# Parelli-positive thread



## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

Ok since there always seems to be a debate about PP and threads get off track I am going to start this one.

I am going to set a few rules. Hope non of the other mods or Admin mind.

*First ONLY POSITIVE PP info here*. NO basing no getting off topic. I am in no way a PP fan. However I still would like there be at least one thread that people who do like him can talk in piece. If you are new to PP and want the other side there are plenty of thread that will give you that.

*Second. ANY NEGATIVE* comments of ANY KIND will be removed. No ifs ands or buts about it. 

Ok start away and enjoy.


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## christopher (Feb 11, 2011)

most of his psychologies are very usefull, and he's a great way to learn the principles of good horsemanship. worked for me & i'm glad for it! (though i'm my own horseman now, not one of parelli's horsemen)


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## SarahRicoh (Jun 23, 2010)

Thanks for this 'nrhareiner'.. I have no idea about Parelli or really many other NH methods but I would like to find out more... I dont neccessarily want to use all Parelli material and I cant afford to buy the DVDs etc but I feel its always helpful to add different bits of training into your own techniques...
So please can someone state the basic essence of NH techniques such as CA/Parelli etc..


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

NH is not about PP or any other trainer. It is a way to interact with your horse. You do not need to buy all the stuff. You just need to learn how horses think and react and then use that as a tool along with many other tools. There is no one way. 

Most trainers use some type of NH even if they are not NH trainers. You have too. You have to under stand how the horse thinks. It is no different then understanding how a dog thinks or a cat thinks so you can train them.


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## xXEventerXx (Nov 27, 2010)

ive always wanted to learn some parelli but never have thankfully my new barn trainer has done it before so i can learn


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## vai (Feb 12, 2011)

nrhareiner said:


> It is no different then understanding how a dog thinks or a cat thinks so you can train them.


:clap:


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## bellagris (Dec 6, 2010)

I am in my currently involved in my first horse training experience, what PP taught me was how to interact with my horse, I did not go out and buy everything they require, but rather followed the games. I think every one will modify it to suit their ways, but it is a great base to start from if it is your first time. 

I am not even that well versed in PP, but I do know that my horse trusted me because of the way we worked together and it was a great guide to learning to communicate with her.


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## heartscontent (Jan 11, 2009)

I found it interesting when Pat explained why he named the circling game that name instead of lunging and the other games with some silly names. He said he used to call the circling game some type of lunging but people didn't listen/pick up on regular names so he made up the interesting sillier names for things. Like the friendly game is desenitizing, etc.
BTW I watched a few Parelli videos in which Pat does the exact same thing Clinton does. Clinton was a Pat Parelli student and you can really see that in his program. Clinton uses the 7 games too but I think he made them into 8 steps instead of 7 games. If you look past Clinton's more aggressive and to the point style, you can see just how much he was influenced by Parelli


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

nrhareiner said:


> NH is not about PP or any other trainer. It is a way to interact with your horse. You do not need to buy all the stuff. You just need to learn how horses think and react and then use that as a tool along with many other tools. There is no one way.


So very true.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

PP called it lateral lunging. I think the whole concept of games is a really effective teaching tool and also the whole idea of playing games. 

I also like how the sequence of the games is important in teaching horses and humans. But most of all I totally love the creativity. 

Most of the NH people out there are doing really similar stuff. Jonathan Field was a 3star PP professional and his program is exactly the same but with different labels. 

It's great to hear some positive stories


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Yay!

So does anyone want to explain the seven games to me or point me to a *clear* video of someone doing and explaining the seven games.?

I have looked all over youtube and all I can find is people doing them but not explaining them

I tried the friendly game with my mare but she got very mad when I tried to touch her udders. I do not want to attempt that again any time soon but I know you cannot progress the games until you complete them properly so how do I get her to trust me?


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## christopher (Feb 11, 2011)

quantam savvy does a good job describing it simply. their word for parellis "friendly game" is "no yield contact". that's where you do something with the horse like swinging a rope around your horse and expect the horse to standstill & relax, and not yield from (or push into) that pressure. next game being the "contact yield' ("purcupine game") that's where you want the horse to yield to pressure it can feel. like pressure on the reins/seat/legs and on the ground picking up their feet and anything that involves steady pressure on the horse. then there's "no contact yield" ("driving game") this is where you want the horse to yield from more rythmic pressure that doesn't necessarily have to physically touch the horse, any kind of "suggestive" pressure. an example of this is a lunge whip.

those are the basic parelli games, the rest are just combining some of those basics to achieve purposes like what most would call lunging ("circle game", excersize and learning to maintain gait & direction), pushing the horse sideways ("sideways game", good for flexibility) "squeezing" the horse between 2 scary objects, usually the human and another big object, while expecting him/her not to get claustrophobic and rush ("squeeze game", good for self confidence in the horse)

the other game is the one in the middle called the yo-yo game, one "yo" being forward movement and the other "yo" being backward movement. priorities of the yo-yo game are getting equal sensitivity to forward and backward aids, and depending on which "yo" you consistently finish on, it builds more go than whoa, or more whoa than go in the horse. great for horses that are "hard to rein in" or horses that need constant nagging to go forward. next priority being straightness, the point of that is that when our horses are going forward or backwards we want exactly that, minimum lateral movements, good for horses that constantly bend to one direction and not the other.

despite what the parelli's say, horses don't play these 7 games with eachother. i have yet to see horses play the circle game or the sideways game in a herd situation. horses only play the first 3 games with eachother (friendly/no yield, porcupine/contact yield, driving/no contact yield)

basically.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

First I have to commend you in the amount of time you take to help others.



christopher said:


> despite what the parelli's say, horses don't play these 7 games with eachother. i have yet to see horses play the circle game or the sideways game in a herd situation. horses only play the first 3 games with eachother (friendly/no yield, porcupine/contact yield, driving/no contact yield)
> basically.


I know it sounds crazy but some of mine do in fact play circling, yo-yo, sideways, and squeeze. I've only ever seen circling once but I actually did see it. My warmblood and draft play sideways and my warmblood likes to squeeze one of the quarterhorses - he seems to enjoy it! They do that quite regularly.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

I hope the Mods won't mind my opinion being voiced here. I hope I don't sound too crazy. 
The Horse Forum is made up of a lovely, diverse equine community, but we seem to hold certain values at our core. For example, we are largely a "snaffle community" (with a few exceptions) - whereas some other communities completely advocate using as much bit as possible to get the horse to listen to you. While we are a moderated forum, we are still allowed our own opinions and I guess my concern is that if we start having "positive only" threads, we might get into somewhat of a censorship problem. Please don't read this as my attacking anyone on here, but rather a comunity member voicing my concerns. We are a diverse community and we have lots of (sometimes heated) discussions. We have areas where people may find their niches, but we cannot always avoid conflict - two horse people, three opinions, as one might say.
I hope you guys don't mind my posting, but I do have concerns about these types of threads popping up, where our voices might be censored - an example coming to mind of "nice comments only about my breeding pair" in the Breeding section, or "positives only about X training method." Again, we are a diverse community, and we have a wealth of knowledge between the thousands of HF members. There's a reason behind a lot of our opinions. 
Hope you understand my position.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

