# Conformation on 7 month Stud Colt QH



## WindTree

After reading another thread, I will get a few more pics.


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## Tryst

Are you planning on leaving him a stud?

When you take pics stand further back and get down a bit lower. Since you were shooting downwards in this photo it is distorting him a bit. I will wait for better photos to give a critique.


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## WindTree

OK thanks, I will take more pics. I don't think I will leave him a stud, I would like to but too many mares in a pasture next to his. May have him cut when he's about a year and a half...maybe. Really have not decided.


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## WindTree

*Conformation for Dakota..I got the pics*

OK it was tough getting these but I got some pics. Thanks


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## stevenson

he looks cute. I would be interested in seeing pics of him in the summer. His shape will change in a year. He has the high butt that is popular now, and I would get a farrier out for those hooves soon.


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## Tryst

I think will make a super cute gelding. He looks very mellow. Right now he is quite butt high, but I like his short back. His shoulder appears average. Pasterns are a touch more upright than ideal. Legs at this time appear straight and correct. Hip is short. Neck is a bit course, tiring in a touch low and with a fairly thick throat latch. I think he will mature to be a very useful using sort of horse.


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## Zexious

I don't know anything about conformation, but that never stops me from posting! :> He is so cute <3


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## WindTree

I appreciate everybody's comments. Yes he is a cute boy and does have a mellow temperament, (most of the time). This short video shows him showing out to my Mammoth Jenny. And the farrier is due to be here in a about a week. He comes about every 6 or 8 weeks, sooner if needed. He is a growing boy and is changing. I hope this video works, I have not posted one before. Thanks!


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## WindTree

Well I did not do it right and had to remove it. Will research it and try again later.


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## SullysRider

Second what has been said, I think he is definitely a candidate for gelding. I hope you enjoy him!


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## WindTree

Still a problem for video...Sorry


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## smguidotti

Not that this guy is ugly -- mos def not stallion quality -- but I bet he will be one of those "ugly ducklings" of babies that turns into a real handsome gelding.

I would take him.


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## Elana

What I don't like are the rotations in the front legs. He appears knock knee'd with some rotation toeing him out. He is also a little straight through the hock and I would like to see larger hocks.

His hocks are a lot higher than his knees so he will likely mature quite downhill. Above he is not at the best stage to judge. I suspect his neck will tie low to his chest and he may mature pigeon breasted.

Right now he doesn't look like much. I would wait until he was a 2 year old to geld. I would absolutely not breed him at all until you see what you have. The rotations in front take him out of stud material IMO... would like to see the sire and dam front on.

To keep a young one growing correct and straight you need to trim every 3 to 4 weeks.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## WindTree

I finally got the video..I think. But anyway a lot of good comments from everybody. I think most everything about his conformation was covered from his Butt, shoulders, neck, hocks, throat, hoofs as well as his looks. I don't have a pic of his sire but I do the mare. Not sure if it's straight on but I can get that. In the video he is just showing out a little bit. He does that often, everytime the stud across the fence gets him going. 
Thanks!


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## WindTree

Elana said:


> What I don't like are the rotations in the front legs. He appears knock knee'd with some rotation toeing him out. He is also a little straight through the hock and I would like to see larger hocks.
> 
> His hocks are a lot higher than his knees so he will likely mature quite downhill. Above he is not at the best stage to judge. I suspect his neck will tie low to his chest and he may mature pigeon breasted.
> 
> Right now he doesn't look like much. I would wait until he was a 2 year old to geld. I would absolutely not breed him at all until you see what you have. The rotations in front take him out of stud material IMO... would like to see the sire and dam front on.
> 
> To keep a young one growing correct and straight you need to trim every 3 to 4 weeks.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 Well this morning I was out mucking out his stall, fed him, groomed him good and checked him over top to bottom. Got out on level ground and really studied him good. No offense to your comments, its got to be a challenge to critique just by pictures. I don't see the concern for knock knee'd or rotation issue what so ever.. BUT I'm not an expert. I compared him to conformation charts and he looked ok. The old man across the field came over and pointed out a few things and his observations were same as mine. One thing to keep in mind, he is a quarter horse and both sides Top and bottom were all mostly competitive cutting horses. He is build like they are for turning, stopping and he is very fast and displays very much athletic ability. He does have that baby face but he is very smart and learns quick and . Also he is young and a lot of growing to do. I agree it may be too early for some of his conformation critiques to be accurate and can be misjudged at his age. May just be too early for some of his conformation critiques. He has his winter colt too and things will look much different next summer after he grows and slicks up. But I really appreciate everybody taking the time to express your opinions. 
Thanks!


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## SullysRider

WindTree said:


> Well this morning I was out mucking out his stall, fed him, groomed him good and checked him over top to bottom. Got out on level ground and really studied him good. No offense to your comments, its got to be a challenge to critique just by pictures. I don't see the concern for knock knee'd or rotation issue what so ever.. BUT I'm not an expert. I compared him to conformation charts and he looked ok. The old man across the field came over and pointed out a few things and his observations were same as mine. One thing to keep in mind, he is a quarter horse and both sides Top and bottom were all mostly competitive cutting horses. He is build like they are for turning, stopping and he is very fast and displays very much athletic ability. He does have that baby face but he is very smart and learns quick and . Also he is young and a lot of growing to do. I agree it may be too early for some of his conformation critiques to be accurate and can be misjudged at his age. May just be too early for some of his conformation critiques. He has his winter colt too and things will look much different next summer after he grows and slicks up. But I really appreciate everybody taking the time to express your opinions.
> Thanks!


Honestly Elana is pretty much a conformation guru, so it sounds like maybe you're just not hearing what you want to hear. If you go and look at the pictures there is some rotation.

ETA I won't comment on the knees part as I'm still learning.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

He isn't and won't be a stallion candidate and I'd geld him now while it's cold and there are no flies to bother him. I believe in gelding as early as possible because they don't waste time on getting a bunch of hormones they're not going to need later on and they never start acting interested in the mares. 

He's very cute and will be a good looking grown up horse. I won't critique anything under 2 at the very earliest, it just isn't fair to the animal.


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## WindTree

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> He isn't and won't be a stallion candidate and I'd geld him now while it's cold and there are no flies to bother him. I believe in gelding as early as possible because they don't waste time on getting a bunch of hormones they're not going to need later on and they never start acting interested in the mares.
> 
> He's very cute and will be a good looking grown up horse. I won't critique anything under 2 at the very earliest, it just isn't fair to the animal.


