# Endurance and Limited Distance Ride for the new guy



## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

I have looked into these events and am gonna join, American Endurance Ride conference, and Old Dominion Endurance, I may also look at events in PA, NC MD, We'll see how it goes. I have read a bit.
I'd like to start a thread for experienced people to share info, and for new people to ask questions. For me I frequently do 15-20 mile trail rides but at a leisurely pace. 
I am looking at a wrist GPS, the Garman fourtrax 330 to keep track of my pace and distance,

Just a request, please no abbreviations , acronyms, or jargon until they are defined.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

I'll join in. I am currently conditioning The Biscuit for a Limited Distance ride of 25 miles in February at the Houston International Airport! My endurance buddy is the Barn Manager where I board my horses and we are going to try to ride at a local park 3 days a week - we rode today for 7.3 miles. 

We were trying out our new heart monitors - I have a wrist watch monitor and hers goes to her Garmin. I was thrilled to see Biscuit (QH) pulsed down as quickly as Legato (Arabian) did!!


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## SorrelHorse (Apr 9, 2009)

I'll join.

I've not done anything huge and long, but I've done my fair share of long rides and some short thing with the Northwest endurance crew.

Rebel, Anglo Arab, came out of his first endurance ride at 18 years old in the first place, SO impressed with him.

He pulsed down incredibly fast. Even faster than the horses that came in after us, and much faster than most of the younger horses and more "Endurance-y" horses. All our game plan was, was to go out there, haul butt while it was cool outside and then relax when it got hot. Turns out we put a big enough distance in between us and the pack that they couldn't catch up! Soooo proud of him. No one expected the 18 year old, unregistered, gangly thing to do so well. He came out with not a drop of sweat on his body. I guess all the hard training for the shows transferred into some kinda cardio, huh?


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

I'm looking at pads, now, I have a fleece one that is ok, but it stinks bad if I dont wash it, and takes days to dry if I do., My problem is an odd saddle, I ride an austrailian saddle but it is long, many of the socalled Aussi pads are only 27-28 inches long and my saddle is 29" long.
Right now I have the fleece one, a thinner air grip one, and a quilted english style (pretty thin) that fits. Might be able to look at the toklaks, made for tucker plantations, as that brand made of aussies, actually dont fit my aussie.


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## kait18 (Oct 11, 2011)

can i join in even if i didn't do one yet  my first ride is oct 29... i am so excited. it was supposed to be a 15 mile turns out its a 24 miles lol big difference me and my boy will take our time with this event as to not over ride him 

as for gear i am just using my normal western tack (saddle- less than 20lbs, breast collar, reins that are not split but are long enough when walking he can kinda mosey if i want him to). i am thinking about investing in a felt pad as i hear they take the sweat from the horse and makes it a bit more comfortable but for this ride i will stick with my vented pad that he loves surprisingly (very picky horse ). 

i plan on riding in a curb bit in the beginning (since that is what he listens the best in) and i wont to have little room for horror if that shows up that day. but later in the ride i am switching to a hackamore so he can have better access to food and water that way. 

(joe you and some other people gave me some great advice earlier on my post you should switch over or add it here like things to pack)


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

kait 18, I ddint wanna hijack your thread and get off you original questions, I am still looking for the perfect pad. I would prefer a wool felt, but not having luck finding one that fits as I'dlike to not have saddle bags rubbign directly on the horse, Bags also dont attach to a Aussi saddel to well without flopping all over the place. The fleece on I have sems to want to walk out the back, but I am afraid the aire grip one will grip to much and rub. I bought a Garmin wrist GPS model 301 ? or 3 something, I am doing a 22 mile ride saturday with a lunch break, I will check the Gen's pulse at lunch also see what it says. 
I am looking at a 25 mile LD with a max time of 6 hours, Seems pretty doable but I will find out this weekend with actual instead of hearsay mileage.


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## Endurance Chica (Oct 1, 2010)

Ill join in.
I started doing endurance when I was 8 on a welsh quarter horse cross pony. We competed in 50 miles right up there always in top ten, but 50 mile races was his max. Still pretty impressive for a 14 somethin pony! I decided I wanted to move up in distance and be more competitive so I got my big white arab Miles, appropriate name eh?  Miles and I spent several years almost exclusively doing endurance. I basically grew up in the sport and absolutely loved it. Some of the funnest times I will remember.
This is just a few of my observations through competing in the sport...
AERC (american endurance ride conference) is a great organization, but I would only really suggest it if you are competetive in endurance. Otherwise I found the local groups to be better, example PNER (pacific northwest endurance rides) in my location.
For endurance I found Orthoflex saddles to work the best with my horse. The pads slip over the saddles flexable panels and you can add shims in for the horses comfort. Even after long 100 milers we never had saddle problems.
Heart monitors and GPSs are a great way to get started. I started using them but with experience comes the ability to better gauge your horse, pace and thier recovery.
....Sorry if I'm babbling. Was just excited to come across an endurance thread and more people interested in the sport


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Thanks for the info Chica!! My riding buddy and I are going up to Ebenezer Park Wednesday to train. They used to run endurance rides up there years ago and there are miles of trails. Lots of up and down on the hills, sand, creeks, downed trees, etc. Way too much fun up there. We are going to ride for approximately 6 hours and see how many miles we can go in 6 hours. My backside MAY fall off and I may be in a coma on the way home but we are going to give it a go!!!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

The 22 miler turned out to only be 17, I did it in 4 and some changehours, but horse wasnt even sweating coming in. He was tired and ready fpr camp though.
The 4 mph average was including a lunch break, and I also had to get off and walk the second mile or so as Bo was wound up like a top and and wanted to run and i felt like i was out of control. Plus I was a little gunshy still healing broke ribs from our last ride. But once I got back on he was perfect. We'll see next time, gonna pick it up a bit from the get go supposedly get up around a 7mph average.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Broken Ribs? Gaaaaaa!!!! Glad you are better and getting off is sometimes the smart thing to do. 

