# Joy, the 2/3 Friesian Filly



## horseylover1_1

Two weeks ago I got the most amazing filly. After not having a horse for over a year, it's amazing how much happier and "fulfilled" (yes, it's cheesy) having a horse to call my own! She's 9 months old, and I have been wanting to have a "journal" to write in about our daily training sessions so I will be posting them here. 

I'm working on writing down a "goal list" for both of us. I'll post it when I get it written up. There are so many things that I want to do with her, so it may take me awhile to compile a realistic one with goals we can achieve. 

So far we have achieved her picking up all 4 feet happily and consistently. She also disengages her hindquarters when I ask her. 

She is SUCH a sweet filly. I am so excited I got her. She is willing to please, very submissive, and smart - I usually only have to ask her 2 or 3 times before she picks up on what I want and does it. I'd like to say that it's my training but I think it's just because she's sharp as a tack. :lol:

She is very very spooky. So 75% of our training is desensitizing. When I got her she was VERY head shy, threw her head whenever you took a halter off or put one on. She is doing much better. I wish I had before and after video.

I can't wait to go on this journey with her. I'm sure it'll be filled with frustrating days, amazing days, and even boring days. But I am looking forward to every minute of it.


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## horseylover1_1

Today was a great day with Joy! I got to see her in the morning and in the evening. This morning we worked on crossing the creek for the first time. She was hesitant at first then completely walked through it/jumped it depending on how wide it was where we crossed it. Will upload a video later. 

I tried doing the same thing with her in the evening and brought my husband so I could brag on how well she does, and of course the darn thing would NOT go in the water. I kept swearing up and down she had walked right in earlier. We finally did get her in as I didn't want to let her win the battle but it was pretty humiliating... lol. 

She also did well on not spooking. There was a nail gun going off, tractors rolling by etc and she did not spook. She got to get turned out with a new yearling friend which was awesome. They played together. She also trotted in hand with me without totally going bonkers which was nice. 

AND... possibly the best part of it all... when I let her out two weeks ago when I first got her she wouldn't let us catch her. It took 4 people and a miniature horse to get her in the barn. Today she not only let me catch her but came straight to me twice. I'm extremely happy with her today.


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## Tori Taylor

She is cute! Got any more pictures?


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## horseylover1_1

Today Joy and I tackled the scary blue tarp and I think she hates me now. :lol: It took about 15 mins of running around the round pen scared of the tarp to get her to relax and let me rub it on her. We will do more tomorrow if it's not windy. This was not one of our easiest training sessions, but I think she'll do better next time. 




Tori Taylor said:


> She is cute! Got any more pictures?


Thank you so much! Here are a few


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## PoptartShop

Aww Joy is so cute.  I love her pink halter!


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## carshon

So glad to see this post. I am also happy to see an owner who is using the young horse and exploring and experimenting. In my area when I did that with my young colt I received the strangest comments and looks.

It will pay off in the long run! Happy to follow your journal and watch Joy grow.


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## SorrelHorse

Subbing, she's a cutie, would love to watch her grow


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you so much everyone! 

Today we worked more on the blue tarp and she definitely did much better, even though she doesn't love it quite yet. 

I think she pulled a muscle or something in her neck so we are doing only light work the next few days, and no turnout. She seems ok until I go to touch it, then she acts as if it's hurting. The stable owner is taking a look at her tonight as well. 

A little off topic.. but a new baby arrived at the barn today! She is a Clydesdale filly and the cutest thing I think I've ever seen.


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## horseylover1_1

Joy did so well today. Possibly the best since I've gotten her. She was in a really good mood today and did everything I asked without hesitation. We trotted in hand (a flip of the whip was needed to get her going - but she did trot next to me), walked through and up a creek a few feet, came right to me after I turned her out for a few mins, etc. 

One thing I have been really working on the past few days is desensitization to blankets/towels/tarps. She HATED them on her back. I assume because she can't see them well. So for the past few days I had been frustratingly trying to just desensitize with persistence. She got ****ed. I got ****ed. I wanted to move on. But, while I feel taking a step back and taking a break is not necessarily wrong, especially with a baby, I didn't just want to skip it and move on to more fun/easy stuff. So I decided to switch it up a bit.

I bought a few clickers a couple weeks ago and decided to utilize them. I would start waving the towel around and putting it on her back. Every time she let me do so and didn't flinch/move away, I clicked the clicker and she got a treat. It did not take long for her to associate that standing still while I threw the towel around meant a treat/positive reinforcement.  She also picked up on the fact that the clicker means a treat almost instantly. So I would praise her, say things in a sing-songy way like "this is not going to hurt you, lalala!" whilst throwing the towel around and clicking the clicker when she stood still. We looked absolutely ridiculous I'm sure but what went from a frustrating workout turned out to be a fun exercise for both of us. She still does not love the towel yet but she is much, much more accepting of it being thrown around her now. 

She's actually not very food motivated and treat training is not my favorite way to work with a horse. But it worked SO well for her in this instance. I wanted to take something she previously hated and make it fun for her. And it seemed to work. But I do like clicker training because she knows not to "ask" for a treat unless she hears the clicker go off. And she actually starting spitting the treats out after awhile so I think she got sick of them, but she does seem to respond well to the clicker and praise in general. So eventually I will probably wean her from treating altogether and just use clicker/praise. But who knows... she's teaching me new ways to work with her everyday!


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## horseylover1_1

Not much to report today. It was raining so we stayed in the barn and under the indoor arena. 

She irritated me today by being a butt when I tried to put MTG in her mane. And then when I tried catching her in the indoor she thought it would be fun to play "you can't catch me" for a few mins. She got to run around for a few minutes for that and she did let me catch her but it was just one of those days...


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## PoptartShop

So glad Joy has been doing well. That's great! Desensitizing is awesome. 
Clicker training is really good too. LOL sounds like she wanted to be playful that rainy day!


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## whisperbaby22

Very nice looking filly.


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## horseylover1_1

PoptartShop said:


> So glad Joy has been doing well. That's great! Desensitizing is awesome.
> Clicker training is really good too. LOL sounds like she wanted to be playful that rainy day!


Thank you! I'm somewhat new to clicker training so I'm constantly learning, but it seems like a great tool. 



whisperbaby22 said:


> Very nice looking filly.


Thanks so much!


Joy got to be turned out in the "big horses" field today. :lol: It was her first time turned out with more than one horse, and she looked liked she had a lot of fun. I'm glad she'll have more turn out time. I hate her being in a stall for more than a half day at a time. As much as I love working with her I know she needs a chance to be a baby/horse as well. 

Her desensitizing is going well but she still is very spooky with anything that's going on behind her, which, can't say I blame her. She has been bolting much less though and overall has calmed down a lot. 

We accomplished a couple new things today. She's learning to walk, trot, and whoa by voice command. I say voice command but it's more of a combination of body language and clucking/kissing/using the whip/etc. But regardless I'm thrilled I can get her to do that gait I want with only slight cues. She also flexed today as well. She is much more comfortable going to the right than the left so we will probably work on the left more. 

Also, it's been high 60's to low/mid 70's so I have been able to play with her that much more. Normally I would be disappointed about not getting snow in February, but since I have a filly to play with I can't complain.


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## horseylover1_1

I started training Joy to pivot today. I found a show that offers about 7 in-hand classes she could enter including halter, showmanship, and trail in hand (and variations of all of them). After I looked at videos of showmanship and trail in hand I realized there's that much more we need to work on.. but that's OK, because we have well over a year before I can even sit on her so I need new goals to keep us busy on the ground. Video attached of the pivot. She did another pivot even better than that but of course I didn't get it on video. :icon_rolleyes:

EDIT: Video...


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## whisperbaby22

I couldn't see the video, but good for you for doing so much with this filly. She's going to be a real nice horse.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> I couldn't see the video, but good for you for doing so much with this filly. She's going to be a real nice horse.


It failed to attach the first time so I added a Youtube link, hopefully it's working now. And thank you so much!


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## whisperbaby22

Yah, it worked, thanks!


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## horseylover1_1

We've had a pretty uneventful week. I'm self-employed and made myself pound the pavement this week to get some stuff done. That means less time with Joy, but gotta work so I can afford Joy. lol. A really bad storm came through early Wednesday morning as well, so it's been windy and I am a big baby and hate working outside when it's windy. 

I did do some pivot work with her again today. She's started going forward when I ask for the pivot which is frustrating because she never did it before. I did realize it was partly my fault because when she went forward I would release the "pressure" and try again. Today I kept the pressure applied until she stopped and pivoted the correct way. We did a good 90º half circle so I called it a day.

Here is a picture of her cuteness taking a little nap.


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## whisperbaby22

Really cute photo!


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## PoptartShop

That is the cutest picture ever!


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## horseylover1_1

Today Joy and I worked more on the pivot.. which I still am having a bit of a difficult time teaching her. I think it’s more me than her. I keep wanting to do a perfect, champion showmanship pivot like yesterday. So I made myself slow down a bit. One step, praise. One step, praise. Then move on up to two steps, praise. etc. Will do more tomorrow.

She is doing wonderfully on trotting in hand. And more importantly, she whoas when I stop. Very pleased with that. She leads really well. Every once in a while she will get a little ahead of me out of excitement or whatever so I pull against the lead slightly and push my arm back which makes her fall two steps behind me. She usually stays there.

Oh, and because someone here suggested we work on ground tying we have started on that. She is good at it. She will let me walk all the way around her and groom her, pick her feet, and back away from her. She definitely isn’t going to stand somewhere for 15 mins while I do barn chores but I was impressed with her standing so good especially since she was in the middle of the barn with a lot going on. 

I’ve also been working with someone else’s horse recently. Her name is Lady. Tomorrow will be our 4th session. I hope she will be ready to ride but not sure.. she is a very pushy mare and I am wanting to establish a solid ground foundation before getting in the saddle. She wouldn’t lead when I started working with her, and hated switching directions when I was lunging her in the round pen. She respects me more now for sure but still has a “I really, really don’t like you telling me what to do” attitude. I absolutely adore her owner. We’ve become friends. Her entire family is just so sweet. 

Will post updates on Lady and Joy tomorrow.


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## horseylover1_1

Had a good (busy) weekend. This post is actually less about Joy and more about my journey to become a better horse woman. 

I have been working with an older paint mare named Lady for the past few weeks as mentioned in the post above. She was very pushy and dominant. She had this lovely habit of stopping suddenly when riding her and lowering her head. She’s a sweet horse when she wants to be, and not mean, just dominant. Saturday I went out and grabbed her from her field to walk to the round pen. Her field is a good quarter mile away from the barn and round pen, so we both got some exercise. She lead like a DREAM. Two steps behind me the entire way, even when her friends galloped past her. I was slightly amazed because she would not lead at all the first time I saw her. But this was the 4th time I had worked with her so I was happy the respect was growing between us. 

When I got her to the round pen she was doing well. Showing signs of submissiveness, turning in the right way (usually), turning around at all (she would just stop at first and not turn around for anything), licking her lips, ears/eyes toward me, not neighing when her friends did, all good signs. It took about 10 mins of that before I decided she was ready to ride. 

In an effort to not make this a book, Lady did wonderfully under saddle. It was my first time riding in over a year so I was very stiff and I know she was too. But there was absolutely no attitude from her. She did as I asked. I was so pleased. She likes to run through the bit so we are working on that. 

Another lady who boards there came up to us while we were in the round pen and said that she had known something was up because Lady was “nicer” lately and her owner told her I had been working with her. She said she’d be interested in me training a buddy sour horse she has. 

Guys. This is huge for me.

This is huge because I suffer from anxiety and felt like I was a failure as a horse person and rider for YEARS. When I was about 12 I went to horse camp and the instructor told me, and the rest of the group, that we were impossible to train and hopeless basically. Most people would shrug it off and say the instructor had the issue. But at 12 it really affected me. I’ve also been picked at from some members of the horse community in ways that caused me to have severe anxiety. Never had proper riding lessons. And I will say that when I was younger I know I did stupid stuff with my horses. So I’m sure some criticism I received was deserved. But I do not feel like a failure anymore. I still have a very long way to go. If this horse is something I feel like I cannot handle I will tell her so. I’m by no means a professional even though I’d love to be professional horse trainer someday. But to have someone tell me they’ve seen my “work” and like it.. what a good feeling. I am both humbled and built up. 

As for Joy, she is really doing well with her ground tying. 

Thanks for reading! Pics of Lady and I this weekend. Ignore my seat.. I need to get back in shape after not riding in forever.


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## whisperbaby22

Congratulation, good work.


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## PoptartShop

Glad everything is going well.  Thank you for sharing!!!


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## carshon

I am loving your posts!


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## Zexious

Congrats on riding for the first time in over a year! That's a huge accomplishment! 

And what a lovely compliment to receive from a fellow boarder--it sounds like a really positive experience!

So, major Kudos from Colorado!

Horseback riding is definitely no easy sport--on the contrary, it's easy for us to get down on ourselves, especially those of us (it sounds like you're one of them!) who really strive to be their best at all times. For what it's worth, I'd ignore what the trainer said. No instructor/teacher of any activity should ever say that to a student--much less an entire group of them! I think you can rest easy knowing it wasn't you, it was her (easier said than done, right?)

My one critique of this post is...
We need more pics of Joy !!

Even though Lady is awfully cute, too 

Can't wait to keep up with your journal!


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you all so much! I'm happy people are enjoying reading about our adventures. I love reading everyone's comments. :grin:

I have been busy with work so I have not quite as much training time with Joy but I still have made it a point to see her everyday.. except for this past Monday and Tuesday. That's the longest I've ever gone without seeing her, two days. :icon_frown:

Today I was able to spend about a good hour with her even though it was dark. I ground tied her which she did well with. She will stand pretty much as long as I want as long as I'm grooming her. She'll start to walk off if I walk away from her to follow me. She stood for about 30 seconds after I stepped away so I praised her for that. 

I didn't really realize until today and yesterday how much.. calmer she is. Other people at the stable have been saying "she's so much calmer!" I guess since I work with her everyday it's hard for me to see a drastic difference versus someone who sees her once a week or so. But she definitely is calmer. I threw a towel around her face, on her face, swung the lead rope around etc. and she barely blinked an eyelid. Plus she didn't spook at the scary hose the moved around her feet yesterday. Oh! And she lowers her head for me to take the halter off when I ask her to instead of throwing her head like she did when I got her. 

I'm trying to think of stuff to do next. I want to perfect the pivot (this has been a looooooong process) and get her to be super calm with the tarp which is the one thing she still does not like. I'm thinking maybe teaching her how to side pass. I also want her to consistently back up a few steps. I guess in my head I'm thinking I need to get her to be solid with all those things because I plan on showing her in showmanship and in hand trail classes and would prefer to not be a laughing stock, lol. 

So, yesterday I did meet the horse I'm going to train. His name is Patrick. He is approx. 12 years old. Sweet guy. I think he has a good head on his shoulders. What I'm supposed to work on in particular is his habit of balking badly when he's being led away from his friends. He's buddy sour but not in a prancy, panicky way. He just dead stops. My first thoughts were "I'll just get my rope halter out and teach him pressure and release." Wrong. I swear, he will let you hang on his poll for 10 mins and will not budge. And since I have no intention of damaging the poor guy's head/neck I switched my routine up. I am going to make him work every single time he stops. He yields his hindquarters well so anytime he stops he will get to move his feet a lot. It seemed to work pretty well leading him before. I did it once I think. So with consistency I think he'll think twice about stopping because it means 5 mins of work for him every time he does.

I did ground pen work with him. He joined up within 5 mins which I was thrilled with but quickly realized it wasn't so much a submissive gesture as a "I don't want to work and I can get out of it by going up to her." I sent him back out and he kicked at me, so he got to gallop around in a few circles while I chased him and "pressured" him. LOL. Guys, I swear, I must look absolutely ridiculous chasing these horses around cause I'm like 5'4" and the least intimidating looking person ever. It probably looks like a chihuahua chasing a great dane around. 

Patrick's owner and I agreed on a price so I'll be working with him starting hopefully early next week sometime. I wanted to make sure she was comfortable with me working him after seeing how I do things. But she's a sweetheart, and Patrick can be, so I am excited to work with them both. I'm really excited she's given me the opportunity especially since I'm not a professional. I'll post updates about him too. 

Pics of Joy below


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## whisperbaby22

Yes, please keep me updated on Patrick, herd bound is one problem I have never wanted to deal with.


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## horseylover1_1

I'm going to see Joy and Patrick soon, so I'll post updates later tonight.

Patrick's owner says he was limping. It started after I worked him. :-( The only thing I can think of is I worked him in the round pen for 15-20 mins on Thursday. Trotting/cantering. But he only trotted and cantered for about 2 mins each time, and we did lots of walking before and after to warm him up. And in-between the trotting and cantering we did walk/stand. I just feel bad. I didn't think that little of work could cause a horse to go lame, even if he's been out to pasture. I'm checking on him today, if he feels better I will do light work. If it was my horse I wouldn't feel quite as bad but apparently I made another person's horse lame. :-( Gah I hope he is better today.


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## whisperbaby22

No you didn't make him lame, you just showed the owner that there is something going on with the horse. That little bit would not have made him lame unless he was already lame.


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## horseylover1_1

Thanks @whisperbaby22 I was mildly freaking out. She didn't blame me; just let me know he was limping and I of course thought the worst. Thankfully I did see him and he wasn't limping at all.

Joy was a bit difficult today. Actually she wasn't being bad per say, but she really didn't want to learn anything new. I was trying to teach her to back up using a variety of methods from different trainers. She would not respond to any of the methods, in fact, she thought it would be fun to go forward every time I asked her to back. I know MOST of it is because she doesn't know what I'm asking. She's not usually defiant. But it was frustrating because she made 0 effort to learn today. Toward the end I finally found a way to make her somewhat back up. I had to stand in a position similar to what you'd see in a showmanship class and jiggle the halter. She backed up 3-4 times so we called it a day. On a brighter note though, she nickered twice when she saw me today! It was the first time she's done that, so she must love me. :lol: 

Patrick was the complete opposite. He was an ANGEL!!!! Not limping either, thank goodness. I started to teach him to back with the same methods I used on Joy and he picked it up in about 30 seconds. It's amazing how different horses can be. They have their own ways of learning and reacting. I led him away from his friends 3 times and he didn't balk once (even when his friend neighed at him). That is huge for him apparently. Once we got about 1/4 mile away from his friends I let him graze for about 15 mins and told him he was SUCH a good boy and just let him enjoy being away from his friends. We didn't work at all in the round pen, partly because I am babying his foot and also I wanted his first trip away from his friends to be really positive. I'm all about cutting a lesson short if the horse is giving you 110%. 

I am going to take professional pics of all these horses at some point. My husband and I (more so him) are photographers for a living, so it's pretty sad I've mostly posted cell phone pics so far. Haha.

Pics of "Patrick the Paint" below.


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## whisperbaby22

About Joy, she's a youngster, and I would expect, and in fact, prefer a young horse to sometimes rebel. She's thinking, and she's got her spirit intact. There is nothing sadder than a horse that just obeys without thinking. I rode one once as a kid, a very sad case, his brain was fried.


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## Joy Brock

Great journal!! I'm loving it and subscribing. I'm a photography buff too! And I think we have a lot in common 😊


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## horseylover1_1

@whisperbaby22 I appreciate you bringing that up. Especially today. For the first time in a VERY long time she wouldn't let me catch her. She was galloping around the paddock with another horse. The BO had to help me grab the other two horses before we could catch Joy. I know this is ridiculous but it did hurt my feelings a little. I immediately took her to the round pen (she was even being bad about leading) and made her move her feet for about 15-20 minutes. She didn't want to join up - first time since I've owned her - but she eventually did and then I groomed her and put her away.
@Joy Brock Yeah it seems like it! I'm glad to have you following my journal


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## horseylover1_1

Videos..


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## horseylover1_1

Joy was, overall, very good tonight. She nickered when she saw me. (I think she was saying she was sorry for yesterday). It was snowing when I got there so we stayed in the barn. I like our barn because the center aisle is huge.. there is enough room to do basic ground training. Nothing crazy but more than enough room to work on pivots, backing up, ground tying etc. 

I put some MTG in her mane and tail and noticed how fast her tail is growing. It was at her chestnut about a month ago and is a good one inch past it now, plus her body is growing too so I think her tail is growing really quickly. 

We worked on backing again and she was a dream. Barely had to apply pressure to the halter. She was acting a bit babyish the entire night. You know... just restless and squirmy. She nipped my leg and I immediately hit her nose. Not only did she not bite me again but she straightened up and listened. 

I totally get it now. By "it", I mean those moms who are constantly correcting their 2 year olds... "Get your foot out of that." "I JUST SAID not to do that" "If you do that one more time you're losing your cookies" I will never subconsciously judge a mom again.


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## BlindHorseEnthusiast4582

Joy is so cute, and the other two are nice as well! I'm subbing to keep up. You seem like an excellent horseperson.


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## horseylover1_1

BlindHorseEnthusiast4582 said:


> Joy is so cute, and the other two are nice as well! I'm subbing to keep up. You seem like an excellent horseperson.


Aww thank you so much!! I love her. (And the others.. haha) I try to be but still have so much to learn. I really do enjoy being around them all. I can't wait to get to the barn most days.

Today was rather uneventful. Made Joy ground tie while I groomed her, then just took her on a walk. We do that quite a bit. Instead of walking a dog I walk my filly around. She seems to like it. :lol:


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## PoptartShop

Joy is such a cutiepie!  I love the videos too. They're adorable.


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## horseylover1_1

Joy still doesn't like the tarp. 

I decided to work on desensitizing her to the tarp again. I will say she is _better _ than when I first started working with her on it a few weeks ago. What I don't understand is that she is comfortable with the tarp about 75% of the time whether I wave it around her or put it on her back or whatever. But 25% of the time she FREAKS. OUT. She's fine for 2 mins and then runs away from it like it's going to kill her.

I am trying to figure out if it's a certain something that's triggering her fear. Touching her on the leg? Coming up near her face? Blowing a certain way? There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to her spooking at it; it just seems random. I attached a video of me working with her, this was during the 2 min spell of her not spooking at it.

I'm sure this is slightly boring because I mention it almost daily (lol) but she is so good at ground tying and gets better every day! I've gotten to the point I'll walk away from her to grab whatever I need and she just stands there. 

Oh, and on Thursday she came up to me in the field. She got lots of loving for that. :lol:


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## whisperbaby22

OK, I am not a trainer, just have worked with a few horses over the years, so take that into consideration. I would stop using the tarp. She may be freaked out by the smell of it, or some other thing but she clearly does not like it. Try sacking out with an old horse blanket, or saddle blanket. Every horse I have had has had some thing that they clearly do not like and since what we are trying to achieve is a give and take, not a dictatorship, giving in on this one small thing may make a large impression on her. Unless you eventually do some class where a tarp is required, what use is it.


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## horseluvr2524

Joy is looking great. She's so tall! Congrats on the training jobs.

Joy doesn't suddenly freak out at the tarp, even though it may seem that way. In the video, she was giving you clear signs that she was uneasy about it, especially more so once it was on her back and around her chest.

All horses have a breaking point. They will only take so much, and until you learn to read the very small communications they make (which can vary from horse to horse), it definitely does seem like they just suddenly freak out. But really they are just containing all that anxiety until it builds up and they just can't contain it anymore.

The finesse part of horse training that you can only learn through experience, is knowing where each individual horse's breaking point is, and how far to push before stopping.

Don't worry, you'll get it! Just make your goal 1%, a small improvement, every day. If you are working on backing up, have her take two steps back, then praise and quit. The next day, try to get four steps back. With the tarp, I would want her to be standing quietly while the tarp makes noise on the ground before getting her comfortable with it on her back. A favorite trick of mine is to put the horse's favorite treat on the scary object. I put carrots in plastic bags and taught my mare to take the carrots out of them so she wouldn't be afraid of it. It worked, except the unforeseen effect was that she now will try to go through any bag she can get ahold of, plastic or not! :lol:


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## StephaniHren

I don't agree with @whisperbaby22 that you should give up on the tarp training. It's not so much about the tarp (because it's true that you'll never encounter a tarp in the wild, though you will see them in trail classes), it's about expecting your horse to refer to your judgement whenever they're in a situation that makes them uncomfortable or uneasy (like when there's a tarp on top of them). It's the theory that no matter what you put your horse in front of, they should be able to go over it/have it on top of them so long as your body language says it's nothing to be afraid of. Very handy, especially for trail horses!

Like @horseluvr2524 said, you can definitely tell that she's uncomfortable with the tarp before she reacts—head up, ears turned back, tension through her back, consistently rushing forward/away from the tarp (even subtly), etc. All signs that even though the tarp is on her and she's not outright freaking out about it, she's not necessarily _okay_ and she's building her way up to a freak out.

Have you worked her walking _over _the tarp yet? Typically the last thing I do with a horse is put the scary object on top of them (which simulates a predator jumping on them from above). Ezhno's walked over tarps before, but I haven't moved on to putting the tarp over him yet (which is a good idea, I should go back to that!). I want my horse to be completely comfortable around the item (and over the item) before I make that final step.

Here's the steps I usually take (I'm specifically thinking about a big plastic garbage bag filled with stuff that my horse spooked at today—jump, blow, snort, wiggle, the whole nine yards of ridiculous):

1. Turn and face the scary object. Stand still. Look at it. Usually I identify it out loud, generally with an exasperated tone. "It's a garbage bag."
2. "Come on, let's go look at it." Iwalk away from the horse, usually letting the lead line out as I go so that they're not forced to come with me (because if I'm walking straight towards it then it's probably not a threat). I touch the object. "Not scary."
3. I bring them closer to the object with a tug on the lead. I keep touching and poking it. Once they're close to it (usually of their own accord, with a bit of coaxing from me), I wait until they're bored and standing normally.
4. I whack the object so that it makes noises and moves. I pick up the item. I toss it around. I keep doing this sort of stuff until they're bored. I "play" with it.
5. I touch them with the item until they're bored. Then I pat them with it. Then I whack them with it (lightly, of course)—neck first, then shoulder, then barrel, hindquarters last. 
6. I put it on top of them—_slowly_. They've already had it bumped against them, so this usually isn't a big deal. Rustle it, wiggle it, etc. No movement, just standing around with the item on top of them until, again, they're BORED.
7. Move on to throwing the item on top of them. Chuck it around like you would sling a blanket/sheet up on top of them. This is the phase where you get to fling it through the air wildly. If they run, you wait until they stop, then take the item off and step back to putting it on them slowly(maybe even put it on yourself first!).
8. Walk with the item on them. This can be _super scary_. Usually I walk around with it on me/waving it in the air first.

The "until they're bored" part is key. Since you're working with a young horse it can take a long time to find that "bored" phase. I'd stick with the highest step you can get the bored reaction with and not jump to throwing the tarp on top of her if she's not comfortable with being around it/having it touch her first. It can take many, many days to get to the point where the tarp is 100% boring, but I _do_ think it's important. It's more about teaching the process than it is about the tarp, because next time she encounters something scary you can go through the same steps and expect it to progress much quicker.

At some point she'll be nonplussed by all the weird things you keep showing her, so long as you say they're okay.


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## horseylover1_1

Hi everyone! I have appreciated all the feedback!

