# Young horse, confident rider, NEED ADVICE



## DuffyDuck (Sep 27, 2011)

You've only been riding a year?

I will talk from my point of view. I DID have a school master. And I was blessed for that, because he taught me more than I realised there was about riding. Seat balance, quiet hands, using my weight and training programmes.

I was like you. I was put on every lunatic horse going, and I stopped when I was no longer bouncing back and started breaking bones.

Its 8 years before I bought my first youngster. I won't lie, he was a walk in the park, but that was his absolute nature and because I had 24/7 contact and help from a very, very good trainer who was always around when I rode and could always help. 

A school master is less of a horse that knows it all and you can point in the right direction, and more of refining you as a rider to prepare you for the young, green horses you want to produce yourself. 

I used to have the same "job" as you, calming down the flighty idiots that people hadn't bothered training properly so their riders could get on and be amazed how well behaved their horses are. It wasn't se much that I could ride, but more that I could stick. The more I stuck, the quicker the horses got the beans and whizz out, and the more horses I was given. I stopped that, and focused on me.

It DID teach me how to sit an almighty buck, and stop a bolter and how to throw myself off a horse who rears and falls back. I DID get to ride a variety of horses. 

I didn't learn how to ride to become a better rider, however. There is a massive difference to sticking the bucks, and riding and training. That's just my opinion though


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

DuffyDuck said:


> You've only been riding a year?
> 
> I will talk from my point of view. I DID have a school master. And I was blessed for that, because he taught me more than I realised there was about riding. Seat balance, quiet hands, using my weight and training programmes.
> 
> ...


this is what I was thinking but didn't know how to put it in such good words


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

Hey!  Any horse can be messed up if people try hard enough! Personally I wouldn't let it worry me. I rode for half a year as a child before I started riding a "problem" Warmblood my family acquired. This in some circles would cause the usual predictable hoo-haa. But, it worked well for us. I found "plodder" and push-button horses boring and enjoyed the challenge of working with something with more sparkle and trying to find ways to communicate with an animal. The "problem" had actually been caused by the people who'd previously worked with the horse (as is usually the case with such horses), and the horse responded well to kindness, empathy, consistency, patience and not being harassed. He went from having a reputation for "throwing" people and refusing to do things to being a good-fun family horse, useful on trails and the kind of arena work and jumping I did as a progressing rider. Later on, the family bought a second horse so we could ride together, and we used to alternate.

Long story, but we got professionally involved with horses soon after that, and from the age of eleven I schooled my own horses, and never messed one up. So I don't see why you should, if you're a capable rider (and you sound like one) and you are willing to continue learning. I'm not an isolated case - if you're naturally drawn to that sort of thing and you have the right kind of personality etc, these things can work out very well. I've compared notes with quite a few friends and acquaintances who were riding and schooling horses early on in their lives, and there is a lot of overlap in attitudes and results. We all grew up surrounded by large animals and we had enthusiasm and confidence with them.

You're from NZ: Well, you have a young rider there making a splash with bareback, bitless jumping. She grew up that way as well - pretty distant from all the "oh but you can't" chatter. If you grow up like that - then you just _do_.

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=alicia+burton's+story

When I started schooling my first horse from scratch, I had about two years of experience behind me (my very beginnings were in an intensive military-style group riding course in Germany, teaching us basic dressage) and by then my parents started training, racing and breeding harness horses in Australia. I read voraciously about horse training and behaviour and found that Tom Roberts' little book "Horse Control - The Young Horse: The Handling, Breaking-In and Early Schooling of Your Own Young Horse" was an excellent companion that contained more condensed experience than a dozen good people you could meet on the ground. TR himself had been instructing riders and educating horses in the British Army from the age of 16, and wrote this book in his 70s after a lifetime of diverse experience in a number of equestrian disciplines, and after gaining a reputation for being able to consistently fix "problem" horses, with whom he then competed in showjumping, polocrosse, dressage etc.

My father had worked with carriage horses as a young child and switched from being a systems analyst to setting up his own horse operation in his 40s, moving continents in the process with our family. He's the kind of person who always nuts out problems and works things out for himself, and doesn't have any time for prevailing opinions if they don't stand up to real-world testing. He set about getting a trainer-reinsman license and his very first horse was runner-up in the Triple Crown Age Classic in his first season of racing. He went on also to learn about corrective trimming and shoeing, and people brought him harness horses from far and wide to have various problems with their feet and gait fixed. Since there were no people with such skills in the district in the first place, he sent off for the O'Dwyer video series on corrective trimming and shoeing and just went from there. He'd already been barefoot trimming for two years at this point.