I got off a few weeks ago and took some heat for it...I said "I was still walking that afternoon...and that is what is important to me...that I am still walking!!!!" Biscuit got a little excited and reared up a bit after a parade. Loads of concrete, tons of people...nope...I got off...and walked. Better safe than sorry


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

yep I aint to proud, and I was on a group ride with several hundred people, Of course every single one of them had to come by and give me their expert opinion.


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## phantomhorse13 (Feb 18, 2011)

This is my 5th season riding endurance and I am loving every minute of it. I am a member of both AERC and the OD. 

Just last weekend was the final leg of the OD Triple Crown at Fort Valley, VA. While my mare Dreams is done for the season due to lyme disease, I was able to ride a friend's gelding in his very first LD there! It was rather bittersweet though, as I had really been hoping to get our Triple Crown this season. Maybe next year.

There is a ride up here in jersey in the middle of November, if you are interested in a bit of a road trip to check things out and maybe volunteer. I have a couple maybes in terms of horses to ride, but I will be there to crew and volunteer if nothing else.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

*Training ride - learned so much!*

Phantom, sorry your horse is laid up right now and hope she is better soon.

I went on a training ride with my endurance buddy yesterday. OMG we had a blast and laughed like fools a few times. We hauled 100 miles to a park that used to have endurance rides years ago. Miles and miles of trails in all kinds of terrains. 

Lee Ann had been to an endurance clinic with Darolyn Butler and she had all kinds of hints and tips. One was wearing a fanny pack with water bottles attached in case one becomes separated from their horse they will have water on them. 

Ok...I trot myself to Academy and purchase a deluxe fanny pack and I can tell you I am at this moment in my life THE LAST person on earth who should frame their backside with a fanny pack!! :shock::shock::shock::shock: 

My fairly new Justin Gypsy's toe came loose so I replaced them with Ariat riding shoes and now I need half chaps. Anywhoo...Tractor Supply switch the Gypsy's for the Ariat's and I bought some  pink Anti-Monkey Butt powder :lol::lol::lol:, zinc oxide (otherwise known as diaper rash ointment!), another water bottle with a koozie thingy on it.

Ok...we are ready to ride. We tack up - heart monitors in place, watch monitor was working, GIANT fanny pack like a rocket pack on, socks rolled up over my pants - folks, I was a fox! I think Biscuit looked away so I wouldn't see him roll his eyes at me. Ok...my two water bottles of frozen water were HEAVY. I discard one water bottle, zinc oxide, a few Fiber One bars to lighten the load and off we go. Ok...the pack is throwing me off MAJORLY :evil:. A few times the bottle went under my backside. It was hot...it itched...it was unbalancing me. Biscuit was thinking "darn...she needs to shut the heck up and just ride" :wink: 

After 3 miles or so I took off the fanny pack and strapped it to the cantle of the saddle. I couldn't stand it another minute!

The ride was fantastic and Biscuit is in pretty darn good shape. He was trotting fast and had a heart rate at its highest of 125 and he pulsed down nearly immediately each time. He pulsed down as fast as his Arabian buddy, Legato. We only rode 13 miles but we got to use our Garmin's to find our way back to a waypoint and navigate by directions on the Garmin to "go southeast"!!! Also found out that Biscuit's has a wonderful sense of direction and once went the wrong way and he stopped himself, looked around and then turned around! I had to laugh at him. His name is now Biscuit Navigator Garmin....I think that is a great name for an endurance horse!

We had a great time and I am pretty darn sure we are ready for a 25 miler and hopefully sometime next year a 50 miler. At any rate we are having a blast training for it!


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## Kiviknon (Jul 26, 2010)

Now, if you're really feeling hardcore, there is always this: NACMO - National Association of Competitive Mounted Orienteering


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## horsemadgirl (Aug 23, 2011)

I don't know what they are, are they good?


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Kiviknon, I have read a little bit about their organization and would TOTALLY love that. I got my Garmin for Christmas last year and have had a blast mapping trails with it. I do not know ANYONE using one so I have had to learn to use it on my own and looking at the few Youtube videos I could fine. The local university had advertised a class and I called to sign up and it was cancelled. : ( I have called Garmin and they are super nice but it is not the same as someone sitting down with you and explaining/teaching you to do everything it can do!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

I get the heebee jeebee's thinking about crossing the potomac, But I have heard the fort royal terrain is extremely rough. I will be back at work the second through the 17th. I'll look at calender for Jersy ride. Wed I rode and am working at getting my pace up, ended up with a 4.6 mph over 12.2 miles. Bo had serios case of, "I don wanna go" for the first mile and the first mile after about a 20 minute break. He kept doing the turn around, or walk slower and slower and zig zag side to side, was really aggravating. I am gonna target an LD somewhere in VA, NC, PA or NJ and work towards that.


