# Non-horse family about to get horses in our backyard - HELP! our backyard - HELP!



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

All I can think of right now is that this might turn out to be a real blessing in disguise.

it's not that you aren't right to have some concerns. horse poo isn't generally all that stinky. Especially once it's composted or dried on the ground. As long as the manure pile (assuming the caretakers make one) isn't closer than about 60 to 80 feet, you probably won't smell it much. 

Your girls might end up falling in love with horses, and this can be a very good thing for children. They may end up doing barn chores there, learning responsibility and earning some money. They may find a lot of joy in watching the horses graze next door. 

Yes, they would have to be taught not to go into the pasture unsupervised, etc. And, if the fence is not good, there is a possiblity the horses could get out. But, 'kill' you daughters? not very likely.


I dunno. I think you are worrying more than need be and you may find more good things come out of this odd situation than bad.


----------



## pazfam (Aug 29, 2017)

tinyliny said:


> All I can think of right now is that this might turn out to be a real blessing in disguise.
> 
> it's not that you aren't right to have some concerns. horse poo isn't generally all that stinky. Especially once it's composted or dried on the ground. As long as the manure pile (assuming the caretakers make one) isn't closer than about 60 to 80 feet, you probably won't smell it much.
> 
> ...


awesome, thank you so much, def appreciate it! I know that previously a smaller horse (maybe even a donkey) got out into the highway right next to us and caused a major accident in which someone was very injured. we have two highways/routes (45mph+) that are on two sides of us. so I guess I worry about that, and also not being horse people, if one got out I don't know if I would know the best way to react. What do you do with an escaped horse? Run? Stand your ground and woah?! very good to know about the manure, though I only really worry about it because the horse vet that used to live here got his vet practice shut down by a neighbor two doors down because of the smell. That's why this house was sold, bc the vets couldn't do their work on this property anymore. So I'm def worried! The outdoor fence I read online should not be a single fence with one small electric wire along the top of it, which is exactly what it currently is - the landlord told me this weekend that the tenant would be repairing the fence - this seems strange to me. Is that normal that a tenant would fix up the property to get it ready for horses? Thanks again for your help and response, it's very much appreciated!

also, insurance, do we need to ask for copies of horse insurance? if such a thing even exists...


----------



## Horsef (May 1, 2014)

Well, first of, most people here would love to have horses in their backyard - even if they were someone else's. It's the horse owner I would worry about 

I don't know anything about laws so I will not address that part of your question 

You most probably don't need to worry about the smell unless they put their manure pile right next to your house. Most people wouldn't do that. Generally, horse manure doesn't smell unless you put your nose right into it. It's not like pig manure, it's mostly grass. If you go into an unkempt barn, you will smell ammonia, not manure. Fields are picked for the benefit of the horses (to keep the worm count down and ensure even grazing), not because of the smell. I've never smelled horses even on most neglected fields. 

A bad fence might prove to be a problem. Do keep in mind that horses will rarely run at a person, they usually run AWAY from them. What could be a problem is kids going up to the fence or even into their field to feed them. It seems kids love doing that and it can become dangerous with some horses. If the horses move in I would look into putting up electric fencing both to keep the horses in and kids out. It isn't expensive.

Another problem that you didn't think of is flies. There will be flies. It's just the quantity that depends on the horse owner's housekeeping. You can't actually do much about that.

The amount of noise depends on the horse owner and what they do with the horses. If they compete, they might leave early on the weekends using a trailer in spring and autumn. Mind you, I sort of doubt that a horse owner who puts their horses into an unkempt field with no arena will be doing all that much competing. Unless they trailer out for lessons- more noise. But generally keeping horses is not a noisy affair at all. It's usually much quieter than living next to a family with children.

Anyhow, I think you should look for alternative accommodation. If you are this bothered even before they moved in, you will find it irritating. I personally would be bursting with joy


----------



## pazfam (Aug 29, 2017)

Horsef said:


> Well, first of, most people here would love to have horses in their backyard - even if they were someone else's. It's the horse owner I would worry about
> 
> I don't know anything about laws so I will not address that part of your question
> 
> ...


you are AWESOME! thank you so much - both of you two - for taking the time to respond. you've helped a LOT already, thank you!!

and yes, I am sure most of you would be super psyched to be in this situation lol! for me, if it was dogs, I'd be ecstatic - just because I know dogs well and have been around them all my life. So I'd imagine y'all feel the exact same way. Anyone looking to move to Maine hehe?
thank you again very very much - esp about the flies, def hadn't thought of that at all!


----------



## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Check with your local zoning committee, and find out how much land is required for livestock. I go by the rule of 3 acres for the first horse, and 1/2 acre each thereafter for any additional. Your ordinances may be different of course, but that's a good rule of thumb.


Is the landlord absolutely CERTAIN that the place is zoned for livestock? If it's not, there's your out. The fence itself sounds like a nightmare, and there are also ordinances about what type of fence horses require. One strand with an additional strand of hotwire on top is not acceptable.


The horses are not going to jump the fence and kill your children. They're domestic animals that have been bred for docility, and as long as they're not being harassed there's no danger. Even high strung horses would rather run away from confrontation than fight. 


