# Mini Critique



## ThatRoanHorse (Mar 2, 2017)

After watching some videos online (“From a Judges Perspective”) I was curious as to what people other than those at my barn think about Duncan’s movement. So, have a Riding Critique! He can go much slower but this is his “consistent” speed and the imo the most natural *feeling* trot. Ignore the failed lope off attempt at the end, we were in a lesson and unfortunately the boy’s name can sound quite similar to “Duncan” especially in the high wind, so it was a bit confusing. 

ETA: if the weathers good tomorrow I’ll get a more complete Critique... in this video my “Horsemanship” isn’t the best, trying to focus on his movement lol


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## mmshiro (May 3, 2017)

Here's a short one: Look up instead of at the horse's ears. Your balance will be better if your head isn't tilted forward.

At first, I thought there'd be miniature horses...


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## Boo Walker (Jul 25, 2012)

Haha me too, looking for a mini horse. Yes, look where you want to go. It will send subtle cues to your horse. Look up and sit up. Bring your elbow in and your upper arm even with your torso. This will eliminate the appearance of you reaching far forward with the rein hand. The horse has a nice little jog!


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## ClearDonkey (Nov 27, 2016)

I very much so like this horse - mostly because he is ACTUALLY jogging, and looks sound! One thing I would work on is working on making your corrections less obvious - if it takes you a big correction during practice, then it will likely take a bigger correction at a show (with more distractions, noises, horses, etc), and you ultimately want to look effortless


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

I too thought I was going to see mini confo shots! 

Not great at critiquing this sort of thing so BIG lump of salt... I think it's hard to critique the *horse's* movement, when you're obviously still at the stage you need to correct him all the time - tho I can't really see what you're correcting either, just seeing a lot of big, jerky arm movements.


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## FlyWithBlueJay (Aug 3, 2018)

This is coming from an English rider... so let’s see how this goes. You need to look up, keep your hand quieter, and get your leg underneath you before I can really critique your horses way of going correctly. You’re looking at Duncan’s ears, when you should be looking straight ahead. Keep your hand motions quiet (don’t yank as much), the big and jerky hand motions aren’t pretty. From what I can see, your pony knows what he’s doing so you don’t really need to keep doing that. Moving on, you leg is braced and too far forward, I have the same problem. Wrap your leg around him and keep your heel aligned with your hip and ear. ANYWAY, I would like to see more of a trot out of your horse, he’s barely moving along and a couple of times I thought he was going to break off into a walk. Avoid this by keeping your leg on him and nudging him every so often to keep it up. I think he might be going so slow because he’s a school master and was taught to trot very slowly for the beginners. Besides the point, he’s long and low and rounded out and looks very nice. He’s a gorgeous boy and you look super on him. Just please keep those things in mind 😀.


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## FlyWithBlueJay (Aug 3, 2018)

I would also advise to wear a helmet, for your safety of course.


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

Your horses movement would be a lot nicer if you left him alone and let him jog not bumping his mouth every step or balancing by the non-stop shifting of your body.
Stop interfering...

Duncan covers for your bodies movement constantly...
His jog can be a real western jog...slow and going near nowhere...

As others said...
_Look where you are going, go where you are looking.* Eyes up!!*_

Quiet that hand...you fuss at the horse non-stop with correct, correct, and more correct it is un-necessary.
Let go of that face, give him some rein...every-step you pop him in the mouth, watch his reaction he flinches as the bit grabs.
You look so stiff trying to do everything at once..._relax._

Personally, I know it isn't "western" but if you allowed your horse to move a bit more freely you would sit his trot/jog easier...he's a big horse who has a large stride all contained in baby-steps.

I also for now would tell you to kick out of those stirrups and learn to truly balance on your seat bones... 
Relax the spine, sit and absorb the energy through the entire body and stop fighting your own bodies natural softness. _I would love to take your saddle away...no pad no blanket but jeans to horses coat and you ride with nothing but you to keep your balance..._
Eyes up, hand down and out front. 

Raising your eyes _*will*_ help you to sit and balance better, quietly...

English riders ride with quiet contact...and you have a curb bit...not nice!
Release the reins, a looped, draped rein is not one with contact like you have happening.
Stop balancing on your hand and with the horses mouth.

