# Moving to Texas from Germany, yearly cost of hobby farm?



## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

It all depends on where you are located. What area of Texas do you plan on moving to? I've lived or worked all over and if you could give us a a better idea we can be of more help. There are several here living there currently. Smaller towns would have lower cost of living especially if you are more self sufficient and don't plan on traveling around much. Two of my favorite places are Ledbetter and Medina. As for cost of horses it depends on stocking rates. The better you grass the less you have to add hay and pellet wise. Rotational grazing and overseeding can help.


----------



## Avna (Jul 11, 2015)

Texas is twice the size of Germany. It has a wide range of climates from steamy wet bayous to cold arid plains. It has giant cities and teeny little sagebrush towns. Unless you can get a little more specific about whereabouts in Texas you are looking, you aren't going to get extremely useful information here. As @QrtrBel notes, much is dependent on the quality and amount of grazing. Some parts of Texas, 25 unirrigated acres would barely sustain a horse, in other parts, two would be enough.


----------



## Hugopf (Apr 4, 2018)

Thank you for your quick replies 

>>>What area of Texas do you plan on moving to?
Hmm, we don't have a specific area in mind. Currently we just browse those horse property websites and try to find what we like.

>>>Rotational grazing
Yes, that is part of the plan.

>>>Smaller towns
The less people the better it is. We now live in a small rural village with around 2000 people but a major city 800.000 people is within 40min of driving. That would be ideal, so probably we are looking for something similiar.

>>>Texas is twice the size of Germany.
Yes, I believe it is almost 3 times the size. We try to travel to the USA almost every year for the last 20 years. It is our favorite country. Last year we made a trip from Ft. Worth to Oklohoma City to Amarillo, down to Port Aransas and back up north to Ft. Worth.

So I believe best will be something around the Ft. Worth/Dallas Region or around San Antonio or Austin. Houston not so much.

Has this been helpful? Sorry for not being able to be more specific.


----------



## EstrellaandJericho (Aug 12, 2017)

I live in small town Texas with 10 acres. $8.75 is the going rate for a bail of hay ($10 in other places but the stuff I get is higher quality and cheaper so I go with it). Seems like barefoot trims average is $40 a horse while shoeing is $65. Property tax is my biggest expense, but we are working on an ag exemption. It takes 5 years for it to go into affect. 

Feel free to PM me!


----------



## SwissMiss (Aug 1, 2014)

Hugopf said:


> We try to travel to the USA almost every year for the last 20 years. It is our favorite country. Last year we made a trip from Ft. Worth to Oklohoma City to Amarillo, down to Port Aransas and back up north to Ft. Worth.


Planning to move is exciting :biggrin:

I have no experience with prices in Texas, but I wanted to add some things to consider as well. Not to sour the idea to you, but make you aware of things that you are *maybe* not thinking of yet...

Did you look into the legal necessities (aka visa, possible residency status and such) already? If not, I would start rather early, as the process can be long and tedious. I know you said for retirement, so the requirements may be different than for working purposes, but still worth looking into.

While traveling gives you an impression of a place, actually _living_ there is a completely different ballgame! After being used to German efficiency, just be prepared to relax your expectations a bit :wink: I never expected such a big culture shock - after all I was moving to the Boston area, which is as European as you can get :wink: Even now after over a decade there are still instances where I feel like banging my head against a wall :shock: Ok, living in the South (moved to a warmer climate a couple years ago) doesn't help :rofl:


----------



## Reiningcatsanddogs (Oct 9, 2014)

I live almost exactly the life you are looking to have...

We have 11 acres, live just outside a town of 1800 people and about an hour to the city of Austin (to our SE). We have 5 horses and about 6 acres usable flat grazing.

Where I can tell you that you are the most off on your calculations is the property taxes. Texas has no State income tax but, because of that, they shift the costs for things like schools to the property taxes. We pay about $4500 a year but, that was on a property bought 17 years ago so, I would estimate if purchased today, $6000 a year would be more in line with reality. This will depend upon which County you reside and which school district. We have an agricultural exemption on three acres and a homestead exemption on the rest. We have three other structures on the property, a tractor barn and two small barns w stalls. There is also the possibility, depending on the property, of getting a wildlife exemption which will also lower your taxes.