The first horse I schooled successfully competed in endurance, general gymkhanas and horse shows, and reached a decent standard at dressage. We had a long and happy 25-year riding life together. We slowed down a little when I turned 16 and went to study biology and environmental science at university, after which I entered into research and teaching for many years. My mare retired and died on the farm my husband and I bought five years ago when we hit mid-life and decided to tree change. Part of the challenge there was to build our own house.

I don't often give people my CV like this, so to speak, and I'm not doing it to impress on you or anyone else how brilliant we are. It's just a real-life story, and I think the difference between people like us and the back seat critics is that we've always embraced things with enthusiasm, voraciously sought, absorbed, and applied information, worked our backsides off, experimented, and never stopped learning - plus we have a lot of respect for animals and nature, rather than seeing these as our servants. I know quite a few people who've done things of the scope that we have, and more than we have, and they didn't get there by listening to all the reasons why they couldn't and shouldn't do it.

So go for it, and good luck to you!


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## Reiningcatsanddogs (Oct 9, 2014)

I would say if you think you have found the right horse, give it a try. 

My eleven year old daughter started training a two year old when she was the ripe old age of nine with the help of her trainer and sometimes, mom. 

She had been around horses her whole life, but only started formal lessons at 8, so she had technically only been riding for a year.

Presently, two years in to training they have become quite the couple. It has worked because she was willing to ask questions when she encountered a problem or wasn't quite sure how to do something and wasn't afraid to try different approaches until she found one that worked well for both of them. 

There were times she was frustrated but learned to take a deep breath, reset her emotions and try again. 

It sounds like you ride a lot, so don't get too hung up on the time frame. A student who rides one hour twice a week vs one who rides two hours six days a week are generally at two completely different levels at the end of a year. 

So in the vein of SueC's comments, patience, consistency and respect for the spirit of the horse, as well as asking a lot of questions of mentors and continuing to learn independently many different ways of accomplishing the same thing, will help take you go a long way to success. Good luck!


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

Thanks for the replies and the advice and stories, guys! The thing I am the most worried about is the big elephant in the room: Am I too new to horses to work with my own young one? I of course won't be riding him for a few years, so that's not the issue. It's the controversy of someone so new to the horse world starting off with a youngster....I really wanted to know if I would get immediate and definite "No don't do it"'s, which worried me a lot. Personally I believe I can do it; if anything goes severely wrong (I can't imagine how it could but then again, what do I know really?) then I have the breeder who will happily have him back, and a large community to sell him into (not that I feel it will ever have to come to that) but again, what I worry most about is the "You can't do it because you've never had a horse." It's almost as if, if you aren't privileged in the beginning, you can't do what other people can? I don't know...I guess I worry too much. Or am I right?


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

Reiningcatsanddogs said:


> I would say if you think you have found the right horse, give it a try.
> 
> My eleven year old daughter started training a two year old when she was the ripe old age of nine with the help of her trainer and sometimes, mom.
> 
> ...


Thank you very much for this! It gives me confidence that I may be able to do it. My biggest fear is not being "allowed" because I haven't grown up with horses; a girl I study with, who's had horses her whole life, commented under her breath (when I made a comment on how a horse I was riding was really cute but not "first horse material") that no, he wasn't first horse material, implying that I needed a kids pony as my first horse instead of something with some energy to it (so to speak....) 
I guess I'm most worried about people seeing me as a brand-new-novice rider, someone who, because they've never had their own horse, doesn't know which way to sit in the saddle, and that I can't just buy my first horse as a rising 2 TB. :/


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## Reiningcatsanddogs (Oct 9, 2014)

My daughter didn't grow up riding or even owning (though she is now). 

Before she was born, I sold my mare and then we were only boarding other people's horses who would sometimes throw her up on the back of a horse and lead her around. 

Don't let people get to you. I'll tell you a short story that doesn't have much to do with horses but with the effects of dedication. 

I was an elite level figure skater at one point in my life. I started at the old age of 12, in figure skating that is quite old. Female skaters are generally competitively washed up by age 20.

Within four years I had passed up in ability those who had been skating since they were five and I was invited to train with Olympic Champion coaches. 

From the beginning, I put in three to four hours a day seven days a week and every second I was on the ice was spent working rather than socializing. 

When I was not in school, I was thinking about ways to improve the way I was training. Some people said I had natural talent, I think it was more because I loved it and worked hard at it, even when there were days I was so sore, moving was a chore. 

There were people who took every opportunity to criticize me, but it didn't matter, I was doing something I loved to do, nasty people were simply an unfortunate thing to put up with. If you love to do something, don't let the sour grapes hold you back. 

That said, the selection of the horse is one of those areas where your mentors can help you immensely. 