I agree I do still have mixed emotions on him being a stallion and really need to put those aside and go ahead and cut him. I have already spoken with one of the Doctors at the University Vet School where I got him. She actually spent a lot of time with him and took care of him of all his medical attention/shots etc. She also recommended that if I decided to cut him, do it now. Even if he was a prime stallion candidate, I don't think I would have interest in breeding. A stud leads a lonely life. And I would like for him to keep the mild attitude he currently has as much as possible. He is already showing interest in the mares across the fence and chases my Mammoth Jenny around trying to mount her. I appreciate your comments. Thanks


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## WindTree

SullysRider said:


> Honestly Elana is pretty much a conformation guru, so it sounds like maybe you're just not hearing what you want to hear. If you go and look at the pictures there is some rotation.
> 
> ETA I won't comment on the knees part as I'm still learning.


I have looked at the pictures and studied him this morning. But like I said I am no expert. I will let the Vet check him out when he goes in to be cut. The farrier will be here next week and will get his opinion too. 

No that aint what I wanna her but I am concerned and will let the Vet check it out and identify exactly where and why the problem is there if it is and how severe it is and what can be done to correct it as much as possible. This Vet School is one of the best in the country. They bred the Sire to one of their mares and are very familiar with my Colt. 

Thanks


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## Corporal

stevenson said:


> he looks cute. I would be interested in seeing pics of him in the summer. His shape will change in a year. *He has the high butt that is popular now,* and I would get a farrier out for those hooves soon.


Gee, that was what I DIDN'T like about him. Why is a high butt popular? Seems to me that would make him downhill and I know from personal experience--"Ro Go Bar"(1982-1997, RIP) who I bought as a 7yo and kept until his death at 27yo--that this is a great fault. Please tell me more about this current fad. =/


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## CandyCanes

Corporal said:


> Gee, that was what I DIDN'T like about him. Why is a high butt popular? Seems to me that would make him downhill and I know from personal experience--"Ro Go Bar"(1982-1997, RIP) who I bought as a 7yo and kept until his death at 27yo--that this is a great fault. Please tell me more about this current fad. =/


She means its common... Found a lot... Or thats what it sounded like to me.


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## WindTree

It is common to see Quarter Horses with big high butts. Some like it a little high for cow cutting. Dakota's folks most all had high butts. I don't have a problem with that now, I think in time, it will even out. But glad my wife don't got no BIG High Butt!


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## SullysRider

A lot of Quarter Horses used for speed events are butt high and bred on purpose to be that way, means they can't collect very well but supposedly makes them faster, same with racing Thoroughbreds. You don't see it as bad in the Thoroughbreds, but it's horrible in the Quarter Horses, racing and non racing lines. I personally don't like it, a lot of people don't, but that's the breeding trend.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

I don't comment on conformation and especially not on high butts because at 7 months that colt will go butt high, even out, withers high sometimes and butt high, cycle and repeat. He probably will be a little butt high when he's done, they seem to be breeding for it these days, but there's no way to call it at this point. Crooked legs.....if he was windswept as a newborn, he could be still straightening out. So, I don't like to look too critically at their confo til they're 3 or 4 y.o. really. 

But knowing stallion material when you see it is easy. 99% of all foals born are not going to be stallion material. The 1% that could be stallion material, may have severe faults, horrible tempers, genetic disorders, and who knows what else to wash them out. 

One of the key things that tells me a horse is not a stallion prospect is, I've seen others just like this one and have a couple in my back yard. Cute, athletic, sweet and gelded. Also, the OP did not come on this thread shouting from the rooftops that her stallion has been Panel Tested Clear for all 5 of the genetic issues, HYPP, GBED, PSSM, MH AND HERDA. If he'd tested clear for everything or even been tested is one of the first things that needs to be disclosed, that's one of the first things prospective mare breeders will be looking for and very soon, AQHA is requiring the results be submitted to be kept on file.


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## WindTree

Just for the record I am a Stallion. No I have not had those tests performed and do not know if the University has either. His papers only say that he has been fully vaccinated for Eastern/Western Encephalomyelitis, West Nile, Rhinopneumonitis, and Tetanus. Also when I picked him up he came with recent negative coggins papers. The AQHA does offer the genetic panel test. Somewhere around a hundred bucks for members and a little more for non-members. I think there are other places that are a little bit cheaper. If I do that it will be just for piece of mind and that's it. As I mentioned earlier I spoke to his Doctor and although she did not mention anything about him being born windswept, she did say that he was born a healthy foal with no problems or deformalities. As far as him being a Stallion, no, he will be cut and be a gelding. There are a few pics of him back in September here at this website as well as all his other info and what I paid for him. I have no problem sharing that information. MSUES Auction Lot 19 2013 AQHA Bay Stud Colt
This was their first on line sale as they have always had them every year but not on line. I spent a good bit of time with him in the field and barn before I bought him. I was considering a couple of others too but ended up with just him. 
Thanks


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## FGRanch

WindTree said:


> I agree I do still have mixed emotions on him being a stallion and really need to put those aside and go ahead and cut him. I have already spoken with one of the Doctors at the University Vet School where I got him. She actually spent a lot of time with him and took care of him of all his medical attention/shots etc. She also recommended that if I decided to cut him, do it now. Even if he was a prime stallion candidate, I don't think I would have interest in breeding. A stud leads a lonely life. And I would like for him to keep the mild attitude he currently has as much as possible. He is already showing interest in the mares across the fence and chases my Mammoth Jenny around trying to mount her. I appreciate your comments. Thanks


Conformation aside you don't sound ready to have a stallion so I say geld. He is a cute little ****** for sure, only thing I am willing to judge at this age is how upright his hocks are. Especially in a cutter, we really like to see them a lot lower and not near as upright. Who is his sire? I think he is going to be beautiful and I'd like to see some photo's of him next summer to see how he is maturing.