There's no guarantee your new neighbor is going to want your children around to 'help'. I know I'd be irritated if someone's children were just dumped on me because they 'love horses'. Yeah, no. If your kids want to learn about horses, the best way is to get them lessons at an established professional barn where they not only learn how to ride, but also to care properly for them.


Bottom line, this sounds like a nightmare waiting to happen, and your landlord sounds clueless.


----------



## Horsef (May 1, 2014)

pazfam said:


> so I guess I worry about that, and also not being horse people, if one got out I don't know if I would know the best way to react. What do you do with an escaped horse? Run? Stand your ground and woah?! very good to know about the manure, though I only really worry about it because the horse vet that used to live here got his vet practice shut down by a neighbor two doors down because of the smell. That's why this house was sold, bc the vets couldn't do their work on this property anymore. So I'm def worried! The outdoor fence I read online should not be a single fence with one small electric wire along the top of it, which is exactly what it currently is - the landlord told me this weekend that the tenant would be repairing the fence - this seems strange to me. Is that normal that a tenant would fix up the property to get it ready for horses? Thanks again for your help and response, it's very much appreciated!
> 
> also, insurance, do we need to ask for copies of horse insurance? if such a thing even exists...


If you don't know your way around horses, don't attempt to catch it. Stay out of its way but don't panic - it will only scare it . The best way is to stay indoors or in the general vicinity of a tree or some other large object and keep the object between you and the horse. It would be very, very unusual for an escaped horse to approach you. If it, does flap your hands in the air and make a (non-panicked) kissing sound. It will go away. Again, it would be very unlikely it will approach you. Keep your energy calm to calm the horse. 

A tenant might agree to fix the fence in exchange for a lower rent amount. It isn't the most common way to do it but it does happen. Try to keep an optimistic outlook, most horse owners don't want their horses getting out. It really doesn't happen all that often - much less than with dogs.


----------



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Now, I'm just the opposite; I would not want to live next to someone who had a lot of dogs and didn't care for them well. their poop DOES smell, they DO bark and make noise, and they bite.


----------



## BlindHorseEnthusiast4582 (Apr 11, 2016)

What do you mean by a single fence exactly? A wire fence with a single electric wire can be fine, depending on the horses and placement of the fence wires. I'm sure the owner knows how much/if her horses respect a fence, and will fix it accordingly.

Especially if you know nothing about horses/the specific horse, I do not advise that you try to catch them if they were to get loose. Desperate times may cause you to have no choice, such as just trying to keep them away from the road, but not all horses will react the same way. Some would run over you just as soon as run away if you try to block them, for example. That's a discussion you should have with the owner once you get to know them.

I agree with tinyliny that this could be a very good thing, so don't expect the worse right away!


----------



## LoriF (Apr 3, 2015)

I honestly think that you are doing a whole lot of freaking out over nothing. There is a lot of what ifs that are making you uncomfortable because you know nothing about horses. I love horses and I love dogs and I can tell you, I would rather have a couple of horses in the vicinity than the equivalent of dogs. Dog poop does stink, horse poo does not. Dogs bark and horses are fairly quiet creatures. The only detrimental thing would be flies. 

I would tell my children to stay away from the horses. For their protection and for the sake of the horses. Horses can hurt people just due to their size. I would not like people messing with my horses at all, especially people who know nothing about them. Don't feed them anything, even if they look hungry. Horses have particularly specialized digestive systems and being fed the wrong thing or even too much of the right thing can be disastrous and deadly. 

If you are worried about an escape, ask the owner of the horses for their phone number in case of such an emergency happening, and don't use that number for anything else. Most horse people keep to themselves and just come to take care of their animals.

As far as horses insurance, Yes, there are all kinds. Most people have horse insurance for the health and well being of the horse. I'm not so sure that there is insurance for liability from the horse damaging anything. Most insurance like that is for the actual property owners that have livestock on their own properties or property owners that board horses but not everyone does nor is it required.

Honestly, the only way that you can stop this is if the property is not zoned for horses. If it's zoned for horses then nothing you can do except move or cause grief for the horse owner (which isn't fair to them as they're walking into unknown turmoil). Another thing you can do is build a fence to keep your kids confined to the yard right by the house.


----------



## pazfam (Aug 29, 2017)

really, I can't even thank you ALL enough. every single piece of info and thoughts and opinions , which are all super welcome - thank you!!! you're helping me out a lot and I think I'm slowly lowering my freak-out level after reading your responses, haha. thanks!!


----------



## Horsef (May 1, 2014)

BlindHorseEnthusiast4582 said:


> What do you mean by a single fence exactly? A wire fence with a single electric wire can be fine, depending on the horses and placement of the fence wires. I'm sure the owner knows how much/if her horses respect a fence, and will fix it accordingly.
> 
> Especially if you know nothing about horses/the specific horse, I do not advise that you try to catch them if they were to get loose. Desperate times may cause you to have no choice, such as just trying to keep them away from the road, but not all horses will react the same way. Some would run over you just as soon as run away if you try to block them, for example. That's a discussion you should have with the owner once you get to know them.
> 
> I agree with tinyliny that this could be a very good thing, so don't expect the worse right away!


I wouldn't say that a non-horse person would have a moral obligation to try to keep a run-away horse off the road. I think the first thing they teach emergency medical staff (for example) is that they should only provide help if it's safe for themselves. A non-horse person trying to catch a horse isn't safe for them. I hope you don't take offense, I just wouldn't like OP to get that impression, sorry if I misunderstood your point.

