# my dads horse fell into a cattle grid!!!



## koobean (May 19, 2010)

Hi there,

My dads horse recently fell into a cattle grid. She is so badly wounded and we live in a very remote area where the vets arent really horse qualified; they mainly work with cattle. We are cleaning and rebandaging her twice a day and she is getting Bute and penecillan. The swelling has gone doem a bit since the pictures but obviously she is still in a critical condition.

I'm looking for any advice at all on what we can do to help her? homeopathic and natural remedies in particular. what extras can we put in her food? etc.

Thank you so much, I will really appreciate any help at all!


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## LoveMyDrummerBoy (Nov 5, 2009)

Is that the bone in the first and last photo?


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## HowClever (Feb 16, 2010)

holy!! find a vet that can treat her! That is just begging for a major infection.


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## Cowgirl140ty (Jan 7, 2010)

Wow. Poor horse. The best thing in the world... mix iodine with sugar... to where it is like peanut butter texture. And pack the wounds with it. Hopefully she makes it out of this situation well.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

yes that is her bone  the worst part is that im not there to help my dad with it and he's only been around horses for two years.

really? suger and iodine? does it have to be special suger? or just normal shop suger??


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## LoveMyDrummerBoy (Nov 5, 2009)

get a qualified vet out. That is going to get worse and worse and more and more painful for her.


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## HowClever (Feb 16, 2010)

I just looked at the photos again, and I have to reiterate. Please get a vet. The chances of that horse healing without a vet's attention are not good. I'm not even sure they are good with a vet's attention. But if that is not seen and tended by a vet she is going to be in a lot of pain and will get very very sick.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

we have had advice from a vet and sent him pictures and he says there isnt anything he can do about it because there's no skin to stitch up..?


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

we know she'll never be able to be ridden again, we're content to just let her have an early retirement and be our garden lawnmower, so we just want her to be healed..


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## Cowgirl140ty (Jan 7, 2010)

Just normal sugar you cook with. Im not making promises... cause that is a really really bad wound. But if their is no vet and your trying on your own.... thats what I use on all my wounds. Pack it and wrap it...


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

Really. A vet needs to see that, even if they are mainly cattle vets. Cows get hurt too and the physiology isn't so different as far as muscles, bones, and tendons go. Your girl needs some serious help and someone with vet training to treat her. If she gets even a little infection, it would be very easy for it to get into her hock or stifle joint and then there really isn't much that can be done to help her.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

oh okay! thank you so much! i will tell my dad about that tonight on the phone.. he is sending me update pictures soon and ill put those up when he gets round to it, thanks again!


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## kevinshorses (Aug 15, 2009)

koobean said:


> yes that is her bone  the worst part is that im not there to help my dad with it and he's only been around horses for two years.
> 
> really? suger and iodine? does it have to be special suger? or just normal shop suger??


 
If she were my horse I would put her down. It is going to take YEARS for that to totally heal if she doesn't die from the infection that will certainly occur. Even if she doesn't die she most likely will not be sound on it again. Sometimes the best thing we can do for our horses is end thier suffering.


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## HowClever (Feb 16, 2010)

Honest opinion here. I agree with Kevin. That horse is never going to be comfortable after an injury like that. Even as a pasture puff she is going to have ongoing issues, and that is if, as Kevin said, she survives the healing process. The kindest thing you or your dad could do is have her put to sleep now before she has to endure any more pain then she already is.


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## LoveMyDrummerBoy (Nov 5, 2009)

^^ This is what I was going to say at first anyway. The horse will never do anything again and she will be in pain for a long time, maybe even forever after this. It may be a good idea to send her to a better place


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## coelh102 (Oct 9, 2009)

Agreed, An injury that severe, I am afraid, will never fully heal properly. Look at all the muscle and tendons and veins that have been ripped apart, to the BONE. The amount of infections to the bone, muscle, everything. A single fly lands on that you could have a serious problem. I am sorry but put her out of her misery.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

i know, i know.. but right now we/I want do do everything i can to TRY. my dad loves her so much and it would kill him to put her down.. he's like a surgen with her, cleaning and disinfecting and bandaging and feeding. He even tells his dog to stay and guard her so no non of the others can bother her. so for now, she is infact healing, apparently, so i just want to keep trying for her and if she does get an infection and does get worse, we will have to put her down, but just for now... sigh. we need to try evrything we can to get her better before putting her down..


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

The horse needs a vet, ASAP. If he has a chance of surviving (slim, but possible) he will need antibiotics and professional care. Please get a vet out.


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

Loving her means doing what is best for HER, not for you, your dad or anyone else. HER needs are not being met by keeping her alive to suffer.


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## IllComeALopin (Apr 6, 2010)

BUT you arent going to do whats best for her which would be packing her up and taking her to an animal hospital that can work on horses... regardless of how far away it is going to be... then put her down. 

Put her down yourself if you can't afford a vet visit. 

sorry your horse was so badly injured but a vet REALLY needs to look at that and even then they may tell you its too bad..

Realistically you can't fix that alone... no matter how much you read up on it via forums, books, or web sites.


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## HowClever (Feb 16, 2010)

^^ exactly


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

WE HAVE CONTACTED A VET. he says he cant do anything because thers no flesh to STITCH! so even if we packed her off to a vet (there are no horse vets in our province) he wouldnt be able to do anything. we've had all her madication sent to us by the vet, so we have it and shes getting it and so far she IS getting BETTER. its been just over a week and so far she has only had improvements.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

kevinshorses said:


> If she were my horse I would put her down. It is going to take YEARS for that to totally heal if she doesn't die from the infection that will certainly occur. Even if she doesn't die she most likely will not be sound on it again. Sometimes the best thing we can do for our horses is end thier suffering.


Agreed, Kevin.

I was absolutely_ horrified_ when I saw the pictures, and it takes a lot to upset me.

If it was one of my horses, I'd have had them put down.

koobean, there's such a thing as being inadvertently cruel by trying to help an animal who's that badly wounded. 

Your father's emotional pain is immaterial. If he truly loves that animal, he'll do what's right for _her_ and not worry about himself.

I'm so very sorry, but that poor creature needs to be put out of her misery. Keeping her alive is something you're doing only for yourselves, not her.


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## kevinshorses (Aug 15, 2009)

I hope she gets better then. I have seen some pretty bad wounds on horses that healed up without a trace. Whenever the skin is gone and that much flesh it will take a very very long time to heal and the muscle that is gone will never come back. The best you can hope for is that skin eventually covers the bone. I couldn't stand to see a horse like that every day and know that she was never going to be right again.


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## LoveMyDrummerBoy (Nov 5, 2009)

^^ I definately agree


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## aforred (May 12, 2010)

I agree with Kevin. I have seen horses recover from some really big holes before, but NONE of them had bone showing. There is no way to close that hole, and the risk of sepsis is extreme. She might look like she's getting better at first, but I'd bet that's one of those things where it just won't ever close, no matter what.

I understand how hard it is to put a horse down, believe me. But I just don't see any way for this to heal. Even if that wound were to miraculously close, she will never be comfortable again, forget feeling good. Unless there's a vet on here that looks at that and thinks I'm wrong, I would definitely put her down.


