# Rebuilding Ares - Journey of a Neglected Equine



## Wallaby (Jul 13, 2008)

I have a half-Lipizzan too! 
Weirdly, my guy has a very similar story [we're in Oregon as well, not sure where in Oregon my guy came from originally though - lots of Lipizzan people out here!], but it all happened to my guy about 4 years ago. Weird!


Is he registered? If you aren't sure, USLF has a reverse look-up service [I think it's $45, I thinkkk] where you can send in hair, they'll isolate DNA from the hair, and see if it matches any horses in their database or if they can identify any close relatives [mom/dad] in their database.
It's pretty neat!

They weren't able to pin down who my guy is, but they were able to confirm that he's 50% Lip and that his dad was the Lipizzan and that his mom was "other" [Arabian, in my guy's case]. They were incredibly helpful to me for really no reason, other than love of the breed.


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## EmberScarlet (Oct 28, 2016)

Wallaby said:


> I have a half-Lipizzan too!
> Weirdly, my guy has a very similar story [we're in Oregon as well, not sure where in Oregon my guy came from originally though - lots of Lipizzan people out here!], but it all happened to my guy about 4 years ago. Weird!
> 
> 
> ...


I've always goggled at your horse when I see the think in your signature! I'm pretty sure his Dad (the Lipizzaner) would be registered, because the old and new owners say his Sire was going to the Olympics, but was injured. Whether that's true or not is anyone's guess. xD


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## EmberScarlet (Oct 28, 2016)

Today the owners called (whole family is always gone between 7:00-3:00 or so) and asked me to check on Ares. I went into the barn to see him looking mopey and nibbling and tentatively ''cribbing'' the sides of his stall (he may have a stomach ache from constantly getting fed, and eating more then his stomach can handle.). He appeared extremely bored, because his ''companion'' llama says ''hell-no-way'' and won't go near the poor thing. He had food available, but wasn't interested.
Any tricks against boredom? If possible, I'd really like to stop him from cribbing!


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## Acadianartist (Apr 21, 2015)

EmberScarlet said:


> Today the owners called (whole family is always gone between 7:00-3:00 or so) and asked me to check on Ares. I went into the barn to see him looking mopey and nibbling and tentatively ''cribbing'' the sides of his stall (he may have a stomach ache from constantly getting fed, and eating more then his stomach can handle.). He appeared extremely bored, because his ''companion'' llama says ''hell-no-way'' and won't go near the poor thing. He had food available, but wasn't interested.
> Any tricks against boredom? If possible, I'd really like to stop him from cribbing!


Does he have to be cooped up in a stall? I'd put him outside as much as possible, even 24/7, but with shelter and/or a rain sheet if it's raining. Otherwise, I have no tips on dealing with a cribber, unfortunately. 

Is he being quarantined? Maybe you can ask if you can set up a temporary fence perimeter (like with step-ins and electric fence) so he can have his own paddock.


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## EmberScarlet (Oct 28, 2016)

Acadianartist said:


> Does he have to be cooped up in a stall? I'd put him outside as much as possible, even 24/7, but with shelter and/or a rain sheet if it's raining. Otherwise, I have no tips on dealing with a cribber, unfortunately.
> 
> Is he being quarantined? Maybe you can ask if you can set up a temporary fence perimeter (like with step-ins and electric fence) so he can have his own paddock.


I'm not sure why they have him cooped up. :/ they have a field that was built (by the original house owner, who had multiple horses) for horses with proper fencing, but I think their being ''worried first parents'' who don't feel comfortable with him out there. They are building a separate paddock, as well.


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## BlindHorseEnthusiast4582 (Apr 11, 2016)

Subbing


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

EmberScarlet said:


> Today the owners called (whole family is always gone between 7:00-3:00 or so) and asked me to check on Ares. I went into the barn to see him looking mopey and nibbling and tentatively ''cribbing'' the sides of his stall (he may have a stomach ache from constantly getting fed, and eating more then his stomach can handle.). He appeared extremely bored, because his ''companion'' llama says ''hell-no-way'' and won't go near the poor thing. He had food available, but wasn't interested.
> Any tricks against boredom? If possible, I'd really like to stop him from cribbing!


Over feeding is a real problem in his condition. I would NOT be feeding him free choice. Again, vet. At least talk to one if the owners won't have one out.

Read this: Feeding the Starved Horse | TheHorse.com
Note that alfalfa is the feed of choice for the beginning stages of rehab.

What other animals are around? He may need a different friend. I'd also not keep him shut in.... but am concerned about the "stomach ache" part. That can become very serious.

I would not turn him out on grass yet unless he is used to it (I'm guessing no?) but he does need to be turned out. Think this is another good time to practice your "you wanted me here to teach you so listen"  Definitely doing more harm than good.

