# Mysterious Wounds, Vet has NO CLUE



## Endiku (Dec 6, 2010)

This is so strange...I'm sorry, I have no idea whats going on but I'm subbing and I hope you can figure out what is wrong and how to fix it! Poor guy.


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## Saranda (Apr 14, 2011)

I'm no vet, but it looks almost like pemphigus foliaceus or another auto-immune disease. It can appear in different species, my experience comes from treating a cat who had almost similar sores to your horse, although all over her body, not just legs. She was successfully treated with prednisolone, but she's on the drug for the rest of her life now, otherwise the sores return.

Equine Pemphigus Foliaceus | International Pemphigus Pemphigoid Foundation


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## Cherie (Dec 16, 2010)

I have heard of this condition but never seen one. It sure looks like everything I have read about pemphigus foliaceu. Show this to your Vet.


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

The culture results came back on Mozart's legs. Its a bacteria called trueperella pyogenes and its a bizarre bacteria that my vet has never heard of before. Even the lab is running further tests to see what exactly causes it. Right now he is on antibiotics and steroid cream applied to the wounds. Seems to be working for now.


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

*Mozart Update*

Hello All,

I am giving anyone who might be interested in an update on Mozart and his weird leg problems. We figured out what it is but we are still fighting to make it better. His back leg is healed (finally) and the front of his front leg is healing up nicely as well. However, the back of his front leg looks awefull. He will be starting penicillin on Friday and hopefully that will give him the chance to heal the back of his front leg.

This is what the front of his front leg looks like now:









and this is how the back of his front leg looks. Its actually healing everywhere but that large lump. (he had a similar lump on his hind leg that went away on its own, hopefully this one will too)


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## Ale (May 8, 2013)

Keeping my fingers crossed that the treatment continues to work!


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## JulieG (Jun 25, 2013)

How strange! Glad to hear it's starting to heal.


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## NBEventer (Sep 15, 2012)

That is the craziest thing I have ever seen.

Does the vet know anymore about what this was? Like what caused it? A quick google search said its the same family as Mastitis but that seems far fetched to me given how nasty it has brewed... I would really be interested in knowing more about what caused it.


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## beau159 (Oct 4, 2010)

Very strange indeed! I hope you can get it cleared up.

Does the vet have any idea on how that particular bacteria travels from animal to animal? (As in, where did it come from?)

I'd certainly be keeping him in a strict quarantine. We don't want any of your other horse's getting it.


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## 4horses (Nov 26, 2012)

Any cattle in your area?

A quick google search suggests it is common in cows (mastitis) and in musk deer it can cause abscesses.

Looks like it has developed resistance to both tetracycline and erythromycin. 

Here is a good article:
Arcanobacterium Pyogenes

Looks like penicillin is the way to go! 

I would ask the vet about chlorhexidine skin cleaner to try and kill bacteria on the outside of the skin?


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

We have no idea how he got it. There are cows in the area, however they are nowhere near where the horses are turned out. We do know that it is not contagious. I touch his legs and touch other parts of him and other horses and so far he is the only one with it. (as a precaution I do not use his leg wraps on other horses, just to be safe) He will be starting Penicillin on Friday and hopefully that clears this up. This is the last of the bacteria, since his hind leg and most of his front leg are healed. There was a large solid mass (like the yellow one in the picture) on his hind leg when we were fighting with that and it is now gone and he actually has little scarring. Fingers crossed that this leg heals soon and that he can return to work. He is on and off lame right now so he has the rest of the month off in hopes that the down time, combined with the new meds, will help.


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## SueNH (Nov 7, 2011)

Sometimes I'm so jealous of the warm weather so many places have compared to me, then I see all these weird creepy crawly things and I'm glad I live where I live.


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## rideverystride (Jul 19, 2013)

Weird.. I'm glad you're starting to get it under control.


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## evilamc (Sep 22, 2011)

I'm probably going to get called a hippy for suggesting this...

If Penicillin doesn't work you could try looking into Chinese herbs. I'm actually going to start treating my horses lymes with them in two weeks because other treatments aren't working. The herbs are said to be a little stronger, easier on the horse and less likely for the horse to get an immunity to it...Not sure which you would need but if you are at all interested I can give you the info of the man who is helping me treat my horses lymes. 

Just a thought! Hopefully Penicillin works though!


