# 14 year old QH mare



## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Y'all have seen her before, this is my 14 year old Quarter Horse mare. She has been out of exercise for two years and recently has started to come back. She is a barrel horse and she's pretty darn nice at what she does. Anyways. I got new and better pictures. The last one of her wasn't that great. The angle on the side picture is way better but still hard since I was taking them by myself.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Front legs


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Back legs


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

Hi - thanks for sharing  She has a very cute face  She needs a ton of groceries and get her hooves on trimming schedule.. Her pasterns seem really upright to me.. I think it would be really interesting to see her few months from now when she puts weight on


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

Also - her back looks really long at the first look - however on 2nd. look she seems to be standing on an angle with her hind end.. she needs to be squared up not swaying her butt away from the camera..


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

MyBrandy said:


> Also - her back looks really long at the first look - however on 2nd. look she seems to be standing on an angle with her hind end.. she needs to be squared up not swaying her butt away from the camera..


When I get help the side will be much easier. 

Right now, she is actually fat. She just has ZERO muscle. She eats one scoop of 12% pellet and 12% sweet feed with unlimited access to hay. So her groceries are all there. She's actually pot bellied, I think I'm late for worming.... 
Thank you for your input! Farrier actually comes out tomorrow to trim her and fix her shoes. So she's right on schedule  she's absolutely filthy in this pictures, but I believe the "skinny" look comes from her lack of muscle in every area of her body. She has a big belly on her xD


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

She eats the two scoops together twice a day sorry I forgot to say that


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Here she was yesterday. To me her weight seems fine. Could it just be the angle or do I need to add groceries?


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## CLaPorte432 (Jan 3, 2012)

The first picture...she looks very thin. Almost sick looking. Her neck is very thin and has that sunken look to it. Ribs are showing even through a winter coat. The color of the photo is off, but her coat looks dull. Eyes look a little listless too. Based on that picture...id guess she was mid-20s. But, She's your horse, you know her best...

I saw in another thread you wanted to get her checked for ulcers. I'd definitely recommend that. 

She needs a top line and weight/muscle...which in turn needs proper conditioning and a good diet. I'd cut out the Sweet feed and add a good Senior pellet into the mix. Nutrena SafeChoice makes an incredible Senior formula.
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## stevenson (Sep 12, 2011)

shes thin, and dont know if its hair or what but looks to have some issues with her knee, swollen or arthritic ?


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

She does look back in the first pic, and I'm not sure why. I may have my camera stuck on a weird effect. I think I forgot to take the effect off... Tomorrow if not chilly I'll bathe her, she has sweat crusted to her poor body it's sad ! 
I do want to get her checked for ulcers. She is very girthy and in a very sandy environment, it wouldn't hurt. 
She hasn't been rode much for two years, so she is now getting worked out, fed more to keep up with exercise. 
I'll look into that, her hocks are getting puffy so I'm concerned about a bit of arthritis, I know she's getting older and being an active horse it's very possible. Do you know of any supplements?


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

stevenson said:


> shes thin, and dont know if its hair or what but looks to have some issues with her knee, swollen or arthritic ?


I can promise you, she actually isn't that thin. I took that picture today but yesterday she was as fat as a pig. I know she's under muscles but as for belly wise, she isn't thin. 

She's always had a little bump on her knee, but it's never caused a problem!


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## CLaPorte432 (Jan 3, 2012)

CortaFlex with HA is a great oral supplement. And I do Pentosan IM injections.

I think she needs to be brought back into work slowly though. At 14, she isn't old, but she's not a young girl anymore and taking them to shows and running isn't going to be easy on her. She's going to try her heart out, but at what cost to her health? 

Lots of long trotting to bring her back into work and build muscle. And I'd stop running until she is muscled up and fit. It's a good way to pull something.

I see the bump on her left knee too. Could be cosmetic, could be something more.

Also, quality of hay will impact belly size too. The lower the quality, the more of a hay gut they'll get due to not getting enough nutrients and poor digestion. (Not saying that you hay low quality hay but just throwing another option out there)
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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

This was taken the 17th. Could she have been dehydrated and her flanks were drawn high or something seriously off?


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

CLaPorte432 said:


> CortaFlex with HA is a great oral supplement. And I do Pentosan IM injections.
> 
> I think she needs to be brought back into work slowly though. At 14, she isn't old, but she's not a young girl anymore and taking them to shows and running isn't going to be easy on her. She's going to try her heart out, but at what cost to her health?
> 
> ...


