# Impaction colic-need advice!



## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

Please help! My mustang has impaction colic. I've already had the vet out, but don't have thousands of dollars to treat her. He told me to keep her hydrated & I could try an enema to soften the impaction. I was wondering if I could give her some fruits or mushy beet pulp as well? What about Pedialyte? Safe for horses?

I'm going out to try to give her an enema now.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

You've had the vet out, did he treat?


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

The vet was out, diagnosed impaction colic, and DIDN'T intubate your mare with mineral oil and water? Color me skeptical. :?

_*IF*_ you actually had the vet out and you know for certain that the mare has impaction colic and not a twisted gut, one of the very_ first_ things the vet would have done would have been to intubate her. 

Either you're telling a fib about having the vet out, or you have one of the worst, most incompetent, moronically stupid vets on the planet. I know which of those two options I'm leaning toward, and it's not that the vet is an idiot.

It doesn't cost 'thousands' to treat impaction colic. Several hundred yes, but not _thousands_.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

Speed Racer said:


> The vet was out, diagnosed impaction colic, and DIDN'T intubate your mare with mineral oil and water? Color me skeptical. :?
> 
> _*IF*_ you actually had the vet out and you know for certain that the mare has impaction colic and not a twisted gut, one of the very_ first_ things the vet would have done would have been to intubate her.
> 
> ...


Normally I would say be nice to this type of response but it's actually what I was thinking. Usually the vet will actually manually pull out as much poop as he can and then he will put several gallons of mineral oil down the horses nose and into his tummy....And of course give some banamine.


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

ITA, SR and farmpony -- I have never encountered a vet who would diagnose a situation such as this and just leave the animal to die a horrible, suffering death because someone doesn't have "thousands" (and, as pointed out already, that is horribly inflated - for dramatic effect, OP?) to treat the animal. Most vets I have known would either work out something for payment or offer the alternative of a less expensive and much more humane euthanasia than leave a horse with a diagnosed impaction colic.


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## Codysmom (Aug 4, 2011)

If this truely is an impaction colic and the vet did not tube with oil and water then the vet is very incompetant. My gelding impacted pretty badly about 4 years ago. He was tubed twice with oil an dthen taken to the clinic and put on IV fluids and a lot of banamine. 40 liters of fluids, $800 dollars and 12 hours later he came home (I got lucky) to only soaked hay for a week and then SLOWLY re-introducing grain (still soaking hay) for another week. Impaction does not always + thousands of $$$. Get the vet back out to start fluids. The most important thing with impaction is re-hydration.


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

> Usually the vet will actually manually pull out as much poop as he can and then he will put several gallons of mineral oil down the horses nose and into his tummy....And of course give some banamine.


He did stick a tube up her nose & pump about 4 gallons of water into her stomach. He said to take her to the hospital, I was looking at about 5-7 thousand dollars to treat (hence the "thousands" I was talking about). To treat her intravenously would be about 1 to 2 thousand dollars (again, the "thousands" I do not have). He did stick his arm up her rump & said the impaction was like a solid wall of poop in there & offered me a glove to feel for myself (which I declined). I asked about using an enema with mineral oil & he said it was "too late for that". I did it after he left anyway.
Since he left, she has had a few rather large farts (forgive me for being blunt), but no poop yet. She did eat some really sloppy beet pulp & some soaked alfalfa, plus she drank a couple more gallons of water.
He also left me with enough Banamine for about 3 doses.



> The most important thing with impaction is re-hydration


She does seem more hydrated than earlier. When I pinch her skin, it goes back flat very quickly. That was also why I asked about Pedialyte. Not being sure it was safe, I opted for Speedy Beet instead (which she ate).



> Either you're telling a fib about having the vet out, or you have one of the worst, most incompetent, moronically stupid vets on the planet. I know which of those two options I'm leaning toward, and it's not that the vet is an idiot.


I am not a liar (as was implied earlier). I do feel that this particular vet is a bit on the high dollar side & wish there was another vet available to me. There is only one local equine vet. I think there are a few different Dr.s in that office, but it seems like he is the only one available whenever I call. What am I supposed to do? I came here for help, but it is difficult to find with so much hostility. Understandably, there may be those with greater experience and differing opinions, but one would think they could express that in a more constructive manner. 

I spent the entire day by my mare's side & I am quite upset. It did not help to come back in to read flaming posts about it.


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## Beauseant (Oct 22, 2010)

Wow....what a scary time this must be for you!!


Please let us know how she is doing.


