# What are you saying with blinders or without?



## Paradise

I think blinkers depend on the horse and how it was trained. 

Our teams have always worn blinkers and are more comfortable with them. Plus the blinkers are on most of the bridles so thats all they ever wear. We had a Percheron team that literally couldn't go without them or you'd be in the ditch every time a vehicle went by. Same horses were just fine in heavy traffic. .with the blinkers

Given the choice I'd rather train a horse not to need them but what works, works.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## littrella

my mini donk is only green broke to drive at this time. With out the blinders, he's too worried about what is going on behind him. maybe with time, he may not need them, but at this stage of the game, i'm not going to mess with what works


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## GreySorrel

I have been driving since the mid 90's, I myself have driven many different teams and singles as well. I will always use blinders. 

Why? Because while my own team is use to what is going on around them and behind them, when they are working, the blinders help with distractions and noises that may otherwise cause them to pause or their attention not be on me. They also help with whatever is behind them, yes they can't see it and I am not as worried they will and spook and bolt. 

When those of you who think it is okay to drive with no blinders, when you have your first real wreck with your animal because of your decision, please, let me know how it went for you. I will even go so far as to say that you won't ever be able to pull and enjoy half the farm wagons and implements I have had the joy of hitching my team of Percheron mare's up to. One in particular, which my good friend and mentor fondly referred to as the "Chatter Box" wagon. While my team didn't mind the noise one way or other, I would bet $100 that you try to drive that with a team with no blinders...you had best hang on....


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## Idrivetrotters

I have 2 driving horses in the barn now, a 12 yo OTSTB trotter and a 8 yo Shetland pony mare (classic/stocky type). The Standardbred is only driven open, he hates being closed up, he has never spooked at anything and has been driven in heavy traffic, farm equipment, etc and barely flicks an ear.

The pony mare is closed up because she is very ADD and needs help focusing. 

I start all my horses open and only close up on an as needed basis. Some horses need to see others shouldn't see. I found the smarter horses want to see and prefer to be open. 

I honestly want a horse to see, we don't close up riding horses so why should driving horses be so hampered?


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## Chevaux

FWIW, my grandfather farmed (at least in the early years) with teams - he never used blinkers on either the field teams or the buggy horses and did not have any problems doing it that way.


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## Southern Grace

I prefer to start horses in open bridles, then go on with blinders. As with most posts above, blinders help keep your horse focused, and when working with team are especially vital in helping you to cue only one horse, rather than horses anticipating the whip.

The reason I start horses open? You never know when something will go wrong, and that horse does see the cart chasing him. I know it seems odd, but after 10 years of hauling a carriage around behind them, there are horses who just never realized that that thing follows them and will panic the first time they see it "chasing" them. I just want to make sure my horse knows what is behind him before we go on to working in blinders.

Keep in mind that when comparing riding to driving, an accident while driving is amplified by the cart, legs can get caught up in shafts and tons of straps, and the disaster doesn't end when you fall off, the horse and cart are strapped together, making things worse and worse until something breaks (and we all hope it is the harness or cart and not the horse). Also, the horse's movement is restricted by that cart. If your horse bucks and spins, a good rider can usually stay on, whereas a cart will flip and once again, send the horse into panic mode.


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## Lorden

When it comes to working horses and largely other horses too so we prefer here in Sweden that do not use blinkers because we get the horses to trust the os! 
blinkers are for the lazy to use and for me not worth having. 

Subject Bridle without blinkers Here in Sweden, most bridle manufacturers so that it can be removed blinder


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## jimmy

please god ,you never have a runaway horse ,without blinders,it's a long story but I ruined the best mare I ever had in my life,driving without blinders,I often wish I could set the clock back to that day and how I would have done things different . with blinders you are controlling the horses visual area and if something scares it and it tries to bolt ,within a few yards the thing that scared it ,is out of the horses line of sight and that's why you can pull it back,without blinders the thing that scared it can be seen a lot longer plus whilst scared othe things that normally would ent bother the horse take on a sinister note and builds on its fear ,not only visuals but noises as well.once a horse is scared it's scared of everything at that moment in time.you can have bomb proof horses ,but you have to remember that when scared its survival instinct kicks in ,fight or flight ,I go out six days a week with two working horses in a city, please believe me ,use the blinders or blinkers ,or what ever else you want to call them