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## Kiviknon (Jul 26, 2010)

QOS said:


> Kiviknon, I have read a little bit about their organization and would TOTALLY love that. I got my Garmin for Christmas last year and have had a blast mapping trails with it. I do not know ANYONE using one so I have had to learn to use it on my own and looking at the few Youtube videos I could fine. The local university had advertised a class and I called to sign up and it was cancelled. : ( I have called Garmin and they are super nice but it is not the same as someone sitting down with you and explaining/teaching you to do everything it can do!


I would start with a local orienteering club. It's dismounted but still lots of fun navigating with a map and compass. I learned for the military, and I go with other former military guys and we do this at night. Sometimes without maps and a compass. Just navigate by the stars. It's a very cool feeling to find your way around like that.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

wow wee that would be totally cool! My grandfather was a seaman and he navigated by minutes and degrees. I have his "little book" that he had for years with several phone numbers for Ridley Scott who became his wife/my grandmother! Grandpa also had directions out to his favorite fishing spot in the Gulf of Mexico by degrees and minutes from some jetty. LOL I would end up in Cuba if I tried that! I would love to know more and I will see if there is a club around here. I have asked at Gander Mountain and Academy if there were any classes on GPS/Compass stuff with no luck.


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## phantomhorse13 (Feb 18, 2011)

Joe4d said:


> Wed I rode and am working at getting my pace up, ended up with a 4.6 mph over 12.2 miles.


that isn't too far off the pace i normally train at, which is about 6 mph. sounds like you are def on the right track to be able to comfortably do an LD ride.

if you decide to come up to jersey, let me know. looks like i will be crewing on saturday and riding in the LD on sunday.


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## phantomhorse13 (Feb 18, 2011)

QOS said:


> Ok...the pack is throwing me off MAJORLY :evil:. A few times the bottle went under my backside. It was hot...it itched...it was unbalancing me.


Have to say, I was laughing so hard at this, the cat abandoned my lap! :lol:

I cannot stand to ride with any sort of pack on.. how people manage to ride distances with fanny packs or camelbacks on is beyond me. The couple times I have tried sounded exactly like your experiences.

So jealous you are out there riding though!


Dreams has another 4 weeks totally off, then I will put her back into light riding for a month and see how it goes. She's certainly looking much better, so hopefully one round of doxy is all it will take. I am lucky to have friends' horses I can ride, but it's not the same at all.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Hope Dreams is better soon so your team can get going!

I don't think the fanny pack is going to work for me....I will just have to make sure I never come off of my horse or if I do, reins stay in my hands!!! :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

I rode for right at 8 miles today with my cousin, my hubby and another friend. We rode through the woods and down the bayou. We crossed a bridge and came back up the other side of the bayou which we haven't done in awhile. I think I finally got the feel for posting correctly at a fast trot!!! We did a little cantering but mostly Biscuit did some pretty fast trotting and walking. Our moving average was 4.1 mpg. 

I am having a blast and hope we can go for a ride tomorrow.


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

Looking at calender I was planning my first event around Sandhill state forest in South Carolina 26 Nov, only 5.5 hours away and fairly easy terrain. Usually SC weather is pretty mild. Kinda miffed at the lack of info though. The flier with directions seem to be written for people that already know where it is. With local slang for the roads and camp areas instead of an actual address, Also the email address on the flier is no good. Not giving me a good feeling about the level of organization. Did another 7 miles today but at a slow 3.2 walk the hole way. Beauregard didnt break a sweat. Will run him hard tuesday. Then he'll get 2 weeks off while I go to work.


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

The organizers contacted me, I have good addresses now and all is well with the world, This will be mine and General Beauregard's inaugural event.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Good deal! Can't wait to hear all of the details!


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## phantomhorse13 (Feb 18, 2011)

Joe4d said:


> The organizers contacted me, I have good addresses now and all is well with the world, This will be mine and General Beauregard's inaugural event.



JD's is a really fun ride from what I have heard (never made it there myself yet, as it's a bit of a haul for me). Good, though sandy, trails and lots of good food and people. I can't wait to hear your ride report!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

got a 8.5 mile ride in this morning with a 5.8 mph average. Bo's learning it is ok to go sometimes. Was hitting 16 mph with him on some of the clearer trails.

The pic is us on a fun ride last month, he has beafed up some and I am wearing helmet now.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Joe - y'all look great!!! Bo is a pretty boy!!! I had 2 Aussie saddles and they are terrific. I loved them!!! 

My riding buddy and I are going out tomorrow to ride in the local park. Yesterday and today we worked on feet - we are into barefoot trimming and I almost have Biscuit's feet like I want them to be. I have owned him one year today and his feet were not too great when I got them. We had a barefoot clinic this past February with Darolyn Butler who is the superwoman of endurance riding! It is hard work but it is rewarding. 

I am looking for someone to ride with me Thursday and then I am going this weekend too...can't get enough of it!


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## Painted Horse (Dec 29, 2006)

Joe, I find most horses that are being rode several times a week can do a limited. Usually the problems is not the soft tissue, but getting the hard tissue conditioned. The soft tissue develops pretty quickly. ( muscle, lung heart) The hard tissue is what takes a little longer. ( Bones, tendons, ligiments) 

The repeated pounding of long slow miles builds stronger bones, tendons and ligiments. The hard tissue is also the type of injuries that take longer to heal when and if they get damaged. 

I showed up for my first endurance race, expecting to compete in the limited. The folks I knew twisted my arm and convinced me to just ride along on the 50 miler. Which I did. I quickly learned my horse wasn't in shape to stay with the leaders who finished that 50 in 5 hours. But we finished with a respectable 7.5 hours for our 1st race.