Our trainer was really hesitant at first....young horse-young rider, green horse-green rider...but it didn't take him but a few minutes of watching the two of them interact before he changed his tune. Select the horse carefully, but no one size fits all.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

Reiningcatsanddogs said:


> My daughter didn't grow up riding or even owning (though she is now).
> 
> Before she was born, I sold my mare and then we were only boarding other people's horses who would sometimes throw her up on the back of a horse and lead her around.
> 
> ...


That's an amazing story, thank you!~ So awesome you were able to pursue what you loved...They had an ice-skating rink in the centre of my town once, I think I fell over more than I skated! xD I was terrible.

But really, thank you... I guess all my life I've worried what other people will say about me, especially behind my back. ****** 'em, it's my life


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

DreweTC said:


> I
> I've got the opportunity to buy a rising 2 Thoroughbred x Warmblood gelding who is well handled and well mannered, and I will have professional young horse handlers (who are close friends) working beside me. I have the place to keep him and all I'm worried about is that I will basically mess up a young horse. Thoughts?



it's inevitable that you will 'mess up' a horse, or several horses, as you learn this business. so, get on with it!


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

OK UPDATE

I rang the breeder (who I've met/worked with for a day and it went well, I was working with her current foals for a photo shoot) and we've organized a meeting this weekend!! Ahh, super nervous and excited


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

It went really,really well. I'm putting in a deposit for him and she's agreed on 20%. He's gonna be mine <3


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## Reiningcatsanddogs (Oct 9, 2014)

Good Luck with him.


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

I second that!  Updates and photos always welcome!


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

Thank you all! Here are his TradeMe (New Zealand trading website) photos, but this is not how I found him, I met him when I went to the stud to do photos.



















The breeder was so open and honest about him.... It was wonderful. He's not been rugged through two winters, not had his feet looked at, and not handled. I put him in a drafting pen and he went from "Don't touch me, you're a tiger!" to "Cuddle me you're my best friend". It was uncanny. I got the halter on after two tries (the first try it got on, but the neck strap twisted and I pulled it off so it didn't stress him) and then we backed him out and I had a long lead rope on him...He lead like a dream, as if he'd been doing it his whole life, walked quietly, stopped when I stopped (instead of running me over like some adult horses still do!) and backed up when I pressured him with my shoulder. He only spooked twice, once because he freaked when there was resistance on his face, and then when the rope got caught in his leg (he stepped over it) and it moved and he bolted; walked right up to him and caught him straight away, right back to well behaved baby. He's turned out in his halter in a small paddock with a lot of grass and two friends. Going out there next weekend to do some more work with him


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## MaximasMommy (Sep 21, 2013)

The spanish riding school puts newer riders with the younger horses because they both only understand the simplest of cues. I started as a new rider with my greenie under the constant supervision of our trainer. We have grown together, him being sensitive and letting me know when I'm messing up, and me teaching him to be patient with my new-ness. He's a very level headed horse though. It's worked out great for me. And like you said, you won't be riding him for a couple years, so you have a lot of time to grow as a rider yet.


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

First things first!

You have confidence and that is something that many lack and money cannot buy.

You obviously have a certain amount of natural talent to be riding the problem horses, again people can work at Roding but with some it is just natural and money cannot buy that. 

Word of warning - that is going to provoke a lot of bitchiness from those that lack either or both!

Now, in many ways your path of similar to mine, I was always the one, from an early age, to ride the naughty ponies, I loved it, once a pony was going well I was happy to move onto the next. 
All this was very well and I would never wish to change it, the downside was that I missed out riding the schoolmasters that taught the rider the finer points. 

You probably can bring on a young horse with help from a good instructor, it would be a lot easier for you amd the horse if you know the feel of what you are aiming for. 

If you can, ride some schoolmasters, horses trained to a high level, there is a lot of,difference in riding a naughty horse to riding amd teaching a youngster.

Best of luck to you.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

Thank you so much Maximus and Fox! Your comments inspire me and give me hope I am not doing the wrong thing! 
All of my concerns come from one girl I know irl....She worked at racehorse yearling sales and is constantly going on about how "colt foals aren't toys" because we have three gelding foals and a colt foal at the Equine Park I study at, and I like to pat them and play with them and she "caught" me and told me off one time. I don't really see what's wrong with socializing young horses, and my "play" was walking around letting them follow me and then patting them (not running and them chasing me, cause I know that's wrong lol, if I'd been doing that then yes I'd expect her to snap at me) and I'm really worried that she'll tear me a new hole when she inevitably finds out I'm buying a gelding foal but in reality, her opinion means next to nothing to me because of the kind of person she is: a braggart and a *****. 
The other thing that worries me is telling my tutor, which I will also have to do, because I want her help and advice with him since I'm new to this, and I'm scared she'll say it was a terrible idea and that I can't handle him but I guess at the end of the day she can't tell me to take him back, it's my decision, and it's her decision to help me or not.... 
Thank you for all your support, advice, and stories!! I'll keep posting updates here (I'll have more pictures this weekend as I'm going to see him and will take the iPod down for photos)


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

My advice to you would be to talk to talk to your tutor _before _ you go look at this foal and take her along to look at it with you. 