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## Lorden

jimmy said:


> please god ,you never have a runaway horse ,without blinders,it's a long story but I ruined the best mare I ever had in my life,driving without blinders,I often wish I could set the clock back to that day and how I would have done things different . with blinders you are controlling the horses visual area and if something scares it and it tries to bolt ,within a few yards the thing that scared it ,is out of the horses line of sight and that's why you can pull it back,without blinders the thing that scared it can be seen a lot longer plus whilst scared othe things that normally would ent bother the horse take on a sinister note and builds on its fear ,not only visuals but noises as well.once a horse is scared it's scared of everything at that moment in time.you can have bomb proof horses ,but you have to remember that when scared its survival instinct kicks in ,fight or flight ,I go out six days a week with two working horses in a city, please believe me ,use the blinders or blinkers ,or what ever else you want to call them


What you say is so true, but it can happen with blinders too and when the horse does not see what is chasing it, it becomes even more afraid of it must go to the only sound that the horse can hear and not see! 
What I wanna say with this is that it is not wrong or right to use blinkers, it is up to each individual to decide.
For me, I want the horse to see what happens, and that way it will not be as frightened. 
But a horse is, however, a creature so how to do it can become afraid of anything


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## jimmy

yes lorden you are right,but I have had many horses and any that have ever bolted wearing blinders ,were never a problem to go back in the cart/ waggon,but the ones with no blinders,you could use for twenty years ,no problems,but the day an unblinkered horse takes off attached to a cart ,I can nearly 100per cent guarantee ,you will not be able to drive them again ,even with blinders on


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## michaelvanessa

*blinkers*

tricky.
some times i do if he has not been in the shafts for a while and when i know he is relaxed i drive him in an open bridle.
quincy i would not take the chance so he stays blinkerd.


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## michaelvanessa

*bolting with or with out.*

we have a problem here with scramblers (motorbikes very loud) tricky hates them and we had some comeing behind us and he bolted but i gained control and we hedded home in a very fast trot and thay were about 200 yards behind.
its the only thing that sets him off.
we have had a couple of incedences were we got hit by a car twice and he went lame and my sulky had to be welded.
the driver under took us on the pavement side walk and reved the hell out of his car and tricky bolted as well and the shaft went through the off side drivers window.
i was in shock and tricky was lame my main consern was him.
if i got my hands on that driver i would have skined him alive.


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## jimmy

michaelvanessa said:


> we have a problem here with scramblers (motorbikes very loud) tricky hates them and we had some comeing behind us and he bolted but i gained control and we hedded home in a very fast trot and thay were about 200 yards behind.
> its the only thing that sets him off.
> we have had a couple of incedences were we got hit by a car twice and he went lame and my sulky had to be welded.
> the driver under took us on the pavement side walk and reved the hell out of his car and tricky bolted as well and the shaft went through the off side drivers window.
> i was in shock and tricky was lame my main consern was him.
> if i got my hands on that driver i would have skined him alive.


you do definitely get some ignorant *******s,no point being polite about it,I find when I,m on the road and cars /bikes get stuck behind me ,they wait patiently until they can see a clear road in front of them to pass,then as they pass they blast the horn or shout abuse at me,then **** themselves when they get stuck at lights and see me coming up behind again lol


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## michaelvanessa

*driveing with or with out blinkers.*

jimmy spot on there we had fun in the streets of london were i live i could make you laugh what we all got up to my frend michael burgess had a sec d called sid he jumped on a bonnet hood of a car and there was a real funny one with me a police car put is scirene on behind us my old mare went straight in reverse.
boy a horse can go as fast backwards as fowards.
i had my governess cart and the step went through the grill and punctured the cop car radiator lol.


