# Marish, mares....gotta love them



## Horsecrazy4ever (Nov 29, 2011)

I used to ride a mare like that.. I am very interested in what other people will have to say.. =)


----------



## RisingGlory (Sep 12, 2010)

Wow... that is weird... I haven't heard of anything like that before. I think you need to get her used to more people. If she gets more used to your husband, it could be a step in the right direction toward NOT hating men. I don't know if your husband rides or not or even likes horses, but it might be a good Idea. I don't know if this would help, but It's what I would start to do. GOOD LUCK!!!!! 

P.S. do you have any other horses? Does she act this way to them? or is she just a loner?


----------



## toosexy4myspotz (Oct 7, 2007)

I love my mare to death and wouldn't trade her for the world. My husband shoes her with no problems at all but she does not want anybody touching her. I can't do whatever I want to her. She gives me dirty looks from time to time but I pay no mind to her cause the more you correct her the worse she gets. If you let her make her snarling faces and go about your business but if you pay attention to her she gets worse. So I just don't pay any attention to anything she does like that.


----------



## trainerunlimited (Jan 26, 2012)

I had a mare that would do stuff like that and if you smacked her, she'd think it was war. I finally broke her of it, but it wasn't pretty. She had a lot of attitude and thought she was the boss. 

I don't accept that behavior from my mares, whom I primarily ride, but I've had all my good ones before they were handled much, so no one has had a chance to affect them in their behavior in any way. 

It is extremely tough to break them of being bratty if they've done it for any long period of time, lol. I almost didn't win with the mare I had.

It all started because I wanted her to yeild her hindquarters and she wanted to kick/bite/paw at me, lol. She yeilded both front and back before I was done with her, but man, I got rid of her as quickly as I could after that spectacle.


----------



## toosexy4myspotz (Oct 7, 2007)

She is perfect in the pasture. She gets along with everybody. We have five horses. He has been around her sense she was a two yo. We travel with her and another one of our walking horses. She sees him every single day. When she was 2 1/2 yo she did this to everybody, even me. It took me one week straight of rubbing her from head to toe for about an hour a day and then working her in a round pen and she stopped the aggressiveness towards me but I'm the only one who grooms her, saddles her, works her, etc. All I have to do point my finger at her and say that's enough and she straightens up. She behaves this way towards vets too. She just absolutely hates people touching her. My husband hates mares, we have two, the ssh who is aggressive towards random ppl and then our new twh who is the boss. So, I doubt I will be able to talk him into anymore mares. :-D


----------



## toosexy4myspotz (Oct 7, 2007)

Cheyenne isn't really aggressive towards me. She don't bite at me, she don't kick at me, she is a beauty under saddle, responds to every cue as quickly as possible. She is a breeze to ride or work with on the ground. She has A+ ground manners. her only problem is her aggression when she doesn't want someone to touch her. If somebody touches her that she don't like she will twitch her skin and throw her head up with pinned ears. If they don't stopped then she proceeds to rearing and kicking. She has never done this to me. She has never done it towards my husband, but she did last night. I don't use eating as an excuse cause I don't give a rats butt. I do what I want when I want with my horses eating or not.


----------



## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

If my mare turned her butt to me and started kicking, all hell would break out. Either she would think she was going to die, or she would die...but I see no reason to compromise on something like that.


----------



## xxBarry Godden (Jul 17, 2009)

What's this business about a horse not liking men? 
How can she tell what is male or what is female?

Is it the butts or the boobs?

Or maybe it is the length of hair?
or 
could it be the beard? 
I rub my beard against my mare's muzzle, she quite likes that.

or did I ought to wear a skirt to get her to like me ? But women don't wear skirts when they are riding horses do they? Anyway my mare already likes me.

And I don't wear perfume. And I am bald. And I am bow legged

But I don't wear high heels, nor stockings, nor baubles, nor bangles.

But she can tell its me from about 500 yards - 

SO, HOW DOES SHE KNOW ITS ME? or any old man for that matter?


----------



## toosexy4myspotz (Oct 7, 2007)

She never turns her butt to me.ever. None of my horses do or else they are going to have a blistered butt end. The problem is correcting her then its not me she is doing it to. If my horses act out or do anything disrespectful they get a run for their money. It ain't just men she don't like. Its anybody that thinks they can just walk up and pet her. If you stand there and talk to her first then proceed to pet her you probably won't have a problem but if you just go pet her she has a fit. Most the time unless I'm riding her or working her I'm not standing right there to correct her. Idk if that if just her being a mare and don't like to be touched or what. But like I said she doesn't do this to me.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Shropshirerosie (Jan 24, 2012)

We have a male instructor who visits the yard sometimes, and my yard owner has a mare who HATES him with a passion. He has never sat on her, never done anything to her, my YO tried to have a lesson her with him once, but had to give up after half an hour because she was being so nappy grumpy spooky (not her normal self at all).

He is what one might term an Alpha Male - I think he just gives off too much testosterone for her to deal with!

My mare has no problems with him; but then she is a 14 year old ex-broodmare..... And knows what to do with testostone-filled males of her own species.


----------



## Cherie (Dec 16, 2010)

I have trained very close to an equal number of mares and geldings during my lifetime. I think many people give mares a 'pass' when they act 'ill' and think that mares are supposed to act like that.



> She gives me dirty looks from time to time but I pay no mind to her cause the more you correct her the worse she gets. If you let her make her snarling faces and go about your business but if you pay attention to her she gets worse. So I just don't pay any attention to anything she does like that.