I'll look into that. She gets rode 2-3 times a week at a trot or lope for about 30-45 minutes. Of course with lots of walking to cools down and breathe. 
I suppose you're right with the running. She's been back for about two months, and I just started pushing her. Otherwise she ran her pace. I'll keep her back, and just condition her. 
I won't work on the pattern, she's one of those weirdos who does bad at the actual race the more you work her on the pattern during the week. 
We've used the same hay, unsure of quality for years. She always gets a big hay belly off of it. She's never been a hard keeper, she's actually always been on diets. 
I've had her knee checked, there's no lameness from the bump, but she goes back for another exam in April. 
I don't like to inject, my family and I are against it so we look more for oral treatments.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

CLA have you heard of Cosequin? I'm reading some great reviews on this product and it's a bit more in my price range. I read about the project you told me of, I saw many many bad reviews?


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## Elana (Jan 28, 2011)

This is a nice little horse but as every one says she needs groceries. Just because she has hay does not mean she is utilizing the hay (or that the hay has any nutritional value!). Have the hay tested. It may be so high in NDF that it has little feed value. I would have this mare on a couple of pounds of alfalfa cubes a day in addition to what you are giving her now. 

Check for ulcers. Have her teeth floated and looked at. Get a farrier to trim her. Be sure she has free choice fresh clean water all the time. 

Stop riding her until that is cleared up and she gains about 100 pounds. I like this horse. You should like her enough to do these things. 

When you get that done and this horse is in good flesh I expect this horse will move you right up in Barrel competition because she is that nice and she is worth it.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Elana said:


> This is a nice little horse but as every one says she needs groceries. Just because she has hay does not mean she is utilizing the hay (or that the hay has any nutritional value!). Have the hay tested. It may be so high in NDF that it has little feed value. I would have this mare on a couple of pounds of alfalfa cubes a day in addition to what you are giving her now.
> 
> Check for ulcers. Have her teeth floated and looked at. Get a farrier to trim her. Be sure she has free choice fresh clean water all the time.
> 
> ...


Said before, her feet are getting done today. They were supposed to be done Friday but our farrier is ALWAYS late. Yet I only trust him with my horses feet. Hers were absolutely RUINED a few years ago. 
We are going to switch her to a senior feed, also probably put her on a supplement for arthritis. Alfalfa here is VERY expensive, since I don't run the money if really have to try and get alfalfa for her, there is no promise I will. I haven't even seen alfalfa sold here In a while but I also haven't looked. 
She JUST had her teeth floated about two months ago, and we will examine her for ulcers probably in April or May. All depends on the finance.


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

I've had tremendous success with Kent SBP 14/10 feed (protein / fat) - low sugar / starch feed - it implements cool calories from ride bran - it gets their coat looking wonderful.. promotes overall condition of skin / hair / hooves.. I think they changed the name of it since last year - I only use it with my horses when riden 3+ times per week - that is about 5 months in a year.

Kent now makes is for Blue seal I think.. the higher protein and fat combined with regular workout will do miracles with any horse.. And yes she probably needs worming also - have you had her teeth checked / floated in the past 12 months? She does look thin..


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

MyBrandy said:


> I've had tremendous success with Kent SBP 14/10 feed (protein / fat) - low sugar / starch feed - it implements cool calories from ride bran - it gets their coat looking wonderful.. promotes overall condition of skin / hair / hooves.. I think they changed the name of it since last year - I only use it with my horses when riden 3+ times per week - that is about 5 months in a year.
> 
> Kent now makes is for Blue seal I think.. the higher protein and fat combined with regular workout will do miracles with any horse.. And yes she probably needs worming also - have you had her teeth checked / floated in the past 12 months? She does look thin..


Do you know the wormer for this time of year? I get the workers mixed up a lot -__- she does look thin but she actually isn't thin which is why I'm so thrown off. Yet I'm taking any advice because others can see more than I can. 
I'll look up that feed and see what the prices range around here. Her teeth were floated two months or so ago.


