# He went bronc on me, I think I give up...



## RedTree (Jan 20, 2010)

oh wow, glad your okay.
But I think you should of gotten back on, even to just walk around.

Maybe for the next few weeks tack him up and if you feel up to riding get on and walk around.... not much help are you sure hes not in pain?


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## ChingazMyBoy (Apr 16, 2009)

*Have you ever thought of lunging before you ride, specially with the rich grass you are currently having. I think it would be both best for you and the horse for you to do so - as that way if your horse does decide to throw a mental and carry on and buck you are not on the horse to fall off and be injured. Also, has this laziness problem been there from the beginning (sorry if you mentioned this already, I must have missed it).*

*Also did you have him vet checked when you first got him and are you positive that your saddle fits correctly and that he is in no pain what so ever.*


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## PumpkinzMyBaby22 (Jul 5, 2009)

I agree with lunging before the ride. That way any extra energy can leave before you get on.

Hope you are ok, and don't give up on him yet.


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## wild_spot (Jan 30, 2008)

If a horse goes bronc on me, I don't give a hoot what may have caused it. Nothing is an excuse for that behavior. That doesn't mean I don't check and double check everything is ok - but it is never an excuse. 

Life is too short to spend it with a horse you are afraid of.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ChingazMyBoy (Apr 16, 2009)

wild_spot said:


> If a horse goes bronc on me, I don't give a hoot what may have caused it. Nothing is an excuse for that behavior. That doesn't mean I don't check and double check everything is ok - but it is never an excuse.
> 
> Life is too short to spend it with a horse you are afraid of.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


*I agree with this statement 100%.*

*If you don't feel comfortable with the horse you own are riding, then maybe they aren't the horse for you. Have you got this horse on trial? Maybe you should continue looking for a horse. If you only got this horse in December and your already wanting to give up - this may be giving you signs for the future.*


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

I do lunge him before I ride with this new grass, and when I fell off I lunged him and then got back on and just did walk/trot for about 10minutes.

He was vet checked and everything before I bought him home, and his saddle was properly fitted and to my knowledge he hasn't changed shape since then.

And yeah the laziness has been there since the start.

I will ad more later im off to school


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

Sometimes a horse will, for lack of a better phrase, get a bug up his *** for no apparent reason. It's really good that you got back on him but I doubt his reaction was because he was fresh. After all, you said that you had already done several transitions up to and down from the canter. In my experience, if a horse is feeling froggy because he's fresh, then it's the first time you hit a canter that he'll blow. 

Without having seen what happened with my own eyes, my gut tells me that this may have been his way of throwing a tantrum because he just didn't want to trot. If he tries it again, try to get his head bent to one side and use inside leg to push him into little tiny circles. With his neck bent and his hindquarters moving sideways, that will take much of the power away from his bucking or maybe stop him cold. Whenever I have one buck with me, immediately after they stop trying, when I still have their face to the side, I will push them into those tiny little circles for a minute or two until they are puffing pretty good. Then, I just resume what we were doing when the fit started. On a normal horse, it only takes a few sessions of that before they give up bucking altogether.


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## Shasta1981 (Nov 12, 2010)

Yikes! That's scary. Glad you are OK! What did you originally buy him for? Do you have a trainer helping you out? 

Agree with SMROBS' post. Sounds to me like he wants to call the shots.


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

Wow, glad you're okay. You might want to consider a career as a writer. I can totally picture how he felt right before he pitched his fit and your thought process about his height on the way down. 

So you've had this guy for almost 3 months now. Any chance he's just feeling a little overfaced? Maybe back things down just a notch and break it down into very small steps for him to try to determine where he might be feeling frustrated. By his look of guilt, I'm not convinced he was trying to be mean or even bad. He was most likely thinking, "crap I just can't do this" and picked the easiest way out.


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## FoxyRoxy1507 (Jul 15, 2008)

i agree with MyBoyPuck esp being a OTTB, they can get like this when theyre not used to be taught something new. i would just go back to walk/trot for a while till you get his confidence back up for about a month or so and then go back to the canter. For an OTTB keeping a nicely balanced canter is very hard for them and they do tend to get frustrated so just take it slow.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I agree that you write very well and it's a good story, with a happy ending in that you weren't badly hurt.

I think that this horse doesn't know how to handle pressure. What I mean is that he goes along, goes along, goes along in a way of going that you describe as "lazy". He is kind of tuned out. when there is enough pressure to move him out of the zoned state of mind, he comes unglued. some horses have two settings : Turned off and wacked out. and the tranistion line between the two is razor thin. Most horses have a middle ground that moves progressively toward wacked out as pressure goes up and with training, they know how to deal with a lot of pressure before they reach the place where they lose their mind. I think your guy has never had the training to DEAL with pressure and his inborn personality is kind of unaware or sucked into himself, UNTIL something breaks the shell and then he is GONE mentally. That's why a horse that on the surface looks really "deadbroke" can often be so mentally tuned out that he is dangerous when faced with sudden pressure. 