As long as you set such a low bar, you will get just exactly what you are settling for. 

*The worst behavior that you accept is the best behavior that you have any right to expect.

What you LET them do is what you are training them to do.*

This is how everything works in the world of horse training. When this spoiled mare turned her *** and kicked at you and your husband, one of you two should have taken a lead-rope or a whip to her butt and like BSMS said, "She should have thought she was going to die."

No mare should get a pass on good, safe manners and behavior toward *ANYONE, *male, female or ???? To make excuses for them and to give them a pass only trains them to do it. 

We have about 7 or 8 broke mares right now that I can put anyone on or around. We hauled 2 mares in a trailer of 6 horses this morning. They were tied on the left side of the stock trailer with no dividers. Each had geldings on each side of them. One is 5 and one is 6. I never gave it a thought that one might be fussy or not like the horse behind her or anything. They are broke and I know they will mind. I can lead strange horses from the back of any broke mare on the place. I would not settle for anything less.

There is NO reason not to make a mare have good manners. They train like any good gelding. They learn to do what you accept.


----------



## trainerunlimited (Jan 26, 2012)

I 2nd that Cherie! My mares don't act like mares at all, other than their heat moments where they aren't quite as willing to do something with a "YES MA'AM" attitude.


----------



## LynnF (Jun 1, 2011)

This doesn`t sound like `mareish` behavior to me. It sounds like a horse that has been allowed to get away with too much and has no respect. I agree with Cherie totally, there is no reason we should allow mares to get away with things just because they are mares. That is like saying that I am allowed to be a complete bag to everybody whenever I want just because I happen to be female. It makes no sense. I have had several mares and geldings and like Cherie my mares were just as well mannered as my gelding even when the were in season.


----------



## toosexy4myspotz (Oct 7, 2007)

if she doesn't do it to me then how am I suppose to stop her
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## toosexy4myspotz (Oct 7, 2007)

Cheyenne has had her back legs smacked multiple of times by a whip for kicking. I haven't had any issues with her kicking at me in well over a year. I don't have problems out of her and if she pins her ears that is not something I can help. What am I suppose to do if she is standing tied and her ears are pinned. She pins her ears 90% of the day. The only time her ears aren't pinned if when she is being worked.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## palominolover (Apr 28, 2010)

I agree 100% with Cherie. This is NOT your typical mare. This mare is rude, and pushy and in the end she will eventually turn on you because she can get away with it. Don't try to make excuses, get the other people to correct it. I'm pretty sure a few very hard smacks in designated places, at the correct time will straighten her up. It's all about CONSISTENCY. What you are saying makes me believe you are disciplining her inconsistently.


----------



## toosexy4myspotz (Oct 7, 2007)

I do not have any problems with her. She doesn't kick at me, she doesn't bite me, she doesn't test me. She does everything when I ask, no questions asked, she is perfect on the except when other people go to mount their horses and she pins her ears and throws her head, she gets corrected on this EVERY time. She has BEVER
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## toosexy4myspotz (Oct 7, 2007)

She has never offered to kick another horse on the trail even if they ram her. She is a charm to ride alone our with other horses. She responds with one cue, you never have to ask her twice. Yes she does keep her ears pinned most the time but she is never hard to control. On the ground she leads prefect. She stays out if your space, she backs, side steps, lunges perfectly. She doesn't have to be tied to be bathed, groomed, saddled, etc. she hobbles on both back and front feet. She stands tied with no fuss at all. She is perfect in the trailer alone or with any other horse. She stands patiently with fifty other horses gallop ing and going crazy around her. I do not have problems at all with her. She only acts out when some body walks up to touch her. I dont know if its that she doesn't like them, she doesn't trust other people or what. My husband walks her in and out of her pasture everyday. She has never gave him a problem till yesterday. Neither of us had a lead rope or whip to use to correct her and by the time I walked around the stall wall she had already stopped. She is in a stall with one high side and three low sides. I was standing outside the stall on a low side with my husband standing in front of me in the stall.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

toosexy4myspotz said:


> if she doesn't do it to me then how am I suppose to stop her
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


When she does it to someone else, nail her.

My mare once thought about turning her butt to my wife. I nailed her (my mare) with a feed bucket from 20 paces. Then I chased her (my mare) around the corral until she thought death was likely. Then my wife guarded the feed bucket for a while with a pitchfork, and didn't let the mare eat.

When I'm around, my mare isn't allowed to get fussy about anything, including other horses. To try to discipline another horse while I'm around is to defy my authority in the corral.



toosexy4myspotz said:


> ...I pulled her blanket off for my hubby to how fat she was getting and god forbid, he touched her, *she reared up* and then proceeded to turn her butt to us and *started kicking*. *I hollered at her* and told that was enough *and she went back to eating*. What it is with her and men I will never know...


Hollering and then letting her eat isn't quite what I have in mind when I wrote:



bsms said:


> If my mare turned her butt to me and started kicking, all hell would break out. Either she would think she was going to die, or she would die...


It may require showing your husband how to put the fear of the Lord into her. And of course, that means more than hollering.


----------



## its lbs not miles (Sep 1, 2011)

The first horse I owned was like that, but it had nothing to do with gender. She was a one man horse. People could do certain things with her, but she wouldn't tolerate other things. I borrowed a male and female cousin (she was always wanted to ride her, but the mare wouldn't allow it) and using them I worked with the mare for about a month until she would allow others to do almost anything with her. 
She had always been excellent for me, but needed to be taught that she was expected to have good manners with everyone.


