# Broke my Black Forest saddle. Off the trails for awhile. :-(



## SailorGriz

Last Saturday on a trail cleanup ride Mr. Big spooked or shied or something when I was trying to mount. I was just in the process of getting ready to swing into the saddle when he bolted forward a short distance. I must have still had one foot on the ground since I don't recall that falling was an issue.

However, I must have been holding the pommel pretty tight as I got ready to launch into the air to mount. When Big bolted, the pommel came off in my hand. Well, not clear off, but it ripped the saddle covering that it was stitched to.

I ride, or was riding, a Black Forest treeless saddle that I've really enjoyed. It's comfortable for me and, more importantly, is comfortable for Mr. Big. It sits well, stays put (once I get it tight enough) and has never caused any sort of "hot spot" on Big's back.

And I had always thought that it was made fairly well. I've since learned differently!

Since there is no tree the pommel is simply sewn to the top saddle cover. I'd assumed it was sewn through the saddle for strength. Not so! the ends of the pommel cover are sewn into the top layer of saddle covering over a fairly large area and I've always been amazed at how sturdy the pommel felt.

Until I put some pressure on it. Not even a lot of pressure as I let go as soon as Big really started to move. But, alas, it was enough. The top covering of the saddle let go along the stitch lines and the pommel now hangs loose.

I bought the saddle last fall. When I contacted Black Forest Vic said it wasn't covered by warranty but that he'd talk to "the powers that be" (I suspect that's his wife and, maybe, lawyer) and get back to me today. Since he asked if anyone got hurt (after seeing the pix of the damage) I'm thinking he's checking with his lawyer to discover the extent of liability. No one got hurt, thank the Stars, but it doesn't bode well for me!

In the meantime, I'm looking for a new saddle. Can't afford something really expensive and I can't spend all summer looking for something that fits Big. I'm considering a Royal King with a auto-flex tree in the hopes that it'll fit his broad, arched back and high whithers. But I've not decided, yet.

Part of my problem is that I'm planning two, or maybe three, week long trips into the Wilderness Areas of Idaho this summer. Having a saddle break 3 miles from your rig is an inconvenience. Having a saddle break 3 days out can be a disaster. And I don't much trust Black Forest saddles after this little incident. And finding out that Black Forest doesn't trust them enough to stand behind them certainly doesn't help! 

Sorry for the disertation.


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## QOS

Sailorgriz, thank God you weren't hurt. Wow...could have been ugly. 

Would you be interested at all in Aussie Saddles? I have two that do not fit The Biscuit. They were for Dashing Big Red, my former gelding. Red is 15.3 hh and a good sized boy. One of the Aussies is a Down Under Wizzard Poley with a horn and is 18" and has all the bells and whistles (the woolie leg protectors, breast strap, suede stirrup pads) and the 19" is a Kimberly Stock saddle that doesn't have a horn and is a synthetic. They are both UBER comfortable and the only reason I didn't use them for Biscuit is they just don't fit!!!

Send me a PM if you are interested. Glad you weren't hurt and hopefully they will replace you saddle - seems like at the least they should repair!


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## Painted Horse

A good western saddle is hard to beat for packing and trail riding.
Check you local classified and see whats for sale in the area.
Here in Northern Utah. a local TV/Radio station has a website with classifeds. way better than Craigs list. Classifieds for Utah, Idaho, and Wyoming - ksl.com I bought a couple extra saddles off here for $600 from a lady getting out of horses. They were almost new, hardly been used. I'll bet she hadn't ridden 15 times in either one. One was a Reinsman and the other was a Tucker. Both sell new for $1500 to $1700 

My kids have grown up and I just needed more larger saddles.

Lots of folks getting out of horses because they can't afford them in todays ecconomy. They are often happy to take what they can get for their tack.


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## equus717

Yikes. I was considering getting a treeless western saddle but now am hesitating since seeing these pictures. I hope you find a good saddle to replace the one you had.


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## RoxanneElizabeth

I hope they are able to repair the saddle at a affordable price!


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## SailorGriz

Well, well. Black Forest saddles says that when the pommel rips off of one of their saddles they won't cover it under warranty. Makes me wonder what they DO cover, but that's a different story.

They do, however, have a "goodwill" policy that works like this: they determine what shipping and repairs would cost and subtract that from the cost of a new saddle--then credit you the difference to apply toward the saddle of your choice.

In my case the credit came to $269 against a $429 saddle that nuked. I can apply the $269 against any saddle they sell. If I get a direct replacement, I basically get a new saddle for the price of getting the old one repaired. Guess they don' t want to mess around with fixing busted saddles.