I would work with him in a round pen (if you have one) and push him forward, push him to the point where you can see he is getting irritated or frustrated or just reacting to the pressure emotionally, and then experiment with both easing off at that point, and then pushing again, a little further. IF and WHEN he "blows" don't let him indulge in a long bucking session, but rather get hin there turn him, turn him , turn him and bring him back into his mind and listenting to you, even though he wants to react ballistically to the pressure.


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

Thanks everybody, I don't have a professional trainer helping me, as the closest I can get is my awesome next door neighbour who is a race horse trainer, he has Mitchell for now and he's going to hack him out for me untill the weekend where I'm going to get him back and start working on him again.

I wasn't doing anything excesively difficult, and he is very balanced in his canter (to me anyway, but i'm naturally off balance thanks to scoliosis so hey)

I'm actually wondering if he's been bored also, I was only riding him in paddocks, while they were different ones with different scenery and "scary" objects (road cones and barrels) they were still just paddocks.
I did some bending poles on him at a trot the day before and he enjoyed it, but you should have seen his face when I asked him to walk around one of the big logs in the paddock, his eyeballs nearly popped out of his head. He is quite spooky but the last time he spooked he went leg yeilding across the paddock at a trot, which I have to admit was hilarious at the time because any other horse I know goes either backwards or forwards... very quickly. He leg yeilded, very quickly.

He has been taught to naturally go down on the bit, this was after he finished his racing career in April 2010.



> I agree that you write very well and it's a good story, with a happy ending in that you weren't badly hurt.
> 
> I think that this horse doesn't know how to handle pressure. What I mean is that he goes along, goes along, goes along in a way of going that you describe as "lazy". He is kind of tuned out. when there is enough pressure to move him out of the zoned state of mind, he comes unglued. some horses have two settings : Turned off and wacked out. and the tranistion line between the two is razor thin. Most horses have a middle ground that moves progressively toward wacked out as pressure goes up and with training, they know how to deal with a lot of pressure before they reach the place where they lose their mind. I think your guy has never had the training to DEAL with pressure and his inborn personality is kind of unaware or sucked into himself, UNTIL something breaks the shell and then he is GONE mentally. That's why a horse that on the surface looks really "deadbroke" can often be so mentally tuned out that he is dangerous when faced with sudden pressure.
> 
> I would work with him in a round pen (if you have one) and push him forward, push him to the point where you can see he is getting irritated or frustrated or just reacting to the pressure emotionally, and then experiment with both easing off at that point, and then pushing again, a little further. IF and WHEN he "blows" don't let him indulge in a long bucking session, but rather get hin there turn him, turn him , turn him and bring him back into his mind and listenting to you, even though he wants to react ballistically to the pressure.


Thankyou  I enjoy creative writing but that's normally imaginary... This definately wasn't haha!
When I got my first horse I trained myself to ride her before I actually rode her... If that makes sense. I don't have a round pen, but I would set up a make-shift one out of standards and a reel. Would this work? Or should I just kindly ask my neighbour if I can clean out and borrow his? It's a wee while away but that's ok. 

Yeah I have to agree he is quite tuned out at times, for instance he's very smart but at the same time a bit of a numb skull, if I pick out his right front hoof first he doesn't pay attention and slowly leans backwards, then leans down slowly as if he's going to bow, then just drops to his knees because retard wasn't paying attention, any other hoof he's alright though the wierdo :L


I also have to say I am in a far better mood about my horses in general today, I rode bubbles tonight and she was an absolute angel for once in her life, I rode with barely any contact on her mouth and we did a few flying changes. We are *hopefully* competing on saturday.

Humphrey wants to get Mitchell ready for me to compete on saturday in the flat classes, but I'm not to keen on that idea I would rather just take bubbles and leave Mitch at home... Unless maybe it could benefit him having a day out? Even just to walk around and not be ridden?



> Sometimes a horse will, for lack of a better phrase, get a bug up his *** for no apparent reason. It's really good that you got back on him but I doubt his reaction was because he was fresh. After all, you said that you had already done several transitions up to and down from the canter. In my experience, if a horse is feeling froggy because he's fresh, then it's the first time you hit a canter that he'll blow.
> 
> Without having seen what happened with my own eyes, my gut tells me that this may have been his way of throwing a tantrum because he just didn't want to trot. If he tries it again, try to get his head bent to one side and use inside leg to push him into little tiny circles. With his neck bent and his hindquarters moving sideways, that will take much of the power away from his bucking or maybe stop him cold. Whenever I have one buck with me, immediately after they stop trying, when I still have their face to the side, I will push them into those tiny little circles for a minute or two until they are puffing pretty good. Then, I just resume what we were doing when the fit started. On a normal horse, it only takes a few sessions of that before they give up bucking altogether.