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## FGRanch

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> I don't comment on conformation and especially not on high butts because at 7 months that colt will go butt high, even out, withers high sometimes and butt high, cycle and repeat. He probably will be a little butt high when he's done, they seem to be breeding for it these days, but there's no way to call it at this point. Crooked legs.....if he was windswept as a newborn, he could be still straightening out. So, I don't like to look too critically at their confo til they're 3 or 4 y.o. really.
> 
> But knowing stallion material when you see it is easy. 99% of all foals born are not going to be stallion material. The 1% that could be stallion material, may have severe faults, horrible tempers, genetic disorders, and who knows what else to wash them out.
> 
> One of the key things that tells me a horse is not a stallion prospect is, I've seen others just like this one and have a couple in my back yard. Cute, athletic, sweet and gelded. Also, the OP did not come on this thread shouting from the rooftops that her stallion has been Panel Tested Clear for all 5 of the genetic issues, HYPP, GBED, PSSM, MH AND HERDA. If he'd tested clear for everything or even been tested is one of the first things that needs to be disclosed, that's one of the first things prospective mare breeders will be looking for and very soon, AQHA is requiring the results be submitted to be kept on file.


As of 2014 all stallions breeding 25+ mares will be required to be 5 panel tested through UC Davis (They don't have to be negative across the board) and as of 2015 ALL stallions will have to be tested through UC Davis (Again they don't have to be negative) Thankfully mine are tested N/N as is the majority of my mares.


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## FGRanch

Sorry didn't read the last page until now. I LOVE LOVE LOVE his mama


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## CandyCanes

WindTree said:


> Just for the record I am a Stallion.


:lol: :lol:


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## Elana

Judging a horse by a photograph is no way to determine if he should be cut or not. Especially a horse this young. You need hands on.. and I think age.. 

I saw rotations in the front legs. Maybe a bad photo or a bad stance. Happens. His hocks are straight and that is not a good thing. 

All that said, owning a stallion is a huge responsibility.


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## WindTree

Elana said:


> Judging a horse by a photograph is no way to determine if he should be cut or not. Especially a horse this young. You need hands on.. and I think age..
> 
> I saw rotations in the front legs. Maybe a bad photo or a bad stance. Happens. His hocks are straight and that is not a good thing.
> 
> All that said, owning a stallion is a huge responsibility.


I agree... Judging a horse by pictures to make a decision as to whether he will be cut or not; would be insane. It is the owners decision based on what he plans to do with the horse, its medical condition and conformation. And like you said, hands on experience. 

Bad pics? Could be, I don't know. But as I mentioned earlier, those were tough pics to get. I tried it by myself, but he was all over me. It was also the time of day when he is the most active. I had to get his momma (my wife) out to help get the pics. But then his attention turned to her. If you look at the close up, you can see the stud across the top of his back keeping a keen eye on him making sure he was not showing interest in his mares. My wife was also to his left causing him to twist and turn constantly. The rearend pic was taken with his head all the way down eating grass and he just before taking a crap. And again, all the other horses and my wife was to his left. I will let the vet decide on the possible rotation issue and as far as straight hocks, may be but this horse will not be jumping, racing or hard work. So physical stress will not be an issue. But we will see how he developes over the next year or two. It is a possibility, that he could do some barrel work, but may not. 

Right now, he and I have a lot of ground work to do and plenty of time to do it. His balls have dropped and he is beginning to show change. As he changes, I will too. We work with him dailey and he is in the field all day. Stalled at night. He is getting plenty of exercise. He gets plenty of hay, water and Omolene 300, twice a day. Groomed once a day, sometimes twice. He has excellent stall and ground manners and very smart. Don't let his little baby face fool you, sometimes he will show you his other side. I think my wife babys him too much but when she needs to be firm, she does. I keep reminding her of that. I think sometimes that can confuse the the horse. But he knows when I am handling him, I'm the boss and he knows I am not afraid of him. I know some horse owners that have been dealing with horses all their life and I can sometimes see fear in that owner when around their horse. I think the horse knows that and will take advantage of them. 

But anyway, he is still growing and I have already decided to have him cut. My wife has had experience with Studs and we don't want no more of that. Yes it is a HUGE RESPONSIBILITY. As I said earlier, a Stud for breeding can lead a lonely and stressful life as well as causing the owner the same not to mention the financial burden. 

With all that being said, Thanks and good luck!


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## churumbeque

looks to be in need of some TLC and a vet to do some neutering. LOL


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## Endiku

churumbeque said:


> looks to be in need of some TLC and a vet to do some neutering. LOL


TLC? I actually thought he looked to be in good condition and right on schedule as far as age goes. He doesn't look scruffy or undernourished to me whatsoever so I'm really not sure where that comment is coming from. He may be a tad potbellied but that seems to be a stage they all go through at around this age when its minimal like this.

That being said, Windtree, I'm one of those that refuses to critique babies because they're just so immature. I've seen some UGLY weanlings and yearlings turn into find adults, and some nice looking weanlings and yearlings end up mediocre at best. Give him some time. Either way, he's adorable!


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## churumbeque

Endiku said:


> TLC? I actually thought he looked to be in good condition and right on schedule as far as age goes. He doesn't look scruffy or undernourished to me whatsoever so I'm really not sure where that comment is coming from. He may be a tad potbellied but that seems to be a stage they all go through at around this age when its minimal like this.
> 
> That being said, Windtree, I'm one of those that refuses to critique babies because they're just so immature. I've seen some UGLY weanlings and yearlings turn into find adults, and some nice looking weanlings and yearlings end up mediocre at best. Give him some time. Either way, he's adorable!


Not what I am used to seeing
. If he was cared for he would not have a pot belly and he would have some shape and muscle to him. Nice plump rump would be in order. He is probably a nice calm colt because he is wormy and not fed properly.


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## WindTree

Endiku said:


> TLC? I actually thought he looked to be in good condition and right on schedule as far as age goes. He doesn't look scruffy or undernourished to me whatsoever so I'm really not sure where that comment is coming from. He may be a tad potbellied but that seems to be a stage they all go through at around this age when its minimal like this.
> 
> That being said, Windtree, I'm one of those that refuses to critique babies because they're just so immature. I've seen some UGLY weanlings and yearlings turn into find adults, and some nice looking weanlings and yearlings end up mediocre at best. Give him some time. Either way, he's adorable!


Endiku I appreciate your comments in regard to what the ? right above you wrote. He does have a little pot belly and as far as TLC, this boy gets more than most. Thank You!


