like me) and ride him to get him moving and not stiff, do different exercises, ground work, flatwork,dressage,jumping, work on bending, circles( I love circles!), backing, ect...... Even though it seems like a lot, most of it are things everyone should always work on with their horse(s). Or incorporate them into their daily routine. 

Anyways, my point is: With the help of my instructor, I can absolutely handle this horse, and I will definitely be winning some shows with his beautiful face.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

equiniphile said:


> I'm somewhat confused on the stage of purchase with this horse. On some threads you've said you own him, and on others you say you can't post pictures of him because he's not yours. Obviously it's not that important, just curious


Oh haha, I call him "my" horse because obviously I want to buy him and well....storytime!
So I told my mom I wanted him and my mom sent a $3,000 deposit to "hold" him but my mom got a text from Finns owner saying that another person payed the full $10,000 upfront with a horse trailer and took him. BUT!!!! My dad went to the stables where he was originally being boarded to say thank you for trying to the owner. But when he got there.... *FINN WAS STILL THERE!! So my dad i think that my mom either secretly bought him(because she loves surprises and will do ANYTHING to surprise someone) and doesn't want anyone to know OR the other person who tried to buy him withdrew and my mom just doesn't know. So I call him "mine" because either way, my mom is buying him. Whether she already did or she will be i'm going to own him! Yay!!!*


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

When a price is mentioned it pretty much invites people to comment on the value. It is a form of concern for the poster and, in this case, the poster's parents. I have no idea what a Dutch Warmblood sells for, so I cannot comment - but the comments are well intentioned, and should be taken that way. IMHO.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

tinyliny said:


> NO way would you get that horse for $2000 where I live. You don't get dog meat for $2000 where I live.


WOW the market must be strong in your area :shock:


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## riccil0ve (Mar 28, 2009)

Golden Horse said:


> WOW the market must be strong in your area :shock:


I didn't realize the horse market could be so different so close together. An hour, hour and a half away from Tiny, I have found several reasonably priced horses. Maybe a little on the expensive side, but not ridiculously so.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

riccil0ve said:


> I didn't realize the horse market could be so different so close together. An hour, hour and a half away from Tiny, I have found several reasonably priced horses. Maybe a little on the expensive side, but not ridiculously so.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes, it definitely depends on where you are located


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

As a general rule (is there such a thing?), you won't find a horse really worth owning for less than about 2,500 here. That's pretty rock bottom. More realistic is about 3,500 for a horse of just decent conformation and training. If the horse has any big name breeding or training, the price will be above 5k at least.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

tinyliny said:


> As a general rule (is there such a thing?), you won't find a horse really worth owning for less than about 2,500 here. That's pretty rock bottom. More realistic is about 3,500 for a horse of just decent conformation and training. If the horse has any big name breeding or training, the price will be above 5k at least.


Pretty much the same concept here. Thanks


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

Wow! I sold a very sweet purebred Arabian mare (Lilly), 9 years old, used her to teach my youngest daughter how to ride, for $600. 

Four years ago, I paid $1200 for Mia. Her behavior is far better now, but she still wouldn't bring more than $1000 on the market here today.

Mia and Lilly about 6 months before I sold Lilly:










If you want a horse trained to compete in something, THEN you will need to pay more. But you can get a horse worth owning for free...with tack...delivered:










Guess it depends in part on how you define a horse worth owning...:?


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

bsms said:


> Wow! I sold a very sweet purebred Arabian mare (Lilly), 9 years old, used her to teach my youngest daughter how to ride, for $600.
> 
> Four years ago, I paid $1200 for Mia. Her behavior is far better now, but she still wouldn't bring more than $1000 on the market here today.
> 
> ...


Everybody is different some people want a trail horse, or a barrel horse, a jumper,a fox hunter, a dressage horse, an a event horse, or just or pleasure horse. It's a matter of opinion, perspective, and discipline. Horses are subjective. Ex: pain is subjective because everybody has a different pain tolerance. So, horses are subjective because people do different activities or disciplines with them. 

Personally, I want a horse that is well rounded, has a willing, and a baby-like personality, is especially skilled in jumping, is calm, has a low temperament but still a little spirited.....ect. I could go on for hours....but trust me, for me to have looked at about 40 horses and then finally discover Finn, I'm positive that he has met all my criteria...


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I live near Seattle. MOst everything here is very expensive. I think incomes are concordently (is that a word?) higher, too, but not sure.