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

I'm sorry, but I think trying to "save" her at this point is incredibly selfish. I would put my most beloved pet down in a heartbeat (have, in fact) rather than put them through the kind of suffering you are expecting her to endure.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Amen, mac.

I put down my beloved, once in a lifetime gelding for _him._ If I had been selfish, I'd have made him continue to suffer. I couldn't do that to him; he deserved better than that. 

We need to remember that being good stewards sometimes means letting them go when _they're _ready, not when we are.


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

themacpack said:


> I'm sorry, but I think trying to "save" her at this point is incredibly selfish. I would put my most beloved pet down in a heartbeat (have, in fact) rather than put them through the kind of suffering you are expecting her to endure.


Yes. This WILL get infected. Normal PenG will not even begin to counter the infection.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

The horse must be watched extremely carefully for any sign of infection; which is why I recommend a vet - can you tell normal flesh from infected flesh? Signs of infection other than appearance? What medications did the vet send? 
I can understand wanting to try your hardest to keep a special horse alive, and you must be very stressed about the entire situation. Please do not allow your sorrow cloud your better judgement, though.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

themacpack said:


> I'm sorry, but I think trying to "save" her at this point is incredibly selfish. I would put my most beloved pet down in a heartbeat (have, in fact) rather than put them through the kind of suffering you are expecting her to endure.


I totally agree!

Especially trying to save her with no real medical intervention.


If you insist on not putting her down then put in her the trailer and take her to the nearest real horse vet clinic (college, etc).


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## IllComeALopin (Apr 6, 2010)

JustDressageIt said:


> The horse must be watched extremely carefully for any sign of infection; which is why I recommend a vet - can you tell normal flesh from infected flesh? Signs of infection other than appearance? What medications did the vet send?
> I can understand wanting to try your hardest to keep a special horse alive, and you must be very stressed about the entire situation. Please do not allow your sorrow cloud your better judgement, though.


Yes.

And at a horse 'emergency hospital' (not just a vet, but a place the horse could stay) the horse would be getting an IV and be in a much more sterile enviroment getting 'round the clock attention, meds, and cleanings.


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## Skipsfirstspike (Mar 22, 2010)

My horse got a bad leg wound last year. Not even in the ballpark as bad as yours, but the vet couldn't stitch him either.
However, there was a LOT the vet could do for him.... antibiotics, both fast acting injection and oral for 10 days. Injection for pain, as well as a weeks supply oral. Tetanus shot, even though he was up to date on his annual.
If your vet did not advise any of that treatment, maybe you should take to heart what he said.. There is nothing he can do. I love my horse beyond words, and I can't imagine the pain of putting him down, but I would rather that than watching him die of major infection. If your horse hasn't had any antibodies yet, don't even know if a massive dose would even help at this point.
I am so very, very sorry for your poor horse. What a horrific thing to have happened.


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## Ktibb (Mar 24, 2010)

I agree with most everyone here. But it sounds like there is no changing your mind. Here is another topical wound treatment known to pull flesh & skin back together that cannot be stiched.

Testimonials

Google Underwoods horse medicine- there are lots of testamonials on other forums.

My vote is still to end her suffering- I've never heard of a horse comming back from trauma that serious. Poor thing.


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## IllComeALopin (Apr 6, 2010)

I don't notice the OP was from South Africa... :-( Anyone there or been there that could piont them in the direction of a horse clinic?


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## Ktibb (Mar 24, 2010)

*More Underwoods Info*

A few pictures and quotes from this thread: Underwood Horse Medicine - Horse Forums (HGS)

"Another huge fan

Both my sister and I have used it on horses with huge gaping wounds and it healed with no proud flesh, no scarring and full hair re-growth

In the case with my sister her mare cut the hock right down to the joint - everything was completely exposed in the joint, on the front surface and in 3+ months it had totally and completely healed and you had to ruffle the hair to even see where the original injury occured

Love the stuff ...







"

"Yup-live by it. When it is a wound that can not be stitched-won't hold stitches-and especially on a puncture wound, this is ALL I use.


This horse has a hairline scar on it now-if it isn't pointed out to you-you won't see it. The vets here predicted a 5 inch scar that was going to be over 4 inches wide-they were also amazed. He had so much muscle stitches would not stay in. I ordered the Unders and when it got here, his leg was desleeving down to the hoof. I was pushing up at least a cup of puss a day. I poured that in there, pushed it out, then started topically treating the wound on top, and he healed up marvelously. LUV that stuff!"

More threads: Horse Forums (HGS) - Search Results


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

Ktibb said:


> A few pictures and quotes from this thread: Underwood Horse Medicine - Horse Forums (HGS)
> 
> "Another huge fan
> 
> ...


 
I know you mean well - but the BONE is exposed on the OP's horse. HUGE difference in the type of wound. HUGE.


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## aforred (May 12, 2010)

I don't have any idea if this is near you or not.

Physical address: D725 Hamilton Way, Summerveld. 
(see signage from the Polo Pony - into Cliffdale rd - into Hawkstone - into Hamilton Way.)

Phone +27 31 769 1256

www.savets.co.za


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## Ktibb (Mar 24, 2010)

mls said:


> I know you mean well - but the BONE is exposed on the OP's horse. HUGE difference in the type of wound. HUGE.


I agree 110% and as I stated I think the horse's suffering should be ended. The first quote claims that their horse was injured to the joint and it covered it- the photos were just one example i found in a quick search. 

If anything might help I think it's underwoods- though I SERIOUSLY doubt it. That poor poor horse... already enduring a week in that state


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## ShutUpJoe (Nov 10, 2009)

How is this poor horse even standing? Wow... I agree. She needs to put down.


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

I agree with the posts of putting that poor horse out of her pain. If you can't do it because your dad doesn't want it done, he is thinking of himself, not this horse. Even if it heals, which I seriously doubt, she will be in pain the rest of her life. Talk about a walking infection. One fly laying eggs and you will in fact have maggots crawling all over those wounds. The only way to maybe get the skin to cover that wound is skin grafts, that is a huge area to cover. The swelling in her legs is awful and they are probably full of infection. She needs to be on intervenous antibiotics and pain meds to even begin healing.
We had a gelding cut himself and had a HUGE open draining wound in his hind leg, he spent time at the hospital on IV fluids, antibiotics and pain meds. Stitched and stitches removed, drains, drainage, etc. but our first and foremost thought was for him. If there had been no chance for healing, then I would have put him down immediately.He has healed, but now that the winter hair is gone, there are still two small areas of the wound that still needs to close. And his is nothing compared to your mare
You said it has been a week, you are not in anyway on the way to healing.Some infections, including bone infections don't even start for a week to 10 days. Minimum antibiotics of Pen G would be 35 or 40 cc twice 
a day for months to keep an infection at bay. And then there are many many more infections, general and systemic that can appear at the drop of a hat. 
I'm sorry to be so hard, but I work for a vet, and this is one of the worst injuries I have seen, and beleive me, I have seen plenty that make your heart beat fast. 
The best and most humane thing you can do is put this poor mare out of her pain, and please don't try to say she is not in pain.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

she is getting:

antibiotic- lentrax, every second day.
her wounds are washed out with antibacterial solution everyday.
then its gets dressed with a dressing of acrislavine and then bandaged up.
she's on a course of bute.

we've had the opinion from three different vets who have seem the pictures, that she will get better. one vet has apparently delt with a horse who has been caught in a fence and removed all the muscle of its leg, also revealing the bone. 

apparently the biggest problem is infection, obviously, and then keeping the bone moist. the acrislavine is apparently supposed to do this.


