# Riding in the open: I lost the first battle, do I pursue the war?



## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

Well, I started getting my mare used to the great outdoors by walking her on a lead line. We started at 100 yards (last November) before a meltdown and worked our way up to several miles. Then I started her with short rides with another horse. At first she wanted to be in the middle with her nose in the front horse's rump, so I started insisting on her letting the gap open, until she was used to riding about 20 yards from the front horse. At that point, she decided she preferred the lead. With time, she has opened it up until we regularly can't see the other horse. I've now started riding her on short rides by herself. We started at about 100 yards before significantly increased tension, and now we're up to about a half mile. I'm only riding her by herself a couple times a week, so progress is slow - but she seems to be starting to enjoy it.

When I started walking her, she literally didn't know to pick her feet up to clear a 3" rock, and got scared at the sight of a 6" deep gulley. There were a lot of times when she would brace, and I would back her up and either dismount and lead her on the ground or have another horse take the lead. I think of it as desensitization. The goal isn't to present her with anything that overwhelms her, but to notice the increased signs of tension, push her into something new far enough for her to get tense, and then back off. Obviously, this wouldn't work so well with a horse that needed fast improvement!

Just my experience with one horse who is still a work in progress. A lot depends on how you are reading your horse's behavior. If it is FEAR, I back off and let her learn it isn't scary. If it is stubbornness, she gets a whack on the butt with a leather strap I have wrapped around my saddle horn for that purpose - although I don't need to whack hard, and it happens about once every 2-3 rides. Maybe less as we progress.

There was one time where she acted like, "You can't make me!" We were near the arena, so I put her on a lunge line and ran her until she was soaked with sweat. I was ****ed and I wanted her to understand how ****ed I was. Then I led her on a lead line for a 3 mile walk thru the desert. It was dark when we got back. That was 6 months ago, and she hasn't done it again.

YMMV. I'm not a horse trainer. Not at all. I don't teach anyone anything. This is my experience with one mare only.


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## Painted Horse (Dec 29, 2006)

Most horses get a little barn sour. They get to stand around with friends and eat. Whats not to like about that? I'll have to admit that even my horses have a tendency to prefer to be back with the herd. If I ride in the fields ajoining my place, they hear the other horses calling for them. They dog walk away and then want to rush home.

Rather than fight it, I load my horses up in the trailer and take them some place away from the property, where i can ride them and they don't know where home is, they don't see their herd mates running up and down the fence line, don't hear their buddies calling. They get to focus on me and what I'm asking them to do. Once the horse has learned to do what I ask, Then I can ride at home and not worry about being barn sour.

You may not have the ability to trailer off property. Each of us has to choose what battles to fight. You might find it easier for a ride or two, to get a buddy to ride along on the trails and you follow, Your horse will become more comfortable with the surroundings, so that when you go out alone, it is not such a battle. Evaluate what resources you have and make the best use of them.


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## gunslinger (Sep 17, 2011)

Just a suggestion to help with the bolting....

I'm of the opinion a barefooted horse in uneven rocky terrain is less likely to spook as they have to watch the trail and being somewhat "tender-footed" makes them concentrate more on the trail and less on the ******-man horse eater.

Maybe try taking the shoes off and ride barefoot.....find a narrow rocky trail and ride, ride, ride.


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## egrogan (Jun 1, 2011)

Question about leading her out through the field vs. riding-since she is turned out there all day, I know she isn't scared of it. She just doesn't want to work out there, right? If that's the case, what do I accomplish by leading her out there dismounted? Not being snarky, just trying to understand what reaction I should be expecting from to do this effectively, so that it might ultimately translate to undersaddle. I totally understand why this can help in a new environment.

Painted Horse- right now trailering out isn't an option, but in the next few weeks, the boarding stable is going to be cutting a couple of miles of new trails in the woods around the pasture. I am hopeful that I will be able to round up a few other riders so I won't have to ride alone.


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## egrogan (Jun 1, 2011)

gunslinger said:


> Just a suggestion to help with the bolting....
> 
> I'm of the opinion a barefooted horse in uneven rocky terrain is less likely to spook as they have to watch the trail and being somewhat "tender-footed" makes them concentrate more on the trail and less on the ******-man horse eater.
> 
> Maybe try taking the shoes off and ride barefoot.....find a narrow rocky trail and ride, ride, ride.