I was definitely wrong in saying she was "comfortable" with the tarp. She's not. More specifically she will usually stand while I wave it around her, and maybe stand still when I put it on her back, but you're right guys - it's not sudden and she's definitely letting me know she doesn't care too much for it being on her back. Sometimes I get too caught up on the goal and not the steps to take to get there (something for *me* to work on!) She is comfortable (truly comfortable) with towels. I think it's the sound and color she's not caring for. The reason I am so set on the tarp is because it will probably be in the trail in hand classes I plan on entering her into this summer. 

BUT I do have good news, she did _much_ better with it today. Absolutely no "freak outs". She hasn't gotten to the point that she's comfortable with it per say but she did 10x better than when I took the last video. Today I rubbed her head (which she loves) after I put the tarp on her, around her, etc. and that helped to calm her down. I also let her sniff it a lot before I put it on her back. 
@StephaniHren She actually doesn't mind going over it at all. If I put it down in the round pen and we're at liberty, she will walk over it after I do. Sometimes she stands on it and paws at it. I tied it to the top of the round pen today and let her walk under it. 

I typically feel like I'm _pretty_ good at reading horse's body language, so I do feel a bit discouraged. I feel like that's the most important thing in horse training and here I am saying my horse is comfortable when she's clearly not. But I really do appreciate the comments, my goal is to take your suggestions and apply them - or at the very least try them.

A little off topic, Patrick did pretty good today. Balked a couple times but once I got him moving his feet his attitude improved ten fold. And his owner called, said she is so happy with his progress she would like me to continue working with him in April. I am so happy about it. It really has nothing to do with the money at all for me. As mentioned beforehand my confidence is BAD as I have crippling anxiety. Whether it be houses(I sell real estate), horses, whatever, I always worry I'm not good enough.. that I am a failure. It keeps me up at night. So having someone say "Hey, I see progress, you're doing a great job. Keep it up, I appreciate it." It means so much to me. 

Pics below. I included a blooper of me attempting to run backwards while asking Patrick to change directions... lol...


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## horseylover1_1

This was a few weeks ago. She went over it quite a few times






And look what else I found. A baby pic!


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## whisperbaby22

OK, I missed the part where you are going to be in classed that require this. The suggestions you have here should help. But I differ from Stephani about how to train trail horses. That's why I so rarely comment!


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> OK, I missed the part where you are going to be in classed that require this. The suggestions you have here should help. But I differ from Stephani about how to train trail horses. That's why I so rarely comment!



I love reading your comments! You're always so encouraging!


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## horseylover1_1

I've been so busy lately I have not had a chance to eat dinner until 10 PM let alone write in my journal. Whew! That's a good problem to have when you're self employed though.

Today was a great day with Joy. I think for the first time since I got her she let me just pet her for 5 minutes straight after I worked her without pulling her head away to eat. She was just letting me pet her and I could tell she was enjoying it. It was really, really sweet. 

I took her up to the road in an attempt to get her used to cars. (There is a large field owned by the barn owners we can hang out in so there's plenty of buffer space between us and the cars.) Thankfully they don't seem to bother her for the most part. I let her graze in the field as the cars went by so she enjoyed the "training." I think she just enjoyed the walk and new scenery. 

She was super mellow today. She's been acting a little ADHD the past few weeks. Not bad per say, she just has a tendency to get antsy, flighty, not really pay attention to me for more than 5 seconds etc. She ran out of her normal feed about 36 hours ago and we replaced it with oats and I think I am seeing a MAJOR improvement. I suppose it's possible that she was just having a good day. But I was actually driving away thinking how good she was today when it dawned on me she hadn't had her old food in a couple days. It has corn in it. I asked the B.O. how long it took for it to get out of their system. She said 12-24 hours. She said that she has seen major improvement after taking other horses off corn because it's a "hot" feed. So we are going to try taking her off it completely. I can't get over how level headed, calm, and affectionate she was today. 

Pics from the field below. :grin:


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## PoptartShop

She is just the cutest thing ever!  Love her pink halter.
I'm glad you had a good day with her! So cute!


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## whisperbaby22

Yes, she really does have a look to her! And some horses can really be affected by feed.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> Yes, she really does have a look to her! And some horses can really be affected by feed.


I started another forum on the feed, to get suggestions. I supposed it could be a fluke but I know it wasn't a placebo because I couldn't get over how well she was doing and then I realized she hadn't had any of her old food. It could be that it's not really the corn but she's just sensitive to the feed in general .. apparently it's a very low quality feed so I'm glad to get her off of it regardless.

It's so overwhelming, lol. So many contradicting opinions from "professionals."


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## whisperbaby22

A lot of these "professionals" are trying to sell you something. Taking good care of our horses has become an industry. It's best to just think of the horse in it's natural setting, and get as close to that as you can.


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## horseylover1_1

Miss Joy has been really good the past couple days. I swear switching her off the bad feed has helped. Maybe it wasn't specifically the corn in the feed that was making her act like she has ADHD, but something in it she was sensitive to. 

Video time!

My husband got a drone and took some drone video of us:






I did take everyone suggestions on moving slower with the tarp. I also took her out of the round pen and into the barn to desensitize her because the barn is her comfort zone - the round pen is not. She is doing much, much better. I treated her while I put it on her back so she associated it with something good. She didn't try moving away from the tarp once even though she's still not "comfortable" with it per say. Short video below. It's less about the tarp and more about her cute face. :grin:


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## horseylover1_1

Can't believe it's been a week since I posted anything.. time flies..

Nothing really exciting has happened with Joy the past week. She seems to be doing well on her new diet and I'm starting to see little white spots and white roaning on her. I hope she doesn't get too many, I really didn't want her to have an appaloosa look to her. But I love her now, so don't care if she turns purple at this point. :lol: She's stuck with me for life.

I rode Patrick for the first time Sunday. His owner wanted me to focus on ground work at first which is fine because that's what I would have done anyway. She said he did well and I am free to ride him anytime I want. I feel like I have graduated. Haha. She's real fun, I'm starting to really get attached to him and her as well. 

Oh, Joy and I did do something kind of new - she got her first real bath. She's been sprayed with the hose before but this was her first real bath. She did pretty well with it. She likes water so that helped. She also managed to untie her quick release knot.. lol.. it's a good thing she's not hard to catch. I also did some flexing with her. She didn't get it at first but once she did, she was all for it because all she had to do was stand there and turn her head around. Lazy thing. All she wants to do is stand around and eat. I know all animals love to eat but this girl LOVES to eat. Even the BO commented that she inhales her hay faster than most horses. She was a little too focused on the new green grass yesterday so I made her do some exercises that turned her attention back to me such as flexing, backing, yielding her shoulder, etc. 

She's getting her feet done for what I believe will be the first time on Saturday. So will post about how she did with that.


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## horseluvr2524

What is Joy's other third? I know she's 2/3 Friesian, but I have looked trying to find what her other third is, and either I missed the information or it's not there.

She is gorgeous  Cool that you still get riding time on other horses! It can be a little rough having a horse you aren't able to ride. When I was younger, that would have been a big deal. Now I just really enjoy all the other things you can do with horses, like liberty training and driving, so riding is no longer the be all end all for me.


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## horseylover1_1

horseluvr2524 said:


> What is Joy's other third? I know she's 2/3 Friesian, but I have looked trying to find what her other third is, and either I missed the information or it's not there.
> 
> She is gorgeous  Cool that you still get riding time on other horses! It can be a little rough having a horse you aren't able to ride. When I was younger, that would have been a big deal. Now I just really enjoy all the other things you can do with horses, like liberty training and driving, so riding is no longer the be all end all for me.


Thank you! She is 1/3 appaloosa. I attached a pic of her mom. Everyone at the stable jokes about apps being crazy and they say my filly got the crazy app in her. lol. I have no experience with appaloosas so not sure what their traits are and if there's truth to that or not.

Anyone have knowledge of breeding and genetics? I think I read somewhere that some horses will always throw LP no matter who the sire is. She definitely has LP characteristics.. she's spotted on the inside of her lip, her nipples, anywhere that has skin w/o fur. I just hope that any spotting she has is minimal. (Watch, I'm going to end up with a white horse before it's all over with. haha) Going beyond that, if I breed her someday, will she be able to throw a solid foal? I would say it would be a 50/50 chance because she does have a solid sire. So I am assuming Joy is LP/something else. I think her mom may be LP/LP. Her mom is 75/25 Appaloosa/Friesian. Joy's sire is Keegan. 

At first I really wanted her to be solid, but she exhibits that Friesian "look" (IMO) so much that even with color she will still look Friesian. Some Friesian/app crosses.. you can't really tell there is Friesian in there.

And yeah I do miss riding, but there is so much other stuff to do. The show I want to go to has like 7 classes she could enter. Trail in hand, showmanship, etc. They have about two dozen non-riding classes, which I think is awesome! Some people can't or don't want to ride so I think it's wonderful.


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## whisperbaby22

OK, now I see where the "look" in her eye comes from. Me, I am an appaloosa person, but in a different way. What I like is the color, not the breed. The color is an ancient one, especially the leapards. Breeding paint and appaloosa with friesian is growing in popularity here in So Cal, everybody wants the next "big thing". Appaloosa's can change color quite a bit, it will be interesting to see how she goes.


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## horseylover1_1

It's starting to become popular here. One person in particular breeds them. The sire they have is my filly's grandsire. I looked at some of their horses before I decided to get Joy. I attached a pic of her grand sire, and I'm sure everyone knows what a purebred Friesian (her sire) looks like.

I am very curious to know what she'll look like in the future. She is roaning out everywhere.


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## horseluvr2524

@WhattaTroublemaker I think knows a lot about appaloosas. I believe she has one, who is anything but crazy.

Joy is very pretty, and her mama and grandsire are stunning! Personally, if I were you, I would be thrilled to have a horse who looked like a Friesian except had more interesting coloring. I think a leopard appaloosa Friesian would be very cool looking lol.

I just love all horses. I've got ADHD for horses like some girls have for jewelry... "ooh, pretty horse!". The only breed I don't think I'd be real interested in owning is Arabian, but I still admire them. My favorites are Lusitano, Andalusian, and mustang.

I am so thrilled that my mustang Shan has finally mellowed. I was a bit afraid she would always be that horse, like an arabian, that you could never relax on. It took a few years, but now I can trust her to truck DH around safely.


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## Dehda01

Homozygous lp appaloosas are usually few spots, so it is unlikely her dam was homozygous.


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## whisperbaby22

I am not at all familiar with the ins and outs of horse colors. Due to the testing that is available now, lots of different colors and markings have different names than what was the norm when I was a kid. When people refer to "crazy" appaloosas, well, all horses can be labeled. My current horse is a few spot named "Chief Crazy Horse". No papers, so not considered an appaloosa, but a plain bay or chestnut can be considered a purebred appaloosa. I'm not here to argue about the breed, which I am not interested in, I just admire the color. As for temperament, my opinion is that they range the gamut just like all other colors. I remember when chestnut fillies were all considered wild and crazy. 

As to what will happen with Joy, that's really up in the air at this point.


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## horseylover1_1

Today was filled with lots of horses and lots of smiles.

A boot barn just opened near where I live so we went to the grand opening celebration and I got me my first cowboy hat. :grin: 

I worked with Joy and Patrick today. Patrick is making good progress. We definitely have a ways to go but he is doing a lot better than he was when I first started working with him. Today when I rode him he was getting "pasture sour" real bad when I rode him outside of the round pen. It was progressively getting worse - the longer he worked, the more he wanted to go back to his pasture and his buddies. Toward the end he was trotting real fast/cantering toward the pasture. I remember watching a CA video that explained when a horse is acting that way as he's going toward his barn/field/buddies/whatever to let them - and make them work their little butts off once they get there.

It worked marvelously. By the end of it Patrick was walking calmly toward the pasture instead of borderline bolting toward it. I originally tried making him turn in circles or just pulling on the reins but I think it just made him more resentful and wanting to be with his buddies that much more. He got more and more hot. Once he realized he had to work HARD at the place he wanted to be - and got to rest away from it - he was a dream. So I plan on using that more on him.

Joy was amazing too. She was out in the pasture and came up to me. We did her feet for what I feel like was her first trim (yes, she's almost a year old and apparently you're supposed to do their first trim MUCH earlier.. but her feet weren't that long, even today when we trimmed them). I rubbed her forehead while she was getting her feet done because that always calms her down and she was half asleep through her "pedicure." She fidgeted a bit when one of her back feet was done, other than that she was a little super star with it. Which made me happy because when I first got her I couldn't even pick her feet up, let alone stand there to be trimmed for 5 minutes at a time. 

I was proud of both my babies today.


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## horseylover1_1

It was soooo amazingly beautiful today. Sunny and 72 degrees most of the afternoon. I worked with Joy and Patrick, and they both did so well. It's really hard for me to describe how upbuilt I feel after working with horses and seeing their improvement. 

So I am going to try something new and write my journal as a novel for a couple entries to see what everyone thinks. If you like it I will continue doing it, otherwise will switch back to the way I normally write. I used to write quite a bit but have gotten away from it, so my writing will probably be pretty rusty! (I changed the name of the stable+Patricks owner)

*Patrick:*
It was the first hot day of the year. The mid-april sun bathed Whispering Creek Stables in a mid afternoon light. Pulling my 4 door sedan unto the long driveway, I can't help but get a small knot in my stomach. I've been working with Patrick for a few weeks now, but today was one of the few days his owner would be there as well.

I smile as Patrick rushes to the fence once he recognizes my car. He knows there always apple nuggets awaiting for him when I pull up. He's learned not to beg, but puts his head over in anticipation of attention. I give him a peck on the nose and grab his halter and lead rope. I smile as Patrick's mom, Amber, pulls up. As usual she greets me with a smile and a "how are you?"

"Good," I grin as I brush Patrick's coat. 

I love Amber. She has become a good friend to me. Still, she's the first person to ever hire me to work with a horse so I am slightly nervous whenever we are together. I want to make sure she's pleased with what I'm doing, and that I'm worth my keep and she's seeing a difference in her horse.

We talk about this, that, and the other until we finally saddle up and ride on. I feel my heart pounding as we make our way down the fence line. Patrick is calm. I let the reins slide through my fingers some and feel myself start to relax. I know he has a habit of bucking and throwing a fit once he's "done" being ridden. I make myself relax more so he can relax as well. I smile, looking back at the horse's friend - a 30 year old standardbred named Duke that tags along on our rides.

Amber turns her horse one way and I turn Patrick the other. My nerves start to get to me again. This is a major test for him. At any moment he may start to buck or bolt now that his friends are slowly getting farther and farther away. He balks. I thrust my reins towards his neck, kick, and cluck. I cannot help but smile as he walks calmly on. 

"Good boy," I say as he calmly walks on, head down and snorting, starting to relax. We do this for the next half hour, testing Patrick's patience and my ability to help him walk calmly on. 

I think to the two rides beforehand. Patrick had balked, bucked, and bolted with me numerous times. As I look between his relaxed ears I realize what I'm doing is _starting_ to make a difference. My smile returns as we return toward the paddock, my thoughts on how well Patrick did overall. 

After grooming, loving, and treating I get in my car to start my next adventure of the day. With sun shining on me and a load full of horse tack in my trunk, I head off to my next session.

*Joy: *
Joy. The light of my life, the smile and warmth in my heart. She is my everything. She is my joy. I smile as I pull around the top of the hill and see her playing with a baby Clydesdale in the pasture. Even from afar, she exudes her lovely innocence as one of the sweetest fillies I have ever met.

Pulling into my normal parking space, I climb out of the blue sedan and head straight toward my girl. For the first time since I've owned her, she can't get to me fast enough and gallops down the dusty hill, mane and tail flying. 

"Hi baby girl!" I say with genuine love and excitement in my voice. How far we have come. Three months ago it took 4 people to catch her. We couldn't pick up her feet, and she threw her head every time we haltered her. 

I grab the neon pink halter and lead her into the barn as the tops hits radio blares as someone is mucking stalls. I feel myself doing a little jig as I brush her mane and tail, telling her how amazing of a horse she is. I stop mid-curry. She's got 3 very distinct white marks coming in on her hip and stomach. She's getting more the more she sheds out. I brush and curry more in anticipation of finding more markings. Finding none, I lead her out of the barn and into the arena. 

She's tired. Her eyes are half closed. As I ask for a shoulder yield she coughs, a couple times, and I decide it's not the best day to be working her in the dusty arena. Several horses have developed colds from the extreme weather and my girl is no exception. 

"Come on," I coo as I lead her to the green grass so she can eat a few minutes before I go home for dinner. She's just lovely. There's not a single thing about this baby I don't love. Knowing I could spend the rest of the night there, but my husband is waiting for me at home, I finally turn her out in her pasture and get one last smile as she stays with me, not wanting to leave my side.


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## horseylover1_1

Forgot to include pics of the little angel


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## horseylover1_1

Hello all.

I've been torn on updating regularly or just posting like once a week. Being that Joy is young our journals are getting pretty consistent and boring, like "Joy ate today." Or "Joy and I worked on <insert basic training skill here> for the 5th time today." 

Pretty much everything we do now is just refresher and refining lessons. I think it's important for her or any baby to have that so she will have no "holes" when she gets older. One new thing we did was clip (just her nose - she was unsure at first but took to it well) and she's really starting to show some white spots on her from shedding. Oh, and I tried this new homemade conditioner on her mane. I think the MTG was irritating her. I still use it on her tail because it doesn't seem to bother her there. But she was scratching her mane and messing up her neck.

Off topic.. it's been so beautiful here. One of the best springs I can remember. Work has been picking up a bit and I'm excited for the rest of the year.


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## horseluvr2524

The way I see a journal is a personal record. So in my opinion, you should record what you want to remember. The rest of us are just along for the ride.

I don't know if you are going to be heartbroken if Joy doesn't stay solid black, but I think she is going to look amazing with spots! I'll tell you a little secret (and don't take this the wrong way because I think Joy is gorgeous)- Friesians are not my favorite breed. In fact, they are not even close to making the list. I just don't think they are that beautiful. Andalusians and Lusitanos are my weakness... not Friesians. But a Friesian looking horse that is different from the standard black? Gorgeous! I do think the rare chestnut Friesians are pretty.

That said, I love all horses, so a breed being my 'favorite' breed doesn't mean a whole lot.


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## whisperbaby22

My personal opinion is that friesians should be a separate category. They for the most part are not riding horses, they are carriage horses. For a while there seemed to be a half and half split locally here of friesians and andalusians. I think that one reason all the vaqueros around here started riding them is the temperament. Andalusians can be a handful. But there is no denying friesians are bouncy. I am seeing less of them and more andalusians lately. 

If you like color there is a horse called Patent on Patina that I think is a friesian color stallion. They are promoting him for stud now.


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## horseluvr2524

whisperbaby22 said:


> They for the most part are not riding horses, they are carriage horses.


Exactly :thumbsup:


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## horseylover1_1

I think people fall in love with the long mane and tails that some Friesians have, the ones that look fairytale like, and not really the breed itself. They're not particularly versatile as a whole. I love black horses, always have, so that's one reason I love them. At first I was disappointed she wasn't solid black but the more time goes on the more I am getting used to the idea. Plus, I don't think color makes a beautiful horse. I've seen some not so pretty appaloosas/paints/etc. and some that are absolutely drop dead gorgeous. So it depends on the horse. I've been putting a lot of time and effort into making her mane and tail long and healthy - my biggest weakness is a nice mane! 
@whisperbaby22 you are absolutely correct. They're not really warmbloods or cold bloods. Which is one reason I opted not to get a full blooded one at the moment.. I want something that can jump small jumps. I mean, any sound horse can jump I guess, but obviously a Friesian is not built for it. I don't really go higher than 3 foot jumps at the most anyways. We are still a long ways from that. But I can already tell she has a natural aptitude for it. If I lead her over a log she will jump it every time. My main goal for her is an all around horse. Western pleasure, dressage, some jumping, I plan on doing it all.


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## horseylover1_1

Also @horseluvr2524 I remember you said you loved mustangs. That is actually what I wanted to get when we were shopping. But I mentioned to my husband I liked Friesians and he liked them so that's what we shopped for. He likes pretty animals. I wanted a mustang because I have heard nothing but amazing things about their personalities... but I wanted a mustang that had been wild, that I could train, but there are not many around here. I found one (a buckskin, with amazing movement) 2 hours from here that I wanted but timing was not right.

Speaking of mustangs I am supposed to call someone in an hour about possibly helping her start a couple BLM mustangs. I am so excited. I hope we are a good fit. She knows me well, we went on a couple trail rides together, never seen me train before though. I guess every time you ride you're training. She's started quite a few mustangs so having someone experienced to assist me in my (hopefully) long horse training career is very exciting. I will let everyone know how it goes later. Seeing Joy as well. So will post pictures of her


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## PoptartShop

Awww she's sucha pretty little girl! :smile: I love her halter too.  You can post whatever you like, it's your journal. I love hearing about everything!
That will be fun to start some mustangs. Let us know! And yes, pictures are a must!


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you, @PoptartShop!

The mustangs' owner is interested in having me work with them which is exciting. Still unsure if schedule and timing will allow me to do it.. the horses are an hour away and my husband thinks I have "too much going on" to take on 4 unbroken horses. But we'll see.

Joy officially became a yearling yesterday. And to celebrate that she had her first heat cycle. Lol. She hadn't been turned out in a couple days AND she was in heat so she was a little distracted tonight to say the least. She was squirting at anything with 4 legs. I was going to work on clipping her ears but gave it a rest because she just was not having it tonight. I can imagine it being her first heat cycle she's a bit overwhelmed with the new hormones and all. She's also considerably easier to mess with when she's had her turn out. So I groomed her and did some trailer loading exercises and put her back. 

She is getting to be so pretty. I hate bragging on my own horse but I can't get over how nicely she's filling out.. her coat looks great. She is doing exceptionally well on her new feed.


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## horseluvr2524

Wow, she does look a LOT more filled out and grown up than even her pictures from last month. What was the feed change? I missed it.

ETA: I would also not pass up the opportunity to work with mustangs if possible :wink:
ETA2: how many hands is she now? She looks big.


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## PoptartShop

Wow she really is filling out nicely.  So pretty!
Working with the mustangs will be really cool too!


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## horseylover1_1

Thanks guys!

I switched her from a crap sweet feed to Tribute Alfa. The difference is amazing. She looks better physically and I think it's helped her mood as well. She's less "ADHD."

Speaking of she pretty much lets me rub the tarp all over her now. She has started associating it with treats so she tolerates it. Every time I pull the tarp off her back she immediately asks for her treat. lol. That's really the only thing I treat train her with other than tricks though. 

Not sure how tall. I've never actually measured her. I wanna say somewhere in the area of 13 hands? 

Our first show is July 1st. And there is a show the following week on the 8th. So far I plan to go to both. I am SO excited. There is something I really love about showing, I think part of it is having a goal to work toward.


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## horseluvr2524

Nice! Much better to stay away from grain, if possible. If what you were feeding was just sweet feed with no vit/min... yes no nutritional value at all to that. You may as well have been feeding a human toddler straight sugar. lol.

You should get a tape to keep track. I would, I think it would be fun when you have a growing horse on your hands.

Something like this? I've used them before and they are very simple to use.


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## horseylover1_1

It had some nutritional value added to it, but yes it was low in "real" nutritional value. Kinda like adding a whole bunch of Vitamin A, B, fiber, etc. etc. to food that doesn't naturally have it in it. If that makes any sense. Actually I had her on forage based feed at first and she wouldn't eat it, even with sweet stuff added to it. She is picky like mom. Lol.

I'm going to get one of those tapes. I tried ordering one off Amazon tonight but wouldn't let me for some reason. 

Looks like I may have picked up another horse to work with. Etta. Will call her owner Mary. She likes to move away from the mounting block when you try to get on her. It's Mary's first horse. Etta is at the same place Patrick is, so finding the time won't be hard. I don't think it'll take much to get her out of that habit... but every horse is different so we will see.


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## horseluvr2524

Good for you!

I'm going to make a guess that horse trainers aren't too abundant in your area. I had a hard time picking up clients when I tried it out, despite the fact that my clients were always satisfied with my work. I think it is because I live in an area where horse trainers, people, stables, etc. are extremely abundant. 
I probably could have made it if I kept at it. I just found I wasn't enjoying it, because the owners would refuse to work with their horses. I felt like I was wasting my time (despite getting paid for it) to be putting all this training on the horses, for the owners to just let them sit there.

I'm enjoying mine and DH's very small but growing business. I get to do a lot of creative writing and don't have to deal with difficult people.

*sigh* sorry for the thread derail. I tend to be really good at those.


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## horseylover1_1

Thanks! 

It's a bit of a mixed bag far as trainers go. I am near Louisville, KY and there are quite a few trainers down there and the surrounding area. If you look on Craigslist for one you'll find at least a half dozen ads. There are less on this side of the river though, in Indiana. And I will go to the horse which most trainers require you to bring the horse to them. Mostly it's word of mouth and other boarders seeing me work with horses, most of my work I have been getting is people approaching me. But I have to be careful not to let it crowd out my "real" job of selling real estate because that's what puts bread on the table. There are only so many hours in the day. That is one worry I have.. about people not working with their horses after I am done. I can get a horse to do exactly what I want and work well for me but I'm afraid he'll go right back to the way he was without maintenance. I don't want to get complaints like "he is still doing xxx" when they aren't doing the maintenance work I tell them to do. Especially when it's a vice/behavioral issue. Horse will go right back to doing whatever they were doing if you don't work with them. 

What kind of business do you do? Any business you don't have to deal with people is lovely in my book. Haha.


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## whisperbaby22

That's why I never went into training. You can't train the horse without training the owner. When the owner really wants to get involved, it's a beautiful thing. But it can go wrong so fast. I'm not encouraging you to not do it, but I'd keep pretty intensive records of everything you do. Especially in this internet age, you want to keep helping the horses and not get into a problem..


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> That's why I never went into training. You can't train the horse without training the owner. When the owner really wants to get involved, it's a beautiful thing. But it can go wrong so fast. I'm not encouraging you to not do it, but I'd keep pretty intensive records of everything you do. Especially in this internet age, you want to keep helping the horses and not get into a problem..


Thank you SO much for that suggestion whisperbaby. I should be doing that.. keeping a log with dates and description of everything I did. I try to teach the humans as well but it's their responsibility to apply it. So far everyone is happy but I don't want a call in 3 months that the horse is acting out again when s/he was working fine for me. Signing a contract wouldn't hurt either. 

Measured Joy today. 13 hands exactly! Wish I had measured her when I first got her, but at least now I will be able to track her growth. I worked on some light lunging on lead line today and I'm glad I did because she needed it.


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## horseylover1_1

Nothing has happened since I posted last except I found a pic of one of Joy's half siblings.. and oh my goodness, she looks just like her!


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## horseluvr2524

horseylover1_1 said:


> Thanks!
> 
> It's a bit of a mixed bag far as trainers go. I am near Louisville, KY and there are quite a few trainers down there and the surrounding area. If you look on Craigslist for one you'll find at least a half dozen ads. There are less on this side of the river though, in Indiana. And I will go to the horse which most trainers require you to bring the horse to them. Mostly it's word of mouth and other boarders seeing me work with horses, most of my work I have been getting is people approaching me. But I have to be careful not to let it crowd out my "real" job of selling real estate because that's what puts bread on the table. There are only so many hours in the day. That is one worry I have.. about people not working with their horses after I am done. I can get a horse to do exactly what I want and work well for me but I'm afraid he'll go right back to the way he was without maintenance. I don't want to get complaints like "he is still doing xxx" when they aren't doing the maintenance work I tell them to do. Especially when it's a vice/behavioral issue. Horse will go right back to doing whatever they were doing if you don't work with them.
> 
> What kind of business do you do? Any business you don't have to deal with people is lovely in my book. Haha.