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## trailhorserider (Oct 13, 2009)

I lost a couple horses this way, and saved one. We do not have the finances for colic surgeries and such either. Our vet did the banamine and water/mineral oil route via stomach tube. One horse recovered great and never had another colic (and he was sick for days, so there's still hope). The two other horses never did recover and we finally had them put down. They were sick for days also. 

I think your best bet is to give the banamine (because it helps with the pain and can help the gut relax and start to function again) and if you can, get the vet (or a different vet) to give some more water via stomach tube because I believe the most current thinking is that hydration is the most important thing with impaction colics (my vet always gave mineral oil and water both). Either way, time is of the essence, so I would try to do that tomorrow if you can (if she isn't pooping by then). Because the longer you go, the worse the prognosis. So tomorrow would be the time to make a move. 

I have heard that enemas are rarely useful with horses because they have so much intestine that it can rarely reach the problem area. But I know you feel you have to try and I was doing the same thing with the last horse I lost. We tried everything short of surgery. 

So good luck with your girl, hope is not all gone. But if she still looks sick tomorrow (and no poop) I would try to get another vet out, for additional water via stomach tube if nothing else. (Again, the longer they go, the worse the prognosis.) 

Also, I'm not sure if feeding large quantities of food is good for a horse with an impaction. It may just plug their system even more. But that is something to ask a vet. If I did offer food, it would be something sloppy wet. The last horse I lost was not even able to eat. So it's good that your girl feels like eating, although I'm not sure how much food is good for her right now.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

excellent post , Trailhorserider.
I was told to NOT offer food, only water, in this kind of case, but my personal experience with this kind of colic was that the intubation was totally successful. I have been present at three other colics that all resulted in death, due to catching them too late and severe dehydration. Water is key.

please do let us know what happens. We will be thinking of you and your mare and wishing a successful outcome.


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

> I think your best bet is to give the banamine (because it helps with the pain and can help the gut relax and start to function again) and if you can, get the vet (or a different vet) to give some more water via stomach tube because I believe the most current thinking is that hydration is the most important thing with impaction colics (my vet always gave mineral oil and water both).


I have to go out at midnight to give her the Banamine. I just came back from there & she was laying down again. I offered her more water & she drank some, but not as much as I would have liked. When she got up, I walked her around a bit. Also, I could hear lots of gut sounds.
I watched very closely what he did to pump the water into her & was wondering if I could do this myself? Like I said before, I always seem to get the same vet when I call. I did ask the receptionist earlier for a different vet, but she said Dr. D*** was the only one available right now. As it is, I really didn't have the $276 I paid for today's visit, but I have to try.


> I'm not sure if feeding large quantities of food is good for a horse with an impaction. It may just plug their system even more. But that is something to ask a vet. If I did offer food, it would be something sloppy wet.


I felt the same way, but what food I did offer was sloppy wet. I just thought it was a positive sign that she had her appetite back & I know she had not eaten all day. I tried offering prunes as well, but she would not take them...even mixed in the beet pulp.


> I have heard that enemas are rarely useful with horses because they have so much intestine that it can rarely reach the problem area.


The vet said sorta the same thing, but he said it wouldn't hurt to try. He did say to be very careful because if the hose is not very smooth, I could run the risk of tearing her intestine. I made sure to lubricate the hose (I bought one to fit the enema bag) with mineral oil before inserting.
But I was wondering...he said he could feel the impaction. In fact, he called it a "solid wall". Would it be possible to reach inside & try to remove it manually?

I would like to thank those of you who gave me positive responses. It really does help to read something positive after you come in from crying on your horse's shoulder. I know we're not out of the woods yet, but it's nice to know that not all hope is lost.


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## Beauseant (Oct 22, 2010)

Thank you so much for the update! I will keep you both in my thoughts and prayers tonight.

You are a very stoic person, and you are doing everything in your power to help your horse.

I don't think it is a good idea to try to pump water into her yourself, though. it sounds like it could do more harm than good. I know you want to try anything and everything at this point, but you don't want to do anything to cause injury or setback....or death.


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## trailhorserider (Oct 13, 2009)

I definitely wouldn't try the nasal/stomach tube because if you miss the stomach and get the lungs you will drown the horse. :-(

I did reach in the back-end of my last colicking horse but there was nothing to feel. No poop or nothing. (We really don't know for sure if he had an impaction, a twisted gut, or what- but the vet treated it as an impaction.) If you do try that, I would make sure your fingernails are short and blunt (so you don't tear/bruise anything), wear a glove and make sure your thumb is folded flat against your hand, not sticking up. I have heard you can actually tear the intestines if your thumb is not folded down flat. Lubricate with something like mineral oil or petroleum jelly. Keep in mind I am NOT a vet and don't recommend this. The only reason I mention it is because you mentioned trying it and I was in your shoes a couple years ago and was desperate enough to try it myself. 