----------



## toosexy4myspotz (Oct 7, 2007)

My husband is not this discoplinary one by far. O went in with him tonight and made him mess with her while she was eating and she didn't even stop much as pin her ears at him. Which if why I dont understand what she did last night. The first time she ever kicked at me I made her literally poop on herself. My husband of coarse doesn't do this. None of our horses test me for anything.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## pintophile (May 18, 2011)

OK OP, I'm sorry, but what I see is a whole lot of contradiction and you trying to backtrack and frost over points that you were originally asking for help on.

From your original post:


toosexy4myspotz said:


> Well, my 4 1/2 yo spotted saddle decided to pull a few stunts last night. I trained her as a two yo and she is a very good riding horse I can take her anywhere I want to, alone or with 100 other people. However, Cheyenne has a wee bit of an attitude. It doesn't both me at all but she isn't all that bad towards me and if she does get out of line I correct. Last night she was eating and I pulled her blanket off for my hubby to how fat she was getting and god forbid, he touched her, she reared up and then proceeded to turn her butt to us and started kicking. I hollered at her and told that was enough and she went back to eating. What it is with her and men I will never know. She, to the best of my knowledge, has never been abused by them. When you ride Cheyenne her ears are back all the time, unless she is in the front or alone, she pins her ears and acts like she is going to bite ppl when they mount their horses?! This is stuff she has done when she is young and correcting it has only made it worse. The more you correct her on her attitude towards strangle people or with men it only gets that much worse. I have two local twh trainers to tell me to leave her alone that she is a mare. Like I said, she doesn't bother me. Very very rarely will she ever attempt anything with me.


On to another few posts down:


toosexy4myspotz said:


> She is perfect in the pasture. She gets along with everybody.


Really? She's perfect in the pasture? I thought you said above "Last night she was eating and I pulled her blanket off for my hubby to how fat she was getting and god forbid, he touched her, she reared up and then proceeded to turn her butt to us and started kicking."



toosexy4myspotz said:


> Cheyenne isn't really aggressive towards me. She don't bite at me, she don't kick at me,


Really? She's never aggressive towards you? I thought you said above: "Last night she was eating and I pulled her blanket off for my hubby to how fat she was getting and god forbid, he touched her, she reared up and then proceeded to turn her butt to us and started kicking." I don't know about everyone else, but turning her but to you both and starting to kick is pretty much as aggressive as a horse can get, in my books. 

Maybe she was kicking at your husband, and didn't want to hit you. The fact that she turned her *** and started kicking towards ANY human at ALL, regardless of who it was, says to me that she is pretty aggressive. There's no excuse for a horse to EVER kick in the presence of a human.



> she is a beauty under saddle, responds to every cue as quickly as possible. She is a breeze to ride or work with on the ground. She has A+ ground manners. her only problem is her aggression when she doesn't want someone to touch her. *If somebody touches her that she don't like* she will twitch her skin and throw her head up with pinned ears. If they don't stopped then she proceeds to rearing and kicking. She has never done this to me. She has never done it towards my husband, but she did last night. I don't use eating as an excuse cause I don't give a rats butt. I do what I want when I want with my horses eating or not.





toosexy4myspotz said:


> She has never offered to kick another horse on the trail even if they ram her. She is a charm to ride alone our with other horses. She responds with one cue, you never have to ask her twice. Yes she does keep her ears pinned most the time but she is never hard to control. On the ground she leads prefect. She stays out if your space, she backs, side steps, lunges perfectly. She doesn't have to be tied to be bathed, groomed, saddled, etc. she hobbles on both back and front feet. She stands tied with no fuss at all. She is perfect in the trailer alone or with any other horse. She stands patiently with fifty other horses gallop ing and going crazy around her. I do not have problems at all with her. She only acts out when some body walks up to touch her._Posted via Mobile Device_


OK, and then we move on to these posts. She is a beauty under saddle, responsive, well-trained etc...MOST of the time. She's well-behaved MOST of the time because it's easy. You said right there, that when something happens SHE DOESN'T LIKE, she throws a massive, dangerous tantrum. What I get from this is that she's not well trained. She appears well trained, and she acts well trained when you're doing something she doesn't mind doing, but there is still a lot of resistance there. I can't remember which member on here said it, but they said something like: "A horse that comes with a list is not a well broke horse. A horse with a set of rules that you need to follow to handle them has the people trained, not the other way around."



toosexy4myspotz said:


> She never turns her butt to me.ever. None of my horses do or else they are going to have a blistered butt end. The problem is correcting her then its not me she is doing it to. If my horses act out or do anything disrespectful they get a run for their money.


Really? She never turns her butt to you? Ever? I thought you said above: "Last night she was eating and I pulled her blanket off for my hubby to how fat she was getting and god forbid, he touched her, she reared up and then proceeded to turn her butt to us and started kicking." 

