# Looking for improvement - Hero on flat and first time jumping PIC HEAVY**



## madisonfriday (Apr 3, 2009)

Okay not really his first time jumping but first time jumping something higher off the ground lol.. I think he did pretty good - he was scared of those tires!

For those who dont know Hero is a ottb 13 years old, he sat for 6 years I have a lot of weight/muscle to build up - I have been working with him for 3 months. I am a new horse owner so we both are learning and probably taking a lot longer in training then it should.


Just to recap my lesson a few weeks ago and some older photos...been working on tighter contact and getting leads correct- he is getting used to it 

OLDER
MY HORRIBLE POSITION LOL



















Today I think my position is approving, 
**BTW he was being a bit naughty and was so foward today
















Circles around the photographer (BF)


















Cantering - on the right lead not throwing a fit!!
so pretty - not me lol










left









jumping!! He was sloppy but I think my position looks decent for not jumping a horse in i dunno 8 years!

























Just for fun my fiance got on (5'11 hero is 15.1)! lol









Hates the wash stall but getting used to it as well  









I know he needs more weight/muscle build up but he has improved greatly since I got him- His neck was ROCK hard underneath all the fat and muscle sat there its slowly building up the right way lol


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## Gillian (Aug 2, 2008)

I don't have time for a full critique but I have to say, WOW. The improvement is amazing!
You two are looking so much better and look like an awesome team. Keep it up!


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## madisonfriday (Apr 3, 2009)

thank you!


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## IrishRider (Aug 7, 2008)

I also can't critique but he is super cute and you can definitely see some improvement!


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## eventerwannabe (Jun 10, 2009)

WOW! You have improved so much! Here are some things that you still need to work on:
Getting your heels down. That will also come easier if you shorten your stirrups a hole or two. Put your weight onto your heel and really stretch down with them.
You have a slight chair seat, pull your lower leg back and hold it there. It will be painful at first, but after a few rides it will stop hurting.
LOOK UP! If you look down that's where your going to end up, ive learned that one the hard way, it's not fun. Haha.
You look a little tense, make sure your taking deep breaths and your relaxed. Your pretty pony (horse) will feed off of that and will start to listen to you more (not saying he isn't now).
Now that I look at the canter pictures, you really do need to shorten your stirrups. Bring them up two or three holes. 
When you half seat the canter you dont need to come out of the saddle so far (I used to do it JUST like you are, which is OK). Don't worry about that one really, it's just helpful if your horse spooks, it can keep you from falling if you stay close.

Jumping:
I really like your jumping position and his too. Just a few touch ups and you guys could be doing hunters and placing well! 
Again, push your heels down. I like that in the first jumping picture they are somewhat down, that has to be my favorite picture out of all of them. Shorten your stirrups a few holes.
You leg is swing back a bit. Try some two point work at the trot and canter and some no-stirrup work too. That will build your muscle up really fast. That will also keep you from over jumping.
I love, love, love your release. It's big, but that's good for an OTTB learning to jump. 
And great job looking up and ahead! That's what I love to see in a rider 

Overall you look good. Just a few things to touch up and you'll be a hunter. 

Sorry for tearing apart your riding, just want to make sure I got everything. I love your horse by the way, super sute!


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## madisonfriday (Apr 3, 2009)

eventerwannabe said:


> WOW! You have improved so much! Here are some things that you still need to work on:
> Getting your heels down. That will also come easier if you shorten your stirrups a hole or two.


lol thanks! I just had a lesson and everyone said I needed to make them longer..
I think I just need to work on bringing my leg back I did notice that chair seat.

Throughout the years my seat has been all over and looking at these photos its so much better..
I used to lean forward hands in my lap,
or hands high and stick my chest out and arch a huge curve in my back...now im somewhere in between lol!!


but yea ill work on bringing my legs back a bit on the flat I think thatll help point the toes higher...then put my stirrups up a whole during the jumping so they dont fall back


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## Misfit (Jun 29, 2009)

You have gotten some good advice so far. The biggest thing I see is that your horse isn't giving to the bit correctly.

Take a look at his confo pic. See how his neck looks upside down, with the underside much more muscled than the topline? This is because he isn't working correctly from behind, and raising his back.

If you see when he's being ridden, his neck once again looks braced against the bit, with a dip right in front of the withers. All his flexion is from the neck, not through his back. Furthermore, if you look at your hands, your hands are broken below the line from elbow to the bit. Your hands are too low, and your horse is being pulled onto the bit vs being ridden from back to front.


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## madisonfriday (Apr 3, 2009)

He was acting up that night he normally drops and bring in his hiney and usually no dip in the neck, he still has a long way i know - just starting out with this tighter contact he is getting better...so am I my hands used to be IN my lap (first pic)
I have a lot to work with - his neck was SUPER bad


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## Tennessee (Dec 7, 2008)

hehe. I don't know SQUAT about English, but can I just say that I adore the bright blue wraps?


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## madisonfriday (Apr 3, 2009)

Here is another pic showing his lack of weight and muscle



















What I started with lol


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## mom2pride (May 5, 2009)

Wow, there is definitely alot of improvement coming! Keep up the good work!!!