I would hope that if the impaction was within reach, the vet would have been able to remove some of it.

You might just be better off trying to get a goodly amount of water in there with an enema and hope it will soften things up. I just used a human waterbottle/enema bag when I tried this. No harm done, but it didn't produce any poop either. 

Just be careful and don't do anything to injure her, because at this point if she's eating and drinking, she might not be in too bad of shape. 

Best of luck, and I hope to hear she is pooping soon!


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## Masquerade (May 17, 2011)

ThaiDye said:


> I watched very closely what he did to pump the water into her & was wondering if I could do this myself?
> 
> Would it be possible to reach inside & try to remove it manually?


*Please do not try either of things yourself.* I am not trying to be mean at all but you can kill your horse doing either one. 
With a nasogastric tube you can cause pretty severe bleeding if you hit the ethmoid turbinates, you can rupture their stomach if you put too much water in, you can tear through their esophagus, you can drown them if you go into the lungs instead of the stomach (which is very easy to do). As for the hind end the major concern is creating a rectal tear which will allow fecal matter to enter the abdominal cavity causing a peritonitis and death. 
If you are not able to get her more advanced treatment (such as IV fluids as suggested) then you have done all that you can for her and either she will improve or she will get worse.


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## trailhorserider (Oct 13, 2009)

Masquerade said:


> *Please do not try either of things yourself.* I am not trying to be mean at all but you can kill your horse doing either one.
> With a nasogastric tube you can cause pretty severe bleeding if you hit the ethmoid turbinates, you can rupture their stomach if you put too much water in, you can tear through their esophagus, you can drown them if you go into the lungs instead of the stomach (which is very easy to do). As for the hind end the major concern is creating a rectal tear which will allow fecal matter to enter the abdominal cavity causing a peritonitis and death.
> If you are not able to get her more advanced treatment (such as IV fluids as suggested) then you have done all that you can for her and either she will improve or she will get worse.


I do agree. 

I think the best idea would be to get one more round of fluids from a vet, banamine if you are out, and pray for improvement. It's a good sign that she feels like eating and drinking.


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

> Please do not try either of things yourself.


I won't. It's not worth the risk. I will call the vets office tomorrow if she has not pooped yet & ask if a different Dr can come.

Currently, she is in a large turn-out with another mare & a young foal. I can move her to a stall tomorrow, but since she is with another horse, it may be hard to tell if she poops overnight.

As for the re-hydration, I still cannot find any information on the net if Pedialyte is horse-safe. I found sites that say it is safe for dogs & cats, even rabbits, but nothing for horses. Does anyone have any experience with this? I also read to "be careful when mixing it as it can make some hydration problems worse". 
I offered the Speedi Beet because it does say it is recommended for:
*95% Sugar free beet pulp
*Rehydration
*Easy keepers
*Healthy digestive tract
Also, I thought that some food may give her some energy to help her try to work through this versus her getting lethargic with no strength. I did make sure to make it extra sloppy, though.

It's just about time to go give her the Banamine. I do feel fortunate that she is next door & I don't have to drive to a boarding stable. However, I don't expect that I'll get much sleep tonight.


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## gaelgirl (Mar 3, 2011)

Good luck. I have no advice for you unfortunately, but you are both in my thoughts and prayers.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Masquerade said:


> *Please do not try either of things yourself.* I am not trying to be mean at all but you can kill your horse doing either one.
> With a nasogastric tube you can cause pretty severe bleeding if you hit the ethmoid turbinates, you can rupture their stomach if you put too much water in, you can tear through their esophagus, you can drown them if you go into the lungs instead of the stomach (which is very easy to do). As for the hind end the major concern is creating a rectal tear which will allow fecal matter to enter the abdominal cavity causing a peritonitis and death.


This!
Sticking objects into your horse, from either end, is dangerous. It is something we allow our vets to do because it needs to be done and they are properly trained. It is still risky, even for them.

Why would you leave a horse, whose manure output you need to monitor and whose liquid intake you need to monitor, out with two other horses?


I am surprised the vet did not include mineral oil when initially treated.

I am interested to know why IV fluids would be thousands. IV fluids does not require the horse to go to the clinic.