Thankyou smrobs, I will try that next time, generally when they buck thats around about what I do if I can't initially push them forwards underneath me to canter properly, but this time it happened so fast I couldn't react fast enough... And that's saying something because I race ministocks and have one of the fastest reaction times on the track, which has saved my butt numerous times.

My knee is still purple haha but I rode bubbles today anyway, I will sacrifice my comfort to keep her in work and strong lol. That's why I love bubbles, because no matter how, when or why I get thrown off any horse I know I can get on her and do what I would do on any other day, she just can't scare me anymore. So I got on her today especially for that reason, because it did un nerve me quite a bit when Mitchell did what he did.

*hehe, sorry, another novel.* -i'm good like that :L


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## AppyLuva (Oct 25, 2010)

smrobs said:


> Sometimes a horse will, for lack of a better phrase, get a bug up his *** for no apparent reason. It's really good that you got back on him but I doubt his reaction was because he was fresh. After all, you said that you had already done several transitions up to and down from the canter. In my experience, if a horse is feeling froggy because he's fresh, then it's the first time you hit a canter that he'll blow.
> 
> Without having seen what happened with my own eyes, my gut tells me that this may have been his way of throwing a tantrum because he just didn't want to trot. If he tries it again, try to get his head bent to one side and use inside leg to push him into little tiny circles. With his neck bent and his hindquarters moving sideways, that will take much of the power away from his bucking or maybe stop him cold. Whenever I have one buck with me, immediately after they stop trying, when I still have their face to the side, I will push them into those tiny little circles for a minute or two until they are puffing pretty good. Then, I just resume what we were doing when the fit started. On a normal horse, it only takes a few sessions of that before they give up bucking altogether.


I'm so glad that you got out of that situation with a bruise instead of a broken bone. I'd also have to agree with the post above. Perhaps you should take a little more time before you completely give up on this horse.


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## rottenweiler (Apr 16, 2009)

I have to comment just because this same thing happened to me riding someone else's horse. They told me he was well broke, had been leased by a young girl who did barrels on him but recently he had gotten and absess in one of his hooves and hadn't been ridden for months while it healed. I watched the owner lunge him on my first visit and he was an ***, but I could see what SHE was doing wrong. So the second visit out she lunged him for a bit and then I lunged him. He tried his antics with me at first but I already knew what he was going to do so I managed to keep him from doing it. Then I got on and just walked around in a small circle. Next time I was out on my own. He always had been a distracted horse, looking this way and that like his head was on a swivel. I had lunged him for a bit and then got on. Was just walking around the ring and he just stopped. I thought 'maybe he's going potty' so I turned and checked..nope, just standing there. so I squeezed with my leg a little. Still no response. I gave it another second trying to think, myself, why he decided to stop. Next time I gave pressure with my leg he bucked and then went backwards right out from under me. When he bucked, I landed on the wide part of the saddle horn (western saddle, not my choice but the only one that was available) then he was off into his bucking/farting fit around the arena. It was a small arena so not really a big concern of me having to chase him. I just got up and dusted myself off and moved out of the way until he was finished with his tantrum. During his tantrum he destroyed the bridle. Stepped through the reigns and snapped them as well as the bridle itself. So he had his little fit and then just stopped and walked back over to me like 'ok I'm done now' I couldn't get back on him because there was no bridle but I free lunged him around the small arena making him work out the excess energy he had. I explained to his owner what happened and she was a little suprised but not 'enough' suprised if you catch my drift. She sold him the next day.


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## Thia (Sep 21, 2010)

Maybe you should have the vet check him if he drops to his knees when you are picking his feet. Even if it is only with one leg. It sounds like something is wrong there.


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

> Maybe you should have the vet check him if he drops to his knees when you are picking his feet. Even if it is only with one leg. It sounds like something is wrong there.


He has been checked over by a vet but he only does it on that one leg if he's not paying attention. If I pick out another hoof first or I have been doing other stuff with him he doesn't do it. I think brushing him relaxes him to much haha then when I go to pick out his hooves he's like oh wait what? If I pick the hooves out before I brush him he's generally ok.

Bubbles has done it to but she had grass staggers so thats a different story alltogether.

I'm going to buy either alleviate of tox-defy to put in his feed until the grass isn't so much like rocket juice anymore.. I've been told it works so hopefully it does.


