# I need help with this neck



## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Have you had a bodyworker ( vet chiropractic or such) to him? That's where I'd start. He looks to be weak in lumbar/hind end. And id move your saddle back off his shoulders, and while can't tell details from those pics, hooves look a bit problematic too, which effects everything above.


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

Yes, chiropractor and then a Therapeutic Massage. If he's been out for a long time, muscles tend to have a memory and will push the affected bone right back. When you massage the muscles it relaxes them and everything will stay put, hopefully. I took a weekend clinic on Therapeutic Massage and thermal imaging, it has worked wonders for my horses.


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## Chaz80 (Sep 29, 2015)

hi where do you live if you don't mind me asking?
just that he doesn't look to me like a typical warm blood..he doesn't look heavy set enough quite light boned like he is maybe x?
in the uk our warmbloods look like the pic belowobviously i know there are variations but this is pretty typical for us 

anyhoow..you can try long and low exercises when you school him..use a passoa when you lunge him to help build his hind end and topline
i used a market harborough on my mare..worked a treat.


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## Boo Walker (Jul 25, 2012)

From his size and those very substantial pasterns, it looks like this guy could do fine with lots more muscling. You'll have to increase his protein and other nutrients as you increase his workload. But I think as his hips and butt fill out, his forearms and gaskins bulk up, you'll see more thickness in his neck as well. 

He's balanced but under muscled. He should therefore stay balanced as he gains conditioning. You've only had him three months, it may take a consistent year to get those results. 

Flat work, keeping him in a balanced frame, hills, bending, counter bending, all that good stuff is never wasted effort. Keep a monthly photo journal of him and this time next Fall I think you'll be really pleased!


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

I missed the bit that he's a WB - yeah, as Chaz said, he is VERY lightly built for a WB in my experience, I would have assumed more TB. @chaz, not assuming this is yours, but ouch! to that bit rig you pictured. Look how small the mouthpiece is & how much it's pulling the lips up. What with the loose rings too, I don't imagine that horse is comfortable... or can feel much light contact.


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

I don't care what "breed" he is or not....
When you purchased him he was considerably underweight, period.
His being underweight was a large part of why he looked as he did with his neck.

3 months of being fed is only starting the inside healing process of cell recovery and damages reversed from being food deprived.
He still is recovering...
Muscling takes a long time to recover and replenish from depleted nutrients...
3 months is not a long time either when you think about all of the small changes you have made in how the horse works and travels.
There is not a marked improvement yet in looks in your last picture.
_{Chaz picture is what I mistook for your horse.}_
This horse needs some serious groceries fed...that will change much in appearances.

I think what you are doing is working, but it is a slow process to teach muscle memory to carry the body in a different frame and "look".
Remember is it extremely hard work for the horse to perform as you wish...go slowly with the training and changes made.
:runninghorse2:...
_jmo..._


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

He's still significantly underweight but is looking quite a bit improved in the 2nd picture. I think more time, groceries and as others have suggested, chiro & massage will do him a world of good. But based on how he looks, I'd expect a full year before he's not only up to weight but muscled up how you want him.


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## SteadyOn (Mar 5, 2017)

Neck seems to be one of the last areas to develop muscle -- which in a way makes sense, because they can't carry and round themselves correctly until the hind end strength is developed.

Feed him to build his weight and strength up, work him regularly and in a way that sympathetically and gradually increases his fitness and flexibility, and don't worry about his neck. If you do the rest of the conditioning correctly, the neck will come along on its own eventually.

As other users have said, three months isn't that long. Give him time and get there gradually. There's no quick fix that will be *good*, and if you try to force roundness or a head carriage you'll get stiffness, improper muscling, and possibly a horse with a habit of going stiffly and trying to duck behind the bit -- or leaning on it and ignoring it.