ETA - if you are going to offer food offer it keeping in mind your main goal is fluids, not food. Do not just make it sloppy, make it like cheap soup, where there is all broth and almost no food.
When I need to get fluids into my horse I take half a bucket of water (2 or 3 gallons) and drop in maybe a cup (yes, just a cup) full of feed pellets (in my case it is hay stretcher pellets). Stir. 

I have never had a vet suggest giving feed when dealing with an impaction colic. Never. 

Do you have grass? You might try hand grazing for 10-20 minutes. That gets some moisture into the horse.


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## mbender (Jul 22, 2009)

Not a good situation. Impaction colic is terrible. If you don't get this out this animal will die. Are you prepared for this? I almost had to put my filly down when she was only 2wks old because of this. But I worked at getting as much manure out as I could. And you REALLY need to be careful not to tear the intestine. 

Feeding is a big NO, NO. But like Always said if it is mainly a soup it might be ok. And yes, I would have had her/him hooked up to an IV. The kidneys can shut down quickly. Try and find a vet that will work with you and get this animal help. 

Good luck. Prayers sent your way.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

On the Pedialyte topic - I can not see why it would not be OK for horses. 

Though I would think it would take a boat load of Pedialyte to be an affective electrolyte for a horse since it is designed for small children. If you do not have any horse electrolytes you can use Gatorade or even adding some salt might help.


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## candandy49 (Jan 16, 2011)

I don't know about giving your horse Pedialyte, but there is a powdered electrolyte that is added to the drinking water. It is marketed for calves, but my Vet had me give it to one of our sick dogs with good results. You might check with your Vet about using it for your horse.

Wishing you the best of luck with your horse.


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## mysticalhorse (Apr 27, 2011)

As far as everyone on here believing that the vet wouldnt treat this horses the way everyone elses vet...... I know of a vet in my area the is a major stay away & he is the closest one. He has mis-treated many horses because he didnt want to take the time to do the job. I have 2 vets I call & both are over 20 miles away. I pay much more to have them treat my horses then the vet down the road. 

Not all vets are in it for the horses! Not all people live where they have the option to call a different pratice to get a better vet & all vet can charge what they want. 

I hope your horse is doing better this morning & when you go out to her she poops right in front of you! I havent dealt with impaction colioc but I have dealt with gas colioc. My 3 yr old gets gassy easily & I didnt know what to look for when I first got her so she ended up minorly coliocing. Now I know to trot her to break up her gas & I love hearing her toot when it happens. She is my gassy gal! 

Praying for your horse!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

> As far as everyone on here believing that the vet wouldnt treat this horses the way everyone elses vet...... I know of a vet in my area the is a major stay away & he is the closest one. He has mis-treated many horses because he didnt want to take the time to do the job. I have 2 vets I call & both are over 20 miles away. I pay much more to have them treat my horses then the vet down the road.
> 
> Not all vets are in it for the horses! Not all people live where they have the option to call a different pratice to get a better vet & all vet can charge what they want.


Thank you for this. I want to try to find a different vet so desperately! I truly believe he is the only one available when I call because nobody else wants him! He is the only vet I have ever had here, so I have no other experience. I do know that 1 time he was here, my neighbor asked him if he had horses himself & he said he didn't even like horses. He likes cows (I think). Also, his business card has airplanes on it b/c he like to fly. Maybe I'm supporting his habit?

I am seriously depleting my savings for this & have already made 2 withdrawal transfers this month. I am only allowed 6. Beyond that, the bank can close my account. I am really at my wits end here. If I drain my savings & then need money for my mortgage I'll be s*** out of luck!

We got the Banamine in her, but not until 6 o'clock this morning. I had to wake my neighbor b/c my husband & I just couldn't do it last night. She fought me all the way. I wish the vet left me with a shot instead of a paste.
I am going to look for a different vet this morning. I hope I find one before it's too late.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Banimine shots should only be given IV, not I-M so your choices if you can not do IV shots is paste or give the injectable orally (which is very doable, just tastes gross).

I do not find it bad that a large animal vet does not like certain types of large animals. He is only human. Treating horses is part of his job, he does not have to like them.

If she has enough gumption to fight you then she might just be feeling better.


Have you separated her so you will know how much manure she produces and how much water she is drinking?


Edit to add - The dash in I-M is because the forum's auto-editing system changed it to I'm with out the dash.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

tinyliny said:


> excellent post , Trailhorserider.
> I was told to NOT offer food, only water, in this kind of case, but my personal experience with this kind of colic was that the intubation was totally successful. I have been present at three other colics that all resulted in death, due to catching them too late and severe dehydration. Water is key.
> 
> please do let us know what happens. We will be thinking of you and your mare and wishing a successful outcome.


