# My horse is being picked on..... is this really normal behaviour?



## amberly (Dec 16, 2012)

My horse is on the end of the dominance line, so he gets all the bites. But The worst he has gotten is a little bite that bled for two days, but then nothing else happened. If it got worse with my horse, I would try to separate them, but otherwise I am no expert on this.

Yes, it is normal behavior, but I am pretty sure it wouldn't be that bad. 

I would try some more blankets and stuff. It might help and it might not. My horses are boarded 20 minutes away from where I live and it is the best place around, so I won't be moving my horses for some time....hopefully. 

And just to say, I have never heard of a horse getting kicked in the head to be normal behavior or something. It might be true, but I have never heard of it.

But yea, I would try some blankets if it won't stop and if you can't seperate them.

You say this person is a boarder? WHy doesn't he/she have other pastures??


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## Maple (Jan 10, 2012)

As far as I see it, horses kick and bite each other. My gelding would get bullied by his own shadow - unless I want to keep him alone he is going to get picked on. It's just a fact of life for them when they are turned out in a group setting.


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## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Welcome to the forum

Some arguments over feed, pecking order or mares is normal, and to be expected. Five months is not normal. 
You say there are 4 other geldings...could be they're arguing about the mares. 
Don't know what type of hayfeeder is used, but one for 7 and no other source of hay might be the reason for it. 
Could be there is a particularly dominant horse in the herd, or your gelding wont accept his current position. 
And it will get worse for some time once the other mare and filly arrive. 
Does he have a best friend? If so, would it be possible to separate him and his friend from the herd?
If not, I would move my horse. A little arguing and even fighting is normal, but not to the extend you describe, for such a long time.


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## walkinthewalk (Jul 23, 2008)

I agree with everything "deserthorsewoman" said but, I can put yet another spin the situation:

I have 22 acres, more than enough space for four horses.

Third in the pecking order is nothing but a bully - he's been with me 16+ years and I can't tell you how many times I've come close to giving that agitating SOB a lead earring.

He has deviled both the Lead and Second-in-command horse when they have been sick.

He devils the begeezus out of the 4th in order horse and will pin that horse in a skinny minute and either bite or kick him, if he can get away with it.

I even went to the time and expense to open up a section below the paddock and put a second gate at the bottom end, so horse #4 could get away from the Bully.

Horse #4 absolutely is not a fighter - in the 6+ years he's been here, he has never shown one inth of a moment of agression or challenge against another horse.

^^^^that may be your horse.
*************************************************
So the BO kindly put in a second hay feeder and is bringing in another mare and filly? Sweet -- sounds like the main focus here is $$$$.

It appears the other horses are using your horse for a whipping post. Survival of the Fittest is still in the modern-day gene pool and they will have no conscience about beating him down until he can't stand up for himself.

Pretty soon your horse may start losing weight because they won't let him near the feeder - they will intentionally starve him out - I helped get a mare in that kind of situation. I took the videos.

You also run the risk of the horse developing ulcers from the stress of never knowing when he's going to get slammed. I doubt he even has the opportunity to lay down and rest.

If my Bully horse feels the need, he will charge my #4 horse when that horse is lying down to enjoy a good roll. Unless, I'm close on the 4-wheeler to give him some of his own medicine with the buggy whip.

I know it's more money and a further drive but given three kicks to the head, and big pieces of missing flesh, I would get my horse "the flock out of there" five minutes ago. JMHO


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## Palomine (Oct 30, 2010)

You need to move this horse. BO does not care about if he is going to get hurt, and he can't call you and tell you he is going hungry or getting hurt.

At this point? You KNOW this is happening and if you do nothing about it and protect him? It is your fault, no one else's.

There are some horses which are perpetual whipping boys, yours may be one of them, but eventually they will either run him through a fence or corner him and hurt him so badly you will have to put him down.

I am having to make this decision on Kola, and he was only cornered once, but it has ruined his near fore to point I am considering having him PTS soon. He can't move good, and lays down quite a bit now.

He was arthritic this time last year. Close to 20, but would still trot some. Now he is damaged beyond help. Due to long story which won't go into? 5 other horses got into his area/stall and ran him through a wooden cattle chute, and into hay area. Only reason they didn't kill him is they couldn't get to him.

Would they have? Without a doubt.