If your horses act out or do anything disrespectful they get a run for their money or a blistered butt end? "I hollered at her and told that was enough and she went back to eating" doesn't sound to me like she was punished for doing something that could have easily killed you and your husband. I like what bsms said: "She should have thought she was going to die...or she should have died." 



toosexy4myspotz said:


> Its anybody that thinks they can just walk up and pet her. If you stand there and talk to her first then proceed to pet her you probably won't have a problem but if you just go pet her she has a fit. Most the time unless I'm riding her or working her I'm not standing right there to correct her. Idk if that if just her being a mare and don't like to be touched or what. But like I said she doesn't do this to me.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Again, full of contradictions with your earlier posts. It sounds like as soon as people started telling you what you didn't want to hear, we get a whole bunch of excuses.



toosexy4myspotz said:


> if she doesn't do it to me then how am I suppose to stop her
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Either make sure the people she does it to are prepared to beat the crap out of her, or make sure you are there to do it for them.



toosexy4myspotz said:


> Cheyenne has had her back legs smacked multiple of times by a whip for kicking. I haven't had any issues with her kicking at me in well over a year. I don't have problems out of her and if she pins her ears that is not something I can help.


_Again_, more contradiction. You do have pretty big problems if the horse rears and kicks furiously at people she doesn't like.



toosexy4myspotz said:


> I do not have any problems with her. She doesn't kick at me, she doesn't bite me, she doesn't test me. She does everything when I ask, no questions asked, she is perfect on the except when other people go to mount their horses and she pins her ears and throws her head, she gets corrected on this EVERY time. She has BEVER
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yet AGAIN, another contradiction, and again, it seems like the more people tell you what you don't want to hear, the more excuses we get about how she's not really that much of a problem at all.

I think correcting her is going to be what trainerunlimited said - you are going to have a big fight, and it won't be pretty. What I gathered from your posts was: she gets snarly, when someone hits her, she gets REALLY snarly, aggressive, and mean, and the person backs off because they think they're doing the wrong thing if they're getting a bigger reaction. She sounds like a smart mare, and she's learned and it's been enforced that if she gets really mean, people stop trying to punish her. She wins. She's still fairly young. The longer this goes on, the deeper it becomes ingrained, the meaner and more sour and 'mareish' she'll likely become.

JMHO


----------



## xxBarry Godden (Jul 17, 2009)

Pinto - a magificent post for sure.

I assume your chosen speciality is endurance riding.

Well done


----------



## toosexy4myspotz (Oct 7, 2007)

You can say I'm making excuses all you want. My horses don't have it easy. They dont do what they want when they want and they dont run me over. They are worked six days a week and a very strict routine which everyone goes by. This was the first time she is acted this way in a long time. Yes when i first bought her are was a kicker so yes she had kicked before. She has not offered to kick at me our me husband in well over a year. I have only owned her for two years . I will try my best to get a video for you do that you can actually see.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## RisingGlory (Sep 12, 2010)

This has gotten pretty heated in here!!! woofta..... well, I can see A LOT of contradicting facts and opinions!!! I think the main things issued here are :
1. to correct your horse every time, even if it envolves chasing them and, as quoted earlier, Putting the fear of the Lord into them.
2. Some horses just have thier moments when they are going to act weird. They are horses people, not machines. They aren't perfect, so that's why we have to go back to step one. This also could have been just one of them moments for the mare when she just didn't want to be touched. Correcting was the right thing to do. 

Again, this is just what I've picked up. I've also realized that it shouldn't matter gender wise, or who the person is. The biggie here is to just correct things, even if they are minor. But, my main thought is, no matter how much you correct, a horse IS a horse and they are NOT perfect. Neither are we, that's why we come to horseforum. To talk to people and get other suggestions. GOOD LUCK!!!!!


----------



## NeuroticMare (Jan 8, 2012)

Ugh, I hate that all mares get lumped into a category, or that you are calling this behavior "marish". It is not marish, it's dangerous and spoiled, regardless of her sex. I love love love my mare, and all her quirks (which are HER quirks, not marish quirks!) and another mare I ride is literally the sweetest horse I've ever met, mare, gelding, stallion, she is the sweetest HORSE I've ever met. 

Off my soapbox, you may continue


----------



## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

personally, i dont think it is much of an improvement that your husband walked up to her while she was eating and she didnt get mad. i would practice taking her away from food and have him take her away from food. 

also, after the original incounter [her kicking at you] i dont think you got after her enough, if she immediately went back to eating. if my mare tried to kick me while she was eating, she would get in so much trouble and she sure wouldnt be let back to her food. 

if you say shes perfect BUT ..... she needs more training !


----------



## xxBarry Godden (Jul 17, 2009)

Now I have to put my hand up and confess I am male. An old male, well used to living with the female of the species human. I have learned, over the decades, toleration. I know the women in my life can’t really help what they do since it is in their genes. They are hormonal. So I forgive them, after all for most of the time they are liveable with and they will cook, clean and make the beds.

When the time inevitably comes for them to behave oddly then it is beholden upon we mere men to sit back and tell ourselves that the mood will not last too long. During those periods of stress we men adopt a different pose. We try to become invisible. We can’t possibly do right. So we hide. We lie low.

Occasionally there are times when it all becomes too much for us men, so we vent our spleen. We raise our voices and if we are lucky enough to live in a village with still has a pub, we go down and have a few jars. Never do we raise our hands in reproof, for we know only too well that even one light tap will be remembered for ever more. By the time we get back home we are deaf, sleepy and very malleable, if only the ladies knew how, so long as they catch us before we fall asleep.

Now I own for the first time ever in my life, a pretty mare. I know she can’t help herself, it is all in her genes. She is hormonal. So I forgive her tantrums After all, usually she will carry me hither and thither. And she wins at competition. She eats the grass. I know that when she acts up, the mood will not last too long, merely a day or so. During those periods of stress I adopt a different pose. I try not to ask too much of her. I can’t possibly do right with her. I keep my distance. I lie low. I keep my hands to myself. I do not fight with her.