Board here is LOW : 450 HIGH : 1200


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

tinyliny said:


> I live near Seattle. MOst everything here is very expensive. I think incomes are concordently (is that a word?) higher, too, but not sure.
> 
> Board here is LOW : 450 HIGH : 1200


My board for Finn is 450 a month. So excited! My dad just told me today that Finn is at the barn where I ride, so now I'm 99.9% sure my mom bought him,, I would say 100% but I don't want to jinx it lol Yay!

And yes, concordantly is a word. Definition- In keeping or being of the same opinion. Lol I'm smart but google helped me with this one lol :rofl:


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

finn113 said:


> Everybody is different some people want a trail horse, or a barrel horse, a jumper,a fox hunter, a dressage horse, an a event horse, or just or pleasure horse. ...So, horses are subjective because people do different activities or disciplines with them...


Yes. As I pointed out:



bsms said:


> ...If you want a horse trained to compete in something, THEN you will need to pay more...Guess it depends in part on how you define a horse worth owning...:???:


I would expect to pay a large premium to get a horse with a record in jumping, dressage or cutting cattle. Where I'm from, a horse that can show it knows how to work cattle well and has experience roping will probably start around $3000, no papers.

I suspect the phrase "a horse really worth owning" rubbed me wrong. It is kind of like when someone says, "Just a trail horse..." I now have 10 months of work into turning Mia into 'just a trail horse', and we aren't there yet. I'm guessing it could be next summer before I can ride her solo in the desert and have both of us looking forward to it. If we can do it, then I'll have a horse I wouldn't sell for $10,000...and that most folks around here wouldn't think of offering me $2,000 for.

The mustang pony I was given last winter is really too small for me to feel good about riding. With saddle, I break 30% of his body weight. He's a former lesson horse who doesn't trust strangers...imagine that! But he would be an awesome little horse for someone who weighed under 135 and who would commit to riding him regularly and who would treat him with some kindness. No, he is NOT a horse for someone who wants to compete in anything. But a sure-footed, sensible pony built like a tank who knows the desert (he was born wild) can still be a horse worth owning - for the right owner. Heck, if I can find a western saddle that fits him, I may take up riding him. A sensible, strongly built horse - even at 13 hands - can be well worth owning...:evil:

But for the record - if you are looking for a horse that can compete in jumping, then yes, I fully understand paying quite a bit more...


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

bsms said:


> But for the record - if you are looking for a horse that can compete in jumping, then yes, I fully understand paying quite a bit more...


thank you:happydance:


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## Ashsunnyeventer (Aug 17, 2012)

My parents dropped $10,000 on my first horse, but he was almost ready to compete. That being said- he is a TB, so he can be sold for less. You "have" a Dutch Warmblood. A good part of that $10,000 is probably paying for his bloodlines. I know you said it doesn't matter about the price and it doesn't, but I just wanted to point that out. Also your location is very important. Around here, you can't get a decent eventing horse for less that $6,500. I just bought a $5,500 TB who is 4 and would have a heart attack if I tried to show her right now.. I'm lucky if she is show ready by spring.


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

Ashsunnyeventer said:


> My parents dropped $10,000 on my first horse, but he was almost ready to compete. That being said- he is a TB, so he can be sold for less. You "have" a Dutch Warmblood. A good part of that $10,000 is probably paying for his bloodlines. I know you said it doesn't matter about the price and it doesn't, but I just wanted to point that out. Also your location is very important. Around here, you can't get a decent eventing horse for less that $6,500. I just bought a $5,500 TB who is 4 and would have a heart attack if I tried to show her right now.. I'm lucky if she is show ready by spring.


I live in "horse country". And I agree that a good portion of his price are his bloodlines. And I found out today that my mom did buy him she just doesn't know I know lol shhhhhhh lol it's gonna be a "surprise" lol


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Congrats! you make sure she gets the "surprise" effect she wants. She is SOME mom!


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

tinyliny said:


> Congrats! you make sure she gets the "surprise" effect she wants. She is SOME mom!


Most definitely, she is the best mom I could ever ask for, I love very much. And trust me, even though I know, I still will be really surprised!!!


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Golden Horse said:


> WOW the market must be strong in your area :shock:


Yeah, where abouts are you Tiny?? I'm coming to your area to become a horse dealer!


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## finn113 (Aug 21, 2012)

@loosie- lol


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