# My version of Western Pleasure



## GottaRide (Dec 10, 2007)

I've been debating with myself about posting this here because I know there are stong feelings both ways about western pleasure. I guess I'm just a glutton for punishment cuz here goes!

I fully admit that we are not perfect yet. There are still issues that I am working on. There is a progression of earlier videos so you can take a look back to see where we started from. This is just another video to document our training progress. 





 
All comments are welcome (but I'm pretty good at ignoring the unnecessary bashing of WP).


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## Solon (May 11, 2008)

I think the head is too low. The horse seems a little stiff on your circles. I didn't realize WP was with such a loose rein.


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## ShutUpJoe (Nov 10, 2009)

You can tell he's listening to you. Very pretty horse


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## Allison Finch (Oct 21, 2009)

The head is too low.

Here are the AQHA rules regarding head carriage;
*453. WESTERN RIDING
(a)​*​​​​Western Riding is an event where the horse is judged on
quality of gaits, lead changes at the lope, response to the rider, manners
and disposition. *The horse should perform with reasonable*
*speed, and be sensible, well-mannered, free and easy moving*.​
*(b)​*​​​​Credit shall be given for and emphasis placed on smoothness,
even cadence of gaits (i.e., starting and finishing pattern with the same
cadence), and the horse’s ability to change leads precisely, easily and
simultaneously both hind and front at the center point between markers.
In order to have balance, with quality lead changes, *the horse’s*
*head and neck should be in a relaxed, natural position, with his poll*
*level with or slightly above the level of the withers.* He should not
carry his head behind the vertical, giving the appearance of
intimidation, or be excessively nosed out, giving a resistant
appearance.The horse should have a relaxed head carriage
showing response to the rider’s hands, with a moderate flexion at the
poll. Horses may be ridden with light contact or on a reasonably loose
rein. The horse should cross the log both at the jog and the lope without
breaking gait or radically changing stride.​
*(c)​*​​​​The judge will select one of the four patterns to be performed.​
The judge is responsible for the pattern being correctly set.


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## BaliDoll (Sep 21, 2009)

I agree with the others about his head carriage, but i love how he is moving. He's a cute dude! How old? I think that his lope is nice, his head gets a little bobby at times, but I think thats when you're spurring him from what I can tell. His jog is a *little* slow for me, but that's all just personal preference! 

Oh and it looks like you need to work a little more on neck reining before you go for such a loose rein, at one point you reach WAY over to get his attention, which we've all done, but just mentioning for critiquing purposes


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## Curly_Horse_CMT (Jun 8, 2008)

His reins look so loose that he could get caught in them... :shock: Maybe I am just not used to WP horses though :lol:

Pretty guy. His lope looks really nice.


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## Plains Drifter (Aug 4, 2009)

I think you've done a great job!!! IMHO, he does seem a bit "stiff" in his trot...but his lope was very nice. I think he's a lovely little thing! Congrats in your training. I hope you'll post more videos as you progress.

Believe me..even if his head carriage is low now, at a show, where there is so much going on, his head carriage will automatically be higher, which is why some folks try to go lower during practice.

Ps. For those talking about how low his head is, or the head bobbing, or even the loose rein: Here is a video of a 2008 wp class. You will see heads as low as this this guy and you will see their heads bob, and plenty of loose reins as well.


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## Solon (May 11, 2008)

I thought they had changed the rules about heads being so low (like posted above), do they just not really enforce that?

Why is there so much bobbing of the head at the canter? The horse looks uncomfortable at that gait.


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## Ridehorses99 (Dec 23, 2009)

Looks like he is coming along very well. His right lead looks very natural but he fights his left lead. It looks like he doesn't quite get the shoulder lift he needs so he throws his head to get the lift. 
Nice looking horse !!


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## Honeysuga (Sep 1, 2009)

At the beginning as has been said, his head is pretty low, but not too bad. After the ground poles at about 1:20, it gets much better and his frame rounds much better with a more level topline. I actually like your lope, it looks much more energized than I am used to seeing on a Wp horse, Kudos. He is pretty heavy on the forehand at the lope, but a little work will fix that. Overall not bad at all.

So in summary
-get his topline a little more close to level
-get him off the forehand(which is why most wp horses :"bob", they are very heavy on the fore and have to force their front ends up to get the slow lope by jerking their heads up and down, kinda like what a BL horse does ***and no I am not comparing a WP to a BL that is just trying to illustrate what I mean...)
-get him under him self, and you guys will be great!(All 3 of these will help each other, his topline will improve and he will become lighter and less choppy once you get him more underhimself... so I would say that is what you need to work on the most)

Cant wait to see how you guys progress!