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

I am sorry, I do not see how anyone could see a horse with an injury such as the one in the bottom center of that last group and NOT realize the poor horse was suffering immeasurably and feel compelled to do the right thing by it.


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## IllComeALopin (Apr 6, 2010)

Ugh, thats just horrible .

Why do people insist on asking for help from a forum instead of socking out the money for a REAL EMERGENCY vet like a good, intellegant, caring person would do.

Or don't you have a horse trailer either?


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## riccil0ve (Mar 28, 2009)

This breaks my heart. Really, really breaks my heart. ='[


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## kevinshorses (Aug 15, 2009)

I would imagine that vets are not as close by in South Africa. The OP said the vet sent the medicine to her dad which tells me it may be a ways from the clinic to the farm. I would also venture to guess that there are no large vet hospitals or schools in South Africa that would handle it like there are here. I wouldn't trailer the horse anywhere either. She is severely injured on one leg and probably at least two. They are doing all they can to save the horse but I just don't think it's the best decision for the horse.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

koobean said:


> we've had the opinion from three different vets who have seem the pictures, that she will get better.


I'd like their names and phone numbers, please.

I don't know of a vet on this _planet_, much less three in the same country, who would dare risk their reputations by giving the opinion that this animal is going to get better.

That horse is going to_ die_, but not before your father tortures her for an unbearable amount of time. 

She'll mostly likely die from a raging systemic infection, with gangrene that will set into her wounded leg, making it putrefy. 

I feel sorry for the horse; she doesn't deserve to be treated like this. If your father really loved her he'd let her go, instead of making her endure horrific pain when it's just going to end in her death anyway.


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## IllComeALopin (Apr 6, 2010)

kevinshorses said:


> They are doing all they can to save the horse but I just don't think it's the best decision for the horse.


Me either...


I understand the not wanting to trailer the horse... but how can you go out and look at THAT poor suffering horse over and over; again and again.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

wow. I'm really sorry this happened. I am warmed by the love that you have for your animal, and even impressed by the heroic measures you are taking to save this horse. I only worry that the injury is too much and the suffering to severe. It's really hard when your heart gets involved in such a horrific situation.

I have never seen such an injury before. Did they tell you to cover the wound or keep it open?


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## kevinshorses (Aug 15, 2009)

She said it gets bandaged.


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## corinowalk (Apr 26, 2010)

Those wounds are really horrific. I do feel terrible for your girl and will include her in my prayers. Please don't take this as judging but I think you haven't had a vet out yet because you know what that vet is going to say. Exposed bone is going to get infected. I couldn't imagine having that happen to me or my horse. Any vet will tell you to put that horse down first...and then move on to treatment options if you are absolutly sure you want to keep her alive. Even then, and I am no vet, her chances arent great honey. If you insist on keeping her alive, keep her as drugged as possible. Imagine her wound on your shin. Im so sorry that this happened to you.


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## IllComeALopin (Apr 6, 2010)

How lame is she?
Is she laying down a lot or walking around pretty often?

I have NO idea what type of horse bedding they have in South Africa, but I'm thinking the pelleted wood bedding would be ideal in a case like this... it might help keep things cleaner!

Maybe it looks a lot worse than it is and the horse is really not suffering that bad.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

do have a picture of the entire horse?


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

I don't doubt that care is difficult to get where you are located. I also don't question the love that you/your father feel for the horse. I just question whether the decisions are being made with head or heart in this matter.


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## my2geldings (Feb 18, 2008)

PUT THE HORSE DOWN. You are torturing the poor animal. She will get an infection. It doesn't matter how clean you keep her, she will. It's down to the bone for poo's sake! there is no way with ANY amount of cleaning that she will stay infection free-IMPOSSIBLE.

If you love this mare, you will put her to sleep. You are torturing a horse who will never recover from this.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

kevin, thank you for at least understanding south africa. i dont think people realise how it is here. ive actually never even heard of a hospital specifically for horses here. the vets are small buildings that dont have space for horses to be. The three vets we have sent pictures to, say that she has a chance. we send them regular picture updates and they send us down madication all the time. she has had a tetenus shot, person who said she should have, she is on antibiotics. she is eating like mad and is as big of a piggy as always, knocking you about with her head trying to get the food before it has been put down, nickering loadly and getting excited if she sees you. she isnt depressed and while im sure she must be in pain, she is showing the desire to live! she isnt moping around with her head hanging not eating much. she grazes grass, munches loads of lucern, eats her food with gusto and still speaks to the other horses when they come down from the mountains to be fed.

If she was acting like she'd rather be dead, or standing head down, lifeless, sure! we would put her down. but she is not. she isnt a soft stabled horse, she's never lived in a stable until now, shes been galloped over gravel, lives up up up in the mountains, our fences here are all barbed wire- post and rail rarely exsists here. vets here see stuff like this often i am sure, because they have hope for her. we have hope for her, and greatest of all, she has hope for herself. we owe her the chance to survive.

If she gets infected, fine. but right now she isnt. theres no point thinking, "well she's going to so you may as well just put her down now", because miricals happen. they do. 

so, i wanted advice for now. how can i help her now? what can we do to help her now? while she isnt infected. while she still shows the undeniable signs of wanting to pull through.

My dad has devoted his days to her. he's doing everything the vet would, the vet advises him all the time. we call him everyday. send photo's every three days. we arent just letting her frot, we are getting the medical help we can here. over seas is different to south africa, evidently, more vastly than i thought.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

I have been surfing the web and found where horses have actually survived such injuries. However, they did have a vet involved in the treatment. I am posting links because we aren't vets and most of us have not experienced this. I'm in agreement that the outcome seems very grim. I was told by my local vet to put my mare down when she severed her tendons. I chose to thave the surgery. After a year of recuperation, she can walk trot canter and jump...

Wounds, Injury, Injuries, Horse, cannon bone, pastern, Case 173

http://www.horseadvice.com/horse/messages/4/190618.html

http://www.userltriangle.org/BriarRose.html


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

she has bedding of shavings.. it gets completly renewed everyday, everytime she poos, my dad is there, picking it up. she is very lame on her one back leg, but she walks around a bit and grazes. she also lies down for a bit a few times a day.

We are not, not getting the vet there because we think he's going to tell us to put her down, because not one of them have! they all want to give her a chance. THEY SEE PICTURES. if you look at the first set of pictures compared to the ones i just put on, you will see that she has almost no swelling left. improvement. 

the person who says that she thinks i'm going to let her decay away from gang green is an imbicile. i'm not stupid. if she gets infected, fine, we'll put her down. so i'm not being irrational keeping a frotting, pained, half-dead horse in misery.

i will ask my dad to take a full body one tomorrow and get him to email me and then ill but it on here.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

thanks farmpony  i am having a look at them now...