Yet there are occasions when it all becomes too much for me. I feel myself getting angry. My faithless steed has pushed her luck. I raise my voice and I go off to the pub for a glass or two. When I arrive back at the yard, there she stands watching my every move. All she has to do to redress matters is to give me a lick. but she has to catch my eye before I fall asleep.

Just why is this sport of horses such a woman’s world? Maybe I should have bought a gelding.


----------



## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

I've got a fairly demanding, dominant mare. She is intensely aware of her rider. She is a perfectionist. When she thinks my riding is substandard, which is often enough, she swishes her tail & flicks her ears back.

But if she kicked at me, I wouldn't head for the pub. All hell would break loose.

About a year ago, she THOUGHT about kicking at me. Didn't, but she was thinking it. Don't ask me how I know, but she is an extremely expressive creature. So I grabbed a convenient rock and popped her in the butt so hard I thought I'd need the vet to come out and surgically remove it. Then I stalked her around the corral, glaring at her and reminding her that a cup of horse blood would taste fine trickling past my fangs.

Eventually, I decided to let her live. She came to me, and we went to her food bucket. Then I stood in her way until I felt like she was sufficiently contrite, and THEN she was allowed to eat. 

Tail swishes, reluctance, ears...I can understand those in the right circumstances. Kicking at me, or at any other human? Nope. She is more than enough of a handful already. Sometimes when I ride, she gets ****y and I tell her it is just too darn bad - if I can feed her and clean her corral, she can do some work for me. She can get ****y, but she still has to get the job done.

Often it is something I'm doing wrong (looking down, incorrect lead, etc) - and I'll try to correct those. But if it is windy, it is windy - ride on. And don't even THINK about offering to kick me at ANY time. Nope. Not interested. That brings out my evil twin... :twisted: :twisted:


----------



## Allison Finch (Oct 21, 2009)

Barry, I do think geldings are a great idea for many people.... and horses.


----------



## xxBarry Godden (Jul 17, 2009)

Alli - neat.


----------



## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Allison Finch said:


> Barry, I do think geldings are a great idea for many people.... and horses.


I can think of a few right enough.


----------



## xxBarry Godden (Jul 17, 2009)

Ladies, Your ganging up on me.


----------



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

_Ganging up here! Barry, your post back there was so utterly , amazingly sexist, that I was sure it must be some finely tuned wit and sarcasm , ala Jonathon Swift and his suggestion that the poor eat their children. You have the brains and finesse to do it, too. I really like that about you, and I know I am not alone here._

_However, this thing about females being at the mercy of their hormones irks me 'cause we aren't the only ones to be driven by hormones. If anyone thinks that human males are not yanked around by their hormones, let him speak now and forever hold his peace. _


----------



## xxBarry Godden (Jul 17, 2009)

Tiny. I love my mare as if she were my kin. But, Oh My, does she demand a price and I truly believe it is her hormones that cost me dear. What else can it be?

Sadly it is often her who pays the price.


----------



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Of course, I was not referring to your comments regarding your mare, but rather your openning remarks regarding life with human females. It's not that I totally disagree with your observations regarding female behaviors, it's just that I also feel that men are much driven to behave , often without logic, by their hormones. Yet they seem to think we are the only ones subject to these powerful chemicals.


----------



## Kayty (Sep 8, 2009)

I'd better get home from work and go back to my real job of being a good little housewife!!!!


----------



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Kayty said:


> I'd better get home from work and go back to my real job of being a good little housewife!!!!


I AM a good little housewife, 24/7. It's actually a fairly challenging job. Much underrated.


----------



## Kayty (Sep 8, 2009)

Hahahaha precisely, Allison!
Any man that expects me to be at home 24/7 to make beds, make dinner and play housewife, being at his beck and call constantly, attending to his every need - hey why dont we through in a little maids outfit into the mix - , can go jump for all I care. I am a very independant person, I work my backside off, I LIKE going out going to work, making a living, and being able to support myself. No holier than thou, sexist man is going to take that from me


----------



## its lbs not miles (Sep 1, 2011)

Allison Finch said:


> Barry, I do think geldings are a great idea for many people.... and horses.


I tried that with my ex.....had her fixed (I really did :lol while we were still married...didn't work. Had to get rid of her anyway. I kept the kids, house, pets, etc.... Fixed my female dog (yes, I know that a dog is a male, but saying ***** gets many non breeders upset :lol and it did wonders for her. But when fixing the wife didn't work what choice do you have left? :lol: (Putting her down isn't legal)

Yes, I know I'm stirring the pot :lol:, but I'm not the one who put it on the stove :lol:. And being Dad and Mom to 3 children leaves you pretty resilient and with a wicked sense of humor :lol:

Happy Valentine's Day ladies. I feel great now. Think I'll go cook some bread with my son


----------



## thesilverspear (Aug 20, 2009)

How many mares have you had, Barry? I expect my mare to behave and not be at the "mercy" of her hormones. These are your boundaries, honey, I don't care how in season you are, bucking across the arena isn't on. And because that was the Law, she hasn't pulled that crap for years. 

Some horses, mares, geldings, stallions, are just hot. Has nothing to do with their gender. 

