# packing on saddle without a horn- how?



## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

Attach D rings under the screws front and back. Be sure the panniers are evenly weighted or you will have sore horses.


----------



## GracielaGata (Jan 14, 2012)

So it is as simple as attaching the panniers to the existing D rings? I already have several D rings on my saddle, 2 front 2 back, could do more if needed. 
Is there a certain type of pannier to look for? I also plan to pack as evenly as possible. We used to backpack in the past with out dogs, so we definitely know how to pack a bag to be even! Though I worry about how the heck to carry hay?!

Thanks, I will check into that!


----------



## Painted Horse (Dec 29, 2006)

What type of Panniers are you going to use?

If you get the type that just _Throw_over the top of the saddle. They will probably work fine. They have a hole for the Horn and cantle. Just make sure you get them balanced evenly and they should ride alright. Often the hole for the horn is big enough for the entire pommel to fit in.

I use these a lot during hunting season, because I can roll them up tight and tie them behind the cantle while I ride and if I shoot something, I can throw them over my saddle and load the deer or elk into the panniers.

This horse is packing two 80lb bags of hay cubes into camp.


----------



## GracielaGata (Jan 14, 2012)

Painted Horse said:


> What type of Panniers are you going to use?
> 
> If you get the type that just _Throw_over the top of the saddle. They will probably work fine. They have a hole for the Horn and cantle. Just make sure you get them balanced evenly and they should ride alright. Often the hole for the horn is big enough for the entire pommel to fit in.
> 
> ...


Actually, I don't know a lot about panniers yet. But yours look like they type I was aiming for. Do I just google throwover panniers and it will pop up? And I was thinking of hay cubes as well, since they are a tad easier to carry. Is there an adjustment to them for the horses? Or do we just treat them like hay, but make sure they have extra water?
We also plan to carry our own backpacks, so in reality the horses will probably only be carrying all the water and their own food, and a few of our bigger items. The cabin has all the cooking and such type items in it. 
Thanks!


----------



## Painted Horse (Dec 29, 2006)

They are usually called a "Saddle Pannier" vs just plain pannier. Meaning that they are designed to be used with a saddle.

Saddle Panniers

They come in various materials. Some are lighter and easier to roll up behind the cantle, others are made of Iron Cloth and very tough but are somewhat bulky when rolled up. The lighter ones are easier to roll up and tie on behind a cantle , but when loaded and the brushes against a tree or rock they can tear. The heavier fabric panniers are much more durable to abuse the horses will give it.

When packing, Make sure you even the load on both sides. That is really easy to do with two bags of feed. Since each bag weighs the same. If you put a 80lbs bag on one side, You need to put 80lbs of gear on the opposite side. And yes I've been know to place a couple of rocks in the panniers on the opposite side to even out the weight. It is much more important to be even , than a few extra pounds.

Hay cubes and pellets work fine. 10 lbs of cubes is = to 10 lbs of hay. The big challenge is getting them inside the horses. When camping, you don't have mangers or buckets with you, So you are often pouring the hay cubes on the ground. And you will loose some. Mashed into the dirt or pee'd on. I often feed the smaller pellets ( rabbit pellet size) in nose bags to prevent as much waste on the mountain. Or place the cubes on old feed bags on that I put on the ground.

I also bring hobbles and let my horses graze what they can find. The pellets or cubes make sure the horses are getting the calories they need, But the grazing on yellow grass satisfies their urge to chew and the longer fibers help fill them up. Even if there isn't much nutrition in dry yellow grass.

Offer water and the horses will consume what they need .

Your pack horses should be able to carry 150-180 lbs of supplies very easily. Dead weight is harder to carry than live weight. Meaning that you as a live person who works at keeping your balance is easier to carry than bags of feed or other supplies that make no effort to help balance.

I often use a Top pack. These packs sit ontop of the panniers. Basically spanning both sides of the horse. These are great for lighter items. Sleeping bags, cloths, etc. I just stuff them and throw them on top and tie everything down.


----------



## GracielaGata (Jan 14, 2012)

Painted Horse said:


> They are usually called a "Saddle Pannier" vs just plain pannier. Meaning that they are designed to be used with a saddle.
> 
> Saddle Panniers
> 
> ...


I did see all that info when I went looking about saddle panniers. Thank you 
I am trying to research early.. the trip isn't until June-ish, so we have time. I do want to also work on hobbling more, but probably won't be doing it, as the majority of the area we will be in is fairly rocky, and that worries me with hobbles. I do plan on letting them graze in hand, or even during breaks while riding. If the ground is better then, great, they can hobble as well. 
We will have corrals to keep them in. I was thinking I would just hang an empty bucket from the saddles (one on each side, of course!) for the water... not sure on the cube eating, the empty bag is a good idea. My husband was talking about feeding only pellet grain while we are there, as it is easier to pack in, in regards to its space to weight ratio. That worries me, in regards to such a large diet change for them, as they really don't get any grain during the summer, just a bit a few days per week to give vitamins.

My hope is that the horses will really only have to carry their hay/cube and some water. We will have our stuff on our backs in packs, and the dogs will carry their own food and some water in as well (they are larger dogs, so this has always been easy). We plan on dehydrated food for us, and the cabin we are going to has a stove, cots, pots, etc. So that really cuts down on stuff to carry. 
In reality it is near full amenity cabin camping with an outhouse, but you can't get a horse trailer closer than 3 miles, so you pack in food, water and clothes.
There is also supposed to be a stream I am going to ask about, so that hopefully means water won't be as much of an issue, because we can filter for us and they can drink it straight.

Thanks for all your info, it really helps!


----------



## thenrie (Sep 10, 2012)

My dad and I have made our western saddles more useful by using parachute cord to create ties where we need them. We tie them off to the cinch rings and string them around behind the cantle and up around the pommel and knot them with an overhand knot where ever we want a tie. You make the overhand knot with a looooong tail loop, then split it to make the two "saddle strings". Works like a charm for saddles with not enough saddle strings, or when the saddle strings are rotten. You can configure it any way you like, to tie on any kind of pack.


----------



## GracielaGata (Jan 14, 2012)

thenrie said:


> My dad and I have made our western saddles more useful by using parachute cord to create ties where we need them. We tie them off to the cinch rings and string them around behind the cantle and up around the pommel and knot them with an overhand knot where ever we want a tie. You make the overhand knot with a looooong tail loop, then split it to make the two "saddle strings". Works like a charm for saddles with not enough saddle strings, or when the saddle strings are rotten. You can configure it any way you like, to tie on any kind of pack.


Parachute cord... I assume the same thing we call 550 cord (DH is a retired Marine, lol). Yep, I have some of that as a saddle string just in case I need to repair something on our bridles, etc. I agree, it is also stronger and more pliant than saddle strings. DH thought I was odd till I told him why it was there... now he sees my ways.  I have plans to employ lots of it in our attempts at getting the panniers where they belong... good thing he also knows all those funky ties!  I have my book to refer to for them as well. 
Thanks so much for your input!


----------



## 6gun Kid (Feb 26, 2013)

GracielaGata said:


> Parachute


 yep same stuff


----------