In any case, a runaway horse really isn't that common.


----------



## pazfam (Aug 29, 2017)

And to address the one thing I think just needs to be pointed out from our end, we would never in a million years harass or intimidate or annoy the woman coming with her kids and horses - that would absolutely not be right and absolutely not be fair. there is zero intention of doing anything of that sort, I love horses, they are absolutely majestic animals, and would never ever consider anything that could harm or hurt or bother or annoy the animals or the owners. I agree zoning may be our only out, but I'm pursuing moving out first, I don't want to cause this woman any grief of having a place to live and then after a long exhausting x-country drive, she does not have anywhere for her babies. Maybe she'll even take over our lease if we all work together? Hopeful for an amicable outcome. Again, thank you all!


----------



## Horsef (May 1, 2014)

pazfam said:


> And to address the one thing I think just needs to be pointed out from our end, we would never in a million years harass or intimidate or annoy the woman coming with her kids and horses - that would absolutely not be right and absolutely not be fair. there is zero intention of doing anything of that sort, I love horses, they are absolutely majestic animals, and would never ever consider anything that could harm or hurt or bother or annoy the animals or the owners. I agree zoning may be our only out, but I'm pursuing moving out first, I don't want to cause this woman any grief of having a place to live and then after a long exhausting x-country drive, she does not have anywhere for her babies. Maybe she'll even take over our lease if we all work together? Hopeful for an amicable outcome. Again, thank you all!


If, by any chance, you don't manage to move out in time and decide that you do love living next to horses - we would love to hear about it  Best of luck!


----------



## HombresArablegacy (Oct 12, 2013)

The only thing I personally would be concerned about is invasion of privacy. By that, I mean that the horses will have to be fed at least twice a day, which means the owners have to come every morning and evening to feed, hay and water the horses. If they plan to stall the horses at night, putting them up and turning them out daily. That's basic horse care.

So, you're going to have traffic every day from the horse owners. Might want to get with your landlord to see if he'll agree to time limits on how early and how late they can be on the premises, but don't hold your breath. 

You can play it by ear and see if it works out, the horse owners may be very nice people. Most are. Or, you can start looking for another place to live.


----------



## pazfam (Aug 29, 2017)

Horsef said:


> I wouldn't say that a non-horse person would have a moral obligation to try to keep a run-away horse off the road. I think the first thing they teach emergency medical staff (for example) is that they should only provide help if it's safe for themselves. A non-horse person trying to catch a horse isn't safe for them. I hope you don't take offense, I just wouldn't like OP to get that impression, sorry if I misunderstood your point.
> 
> In any case, a runaway horse really isn't that common.


yeah, definitely would not try to catch at all, I like the suggestion of using a large object like a tree to keep between, but now reading a few people say the horses would be most likely to run away from us, I feel a LOT better about that. The reason this whole running away thing is even an issue is because before the horse vet was here, the original owners apparently neglected the barn and the horses very much so and they got out ALL the time. The town here knows my property well because they went through a few years of constantly escaping horses, shutting down the highway both lanes, etc... and none of us know why that exactly was happening - was the stable not locked properly? Were the barn doors closed properly? Was it a fencing issue? Anyway, I know my local animal control officer is not especially psyched either..

To answer a couple of questions, the property is zoned for animals, but our town only allows 3 horses up to 5 acres. The whole property is 4.6 acres but the half the horses will be on is roughly half of that, so I will definitely check into the zoning for smaller acreage, though again, that will be a Plan B or C. 

The fencing - it's a single white wooden fence (I did look up specifications so I'll be going out to measure this week) and it has one loose electrical wire running along the top of that fence - to the very layperson eye, it does not appear to be one of the thicker flat electrical wires that horses can more easily identify. In my research, this fencing would not be considered adequate, and that an exterior fence outside of this setup would be appropriate - does that sound right? 

I'm happy to take a couple of fence pics if we are allowed to post them here.


----------



## SilverMaple (Jun 24, 2017)

I'd take horses next door in a crappy fence than a family with a bunch of loud kids and dogs any day, and I love dogs and (usually) don't mind kids 

Make sure the zoning is legal, but other than that, see what happens. You may find that you enjoy having the horses there after all. Most people who have horses next door like having them there. If you have issues with manure, usually asking the horse owner to pick the pasture occasionally or move the pile is all that is needed. Horse people don't want complaints that may mean their animals have to move. If you're amicable, they likely will be, too. Teach your kids how to be safe around horses, and don't go into the pasture unless the owner of the animals invites you in. Don't feed someone else's horses, even if it's just a treat. Some horses can't handle changes in diet, apples, carrots, other grass, etc. Certainly don't throw lawn clippings over the fence as a treat for the horses-- it can kill them. Use it as a learning opportunity for yourself and your kids, and you may make a good friend in the process, too. 

A strand of electric wire or tape that is properly charged will keep 99 percent of horses off even the worst fence. I wouldn't worry too much, especially if the horse owner is going to be upgrading the fence. Horse owners don't want their animals to get out, either. If she dumps the horses there and doesn't ever come see them, feed them, check the fence, or what have you, then you have a problem. If she's responsible and visits every day or two to feed and check water and the horses, and puts up a working strand of electric wire, most likely all will be just fine. 