I don't cook, really, unless it's one of those oven pizzas from Tesco. My OH is a far better cook than me. The good news is that I just finished a PhD, so at least I have some other (hopefully) marketable skills, eh.


----------



## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

tinyliny said:


> It's actually a fairly challenging job. Much underrated.


Very very true, tiny! 

One of my mares tried to kick out at me once during feeding time. She got a manure fork handle on her butt right away. Hard. She learned the lesson. 

I don't think it's OK to pin ears and threaten to bit either people or other horses. My qh used to do it when she was younger, and I either cut her off right on spot (she's very good about understanding my intonations), or if it's in ring she's driven forward into more work. Now, I do not trust if someone gets too close to her from behind, but frankly I don't trust any horse on that - they all can kick. So on trail I usually ask people NOT to tailgate her (just in case). 

I noticed lots of people use "marish" as an excuse for the ****y behavior. If my mare has to work, well... it has to work. I don't care that she's a mare and may be not in mood in this particular moment (although yes, they are usually more jumpy and my paint is more flightly in their "heat" days). It's all about training and how you approach it.


----------



## thesilverspear (Aug 20, 2009)

Yeah, mine is also flightier on heat days, but while you feel this extra bit of tension and fizz when you're on her back, she rarely, if ever, puts a foot wrong. People watching from the ground wouldn't see any great difference. The first couple years I had her, when she was 7-8 years old, we had some exciting moments, but I made it clear that acting like a lunatic under saddle just because you were in heat wasn't cool and she's a smart girl, so she figured it out. 

My previous mare did not get flighty when in heat; she got snarly. There were several times when I made her back up through the entire barn and/or do teeny circles until the ears went forward. That habit didn't last very long, either.


----------



## xxBarry Godden (Jul 17, 2009)

Ladies, perhaps it is now time for me to confess to being mischievous. But having lived with the same woman for nearly fifty years I have learned where to find the buttons to push to arouse lively repartee. My wife is no shrinking violet and during her career in the medical profession, she rose to the top of her speciality at national level. The daily banter between us reflects the no holds barred approach to each other. When aroused she can be a formidable lady and quarter is neither sought nor given. 

Men and women have different skills and the knack of living together for so long is to mix and match our respective abilities. Trust, respect, familiarity and tolerance are paramount in any relationship between the sexes, even with the women whom one does not marry but who become friends through life.

However I have never baked a cake, nor ironed a shirt to name but two chores which I would find some way to avoid. Neither do I sew nor do I shop. I am left to mow the lawn, to play with my horse and dogs, to do the accounts and to buy the wine. She has her theatre, her ballet, her friends and her walks. She reads, I write. The system works for us, as time has proved. 

We both handle the mare but usually on different days. We are not always in agreement as to how the horse should be worked and I am sure the canny mare notices the differences. Nevertheless the two females will gang up on me and if I don’t take care, I’ll be left mucking out. 

Thankfully, nowadays hormones don’t affect either male or female and I am sure that is why the atmosphere in the house is calmer. Whereas that horse in her stable, ………………………!


----------



## thesilverspear (Aug 20, 2009)

"However I have never baked a cake, nor ironed a shirt to name but two chores which I would find some way to avoid."

Neither have I. I'm pretty sure baking, ironing, and sewing for that matter would all end disastrously. My boyfriend does all these things; however, his riding skills are limited to not falling off, stopping, and steering.


----------



## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

Barry Godden said:


> Thankfully, nowadays hormones don’t affect either male or female and I am sure that is why the atmosphere in the house is calmer.


Hmmmmm.... Are you making a hint at the age, Barry? :lol: 

I didn't come across the man yet that could cook well enough for me to eat it every day. Not saying they don't exist out there, just saying to this day I haven't been lucky enough to meet one. I'd much rather cook or bake myself (even though I don't like it much): at least I know I'll enjoy the meal.


----------



## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

tinyliny said:


> Of course, I was not referring to your comments regarding your mare, but rather your openning remarks regarding life with human females. It's not that I totally disagree with your observations regarding female behaviors, it's just that I also feel that men are much driven to behave , often without logic, by their hormones. Yet they seem to think we are the only ones subject to these powerful chemicals.


Absolutely right, Tiny.

I don't care if he was* trying* to be witty, it fell far short of the mark. :?


----------



## thesilverspear (Aug 20, 2009)

Indeed. After all, it's not only women driven by what can be only hormones to do absolutely daft, illogical things.

Like this guy, for example: Ice climber gets verbal warning after baring it all at Bridal Veil Falls in western S. Dakota | The Republic

Speaking of climbing... While I personally don't ascribe to the belief that mares are just moody and "marish," I always thought it etymologically interesting that climber slang for having a major debacle on a climbing or mountaineering route is "having a mare." 
* 
*


----------



## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

Good grief! Barry, you are old enough to know that while a man may NOTICE monthly mood swings, it is darn near suicidal to mention them!

When men are inclined to be stupid over hormones, they are CONSISTENTLY stupid over them - 365 days a year, +1 on leap year.


----------



## Mike_User (Oct 24, 2006)

_Aaanyway_, about those horses... ;-)


----------



## RisingGlory (Sep 12, 2010)

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!


----------



## xxBarry Godden (Jul 17, 2009)

Now regards calming down a troubled mare,

Has anyone any experience of using VALERIAN or CHAMOMILE

If so HOW MUCH?, HOW? & WHEN?

but most importantly DID IT WORK?