JustDressageIt said:


> I hope the Mods won't mind my opinion being voiced here. I hope I don't sound too crazy.
> The Horse Forum is made up of a lovely, diverse equine community, but we seem to hold certain values at our core. For example, we are largely a "snaffle community" (with a few exceptions) - whereas some other communities completely advocate using as much bit as possible to get the horse to listen to you. While we are a moderated forum, we are still allowed our own opinions and I guess my concern is that if we start having "positive only" threads, we might get into somewhat of a censorship problem. Please don't read this as my attacking anyone on here, but rather a comunity member voicing my concerns. We are a diverse community and we have lots of (sometimes heated) discussions. We have areas where people may find their niches, but we cannot always avoid conflict - two horse people, three opinions, as one might say.
> I hope you guys don't mind my posting, but I do have concerns about these types of threads popping up, where our voices might be censored - an example coming to mind of "nice comments only about my breeding pair" in the Breeding section, or "positives only about X training method." Again, we are a diverse community, and we have a wealth of knowledge between the thousands of HF members. There's a reason behind a lot of our opinions.
> Hope you understand my position.


While I understand and agree. This thread was started for one simple reason. There are so many other threads that all opinions are given good bad or indifferent. This thread started to give people a place where they could discuss PP and/or NH without worry that it will turn into a big debate. We have many other threads that will give all sides. SO this one is just for people to talk about NH/PP without a big debate starting.

If you see something here that you wish to debate please start a new thread.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

I actually had a friend lend my the 7 Games DVD and I rather enjoyed it. I think that Parelli is good for promoting working with your horse on the ground, something SO many people don't do and end up with brilliant upper level Dressage horses that are pushy dangerous MONSTERS on the ground. I actually purchased the initial kit when Zierra was injured this weekend as something to do to keep her mind active. Even though I'm not really following it right now, I have to say, I LOVE that halter and leadrope! :lol:

It also helped me work through some attitude problems she was having on the ground. I would love to do more, but I actually found it a BIT difficult to follow because unless you're watching a TV and working at the same time, it can be hard to remember everything! I would actually love to have a session with a Parelli coach, just to get some hands on insight as to the things I'm doing right or wrong.


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

i love playing the yo-yo game with gypsy ! its really cool because i can get her to walk up to me step by step and have a lot of control over her body. she used to be really stubborn about backing up. i could hardly get her to back on the ground. once she got really good on the ground i noticed a lot of progress with her backing undersaddle. i didnt back her undersaddle for a few months because we were focusing on other things [she was not good at it anyways, very slow and crooked] now she will back up immediately and very straight.


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

The 7-games is just basic ground work set up in a "fun" way that more people can understand & perform because he's made it a "game" lol. Some games may seem silly to certain people, but this is stuff that we all do with horses each day.
The Squeeze Game teaches a horse to go into small spaces without exploding which later helps with loading & standing _quietly_ in a trailer without wanting to rush out the moment the door opens. 
The Yo-Yo game teaches a horse to come & go away from you which helps alot if you want a horse to back in or out of a trailer & of course follow you 

I really like his way of "longeing" much better than the traditional way because it focuses on working the horse's mind & not his body. I've seen highstrung horses worked this way for only a minute or two become calm & collected much quicker & more effectively than running the horse in mindless circles trying to burn off the engery. The way i see it, if the horse is calm and focused in his mind then his body will be calm.


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

lilruffian said:


> I really like his way of "longeing" much better than the traditional way because it focuses on working the horse's mind & not his body. I've seen highstrung horses worked this way for only a minute or two become calm & collected much quicker & more effectively than running the horse in mindless circles trying to burn off the engery. The way i see it, if the horse is calm and focused in his mind then his body will be calm.


i dont really do the circling thing because regular lunging works so well with my mare and i dont really understand the circling game that well....maybe you [or someone else] could explain it in more detail. i have never seen it done besides on videos and for some reason i just cant understand it [i dont have any parelli dvds btw...]

correct lungeing is not running the horse mindless trying to burn energy. a trainer suggested i do that with my mare if i ever want to show her in hunters... really ? no way.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

I do not lunge any of mine. Never have had a need for it past the first few rides on a green youngster.


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

Clinton Anderson did not train with Pat Parelli.
They are competing against each other on Road to the Horse, this weekend I believe.


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## christopher (Feb 11, 2011)

whats up with the circle game. though it's great and everything, and it's what i do with my horses, but its not that different to normal lunging, except normal lunging has the added "friendly game" of the "micromanaging" in the case of lunging, micromanaging will become a friendly game in that the horse will become dull and non-responsive to it, and eventually relax while it's going on, which is the friendly game.


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## heartscontent (Jan 11, 2009)

christopher said:


> whats up with the circle game. though it's great and everything, and it's what i do with my horses, but its not that different to normal lunging, except normal lunging has the added "friendly game" of the "micromanaging" in the case of lunging, micromanaging will become a friendly game in that the horse will become dull and non-responsive to it, and eventually relax while it's going on, which is the friendly game.


The circling game is a speficic type of lunging. Pat Parelli on one of his dvd's says that 10-20 years ago he used to call it lunging or some type of lunging. It's a specific type of lunging because you do specific way of stopping, and circling. It is not lunging in the sense that do you 50 circles. Most of the circling game at level 1 and 2 is a few circling laps done in a specific way. 
I do both with my horses. I lunge for exercise and do the circling game. Pat thinks most people lunge to get freshness or energy out of a horse so he based this game on doing less laps, but more specific things to do while lunging.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

The biggest difference between circling and lunging is that fact that many people lunge using constant pressure as if they are constantly chasing the horse with their body/whip/energy. This is not teaching the horse any responsibility or anything about pressure/release. He used to call it lateral lunging.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

natisha said:


> Clinton Anderson did not train with Pat Parelli.
> They are competing against each other on Road to the Horse, this weekend I believe.


Hmm I have heard that he did study in Pat's program. There are quite a few people out there that are ex-Parelli that are using many of the same techniques but branding it differently - with their name.


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## Northern (Mar 26, 2010)

I heard or read that CA is a Level 3 graduate of PP's program. 

He had to change the term for "carrot stick" to "handy stick" .


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

thanks for expalaining the circling to me guys ! i think its exactly what i do when i lunge, but i walk around in a small circle instead of standing in one place. i dont believe in lunging to get the bucks out or chasing my horse in a circle 50 times. i do sometimes lunge when she is a little hot, though i never let her run out of control, i w/t/c halt and back until she is responsive to my cues.


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

I really like watching him work with a horse that doesnt know any of the games because you get to see what problems can arrise & how to fix them. I watched a video with my friend last night & thought it was pretty good because it wasn't just him working with one of his horses that already know everything.