Let us know how it goes!


----------



## BlindHorseEnthusiast4582 (Apr 11, 2016)

Horsef said:


> I wouldn't say that a non-horse person would have a moral obligation to try to keep a run-away horse off the road. I think the first thing they teach emergency medical staff (for example) is that they should only provide help if it's safe for themselves. A non-horse person trying to catch a horse isn't safe for them. I hope you don't take offense, I just wouldn't like OP to get that impression, sorry if I misunderstood your point.
> 
> In any case, a runaway horse really isn't that common.


No offense at all 

The point I was trying to make is that something could happen when a non-experienced person is put in a situation where they have to handle a horse. ALWAYS the person's safety should be put first, I was just saying that that's the only reason I could think of where I (if I was non-horsey), would probably try and help. Make sure you will be safe first though, absolutely do not put yourself in unnecessary danger. Maybe I'm not saying much different by rewording, idk, but glad you raised the point incase someone else misunderstands as well.


----------



## pazfam (Aug 29, 2017)

HombresArablegacy said:


> The only thing I personally would be concerned about is invasion of privacy. By that, I mean that the horses will have to be fed at least twice a day, which means the owners have to come every morning and evening to feed, hay and water the horses. If they plan to stall the horses at night, putting them up and turning them out daily. That's basic horse care.
> 
> So, you're going to have traffic every day from the horse owners. Might want to get with your landlord to see if he'll agree to time limits on how early and how late they can be on the premises, but don't hold your breath.
> 
> You can play it by ear and see if it works out, the horse owners may be very nice people. Most are. Or, you can start looking for another place to live.


Aside from my children's safety, which is always #1, this is 1000% my selfish reason for not being happy about this situation - I like my privacy, a lot. I can see the barn from every window I walk by every day. I will not be happy staring at people in my backyard every day, driving by with trailer and pickup trucks going past my house every single day, like we are talking 15feet max from my daughters' bedroom window. I do like the idea of coming up with a time plan but I don't think the landlord will be helpful with that, so I'll get my wife to talk to the horse owner herself, one mom to another hehe. thank you for your thoughts, I do hope this goes well, but I hope much more that the house I'm looking at in 1hr will be a winner lol.


----------



## pazfam (Aug 29, 2017)

Love it - you all are so nice and helpful!!! Horse people truly are some of the best in the world. Thanks!!!


----------



## LlamaPacker (Aug 29, 2016)

Very interesting to see from a non-horse family angle how worrisome horses can seem. My first thought was that it will be very beautiful for you to see lovely horses grazing behind you. We sit on our front porch and love it when the horses have moved to the upper pasture so we can see them. Sounds like enough land that only two will not over-stress it. 

My next thought is that if the owner has two girls, these are probably gentle horses. However, definitely make sure your kids know to stay out of pasture, to keep their hands away from horses' mouths. As a previous poster said, people can get hurt just due to large size of animals and their tendency to not always watch where they are putting their feet. I'm so paranoid that at my dry corral with llamas, ponies and mules, which is close to a major road and rural business area; I've posted a sign saying STAY OUT, Animal Behavior is Unpredictable, with some smaller print legalese underneath. Mostly because I'm afraid that young girls will want to go in and braid pony manes; also, even though my mules are very friendly and I believe safe, I don't know enough about mules yet to be sure that something wouldn't irritate them. 

My final thought, due to fact that sometimes gates get left open, animals push through fences (our farm animals have gotten out and onto the highway — goats, llamas, cows — luckily no accidents yet), is to let you know that you only need to call the owner to let them know, so be sure to get that number. If not able to reach owner, then call 9-1-1. Quite awful for an owner to have their animals cause a wreck and lots of liability, so my guess is the owner will be sure fence is adequate and will be no problem if feed is adequate in the pasture.

Hope it goes well, whatever you decide to do!


----------



## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

I think you're worrying about things that might never happen and assuming the worst
Your landlord doesn't have to know anything at all about horses to lease his land and barn to someone with horses
The people might do a lot of good by tidying the barn up and keeping everything very neat and tidy.
I don't think any horse owner would agree to restrictions on when they can spend time on the land they're leasing.


You can talk directly with your town council to find out how many horses per acre are allowed on a property
You can also ask if there are zoning laws that require horse and livestock owners to have a fence within their boundary fence that stops their animals from actually touching the shared boundary fence - in our CT town our horses have to be kept 10 feet away from our boundary fence


Based on everything you're saying I can't see the situation working for you as far as loss of privacy goes so might be a good time to move


----------



## Horsef (May 1, 2014)

pazfam said:


> yeah, definitely would not try to catch at all, I like the suggestion of using a large object like a tree to keep between, but now reading a few people say the horses would be most likely to run away from us, I feel a LOT better about that. The reason this whole running away thing is even an issue is because before the horse vet was here, the original owners apparently neglected the barn and the horses very much so and they got out ALL the time. The town here knows my property well because they went through a few years of constantly escaping horses, shutting down the highway both lanes, etc... and none of us know why that exactly was happening - was the stable not locked properly? Were the barn doors closed properly? Was it a fencing issue? Anyway, I know my local animal control officer is not especially psyched either..
> 
> To answer a couple of questions, the property is zoned for animals, but our town only allows 3 horses up to 5 acres. The whole property is 4.6 acres but the half the horses will be on is roughly half of that, so I will definitely check into the zoning for smaller acreage, though again, that will be a Plan B or C.
> 
> ...