----------



## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

Barry Godden said:


> Now regards calming down a troubled mare,
> 
> Has anyone any experience of using VALERIAN or CHAMOMILE
> 
> ...


Barry, valerian made my mare even worse. However vervain helped calming her down (although not tremendously). As for how much I don't know: I got Hilton Herbs mix and gave her 1 (attached) scoop / once a day.


----------



## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

I tried 'Cool & Calm' and 'Mare Magic'. In the end, the only thing that has made a difference to my mare is *more training*...with me walking her around our terrifying neighborhood, and the trainer spending a lot of time doing stuff like this:



















After working with her for a week, the trainer concluded Mia had never been taught about yielding to pressure, or even how to respond to a bit. I had ridden her without a bit for 3 years, but was getting tired of bolts & sometimes the injuries that followed...

Spending a LOT of time with her (uncounted hours), and 3 full months of training, has worked wonders...although she remains a dominant, expressive mare who wants everything to be done exactly right. If I don't get killed first, she'll teach me a LOT about riding and horses. And I think I've been teaching her a few things as well. If nothing else, she has long since learned not to act dominant to a human!


----------



## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

I agree with "more training" statement, but for some horses the calmer just takes the edge off. It's kinda hard to explain, but my horse goes into over-excitement state very easily (especially when she'll be trailering somewhere and knows that), and all training she has doesn't help her to come over that excitement. I do NOT use calmer for quite a while already, but I can see why people may want to use it.


----------



## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

I will say that I've read a lot of positive reviews for the stuff I tried. And it is cheap enough to give it a try for a month or two without worrying. And the lady who has trained our horses uses one of them (I forget which) on a mare she owns. She says it helps one, but has no impact on the other. Horses are kind of like women - all individual, regardless of their sex! That is part of what makes them interesting...:?


----------



## its lbs not miles (Sep 1, 2011)

To be honest I've had one stallion and one gelding. All the rest of my horses (starting with my filly in 1972) have been female. Until my present mare I've never had any of them get "marish" or "moody". In fact it wasn't until very recently (last 4 or 5 years) that became aware of the term "marish". And although my present mare has her moments, a swift kick in the butt (figuratively speaking) takes usually takes care of it. She's just trying to have her way vs my way. My, soon to be a mare, filly is like all the other mares I've owned....steady and constent.

I guess I've been extremely lucky for the past 40 years judging by what others say about mares. Whenever I start to look for a new horse my father still tells me to get a gelding. And I still ignor him. The stallion and gelding in my past had been his  Just ended up with me.


----------



## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

I am not a mare person. I like the boys, without knackers. The other 2 types are constantly in heat, & in heat sometimes every 2 weeks. I don't like breeding animals, they will always own that part of themselves, kind of feral like. Yes we can make them behave, perfectly, but they still have another need.


----------



## apachiedragon (Apr 19, 2008)

Any of the mares (or geldings/stallions) I've worked with over the years learned right away that I was a bigger "mare" than they could ever hope to be, if they crossed that line. IMO, the ear-pinning is the first sign of trouble. If she is pinning her ears at you out of aggression, or even "marish-ness", even if she hasn't thought about kicking/biting yet, THAT is the time to correct. If my horses are having a grumpy day, and think about pinning those ears at me without just cause, all I have to do is point a finger and give a stern look, and they are back to being docile as a kitten. You cannot wait for the behavior to escalate, you have to stop it BEFORE the kick comes. They can be as grumpy as they like on their own time, on my time, they will mind their manners and be happy about it.


----------



## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

bsms said:


> I will say that I've read a lot of positive reviews for the stuff I tried.


I did try the ones you mentioned (both of them). Didn't do a dime for mine, so basically was waste of money (the Mare Magic had wonderful smelt though I really enjoyed!). Calmers are something you never know until you try.


----------



## thesilverspear (Aug 20, 2009)

A couple years ago, my mare got into the habit of pacing the fence line at the stable where I kept her at livery and driving me, the yard owner, and herself bananas. I tried a magnesium calmer. It didn't work. I found a new livery yard for the horse. That did work.


----------



## xxBarry Godden (Jul 17, 2009)

I've just got back from a session with my mare. I had collected her from her paddock where she had been standing perfectly still by the gate for between 2 -3 hours. She was facing east towards where the hunt had been the day before yesterday.

Together we walked up the track and she stopped 6 -7 times with her ears pricked high and looked east. Eventually she reached the yard where she looked around for the bogeyman. I untacked her and cleaned her up. She stood still but occasionally she startled when the wind blew or whenever she heard an unfamiliar nose.

When I took off her field blanket I realised she was quivering but she wasn't cold. She was tucked up. The whites of her eyes were showing. She was petrified but of what?

Now I don't believe in beating any horse other than those which bite or strike. DiDi has had more training than most horses and within the dressage arena she is ultra sensitively obedient. She does willingly what she is asked to do.

I had the idea to fit a massage pad for the first time and surprisingly DiDi liked it. We stood together for 20 minutes or so. Then I tacked her up again in her outer wear and took her back down to her field. Any work today would have been counter productive. When we arrived she said 'hello' to her gelding mate next door and she started to graze alongside him. Maybe I had done some good. She was definitely more calm then than when I had collected her. 

If the hunt comes back this way again in the near future, I shall get very angry.

If locally there were a man from Jamaica, I would knock on his door.
Maybe a bucket of his magic mix would keep my mare calm.