There are a lot more trainers than that in my area, and very experienced ones too who will travel to you for about $40. Makes it difficult for any new trainers without a reputation to speak of yet to make a name for themselves.

One client I had just wanted her horses going out on the trail. I had to get them out riding on their own (all of them OTTBs). Not bad horses overall, but I didn't think they were appropriate for her and the kind of horse she wanted (she would have enjoyed an old retired QH much more). Anyway, she got mad at me because I was not riding them the direction on the trail she wanted them to go. I was perplexed by this, but did as she asked next time I rode them. Sure enough, they went just fine. I told her "these horses will go anywhere you point their head". Her response "oh really?" Yeah, I think I know a bit, that's why you hired me! Geesh. Sorry, ranted a bit. Thus why I don't do horse training anymore...

As for our business, DH and I are trying our hand at developing/publishing/creating our own content, art, and written adventures for tabletop gaming. Actually listening to a playtest of one of our adventures right now. It is frustrating at times, but very fun and a lot less frustrating than contracting! We really want to get out of construction. Just had far too many problems getting people to stay honest (pay us for the work we do) the past couple years. DH just spent several hours doing estimates for a bunch of drywall work and such. We are pretty sure they took our estimates with the material amount on it, bought everything, and then hired a bunch of cheap illegals to do the work. The reason we think this is because next thing we knew, the same people were contacting us over the weekend trying to get us to give them an estimate before monday for paint because of a sale they didn't want to miss out on. They just wanted to know how much paint to buy, and weren't going to give us the job (though they didn't say that). How rude can you be, demanding an estimate on a weekend and demanding it before monday! It's not like we were getting paid for those estimates.

So yeah, no more estimates with material amount (number of each thing) on them. :icon_rolleyes:


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## horseluvr2524

horseylover1_1 said:


> Thank you SO much for that suggestion whisperbaby. I should be doing that.. keeping a log with dates and description of everything I did. I try to teach the humans as well but it's their responsibility to apply it. So far everyone is happy but I don't want a call in 3 months that the horse is acting out again when s/he was working fine for me. Signing a contract wouldn't hurt either.
> 
> Measured Joy today. 13 hands exactly! Wish I had measured her when I first got her, but at least now I will be able to track her growth. I worked on some light lunging on lead line today and I'm glad I did because she needed it.


I keep a log/journal for my business arrangement with my mother. I work her horse every week, she pays for my horse's feed. At the end of every month, I sum up everything my horse ate and the value of all the sessions she got. Been doing this for a few months, and monetarily she is getting the better end of the deal.


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## horseylover1_1

@horseluvr2524 That sounds like a cool business. I love hearing about what people do especially if it's something out of the box like that. If you're artistically inclined I say use it. And yes contracting in construction can be VERY dishonest. As a Realtor I have some exposure to that and it makes me sick how some people in the real estate business operate. 

My parents finally got to meet Joy!! They live in Hawaii most of the year but my Dad got back Saturday (mom has been back a couple months, long story.) When I first walked in I was confused because they moved Joy to another stall. They are building on to the barn and Joy will have a new stall in a few weeks complete with my own tack area.


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## horseylover1_1

Today was awesome!

Worked with Patrick, Etta, and Joy today. All 3 horses did amazing. I think the nice weather makes them more apt to listen. It was my first time working with Etta. She needed help backing and not moving her butt away from the mounting block. She caught on to both within an hour. She is a VERY fast learner.

Anyway, Joy was great! Worked on a little bit of everything - shoulder yielding, desensitizing, trotting in hand, bowing, ground tying, etc. She's really starting to become a well rounded horse. What I'm really happy about is that her confidence is increasing the longer I have her. She is starting to trust me more, so things that normally would have scared her aren't bothering her as much because mom is right there. It's a great feeling. 

Pic I took a couple weeks ago...


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## horseluvr2524

Joy is so pretty, but what I'm really drooling over... is the grass and the trees in your photos. With the summer heat coming, I miss places that have things that grow that don't hurt when you touch them, and the cooler weather! lol.


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## horseylover1_1

horseluvr2524 said:


> Joy is so pretty, but what I'm really drooling over... is the grass and the trees in your photos. With the summer heat coming, I miss places that have things that grow that don't hurt when you touch them, and the cooler weather! lol.


It's funny you say that because I get so bored with our flat, green landscape. LOL. Would love to be back in Vegas or somewhere in Wyoming or Colorado. It is pretty in its own way but I am definitely a mountain girl.

Today was Derby day! Being from the Louisville area we always make a big deal out of it here. I thought what better way to celebrate than hang out with Joy? She was really good today. Turning into such a sweetheart. 

I've been fine tuning the cues and commands I've been teaching her for showmanship/halter/trail in hand classes. For awhile she didn't want to square up, but I taught her that when she does she gets a treat. I've never seen a young horse square up so quick, lol. She's also starting to get shoulder disengagement down pretty well. Not to the point I think she will be a real contender in the showmanship - there are some horses that are trained to do the pivot perfectly every time - but enough to where I feel confident going in the show ring with her. It'll be fun.

I ordered her a new leather halter and chain lead from Chick's saddlery for $25. Everything else was at least $50 so I am excited. Should be here Monday.

She looks like a boy in the last pic. lol. I swear she's a girl, there was something on the gate.


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## horseylover1_1

Got some pics today! 

I wanted to show her growth since early February. She has gotten somewhat taller but where you can see the biggest difference is her tail (almost down to her pastern!) and her muscle. The image on top is mirrored. 

Ignore my overly cheesy grin and poofy hair.. lol.. it was very humid.


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## GMA100

She sure is a beauty! You are doing a good job getting her to grow nicely! 
Frisians are beautiful creatures, but a Frisian with appaloosa blood is even better! 

I love reading your journal and I thought it might be time to tell you so!


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## horseluvr2524

Joy is turning into a real beauty! You are very blessed to have her.

I really do like the friesian crosses over purebloods. Joy is getting a very 'warhorse' look to her. The app/friesian looks to be an awesome cross.


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## horseylover1_1

@GMA100 Thank you so much! I'm glad that you're reading/enjoying our journal.  
@horseluvr2524 - Thanks! I love the "warhorse" look myself. Maybe when she's older I'll dress up medieval like and do a photo shoot with her. Haha.


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## horseylover1_1

Can someone please tell me what my profile pic is...? Lol.. it says I have changed it in my control panel but I'm seeing my old one on Safari and Chrome (so I don't think it's the cookies).


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## Maistjarna

This is what I see:


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## horseylover1_1

Maistjarna said:


> This is what I see:


Hmm. That's the old one. Wonder why it's not updating.


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## horseylover1_1

Recently I have been just grooming Joy and watching the lesson kids from the makeshift bleachers at the barn. I taught Joy to bow as well. She LOVES it. I only do it occasionally so I won't stress her joint and so she doesn't think she should bow every time she picks up her foot. I need to make a new list of stuff to do with her because we are running out of stuff. She picks up on stuff so fast I may try some liberty stuff with her. 

Update on Patrick: He is about ready to "graduate." It is bittersweet. I will miss working with him but I'm glad he's improved enough that he doesn't need me to work with him twice a week. He still has little stuff I wish I could address but I was hired to mainly get rid of his balking vice which I have done and more. I will still ride him occasionally. I don't think there is a much better feeling than watching a horse improve and trust you more as time goes along. I think that he wasn't treated well in the past. I won't say abused per say. But I really do think this is the first time he's been around people who were mild and "soft" with him. I think he was a barrel racer and the way he acts is that he had a rider who would ONLY hop on, run him around the barrels, and hop off. He has absolutely no idea how to collect himself at the canter (one of the things I wanted to work on), and just relaxing seems so foreign to him. It's like the only gait he knows is fast and stop. Plus I took him around a barrel just to see what he would do and he did it like a natural. Patrick was a rescue so it's hard to say what his past is. 

And that's about it I guess. There is a show this weekend I have to miss because I gotta work. Ugh. Hate responsibilities. :icon_rolleyes:


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## horseylover1_1

It has been raining a lot here. Thankfully it's not like most springs where it rains all day, every day. We get a lot of rain at once and then it seems to lighten up. That's bad though in the sense everything has been flooding. I've been limited on what I can work on with Joy because of it. The arena is wet more often than not. It's currently under roof and they will be adding siding soon so it will stay dry. The rain has been so bad that it blows in sideways from all over. 

I've been doing quite a bit of refinement with Joy. Like any young horse she has a tendency to regress a little if I don't keep on her. She had been fidgeting an awful lot (which is a pet peeve of mine) so we worked on that the last couple days. She is doing a lot better. She ground ties better than ever now. I still wouldn't trust her to stand while I did barn chores or anything but she will stand under supervision. She is like a little toddler. lol.

She had gotten pretty good at yielding her forequarters but regressed on that as well, so have been working on it again. Overall she is incredibly well rounded especially for her age, so I will probably get a new list together for goals we can work on. Probably will try some advanced liberty training.

I finally got her papers sent in to FHH! Her registered name is going to be "Joyous Song." We plan on going to the International Friesian Show in October. If anyone lives near Springfield, Ohio, would love to see you there!


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## horseylover1_1

Only a month left until we show! I am so pumped that you would think that we were going to the Rolex or something, not a small local show. lol. I've been practicing like crazy. I think when I go out today we will mix it up a little though. She gets bored VERY fast. It's good in some ways and not good in others. I think it shows signs of her intelligence, but she also has the "I want to do what I want to do" attitude too. I try to make everything fun for her. Poor girl is starting to realize she has to do stuff she doesn't want to do when she doesn't want to do it.

Pics attached just because :smile:


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## Zexious

She is really lovely!
Can't wait to hear how you do at your show


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## horseylover1_1

@Zexious Thank you! Trust me, I'll be posting all kinds of pics and details from both shows. :lol:


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## AtokaGhosthorse

Subbing as well. What a lovely little lady!


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## horseylover1_1

AtokaGhosthorse said:


> Subbing as well. What a lovely little lady!


Thanks!! Glad to have you read my journal :mrgreen:


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## horseylover1_1

Got some pics of her trotting/ galloping in the field last night with my phone.


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## horseylover1_1

Proud mama moment here. 

I'm really careful to do this only occasionally on soft ground. She loves it, does it without hesitation every time.


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## GMA100

Good job!! I remember how happy I was when Asher finally learned to bow! It lead to him laying down eventually!


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## horseylover1_1

That is so cute @GMA100 ! How did you teach that from the bow? I have been using OreoLiberty's Youtube channel because I like the way she explains everything. But her technique to teach the laying down is totally unrelated from the bowing trick. I see how that could be good, but it takes a lot longer. Any tips are appreciated.


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## GMA100

horseylover1_1 said:


> That is so cute @GMA100 ! How did you teach that from the bow? I have been using OreoLiberty's Youtube channel because I like the way she explains everything. But her technique to teach the laying down is totally unrelated from the bowing trick. I see how that could be good, but it takes a lot longer. Any tips are appreciated.


I just slung the lead rope over his neck ( be careful that you do it from the opposite side of where you are standing at the horses side) and picked a leg up and pulled both the rope and his front leg, I actually got him to lay down on like the 3rd try of getting him to bow, but I decided to do bowing for a while. 



Some side tips: Make sure you pull the part of rope that is connected to the halter and the part that is around the neck, and make sure the neck rope is fairly slack, this evens the pressure out to both the neck and head. 
Don't pull on the lead rope to hard, soft and easy does it. 
Release the pressure whenever the horse gives in a little more than she did before. 
I made sure to do it in a nice and sandy spot on the first few tries. 

Sorry if it is confusing! I am terrible at explaining stuff!


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## horseylover1_1

Thanks for the tips! Eventually I hope she will be able to lay down, bow with only a slight cue, do Spanish walks, piaffes, etc. Fancy stuff. I would like to teach her to "rear" but not actually rear. More like a levade. 

Miss Joy hurt herself today. :-( She got a few scrapes on her legs. It wasn't so bad that we had to call the vet (my stable owner works for a vet so is pretty good at addressing minor stuff)... but Joy was pretty pitiful. She perked up a whole lot when I gave her treats. 

I just ordered a new shirt for the show on July 1st. I have had my eye on it for a few weeks, I'm super excited to get it!


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## horseylover1_1

Yesterday was really awesome. I got to ride one of the stable owner's horses w/ some other people from the barn. It feels so good to ride considering I don't get to that often since I can't ride Joy yet. The horse I got to ride is SUCH a good horse, very push button and always takes care of her rider. Very refreshing from the usual "challenging" or "green" horses I get to ride.

Joy's leg is doing better. It was pretty swollen for a few days but has gone down and it doesn't seem to hurt her anymore. I was babying it at first which is possibly part of the reason it got swollen. Swelling went down after we had her walk around farm some. Today I was able to do some light work with her, but mostly I just groomed her and braided her mane.

I've been putting all sorts of product in her mane. I think it's already starting to get longer, I will definitely be posting before and after pics in a few weeks. I hope her mane is down to her knees someday.


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## horseylover1_1

I have been working wayyyy too much lately. I always say that if you're self employed it's better to be way overworked than underworked, but phew! Could use a day with my phone turned off the entire day (never going to happen)...

Guess who gets to ride in a parade this Saturday? There is a celebration of the city every year and I get to ride in it this year with my barn. I'll be sure to post pics. I absolutely love weekends with something going on. I know a lot of people are content with just having a day off of work, and I get it, but I really like having something to _do_, to look forward to. My husband would be content to stay home and relax every weekend. lol. Not me. Want to camp, hike, swim, horseback ride, travel, kayak, or something fun.

Joy seems to be almost 100% with her leg now. She was bucking and running around today, so I think she is feeling much better which is a relief for me because I was worrying sick over her.


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## horseylover1_1

The parade went well. Almost everyone rode Clydesdales. One of the pics from today


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## horseylover1_1

Joy and I have been practicing a lot for Saturday. I could tell her head wasn't into it at all last night. We have been practicing an awful lot so I fear she is getting a little burnt out, so today and tomorrow will be "fun" days. I'm going to ask the barn owner to turn her out Thursday and Friday so she can run off steam and relax. 

She amazes me all the time. She's so smart, willing, and capable. Sure, she has her ups and downs. She gets moody and doesn't want to do anything. She's actually pretty lazy by nature. But she is such a good horse and I'm so happy I picked her out of all the ones I saw. Can't wait to see where she will be in a few months and in a few years.


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## horseylover1_1

Joy and I reached a milestone today, I think.

She has improved 100 fold on her spookiness. BUT she is still extremely flighty when she is in an area she is not comfortable in. Bushes, trees, and tall grass in particular worry her. (Not that I blame her - that's where a predator would hide). 

Today, in an effort to mix up our routine a bit, I took her on a walk. She kept bolting. Now, I have been working on this for awhile now. I had tried everything from petting her, talking to her, letting her eat, helping her face her fears, desensitize her, etc etc etc. I finally gave her some tough love. She decided it would be an appropriate response to bolt ahead of me again for like the 6th time that day, and I just finally had to take control. I chased her hindquarters and made her back up really quick. After I did that twice, voila... She not only stopped bolting but appeared much calmer and happier afterward. 

At first I felt kinda mean. But it really worked. And most importantly, she did seem a lot more confident and happy. I can't decide if she straightened up because she didn't like the discipline, felt more comfortable because I took control, or both. 

I suppose if someone had a young kid around 3 or so that acted out every time they saw a spider, the parent at some point would have to stop coddling the kid and say "It is NOT going to hurt you, you need to stop acting like that!" That's kind of how I felt today. I didn't PUNISH her for being scared, but I did have to finally correct her reaction to that fear. And give her reason to trust me too, that I won't let anything hurt her and she just needs to trust me because I am in control.

We will probably work on it again tomorrow. She does enjoy the walks away from the barn overall.


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## horseluvr2524

I'm glad you nipped that in the bud and stopped coddling her. I went through the same thing with my mustang mare. Except I didn't get her to stop quickly enough and it turned into a vice. This lead to her dragging me on the lead. She would try to run off anytime she didn't want to do something. This was very dangerous especially away from home. She nearly got out in the busy road a few times. So DON'T feel bad for reprimanding her. You need to be understanding, but also tell her to knock it off when she's doing dangerous behavior. Coddling horses doesn't do them any favors.

I've gotten a lot of flack for this belief of mine. But this has come from years of experience with difficult horses. And as you've discovered, they are so much calmer with someone who will stand up to them. My mare was and is the same way. So much happier and calmer when I took charge.


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## horseluvr2524

Also, yes, part of training horses is to train them to react appropriately to their fear. Bolting is not OK. A tiny jump or shiver and stopping to look is OK. We have to teach them how to respond to their fear in a way that won't put them or us in danger.


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## horseylover1_1

horseluvr2524 said:


> I've gotten a lot of flack for this belief of mine. But this has come from years of experience with difficult horses. And as you've discovered, they are so much calmer with someone who will stand up to them. My mare was and is the same way. So much happier and calmer when I took charge.


Thanks for sharing your experiences.  Yes, some people don't agree with my method of correcting horses or "making them move their feet" when they're fearful. I never do it in a mean way of course, but some feel that if a horse is scared they shouldn't be corrected. But I think there comes a point where you have to say enough is enough, when the horse is being a knucklehead over something stupid there's nothing wrong with commanding their attention back.

We worked on this again today. Every time she bolted I disengaged her hindquarters. I think I had to do that 3 times. But I did see some improvement, she wanted to bolt twice but decided against it. Progress.


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## horseluvr2524

horseylover1_1 said:


> But I did see some improvement, she wanted to bolt twice but decided against it. Progress.


See, she's already learning how to respond to fear appropriately when being handled. This type of training eventually leads to the horse looking to you, its handler/rider, and not to themselves or others for how to respond to a situation. That, I believe, is one of the hallmarks of horsemanship and something the best horse people strive for.

A little sidetrack here: One of the problems with some 'natural horsemanship' teachings is that if you really look at the training, they are not focusing on becoming a trustworthy, unwavering leader for the horse. They are making the horse the leader by constantly allowing it to decide what is dangerous and should be responded to explosively. This puts a lot of stress on the horse, being the leader and having to decide what is safe.

I personally have never met any practical horseperson that uses their horses for things like ranch work and commercial driving, that trained those horses using such methods as Parelli games. :wink:


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## horseylover1_1

@horseluvr2524 I agree. Especially Parelli; I feel like a lot of horses trained with those methods are not prepared to handle the "real world." I think that I was reading some info from that website that said if the horse does xx it's because it doesn't trust you and basically you should whisper to it and all your problems will go away. :icon_rolleyes: I really like reading your insights, I always enjoy your posts!

Tomorrow is SHOW DAY! I am *so* excited! I am praying and praying the rain will hold off. The BO mentioned I may be able to ride one of the horses they are taking to the show. I guess we'll see how it goes. I have not really ridden in well over a year. I mean, sure, I have been training and stuff but have not had the chance to really ride outside of doing the occasional hack. I'm not particularly a fan of hoping on a horse I have never ridden before and then riding in front of a judge with other people. But her horses are so well trained, I think it would be fun.. and I may just do walk/trot. They have an adult class for that. 

Be prepared for pic overload tomorrow everyone.


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## horseylover1_1

Today was so gorgeous! For the most part the rain held off, which I was really worried about. It was beautiful this morning. 

Show went ok; I don't believe she was the judge's cup of tea because she placed last or almost last in every halter class. But that's ok! During the first few classes she was really, really well behaved and I couldn't have been more proud of her than if she did get a blue ribbon. Showmanship wasn't bad. I am kicking myself because the judge said that while Joy did a GREAT job on her pivot, better than most of the other horses, I wasn't aware of him when I should have been. Oops! It was my first showmanship class, so I just took it as a learning experience. We got 4th out of 6 in that one.

She was very ahead of me when we trotted during the trail in hand class. :icon_rolleyes: The results won't be in until 3 PM and we had to leave early. By this time she was getting a bit antsy. 

I guess I'd be lying if I said I wasn't disappointed. But I am just going to take it as a learning experience. After all we had tons of fun, and we learned a LOT, so it was a good day overall. Anyone else got any not-so-great show experiences to share?

Will definitely post pics later


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## horseylover1_1

Update: Apparently she got 2nd out of "several" in the in-hand trail! Go Joy! I will say that other than the fact she was ahead of me she did go through the course like a charm.


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## horseylover1_1

I am a firm believer that one should express their true feelings and experiences in a journal for it to be effective. No matter how embarrassing or humbling they are. (Depending on the purpose of the journal). For me, my journal is to record the ups and down of being a horse lover, owner, and trainer. That being said, I am going to share my not so great experience a couple days ago. 

I went too far.

I did. Before the show, I was trying to clip Joy. Because, you know, sometimes in the AQHA and political show world, it's expected that your horse be groomed up like a perfect Breyer horse to place well. Joy is not known for her courage in the first place, but clippers are a... "problem area" if you will. I bought clippers the day before the show in an effort to clip her before the show the day before. She was not having it. I was super patient with her that night. In fact, I stopped clipping her because I knew she was not ready for them. 

The next day, someone told me that part of the reason Joy didn't place well because she was not clipped well. Too hairy. I need to Vaseline her, clip her all over, put black gloss on her hooves, etc. Their advice was not in bad in itself.

The next day I decided I was going to clip her. Not because I was going to show her again soon, but that she needed to get used to it. I am extremely patient with Joy. I never feel like I snap with her. And to be honest, I didn't really "snap" on Sunday. But there were little voices in my head "You are too soft with her" "You need to just chase her around a little when she acts up with the clippers, she's being a little brat about it". So I did. Even though I knew in my heart that's not what she needed. She got *so* defensive. She struck out at me out of fear because I was pushing her too fast. After a little "argument" I did take her to the pen and make her move her feet for about 10 minutes until she gave me two eyes and joined up. Even though I know I deserved it, I didn't want her to ever think that was acceptable behavior. 

I cried. I took her back in the barn and cried. I felt I defied the trust she had given me. I just petted and loved on her and apologized to her. She doesn't seem to be permanently scarred from the experience, but nonetheless, I feel bad about the whole thing. I am not against getting after a horse sometimes. Even in a harsh way. Heck, I went after Patrick 100x worse than I have ever went after Joy. But I knew he could handle it. He's a tough old gelding with an attitude that can be sour as the day is long. But Joy is different. If Patrick is an old metal whiskey flask, Joy is a piece of delicate china. And the main difference between the two of them is Patrick truly acted out of defiance. Joy was just scared. And I did wrong by her.

I'm glad horses are forgiving, and I have DEFINITELY learned from the experience. Regardless of what someone thinks I "should" do, especially if it goes against my gut, I am going to listen to the horse. They are so clear about what they're feeling. I feel like they are some of the most transparent domesticated animals we have. I don't feel like you should listen to someone else who tells you what they're thinking when you already know.


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## horseluvr2524

Isn't it great that horses are so forgiving? I've been there too. Pushed a horse too far, felt terrible, then had to fix it and unfortunately that often doesn't happen with just love and cuddles. The fact that you recognize the mistake is a good thing though!

Unfortunately the showing world has a lot of ugly facets to it. Personally, I feel that all the clipping and such is a tad ridiculous. Like you said, you should always listen to your gut instead of letting other people pressure you into something you don't want to do or aren't ready for.

Don't beat yourself up. Clippers are a hard thing for a horse to get used to! I have asked a lot of trainers and a lot of experienced horse people how to train a horse to clippers. Typically, what I get is a shrug or the word "twitch". It seems to me that if you don't start getting a horse used to them while they are around 6 months old or less/more, it is an ordeal and takes a lot of patience to get them to accept clippers. My mare would not let me clip her face or bridle path. She did allow me to body clip her though. I never pushed with the clipper thing since I haven't showed and I'm not too keen on trimming off those whiskers, which are what the horse uses to feel around (from what I've been told anyway), since they can't see what they are eating (can't see right in front of/under their nose).


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## horseylover1_1

Yes, they really are amazing. Very forgiving. But at the same time, their forgiveness is not unconditional like a dog's tends to be. 

I've heard that the whiskers are similar to a cat's and they do use them to "feel" around. In which case, I don't know why any showing organization would take away points to someone who chooses not to clip their horse. Even their ear hair has a purpose. But like you said, showing isn't always pretty. Just because something is not condemned - or worse, encouraged in the show ring - does not make it right. I've never really had a problem with clipping only because it doesn't really seem to affect them one way or another. At least I've never noticed a difference.

I saw Joy for a few mins today. She was turned out, and when she saw me she came running towards me. I guess she still loves me. :grin:


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## horseylover1_1

I think I found Joy's passion.. liberty work!

We tried liberty for the first time today. Obviously we've done some "liberty" but this is the first time I've really dedicated a day to do it. I cannot describe how fun it was. This is going to sound super cheesy but it felt like we were absolutely dancing. She took to it so quickly... I was really impressed. I wish I had video. It wasn't just her following me around. She backed up SO well when I simply motioned toward her chest. It's literally the best I have seen her back up. It was dynamic, energetic, and willing. And she really engaged her hind end, like a reining horse. I'm not going to lie and say I wasn't impressed with us both. Lol. We did trotting, stopping, backing, bowing, and this one trick where I would face her and move to the left, than the right, and then the left, and she would follow me with her head/shoulders.

I wish I could say we did all this because of a "magical" bond but honestly, it was lots of praise and treats :lol: Not to mention LOTS of practice over the past few months while using a halter/lead rope.


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## StreetKnots

I have never owned a horse, but I think that it would be amazing. So far what I have heard, they are amazing and magnificent creatures. I can't wait to start.


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## horseylover1_1

StreetKnots said:


> I have never owned a horse, but I think that it would be amazing. So far what I have heard, they are amazing and magnificent creatures. I can't wait to start.


They are definitely amazing!! Are you getting a horse soon?


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## StreetKnots

horseylover1_1 said:


> They are definitely amazing!! Are you getting a horse soon?


I don't think that I will be getting a horse. I know several people that own horses though. I may begin doing some work in exchange for lessons.


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## horseylover1_1

StreetKnots said:


> I don't think that I will be getting a horse. I know several people that own horses though. I may begin doing some work in exchange for lessons.


I would encourage you to at least try lessons! Horseback riding is so much fun. It's a good way to get exercise too.


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## horseylover1_1

Not much to report. We have had an out of town guest for the past few days so I haven't been doing much at the barn. We are all going horseback riding tomorrow which I am excited about. Joy is fine. I swear she looks different everyday. I pulled her out to give her a bath tonight and could not get over how big and "Friesian" she looked.


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## horseluvr2524

horseylover1_1 said:


> I wish I could say we did all this because of a "magical" bond but honestly, it was lots of praise and treats :lol: Not to mention LOTS of practice over the past few months while using a halter/lead rope.


Yup, liberty is definitely not caused by a magical bond lol. Some liberty trainers/show people will certainly have you believe it is though! It's caused by good training, that ends up feeling magical because you and the horse are so in tune. However, I get the same feeling riding a well trained horse where we are so in tune that I don't even feel like I'm giving cues anymore, just think and it happens.