The biggest challenge I had was getting my horse to slow down and not worry about the crowd. He could see all the other horses moving out at strong trots and wanted to stay with the group. I had let the main mob leave the starting area before I left. Unfortunately they all got lost and I stayed on the trail. So a few miles into the ride the leaders came flying by trying to make up time for getting lost and sucked my horse into trying to stay with them.

Determine the speed you will travel and hold your horse to that gait. Don't get influenced by the speed that others may run the course at a faster clip. And I guarantee that the first few competitions you attend, that will be your biggest challenge.

I understand that is some areas, The endurance races are set up as laps around a set course. Here in my area, we have enough space that we rarely back track or travel the same trail more than once in any given race. So if you let the leaders go ahead, most of the time, you will never see them until you arrive back at camp. But if you ride a looping course where they might occassionally pass you, it creates a different challenge for keeping your horse at the set gait.

As far as packs, I pack everything into cantle or pomel bags. I don't plan on getting seperated from my horse. And hopefully if I came off, Somebody would catch and return my horse. With P&R spaced along a ride. You can cache supplies with the P&R crews to replenish your cantle bags. You don't need to take everything with you the entire length of the ride.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Thanks for the info Painted Horse. I believe Biscuit and Legato can easily do a 25 mile ride right now. They are rode frequently and we have been doing the LSD type training. The 13 miles we did the other day didn't phase either one of them. LOL Last March 8th we went to McKinney Roughs in central Texas - lots of hills/rocks and is a terrific training ground. I rode two rides that day on Biscuit - for a total of about 17 miles split almost evenly with about a 2.5 hour rest in between. Last ride lots of extended trotting at 11.5 mph for Biscuit. We got back to the place we were staying and Biscuit laid out flat in his pen! LOL He was tired!!! Now...he just goes and goes...but he was still putting on weight back then and was what my barn manager calls a "semi-rescue". He has gained between 200 to 300 lbs since I bought him a year ago!!!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

My normal ride, is 10 miles been doing that couple times a week since late summer, What I am finding since buying a watch is how much people exaggerate distance. Last night at my riding club meeting when I I said I was gonna do the 25 mile LD and the rules say you have to come in under six hours, I was told, "Oh thats easy" you should n have any problem we ride like that all the time,,, Yeh bull****. 
You have to stay a bit over 4 mph the whole time and that includes rest stops, water breaks, horse wont go , etc. 
The 12 mile ride we usually do , is actually only 8.5 miles and I was moving pretty good to come in with a 5.8 mph average. 
The 22 mile ride in Meherrin is actually only 16, So I imagine most of the other rides people do are way off also, giving people a false since of how far how fast. As noone ever actually measures it. 
I'm not an expert by no means but I know Im not just gonna putz along drinking watermelon shooters and do a 25 mile ride in 6 hours. 
My horse is getting a 2 week break while I work then probably rode a few times in the 8-12 mile range working at a 6 mph then 6 days off with maybe a bit of gaiting in the round pen before SC ride. But no wont be doing the 50, this will be our first one, He's only 9 yo and has years ahead of him.


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## Gidget (Jan 19, 2010)

Hey Joe!

I just wanted to say that endurance looks so much fun. I have my arab/welsh who I will be training once she is old enough.She is just a yearling. What kind of horse do you have? This is just me but if you get into long distance riding..like 50 miles I would recommend a treeless saddle. You can get them used and they are great for horses as it doesn't make them sore...BUT you need a special saddle pad with shims and the shims come in different thickness depending on the weight of the rider..the more the person weighs the thicker the shim. If you are interested I can EASILY find you one. Look up Barefoot treeless saddles. I have one and my horse is a super sensitive one >.< and this is by far her favorite saddle.


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

I am a big guy 6" 225 lbs. Not so good for a treeless saddle. Even the treeless saddle people agree. 
I am riding a TN walker, Will always stay with a gaited horse. Love em. No more trotting for Joe,, 
I ride Aussi, I think for my purposes they work very well. Secure on the trail but comfortable. About half the weight of most western saddles. My horse is kinda short backed and was hurt with western QH saddles. When I bought him used to spook and roll his eyes and fuss if you got near him with a saddle. When I got him and started using Australian saddle on him he seemed to change overnight.


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## Painted Horse (Dec 29, 2006)

I started and sponsored/managed for 6 years the Strawberry ride in Utah. The first year I laid out a 50 mile trail. The earliest rider came in at 7.5 hours and I had many that barely made it in before the 12 hour max.

The Vet came to me and asked how long the ride was. I told him I had laid out a 50 mile long trail ( my understanding) He said this terrain is way to tough to do a 50 in. His advice to me was to shorten the course to 40 miles and tell everybody it was 50 miles. BTW we had 16,000 foot of verticle elvation change in that 50 mile distance. So it was a serious work out for even the best of horses.




























If you've been riding 10-12 rides twice a week at 6 mph speeds your horse will do the limited just fine. Just keep her calm and stick with the speeds that you normally ride at. Don't try to keep up with the crowds and don't let you horse get excited by seeing other horses leaving her behind.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

I was supposed to go riding today but my ride buddy was not well. Hopefully going tomorrow. Biscuit had a lesson today all the same....He was rode for about a hour and 20 minutes by a trainer working on all kinds of skills.