The horse owner will know if the the fence is appropriate for her horses. Some horses you can be contained behind a rickety contraption (not that that is a good idea), others need a lot more. We are all coming from a position that irresponsible horse owners like the one that kept the horses there previously are very rare. It might be different in your part of the world but I doubt it. Again, runaway horses really aren't common. They even make it to the newspapers when it happens 

I would be more worried about flies and your kids messing with horses. Flies you can't do much about, kids need to be educated and supervised for a while. Or is it the other way around? 

You said that you are familiar with dogs and I think that is what is getting your blood pressure up. Horses are very different to dogs. Most dogs need a very solid and "full" fence to keep in. Because dogs want to get out. Horses for the most part don't. They will usually only get out if there isn't enough food or water, or if they get scared. Also, a stallion will go after mares but I don't think that will be the case, not many people keep intact stallions.


----------



## beau159 (Oct 4, 2010)

pazfam said:


> So we agreed to rent the property, and 6 days before our move, we received the lease which stated that the barn AND all of the horse land was not included.


Backing the truck up .... seems strange that this was not mentioned in your previous conversations with the landlord, and it probably would have been a red flag for me to have the landlord try to "slip" that detail into the lease. 

But I suppose it's neither here nor there since you are already renting the house.



pazfam said:


> also, insurance, do we need to ask for copies of horse insurance?


You have nothing to do with the horses. They are not yours. They are not on your land. It wouldn't be any different than your neighbors getting horses. 

Now it will depend on your state, but horse insurance (assuming you mean liability) usually is only needed for the people that own a boarding barn, or trainers that give lessons. .....Not for "innocent bystanders" to horses. 



pazfam said:


> Aside from my children's safety, which is always #1, this is 1000% my selfish reason for not being happy about this situation - I like my privacy, a lot. I can see the barn from every window I walk by every day. I will not be happy staring at people in my backyard every day, driving by with trailer and pickup trucks going past my house every single day,


This would be the only thing I would be concerned about in your shoes and very worthwhile to talk to your landlord about it. However, be prepared for them to come and go as they please.


----------



## Cynical25 (Mar 7, 2013)

Personally, I would NOT want the contact number of the person leasing the horse property. Call your landlord any time there is an issue because it's entirely HIS problem to handle, not yours. If the horses get out every single morning, call the landlord every single morning. Wash your hands of it all, so you don't become inadvertently responsible for taking care of issues.


----------



## pazfam (Aug 29, 2017)

To the last few responses (and everyone who has responded), all I can say is thanks again! seriously, you all bring up great points, thoughts, and have ALL seriously put my mind much more at ease than it was this morning and all weekend. I really really appreciate it!!! 

also, the one person who mentioned the lease situation - that was a shock to us. but at that point, we were moving in 6 days and had to be out of the house we were in, end of lease there.. so there was no option to say no, other than moving me and the fam into my mom's basement lol. The ad itself listed the property as 6 acres and the only thing mentioned about the land in the back is the barn - it stated "barn not included" - that was it. Then the lease arrived and it stated the barn and all the horse land .. we certainly would never pay as much as we are for half the land ... so it sucks all around and our landlord hasn't been super great. hopefully the horse woman is awesome, but based off how cool y'all have been, I'm not even worried about her anymore. I'm looking forward to meeting her bc I think she will be much nicer and friendlier and easier to work with our family, since she has her own. Thanks again everyone!!


----------



## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I do hope it turns out well for you. not all horse people are as cool as we are, though.


----------



## AnitaAnne (Oct 31, 2010)

@pazfam Have you ever been around horses? It doesn't seem from your worries that you have ever been around them. 

Reading about your situation sounds more like a really good opportunity, not the disaster you envision. 

The horse owner has children, you have children. Children, especially girls, as a group tent to really,_ really_, like horses! 

My kids horses were great with children, which is why I purchased them. You, and your children, might have a wonderful opportunity to learn about horses (and maybe even get to ride them) right in your backyard! Possibly for free! Do you have any idea how much people pay to ride a horse? 

Your kids and her kids may become great friends building memories to last a lifetime. 

Looking out your back door and seeing horses peacefully grazing may turn into the highlight of your day. 

If you like dogs, you may discover you love horses. 

You might find yourself eagerly watching for the horse owner's truck to arrive so you can talk to her, not dreading seeing the trucks pulling through. 

Try to look at the positive, this situation may turn into a blessing :grin:


----------



## beau159 (Oct 4, 2010)

AnitaAnne said:


> You, and your children, might have a wonderful opportunity to learn about horses (and maybe even get to ride them) right in your backyard! Possibly for free! Do you have any idea how much people pay to ride a horse?


....Or maybe not. 

Just so the OP doesn't get hopes up high, it is possible the horse owners may not want them anywhere near their horses. 