It depends on the type of colic you are dealing with. Sometimes the vet will sometimes tell you to give small amounts of hay because the roughage will actually help push the blockage or the stalled sand/poop out of the system. I have never heard them tell you feed grain though, not during a colic...


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

Do you have a horse trailer? If you do, you might want to load her up and take her for a half hour drive. Sometimes that will help shift things around and get the poop out. Also, see if there is a vet school near by. You don't want to play around too much here.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Not sure from your more recent posts. Is she still acting like she is in distress?


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

I found another vet. He is further out, but he's on his way now. I called expecting to leave a message until they opened & was surprised when the vet himself answered the phone. I hope he can do something for her.

Currently, she is just standing around. I do have a trailer & can take her for a drive if that really helps. Right now, I'm willing to do about anything.


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## ~*~anebel~*~ (Aug 21, 2008)

I had a mare impact at a show. She was impacted for over 48 hours and was a few hours from being put under the knife when an enema caused her to finally pass it. She was very quickly transported to the vet clinic with 24/7 monitoring and IV fluids and even then was in grave danger.
Make sure if your horse does pass this that you get her teeth checked and make sure she has enough access to water.

I hope that you are able to get her tubed and on IV fluids so she has a chance. Personally I would not be feeding anything including electrolytes. Offer only water in large quantities in a dry stall. If she doesn't get stressed in a trailer then a short trip may help her pass the impaction.

Good luck
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

ThaiDye said:


> Currently, she is just standing around. I do have a trailer & can take her for a drive if that really helps. Right now, I'm willing to do about anything.


What are her vitals?


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

Okay, new vet just left. We are MUCH happier with this vet. He did another tube through the nose with water, mineral oil & a laxative powder. He was able to remove some fecal matter, but it is still very dry. Only a little water came out when he squeezed it. Also he soaked it & found only a tiny amount of sand. She has pooped a couple times now, but he could still feel some when he palpated her.
Good signs: she is very alert & curious about all the activity around her (some gardeners came to clear the brush in the hillside), she is moving around a lot, & she has a good appetite. He did say I could give her small amounts of soaked alfalfa or wheat bran or beet pulp every few hours, but to soak it as wet as she'll take it. Also, I could add a little table salt to it to help her to want to drink more water. 
Vitals: her heart rate is still kinda high (about 56 bpm...yesterday it was 60 bpm). Her skin flattens out almost instantly when pinched & her gums pink up pretty fast. He would like to see them pink up just a bit faster, but he said the reaction time was very good. Her color is good & her eyes are bright. 

Anyway, things are looking much better right now. Hopefully they will continue to improve. At any rate, I have a new vet. We are both MUCH HAPPIER with him. He even cost less than the one yesterday & did more for her than the first one.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

yeah. glad to here it!


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Great news! Having a vet you like is a great thing. Glad you found a new vet.

Fingers crossed she passes all that dry stuff and is on the mend.


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## mbender (Jul 22, 2009)

Very happy for you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

A little more poop came out, but not much. At least there is movement. 
It's funny...I've never wanted a horse to poop so bad in my life! I'm even happy to clean it.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Isn't that the most ironic thing in life?

Every other day I am grumbling picking up all the manure they make.

Last colic I was out there counting manure piles and wishing there were more piles.

Glad she is making manure. Fingers crossed she keeps it up.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

Alwaysbehind said:


> Isn't that the most ironic thing in life?
> 
> Every other day I am grumbling picking up all the manure they make.
> 
> ...


I have one that has coliced multiple times so I'm one of those people that is always looking at the consistency and counting piles, running my shoes through it, grabbing a stick and poking it... I'm sure people would think I was a freak.......


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## Gidget (Jan 19, 2010)

I have not read all of the posts on here but I had to deal with impaction colic. 

DO NOT give your horse any food...nothing. Keep a salt block and water and make sure you keep an eye out on how much water she is drinking.

Your vet should have fed a tube through her nose and pumped her with food grade mineral oil. 

Do you have bute and banamine? You will need these two items to help her with the discomfort she is goign through. I would keep her in a stall or some type of inclosed area to monitor her to see if she is passing manure.

Do not do an enema...the horses rectum is very sensitive and if you are not careful you can do an extreme amount of damage to them. You need to call another vet and get her pumped. You might have to do it twice.