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

rottenweiler said:


> I have to comment just because this same thing happened to me riding someone else's horse. They told me he was well broke, had been leased by a young girl who did barrels on him but recently he had gotten and absess in one of his hooves and hadn't been ridden for months while it healed. I watched the owner lunge him on my first visit and he was an ***, but I could see what SHE was doing wrong. So the second visit out she lunged him for a bit and then I lunged him. He tried his antics with me at first but I already knew what he was going to do so I managed to keep him from doing it. Then I got on and just walked around in a small circle. Next time I was out on my own. He always had been a distracted horse, looking this way and that like his head was on a swivel. I had lunged him for a bit and then got on. Was just walking around the ring and he just stopped. I thought 'maybe he's going potty' so I turned and checked..nope, just standing there. so I squeezed with my leg a little. Still no response. I gave it another second trying to think, myself, why he decided to stop. Next time I gave pressure with my leg he bucked and then went backwards right out from under me. When he bucked, I landed on the wide part of the saddle horn (western saddle, not my choice but the only one that was available) then he was off into his bucking/farting fit around the arena. It was a small arena so not really a big concern of me having to chase him. I just got up and dusted myself off and moved out of the way until he was finished with his tantrum. During his tantrum he destroyed the bridle. Stepped through the reigns and snapped them as well as the bridle itself. So he had his little fit and then just stopped and walked back over to me like 'ok I'm done now' I couldn't get back on him because there was no bridle but I free lunged him around the small arena making him work out the excess energy he had. I explained to his owner what happened and she was a little suprised but not 'enough' suprised if you catch my drift. She sold him the next day.


 
It's not nice aye, Mitchell carried his fit out in the paddock and come back when he had finished but I ignored him because I was so frustrated all I wanted to do was smack him one, I didn't though I only smack them immediately after/as they are doing something bad. I ended up putting my whip away 'cause I didn't wanna use it out of frustration.
Oh yeah, sounds like the horse had a slight history of it then?
That's one reason why I ride with a running martingale, if I come off I generally let go of the reins and when I do I know the martingale will help keep the reins away from the legs etc. He has a brand new very expensive bridle so needless to say I would have been less than impressed.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

So sorry that happened to you. Something like that happened to me but I was hurt pretty severely - gaaaa...don't ever want that again.

No horse is worth taking away your confidence and joy of riding. If you aren't comfortable with this boy - get one you are comfortable with. I don't do bucking fits...I am too big of a sissy.

Hope everything works out for you...not matter which road you take. : )


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## Lakotababii (Nov 28, 2010)

I used to ride this little arab/paint cross that did the same thing. He would go great for quite a while. Then, for no reason other than being an a** he would buck. And I mean BUCK! lol. I know it wasnt the saddle, because he did it both bareback and with a saddle on. I know it wasnt the bit, he did it both bitless and with a bit on. And I know it wasnt transitions as he has done it as a trot, canter, walk, and full out run (which is fun trying to stay on a bucking bolting angry little arab without a saddle on lol). Anyways sometimes horses personalities are harder to tame. The horse, when I left for college, had gotten a lot better and no longer bucked hard, but he still threw little fits sometimes. The point being some horses are just more easily irritated and act out. Like humans they have distinct personalities. Good luck with the little ******, and good job for getting help.


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

My neighbour told me today he thinks mitchell is to big and to strong for me... No kidding, he's a full hand bigger than bubbles, 18 years younger, has an incredible amount of muscle... so of course if he wants me off he's gonna get me off.

But him telling me that has kind of made me determined to make it work. I'm not scared to get on him i'm not scared to ride him, i'm just afraid of what I know he can do. When someone tells me I can't do it I get very determined to do it and prove them wrong.
When I first got bubbles I was told she was very strong, would need riding twice a day and would be very difficult... Now almost 3 years later I can jump on with no reins and ride around the paddock. I've gone from scared crapless of her to knowing at the end of the day I can get on her after getting thrown off any horse and still be happy, and i'm satisfied to know that i've proven a lot of people wrong with her. And I plan to do the same with Mitchell.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

Good for you! Just stick with him.


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## CJ82Sky (Dec 19, 2008)

i don't know if this has been mentioned but this SCREAMS to me of saddle fit/back pain issues.


have you checked your saddle? and checked his back?

my OTArab has spine damage and he will be fine but if he hits that damaged disc that little guy ca buck 10x harder than any bronc i've seen at the rodeo. as i've had him and learned to understand that, he's had chiro adjustments and i've learned that small circles hurt, etc. and don't do those things with him and do lots of trot exercises so that we can build muscle better.

im guessing in the case of your horse not wanting to move forward that even if the pain isn't severe now he's learned that at some point forward = pain.

check the saddle fit (check my site equi-eval.com for info and ideas) and stretch him before you ride and longe too - which i saw you are doing and also gives the horse the opportunity to stretch.

good luck and i'd be willing to bet the saddle pinches at the top of the shoulders below the withers, and again where the saddle gullet narrows it sits unevenly about 2/3 of the way back from the cantle and is hitting his lower back causing pain. just a guess though - w/o pictures i'd be hard pressed to tell. happy to help with saddle fit if you want to post pics!