----------



## thesilverspear (Aug 20, 2009)

I think we've probably disagreed on this before, Barry, but I still think desensitization is the way forward for your mare. Probably would not help with the hunt coming through, as that makes a lot of horses get pretty uptight (the yard owners of a place where I used to board would keep the horses stabled if they thought the hunt was coming through that day) but it generally makes them calmer about the world. I suspect that's what bsms meant by "more training." I have yet to see horse get spookier when exposed to flapping jackets, tarps, giant exercise balls, plastic bags, or whatever else you can think of. Provided it's done sensitively and slowly, they usually get more confident about the world and about you as their handler.


----------



## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

A big part of what has helped Mia is walking her almost daily (on a lead line) around the neighborhood and nearby desert. When she starts getting nervous, I either ask for one more step forward and then *I* turn her around (pretending it is my decision), or we stop, do head down, neck scratches, etc until she is calm enough for a few more steps forward. It is counterproductive to force her past the scary thing. I have to calm her past it. 

However, the trainer also spent nearly 2 months working on getting her to accept lines touching her rear legs, and even a little work at pulling a small log.

But if a bunch of horses raced by, Mia would melt into a pool of terror...


----------



## xxBarry Godden (Jul 17, 2009)

No Silver, I am constantly trying de-sensitisation. We still haven't got past the poles on the ground and the plastic barrels stage. If I introduced plastic sheeting on the ground and flags etc she'd freak. When I think back to what I subjected my old cob Joe to in order to make him streetwise, then it amazes me just how sensitive DiDi is. Joe would stand firm whereas DiDi will flip, whirl and flyoff to an extent where she will hurt herself - regardless.

The other day was a case in point where she dug with her feet deep holes in the surface of the sand arena whilst flying off at a super gallop when being lunged. I made up a reason for her flipping, but I am still not s ure if that really was the reason.Today, a couple of days later, the residues of whatever it was, are still in her system.

I am going down the route of calmers next. At the moment she is only safe in this world so long as I remain her guardian. Her fears are to her genuine. I felt them today through my fingers and they are deeply embedded.


----------



## thesilverspear (Aug 20, 2009)

A women who kept her hotter than hot Arab at an old barn of mine faced similar problems -- when that horse flipped, she had no regard for her safety or anyone else's, and she did so frequently, without much warning. I have to say, my horses, no matter how scared they are, will at least keep themselves safe and you'll be alright so long as you stay on.  Sounds as if DiDi doesn't. This fellow livery of mine still did the desensitisation thing with her mare, only the horse took much much longer to accept new, scary things than did most other horses. And the owner couldn't push it, not even a little bit. The mare once ended up on her back in a ditch due to having a meltdown on a trail ride and running backwards into said ditch. Properly scary stuff. The owner was well into the style of training of Buck Brannaman, Mark Rashid, et al, as well as the Centred Riding thing. I think she may have done a lot of Linda Tellington-Jones TTEAM work as well. She also took dressage lessons with the barn's trainer, though the horse thought being on the bit was the most terrifying thing, ever. In part, because the owner was really tuned into the horse and open to all these different approaches, the horse did improve and learned that the world isn't out to get her. 

Now that the horse is in her twenties, she is a relatively chilled out creature (for an Arab) and is a solid, sensible trail horse.


----------



## xxBarry Godden (Jul 17, 2009)

SIlver
My wife and I have bought in our lifetimes three colts , two welshies, one irish draft which we have gelded, back and trained on to ride in the rural suburbia of Surrey. The access for one favoured ride was thru the high street of the local small town centre. We did de sensitization work as part of the basic training.

These days I follow ideas by Michael Peace - who works with Police horses.

DiDi is something different. I got her when she was 8 and she had been thru at least five sets of owner. With hindsight perhaps for good reason.

She will come off all four feet, and move a metre sideways as a reflex response to her catching sight of something out of place. There is no warning - none - not a twitch nor a stiffening, nor a scrap of tension - one minute you are walking along the next minute it is all over. Either the rider sits it out - or he/she lies on the ground.

If her neck comes up, her ears twitch, the rider gets the warning but what comes then is no more than a bending of her front legs - again sharp but the rider is warned. The rider drops six inches but is shaken rather than thrown..

Three days ago she went from gallop to racing gallop whilst attached to a lunge line. She leant over and galloped as fast as she could on a 25 foot circle till she was exhausted. I could not stop her, until she started to puff.


The problem is that this is a horse which if you turn your head to the right whilst keeping your hands still - she will turn right. If you hesitate at the walk she'll halt. She is sharp and ultra responsive and even the lightest of riders is not prepared for the violence of her shy.

Her marish traits come out when she decides to be the boss - they are a different problem altogether.

I am beginning to despair that there is no answer. Without my guardianship, she would be euthanised.


----------



## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

Barry Godden said:


> If the hunt comes back this way again in the near future, I shall get very angry.


My trainer doesn't allow foxhunters around her farm anymore, because it drives many horses crazy for several days (to the point that some cleared the fences in past). I can see why.


----------



## trainerunlimited (Jan 26, 2012)

Whew, I wouldn't allow that behavior for very long! I would tie all sort of plastic bags, jugs with rocks in em, and whatever you can think to tie up to a very sturdy round pen and put that mare in there to get over herself. Having an owner tiptoe around her dangerous spooks isn't going to make her any better and will end up making her into something good for only dogfood. Harsh words, but you are hurting rather than helping her overcome her problems.


----------