It also gave good tips for when testing a new horse to determine what they will be like in the saddle (how sensitive they are to pressure, if when you ask for a little they give you alot, are they spooky, etc) but on the ground.


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

Northern said:


> I heard or read that CA is a Level 3 graduate of PP's program.
> 
> He had to change the term for "carrot stick" to "handy stick" .


Not true, he has never worked with Parelli. He always says who taught him & it's not Parelli. Nothing either does is new, just fancier.


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

Just to clarify








*Clinton Anderson's "Down Under Horsemanship" TM*
Rated by Horse Magazines “Horse Illustrated” and “Horse and Rider” as one of the country’s SUPER clinicians, Clinton Anderson is making a tremendous impact in the horse community. Clinton Anderson was born and raised in Australia where at the age of 6 he started riding horses during weekends and holidays. His family recognized Clinton's natural ability with horses and cultivated his interest, buying him his first horse at age 9. Anxious to train his own horse, Clinton began attending horsemanship clinics at age 12. At age 13 he began playing Polo-Cross, played for a couple of years and was chosen for a national team representing his state. At age 13, he began spending all available time during holidays with nationally acclaimed clinician and horse trainer, Gordon McKinlay of Rock Hampton, Queensland, Australia and using his knowledge to train horses for friends and neighbors. (Select the photo for more information)
Contact: Equi-Management Group

Clinton Anderson was born and raised in Australia. His family encouraged him to pursue his talent for horse training at a very early age. As a teenager, he apprenticed with renowned Australian clinician and horse trainer Gordon McKinlay and the, Ian Frances. Clinton then came to the U.S. to train with Al Dunning. He returned to Australia but then moved permanently to the U.S. in 1997


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

Natisha nothing here tells me he didn't study under Pat. There are many people saying he did and I also believe I read it somewhere. Is it a sin to study under Pat. It must be a conflict for you somehow... I don't understand that.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

CA started in the US as a reiner. He studied under Al and with a few other reining trainers over the years. From his time line from Australia and then here in the US with Al and showing reiners there is no time for him to have worked with PP.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

nrhareiner said:


> CA started in the US as a reiner. He studied under Al and with a few other reining trainers over the years. From his time line from Australia and then here in the US with Al and showing reiners there is no time for him to have worked with PP.


You know what I'm going to call him up and ask him. Then I'm going to verify it with people I know and trust. We'll see what is true.


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

You can call him? Really? lol There's gotta be an easy way to find out. Maybe he studied Pat's stuff/technique but not necessarily under him?


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

TheLovedOne said:


> You know what I'm going to call him up and ask him. Then I'm going to verify it with people I know and trust. We'll see what is true.


Go for it. I just know he trained under Al for a year or so then went back to Aus. which is what his bio said and then came back and shortly after that he started doing reining and I think some reined cow horse. He also worked out of Ohio for a few years also if memory serves. I know for a fact that he showed NRHA aged event for about 5-6 years and has a little over $34K in NRHA earnings. That is why I find him much more credible then PP.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

34k that's it ... my god why would anyone bother  Still nrhareiner what you know doesn't exclude his study within Parelli and who cares anyways like it's a sin. Sure why can't I contact him. I'm sure he'd want my money ;-) right.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

It is not a lot however he did that in 16 classes. Which is probable more like 10 runs. Of that he had 6 wins and several more top 5's in some very very big shows. All but 4 had over 40 entries and several of those over 125 entries.

Is that great when you compare that to say Shawn and Tim and Craig and others? Not really but then again there are very very few who can compare to Shown and Tim and such.

Point is that is $34K more then PP.

Also would you say the Stacy Westfall is a good trainer??


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## Northern (Mar 26, 2010)

Now,* I* want to know for sure if CA is a L3 grad of PP! Get on it on the double, TLO!


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

Yes I think Stacey is a good trainer.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

Very well proven. How much do you think she has won in NRHA??


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

I'll bet very little. It proves my position even further. This is not a business to me. Competing for nickles and all the costs associated with it. Even to breed/sell/train it is not a business to me. I can make a lot more money working in my profession and I don't have to worry about horses that I sold ending up at the auction. 
Sorry it's just my position on the topic.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

Well that if fine. People who are not into breeding as a business should not be doing it. Those are the majority of horses going to slaughter.

Lets just say that money is not a problem. Retired a by 40. However if people looked at horses and such as a business then perhaps there would not be as many un wanted horses.

As for how much stacy has made. She has made more the CA. Keep in mind also. That she did not own the horses she won on. So that means that she made very very good money training those horses. 

Showing is to the horse world as touring is to the music world. That is not where the money is made. It is where you prove you are worth the money and effort that goes into the whole thing.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

I know but it is irrational. No other business operates that way. Not even the music industry. 

I do agree that some people breeding should not be breeding and I really wish it would stop. However, there are many good breeders that send horses to auction so please don't try to claim that that is not happening. I would be happy to hear that you don't do that.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

I was once knew a woman who made a small fortune breeding horses. Of course, she did start out with a large fortune


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

TheLovedOne said:


> I know but it is irrational. No other business operates that way. Not even the music industry.
> *
> Actually the music industry does work that way. Most tours loose money.*
> 
> ...


I have no need. My foals are normally sold before my mares are ever bred. This coming year will be the first time that I have not had buyers lined up and that is only b/c I am looking for my next prospect. If I get what I want I will keep it if not it will be for sale and I have no doubt I will have any problem selling them.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

I think succeeding in the music industry is like winning a lottery. However, people that are successful make a lot of money from their recordings. If a tour loses money then I would say it was managed poorly.

Making money with horses however is delusional. People that breed are never including all of the expenses in their calculations. Especially now, people are not making money. You won't convince me of that.

What are you retired from? What did you do for a living?
If money is no problem then why do your horses have to earn their keep? It doesn't add up for me.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

TheLovedOne said:


> I think succeeding in the music industry is like winning a lottery. However, people that are successful make a lot of money from their recordings. If a tour loses money then I would say it was managed poorly.
> 
> Making money with horses however is delusional. People that breed are never including all of the expenses in their calculations. Especially now, people are not making money. You won't convince me of that.
> 
> ...


Can you please PM nrhareiner if you wish to continue this? It has nothing to do with Parelli at this point and is going against the point of this thread.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

My comparison between the music industry and showing horses is that touring is a loosing money making deal same as showing can be. It is used to prove and promote.

No tours are not poorly run they are just very very expensive. I know you asked what I did for a living. I was in the Music industry for a long time. Own several businesses. 

Anyway back on subject. If you want to know how the touring with in the music industry works feel free to PM me. Just so you know that 98% of all tours loose money. The people who make the most off an album is the writers and publishers.


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

TheLovedOne said:


> Natisha nothing here tells me he didn't study under Pat. There are many people saying he did and I also believe I read it somewhere. Is it a sin to study under Pat. It must be a conflict for you somehow... I don't understand that.


