# Can't pick back feet up



## Spotted Image (Aug 10, 2011)

I bought a 7 year old Appaloosa Mare, who is an dream to ride but on ground is a different story. Ground manners have improved majorly. Only problem is she is to hyper to be saddled without someone enforcing standstill while someone else saddles, which is limiting me a lot when I ride. She is even getting better with this. But now comes to my major problem is picking up the back feet. She really gives us an fight and after ten minutes she gives does even give in using the rope around the hoof. We so how got her to pick them up to shoe them, but not she won’t let us take the shoes off. She isn’t in pain any, and our farrier agrees she has been spoiled and let get by with everything. She is also a good 1400 pounds and we can’t out fight her. I have saw on here from Cheri, on how to use a Lip Rope to teach this and was wondering more about this. I have trained horses for years and so has my father, but we haven’t heard of the lip rope. We was wondering if you could explain it for us. We will also take to our farrier about this and see if he has any ideas, but I don’t like his methods. Also this mare doesn’t tire easy, so we can’t ride her, enough to calm her down much. I really love riding her and she is my dream horse other than the feet issue. Hoping to work on her with this issue this weekend, so advice will be helpful.


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## Allison Finch (Oct 21, 2009)

Spotted, you need to stop using brute force and start training her to accept being handled. Brute force will only make her more fearful and resistant. Now, if you need to do something as an emergency, that may be a different matter.

Start by rubbing your hands up and down her hind legs. After doing it, praise her and maybe even give a tiny treat (even though I rarely use treats myself). Then as she accepts that without a flinch, you work on picking up a hind foot BRIEFLY. Lean your shoulder into her to push her onto the other hind leg, pull on her fetlock or lightly pinch her tendon. She will, eventually lift the foot to relieve the pressure. Immediately allow it to go down and REALLY praise the horse. Do this for as long as it takes for her to lift the foot easily. It may take a LONG time, if she has been handled harshly. When she does this fairly easily, ask her to hold it up for a few seconds and put it down. Do nothing but hold it for a few seconds. Each time she does hold it up, PRAISE her. 

See where I'm going with this? This is a trust issue with her and you have not developed that trust. It will be slow, but it will fix the problem eventually. Now, to get those hind shoes off, I would tranquilize her and pull them. Then, as the "pick up" training progresses to her allowing you to hold her hind feet up, I would take the hoof pick and start tapping the foot to get her ready for shoeing. 

The key is the praise her (treat her) every step of the way. She will not only develop trust, she will WANT to do this for you to get the positive attention. I have had some really rank horses who all have been retrained with this method. Some took longer than others, but it works.

Save the lip ropes and twitches for bigger, more important emergencies. What you have now is something every well trained horse should accept.


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## Spotted Image (Aug 10, 2011)

I honestly, but think it’s an trust issue, because she seems to trust us on everything else, as soon as she heard my voice she stopped freaking out while she was caught her an rope when camping. With that said I do know that in two months you can’t always build the trust needed, so some of it could be partly trust.
While you could be right as some of it could be a trust issue, I do know for it’s also a build habit. We knew of this problem when we got her, but it didn’t seem as bad, but we believe she could have been on a calmer then too. They took us she fought a lot when picking up her back feet. You can pick them up no problem but from then on out she will kick like crazy. If you can keep it held for about 2 minutes she will then hold it still for about 1 minute. Personally, I don’t like being kicked so I use a rope it hold it up for the two minutes she is kicking. After that the battle starts all over, we also try to pick them up after a trail ride. I don’t put up with this and neither will my farrier. The back shoes aren’t over grown yet, but she clips her front feet at the lope, until I get them removed she will be ridden in bell boots, which isn’t often. Also when we got her she would bite, run you over and anything else she could do to try to disrespect you. Her past owners would allow her to misbehave on the ground. She has come a long ways, but she is to an dangerous point on her back feet, where I need to teach her now. I have worked with her once like you said, but I do plan on keeping trying that way, but with a rope to keep me out of danger. I know there isn’t an soft cut way to training, but I heard that was safer.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Horses are VERY vulnerable when you pick up one of their hooves. Have you tried doing it yourself? (as in go on all fours and practice lifting one limb without falling over?)

It's hard, and it's not really a natural/instinct process for them.

Use the rope so you don't break your arm, and when she stops fighting, praise her lots and lots. Then put it back down. 

Horses cannot SEE behind them, so it's definitely a trust issue.. not just a habit. 

I trust my friends but when it comes to playing that stupid game where you fall backwards and they catch you? I cannot do it because the pain I will experience if they don't catch me, outweighs our level of trust. 

Same with the horse. The horse sees you as a leader (apparently, I cannot verify that since I'm not there) but does not feel comfortable with picking her feet up. 

Just work on it.. don't rush her, don't get angry.. remain neutral and stay consistent. As SOON as she quits fighting, gently set her foot down. The MINUTE you get frustrated, or your farrier gets frustrated, the bigger the issue becomes.

Definitely cannot out-muscle a horse so don't even try. Approach this from a different angle. Maybe you need to have someone work with her on the hinds if you cannot figure it out yourself (which is fine)


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## Calming Melody (May 20, 2012)

So you're tying your horses leg up , that's the way I am reading it anyways ... Isn't that dangerous for the horse if she is fighting? I'm new to horses myself , but I agree with everyone else on the trust issue . I have had my horses for a few weeks and they are just now letting me pick up their back feet , but I would never tie them up , doesn't seem right for me and if I was the horse I don't think that would make me want to pick them up for anyone . I have learned patience is the key ! Good luck to ya!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

I just went through this with my new mare, refused to allow her back feet to be picked. Last time farrier could only trim her front,,, SOooo basicaly followed Alisons methods. Only I did the first lesson in the horse trailer with her locked in stall me on outside so no way I could get kicked. Wasnt sure how she would react. After that I would lunge her at a walk, just slow easy easy , couple change of directions then put her in cross ties, break out the bug spray and brush , brush brush spray, pick up front, brush brush her back leg but dont try to pick it up, move all around her pick up front, try to pick up back, she would dance around, but with patience I would get her back foot up. Hold it a couple seconds put it down, Pat her and let her stand a minute. The other side pick up front, rub her back leg, eventually get it up, Repeated that a few times then turned her loose, couple days later did the same, couple days later did the same but added a jack stand and pulled her leg forward. SO after about 2 weeks of 30 minutes every other day she was fine. Just had her trimmed yesterday. Farrier said he was very impressed with me. Said I was becoming a horseman instead of a rider.


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## Army wife (Apr 29, 2012)

I have handled my fillies feet since day one. At about 9 months old, she went through a phase where she wouldnt even let me near her back end. Again, this girl was basically born right in my lap, so not a trust issue, just a phase. Shes 2 now and has been out to pasture for about 4 months now, and is not happy picking up any of her feet. Again, i believe this is a stubborn phase, as she knows what i want, and knows i wont hurt her. Im actually going to try the rope trick soon. I for one, do not want to get kicked just because my 2 year old is in a ****y mood. Also, if you grab their toe and pull it back...like flex the pastern as much backwards as possible, they cant really kick. You have complete control over where their foot goes. This does not hurt them, its simply using and knowing their anatomy to keep yourself safe.


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