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## rottenweiler (Apr 16, 2009)

Well, good for you. I have learned that me and tb's don't get along well. They are too high strung and I am not confident enough. I do well with tb mixes though (what do you call that appendix tb?) The mare I ride now is arab/tb which is ironic because I USED to be afraid of arabs...only because I had never ridden one and every one that I knew was really high strung. I wish you luck but I don't think you'll need it, all you needed was that little bit of motivation


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

CJ82Sky said:


> i don't know if this has been mentioned but this SCREAMS to me of saddle fit/back pain issues.
> 
> 
> have you checked your saddle? and checked his back?
> ...


 
I have been told by one professional and several random people that his saddle fits, but these pics are from when I first got him, hopefully it'll give a rough idea. (but the professionals in any type eg chiros and vets never seem to do a proper job so it totally wouldn't suprise me if it actually doesn't fit :evil -and that's why I dont have local chiros do work to my horses.


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## CJ82Sky (Dec 19, 2008)

what does the saddle look like w/o a pad?
here's what would help in terms of pictures (taken from equi-eval.com):
Saddle Images
First, please be sure your horse is clean, groomed and trimmed and that you have something to stand on while taking these pictures to ensure that you can get the necessary angles. All pictures should be taken on solid, level ground with adequate lighting so that the way the saddle lays on the horse’s back can be clearly seen. All pictures should be taken without a saddle pad or girth to assess the true fit of the saddle on the horse.
•Take pictures of the saddle from both the left and right sides, with the camera level to the center of the side of the saddle and parallel to the ground
•A picture from the front (facing the tail of the horse) taken of the saddle on the withers, with the camera as close to level as possible with the horse’s head and neck at a normal, comfortable level - having the horse put their head up or down can adversely affect the pictures
•A rear view picture should also be included showing the saddle on the horse’s back, with the camera as close to level as possible with the top of the horse’s back
•If possible, include pictures a total of four from the left and right side showing the back flap and the front flap of the saddle with the camera aimed upwards, giving a clear view of how the panels and flaps rest across the horse’s sides

from the pics you posted so far it looks to me like it clears the withers but pinches in the top of the shoulder. im also guessing with that deep slightly awkward seat (not a fan of APs - jack of all trades master of none when it comes to position!) that it puts you in a bit of a chair seat with your weight slightly towards the back of the saddle when you sit and your legs from the hip bone a bit out in front of you. that would cause shoulder pain/pinching and stress on his mid-lower back which is a prime trigger for bucking. i'd definitely be curious to hear more from you and see some more pictures.

thanks for sharing!


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## MajorSealstheDeal (Jan 4, 2011)

I just have one piece of advice. I completely disagree with lungeing a horse to get rid of their energy. Instead, find a way to use it. On the flip side, I agree with lungeing a horse before riding for other reasons.

I am training my green broke mare, and to get her head in the game, as she is very emotional and more high strung, I will lunge her at a flat walk only. She usually starts out a little fast, but in a few minutes she slows down and relaxes. I use parelli games on her so I will ask her to back up, come in, back up, change directions. All at a slow speed.

When I was a teenager and taking lessons on a TB, he was getting very ring sour. My instructor had every student who rode him, lunge him half an hour before the lesson to get the bugs out, with the same idea, if he is going to buck, get it out on the lunge. Well that horse got in excellent shape, and it did nothing to stop his bad behaviour. 

There must be an underlying cause, a pain issue, saddle fit, etc. 

I agree with whoever suggested a round pen, that is a great tool, and that poster had great advice.

Good luck and don't give up!


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

CJ82Sky said:


> what does the saddle look like w/o a pad?
> here's what would help in terms of pictures (taken from equi-eval.com):
> Saddle Images
> First, please be sure your horse is clean, groomed and trimmed and that you have something to stand on while taking these pictures to ensure that you can get the necessary angles. All pictures should be taken on solid, level ground with adequate lighting so that the way the saddle lays on the horse’s back can be clearly seen. All pictures should be taken without a saddle pad or girth to assess the true fit of the saddle on the horse.
> ...


 
I will do the photo's when I can, I'm very busy now with level 2 NCEA (darn school, but I'm not going to drop out), and the fact that Mitch isn't even with me right now makes a bit difficult to take photos of him haha.
When he comes home I will try to do the pictures.

When you say you think it could pinch behind the shoulders, how do you mean? and does that suggest he should have a wider gullet?

and while I think about it... Is it possible that it could be me causing him pain? Being that I will never have the most amazing position out there because I have scoliosis both ways and one side of my pelvis is smaller than the other, so naturally I ride crooked whether I like it or not... And because of it, I ALWAYS fall off/get thrown off the right hand side.

I've put on a recent picture of me riding him, but only one as I only really have pics of me riding bubbles in that saddle. Now I know my position will probably be frowned upon, and my hands are discusting and i'm leaning forwards something terrible, and I do my best to correct it but I'm limited to how much I can correct it even with a trainer. -And that particular day he had this thing about keeping his head near to the ground because there were flies around so my hands were up trying to keep his head up, it worked mostly.