I don't have a conflict with anything. I just pointed out information. I like facts.
No one writes an article pointing out all the people someone_ didn't_ work with. If CA had worked with PP then I see no reason why that wouldn't be mentioned. 
I haven't offered an opinion one way or the other but no, it's not a sin to study under PP.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

natisha said:


> I don't have a conflict with anything. I just pointed out information. I like facts.
> No one writes an article pointing out all the people someone_ didn't_ work with. If CA had worked with PP then I see no reason why that wouldn't be mentioned.
> I haven't offered an opinion one way or the other but no, it's not a sin to study under PP.


I am with you, Natisha.

Facts are good.

I am sure there are very many well known horse people whose bios do not mention that they have not worked with PP.... and they have not worked with PP.

It not saying that does not mean anything.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

natisha said:


> I don't have a conflict with anything. I just pointed out information. I like facts.
> No one writes an article pointing out all the people someone_ didn't_ work with. If CA had worked with PP then I see no reason why that wouldn't be mentioned.
> I haven't offered an opinion one way or the other but no, it's not a sin to study under PP.


I did a quick search, and there is TONS of Parelli VS Clinton Anderson because they follow essentially the same program but modified in their own way. I didn't find a single comment about Clinton Anderson training under Parelli, except a Wiki question where someone responded with no. I would agree entirely that CA training under Parelli seems a little far fetched.

Keep in mind that nothing either of them is doing is unique - the exact same methods have existed for eons, with a massive variety of different names and terminology but essentially the same focus and goal and same general path of guidance. Natural horsemanship is natural horsemanship! (this was to everyone in general, not you natisha, haha)


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

MacabreMikolaj said:


> I did a quick search, and there is TONS of Parelli VS Clinton Anderson because they follow essentially the same program but modified in their own way. I didn't find a single comment about Clinton Anderson training under Parelli, except a Wiki question where someone responded with no. I would agree entirely that CA training under Parelli seems a little far fetched.
> 
> Keep in mind that nothing either of them is doing is unique - the exact same methods have existed for eons, with a massive variety of different names and terminology but essentially the same focus and goal and same general path of guidance. Natural horsemanship is natural horsemanship! (this was to everyone in general, not you natisha, haha)


 (what's with the rule of not allowing only a smiley but needing 6 characters?)


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## MIEventer (Feb 15, 2009)

MacabreMikolaj said:


> I did a quick search, and there is TONS of Parelli VS Clinton Anderson because they follow essentially the same program but modified in their own way. I didn't find a single comment about Clinton Anderson training under Parelli, except a Wiki question where someone responded with no. I would agree entirely that CA training under Parelli seems a little far fetched.
> 
> Keep in mind that nothing either of them is doing is unique - the exact same methods have existed for eons, with a massive variety of different names and terminology but essentially the same focus and goal and same general path of guidance. Natural horsemanship is natural horsemanship! (this was to everyone in general, not you natisha, haha)


Great post and well said!

When I ventured into the world of NH I learnt a lot about its history - NH goes back to the Native Americans, goes back to the Ancient Greeks and so on. 

As my Trainer at the time stated "Speaking horse is speaking horse - all paths lead to the same goal. It is about sorting through all the approaches given, and take what works best for you and your horse"


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

natisha said:


> I don't have a conflict with anything. I just pointed out information. I like facts.


Agreed



natisha said:


> No one writes an article pointing out all the people someone_ didn't_ work with. If CA had worked with PP then I see no reason why that wouldn't be mentioned. I haven't offered an opinion one way or the other but no, it's not a sin to study under PP.


I do. It is a marketing strategy. I know someone else who does the same thing. CA was never a PP professional just a levels student like a million other people. I'll see if I can verify it somehow 'cause I too like facts.


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

TheLovedOne said:


> Agreed
> 
> 
> 
> I do. It is a marketing strategy. I know someone else who does the same thing. CA was never a PP professional just a levels student like a million other people. I'll see if I can verify it somehow 'cause I too like facts.


So if i make a resume' I would list all the places I never worked for?:wink:
I think the only way to mention someone you never worked with would make it seem that that person sucked so bad you wouldn't even want to be accidentally associated with them. It may be a political strategy but I don't know how that would look in everyday life.
Do you have an example of how this method would be used without insulting the person never worked for? I'm really curious.


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## Peggysue (Mar 29, 2008)

all you have to do is ask anybody at RTTH and PP and CA did not work together nor do they even seem to LIKE each other although I could see CA gettting his attitude from PP


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

natisha said:


> Do you have an example of how this method would be used without insulting the person never worked for? I'm really curious.


Yes it is as you say. They claim that they are so much better than person A and that is why you should follow them. It works in the horse world because people like to hate others whether or not it's true. I mean if you're asking me to explain the entire strategy behind it I cannot. I wouldn't do it. But what I am saying is that just because he doesn't list being a Parelli student on his website doesn't mean that he wasn't. That's it. I'm sorry if I offended you.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

I am not saying that PP and CA worked together. OMG they hate each other - I think it's obvious.


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## Peggysue (Mar 29, 2008)

Clinton spends alot of time talking about his mentors and PP is never mentioned


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

TheLovedOne said:


> Hmm I have heard that he did study in Pat's program.





TheLovedOne said:


> Natisha nothing here tells me he didn't study under Pat. There are many people saying he did and I also believe I read it somewhere. Is it a sin to study under Pat.






TheLovedOne said:


> I am not saying that PP and CA worked together. OMG they hate each other - I think it's obvious.


HU? But you did say that you thought he did.


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

TheLovedOne said:


> Yes it is as you say. They claim that they are so much better than person A and that is why you should follow them. It works in the horse world because people like to hate others whether or not it's true. I mean if you're asking me to explain the entire strategy behind it I cannot. I wouldn't do it. But what I am saying is that just because he doesn't list being a Parelli student on his website doesn't mean that he wasn't. That's it. I'm sorry if I offended you.


LOL. Oh my, it takes much more than that to offend me, as a matter of fact I can't think of anything from a person on the net that would offend me & not much in real life either.
I still don't believe they worked together. Maybe PP is worried CA will steal LP? :wink:


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

Alwaysbehind said:


> HU? But you did say that you thought he did.


When Clinty wakes up from his nap I will ask him:wink:


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

OMG you're funny Natisha!


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

I do think it may be possible that CA may have seen PP's videos at some point to scope out the competition or for a variety of other reasons other than to learn his technique. Far from studying with or under. Back in the day, they were pretty boring, and perhaps CA wanted to see how NOT to do it. However, PP is NOT the only one he could have watched for sure. Contrary to the belief of some, he is not the second coming.:lol:
As far as CA and LP-doubt he would do that.....lol
It is pretty eveident they HATE each other. 
(Oops, sorry, this is a POSITIVE thread....my bad:wink


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## Northern (Mar 26, 2010)

Maybe CA is worried PP will steal CC's new hottie wife, too!


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

Maybe they're both worried LP will steal new hottie wife


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

CA has a new hottie wife. Oh oh now that'll make all his groupies upset  Speaking of kool-aiders.