So also to consider the possibility of "look but don't touch". ;-)


----------



## LoriF (Apr 3, 2015)

pazfam said:


> To the last few responses (and everyone who has responded), all I can say is thanks again! seriously, you all bring up great points, thoughts, and have ALL seriously put my mind much more at ease than it was this morning and all weekend. I really really appreciate it!!!
> 
> also, the one person who mentioned the lease situation - that was a shock to us. but at that point, we were moving in 6 days and had to be out of the house we were in, end of lease there.. so there was no option to say no, other than moving me and the fam into my mom's basement lol. The ad itself listed the property as 6 acres and the only thing mentioned about the land in the back is the barn - it stated "barn not included" - that was it. Then the lease arrived and it stated the barn and all the horse land .. we certainly would never pay as much as we are for half the land ... so it sucks all around and our landlord hasn't been super great. hopefully the horse woman is awesome, but based off how cool y'all have been, I'm not even worried about her anymore. I'm looking forward to meeting her bc I think she will be much nicer and friendlier and easier to work with our family, since she has her own. Thanks again everyone!!


If you really want to move the ad might be your out if you still have a copy of it. You can say you signed the lease under duress as there was no where else for you and your family to go. I once, years ago, had a landlord do a switcharoo on me and my roommate. We handled it semi legally, the landlord was a jerk. 

Anyway, good luck to you and I hope everything works out for everyone.


----------



## horseylover1_1 (Feb 13, 2008)

I'll deviate away from the horses a minute and talk about the lease.

IF you are serious about breaking the lease, you _may_ have grounds to do so. I am a licensed Realtor in Indiana and while I do not have a license in Maine (laws vary), I know in Indiana that something like having horses on the same parcel that you are leasing should be disclosed as there are some potential health and safety concerns. Horses actually don't present near the liability that a dog would, but I'm just thinking of this in terms of the law. But in my opinion, saying that a barn/pasture is not included does not give them the right to just lease it out to whoever they want. Especially if they're using your road access, and that was not disclosed... As an example, if one were to lease a house that had a fenced backyard that wasn't included, that doesn't mean they can just rent that to a dog breeder! It affects the person's use of the property they rented - period. You would need to consult a real estate attorney to be sure, they're not overly expensive. Or even a local licensed agent may be able to help. I haven't seen your contract, so I am not sure if you have a case or not, just some things that came to my mind.

Anyway, I agree with everyone in that I don't see the horses causing you any problems. They're pretty quiet as far as neighbors go. Most are docile and typically they don't stink. Though flies would definitely be a concern. 

Keep us posted!


----------



## LoriF (Apr 3, 2015)

horseylover1_1 said:


> I'll deviate away from the horses a minute and talk about the lease.
> 
> IF you are serious about breaking the lease, you _may_ have grounds to do so. I am a licensed Realtor in Indiana and while I do not have a license in Maine (laws vary), I know in Indiana that something like having horses on the same parcel that you are leasing should be disclosed as there are some potential health and safety concerns. Horses actually don't present near the liability that a dog would, but I'm just thinking of this in terms of the law. But in my opinion, saying that a barn/pasture is not included does not give them the right to just lease it out to whoever they want. Especially if they're using your road access, and that was not disclosed... As an example, if one were to lease a house that had a fenced backyard that wasn't included, that doesn't mean they can just rent that to a dog breeder! It affects the person's use of the property they rented - period. You would need to consult a real estate attorney to be sure, they're not overly expensive. Or even a local licensed agent may be able to help. I haven't seen your contract, so I am not sure if you have a case or not, just some things that came to my mind.
> 
> ...


The ad for the property said home on six acres "barn not included" according to the OP. It would not be over the top that the OP thought that the landlord was keeping the barn for himself and they had use of the six acres. Only to find that things changed when it came time to sign the lease at which time they didn't have too many choices as they had to be out of their old place without enough time to find something different. 

I think that they would have a leg to stand on if they really didn't want to live that way. As you said, it all depends on the laws of the state. Worth looking into if they find that they are miserable with the situation.


----------



## AnitaAnne (Oct 31, 2010)

Flies are not necessarily a problem if the owner manages them well. Fly predators work fabulously to keep the place fly free. 

Someone that cares enough about their horses to carry them across the county, will most likely be taking good care of their horses health and well being also. Traveling with horses is much more involved and expensive than traveling with a small animal. 

Most horse owners I know have pretty good fly management system in place. Don't know any riders that want flies around!!


----------



## SilverMaple (Jun 24, 2017)

LoriF said:


> The ad for the property said home on six acres "barn not included" according to the OP. It would not be over the top that the OP thought that the landlord was keeping the barn for himself and they had use of the six acres. Only to find that things changed when it came time to sign the lease at which time they didn't have too many choices as they had to be out of their old place without enough time to find something different.
> 
> I think that they would have a leg to stand on if they really didn't want to live that way. As you said, it all depends on the laws of the state. Worth looking into if they find that they are miserable with the situation.


That's true, visit with a real estate attorney if you still want out of the lease. You definitely have a claim that you thought pasture area was included in your lease (with kids, especially, having a big area for them to play may have come into the decision that this was the property for you), and now you come to find out that you don't have use of that area at all. Also, sharing a driveway with another leaser should have been disclosed. Subdivided properties leased to two different parties in our area either have a very long drive that branches off to each part of the property, or has two separate drives. Your kids, again, can come into play here. You leased the property in good faith not knowing that you'd be sharing a driveway with strangers, and as a parent, that is a safety concern for you.


