# Low Fat VS Low Carb



## verona1016

DH does really well on a low carb diet (keto) and I've done it with him a number of times. I found that I ate _a lot_ more vegetables on keto than I normally do and variety really wasn't a problem.

The big thing that keeps me from being able to stick to it is that all of my go-to foods are very carb-y. I'm a creature of habit, and I've had a bowl of cereal for breakfast most days my whole life. When I come home late from work and want something fast, I make pasta. When I get a sweet tooth, I want cookies.

I certainly found keto effective, but I don't seem to have the drive or creativity to stick with it for more than a couple months  YMMV!


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## Golden Horse

What food groups do you like and enjoy eating? Any diet will fail if you don't get to eat your 'good' things.

I HATED low fat with a passion, so have 3 times in my life, done different approaches to low carbs, each time it was easy to do, and the results were great....so that would be my choice..

THEN the trick is to be able to maintain that choice, that is what I suck at 

I advocate low, not no carb, plenty of veggies you can enjoy, also fruits but you do have to be aware of portion size. Boringly best just to make smaller changes that you can stick to, be active and be satisfied with a slow and steady weight loss, rather than a 'diet'


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## Captain Evil

I'm no expert, but what when my heart-horse died, I went from about 145 to 160 seemingly overnight, and struggled to get back down, unsuccessfully. I tried lots of things, including no breads, or no sugars and fats, or only a vegetarian version of Atkins (thought I would die), fasting three days a week, and eating the other four... 

I finally hit 182.5, and then this old curmudgeon told me to count calories. I did, and it wasn't all that hard to get back down to 133, where I feel happiest. Since then I've kind of gone up and down, but when I start getting heavier, it seems not too difficult to start counting again, writing everything down, and get back down to a reasonable place. 

Counting calories seemed so boring and unimaginative, but it worked for me. Good luck with whatever you choose to do!


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## Horsnaround64

I agree with counting calories. Write down everything you eat each day with calorie count. Find on line how many calories you need to consume to lose weight That way you can still eat the foods you like but be conscious of the calories you are taken in. And maybe do some extra walking for exercise. This way helped me lose 40 pounds and I have kept it off for over a year now. Good luck


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## Eme1217

The problem(s) I have with counting calories, are that I am not good at numbers, even simple addition and I get all mixed up. It is not just adding them together, but comprehending them. It is a brain trauma issue, and I get very aggravated trying to muddle through a jumble of numbers, and dieting shouldn't make you cry (bad joke.)

The other issue with counting calories, is cooking from scratch. I do a lot of cooking at home, and I should do much more of it, but I am not sure how to count calories in recipes. I ended up just guessing about how many each portion had and it drove me crazy and into a strong obsession about counting every single little thing of everything i consumed, or thought I consumed. At the end of my counting calories trial, I had gained weight and always felt starving and stuck in a "punishment" mode. If I ate too many calories at one time, or too soon in the day I literally punished myself for the rest of the day. 

I keep thinking just eat less, or make slow changes to eat better. . .and then somehow old habits just end up sliding back and repeating themselves, ending up another 15 lbs up from where I was when I started. Thank you all for the suggestions and advice. <3


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## Golden Horse

Eme1217 said:


> The other issue with counting calories, is cooking from scratch. I do a lot of cooking at home, and I should do much more of it, but I am not sure how to count calories in recipes.


Oh I am so with you there, it is annoying and I have never found out how to deal it.


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## cbar

I know people who have had success both with low fat & low carb diets. I think the key is picking what will fit your lifestyle the best and what you won't struggle with as much. If you are planning on incorporating a workout routine into your weight loss plan, I would think you would need the carbs. They give you the energy your body needs for physical exertion. 

I am a fan of balanced eating. I don't think it is right to completely devoid yourself of any of the foods you enjoy. And it is great that you already cook a lot yourself; it is SO much easier to make slight alterations to the recipes you already enjoy to make them healthier/lower fat. I suggest this website: skinnytaste.com. She has some fabulous recipes and they don't use weird ingredients that no one has ever heard of. 

Whatever route you choose, best of luck!!