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## Peggysue (Mar 29, 2008)

TheLovedOne said:


> CA has a new hottie wife. Oh oh now that'll make all his groupies upset  Speaking of kool-aiders.


Honestly between the two groups of disciples I thought I was gonna go to JAIL... CA and PP people are CRAZY.


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## Clair (Jun 7, 2010)

Dissapointing... I thought this was a pp positive thread.  as a teenager in public highschool one lesson I have learned is that you can make fun of anything of anything if you try. Religion, politics.. Anything. But it makes me sad to see it about something I'm passionate about.  I like parelli.. I enjoy it. It has helped me a lot. I'm excited and passionate about it. I know its not perfect, and can sometimes contradict itself, but what honestly doesn't? I also like CA. I guess that labels me a "kool-aider". That makes me feel good.
Lets grow up people, (says the 18 year old)


Anyways... For the starter of this thread, or anyone else pp positive left, id love to hear about your experiences with Parelli clinics! I'm going to one on 3/12 with a five star instructor and I'm very excited. I'd love to hear about your experiences and what was done! 
Thanks!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

hey clair, these threads always end up like this ! lets go back to talking about parelli !

i have never been to a parelli clinic or demo but i would like to. i would also like to see CA =]


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

I havent been to clinics but i've seen videos of both (more PP because like i said my friend's a member & i dont have the cash to waste on expensive DVDs lol) I personally find his techniques easy to understand & they make sense if done PROPERLY. 
Ive seen ppl try this way of working with a horse but they dont understand what they are doing or atleast they dont know all the little details that go into it cuz they've only read the book or seen one short film, so they just result in messing up & then blame the whole program for their idiocy. 

And just throwing this out there, after seeing RTTH CA seemed alot more ignorant & "arrogant" than PP but hey, if they want to be that way they have every reason. It's not like you have to live with them


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

Lilruffian-where you AT rtth? Just curious. I have no idea what the webcast covered, but, as I have said in the RTTH thread, perhaps those who weren't there didn't get the WHOLE picture....it IS possible.....just sayin....Sometimes it is best not to judge without all the information....


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## Peggysue (Mar 29, 2008)

the only difference between clinton and PP in regards to attitude is PP is older and has learned that being snobby on top of the rest isn't good pr


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## wormy (Nov 1, 2009)

Sarahandlola said:


> Yay!
> 
> So does anyone want to explain the seven games to me or point me to a *clear* video of someone doing and explaining the seven games.?
> 
> ...


Go to www.parelliconnect.com. Kinda like Facebook for Parelli followers. You get one month for free. Only 10$ a month after that. There are tons of great videos from Pat and Linda. Actually all of Level one is there in abbreviated videos. There is videos of Pat doing the seven games with a new horse. If anyone is interested in Parelli, but dont want to pay for the DVDs, this is a great place to start.


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

_Sarahandlola,_ as PP or any NH trainer would say it's all about rhythm, approach & retreat. Also, if you have troubles touching your mare in certain spots, it's best to use a "stick" or a whip with a bag on the end so that you dont get hurt.
I havent purchased an actual "carrot stick" but i use a nice stiff 4' whip at times. It works the same. The main reason he "invented" the carrot stick as a stick & not a whip is because many people, when they get a whip in their hands, their entire demeanor changes & they want to use it to hit or provoke the horse instead of communicate. 
For some reason some people see hitting a horse with a stick/stiff object it worse than a whip... ':/


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## JerBear (Jan 23, 2011)

I so wanna learn his method. Ive seen videos of him and people using his method and Ive been in love ever since. Im thinking about joining his club... Anyone in it and can tell me if its worth it?? I would like to buy his dvds too but they are outrageously expensive and I might have to buy those one at a time....


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

Well my friend really likes it. I think its $23 a month or something but you get his products & several DVDs sent to you, as well as a huge discount on his other stuff. You also get magazines. Check out the site (if you havent) & it can tell you more


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

Actually-my PP trainer sometimes uses the shaft off of cheap golf clubs. Same Fiberglass feel-just cut off the head of the club (obviously!).


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## Clair (Jun 7, 2010)

All I use is a lead rope. Instead of a whip in the other hand I just use the tail end of the lead in my biting (butt end) hand- as my "suggestion". But Kelty will also respond to an invisible rope.. Aka me pretending to use one, but not having one in my hands. Lol. My parelli trainer is cool with that. She's going to teach me how to send him laterally down a fence line. Which I think is pretty darn cool but she's never tried to sell me anything.. She doesn't even have much parelli stuff herself. We both make do with what we have
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

JerBear said:


> I so wanna learn his method. Ive seen videos of him and people using his method and Ive been in love ever since. Im thinking about joining his club... Anyone in it and can tell me if its worth it?? I would like to buy his dvds too but they are outrageously expensive and I might have to buy those one at a time....


Merp, find a friend. :wink: My biggest beef with Parelli is the outrageous prices, so she lent me her burnt copy. As interesting as it was, I have to HONESTLY say I would have been livid if I'd spent that kind of money on it. Watching the entire Level 1 and then attempting to go work with my horse ended badly - she wouldn't respond like the horse in the video and I was left standing there going "well, what now?" I would very highly advise finding a local Parelli coach/instructor/follower, as I think your money would be much better spent that way.

I WILL say, that although almost any halter will do, the Parelli equipment is top notch. The halter is SO light and accurately designed, and the yacht line rope is uncomparable to virtually anything you can buy on the market. I tried doing this with my Dressage whip and I tried with my lunge whip, and they have the carrot stick for a reason. By all means, get a discounted one, but because my friend's mom is a lifetime Parelli member, I got the halter, leadrope, carrot stick and saavy string all for like $70 which is completely reasonable when you think about it.

After trying to muck around with modified equipment, the only thing I would say is really suitable for "replacement" is the halter. The yacht rope is simply not like a heavy lunge line. However, you can get cheap "faux" carrot sticks I've heard work just as well.


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

The fake carrot sticks on ebay are just fine, and you have the added advantage of other colors! Our barn has a million orange sticks! Mine is blue. I can always find it.