We are on septic and well water so water/sewer costs $0, but we pay for the electricity to pump it up into the house. We have no natural gas service available to us, so everything here is either propane or electric.(we only have propane for cooking everything else is electric though, our water heater also runs on solar) On our 3400 sf house, our electric bill is about $400 in the summer, mainly due to air conditioning. (Our house was built in 1983 and needs some new windows and my husband is a polar bear). In the winter, it runs maybe $50 less (because I am not a polar bear). 

Another area where you are off is car insurance. How can I put this delicately...because of our location close to the border and other reasons, we have many drivers who are unlicensed and uninsured. This drives costs up for everyone else. We have three drivers in our family...18, 50 and 50. The vehicles are 1993 Chevy blazer (liability only), a 2010 sedan (liability only) and a 2013 Ram 2500 diesel truck, options loaded. Our 6 month bill for insurance is $2200. Of course that price will vary upon your vehicles, driving records and company and coverage.

As for the cost of horses...figure on $250 a year for trailer stickers/registration/insurance...that is for both a flatbed trailer used to haul hay etc and for a 2 horse trailer. your driving vehicles will also need to be registered and inspected once a year ($150 ea)

A 1200 lb round bale of Premium, clean, Coastal Burmuda hay (you haul) here costs about $120. It lasts three horses about 10 days (no pelleted feed). Square bales which two of my horses have because of allergies, run between $5-$15 depending upon whether you want to drive the two hours out to load and pick up or buy locally. We are in the hill country, west of I-35 which is considered a semi-arid desert climate and grazing can be limited, you would need about five acres per horse to graze through the summer without supplemental hay. Going East of I-35 grazing is better per acre.

Again depending where you live and whether you have the vet come to you or haul the horses to the vet, costs will differ. Without injuries or illness, we pay about $400 a year for full immunizations, teeth floating and basic health checks per horse. Our vet comes to us

Farrier work...my horses are barefoot and trimming costs between $40-$60 per horse about every 6 weeks (they do some self trimming). Luckily for me, my husband took the time to learn to do a pretty good job and with the exception of one horse who needs some extra professional help, he trims them all. The horse that needed rehabilitative work cost $120 per session (you haul). My friend whose horses all need shoes (we live in very rocky terrain), pays her farrier about $80 per set.


----------



## carshon (Apr 7, 2015)

I don't live in TX but have extended family that live there (sister and many cousins) and the area you chose is where my sister lives (Seguin is where my sister lives) As mentioned in the above post I think the actual cost of living will be somewhat of a shock to you - my cousin lived closer to Dallas and eventually boarded her horse because it was cheaper to do so than to upkeep and maintain their property to have just 1 horse.

Spend more time looking at homes and properties - as I said my sister lives in Seguin near the Guadalupe River and has lush grass on her acreage but her daughter lives 35 minutes away near hill country and she can't even support 5 goats on her 5 acres of sand and weeds.


----------



## AtokaGhosthorse (Oct 17, 2016)

May I recommend you look into the Sherman/Denison area of north Texas?

I say that because real estate is reasonable there, you're in a nice area climate wise, lots of good grass, mild winters, and you're close enough to the DFW area and all it's trendy small towns like Frisco, Plano, and Allen via U.S. 75 to go catch a hockey game or seek out some really cool places to eat or activities to do.

If you're looking for serious horse country - go just a bit west of Sherman (Grayson County) and look at Whitesboro and south of Whitesboro into Aubrey and Pilot Point (Denton County). I see horse ranches for sale in all different sizes and condition all up and down the highway in that area, and they are already set up for horses with pipe fences, barns, etc. You will still be close to Dallas and I-35, which is a main artery to anywhere in Texas and places north as well.

Keep an eye on the property taxes wherever you choose. People are coming just across the Red River in DROVES to build in Cartwright and Durant, OK because the property taxes in Texas have sky rocketed and Oklahoma property taxes are seriously dirt cheap compared to just across the river in Texas... AND you are still relatively close to the DFW area and all it's trendy little towns sprawling north. I've lived in Atoka, OK most of my adult life, moved here as a kid from Lewisville, TX (2 hours south, it's close to Dallas), and I've watched the sprawl of 'Dallas' move closer and closer every year. 