I used to take my radio out, put music on, and dance like a crazy person with Shan. At first she thought I was nuts, then after a few tries she caught on and would run around crazy with me too. I've never taught her to rear on command (safety reasons and all) but I got some perfectly timed moments where she basically reared on a cue. Still one of my best memories. I can still feel the adrenaline, awe, wonder, and elation in that moment, being so in tune with my horse that we both came from opposite ends to the center of the arena at the same time, facing each other, and having the adrenaline and energy coursing enough to cause my mare to rear playfully in that moment.

It looked something a little like this, minus the pretty setting and wardrobe:










^That is my favorite liberty trainer Frederic Pignon. Don't confuse him with Jean-Francois Pignon. The two couldn't be more different. I am sure that JF is abusive, as his horses are always pinning their ears at him in photos and generally just look really unhappy. Not my cup of tea.


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## horseluvr2524

Just curious, what age do you plan on starting to saddle train (I hate saying 'break') Joy? And what age do you plan on really starting to ride her?


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## horseylover1_1

horseluvr2524 said:


> I used to take my radio out, put music on, and dance like a crazy person with Shan. At first she thought I was nuts, then after a few tries she caught on and would run around crazy with me too. I've never taught her to rear on command (safety reasons and all) but I got some perfectly timed moments where she basically reared on a cue. Still one of my best memories. I can still feel the adrenaline, awe, wonder, and elation in that moment, being so in tune with my horse that we both came from opposite ends to the center of the arena at the same time, facing each other, and having the adrenaline and energy coursing enough to cause my mare to rear playfully in that moment.


That is so awesome. It's like you two were dancing together. I think what I really love about liberty is that even with all the treats and cues and training in the world, the horse is never forced to do anything. They're doing it because they want to. I am sure that there are some liberty trainers that are not kind when training, but I think you know what I mean. 

I kind of want to do liberty without any whips - not because I think they are cruel. They're a communication tool of course. But I hate carrying one around. Lol.


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## horseylover1_1

horseluvr2524 said:


> Just curious, what age do you plan on starting to saddle train (I hate saying 'break') Joy? And what age do you plan on really starting to ride her?


You know I have been going back and forth about it. I hear that people start them anywhere from 18 mos. (which seems WAY too young to me) to 4 years old. I have done research on the pros and cons to both. I've heard a lot of breeders/trainers say (and have read scientific articles to support it) that backing them @ 2 is actually beneficial for their bones and muscles. As long as the sessions are kept short and constructive. I've thought about long lining her late this fall and starting to train her with a saddle on her back around 2, and maybe start sitting on her for 5 mins or so. I wouldn't really ride her more than 15-20 mins before she's 3. I really am having a hard time deciding though.


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## mckenzies

I'm late to the liberty training discussion but wanted to add that I've always wanted to try it! So, this blog has inspired me to start today! Thank you!!


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## horseluvr2524

If it were me, I would start getting her used to the tack and equipment at 2, and long lining (driving) her all over the place. I wouldn't set foot on her back until she was 3, and for only 15-20 minute very light walk-trot sessions. Probably taking her on little fun rides around the property. At 4, then I would start her into moderate work, but save high impact (barrel racing, jumping, whatnot) for her 5th year.

But that's me.


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## horseluvr2524

BTW, I would NOT recommend trying liberty without a lunge whip, preferably a long one. Reason being is that it's a good tool to get your horse away from you when they are acting rambunctious. They don't do it because they are out to hurt you, they just want to play (like you are encouraging) and don't understand that the way they play can seriously injure you.

I did a writeup on this a while back. Hope you don't mind me reposting it here. It is very important safety information though, as I personally believe liberty can be a lot more dangerous than people realize if you don't have safety rules and boundaries set.



> I am writing my post as if you actually meant liberty training, not just trick training, as it was not clear to me what you actually want to do.
> 
> I think a large reason why people do not understand how to 'train' liberty style is because there is no set method to it, and also because many liberty trainers turn it into a bunch of mumbo jumbo mysticism. There are usually a few things that are a constant: treats, as Smilie mentioned; positive reinforcement; set rules and boundaries for safety; and body language being your primary cues and communication. Aside from that, liberty is a very 'free' (pun intended) way to train. Everybody has their own way of doing it, and with each handler comes slight variations in how they interact with each different horse.
> 
> When I first learned about it, I watched a lot of liberty performances on youtube, particularly Frederic Pignon. I found his playful style to my liking. I was repeatedly frustrated because I could not find a 'step one, step two, step three' manual for liberty. That's because as I stated before, there is not one. So I figured it out on my own. I went out and made an idiot of myself for a few weeks with my horse playing around in the arena. I ran around like a crazy person, trying to figure out how to dance and play with her. She wasn't a super high energy horse either, but sometimes just by me acting silly she would start acting silly and playful too. Note: this does not mean to go chasing your horse around in the round pen and expect them to play with you or like you. You WILL get yourself hurt as the area is too small and you are not allowing the horse to get away from you when they feel too pressured. It could result in your horse kicking, biting, or unintentionally hurting you. I did my training in a small arena where my horse could easily get away from me when she felt too pressured. This made it a more frustrating process at first but more rewarding in the long run.
> 
> All that time I spent acting silly with my horse allowed me to learn and better understand how to use my body language to communicate. Your horse may not understand at first you wanting to engage in horseplay, so be patient and don't force it.
> 
> Here are some things I learned in my own experience:
> 
> *Despite what some 'liberty' people may say, halters, ropes, and whips are not evil. They are tools of communication and can help your horse better understand you and make the training process faster. I used halters and ropes more often for trick training, not for play so much.
> 
> *Use simple logic. Don't expect your horse to have high amounts of energy, exuberance, playfulness, or athleticism if they are out of shape or not fed up right. Your horse may need a small amount of energy feed to give a spark of exuberance to him, or he may just need to get in shape.
> 
> *Treats are good, but don't overdo them and don't allow your horse to get too pushy with them.
> 
> 
> *Set boundaries and rules. (the following has many points to it)
> 
> ~ALWAYS keep a whip in hand. Realize that you are engaging in horseplay, which comes with its own set of risks beyond that of regular horsemanship. You may need that whip to get your horse away from you if he decides to test your boundaries or gets too close and too rough while playing.
> 
> ~Keep a space bubble around you. You can enter the horse's space, but he CANNOT enter yours. If he does, wallop him! If you're going to engage in herd behavior, you need to reprimand your horse the way a boss mare would. It is important that your boundaries are clear and consistent, so as to avoid accidents when playing.
> 
> ~ALWAYS keep the horse between you and the fence. You want to be to the inside of the arena and be able to get away if needed. If you are between the horse and fence, you are setting yourself up to get hurt and have no escape route. You always want to be in a position where you can move away from the horse quickly and easily if needed.
> 
> ~Pay attention and read your horse. If they are getting too pushy, irritated, in your space, excited, or any of the following, for your own safety send them away from you!
> 
> ~Personally, if my horse is 'free leading' or following me around at liberty as she would on a halter and lead, I do not allow her to run past me. If she chooses to run off and leave me, I send the whip after her (just swing the lash one time as she leaves, not actually chase her with the whip) as if I had sent her away. This would be negative reinforcement. I use it here simply because I do not want her to continue this behavior. If we are free leading, I expect her to stay at my side until I send her away. This method did work for me.
> 
> The main reason I enforced the last one was because I saw the following video. Hempfling did a video on this, saying the horse did not like what she was doing. I disagree. I think that the horse was simply being playful, engaging in horseplay. His kick was playful, he was treating her as he would one of his pasture mates if they were running together. She was between the horse and the fence. She allowed the horse to run past her. There appeared to be no boundaries set for ground manners or respect of her space. All of this culminated into an unfortunate accident. So boundaries and rules must be clear and consistent-this is extremely important!
> 
> https://youtu.be/9bkA307zEv8
> 
> As for trick training, use common sense as to which tricks are appropriate. Rearing-probably not appropriate for the average mount. Bow is fine, but I chose to use Stacy Westfall's method of using a rope instead of trying to do it without one. I tried without one at first and had a very upset farrier when my horse would try to bow as he worked on her.
> 
> Have fun, be safe and smart, and use common sense!


http://www.horseforum.com/natural-horsemanship/liberty-unmotivated-horse-704833/page2/


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## horseylover1_1

@mckenzies - Awesome! Be sure to let me know how it goes. And take video if you can. :smile: 
@horseluvr2524 - Thank you so much for including that article! Maybe I'll get myself a light whip. The one I used was heavy and bulky. I had a good whip but like some other stuff at the barn it walked off... I like using visible whips too so the horse can see it clearly (vs a black one) I agree that liberty can be dangerous. Joy tried to reach out to take a treat when we were trotting once and I had to slap her mouth pretty hard because she was being extremely rude. They also like to kick out, rear, etc. Which as you mentioned is not wrong itself - they're just playing with you. But they have to learn boundaries.


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## horseylover1_1

Joy has developed the teenager syndrome (I hope that is normal with yearlings). She's not particularly disrespectful but she has had this "I want to do what I want to do when I want to do it" mentality. I think it's part of her growing up and testing her boundaries. She was turned out with the weanlings the past couple days and was bullying them pretty bad. Which I know is normal in herd dynamics, so I'm not saying it's a bad thing. She is just trying to find her place so to speak. So I did some round pen work with her for a few minutes and saw an improvement in just 5 mins after doing that. 

I am very mindful to keep these sessions constructive and as short as possible. I think too many people see horsemen doing round pen work and think it's some magical fix-all and get frustrated when their horse doesn't improve much. You have to know when and how to apply and release pressure. Otherwise all you're really doing is exercising (lunging) your horse. Or worse, confusing them with mixed signals!


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## horseylover1_1

Joy and I went on a walk today. She only "bolted" once and it was pretty mild compared to how she did act, so I am very pleased! Overall she did totally awesome!

I think she's a dark bay instead of black like I was hoping she would be. It's so hard to tell when they're babies and have their winter coats on. I asked my stable owner her opinion and she agreed that she looks dark bay, not sun bleached black. What do you all think?


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## LoriF

Personally, she looks black to me. Have her tested if you really want to know for sure. 

I finally got around to having my mare tested. I mostly wanted to know if she carried red but I went ahead and had her tested for agouti as well. She's black. She looks black in the winter and she looks bay in the summer.















Sometimes they can get so sun bleached that it makes you wonder. The bottom line is that it really doesn't matter unless you are going to breed her and want to know about specific colors. Either way she is going to fade in the summer and not look black unless you keep her indoors during the day.


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## horseluvr2524

You could always try one of those coat enhancing supplements too. I read great things in @Tihannah 's journal about the one Smartpak makes for black horses.


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## horseylover1_1

Thanks @LoriF , I would have guessed bay by that second pic alone. Your horse is gorgeous by the way! 

Joy and I did some liberty today, again. She is getting really good at it. She will pivot at liberty which I think is pretty cool. She lacked energy today but it was awfully hot and humid so I didn't really mind. 

Exciting news! I am starting lessons again starting this Thursday! I desperately need them and the BO gives her boarders a deal that is way too good to pass up. So I decided it was time. I miss showing and I want to be a better rider. I think the last time I took lessons I was 15.. but I've had maybe a dozen lessons since I started riding about 10 years ago. And my parents always did lessons every other week. I never got to progress. But now I will be able to since I can have them weekly.


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## horseylover1_1

Here is a video from my lesson  It is my first one in I think 6 years or something and the first time I've ridden (other than a trail ride) in 2 years. Lots to work on! Especially at the canter. I was all over the place. I hope that we can do a lunge line lesson next week so I can work on my seat instead of trying to keep the horse in the canter and guide them.

I'm on the wrong diagonal in the video and would like my leg underneath me more so it's not so chair seat-ish. Other than squats, are there are any exercises I can do at home to build leg strength? 

Joy is good.  I've been putting tons of product in her hair still to get it to grow long. It's hard to tell how much her hair is growing because her whole body is growing too. But I can tell her mane is definitely growing out.


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## horseylover1_1

Joy is coming along well with the clippers. 

As with most things that freak her out, I have been desensitizing with treats. I'm sure some people wouldn't agree with training that way but it works for her so I guess I'll keep utilizing them. She is almost to the point now that she will let me clip her nose and cheek area without a treat or reassurance all of the time. Her ears.. different story. But she's coming along slowly but surely. 

One thing that works well with her is turning on the clippers AFTER I put them on her face, instead of turning them on and then approaching her with them. 

All around she is doing VERY well. If she was old enough, I would definitely feel confident training her under saddle. She went from a skittish, un-trusting, hyperactive baby to a confident, happy, and "solid" yearling. She still has her moments as all young horses do. But the difference between now and when I got her is almost unbelievable. And it's not because I have exposed and desensitized her to everything. It's because when she starts to feel unsure, she looks to me as her leader and her protector. She looks to me for the answers. It's an awesome feeling.

Pic from tonight :grin:


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## seabiscuit91

She's so cute, I can't wait until she's old enough for you to start her training under saddle!

Will you be training her on your own? I would love to do that one day, when I have more experience with babies anyway!


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## horseylover1_1

seabiscuit91 said:


> She's so cute, I can't wait until she's old enough for you to start her training under saddle!
> 
> Will you be training her on your own? I would love to do that one day, when I have more experience with babies anyway!


Thanks so much! I can't wait either! I want to fast forward a couple years. :lol: 

Yes I do plan on starting her on my own. I am slowly working up to (hopefully) training horses for a living. My barn owner trains horses for a living and she's invited me to work with and watch her train. So I've been doing that and taking lessons. I'm trying to be like a sponge and just soak up as much information as I can. :smile:


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## horseylover1_1

I got to "pony" Joy for the first time today! She did really good. Other than getting a bit prancy while we were out she did amazing. The mare I rode (her name is Krista) is a solid older mare and she was a good role model/leader for Joy. 

Here's a pic from today. This was when she was getting a bit.. excited. lol.


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## PoptartShop

She is such a cutie. Awwwww!!!! Love it! I'm glad she did well!


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## horseylover1_1

Thanks @PoptartShop !


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## horseylover1_1

I lunged Joy the last couple times I went out there. At first she just stood facing me and not wanting to lunge, but eventually I encouraged her to walk/trot/canter. It's not something we work on a whole lot because I am a firm believer in letting babies be babies for the most part and making the work fun, but at the same time since I am showing her as a yearling and want her to be kinda.. mature for her age I do like doing some structured work occasionally. 

My second lesson on Thursday went well. I had been struggling with the canter and finally "got it" yesterday. I rode bareback for many many years and I picked up some bad habits from it. The hardest part is that I get so exhausted about half way into the lesson. I really like my instructor/BO though. She is the perfect combination of letting her students relax when needed, push when needed, pushing them out of their comfort zones, and making riding fun.


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## horseylover1_1

Joy is good. I think she is going through a growth spurt because she is more butt high than I've ever seen her. But her topline is looking a lot better. I cannot believe it is almost autumn though. That means my baby is a year and a half. Craziness. I've not really been doing a whole lot with her lately other than loving on her. She's just being a horse for now. 

We put an offer on a house with a little bit of land (3.5 acres) and the guy accepted. Yay! It's not ready for horses yet but we got it for a great price so we will make do. If all goes OK our hope is to have Joy home by early November!

Also, my barn owner has been letting me work with a couple of green horses. :grin: It's really awesome to get hands on experience. One horse isn't so much green as she has bad habits and needs a lot of tuning up. The other is VERY green, only had a rider sit on her once before. (Though she is trained to pull a cart, so she isn't totally unhandled). I cannot believe how much my anxiety has gone down since I've started working with the other horses/riding. The more I do it, the more I love it. Hopefully it can be a career someday.

Speaking of, my last name is Knipp and I was thinking about naming my horse training business "Knipp it in the Bud Horsemanship" or "Kentuckiana Natural Horsemanship" - any suggestions would be appreciated though!


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## whisperbaby22

Congratulations on the property. There's nothing like having them in the back yard.


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## seabiscuit91

Congrats on the house!!
Soo jealous, I hope to be in your position in a couple years and have a piece of land for myself!

I totally can relate about the anxiety as well. Since getting proper horse/riding time basically everyday for the last 6 months it has improved so much for me as well, and on days where it's there I know it can all disappear for a bit while I go do jobs at the stables and get my mind somewhere else. 

PS - Knipp it in the bud!


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you @seabiscuit91 and @whisperbaby22 ! I am really excited to get into our new house and out of the temp rental. It's not a bad house at all. It's actually pretty cute. But I hate staying in something that isn't "home" unless it's a 5 star hotel. lol.

Joy has been such a star! She is really starting to mature. I took her on a walk the other day and she was more collected and calm than she ever has been, even when some cars passed us. She perked her ears forward once but didn't bolt. SO proud of her. She is also pretty into the liberty now. Since she's mellowed out it's been a little harder to get her to trot when I want her to when I'm leading, but nothing terrible. With enough pre-signal she is fine. Also pivots like a dream, with or without pressure on her halter. There is really nothing left new I can think of to do with her. I guess I could build an obstacle course with pool noodles and stuff but I am pretty lazy and I don't see my BO wanting me to clutter the arena with a bunch of stuff and I don't have anywhere to store it. 

The other horses I've been working with are doing well. My anxiety has been waning every day, all from riding/working with these other horses. Cinder and Pearl are their names. Cinder is a Saddlebred while Pearl is 75% Friesian. They're almost polar opposites as far as personalities goes which is interesting. I sat on Pearl for what I think was her first time ever being sat on without someone on the ground holding her. She did great. I laughed from relief when she didn't throw me off. :lol:


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## horseluvr2524

Good for you! I've been at a lot of boarding stables, and while I've had training clients before, I was never able to pick up clients from my stable. Little jealous of you there!

Maybe it's because they saw my bull of a mare try to (sometimes successfully) drag me off on the lead more than once :evil:
If you encounter a horse with this HORRIBLE vice, do a stud chain over the nose, lead them by a bit, or get a dually halter. Rope halters do not work. Dually halters are softer than the other two options and work most of the time. Once a horse learns they can run away to get out of something, it is hard to break. My mare doesn't do it most of the time, but it is ingrained in there, so occasionally when she doesn't want to do something, she tries to run off. Brat!


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## whisperbaby22

Maybe some light weight poles? They are easy to make different patterns, and maybe you can find a discreet place to store them.


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## horseylover1_1

horseluvr2524 Thank you! Though I have to admit they aren't clients per say. LOL. It's a sort of trade agreement I worked out with the BO. She lets me work with those two horses for experience and gives me pointers here and there. The horses get worked with more and I get to build my resume. What I really like about her is while she gives pointers and advice, I don't feel like I am constantly being watched. There are some things she just lets me figure out through experience whether it be a riding lesson or a ground lesson. I really cannot sing her praises enough. I wish I had found her years ago when I wanted to give up riding because I hadn't found the right teacher. Far as the horse pulling you.. gosh that is awful. I hope I don't encounter it. Patrick did that a couple times but I put a bit in his mouth so he did stop before the habit was ingrained. 

@whisperbaby22 That is a good idea. Some people are against PVC pipe but I have never had an issue with using it. I could set up keyholes etc. 

Oh, today my husband went out with me to see Joy. Joy and I did liberty. Oh my gosh she was amazing! By the way @horseluvr2524 I am glad I took your advice on using a crop doing liberty. She is progressing much more now. We have pretty much reached the point I don't need it to guide her but it's invaluable when she veers off course a bit. She also ground ties really well. Does anyone have anymore liberty trick suggestions? So far she will pivot at liberty, back up, trot and stop on command, follow me in circles, and bow. I've seen people train their horses to go around them in circles as if they're lunging them. Any other suggestions? I know it sounds silly but I'd love to get to point we are like...


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## horseylover1_1

P.S. I am going to try getting a video of me doing liberty with her. I wish I had asked my husband to do it today.


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## horseluvr2524

Hmm... trick suggestions... just don't teach her to rear. 

Sylvia is OK as far as liberty trainers go (I find her kind of odd honestly). Jean-Francois Pignon is a NIGHTMARE and his horses hate him, it is very obvious to me. Frederic Pignon however... my God, him and Magali are superstars! Original stars of Cavalia too.
I have never seen any other big name liberty trainer achieve this level of liberty while their horses retained such happy and peaceful expressions. Is there a very fit horse and plenty of 'hot' feeds involved in an excellent liberty performance... yes I believe so! I don't think your liberty show horses make good average every day riding/pleasure horses. I could be wrong, but... the only one I would believe has such horses are Frederic and Magali, but I still think their favorites would be a handful for most people!











Could not find any videos of the horse that made him famous, Templado.

Yeah, great horsemanship by Jean-Francois Pignon below (easy to mix the two up name wise, but they are worlds apart in horsemanship).






BTW, if you wanted to seriously pursue liberty, I would actually recommend looking into things like vaulting. Frederic has quite the background in vaulting. I personally would not go to any 'trainer' to learn how to do liberty (except Frederic. LOL. but let's be real). Liberty is a journey-it's not something that can be taught. You can and should learn from many different sources, and not follow any set program or take anyone's word as gospel (even mine lol!).

Glad you kept the crop. Safety first! Make sure you establish boundaries so you don't end up in the same situation as silly old showboat JF Pignon up there.


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## horseylover1_1

Thanks for the videos horseluvr! I enjoyed watching them. I like doing liberty because I feel like it's something you never really stop learning. Sky's the limit. And since I can't ride her it gives us lots of constructive bonding time. I know she enjoys it. She's more charismatic without the lead rope and halter than with it on! And you're so right about it being a journey. The beautiful thing about liberty is (other than safety) there is no right or wrong. It's a dance between you and your horse, and nobody's else's. One liberty video that inspired me was Shana from Clinton's ranch (I know his methods are controversial but you can't not love these two) 




Maybe I will try the Spanish Walk with her next.. and yeah no rearing.. ever. I am not 100% against teaching a horse to rear but my horsemanship is not at that level yet to do it safely!


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## horseluvr2524

I have read/spoken to trick trainers before. The one thing you don't want to do, especially with a horse that has a vice, is to reinforce that vice with a trick that uses it. You don't teach a rearer to rear on command. Don't teach a pawer the Spanish Walk or shake.

I have read that some trick trainers emphasize teaching a horse NOT to offer a trick until asked for. While that is great and all, there is no trained behavior/training that can be relied on 100% of the time, as horses are animals with free will and their own minds.

So the point is that horses often enjoy offering a trick in hopes of reward (whether that reward is food, praise, pets, etc. is of little consequence). You don't want a horse 'offering' you to rear. Take it from someone who has been accidentally kicked/kneed in a not so great place when her horse 'offered' the spanish walk! (me and Shan).

Trust me, I was tempted in the past to teach a rear. But it really is not only dangerous, but impractical. If you think about it, these people we see in demonstrations/shows who do train the rear on command, their horses are not being handled by outsiders, and likely not even friends. They are horses with a specific job for a specific purpose, that would likely not be useful to anyone outside that realm. It's a lot less dangerous when only you and a trusted few are handling a horse with specific triggers (your cues to trick training). No accidental injuries. Rearing is no joke, not to be played around with. I've known many pro riders who will get on any horse with any vice, with the exclusion of a rearer.

I will reiterate: IMO, the more dangerous tricks should be left to the people whose lives and horses are all about the show business. In their case, it's a risk worth taking. In your everyday owner's case though, it's a fun trick with far too much of a chance of ending fatally. If you are wanting to make the 'horse theater/performance/show' thing your career, the dangerous tricks can be looked at down the line.

Not meaning to lecture. Just too many people get the idea in their heads that their horse rearing on command like at the theater or movies would be fun and cool. And it's not, it is impractical and dangerous.

I would be OK with teaching a miniature horse to rear though, LOL!


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## horseylover1_1

I've considered possibly teaching the levade. But again like you said, unless you plan on being in that type of show biz there's really no reason to teach your horse a potentially dangerous habit. This is an extreme example but people wouldn't go to a circus with trick lions or whatever and think... wow those people can work with those wild animals, so I should be able to, too! Just because you see it being done in a "circus" setting doesn't mean you should try it at home. So Joy and I will not be doing any rearing anytime soon. She reared a couple times when I first got her and she was disciplined for it, so rearing doesn't cross her mind. I'd like to keep it that way. lol. There are too many safe tricks we can do, then risk our (and others) safety for one trick. 

I got a video of her doing the pivot at liberty. I know it's not a huge thing but I am so excited and proud of her!! Ignore my annoying voice ...


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## horseluvr2524

Nice! Small victories, right?


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## KigerQueen

here is my take on that. odie is trained to bow and lay down on command for a treat or because we told him to. i see it like riding. if a horse likes to run do you not teach him to faster than a walk for fear of takeing off? if a horse tries to go faster or take off dont they get a negative consequence. i would wait untill you know she wont be bratty with other commands before ruling out things like rearing. if odie layed down while riding or begging for a treat he would get in a HEAP of trouble (he tried that once a year ago. i acted like the wrath of god was upon him. he dose it when asked but NEVER before now). just food for though.


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## horseylover1_1

Those are some good points. @KigerQueen Joy doesn't usually do things without being asked but sometimes she will do things because she _thinks _ I'm asking her to do it. Which we are working on. As an example she tried to bow a couple of times when I picked up her feet because she thought I was asking her to. Now she knows the cue to bow is me tapping her chest/top of her leg, but for awhile she was unsure. I feel like rearing is a bit different though because one wrong mistake can cause injury or death. I am not concerned with her rearing while I am teaching her to ride, rather I fear that she may rear mistakenly or I might get too close to her and she may come down on me. There are also kids around that may accidentally give her the cue. I'm not against experience horse people teaching the rear per say, I just don't feel confident enough myself to teach it safely.

I get to ride in another parade tomorrow! 

I took pics of her today. Usually she is so sweet and obedient and willing. But today she was just...


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## horseluvr2524

Great faces she has! lol. "Mom, NOT in the mood today. Just NO." 

All I can say for the rear and similar tricks... use common sense. Just because some people do it doesn't mean it should be done. I am fine with horses spontaneously rearing playfully when we play at liberty, I love when that happens. But teaching it to the horse as a behavior that you ask for, not smart IMO.

Just like with parrots. Some people teach their parrots to fly to them on cue, then take them out into public places like parks and forests and let them fly. It's a romantic and lovely idea, but many owners have lost their parrots to fly aways, or hawks, or other terrible accidents. Just because some people do it, doesn't mean it should be done. In the case of parrots, I am a great believer in providing a large enclosed area for them to fly, if your house isn't enough. This may not be done cheaply, but it can be done rather easily in your own backyard. No need to literally risk your parrots life and limb to make you feel better about keeping a wild thing captive.

Some people skydive. To me, not worth the risk of my parachute malfunctioning. NOPE. not for me. As I always say, I'd rather climb on thousand pound unpredictable reactive animals.


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## horseylover1_1

Parade went well! We briefly talked about taking Joy and leading her behind the wagon (which they always take to clean up manure behind the horses) but we decided it may be too much for her. I think she would have been OK if I was with her but I would have been riding another horse so we decided against it. And neither one of us trust her enough to pony her in a parade. Someday for sure though! 

Her top line is starting to look better, for awhile it was very funky looking but she is filling out well now. She has an odd look to her now in that she looks like a horse but at the same time she still looks like a baby. 

We aren't able to attend the World Friesian Show in October like planned.  But I think we are going to do another show in September, and I may be able to ride in that one. I would love to ride one of the horses I am working with. Especially the one I'm starting. We trotted under saddle for the first time the other day and she did great! She has a really good mind on her. Not once has she bucked or anything. A couple times I felt her tense up under me because she was unsure, but I just talked to her and walked on and she did well. I am so happy I am getting this experience because it'll make training Joy that much easier.