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

Oh and ditto on lot of trotting with her to build topline.. also if you can walk up and downhill with her a lot (don't allow her to run it up) should improve topline


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

The worming routine for your horse is something you should discuss with your vet in particular - every horse is in a different situation (boarded? Or on your property? what is your manure management like on the property she is at? Is she in paddock used by other horses / foals etc?)
- For example I found out that I was over-deworming my horses.. My vet said they are in low risk and they are considered low shedders because they live on our property - only the 2 of them, the poop gets picked up from their paddocks every day or every other day, so the ground is not getting re-infected with worms.. Also we test their poop on regular basis and since it came our as "no eggs seen" they are fine to only worm 2 x per year.. now that would be completely different IF they were boarded with other horses or there were foals turned out in the same paddock. I'd say ask your vet what he/she recommends for your horse situation.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

MyBrandy said:


> Oh and ditto on lot of trotting with her to build topline.. also if you can walk up and downhill with her a lot (don't allow her to run it up) should improve topline


If I had hills I would do that a lot more, it's pretty flat out here:/ she holds her head nice and low so trotting is pretty nice with her, if I could slow her down a bit!! She's full of fire and loves to go fast but she slows down... If she MUST (;


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

MyBrandy said:


> The worming routine for your horse is something you should discuss with your vet in particular - every horse is in a different situation (boarded? Or on your property? what is your manure management like on the property she is at? Is she in paddock used by other horses / foals etc?)
> - For example I found out that I was over-deworming my horses.. My vet said they are in low risk and they are considered low shedders because they live on our property - only the 2 of them, the poop gets picked up from their paddocks every day or every other day, so the ground is not getting re-infected with worms.. Also we test their poop on regular basis and since it came our as "no eggs seen" they are fine to only worm 2 x per year.. now that would be completely different IF they were boarded with other horses or there were foals turned out in the same paddock. I'd say ask your vet what he/she recommends for your horse situation.


Hmm I never realized how much it varied! I've always been a late wormer! I forget half of the time. I'll call them. She's pastured with another mare and her colt. It's acreage so the manure stays in the pasture, it's funny they seconded off one side to use as the potty! 
I try to take out the pasture or even the ground in their "potty area" as often and best I can. I might just make that call today! I've never heard of how much it varies on their living conditions!


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

Well - I can relate - my mare wants to to fast too, but she doesn't know that it's not good for her to do all the time and eventually will start running through the bridle and will get out of frame.. if she gets like that I get her doing lots of serpentine under saddle and box exercises.


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## CLaPorte432 (Jan 3, 2012)

Aesthetic said:


> CLA have you heard of Cosequin? I'm reading some great reviews on this product and it's a bit more in my price range. I read about the project you told me of, I saw many many bad reviews?


I haven't seen bad reviews on the CortaFlex HA. I order mine from horse.com. 

Cosequin to me is expensive. I have heard of it, but have not used it personally. 

You'll just have to try to find something to work, you may have to try a few different things or a combination of things before seeing results.
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## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

Have you considered buying/using a feed bag for grain and senior feed?
Nylon Feeder Bag - Statelinetack.com
I, too, like this mare. Your last photo shows her off the best. If you could take another like it with her head Up, that would help. Good luck with her.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Corporal said:


> Have you considered buying/using a feed bag for grain and senior feed?
> Nylon Feeder Bag - Statelinetack.com
> I, too, like this mare. Your last photo shows her off the best. If you could take another like it with her head Up, that would help. Good luck with her.


I'll try after I bathe her. We have a cold front and rain mostly this week. 
I haven't heard of a feed bag, I'll look into it. The only bag I've heard of was a hay bag.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

CLaPorte432 said:


> I haven't seen bad reviews on the CortaFlex HA. I order mine from horse.com.
> 
> Cosequin to me is expensive. I have heard of it, but have not used it personally.
> 
> ...


I read people saying don't bother using it and they haven't seen results. I'll probably try a few before I find one and I'll end up posting what's working for her. We are ordering a supplement ASAP. I can't get feed until we finish all of this feed. Do you have any ideas on what I could put in her feed until then? Beet pulp? She colics easy so I have to move very slowly


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

Aesthetic said:


> I read people saying don't bother using it and they haven't seen results. I'll probably try a few before I find one and I'll end up posting what's working for her. We are ordering a supplement ASAP. I can't get feed until we finish all of this feed. Do you have any ideas on what I could put in her feed until then? Beet pulp? She colics easy so I have to move very slowly



<======= ground flax seed (coffee grinders are like $10+), start slow - VERY good fat for her.. they love the taste too


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

You can make like hay cube wet mash and add the ground flax seed into it - she will love you for that


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

MyBrandy said:


> <======= ground flax seed (coffee grinders are like $10+), start slow - VERY good fat for her.. they love the taste too


Shoot things at me. I'm going to take notes and do some research. She colics so easy I'm really nervous about a lot of change and I have to move really slow.


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

Aesthetic said:


> Shoot things at me. I'm going to take notes and do some research. She colics so easy I'm really nervous about a lot of change and I have to move really slow.