----------



## SteadyOn (Mar 5, 2017)

I wouldn't worry at all about the horses coming after your kids aggressively. While there are some horses who are escape artists, it's not super common -- and when they are, they're usually just after a fresh patch of grass! Truly aggressive horses are extremely rare, and even then, they usually only get aggressive when their space is invaded -- they won't come after someone in the same way a vicious dog would.

To be perfectly honest, I'd also be quite concerned, as a horse owner, having kids right next door that I didn't know.

If you stay, I strongly suggest you talk to the owner about what the horses are like, and what level of interaction (or noninteraction) they're comfortable with. Your kids may be allowed to pet them over the fence, but maybe not, for a variety of reasons. You and your kids should definitely NOT feed them anything, ever. Even something as innocent-seeming as feeding them grass cuttings from the lawn can kill a horse. They have unbelievably sensitive digestive systems and can have potentially deadly health problems from eating the wrong thing, even once.

If you ever DO have an escaped horse in or heading towards an area you need to keep them out of IMMEDIATELY, you can usually move them away by walking slowly towards them and windmilling a piece of rope in your hand, while making a kissing or clucking noise with your mouth. Don't approach from directly behind, and you should be safe to do this with most horses. In most situations, though, you can just ignore them and they'll probably just eat grass until someone can come pen them back in. I'd suggest talking to the owner, and if you really are very concerned about having to ever catch or handle the horses, she could probably show you the basics in safely doing so, or otherwise advise you of the appropriate action in the potential situation.


----------



## anndankev (Aug 9, 2010)

Does the barn have a separate electric meter? If not will you be expected to pay all of the bill?

It may be against rules/regulations/codes/whatever to rent the buildings separately.


----------



## SilverMaple (Jun 24, 2017)

anndankev said:


> Does the barn have a separate electric meter? If not will you be expected to pay all of the bill?
> 
> It may be against rules/regulations/codes/whatever to rent the buildings separately.


Same with water. Are the water meters separate? Or are you paying for the water the horse owner will be using or she for yours?


----------



## Joel Reiter (Feb 9, 2015)

Your landlord is quite ignorant. He might also be crooked and unpleasant, but he might turn out to be a nice guy who soon realizes he is trying to drive ten cows through a two-cow gate. It will be interesting to see how the story unfolds. Your neighbors will be very interested to hear the details and might be able to provide some background.

It's too bad you didn't put a little protest in writing on the lease when you signed it. Just a note that says "I don't agree to this" with your initials could be useful if it gets ugly.

You might want to start feeling sorry for the woman with the horses. It is possible that the situation was misrepresented to her as well. She might take one look at it and start over in a different place.

The privacy concern is a real one, and you might want to start thinking about what boundaries you plan to set. Depending on how far the horses are from where this new family will be living, at some point they will need to use a bathroom while visiting the horses. How will you respond to that ring of your doorbell?

What is the cell phone service like there? If there is an emergency, will they be asking to use your phone?

Possibly you and the horse owner will bond, your children will become friends, and you will rejoice that your foolish landlord brought you together. Or not. In the meantime I expect that whatever your plan B was, it's starting to look more attractive.


----------



## AtokaGhosthorse (Oct 17, 2016)

Cynical25 said:


> Personally, I would NOT want the contact number of the person leasing the horse property. Call your landlord any time there is an issue because it's entirely HIS problem to handle, not yours. If the horses get out every single morning, call the landlord every single morning. Wash your hands of it all, so you don't become inadvertently responsible for taking care of issues.


Generally speaking, I have to disagree with this. 

I WOULD want the owner's phone number and I'd be calling them first and if THEN if I couldn't get in touch or they turn out to be problem people that won't handle a legitimate problem, the landlord. I base this on sharing fences on three sides with property leased out to cattle ranchers and we ourselves have cattle. Their cows have gotten out - we call the rancher, not the land owner. Our cows have gotten out, they call us. Its the neighborly thing to do, especially if the animals are in immediate danger of getting hit by cars, etc. Most leases, at least around here, come with a clause that the lease holder is responsible for fixing fences, gates, keeping brush cut, and the property maintained, and their animals contained, not the property owner. I do admit, however, that things may be different up north.

I'd want both sets of contact information.


----------



## 4horses (Nov 26, 2012)

Here are a couple of suggestions: As for the manure, it breaks down very rapidly if run over with a lawnmower. It is not a threat to your drinking water. Manure is pretty harmless. Horses do not carry worms that are transmissible to people, even if you walk barefoot. As for mowing, do not mow the grass until that grass has been eaten down to the roots, as the grass is necessary to keep the horses from digging up the roots. Your pasture may turn to dirt lot if over grazed, and in certain areas like by the gate.

As for fencing, it sounds adequate. Some horses will stay in their pasture even if all that holds them in is a single strand of electric wire. My neighbors have a fence made of 4 single strands of wire around their 10 acres (not barb wire, just straight wire). Never had an escape. Horses are less likely to escape if they are well fed. 

My horse has gotten out when someone left the front gate open - she stood in the driveway and ate grass until the neighbor called me. Some horses are not inclined to wander even if they get out. Most horses will follow a person, if you put a rope around their neck. 