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## Rainaisabelle

Out of curiosity do you have any specific inspirations for starting liberty?


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## horseylover1_1

Rainaisabelle said:


> Out of curiosity do you have any specific inspirations for starting liberty?


I can't ride my horse and we ran out of other stuff to do. Lol


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## Rainaisabelle

horseylover1_1 said:


> Rainaisabelle said:
> 
> 
> 
> Out of curiosity do you have any specific inspirations for starting liberty?
> 
> 
> 
> I can't ride my horse and we ran out of other stuff to do. Lol
Click to expand...

Haha I meant like people  I'd like to do t with my TB but I have no idea where to start


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## horseylover1_1

Rainaisabelle said:


> Haha I meant like people  I'd like to do t with my TB but I have no idea where to start


Ah, okay. This might sound silly but my first inspiration (though definitely not the first I had seen liberty) was when I was watching Heartland... lol. The video I linked with Marty and the CA trainer was one inspiration. Though the level of liberty they are at is nowhere near where I am. If you're wanting to start liberty I would recommend OreoLiberty training videos on Youtube


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## horseylover1_1

So this happened today :grin::grin::grin::grin::grin::grin:


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## BlindHorseEnthusiast4582

That's you right? Sorry if I'm out of the loop lol. If so congrats!


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## horseylover1_1

BlindHorseEnthusiast4582 said:


> That's you right? Sorry if I'm out of the loop lol. If so congrats!


Haha, yes it is! I tend to forget that my name isn't displayed on here. Lol. Thanks so much!


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## horseylover1_1

Joy was very good today. We went on a walk and she got to visit with a couple little girls across the street. I am so pleased that Joy has turned out to be good w/ kids. Of course I'm always careful with her when they're around and give them basic safety tips (don't go behind her) but she just has a certain gentleness to her. Horses like that are worth their weight in gold. She is definitely a keeper.


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## GMA100

Congrats! That is amazing! So...when do you start training?
It's good that Joy is good with kids! She certainly is worth her weight in gold!


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## horseluvr2524

AWESOME! Good for you! I'm a little jealous, but we all have different paths  Keep up the good work.


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## horseylover1_1

@GMA100 Thank you! I have kind of already started. The two horses I have been working with (Pearl and Cinder) were the first horses I started with. It's going to be super part time for awhile until more horses come in for training. Two just went home from training. But there's babies to work until more clients come in. 

@horseluvr2524 Thanks so much!! I would have never believed two or three years ago I would have had this opportunity, so you never know what's around the corner! I don't think I'll ever get rich off training horses unless I try going about it like Parelli and Clinton do it. But that's ok. I'm not doing it for the money. I'd just buy more horses to play with if I had more money anyway. :lol:


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## horseylover1_1

Today was good. I got to visit and work with Joy for awhile. I'll have to post video of our tarp training and how well she has come along. I can tell it mildly irritates her still but the improvement is significant. Lunged her over a tarp (which bored her) and did some bowing training (which also bored her). She gets bored so easily. Which is, of course, good and bad. Good because that shows how smart she is, bad because I have to figure out a new exercise to do with her constantly. I guess I will buckle down and do the more advanced liberty w/ her. I'm also going to maybe set up a mini obstacle course with balloons, pool noodles, etc. That would be good for her and the other horses at the barn. 

My first official (kinda) trainee horse is making progress, too. He is 4 years old and half Clydesdale/Friesian. I've been working on getting him more forward under saddle. Thankfully the BO has already put 60 days on him, so I am doing easy tune ups. He's such a good boy. And fun fact... he's Joy's brother!


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## horseylover1_1

Joy and I are working on our latest trick... laying down. Most people I know teach their horses to lay down through the bow but I am doing a totally separate cue for it. No particular reason for it other than something new to try. 

I think the Sept 24th show is officially ago. Having a hard time deciding on what horse to ride in it, if any. There are about 10 to choose from, but for one reason or another I don't want to ride a certain one. Lol. Of course Joy and I will do the in-hand classes (there are 3; 4 if I do for open halter championship. Which I highly doubt I would enter). No yearling or "other breed" halter classes, which is unfortunate, she just cannot compete with those full grown, muscled up halter horses. Oh well. We have fun with it.


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## horseylover1_1

I have been doing mostly tune up work with Joy lately. You know you need to when the stable owner jokes with you and says your horse is getting an attitude. Joy is not one to directly disobey, but she will do it very grudgingly with a "look." Even one of the little girls that boards there said "Joy always has an annoyed look on her face."  This horse has a great life guys. We do so much fun stuff and different variety of things. Lunging, doing obstacles in hand, liberty, grooming, baths, going for walks.. like she has it made. I don't know why she is so sour. We do not fun work too.. nitty gritty stuff... ugh... I hope it's a young horse stage. She would just rather be out with her friends.

In other news, Tiernan is doing really well. Makes a lot of progress every time I ride him. I sure am going to miss him when he goes back him. He's a special guy.

Pic of the "look" and Tiernan


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## whisperbaby22

I would be concerned if she didn't have a bit of an attitude. She's a growing girl, and a horse that shows a bit of attitude is better than one that is so cornered that they keep it bottled up until they blow.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> I would be concerned if she didn't have a bit of an attitude. She's a growing girl, and a horse that shows a bit of attitude is better than one that is so cornered that they keep it bottled up until they blow.


Thank you for mentioning that. I always find your comments encouraging. :smile: I do have to admit, despite her attitude sometimes, she really does have a lot of try in her. There isn't anything she won't do for me.


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## KigerQueen

my mare lives in a constant state of exasperation with me lol! dont feel too bad about the tude XD! My little arab dose everything i ask her but i do get looks for some of it.


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## horseylover1_1

Oh she is so cute @KigerQueen! Gotta love the mare stare, :lol: 

LOL so Joy's new thing she likes to do is paw her feet when I walk away from her. She doesn't do it when I am near. And she doesn't do it when I leave the barn. She literally only does it when she knows I can see/hear her do it but I'm too far away to discipline. She looks RIGHT at me when she does it too. Lord have mercy. She is such a sassy little brat. I love her.


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## horseylover1_1

OK. I want opinions and advice. I have an absolutely fabulous teacher who has taught me more in the 8 lessons I've had than all the other lessons I have had combined. But I always like to get multiple suggestions. I uploaded a video of me cantering one of the Friesians at the farm.

So here is my issue. At the canter, I just feel... scared. Nervous. Like I'm going to lose control of the horse. Some horses I am more confident cantering than others. I know one thing I need to desperately work on is leaning back, keeping my shoulders back, and bringing my elbows back. The advice I have read so far is usually the same. Go with the feel of the canter, not against it, eventually it will just "click". My issue is that when I'm cantering I want to slouch. I don't know if it's fear, lack of muscles, a bad habit, or a combination of these things. I do a lot better when I am confident the horse will stay in the canter. A lot of the horses I have been riding have to really be encouraged to keep cantering.

I'm probably way over thinking this... I attached a video that I hope may help.

Show is tomorrow! Cannot wait to let everyone know how it goes! Joy is in 3 classes and I am showing Tiernan in 3 classes. I am supposed to ride Ryker as well. (The Friesian in the video)


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## Rainaisabelle

horseylover1_1 said:


> OK. I want opinions and advice. I have an absolutely fabulous teacher who has taught me more in the 8 lessons I've had than all the other lessons I have had combined. But I always like to get multiple suggestions. I uploaded a video of me cantering one of the Friesians at the farm.
> 
> So here is my issue. At the canter, I just feel... scared. Nervous. Like I'm going to lose control of the horse. Some horses I am more confident cantering than others. I know one thing I need to desperately work on is leaning back, keeping my shoulders back, and bringing my elbows back. The advice I have read so far is usually the same. Go with the feel of the canter, not against it, eventually it will just "click". My issue is that when I'm cantering I want to slouch. I don't know if it's fear, lack of muscles, a bad habit, or a combination of these things. I do a lot better when I am confident the horse will stay in the canter. A lot of the horses I have been riding have to really be encouraged to keep cantering.
> 
> I'm probably way over thinking this... I attached a video that I hope may help.
> 
> Show is tomorrow! Cannot wait to let everyone know how it goes! Joy is in 3 classes and I am showing Tiernan in 3 classes. I am supposed to ride Ryker as well. (The Friesian in the video)


I used to have that feeling to be honest, I was so scared to canter. My suggestion would be to canter horses you really trust until you get the hang of it and feel more confident. You could also ask your trainer to put you on the lunge line and work on your seat so you don't have to worry about controlling the horse.


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## whisperbaby22

I see two problems here, you and the horse. You are not in tune with this horse. I am not a trained rider, and you must take my opinions with a grain of salt and discuss this with others. Drop you stirrups. Start at the walk and progress to the canter. Your short stirrups may be interfering with your ability to sit this canter.

The other problem is the horse. I like all horses, and they are pretty, but they are hard to ride. For a while everybody around here was riding Andalusians, but they are sensitive horses that need an experienced rider. So a lot of the charros switched to Friesians. They were everywhere, and I got a good look at them. They are bouncy, heavy on the forehand horses. Now most of the guys ride Aztecas. 

This horse is trying hard to stay under you, but is just not built to canter in a small circle. Trying to sit the trot without stirrups may be impossible, so try to go from walk to canter. The upside of this is that if you can learn on this horse, every other horse you ride will be easy.


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## seabiscuit91

I'm in no way a trainer, but just a couple tips I have received that really helped me, because cantering is hard, lets be honest!

Since he does seem to be rushing a bit, and from what I can see possibly leaning on you and on the forehand I would suggest loosening the reins, he may get quick, but after a couple strides with his head he should settle really nicely and float, also like you say, pin your shoulders, sit up straight and really squeeze and use your seat as much as you can to drive him from behind and collect him up, then his head set should fall into place. 
Worth trying a few different things, see what works for you. 
I honestly find it far easier when I'm working on things to just do lines up the arena instead of a circle, just so I'm not worried about turning or anything else. So you could always just canter the long side, come back to trot and try different things there as well!


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## horseylover1_1

*First blue ribbon!*

Thank you for the tips everyone. He is not my normal riding horse (I don't really have one). There is another Friesian I ride that I have the same issue with. Leans heavily on the forehand. And I don't really blame the horse, ever. Yes some horses are easier to ride than others but I always try to figure out what I can do better. I ride a new horse just about every week. LOL. Which is good and bad. 

So now for the awesome news! I won my very first blue ribbons yesterday! On Ryker and Tiernan!! My walk/trot ride on Ryker was my first-first blue ribbon and then I won the walk-trot green horse on Tiernan. There were about 6 entries in both classes. This was so, so huge for me. Of all the shows I have gone to before this (3 I think) I didn't place well. I did get 2nd out of 7 on a horse I had trained awhile back which was pretty cool but it's different than a blue ribbon. Of all the times I felt like a failure, all the times I felt like I should give up on riding because my confidence was so bad, this has really done something for me. Given me encouragement to keep going. 

I think I am going to frame it since it was my first. :grin: We gave Tiernan's ribbon to his owner since we are his trainers.


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## whisperbaby22

That's great. Be sure to catalog all these wins, it will help you in your career as a trainer. Start a scrapbook.


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## seabiscuit91

Congratulations!   
That is SO awesome, my goal for one day as well!


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you both so much! I am still excited about it a week later. Took me years to achieve and I'm going to enjoy it long as possible. :grin: I had someone contact me on FB not too long ago about a horse she would like me to train. VERY nice horse. I would LOVE to have the opportunity to work with her. 

So Joy and I did something new the other day! I will start off by saying that some people may not agree with this... but I like sharing our journey, and everyone has been extremely upbuilding and helpful even on points they may or may not agree with.

We did some jumping! In hand, of course. The BO had gotten some new jumps and we played around with them. This is the first time I have ever jumped her and we only did a few of them. She LOVES to jump. I am so excited. My husband was watching us and he said that he could tell that Joy was having fun. I haven't seen her so motivated in a long time. I barely had to encourage her over them. I was lunging her and she went toward the jumps with no encouragement needed. I don't plan on doing this much. It was a one time thing. I generally don't agree with doing any substantial jumping with anything younger than 5. 

Anyway, anything new I can do with her I usually do. I may do some ponying with her once the crops around the farm are harvested. We can't really trail ride now because of the soy beans growing everywhere.


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## horseylover1_1

Well, Joy definitely likes to jump. The BO said she saw her jump over the fencing today. It wasn't very tall fencing and it's not permanent. It also had come loose (electric wire) and had to be tightened. She never goes far, so it wasn't a problem that she jumped over it. She actually just ended up in another pasture.

On one hand, I am excited she likes to/has the ability to jump. On the other, I'm worried about keeping her contained now. LOL.

We should have Joy home at our new house in a couple months or so. We have to set up fencing (tall fencing, apparently) and a barn or lean to. Can't wait until she and other horses are right outside my door. Will definitely post updates on that.


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## horseylover1_1

Since it's been awhile since I posted some pictures of Joy, here a couple recent ones. :smile:

Joy has been sweet again recently. For awhile she was very teenager-ish but lately she hasn't been acting like that. I introduced her to the bit which she took like a champ. She lowers her head for it and lets me take it off easy. I have been hesitant to start on long lining until she's 2 so she can "be a baby" but I truly think she needs to have a job and do something to help build her muscles. So far she has only placed last in halter classes and I think part of the problem is that she has a hay belly and no muscle/ top line. Of course, she is just growing, so I don't expect her to look like a full grown quarter horse or anything. But a little exercise can definitely not hurt.

The horses around here are starting to get their winter coats. I think Joy looks adorable with her pre-winter coat.


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## horseylover1_1

Ugh. It has been crazy for me recently. 

We bought a new house with 3.5 acres and we just moved into it. I love it... it's a cute old farmhouse... but it needs a cosmetic facelift which has been taking up a lot of our time. Currently it's an hour from Joy. The drive honestly doesn't seem that bad but I can definitely tell I am using way more gas than before. I don't make special trips out there anymore (for the most part). Thankfully, many times work will take me out that direction anyway and I can just bring a change of clothes and go out there before or after work.

Joy is great. She messed up her mane by getting cockleburs in it. I got them out but I can tell it did a number on her hair. :icon_rolleyes: So my goals for Joy are getting bigger and bigger. I want her to be a top reining horse in addition to a dressage horse, trail horse, jumper, etc. etc. I have been watching reining videos more and more and love it. I hate that the young horses are pushed so hard sometimes, but there are extremes in every discipline. I think my goal when I start her will be solid walk, trot, canter, and neck reining. Everything else really needs to wait until her bones mature. I can start teaching her the basics of the spin, I guess. I am still debating on when exactly I will back her. I plan on just waiting and seeing and listening to her so I'll know when she (and her body) is ready. 

Speaking of, she is sooo short for a coming 2 year old Friesian X. 13.3. I hope she hits a growth spurt over the winter, everyone comments on how tiny she is!


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## horseluvr2524

I have to run now, so can't do a long comment, but it was nice to catch up! I may come back and comment more later.

BTW, I always thought it funny. My name is Lyndsey, same name, different spelling!


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## horseylover1_1

Thanks for dropping by! Always enjoy your comments. And that's really neat! I like the way yours is spelled.


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## PoptartShop

She really does look so adorable with her pre-winter coat. LOL. Looks so fluffy!  She is just the cutest. Who knows, she may hit a growth spurt when you least expect it! Aww!


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## LoriF

Joy is really cute right now, fluffy. How old is she now in months? 

To be honest, my yearling who is now 18 months has been 14.2 for forever it seems. I could swear that she was 14.2 on her first birthday and I'm thinking "what the heck?" She seems pretty healthy and good weight (not too fat, not too thin) so I'm not going to worry about it. 

As far as backing these young ones, I think that you will know when it's time. I put a super light weight saddle on Novia and she couldn't care less. I don't think that I will be on her back for quite a while though at the rate that she is maturing. Maybe Joy is the same.


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## JoBlueQuarter

Joy is so cute! I wouldn't worry about her size. As long as her parents are good/normal sized, she should hit a couple more growth spurts before she's grown up. My two-year-old filly really grew a lot this summer; I think she's taller than both my older horses, by now.


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## horseylover1_1

@LoriF She is a year and 8 months, so 20 months? 

I know she is growing some because none of her halters fit anymore. She seems to be growing faster because I only get to see her once a week or so now. Being almost an hour away is so inconvenient. It will probably be spring before we get the house ready for her or any other horse. My goal is to have it set up to train horses by spring, but we'll see how it goes. Seems like home projects take a lot longer than you plan them to.

Ok, so I have a winter goal for her... teach her to pull a sled/sleigh. :lol: Mostly for fun, but it couldn't hurt to start the foundation for pulling a cart! I looked at the price of sleighs online. They're like $3000 for a decent one! I think I will just have her pull me on a $40 sled. We'll jerry rig it. I love, love, love snow and winter so I think it would be a lot more fun than pulling a cart.


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## LoriF

horseylover1_1 said:


> @LoriF She is a year and 8 months, so 20 months?
> 
> I know she is growing some because none of her halters fit anymore. She seems to be growing faster because I only get to see her once a week or so now. Being almost an hour away is so inconvenient. It will probably be spring before we get the house ready for her or any other horse. My goal is to have it set up to train horses by spring, but we'll see how it goes. Seems like home projects take a lot longer than you plan them to.
> 
> Ok, so I have a winter goal for her... teach her to pull a sled/sleigh. :lol: Mostly for fun, but it couldn't hurt to start the foundation for pulling a cart! I looked at the price of sleighs online. They're like $3000 for a decent one! I think I will just have her pull me on a $40 sled. We'll jerry rig it. I love, love, love snow and winter so I think it would be a lot more fun than pulling a cart.


Novia is now 1 year and 7 months. It seems that she was stuck all summer long and now she is having another growth spurt. I thought it would be the other way around. 

Nice that you are finding things to do with Joy over the winter.


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## horseylover1_1

@LoriF I looked through your pics of Novia. She's an awfully gorgeous horse. Love her color. As neat as it is to have had Joy since she was 9 months old, I can't imagine how rewarding it would be to have the baby born at your place and raise it from birth. 

Like you mentioned in your last post, I do think I will know when the right time to back/ride Joy will be. If she doesn't have a significant growth spurt before late spring I won't even try backing her until possibly next fall. Speaking of I forgot to post this pic. I had some friends out and I let them sit their little guy on Joy (he was held the entire time of course). Joy didn't care at all! I think when it comes time to get on her she won't mind. She is mentally ready for it, just got to wait for her body to catch up.


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## JoBlueQuarter

So cool that you're teaching Joy to pull a sled; that's something I want to try with Heidi! I've put my little sis on Heidi before, while she was eating. Heidi didn't mind either.

Joy is looking good!


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## horseylover1_1

Thanks so much! Do you have a journal for Heidi? Would love to follow it


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## JoBlueQuarter

Yes, I do, but I'm afraid I'm awful at keeping a journal updated!  Anyway, here's the link: http://www.horseforum.com/member-journals/heidis-thread-751946/


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## whisperbaby22

Joy is definitely getting bigger. And a sleigh is so cool! Have fun with it.


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## horseylover1_1

So I have been fighting with that terrible little monster, jealously, lately. And his best friend... insecurity. 

I think anyone who follows my thread knows of my goal is to be a horse trainer. I had already dreamed of being a "horse whisperer" since I was little. From the time I was 11 to until I was about... 23 (a few months ago) I had never thought of myself as a horse trainer. I felt in my heart I could train a yearling, so I got one. But I always told myself I would never really be any good at working with horses. I got Joy as a pet, not thinking she would be the start of a dream. (So cheesy, I know.) That all changed when Patrick's owner asked if she could pay me to work with him after seeing me work with another horse. I was a bit shocked anyone would consider me good enough to hire. But I happily accepted, and everyone knows that story.

Anyway, fast forward to now. I have had a hiccup in confidence. I have felt like I have a hit a bit of a plateau. Not much has been going on. I moved far from where Joy is so I am not "really" considered a trainer there now (how can I be... I go there 1-2 times a week. I used to go every single day.) Work has been slow so I haven't really been able to start getting my place ready for horses yet. It was a spring goal anyway, but not making ANY progress is still discouraging. 

And the worst part is I am comparing myself to other girls *my age* who are nearby "horse whisperers" and seem to be killing it! Have tons of business, currently living my dream. I know the worst thing anyone could ever do is compare themselves to other people. But that's easier said than done. 

I'm determined to stay humble and keep progressing with riding and training. 

Joy has been great. She is still only about 14 hh. I really hope she hits a growth spurt soon. My new goal is to teach her to lay down and maybe sit down. There is a large sawdust pile in the barn I could use to teach her. I'm also going to teach her to lunge at liberty. Will post videos of our progress!


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## JoBlueQuarter

I know about insecurity. I have the same problem bigtime! If you ever find a way out of it, let me know! 

I have to say though, from reading your journal, you _are_ a good trainer, and don't let anybody or anything convince you otherwise!


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## horseylover1_1

JoBlueQuarter said:


> I know about insecurity. I have the same problem bigtime! If you ever find a way out of it, let me know!
> 
> I have to say though, from reading your journal, you _are_ a good trainer, and don't let anybody or anything convince you otherwise!


Haha, I have to say the one thing that has _helped _ is surrounding myself with the right people. People who truly love horses and working with them. Not people obsessed with a blue ribbon or think more of themselves than they should. 

And thank you *so* much for the amazingly kind words. I appreciate it very much. :hug:


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## whisperbaby22

Take it from an old lady, you don't know unless you walk in their moccosins what other people feel, so it's no use to feel jealous. Most likely they are jealous of you with your beautiful filly. Take this time to do something useful and it will not be wasted.


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## horseylover1_1

That is very true @whisperbaby22 . I read a quote once that said it's easy to get discouraged if you're comparing your "behind the scenes" to someone else's "highlight reel" which is so true. Most people that "know" me just over social media would only see the cool tricks I've made Joy do, the blue ribbons, and the horses I have worked with. Nobody would see the tears of frustration, sleepless nights, and insecurities. I guess I just gotta keep on doing me! And Joy.

Speaking of... she was very mischievous tonight. Running away from me constantly, not paying a bit of attention to a thing I asked her to do. Etc. But honestly I couldn't help but laugh when she was doing it. She would stop, and when I got about 5 feet away she did this little bolting thing. It was kind of playful in a mischievous way. I did make her work her butt off because I don't want her thinking she can get away with it, but gosh I can't help but love her even when has her moods. That's one reason I picked her. I didn't want a one personality horse that did everything I asked it to. That's not nearly as fun. 

I also worked with one of the horses tonight on new exercises to get his shoulder over. It went pretty well but the more I think about it, I'll probably not continue it. Mainly because I am not experienced teaching that - which is fine - everyone starts somewhere. However, he being a green horse, me being a green teacher, and he not being my horse I just don't want to cause him to pick up bad habits. And that can be inevitable when you're training a greenie. He tried bowing the other day when the owner picked up his feet.  Granted I was given permission to train him that, but still. I can just see the owner wanting to have a nice ride on him and he starts side passing because I taught him to do it off a certain leg movement. So yeah. I will just continue exercising him. There is another green horse there I will probably work with more. The gelding is pretty much finished out, so I may play with the mare more. Plus, her owner is the barn owner and she doesn't care if I try new things with her horses. Once we get Joy home I am going to get a project horse to play with. I really want to start thinking about training reining horses because that is in high demand in this area. I don't have any experience with it. I learn pretty well by watching training videos but there is still a lot of trial and error involved. So yeah. Definitely don't want to use someone else's horse as my guinea pig. :lol:


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## horseylover1_1

I've been doing more liberty with Joy. I have been wanting to teach her to lunge around me w/o any ropes. She has picked up every other aspect of liberty so easily, this is something that is just not "clicking" with her. I think it's because I have always taught her that when I send her out.. she is supposed to go out. She's not been trained to really stick with me during our lunging sessions. I think I will focus on that for the next few times I go out there. She has also been turned out with other horses a lot. I haven't seen her nearly as much. Maybe twice a week at most. 

Hopefully she will catch on soon and I can get video. I love seeing horses circle around someone in a tight circle, especially at the canter.


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## horseylover1_1

Here is a video of some liberty work we did a few days ago. 

I'm very excited she is going around me in a circle. I guess it may not seem like a big deal, but for us it was a breakthrough. She absolutely would not stay with me while lunging before. I would take off her halter, and she would run around the arena. 

Liberty is so popular I am thinking of pursuing it more because you can really get the attention of people who want to learn it. To me it's not difficult, but that's probably only because I have watched tons of videos and realized you're basically just teaching tricks. Everyone and their mother is a horse trainer but not many specialize in liberty. It's really exciting to be "trying" out different things w/ horses (reining, liberty, English, driving, etc) to see where my true passion is so I can pursue it. So far English is my favorite. I guess there's no reason I can't do a little bit of everything. I don't really have any desire to be famous or specialize in one field. I just love working with horses.


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## whisperbaby22

And think how great Joy will look when she's all grown up and doing this stuff! You can really make Friesians look cool with tack and plumes and things.


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## JoBlueQuarter

Looking really good! You really don't have anything to worry about; you're doing great! That's the kind of stuff I want to do with Heidi, but can't do right now due to circumstances.


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you so much!! It looks like I won't be able to do much liberty anytime soon myself. It is SO cold. I guess to some people, 15-20 degrees is not that cold. But our horses and bodies are not used to it. It is not going to get above freezing at all next week and it was below freezing the entire past week. There is an indoor arena at the place I board Joy but it is not heated or isolated from the wind because it's only got walls on two sides so far. 

I actually like the cold weather, except that it means I can't enjoy the horses as much. I could handle 15-20 mins at a time, but since Joy is an hour away now, it's not worth the drive.


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## horseylover1_1

New Year!!

2017 was great to me. Obviously the best part of 2017 was getting Joy in January. I'm excited for 2018. I have a lot of "hopes" for 2018. They are hopes and not goals because some of it will be out of my control. But I have a couple significant goals as well. 

First, I want my place set up for horse training by April 1st. I really hope the weather in March cooperates with me on this. I may have to take a couple nice days in February to put fencing up as well. My husband is confident the barn won't take long to build. I guess we will see about that. LOL. 

Second, I am really going to push my horse training more. This ties in with the first goal. 

My "hopes" are all show related. I am supposed to ride a nice mare this year. That is out of my control though as she is not my horse. I showed her in October when her owner asked me on FB if I would be interested in showing her... of course I said yes. Even when Joy comes home I am going to be taking lessons where I am now. I like my instructor and the lessons are cheap enough that the drive is worth it. Plus, they get involved in parades and shows which most farms don't offer. 

Oh, and of course I hope to start teaching Joy to ride this year! That is so up in the air at this point though. I don't want to make it a 2018 goal because she may not be ready physically. If she has a growth spurt this winter I will consider it more. 

What are your horse related 2018 goals?


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## horseylover1_1

Joy learned to long line yesterday! 

I rode one of the green horses for the first half of my lesson and then my trainer taught me how to long line Joy. Since it was her first time doing it, I think she did really well. Other than mouthing the bit some which I assume is normal for a green horse. She has only had a bridle/bit on 4-5 times and this was the first time I ever applied pressure with reins. She steered, stopped, backed, trotted, etc. no problem. 