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## Endiku

I've learned that often the potbelly stems from hay quality more than feed quality, and often doesn't have anything to do with worms. I'd always thought that potbelly=worms until I had my own young horse. I fed her very good grains (Nutrena Life Design Mare and Foal, probios, alfalfa pellets, beet pulp) yet she still had her weeks of looking rather potbellied. I thought for sure it was worms, had a fecal egg count, and she came up clean. The vet said it was just a growth thing.

I did find though that when I finally got ahold of some higher quality grass hay, it decreased quite a bit. That wasn't an option for a while though since I was boarding and hay came with board!


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## WindTree

churumbeque said:


> Not what I am used to seeing
> . If he was cared for he would not have a pot belly and he would have some shape and muscle to him. Nice plump rump would be in order. He is probably a nice calm colt because he is wormy and not fed properly.


Now what is your ------ problem???? Quite obvious you are not one of the experts here that critique. "If he was cared for" "wormy and not fed properly" WHOAAAAAAAAAA!!!! That is just a little too much.


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## WindTree

Endiku said:


> I've learned that often the potbelly stems from hay quality more than feed quality, and often doesn't have anything to do with worms. I'd always thought that potbelly=worms until I had my own young horse. I fed her very good grains (Nutrena Life Design Mare and Foal, probios, alfalfa pellets, beet pulp) yet she still had her weeks of looking rather potbellied. I thought for sure it was worms, had a fecal egg count, and she came up clean. The vet said it was just a growth thing.
> 
> I did find though that when I finally got ahold of some higher quality grass hay, it decreased quite a bit. That wasn't an option for a while though since I was boarding and hay came with board!


He just got his first worming here last week. Safe Guard paste. Prior to that the University wormed him. I will worm him every month and rotate the brands. I have some round bales a man shared with me I gave him for cutting it but I don't feed them that. Ok for cows but I prefer square bales for horses. Good hay around here is hard to come by. I did pick some up last week that looks to be the best I seen. Sometimes you can find Bermuda at a decent price. But he does get plenty of hay and some pasture grass. He is out running around all day. Like you said, may be some of the reason he got the pot belly. As far as his feed he's on 16% Omolene 300 and I just got him on that 100%. I was mixing 70% Omolene and 30% Horsemans Edge 14% because he was on the 14% to begin with. His poop looks ok, was a little soft but now its normal. He also loves his vitamin/mineral blocks. And he gets plenty of fresh water. 
Thanks for the hay info. I am going to look into that.


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## Peppy Barrel Racing

churumbeque said:


> Not what I am used to seeing
> . If he was cared for he would not have a pot belly and he would have some shape and muscle to him. Nice plump rump would be in order. He is probably a nice calm colt because he is wormy and not fed properly.


This RUDE, not a critique, and a completely unnecessary assumption without any evidence.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Endiku

Very good. I've had friends who used Omleen and liked it. Hopefully it works well for your guy. If I remember right, my friend who used it on her two babies liked it up until they hit about 2, then she found that they needed a little something extra. Your boy is a long ways off from 2 though, and the Omleen is _much_ better than Horseman's edge which, IMO, is just a glorified sweet feed. The website even says its not for babies under 18 months old (not enough protein I'd imagine). 

I know what you mean when it comes to hay quality! It varies SO much in my area, and when we're in drought (I live in Texas...we have drought 90% of the time) hay quality takes a huge nose dive. For a while the best 'horse hay' I could find had a bunch of weeds in it and looked rather brittle. Thankfully lately we've had some good luck with our local grass hay (Jiggs Costal) and when I found some that smelled sweet, looked leafy and soft, and was weed free, I bulk-bought xD then I ended up selling my filly and having nothing to do with the 20 bales that I still had left from my hay shopping spree...LOL

Worst come to worst, you could buy some alfalfa/timothy or pure alfalfa pellets for your guy and substitute a few pounds in for one of his flakes of hay. Its great for growing bones and there is a guaranteed analysis on the Standlee brand from Tractor Supply!


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## WindTree

We just got a couple of TS stores within 30 miles of here in the last year or so and I have been in there and looked around. They seem to be a little high on some things compared to what I pay at the local County Co-op. But I did see those compressed sacks of hay and what have you that you speak of. Cubes, pellets and what not. I may have to do some research and talk to some folks that may use it. I do know you gotta be careful when feeding Alfalfa. Im glad you mentioned it. I bought 20 bales last week that smelled good, taste good and had a nice fresh clean yellow green color. And no burs or stalks. $4.50 a bale. Our last spring was wet wet wet and then we had a drought. Now it rains all the time. I am in NE Mississippi. I agree with you on HE, glorified sweet mix. The Omolene is high ($18.00 50#) but I believe you get what you pay for. I tried to find some Triple Crown Growth but it is not around here but they do have it for mature horses. It's around 20 or so a sack. I have heard some good comments about it and its nutritional value. But I think I will just keep him on Omolene and try your advice. I appreciate your help and kindness. 
Thank You


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## Endiku

The only real danger with alfalfa comes when you're feeling high risk horses (cushoids, laminitics, EPSM, etc) or already fat horses. Its actually a great thing to feed the young ones because of the protein and, I believe, calcium that is in it. Definitely not as the main hay, but I had great success rehabbing a filly with 6-7 lbs (equal to one heavy flake) of alfalfa pellets. Your little guy may not need it though. Its just a nice option to keep in the back of your mind if you have troubles with your hay quality. You do have to wet the pellets or cubes before feeding them but otherwise I've really liked them.

Yes, the quality is definitely reflected in the price unfortunately! I was paying $19 per bag as well, plus all of the other things I was feeding my little gal, and I'm telling you- it adds up! LOL. Its great that your local co-op has better prices though...I'd definitely go for that if at all possible. In my case our local dealer charges an arm and a leg for absolutely everything...but TSC is 90 minutes away. Eeesh!

Anywho, I wish you the best of luck with your guy and keep us updated! I love seeing the babies grow.