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## JCnGrace

Portion control and getting my butt moving works better for me than anything else. 

Went on Atkins once and while it worked I felt horrible. No energy, tired and my heart would feel like it was beating out of my chest with the least bit of exertion. Before Atkins I wasn't consumed by bread, maybe some toast once in a while or on a sandwich but after Atkins man I'm a breadaholic which made me do guess what? Gain back the weight and a bunch more.


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## tinyliny

It's easiest for me to stay on a food plan when there are few rules, but they are as clear as possible.


For example 

NO white flour products

No breaded deep fried things

Nothing artificially sweetened

Very little fruit juice ( thin it with fizzy water)

No sweets that combine fat with sugar. So, hard candy in small amounts, very dark chocolate, sorbets.

And , I'd even question whole wheat bread, but that's up to you.

Then eat all the fat you want, but never combined with sugar.

Eat your meals in a bowl, not a plate.


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## greentree

My family of 3 has lost 135 lbs over the past 16 months. 

Here is what we eat: meat, all vegetables(very little potato), cheese, a little fruit.

We do not count anything. We eat when we are hungry. Without the brain stimulation from the grains, our bodies amazingly know when that is, and when it is full. 

For breakfast, we eat eggs everyday, and on weekends we add bacon or sausage. 

For lunch, sandwich meat and cheese, or a bowl at a Mexican place(beans, meat, cheese, all the vegetables, guacamole, sour cream)
If I am at home alone, I just eat an avocado. 

For dinner, I cook any meat, add a salad. I grill hamburger patties with sliced colored peppers and onions. Roast cauliflower or broccoli. 

We eat an occasional corn tortilla. 

In the afternnoon, I eat a bit of chocolate, sometimes with plain yogurt or a glass of milk. 

In the evening, I sit on the porch with a glass of red wine.

I am NOT deprived. I do NOT feel that I am "on a diet".


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## Eme1217

Going to use some of these ideas, thank you all!!!


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## Eme1217

So, it has been several months since I posted this originally and I just wanted to say that a lot of these tips and ideas are very helpful and they are working! Slowly but surely I am losing parts of myself! Ok, not literally, but I am definitely seeing some bodily shrinkage. To quote McDonalds "I'm lovin' it!" (bad joke)

I'm only down 12 lbs so far, but that is 12 whole pounds. I get bags of dog food for 15 lbs, so when you think about it I have almost lost a bag of dog food, haha! 

All in all, I have cut down on most breads. I eat some oatmeal and whole grain pasta, (lord if I could only give up spaghetti!) but I am just generally eating lots of whole foods, and moving a lot more. Oh, and the trick someone mentioned about eating your meals from a bowl is the best thing I have ever decided to do for myself. It works! 

As icing on the cake (another bad joke) a friend offered to have me come out to their place and visit with some horses for awhile, and even do some light riding. I did 2 laps around the arena. For me that is a huge deal right now!


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

I have been on a low carb diet for years and I have cut out all junk/fast food, breads, pasta, rice, potatoes and breaded foods. It's a very easy diet to stick to, once you get past the 'carb withdrawals', which really last about a week. The mental withdrawals last longer, but physically, you will start to feel better very quickly. I drink a minimum of 80 oz of liquid/day, have 60 g protein minimum/day and no more than 50 g carbs/day. I avoid sweetened things, including those with sugar alcohols, like the plague. I'm a 'carbaholic' so know that those things are my weakness and just don't go there. I use a small bread/salad plate for my meals, small utensils and put my fork down between bites and chew (20+ times) per bite. It has worked really well for me.

I also do Tai Chi and at least 30 mins on the Free Stepper daily.


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## buggy

Great Job! Yay for horse time! Even a little is great!
I love spaghetti also. Have you tried Zoodles? Use zucchini and run it through a "Zoodler" (basically just shreds it into noodle-like pieces) and cook for 3 minutes. It doesn't taste exactly like spaghetti, but it is close and way less calories!


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

There are also spaghetti squash and Miracle Noodles or Skinny Noodles or Pasta Zero, they're all Shirataki noodles and have zero carbs or calories.