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## spirit88 (Jan 12, 2011)

evilamc said:


> I'm probably going to get called a hippy for suggesting this...
> 
> If Penicillin doesn't work you could try looking into Chinese herbs. I'm actually going to start treating my horses lymes with them in two weeks because other treatments aren't working. The herbs are said to be a little stronger, easier on the horse and less likely for the horse to get an immunity to it...Not sure which you would need but if you are at all interested I can give you the info of the man who is helping me treat my horses lymes.
> 
> Just a thought! Hopefully Penicillin works though!




Id be interested in what your using to treat your horse for lyme dease is. Currently have two horses sick with it pm me if you dont want to disclose the info here.


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## SaskGal (Apr 18, 2012)

Saranda said:


> I'm no vet, but it looks almost like pemphigus foliaceus or another auto-immune disease. It can appear in different species, my experience comes from treating a cat who had almost similar sores to your horse, although all over her body, not just legs. She was successfully treated with prednisolone, but she's on the drug for the rest of her life now, otherwise the sores return.
> 
> Equine Pemphigus Foliaceus | International Pemphigus Pemphigoid Foundation


My grandmother got a auto-immune disease that sounds exactly like that. She was put on medication but was not strong enough and died....so get that medicated....or put the poor baby down!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Hi evilamc & OP, I'm a bit of a 'hippy' in regard to some treatments too & have found Manuka honey to be fantastic at healing 'stubborn' wounds, infections & skin conditions. Also worth looking into IMO, as a topical in conjunction with penicillin. I'd also look at diet & nutrition.


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## SueNH (Nov 7, 2011)

Any raw honey works well on sores however you pay a premium for it not to be boiled out of usefulness and then; I really suspect keeping a horse from licking the bandages off would be impossible.


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

Mozart started penicillin yesterday morning. The vet said 35cc's twice a day so he has had four doses and already the wounds look better. The large lump on the back of his front leg is gone and he is no longer lame (although he gets the rest of the month off anyway) I couldn't be happier with the new antibiotic. At first I was terrified that I would accidentally kill him but I got the hang of it and I also have a lot of help. I will take pictures in a few days and post them, hopefully he is healed soon.


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

Oh the poor thing. Glad the vet was able to ID it and the Penicillin is working. Fingers crossed for you.


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## Northernstar (Jul 23, 2011)

So glad the penicillin is beginning to work! Prayers sent for your boy


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

fungus? ate something toxic?


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

churumbeque said:


> fungus? ate something toxic?


bacteria that he picked up from an unknown source. After three months, we are finally nearing the end.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

In Florida they wash horses legs with antibacterol soap because of fungus in the sand
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

My poor horse is getting tired of being poked in the butt by a needle twice a day...I feel so bad for him but it is helping. I about had a heart attack when I headed out to the barn this morning and saw him laying down flat (he almost never lays down for a nap) and I was like, "please don't be dead." Even though we are very careful with the penicillin. Still...kinda scary.


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

So today I unwrapped Mozart's leg and saw a big hole in the large circle of dead flesh on his leg. It looks like his tendon is showing through the hole. I called the vet and she will be out as soon as she can to tell me if it is his tendon underneath or if its something else (which I can't think of what else it might be) I am hoping its not his tendon, I really want him to be better soon. He's such a nice horse, a true gentleman and I miss riding him and jumping him. If he is going to be lame for the rest of his life, I will be very upset. However, despite the hole, he is still sound, and has been for the most part. Every once and a while he will have a bad day where he limps a little at the walk but he's been sound now for four days in a row (which is a new record for us in the month of Oct) When this mess all started he wasn't lame at all and I actually showed him, just with vet wrap on the wound and a vet note saying it was okay. I am hoping for the best and I pray every night that he will make it through this and still be my amazing show horse in the end, even if it takes longer, I just want him to be okay in the end. *sigh* 

Anyway, I just needed to rant a little. Please, if you believe in any kind of higher power, pray for us.


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## evilamc (Sep 22, 2011)

Oh no that sounds scary  Hope the vet gets there soon and figures out what it is and its not too serious!


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

So the vet wont be able to be here til first thing in the morning. I will update you all as soon as I know. I am prepared to put him down if it comes to that....but I really hope it doesn't.