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## aforred (May 12, 2010)

I just looked up the map, and the equine hospital I posted about is clear across the country from Cape Town. Sorry I couldn't be more help.


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## corinowalk (Apr 26, 2010)

You have to understand the majority of us have never seen a wound that bad, that is why you are getting so many 'oh my god' reactions. Mine included. If she is thriving, even with a gaping wound, then she is a tough girl and may just make it. She must be a really special girl. None of my horses would stand to have something like that dressed! From the bottom of my heart, I hope she gets better. Good luck and keep us posted.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

wow.. that first one is.. hectic. the same as Lush's i suppose. so there is some hope, it can be done. it may be rare, even the developed over seas places, but her injuries on her lower half of her leg arent as bad as that horses'. the one at the top of her leg is terrible, i nearly died when my dad first sent it to me, i know.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Please remind your father to keep tabs on her hooves. That is a lot of trauma to her leg. I worry about her hoof health. (Founder as a side affect in other words.)


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

oh wow.. that horses injuries were also from a cattle grid


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

Do they have him doing standing wraps? I would worry about laminitis on the uninjured legs. Also, How will he cut the dead skin away when the time comes? Just questions I'm coming up with...


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

everyone, please have a look at the last link farmpony posted. that filly's cannon bone was exposed for WEEKS! and she wasn't a healthy well looked after horse.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

uhm.. i'm not 100% sure what those are; bandages that are wrapped specifically to provide equal and extra support to her legs? if so, yes, she has got those. at the moment the flesh that isnt getting the blood is going black and shrivelling up. the vet said to pull off what comes away and it will fall off as well. we are keeping proud flesh and scabs at bay.


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

PLease just make sure the vets are not telling that she can make it to be able to continue to send you meds , at an expense that I am sure is huge.
I would love to see a full body photo of her. 
I know if this was my horse, no matter how much I loved her, I would put her down. One week into an injury like this is just the beginning, and I would be so afraid of infection in her open wounds and in to the bone.
But, my prayers are with you and your dad and especially the horse since you feel this is the best for your horse at this time.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

isn't lamnitis just from them eating too much and not getting rid of the extra carbohydrates or whatever? i've told my dad to watch out for it and so did my friend who owns a sporthorse breeding farm not that far away. so he is on the look out. what are the first signals to look for?


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## Appyt (Oct 14, 2007)

I am appalled at some of the judgmental comments that have been made here. 

koobean, Kudo's to you and your dad for giving this mare a chance. The wounds are horrible but with lots of support from the vets and the devoted work that your father is putting into her care she just may have a chance. Stranger things have happened. My mare, Heidi injured her pastern so badly on a jagged piece of metal I was sure she would not make it. But with the expert care of my trimmer and her vet she did make it and is now sound. I am sending healing thoughts and prayers for your dad's mare... Give him my best from Kansas, USA


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

koobean said:


> isn't lamnitis just from them eating too much and not getting rid of the extra carbohydrates or whatever? i've told my dad to watch out for it and so did my friend who owns a sporthorse breeding farm not that far away. so he is on the look out. what are the first signals to look for?


I'm sorry, if you don't know what it is, how did you tell your father to be watching out for it?


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## Hunter65 (Aug 19, 2009)

Wow I don't know if I could handle looking at that wound every day. I'm glad your dad is doing everything he can for her. I sure hope she heals and doesn't get sick. At first I agreed with some of the others about putting her down, but if you say she is getting better and doesn't seem depressed/sick then maybe she does have a chance. I look forward to seeing a picture of the whole horse, keep us updated please. Best of luck.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Appyt said:


> The wounds are horrible but with lots of support from the vets and the devoted work that your father is putting into her care she just may have a chance.


Did you miss the part where the vets (three of them) told the OP's father that there was nothing they could do?


OP, that third filly you asked us to look at had extensive vet care. Does your father know how to identify and remove dead bone?


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

wyominggrandma, i will ask him to take a full body photo tomorrow and send it to me so that i can post it here. i'm not on the farm, i'm in a city finishing school, otherwise i'd runoutside now and take one for you. 

Wyomingrandma and corino walk, your prayers are much appreciated by me, my dad, Lush and all our other horses. 

She is a brave girl. She is fearless when being ridden too. her foal has inherited her craziness and toughness, since day one she been catapulting over fences when attempting to jump them and she's ok. When Lush was peregnant with her foal she crashed through a farm gate and bent it right into an L shape the day befor she gave birth. No problems. they are tough. and i swear if lush was all hang-dog and depressed, i would put her down. i'm not being selfish to her. humans and dogs survive from things like this, and now i've seem from the links farmpony posted that horses do too.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

Appyt said:


> I am appalled at some of the judgmental comments that have been made here.
> 
> koobean, Kudo's to you and your dad for giving this mare a chance. The wounds are horrible but with lots of support from the vets and the devoted work that your father is putting into her care she just may have a chance. Stranger things have happened. My mare, Heidi injured her pastern so badly on a jagged piece of metal I was sure she would not make it. But with the expert care of my trimmer and her vet she did make it and is now sound. I am sending healing thoughts and prayers for your dad's mare... Give him my best from Kansas, USA


 
thank you so much Appyt ) i am relieved to see that there are others who have faith. Your words were encouraging and i was actually shaking i've become so stressed by all this. i really dont want you all to think i'm some heartless little girl. 

She wants to live, and with all these prayers shes getting... 

i dont personally know what to look out for with laminitis, thats why i asked, but i warned my dad about it, my breeder friend warned him and explained to him, ok? i was asking for me right then, not my dad.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

Alwaysbehind, nothing they could do that he cant.. they can only do what he's doing, so he might as well since they live millions of kilometers away.


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## AQHA (Mar 15, 2010)

Get a vet asap


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

AQUA, read all the previous messages, they'll give you and answer


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## AQHA (Mar 15, 2010)

^Oops, I only looked at the first page


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## Ktibb (Mar 24, 2010)

Again I want to recoment the underwoods medecine. It really helps with proud flesh and scar tissue. Did you get a chance to read any of the threads I linked to? Lots of first hand experiance there. I was glad to read that she is showing will to live, without that even the best vet care in all the world wouldn't be enough. I do hopw she pulls through, and I do see improvment in the 2nd set of pictures.

Please keep us updated, good luck.


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## Appyt (Oct 14, 2007)

> Did you miss the part where the vets (three of them) told the OP's father that there was nothing they could do?


Always Behind, I didn't miss a single post written before I posted. Did you?


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## my2geldings (Feb 18, 2008)

What really bothers me is the long term picture of this injury. 

Not only am I still convinced she won't beat infection BUT you have to look at this from a musculoskeletal view. This mare has lost all muscle and soft tissue in the region. She has likely also lost some ligamentous tissue as well which will permantely disable her. She will suffer from chronic pain because she will be unable to carry herself fully. She will be at high risk of injury as she has practically nothing there to protect her leg.

Would definitely never put her around with other horses again. A kick or goofing around in a field, a slip and boom. She'd be done.