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## CJ82Sky (Dec 19, 2008)

super hard to say if it's you causing it and even if it is - such a big reaction is not deserved.

as for saddle - often what gives wither clearance will then be too narrow for the shoulder. get wider in the gullet and fit the shoulder but then hit the withers/spine. makes for a tough to fit horse.

no rush on pics just trying to help.


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

MajorSealstheDeal said:


> I just have one piece of advice. I completely disagree with lungeing a horse to get rid of their energy. Instead, find a way to use it. On the flip side, I agree with lungeing a horse before riding for other reasons.
> 
> I am training my green broke mare, and to get her head in the game, as she is very emotional and more high strung, I will lunge her at a flat walk only. She usually starts out a little fast, but in a few minutes she slows down and relaxes. I use parelli games on her so I will ask her to back up, come in, back up, change directions. All at a slow speed.
> 
> ...


Generally I use the lunge to let my horses stretch out before I get on them, sure I manually stretch each leg etc before I get on but especially with bubbles who is 25 I like to let her have an extra bit of a stretch before I climb on. (PS wish me luck i'm taking her to a show tomorrow :lol

I'm guessing there has to be an underlying cause, I know it's not worms, I know it's not his hooves, so unless it's his previously bowed tendon playing up (it was pretty minor though so I don't think it would be that, he is booted when ridden and I check his legs before and after each ride, and I don't do overly strenuous work eg jumping or riding on hard ground etc), his saddle fit, or his back then I'm pretty sure it's the rich grass. He's next door with our neighbour in a pretty grassless paddock, so if he's still doing it even without the hyperness from the grass then I know he's definately sore. Even dad said it, the grass is like rocket fuel to his cows at the moment, I'm so lucky bubbles isn't on much grass she goes absolutely nuts.


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

CJ82Sky said:


> super hard to say if it's you causing it and even if it is - such a big reaction is not deserved.
> 
> as for saddle - often what gives wither clearance will then be too narrow for the shoulder. get wider in the gullet and fit the shoulder but then hit the withers/spine. makes for a tough to fit horse.
> 
> no rush on pics just trying to help.


I know a few brands of saddle that have a cut back pommel, which is probably good for thoroughbreds.. He has massive shoulders to, I don't know if you can tell from the photo's, but he does. That was the first thing one person said to me a few weeks ago upon introducing mitchell to her.

I don't think i've posted this before, if I have oh well, but I walked out the night before he was taken to the neighbours, lifted up my trouser leg and said "look what you did to me mitchell, look at the size of this bruise" and he looked at it quite intently, kind of going 'what do you call that?' and he was snorting and sniffing at it and put his nose right on the bruise, it hurt haha, but i let him see it.
Then I bought a road cone over to his paddock, thinking perhaps he was bored paddocked on his own and needed a toy, when I bought it over to him he got excited (I think, he didn't look scared so must've been excited) and he started doing, in the paddock with no gear on, what he had done when I got thrown off him. He was galloping around in circles and stopping at the fence and pawing the ground and bucking and farting and rearing infront of me, I didn't know how to take that reaction, so I let him have the cone and walked out of the paddock not wanting to be in his path of destruction. He would walk over to it, snort at it and take a sniff, then go into his big bucking frenzy.. I dare say next time I take something out for him to play with I'm taking a camera.
That kind of made me think well maybe it is just the grass, afterall he's doing it with no tack on so it can't be his saddle or me this time. Maybe he's just high on grass and was a bit of a ticking time bomb.
Bubbles does the same on her "grass highs" but instead of bucking she tries her luck at a flat out bolt, but i've learnt her tricks now and can stop her cold no worries.

And by the way, I appreciate everyone trying to help, I am not ashamed to admit no I don't know a lot of things about horses, that's why I am asking questions, nobody does know every single little thing, that's why we have professionals :lol: (even though some of them do more harm than good around here, but we won't go in to that :evil
And I appreciate the fact that I haven't had my head ripped off for whatever reason like I've seen happens on some threads


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

He's definately not a nasty horse in any way, as you can probably tell by the photo's, so whatever his reasoning is to being like he was that day I will get to the bottom of it.
He is the sort of horse that always wants to be with you, he runs up the paddock to meet me and sniff's everything I brong out to him (I haven't given him treats yet though) I bring random things out like my car keys and water bottles and my chapstick etc just because its so funny to see him so interested in things. He doesn't even try to eat them he just sniffs them and listens to the noises they make. Even my camera haha.







And while I remember and you can see it in this photo, his right front leg is the one he has previously had a bowed tendon to, you can see the little bump in it... Well to me it's little anyway I've never really seen very many bowed tendons.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Hm m m . I still think he has not learned how to deal with being overfaced. It's cool that you are bringing stuff out and letting him see it and reacte. Maybe after awhile he will find ways to react that don't entail a big hullabaloo.