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## GreySorrel

Jimmy has it spot on. Have a true runaway and we will see who will go back to driving without blinders on....IF they can get that animal back on a vehicle again. The blinders are there for a reason, to stop all the distractions and this nonsense of well we don't put them on riding horses...that is because we are ON THE ANIMAL!! We can feel it beneath us, we are better able to get to the reins and to pull them up quicker...my driving lines are approximately 100ft long, they are never slack but still, it will take me moments to get that team back under control, I can't always see what their body is doing or how they "feel". 

Bottom line, safety, safety, safety.


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## greentree

I am working on filly #3 of the team at present. As I was working her this morning, I was also contemplating the blinkers/blinders. 

My take is, the blinkers/blinders are about trust. We are teaching the horse to trust us, whether they SEE or not. The blinkers train the horse to focus and listen. 

Horses almost always go where they are looking....so we NEED them looking forward, not trying to look behind them. That's why we have the systematic steps to train them to drive, instead of just hooking them up and hoping for the best.

Do I make any sense, or am I just rambling?

Nancy


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## greentree

Forgot to attach the picture......

Adrianna pulling her tires..


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## Cat

This has been a very interesting read, I am mostly writing to subscribe to see future responses.


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## Idrivetrotters

I drive with and without blinkers, my current OTSTB has only been driven open, he was a nervous wreck and fought with blinkers on. Once he was opened up he was perfect. I drive him still open as that is how he is the most comfortable. My Shetland needs to be closed up because she can't focus (my sweet ADD girl) but Beaux needs to see. If I was forced to make him wear blinkers, Id have to stop driving him. 

I like having options for driving horses, and if a horse needs to be closed up I do it, if a horse is more comfortable open then I leave them open. It should come down to the best interest of the horse, how comfortable they are, and safety.


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## greentree

here is #4, Adagio, pulling tires today. They will pull tires one or two more times, then the drag, then the cart. Perhaps in 2 weeks or so.

Adagio is going to be paired with her older sister, Gavotte, in the wheeler position, and Adrianna and Alaska(their mother) will be in the lead. 

Team estrogen, we call it, lol!!!

Nancy


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## Clayton Taffy

Go team Estrogen !


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## Saddlebag

When delving into the history of the early ranching and farming days, it was revealed that many were killed by runaway horses, be it big hitches in the field or pulling a road cart. In hindsight it was felt this may in large have been attributable to blinders. One woman recalled driving a 4 horse hitch abreast that bolted. When they hit a rough patch of ground she was catapulted ahead of them, the team and machinery passing over her. She was unscathed but never drove a horse again.


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## michaelvanessa

*tc greeen tree*

i cant stop laughing i fell off my swivel chair.
go girls.
i think pink harness all round lol.


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## greentree

I am going to need 2 estrogen-filled navigators. I'm too old to breed THEM myself!!

Got my "emergency" rope today, and talked to the Mennonite about having his son help me hitch them for the first time. 

MV, pink will DEFINITELY be the way to go!!

Nancy


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## michaelvanessa

*super charged navigators.*

well the green tree team go girls with estrogen turbowpower.
i think if i blinked i would miss you flying past lol.
i think team tc would be neck and neck with you lol.
are you pulling my leg to old i fell about laughing lol.
you type like a girl of 21 green tree.
well that rules me out of the race ?.
or out of a 3 day driveing event.
well i think ill have to give that one a miss and stand on the side lines and let you girls have all the fun.
well tc i think youll have to stand pilgrim on the sidelines to lol and get a mare.
then go estrogen team tc.
well i think quincy will pass in pink lol.


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## greentree

Quincy does look great in pink! Do you have a source for pink harness pads? I think I will do pink pads, lines, and ear covers....will that be pink enough? 

If I win the lottery, they will have russet dress harness. 

Not a day over 21......

Nancy


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## michaelvanessa

*to the young lady of 21 years.*

howdy.
that sounds good to me i think eather a single or a pair would look super fine like that.
i have a full pink harness and also a pink fly bonnet as well also to top it pink brushing boots to match as well.
the blinkers have pink harts 4 of them i have tryed this harness a couple of times.
well i think if i won the lottery i would come over and meet you all it would be a laugh.
ill have to find the photo graph lol.
green tree you are a good laugh like taffy and my frend have a great day with your horses.


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## michaelvanessa

*in the pinks lol.*









heres one for starters.