You need an impartial opinion on the foal. It is all to easy to fall for a youngster and to be able to judge what a foal will be like when it is grown.

As for the other woman who told you off, in some ways I agree with her. Colts, gelded or not can be very quick to rear up in play and if you are walking away with three of them behind you then it could lead to an accident, one could bite the other causing it to slam into you, not in a mean way but just being forgetful youngsters.

Confidence is one thing, taking silly risks another.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

Foxhunter said:


> My advice to you would be to talk to talk to your tutor _before _ you go look at this foal and take her along to look at it with you.
> 
> You need an impartial opinion on the foal. It is all to easy to fall for a youngster and to be able to judge what a foal will be like when it is grown.
> 
> ...


I say foal, he's 2 years old. The breeder is a friend of the tutor and is almost too open and honest about him. I couldn't ask for a better seller.
The youngsters are incredibly well handled and well behaved, and while I see where you're coming from, these three have been raised together and have never displayed that kind of behavior. The girl is only 18, same as me.


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

I still say take your tutor along. She may well know the owner and the youngster but an older and more experienced person is sensible and what it there to loose? 

Involve her from the start and you are far more likely to get her help!

Believe me, it is never worth the risk of turning your back on young horses that are loose in the field!


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

I agree with you, but I want to pay his deposit first before I involve her. One of my close friends (older than me, in her 40's) back in my hometown 2hrs away breaks horses and is an amazing rider and taught me a lot about riding on her horses, is coming to see him, and I will involve her as much as I can. 
And while I agree, (in a humorous tone) how do you leave a paddock without turning your back on them?


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

You make sure that they give you distance!

Believe me, I have bred many foals and frequently went into the field with them. Although I handled them I never let them get over friendly, I could catch them, they led, picked up their feet and then were left to their own devices of growing and being youngsters. 

Some of the worse horses to break are those that have been allowed to be over friendly with humans - the worse of them are the bottle fed!


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

A really easy and effective trick to keep playful youngsters at a safe distance from you is to carry a lead rope and "helicopter" the end over your head as you are walking away! Just make sure you're spinning the rope end, not the end with the metal snap on it. It buys you a nice safe 2-3m circle. Also works great for aggro adult horses. And you don't even have to touch them. They seem to work it out without having to collide with the end of the rope.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

My aunty agreed to allow me to take his full price from my trust (That I don't access till Im 21) and was genuinely pleased at the idea of me getting a horse. Couldn't have gone better, super excited for this weekend.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

Here's a video of him from when he was younger and they had them in the roundpen taking pictures for sale  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzRcd1bbUVI


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

Ok, that is a very nice foal, update pictures please?


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

Seeing him this weekend so update photos then


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

Let me tell you a little story. 
Back in March, I bought my colt, Maverick along with his dam, a mare named Dixie.
Maverick was just a yearling or so and had never had much human contact, other than the occasional treat or petting. He and mommy Dixie were confined to a tiny pen with mud and muck up to their knees. Maverick never knew anything but that before he came to us. All they had to eat was hay. No good for a lactating mare and a growing foal, and unfortunately Maverick is having some issues with his stifles and knees due to that poor nutrition now, but we didn't come to talk about that. Mav was practically feral, with the exception that you could pet him. That was all.
Well, the state got onto them about it and they were told if they didn't do something by March 16, there would be consequences.
Well, Nanny and Paw Paw (I don't live with them but they live just next door and they house my horses, I go over there every day to see about the horses) decided "Let's see if we can get us a colt out of this!" And we did. We bought him and Dixie on March 15, 2015 around 3:00 pm for 200 dollars (all together). Really cheap where I am. Now like I said, Mav is having some issues due to his upbringing but by the sound of it the colt you speak of is coming from a good place where no such issues are likely. Anyway, Mav is learning to longe now, picks up his feet and is a STAR for the farrier, has a very sweet disposition, leads, halters without issue, etc. He has come a long way. We had no trainer to come and train him. Had a few people to give advice along the way, but otherwise did it all on our own. I have only been a horseowner for 11 months now, and then it was 8 months. I had ridden inconsistently for two or three years. I didn't start out with a schoolmaster. Couldn't afford one. Instead my first horse is spooky, bullheaded, and nuts, and I love him anyway.
No, you don't need a schoolmaster. 
I remember when we first started speaking of purchasing Maverick, I worried we couldn't train an unhandled yearling on our own. I worried I was thinking with my heart and not my head, but sometimes, it's better to listen to you heart. 
Best of luck.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