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## barrelbeginner (Jan 31, 2012)

I hope everything goes well with the vet. This must be a scary situation! prayers and good vibes


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## Kayella (Feb 11, 2012)

Sorry to hear about the update, I hope everything goes well. ):

As for the wound, there's a mare at my barn that had something similar. My vet called it a summer sore and said it was infected with microscopic worms. Or something along that line. He lanced the large part off and gave her antibiotics to apply to the wound. He also had her worm the horse every week with Ivermectin to kill off the worm things. The wound is almost completely healed and it's been about 7-8 weeks now? Just food for thought.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NBEventer (Sep 15, 2012)

Oh no! My thoughts and prayers are with you. I hope it is something manageable :-(


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

Okay so its not his tendon, just another layer of flesh. Thank God. 

The vet was actually please at how it looks (since it does look better) and she gave me some pre-medicated, nonstick pads to put on the wound to hopefully close the wound.


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## Kayella (Feb 11, 2012)

That's great news! I hope the new stuff works out well for him. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NBEventer (Sep 15, 2012)

Fabulous news!!! Sending speedy recovery vibes your way!


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

Ok so the nonstick pad helped heal a lot! The vet will be dropping more out tomorrow. As soon as I get my Internet is back (using my phone currently) I will upload pictures.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## dressagebelle (May 13, 2009)

Glad to hear he is healing, and that he let you continue to give him his shots. My mare tore open her back leg, and I had to give her 8cc of banamine 2x a day for what was supposed to be three days, but by the second shot on the second day, she wouldn't let me near her with a needle. So she unfortunately didn't get her pain meds. Fortunately they were just for pain, not an antibiotic. But she really didn't like needles after that, and I've given dog, cats, and horses shots for years, so I made sure that I was gentle, and quick about it, she's just a sensitive horse. Can't wait to see more pictures on how it's healing.


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

Ok guys. This picture was taken last night (11/3) and even overnight it has gotten better. The wound is closed now and he is sound! I got to ride him for the first time in over a month today! Man how I missed him. 

Anyway, we are going to be putting two more nonstick pads on just to help heal it up even faster. 

Here is a picture as of last night. I will take pictures after we take each pad off (they stay on for three days)


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

Hello guys. 

My vet wanted to see what would happen if I took Mozart off antibiotics so he has been off them for about a week now. Then I took another one of the medicated pads off on this past Monday and this is what it looked like.










much better right?

So I put another medicated pad on and it came off today. However, instead of getting better, it got worse. Its all big and swollen now (the whole in his leg looks like the first pictures I took, but a little smaller and not infected at all, just really bloody) He is also lame now too.  So my vet will be stopping by to give him more antibiotics, and to give me more medicated pads and bute. 

I'll keep you guys posted.


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

Ok guys, I have been updating people on how Mozart's leg is coming along on different posts. So I decided to post the updates here as well, since this is the original post. 

This is a quote from my second post on Mozart's Health. This post was posted on November 19th:

"Running out of things to try to get the would to heal, my vet suggested that we try these pre-medicated pads that are really expensive. Well they work. His leg was almost healed, then the vet wanted to see what he would do off of antibiotics (which he has been on this whole time) and so we stopped the antibiotics and his leg got worse again. So back on the antibiotics he went. Now the back of his front leg is healing but the front of the front leg is opening up to be a big sore like the back of that leg. So now we are fighting two sides of the same leg.

And then to top it all off, Mozart is ill. It seems he has the flu that is going around in our area. He had a high fever (103.8)for two days and was in a lot of pain (you could tell because this horse is calm and he was pawing and curling his lip and shivering) and he had been laying down for the greater part of the days he had a fever. His fever is broken, he is eating and drinking normally and he only lays down for a few minutes at a time and only three or four times a day. He has been all sucked up the whole time, like ribs showing, hip bone showing and his stomach all tense. My vet said something was causing him a lot of pain (probably the flu) and she told me to put him on U-guard (an ulcer supplement) and so far he is just starting to look less sucked up, not back to normal, but in less pain."

As of today (Dec 14th), Mozart is no longer sick. He is mostly sound (he has his ouchy days still) and his leg is looking better and better everyday. He is now on a steroid that is doing great things with his legs. He will be on them for a few more weeks so they still have plenty of time to heal some more before the steroid treatment ends. I am hoping that the wounds will be mostly healed by the time we run out of steroids.