If she happen to be the one in thousands to survive infection, what life are you giving her by letting her become a chronically lame and pained animal?

If it were my horse, I can honestly say I would have put him/her to sleep. Accidents happen and this is another unfortunate one but I also wouldnt live knowing I've left a horse I adore in pain for the rest of it's life.


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## aforred (May 12, 2010)

I'm not trying to be judgemental, but that last link farmpony posted is a different situation than your dad's mare. First, it was not one person trying to care for this animal. Second, Briar Rose had a TEAM of vets working on her. This included farm visits for evaluation and debridement, clinic visits for other issues (and they WILL pop up), IV antibiotics, and surgery. Third, while BR's injuries did include tendons and ligaments, she was not stripped of a significant amount of muscle.

Since your dad is going to try everything he can to save her, I would recommend finding an equine vet (if you haven't already) to consult with. I would also strongly recommend building a support network to help in the care of this horse. After a year, BR's skin was not completely closed. 

I wish you all the luck in the world, and I sincerely hope I'm wrong. You are in my family's thoughts and prayers.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kevinshorses (Aug 15, 2009)

I'm going to have to eat my words and say that there is a chance she will survive. If she is lively and you are caring for her as well as you say she may very well suprise us all. Please Please Please start a thread updating us on her progress. If your dad could take pictures every week or so and you posted them here I for one would be grateful. Horses can heal up from some horrendous injuries and it would be interesting to see how fully she recovers.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

aforred said:


> You are in my family's thoughts and prayers.


That poor _mare_ will be in my thoughts and prayers. 

I'll be praying that the OP and her father see the light and put her down sooner rather than later.

There _are_ worse fates than death. That mare is living one of them.

There's absolutely no excuse to leave that mare suffering. *None*.

Those of you throwing sunshine, butterflies and sympathy at the OP can call me all the names you want, but an inexperienced person trying to care for an animal that horrendously wounded, with _no_ on-site veterinary care and without a controlled, sterile environment, *is* doomed to failure.

Barbaro had a _team_ of doctors around the clock at one of the best equine hospitals in the U.S. and he couldn't be saved, so what makes any of you think some random guy out in the wilds of Nowhere, SA will be able to do what the best vets in the world couldn't? 

Stop thinking with your hearts, and start using the brains God gave you. That horse has as much chance of recovering as an ice cube in Hell does of not melting.

Instead of giving the OP pats and encouragement, we should be trying to pave the way for her to start thinking about letting the animal go.

A _real_ horse person knows when the fight is futile, and is willing to let go of their ego and own emotional pain to do what's right by their animal.


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## corinowalk (Apr 26, 2010)

Speed Racer, sorry to be one of those butterfly spewers but I do it with reasoning. The mare is not this girls, but her fathers. He has his mind set on keeping the mare alive even if her chance at survival is not good. This girl is looking for support and ideas to help her fathers horse. While I do agree that the long term prognosis for this horse is not good, it is her FATHERS decision. If he is willing to run the risk, it is his decision. And while you believe the fight is futile, they don't.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

It is possible for the horse to live through such horrific injuries - *with an extremely competent vet's constant care.*
If you can't provide that, please consider putting the horse down. If you have access to a horse hospital and a competent vet who feels confident, then take your chances keeping the horse alive. If you don't, then it's just a matter of time until infection sets into the bone and surrounding tissue.


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## JumpsxGlory (Dec 20, 2009)

I really hope that she will be able to recover! Those pictures shocked me!!!


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

Ask your dad if he knows what it's like to have half of his lower leg cut off and be on only Advil. This is essentially what your mare is going through. PLEASE try to get him to put her to sleep. Please.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Pidge (Sep 5, 2009)

I have heard and read up on a few dif. similar injuries...the horses recovered in some I read...on one the granulated tissue that forms actually covered the bone back up and filled in the hole...the muscles and tendons werent there so the horse had a limp but the bone was protected by the granulated tissue...

Stop worrying about proud flesh for now and let it granulate in...if it will...it might not but there is a chance...so many people worry about proud flesh and medicate for it on wounds...truth be told a lot of those medications can prevent new good granulated tissue to form and fill in the hole. Keep it moist and the scabs off until the hole fills in and the bone is covered...then you might let it scab over and let the skin grow back...This is what Ive heard from people who have had similar injuries to their horses...If anyone on here is a vet and this is wrong please correct me...this is just what I have heard.

I come from an area where while there may be tons of horse vets they all come at a premium cost...most people self vet their animals...I have seen some bad stuff (not as bad as your dads horse but still bad) heal up like it never happened...and that was with people self vetting...

If your dad is doing everything you say he is...and if she really does still feel good...I think there is actually and ok, not good but ok, chance that she might pull through...keep posting pictures...I would like to keep tabs on her progress...updated pictures would be nice... 

I think that for now she is ok...but I agree that if it gets infected or she looses the will to live then putting her kindly out of her missery is best...but for now...I think she may pull though.

Also on the granulating tissue thing...if the hole is filling in even when medicating for proud flesh you may be ok with still medicating for it...


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## SilverSpur (Mar 25, 2010)

i hope your father knows just how long its going to take to heal and the time that he has to put in. the likely hood of infection is very great of not certain. It’s is concerning that all 3 vets have said there is nothing they can do other than medicate her. When ever ive head a vet say that it’s because the horse needs to be PTS. And if this were my horse it would be what I would do. Not just because the horse was in pain, but also if she does make it,her quality of life after.

I have seen this type of injury before. This took a year and a half to fully heal, does your father have that time? It may take longer for him. The biggest thing about horse ownership is knowing when enough is enough and what is best for the horse and not yourself.


this filly will be a cripple for the rest of her life.(not my horse, photos are from another forum)


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## kmacdougall (Feb 12, 2010)

Oh man, I have read this whole thing and have a lot of mixed feelings about this situation. 

Basically, I'm hoping for a miracle for you. I hope you will continue to update us because I'm interested in the outcome, whether she gets better or you decide to put her down.

Good thoughts in your direction.


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## my2geldings (Feb 18, 2008)

I just gasped at the last pics. That's another horse who I think should have been put at peace. God bless that poor horse's soul.


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## cmvet (Apr 14, 2010)

So WOW!,

That is a good one. I would definitely recommend having a vet out to look at the horse. There are a number of critical structures involved those regions (joints, tendons, ligaments, and major blood vessels). Infection involving a joint, tendon, or ligament can be life threatening and identifying which structures are involved is imperative to providing appropriate treatment.

Depending on which blood vessels were involved and damaged, the wound may only get worse as tissues begin to die from lack of blood flow (usually becomes evident 5-8 days post injury).

The exposed Tibia (bone) needs to be protected as further damage can occur due to exposure. There is a high potential for sequestrum formation associated with the trauma of the bone. Generally trying to keep the limb bandaged in a way that the wound can stay moist helps facilitate granulation over the exposed areas. Cleaning the area daily with a very dilute betadine (weak ice tea color) or chlorhexadine (barely blue color) solution will help. As this is a very large area of involvement, skin grafts may be needed to fully heal the wound (if it can).