LilyandPistol said:


> Let me tell you a little story.
> Back in March, I bought my colt, Maverick along with his dam, a mare named Dixie.
> Maverick was just a yearling or so and had never had much human contact, other than the occasional treat or petting. He and mommy Dixie were confined to a tiny pen with mud and muck up to their knees. Maverick never knew anything but that before he came to us. All they had to eat was hay. No good for a lactating mare and a growing foal, and unfortunately Maverick is having some issues with his stifles and knees due to that poor nutrition now, but we didn't come to talk about that. Mav was practically feral, with the exception that you could pet him. That was all.
> Well, the state got onto them about it and they were told if they didn't do something by March 16, there would be consequences.
> ...


Thank you, so very very much for this! A heartwarming story that (off topic a little here) reminds me of my dog, who I rescued from a horrible place that had newspaper (unchanged, filthy newspaper) on every corner of the floor of the house and where 19 dogs ran unchained and untamed. 
I hope I can do what you did and have the confidence to do a good job....I've managed to tell a few irl friends so more people know what my plans are, but my tutors and some peers in my Uni don't know. I think I'll tell them eventually once I've paid for him on Sunday. I don't know how to though, like "Heeey bought a rising two TB cross....." I feel like they'll tell me I'm an idiot but, there's been worse idiots right?


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

You don't have to have a schoolmaster but if you want to get into eventing you'll need to have a good understanding of dressage yourself so you can teach your young horse
It is a lot easier to learn the more intricate side of riding (not just sticking on a bucking horse or being a calm relaxed rider that's good on problem horses) on a horse that knows what its about 
Green on green in that case can lead to a lot of confusion and frustration


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## DreaMy (Jul 1, 2014)

Its easy to sit a few bucks and get a horse to respond to a few basic cues, if that's your thing then go for it, I had many friends that would ride some really green horses. Me? I have never bounced, but I still remember the first time I did a passage on a school master and it was a dream.

In saying that I think its unrealistic to expect to go into eventing with this new horse without ever having the experience of a school master. I'm not saying that you can never do this or that the whole goal is silly but right now you're staring down the barrel of the blind leading the blind.

When I got my first horse (after ~10 years of riding) she wasn't a school master, she was green broke with a good foundation and an owner that rode her though some nasty trails but she lacked some "finishing" in her training including any work at the canter. Now I've ridden for ~10 years, I've cantered and cantered and cantered some more on other horses but even after a few months of only riding this mare and thinking about working back up to a canter I got on two different horses to practice cantering myself. I mean if my canter is rusty on a school master then how can I be clear when teaching her?

Even if you decide to train this horse on your own are you going to get bored after all of the major kinks (bucking/bolting/rearing) are over? Will you be just as satisfied to ride this horse once you can hop on and work on piaffes, something that it sounds like you don't have much experience with (not to knock you as a rider in any way but do you know you will be happy doing something like this)?

Just my two cents.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

jaydee said:


> You don't have to have a schoolmaster but if you want to get into eventing you'll need to have a good understanding of dressage yourself so you can teach your young horse
> It is a lot easier to learn the more intricate side of riding (not just sticking on a bucking horse or being a calm relaxed rider that's good on problem horses) on a horse that knows what its about
> Green on green in that case can lead to a lot of confusion and frustration


I totally agree, and I'm quite fortunate to have a lot of schoolmasters and dressage masters (both equine and human) to teach me, which is why I didn't want to buy a horse like that when I have them on offer.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

DreaMy said:


> Its easy to sit a few bucks and get a horse to respond to a few basic cues, if that's your thing then go for it, I had many friends that would ride some really green horses. Me? I have never bounced, but I still remember the first time I did a passage on a school master and it was a dream.
> 
> In saying that I think its unrealistic to expect to go into eventing with this new horse without ever having the experience of a school master. I'm not saying that you can never do this or that the whole goal is silly but right now you're staring down the barrel of the blind leading the blind.
> 
> ...