<====== Okay then that sounds like I am going to repeat myself - talk to your vet about this - it seems that she has multiple things going on and her entire health background needs to be addressed properly. I have never heard of any horse collicking from ground flax seed but like with any dietary change you need to take caution when introducing new feed / supplement and knowing your mare is sensitive you just take it very slow


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

MyBrandy said:


> <====== Okay then that sounds like I am going to repeat myself - talk to your vet about this - it seems that she has multiple things going on and her entire health background needs to be addressed properly. I have never heard of any horse collicking from ground flax seed but like with any dietary change you need to take caution when introducing new feed / supplement and knowing your mare is sensitive you just take it very slow


She has coliced at hay changes. We've never changed feed so I don't know how she will react to this. I'm going to go slow, I'm just doing research on feeds, supplements, and fattening items.


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## Elana (Jan 28, 2011)

You mentioned she is on sand? If she is on sand AND has had colic issues could be she needs to be cleaned out because she may have sand in her gut. 

Alfalfa (hay) cubes are bought by the 50 pound bag. They are really high in feed value so you don't need to feed more than a couple of pounds per day with free choice hay. 

You can also add corn oil to her feed (a cup a day) as it adds calories and is very cheap. You will need to supplement it with a supplement high in Vitamin A and E since corn oil can interfere with the absorption of those vitamins.


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## Dustbunny (Oct 22, 2012)

Take a manure sample in to the vet and have them check it. That way you will know what parasites she has and what deworming product to use.


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

Elana said:


> You mentioned she is on sand? If she is on sand AND has had colic issues could be she needs to be cleaned out because she may have sand in her gut.
> 
> Alfalfa (hay) cubes are bought by the 50 pound bag. They are really high in feed value so you don't need to feed more than a couple of pounds per day with free choice hay.
> 
> You can also add corn oil to her feed (a cup a day) as it adds calories and is very cheap. You will need to supplement it with a supplement high in Vitamin A and E since corn oil can interfere with the absorption of those vitamins.


<======= I second the alfalfa cubes as I give this to my guys in winter (soaked) and it really is great for gaining weight- I do oppose corn oil as it doesn't have correct Omega3 to Omega 6 fatty acid ratio - ground flax or flax seed oil is next thing best to fresh pasture


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Elana said:


> You mentioned she is on sand? If she is on sand AND has had colic issues could be she needs to be cleaned out because she may have sand in her gut.
> 
> Alfalfa (hay) cubes are bought by the 50 pound bag. They are really high in feed value so you don't need to feed more than a couple of pounds per day with free choice hay.
> 
> You can also add corn oil to her feed (a cup a day) as it adds calories and is very cheap. You will need to supplement it with a supplement high in Vitamin A and E since corn oil can interfere with the absorption of those vitamins.


We are getting her lameness exam in April. After that exam we are going to set a date to check for ulcers and any issues caused by sand. Her basic exam is when she goes in for lameness so she will have her manure checked for worms and sand. 
Alfalfa hasn't been in good supply here so I need to look for it. My faith in alfalfa cubes needs to be restored. I've bought several bags that ended up moldy but that's most likely the stores fault. It's been a year or two since I've got alfalfa. Alright, I'll read up on corn oil with horses. I'm making myself a nice list.


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## Endiku (Dec 6, 2010)

Aesthetic, for some reason I remember you living near-ish to me in Texas? Maybe that was someone else.

If you do though, or even if you don't, do you have a tractor supply? They sell alfalfa pellets/cubes by Standlee or Stockman (standlee is cheaper/better quality IMO) in 40 lb bags. Alfalfa is VERY expensive for a bale in my area too ($18+ for a 50 lb bale) but Standlee has kept their price at $13.99 for a while in my area and there is a guarenteed nutritional level in the pellets. Feeding even 3-4 lbs a day can be very beneficial, especially if your mare has ulcers because it works as a buffer. My filly couldn't comfortably eat grain without some alfalfa pellets too because of a sensitive tummy.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Endiku said:


> Aesthetic, for some reason I remember you living near-ish to me in Texas? Maybe that was someone else.
> 
> If you do though, or even if you don't, do you have a tractor supply? They sell alfalfa pellets/cubes by Standlee or Stockman (standlee is cheaper/better quality IMO) in 40 lb bags. Alfalfa is VERY expensive for a bale in my area too ($18+ for a 50 lb bale) but Standlee has kept their price at $13.99 for a while in my area and there is a guarenteed nutritional level in the pellets. Feeding even 3-4 lbs a day can be very beneficial, especially if your mare has ulcers because it works as a buffer. My filly couldn't comfortably eat grain without some alfalfa pellets too because of a sensitive tummy.