As bad as the upper wound looks, the lower wounds can be every bit as bad, if not worse. There is very little tissue in the lower limb to protect the flexor tendons, joints, or blood vessels. If the hoof feels ice cold, that is most likely because the blood supply to the lower limb has been significantly compromised and necrosis can be expected. Again, i would highly recommend a vet come out to assess (even a bovine practitioner).


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## Appyt (Oct 14, 2007)

> Ask your dad if he knows what it's like to have half of his lower leg cut off and be on only Advil.


I can attest to the fact that pain is not felt in some injuries, due to the nerves being severed. Once had a chunk of my cheek bit out and there was no pain. Looked like it should hurt like heck but nope. 

The mare is said to be in good spirits, who are we to say she's in horrible pain. Looks like it would hurt like H* to me too. But if she's in good spirits, eating, not acting depressed etc then she deserves a chance. Sounds like she's getting one. I highly doubt the man will let her suffer if she takes a bad turn and the vets he is consulting advise letting her go.


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## ShutUpJoe (Nov 10, 2009)

" On day 21 the right rear pastern had granulation tissue covering all of the exposed 
tendons and showed no evidence of infection but the patient continued to get more and more unsound. IV antibiotic therapy was employed 
in addition to pain medication but eventually the horse had to be put to sleep."
Wounds, Injury, Injuries, Horse, cannon bone, pastern, Case 173


That was with vet care..... I hope your horse has a good ending. No matter what it is.


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## Hali (Jun 17, 2009)

My opinion is that this horse should be euthanized.

The chances of her surviving such a serious wound without adequate vet care is slim to none.

OP - you can't assume that your horse isn't in pain just because she doesn't _appear_ to be. IME, horses can be some of the most stoic creatures around.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

Speed Racer said:


> That poor _mare_ will be in my thoughts and prayers.
> 
> I'll be praying that the OP and her father see the light and put her down sooner rather than later.
> 
> ...


I have not seen anyone spewing sunshine and roses. I have seen people showing concern and offering hope and prayer. This is not my decision, it's not YOUR decision. It's not OUR horse. 

This is a person that is doing everything they can and doing what they BELIEVE is the right thing to do. Are they wrong? MAYBE. QUITE POSSIBLY. Good intentions can and do bring pain and suffering to animals, but once in a while there is a miracle. A crippled horse can have a permanent limp, it can be severely scarred, and can still live a long and happy life. A severely injured horse can also live a few long months in pain and suffering. 

You've said your piece.


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## SorrelHorse (Apr 9, 2009)

Holy Jesus.....Poor thing!!

I can't offer any remedies because I'm not medically inclined, and I also ahven't read through the replies to be able to add my opinion to anything. I'm too lazy to do that.

But I'm pulling for the poor baby. Please thogh, even if the vet is really far away get her in the trailer and haul her out. Just wrap it and keep her steady. This isn't something you will be able to heal on your own.


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## yukontanya (Apr 11, 2010)

I am wishing you the best of luck, and I think its great your trying for this animal. If she is fighting then you should fight with her. 

I can relate to you not having the access to vets and specialists, I live far in norther Canada and don't even have access to a horse vet, for my boys. 

I grew up on a farm and anytime there were bad cuts, holes, rips or infection on any of our animals we used "Dettol". Its amazing stuff, and it great cause it kills germs causing infections, but does not damage the health flesh, allowing it to heal faster. In fact I had to use it last month on my dog who cut his foot really bad on a broken glass bottle. 

You do have to water the "Dettol" down, I would buy sterilized water or distilled water it you can, but if you cant buy it, boil some of you home water for a half hour and cool and use it.


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## Gidget (Jan 19, 2010)

I can't help you other than saying you will should probably put the horse down. She isn't in good shape. It will be a miracle if she doesn't get an infection and doesn't turn cripple.


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## My Beau (Jan 2, 2009)

I'm also in the put her down boat.

All you need is 1 well placed bullet.

One of my favorite sayings when it comes to horses: "a week too soon is better than a minute too late."

I think that applies in her situation.


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## yukontanya (Apr 11, 2010)

I do think its worth a try, but with anything like this it is touch and go, weather or not its far for the animal. I am not jumping on this "put him down" band wagon, but saying to take a step back and really think about whats best. I hope it all works out, and she survives this.


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

Wow. See this is why I stopped posting so often here. How many times does it have to be explained that the vet is not available? How many times does it have to be explained that the OPs dad is going to try to save the horse regardless of what we say? How many times does the OP have to say they are watching the horse for misery -- in emotion and pain? The poor girl is asking if we have advice on how to help. If you don't have any, don't post. If your suggestion has already been posted 6 dozen times (yes, I'm exaggerating), don't bother to post the same thing again.

Koobean, I wish I had some advice for the physical care of such a wound, but I don't. With the support you have been getting from the vets via long-distance communications, you are already far beyond any suggestions I could add in that area.

It sounds to me like you guys have a good sense of the seriousness of this and the possible outcomes. 

Here's all that I can suggest for your dad's huge emotional, financial and time investment:

Keep your heads about you at all times. The ability to see what is really there versus what you want to see must be maintained. I strongly urge you/your dad to keep a daily journal of everything you do and see including body temperature, respiration, excretions, feeding. And don't ever write down "no change." Each entry should be independent of the previous entry and factual only. You could add just one subjective line every day like "good day today" but keep the journal as objective as possible. That way you won't wonder if something changed or not. You will have actual notes and measurements to refer to. Take pictures daily of the wounds and the entire horse. Preferably in the same position, same time of day. Consider holding a measuring tape beside each of the wounds at picture time, keeping the start at the same point on the mare each time -- not relative to the wound, but relative to say the coronet band or point of hip or joint, etc.

No one can tell you for sure what will happen, of course. I hope your dad and the horse are strong enough for the road he has laid out for him and her. And I hope your dad is strong enough to recognize at any given time the best thing for his special friend and his ability to provide it.


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## Pidge (Sep 5, 2009)

very well said NorthernMama, I agree.


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## hillarymorganstovall (Mar 27, 2010)

Northern Mama, I second that... 

It seems the longest threads on this site are the negative ones... PEOPLE, quit judging this girl and just hope for the best!!! Don't post if you don't have good thoughts and prayers or advice for them... The 5000 people before you have told her to kill the horse. SHE GETS IT

She and her dad are CLEARLY gonna try and save her, so be glad they care that much!!! My dad would've had his gun loaded the second after the accident, and we could afford to euth!!! In the end I'm sure they will do what is best for the horse, obviously they love her... If you say she may not be able to be ridden again so she needs to be put down, you should be ashamed... If they can give her a pain free, happy but useless life good for them!!!! 

I'm not saying she should have to live with pain, she shouldn't, but if she _can_ live pain free, she should... The horse deserves to have EVERY option exhausted before they put her to sleep. No horse should be put to sleep if there is a chance for a quality life. No matter how much effort it takes... 

It may be a painful, ugly process for her, but I've had 2 knee surgeries that were too, and I have a great quality of life!!!! I have limitations, but I don't deserve to get shot, and I didn't get shot before my injuries were even assessed!!! Neither should this horse... When they foal, I'm sure it's painful, but no one is out there in the pasture digging the hole!! 