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

hats off for sponsoring the ride, but I dont think lying is ever a good policy. Lots of people (like me) have GPS watches and will dime you out in a online review, then you dont look to good. Better to just tell the truth,, "This is a hard ride with 16000 feet elevation so will only be 40 miles" I think horse people that do these events are knowledgeable enough to plan. I havent timed myself on any 6mph courses yet. Just now started using a GPS. last ride was 5.8 over 8.5 miles and Bo was pretty dang sweaty coming in. But was great fun. I ride on Petersburg Battlefield and one area still has confederate cannons emplaced where there was a big union cavalry charge that got mowed down. When you charge up the same hill and see where the cannons are you'll know why. SO cool riding through there, many of the trench lines and eart forts are still visible.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Wow Joe that must have been really neat riding there!!! I am a civil war buff so I would have like to ride there! 

Using the Garmin is a blast and I am learning new things on it all the time. I can track top speed and moving time, etc which is helpful. I do agree though, I'd rather know how far a ride really is and the max elevation. Elevation is something we don't have too much of here in southeast Texas. We have to haul around 100 miles to get into some hills!


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## Hrosec (Aug 9, 2011)

Hi! We are just getting into endurance ridding and was wondering what you use to track your speed and distance?


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

I am using a Garmin eTrex Venture HC - it was $159 at Target.


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

I am using a garmen foretrex 301 wrist personal navigator GPS, still learning it. Does anyone know how to stop the odometer ? When I finish my ride the timer keeps goind. I cant figure out how to stop / pause it and then resume. The directions are really bad and dont include anything.


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## phantomhorse13 (Feb 18, 2011)

Joe4d said:


> last ride was 5.8 over 8.5 miles and Bo was pretty dang sweaty coming in. But was great fun.


Nothing wrong with your horse being sweaty! This picture was taken about 4 miles into a 50 miler held in the mountains of West Virginia, where the heat index was already in the 90s when we started in the morning:










That picture also shows the saddlebags I always ride with.. and they are most def on the horse, not on me!


And if your aussie saddle works for your horse and for you, then no reason you can't do distance in it. This picture was from the LD a couple weeks back where I got a surprise horse to ride at the last minute. I spent a lovely 30 miles enjoying how comfy the aussie saddle was!











I ride with a Garmin Forerunner 301. I also use a separate VMax heartrate monitor setup.


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## LetAGrlShowU (Mar 25, 2009)

Joe4d said:


> got a 8.5 mile ride in this morning with a 5.8 mph average. Bo's learning it is ok to go sometimes. Was hitting 16 mph with him on some of the clearer trails.
> 
> The pic is us on a fun ride last month, he has beafed up some and I am wearing helmet now.


Ha Joe! Whne I saw this pic, I did a double take. You added me to the wanted/sales trail riding group a few weeks ago on FB. So now that we're "friends" i saw this photo a few days ago! What a small world. You guys look like you had a great time!


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

So, Phantom, you have two watches? Do you wear the heart monitor watch on the same wrist or the other? I think I would like the Garmin Forerunner so I could just see quickly instead of digging out my eTrex...Of course the screen is bigger though...lol and I need glasses to see up close!!!

Joe, the instructions are clear as MUD. I just fiddled with mine and I added a field for stopped. Don't know if that is going to do what I want...think I will Garmin a call. They are super nice....just need better instructions.


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## phantomhorse13 (Feb 18, 2011)

QOS said:


> So, Phantom, you have two watches? Do you wear the heart monitor watch on the same wrist or the other?


If you look closely at the pics of me on Dreams above, you can see that I have one on each wrist--the heartrate monitor watch is on my right wrist (you can see the shine of the screen above my glove) and the garmin is on my left (the big lump).


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Ok...you are my kinda girl....your totally tricked out. I don't know that I want that kind of Garmin though...I do like the hand held one because the screen is bigger and I can't see some of the little fields without my reading glasses!!!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

QOS said:


> So, Phantom, you have two watches? Do you wear the heart monitor watch on the same wrist or the other? I think I would like the Garmin Forerunner so I could just see quickly instead of digging out my eTrex...Of course the screen is bigger though...lol and I need glasses to see up close!!!
> 
> Joe, the instructions are clear as MUD. I just fiddled with mine and I added a field for stopped. Don't know if that is going to do what I want...think I will Garmin a call. They are super nice....just need better instructions.


Well keep me posted if you figure it out. Turning the unit off seems to pause it and when you turn it back on it is in same spot but I dont know if it starts again. I actually saw a screen and two timers on it, One said stop time and was moving and the other said moving time and that timer was stopped, No idea how I did it and the next time I went to that screen the moving time was moving again and the stop time stopped. Maybe it does it automatically when you stop moving, Now that would be cool, but kinda suck if your lunch break is part of your time,,,,, Nope no clue need to find a garmin guru.


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## livestoride (Mar 30, 2011)

Great thread! I am by no means an expert - I just finished my 2nd 25 mile this past weekend. There are a TON of resources out there including good books, websites and blogs all about endurance. It really is a sport of knowledge and getting into the weeds for the health of the horse is really important. www.longridergear.com is a good resource for tack. www.endurance.net is another good resource. 

As far as AERC membership goes - any sanctioned event will charge you around $15 extra if you are not a current member. It takes roughly 5 races a year to break even, so if you don't care about earning milage patches or getting the newsletter and are not going to do 5 or more next season, don't sign up. Membership is due by Dec 15 with a late enntry by mid feb for the 2012 season.