Sit down and slide 1" forward in that saddle off the cantle and your leg should gently fall under you and you stop fighting looking for it.

You're working to hard to ride a quiet gait...relax.
Just relaxing will make a world of difference to horse, to you and to the pretty picture you want to make.

And yes, you *should* have a helmet on your head. 
If you plan on doing any showing, most associations today do not allow junior riders to ride without a approved riding helmet so good practice to get used to wearing it _all the time astride._
:cowboy:...


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## SilverMaple (Jun 24, 2017)

I like this horse, but stop picking at him, sit deep, look up, and leave him alone. You're pulling his mouth every stride with a big curb bit. My old 4H instructor would have you off that horse in a heartbeat for getting in his mouth all the time like that. If he goes faster, so what? Some horses need to move more quickly until they learn to balance. A good western jog is balanced and slow, not from the bit, but because the horse is carrying and rating himself. If you need to rate him back, do a half-halt or a small circle, then let him go again. Eventually he will figure out how to rate himself and you can stay off his mouth. Once a western horse is in a curb bit, you shouldn't have to pick up more than light contact, ever. 



I would recommend a couple of months bareback or at least without stirrups on the longe line, no bridle. Learn to sit balanced at all three gaits with a quiet leg, eyes up, proper posture, and relax with the movement rather than fighting it. At a slow western jog, you should have a quiet hand and be nearly motionless in the saddle.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Nice horse. He looks a bit stiff, though. is he older? I like him, and you two will be a good pair.


the stirrups look to be of unequal length, with the left being significantly longer.


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## ThatRoanHorse (Mar 2, 2017)

FlyWithBlueJay said:


> ... I think he might be going so slow because he’s a school master and was taught to trot very slowly for the beginners. Besides the point, he’s long and low and rounded out and looks very nice. He’s a gorgeous boy and you look super on him. Just please keep those things in mind 😀.


I'm laughing a little at his. Duncan is in no way a school master. His trot is a WIP (but getting better!). He's 7 years old, saddle broke at 3, and had almost two years of pasture. So essentially, when I began riding him two years ago, he was the equivalent of green broke. Thank you for the compliments! I will definitely keep those thingsin mind as they seem to be a recurring point of interest.



horselovinguy said:


> Your horses movement would be a lot nicer if you left him alone and let him jog not bumping his mouth every step or balancing by the non-stop shifting of your body.
> Stop interfering...
> 
> Quiet that hand...you fuss at the horse non-stop with correct, correct, and more correct it is un-necessary.
> ...


Thank you! I was doing what my trainer was telling me to do. Before that video he was head up, fast trot. Not listening. By the time my mom started videoing, he had put his head down (mostly) but was still trotting quicker than he's 'supposed' to. 

I'll attach a video of how I 'normally' ride once he's gotten his energy out and is listening well. I guess that probably wasn't the best video to post a critique of, however that video was taken about a month before the upcoming video was.

More rein, less contact. Sit up, forward, look up. I'll try my best to remember! ^w^

Edit: Also, although I'm in W/T classes, I'm not in the Junior age group  The only event I'm required to wear a helmet in is the HUS or "English Pleasure". I will, however, try to remember to bring it out to the barn next time.



SilverMaple said:


> I like this horse, but stop picking at him, sit deep, look up, and leave him alone. You're pulling his mouth every stride with a big curb bit. My old 4H instructor would have you off that horse in a heartbeat for getting in his mouth all the time like that. If he goes faster, so what? Some horses need to move more quickly until they learn to balance. A good western jog is balanced and slow, not from the bit, but because the horse is carrying and rating himself. If you need to rate him back, do a half-halt or a small circle, then let him go again. Eventually he will figure out how to rate himself and you can stay off his mouth. Once a western horse is in a curb bit, you shouldn't have to pick up more than light contact, ever.
> 
> 
> 
> I would recommend a couple of months bareback or at least without stirrups on the longe line, no bridle. Learn to sit balanced at all three gaits with a quiet leg, eyes up, proper posture, and relax with the movement rather than fighting it. At a slow western jog, you should have a quiet hand and be nearly motionless in the saddle.


Thank you!