I guess it's not too bad considering they could have left me out in the cold. But I'm still not sure I trust their saddles--and where I plan to ride, I gotta trust my saddle!


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## SailorGriz

Saturday we take Mr. Big up to Spokane to fit saddles. I've lined up a saddle/tack shop where we'll meet with the owner and see what she has and I'm working on lining up a couple of private parties via TackTrader. 

The Grand Plan is to come home with a saddle and give it a good ride on Sunday or Monday to see if it'll really do the job.

We decided we just don't trust Black Forest. If the owners won't stand 100%BEHIND their saddles I won't stand IN their saddles! Nor buy another one nor sit in 'em, neither!

QOS, thanks for the info on your saddles. I think they're too big for me and I really need to try saddles on Big to make sure they fit well enought.


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## QOS

Your welcome Sailor - but just to let you know, Aussie saddles are sized like English. The 18" is like a 16" Western and the 19 like a 17. It is always best to try them on if possible. 

I will tell you I had Biscuit's new saddle custom made from Alleghany Saddles in New York. They sent out saddle fitting forms that I tried on The Biscuit and took tons of pictures with him with the forms from different angles. The result was a perfect fitting saddle that cost me around $1100. The leather is wonderful and that was with the upgraded seat. They were also very nice to work with. Takes a while to get a saddle but I love the looks, feel and fit of it.

Good luck on finding a good saddle - you have to trust that it will take you out and back again safely.


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## Nokota

sorry to hear about the broken saddle. I'm with painted, a good western saddle can really stand the test of time, Good luck finding another, I hope you get exactly what you want.


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## SailorGriz

thanks Nokota. There's a half dozen, or so, used ones up in the Spokane area. We'll take Big and go for an excursion on Saturday. Hopefully, one of them will work. As a last resort the tack shop in Spokane Valley has some new ones I could also look at. But I don't want to spend that much!


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## SailorGriz

350 miles and five saddles later, Mr. Big has a new seat for me to ride in. The nicest saddle I tried was a Tucker trail saddle that was just as supple as can be. But it didn't fit Big's withers--too tight. It was also more expensive than we wanted but we would have handled that if it'd been the right saddle in every other way.

We ended up with a fairly inexpensive roping saddle. It seems to fit Big and it works very nicely with the very expensive pad I bought for the Black Forest. Interestingly, I'd never really felt "insecure" in the Black Forest saddle--it always felt stable and solid. But when I tried out the western saddles I realized that the BF saddle was anything BUT stable! Very interesting experience!

Assuming it continues to seem like a good fit on Big I think this will make a fine saddle for me. I'll post pix tomorrow, I hope. If it's pouring rain all day the pix will be delayed a tad!

But, I'm back in the saddle and this week will be back on the trails!


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## QOS

glad you found a saddle that works for you and Mr. Big. Tuckers are soft and comfy - I like that!


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## Nokota

Good for you!! Now we need PICS!!!!!


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## SailorGriz

OK, Nokota, Pix you get! It's a like new saddle. Not sure it's ever even been oiled it's so new. The woman who sold it to me bought it for her teenager who lost weight and it no longer fit. So she bought a new one and sold this one to help pay for it.

It has a lot more tooling on it that I wanted--I was looking for a very plain jane sort of saddle. At least it doesn't have any silver other than the conchos. I had hoped to avoid as much "bling" as I could--but then I got what fit. Sometimes you just gotta take what you can find.

It's a barrel saddle with minimal dee's. I've ordered dee's and chicago screws from Tandy Leather so I can add some in, as needed. I can punch right through the skirt and bolt the dee's pretty much anywhere.

I saddled up Big this morning and went up the Butte across the road for a bit then we did a loop around the property lines on our place through the not yet planted fields. Going up the Butte the saddle slipped back a bit but it might be that I didn't put it on far enough forwardward so it started back and only moved a little. Before I get too excited I'll try it again a few times.

Big seemed comfortable in the saddle and I was comfortable, too, so I think it'll work out fine. 

There is one, fairly minor, aesthetic issue. I'll leave it to the forum members to see if they can tell what it might be. :?


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## QOS

It is simply an aesthetic issue - but I will say you are the most secure man that I know!!! Hugs!!


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## SailorGriz

The saddle feels secure, too, and that's what's REALLY important! ;-)


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## phantomhorse13

if it fits big and your butt, who cares what color it is?

and hey, you'll never have to wonder from a distance if the saddle is yours or not.

down the road, you can even get matching a biothane bridle! :lol:


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## SailorGriz

Whew. Phantom, when I first read your post I thought you said "if it fits your big butt . . . . "!!!!

I was starting to wonder if we'd met! ;-)

But, yes, color is fairly far down on the critical attributes list!