While I do not own my own horses, I have access to schoolmasters whenever I like (the reason I ride the unruly ones is my own decision (as well as my instructors decisions)) I do not "not" have the experience, I have had a lot of experience (considering my lack of exposure to horses). Just because I do not own my own does not mean I haven't ridden them; we ride 4 days a week under instruction of some of the top names in our area. When I say I don't want a schoolmaster, I mean that I don't want to buy a horse that I could ride at my Uni for free. 
And yes, I will be more than satisfied to simply school my horse instead of riding a "wild" animal. As I've said, my tutor wants me to ride these horses to give me experience on them and to improve myself and the horse. 
While I agree with you, I am not a 5-minute obsession with horses and then walk away, this is the life for me.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

Hey guys! Got some photos from today, he was super well behaved and such good manners!! Doesn't know anything but still learnt quickly to take food nicely, loves having under his chin scratched, and was again a dream to lead. Good manners when let out into a larger paddock as well (didn't whirl away and kick when let go, which I find is a really horrible and dangerous habit when they get older) just walked away politely. 
A little bum-high but I feel he'll grow out of it and it's barely noticeable. Easy to handle front legs and feet but too unbalanced to pick up a hoof yet (Second time being handled so not going to push it too far in the paddock yet). Legs feel fine, no funny abrasions or bumps, and my tutor tells me the light swelling behind his cheek bones is a typical young TB trait and nothing to worry about. All in all I'm seeing no faults in him so far 

My Pets Irl by XxTheFoshyNozz on DeviantArt


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## Kay Armstrong (Jun 28, 2015)

The other thing that worries me is telling my tutor, which I will also have to do, because I want her help and advice with him since I'm new to this, and I'm scared she'll say it was a terrible idea and that I can't handle him but I guess at the end of the day she can't tell me to take him back, it's my decision, and it's her decision to help me or not.... 


If she gives you a hard time, can you choose another trainer (tutor)?


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

No? Not really. I study Equine and Sporthorse at a place called Taratahi College. My tutor is literally my University tutor. Like, yea. I don't mean like, horse trainer or something, I mean the one in charge of my entire course year, riding instructor, etc etc 

But luckily she said it was a great idea!! She's really supportive


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

I'm going to approach this from a different vein to everyone else. My mother's first horse was a yearling and he ended up being spectacular (and she had no help training him). So I believe it's perfectly reasonable to get a young horse as a relatively inexperienced rider, IF you can already ride, and IF you have the right temperament and the horse has the right temperament.

He is rising 2.

Are you content to wait for two years before you get on his back?

I broke a horse in at 2 1/2. She'd had all the groundwork and it was the logical next step - and she agreed, because she was 100% relaxed about the whole "riding" lark. But, had I had something else to ride, I wouldn't have done it. I'd have waited. It's not good for them to be ridden before their skeletons are mature enough - and full skeletal maturity doesn't happen until 7 or even later in some horses (geldings mature slower, big horses mature slower). A draft or warmblood gelding may not mature until 8 or even 9.

I don't advocate letting a horse sit until it's 9. That's too long and by the time it's coming into its prime education-wise it's not physically as able as it was as a young horse. 4 is a good medium - usually the legs are fully mature by then. The back matures by 5ish, so a horse shouldn't be jumping super high until then. The very last bones to fully mature are in the base of the neck and they often don't finish growing until 7, so it pays to be gentle to a horse's neck until it's a little older.

I've been riding for about 9 years but only RIDING for 5. Total. Including two extended breaks. So I don't doubt somebody who starts off learning to ride every stride (not just cling on and hope for the best, as was my foundation) would be a better rider in 1 year than I am after 9.

A rider I was briefly a working pupil for claimed that the average amount of time it took him to train a rider from raw beginner to 4 star event rider was 3 to 4 years. He preferred raw beginners - less bad habits to break.


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

Hard to tell from those pictures, he does to me look as of he needs more groceries. I don't like to see young horses overweight but do like to see them rounded.

A horse of two years should be perfectly balanced and capable of standing when having their feet picked up.

I would not be trying to pick a horse's feet out in the field.

Good luck to you.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

blue eyed pony said:


> I'm going to approach this from a different vein to everyone else. My mother's first horse was a yearling and he ended up being spectacular (and she had no help training him). So I believe it's perfectly reasonable to get a young horse as a relatively inexperienced rider, IF you can already ride, and IF you have the right temperament and the horse has the right temperament.
> 
> He is rising 2.
> 
> ...


Thank you for this! It's great to see success stories. 
Yes, I am more than content to wait for him to mature; he's going to be large, around 16.1 hands, and I'm not a "fun" rider, which is somewhat unfortunate because so many people are so happy to just ride their horse around a trail and it fulfills them whereas I cannot do that, I must be learning or improving something in myself and my horse, so I won't be tempted to jump on him early. I'm also a strong believer in not breaking a horse young; it's like not wearing a helmet or putting your saddle on backwards, just don't do it.
Also, the time it takes for him to grow will give me the time to educate myself more and more, so that when he's ready, I'm ready to teach him.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

Foxhunter said:


> Hard to tell from those pictures, he does to me look as of he needs more groceries. I don't like to see young horses overweight but do like to see them rounded.
> 
> A horse of two years should be perfectly balanced and capable of standing when having their feet picked up.
> 
> ...


