# Thoughts on this ISH mare



## Thundering Hooves (Dec 16, 2019)

All i have to say is shes GORGEOUS!


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## Jj1001 (Aug 26, 2020)

Hopefully it shows a better quality photo below


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

Are you actually looking to buy or just finding pictures of horses for sale that you are trying to learn what to look for and or avoid?:think:

Her..._not impressed._
She's big, she's thick and very drafty looking to me.
I don't like her hind leg set nor do I like her SI joint placement.
Her hind-end, her motor is weak imo.
She has a large coarse head, a rather thick throatlatch.
I don't like her back nor the blending of back into hind-end.
I see nothing "refined" about her. Nothing mareish or feminine.
When I looked at breed characteristics,_ https://www.thesprucepets.com/irish-sport-horse-breed-profile-4589364_ , to me she is not a prime crossing of draft and Thoroughbred..
When I asked for pictures of this breed, there were drop-dead gorgeous examples even nicer that show the characteristics you want to find in a horse.
The below picture is of a stallion where I would expect to find "male" characteristics of thick/coarse, yet the mare you show is far more coarse in appearance to me than a breeding stallion as the one shown is.


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## Jj1001 (Aug 26, 2020)

horselovinguy said:


> Are you actually looking to buy or just finding pictures of horses for sale that you are trying to learn what to look for and or avoid?


Hi HLG, I'm a first timer so looking to getting a horse but some of the ones I like cost in the thousands so I'm hoping to get advice from more experienced people about whether they are worth the price in terms of conformation as well as abilities and temperament and health. For abilities she ticks all the boxes in that she is a kind, easy mare in terms of temperament and good with farrier, dentist, clipping, no vices, walks trots, canters, jumps well and also hacks well alone which is great for me. I still need to ask about the owner about any injuries and get her vet assessed. The owner is asking 7 thousand pounds for her. I'm just wondering if she is worth 7 thousand if her composition is poor
Thankyou
Thankyou


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## Avna (Jul 11, 2015)

I like her front end assembly. Something about her front pasterns doesn't match with her hoofs however. Otherwise, pretty much what @horselovingguy said. She does look like a kind, easy to live with type of horse. I have no idea what horses go for in your part of the world so cannot comment on that except to say that in the US, such a horse would be modestly priced. A well-schooled horse who is a steady jumper would go for more, though.


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## Jj1001 (Aug 26, 2020)

I've found some videos of her if it helps assess better- 1st one is her standing and 2ndd one is her walking
https://youtu.be/13INTXFzBE8

https://youtu.be/FmBtAdZZHLc

Thankyou


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## Jj1001 (Aug 26, 2020)

Avna said:


> I like her front end assembly. Something about her front pasterns doesn't match with her hoofs however. Otherwise, pretty much what @horselovingguy said. She does look like a kind, easy to live with type of horse. I have no idea what horses go for in your part of the world so cannot comment on that except to say that in the US, such a horse would be modestly priced. A well-schooled horse who is a steady jumper would go for more, though.


Thanks very much for your advice x


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## trailhorserider (Oct 13, 2009)

I think she looks a bit like a mule. :hide: 

Not that she isn't a perfectly functional horse, it's just that she just has something muley about her. The shape of her hindquarters and head are probably most of it. 

I don't tend to divide horses into feminine or masculine for some reason. I think a well-built horse is a well-built horse. 

I'm sure she's perfectly functional. She is just sort of homely. She is more of a fern than a flower.


*****For a first time owner, temperment and training are way more important than conformation. You want a horse that's safe first and foremost. The best thing I think you can do is take someone experienced with you when you shop for a horse. Best of luck finding the perfect horse for you. :smile: ******


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## 4horses (Nov 26, 2012)

I don't see anything glaringly obvious that would be wrong with her. She's a bit plain and just not super attractive to look at. That said, I will take a plain horse over a fancy one, especially if that horse is sound, sane, safe, and well behaved. 

She looks slightly rump high, her front end doesn't quite match her back end. Her head is big and unrefined. That said, her legs are sturdy and look straight. If I was looking for a broodmare, I would pass. If I wanted a riding horse and I liked her, I would consider it. Not sure I would pay that price. I guess it would depend on how she rides.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

Based on the videos, she's a fairly typical Irish horse that was bred primarily for the hunting field.

They don't need to be pretty, they need to be functional!

She was standing calmly at the Meet and rode off quietly which is a positive.

Its a shame there isn't a video of her in action. 

Irish hunts are tough so you need a tough horse, a few lumps and bumps are inevitable but be sure that you rule out anything serious in a thorough vet exam pre purchase.

If you're going to hunt her, whats she like when she gets galloping? That's a lot of horse to stop if she's the sort that pulls.

Is she sensible and careful over fences?

If all she's ever done is hunted, she might not be so great on her own or on a quiet hack out. There could also be some pretty big holes in her schooling.