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## SullysRider

Endiku said:


> Very good. I've had friends who used Omleen and liked it. Hopefully it works well for your guy. If I remember right, my friend who used it on her two babies liked it up until they hit about 2, then she found that they needed a little something extra. Your boy is a long ways off from 2 though, and the Omleen is _much_ better than Horseman's edge which, IMO, is just a glorified sweet feed. The website even says its not for babies under 18 months old (not enough protein I'd imagine).
> 
> I know what you mean when it comes to hay quality! It varies SO much in my area, and when we're in drought (I live in Texas...we have drought 90% of the time) hay quality takes a huge nose dive. For a while the best 'horse hay' I could find had a bunch of weeds in it and looked rather brittle. Thankfully lately we've had some good luck with our local grass hay (Jiggs Costal) and when I found some that smelled sweet, looked leafy and soft, and was weed free, I bulk-bought xD then I ended up selling my filly and having nothing to do with the 20 bales that I still had left from my hay shopping spree...LOL
> 
> Worst come to worst, you could buy some alfalfa/timothy or pure alfalfa pellets for your guy and substitute a few pounds in for one of his flakes of hay. Its great for growing bones and there is a guaranteed analysis on the Standlee brand from Tractor Supply!


Off topic, but where'd you get your hay? I don't have enough storage for that much hay or I'd buy it off of you lol


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## Endiku

Haha, I ended up giving it to the family who kept Kenzie from me! I buy from various places...I can't seem to find a reliable dealer who sells good hay all of the time. The good stuff that I bought was from a guy off of Morton road near Katy Hockley. I happened to see a sign that he had out in the field (old school style y'know...LOL), went by to see what he had, liked it, and bought a bunch. You should have seen me with my big ole' Oddessy with the trunk open and stuffed full of hay xD


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## Endiku

*kept Kenzie FOR me

LOL sorry, double post, but that was a pretty significant typo xD


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

WindTree said:


> We just got a couple of TS stores within 30 miles of here in the last year or so and I have been in there and looked around. They seem to be a little high on some things compared to what I pay at the local County Co-op. But I did see those compressed sacks of hay and what have you that you speak of. Cubes, pellets and what not. I may have to do some research and talk to some folks that may use it. I do know you gotta be careful when feeding Alfalfa. Im glad you mentioned it. I bought 20 bales last week that smelled good, taste good and had a nice fresh clean yellow green color. And no burs or stalks. $4.50 a bale. Our last spring was wet wet wet and then we had a drought. Now it rains all the time. I am in NE Mississippi. I agree with you on HE, glorified sweet mix. The Omolene is high ($18.00 50#) but I believe you get what you pay for. I tried to find some Triple Crown Growth but it is not around here but they do have it for mature horses. It's around 20 or so a sack. I have heard some good comments about it and its nutritional value. But I think I will just keep him on Omolene and try your advice. I appreciate your help and kindness.
> Thank You


Just remember that Tractor Supply has a 'meet or beat' policy. Go in and tell them where you saw something priced lower and usually they will at least meet the price, at mine they try to beat it by at least a little.


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## WindTree

I went by TS yesterday, they had a big display of Alfalfa compressed hay up front on sale for 18. (actually a few pennies under). I picked up one bale to try it out. Wife was out feeding bout dark when I got home. Took it to the barn, turn the lights on, put it in a crib, cut the bands off and opened it up. Strange looking, greenish and seemed to be some almost powered up. Was dusty. Strong aroma but not bad. I think this morning, we will take a flake this shake it out, wet it down and try it out. He gets about three lbs of Omolene first, he will have already eaten the hay we put out last night. Just wondering should I mix this with his regular hay or put it in a trough by itself. I think he might smash and waste some of it if put with his regular hay. He is a pawer when he eats. He just likes to do that. I could put it in his feed bucket after he finishes his feed. Then he gets turned out and I always halter him and lead him around and work with him a while, just the usual ground work. Then I will turn him loose and he will check the field out and the surroundings and the mares and stud across the fence. Then he will graze a while and then he will run a while and go back to grazing. Around mid day he will pick out a spot in the sun and lay down and sleep. Then he will get up and start all over again. Then he and I will work some more. I will watch his behavior and poop and pee the next few days. Still what are your recommendations on feeding that Alfalfa? He is over 12hh now and I know he's pushing 550-600 lbs. Maybe a tat more. Thanks


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

WindTree said:


> I went by TS yesterday, they had a big display of Alfalfa compressed hay up front on sale for 18. (actually a few pennies under). I picked up one bale to try it out. Wife was out feeding bout dark when I got home. Took it to the barn, turn the lights on, put it in a crib, cut the bands off and opened it up. Strange looking, greenish and seemed to be some almost powered up. Was dusty. Strong aroma but not bad. I think this morning, we will take a flake this shake it out, wet it down and try it out. He gets about three lbs of Omolene first, he will have already eaten the hay we put out last night. Just wondering should I mix this with his regular hay or put it in a trough by itself. I think he might smash and waste some of it if put with his regular hay. He is a pawer when he eats. He just likes to do that. I could put it in his feed bucket after he finishes his feed. Then he gets turned out and I always halter him and lead him around and work with him a while, just the usual ground work. Then I will turn him loose and he will check the field out and the surroundings and the mares and stud across the fence. Then he will graze a while and then he will run a while and go back to grazing. Around mid day he will pick out a spot in the sun and lay down and sleep. Then he will get up and start all over again. Then he and I will work some more. I will watch his behavior and poop and pee the next few days. Still what are your recommendations on feeding that Alfalfa? He is over 12hh now and I know he's pushing 550-600 lbs. Maybe a tat more. Thanks


More than height and weight, I'd be interested in seeing some pics of him to see if ribs, hips, spine bones are showing. That would give me a better idea of what you need vs what he's getting. 

For the alfalfa, I used that a year or so ago when we had the severe drought and you just couldn't find good hay. I really disliked how crumbly it was, but there was really very little waste. I flaked it, then misted it to keep the dust down and to rehydrate it just a little blt. The horses LOVED it. I'd start out with only a pound or 2 at a time, too much will cause him to have diarrhea. I'd serve it separately to avoid him wasting it with the grass hay, it's too expensive for that!

I'd also invest in a weight tape, they should have one at TS. They aren't real accurate but closer than eyeballing, usually.


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## WindTree

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> More than height and weight, I'd be interested in seeing some pics of him to see if ribs, hips, spine bones are showing. That would give me a better idea of what you need vs what he's getting.
> 
> For the alfalfa, I used that a year or so ago when we had the severe drought and you just couldn't find good hay. I really disliked how crumbly it was, but there was really very little waste. I flaked it, then misted it to keep the dust down and to rehydrate it just a little blt. The horses LOVED it. I'd start out with only a pound or 2 at a time, too much will cause him to have diarrhea. I'd serve it separately to avoid him wasting it with the grass hay, it's too expensive for that!
> 
> I'd also invest in a weight tape, they should have one at TS. They aren't real accurate but closer than eyeballing, usually.