She may recover completely or the owners may have to make that difficult decision if the horse takes a bad turn (again, I'm not against it if there is no other alternative), but if the horse had a voice, they would rather suffer a few months and live 10 more years (I don't know how old the horse is) than suffer five minutes and get shot in the head by the people who are supposed to care for it without them even putting in an effort to save her....

Those who say it is selfish to try and *save the horse's life* because it may hurt, I bet SHE would disagree if she could... I'm sure someone that posted 'kill the horse, kill the horse' on this thread gives their horse bute for pain, and some horses live their whole life on bute, *because they hurt* 

Pain is not _always_ the enemy, but most of the time, DEATH _is_!!! 






Koobean, You should definitely watch for infections, and if the horse pulls through, call out some kind of vet (any kind) and make sure she doesn't have any left over pain as a side effect of the injury....


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## HowClever (Feb 16, 2010)

The thing that worries me most is that her quality of life from here on out is not looking good. Even IF that wound heals up, she will have ongoing problems. It is all well and good to say that she will just be put out to pasture, but she's not going to be comfortable. I can understand how hard it is to even consider putting her down. My pony lost his tail not all that long ago and if he had have had exposed bone, his story probably would have ended a lot sooner than I would have liked.

I am just urging you to consider her future.


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## Pidge (Sep 5, 2009)

HowClever said:


> The thing that worries me most is that her quality of life from here on out is not looking good. Even IF that wound heals up, she will have ongoing problems. It is all well and good to say that she will just be put out to pasture, but she's not going to be comfortable. I can understand how hard it is to even consider putting her down. My pony lost his tail not all that long ago and if he had have had exposed bone, his story probably would have ended a lot sooner than I would have liked.
> 
> I am just urging you to consider her future.


Are you saying you would have put down your pony if the bone in his tail had been showing? Im sorry but thats a bit far...if your will to put a horse down over his tail you might as well run around gun happy...

Also...Alot of horses are not comfortable... arthritic ones who need bute an supplements hurt but we keep them around... as far as im concerned any animal who shows a will to live and can be kept in a fairly comfortable state deserves a chance. Lots of horses have problems and limp but live happy lives with a pain killer every now and then. 

Hell I have a slightly bum knee, I injured a tendon, Had to have 9 stitches in my knee because I got run into a post with sheet metal sticking off. The Large tendon that wraps around your knee got slightly damaged. Doc said there wasnt much to do except stitch it up and let it heal. Im fine and active but I still have to take a pain pill on and off if I get to active...I def dont want to be put down cause I sorta have a gimp.

This horse may have a perminent limp but so long as a little pain killer can keep her fairly comfy after all this heals then let the dang horse live out its life...a doted on pasture puff can be just as happy if not happier then a working horse.

send hope to people in need...not just hurt...


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## ridergirl23 (Sep 17, 2009)

I agree pidge, nowadays, there's a supplement/pill for that. There's things (some even come in powders to put in oats) to keep things from hurting. If all goes well that horse will be a happy pasture puff for the rest of her life 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## HowClever (Feb 16, 2010)

Nope, I said his story PROBABLY would have been shorter. Meaning that there is more chance that he would have become infected. I never implied I would have put him to sleep right then and there, but I would have been preparing for the worst. A tail is not a necessity for my pony to live a happy life. But if an infection got in that bone he sure wouldn't have been happy. 

I am not trying to send hurt her way, I am simply offering my point of view, my opinion. Which is, after all, what a forum is about.

I am sorry if I have put anyone's nose out of joint, as that was never my intention. I have said my piece regarding the OP's situation and I will not feel the need to say it again.


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## hillarymorganstovall (Mar 27, 2010)

OMG, Pidge, 
I'm soooo glad I'm not the only one!!! I thought I would get run out of here on a rail!!! Whew, glad I'm not the only one who thinks this..... :hide:


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## hillarymorganstovall (Mar 27, 2010)

Sorry to post again, but the tail thing was harsh!! Some horses get their tails docked, I know they are younger, but gosh.... I think some people think horses are a lot more delicate than they are... 

We think we have to put them down because that's whats always been done, but veterinary medicine has come pretty far!! Look at these lucky little boogers!!!


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## HowClever (Feb 16, 2010)

I feel the need to clarify here, as it seems I am being painted with the wrong brush.

I would not have put my pony to sleep at the first sign of bone, I am well aware that there are horses that have been docked. 

However, if that bone was exposed an infection would have left him crippled, seeing as the infection would in fact be in his spine. I had a vet out when it happened and followed his recommendations to the letter. If there had been exposed bone there would have been a vet involved every step of the way to ensure he had the best chance of healing. 

Photos do not do an injury justice. 

Please do not insinuate again that I don't care for my pony, he is my pride and joy.


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## hillarymorganstovall (Mar 27, 2010)

HowClever said:


> I feel the need to clarify here, as it seems I am being painted with the wrong brush.
> 
> I would not have put my pony to sleep at the first sign of bone, I am well aware that there are horses that have been docked.
> 
> ...


I appologize... I _was_ painting you with the wrong brush!! 

I am very glad you wouldn't euth at the mere sight of bone!! 

I would agree with putting a horse to sleep if it were permanently crippled and it _would_ be very possible with an infection on the spine....

I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings


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## HowClever (Feb 16, 2010)

No worries, I'm sorry if I came across as a heartless so and so. I promise you I am not!


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## sandy2u1 (May 7, 2008)

I am so sorry this happened to your dads horse. What a horrible situation to have to go through. I don't blame you a bit for trying to give this horse a chance. As long as she has a will to live and is attempting to function as normally as possible and seems happy, then it is worth a try. I personally think that the healing process is aided by the spirit, and with this girls heart, I think she may just make. If it does come down to her death, then hopefully your dad will be able to take some comfort in knowing that he did everything he could to help her. Please keep us posted.


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## SallyRC123 (Aug 22, 2008)

NorthernMama said:


> Wow. See this is why I stopped posting so often here. How many times does it have to be explained that the vet is not available? How many times does it have to be explained that the OPs dad is going to try to save the horse regardless of what we say? How many times does the OP have to say they are watching the horse for misery -- in emotion and pain? The poor girl is asking if we have advice on how to help. If you don't have any, don't post. If your suggestion has already been posted 6 dozen times (yes, I'm exaggerating), don't bother to post the same thing again.


We need more people like this on Horse Forum and less people like the ones they are referring to! Well said.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

Ktibb said:


> Again I want to recoment the underwoods medecine. It really helps with proud flesh and scar tissue. Did you get a chance to read any of the threads I linked to? Lots of first hand experiance there. I was glad to read that she is showing will to live, without that even the best vet care in all the world wouldn't be enough. I do hopw she pulls through, and I do see improvment in the 2nd set of pictures.
> 
> Please keep us updated, good luck.


 
i did have a look  it looks like amazing stuff! can you get it in south africa?