She has been taught since the day I got her to yield to pressure. It is so exciting seeing a horse progress well in their training because they have a good foundation. (At least, I would like to think I gave her a good foundation...) 

I love the way she carries herself. She did not have a martingale or anything like it and she was on the bit most of the time. Of course a truly collected, round frame doesn't come from bit pressure alone. But I am happy with the way she naturally carries herself. 

There is a video on my IG account if anyone wants to take a look - horse_whispers_


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## horseylover1_1

Oops, meant to post this pic also


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## horseylover1_1

Today was frustrating. 

Work frustrated me to no end. I had a somewhat “easy” day planned because it was a snow day for most. We have about 4-5 inches, which for this area practically shuts the city down. I mean I don’t mind the fact I had to work at all, self employed people can never complain about it, but it was just... ugh. 

And then, (rant ahead) I reached out to a local humane society about working with some feral horses they brought in and they said they needed someone with more experience. Which I totally understand to an extent. I do. There are too many wannabe horses whisperers out there watching movies and TV shows that are “trainers”. I told them about my work where Joy was and that I was confident I had the skills to work with feral horses, however, I respected their decision to bring on someone with more of a resume. It still stings a bit though. I guess I wear my heart on my sleeve in that sense. It’s just hard because everyone wants someone with experience, so it’s hard to get experience. I’m lucky that the stable owner gave me the opportunity to work with her horses because nobody takes you seriously when you’ve trained your own. And most trainers in the area won’t even think about letting you train under them as they know you’ll be their competition! They want to feed people fish and not teach them how to fish so to speak. Hopefully that made sense. Anyway, rant over, I’ll get over it. Being that I’ve been an entrepreneur since I was 18 I’ve learned to pick myself up a lot. Hurdles and setbacks and failures are part of success and there are no shortcuts.


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## whisperbaby22

You are absolutely right, but keep in mind that your feeling "stung" only means that you care. It's important to you. That's what makes you a great horse trainer. Keep an eye and ear on those feral horses. Maybe you can audit a session. Or maybe the person they picked will not let you "learn how to fish"! One can only try with that kind of mind set.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> You are absolutely right, but keep in mind that your feeling "stung" only means that you care. It's important to you. That's what makes you a great horse trainer.


Thanks whisper baby, you always seem to say just the right things! I so appreciate it! :hug:

Well, I could probably write a book on everything that has happened since I last posted but I won't bore everyone to tears. I've encountered what feels like minor setbacks in my professional horse training. Nothing major. Just some stuff I have to work through. Maybe someday I will post about it in detail. It has nothing to do with working with the horses at all, it's working with the _people_ who let you work with the horses! Sometimes I forget the equine industry is full of cut throat individuals... though I guess that is just life/people in general... 

Joy is fine. I think I have burnt her out a bit trying to perfect this liberty stuff. Just like the tarp, I don't see any other choice to step away and take a break from it. I hate doing that because I have a "never give up" attitude especially if it's something I put my mind to. However it's not fun for either of us anymore. She likes the liberty but she just isn't getting the lunging at liberty part. If she is in a good mood I may do short lessons with her on it. I think I will also do more ground driving and get her used to a saddle because she does like doing new things. I'm somewhat running out of things to do. 

In 3 months, she is going to be 2 years old! I can't believe it! It's hard to believe in 3 months I can at least start _thinking _about riding her, though realistically I am looking at 2.5 before I do anything more than sit on her back. She may not even be ready then. I don't plan on doing anything more than 15-20 min rides until she is 3, anyway. That is even if I do ride her before 3... it's so up in the air. I will just have to wait and see how she is doing growth wise in a few months. She isn't even 14 hh yet.


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## whisperbaby22

I am able to say the right things because I am old and have spent my life fascinated by horses. Believe me, when they say you never stop learning they know what they mean! Seems like I always am learning. 

I just picked up a book called Schooling For Young Riders, by John Richard Young. I had only read a few pages when I realized that I had another book written by him called Schooling of the Western Horse. Never got around to reading it, just one of those books I figured will not teach me anything, but I have started to read it. Most of these old books do not teach anything I don't already know, but the writing so far is interesting, and if I do like it I'll do a review in some part of this forum. 

You will have a lot of ups and downs with Joy, and with horses in general. As long as the passion is there, knowledge will find a way.


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## horseylover1_1

I’ve got an exciting opportunity. I am not going to go into details because a.) this is a public forum and someone I personally know may stumble across it and b.) it’s just in the “possibility” stage... but this may end up changing my horse career forever. I’m very excited, but trying not to get too worked up in case it doesn’t work out. But definitely keep an eye out for details as it unfolds into spring and early summer... 

Joy is fine. I worked her a little on liberty and it was a good session so I only did it for about 10 mins. I worked 5 horses Thursday which was great. My trainer complimented me which I appreciated. 

I went to a show Saturday. It was OK, not my best performance. The mare has an old injury that flares up sometimes. So she was sore. It was the first time I had shown at the canter in 2.5 years and I was SO nervous and scared. The same mare had bucked me off twice the night before (long story). But I was determined not to let that stop me. We ended up getting a 2nd and two 3rds and no last places so that was good. I definitely need to work on my eq at the canter when I ride English (hunter specifically). I’m fine in a western saddle. I guess we all have something to work on. Overall it was a good day.


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## horseluvr2524

horseylover1_1 said:


> Well, I could probably write a book on everything that has happened since I last posted but I won't bore everyone to tears. I've encountered what feels like minor setbacks in my professional horse training. Nothing major. Just some stuff I have to work through. Maybe someday I will post about it in detail. It has nothing to do with working with the horses at all, it's working with the _people_ who let you work with the horses! Sometimes I forget the equine industry is full of cut throat individuals... though I guess that is just life/people in general...
> 
> Joy is fine. I think I have burnt her out a bit trying to perfect this liberty stuff. Just like the tarp, I don't see any other choice to step away and take a break from it. I hate doing that because I have a "never give up" attitude especially if it's something I put my mind to. However it's not fun for either of us anymore. She likes the liberty but she just isn't getting the lunging at liberty part. If she is in a good mood I may do short lessons with her on it. I think I will also do more ground driving and get her used to a saddle because she does like doing new things. I'm somewhat running out of things to do.


Cool to see what you've been up to, I haven't been around much.

You have discovered/run into what I did myself so many times when I started horse training. I really couldn't deal with the people and I was so endlessly frustrated that they thought they didn't have to change anything about the way they worked with their horse. They thought a horse trainer is a magic fix. Well it's not, the owner has to be involved too. So I gave it up, because I discovered that training other people's horses isn't really what I wanted to do after all. I'm sure you will discover your niche in the horse industry, whether it's what you are doing now or something else.

For lunging at liberty, the horse has to be solid lunging on the line first, so they understand the concept. Then you use similar voice cues and body language, they get the idea. It's a lot of work. And keep in mind that the liberty trainers you see in videos not only spend a ton of time on liberty, but also use a lot of treats. As nice as it is to think the horse is doing what we ask because he enjoys being with us, a great deal of the time the reason is either because of conditioning, motivation (food), or both.


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## horseylover1_1

@horseluvr2524 I am just now getting back on myself after almost a month. I enjoyed reading your thoughts as always. Yes, it can be hard working with people in general. Horse trainers are not magicians. I think the one thing that people really don't understand is that a _really_ well trained horse is not made in 60-90 days. It's made in YEARS. People don't understand the time and energy it takes to get from Point A to B. People will even take for granted how well behaved Joy is, not realizing how much time and effort went into making her the complacent and easy going horse she is now. 

I have been doing a lot more training under a new mentor. Learning to work with ranch & reining horses! She also does liberty. It's been quite the experience to say the least! I am currently interning so I can show non-pro this year. And.. honestly.. as much I wanted to start training professionally I know I need more time under my belt before I can start charging people. I guess I could try faking it till I make it but I don't want to be known as a backyard trainer. I attached some photos she took of me riding a couple of the horses last week.

Joy is great. I have a small confession to make. I was on her for like 15 seconds today. Lol. I didn't actually sit on her. I just had my husband hold her while I leaned over her back for a couple of seconds. She just stood there. I can already tell that she is going to be super easy to train. I feel like I can just hop on her back and ride her now, she is so docile and laid back. But she is SO TINY! Still 13.3! Ugh! Please someone share some stories of your 2 year olds growing a full hand over the summer because I am afraid I am going to have a midget horse here :icon_rolleyes:


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## whisperbaby22

Isn't there some kind of a string test you can do on young horses to get an idea of how tall they will be?


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## horseylover1_1

Yeah, the barn owner did the string test on her and I think we came up with right about 15 hh. Which, both her sire and dam are taller than that. So I was hoping maybe it was inaccurate. I'd be fine with 15hh though. I would prefer her to be taller but that's not a bad height.


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## horseluvr2524

She's got a long time to grow. Most horses aren't done growing until they are 5 years old. Many continue to mature physically (though in smaller ways) until they are 7 or 8. Give her some time.


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## horseylover1_1

Quick update! Joy took like ... 3 trotting steps around me at liberty without running off. I was super excited. Seems like a small thing but I really think it's going to be a huge breakthrough. Mostly because I feel like she has been trying to figure out what I want for so long and she finally gets it. She is actually very willing to please. She rarely tells me "no." Or maybe she just really likes the treats. Lol. Either way, I can't wait to share some liberty videos when she's getting good at it!


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## horseylover1_1

I finally feel like I made my big breakthrough with Joy.

For awhile, I was honestly worried that I may never _really_ bond with her. I mean sure, any animal you have for a long time you are going to love and be attached to to some extent. And I've always known I wanted Joy. Ever since I saw and worked with her for the first time, I knew we'd be a good team. We work well together and we've come far in many, many ways. But after Wednesday I really feel like we have a bond. Had someone offered $10,000 for her a couple weeks ago I probably would have taken it. If someone offered $10,000 for her today, I probably would not take it. 

We had a really good day on Wednesday. She finally "gets" the liberty. She also came straight to me when she saw me - unusual when she is in the pasture. But it wasn't just a good day. It was something deeper.

So, I am even more excited to continue our journey. I wish she was old enough to just jump on ride because there is sooo much I want to do with her. But I have to think of her best interests. I've thought about getting another young horse to train while I am waiting for Joy to grow up. Something to train and eventually resell. I guess we'll see once my place is done. Was supposed to be done by April 1st. Haha. Not going to happen.

I am showing on Sunday. Not Joy - I can't justify the cost to clip and transport her to enter two schooling classes. I'm showing her brother, Tiernan, one that I helped train at the barn. It's actually my first show after a nasty fall three weeks ago. I don't think I've posted about it. That's another journal entry altogether though.


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## JoBlueQuarter

That's so awesome, at @horseylover1_1!! I have the same 'kind of' bond with Heidi that you used to have with Joy. I mean, sure, I love and adore Heidi, and I get the feeling that she likes me too (kinda like an older mare in her herd to come to when in need of security) but not like what you just described. I'm not going to push her or anything though, just give her some time to except me and realize that I'm there for her, if you get what I mean.

I love reading in this journal about your work with Joy! It's very inspirational! <3


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## horseluvr2524

Liberty is so fun and rewarding. And boy does it teach you patience lol. But it is truly amazing and builds such a wonderful bond. I'm looking forward to seeing your progress with Joy, no matter how slow. Slow and steady wins the race!


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## horseylover1_1

@JoBlueQuarter - I think with young horses sometimes it's harder to form a bond. They're babies.. personality is constantly changing and they typically want to be around other horses their age. I'm sure with time and love and patience you and Heidi may still form a bond. And if not that's OK too. Of all the horses I work with, I feel like I "click" with few of them. Sure, we get along and enjoy each other company etc. But nothing more. And thanks for the kind words. <3 

Finally have a somewhat decent video of Joy and I doing liberty. I attached it with a link. She had a Western saddle on for the first time! It didn't fit by a long shot, but not bad just to get her used to something heavy on her back. She did not care at all. Even when I put it on and cinched it she just stood there. And she takes the bit like an old, happy, seasoned lesson horse. Puts her head down and opens her mouth. 

Wouldn't it be great if everyone had the opportunity to start their horses so slow and steady? I know it's not always possible, and that's OK, I'm just thankful I had the privilege of having Joy since she was 9 months old!


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## horseylover1_1

*Journal within a journal: Blue*

I am excited to say I have another project horse! I want to keep record of her progress here for future reference, and I enjoy writing about the work I do with horses.

Her name is Blue and she is a cremello mare. I think she is going to be "my" project. She isn't mine though, of course. I am planning on going out 3 times a week to work her and visit Joy. 

I've done two groundwork sessions with her so far. She's a bit jumpy but she's been messed with before. So she's not hard to handle per say. She's been taught to lunge, back, yield from pressure, etc. I've been told she was saddled/bridled by her previous owners. She did kick out twice the first time I lunged her, though it wasn't an aggressive kick. She was just being a horse. So I am primarily working now on boundaries and building her confidence. She is eager to please, docile, and submissive. Not a mean bone in her body. She is quite the opposite of Joy, who is testy and almost a little too confident. 

I really enjoy doing groundwork. I don't understand why some trainers feel the need to start backing the horse right away. You learn so much about them on the ground. Their strengths and weaknesses. You learn to respect each other. You can communicate in a way you can't when you're on their back.

I'm very excited about the opportunity. 

Joy is great. She was very testy this afternoon. It was like she was saying "Oh, there's people watching you work me? Let me just ditch you and pretend I've never done liberty before in my life." Yeah... showing her is going to be interesting someday. She LOVES to make a liar out of me and I swear she does it on purpose.


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## JoBlueQuarter

horseylover1_1 said:


> I am excited to say I have another project horse! I want to keep record of her progress here for future reference, and I enjoy writing about the work I do with horses.
> 
> Her name is Blue and she is a cremello mare. I think she is going to be "my" project. She isn't mine though, of course. I am planning on going out 3 times a week to work her and visit Joy.
> 
> I've done two groundwork sessions with her so far. She's a bit jumpy but she's been messed with before. So she's not hard to handle per say. She's been taught to lunge, back, yield from pressure, etc. I've been told she was saddled/bridled by her previous owners. She did kick out twice the first time I lunged her, though it wasn't an aggressive kick. She was just being a horse. So I am primarily working now on boundaries and building her confidence. She is eager to please, docile, and submissive. Not a mean bone in her body. She is quite the opposite of Joy, who is testy and almost a little too confident.
> 
> I really enjoy doing groundwork. I don't understand why some trainers feel the need to start backing the horse right away. You learn so much about them on the ground. Their strengths and weaknesses. You learn to respect each other. You can communicate in a way you can't when you're on their back.
> 
> I'm very excited about the opportunity.
> 
> Joy is great. She was very testy this afternoon. It was like she was saying "Oh, there's people watching you work me? Let me just ditch you and pretend I've never done liberty before in my life." Yeah... showing her is going to be interesting someday. She LOVES to make a liar out of me and I swear she does it on purpose.


Blue sounds lovely! And nothing AT ALL like _my_ Blue! :lol: She sounds nearly exactly like Heidi, though. You must be so excited to be working with her! You're doing, like, exactly what I want to do. You're training your own filly (and doing an awesome job of it, might I add) and also training for other people. Like, dream job right there!

I hear what you're saying about how horses love making liars out of their trainers! And it's not just them; dogs are the exact same!

ETA: I *need* pics of Blue!


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## horseylover1_1

JoBlueQuarter said:


> Blue sounds lovely! And nothing AT ALL like _my_ Blue! :lol: She sounds nearly exactly like Heidi, though. You must be so excited to be working with her! You're doing, like, exactly what I want to do. You're training your own filly (and doing an awesome job of it, might I add) and also training for other people. Like, dream job right there!
> 
> I hear what you're saying about how horses love making liars out of their trainers! And it's not just them; dogs are the exact same!
> 
> ETA: I *need* pics of Blue!


You are sooooo sweet! I do love it! I’m hoping in a few years I can make a career out of it. For the time being I’m working in exchange for experience, which I don’t mind at all. What I’m really trying to learn now is the transition from “backyard trainer” (not saying that in a negative way whatsoever. Just someone that trains their own horses at home) to “professional horse trainer” and it’s a loooooooot of work. Particularly getting horses that will show and place well. Because that’s so important to many people. There’s so much to learn though, oh my goodness. Headsets, transitions, shoulder/hip movement, etc etc. Training a good old trail mount is NOTHING like training a show horse. I mean yes, a good trail horse can have all those things too. But it’s different. 

Your wish is my command  I will get more later as well!


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## JoBlueQuarter

horseylover1_1 said:


> You are sooooo sweet! I do love it! I’m hoping in a few years I can make a career out of it. For the time being I’m working in exchange for experience, which I don’t mind at all. What I’m really trying to learn now is the transition from “backyard trainer” (not saying that in a negative way whatsoever. Just someone that trains their own horses at home) to “professional horse trainer” and it’s a loooooooot of work. Particularly getting horses that will show and place well. Because that’s so important to many people. There’s so much to learn though, oh my goodness. Headsets, transitions, shoulder/hip movement, etc etc. Training a good old trail mount is NOTHING like training a show horse. I mean yes, a good trail horse can have all those things too. But it’s different.
> 
> Your wish is my command  I will get more later as well!


What you say makes sense, but you're well on your way to being a professional trainer! It'd actually be really cool if we lived closer together; you could help me with Heidi! ;-)

Blue is gorgeous, and it seems she likes water. Which is another way that she's the direct opposite of my Blue


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## horseylover1_1

JoBlueQuarter said:


> What you say makes sense, but you're well on your way to being a professional trainer! It'd actually be really cool if we lived closer together; you could help me with Heidi! ;-)
> 
> Blue is gorgeous, and it seems she likes water. Which is another way that she's the direct opposite of my Blue


Haha, she lives in a pasture with a decent sized stream going through it so she doesn't have much choice to like it if she wants to drink. :lol:

It would be neat if we lived nearby! Though from what I've read from your journal, you don't need a whole lot of help! You seem to really "understand" your horses and how to get results. I could probably get some pointers from you! The beauty about learning about animals... you are never done learning.


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## JoBlueQuarter

horseylover1_1 said:


> Haha, she lives in a pasture with a decent sized stream going through it so she doesn't have much choice to like it if she wants to drink. :lol:
> 
> It would be neat if we lived nearby! Though from what I've read from your journal, you don't need a whole lot of help! You seem to really "understand" your horses and how to get results. I could probably get some pointers from you! The beauty about learning about animals... you are never done learning.


Yeah, that can be a curse and a blessing! :lol: Thanks for your support but I actually don't feel like I'm doing so well. But I'llo keep going and keep learning from people like you!


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## horseluvr2524

Stay humble, never think you know everything, and never assume/believe anyone else knows everything, and you will do well. I've learned a lot going outside the box of what is conventional with horses to achieve a specific result.

The horse industry is very much about 'who you know', and not so much about talent and what you can do. You are doing well in that you already are at a show barn and getting experience showing other people's horses. Get good and you can make money catch riding at shows.


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## horseylover1_1

Wow, it's been two weeks since I last wrote. Time flies...

Joy is fine. She is being started on driving a cart. I took a lesson w/ her last Thursday and while she was unsure of the weird pressure she wasn't used to, she started doing what we asked within 15 mins. No cart yet obviously, just set up a long line to get her used to it. She is also great about ground tying. I don't think she will ever be to the point she'll ground tie when I am out of sight, but thats a lot to ask of a horse.

I managed to hurt my finger while riding. No idea what happened. I was loping around and felt a _very_ minor soreness in my pinky, kept loping around for 5-10 mins and looked down and my finger was in a weird shape and was hard to move. I don't think it's broken but it hurts pretty bad. It's also purple/bruised. I have it in a little finger brace and have been icing it which seems to help with the swelling. Also, ibuprofen. :wink:

I'm learning a lot at my internship!! I've been able to go approx. every day. Seeing progress in yourself and the horses you're working with .. priceless. Even when there are bad days. The bad days just make the good ones that much better.


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## whisperbaby22

So true!


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## EquineBovine

Just read the whole thing. You've come so far! Love watching Joy grow and looking forward to more updates!


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## horseylover1_1

EquineBovine said:


> Just read the whole thing. You've come so far! Love watching Joy grow and looking forward to more updates!


Well thank you so much for the kind words _and _ reading through the entire journal, it's become quite lengthy! lol.

I did break my finger. :| I still don't know exactly what I did. Doctor said I could still ride as long as I kept my finger in a splint and my husband is like NO WAY... :sad:


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## EquineBovine

Don't take any chances with your finger hun. Arthritis will jump on you if given a chance. Rest up x


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## horseylover1_1

Rant ahead. 

So to start the thread off on a good note, everything has been going pretty well in the equine world. Not one day goes by that I don't make a mistake but I am really happy with my internship and Joy's progress. And Blues. I usually make it out to my internship 3-4 times a week. Joy is an hour away now so I usually see her twice a week, sometimes three, but never less than once a week. 

So... I've been getting messages on my social media pages from people at Joy's barn saying she is "jealous", misses me, and one comment that went as far as (this is NOT quoted) _you need to do what's best for her and not best for you._ Excuse me? I'm sorry but I didn't realize working with other horses at another barn was somehow not good for her? Trust me, I wish I could visit Joy every day. It's not an option right now. We literally sold our house and purchased a property for Joy! It's just in limbo. The weather up until a week ago or so has been very bad. Couldn't really work on my fence or anything. And like... literally was out there two days in a row last week and spent time with her both days. Killed it at liberty. She doesn't really run away anymore. 

I think what really bothers me is that I have sacrificed so much for Joy and yet people have the nerve to make comments that (and only when I post pics from the other barn) I am abandoning Joy somehow. When I first got that wild filly I was out there 6-7 times a week, rain, sleet, or snow, in 20 degree weather, picking up her feet, taking her on walks, desensitizing her, working with her etc. because she NEEDED me. Now she is 2, very well behaved, and I really don't think it's killing her to just be a horse a few times a week. She is too little to be ridden, as much as I want to ride her. I pay for full care board so she is taken care of. And I do go out and love on her regularly! It's just not every other day.

My husband say I shouldn't care about what other people think. And he's right. I just had to vent and get it off my chest.


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## whisperbaby22

Your husband is right of course, but pay special attention to what these people are saying. We live in a very busybody age, and with the internet, every new horse owner is an expert. I would not be surprised to find these people are trying to "fix" what they find wrong behind your back. Since you only get out there a few times a week, be very suspicious. Make it clear to the people you are paying to take care of her that no one else is supposed to be near her. I'll be glad when you can get her out of there.


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## horseluvr2524

In the horse world, most everyone thinks they know best, "I'm right you're wrong", and refuse to accept that there are other lifestyles/training styles/riding etc. that are different but not wrong. The point of full care is because you can't be there every day, for whatever reason. That's not a bad thing and the horse certainly doesn't hate you for it.

I can't imagine what they would think of me, spending close to an entire year away from my horse. But that is why I put her in full care, because I can't be there right now. I know that she is enjoying grass, bossing a couple calves around, and getting great care. It's a much better situation than anything I could have found in the desert. I'm so glad I AND my horse finally got out of there lol.

But yes, beware the barn busybodies. I'm glad you are getting set up with your own horse property. You will be so much happier and have so much more peace. Not to mention the horse business potential!

Now is a good time for Joy to have a 'part-time' job instead of 'full-time'. You've taught her a lot. Now she can just enjoy being a horse, and being a baby, for a while, until she's old enough to begin real work. In the meantime, you are making yourself a better horsewoman which will be better for HER in the long run. I don't think things could be going better for the both of you. Keep up the good work.

And tell the barn busybodies to stick their nose where the sun don't shine. Any way to remove them from FB so they aren't crashing your horsemanship learning party?


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## whisperbaby22

I disagree with that. I would advise just ignoring the social media, and if one of them has the nerve to confront you, smile sheepishly, agree with them and say that you are planning to come out more. This will diffuse the situation. Agreeing with them will keep them from bashing you. Do it anytime they confront you. There have been instances where these busybodies will actually start to feed or handle your horse behind your back. Do what ever you have to to keep her safe. 

Now most likely these people would not do anything. But I was in my mid 40's before I got my own place, and boarding can become a nightmare. Have two faces when you go out there. Firm to the persons you are paying and pleasant (but to busy right now to talk) to the other boarders.


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you @whisperbaby22 and @horseluvr2524 for your input. The situation actually escalated (which was NOT my doing) after I made that post. I privately messaged both people who were harassing me and explained that I had personal reasons for not being able to see Joy that often (which is true) and that Joy not being worked every day is not hurting her. She's a horse. Not a kid. Some horses live their entire lives as broodmares/pasture ornaments and they're just fine. I haven't really heard anything negative since... other than some passive-aggressive comments made to me while I'm there, which I ignore. 

I got to long-line Joy today and do some liberty work. The barn owner is clipping her for me. She is starting to look really good... I am extremely happy with her, especially her movement. She carries herself so nicely.

Pics from long lining today. And a video of some liberty from today.


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## EquineBovine

Looking great!!!


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## horseylover1_1

EquineBovine said:


> Looking great!!!


 Thank you!!


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## whisperbaby22

Ya, well done!


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## horseylover1_1

Ok.. so.. wasn’t going to post this as it’s definitely not the best moment I’ve had with Joy. But I’ve always posted the ups and downs. So here it goes. 

I sat on Joy... and she bucked me off. She’s had weight on her back before. I’ve actually leaned on her before and she was fine with it. She’s used to a saddle and doesn’t mind it. She ground drives and long lines well. So really, having weight on her back is the only thing she needs to learn. Normally when starting a horse I would lean on them quite a few times before ever swinging my legs over them. I was with my trainer. Asked if her if she thought it would be OK to sit on Joy. She said yes, I’m light enough. So I’m super excited about this and think I went too fast for Joy. My trainer offered me a “leg up” on Joy bareback and I took it. Should have said no, I need to get a mounting block. I absolutely do not blame Joy at ALL. If 130 pounds randomly landed on my back and I wasn’t expecting it, I’d buck too! I don’t even think she knew it was me necessarily.

It was slightly embarrassing because everyone heard about it and I’ve been saying for months how Joy was the type of horse you can just hop on and she’d be broke. And I honestly still think she is. It wasn’t fair to her... just landing on her back. Poor thing wasn’t expecting it at all. I should have gotten the block and leaned on her a few times. I know better than that. I guess we all make mistakes, even stupid ones, but dang.. that was painful. 

So I did lean on her after that happened and she was perfectly fine with it. I didn’t swing my legs over. I just laid across her back. 

So anyways. I’m going to NY (for the first time ever) tomorrow for ten days. So won’t have any updates during that time. I will probably attempt to sit on Joy again when I get back.


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## whisperbaby22

OK, did you have a saddle on her? And I think from your comments that no one has ever done "leg up" on her.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> OK, did you have a saddle on her? And I think from your comments that no one has ever done "leg up" on her.


No saddle. Saddle pad and surcingle. No one has even ever sat on her before. It was definitely a bad decision. I feel really bad about it.


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## whisperbaby22

Ehh, we all make mistakes. Be glad you were not seriously hurt. I would carefully explain to her what you did wrong, and that you will expect her not to buck in the future. People will think you are nuts, but if nothing else it puts your own mind in the right place.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> Ehh, we all make mistakes. Be glad you were not seriously hurt. I would carefully explain to her what you did wrong, and that you will expect her not to buck in the future. People will think you are nuts, but if nothing else it puts your own mind in the right place.