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## christopher (Feb 11, 2011)

MacabreMikolaj said:


> Merp, find a friend. :wink: My biggest beef with Parelli is the outrageous prices, so she lent me her burnt copy. As interesting as it was, I have to HONESTLY say I would have been livid if I'd spent that kind of money on it. Watching the entire Level 1 and then attempting to go work with my horse ended badly - she wouldn't respond like the horse in the video and I was left standing there going "well, what now?" I would very highly advise finding a local Parelli coach/instructor/follower, as I think your money would be much better spent that way.
> 
> I WILL say, that although almost any halter will do, the Parelli equipment is top notch. The halter is SO light and accurately designed, and the yacht line rope is uncomparable to virtually anything you can buy on the market. I tried doing this with my Dressage whip and I tried with my lunge whip, and they have the carrot stick for a reason. By all means, get a discounted one, but because my friend's mom is a lifetime Parelli member, I got the halter, leadrope, carrot stick and saavy string all for like $70 which is completely reasonable when you think about it.
> 
> After trying to muck around with modified equipment, the only thing I would say is really suitable for "replacement" is the halter. The yacht rope is simply not like a heavy lunge line. However, you can get cheap "faux" carrot sticks I've heard work just as well.


i agree. for what it is, it's ridiculously overpriced. but it doesn't change the fact that most of it is better quality than most other equipment on the market. the halters especially.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Peggysue said:


> the only difference between clinton and PP in regards to attitude is PP is older and has learned that being snobby on top of the rest isn't good pr


Since this thread is supposed to stay positive I will simply say that I have not read anything funnier in a very long time.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

christopher said:


> i agree. for what it is, it's ridiculously overpriced. but it doesn't change the fact that most of it is better quality than most other equipment on the market. the halters especially.


Totally. There are a couple of other suppliers here locally that have almost the same quality but more expensive ~30% more.


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## wormy (Nov 1, 2009)

I dont get the outrage over the cost of Parelli products. PP is not operating a "non-profit organization." Its called CAPITALISM. He has a product that is in high demand and he his making money from it. I hope he makes a gazillion dollars. Has anyone priced Clinton Anderson or Chris Cox products? They are just as expensive if not more. I recently got a carrot stick and 12ft rope and Parelli halter for $65 shipped. I couldnt find it any cheaper on e-bay.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

wormy said:


> I dont get the outrage over the cost of Parelli products. PP is not operating a "non-profit organization." Its called CAPITALISM. He has a product that is in high demand and he his making money from it. I hope he makes a gazillion dollars. Has anyone priced Clinton Anderson or Chris Cox products? They are just as expensive if not more. I recently got a carrot stick and 12ft rope and Parelli halter for $65 shipped. I couldnt find it any cheaper on e-bay.



I can get a rope halter, lunge line, and lunge whip for under $20. So ya it is all over priced. Does not matter who is selling it. They are selling the hype behind it all and telling people that some how their stuff is better. 

Like was said sucker born every min.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

wormy said:


> Go to www.parelliconnect.com. Kinda like Facebook for Parelli followers. You get one month for free. Only 10$ a month after that. There are tons of great videos from Pat and Linda. Actually all of Level one is there in abbreviated videos. There is videos of Pat doing the seven games with a new horse. If anyone is interested in Parelli, but dont want to pay for the DVDs, this is a great place to start.




Thanks so much for this =D


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## wormy (Nov 1, 2009)

nrhareiner said:


> I can get a rope halter, lunge line, and lunge whip for under $20. So ya it is all over priced. Does not matter who is selling it. They are selling the hype behind it all and telling people that some how their stuff is better.
> 
> Like was said sucker born every min.


This sucker has the $20 halter and lunge line. It is NOT the quality of the Parelli. Especially the halter.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

wormy said:


> This sucker has the $20 halter and lunge line. It is NOT the quality of the Parelli. Especially the halter.



Yes the ones I have are. There is no difference. Well the cost. Not to mention I am not going to pay big bucks for something to tie my horse with. A $5 rope halter works very well for that.


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## iridehorses (Oct 22, 2007)

This is beginning to sound a lot like Parelli bashing.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

Yes iridehorses it is. I guess it's up to the mods/admin to do something about it. I know what I would do


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

Not entirely as his stuff is expensive but so is any high-quality equipment. 
And i noticed that the parelli halters are far nicer than the regular ones you'll find at any tack shop. They're lighter, as someone else said, & designed better to ad more pressure in certain areas yet strong at the same time. You dont really realize it until you have one & can compare. 
I thought it was bogus too until my friend got hers (she was sent 2 in the mail cuz she's a club member) & she gave all her other halters to her dad right away. 
Now, maybe down the road i might buy one but for now my normal rope halters work just fine & are alot cheaper! lol


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

lilruffian said:


> Not entirely as his stuff is expensive but so is any high-quality equipment.


This is so true. I have a carrot stick from a tack shop and actually paid more for it then the parelli one. The parelli one is better quality. The ropes are good quality too and I've shopped around a little bit for ropes and could not find a supplier with the same quality and lower prices. So I don't get all the fuss over the money either. The DVDs are not that much either. Comparing to other famous trainers they are a lot of the times cheaper.


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

True. I was lucky to find a Parelli rope at a local tack dealer (he gets in both new & used stuff) and had to pay $50 for it, though if i had gone through Parelli it would have been $60 with shipping.


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

i dont have any parelli stuff, wish i had the money ! i use a rope halter thats very light weight that i got for a few bucks on ebay. i like it a lot ! i just use a regular lunge line and i dont use a stick or whip. i just point with my hand or use the end of the leadrope or lungeline.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

It sounds like LF and gypsy are very resourceful - I like that  That is great that you've got a local store that sells used equipment like ropes. There isn't anyone here doing that. I bought a halter from Jonathan Field and I find it is just a little bit smaller than Parelli ones of the same size. It cost more but it too is good quality. He put this really weird clasp on the lead rope - I don't like it.


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

I, honestly dont like the clasps on the Parelli ropes... maybe it's just me but its come undone on me twice & would much prefer just a simple snap than the whole swivel idea


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

Well the swivel is not perfect but Jonathan's have a pin that you pull and it's even more bizarre IMO. I don't know I guess everyone has got to be different.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

Because of my friend, I got the entire kit for $70 after shipping. I have to say, I love that rope halter WAY more then my $10 rope halters. Also, looking at the tack store, to buy a long lunge line/yacht line rope from Stacy Westfall's line was $65 ALONE. So it's all rather expensive.

My poly rope lunge line would make a good substitute, but it's to long, I tried. I really think I got a great value for the DISCOUNTED Parelli price. Around here, I could pick up a cheap rope halter for $10, a lunge line for $30 and a whip for $15, so really, an extra $15 for quality? Having used both types of equipment, it really doesn't compare to me!


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

MacabreMikolaj said:


> I have to say, I love that rope halter WAY more then my $10 rope halters.


Why? Just curious... I have CA halter I got years ago, but it's too stiff IMHO, frankly I like my cheap ones more (plus they are more colorful).


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

I can tell you - they are thin, strong, light, and soft. I've seen the type that you describe and I'm not keen on the stiffer, thicker ones myself.


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

I agree-I really like my PP halter. I would like more colors-it can get pretty confusing when we all have them at the barn.....

CA halter is much stiffer, which I did not like at all, and I find the cheaper ones are too. TLO-Looks like we agree! LOL


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

kitten_Val said:


> Why? Just curious... I have CA halter I got years ago, but it's too stiff IMHO, frankly I like my cheap ones more (plus they are more colorful).


Really? My Parelli halter is like woven silk - as SpiritHorse had said on a different post "if you throw it to the ground and it still looks like a halter, it's crap." While I don't necessarily AGREE, I understand what she meant. I don't think you could possibly get softer material then the Parelli halter, and it's MUCH more accommodating to my princess Arab's delicate face - there's a fluidity to her movements in it, where she was prone to head tossing due to the roughness and big knots of a cheap rope halter.