My mare almost died because of impaction colic. I didn't feed her for almost 2 weeks as she didn't pass anything. I had her pumped with oil twice,sedated,etc. This is very uncomfortable for them. Make sure you take her temp and check her vitals. Check her gums to see if they are dry or moist. If they are dry and have an odor she is dehydrated..also you can tell by pulling their skin and letting go..if it goes back to normal quickly she is fine but if it takes a few seconds she is dehydrated...check her eyes and her gut for sounds.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Farmpony, I would not think you are a freak for doing that. Even when I have not had a recent colic scare I do take note of manure consistency. Yes, poking it with my toe, etc.

Wait, maybe we are both freaks. 

Last colic I was able to tell the vet how many piles short of the norm my horse was. She did not look at me weird so I am guessing we are not the only people who notice these things.


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## Gidget (Jan 19, 2010)

Alwaysbehind said:


> Farmpony, I would not think you are a freak for doing that. Even when I have not had a recent colic scare I do take note of manure consistency. Yes, poking it with my toe, etc.
> 
> Wait, maybe we are both freaks.
> 
> Last colic I was able to tell the vet how many piles short of the norm my horse was. She did not look at me weird so I am guessing we are not the only people who notice these things.


 
I do the same thing..if anything seems odd I start poking through it with a stick and such. Also if I don't think my horse poops I take her for a walk and if she gets nervous she poops and then I'm happy and put her back...I know,I'm horrible.


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## mbender (Jul 22, 2009)

Guilty of the poop patrol. CSI for horse crap! I do the same to my dogs. Sounds gross but it is a great indicator of what how the animal is doing inside.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DejaVu (Jul 6, 2011)

My gelding over heated and impacted a couple weeks ago, and he didn't have his normal ration of grain for about five days after that, only soaked hay and slow, small amounts of his grain. So, I wonder about that.

But I hope he improves, and everything is fine.

For future reference, you may want to feed some oil in the grain, to help everything slide through easier.


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## trailhorserider (Oct 13, 2009)

Glad to hear you have a new vet and the horse is doing better. I'm crossing my fingers she will continue to improve!


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

> DO NOT give your horse any food...nothing. Keep a salt block and water and make sure you keep an eye out on how much water she is drinking.
> 
> Your vet should have fed a tube through her nose and pumped her with food grade mineral oil.
> 
> ...


The vet said I could give her small amounts (like handfuls) of soaked hay (think cheap soup) or wheat bran or beet pulp. He said these small feedings help keep her GI system moving. He is happy that she has an appetite because most animals (& people too) will not want to eat or drink when you're feeling bad.

He did use a nasal tube & pump alot of mineral oil & a powdered laxative (mixed up, of course) & water into her tummy. I do have banamine. In fact, she is almost due for her next dose.

While waiting for the vet this morning, I cleaned out a stall so I could closely monitor & made sure to tell the property manager NOT to move her & also under NO CIRCUMSTANCES is he to feed her.

Don't worry about the enema, I will not stick anything into her (except the banamine). I have been pulling her skin & it is flattening back instantly. Her gums pink back up very fast...could be a little faster, but the vet was happy with how quickly they returned to pink. Her eyes are bright, she is alert & curious, & her gut has been making sounds.

So far, so good. Hope she continues to improve.


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

> For future reference, you may want to feed some oil in the grain, to help everything slide through easier.


Hi said I can do it if the horse will eat it. Most will turn up their nose, but I will try. Also, no grain, but wheat bran or beet pulp because they are good fiber sources.


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## Gidget (Jan 19, 2010)

I'm glad your horsie is doing much better. You are lucky that she is recovering so quickly! I wish mine did.


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

Update:
I went out to walk her a bit & saw about 3 piles in the stall. Still very large pieces & not very moist, but progress still.
After walking, I tied her while I cleaned her stall & got a small piece of hay soaking. After I put her back, I went around watering the other horses & when I came back, there was a fresh pile. I gave her the banamine & while we were with her, another pile! Yay! Keep it up girl!


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## trailhorserider (Oct 13, 2009)

Yay!!! Maybe things are finally moving along now.


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## mysticalhorse (Apr 27, 2011)

So flippin glad you found another vet!!!! YEAH for poop!!! 

I am always on poop doody....lol.... I alway check my girls poop....didnt realize I may be weird! 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

Give the horse the banamine and walk him. Then walk him some more. Then some more. Hopefully the impaction will pass on out if the banamine stops the pain.
And don't feed any grain.


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

Banamine can be given IM. It just works better if given IV.


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## ~*~anebel~*~ (Aug 21, 2008)

I.M. Banamine can have some nasty complications.

And on walking the horse while colicing. While it is important to encourage movement to move an impaction or gas colic, if there is no change after about 10 to 15 minutes and the horse is not thrashing or constantly getting up and down, they should be allowed to rest either standing or laying down. Walking a horse constantly only serves to tire them out and between that and the pain they can become exhausted very quickly. 