Try not to worry! My neighbors all love my horses. I do not think you will have any problems. Dogs are often more noisy and aggressive than horses.


----------



## AtokaGhosthorse (Oct 17, 2016)

4horses said:


> Here are a couple of suggestions: As for the manure, it breaks down very rapidly if run over with a lawnmower. It is not a threat to your drinking water. Manure is pretty harmless. Horses do not carry worms that are transmissible to people, even if you walk barefoot. As for mowing, do not mow the grass until that grass has been eaten down to the roots, as the grass is necessary to keep the horses from digging up the roots. Your pasture may turn to dirt lot if over grazed, and in certain areas like by the gate.
> 
> As for fencing, it sounds adequate. Some horses will stay in their pasture even if all that holds them in is a single strand of electric wire. My neighbors have a fence made of 4 single strands of wire around their 10 acres (not barb wire, just straight wire). Never had an escape. Horses are less likely to escape if they are well fed.
> 
> ...



Waaait wait. Hold on here just a darn minute...

Is the OP expected to maintain the pasture too, even though its leased out to someone else for horses?

Because.... my answer to the landlord on that topic would be: Excuse me? Uhm. No. Absolutely not.


----------



## Whinnie (Aug 9, 2015)

I am curious about the division of the 6 acres, Is the barn inside the area fenced off for the horses? Of the 6 acres, how much is fenced and how much in unfenced and considered you yard?


----------



## Dixiesmom (May 26, 2013)

Your big problem is the landlord in my opinion. Also, I didn't see it mentioned, but until the horse owner says otherwise, do not feed the horses carrots, apples etc. And don't dump your grass clippings over the fence thinking it's good for grazing. As the owner of a horse that stays fat on thinking about eating, I do not want anyone ever giving my horse treats.


----------



## walkinthewalk (Jul 23, 2008)

Respectfully to all. I see some questions being asked that the OP alluded to in his original post---



> First, my landlord said on the phone two days ago that he knows absolutely nothing about horses. Of course, me being a worried parent, I've already been doing a bunch of research and feel like I know more than he does already. Shouldn't he know something about horses if he's going to be renting a horse barn and land? Doesn't he become an equine professional in the State of Maine as soon as he signs a lease with this woman?*I have never lived in Maines, so I can't answer that. If you are in your new residence now, ask a local attorney that knows livestock laws*
> 
> I don't think he's done any research on the town's zoning codes (we have neighbors all around us too and they do not wants horses back here either - there were many problems with previous owners) so I already know that there really isn't enough land for two horses. I read that one horse should have about 2 acres of grazing area. *And that is iffy. I was raised on the premise of 5 acres per piece of grazing livestock.*
> 
> ...


You also commented the fence was down in places ---- someone has to repair that before the horse's get turned loose in their. It should be the landlord but maybe the horse lady has agreed to fix fence --- many of us women are better at mending fences than some men 

As others have said:

1. Do NOT throw grass clippings to the horse's --- clippings ferment quickly --- they can bring in severe and expensive health issues for the horse.

2. Do NOT feed the horse's treats, especially do not allow your daughters to sneak back there and play with the horse's --- that's what makes good horses become u duly and that's how kids get hurt.

3. If you aren't in a position to move. Hang in there. This woman is moving clear across the U.S. She has a lot of responsibility just to get that done. I can't imagine she is a disorganized dipstick if she is moving her own horses. She is likely aware what the property is like and probably took it out of desperation just to get where she needs to be until she can find something better.

If you can't break your lease and move, just hang in there and hope she is as smart and horse-experienced as I also hope/think she is.

Your biggest duty is to teach your children to respect that fence --- stay away from it or get the wooden spoon to the your butts. That's how I was raised and that's how I raised my son --- respect the fence boundary or else


----------



## pazfam (Aug 29, 2017)

Well this is quite annoying - I wrote a really nice long update post for y'all and then I hit enter and an error popped up telling the thread is too old and so I hit the back button to check off the too old reply button box whatever and my whole response is gone. Argh. Long story short: town planner found out our subdivision only allows the owner of the property to have one large animal - maybe two. No renter is allowed to have animals. So the woman never came - we feel bad and hope it all worked out for her. We sent this info from town planner to house owner certified mail - he is listing the whole property for rent including the barn and offering it as a horse rental now that we are moving out 
#rollseyes - some people just don't get it. 

thanks again for all your help to everyone who commented and replied - we really appreciate your time and hope everyone here has a wonderful Holidays and all the best in 2018!


----------



## Joel Reiter (Feb 9, 2015)

pazfam said:


> Well this is quite annoying - I wrote a really nice long update post for y'all and then I hit enter and an error popped up telling the thread is too old and so I hit the back button to check off the too old reply button box whatever and my whole response is gone. Argh.


Thanks for the update. I figured your landlord was in over his head.

I lose my posts almost every time I write anything for this site. I spend a lot of time on the internet and this forum is by far the most frustrating place to try and post. I've reached the point where I copy every entry before I hit preview because it's so likely that otherwise I'll be starting over. Even if I don't lose my text when I hit preview or post, I'm almost certain to lose my login.


----------



## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

Not so much "like" but certainly feeling the frustration as the same happens to me.


----------