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## michaelvanessa

*tack for team estrogen.*


















i hope you like them greentree.


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## Zexious

I'm just here for the pink :O SO JEALOUS!


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## Lorden

michaelvanessa said:


> View attachment 407114
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> View attachment 407122
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> i hope you like them greentree.


Hello to you 
Thanks for the comments. 
I just have to comment on your horse trappings VERY sweet but totally mad, good to see people who dare to stand out, cheer up


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## michaelvanessa

*standing out*

hiya lordon and thankyou.
the harness was brought by me for a laugh.
i can just get away with the breeching.
the rest is ok but a design falt with the tugs i decided to add a sip-cable tie as i think a keeper should be as normal on the tug so sorted that problem.
i have not drove him for a while and the bridle is set up with a jointed butterfly bit so im going to have to use the black set with the liverpool bit.
first time i have driven this year with him he is still green but ok.
we went down the track with no issues but on the return i think he got a bit excited and was bucking all i could do was laugh and in a stern voice said stop it and he did after about 7 bucks.
we then continued on and he did it again and by that time settled in lol.
we have a laugh on the small barn were i am and he is put to an exercise waggonett.
i have 2 harness for him the pink webbing one and a standard black leather one.
and a set of extra traces with rings for my quick releases.
my ponys harness is a lot heaver build in structure as all of mine are.
so i took the little gray pony out for a walk in hand and visited a frend across the road as she had carrots for him.
please check out my albums for more pictures.
many thanks michael.


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## michaelvanessa

*pinks*



michaelvanessa said:


> View attachment 407106
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> heres one for starters.


heres vanessas pony which i had perchased pink tack in her honor and went to a local show.
tammy was tricks soal mate and my tandem wheeler but sadley passed on two years ago.
and all her pink tack is at home in storage as well as tammys ashes in a beautiful oak casket and also with a part of vanessas so thay are togeather.
so i just kept buying and finding pink tack.


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## greentree

I think the pink tack is the greatest I have ever seen! I wonder if my Mennonite harness maker can get pink? I may ask.....

Seriously, MV, if you run across pink harness pads, send me the price, please.

Nancy


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## michaelvanessa

*tricky*

















ill keep an eye out for you green tree.
i have to resize some pictures.


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## michaelvanessa

*quincy and tricky.*









































im driveing on my own and i got some frends to take some pictures on the street i was useing the black bridle as i have a liverpool bit on it and all went ok to day we went for about 4 miles and with out any problems.
and heres some pictures on the yard as well.


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## michaelvanessa

*to green tree.*









to taffy clayton im looking for a pink 4 wheeled cart now green tree has started the ball roleing.
well it looks like the team is geting there lol.


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## michaelvanessa

*to my pink loveing frend green tree.*

hiya i did some surching and found what you are looking for.
on ebay under pink harnesses i have found them still on sale.
the product code is 400582068035.









































green tree i hope this helps taffy claton thank you for finding the veichele.
go team estrogen.
its all comeing to geather yippy.


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## michaelvanessa

michaelvanessa said:


> hiya i did some surching and found what you are looking for.
> on ebay under pink harnesses i have found them still on sale.
> the product code is 400582068035.
> 
> View attachment 411522
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> View attachment 411530
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> View attachment 411538
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> View attachment 411546
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> View attachment 411554
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> green tree i hope this helps taffy claton thank you for finding the veichele.
> go team estrogen.
> its all comeing to geather yippy.


sorrymy apolagys to taffy clayton sorry i missed typed.


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## eliduc

It goes back to out of sight out of mind. A horse's periphial vison is remarkable and it can see things almost behind it without turning it's head. You are not blinding your horse by putting blinkers on it. You are only restricting the horse's peripheral vision which gives you a great advantage. Once the horse's head passes a spooky object it is no longer a threat. If it still is then you your horse needs more desensitizing or you need a different horse. Sure, some horses are almost bomb proof but there is a great variation in temperament between the breeds and individual horses. As a general rule you are much safer with blinders and your drive is much more enjoyable when your horse is not distracted and gawkig off in space looking for something to be worried about. This is why the ADS requires blinders. It comes down to whether or not you have a professional or emotional attitude.