OP glad to hear you found a competent vet and hopefully your horse continues to improve! As I mentioned earlier, it is important to find out why she coliced and correct it before it happens again. Teeth are a common issue. Good luck
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dreamer1215 (Jan 31, 2009)

_Like the others, I'm SO glad you have a new vet and I'm EXTREMELY happy for you that your girl is improving! I hope she comtinues on getting better & you have your girl back happy & healthy soon. Sucks when your horse is sick & they can't tell you... _


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## Masquerade (May 17, 2011)

~*~anebel~*~ said:


> I.M. Banamine can have some nasty complications.


The complication is gas gangrene and it is a fairly common complication with I.M banamine. 



~*~anebel~*~ said:


> And on walking the horse while colicing. While it is important to encourage movement to move an impaction or gas colic, if there is no change after about 10 to 15 minutes and the horse is not thrashing or constantly getting up and down, they should be allowed to rest either standing or laying down. Walking a horse constantly only serves to tire them out and between that and the pain they can become exhausted very quickly.


Totally agree with this, with any colic if your horse wants to lay down quietly (no rolling/thrashing) you should let them.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Celeste said:


> Banamine can be given IM. It just works better if given IV.


As others have already said, just feel it is worth repeating. Giving banamine I.M. is strongly discouraged because of the complications. It is not just a matter of it working better IV. 

Yes, it used to be common place for owners to inject banamine I.M. (under the direction of their vet), but it has been determined that the risk of gas gangrene is too high so it is no longer an acceptable way to give banamine.



Thai - so so so very happy to hear about the manure! It sounds like she is on her way through this glitch in her life. 

Per two vets in my area colic has been a real issue this year because of the extreme weather.


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## candandy49 (Jan 16, 2011)

So glad to hear your horse is getting better.


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

All I.M. injections can cause gangrene. Gas gangrene is caused by _Clostridium perfingens _which is a bacteria that thrives in damaged tissue with poor circulation (such as muscle that has been insulted with a bacterially contaminated I.M. injection).

IV injections should only be given by trained people. If accidentally given in an artery (carotid artery is close to jugular vein) the horse may seizure and die. That is why veterinarians tell horse owners to use the banamine I.M. 
(Bute is not labeled for IM use and should not be given I.M.)

Banamine is labeled in horses for IV or I.M. use. I do agree that IV is much better.

http://www.fda.gov/downloads/Animal...lDrugProducts/FOIADrugSummaries/ucm061762.pdf

Flunixin Meglumine for Veterinary Use


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

Celeste said:


> AThat is why veterinarians tell horse owners to use the banamine I.M.


Maybe your vets - but not mine. Banamine is a drug that cannot be purchased OTC. If the vet does not feel the owner is able to give an IV injection - or has someone that can - paste is better.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Years ago (probably four now), when my horse had a minor colic the vet left me with a syringe with a dose of Banamine in it to give it I.M if his symptoms came back.
That was then.
Now. No way no how will they give an owner that same syringe and tell you or even suggest you give Banamine I.M.

The risk of issues with Banamine has been determined to be much higher than other I.M injections so most vets (I would say vets who pay attention to current research) strongly recommend against giving Banamine I.M to a horse.

If an owner does not know how to give an IV injections then vets now suggest either Banamine paste or giving injectable Banamine orally.


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

Update:
5 more manure piles between 7pm & 10pm. WAY TO GO, BRANDI! This morning, vet said to use a half dose of banamine. Great appetite & she is very excited about going for her walks. She's not happy about eating soup anymore, but she's just going to have to until I see runny poo. In fact, I've starting wetting down the alfalfa for my other horses as well...not to soupy levels, but still moist.


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

*I am glad your horse is doing better.*


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

About the banamine I.M. .........
It is far better to either have your vet out 3 times per day to give the injections or to *hospitalize* the horse. It is never best to have a horse owner give any type of injection. It is only done because the horse owners do not want to or cannot invest thousands of dollars. It is the lesser of two evils if the horse is going to die without treatement.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Celeste you are missing the big picture that there are safer ways for an owner to get banamine into the horse. I.M and IV are not the only two ways (as has been said by many).

If I.M was the one and only way an owner that could not do IV injections could get banamine into their horse then fine. Then the risk would be worth it.

But it most certainly is not the only way.

Injectable banamine given orally works just fine. It tastes horrible but who really cares at that point.
Paste banamine works fine too. It worked quite well for me just the other day even. It appears to be working just fine for the OP of this thread.