Interesting. She's barefoot, but we were in a wide open field vs. on a truetrail. Her mind was definitely not on what was in front of her- it was on getting back to the barn. Most of our current "trail riding" options are really riding through open farmer's fields. I've never been on her on a narrow path- but will hopefully have access to some fresh cut trails in the near future.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Do this in steps. Take her out on a long leadline and walk around "inspecting" the place. stop and go and turn around and turn around, and do all kinds of manuevers to keep her occupied following you. Mount up and just sit there. get off. walk some more. mount up, move a bit, get off move around. all casual like.

next time, take her out and lunge her a bit out there. mount up , walk around, get off, quit.

mix it up like this.

when you first start trying to ride her away from the barn, walk her out, then turn around and go back, then back out, then back to barn. try to time the turn for home thing before she is so uptight that she "blows". So, you turn back on your terms, not hers.
you don't have to conquer this like it's an allor nothing battle.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

egrogan said:


> Question about leading her out through the field vs. riding-since she is turned out there all day, I know she isn't scared of it. She just doesn't want to work out there, right? If that's the case, what do I accomplish by leading her out there dismounted? ...


I was about to say that if it isn't a fear issue, then leading her wouldn't help. But as I try to teach my mare that she can leave her 'herd' of 3 and go out alone, I started with leading her away. And yes, she got a bit freaky at times, but it was easier for me to handle that from the ground.

But I'm told some horses just need to have it ridden out. I don't know because my mare is a very honest horse. If she balks or pulls her head way up and starts prancing, it is almost always fear. That is where I can only offer the little that I know, and admit your problem may be different. Happily, there are a lot of experienced people here that can provide a broader view...


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## phantomhorse13 (Feb 18, 2011)

I would pick a day you have a lot of time and the weather is nice. Start out working her on the longe in the area. Work her hard enough she is sweaty and looking forward to stopping. Walk her out (in hand) to the pasture and take note of the first place she starts looking tense (this may only be 3 feet from the gate). Stop and let her graze/relax--as long as she is looking away from the barn. As soon as she starts the spinning crap, go straight back to the arena and WORK her. After she is sweaty, again go back to the pasture.

Basically she needs to learn that arena=work and pasture=relax. It may take you several rounds with going back and forth, but she will figure it out. Eventually you should be able to increase the distance you get from the barn as she learns outside is a good thing (though to start with, I would be happy with her to just be content to graze 3 feet from the gate). Eventually you can do the same under saddle until she figures out being outside is a good thing.


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## trailhorserider (Oct 13, 2009)

I would try to find a confident trail horse/rider to go out with you. She'll be less likely to bolt back to the barn if she is following another horse. Not to say it couldn't happen, but it would certainly help. I would get her trail riding good with another horse for company at least a few times before I would take her out alone. 

She is probably genuinely scared. I know my Fox Trotter, although I take her out alone often, is much more calm and relaxed with another horse. When alone I have to keep on top of things more and she is less secure and more likely to spook. With another horse she's like "thank goodness we have someone with us, now I can relax."


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## Tracer (Sep 16, 2012)

I have no idea if what I'm about to say is relevant, but there's one thing that struck me and I thought I'd throw it out there.

It seems to me like she is used to working in the arena, and then being put away. She could be stuck in that routine, and just being plain stubborn. If it was me, I would try taking her out BEFORE you do your arena work. She could very well have it stuck in her mind that life goes barn-arena-barn, with no space for anything else. By going barn-pasture-arena-barn, you might be able to tell whether or not it makes any difference to her behaviour.

Just my two cents. I have no experience with something like this, but thought I'd throw it out there.


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## cebee (Apr 4, 2010)

My horse is very nervous in wide open spaces alone... you probably need to determine whether yours is being naughty or truly scared. When I know mine is truly fearful, and he tries to head back to the barn, I do the 360 turn so he is facing the way I want him... and then we stand there and let him put his big boy pants on... once he has reassured himself he will usually move on.
I know a lot of people insist that if your intention was to go to xxxx, you must make the horse do so or he wins...and will continue to refuse. I like to keep in mind that the only one who KNOWS that my intent was to get to the creek ( or wherever) is ME... so if he refuses at a certain point, and with time I get him 20 feet further along the trail... well, then I 'won' even if we never made the milestone I initially wanted. 
It may take baby steps... but keep with it!


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## LesandLily (Oct 8, 2012)

How is your horse in the arena? Are you able to w/t/c on a loose rein with her mind totally on you? Does she know the one rein stop? Is she soft and supple in laterall flexion? 

One of the biggest issues I see in trail riding is people trying to take horses out on a trail ride that they have little to no control of in an arena. now I am not saying this is your problem but I would evaluate where you may have holes in your training of this mare and get COMPLETE control of her in the arena before taking her outside of it. 