Re the cribbing, it's the least of your worries atm (but get him out of the stall). I've also seen horses that don't crib sort of "pretend" sometimes so could just be a fluke moment.


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## EmberScarlet (Oct 28, 2016)

Yogiwick said:


> Over feeding is a real problem in his condition. I would NOT be feeding him free choice. Again, vet. At least talk to one if the owners won't have one out.
> 
> Read this: Feeding the Starved Horse | TheHorse.com
> Note that alfalfa is the feed of choice for the beginning stages of rehab.
> ...


I think he is doing what a lot of starving humans do when faced with food. He had next to no food for ages and ages, and then he gets a wealth of it, 24/7 to eat constantly. Who knows when the food'll go away? How long will it last? I should make the most of it, and eat it all. He starts packing in food and water, until he's sick, but then he keeps going anyways, like Willium Hook in the Donner party.

Probably wrong, but that's just what it looks like. 

I'll see if I can get them to let him go in the pasture.


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

^I understand but that's VERY dangerous in his condition. He CAN'T have a wealth of food, it would be worse than continuing to starve him, and yes I truly do mean that. Read the link if you haven't already. When you have a horse you can truly call emaciated, and this guy is, you literally start with handfuls of hay. He's had NOTHING, he can't go to everything at once even if everything is only decent hay that you'd give any horse that's sooooo much more than he's used to.

And yes he will likely always be desperate around food now, that is true. But while it doesn't matter if a healthy horse stuffs their face (aside from choking risk) it is extremely dangerous in his condition. Remember he can't think "oh I ate too much" and throw up like a human would.

Here is the official UC Davis: http://www.vetmed.ucdavis.edu/ceh/local_resources/pdfs/pubs-July2012-bkm-sec.pdf
(If I was rehabbing a horse I would literally follow this step for step. Note it goes so far as to say not to give treats or supplements because they really are THAT delicate at that point.)

Another good link: Refeeding Malnourished Horses | TheHorse.com
From the link: "When refeeding malnourished horses, caretakers must overcome the impulse to immediately feed them whatever and however much they want. Months of neglect cannot be undone in a few days or weeks. Overfeeding malnourished horses can cause much harm and potentially death.

Refeeding syndrome has been recognized in starved humans and animals when they regain access to food. During starvation, body reserves of fat and protein are used for energy. Likewise, electrolyte and mineral storage, especially of phosphorus, decreases. When the animal eats again, insulin is released in response to increased blood glucose, and stimulates protein synthesis and movement of electrolytes and glucose into cells. This shift of electrolytes results in low blood concentrations of phosphorus, magnesium, and potassium. Phosphorus is needed for energy production in the cells and for delivery of oxygen by red blood cells. Swelling of the legs, bottom of the chest, and abdomen occurs due to low blood protein and sodium and water retention.

Refeeding syndrome can result in neurologic signs, or even death, due to cardiac and pulmonary failure. Feeding large amounts of carbohydrates before the horse's gut flora have had time to adapt can also result in colic, diarrhea, and laminitis."

So I would literally go so far as to walk over there and take all the hay away. He needs it very frequently but only in tiny amounts. When he's a little stronger you can start upping it.

Sorry if I'm freaking out a little, I'm just concerned as it sounds like he's already acting off due to having so much feed.


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## EmberScarlet (Oct 28, 2016)

Yogiwick said:


> ^I understand but that's VERY dangerous in his condition. He CAN'T have a wealth of food, it would be worse than continuing to starve him, and yes I truly do mean that. Read the link if you haven't already. When you have a horse you can truly call emaciated, and this guy is, you literally start with handfuls of hay. He's had NOTHING, he can't go to everything at once even if everything is only decent hay that you'd give any horse that's sooooo much more than he's used to.
> 
> And yes he will likely always be desperate around food now, that is true. But while it doesn't matter if a healthy horse stuffs their face (aside from choking risk) it is extremely dangerous in his condition. Remember he can't think "oh I ate too much" and throw up like a human would.
> 
> ...


xD The point of what I said was to show how dangerous it is; Willium Hook _died _from it. And I did read your link.


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

I feel like an idiot, I've honestly never heard that story and thought it was some horse reference! 0.0

ANYWAYS what I said still stands lol. I didn't realize you were aware but esp as you are that is probably the most immediately pressing thing to address. And the links are definitely good info. I'd print them out and show them if they are concerned about him not getting enough with the slow method.


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## EmberScarlet (Oct 28, 2016)

Yogiwick said:


> I feel like an idiot, I've honestly never heard that story and thought it was some horse reference! 0.0
> 
> ANYWAYS what I said still stands lol. I didn't realize you were aware but esp as you are that is probably the most immediately pressing thing to address. And the links are definitely good info. I'd print them out and show them if they are concerned about him not getting enough with the slow method.