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## Eme1217

I did try using spaghetti squash in place of noodles, but I just didn't care for it overly much. I do love both foods, just not combined, lol. I should try the zoodles or the Shirataki noodles to see if I like them any better!!


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## bsms

I'm a low carb fan myself. That doesn't mean I can eat limitless low carb meals. It just means I don't get headaches while hungry in between my smaller meals. When I try a low fat diet, I get vicious headaches. But either way, if I want to lose weight, I end up spending some time hungry...:angrily_smileys:


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## tinyliny

ok. I feel odd giving any sort of advice, considering that my own eating is totally messed up and I'm heavier now than ever, . . . but . . . (and I'm the one who said use a bowl instead of a plate) . .two things that come to mind that helped me back in the good days when I wasn't messed up with my food:

1. eat nutritionally valuable food. some high calorie /high carb foods are nutritionally valuable, such as sweet potatoes, or kidney beans. don't be afraid of high cal/carb food if they also bring you a lot of nutritional value.

2. experience abstinence. when you are not eating, DONT eat. I mean, the space between meals should be total abstinence, and you should experience it , too. not just be impatiently waiting for the time you can eat, nor allowing yourself to pick at a tiny bit of this or that to carry you over to the next meal. the empty space between meals is as important as the meal time.


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## Fimargue

Go with low carb. Having done both to slim down and tone up, I can say it's much more satisfying and definitely works (have seen great results for other people as well). Also, I was just so full of energy because of the diet - it was great.


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## smrobs

Things would be so much easier if there was a "one size fits all" diet. Unfortunately, we are all different. It's great to hear that you are already down!! Keep up the good work!


What seems to work best for me, when I actually follow it, is avoiding cokes and candy, portion control, and exercise. Other than that, I eat whatever I want, but I eat frequently and have small servings.


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## Golden Horse

smrobs said:


> Things would be so much easier if there was a "one size fits all" diet. Unfortunately, we are all different.



Yup, this is true..

OP congrats on your loss


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## Eme1217

Tis' the season for Caramel Apples and Pumpkin Spice, Welcome to Autumn!! Oh, and my local store is now carrying a seasonal "Raspberry White Chocolate" coffee creamer. I'm so going to gain back all that weight!! Well, since I'm going to hell. . . *sips slowly.*:mrgreen:


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## greentree

No, you are NOT! Look at those things and say ,"Those are poison!"....out loud!! Because they are!


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## Eme1217

It IS poison!!! But, poison never tasted so yummy!!! I told myself I just get to enjoy this one bottle of creamer. I'm going to make myself stick with that. Why oh why can't they make healthy stuff like this? Haha! I need to be fabulous for my riding!!


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## tinyliny

you CAN make some creamer that is healthier, if not actually healthy.

make it with REAL cream, not that hydrogenated veg. oil crap. 

add sugar , not fake sugar, some spices, and . . . Voila! spicy creamer! that is less poison but just as yummy. 

(I have to take your word for it. personally, I hate flavored coffee. I like the flavor of coffee, with a whiff of real cream, as is. if I want pumpkin spice, . . I'll eat pumpkin spice.)


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

Eme1217 said:


> Why oh why can't they make healthy stuff like this? Haha! I need to be fabulous for my riding!!


You can make that a lot healthier. Use real cream, fresh raspberries and melt real white chocolate into it. I would use a real sweetener but not sugar. There are a ton of real sweeteners out there now, and a lot of them don't affect your glycemic index, so are healthier than both sugar AND the fake stuff.


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## tinyliny

it is all about shelf longevity. they make it out of the witches brew of chemicals because they last longer , not because they are BETTER tasting or more healthy.


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## TackHunter

Given all of my diets in the past, a low carb diet seemed to have the best effect. However, a combination of building/toning muscle and a healthy diet is really the approach I would take if i could do it all over agian. 