Well it’s funny you mention that. Obviously horses don’t understand English, but I do believe they understand more than we give them credit for. They say communication is only 20% (or something like that) of the actual spoken word, while the other 80% is body language and tone of voice. And horses can most certainly understand body language and tone of voice. I think they understand more than we give them credit for. 

I was with my trainer, who has started dozens- if not hundreds- of horses. I guess I just figured if she suggested a leg up it would have gone better than it did. Another situation where I should have trusted my gut. But Joy is my horse. I take responsibility for what happened. I should have said no I’m not going to do a “leg up” on a horse that’s never been sat on before. It’s even worse than mounting with a saddle. There’s no “pre-signal.” It’s just 130 pounds plopped on their back. She honestly wasn’t being mean and I don’t think it reflects anything negative about her personality. If I was standing around minding my own business and something heavy landed on my shoulders I guarantee you I wouldn’t stop and think about what was happening - I’d be getting it off!


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## whisperbaby22

Exactly. The only person who says horses are stupid has been outwitted by a horse.


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## horseylover1_1

My fence is officially almost done!

I got back from my trip about 2 days ago and have been working on the fence diligently since. Joy and the horse I'm going to be free leasing/training (more about her later) are coming on June 8th or 9th.  I guess I am a couple of months behind from my April 1st goal, but considering how terrible the weather has been, I'm not disappointed with the progress. 

Round pen will come right after the fence is done. I got a quote on a 60 foot round pen w/ gate and delivery for $1150! Seems like a steal to me. 

Get to see Joy tomorrow for the first time in 10 days! (Since I was out of town). I cannot wait to see her.


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## JoBlueQuarter

Nice! I have to replace my fencing. Like, really badly! Can't wait for pics of your pretty horses!  It's always a Joy seeing an update here ;-)  Lol, lame pun but true


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## horseylover1_1

JoBlueQuarter said:


> Nice! I have to replace my fencing. Like, really badly! Can't wait for pics of your pretty horses!  It's always a Joy seeing an update here ;-)  Lol, lame pun but true


Ha! Thanks! That's one reason I named her Joy... I love the meaning behind it. She's my joy, and I slightly based it off of scriptures from the Bible as well. I think if (when) I get more horses, I'll continue the theme. Faith, Patience, maybe Hope. 

It's very exciting to see the fence coming together. It'll be even more exciting when the ponies are poking their head over it for breakfast.  I've also been working on pasture maintenance already, as I do not want a big mud pit by late fall. I don't think we will have a choice but to put in a barn (as opposed to a lean-to) as you have to keep horses off the grass when it rains a lot. At least, you do when you only have 2 acres of land. However we are also working on getting more land cleared this week so there will be more pasture - about 3 acres. Since I will be eventually training from home it has to look professional.


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## JoBlueQuarter

I love that idea of continuing the theme. The best names are those with a legit meaning


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## horseylover1_1

I originally wanted to name Joy a Hawaiian name as I have some Hawaiian roots (not genetic) - but my husband doesn't care for most Hawaiian names and they aren't really a good "fit" in the Midwest. Hard to pronounce. Nobody understands what they mean. So I went for something simple, easy to spell, unique but not weird, and pretty (in my opinion)


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## horseylover1_1

Hey everyone!

Can't believe it's been a month since I updated, so much has happened! I'll elaborate on them later, but for now I do want to say that Joy is finally at my house, I've successfully sat on her (twice!), and I have started another journal that kind of goes along with this one but focuses on other horses instead of just Joy.

https://www.horseforum.com/member-journals/rider-trainer-791887/

I'll be sure to update everyone with pics of Joy.. and her new home.. soon.


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## horseylover1_1

So much has been going on! Between taking care of a mini farm, interning, working a full-ish time job, minimum socializing, and home life, I barely have time for anything else. It's been great, though. I love being busy.

Joy has come a looooooong way since the last time I wrote a journal entry about her. As mentioned in my last journal entry, she is finally home. The horses came sometime in the beginning of June, so I have had her (and Denari) for I guess about a month and a half now. Crazy how time flies. Denari's training has been going very well. Joy's has been too. I think I have sat/rode on her... 4 times since she's been home? 

The first time I literally just sat on her. No fireworks, thank goodness. Especially after that last incident. She actually didn't seem to mind me being on her back at all. Last time was a freak thing for sure. The second time I sat on her, we walked about 3-4 steps and I got off. The third time, we walked a few more steps. Not much though, I have been taking it slow with her. The fourth and last time (which was yesterday), we walked quite a bit and trotted 4-5 steps. She's always been the type to need a lot of reassurance so I am going much slower with her than I am Denari. 

Some have asked at what age I plan to ride Joy. She is about 2 years and 3 months now. _However _ I am _not_ doing anything more than sitting on her for more than 5 minutes at a time. Usually once a week, as well. I am not 100% against people starting 2 year olds, but Joy is just much too small and physically immature to really ride around a lot. I gave it a lot of thought and decided I want to put about 10-15 rides on her this year so she can learn the basics of having a rider on her back so when she is started next year, she will be safer to train. I really do think that their brains are wired to learn a lot at 2, however, so I don't want to completely give that up. Come next spring she will be more mature for longer rides and more concentrated training. Even then, I plan on only doing light flat work until she's 5. No reason to wear out those baby joints. 

I will say, however, she is built a lot better than she was even early this year. I wouldn't have even dreamt of sitting on her late last year. The saddles didn't even fit her right - that is how tiny she was. Now, she has filled out a lot and I feel comfortable sitting on her for 5-10 minutes once or twice a week.


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## horseylover1_1

I realized today that I haven't updated in two months! If anyone is still reading our journal (LOL) here is a little update!

Pretty much everything is the same as it was last time I wrote, except that Denari went to training at the barn I work/intern at so as to get a little help on getting her really fancy and show broke. Denari rides VERY nice now. I am super impressed. Wish I could say that I trained her that way, but I got a lot of help. Someday I know I'll be able to take a horse from never been ridden to super fancy broke. It takes time, and I'm not patient, but I am determined!

Joy is good. I finally got her looking shiny. She has been dull since I bought her. She is on Strategy instead of Tribute and I'm super pleased with it so far. I rode her yesterday; I hadn't ridden her in about a month so I am starting from scratch. She got scared and bucked a little - normal young horse stuff. I realized I really need to ride her regularly instead of basically starting from scratch every time I get on. I'm just so busy training the colts at my internship, riding Joy gets put to the back burner b/c I'm not in any rush. But because she is so nervous, the best thing to do for _her_ is ride her regularly until she is comfortable. Once she is comfortable I'll give her the winter off. 

I've also been working on her lay down - it's really testing my patience!


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## whisperbaby22

Lots of times it seems you just have to try different feeds to figure out what works best. And as far as riding, you do what you can do.


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## horseylover1_1

So guess who loped for her first time under saddle today. 

I actually had a friend (who has put the first rides on many horses) trot and lope Joy around. I don't know what was holding me back. You'd think that I would trust a horse that I've practically raised more than these horses I don't know from Adam. And it's not that I _didn't _ trust her. It's just... idk. I guess I wanted someone who wouldn't let their emotions get in the way of pushing Joy past her comfort zone. Once she did, though, I did get on and lope her around. She did great! She knows how to steer well from all that ground driving and she's pretty comfortable. Thank goodness. 

So this is Day 2 of her riding training. She's been sat on before but I'm counting October 15th as her official train date. She trotted yesterday. 

So I'll be writing here more often for sure. :wink: 

Oh, not sure if I mentioned this or not, but Joy moved from my house to the barn I intern at for the winter so I can work her consistently. Once we get past the first 60 days on her I will probably let her have a couple of months off. Not sure yet. I don't want to over due it. She is so healthy, happy, and sound. The last thing I need is her breaking down in a few years from too much riding early on. She has filled out A LOT since earlier this year.


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## whisperbaby22

Great news, enjoy your horse.


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## PoptartShop

Aw, that is great to hear. Yay for progress! & that is good that you moved her for now so you can work her consistently, as that is going to benefit her so much. 

It helps to have someone else get things started, and it can help build your confidence too. I am glad you are feeling better about it!


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## horseylover1_1

Wellll miss Joy has decided that she likes to buck. Hard. :|

My trainer (the one who is teaching me how to train) has been helping me with her. I've ridden her a couple times since she bucked me off and she did OK. It's really frustrating to deal with something like this considering I've been working with this horse for almost 2 years. But I know it happens sometimes. I work with horses that have barely been halter broke when we start working with them and by the time they're riding (usually a couple weeks), they don't even think about bucking. Never any guarantees I guess. I have one now that was a broodmare for 10 years and just learning to ride and she hasn't done anything more than crow hop. 

But, things are definitely looking up. She is getting better. 

She has been kept inside during the day for about 3 weeks now. And omg. Look at her coat. mg:


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## JoBlueQuarter

OMG I'm literally starstruck right now. Joy is so gorgeous! Like, *so* beautiful!! Wow, she's really grown up since I saw her last 


Sorry to hear about the bucking, but it seems you guys are making steady forward progress, which is great! How old is she right now? I'm guessing three, like Heidi? I was going to start Heidi this past summer, but then I changed my mind - I'm going to wait until she's four, which I hope is the right thing to do and won't cause any problems...


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## Willrider

She looks like such a sweetie! I’m glad we get to see all the progress she’s making!


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## horseylover1_1

Aw well thank you @JoBlueQuarter ! She doesn't look like the same horse. She was looked bay for the longest time. It's amazing what the sun can do! She will be 3 this April. I'm sure it won't hurt at all to start Heidi at 4. It's nice to let them be horses until they start their riding careers. Do you have any recent photos of Heidi?  By the way, your signature makes a LOT of sense to me - haha! 

Joy has a cold so I haven't done anything with her for a week. She should be ready to work again next week I hope.


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## horseluvr2524

Just came back from baby hiatus and boy do I have a lot to catch up on here. Looks like you are doing great with her, keep up the good work! And don't worry about her "trying things on" with you. You've surrounded yourself with people who have the know how to deal with it, so I'm sure she will not develop any vices. I've noticed that intelligent, inquisitive horses tend to try things more than those mellower, more laid back types. Just make sure that she's never allowed to get out of something by doing a bad behavior. You might also want to think over her rides and try to pinpoint what the trigger is for her bucking. It could have been any number of things from tack issues to needing a chiropractic adjustment, to simply just being a bratty baby and throwing a temper tantrum. She also could have been pushed into new things too fast and is "acting out" because of that. Or she could just be being a baby :wink:

Just be glad she isn't part mustang. Then you have smart and an exponential amount of stubborn.


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## JoBlueQuarter

I do have a couple pics of my girl that I took the other day when I tried her new bridle and bosal setup on her. She's such a furry bear right now :lol: She's also been filling out a bit more; legs aren't as spindly anymore, but I don't think she's quite done growing yet.


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## horseylover1_1

Ohhhh @horseluvr2524 I want baby details!! Didn't you recently move as well?? Sorry if I missed that in another discussion, I don't get around to much other than a couple of subscriptions and this journal. 

I do think I have underestimated her intelligence. I always knew she was smart, but she's surprised me with some of the stuff she does. I've ridden her twice since the last time I posted. (She's over her cold). No bucking. She was a bit tense the first time I rode her but we did walk, trot, lope with no issues. My trainer and I were able to get her loping on the lunge line which she didn't want to do at first. I have become quite the ground work fanatic. It's so much easier to work stuff out on the ground where you're safer. There's honestly not much that you can not fix on the ground. 

I'm a little concerned that her little blow ups are causing me to "walk on eggshells" when riding her - which my trainer said I absolutely must not do. She's right, and I know it, but at the same time I kind of just want to get 6-7 more rides past us where we have absolutely no expectations whatsoever other than being forward at all 3 gaits.. introduce pressure later.. which I assume a lot of trainers do anyways. We jump in and teach them pretty quick. Most of them at 30 days can move their hindquarters, shoulders, side pass, move off leg, and collect - although they of course have not mastered any of those things. I don't really have a specific timeline for her but at the same time I want to progress quickly so we can hopefully show this spring. 
@JoBlueQuarter She is so cute! I agree, looks like she has a bit more growing to do. She sure is pretty.


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## horseluvr2524

Baby spam as requested! If you head over to my journal, "The Trail Less Traveled", you can read the birth story. Little baby is growing so fast. I'm gradually getting used to her doing new things and making new sounds. The first time she made a different sound, I had a freak out moment, I thought something was wrong. Everybody comments on how strong she is. She's smart, strong, and a quick learner. I can't wait to see her riding or practicing martial arts or ballet, whatever she wants to do. Hopefully riding will be a no brainer.

Yes, I'm in Virginia right now. Shan is in Ohio. We'll be in Ohio with Shan in the spring. I get to introduce my baby Aria to Shan when we drive through around Christmas. Looking forward to that. I miss Shan bunches, and can't wait to see how she will react to Aria. She adores babies.

I think if you take things slow with Joy, you'll do fine. The 30 day thing is really more of a commercialized aspect of training. People have a young horse, they don't want to pay for several months of training at say $600 a month. So the trainer gets as much done as possible in those 30 days.

Introduce new things from the ground at first. Then apply those same methods under saddle. If you use say, a dressage whip, to tap her on the ground and get her to move away from pressure, then use the whip in the saddle in the same area, in conjunction with the new leg cue. It gives her a way to understand what you want.

One thing that took me a long time to learn was that while it is great to address things from the ground and a good way to go about it, what you've taught on the ground doesn't really translate to under saddle as well. It is sometimes like dealing with a whole different animal when you move to the saddle. Treat it that way. Introduce the new concepts just as slowly in the saddle as you did on the ground. And, IMO, there's nothing wrong with walking on eggshells, or in other words, simply being cautious and wary of doing things that would put her into overload and cause an explosion. Build that confidence and trust in the saddle before you attempt the more difficult things. Again, it's like starting from scratch, a completely new, different animal. If she's exploding when you try to get her to move away from pressure or whatever, it's probably just because she doesn't understand. 

Shan used to explode, run out on you, whatever, if you tried to make her do something new and she didn't understand. I HAD to walk on eggshells with that horse. Any trainer that tried to coerce her would have a massive fight on their hands, and even if they won, she'd often just fight harder the next time. But we've come through all of that and figured out how to communicate, and now she's my go to steady eddie horse, I can go with her anywhere and do anything. The trick with her is, if it's something new, take it very slow and let her understand what is happening. Once she learns it, you never have to revisit it. She never forgets it.


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## horseylover1_1

@horseluvr2524 I'm not really sure how I missed your baby stories! I always keep up with your journal. Or at least I thought I did. LOL. It's in my subscriptions. I'll be sure to head over there and catch up next time I am on here, about to log off. Ever since this time change I am exhausted by 10 PM. Your little girl is tooooo cute! Love the name. I am sure you miss Shan a lot, but I'm sure it's nice to be able to give 110% attention to Aria. I imagine babies take up most of your energy. 

And yes you're right, there's no reason to feel like Joy needs to be at a certain point in 30, 60, 90, etc. days. As long as she's doing well enough to show in say 3-4 months I will be pleased. And even if she isn't, well, she's still young. It would not be the end of the world if she's not ready to show in the spring. 

A lot of what I have taught her on the ground has transferred under saddle. She can pivot, knows what "whoa" means, can trot when I cluck and lope when I kiss, etc, but one thing that didn't transfer was her confidence. But you know, ever since I got her she's always been unsure of new things. I'm sure we all remember the tarps. LOL. (Which she doesn't care about at all anymore, by the way!) Among other things. But you're right, it's a totally different experience for her under saddle. She is used to looking to me as a partner, I'm sure it's a little unnerving for her to have her leader on her back. It's just different. I try to talk to her a lot when I ride her because I would like to think my voice comforts her. 

I actually think I know exactly what caused her initial bucking issues in the first place. I won't go into too many details because it was a negative situation that I'm not in, any longer. 

Anyways. I'm supposed to ride her on Saturday. I rode her again since my last entry. No bucking! She did think about bolting but I one rein stopped her and went on to ride as if nothing happened. She did very well. I need to work on yielding her hindquarters, backing, and side passing under saddle. There are my Saturday goals.


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## horseylover1_1

Joy and I had a fabulous day today! We worked on picking up her inside shoulder with inside leg and rein. She was a little sluggish at first but eventually got it. She was so lazy during her ride. 

We are going to work on it more tomorrow. She is moving off my leg fairly well considering she has about 10 rides on her. ("Real" rides. Of course I have sat on her before). 

I'll post tomorrow and maybe get some pics and/or video!


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## horseylover1_1

Joy rode really nicely for me today.

I think it's safe to say we are past the bucking (of course, I say that, and tomorrow she'll decide she wants to throw a fit) 

She is on her... umm... 12th ride? Approximately. I don't work her often - partly because of time and partly because she's only two and a half. I ride her maybe 2x a week for 30 mins at a time. 

I've been working on the collection cue. That is one thing that I thought would be soooo easy to learn and it's taken me 9 months to START to truly understand it. I used to think it was about getting them to lower their head. Nope. If anything, when you focus on the head too much, you may bring them into false frame. So I have been working on getting Joy soft - moving off of inside leg and rein, outside leg and rein, and any combination of those 4 things. I've also been working on getting her forward. She is a bit on the lazy side, which a lot of Friesian trainers attribute as a "breed thing." My trainer has taught me that with the exception of a few horses, there is nothing that physically prevents a horse from loping forward consistently. So no excuses. Lol.

When a horse is soft and forward, you can begin to ask for collection. I started on the cue the last time I rode her and quit after she picked her back up and used hindquarters - even thought she only did it for one or two seconds. Today, she was able to hold it for 2-5 seconds. Hopefully next ride it'll be 5-10, 10-15, and in a few more rides I'll have her moving nicely. 

My goals for next ride are:

- Work on collection
- Work on backing up
- Work on side passing

And whatever else she may need as things come up.


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## horseylover1_1

New learning curve!

She doesn’t want to pick up her left lead. Which is frustrating because I’ve seen her do it on the ground countless times as a baby. She actually has some gorgeous flying lead changes. 

Just a thing we will need to work through. She got frustrated because she didn’t understand why I kept asking her to lope off and then bring her down to the trot and asking again. I get it. I didn’t get mad at her, she WAS trying to understand. And of course I set her up to take the correct lead but she’s too green to really understand. By the end of it she was tired and I’ve learned with her that sometimes it’s better just to call it a day then work on it till she gets it right. She burns out mentally very quickly. So next time I ride her I’ll start going toward the left (usually we go right, her good side) and work on exercises at the walk and trot to get her to pick up that correct lead. 

Thankfully in the past few months I’ve been learning how to set them up to take the correct lead so we will get there.


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## horseylover1_1

My trainer worked with me on getting Joy’s left lead on the ground.. though we haven’t practiced it under saddle yet. 

Check out this video I got from today! This is approx her 15th-20th ride, super happy with her so far!


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## whisperbaby22

Both of you look just amazing.


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## PoptartShop

Nice video! About the lead, yeah she may be weaker on that side. The more you work on it, the better it will be. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you so much @whisperbaby22 and @PoptartShop !!! I really appreciate the kind words and feedback. I like getting other people's opinions. Good and bad. Because I am definitely biased when it comes to Joy! 

I think she has gotten a bit weaker on that side. Probably partly my fault because going to the right is my favorite direction too, don't ask me why! Come to think of it, I almost always start my rides off going to the right.. the other half I think is just being a baby and not understanding leads, and how to use her body under saddle, all green horse stuff. 

When she isn't being lazy she arches her neck real pretty and has more knee action. Her sire carries himself really nicely too. With time I will push her into the bridle more. I don't really want to ask much of her yet. If I maintain a lot of contact she does tuck her nose in but that's not really what I'm after right now. I'm more concerned about her learning to use her hindquarters properly, get off my leg, be responsive, be soft and quiet, etc. Her head is the last thing I need to concentrate on... which is hard... everyone wants their horse in a nice headset. But I know her head will fall into place as she learns to use her body correctly. Just gotta be patient.


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## whisperbaby22

Most of us as riders have "sides" we prefer. It's good to keep an eye on that.

As for how she moves, keep in mind the friesian part of her. I have never ridden one, but I sure see a lot of these horses being ridden. They naturally have a more uphill hollow backed way of moving. She doesn't show that so much here, so she may stay more in this appaloosa way of moving. How she moves when she's just fooling around on her own will be her more natural style of movement.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> Most of us as riders have "sides" we prefer. It's good to keep an eye on that.
> 
> As for how she moves, keep in mind the friesian part of her. I have never ridden one, but I sure see a lot of these horses being ridden. They naturally have a more uphill hollow backed way of moving. She doesn't show that so much here, so she may stay more in this appaloosa way of moving. How she moves when she's just fooling around on her own will be her more natural style of movement.


True, when she is excited and playing and full of energy she has more spring to her step. She was dragging her feet a bit in this LOL - I always say I'd rather have a horse on the lazy side than hot. Some people argue that hot horses make better show horses but I'd rather feel safe than anything. Not to mention that horses are typically more hyped up at a show than they are at home. So you're naturally going to get more "horse" anyway - and if they're hard to handle at home I personally have no desire to show it!


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## horseylover1_1

Oh, and lead update. I had a really good trainer hop on her and he was able to get her to lope on the left lead twice however he said she's really really tough and I'd say between the two of us we had to lope her off at least 35-40 times before she took it! 

She's always been that way, though. She'll get stuck on something and usually will not come out of it for the longest time. I used to think it was just me but working with other horses and having other people work with Joy have confirmed - it's her. That's just how she is.

But it's made me a better trainer because I have to think outside of the box a LOT for her. And we always get past it, and once we do, she is SO solid. It took countless trial and errors to get her to do liberty circles around me at the trot but when she finally figured out it's what I wanted, she did it beautifully and still does.


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## whisperbaby22

Also keep in mind her natural temperament may be on the lazy side. The reason that I see so many where I live is that we have a large vaquero population, whose natural go to horse is the andalusian, but a lot of these week end riders (who to be fair have to work) found the andys too high spirited to handle. The friesian has the exaggerated movement with a even temperament that is easy to handle. 

A lot of these guys have moved on to quarter horses and aztecas for riding. But there are still a lot of friesians around.


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## horseylover1_1

I was really really really happy with how she rode today. I asked for more energy from her than last time and was pleased with how much she tried for me. I'm hoping/supposed to get pictures tomorrow.
@whisperbaby22 She's definitely on the lazy side. I originally thought she'd have a lot of knee action in her movements but after riding her today I don't think she will. Which is fine with me. Some Friesians are so hard to ride because their movements are so exaggerated. 

I've never been around Andalusians. I thought they were more on the lazy side? Guess not?


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## whisperbaby22

She's so young it's hard to tell how she will move when she's fully grown and trained. But yes, the rounder the movement the harder it looks to ride. I see my vaquero buddies kind of bouncing around on these horses, it take a real rider to sit them. 

Only breeders will say their horses are gentle. A lot of ads around here have little kids sitting on stallions saying that a 4 year old is gentle and any one can ride. We all know that is just bunk. Andalusians are war horses, they are not for kids.


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## horseylover1_1

I don't really know why people think that posing a kid with a horse for a picture equates to "kid safe horse" - it amazes me what people consider "quiet" and "well broke." 

Ok, so I kind of stole this from another thread but thought I'd start a discussion in here as well.

What are your goals for 2019 and did you meet your 2018 goals? If you didn't have any goals, how'd your year go? 

Here is what I wrote on the other thread..

*What has happened this year?*

I made a goal for myself in 2017 that I would take my horse training goal to the next level and I definitely did just that. I started interning about 20 hours/week with a successful, respected, professional trainer in the area. I'm happy with my progress overall, albeit I get frustrated very easily and don't take learning curves well. At all. My trainer may mention that my leads "need work" and that'll send me into a "I'll never figure this out, I am bad at this, I'll never be good enough to be a professional horse trainer..." I also sell real estate so another goal was to do well selling homes in 2018 - and I had a good year! 

*What are your plans for next year?*

Continue my training. Learn to show, especially. I'm going to be interning with someone else in 2019. I am going to miss my trainer a lot but I'll be too far away from her (drive time like over 2 hours) to continue. I'd like to meet or exceed my real estate sales in 2019. But my main goal is to be kinder to myself and think more positively and make changes to help with that. (Such as not skipping breakfast, sleep, etc.) I have chronic anxiety and I need to learn to take care of it better.

What about you guys?


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## SummerBliss

Those sound like really good goals to have! And also congrats at managing to accomplish the ones you had set for the year. It can be difficult to accomplish those sometimes. 
I didn't really go into this year with too many goals myself. Simply to learn how to survive on my own I suppose since I moved out on my own for the first time in February lol. This year has been full of a TON of changes for me but I have managed to improve in different areas despite not setting any goals. 

*Plans for next year?*
I have so many lol The main ones would be to improve my riding skills. I have a trainer that I'm going to be taking lessons from as well as have my own horses that I recently got. I also want to learn more about training horses and also start learning and teaching my horses liberty work which I think would be a lot of fun. Current biggest goal is to win over the trust and respect of my newest mare since she's had a rough past. A long term goal that won't get done this year, but I can start taking steps toward it, is to get to the point of running my own horse rescue/sanctuary center. 

Wishing all a great and successful new year


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## horseylover1_1

Those sound like awesome goals, @SummerBliss . Really, I think a goal of opening a horse sanctuary would be a very fruitful one. Working closely with a legitimate trainer is very important so it's good you're going down that road. Also, if you're interested in liberty I recommend Oreo Liberty on Youtube. I LOVE her approach! 

Thank you very much  Hopefully I'll have some successful stories to post on her in the coming months!


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## horseylover1_1

It finally snowed here!

We only got, like, 2 inches. But my trainer and I got some beautiful pictures of the horses in the snow. I could not get over how "Friesian" she looks. She doesn't really look like a cross, at least not in pictures. You can tell in person because she's so short. I hope that maybe she will have one more growth spurt. Being that she's coming up on 3 this spring it's very possible. 

She's really starting to ride nicely. She has been a little all over the place so I've been trying to work her off the rail as we are both using it as a crutch. If she's going to be a dressage horse, we absolutely cannot depend on it. (I guess no horse/rider should, really...) 

I hope I can get pics of me riding her soon! I always seem to run out of time!


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## horseylover1_1

No caption needed


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## GMA100

I haven’t been here in a while, but I’m amazed at how good you and Joy have come along! She’s just plain beautiful! You’ve done an amazing job!


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## PoptartShop

Lovely pictures!!!!!  So cute!


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## LoriF

She's gotten really big!! She's a little over 2 1/2 years old right? How tall is she now?


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## JoBlueQuarter

She's so gorgeous!! Love the pics! <3


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you all! @GMA100 , @PoptartShop , @LoriF , @JoBlueQuarter 

She will be 3 in late April. She is still on the short side but starting to grow into herself a bit. I have a feeling she is going to hit one more growth spurt this summer and be 99% done growing after that. I haven't measured her recently - I need to. I want to say the last time I measured her she was 14 or 14.1. I remember she was technically still pony sized. Wouldn't surprise me if she was 14.2 now. I am pretty short myself so thankfully I don't look big on her (at least I don't think so). 

I'm attaching more Joy pics cause I'm kind of obsessed with her right now :lol:


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## horseylover1_1

Oh and taking a poll. I want to make one of the pictures my profile pic on FB. Which one says "professional horse trainer" the most to you? LOL


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## whisperbaby22

The third from the bottom.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> The third from the bottom.