Kola has never in his life hurt anyone, not offered to bite, kick, buck, nothing. And then for this to happen to him just breaks my heart. I've had him since '99 I think, but most of his life, and now I'm trying to make decision to kill him.

I moved him to vet for week on the Sunday it happened. The next day? I walked 80 acre pasture to catch up Baby Huey, Bonanza met me quickly when went out there, oddly enough.

Had he not gotten kicked and bitten and attacked? Kola would be easily looking at another 10 years of life. He will be lucky to last 10 more days, as I can't stand to see him like this any longer.

And I had NO IDEA this was going to happen either. He had his own 2 acre area, and 10x20 stall. No way other horses would be able to have hurt him, except 2 people screwed up and let it happen.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

Horses will always have a pecking order and there will usually be a bully and a victim type but when the bullying becomes bad enough to damage blankets (they aren't that cheap to keep repairing and replacing) and the bites and kicks involve vets bills or a horse being constantly off work or badly blemished then its probably time to draw a line under things and look for some other way to keep your horse.
A normal 'alpha' type establishes itself with no more than a dirty look and maybe a threat and a bit of a scuffle and then its all over with but these bully horses just never give up and go out of their way to inflict injury on others so are usually better off separated.
I had to have a lovely horse shot after its back leg was completely shattered by a 13.2 bully pony so its made me very cautious of horses that are overly aggressive towards others.


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## Palomine (Oct 30, 2010)

Here are pictures of him after being attacked. The only place he didn't have marks? His ears. There was not one place on him that had not been bitten, kicked, scraped or hurt.

The September before, 2011, I had had x-rays done of bad knee, and vet said only arthritis, and could bute if wanted to ride him some.

X-rays taken Sept 2012...showed upper joint capsule damaged beyond any hope. He's had cortisone shots, 2 so far, in on joint supplements, and have tried to keep him trimmed.


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

To address the being kicked in the head part...yes, it happens in normal herd dynamics. My gelding is a 4yo 16.1hh draft cross. My new BO put him out with four other geldings for turnout after getting my permission. Aires is like everyone's kid brother, so why not? I went to pay my board last month and we were chatting about how Aires was doing with the other geldings. Turns out that he's the natural leader. Problem is, he doesn't really want to be. But, he has always been good at herd dynamics, so he has become the leader. So, when one of the BO's geldings got a little too pushy, he put the gelding in his place with a sound kick...that happened to land on the gelding's jaw. Luckily the other gelding wasn't hurt (vet checked him over when he was there taking care of another horse), but he could have easily been hurt by Aires dinner plate-sized hooves. Point being, even unintentionally, horses kick each other in the head.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Palomine (Oct 30, 2010)

I can't get the pictures to load right on here.

At any rate, Kola is paying the price for the bullying of the other horses.


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## Palomine (Oct 30, 2010)

This is what Kola's leg looks like now.


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Palomine said:


> This is what Kola's leg looks like now.


Poor baby! :-(
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Palomine (Oct 30, 2010)

This is what his leg looked like day of attack, June 2012.

You can see how much it has moved at the knee on near side.

Hole vet is cleaned, was as big around as thumb and 2/3 inches deep where he had ran bolt into shoulder crashing through the cattle chute.


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## TheLastUnicorn (Jun 11, 2010)

The pecking order is normal... But Out and out agression towards or by any particular horse is a problem. 

In a balanced herd, even the bosses don't act aggressively - they will certainly assert themselves, but they rarely bully to the extent being described. 

I would find another place to board if the barn owner can't do more than add another feeder to fix this situation. Having bloody bite marks all over him, and likely bruising to go with it just isn't fair to him... Or you, it will eventually cause problems for you be it that you can't ride due to a badly placed bruise or worse, because your horse actually ends up with a serious injury.

Generally heirarchy is decided pretty quick among horses... A week or so, at most is all most herds need to settle down. It will shift day to day a bit, but any actual confrontations should be really minimal... Not a full on attack resulting in open wounds. 