Low carb diets are great for sustaining muscle mass during your weight loss (i.e. when you lose weight, some of it is fat and some of it is muscle, ketogenic diets help mitigate muscle loss). However, regardless of what people say, the science is still out on ketogenic (very low carb) diets. Using fat as your primary fuel source is not a natural state to be in, and it is potentially stressful to be in that state for extended periods of time. Thus, I'd argue that low carb diets aren't really sustainable if we're not even certain that we can maintain them for many years. It may be a great way to kick start your weight loss, but you need to have a plan post weight loss, so that the weight doesn't come back.

Personally, I've adopted the paelo diet. People often mischaracterize the paleo diet, but essentially it is just an avoidance of processed foods and refined sugar, and a reliance on lean meats, fruits, and veggies. Based on what I've researched, this is the most sustainable diet for a healthy life style. "Paleo", to me, is analogous to just eating clean/healthy (and reading the ingredients of what you're consuming). 

Hope this helps!


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

I've been cooking for the last couple of days so I can pre-package meals for DH & me. He works a 12 hr shift out of town and when he's not here, I don't like to mess around cooking when I could be out with my ponies. 

So here's what I've done: 

Egg "Muffins" for breakfast. They consist of eggs, low fat sausage crumbles, broccoli, mushrooms or another veggie (pretty much whatever I have), and cheese. I cook the sausage, mix the veggies in and spoon it into muffin cups. Then I fill the cups with scrambled egg mixture and bake until done. Quick and easy to grab if you're running late in the morning. 

Ground Turkey & Lentil Stew, it has turkey, lentils, green beans, corn, tomato sauce and seasonings. Nice & thick & hearty and pretty low carb. 

Beef Bourginon, has wine, beef broth, seasoning, onions, carrots, beef and "Ziti Noodles" (they are Miracle Noodles, zero carbs & calories). I use Julia Child's Recipe with 11.7 g carbs & 48 g protein/serving which is approx 3/4 c.

Tonight's dinner is Baked Chicken and Vegs with Cauliflower Fritters (baked). My vegs will be Squash, Carrots & Bell Pepper. Again, very low carb & fat. 

Breakfast is usually eggs and some kind of meat or Greek yogurt or Cottage cheese. 

DH and I have been eating fresh, clean and just swapping out potatoes, rice & pasta for lower carb alternatives for quite a while now and don't feel at all deprived.


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## greentree

TackHunter said:


> Given all of my diets in the past, a low carb diet seemed to have the best effect. However, a combination of building/toning muscle and a healthy diet is really the approach I would take if i could do it all over agian.
> 
> Low carb diets are great for sustaining muscle mass during your weight loss (i.e. when you lose weight, some of it is fat and some of it is muscle, ketogenic diets help mitigate muscle loss). However, regardless of what people say, the science is still out on ketogenic (very low carb) diets. Using fat as your primary fuel source is not a natural state to be in, and it is potentially stressful to be in that state for extended periods of time. Thus, I'd argue that low carb diets aren't really sustainable if we're not even certain that we can maintain them for many years. It may be a great way to kick start your weight loss, but you need to have a plan post weight loss, so that the weight doesn't come back.
> 
> Personally, I've adopted the paelo diet. People often mischaracterize the paleo diet, but essentially it is just an avoidance of processed foods and refined sugar, and a reliance on lean meats, fruits, and veggies. Based on what I've researched, this is the most sustainable diet for a healthy life style. "Paleo", to me, is analogous to just eating clean/healthy (and reading the ingredients of what you're consuming).
> 
> Hope this helps!


I am a little confused about your thouggts that low carb is nit sustainable, but Paleo will be.

Paleo is much more restrictive than say, Wheat Belly, as far as foods. They cut out grains, legumes(beans), soy, dairy, white potatoes, and vegetable oils.

In my family's LC journey, we eat a small amount of beans (good source of prebiotic fiber), and an occasional potato. We do not seriously restrict dairy, because we could not live without cheese. When I crave milk, I drink raw milk from the cow acrossthe street.

I do not knowingly consume soy, nor do I cook with vegetable oil, anyway, so those were non-starters.

I DO prefer a Paleo cookbook, because they do not contain all of the " gluten-free" junk that I have to weed through!!
@DreamCatcherArabians , thanks for the "recipes"! The muffins sound good!