It's closing in on Denton and Grayson counties, so you'll have the luxury of living 'out' and away from the madness of Dallas (You just think the Autobahn is fast. Wait till you try 635 or 75. 85 mph with 5 lanes of hardcore bumper to bumper traffic and lane jockeying. You better drive it like you stole it or grab one lane and be like that gospel song: Like a tree, planted by the water... I shall not be moved), but you'll also not be so far out you think you're in Deliverance country.

White Settlement (Sounds racist doesn't it?), Gunter, Sanger, and those surrounding areas are also in the vicinity and are growing but still lots and lots of open spaces for horses.


----------



## mmshiro (May 3, 2017)

Reiningcatsanddogs said:


> We pay about $4500 a year but, that was on a property bought 17 years ago so, I would estimate if purchased today, $6000 a year would be more in line with reality.


Well, he did assess all his costs on a per month basis, so he's pretty much ballpark.


----------



## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

You need to factor in health insurance a well...


----------



## Hugopf (Apr 4, 2018)

Wow, your answers are quite overwhelming. Thank you for the time that you invest, I read everything very carefully 

By now I'm having this:

Cost per month	
Total $3.870 
Food $517 
Electric $260 
1 horse $260 
1 horse $260 
Car insurance $80 
Internet $100 
Amazon Prime $5 
Credit cards $5 
Zwift $10 
Rouvy $10 
Mobile phones $120 
Auto Diesel $120 
Trash $40 
Property tax $700 
Maintenance $150 
Health Insurance $1.200 
Farm Insurance	
Trailer insurance etc. $21 
Car registration inspection $13 


My main issue is the health insurance, indeed I didn't think of it. Here in Germany it is automatically deducted from your wage and if you need to see a doctor you pay nothing, just show your Card and that's about it. I assumed health insurance to be about U$ 600 per Person per month. But I'm not sure yet, what I'll get for it.

I know traveling in a Country is nothing like living there. Being on vacation is all "pink skies"  So I'm even more grateful for your comments.

Hopefully this is not too silly. I'm in my late 40ies and plan to retire at 60. So there is still some time left. I like to have something to look Forward to and to have a good plan. So the Immigration part is a Little delayed.

Any insights into farm insurance?

Thanks, again.


----------



## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

I can second Sherman/Denison. I loved living there. Also Dublin/Stephenville, Ovilla/Waxahachie/Red Oak, Cedar Hill Desoto, Brenham, New Braunfels, Mineral Wells, Granbury, Atlanta (yes, Atlanta, TX) and Jeffereson. I loved living in Sugaland as well but it has built up in the years since I have lived there but don't throw that out without looking to the smaller communities north. There are some really nice areas. These are in no particular order. 8 horses on 12 acres would not be feasible without adding in hay and concentrates in most areas. Put a house on that and barn with storage areas and you don't have 12 acres with 8 horses. You have cut into that considerably.


----------



## AtokaGhosthorse (Oct 17, 2016)

Hugopf said:


> Wow, your answers are quite overwhelming. Thank you for the time that you invest, I read everything very carefully
> 
> By now I'm having this:
> 
> ...


What are you meaning by farm and/or horse insurance? Are you talking home insurance? If so, that also varies as to where you live in Texas. If you're talking anywhere near the coast (Hurricane, flood, tropical storms, etc) the price increases. It depends on how much coverage you want, what kind of house you have, how much land, etc. If you mean horse insurance, as in, your horse gets out and someone hits it with a car and sues you for their injury - there's no _required_ insurance for livestock. Texas and Oklahoma both have generous laws regarding injury due to livestock that afford a lot of protection to the livestock owner. For that sort of thing, I'd advise you to figure out where you want to live, contact an insurance agent AND an attorney in that area, and inquire as to the cost of a ranch policy and the laws and cost of insurance. There's just too many variables there, I think, for us to be able to give you an estimate.