For those of you saying I'd sit easier if he went faster, that isn't true. It is actually harder for me to sit a fast trot (without posting or sitting in a two-point) than at Duncan's jog.
I'll post the newer video, see below. 



tinyliny said:


> Nice horse. He looks a bit stiff, though. is he older? I like him, and you two will be a good pair.
> 
> 
> the stirrups look to be of unequal length, with the left being significantly longer.


Nope, he's only 7. What do you see when you mean stiff? And thank you! <3 I'd actually have to go back and re-watch, I didn't think my stirrups were uneven but they might've been.

New video: This is how I ride once he slows down. I do tend to get after him a lot with the reins, but that is how I was taught to ride him; he runs through smaller bits and ignores leg commands without spurs (sometimes even ignores the spurs). Even in this video, we hadn't clicked and hit that sweet spot. I was still a little tense and nervous, which tbh was simply caused by the camera. The one major thing I noticed about this video is that I need to get that right shoulder and heels back, back, back. He definitely has a English stride, but there is only one English class that we can compete in (which we do), but it's no fun going to a show and only competing in one class so we also do WP/Horsemanship/Showmanship/Halter/etc.






Edit: Also, do you guys think longer stirrups would help? Or am I simply not riding with my leg in the correct position?


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## FlyWithBlueJay (Aug 3, 2018)

Back again! And no, I don’t think your stirrups should be any longer, they could actually be shorter if you wanted. I think you just need to bend at the knee more. As I said before, your heel should be vertical with your hip and ear, no matter the discipline. And good job reducing those hand motions, you really listened! I can tell you might need a bit more work on quieting your hand, but you have made progress. With less jerking, Duncan will become more calm and won’t stress as much because of that constant picking at the bit. Something I do notice in the video is that you are bouncing a lot. You can fix this by sitting on your seat bones and rocking with your horse’s motion. Getting your leg in the correct position and remembering to look up and where you are going will help with this INDEFINITELY. Also, please wear a helmet for your safety and my sanity... I wish you the best of luck with Duncan and hope you take note of these things while riding!


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

I like his movement, nice for a junior open horse. I won't critique your riding, others have already mentioned lots, BUT stop picking up on him, he is learning to tune you out.


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## ThatRoanHorse (Mar 2, 2017)

waresbear said:


> I like his movement, nice for a junior open horse. I won't critique your riding, others have already mentioned lots, BUT stop picking up on him, he is learning to tune you out.


He definitely is learning to tune me out  I want to wean him onto a smaller bit and less/no spurs but he ignores them. I’m working on the picking on him thing! (Edit: right now he’s in a correction bit.. recently I’ve been reading up and am slightly horrified with what I’m reading and thus the less nitpicking, although I’m not sure if everything on the internet is true. I used to use ball spurs (it was my first time ridin with spurs on any horse) and now the BO has me riding in clover-style rowels.) He just.. won’t go slower if I don’t constantly get after him, though. I could ask him to walk in a circle for an hour and he wouldn’t put his head down even remotely. Granted that’d be boring for him and therefore he would want to look around, but we have a small indoor arena so it’s hard to do anything other than circles. What do you guys recommend for this? I mean he doesn’t go fast, he just has a big stride and is an English/HUS-style of a horse. However, all of the shows in our area are Western-based and HUS is one class out of 40+. We normally place really well against the “true” western pleasure horses because if I ask him for it, he loves to open up and use his full stride. Sometimes he can be quite lazy though, I can feel him slow down and revert to his WP trot when posting in HUS.

I feel like our issues are more of a “we haven’t really found what discipline we’re cut out for”. He LOVES English, but I have no clue how to do Dressage, there are few HUS shows nearby, and he’s isn’t supposed to be jumping because of a previous injury. I’d like to do Reining but he doesn’t have the speed control necessary (yet) nor do we have the arena for it. He’s in training for WP but I feel like he really hates it (or it’s hard for him because of his natural stride). Neither of us like gaming so that’s the one thing we agree on. 

Sorry for the mini rant lol. We’re working on it, though. Hopefully we’ll figure it out and push through it. I am willing to do whatever event he’s best at; I want him to be happy and to do something that he can actually do. I can always learn.