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## thecolorcoal

I just wanted to write in that I lost 40 pounds eating low carb, high fat in a little over 2 months. I was 178 and now I am 138. I did it for my mare, who is light boned and easily becomes sore. I didn't want to be too big for her.

it's VERY hard in the beginning. You are so hungry that you could eat, well, a horse! But get past the first week or two and you will be AMAZED at what little you have to eat to feel full all day. My goal weight is 120. I am 5'3. I don't even care how I look in clothes, but right now I no longer have depression or anxiety and I am finding the diet is not nearly as restrictive as it seems.


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## thecolorcoal

It seems like there are two options: high fat, low carb or high carb, low fat.

Low carb, high fat is transitioning your body from using carbohydrates as energy to using fat as energy. Carbs are an efficient source of energy for the body but they are used up easily. As soon as you burn through your carbs your body tells you it's hungry and needs another supply. While you are burning carbs, you are not burning fat, so whatever fat you do eat is stored away for "emergencies." Protein is the last to be burned, once you've gone through all your carb and fat stores (essentially starving). Low carb, high fat uses the notion that if you do not supply your body with carbs, it will go into a state of "ketosis" where it burns your CURRENT fat stores as energy. The trick is to hold out while your body is SCREAMING for carbs in the beginning. I went through an entire bag of groceries in under an hour because I was SO HUNGRY. None of it was carbs, it was all protein and fat. My body was searching for carbs and it refused to turn off it's hunger signal even though I was eating.

I'd assume, if you ate low fat, high carb you run primarily on sugars. Meaning you can eat fruits, candies, etc. that you can't eat on low carb but it means NO fat. If you're using carbs to burn energy that fat is not going to be used UNLESS through excercise, where your carb stores will be burned through in 20 minutes before your body accesses its fat for fuel. I'd imagine this would be a lot less motivating for someone who hates to go to the gym (like me) and a slower process.

Nowadays, I drink a coffee in the morning and that's about all I eat. Occasionally I will have dinner, but not because I am hungry but because I know I must give my proteins some fuel. I eat a lot of chicken, pork, and beef. I eat absolutely no fruit, no candy, but I do drink diet soda as a treat. I'm still losing weight as we speak. I never go to the gym. The next step is to start exercising to tone, but gym time does not mean weight loss time for me, just time to get strong to handle my horse's bucks and antics. This diet has put everything in a completely new perspective for me.

At 120 I am rewarding myself with a belly button piercing. This is the first time in my life i've ever had a flat stomach.


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## gunslinger

thecolorcoal said:


> At 120 I am rewarding myself with a belly button piercing. This is the first time in my life i've ever had a flat stomach.


Pictures! We need pictures!


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## Avna

The truth is, the diet that will work is the one you can eat for the rest of your life. 

This is what worked for me -- it is particular to what I like eating, and how I like eating. It's a weird one but I've kept the weight off for two years now. I don't diet, I just adhere to "lifetime" rules. 

1. Whole grains. Whole wheat pasta, brown rice, polenta, whole grain bread, popcorn, whole grain crackers. 
2. Fresh fruit. Can be sliced up, or cooked, but not in a dessert. 
3. Vegetables. All the veggies. Except asparagus, which I can't bear.
4. Oil and butter for cooking. 
5. Tofu, beans, fish, poultry, nuts. Light on the red meat, even lighter on the ham and bacon. 
6. Plain yogurt, milk, cheese.

What isn't on there: sugar. White flour, white rice. Packaged foods of any kind (I do buy plain canned tomatoes and a couple other very simple products.). Eating out. Desserts. Commercial snacks. Most of my food is bought at the local farmers' markets, or at the natural foods store. I'm not much of an alcohol drinker so that's not a source of calories. 

I do not limit portions or count calories, but I do eat out of a smaller bowl or plate than I used to. I have a set breakfast -- plain yogurt, fruit, nuts, and a handful of oats. Lunch is my big meal. Noodles or rice, vegetables, tofu, cheese, piece of fruit. Dinner is very light, a salad or soup and a piece of bread, even just popcorn. I don't eat after six pm. I don't eat dinner as a social meal except occasionally, because if I'm going to overeat it will be at night. 