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## PaintsPwn (Dec 29, 2009)

I admire your courage GottaRide. The WP bashing gets tiring on here.


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## shesinthebarn (Aug 1, 2009)

I do not agree that his head is too low - I think it looks pretty natural for a horse built like him. a majority of the WP/western headset bashers are not from the discipline, or are even english riders, so I would take the opinions lightly. That being said, his nose could tip in a tiny bit more at the jog. His lope looks very natural, but hlacks cadence and impulsion at the jog. Cadence is so very tricky, isn't it?
Maybe do some stop/rollback/jog off exercises when he looses tempo? I think he's super cute - you guys should be doing well by show season! I also athink you are brave to post your video - the WP bashing is nauseating!


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## PaintsPwn (Dec 29, 2009)

shesinthebarn said:


> I do not agree that his head is too low - I think it looks pretty natural for a horse built like him. a majority of the WP/western headset bashers are not from the discipline, or are even english riders, so I would take the opinions lightly. That being said, his nose could tip in a tiny bit more at the jog. His lope looks very natural, but hlacks cadence and impulsion at the jog. Cadence is so very tricky, isn't it?
> Maybe do some stop/rollback/jog off exercises when he looses tempo? I think he's super cute - you guys should be doing well by show season! I also athink you are brave to post your video - the WP bashing is nauseating!




That! That was so well said, I am speechless! 8D


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## Honeysuga (Sep 1, 2009)

I agree, plenty of stop/rollback/jog off exercises would be helpful.


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## thunderhooves (Aug 9, 2009)

I don't think they enforce the rules, but hey, its better than those old peanut rollers! In thtat AQHA video somone posted, those lope look soooooooooo weird. I always think it looks like their back legs hurt,lol. It never looks very pleasureful, and I've ridden pleasure horses before. I like my trail/fun horses better, but I'm not going to "off" your disipline. I would take the advise that the others have said, and I hope you have a good show season!


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## I love Arabs (Nov 19, 2009)

Solon said:


> I thought they had changed the rules about heads being so low (like posted above), do they just not really enforce that?
> 
> Why is there so much bobbing of the head at the canter? The horse looks uncomfortable at that gait.[/QUOTE]
> 
> ...


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## Allison Finch (Oct 21, 2009)

shesinthebarn said:


> I do not agree that his head is too low - I think it looks pretty natural for a horse built like him. *a majority of the WP/western headset bashers are not from the discipline, or are even english riders[/B], so I would take the opinions lightly.  That being said, his nose could tip in a tiny bit more at the jog. His lope looks very natural, but hlacks cadence and impulsion at the jog. Cadence is so very tricky, isn't it?
> Maybe do some stop/rollback/jog off exercises when he looses tempo? I think he's super cute - you guys should be doing well by show season! I also athink you are brave to post your video - the WP bashing is nauseating!*


*

I saw THAT one coming. That is why I posted a quote on the standards right out of the AQHA rule book. It is not just my opinion....it is the rule! It's just too bad the rules are being consistently ignored. BTW, I have spent a fair amount of my life in a western saddle, too.

I do like that horse and think he has potential.*


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

First thing that pops out at me is that he seems a bit off in the right front at the trot. I like him for the most part. He is a little heavy on the forehand and in the trot and walk, his head seems just a touch lower than where it should be. I think he would look a bit smoother and more relaxed with his head a touch higher (like poll level with withers higher). I absolutely adore how he lopes from 1:50 to 2:00. He is level and moving out. That being said, he is very uncomfortable on the left lead. I think some more impulsion would help that immensely. He really drops on his forehand on the left and I think that getting him going a little faster with his butt under him would help because then he wouldn't be picking up his hind end with his neck/head (hence the severe head bobbing on the left). He would be pushing with his hind end instead of pulling everything along with his neck and shoulders. He also needs a bit of work on the haunch turn so that he isn't fighting the bit so much, but that will come with more training. All in all, he is a nice horse with some real potential and really does look more pleasurable to ride than most.


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## PaintsPwn (Dec 29, 2009)

> I posted a quote on the standards right out of the AQHA rule book. It is not just my opinion....it is the rule!​




It's also a rule from WESTERN RIDING, which is a pattern class, not a rail class. Spending time in a certain type of saddle by no means makes one any more relevant in it. I've spent a lot of time in an English saddle, but that doesn't mean I can give super awesome advice to a jumper or someone who rides dressage, because I simply don't train for that, as I'm sure you don't train western pleasure show horses. 

And also, that's not an AQHA horse. It's an APHA horse  Similar association, but they are different.