Already was firing the ol' printer up! Gonna visit after a shower.


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## EmberScarlet (Oct 28, 2016)

OK, printed and gave the new owner the article. She says the vet is coming very soon.


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## EmberScarlet (Oct 28, 2016)

Yogiwick said:


> I feel like an idiot, I've honestly never heard that story and thought it was some horse reference! 0.0
> 
> ANYWAYS what I said still stands lol. I didn't realize you were aware but esp as you are that is probably the most immediately pressing thing to address. And the links are definitely good info. I'd print them out and show them if they are concerned about him not getting enough with the slow method.


Update; Did just this. Printed it out, and they basically told me off pfft. No longer working with this horse. They are not interested in listening and don't care for my advice. Don't know if I'm fired, but I definitely quit.
Literally all I did was print it out and asked if they would like to read it. Got a text from her, and the owner isn't happy. She is pretty sure she has it all down, so when she needs help, she can come back to me.

Prayers for the horse.


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## Acadianartist (Apr 21, 2015)

EmberScarlet said:


> Update; Did just this. Printed it out, and they basically told me off pfft. No longer working with this horse. They are not interested in listening and don't care for my advice. Don't know if I'm fired, but I definitely quit.
> Literally all I did was print it out and asked if they would like to read it. Got a text from her, and the owner isn't happy. She is pretty sure she has it all down, so when she needs help, she can come back to me.
> 
> Prayers for the horse.


So sorry to hear this. But you did the right thing. I'm sure you know that, but still, it doesn't hurt to hear it from others right? 

When this horse gets sick, they will realize you were right. The vet will tell them the same thing. Maybe, by some kind of fluke, the horse will live through this, but they are behaving extremely irresponsibly and doing more harm than good. The horse could founder, colic, etc. etc.

It's good that you're walking away. It's sad, but there is no other option if they won't bother to consider clearly established medical guidelines for rehabbing a malnourished horse.


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## Reiningcatsanddogs (Oct 9, 2014)

That’s not good news but, unfortunately it is one of the pit falls when working with other people’s horses. Sometimes you just want to scream “What on earth are you doing?!” and have to bite your tongue instead.

Hopefully, this guy will be able to pull through. Oliver and Ghost both came to us emaciated to different degrees. 

I had a third one, a 17.2 hh TB that I took on when the previous owner didn’t want to pay to have the tests done that he needed.











We (vet and myself) figured out what was wrong with him (gut absorption issue), started him on Dex per the doc’s orders. He was doing good for over a week and then went down, eventually with a twisted gut and had to be euthanized. 

To this day, I wonder if it wasn’t due to the fact that once we started medication, we did not pull him off his food and treat him like a horse who had not been fed in a long time. Even though he had been getting food all along, as far as his body was concerned, it had been starving. I'm still kicking myself for not having thought of it that way and asking the vet about it.


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## Reiningcatsanddogs (Oct 9, 2014)

That’s not good news but, unfortunately it is one of the pit falls when working with other people’s horses. Sometimes you just want to scream “What on earth are you doing?!” and have to bite your tongue instead.

Hopefully, this guy will be able to pull through. Oliver and Ghost both came to us emaciated to different degrees. 

I had a third one, a 17.2 hh TB that I took on when the previous owner didn’t want to pay to have the tests done that he needed.









Believe it or not that horse had free access to good hay and was eating senior feed. Had already had multiple tests for everything from worms to ulcers. All negative.

We (vet and myself) figured out what was wrong with him (gut absorption issue), started him on Dex per the doc’s orders. He was doing good for over a week and then went down, eventually with a twisted gut and had to be euthanized. 

To this day, I wonder if it wasn’t due to the fact that once we started medication, we did not pull him off his food and treat him like a horse who had not been fed in a long time. Even though he had been getting food all along, as far as his body was concerned, it had been starving. I'm still kicking myself for not having thought of it that way and asking the vet about it.


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

Reiningcatsanddogs said:


> That’s not good news but, unfortunately it is one of the pit falls when working with other people’s horses. Sometimes you just want to scream “What on earth are you doing?!” and have to bite your tongue instead.
> 
> Hopefully, this guy will be able to pull through. Oliver and Ghost both came to us emaciated to different degrees.
> 
> ...


That is a VERY obscure thing to think of so don't kick yourself too much! So he was in that condition with plenty of food? Yikes! I thought our old mare with stomach issues was bad but nothing like that.