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## Amitubin (Sep 11, 2018)

To anyone who asked he is a registered kwpn, i live in Israel though he is imported from Belgium (@chaz80) @loosie he does have problematic hooves but he gets special shoes for them so that’s taken care off, I live in a place where massage therapy and chiropractors are pretty much non existent, I’m looking to start learning but until then I’m trying to find someone @Boo Walker I do exactly that a lot of good flatwoork, which is definitely helping and he’s getting a lot better at it

Thank you for your comments. Hopefully I can get this guy back to where he should be 😊


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## Chaz80 (Sep 29, 2015)

loosie said:


> I missed the bit that he's a WB - yeah, as Chaz said, he is VERY lightly built for a WB in my experience, I would have assumed more TB. @chaz, not assuming this is yours, but ouch! to that bit rig you pictured. Look how small the mouthpiece is & how much it's pulling the lips up. What with the loose rings too, I don't imagine that horse is comfortable... or can feel much light contact.


haha no its not my horse,just one i found to show what a typical warmblood looks like in the uk
i have a very tubby welsh lol


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Chaz80 said:


> haha no its not my horse,just one i found to show what a typical warmblood looks like in the uk
> i have a very tubby welsh lol


Yeah I meant the one you posted of the grey to show that martingale/rein thing.

To OP, I wasn't trying to say he wasn't WB btw, sorry if that's how it sounded, just that he's very light built for one IME.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

Here's a photo of my horse when I first got him 3 years ago (May 2015). He's the small one on the left in the top photo:








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These pictures were taken in August:








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I have no interest in "round", which I believe is a false concept in horses. I make no attempt to "shape" my horse or "frame" him. His neck is thicker and his chest is thicker and he uses both ends of his body in a coordinated manner now. Why?

1 - Groceries. He gets to eat more. He isn't raced while eating too little. 15 hands. Vet estimated his weight at 790 lbs when he arrived. I'd guess close to 900 lbs now.

2 - He is now ridden at 23-25% of his body weight instead of at 33-37% ( :eek_color: ) of his body weight.

3 - I'm just a trail rider, but our trails here have almost no level ground. So riding any trail means doing work climbing and descending hills.

4 - He had been poorly shod, and we pulled the shoes off. Although I'm now using hoof boots on his front because his front feet have thin soles:








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Maybe a good trainer could have created more improvement in less time. Oh well. There aren't any trainers near me I would trust. If in doubt, simply do no harm, or at least do less harm. I'm a stiff, awkward rider, so trying to do less harm is about as good as it gets for me! Food, exercise, a good farrier, letting him move around on his own, food, hills, try to be light on his back, food...and time. He's no warmblood. Half-mustang, half-Arabian. Had a back like a beam of steel when he arrived. Mostly uses his back now, although he sometimes reverts to old habits for a stride or two. I come from a "Forward Seat" background and tend to think the easiest way to encourage a horse to use his back is to sit on his back as little as possible.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

You can use an Equine Physio and massage therapist to help you and the horse work together to develop the right muscles but if you're already working the horse in a correct outline and the underside of the neck isn't 'solid' and over-developed to indicate that the horse is bracing then you're probably already doing all the right things re. exercise.
Carrot stretches and simple flexion exercises will help with stiffness that isn't related to some serious arthritic changes
What's lacking in your horse is a few more pounds of weight to cover his bones a bit more - we used to get a good topline on show ponies and horses just by increasing their food ration. The extra work they then got was just about creating muscle in flesh that was already there


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## Chaz80 (Sep 29, 2015)

loosie said:


> Yeah I meant the one you posted of the grey to show that martingale/rein thing.
> 
> To OP, I wasn't trying to say he wasn't WB btw, sorry if that's how it sounded, just that he's very light built for one IME.


lol no thats not mine either haha


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## 4horses (Nov 26, 2012)

Hmm. He does look very much like a thoroughbred. He has a long back. If he is 15, I'm not sure you are going to get big changes in his musculature. He can gain more muscle with exercise, but I'm not sure you are going to see big changes. 

My mares both tend to lose their top line easily. Right now they are not getting worked much so they have lost all that muscle along their top line. I think it is breed specific with lighter breeds having less muscle. Even when in consistent work, my horses won't have a top line like a warmblood.


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## SteadyOn (Mar 5, 2017)

4horses said:


> Hmm. He does look very much like a thoroughbred. He has a long back. If he is 15, I'm not sure you are going to get big changes in his musculature. He can gain more muscle with exercise, but I'm not sure you are going to see big changes..


That's not necessarily true. I was riding a 20-year-old mare for six months over this last winter, and the amount of muscle she put on during that time amazed everyone! Her owner said it was the best she'd looked in about five years. That was just with about four or five thirty-minute rides per week and some good, stretchy free-lunging. And of course good nutrition -- but she'd always been fed a good diet.


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