The first picture in post #306?

Also if so why is it your favorite? I really, really like the very first one but she looks like she is on the fence about collecting in that picture. Which is more than expected @ 25 rides. But I want something that looks.. well professional. 

I'm not going to train client horses myself for a while yet, but it's never too early to make a good impression...


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## whisperbaby22

Joy looks good in all the photos. You are trying to sell yourself in this photo. Take a look at the professional photos other trainers use. I just happen to think that that photo is the one that makes you look the most professional.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> Joy looks good in all the photos. You are trying to sell yourself in this photo. Take a look at the professional photos other trainers use. I just happen to think that that photo is the one that makes you look the most professional.


Thanks I really appreciate it!!


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## horseylover1_1

Well I am super excited!!

Joy and I went to our first show under saddle together last weekend! She was AMAZING! I was riding another horse at the show and we got there late, so I only had time to warm up one horse. The other horse was feisty and our classes were first so I rode her. She did great - got a first, second, and third place on that horse. 

Joy's classes were next. There was really no way to warm her up because they had classes going on in the arena. This particular arena causes horses to spook a LOT because there are stalls about 10 feet away from the rail on about 80% of the arena and you can see through to the aisle ways which is where people tend to hang out. I did trot her around outside for about 5 mins but it started snowing so I went in the barn aisle way. 

I was SO nervous going into my first class on a horse at her first show that hadn't really even been warmed up. But she absolutely KILLED it! She was AMAZING! She stayed collected the entire time, her transitions were beautiful, and she listened to me the entire time. I almost teared up I was so proud. And she came in 2nd out of 9 or 10 horses! And most of these horses had much more time on them, I'd say she by far had less rides than any other horse there. She had about 35 rides on her at that point. Oh my gosh I was grinning from ear to ear. 

Her second class didn't go as well, but it was still good. It was a green horse class and a lot of the green horses in that class were going sideways, cutting each other off, etc etc. Just green horse stuff. She gets really nervous when horses crowd her so she stopped once and her head came up a few times. Still not bad though! That's what a schooling show is for! 

So yeah. I can't wait to keep showing her this year. I plan on doing as many schooling shows as I can this year. Not worried about placing or anything. It's going to be a year of light riding, exposure, and fun. Hopefully by next year she'll be a solid little dressage horse. 

It's just an amazing feeling to see this horse that I've had since she was a weanling grow up into such a nice 3 year old.


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## whisperbaby22

Congratulations, does she get a lot of attention because she is Friesian?


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## JoBlueQuarter

Omgosh I'm so proud of you two!! It's been amazing following y'all from the beginning to this, her first ever show under saddle! And what an accomplishment for you too, considering that you started her yourself and brought her all this way! I know I'd be just about bursting with pride, lol. Good job you two! )


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you so much! @JoBlueQuarter @whisperbaby22 yes, a lot of people came up and complimented her. There were other Friesians there though she kinda fit in. Haha.

I can't believe I haven't posted here in over a month. I just haven't really had time. My trainer is moving early April. I am trying to work out training with someone else but my schedule is filling up so much that it's getting overwhelming. Joy is coming back to my house soon which is bittersweet. There is nowhere to ride. I am just feeling like I am in a bit of a funk. Seems like nothing is working out for me timing wise and there are WAY too many details to put in my journal. I'll be sure to post anything significant that comes up...

I have been working with Joy on a couple of things. Bareback and bridleless riding (which she is awesome at!) and picking up the left lead. Thank goodness she is FINALLY starting to get it. That was a HUGE challenge. 

My trainer made a video of Joy and I -


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## horseylover1_1

Well, my trainer has moved away and I am currently without an internship.. I am going to resume it as soon as possible with another reputable horseman but my husband wants me to take a break for a bit to get some bills under control. It's really hard not to go to the barn every day and continue learning how to train but I am trying to be reasonable about it. 

My friend did drop off her horse at my house for me to train. His name is Rusty. He is on his 4th ride w/ me. He's pretty broke as far as not being spooky or anything but knows absolutely nothing. Can't stop, turn, and didn't even lope when I got him. He is sweet though and very smart so I am excited to see what I can do with him in a few weeks. 

So, @horseluvr2524 despite my original plan not to teach Joy how to rear I have started on it. LOL. ONLY because I worked with a professional liberty trainer for a year and learned how to do it correctly and safely. Not to mention, Joy just may be used for expos soon. :wink:


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## whisperbaby22

Life does often make horses take a back seat, but you are so lucky to be able to do anything at all with horses, so many horse lovers just can't make it work. 

Your talent will keep, opportunities will come along.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> Life does often make horses take a back seat, but you are so lucky to be able to do anything at all with horses, so many horse lovers just can't make it work.
> 
> Your talent will keep, opportunities will come along.


This really meant a lot to me... Thank you.... I know it wasn't a long reply but it really touched me. 

I need to buy a UV fly sheet for Joy. She's getting sun bleached :frown_color: 

Rusty is doing really well. We've had a couple rough rides but that's normal when training. Honestly, considering his background, I'm surprised there hasn't been more resistance from him. I've had him less than 2 weeks and he's riding like he has closer to 30 days on him. I attached pictures. He did not lope under saddle at all when I got him.. and would only trot a couple of steps. Didn't really turn (which we are still working on)


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## horseylover1_1

I got pictures of Joy rearing! Not much height yet, but I am focusing on consistency and doing it safely right now.


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## whisperbaby22

Oh she looks great.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> Oh she looks great.


Thank you!! The more I look at the picture, the more I think her rear is quite levade-like... She balances herself nicely. Maybe I'm biased.

It may be kind of cool to teach her piaffe and capriole. I'd love to do stuff like that with her. It's more advanced but she is so smart, I think she could do it.


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## whisperbaby22

No, you're right. She is balanced and not so much rearing as doing the levade thing. At some point in the future you could probably teach her to do it. To bad her tail is tied up, that could be a real great promotion photo for you. I mean it is, but she sure would look pretty with a full tail.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> No, you're right. She is balanced and not so much rearing as doing the levade thing. At some point in the future you could probably teach her to do it. To bad her tail is tied up, that could be a real great promotion photo for you. I mean it is, but she sure would look pretty with a full tail.


Good thinking! I'm going to have my husband take some pro pics of her rearing up.. maybe could use to advertise. :smile:

I took Joy out to do a liberty in the field tonight. Omg, she did so well. She was loping circles around me at liberty (tight ones), running with me, playing, and reared when I asked. It was pure magic. Liberty is like a beautiful freestyle dance. She really expresses herself at liberty, too. Running and bucking and getting excited. Nothing brings me as much joy as that - not even a good ride.


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## horseylover1_1

Ever feel like you're super busy but aren't really getting anything worthwhile accomplished?

That's been me the past few weeks. I mean, sure, in my head I am thinking that, _of course _ landscaping our lawn, attending an out of state wedding for a family member, working on our new business, and riding Joy is all important in their own way. 

Ugh. I guess I'm just in a funk. My real estate has slowed down a bit, the new business is having typical new business woes, and I miss training horses _terribly._ I have Joy and Nash, of course, but somehow it's just not the same as training for others. Even as an intern. 

Recent pics of Joy. Ignore my horrible outfit. I like riding English but hate English spurs and boots so I usually ride half Western.


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## horseylover1_1

Opinions please?

I’m going back and forth on my opinion of how Joy carries herself at a lope. 

I don’t really care about headset, but I do care about her being soft, using her hindquarters, and carrying herself properly. 

When she rides like this she feels good. But looking at the pictures.. I don’t see other Friesians carrying themselves like this. She looks like a ranch horse in the one picture. All the best horsemen I’ve ever talked to have said that if a horse is using their body correctly, it doesn’t matter where the head falls. Which I understand, except she just doesn’t look like a English/dressage horse to me... ugh. I wish my trainer lived close. 

Any thoughts?


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## whisperbaby22

I'd have to see a video of her to make a better opinion, but I think you might be better off with her moving this way. Most of the friesians I see are stallions, and they always carry themselves differently, but these horses are bouncy. They look pretty but these guys that ride them really smack smack smack down the trail on these horses. 

I know lots of people love the way they move, but I see a lot of these horses in action, and I would never ride one.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> I'd have to see a video of her to make a better opinion, but I think you might be better off with her moving this way. Most of the friesians I see are stallions, and they always carry themselves differently, but these horses are bouncy. They look pretty but these guys that ride them really smack smack smack down the trail on these horses.
> 
> I know lots of people love the way they move, but I see a lot of these horses in action, and I would never ride one.


I started a thread in the training section and some of the suggestions were helpful. I'm starting to gather that there is no reason she can't pick herself up. It's common to see the ranch horses carry themselves the way she does but dressage horses pick up their shoulders a lot more. 

The video I got today wasn't the best. I am going to school her for a week or two and see what I can get. 

Appreciate your feedback as always whisperbaby!!!


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## WildestDandelion

Just discovered this journal and lets just say I haven't gotten anything done at work today! I have loved reading your guys' journey so far.


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## GrittyGrulla

She's adorable!! Pink looks good on her too!!!


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## horseylover1_1

CamBam said:


> Just discovered this journal and lets just say I haven't gotten anything done at work today! I have loved reading your guys' journey so far.


Awww you made my day! Glad to have you :smile:

Thanks GrittyGrulla!

I haven’t ridden her all week. Heat index has been 115. They even cancelled one of the larger local horse shows in the area - which they usually never do. So you know it’s too hot to ride safely. I have been riding Nash late in the evening after it cools off to 88 degrees (plus humidity). Unfortunately it’s too dark by the time I’m done with him to ride her. And I’m not one to wake up at 5 am to ride before it gets hot. So.

It’s going to be 75 this week though! And mostly dry! Can’t wait!!


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## horseylover1_1

Wasn't sure if I wanted to post this or not.. but I have always been an open book, so here goes.

I have been too depressed to work Joy. The person I was borrowing the saddle from asked for it back (which she lent to me for a very long while and was very generous about it) and the Western I have doesn't fit Joy correctly. I am not much into bareback riding when I am trying to fancy train my horses. I actually don't like riding bareback much at all. And as far as liberty goes she hasn't been doing very well with it because of how inconsistent I've been. I force myself to work Nash every day because he has that 2 Yr Old Challenge coming up in September. But I have no motivation to work Joy right now. At all. Can't show her, can't trail ride her, can't even ride her around the property because I have about 1/2 acre I can ride on in the first place. I do OK when I am doing concentrated training but it gets so old so fast. 

I have told a couple people that and the general consensus is that she's 3 and a few months off won't kill her. It would actually be beneficial since she is still a baby. But I know how much potential she has and it just makes me want to cry that I can't give that to her right now. 

So that's been my life the past few months. 

I hope this ends. I hate the numb feeling, I hate the defeated feeling, I hate not being able to do the one thing that brings me joy... riding my horse... :frown_color:


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## whisperbaby22

I've been thinking about this, and while there may be several reasons, the most common one is probably what is going on with you. I think you are just going through some growing pains, mentally speaking. Let yourself just float for a while. And yes, letting Joy sit for a while is just fine. Horses don't forget things, you can pick it right back up when the time is right.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> I've been thinking about this, and while there may be several reasons, the most common one is probably what is going on with you. I think you are just going through some growing pains, mentally speaking. Let yourself just float for a while. And yes, letting Joy sit for a while is just fine. Horses don't forget things, you can pick it right back up when the time is right.


Thank you.. yes thankfully they tend to pick up where you left off. It’s like riding a bike. You might need some conditioning and refreshers after a lot of time off but they don’t “forget” either. Very thankful that lack of riding doesn’t usually cause regression. Although there’s always exceptions. 

She does have a dressage show in November I have a ride for. So I’m going to train with that in mind. Not to mention there’s a 3 day liberty show at the KHP I may be able to take her to. Even a small schooling show is enough motivation for me to ride. And I did find a $260 Collegiate saddle I may try out. I really wanted to spend between $800-$1000 on something but I’ve not been able to find one (I swear there are $300-$400 saddles or $2500+, nothing in between) and we have some expenses coming up that make buying a saddle not the wisest choice at the moment.

Ugh. To be a millionaire right? Having horses would be so much easier :icon_rolleyes::icon_rolleyes:


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## leannacinquanta

whisperbaby22 said:


> letting Joy sit for a while is just fine. Horses don't forget things, you can pick it right back up when the time is right.


YES. Relax :smile: I started both my Friesian sporthorses and they're now 9 and 6. They sit in the pasture most of the year, cared for by Mom. As a nonprofit director I'm always either on the road or the other side of the planet so I get over to ride for like two weeks at a time, about four times a year. Even so, they never forget anything. We just pick up where we left off. It's getting challenging now with my mare who is into 2nd Level and working on some 3rd stuff, because she gets so fat and out of shape and it takes awhile to condition her, but brain-wise the time off never sets us back. Enjoy your baby, don't stress, and let her mature into her bright future. My 6 yr old 3/4 Friesian is still growing!


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## PoptartShop

Awww, I'm sorry you are feeling down lately. :sad: Things will get better though. I think the $260 saddle is a good idea, plus her body may change as she grows, so you probably don't want to spend a fortune on a saddle (although you could sell it, too). Don't stress, she is still young & everything will fall into place like it's supposed to.


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you so so much everyone. I have some *super* exciting news!

We got a trailer today! Like, a beautiful 2 horse, aluminum, Sundowner! I am still in shock. As of 2 weeks ago a trailer was out of the question. But I guess my husband thought about it and decided that the monthly payment would be doable. I crunched some numbers. I am trading the 2 yr old I have been working with to lease a fat mini horse to keep Joy company, which will save a lot of $$ per month. Almost enough to pay the entire trailer payment. He was due to leave late Sept anyway. I will miss him dearly. Honestly in some ways I am just as attached to him as I am Joy. He will always hold a very special place in my heart as the first horse I ever trained by myself. I can't even say that about Joy. But it just wasn't in the cards to buy or lease him long term. I haven't minded feeding him at all, but he is a very hard keeper. I am sure he will grow out of it eventually, but at 2, he is just shooting up so fast. I hope we do well at the challenge. 

Anyway, right now pursuing professional training isn't doable but I feel like having a trailer that I can haul Joy to different arenas and shows (liberty, hunt seat, and dressage) can help set me apart as a trainer in the future if she does well. She certainly has the potential to be a NICE show horse. Much as I enjoyed working with Nash, it will be a bit of a relief to focus time and energy on one horse for now - the one that deserves it from me more than any other horse. She will be 4 next show year, too. A good age. It is possible I'll be able to revisit training early next spring. 

The saddle is still a minor issue but I have a few months to figure that one out. I was able to get a pad that makes the Western saddle fit Joy well enough to school in. My friend said I could borrow her saddle for shows still. So I am not going to dwell on it. 

I cannot wait to post updates! I am hauling Joy and Nash to a show Sept 14th. Riding classes for Nash and a liberty class for Joy! It's a schooling show. The challenge is the 28th and then there is a hunt seat schooling show 5 mins from me on Oct 26th.. and then I think we will do a schooling Dressage show in November.


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## carshon

Congratulations on the new trailer! It is amazing the feeling of freedom it gives you just knowing it is there at your disposal. Can't wait to see more updates and pics of the new mini!


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## PoptartShop

Congrats on the new trailer, how exciting!  It's the best feeling knowing you have your own & can pretty much go wherever, whenever! Definitely feels more secure.

I'm glad you figured out some padding & you will be able to borrow her saddle also. How exciting!  Can't wait to hear about the show!


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## horseylover1_1

Thanks so much you two! It definitely changes things. I was telling my mom that having a horse without having a trailer is like having a beautiful new car you can't drive. Sure, you can look at it, wash it, even sit in it, but it's not the same as being able to get it out and drive it. If I had more land I would not feel that way but there is literally nowhere to ride at my house. The road is a narrow old state highway too with tons of hills and a speed limit of like 55 (and cars going 70) so it is not safe to ride down the road where I live.

But yes sooooo excited! The Sept 14th show is like the most schooling show of all schooling shows. Lol. It's just a local farm where everyone comes together and rides - $6 classes. But that is perfect for Joy and Nash. It's just to get them out. They do have a few English classes but they usually start at like 6ish so I probably will ditch beforehand.


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## PoptartShop

I know, I didn't have a trailer for a bit after I got my horse, it sucked always having to depend on people! & most people would say they'd haul us, but then back out last minute. :icon_rolleyes: So much better having your own.  

You're gonna have a blast at the show!


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## horseylover1_1

That happened to me a lot too @PoptartShop . People have good intentions I think but it seems like something always comes up. And I hate to ask anyway. 

I will let everyone know how it goes!

In case anyone is wondering how Nash is doing, he is really starting to ride nice! He had 2 (maybe 3?) days off the past couple days and I rode him today and he was really good. One thing that I am noticing with him is I am trying to put "fancy buttons" on him. He is doing awesome with it, but I do find he gets the buttons mixed up sometimes. I am not sure if it's because I am sending mixed signals sometimes (probably) or it's just because of his age and normal for a young horse to do. He's got maybe 45-50 rides on him.


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## horseylover1_1

I’ve put Joy back on the work schedule and I’m super pleased with her progress so far!! Her trot is _really_ starting to come along. Her canter leaves a lot to be desired .. but she’s only been back in work for a week, so I’m trying not to dwell on it. Her trot though.. omg it’s starting to look pretty. I can’t wait to post an update video. 

She’s been tripping a LOT lately. Like I can’t even canter her without her stumbling. I’m not 100% sure why, I feel like it’s because she’s unbalanced but she is fine in an arena. The area I ride on is super dry grass and hilly. But other horses haven’t really had issues. And she only trips when she canters. I’m going to trailer her to an arena and see if I see improvement. 

The 2 yr old challenge is Saturday. I’m nervous!


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## PoptartShop

Glad Nash is doing well! & Joy is probably happy to be back on a schedule, so glad to hear her progressing!  The trot sounds lovely! Yay!
It could be the dry/hard ground making her stumble - my horse is barefoot & very surefooted, but the ground has been irritating her a lot lately, I can tell she struggles at times, because it's just SO dry/hard, we haven't had any rain in weeks. :sad: If she's fine in the arena then I wouldn't worry too much. The dry ground can be rough on them.

Good luck tomorrow, let us know how it goes!


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you @PoptartShop ! So it's dry where you are too? We haven't had an substantial rain in about a month (if not longer). You're in the midwest aren't you? I'm near Louisville, KY.

Nash did AMAZING on Saturday. It was literally our/my best show ever. He got 1st place in our rail class and 2nd in the trail class. Unfortunately I got confused on the rules of the cow class and practically got DQ'd. Technically I didn't, and we did get a score, but it was low. And he's a bit gangly so we didn't do well in conformation. But we still got 3rd overall! I had a lot of compliments on him. It's so cool because he is the first horse I have started and trained by myself. (My trainer did take him for a week to work him on cattle and stuff though). 

And apparently Joy woke up yesterday morning and decided she did want to be soft and collect at the canter.  Our next show is the 13th of October.


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## angelica13

wow sounds amazing congrats looking forward to hear about your journey


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## carshon

Congratulations! Great pix.


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## whisperbaby22

Yea, I second congrats, and great photos.


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## PoptartShop

Congrats!!  SO happy to hear the show went well. Great pictures. Glad you had a good time!!

& yes, today it FINALLY rained...but hasn't in weeks! I'm in MD, east coast. But everything has been so dry!


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you all!!

It’s raining!! After about 45 dry days it’s finally raining! Unfortunately it’s gotten so dry that I think the grass in the paddock is done for the year. But hopefully the ground will be a bit softer so Joy can get a better grip.

Here’s an updated pic of her. 

She’s been riding pretty well. She’s relatively soft (there is room for improvement but I’ve only had her back in work a couple of weeks - not complaining), and I’m happy with how she is using herself especially at the trot. But a couple of people on other sites have mentioned that she’s not picking her shoulder up enough. She uses her hindquarters but instead of bringing her shoulders up she is doing a bit of a “long and low” movement although her poll is actually right about where her withers are. Will try getting video. But I’ve mostly been working on softness and self carriage. I don’t think she’s physically ready to push much harder. She’s also got much more impulsion now. I guess I should get with a dressage trainer sometime next year.


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## PoptartShop

What a beautiful picture!  Joy is gorgeous!


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## horseylover1_1

It is so muddy here. :? And it's only November...

I tried something new this weekend... Dressage... I have never even had a dressage lesson let alone competed in a new show but I winged it this weekend. Joy did well (she usually does). I unfortunately forgot one pattern and made a mistake on another. When I asked, they told me it was technically considered a "schooling show" but I personally felt it was a bit high caliber for what I would consider a schooling show. So I was slightly embarrassed because of it. I felt like I was the only one there that didn't really know what she was doing. 

I didn't go deep enough in my corners and apparently my circles were too oval-y. :| I didn't realize how important those two things were. If I had done better my scores would have been quite a bit higher. Pretty much every comment was "go deeper in corner" and "O not round" or something to that extent. I am thankful for the judges comments though. She said Joy and I have lots of potential which my DH said is a nice way of saying it wasn't that good. :lol:

She did get good marks on impulsion/gaits (7) and submission (6) which I felt for a 3 year old wasn't too bad. 

I think I'd like to do more dressage, but I told hubby I would not do any more shows until spring (cost/time). I am actually working with someone who does ranch horse and I am thinking about showing my Friesian in ranch classes... LOL.. right.. I mean you never know I guess. If judges place her well I will continue showing her in ranch. If not I will take lessons in hunt seat/dressage. 

I actually just bought another horse. His name is Koa. He will be 2 April and he's registered AQHA. I'll post pics sometime. Joy needed a companion and he will make a good project.


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## JoBlueQuarter

Good for you trying dressage! I really want to try that too. Even if you're not hella serious about it the type of criticism you get in dressage classes seems like it would be very helpful in the overall training of a horse.

That's really cool! I'd love to see a friesian doing ranch classes  They look a lot of fun too.

You just introduced a new horse and didn't even post pictures?! The nerve :lol: That's awesome though! Can't wait to hear more about him and your plans for him


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## PoptartShop

Congrats on the new horse!  & that's awesome you tried something new. Why not?! Always good to keep things interesting. Sky is the limit!


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## WildestDandelion

what a way to just casually slide a new horse purchase into conversation XD


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## horseylover1_1

Haaa thanks everyone! Yeah I guess I just threw that in there because I am so used to having new horses come in and out and working with different ones that it doesn't seem as big of a deal that this one just so happens to be in my name. :lol:

I have a few plans w/ him for next year. Hopefully we accomplish some things! 

He's my 2 year old challenge horse for next year. I really need to go ahead and start doing stuff like side passing and lunging to give him a head start. He's not worried about much. He's pretty confident which is good! His full sister is pretty quick but I hope he is slightly on lazier side. (I think he will be)


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## JoBlueQuarter

Awwww he's really cute! has a very nice look to him. Congrats!


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## whisperbaby22

Nice, I like him.


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## PoptartShop

Wow, he is gorgeous. Love his mane! Congratulations!!  He has such a sweet kind face.


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you all... he is really growing on me. 

I've been riding under someone new. I've waited so long to have the opportunity to apprentice under someone. I am only able to go once a week, but I get to take Koa and Joy and work them both. I have a great mentor! Very experienced and respected horseman. 

I love talking about 2020 goals... so here is mine.

1. Take Koa to the world show this year. They have a 2 year old class
2. Show Joy ranch horse this year. I was so on the fence about this. I doubt she will do really well because she's an English type, but since I have been involved in ranch horse so long I don't want to spread myself too thin trying to figure dressage, jumping, hunt seat, reining etc. all at once. So just focusing on one thing. She actually rides pretty ranch-y, for a Friesian.
3. Take Joy to the ILHA show (liberty show)
4. Win the 2 yr old challenge on Koa

I'm sure I will add some goals to this list, but those are the main ones.

P.S. This is my new favorite pic :smile:

What are your 2020 goals?


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## carshon

That picture is spectacular! I love goals. Please keep us posted on your progress. We love to live vicariously via our Forum friends.


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## PoptartShop

That picture is amazing. Wow! I love it! The goals are really good that you have, too. Excited to see where 2020 takes you!


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## horseylover1_1

Thank you all!

I have super exciting news.... that I can't post yet. But I should be able to any day, just waiting on the official announcement. 

It's something I have dreamt about for awhile!


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## horseylover1_1

I can finally post my exciting news!!!!

Joy and I were selected to perform/compete in an invitational only musical liberty performance at Equine Affaire in Columbus, Ohio in April! I could not be more excited! I have wanted to do something like this for awhile and now I get a chance to do so! :dance-smiley05:

It will be hosted by the International Liberty Horse Association. If you haven't heard of it, I would highly recommend checking it out! It is a great organization for all who love liberty!

I hope to get plenty of pictures!


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## knightrider

This is wonderful and amazing! Congratulations! Wish I could be there to see it, but be sure to post video! So proud of you!


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## PoptartShop

That is so exciting!   Definitely post video and photos! April is not too far away, that's so awesome!!


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## whisperbaby22

That's really neat. Looking forward to the pics.


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## horseylover1_1

Thanks everyone!! I wish some of you were going but I don't think anyone that follows my journal is in Ohio.

Yes it is close. :shock: Which means I have approximately 4 weeks to decide on a musical performance/freestyle. Which, I have a couple in mind, but picking something is going to be hard for me. I want to give the audience goosebumps. I am up against the best liberty trainers in the country/world (literally), so it is a bit daunting! I think I'm the only one with a Friesian though!


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## horseylover1_1

As I’m sure everyone knows, Equine Affaire is cancelled. 

BUT I got to ride Joy yesterday - guys - this horse is so awesome. She has only been ridden twice in the past six weeks (been doing tons of liberty prep) and she came out riding like this.

How is everyone doing with the coronavirus? What’s your new “normal?”


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## whisperbaby22

I'm lucky enough to have my horse in my back yard, and am able to ride but since it would be embarrassing to end up in the ER due to a stupid horse accident I am staying off my usual trails and only riding in the sand. It's pretty deep and I just feel safer out there right now. 

I feel lucky to ride at all, some of the members here that lease don't have access to their horses at all.


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## horseylover1_1

whisperbaby22 said:


> I'm lucky enough to have my horse in my back yard, and am able to ride but since it would be embarrassing to end up in the ER due to a stupid horse accident I am staying off my usual trails and only riding in the sand. It's pretty deep and I just feel safer out there right now.
> 
> I feel lucky to ride at all, some of the members here that lease don't have access to their horses at all.


True.. our local hospitals are not overrun but if I lived in a county with a lot of cases I would be extra cautious to not end up in the ER.

Glad you can ride though, I so feel for horse owners that can't visit their horses right now! I would be going stir crazy if I couldn't!


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## horseylover1_1

Can’t believe it’s been 9 months since I signed on here... 

Joy is pretty much at the same place as she was 9 months ago. More liberty work, little riding. She’s probably been ridden 10 times since August? 😬 If I’m being generous.

I did get a Pivo to record my rides (more so with Koa, my coming 3 year old ranch/performance horse). But I got some footage of Joy a couple days ago. She rides OK for something that never gets ridden,😅. I may put her back in my riding routine because I can tell she’s getting bored


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## whisperbaby22

She is looking real nice, more friesian all the time.


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## JoBlueQuarter

She looks awesome! Really cool tricks too. Good to see you back here!!


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## PoptartShop

I love my Pivo!!!  Good choice!

She is so cute! Glad to see an update!


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