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

thank you every one for posting here. i think the diary thing is a very good idea and i will tell my dad to do that. i am happy that some of you are understanding what i'm saying now.

i will keep everyone updated. i understand that her chance of surviving is slim and im acting on the other side of the slim chance that she will survive. if she gets an infection and there is no alternative, my dad will put her to sleep. its not like we havent done it to our other animals loads of times before. we live on a farm, things happen to our animals all the time.

dogs can be just as precious as horses, i mean, ours sleep in our beds with us. we have ten of them and their numbers have diminished and rised again constantly throughout our lives. we have had to put many of them down before. most of the trees in our gerden are infact gravestones of lost pets. so, dont think we are just keeping her alive because we cant bare to be without her, we have done whats best for our pets all the time, and we will do the same kindness of putting her down if things start looking grave.


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## koobean (May 19, 2010)

here is a picture of lush with my horse, Zephyr aka. Koobean, before she hurt herself. its the only one i have of her with me here and i just wanted to put a nice picture of her here for u guys to see too.


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## Kayty (Sep 8, 2009)

Koobean, I am So sorry to hear that this has happened. The injury is horrific and yes, I do think that she would be put down if you can't get her to a good vet.
However, this is obviously not going to happen and I can see by your posts that you dad loves this horse and is going to provide her with the best care he can.

I have seen one injury that is reasonably close to this. My coaches young WB put his leg through a fence kicking out at the neighbour's horse. He skinned his hindleg to the bone in some places. We thought that was the end of him.
Shuttled him off in the float and sent him to the nearest equine hospital. He was there for a week on IV fluids and painkillers, along with sedation to keep him still. Like your dad's mare, there was nothing to stitch to. 

He was put in a full leg cast that was packed as tight as possible with gauze and elastoplast. Then stabled for almost 6 months. It was a terrible process, but he was such a great patient, he seemed to know he was being looked after. It cost my coach upwards of $2500 to treat him, but he was a $50 000 as a 2 year old so she wasn't going to give in that easily. 
He is now out competing dressage and you wouldn't know other than the scar. Not a hint of lameness on it and he has started collection without an issue.

However, his injury was at the front of the leg and his missed the tendons. Once a horse has lost tendons, then you will run into huge problems.

Your dad's mare will most likely be permanently lame, and also prone to arthritis. I would say she'll need regular visits from a chiropractor/physio if she pulls through, as she will also be walking unevenly on it which will easily put her back and shoulders out. 
This is going to be a VERY expensive long term injury. She should also be on painkillers, which in the long term will have detrimental effects to her health if she is on them for an extended period of time. It is a huge gamble you have taken. 

I would tell your dad not to rebandage and clean it every day. You want it to settle and promote growth. I would literally drown it in white ointment (a thick paste that is an antibacterial, healing agent that also keeps the flesh soft to promote healthy tissue growth), then pack it with gauze and elastoplast the whole thing quite tightly. Keep her as still as possible. I'd keep her off hard feeds and just on meadow if possible. Wrap all 4 legs for support with well padded bandages (wrapping legs over a long term basis can lead to bandage bruising. Not sure if you've seen results of bandaged bruising but it can be pretty horrendous, google it if you're not sure). 
You want to keep the flesh as soft as possible, if it scabs over it will make healthy tissue more difficult to grow. Keeping it soft will make it take longer to heal, but it will heal better than leaving it to harden. 
I would be cleaning and re-bandaging every 2-3 days. Being extremely delicate with the process as you don't want to knock off the highly delicate new skin tissue. You are going to have an absolute hell of a time trying to encourage the new skin to grow over the bone. If there is no 'bridge' of tissue for the new tissue to grow along, then the tissue essentially 'gets lost' and doesn't know where to close up. That is where skin grafts come into play. They create that 'bridge' of tissue to encourage growth. However, this mare's leg is so badly damaged, I highly doubt they could graft it. 
Proud flesh you don't want, it will inhibit the healing of healthy tissue. 
Keep the exposed bone covered at all times! Her stable should be sterilised. Once a week completely clear it out and disinfect the whole thing, then put new bedding down. Everything has to be as clean as possible. CHanging bandages, wear gloves, don't let new dressings touch the ground etc. If she gets infection in that bone you will be in BIG trouble. Once infection spreads to the hock there is nothing you can do. You would be forced to put her down, the hock joint can degenerate and be eaten away by the infection, which at the very least would leave her with horrendous arthritis in the joint, making it disgustingly cruel to keep her alive. 
I also worry about the lack of tendon's left. If should does recover with the wound closing up, she's always going to be lame on it. The tendons hold muscles to bone and without them, she will always be weak and sore on that leg. It is possible, with IMMENSE expense to attempt to repair damaged tendons with surgery, but again, I highly doubt this would be possible on an injury of this degree. 

I wish you and your dad best of luck, she sounds like a very special mare to you and I hope she recovers. I also hope you have plenty of money to spend on the recovery process. Bandages cost a fortune. I suggest having a look on Ebay and buying bandages and gauze in bulk. It will be cheaper and my god, you will need it in bulk.


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## mayfieldk (Mar 5, 2008)

Just wanted to add a few things:

About the whole 'stop posting negative comments because it's been said 500 times':

'Negative' is a relative term. I don't think they are negative comments. So what, we're allowed to post sunshine and daisy posts 500 times but the moment someone says something REAL it's then labeled as 'negative'? No one has stated she is stupid or mean or heartless. All anyone has said has been REALITY. Forums are about opinions. Just because you don't like them doesn't mean they are 'negative' and shouldn't be posted.

Everyone is talking about infection. I think the bigger problem here is FOUNDER. Number one--they don't even know what it is! Number two--this is how Barbaro died, I believe. Founder is NOT only caused by over-eating--PLEASE do your research on this. Many, many horses are put down because the good legs founder--and the horse can not stand on two legs. It took MONTHS AND MONTHS of treatment from the top vets in the WORLD and Barbaro died anyway. He went through all that crap just to be put down. You don't even have ONE equine vet.

Also, the comments about the mare 'feeling good and being hungry'--oh my lord are we watching a disney movie? Please look up video of horses coming off the slaughter trucks with three legs (literally, as the one leg is ripped off/stepped on during transit). If you didn't see a full body shot, you could hardly tell these horses were in pain. Horses SURVIVE in the wild by being stoic. The horses that act 'depressed' are the oddities. This mare is in pain.

Horses weren't made to be kept in stalls. If you ever plan on putting this mare outside again--the slim chance that she manages to make it--she would have to be alone. Why does a gregarious animal such as a horse have to spend it's life in a small pen, alone, crippled and body sore?

Because you think she's a miracle?

EVEN if she makes it, heck, EVEN IF she can manage some kind of a walk--why do you think it's fair to keep her alone for the rest of her life? Because she's special to you? So she can see horses and never interact with them except by nickering?

Horses do not dwell on death as humans do. They do not understand a future. They live in the moment.

Let your father see this thread and put her out of her misery before you have to do it a year from now, after wasting all of that money.


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## iridehorses (Oct 22, 2007)

Folks, I think it's time to close this thread. The OP stated that the horse belongs to her father and it's his decision. Our opinion and our reasoning, both for and against has been stated and the OP has responded. I don't believe anything more can be had from this thread except to degrade further.

I'm sure we all wish her father's horse every chance possible or to be put down humanely ASAP if it is the best alternative.


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