# White Flecks



## Sara (Jul 6, 2007)

Thought I'd post this article about firing for you. Usually the patterns are a lot more regular. Looks more like an old injury, to me anyway.
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/horsecare/1370/107799.html

and...one more. There's lots of info on all sorts of firing to be found on the web, freeze firing is just the newest version of an old practice.
http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/horse-health/2006/November/21/Pinfiring-proves-obsolete.aspx


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

I have taken several horses off the track. IMO, the marks you see are not from cyro or pin firing. I think Sara may be right: an old injury. Pin firing is usually a couple of line of dots and freezing is usually several in one location. I have had horses with either or both. If you want a photo, let me know and I'll go take a picture of my girl Lisa's legs. She had it bad, poor thing.


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## upnover (Jan 17, 2008)

I'd have to agree with Northern Mama, I think it looks more like scars/marks from a previous injury. I know a horse that gets white marks on his legs just from a scrape. I'm not an expert in pin firing but what I've seen is usually a little more deliberate looking instead of a random streak here or there.


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## PoptartShop (Jul 25, 2010)

Yeah, I also agree.  Looks like a scar of some sort.


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## Jubilee Rose (May 28, 2008)

Hi guys, I was looking at her legs again today and she also has flecks at the back too. So it can't be scars. I don't think ...


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

You mean at the back of the same legs? It could be from hopples if she was a cart horse. What kind of racing did she do? It could also be from getting caught in something. I really don't think it's pin firing. I'll try to remember to post a photo of Lisa's legs for you. You'll see how different it is.


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## Jubilee Rose (May 28, 2008)

northernmama said:


> You mean at the back of the same legs? It could be from hopples if she was a cart horse. What kind of racing did she do? It could also be from getting caught in something. I really don't think it's pin firing. I'll try to remember to post a photo of Lisa's legs for you. You'll see how different it is.


Yes the back of the same legs. What are hopples? I'm pretty sure she was just a regular racehorse, but I'm not sure.


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

Hopples are "gadgets" that are put on the horses legs to encourage/promote a long stride on cart horses (pacers / trotters). But they are usually put a lot higher (above the knee). I was thinking that maybe in training at a walk they might have put them lower, but I still think that's pushing it too. I think your girl just got cuts from something and scarred. Could be almost anything.

Here is a photo of my newest OT horse's damage -- this is the freeze firing (cyro) method, smaller marks than pin firing and in a lump, not a row:









This is pin firing on my other girl in a neat row on the back of her leg. The "clump" of white marks is probably pin-firing that someone tried to pass off as freeze-firing. Notice her severly bowed tendon. This is what they were trying to "fix".









Notice the difference especially in the size of the scar, but either way, it is very clearly artifical -- very round marks... Pin Firing is illegal on the track now, but I don't know about cyro. Regardless, people do it anyway -- off track and bring the horse back for the next season. Ya, try to prove who did it when...

Anyway, your horse's scars are not from firing. Be happy!


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## Jubilee Rose (May 28, 2008)

Oh wow, that is crazy northernmama! Does it ruin their legs? Like, what happens??


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

I don't know a whole lot about the cyro, but from what I understand it's killing the nerves and tissue by freezing as opposed to the pin-firing which kills it with heat.

From what I know, the original thought process of firing was -- Ok - it's hurt, let's hurt it more and encourage more healing activity in the area to fix the original problem faster. On the track, it's all about time and money -- time IS money. If your track horse is injured, it's not earning money, it's costing -- big time. So it needs to be fixed as fast as possible. So more hurt = more of the horses energy spent on healing in one particular area so it will heal faster, right?. The really stupid thing is that with or without the firing, the horse needs to be pulled from that year's races. Period. Now, to that 6 - 12 mos off for recovery of the initial injury, let's add another injury -- the pin-firing for the horse to recover from. Sometimes, so I've been told, trainers will accept that the horse needs to be pulled for treatment and the pin-firing, but won't agree just to pull the horse for the initial injury. So they spend more money, more time, more drugs to do more damage. Some people say that the scar tissue that results from the pin-firing strengthens the damaged tissue further, by providing scar tissue support around the damage. The problem with that thinking is that scar tissue doesn't flex and pin-firing WILL result in scar tissue on top of any scar tissue from the initial injury. That's why my girl Lisa will always have "bent" legs. Her legs are severely scarred from the initial bow and then the firing on top. You wouldn't believe the ultra-sound pictures. The damage has completely changed the actual structure of the soft tissue due to scarring. Instead of clean lines of tissue, it's cross-hatched, dense and stiff. It's like looking at a pastel drawing -- all blurry.

Lisa is walking, living proof that pin-firing does more damage and no good at all. Her tendons are hard to the touch. She is no longer in any pain at all, but she would never be able to be a competitive horse because the flexion just isn't there anymore.

You don't need to worry about the marks your horse has. These are superficial injury scars, IMO.


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## Jubilee Rose (May 28, 2008)

Wow NM, that is absolutely crazy. I am very glad to hear now that Jubilee's white flecks aren't because of pin-firing. Your poor girl ...


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## ilovemyhorsies (Mar 9, 2008)

> What are hopples?


the correct spelling (from australia) is actually hobbles but it might be spelt different in other countrys


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

ilovemyhorsies said:


> > What are hopples?
> 
> 
> the correct spelling (from australia) is actually hobbles but it might be spelt different in other countrys


In my neck of the woods, it goes like this:

Ho*pp*les: used for racing to pair up a front leg with a back leg (the pairing depends on the gait) and encourage stride length and symmetry; placed above the knees

Ho*bb*les: used to restrict the movement of a horse by pairing up both front legs thereby not allowing the horse complete freedom of movement. Placed in the fetlock / pastern area. Used to be used for "free grazing"


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