Also, due to the "one size fits all", the cheap halters look horrendous on a small headed horse. There's like an extra foot of stiff rope sticking out from her head that I have to wind down the throat latch part to make it look less silly.

However, I love the cheap halters for my Paint filly and she does fantastic in them, so I certainly won't be pitching out another forkful of cash for a Parelli halter for her. And Parelli halters don't come in lime green. :lol:


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## Peggysue (Mar 29, 2008)

I love my CC halters and hated the CA one I worked with ONCE!! Haven't touched a PP one in years like 15 years or so


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

Interesting... As I said I got CA's one 4 years back or so, used it for _may be_ a month (I think it was even less than that), it sits in my shed since then. It's thin and light - that for sure, but horribly stiff. Actually I'm thinking if I have to sell it now as I don't use it at all. I in facet forgot about it completely - the whole conversation reminded me about it. :lol:


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## Peggysue (Mar 29, 2008)

KV put it up on ebay and I am sure you will get most of your money back from it ... I will credit these guys stuff holds it's value well


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

Peggysue said:


> KV put it up on ebay and I am sure you will get most of your money back from it ... I will credit these guys stuff holds it's value well


Good idea! Thanks! Didn't even think about eBay!


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## Peggysue (Mar 29, 2008)

anybody or most horse forums like this one you'll find somebody willign to buy it for a decent price


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

I was actually looking at CA's kits on eBay because they were so much cheaper then Parelli. I'm so glad I found my friend who got me a Parelli kit for the same price, I would have been PO'ed if I got another stiff halter! I thought their stuff was identical and liked the multi-colored sticks he had.


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

You could try washing the halter in the washer-perhaps that would soften it a bit. I wash all my PP stuff and it comes out like new! I can't stand when my white ropes get dirty, so wash them pretty regularly.


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

MacabreMikolaj said:


> I was actually looking at CA's kits on eBay because they were so much cheaper then Parelli. I'm so glad I found my friend who got me a Parelli kit for the same price, I would have been PO'ed if I got another stiff halter! I thought their stuff was identical and liked the multi-colored sticks he had.


Don't waste your money, MM. Halter is bad and stick is exactly the same as I got from Expo for $9 last year.  

But you know, folks, I'm very surprised because for the price I'd expect something nicer. Is it because its simply cheap (and sold for quite a lot) or the way he thinks works the best on horse... :think:


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## brookelovesparelli (Jan 21, 2009)

All I have to say about this thread is it's about time


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

i think im gonna do some ground work with gypsy today =] all the horses are getting their teeth done today so im not planning on riding

i havent decided what im gonna do in terms of ground work yet, im probably gonna try the circle game if there arent too many people riding =]


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## DieselPony (Jul 26, 2010)

Alright Parelli program followers, here's your chance to change my mind on the program. 

I've only seen two people ever in person doing Parelli stuff, and they were the type that people complain about online. The pushy horse, the never anything other playing these games and the pushiness that you must do it their way.

So clearly I don't have the highest opinion of the program, but after all this I started thinking, that if all these Parelli program following horses can walk over, under, around anything you can possibly think of, maybe my horse could benefit from these games.

My mare is green broke, she is 5 years olds, but is a very nervous horse. No nothing bad has ever happened to her, it is just her personality. She freezes and gets stuck so I was curious about the squeeze game or whatever it is called.

How does it work? Or how about the other games? Anything that is specifically related to building the horse's confidence in itself and it's handler?

I do have my own ways that I'm dealing with her, and it is working so far, but I'm willing to try other ways.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

It is not the games themselves that works so well by themselves it is how they are played and all the other knowledge/skills that comes from studying the program. If you're intested go and spend $50 on the seven games DVD from parelli or just do parelliconnect.com for a month for $10.

I find it interesting that so many people think it is bad because they watched a few people that weren't too good and maybe had big heads. I have met lots of "traditional" people with big heads that were hopeless with their horses - people following Ian Millar or other big names and they themselves sucked. So does that mean Ian Millar is also bad. Anyways just food for thought. Gotta run.


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## RadHenry09 (Mar 22, 2009)

I use the parelli ground work with my geldings. I havent done too much of the riding part of their program but the seven games have really built up my nervous gelding's confidence.

I actually worked with both of my boys today and my mustang who can be very concerned about his environment doesnt mess a thing if something is different or changed around the barn. 
Someone hung a orange blanket/rug on the ring fence in the "scary" corner of the ring .( this is what I call the corner of the ring that is by the back door of the barn) 
My gelding was very concerned about this "blanket" as it wasnt supposed to be there according to him.

I used the squeeze game to send him between the blanket on the fence and myself. He walked up very unsure and scooted by it very fast , he was not comfortable with it at all. The next time I sent him up to it and backed him away before he got to the scary part of the fence. I did this several times until he was very close to the blanket, he then put his nose on the blanket several times to check it out.

I then asked him to walk past the blanket which he did, and then sent him up to it again and this time he walked calmly past it as if it wasnt even there. 

I also sent him up to the blanket and moved it around and flapped it and he was very comfortable with it , putting his nose on it and being very relaxed.

This is how I use the seven games to introduce new scary things to my guys, it works well for us.


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## heartscontent (Jan 11, 2009)

To the person above who might be interested in Parelli:

In level 1 and 2 you use a 22 ft line and do the 7 games at a basic level.
In level 3 you progress to a 45 ft line and do the 7 games at a much higher skill. 
I won't even mention level 4 because your horse doesn't sound ready for it. 

You don't need a carrot stick or parelli halter. You can use any rope halter that is good quality and a similar stick.


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

diesel, how much ground work have you done with your horse so far ??

i would start right at the beginning with the friendly game. dont move on to the next game until you have mastered the one you are at. if your horse has not learned the 'tools' or concepts of each game it wont understand what is being asked in the next one.


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## DieselPony (Jul 26, 2010)

gypsygirl said:


> diesel, how much ground work have you done with your horse so far ??


Pretty much all ground work is good. Leads perfectly until there is something "scary" at both walk and trot. She lunges by body position and voice command on and off of the lunge line in round pen and arena. 
She ground drives, backs, moves hindquarters and shoulders(head first and shoulder first) and side passes by 'eye' pressure, I guess you could call it that. Don't have to touch her or really move at her with your body.

She ground ties for saddling and when I walk away and do something else for a few minutes. And of course stands nicely in cross-ties and regular. 

I can pick up her feet easily, her fronts I can just point and say foot. And I can touch everywhere on her body with no problems. Udders included and doesn't need to be held or caught for temperate taking.


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

_*


DieselPony said:



My mare is green broke, she is 5 years olds, but is a very nervous horse. No nothing bad has ever happened to her, it is just her personality. She freezes and gets stuck so I was curious about the squeeze game or whatever it is called.