It's the middle of winter here and her horses are very light on feed at the moment, so I'm not too fussed. For what he could be, he's done well.
He was just uncomfortable with having them picked up, and wobbled because he was unsure; he's never had them handled before. 
I accept that that's your point of view however, I have been taught to always take a pick out to the field and check and pick a horses hooves out. No hoof, no horse, and I'd like him to learn early that I'll be handling his feet out in his paddock.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

He certainly does look in very poor condition - underfeeding a horse that's growing at a rapid rate can have an effect on it later in life, particularly bone density, he may possibly have a heavy worm burden, maybe ulcers too
The sooner you can get him away from there and manage his feeding and care the better
Handling a horses feet in the field is OK if you don't have a stable to take them into to do that sort of thing but it's not the best of places to train them to have their feet handled
I've never heard that its commonplace for a TB or any other horse to have a swelling on its cheekbone
Where exactly is the swelling?


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

jaydee said:


> He certainly does look in very poor condition - underfeeding a horse that's growing at a rapid rate can have an effect on it later in life, particularly bone density, he may possibly have a heavy worm burden, maybe ulcers too
> The sooner you can get him away from there and manage his feeding and care the better
> Handling a horses feet in the field is OK if you don't have a stable to take them into to do that sort of thing but it's not the best of places to train them to have their feet handled
> I've never heard that its commonplace for a TB or any other horse to have a swelling on its cheekbone
> Where exactly is the swelling?


I've shown my tutor and she hasn't mentioned his condition. It's likely that because he's quite dirty he looks worse than he actually is. I doubt his breeder would allow such expensive well bred horses to get that bad, but I will be getting him a cover so he doesn't waste so much food energy on keeping warm; we did that for a TB at my Uni and he chucked the weight back on super fast. 
There are yards, but they are a way away and I just wanted to feel his cannon bone and tendons, picking the foot up was just a test to see how he reacted.
It was behind his cheekbones, in the soft area of the neck. It's gone down a little since I was last out there, and I've been told it's nothing to worry about.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

I would worry that it might be Strangles - depending on where it is.
A blanket will help him to be able to use every ounce of his food for maintenance and not keeping warm - just be sure he's thoroughly clean before you put it on him and that he hasn't acquired any hitchhikers during the winter in the form of lice or mites


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

jaydee said:


> I would worry that it might be Strangles - depending on where it is.
> A blanket will help him to be able to use every ounce of his food for maintenance and not keeping warm - just be sure he's thoroughly clean before you put it on him and that he hasn't acquired any hitchhikers during the winter in the form of lice or mites


My biggest concern was immediately strangles....I got very concerned but this is when I brought it up with my tutor: she said no, it is not strangles and it is only a mild swelling that she has seen as common in young TBs and will eventually go down. I am getting him vet checked, however, but I'm not concerned.
I'm getting him a winter paddock rug as soon as I can, and taking my brushes down to groom him tomorrow; he's also meeting my mum (and vice versa) for the first time, which is exciting.


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

DreweTC said:


> It's the middle of winter here and her horses are very light on feed at the moment, so I'm not too fussed. For what he could be, he's done well.
> He was just uncomfortable with having them picked up, and wobbled because he was unsure; he's never had them handled before.
> I accept that that's your point of view however, I have been taught to always take a pick out to the field and check and pick a horses hooves out. No hoof, no horse, and I'd like him to learn early that I'll be handling his feet out in his paddock.


Forst off the swelling sounds more as if it is the thyroid that is swollen.

I have been around horses for more years plus some, than you have lived. One of the nastiest accidents happened to a friend, a very experienced horsewoman, who went to pick out a mare's foot out in the field. This was an older brood mare she had bred and knew well. No one knows what happened but she was badly injured in the head, five months in hospital for facial reconstruction and rehab. 

You are relatively inexperienced, and my word of warning would be that over confidence can get you into trouble!


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## Clydesdales (Sep 12, 2013)

He looks very underweight to me. 
A rug as you said will help...helped my tb a ton, but he looks like he needs conditioning.

Has he had a vet check? If not it should be something to look into.

The swelling should be checked out, and what feed he should be given to help put some weight on.
He also looks like he needs a drench.

If you want to pick his feet out in the paddock...which I do myself, wear a helmet. What happened Foxhunters friend isn't a rare thing...and it could leave you in a wheelchair for life if something did happen.
Helmets aren't just for riding and wearing it while handling your horse is a good habit to get into.

A farrier I was reading about was trimming a horse's hooves, he knew this horse very well and had been doing it's feet for four years, anyway on this particular day it was spooked by a bird, and kicked him in the head. The poor bloke was left with his lower body completely paralyzed and with brain damage.

Just be careful and mind your melon!!