Before I would take a horse out of an arena I would want them as soft and supple as possible and listening to me and knowing exercises that get them listening to me. Then when I run into problems outside I just put them into the exercises they know "inside". They can really only think about 1 thing at a time and if they are concentrating on you making their feet move, they really don't have time to be goofy. If you walk this mare out to the far end of the pasture, mount up and don't have total control of her feet, you may have a VERY fast trip back to the barn. 

If you do have great control of her inside then I would work her like the devil (make her hooves sweat) at the barn and then ride her a short distance away and let her rest. If she tries to run back...let her and once you are there...work her hard again and take her away and let her rest. Each time taking her a bit farther and farther. Pretty soon she will associate the barn (or whatever location) with lots of work and that nice open pasture as pleasant walking and rest.

I have a friend who races his horses back to the barn (totally against common conviction I know) but once they get there they do rollbacks, loping in the arena, jumps, fast hindquarter yeilds, anything he can think of to make them work hard. He then rides them back out into the pasture and lets them stand and air up. After a few rounds of this you can't hardly drive them back to the barn. Then after they are good with any direction he mixes it up and some directions mean work while others mean rest or treats. That gets them thinking and guessing and they are pretty much content to go anywhere. It takes some work but if you are consistent you can get it to work quite nicely. First thing though is to get total control and get to the point where you can comfortably push them and know you are not going to get killed. Until then I would not trail ride them personally.

Cheers!
Les


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## egrogan (Jun 1, 2011)

Everyone has given really good advice- unfortunately, it's been pouring rain here for about 2 straight weeks, so we haven't had good footing for going out in the pasture since I posted. So, I'm banking up these ideas for the next sunny day!

A few direct responses to the good previous post:


LesandLily said:


> Are you able to w/t/c on a loose rein with her mind totally on you? Does she know the one rein stop?


Yes to both of those. 



LesandLily said:


> Is she soft and supple in laterall flexion?


 No- but I think that's because of my understanding of how to do this, rather than lack of her ability.



LesandLily said:


> Then when I run into problems outside I just put them into the exercises they know "inside".


 Yes- this is exactly what I was trying to do, but it wasn't working. I was trying to work on bending, serpentines, figure 8's- these are all things we do in the arena when I feel her attention slipping (i.e., another horse comes in the arena). But, I was totally ineffectual in reengaging her mind.



LesandLily said:


> I would work her like the devil (make her hooves sweat) at the barn and then ride her a short distance away and let her rest.


 Yes, this was my thought too. It worked really well when we really were just going a short distance outside the arena- a jaunt down the driveway to the main road, a lap around the outside of the property, circling the arena and dismounting at the back of the barn to untack. At first she was nervous and jumpy doing even this, and when she would get crazy and start pulling back to the arena, I would head right back in there and make her trot, trot, trot around the arena until she didn't want to trot anymore (and then trot a couple of extra laps just for good measure)...eventually she became really comfortable with going outside to cool down. :wink: Which is what raised my courage in the first place, she had been doing so well outside the arena I thought we were ready for "the big field." As some other folks said, I think we need more time, and I think if I could get someone else to ride with me at first, that might help too.

We will see!


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## LesandLily (Oct 8, 2012)

egrogan said:


> Yes, this was my thought too. It worked really well when we really were just going a short distance outside the arena- a jaunt down the driveway to the main road, a lap around the outside of the property, circling the arena and dismounting at the back of the barn to untack. At first she was nervous and jumpy doing even this, and when she would get crazy and start pulling back to the arena, I would head right back in there and make her trot, trot, trot around the arena until she didn't want to trot anymore (and then trot a couple of extra laps just for good measure)...eventually she became really comfortable with going outside to cool down. :wink: Which is what raised my courage in the first place, she had been doing so well outside the arena I thought we were ready for "the big field." As some other folks said, I think we need more time, and I think if I could get someone else to ride with me at first, that might help too.
> 
> We will see!


Sounds like you have your starting place. Don't get greedy and just build on what you have. If she'll go 50 feet today, tomorrow make it 60 feet. Over time you will get her out there. I would practice one rein stops as much as you can too so that they are second nature so if you do push her too far then you can always get control and avoid a runaway. You tube "One Rein Stops" if you are unclear on the right process. Better to practice them correctly. Like this: 



 
Good luck and keep updating on how you are doing.
Cheers!
Les


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## Thunderspark (Oct 17, 2012)

I remember the first time I tried to take my mare out by herself a few years ago.......it took me 1 1/2 hours to get 1/3 mile to a corner where I had decided I would go and then go back home!
She would plant her feet and not move! It was a battle of wills with us, who was going to give in first! A neighbor had drove by on her way to town, she stopped and asked if I was having problems, I told her no that I was just trying to convince Spice it was ok to go out by herself........an hour later the same neighbor was on her way home and I think we had only moved 1/2 city block! LOL she stopped and asked how it was going, I don't know who was sweating more, me or Spice! I told her we were fine, we were still discussing it about whether it was ok to go out by herself. When we finally made it to the corner, I swear the look on her face was priceless......how did I get here???
After that it was easier to get her to go out by herself, now four years later I do try and ride by myself once in awhile just to remind her that it's ok.....luckily I do have lots of friends/neighbors close enough to ride with and we do trailer our horses out at least once a week to different areas.
Be safe!