One thing I have learned from months of reading and talking with people is that one of the worst things you can do is over ride your horse. From what I have found most people do very little conditioning once the horse gets in initial shape. Most horses will maintain very well. I ride 3 -4 days a week (more often 3) with 2 of those being hour long arena sessions and the other being a trail ride. The 4th day I take her on the trails on foot and hand jog her. Endurance comes across as being an "easy" sport to those not involved because it is trail riding, but it is just as hard on the horses legs and joints as the other sports and you want to protect them as much as possible from over strain.

One thing I did learn at my 1st event that I quickly fixed before my 2nd one was the jog out. My mare leads just fine and trotted out at the vet in without a problem, but come the halfway point when she was tired and didn't want to she dragged her back feet and we almost got pulled for her being so stubborn. I was told it happens a lot to horses not properly taught for the trot out. Now she trots fully and strong whenever I tell her to and I was highly complimented at the 2nd event by a different vet. He said he gets very annoyed when a horse wont trot out properly since they have 250 feet to judge whether the horse is fit to continue or not.

I hope you and your horse enjoy your rides as much I did mine. Ride your own race regardless of where you come in the pack. As long as you complete, you win.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Livestoride - I recently bought and am reading Go The Distance. Darolyn Butler did tell us to not over ride/over train the horses and I a believe in that! 

I just came in from riding - my heart monitor worked kind of patchy today - I think I had one of the pads too high up on the girth and it wasn't getting the reading consistently. We rode just under 8 miles - probably 7.8 miles. Most of it was at a jog...average speed was 4.5 mph and just before the ride was over the monitor started working...we were at a heart rate of 103 bpm and that was after jogging for probably 7 miles. We stopped once to maneuver around a recently downed rotten tree! I moved pieces out of the way so Biscuit could go through it.

He did a terrific job today with a mare right on his butt - that never even phased him. 

Joe, I am working on learning this nutty Garmin and it is fun but I sure wish I had someone to just sit down with me and say This is how you do it!!!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

can you give me details of what "Trot out" is. Trying to really keep jargon at a minimum.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Trot out is in front of the vets to determine soundness to start or continue and at the end of the run. 

Horse should trot easily and freely with no hesitation or stiffness or resistance. I will have to start working with Biscuit on this because I can't say that he will trot out without hesitation and right now with my cranky knee (I just had knee surgery) I am not in the best shape to run!!! LOL I am going to get the young lady that is training Biscuit to help me out with that!!!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

I understand what it is used for but what is it ? exactly ? what exactly do I do ? remember I havent been to one of these events. Am I in the saddle ? is the horse being lunged on a lead line ? I heard mention of 250 feet. Can you get specific ?


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Horse is on lead line or reins. I haven't been to one yet (going in February). It is to determine if the horse is sound to go on. No limping, stiffness, heart rate to "normal" within 30 minutes. Gut sounds, eating, drinking, good attitude. No swelling or puffiness in limbs. The trot out is to show your horse off to its best advantage to the vet. Get the book "Go The Distance" by Nancy S. Loving, DVM It is supposed to be the bomb dot com of Endurance information. I am reading it now and learning as I go.


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## livestoride (Mar 30, 2011)

Joe and QOS - When you first get to camp you will have to present your horse in halter and lead to the vet. They check heart rate and respirations, mucous membranes, jugular refill, anal tone, muscle tone (all these fall under the broad category of metabolics) gut sounds, palpation of withers and back for pain, and looks for any sores or scratches. They also ask you to trot your horse in a straight line away from them to a certain point and then turn around and come back. They look for any head bobbing, stiffness, lack of weight etc that would require further investigation. If all is well they give you your ride card for the ride which you fold and carry with you.

At the hold (each length is different and it should be detailed at the ride meeting the night before; one was 40 minutes, the other was 50 minutes) you repeat these same things over again AFTER your horse has pulsed to the required limit (usually 64 bpm at the half, but can differ according the to event). After you pass you get your card back with your leave time on it and you now have that time to feed and water your horse, electrolyte your horse and if it is chilly get a blanket on your horse as well as do the same for yourself. Some rides require tack to be off during this process others do not. I think it is best to at least remove the bridle so your horse can eat/drink better.

All this is once again repeated at the end again AFTER your horse pulses down (usually to 60 bpm) and then you are done 

This is why it is important that your horse knows that when you stand beside them at the halt and say "ready, trot, GO!" (or some version that works better for you) that they immediately pick up a nice forward trot and not be a butt like my mare was and drag herself around becasue then they see lamness that isn't there. Fortunately they were nice and let me recheck her at the end of the hold and she trotted just fine and we have worked very hard to fix this so it didn't happen at all the second time. You should have plenty of time to work on this. I suggest asking your horse to trot out after you take the tack off after each ride no matter how short the ride was just so they get in the habit of knowing that you still mean business even when the ride is over. 

Have fun!!!


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Thanks Livestoride. I am going to have to work on that - cranky knee or not - because I know that Biscuit will drag his butt on this!!! Hoping my knee is not cranky in February!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

I'll have a week or so to work on that. course he doesnt trot but we will manage. He does have some bumps on his back right in front of his hips that have been there for years supposedly from a to long square skirt saddle. Never shown any tenderness and I ride with a short saddle. Hopefully that wont be an issue. Guess I ma just getting nervous thinking about things that can go wrong. Would suck to get all the way down there and get an overly cautious vet. Wonder if I should get a letter from my vet.