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

The swelling could be due to an enlarged thyroid gland Foxhunter, especially since the horse looks to have been let get in poor condition - could be a simple iodine deficiency
Hopefully your vet will sort it out for you OP - perhaps the seller of the horse thinks its common because its something she sees in all her horses related to the way she manages them


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

Clydesdales said:


> He looks very underweight to me.
> A rug as you said will help...helped my tb a ton, but he looks like he needs conditioning.
> 
> Has he had a vet check? If not it should be something to look into.
> ...


I totally agree with the helmets!! Didn't mention I wear them practically everywhere with horses; it's so much of a habit I forgot I hadn't said it x'D
That's really horrible, especially when it takes away your ability to do what you love


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

I went to see him again today and there are some things I'd like to clear up:

The seller did not tell me about his swelling. My tutor did. She has 60+ years in horses and has confirmed with me it shouldn't be anything to worry about and I choose to believe her.
He is getting a full vet check before I take him off the property he is living on.
My phone camera has the lense quality of a plank of wood, and after going to see him today with all your concerns in mind, I gave him a full feel over: the photos do not show you that he has a good coverage over his ribs, hips, and withers. I will be getting some better quality photos when I find a better camera, and I went to him today worried I had SOMEHOW missed that he was so underweight, but apart from being light simply from being unrugged, I wouldn't give him a lower BCScore than 3. 
I've gotten his measurements and he's getting a nice warm rug for the rest of the winter as well,


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

If he's never worn a rug before please try to find a safe confined area to introduce him too it
Some horses deal with them 100% fine
Some don't.


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## Textan49 (Feb 13, 2015)

DreweTC said:


> Thanks for the replies and the advice and stories, guys! The thing I am the most worried about is the big elephant in the room: Am I too new to horses to work with my own young one? I of course won't be riding him for a few years, so that's not the issue. It's the controversy of someone so new to the horse world starting off with a youngster....I really wanted to know if I would get immediate and definite "No don't do it"'s, which worried me a lot. Personally I believe I can do it; if anything goes severely wrong (I can't imagine how it could but then again, what do I know really?) then I have the breeder who will happily have him back, and a large community to sell him into (not that I feel it will ever have to come to that) but again, what I worry most about is the "You can't do it because you've never had a horse." It's almost as if, if you aren't privileged in the beginning, you can't do what other people can? I don't know...I guess I worry too much. Or am I right?


 There is a big difference between someone who knows a little and thinks they know a lot and someone like yourself who has had a good amount of experience even if it has been in a short time but has no delusions of being an expert. As long as you are aware of what you are doing and are willing to find the answers when you are not sure, you will be fine


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

Textan49 said:


> There is a big difference between someone who knows a little and thinks they know a lot and someone like yourself who has had a good amount of experience even if it has been in a short time but has no delusions of being an expert. As long as you are aware of what you are doing and are willing to find the answers when you are not sure, you will be fine


Thank you very much for this. It took me a while to be confident enough to let people know, and now that almost everyone in my life knows what my plans are, I'm getting a lot of feedback both from this forum and from them, and also a lot of support that I didn't expect to get.  I feel like this is going to work.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

jaydee said:


> If he's never worn a rug before please try to find a safe confined area to introduce him too it
> Some horses deal with them 100% fine
> Some don't.


Oh my gosh yes. My friend forgot her new pony had never worn a rug before and went into the paddock with him and put it over his bum; then she realized he'd never been rugged. Luckily he is the chillest pony ever and took it like a man, but recently at my Uni we had to have two people assisting with rugging a horse that has been covered all her life! Rugging horses still puts me off; the backstraps make me nervous. Helmets all around.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

If you're worried about the cross over straps if you buy a good quality, well fitted rug you can sometimes dispense with the leg straps and use one of them like a filet 'string' under the tail
I have some Amigo rugs and they aren't even top of the range yet stay in place perfectly without the leg straps - just a filet - and they gallop, buck, rear and roll in them


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## Clydesdales (Sep 12, 2013)

One of our old mares has a combo and she broke the back straps, but her rug stays in place without them.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

True,  Thanks for the advice! I just worry a little sometimes when putting them around the legs; horses are pretty ticklish there and even though I haven't been kicked I still worry.


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## Clydesdales (Sep 12, 2013)

I haven't been kicked while putting a rug on yet...but my sister's ottb always give a mischievous look and slightly lifts one leg as if he's lining me up. I'm sure he does it on purpose!


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

My Pets Irl by XxTheFoshyNozz on DeviantArt

Got him a rug  Trying it out in a fortnight when I next see him and if it's too big we're allowed to exchange it down to the smaller size.


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## DreweTC (Jun 16, 2015)

^^ The pics are in the link above, I forgot to mention


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