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## RidingBareback (Jul 1, 2009)

Wow. That's amazing. Mail me your magic touch!

Beautiful horse!


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## madisonfriday (Apr 3, 2009)

Thanks guys, I'm just concerned about his weight. My BO said he skinny and he is the only one who is not getting that summer weight. But I ride him 4/5 a week all the other horses are QH or mustanges and SIT so its not Hero's fault

I'm going to get him a stronger worming paste the next time around, teeth are getting done too so hope that helps.

I really wouldnt say he is skinny anymore just lacking muscle were its needed.


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## IrishRider (Aug 7, 2008)

I fed my horse Cool Calories to help her to gain some weight. It's great because it helped her put on weight without making her hot. She's always had a good coat but it did help her coat too. Might be something to look into.


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## horseychick 4ever (Jul 13, 2009)

he looks heaps better you have done such a good job with him you should be very proud


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## mayfieldk (Mar 5, 2008)

I think you missed the point about how your horse is building incorrect muscle.

Pulling his head into what seems 'correct' is the reason _why_ he is building incorrect muscle.

'He is just getting used to this tighter contact.'

Contact is NOT something you take--Contact is NOT MADE by shortening the reins and pulling back on his mouth. This is one of the reasons he's hot--you have a grip on those reins and a flash to prevent him from getting ANY leeway from the bit at all. Contact is not used to prevent a horse from going faster!

Lose the flash. Lose the tight contact.

_Correct_ contact is when the horse takes up the slack in the reins. Do you see how this would be different? You are pulling him into a frame to try and 'force' him to work correctly--instead, he is bracing himself against you, which is creating and making his upside down neck look _worse_ with work. Dressage--and proper flatwork--is first done with _relaxation_. And you don't get that by pulling back on the reins, and 'framing him up'.

I have my own hot chestnut TB, who I used to ride the VERY same way--and I'll show you some before and after pictures to show you the difference correct work has on a horse:

Before:










He looks okay here, but note how everything looks 'angular'. His rump looks square-ish and his body is just full of sharp angles. He was in work for several months, being worked 5 days a week, at the time of that photo.

After:










Doesn't even look like the same horse, does it? He is getting less feed that is of a lesser quality then the photo above, less hay, less WORK, but the work is CORRECT. Here is a photo of him under saddle, working on long and low (something that would benefit your horse BEYOND words):










I have a couple of how-to posts on my blog about getting a very hot, forward horse to relax and start taking up correct contact, and working in long and low frames. If this sounds like something you'd be interested in reading, I'll dig up the links for those specific posts. Calming a horse down and getting them to seek the contact is a bit of a 'novel' to post on a forum, so I'd rather just ferry you over to somewhere where I HAVE written it. 

Your boy has a long way to go, but don't think that having a calm, relaxed, and responsive horse is impossible just because he's 'hot'. 'Hot' is just a state of nervousness and imbalance--fix those things and he'll be right as rain--AND building the right muscles.


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## 1dog3cats17rodents (Dec 7, 2007)

Mayfieldk- I wouldn't mind seeing those links. My boy used to work correctly but not anymore (too many rides by the parents) I no longer take lessons on him since I got my new horse, so I would love advice on getting him to work correctly again and relax. Thanks!


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## madisonfriday (Apr 3, 2009)

I know he doesn't do it correctly I'm getting mixed advice from everyone. I had a trainer come out and said hands up and tighter contact.
So thats what I have been doing.

But last night I rode him where he was comfortable.
VERY loose rein, pushing him in from the inside and turning the key his neck was out and stretched.

So that is how I will work him, it was a one time thing with that trainer so that was all that was in my head.

I want hero to build the proper muscles - this is my first horse and I take in all consideration a little to much i think. His neck was just sagging when i got him and all the muscles were underneath


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## dancehabit7 (Jul 11, 2009)

May I just say... you are a FANTASTIC rider!! . I have seen some famous riders.. that are great.. and some normal people that are better.. and you are like them! .. Great work, you have brought him a long way from what he was.


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## stormy and trobby (Jul 16, 2009)

wow you guys look really good


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## I Heart Hershey (Jul 13, 2009)

I agree that working on long and low would be the perfect thing for this horse, and I know you're overwhelmed wit conflicting advice right now, but it sounds like you were attempting some long and low the other night and you were getting some response. You should be proud of your improvements, he is coming along well and so are you!

I have just 2 more comments, one being the post regarding Cool Calories: I used that one a skinny mare I had and it really DID work, it's an excellent, but just be sure to read the label and start out slowly cause it can give them diarrhea or cow patty stools...

And lastly, I may get torn apart here, but does anyone else think that Hero would benefit from a standing martingale?? It was the first thing I thought of when I saw the pics. I have a young TB and we work him in one, it's not tight by any means, and he can stretch long and low easily in it, but it does stop him on those rare occasions when he has put his head up, like in one of your first pics there where he is acting up. Just a thought!! Good luck and keep having fun


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## madisonfriday (Apr 3, 2009)

he doesnt do that anymore - only when he needs to balance him self at the canter he throws his head...im thinkin if he is improving from that he might not need one


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