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## Painted Horse (Dec 29, 2006)

That is the reason the vets look at your horse BEFORE the ride, so they can establish a base line for your horse before he enters the race. If the baselines changes during the race. Then the vet can make decision about those changes from the baseline.

For example he sees how your TWH trots ( gaits) as a well rested horse. 4 hours later he looks at your horse and see that he favors a leg. The vet can now look closer for symptoms of lamness. Another example. Before the ride the vet looks at your horses capillar refill and it's 2 seconds. During the ride the horse shows 4 second refill. The vet may decide the horse is getting dehydrated and ask you to pull or wait for longer hold to rest your horse more.

Your horse can't talk to you. So the vet is there to interpret the horses symptoms for you. To help make sure that you don't hurt your horse. They assume you are caring for your horse. But they know riders get distracted with blister on their own legs, maybe they got kicked by some body else horse and the rider is looking after his own leg and doesn't notice his horse had a slight limp.


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## livestoride (Mar 30, 2011)

Don't worry Joe! It will be fine. Painted horse hit it on the head - they look for changes - new sores, bumps or tenderness. If those bumps are not an issue now, then don't worry.

Once you get there, just let people know you have never done it before and you will be amazed at how helpful they will be. The volunteers are there to help you so don't be shy! I walked around my first one with my eyes as big as dinner plates and kept getting funneled to where I needed to go. You catch on quick and will have a ton of fun


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

Ok ride log time, I got my horse in june, I work on a tug boat, so 2 weeks on 2 weeks off. During my off weeks he got rode two to three times a weeks. He gained alot of weight (his ribs were showing out of shape when I got him, he looks great now and muscleing up)
Not counting my usual petersburg ride, Since mid september, we did a 15, 16, a 17, a 12.2, an 8.5 mile rilde, I have also done several un measured 2 to three hour trail rides at five forks battlefield and Petersburg.
Now my horse is being boarded while I am on boat till the 16th. 
When I get back on the 16th my plan is to ride him hard the 17th or 18th, then one day on the weekend, then ,maybe just some round pen and getting the trot out and back worked on.
My question is should I pay to have him exercised an hour or so a day while I am gone or just let him be till the 16th ? Is it gonna make much of a difference ?


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## phantomhorse13 (Feb 18, 2011)

Joe4d said:


> My question is should I pay to have him exercised an hour or so a day while I am gone or just let him be till the 16th ? Is it gonna make much of a difference ?



Does he live turned out in some kind of pasture? If so, I would leave him be. If he's confined mostly to a stall or small pen, I think getting him out would be helpful.


Also, if you are free next weekend, the Mustang ride is happening in Chatsworth, New Jersey. It would be really helpful for you to come up and see what goes on so you know exactly what to expect (and practice) before your own ride at the end of the month!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

not free till the 16th, Hes in about a 2 acre pasture right now, The BO says he is busy chasing deer.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Wish I could go see one before I am planning on participating. Perhaps I can go on New Year's Day - I have a wedding cake for New Years Eve so I can't go participate myself. I need to get to where I can trot Biscuit for 10 miles without stopping - we did 7 Friday but need to do a little more! I am not worried really about Biscuit - I am worried more about me!!! LOL I think my butt may fall off. I need to toughen up my backside!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

or get a Walker and quit all that trotting nonsense.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

LOL I don't think so Joe...I am getting pretty attached to The Biscuit. He is a doll!!! I wouldn't mind a gaited horse - I'd love a Rocky Mountain but I can only afford so much horse!!


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## hisangelonly (Oct 29, 2011)

i have an arabian gelding and a mustang cross gelding. my arabian is 15 hands and my mustang is 14.1 hands. my friend taylor always rides with me. she has a paint mare about 15.1 hands. we ride to different towns starting from home. we usually cover about 20 + miles a day. It takes so long because we sight see, stop at convenience stores, let people pet the horses, let the horses graze, and play around in any rivers or creeks we come across. We basically stay on the side of the highway and on dirt roads. Kinda where i live. the traffic doesnt bother any of the horses one bit. i usually alternate between my horses, although its usually my arab i take . He loves it and never gets tired. i have a black forest treeless endurance saddle and i LOVE it. it is so comfy! i love the look on peoples faces when we ride up to convenience stores! theyre like "where did you come from?" and we tell them about 10 miles back. lol. it is a lot of fun.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

well that sounds fun!!! 

I about to start packing up for our trip to McKinney Roughs in central Texas. We are leaving at 7:00 tomorrow. McKinney Roughs is terrific and I can't wait to get there. We are riding tomorrow afternoon, Friday and Saturday. We will haul home Sunday morning. I am hoping to get in at least 20 miles on Friday and Saturday. Maybe I will, maybe I won't but it is going to be fun trying!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

Well evewrything is loaded but me and the horse, heading out in the AM. I found some cool Reebox red and black shirt and windbreaker to match my new red biothane tack, I might come in dead last but I'll look really cool and we all know that's the most important part.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

I am excited for you Joe!!!! I'll be cheering you on so let us know exactly how it comes out tomorrow. I am JEALOUS of your new tack and it is RED!!! Woot!!!

I enjoyed my McKinney Roughs ride but didn't get to ride near as much as I would have liked...rough going in places...lots of ups and downs and lots of rocks. 

Monday I went on a training ride and Biscuit is doing great!!! We are going to kick it up a notch for our training in December and January before our ride in February. 

Again, good luck and let us know how it goes!!!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

didnt get any rides in this week hard rains, had an easy ride sunday, dotn think either of us are really ready, but I also know I'll just sit around the house all weekend and do nothing if I dont go.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

y'all will do just fine. Take it slow and have a good time.