OP you need to do what you think is best. Personally I'd probably stick it through but if you aren't up for it then don't. Things like this can really put you through the wringer. That's why we were saying to be so careful in your other thread because you're the one who's going to have to deal with this. If you do stick it out you will still have to continue dealing with this. There is nothing wrong (and lots of right things) about saying you can't do this, these situations are VERY difficult. If the OP has the vet out she may well call you back saying you were right! I was a little optimistic when I read that then saw your latest update . Rescuing, even the ones that go smoothly, takes a LOT out of you emotionally (and in a million other ways too of course)


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## EmberScarlet (Oct 28, 2016)

@Yogiwick @Acadianartist 

Guess what happened tonight?? She gave the horse way too much food and now he's sick, and she texted me about it. All I could think was, ''told you so. Should'a read my papers.''


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## Reiningcatsanddogs (Oct 9, 2014)

Yogiwick said:


> That is a VERY obscure thing to think of so don't kick yourself too much! So he was in that condition with plenty of food? Yikes! I thought our old mare with stomach issues was bad but nothing like that.


 @Yogiwick, the story that I got was this. 

Horse was sold to a lady for her teenage daughter by a horse trader who was dating a neighbor friend of mine. After six months, the horse looked like that. Lady (whom I also know) had spent quite a bit of money and effort on vet bills at that point and was tapped out but, did not have the heart to put horse down and couldn't spend any more money on it to find out what was wrong. Told the trader to just come pick him up.

Trader and neighbor thought “He just needs more groceries and a proper worming” (he had severe diarrhea) and they were mad at the woman for not feeding the horse properly, yada, yada. After two weeks of them trying to pump groceries in him, he developed severe edema in his hind legs and sheath. I got a call, came over to see him and said he looked worse not better. He needed a vet, which I had been advocating for from the beginning. 

I've seen it many times where an experienced owner will just assume that the previous inexperienced owner didn't know what they were doing and be convinced they can shove food or some secret family remedy into a horse and fix it. CALL THE DARN VET! Run the tests needed and if the vet says, all he needs is food, then you have dodged the bullet. When I got Oliver, the vet was out the next morning drawing blood, running tests for organ failure, worms etc before we proceeded beyond water and periodic handfuls of hay. I was prepared to put him down if his body was shutting down. One of the most valuable relationships I have, even more than a good trainer, is with my vet.

Apologies to @EmberScarlet that this is turning into a bit of a rant but, if you are going to take on a rescue then you better be willing to do what needs to be done to ensure the well being of the horse and that is going to cost $$$!! Nothing in life is free and that includes rescuing horses. Oliver cost me $300 to buy, another $450 in tests and vet bills and then another $1200 for help training him when he was recovered. There is a reason good rescues depend so heavily on donations.

In the TB's case, neither the trader or my neighbor were willing to spend the needed money on the vet, even once it became obvious that there was a big problem. Don't let him suffer! I told them I would pay for the necessary tests and the vet bill and would bury him on our property if it came to that. Long story short, they gave me the horse. 

The saying goes, that you can’t save them all and you know that in your head but, your heart still aches for each one that slips away. You are always filled with what ifs, could haves, would haves, should haves....

The shame of it was this boy was only five years old and had a long life ahead of him, if only.... To boot, he was one of those calm level headed TB’s that everyone loves to own. He was a good boy even before he got sick. It breaks my heart.


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## EmberScarlet (Oct 28, 2016)

Reiningcatsanddogs said:


> Apologies to @*EmberScarlet* that this is turning into a bit of a rant but, if you are going to take on a rescue then you better be willing to do what needs to be done to ensure the well being of the horse and that is going to cost $$$!! Nothing in life is free and that includes rescuing horses. Oliver cost me $300 to buy, another $450 in tests and vet bills and then another $1200 for help training him when he was recovered. There is a reason good rescues depend so heavily on donations.


 Couldn't agree more. It disgusts me even more that they just bought a third saddle for this horse, before he's in ANY condition to be thinking about such things!!


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## Acadianartist (Apr 21, 2015)

EmberScarlet said:


> Couldn't agree more. It disgusts me even more that they just bought a third saddle for this horse, before he's in ANY condition to be thinking about such things!!


That's insane! How will they know if it fits since he's going to be a very different shape when they can ride him, IF they can ride him! And if he survives that long...


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## EmberScarlet (Oct 28, 2016)

Acadianartist said:


> That's insane! How will they know if it fits since he's going to be a very different shape when they can ride him, IF they can ride him! And if he survives that long...


I know! That's what I thought too. And I saw those other two saddles... aren't they enough until he's fit again??


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

So weird. I'm sorry he's sick but wondering if her letting you know may have been an olive branch. Let us know what happens and if you decide to get actually involved again. I hope he pulls through. As @Reiningcatsanddogs said it's not for the faint of heart, in so many ways. And while knowledge is vital there's so much more that goes in to that. When a horse is in that rough shape I definitely consider them "under a vets care" even if they don't leave the property. Same as if you had a colicing horse and the vet out 3x/week to check in, it's not far fetched that this type of rescue may need that level of involvement. Really curious what's going on in the owners heads here.





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