Click to expand...

*_


DieselPony said:


> _*How does it work? Or how about the other games? Anything that is specifically related to building the horse's confidence in itself and it's handler?*_
> 
> 
> > Personally, i found the "Horsenality" DVD very interesting & good to watch as it shows you the 4 basic types of personalities and how to deal with each as they arise.
> ...


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## heartscontent (Jan 11, 2009)

Ok it sounds like you might need to look at level 1 but your horse seems past that. Rent the level one dvd and learn the 7 games. Then go on to level 2. It sounds like your horse is ready for level 2 but you need to watch level 1 first because you haven't done the Parelli program yet.

So buy, rent or borrow the level 1 and 2 dvd's. That is all you will need for now. If you don't have a stick you will have to get one(doesn't have to be Parelli brand).


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

As I have stated again and again....they ALL have something to offer. Parelli is not the be all end all. But, since this is a PP positive thread and we must only be nice-nice with regards to him and not even thing anything other than perfect thoughts.......here goes. It may help to get the help of a PP person, rather than buying the videos...I started with a friend just showing me some of the games and that was more helpful to me than the videos. I would also NOT recommend starting with a 22' line. It is just too cumbersome, IMO, and as I recall, they used the shorter one in the beginning videos. It does sound like your horse has some Left Brain Introvert tendencies, as they get VERY sticky feet. I have one, and they can be the most difficult to deal with. They seem to spend more time thinking of 50 ways to get out of work than it would take to do it. :wink:


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## heartscontent (Jan 11, 2009)

Parelli can be cheap.

Like someone said ask a friend to show you the 7 games. Sign up for savvy club if you have $120. If you don't skip the club.
Borrow all the dvd's. It's that simple. You don't need to buy anything else to learn the method.

In fact YOUTUBE IS FREE! Go look at Parelli 7 games on there for FREE!


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

_franknbeans_^^ Ha ha so true! Like PP said (actually it was Linda, but she was narrating lol) left-brain introverts are the only horses where he'd suggest using treats (NOT as a bribe, but as a reward because these horses tend to get very stubborn & lazy if they dont see anything in it for them). I've dealt with a couple & they made awesome trail horses but can be a real _pain _to try & get them to do anything in an arena unless you can keep them interseted.

As for buying Pat's stuff, like someone said before _all _good trainers cost money & atleast by getting some DVDs you always have the information on hand to go back & learn if you forget something. If you prefer CC or CA then buy their stuff but this is a PP thread. 
In my opinion they're all the same only PP's stuff breaks it down better.
Also when i first got into NH i looked into both PP & CA stuff & the Level 1/2 PP DVD (which i would _highly_ reccommend for a beginner) is $200 regular price, whereas CA's starter set is $230 regular without shipping.


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

so i tried to ride today but the footing was so deep =/ it felt like gypsy was drowning and we were both frustrated ! so i ended up playing the friendly game with her for awhile, first with a lunge whip and then with a huge colored ball we have. she was just loose because i didnt have her halter and lead rope in the arena with me. had lots of fun though, she even let me put the ball on her back and throw it over her =]


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## DieselPony (Jul 26, 2010)

Okay.... I have very limited time this week so I just watched some audition clips or something for passing levels on youtube... So I'm still trying to figure out this Parelli thing.

So level 1 is the 7 games at the very basic?

Level 2 is the 7 games but with added obstacles like standing on stuff, touching something or doing the "circle game" around a different object other than the handler, all while on a lead.

Level 3 is all of level 2 plus whatever other objects but off lead?

I haven't watched level 4 yet, decided to double check my thoughts before I have to go to work. 
I didn't notice those lengths of leads that were posted here by Heartscontent. Is that just a general guide line?

And then the games, let me know if I got this right. Just very basic description as I see them.

Friendly game is sacking out.
Porcupine game is moving off of direct pressure.
Driving game is same thing just without actual touch.
Yo-Yo game is the horse backing up and coming forward with whatever cue the person picks.
Circle game is having the horse move around in a circle at whichever set speed around whichever object.
Sideways game is having the horse side pass.
Squeeze game is to put horse in between two objects while moving calmly.

What am I missing? 
Because after watching those clips, I don't get why it is such an expensive DVD program. Not trying to offend anyone, I'm just being honest, I would like to see why Parelli is so amazing to some people. I'm genuinely curious to see what I am missing here.


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## TheLovedOne (Jan 26, 2011)

Well I don't think it's expensive compared to other people's DVDs. Hiring a trainer/coach to help out costs money too and at the end you have nothing except what you can remember.

The program consists of the seven games combined with four savvys: online, freestyle, liberty, finesse. 

ONLINE is on the ground with ropes 12', 22', 45'. The choice of length depends on the situation and/or the level you're working at.

FREESTYLE is riding without contact usually in a halter but not necessarily. It is about riding your horse with your body but without any contact.

LIBERTY is playing with your horse on the ground without anything attached, no halter, no ropes.

FINESSE is riding your horse with contact.

If you want to study it then you're going to have to part with some money unless you find someone that will share with you.


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## christopher (Feb 11, 2011)

DieselPony said:


> Okay.... I have very limited time this week so I just watched some audition clips or something for passing levels on youtube... So I'm still trying to figure out this Parelli thing.
> 
> So level 1 is the 7 games at the very basic?
> 
> ...


basically yeah. there's more to the circle game than just getting the horse moving around you though. the sending, bringing back, changing of direction and all the other parts of the circle game have to be timed perfectly to the horse doing a certain thing. parelli never actually says that though i don't believe.

circles are the most important part imo. if your level 4 in the circle game but level 1 in everything else you'll go far, but if your level 1 in the circle and 4 everything else then you won't, as the circle game incorporates the 4 basic movements of forwards backwards hindquarter movement and forehand movement


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## lilruffian (Jun 28, 2010)

^^ Parelli suggests using a twelve-foot rope when you start out to do all the games, nothing shorter as it doesn't give you enough space. It's meant to be a "safety-net" that's there just incase you need it.
After you & the horse get good, then you move to a 22-foot line or in some cases a 45-foot line until the horse responds perfecty to your cues & you can attempt the games off line. 
Another important key to the circling game is that's it's meant to keep the horse thinking as well as doing all the work. He has to maintain gait, maintain direction & watch where he's going all on his own until you tell him to stop or speed up. It's also his job to keep slack in the rope, so he has to concentrate on that as well without coming too far into your space


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## tinac (Jun 16, 2010)

I don't know if anyone is keeping up-to-date with this forum any more, but Parelli has a sort of facebook type website, that currently has a 30-day free trial and it has free access to the Level 1 stuff, 7 games etc. Also quite a few other videos. Google Parelli Connect and you will find it.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Yeah but ya still gotta put in a number for a credit card etc which I don't have =/


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## McuesHiSierra (Apr 10, 2011)

I use PP techniques with so many of my horses and the games are not only a fun way to bond and grow a better relationship with your horse but they really go a long way in helping with communication!


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