That's about how much I gave him this morning. He smelled it and turned his nose away from it, looked at me and said "What his this crap? I had watered it down and drained it. Anyway he wanted no part of that. I put a bale of hay out for him and my Mammoth Jenny and let them have at it. I then mixed a little sweet mix with the Alfalfa and dropped some on the end he was eating. He smelled it, noticed the sweet mix and dove into it. Watched him a little bit and noticed he was nosing around in it trying to separate the sweet mix out of it. But he still had to eat some of it. Im hoping he will learn to like it, otherwise I will have go another route. There are plenty of pics of him at the beginning of these posts. And more where I posted his pedigree and a short video in one of my posts. See if you can see them. Try here: MSUES Auction Lot 19 2013 AQHA Bay Stud Colt I picked him up Friday before Thanksgiving. He has put on some weight since then. Thanks


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

Ok, I took a good look at the pics, he doesn't look underweight but since he's growing he'll look good, then look ribby, then good, ribby on and on for a while.  I've forgotten but are you feeding him Omolene 300? If so are you feeding what the package says for his age/weight? May 2013, so almost a yearling, so around 8-9 lbs/day? If so, along with his hay he should be getting enough.


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## WindTree

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> Ok, I took a good look at the pics, he doesn't look underweight but since he's growing he'll look good, then look ribby, then good, ribby on and on for a while. I've forgotten but are you feeding him Omolene 300? If so are you feeding what the package says for his age/weight? May 2013, so almost a yearling, so around 8-9 lbs/day? If so, along with his hay he should be getting enough.


Yes he was 7 months Dec 28th. And yes, Omolene 300 but he's getting 6 lbs a day so I may need to bump that up a couple lbs or so. 
Thanks!


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

- WEIGHT OF HORSE IN POUNDS -
Weaned Foal Through Yearling	


Omolene #300® Horse Feed***
300 
7.25-7.75	

400 
7.50-8.50 

500
7.00-9.25	

600
7.50-9.50	

700
7.75-10.00


The feeding instructions show the ranges for feeding the 300. If he's to grow you do need to start bumping that up quite a bit.


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## NdAppy

WindTree said:


> He just got his first worming here last week. Safe Guard paste. Prior to that the University wormed him. *I will worm him every month and rotate the brands*. I have some round bales a man shared with me I gave him for cutting it but I don't feed them that. Ok for cows but I prefer square bales for horses. Good hay around here is hard to come by. I did pick some up last week that looks to be the best I seen. Sometimes you can find Bermuda at a decent price. But he does get plenty of hay and some pasture grass. He is out running around all day. Like you said, may be some of the reason he got the pot belly. As far as his feed he's on 16% Omolene 300 and I just got him on that 100%. I was mixing 70% Omolene and 30% Horsemans Edge 14% because he was on the 14% to begin with. His poop looks ok, was a little soft but now its normal. He also loves his vitamin/mineral blocks. And he gets plenty of fresh water.
> Thanks for the hay info. I am going to look into that.



Per the bold, it is no long recommended to worm that often as it causes the worms to build up resistance. 

Honestly the best bet is to run a fecal count and worm accordingly


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## WindTree

Just finished mucking out his stall and changed his water and loaded up his hay bin. Got his bucket ready with a little over 4lbs of Omolene. So bout dark, I will head to the barn, stall him and let him have at it. One thing I noticed last night, normally he always eats with his head in the bucket gobbling it up like a dog. But last night and this morning, he eats a bit and raises his head up high and finshes it up, over and over. WHy is he doing that? I was thinking maybe his head is getting bigger??? I did notice is head is filling up his halter. It was loose when I first got him. His feed bucket is mounted up about chest high. But he don't do that when eating hay or grass out in the pasture. He did a lot of running today. He wore that stud out running the fence. In fact ran off and left old Hank (12yo) Hank got tired and walked off. He did about a hundred yard sprint and looked to going around 80 or 90. That was the fastest I seen him go. 
Im using the same brand right now as the Vet used and she told me to give to him every month to six weeks. But I will change up the wormer to keep the worms from becoming immune to it.


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## Endiku

Does he tilt his nose up higher than level with the ground? He might be having a hard time swallowing it if he's a quick eater. You could try wetting his food and letting it sit for a few minutes before giving it to him. I did that for my filly even though she never showed a sign of choking/having a hard time, just as a precaution because I've heard horror stories. It makes for a bit of a mess if they're haltered while eating but I think its worth it. Lowering his feed bucket might help a bit too. The lower it is, the closer it is to their natural eating stance (think grazing...head all the way down) and the easier it is for him. It is actually highly recommended to only feed at ground level if feeding grass pellets, beet pulp, or anything similar to that because chances of choke increase as the height increases.

If he still does it after that, he might just be an "ADD eater", like my gal was. She always wanted to be watching her surrounding while eating, so she'd grab a bite and cruise around, then go get another one when she was done chewing. It took her FOREVER to eat a few pounds of feed, and even longer to eat a flake of hay! LOL


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## WindTree

Makes sense to me. Tomorrow morning I will turn him out and lower his bucket to almost ground level before I feed him and see what difference it makes. I don't want him sticking his foot in it. I have his bucket mounted on a horizontal 2x4 so he wont turn it over or knock it off. No big deal to lower it. I don't leave a halter on him. Ive had to untangle horses off fence post and barb wire because they had halters on. And one got his foot hung between the halter and the side of his head. It was a dangerous experience for her and me. I see horses all the time running around with halters on. I saw one running down thru the woods one day had a saddle and bridle on but no rider. He was up on the hill in a cedar tree! Horse put him there. Maybe safer with wood fence but still not safe. 
Thanks


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## WindTree

NdAppy said:


> Per the bold, it is no long recommended to worm that often as it causes the worms to build up resistance.
> 
> Honestly the best bet is to run a fecal count and worm accordingly


Good Advice... I think I will do that. They don't charge much...I think around $20-$25 or so. 
Thanks


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

WindTree said:


> Good Advice... I think I will do that. They don't charge much...I think around $20-$25 or so.
> Thanks


The way I do my babies is to give them a daily dewormer and Ivermectin for their weight every month for the first year. That's per the vets at OK State University Vet School, not just me making stuff up. In the 2nd year, I give daily dewormer to all the youngsters and do Quest Plus twice, once in spring and once in fall. In the 3rd year, I discontinue the daily dewormer and go to fecal testing. If you have only one horse in a pasture or paddock, or if you own all the horses in the pasture, you can do the fecal tests and treat for the worms they have. Once you get into a multiple horse/multiple owners situation, all in the same pasture, the fecal testing becomes less effective if you don't all do it at roughly the same time.