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

He is going as slow as he can for his strength level at this time. if you are going to show him open, that is a good pace he is going at, any slower and open judges will dock you. A breed Show Champion usually cannot win at open shows and vice-versa, different standard of judging. Your horse looks good for open shows. Instead of going with a heavier bit, go with a heavier seat and a heavy lower leg, when you get any kind of improvement using that combo, go to a high ported bit, and use it really loosely and vibration only, make it a point of not moving your hand, just vibrate with your wrist. I really had to glue my arms to my sides and relax my wrists to master that. Hope that helps you out a little bit. You guys show good potential.


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## ThatRoanHorse (Mar 2, 2017)

Okay. I don’t know what our little local shows would be classified as, open I guess? But a lot of the breed show horses (we have a lot of big AQHA shows nearby) come to out club shows, so our WP class has L1/Ametur AQHYA horses in it (one of the mares that we’re up against has over 500 points in youth classes). We frequently have AQHA judges, too. I’ll try the heavier seat/leg although I freely admit to never truly learning to ride that way. Most of my time has been spent on seasoned schoolhorses (10 years, to be exact) and although I’ve been working with Duncan for almost three years now he still gives me quite the workout. I have to say I’d get bored on anything less though. Thank you all for the advice!


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

If I get a judge who is AQHA carded as well, I will slow it down however there's seemed to be a crack down here in my area. Anything that resembles breed Show standards is penalized. Moreso in the last few years. This is BC, Canada.


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## SilverMaple (Jun 24, 2017)

Much improved over that last video! Your hand is much quieter, and he's going better because of it. You make a nice pair.



Try this for a few rides---

Ask for your jog, then leave him alone. When he goes faster, bend him around to a stop or bend him around in some small circles until he slows down, then pitch the reins away and off you go again. LET HIM MAKE THE MISTAKE of going too quickly, then correct it. Don't pick at him trying to keep him from speeding up. I also think he is going as slow as he can. He is still not able to really shift his weight back, so perhaps he is only capable of holding a collected, proper jog for a few strides at a time. So work with that. Ask him to stop before he falls out of frame and speeds up. As you progress, you will find he can go longer and longer without you either having to slow him down or correct him. I would do this in a snaffle that he likes so you can ride two-handed and disengage him into that bend.

Another exercise to strengthen the hind end and teach him to stay collected is lots of backing. Back up a few strides every time you stop. You'll know he's carrying himself nicely and stopping over his hindquarters when you feel that weight shift back as soon as you stop, without him raising his head or you needing to use the reins. Once he's good with that, progress to what I have heard called 'fencing' or more commonly, 'rollbacks into the fence' -- jog along the fence and ask for a stop, roll him back into the fence (nose to the fence), then jog off the other way. Go a few dozen strides and roll him into the fence again. Vary the distance. Sometimes only a few strides. Sometimes a dozen. Sometimes go all the way around the arena before asking again. Then progress to doing it at a lope, then gallop. This exercise, more than any other I've found, gets the horse thinking, listening, off your hands, responsive to your leg, and keeping his rear under him. A horse that can do this well will find staying collected at a jog and lope much easier. It's a training technique usually used by reiners, cutters, and cow horse folks, but your pleasure horse will benefit as well. It can also really free up a 'sticky' horse and teach him to move out. A horse that can unleash down the fence a couple of times, get into the ground, turn, and then jog off slow and collected on a loose rein will be much easier horse to ride and show and be able to handle himself in stressful situations as he's learned to 'come down' off adrenaline and control himself. Not to mention he'll stay off your hands and bridled up in frame. When you first start fencing, you'll find he'll be more 'up' and moving out more quickly for awhile. That's fine. So start it when you have a few weeks until your next show if your horse is the type to get worked up at faster speeds. He'll learn to control himself if you do it a few times and then rate him back down until it's not a big deal anymore. 

Until a horse can stay in frame, I would not use a correction bit. They have their place, but they are for TRAINED, SOLID horses who need a reminder to get off the bridle and frame up and to keep a horse's shoulders up, not for a horse that is still struggling to do so at this stage of training. I have no issues with someone riding in spurs, but if you're having to bring the spur into contact more than once or twice during your ride, you need to go back to the basics and get him listening to you or you'll continue to deaden his responses and he'll keep tuning you out. You're riding in a pretty hefty set of spurs and a big bit, and there's not much more you can go to when he learns to ignore these cues. If you were my student, I'd have you in bumper spurs or none at all until your leg is more solid, and either a snaffle or a jr. cowhorse bit for now.


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