This is my basic every day routine, which I might deviate from for a reason but return to as soon as possible. I don't keep anything not on my list in the house (except cold cereal like shredded wheat, for emergencies). Otherwise I'll eat it until it's gone. I know myself.

It's not low carb. It's not low fat, I don't count calories or anything else. It's just unrefined foods, bought in their most basic forms.

Also I get in at least an hour of walking or jogging every day. That's critical to keeping my energy balanced and my mind centered.


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## AnitaAnne

subbing


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## Mulefeather

I'm a firm believer in the Keto diet. Low carb (less than 25 net carbs/day when losing), moderate protein, high dietary fat. I find that I eat a lot more vegetables, and I'm willing to try a lot more new foods in the name of variety. I also sleep better and have more energy. 

I lost 80 lbs with it a few years back, had some major life upheavals that caused me to backslide due to depression and anxiety, and now I'm trying to undo all the damage I did over that time. It's helped to have my boyfriend on the weight loss train with me, we're taking part in a 6-month challenge to lose 10% of our starting weights. I'm now about 30 lbs down  

Low fat never, ever worked for me. I was always cranky, shaky, and starving 24/7, would lose maybe 2-5 lbs, then gain it all back in a week. And it was just PAINFUL to lose. Keto is like flipping a switch. "Oh, we don't need to hang onto this now? OK, here you go, making a withdrawal from the Fat Bank!"


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## farmpony84

I lost almost 40 lbs on atkins a few years ago. I'm aiming for the Keto diet this time. Today was Day 1 and I already screwed up because I ate some Krave Jerkey which after I googled it... found it was ok for atkins but not Keto...

I may end up atkins but I really was aiming for Keto. Day one is complete...


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## tinyliny

A Keto diet might work for rapid and effortless weight loss, but I wonder how healthy it is for your heart and arteries.

I have been reading other books on nutrition, that take a radically divergent view of correct nutrition for human beings. The China Study is a book on eating Vegan, or very close to vegan. It is a HIGH carb diet, but the carbs come from all kinds of vegetables, modest plant based fats, and ZERO dairy.

This diet incorporates a lot of beans, whole grains, and tons of vegetables.
my neighbor did this, cold turkey, and dropped so much weight he looked TOO thin. This diet was recommended to us after my husband had triple bypass surgery.

So, it's very confusing. I like @Avna's description, though it seems a bit draconian . I am big baby when it comes to pampering myself with food, . . . and it shows!

Most


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## Avna

tinyliny said:


> A Keto diet might work for rapid and effortless weight loss, but I wonder how healthy it is for your heart and arteries.
> 
> I have been reading other books on nutrition, that take a radically divergent view of correct nutrition for human beings. The China Study is a book on eating Vegan, or very close to vegan. It is a HIGH carb diet, but the carbs come from all kinds of vegetables, modest plant based fats, and ZERO dairy.
> 
> This diet incorporates a lot of beans, whole grains, and tons of vegetables.
> my neighbor did this, cold turkey, and dropped so much weight he looked TOO thin. This diet was recommended to us after my husband had triple bypass surgery.
> 
> So, it's very confusing. I like @Avna's description, though it seems a bit draconian . I am big baby when it comes to pampering myself with food, . . . and it shows!
> 
> Most


I'm a big baby too. But my way of eating includes macaroni and cheese (with whole wheat macaroni), grilled chicken sandwiches with mayo, raspberries in clotted cream, hearts of romaine salad ... I pretty much eat what I feel like, within certain parameters. I lost weight slowly (30 lbs over 9 months) but it stayed off, and I never felt deprived or panicky the way I used to feel on diets. I identified the times I always overate -- social eating, dinner, fatty crunchy snacks, sweets, and stopped doing those. I didn't change much of anything else so there were only a few patterns to "rewrite". 

Well, it worked for me. Have to say when I tell people what I did, no one is ever enthusiastic.


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