I would also inquire as to an ag exemption as that will get you a huge break on property taxes. Even in Oklahoma, with low property taxes, we have an ag exemption - our feed for cattle and horses is tax exempt, our vet bills are tax deductible... so far as anyone in an tax position knows our horses are working ranch horses. I believe in Texas you can also enlist the assistance of a local ag extension - in Oklahoma they will pay or subsidize things like water gaps in fences (Creek crossings are notoriously hard to fence in a way your cattle and horses don't escape), springing the property (using a drag behind a tractor to cut up the dirt and then drag springs of bermuda grass through it so you have a good clean pasture rather than a weedy one), and other services such as running tests on your soil to tell you how to enrich it, etc. Texas has offices that afford the same assistance. I do not know the requirements that you'd have to meet as a new citizen to have access to those services. They may be automatic to any landowner - I just don't know. Someone who is a resident there and is following this thread may have that answer.

Health insurance: Think more like 1600.00 a month EACH. Granted, that's what my parents pay and we're in Oklahoma. Our insurance is paid for by my husband's employer. Our co-pay is $30.00 with a $2,000.00 deductible. We are 45 and 46 years old. My parents, by comparison, are late 60s and at higher risk for injury or medical issues, and therefore, theirs is higher. We also live in Oklahoma and insurance rates can vary wildly state-by-state thanks to the ACA. I think a lot of states are in turmoil about how much insurance costs right now, and without getting into the divisive politics of the ACA, suffice it to say there's a lot of upheaval and uncertainty in rates. Again, I'd make a phone call or fire off an email once you decide where in Texas you want to live, and get some quotes.

You HAVE chosen a wonderful state to move to. Don't let the news fool you - a lot of politics come into play when it comes to how the media handles Texas. I don't think you'll find a more diverse, welcoming state in the U.S. When I say diverse, I mean culturally and geographically/environmentally. Texas has just about everything you could want. You just need to throw a dart at a map and decide where you want to park yourself when you get there. North central and east Texas is fairly lush, you can graze a lot more animals on a lot less land. You get out north west, west, and south down into the San Antonio area you get into an arid type landscape and you'll need a lot more land to graze the same amount of animals. You get along the coast, it's gorgeous there, my favorite part of the state, but be aware of the hurricane season and severe weather threats such as flooding. If you get out toward Wichita Falls, you'll a lot of tumultuous weather in spring and fall, and living where I do I can tell you we watch WF for what is going on - because whatever is smacking them around weather-wise will be here in a matter of hours. 

Sherman/Denison, Pilot Point, Aubrey, etc, you will be just far enough south of tornado alley that you won't have to worry about those as much as if you were a bit further north.


----------



## Reiningcatsanddogs (Oct 9, 2014)

We pay about $2000 a year for home owner's insurance to cover liability and damage to structures. Our deductible is $3000. 

One other thing for you to consider when shopping for a property:

Because of the location of our home 50' above the low point on our property (which has a wet weather creek), we are not required to carry flood insurance, an extra cost over and above the cost of standard homeowner's insurance. 

It is a good idea to carry it despite the extra cost in many areas of Texas, as we do get influenced by hurricane rains and flash flooding.

What the still pictures don't do a good job of showing is the speed and force with which that water is moving. The first pic is the creek at a normal stage...the last two after about a 6" rain overnight which is not uncommon in the rainy months. With fast moving water up to our waists, couldn't get across to the pasture to check on the horses...just something to keep in mind. That last pic was taken as the waters were already receding, the big branch was carried up stream with the waters overnight and deposited there.


----------



## Reiningcatsanddogs (Oct 9, 2014)

Don't know if you'd be interested to know this or not but, down in the areas of Shertz and New Braunfels, there is a large German Speaking population in that area. (my brother-in-law was born in Germany and grew up in that area of Texas)

And AkotaGhosthorse is correct, some areas of Texas hill country (west of I-35)are beautiful despite being a bit Arid and it was why we bought here....

View of my back yard from my deck, spring and fall....a wonderful place to start the morning and provides some very challenging trail riding!


----------



## AtokaGhosthorse (Oct 17, 2016)

Muenster, Texas is also an active German community. And it's just past Gainesville/I-35. They even have a kick-butt Oktoberfest celebration every year. I just love all the older homes there - they all have the shutters with little hearts cut out on them and gingerbread cutwork on the eaves and stuff. 

And don't get me started on Fischer's German Market. Oh. My. Goodness - we bring our venison to them yearly and they match whatever weight you bring with pork and make the BEST summer sausage... so if you bring 50lbs of venison hams and shoulders, boned out, you get back 100 lbs of sausage and they keep your venison completely separate from any one else's so you don't get someone's nasty gut-shot meat back. You get back what you bring in. 