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## CJ82Sky (Dec 19, 2008)

i agree on more playtime - he may also be trying to just play with you for fun - so the more you can stimulate him mentally before/outside of rides the better your actual rides will be. try also possibly doing some trick training or games with him - ive found smarter horses love that stuff then are more willing to focus when ridden.

as for the saddle it very well could be pinching his shoulders giving him an excuse, but based on the reaction to the cone, likely not the sole cause! 

engage his brain in some games so that when it is time to work, he can focus. also sounds to me like the kind of horse that doesn't want too much repetition under saddle so perhaps try mixing it up some when you ride. good luck!


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

CJ82Sky said:


> i agree on more playtime - he may also be trying to just play with you for fun - so the more you can stimulate him mentally before/outside of rides the better your actual rides will be. try also possibly doing some trick training or games with him - ive found smarter horses love that stuff then are more willing to focus when ridden.
> 
> as for the saddle it very well could be pinching his shoulders giving him an excuse, but based on the reaction to the cone, likely not the sole cause!
> 
> engage his brain in some games so that when it is time to work, he can focus. also sounds to me like the kind of horse that doesn't want too much repetition under saddle so perhaps try mixing it up some when you ride. good luck!


I have loads of random things I can give to him to play with that I know he won't hurt himself on, but I want to get one of those horse playball thingys. A friend told me yesterday at the show that she gave her mums colt a moon hopper and he loved it and it took ages to pop, so should I get one and give it to mitch? even if he only has it while i'm around to watch?

We play 'games' in the paddock, like I'll walk around the paddoc and he follows me at walk, trot and canter, and he stops when I do, he runs beside me not behind me to, haha if he was behind me I would probably get nervous :lol:.
He likes my chap stick because it clicks when I open and close it and it smells nice, he wouldn't let me leave once I pulled that out.

I try to vary what I do with him, because I hate my horses getting bored and I want him to do lots of different things while he's still young so he might not be so spooky later on.. He's not too spooky but he does get nervous, he's usually alright with some positive enforcing though.
(heaven help us when we met that scary log:lol
I took him to the neighbours for a ride and for a change of scenery the day before he threw me, we did bending poles and jumped a little log etc, and just generally done really random things in no particular order.

Any suggestions for games etc I could do with him?
-He is pretty smart(well I think so anyway), he knows how to open gates , but he can't open his because it involves lifting it up and that is specifically so he can't open it, and he seems so much more intrigued with foreign objects than any other horse I've been around. He plays with my jumps and poles etc, I put up a blue and white stripy pole and he was rolling it around the paddock sniffing it.


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## CJ82Sky (Dec 19, 2008)

the following game is the best - my arab does that with me all the time too it's a riot and so much fun. i also play "soccer" using a big yoga ball and letting the horse kick it around and what not. fun stuff!

parelli has some good games (disclaimer: not a parelli fan, but the concepts and theories are good in their base forms for the most part) and you can buy stuff like hula hoops and yoga stuff at stores like tj maxx and spend just a few dollars for a ton of stuff to do. 

i want to also teach my arab to bow to one knee so that i can get on from the ground haha. just general trick training and various obstacles to challenge him, engage his brain, and keep him interested so that the riding part isn't so boring when we're not doing treks through the adirondacks!


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

CJ82Sky said:


> the following game is the best - my arab does that with me all the time too it's a riot and so much fun. i also play "soccer" using a big yoga ball and letting the horse kick it around and what not. fun stuff!
> 
> parelli has some good games (disclaimer: not a parelli fan, but the concepts and theories are good in their base forms for the most part) and you can buy stuff like hula hoops and yoga stuff at stores like tj maxx and spend just a few dollars for a ton of stuff to do.
> 
> i want to also teach my arab to bow to one knee so that i can get on from the ground haha. just general trick training and various obstacles to challenge him, engage his brain, and keep him interested so that the riding part isn't so boring when we're not doing treks through the adirondacks!


Oh cool, I have a yoga ball and lots of hula hoops, plus living on a farm we have loads of random stuff that could be fun haha.
I taught our mini to bow, Mitchell shouldn't be to difficult he's willing to learn... Normally:lol:.


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## dannyboy834 (Feb 26, 2011)

Don't give up on him! I recently bought an OTTB and the first month was fine. She rode great, was calm, etc. Then one day, nothing had changed, except she didn't want to go forward. So I I simply placed a whip on her (didn't even tap it) and she shot backwards, tripped over her own legs and fell down on me. I was ready to give her away, but I found an EXCELLENT trainer who basically started her over as if she had never been broke. He did ground work for a few weeks, then got on her, and bit by bit she came around. 
OTTB horses are just screwed up from life on the track. Your horse very likely was whipped senseless to get him to go. I think if you find a good trainer who is gentle and knows how to retrain OTTB's, you'd be able to keep him! He's a cutie BTW.


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

Do you have a closeup of his face? I've been getting really good at extracting personalities from face whorls.