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## Painted Horse (Dec 29, 2006)

The old saying is: " To finish is to win"
Go and have fun. Don't worry about where you place. Learn from the experience. If you have't to pull 30 miles into the 50, So be it. You enjoyed 30 miles. And you will have learned something.

Just don't worry about keeping up. Ride at YOUR pace. 50 miles is a long way for your horse to be "Hopped up" get him to relax and travel at a speed you do on a normal ride.


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## livestoride (Mar 30, 2011)

Listen to Painte Horse. Just relax and have fun. It is all about finishing sane and sound with a positive experience for the next one. Remember to put your horse first. You will have a blast adn be addicted after it! Please let us know how it went.

(Red and black are awesome colors - I might be biased though becasue my one set is that  I have a back up for when I do two day rides that is bright blue and black.)


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

Can't wait to hear about Joe's ride!!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

we did really great. learned alot about how to do it better next time. My initial impression of this particular ride and organizer turned out to be correct. We'll just it wasnt the most organized event. The trails themselves were well marked and decent terrain. Water point wast marked so unless you knew where it was youd never find it so end up doing about 12 miles before first water point. Going back to boat tomorrow so will post full report. We cam in healthy at 4:23 for the 25 mile LD ride.


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## livestoride (Mar 30, 2011)

Congrats!!! Can't wait for the full report!


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

wow Joe, that is terrific!!! Can't wait to hear the full report but I think 4:23 is a terrific time!!!


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

I attended the Patrick SC AERC ride on 26 Nov 2011.
The riding trail itself was well marked and I liked the terrain and had a great time, Met some cool people. I have rewritten this multiple times and just cant come up with a way of giving a review with out being extremely negative about the organizer. I guess I am glad theyu put it on as I know it does take a bit of work but there were some serious issues that I will be happy to describe in a private massage but not in a public forum.
The organizers were anything but. Seriously they have been doing this for years and are so bad it's a running joke among the other participants. 
a couple inexcusable issues,
All info was presented in a way that only someone that already knew about the area and event would understand.
No treatment vet on call or even identified a head of time.
No water on the first 12.5 mile loop. Actually there was but only if you already knew the area and where it was. So might as well have been none. This was the only time I really lost my cool, I did notice they went back and put a sign up on the second lap. Evidently I struck a nerve. 
I would probably do this ride again though as most of the issues were lack of info, now I have alot of it so can pretty much get by.


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## QOS (Dec 8, 2008)

No water would have been a serious problem. Geez..that must have been the pits. Sorry it wasn't as smooth as you had hoped.


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## phantomhorse13 (Feb 18, 2011)

Joe4d said:


> I attended the Patrick SC AERC ride on 26 Nov 2011.
> The riding trail itself was well marked and I liked the terrain and had a great time, Met some cool people. I have rewritten this multiple times and just cant come up with a way of giving a review with out being extremely negative about the organizer. I guess I am glad theyu put it on as I know it does take a bit of work but there were some serious issues that I will be happy to describe in a private massage but not in a public forum.
> The organizers were anything but. Seriously they have been doing this for years and are so bad it's a running joke among the other participants.
> a couple inexcusable issues,
> ...


Sorry to hear your first ride experience was not totally stellar. Never good when the lack of organization is a running joke! But I am glad you got around and that time is wonderful for your first distance experience.

If your schedule allows it, plan to come up to Jersey for the Rabbit Run in March. It's very well organized and the only running joke is that it always rains for Jersey, so you will not be lacking for water! :lol:


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

I am looking hard at Foxcatcher in northeast maryland, I did like the soutcarolina ride. The terrain was easy and it is a very simple drive down a rural section of I-95 for me. I drove home on the Sunday after thanksgiving with no traffic issues to give you an idea. A different organizer hots a ride on the same national forest land I would like to attend. Looking at the road map between me and Foxcatcher, has me having anxiety attacks at the thought of pulling a horse trailer through maryland. (I'd be coming from Richmond, Va.) No way I am doing the 495 thing. I will come up 301 and try to navigate baltimore best I can.,,,,,, so if you are stuck behind a really slow moving horse trailer driven by someone that looks like he hasnt got a clue, that would be me. I am severely city driving disabled.


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

Joe4d said:


> I attended the Patrick SC AERC ride on 26 Nov 2011.
> The riding trail itself was well marked and I liked the terrain and had a great time, Met some cool people. I have rewritten this multiple times and just cant come up with a way of giving a review with out being extremely negative about the organizer. I guess I am glad theyu put it on as I know it does take a bit of work but there were some serious issues that I will be happy to describe in a private massage but not in a public forum.
> The organizers were anything but. Seriously they have been doing this for years and are so bad it's a running joke among the other participants.
> a couple inexcusable issues,
> ...


 
Is this a trail riding area? We had trails where folks not connected with our camp had decided to take down the markers.

Also curious about the no vet. Was this a sanctioned event?


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

yes was a AERC event. There were vets for the vet check, but evidently, (and this is heresay) they had no or vsry limited first aid supplies. When a rider needed a treatment vet, there was not one coordinated with ahead of time. I have no idea what kind of area it was, On the map it looked to be a mix of public and private land , dirt roads and logging trails. I know one spot that seemed to have some animosity towards riders, probably as a result of trespassing by horses and riders trying to get to water. Somethign the oorganizers could eliminate if they put a couple water troughs along the trail.


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