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## Idrivetrotters

I do take a bit of insult at the insinuation that if you don't close up a horse you are unprofessional or worse "emotional". Well, I've been training Standardbreds for driving (racing and pleasure) and the decision to close up a horse is not an emotional one. You go tell some of these trainers who have been sending out driving horses for 40 years that sending out an open horse is unprofessional, and you would be ran out of the barn. Nearly half of all racing STBs race open, and my current STB has problems being closed up. He goes from being confident and engaged to spooky and a bit rank closed up. Some horses NEED to see and if a horse needs to see than I let them see.

If a horse can go safely and without distractions while being open then there is nothing wrong in having a confident horse going forward open. I honestly disagree with ADS on blinkers being mandatory and no open debate on what is in the horse's best interest.

Blinkers should come down to what is best for the horse, if a horse needs to be closed up then close them up, if a horse can be open and safe, then let them be open.


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## eliduc

*Blinders*

Perhaps professional was the wrong word. However, you are an accomplished professional trainer who is completely neglecting to take into consideration that many pleasure drivers and the people on this forum do not share your high level of skill and this is why the ADS requires blinders.


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## eliduc

*blinders or no*

Perhaps professional was the wrong word. However, you are an accomplished professional trainer who is completely neglecting to take into consideration that many pleasure drivers and the people on this forum do not share your high level of skill and this is why the ADS requires blinders. What is open and safe for you may not be open and safe for a driver with much less skill driving in a completely different and varied environment. The pleasure horse may be perfectly safe driving open in his accustomed environment but not so much on a parade route. Racing STB's have a very regimented and consistent training schedule and become very stable. I know because I owned one and he is wonderful but I doubt that he ever left CalExpo in six years since it is the only harness track in Calif. Another thing, if open is not safe then that driver and horse is a hazard to other drivers and bystanders. It's only safe until being "open" contributes to a horrendous accident.


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## jimmy

eliduc said:


> Perhaps professional was the wrong word. However, you are an accomplished professional trainer who is completely neglecting to take into consideration that many pleasure drivers and the people on this forum do not share your high level of skill and this is why the ADS requires blinders. What is open and safe for you may not be open and safe for a driver with much less skill driving in a completely different and varied environment. The pleasure horse may be perfectly safe driving open in his accustomed environment but not so much on a parade route. Racing STB's have a very regimented and consistent training schedule and become very stable. I know because I owned one and he is wonderful but I doubt that he ever left CalExpo in six years since it is the only harness track in Calif. Another thing, if open is not safe then that driver and horse is a hazard to other drivers and bystanders. It's only safe until being "open" contributes to a horrendous accident.


 yes but don't forget you are talking about a racing track where it is a controlled environment ,half those standard breds when they come from a track only know how to go straightforward they don't even know how to turn in the shafts,I know everybody's opinion is different ,especially in the horse world ,but you take your standard bred every day through a town with all it's distractions and hazards,and I wish you all the luck in the world


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## Idrivetrotters

You must never have been on a STB track if you think the track is a "safe and controlled" environment. You have harrows and water trucks on the track with horses jogging and training next to them, you have horses sometimes dozens of horses training, jogging, and towing.

Also, do not take into account that there are golf carts, bicycles, trucks, and maintenance equipment going between the shedrows, on the roads, and around the horses every time they leave the barn.

I have taken OTSTBs onto roads, trails, and yes, even obstacles safely, it usually just takes a couple of drives for the horse to get used to heavier carts and different harness. 

Now, saying we need blinkers because of green or inexperienced drivers is ludicrous. The use of blinders has nothing to do with the driver but everything to do with the horse. If we used that logic then you would have every single green rider would ride in the same type of bridle. 

I'm not advocating that all horses go open, but if a horse is capable of going open safely and confidently, then why punish them for being a good horse?