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## NdAppy

Very good point DA. I have a closed herd, and tend to forget that aspect. :lol:


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

Fecal testing is great if you have a closed herd, or keep your horse stalled 24/7 in a boarding facility, but if they all get turned out together, then I'd hope the barn would schedule the fecals and deworm everyone accordingly, all at the same time. Kind of how we used to do the rotational dewormers, every 2nd month on the first Tuesday everyone dewormed with XXXX, or had the barn owner do it for them.


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## WindTree

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> The way I do my babies is to give them a daily dewormer and Ivermectin for their weight every month for the first year. That's per the vets at OK State University Vet School, not just me making stuff up. In the 2nd year, I give daily dewormer to all the youngsters and do Quest Plus twice, once in spring and once in fall. In the 3rd year, I discontinue the daily dewormer and go to fecal testing. If you have only one horse in a pasture or paddock, or if you own all the horses in the pasture, you can do the fecal tests and treat for the worms they have. Once you get into a multiple horse/multiple owners situation, all in the same pasture, the fecal testing becomes less effective if you don't all do it at roughly the same time.


Your scheldule is similar to what the Vet at the University recommended I do, monthly to six weeks. She did mention the fecal count test. I use Safe Guard paste on the Colt and have been using Ivermectin on my Jenny. But she seemed to have a problem with the dailey wormer saying studies have indicated that dailey wormers possibly promotes worms immunity at a faster rate. She didn't say do or not do. It was just her opinion. But she did say that dewormers are powerful and toxic and to be careful. A friend of mine uses Strongid c 2x dailey and strongly recommends it. 

I will see what the Vet says after the fecal test. My big concern is that the pasture north of my property has about 14 or 16 horses on it. They feed on round bales very close to my north fence. And when it rains I get a lot of runoff from that area onto my pasture where my Colt and Jenny are. And Im not sure if that old man is worming them or not. If I were to just flat out ask him, he would cuss me out. But I may ask him in a way that makes him feel like I need his advice and just see where that goes.


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## FGRanch

I can't believe anyone who say that the colt is malnourished...gesh


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

WindTree said:


> Your scheldule is similar to what the Vet at the University recommended I do, monthly to six weeks. She did mention the fecal count test. I use Safe Guard paste on the Colt and have been using Ivermectin on my Jenny. But she seemed to have a problem with the dailey wormer saying studies have indicated that dailey wormers possibly promotes worms immunity at a faster rate. She didn't say do or not do. It was just her opinion. But she did say that dewormers are powerful and toxic and to be careful. A friend of mine uses Strongid c 2x dailey and strongly recommends it.
> 
> I will see what the Vet says after the fecal test. My big concern is that the pasture north of my property has about 14 or 16 horses on it. They feed on round bales very close to my north fence. And when it rains I get a lot of runoff from that area onto my pasture where my Colt and Jenny are. And Im not sure if that old man is worming them or not. If I were to just flat out ask him, he would cuss me out. But I may ask him in a way that makes him feel like I need his advice and just see where that goes.


For some reason the daily dewormer seems to help avoid the pot belly look that they get if you don't use it. If you want to show halter, and we do, you almost have to use it. In CA & AZ we fed straight alfalfa and that seemed to help avoid it also, but out here in OK we can't use local alfalfa and I've not found a reasonable, reliable source for hay from a state without blister beetles. The resistance is one of the reasons I discontinue it when they are 3, adult horses are less likely to suffer permanent damage from worms as young horses are and it gets them off the daily. At that point, I go to fecal counts and see what the vet recommends. 

You might ask the old man what he uses to deworm his herd and when he does it, so that you can follow his lead and do yours at the same time with the same product, to keep everything in sync. That would be kind of a non-offensive way to go about it and hopefully not get you cussed out. You don't actually have to do it the same way he does it, but it might get a dialogue going.


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## WindTree

Endiku said:


> Does he tilt his nose up higher than level with the ground? He might be having a hard time swallowing it if he's a quick eater. You could try wetting his food and letting it sit for a few minutes before giving it to him. I did that for my filly even though she never showed a sign of choking/having a hard time, just as a precaution because I've heard horror stories. It makes for a bit of a mess if they're haltered while eating but I think its worth it. Lowering his feed bucket might help a bit too. The lower it is, the closer it is to their natural eating stance (think grazing...head all the way down) and the easier it is for him. It is actually highly recommended to only feed at ground level if feeding grass pellets, beet pulp, or anything similar to that because chances of choke increase as the height increases.
> 
> If he still does it after that, he might just be an "ADD eater", like my gal was. She always wanted to be watching her surrounding while eating, so she'd grab a bite and cruise around, then go get another one when she was done chewing. It took her FOREVER to eat a few pounds of feed, and even longer to eat a flake of hay! LOL


Lowered his feed bucket almost ground level. It worked! He's eaten out it three times and no more raising that head up high! When he starts off he seems to be getting big mouth fulls because its deep with grain. He will raise his mouth almost chest high ever so often but that's it. After he gets on down he just burys his head there slurping and a going on. He licks that bucket clean. 
THanks!


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

WindTree said:


> Lowered his feed bucket almost ground level. It worked! He's eaten out it three times and no more raising that head up high! When he starts off he seems to be getting big mouth fulls because its deep with grain. He will raise his mouth almost chest high ever so often but that's it. After he gets on down he just burys his head there slurping and a going on. He licks that bucket clean.
> THanks!


Just in case, if he ever starts to choke or eat so fast you think he might choke, put some fist sized rocks in there that he has to move around to get to the grain. It will slow him down to the point where choking won't be an issue.


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## FGRanch

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> Just in case, if he ever starts to choke or eat so fast you think he might choke, put some fist sized rocks in there that he has to move around to get to the grain. It will slow him down to the point where choking won't be an issue.


I have also used tennis balls with great success. Rocks always scared me because I worried about them biting them and breaking their teeth.