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

egrogan said:


> Yes- this is exactly what I was trying to do, but it wasn't working. I was trying to work on bending, serpentines, figure 8's- these are all things we do in the arena when I feel her attention slipping (i.e., another horse comes in the arena). But, I was totally ineffectual in reengaging her mind.


This struck me. I have a mare who as a young horse was for lack of a better description, ADHD to the BONE. Getting her engaged was a PROCESS and it took a while. Just getting her to tune in and do ground work with me sometimes took 45 minutes before she would wind down enough to be able to focus and engage with me. 

It sounds like you have a few things going on:
Barn Sour
Fear
ADHD type behaviour due to stress
Spoiled, maybe just a little 

Sounds like you're actually doing well on the barn sour thing by getting her outside at all. So, just going around familiar stuff is good. And you can use that to your advantage. For instance, you come out of the arena, do the familiar track, then hang a left and go 20 ft without a blow up, come back to the familiar track. Do it again and go 30 ft. and just keep rewarding her with the familiar everytime she doesn't blow it on the new stuff. 

As for the Fig 8 and circles and serpentines, I find those to be great stress relievers, it's just sometimes if there's a LOT of stress you have to do a LOT of fig 8 or serpentines. The repetition will soother her eventually, but make sure you have time to hang in there til it works.

Someone else suggested doing it before the arena work, and that's a good idea too, just make sure you take baby steps there so you can do something easy and go to the arena. Then tomorrow, do something easy twice and go to the arena. It just has to become old hat to her and some horses take a long time for a hat to wear out, especially if it's getting them out of work. 

For you, get a mouth full of chewing gum before you go out, it's hard to clench your teeth when your jaws are working. If you can't clench up then you probably won't go all white knuckles either. If you do, just stop and breathe deep a few times and let it out slow. Do like the horses do...drop your head and exhale, long and slow. She'll actually understand that too, my horses will relax as soon as they hear me exhale, they'll drop their heads and do the same now. 

Baby steps is the key to everything here, for you and for her. Good LUCK!


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

You did very well. When she spins hold her head bent toward your knee, other rein loose and keep it there until she comes to a standstill then ask her to go farther on. Do this the moment you feel something is up, her head coming up, body tension. When she stops circling instantly allow her a loose rein, even if only for a few seconds or as long as she's standing quietly, then ask her to ride on. If you keep diffusing her energy she will come to realize it's not worth the effort. At this point in time always walk back home. It's a nice time to reflect on the ride. When you dismount change it up where you do it, never at the door. An extra safety I always do is make my horse face away from the door and it has to settle before I will dismount. This takes the hurry out of them. I do that as I leave the arena as well. Or on the trail. If the horse begins to hurry I'll turn him around and we wait. They figure it out.


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## KountryPrincess (Oct 23, 2012)

I would find someone to pony this mare out on the trails off of a well broke trail horse. I would pay someone to do that actually, preferably a trainer (the trainer at our barn does just that) and then let the trainer start riding her out on the trails with more experienced horses, and then ultimately, alone.

I see horses come into our barn with these issues all the time, and it really takes months of ground work, arena riding, then ponying, then buddy riding, then riding alone before they are confident, well broke trail horses. And while all of this is going on, our trainer also gives lessons to the horse's owners. It may be lessons in the arena if that is where their horse is at, or out on the trail if he is making progress there. 

Confident trail horses are made with planning, time, and wet saddle blankets. Riding an inexperienced horse alone on a trail is a good way to get badly hurt. Also, occasionally, some horses never do get completely confident on the trail, especially alone. Not every horse can be everything we want all the time :?


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## bbsmfg3 (Aug 12, 2010)

All of the above, except the sore feet method will help. And, she is not confident in your ability to control the issues, and she is taking advantage of the situation to do as she wants. A little trick that will help your confidence and force her to rely totally on you. Blindfold her in the arena, and get her doing everything you want with the blindfold on. Make your first few trips outside blindfolded, but close to the barn. They can hear very well.


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