They also have like, 100 different kinds of hand-made cheeses there. Complete slabs of it in the back. 

And now I'm hungry....


----------



## Hugopf (Apr 4, 2018)

Thank you again everyone!

So by now I have this:

Cost per month	
Total $4.920 
Food $517 
Electric $260 
1 horse $260 
1 horse $260 
Car insurance $80 
Internet $100 
Amazon Prime $5 
Credit cards $5 
Zwift $10 
Rouvy $10 
Mobile phones $120 
Car Diesel $120 
Trash $40 
Property tax $700 
Maintenance $150 
Health Insurance $2.000 
Farm Insurance $250 
Trailer insurance etc. $21 
Car registration inspection $13 

Health insurance is the issue. I checked with our national health insurance system and understood if we like to stay as permanent residents in the USA we have to get private insurance from an american health insurance company. So the above seems to be right.


----------



## SwissMiss (Aug 1, 2014)

Hugopf said:


> if we like to stay as permanent residents in the USA we have to get private insurance from an american health insurance company.


 
Yep, also factor in a pretty hefty budget to _apply _for residency... :frown_color:
And if you can, start saving up for a good down payment. If you need to finance your farm/land and need a mortgage, not having a US credit history makes it a bit more challenging and most banks that will actually consider lending money will require at least 20% down payment...


----------



## Cordillera Cowboy (Jun 6, 2014)

AtokaGhosthorse said:


> Muenster, Texas is also an active German community. And it's just past Gainesville/I-35. They even have a kick-butt Oktoberfest celebration every year. I just love all the older homes there - they all have the shutters with little hearts cut out on them and gingerbread cutwork on the eaves and stuff.
> 
> And don't get me started on Fischer's German Market. Oh. My. Goodness - we bring our venison to them yearly and they match whatever weight you bring with pork and make the BEST summer sausage... so if you bring 50lbs of venison hams and shoulders, boned out, you get back 100 lbs of sausage and they keep your venison completely separate from any one else's so you don't get someone's nasty gut-shot meat back. You get back what you bring in.
> 
> ...



Thanks. Now I want to go back to Europe.... or Texas. Just long enough to enjoy some wine, and a big raclette, and some wurst, and brotchen, and.... and... 


Sorry to interrupt. I'm just following along. The culture shock experienced by SwissMiss, makes some interesting reading.


----------



## SwissMiss (Aug 1, 2014)

Cordillera Cowboy said:


> Just long enough to enjoy some wine, and a big raclette, and some wurst, and brotchen, and.... and...
> 
> 
> Sorry to interrupt. I'm just following along. The culture shock experienced by SwissMiss, makes some interesting reading.


I just had an awesome raclette here in MS a few weeks ago :wink: 

When moving here we learned some things the hard way; e.g. what you CAN'T get without a SSN :shock: At that time you had to be in the US to apply for one in person and then it takes 8-12 weeks to get one. Bank account? Gas? Electricity? Telephone (except pre-paid)? Nope, nope, nope... We had some interesting times :wink:


----------



## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

While you are looking don't ignore other states. Elberta, Al is a great place. German settlement and for some odd reason so many from Europe go there and enroll their kids in the schools. Hispanic speaking kids are a minority compared to the dual (triple, quadruple) speaking kids from all over Europe. So many artisan food related businesses from cultures all over. There are areas in Tx like that too. Stephenville area is one.


----------



## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

QtrBel said:


> While you are looking don't ignore other states. Elberta, Al is a great place. German settlement and for some odd reason so many from Europe go there and enroll their kids in the schools. Hispanic speaking kids are a minority compared to the dual (triple, quadruple) speaking kids from all over Europe. So many artisan food related businesses from cultures all over. There are areas in Tx like that too. Stephenville area is one.


Lol, totally read that as Alberta.....

Do have a look at Canada as well, the same wide open spaces, but a different vibe! We visited the USA a lot and I so wanted to move there, and thought Canada was a second best choice when Hubby suggested it.

Now I am glad we chose Canada, besides I don’t think we would of been able to get into the States, to poor and too rich at the same time! Canada was a lot easier, and it’s a great place to live.


----------



## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

My mother still refers to it as Alberta to her friends and it creates such confusion....


----------