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## WindTree

Something worth considering. He is an aggressive eater and I don't want him breaking his teeth, but would like to slow him down a bit. I will find something heavy and rubberized, part rock, part tennis ball. He ate a flake of Alfalfa during the night that was mixed in with his hay. I saw the Vet School people today and mentioned that I had increased his Omolene from six lbs to eight lbs a day. They seemed a bit surprised and said they have never feed that much a day to any of their horses. But according to the charts that is about right for his age/weight and this feed in. I will keep an eye on him. We spend a lot of time with him and do notice anything different in his behavior, moods, poop etc. And its been very COLD here and more cold is coming. Around 15 this coming Monday morning. 
Thanks Again!


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## WindTree

Oh.... I did pick up a weight tape and will check him in the morning.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

Cool! Looking forward to more pics when it warms up and I'm curious to see what he tapes at, height & weight wise.


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## WindTree

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> Cool! Looking forward to more pics when it warms up and I'm curious to see what he tapes at, height & weight wise.


 I did this several times and think its fairly accurate.
Height at the withers 50"
Heart Girth 55" Just behind the shoulder and 
behind the wither
Length 51" front of shoulder slightly angled up to rear
of butt. 

tape indicated somewhere around 500 lbs

12.5 hh


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

WindTree said:


> I did this several times and think its fairly accurate.
> Height at the withers 50"
> Heart Girth 55" Just behind the shoulder and
> behind the wither
> Length 51" front of shoulder slightly angled up to rear
> of butt.
> 
> tape indicated somewhere around 500 lbs
> 
> 12.5 hh


Ok, here in America we say 12.2hh (12 hands 2 inches, in EU they use 12.5 for 12 1/2). I'll measure my guy this afternoon and let you know what he comes out at for comparison. He was born mid Feb 2013, so is 11 months old (really a yearling). According to the SmartPak Weight Calculator which takes measurments to calculate, he weighs 468 lbs. I'll get back to you about how much my guy weighs later.


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## WindTree

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> Ok, here in America we say 12.2hh (12 hands 2 inches, in EU they use 12.5 for 12 1/2). I'll measure my guy this afternoon and let you know what he comes out at for comparison. He was born mid Feb 2013, so is 11 months old (really a yearling). According to the SmartPak Weight Calculator which takes measurments to calculate, he weighs 468 lbs. I'll get back to you about how much my guy weighs later.


Sorry......Yes I measured him in the USA. My math error! 50" = 12.2hh. I think I got the same measurement a week or so ago.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

WindTree said:


> Sorry......Yes I measured him in the USA. My math error! 50" = 12.2hh. I think I got the same measurement a week or so ago.


Ok, I measured Bo, my yearling gelding (2/13/13) at 13.1 hh and 630 lbs. My boarder's horse who is cow bred and was stunted is now at 13.2 and 615 as a 2 y.o. I have a filly I picked up last summer who just came 3 and is 14.0 and 750 lbs., she also was stunted and starved when I got her. Bo is kind of big, he's all halter bred, so he's going to be 16 hands when he's done and probably outweigh his mom who's 16.1 and 1300 when she's not pregnant.


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## Endiku

12.2 is a pretty decent size for a 7 month old. Have you string tested him to get an estimate of how tall he'll be when he grows up? Its pretty accurate, or so I've heard. My filly was 12.2hh and 14-15 months old when I got her, weighing in at only 290 lbs (rescue case, very very thin) and when I string tested her it said she would be 15.2. I was like "no way!" but its possible that she'll actually still end up close to that despite her stunting...I sold her a few months ago but as of 25 months old she was 14hh at the wither and 14.1 1/2hh at the butt...and they say that young two year olds usually put on a whole 4 inches by the time they're done!


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## Dualy2006

Hes so cute. His legs ae nice and straight but he is quite butt high so he still has growingto do ( onviously since hes less than a year )


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## WindTree

My farrier came by yesterday and was really impressed with his overall conformation, weight, height etc . This farrier knows his stuff and tells it like it is. He also treats horses for disorders in the hips, knees legs etc. He could not find any rotation issues what so ever. He thinks the pics were deceiving and like most of you have already mentioned....he said he is really too young to be critiqued. I really appreciate all the help and advice. Thanks! I will post pics when he's developed a little more this summer.


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## WindTree

WindTree said:


> OK it was tough getting these but I got some pics. Thanks


This is a new one of him taken today. It's been six or eight weeks. I think he's showing results.


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## Elana

Keeping a youngsters feet trimmed (every three weeks) so they grow straight is very very important!!! 

I won't say more.. as he is too young to really critique. Just get on those feet and stay on those feet. Trim level and true. The horse will grow over top of them.. they are the leg's foundation!

Love that you have a good farrier.


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## WindTree

Elana said:


> Keeping a youngsters feet trimmed (every three weeks) so they grow straight is very very important!!!
> 
> I won't say more.. as he is too young to really critique. Just get on those feet and stay on those feet. Trim level and true. The horse will grow over top of them.. they are the leg's foundation!
> 
> Love that you have a good farrier.


Elana, Thanks... Yes we been saying that all along. Too young to critique. And yes we do have a great farlrier. He is due this week. He's been coming on a four week scheldule. I'm about 25 miles NE of him and he travels in a circle about 50 miles out every direction from his home. He also takes care of Mississippi State University's horses. He graduated from there and worked as foreman over the Horse unit for MSU for a few years. Later attended a shoeing School in Georgia and is BWFA certified. He also does correction and lameness shoeing and hot shoeing. He charges $35 per horse. Dakota's hoofs do grow fast. He's on a high protein diet and does a lot of running every day. I'm constantly walking the field picking up anything that may be harmful to his feet and filling any holes (most of which he created) that might cause him to stumble. So far we been lucky not having to treat abseses or cuts etc. Like most all young colts he has shown some aggression and Ive been kicked and struck, reared on, nipped and bit and charged but luckly not hurt. In every instance I was able to react instantly with discipline and authority. Most of the time he's fine but every so often, he gets antsy. Usually in the morning taking him out of the stall. He has to check everything out and all the mares and stud across the fence. So I have changed up the pattern. We feed him in the stall, groom him and just turn him out and halter him and work with him later after he's released some of that anxiety. I will be glad when it warms and dries up. Ice and snow tonight and tomorrow...


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