From the APHA 2010 Rule Book;


> I. HEAD SET. The head should be carried at an angle that is natural and
> *suitable to the horse’s conformation* at all gaits. Ideally, a horse should
> carry its head no lower than level and its nose should be in front of vertical.
> ______________________
> ...


Maters ear was rarely below his withers, and that is thus according the American Paint Horse Association, the proper association that GR's horse will be shown under. (assuming she'll be showing him breed shows XD, and I bet she will)
​


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## FlyinSoLow (Jan 5, 2010)

I think your doing an amazing job on him! 

There are points others pointed out that need a little more tweeking, but your well on your way!

I would be pleased to ride that horse anyday. :wink:


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## GottaRide (Dec 10, 2007)

Thank you all for your comments! 

As I was reading through them, I wanted to point out the rules which I will be following for my shows, but PaintsPwn has already done that. The least of my worries is where his head is at. It is not too low, I will not get faulted for its position. He has the freedom to carry his head at whatever level he wants, and he wants to hang it low. 

The left lead lope is definately our downfall. That video was taken about a month ago & so much progress has been made since. As smrobs suggested, I work on getting more impulsion in that direction. It hasn't caused him to increase his speed necessarily, but he gives me a stronger stride. He's a bit lazy when he wants to be!

Just for kicks...here is what I started with back in June:




He didn't stop, didn't back, didn't walk straight, didn't bend, didn't steer. Oy Vey!


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## Honeysuga (Sep 1, 2009)

Sorry if you thought I was bashing on his headset, I was merely pointing it out in relation to his heaviness on the forehand and slight lack of impulsion... I meant that if you got him under himself and not pulling with his shoulders his head would probably come up into a more balanced frame, and he would work and look better overall.

BTW, what great progress you have made between the 2 videos, great job.


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## welshies rule (Feb 7, 2010)

Hey umm I dont ride western but I have a query, when your horse is loping, he seems to look a little uncomfortable but I dont know if this is just the pace that you need to keep then at. can anyone enlighten me??


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## GottaRide (Dec 10, 2007)

welshies rule said:


> Hey umm I dont ride western but I have a query, when your horse is loping, he seems to look a little uncomfortable but I dont know if this is just the pace that you need to keep then at. can anyone enlighten me??


I think that has been addressed earlier in this post. I'm going to assume you are referring to the left lead lope only as he does have some head bob to that direction. That happens because he isn't using his hind end like he should & he needs to throw his neck up in order to get his shoulders up. The right lead lope has more "flow" because he's using his hind end much better in that direction.

It's not an issue of discomfort or lameness. It is a training issue and a laziness issue (both of which we are dealing with).


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## barnprincess (Dec 17, 2009)

im not critiquing but theres quite a improovment in the june video to the first one (newer) posted.


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## shermanismybaby3006 (Oct 10, 2008)

GottaRide said:


> I think that has been addressed earlier in this post. I'm going to assume you are referring to the left lead lope only as he does have some head bob to that direction. That happens because he isn't using his hind end like he should & he needs to throw his neck up in order to get his shoulders up. The right lead lope has more "flow" because he's using his hind end much better in that direction.
> 
> It's not an issue of discomfort or lameness. It is a training issue and a laziness issue (both of which we are dealing with).


 
Agreed it is not a lameness issue or him being uncomfortable he just isnt using his hind end as much as he should be. Training takes time and I think he is doing very well and looks very nice. Especially compared to the 2nd video he has definately improved very much. You are doing a wonderful job with him.


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## ridergirl23 (Sep 17, 2009)

*i havent read all the posts* but my two cents:
he looks good (i looked at the videos, you guys have improved so much!!!) i think a little more impulsion (not faster) ould make it look a lot more comfortable looking for the horse, he LOOKS (im not saying is  ) a little uncomfortable in the canter, like hes dragging himself forward to stay in it, and i think just a little bit of impulsion will help a lot! 

good luck! hes cute, i love his blaze


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## welshies rule (Feb 7, 2010)

Thanks for that! like I say I don't ride western so I don't have much knowlege on the subject. He is absolutly adorable tho I and I hope you guys do really well

He does look much better in the second video!


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## welshies rule (Feb 7, 2010)

by that I mean the most recent vid


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## horsegirlmaddy (Dec 6, 2008)

To me, it looks like his jog is just him being lazy and going "ho-hum, I don't have to work at all". Western pleasure is on a very loose rein, and all gaits are supposed to be very slow and relaxed, but that doesn't mean that they should be completely without impulsion.

You both look very good, but the quality of the jog needs a bit of work. Overall, though, beautiful horse and you have very nice movement and position (although you tend to look down sometimes). But looking back on the June video, you have done wonders with him! So congratulations, and remember that all the critique is just helping you get better and better cuz we never stop learning!


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