I have had the occasional colt get a good beat down... Colts can be pushy and rude forcing more mature horses to teach them their place in life, but you would be able to note this sort of behavior by observing... In such cases it's usually pretty easy to see where the colt went wrong in his approach to an older or higher ranked horse. (For colts who are very annoying, I tend to pull them away from the herd for a few hours every day to give everyone a break, or find them a suitable playmate who will happily play and rough house) 

I have had the odd stallion get a bit carried away in rough play and need a reminder of when it's quitting time - but I am going to assume your barn owner doesn't run a stallion with horses she boards for other people. Besides that, the solution here is the obvious... Separate the horses which can't get along. It does happen, sometimes you have a horse which just seems to be "unlikeable" according to other horses - horse politics are usually only really understood by horses, we can guess and make observations, but we aren't horses. 

I have had a few really haggy mares who just couldn't seem to lay off the bottom horses - they were helped by a strong, balanced herd which was able to teach them that such behavior was unacceptable. Even now they tend to be a little quicker to snap or kick than most horses, but no longer the full on rage attacks they were known for.

So yeah, if it were my horse, I'd be finding him a new place to board.


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## Saskia (Aug 26, 2009)

Horses do get a bit injured every now and then in herds, but if it's all the time and serious injury that is a concern. 

I think generally most horses can sort it out if they are in a large paddock and not too big a herd - but problems can arise when they congregate in a small area, which has happened. When there is one feed and a handful of horses they are of course going to get injured. 

I only keep my horse places where feeding in paddocks is not allowed. And if they must be given hay its spread out with more piles than there are horses. I've kept her places where people fed in paddocks before and it was a nightmare. 

I would move him. But if he's such a passive horse make sure you evaluate the new place to make sure it won't happen again.


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## wausuaw (Apr 15, 2011)

I would say move him. He seems like the "bottom" guy, and intertwined is one that has taken over that doesn't know how to quit. My friend was (old neighbor) was training a horse that was very dominate/aggressive toward other horses (leaving marks like this). With my permission, she pastured him in with my mare and a large, older gelding (he was a stud for awhile). The two of mine were very dominate, but not aggressive (they would only go so far as to make their point, then quit). 

First thing, the big 16+ h gelding I had put 2 back hooves straight to the head when the trainee charged/challenged him and wouldn't let up. After a month, she put him back in with the other horses she had, and didn't have near as many problems. (It was actually very fascinating to watch the difference it made in his total attitude)

Sounds like yours is unfortunately paired with one of those. If that horse doesn't "know when to quit" and the owner/BO is not willing to do anything about it, you need to get yours gone. Those bites are beyond what's really normal. My horses get bites on them every so often, but nothing near that bad. I would be EXTREMELY concerned if that were to happen, let alone on a regular basis.

My horses all share the same hay ring and pasture (Course there are only 3, I plan on boarding up to 2 additional for extra money, but in that case I would get an additional hay ring, and I have to get things set up here). Only 1 is technically mine, actually. They pick on each other, kick, bite, run, play, etc. I fine the stray hoof or teeth marks that break skin but not regularly and not bad. 

I'd move him out, take the hit, and then see if there's anywhere closer in the long term. I'd move him sooner than later, tho.


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## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

If they are fighting that much, there is probably not enough hay being fed to keep them content.


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## cebee (Apr 4, 2010)

If possible, I agree with the others who suggest moving him. I got my boy as a rescue- nearly starved, kept from the hay by 2 geldings and covered with nips. He is totally a bottom of the pecking order guy, and just gave up. I brought him to a friends, and we fattened him up- put him in a pasture with 3 others and had to end up separating him again when one of her geldings ran him from the water, kicked and bit him... finally my boy would just stand in the corner of the pasture and not come out. SOme horses are just bullies!
Most 'normal' pecking order squabbles consist of some nips and ear pinning, but once the order is established, unless someone tries to move up in it, things move pretty smoothly. BUT... if there is not enough food, even the best of buddies can end up squabbling! Your BO should try putting multiple hay feeders out, so no one is kept from the hay. Yes, try a blanket on him as well. But unless she is willing to separate them, I would consider moving- if things are not smoothed out between the horses by now, I dont think things are going to change... ( and I know it breaks your heart in the meantime..)


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## Bambaura (Jan 10, 2013)

Thank you to everyone for your replies!! I'm glad to know I am not overreacting. I have spoken to the BO again and there was talk of splitting the herd. There has also been two more horses added. I have also contacted other barns and ready to move after this weekend if things don't improve!!! Thanks guys!!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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