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

MyBoyPuck said:


> Do you have a closeup of his face? I've been getting really good at extracting personalities from face whorls.


Unfortunately the only close ups I have, his forelock is in the way :lol:
When I take the camera over next I'll try remember to get some, i'd be quite interested with what it comes up with... But I can't even recall him having any whorls, surely he must haha.
I know bubbles has a clockwise one between her eyes though:lol:


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## gaelgirl (Mar 3, 2011)

Agree with smrobs, he should learn pretty quick that you won't let him get away with throwing you whenever he doesn't want to work. I'm glad you are ok!


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

gaelgirl said:


> Agree with smrobs, he should learn pretty quick that you won't let him get away with throwing you whenever he doesn't want to work. I'm glad you are ok!


He will once I get him back from my neighbour (racehorse trainer, can ride anything:lol I'm actually wondering whether he's ever had anybody come off him before because he looked genuinely confused to see me on the ground.. Once the rocket had gone from his bum that is.


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## annieapplecake (Mar 19, 2011)

*Bucking*

Have you checked his tack - is his girth too tight etc.? If he carries on bucking get a vet to take a look at him just in case - it could also be his teeth. If he does persist get an instuctor to step in but if he bucks keep his head high by shortening your reins - try and be a big harder with your reins - also this is VIP have you tried tapping him on the shoulder? it may work better


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

I'd get him off the rich grass. I'm wondering if he's beginning to founder and has sore feet. That would account for this behaviour. He was a good boy while in his transition stage but now he's testing you to see what he can get away with. I'd do lots of groundwork turning lots of turnbacks while lunging but 15 min is plenty. Do everything you can think up to get him moving away from you, his hinquarters, his shoulders, forward, back. By pushing him around like this you are the dominant one. I'd do this every day for a min of three days, preferably 5 to really drill it into his head. No riding during this time.


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

annieapplecake said:


> Have you checked his tack - is his girth too tight etc.? If he carries on bucking get a vet to take a look at him just in case - it could also be his teeth. If he does persist get an instuctor to step in but if he bucks keep his head high by shortening your reins - try and be a big harder with your reins - also this is VIP have you tried tapping him on the shoulder? it may work better


Yeah I've checked all that and had other people check it in person for me and they seem to think it's fine, but if he carries it on when i next get on I'll get everything checked again.
I haven't ridden him since that day but my neighbour did, after nearly a month of him being on different grass and he said he was fine, but a strong horse (no kidding he's strong:lol: I figured that one out the difficult way)

I'm in the process of trying to find an equine dentist with a decent reputation because I've noticed the last few times I rode him he threw his head quite a bit, I'm not sure if that was the flys or his teeth but I'll get the rounds done anyway.

That is my backup plan, and I know which instructor I'll get out if he carries on, i'm hoping I won't need her for that reason, but it would be nice if I could get her out anyway.

Yep, tapping him on the shoulder was what started his bucking fit. But i'm pretty sure it was him using the tap as an excuse because I've tapped him there many times before to get him moving (can't reach his hindquarters yet:lol and he didn't bat an eyelid. I can stand on the ground and wave it around his face and the rest of his body and tap him everywhere and he just looks at me as if to say "is that supposed to be scary?"


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## HollyBubbles (Jun 22, 2009)

Saddlebag said:


> I'd get him off the rich grass. I'm wondering if he's beginning to founder and has sore feet. That would account for this behaviour. He was a good boy while in his transition stage but now he's testing you to see what he can get away with. I'd do lots of groundwork turning lots of turnbacks while lunging but 15 min is plenty. Do everything you can think up to get him moving away from you, his hinquarters, his shoulders, forward, back. By pushing him around like this you are the dominant one. I'd do this every day for a min of three days, preferably 5 to really drill it into his head. No riding during this time.


He's now been off that paddock since that day, he's now back on my property but up the road on different grass, now I have to find a way to stop einstein over there jumping my reels!:lol: He stays in his paddock just not his allocated part.
He's back to his normal behaviour in the paddock, and I've been lunging him everyday instead of riding him since he got back and unfortunately I discovered a loose shoe yesterday, so now I'm going to have to go through the struggle of finding a farrier, my one has just had knee surgery and all the others are booked out, might have to ask my neighbour, he's done my horses before. -I would pull it off myself, grandad gave me the tools to do it, but i'm not a qualified farrier and i'm a bit iffy about pulling it off myself.

-The lunging we've had to work on a lot as when I first lunged him he thought lunge meant oval, and on one side of your oval your supposed to run over the rope holder, then pull them across the paddock on your other side. He's since discovered this is not the case, and lunge means circle:lol:.
He's gone back to his normal cuddly self in the paddock, but I try not to let him be too cuddly because I don't want to baby him incase he thinks he can cuddle his way out of it, and he probably would try it to :lol:.

I'll start doing what you've said once I've done something about his hooves


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