I live about an hour from Houston so it's possible. We just had a tractor supply open so yes I can go check! Standlee brand is cheaper? I'll get a friend who works there to check and tell me what the prices are. I haven't tried alfalfa cubes in a while.


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## Endiku (Dec 6, 2010)

Ha, I was right! I'm about 30 minutes out of Houston in the suburbs. Definitely try Standlee. I wouldn't be able to afford alfalfa either if it wasn't for them. Even if your TSC doesn't carry the alfalfa pellets/cubes you want, ask them to order it for you. They will. I drove about an hour to the TSC near Katy Mills Mall just for those. I bought a pallet at a time, special ordered, and actually even got a discount for doing that > pays to ask!

Just remember to soak them before feeding them.


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

I've been told by my vet that alfalfa is great for treating and prevention of stomach ulcers - small meal like hour before workout is supposed to help with this due to higher amounts of calcium.
*** make sure you soak the cubes - less risk of choke - you can stir in whatever supplements you need and you keep your horse hydrated ***


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## Endiku (Dec 6, 2010)

I never used cubes but the pellets were definitely GREAT for hiding 'nasties' in. I fed my girl probios, sho glo, and beet pulp mixed in with it- neither of which she'd eat without the alfalfa xD it turns into a soup within 30 minutes of soaking too, so unlike BP you don't have to prepare it hours and hours beforehand.


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

Endiku said:


> I never used cubes but the pellets were definitely GREAT for hiding 'nasties' in. I fed my girl probios, sho glo, and beet pulp mixed in with it- neither of which she'd eat without the alfalfa xD it turns into a soup within 30 minutes of soaking too, so unlike BP you don't have to prepare it hours and hours beforehand.


<======== I like cubes better as they are generally cheaper with pretty much the same nutritional value - the pellets do soak faster


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## Endiku (Dec 6, 2010)

Interesting! At least with Standlee, they're the same price and same weight so I just went with the one I figured would be easier to chew. I'm not sure about Stockman.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

This was taken 5 minutes ago. She just seems under muscled. I don't really see thin or ribs. Someone said they saw her ribs and you definitely can't.


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Here's for the people asking for a better conformation pic. Mind the hose lol I dropped it to take the picture since she finally stood still!! To me she seems under muscled in the butt, back, and neck. She has a lean belly but I don't see thin or ribby like some have said. Idk what I really think. Y'all are the experts.


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

She is a really pretty mare  Just needs to muscle up (gain the right weight) and good training to shape her neck a little bit. I like the size of her feet, seems to have good amount of bone in her legs too


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

And she does appear to have longish back as I thought before


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

MyBrandy said:


> She is a really pretty mare  Just needs to muscle up (gain the right weight) and good training to shape her neck a little bit. I like the size of her feet, seems to have good amount of bone in her legs too


When she's muscled out she's gorgeous! When I ran her a few years ago she got compliments on her build (booty mostly (; ) I haven't worked her in two years and I'm beginning to get her back in shape. I'll probably ride her tomorrow..... If I can figure out these ****ed polo wraps.


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## MyBrandy (Jan 19, 2011)

Aesthetic said:


> When she's muscled out she's gorgeous! When I ran her a few years ago she got compliments on her build (booty mostly (; ) I haven't worked her in two years and I'm beginning to get her back in shape. I'll probably ride her tomorrow..... If I can figure out these ****ed polo wraps.


<====== I'd say get sports boots instead.. Polo wraps look cool but have minimal protection really


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

MyBrandy said:


> <====== I'd say get sports boots instead.. Polo wraps look cool but have minimal protection really


I have them for light work. I am getting sports boots whenever we can get them. With money focused on vets and feed it's difficult to find a spare $150 for sports boots. I just want polos for some support during trotting exercises and loping circles.


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## Endiku (Dec 6, 2010)

IMO if you aren't quite sure how to apply polos properly, its best to just leave them off completely. Otherwise you run the risk of the horse bowing a tendon from incorrect pressure. I had to have my trainer show me at least 3 times how to get them applied just right and even then I worried about doing it wrong xD


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## Aesthetic (Aug 7, 2012)

Endiku said:


> IMO if you aren't quite sure how to apply polos properly, its best to just leave them off completely. Otherwise you run the risk of the horse bowing a tendon from incorrect pressure. I had to have my trainer show me at least 3 times how to get them applied just right and even then I worried about doing it wrong xD


I know how to wrap them correctly. They just seem to big on her legs, and it doesn't help that I'm a bit OCD because it bothers me so much, I sit there and rewrap her legs until they're just right.
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