No reason to risk a serious side affect.


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

Celeste said:


> About the banamine I.M. .........
> It is far better to either have your vet out 3 times per day to give the injections or to *hospitalize* the horse. It is never best to have a horse owner give any type of injection. It is only done because the horse owners do not want to or cannot invest thousands of dollars. It is the lesser of two evils if the horse is going to die without treatement.


What is your medical background with equines?


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

I am a licensed veterinarian, graduate of the University of Georgia College of Veterinary Medicine, federally accredited by the USDA, with 25 years of clinical equine experience. I have been a rider/horseman for 44 years. 
I honestly believe that no injections should be given by untrained individuals. *I do not dispense injectable drugs of any kind ever*, but I know that horse owners find them and give them. I have had frantic midnight calls to see horses that so called "vet nurses" with no licensure have given to horses intraarterially. The horses die. I have seen one case of post I.M. injection gangrene. It was given by a licensed veterinarian. The drug was contaminated; it was not his fault. The horse lived, but there was not much of him left after the incident. If a veterinarian chooses to give banamine I.M. according to label instructions (though they never will because there is no reason to), and the horse gets an infection, then the drug company will be liable. If the label on banamine is removed for I.M. injection (as it was for ivermectin in the 80's) then the veterinarian would be liable. I don't give banamine I.M. because it is ineffective and I would not use it at all if it were not crucial.
What did you say your background was?


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## cakemom (Jul 4, 2010)

I'm so glad your horse is doing better....and given the current discussion, glad to be a trained vet tech, who can give shots and draw blood in her sleep.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

About the banamine...I was given a paste. My horse was fighting me giving her the paste, so I said I _wish_ the vet gave me a shot...just because it would have been easier to give than the paste. I was unaware of the complications & would not have taken a syringe if I had to give it IV. 

Brandi's heart rate is back down to 44bpm & her hydration is almost back to normal. The vet was here again today & was very happy to see how well she is doing. He said I could have her back to normal feeding by tomorrow night, but I am still going to wet down her alfalfa...probably at least until this heat breaks. At any rate, I am going to more closely monitor all my horses poop from now on. It's something I know I have to do with the parrots, but I just never paid that much attention to the horse's manure unless it was very wet.


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## WalkerLady (Jul 22, 2010)

Alwaysbehind said:


> Injectable banamine given orally works just fine.


My old vet let me buy some injectable banamine just to have for an emergency and this conversation has made me very nervous about injecting it, should the emergency ever arise. Always, do you know how much of the injectable banamine should be given orally if needed? Like, should I just mix the entire syringe into some applesauce or molasses and squirt it into her mouth? The amount is 8 cc's.


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

WalkerLady said:


> My old vet let me buy some injectable banamine just to have for an emergency and this conversation has made me very nervous about injecting it, should the emergency ever arise. Always, do you know how much of the injectable banamine should be given orally if needed? Like, should I just mix the entire syringe into some applesauce or molasses and squirt it into her mouth? The amount is 8 cc's.


The same amount


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## KDW (May 31, 2011)

I would be VERY concerned with that vet. 99% of vets don't just "give up" and say that it's too late. He should have pulled some poop out. I would def. try a new vet from a dif. town. may cost more but in the end your horse is getting the care she needs.


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

A friend's horse got impaction colic. The vet, a good farm vet shoved his arm in to get a feel of what was happening. Rock solid. He took the garden hose and inserted it and it was turned on full pressure. After a few minutes, he put his arm back in and was able to break it up a bit. He removed his arm to take the hose again when suddenly manure shot for 20'. The horse who'd been too uncomfortable to move so no one tied or held him, suddenly took off bucking with manure flying all over. He was one happy cleaned out horse.


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## ThaiDye (Apr 28, 2011)

> I would be VERY concerned with that vet. 99% of vets don't just "give up" and say that it's too late. He should have pulled some poop out. I would def. Try a new vet from a dif. Town. May cost more but in the end your horse is getting the care she needs.


Already found one. I think he's new to the area (didn't come up the first time I searched for a vet) but he is 150% better. Great bedside manner & less expensive...if you can believe that. He did so much more for Brandi & didn't charge as much.

There was an incident here the next day. The BO's stallion bit one of a boarder's geldings in the back. VERY BAD bite! I called the gelding's owner & referred them to Dr. M & he came back & took care of it. While he was here, he rechecked Brandi & administered her shots, plus checked on my other horses as well (& only charged for the shots). I called it a referral bonus. LOL


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