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## Northernstar (Jul 23, 2011)

Mozart is such a trooper! Poor sweetheart....the girls and I are sending a big hug


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

*SO Happy*

Hello everyone,

I just wanted to say that Mozart's leg looks the best I've ever seen it today. I will be checking to see if he's sound tomorrow because the wound looks so good! I will try and remember to get a picture of it.


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

So Mozart's wounds are still present, they are getting better, we have resorted to wonderdust. He is still on steroids and he is sound. The vet also cleared him for light work under saddle so at least I can ride him now.


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## Katiy (Dec 29, 2013)

You poor thing, how stressful this must be for you. I hope it continues to heal and he makes a full recovery soon.


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## Drifting (Oct 26, 2011)

How terrible! I love his name. I hope he starts healing faster for you!


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## ZaneyZanne123 (Nov 9, 2013)

Good Greif and how Bizzare. First is there are water source that runs through a cattle facility that runs through your place also? Could be a source. Secondly most (not all) bacteria lives in the soil and for some reason under certain conditions you get a "bloom" of a certain bacteria that does crazy things. (fungi do the same). Some are very oportunistic and doesnt take much to go hay wire. I was just agast at the photos. I feel for you and your horse.

Telfa pads....another one of those great inventions.

Also before you resort to wonderdut give Equaide a try. I have posted a testamony on it on one of the threads. Jingles for Stryder by Drifting. It might be worth a try for your predicament. If intrested go to www.Equaide.com .

I am glad to hear that things are improving and I hope they continue to do so.


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

I don't know why I thought it but is there any chance these could be caused by snake bite? Some venoms will cause the skin to react like this.


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## Northernstar (Jul 23, 2011)

Saddlebag said:


> I don't know why I thought it but is there any chance these could be caused by snake bite? Some venoms will cause the skin to react like this.


Good point! Only 3 things in MI are venomous - 2 spiders, and 1 snake (none are fatal) - the _Brown Recluse_ is a spider that has a _nasty_ bite which eats away an area deep into the skin, and leaves an open wound such as this for a long, long time. (I've only seen one person who's had it, and there was quite a deep scar) It's a much smaller wound on humans, but maybe something in N CA causes a similar bite in horses? Worth pondering...


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## Hunter65 (Aug 19, 2009)

wow what an ordeal this has been for you and Mozart. I hope his leg continues to get better.


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

We did think about the possibility of a bite from something venomous. However that was ruled out when we did the culture.


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

*1/15/2014 Update*

Hello everyone. 

Today Mozart is still sound (even through the work) and his leg looks amazing. The vet will be out today and I'm going to ask her if he can return to regular work instead of just light work. We also have a horse show next month. 

Here are some pictures of the wounds.


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## Horses4Healing (Feb 3, 2012)

Hello everyone,

After 7 long months of trying to get Mozart's legs to heal, I have finally given up. His back leg was healed in October of 2013 and it is opening back up to be the same persistent wound. We have tried everything we can think of and I can no longer afford his vet bills. Mozart will be going to a rescue where he will stay for the remainder of his life. They will take care of his wounds and when he is healed they will turn him out on green pasture where he can live the rest of his life a happy, retired horse.


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## evilamc (Sep 22, 2011)

I'm so sorry to hear that  I know you tried everything you could. I hope he has a good retired life at the rescue.


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## CLaPorte432 (Jan 3, 2012)

Sorry to hear that. But its completely understandable. Super weird disease...

Is Mozart by chance a Bashkir Curly?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

I'm sorry things haven't gone well.
Has a sequestrum been ruled out as a cause for the nonhealing wound? They act the same way.


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## Missy May (Feb 18, 2012)

I am sorry to hear that, it sounds like it has been quite an exhausting battle. I am glad he is going to a rescue. It seems like such an unusual case that a Vet University would want to research it (cultures, blood). 
Many interesting remedies suggested. I always go to sulfur, topically. I really hope the "magic formula" is found and he beats this thing.


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## KigerQueen (Jun 16, 2013)

Look on the bright side. He gets to live the rest of his life a happy horse. This is alot better then just PTS, as he can just eat and be a pasture puff, and always have a home. And i bet the rescue would let you see him whenever you want.


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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

kayella.. the microscopic worms are called onchorios and one other type i forget that name,and they are a parasite of flies that transmit to the horse when its bitten
Does Mozarts leg ever heal up ? Is the rescue going to continue medicating him ? Is he in pain , because that looks painful.


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