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## jimmy

Idrivetrotters said:


> You must never have been on a STB track if you think the track is a "safe and controlled" environment. You have harrows and water trucks on the track with horses jogging and training next to them, you have horses sometimes dozens of horses training, jogging, and towing.
> 
> Also, do not take into account that there are golf carts, bicycles, trucks, and maintenance equipment going between the shedrows, on the roads, and around the horses every time they leave the barn.
> 
> I have taken OTSTBs onto roads, trails, and yes, even obstacles safely, it usually just takes a couple of drives for the horse to get used to heavier carts and different harness.
> 
> Now, saying we need blinkers because of green or inexperienced drivers is ludicrous. The use of blinders has nothing to do with the driver but everything to do with the horse. If we used that logic then you would have every single green rider would ride in the same type of bridle.
> 
> I'm not advocating that all horses go open, but if a horse is capable of going open safely and confidently, then why punish them for being a good horse?


well your right ,the only side of a stb track I,ve been on ,is the side where the bookie takes your money,I don't think it's punishing the good horse by making him wear blinders,the same way it's not punishing the good car driver by making him wear a seatbelt ,it's a safety feature,I have had horses myself that you could drive open through a barrage of shellfire,but I,ve had a shock with one or two bombproof ones as well,each to his/her own but I will stick to the blinders


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## equaeternal

I drove Standardbreds for years and when it comes to blinders each horse is different. When you start training a horse to drive I find most tell you if they need them or not. Of course blinders come in all different shapes an sizes according to what the horse needs. Some horse are distracted by the cart or if you drive tandem they can become competitive with the other horse. I always try to drive a horse with out first and work from there.


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## Idrivetrotters

I will say we must agree to disagree, I currently have a horse that in 9 years of driving has been driven in an open bridle. He gets very unsafe with blinkers on and I've driven many a good horse who has to see or they get very unruly. I just prefer having a horse enjoying their work as opposed to having one that will be not just uncomfortable but possibly dangerous if closed up. If a horse gets unruly closed up, then obviously it is not a safety feature at that point.


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## jimmy

Idrivetrotters said:


> I will say we must agree to disagree, I currently have a horse that in 9 years of driving has been driven in an open bridle. He gets very unsafe with blinkers on and I've driven many a good horse who has to see or they get very unruly. I just prefer having a horse enjoying their work as opposed to having one that will be not just uncomfortable but possibly dangerous if closed up. If a horse gets unruly closed up, then obviously it is not a safety feature at that point.


that suits me,and happy driving to you what ever way you do it


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## Palomine

Idrivetrotters said:


> I have 2 driving horses in the barn now, a 12 yo OTSTB trotter and a 8 yo Shetland pony mare (classic/stocky type). The Standardbred is only driven open, he hates being closed up, he has never spooked at anything and has been driven in heavy traffic, farm equipment, etc and barely flicks an ear.
> 
> The pony mare is closed up because she is very ADD and needs help focusing.
> 
> I start all my horses open and only close up on an as needed basis. Some horses need to see others shouldn't see. I found the smarter horses want to see and prefer to be open.
> 
> I honestly want a horse to see, we don't close up riding horses so why should driving horses be so hampered?




Because driving horses don't have something following them every move they make.

And because it is a lot easier to control a panicked riding horse than it is a team dragging a wagon too.

I've seen what happens without blinder bridle, and not cute, at all.


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## Palomine

Lorden said:


> When it comes to working horses and largely other horses too so we prefer here in Sweden that do not use blinkers because we get the horses to trust the os!
> blinkers are for the lazy to use and for me not worth having.
> 
> Subject Bridle without blinkers Here in Sweden, most bridle manufacturers so that it can be removed blinder



Are these teams driven on the roads too? Is it just work teams, or also driving stock, of hotter temperament?

As for blinkers for the lazy, that is a generalization and isn't true, no more than if I said not using them was because people didn't know how to adjust bridle, or were too poor to buy the extra leather.

And many of us have worked with horses to cart, or been around teams, and blinkers are used every single time I've worked with them, or been around them.

Except for one epic crash involving an antique farm wagon, reduced to kindling, and 4 men...all fools. 

Famous last words.."ya'll watch this!"


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## GreySorrel

Blinkers are for the lazy...really? Wow...going to have to tell my mentor that one...I am lazy then I suppose...okay then...


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