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## phantomhorse13

SailorGriz said:


> Whew. Phantom, when I first read your post I thought you said "if it fits your big butt . . . . "!!!!
> 
> I was starting to wonder if we'd met! ;-)



lol! as someone who spends most of her saddle time in tights, i would be the last person to make comments on the size of someone's rear! :lol:


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## SailorGriz

I have a feeling you look better in tights than I would! 

As a distance rider I bet you really appreciate a good fitting saddle? Both good fitting for the horse (most important) and for you (still important!).


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## QOS

OMG y'all gave me a laugh this morning and I needed that!!! I did a double take on that Big and Butt too!!

A good comfortable saddle is worth their weight in gold! 

Phantom, what type of saddle are you riding in?


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## SailorGriz

QOS, it is our aim and pleasure to serve your need for humor in the morning! 

I don't think Phantom needs a saddle, does she? She doesn't sit down. I think she just needs stirrups bolted to the sides of her horse. ;-)


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## QOS

LOL I don't think bolts are going to make her horse a happy camper!!!


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## SailorGriz

QOS said:


> LOL I don't think bolts are going to make her horse a happy camper!!!


You DO have a point, QOS! 

Continuing to get my saddle fitted to me and getting used to riding in it. Sure is different from my treeless! I feel a whole lot better in this one even if it isn't as comfy on my backsides.

Big did 120 degree shy today and I didn't even feel off balance. I would have been struggling with the Black Forest to stay on. There is something to be said for a solid sitting barrel saddle! 

And, even with some ups and downs on fairly steep hills, it didn't move today. I had it further forward than last time and probably a bit tighter--mayube too tight. I gotta work with someone on how tight is tight enough. Always something!


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## QOS

Glad the saddle is working for you. A good seat is a wonderful feeling. 

Tight is tight enough when the saddle is not shifting. I have a problem with wanting to girth up too tight myself. LOL Poor old Biscuit parked out when I saddled him Sunday. LOL He is a QH - not a gaited horse so I loosened that girth! Poor guy!!


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## SailorGriz

I find the leverage multiplier created by double wrapping the cinch strap makes it really easy to girth way too tight. I had the same problem when putting the pack saddle on the little Arabian--but he was smart enough to tell me about it and make me loosen it a bit! Mr. Big hasn't figured that out--at least, he hasn't figured out how to tell me in a language I can understand!


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## QOS

LOL if you ever pinch his vagus nerve he will let you know LOUD and CLEAR when he drops to the ground like a sack of feed. I tightened Red's girth the first week I got him and I didn't tighten it too tight and OMG he collapsed on ground in a heap. He leaped up so fast and just stood there looking embarrassed. I nearly had a stroke. Since then I have been extremely careful cinching up my horse!


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## HarleyDRider

*Black Forest Treeless Saddles*

I know this is a very old thread - a little over 2 years, in fact - but just wanted to add my experience with Black Forest saddles. I have a 5+ year-old Black Forest Shasta Echo (English rigged) that I have ridden up, over, around and through very rugged terrain and it is still going strong with minimal signs of wear. 

In response to the person (SailorGriz) whose horn tore off when his horse bolted during mounting, the Black Forest website very plainly states that the horn is a decorative item and should only be considered as such: 

*"Can I use the horn of the Town & Country for roping or ponying?"*


"The horn on our western saddle is connected to the fiberglass pommel; however it is not affixed to the saddle itself. Please only use the horn for decorative purposes or for tying small, lightweight objects such as a camera or water bottle. All of our saddles offer 7 d-rings for carrying or tying smaller objects."


I presume you've solved your saddle issue by now, but hope you and others will not shy away from a fantastic saddle because it didn't perform _above_ it's stated expectations. :-|


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## bsms

^^ Given it is a 2 year old thread, maybe the website has been updated to reflect what happened? Frankly, if a saddle horn is weak enough to break off from my hand's pressure, then it shouldn't be there at all.


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## Malice

As I understood the thread, it was not the horn but the pommel which would should be even more secured then the horn as it sits on a larger area. My whole thing is that whatever is near a horse needs to be "horse proof" for the safety of the horse and rider. The fact that in the thread it was stated the saddlery specifically refuses to fix pommel repairs in their contract throws up another red flag for me as they obviously see common problems with this saddle and cover their butts with contracts instead of fixing it. If the POMMEL of this saddle can be nearly completely ripped off by hand then the saddles are frankly useless and would never have one in my tack room, 5 years 'strong' or not.


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## garlicbunny

at least when you are sitting in it, you can't see pink! Maybe a sheepskin seat saver would be nice! Anyways it is a nice looking saddle!


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