I'd be careful to get her back checked out, she looked a bit hollowed in the video and sacroiliac problems are common in hunting horses, especially if theyve been used as hirelings.


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## trailhorserider (Oct 13, 2009)

That was also a thought I had after looking at the videos. I didn't see anything where she moved past a walk. Even if you as a new owner aren't ready to canter or gallop her, I would at least like to see someone else do it, just so you know she's safe at faster gaits.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I had a long post typed out and lost it! darn! but anyway, I'll start again . . . 



I don't see a lot of physical problems with her. Her back looks fine to me, the SI joint position being very close to (slightly behind) the point of hip location. As close to each other (viewed from an exactly perndicular photo) is desireable.


Her legs look fine to me, though it looks like she might have a wind puff on the front right.


Her head is large and somewhat unrefined, but that is in part because you have to acquire a taste for the Roman nose look. I actually love a Roman nose, so I find her appealing.


I see that she is ridden in a running martingale. If she has a hollow back, and I am not sure that she does, it may be because she is bracing upward, against that running martingale. I have seen quite a few horses develop a hollow back, and an overdeveloped neck (underside) muscles, from fighting a running martingale, or any other kind of side reins or tie down. ( a standing martingale being the one less likely to cause them to lean on it all the time)


In my opinion, she is a sturdy looking and handsome gal, and if she is of a sane mind, should prove a wonderful partner. I really like her. Do you know her sire? 



I used to ride an ISH who was grandson of King of Hearts:


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

King of Hearts; Irish Draught Horse


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## Jj1001 (Aug 26, 2020)

Thanks so much to you all spending time answering and helping out. Her sire isnt mentioned- I did try and ring the owner several times and leave messages but unfortunately no reply. X


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

To be fair, one single side on pic doesn't tell all, but I'm inclined to agree with HLG for the most part. Her long, weak looking back & SI region. Don't like her light looking front legs when the rest of her is heavy, don't know about her hind legs, but hind hooves look too sloping, which indicates body &/or hoof issues. Her front hooves too look like there is a fair bit of flaring/imbalance there, tho that's probably easily fixed.

But then, to be (doubly?) fair, depends on what you want of a horse. Are you planning on doing some kind of sport with her? If so, what? What sort of level would you aspire to? Because there be 'different strokes' and just because a horse may not be perfectly conformed, elite athlete material, or good at some sports for eg, doesn't mean to say she is no good for someone who doesn't care about those things.



Emilyjane1980 said:


> The owner is asking 7 thousand pounds for her.


Well IMO, for me to consider that sort of price, she would not only be immaculately trained & wonderful in every way, but she'd want to have wings! And that's assuming $7000 AUD not pounds, which I think is closer to double.

Horses are a bit like fashion - they're worth what people are willing to pay, and people will often pay stupid amounts for some 'name brand', or because it's the height of fashion, or because the sales people were good at marketing! When if you look at things(& clothes, & horses) objectively & buy based on what suits you, what's comfortable, what works for your particular situation, not only will you be more likely to find a 'keeper' but it may well be a lot cheaper too. Of course, also depends on your finances as to where you can afford to 'shop' and what you personally consider exxy may be vastly different to what someone else thinks too.

I, for eg, am in Australia(so prices may be diff to wherever you are), I am not into showing, breeding or elite horse sports, so not stuck on a particular breed or bloodline, perfect conformation, amazing ability etc. All I care about really is that the horse I buy is sound in body & mind. I also train horses, so untrained I wouldn't be necessarily adverse to either. So, wouldn't even consider paying a grand for a horse personally. Exception may be a tried & proven great child's pony(paid $800 & $700 for my kid's second horses when they were young) or a well educated but suitable for a beginner horse, in which case I could fathom paying more.


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

There is something about her that doesn't do anything for me, certainly not for that money. 

Much better around for that money.


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## Chaz80 (Sep 29, 2015)

She looks like a sane easy horse but I definitely wouldn't pay anywhere near £7000 :0
Like foxhunter said there is better out there for less money.xx


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## Rudytoot (Feb 14, 2020)

She is a different type of horse than what I am used to seeing as everything is pretty much Quarter Horses and gaited ones in my area. 
How does she ride? I noticed when she walked out, her rear foot landed where the front foot was. I like for a horse to be able to get their legs underneath them. I would never purchase a horse that was short strided in the rear. So, I liked that. 


I see something with her back legs although. Her right rear hock seems to have build up in the front part of the joint. And her pastern on the same leg seems to have a lump in the front as well. 

How did she ride? Was she smooth and have a nice fluid movement that you look forward to riding each time. No horse is perfect, but find out why her joints are thickened in that right back leg. Check to see if the left shows the same traits. With her being 10 years old, it may be from jumping for so many years. She may be suffering from arthritis. 
Although I love to jump, I always think about the strain it puts on a horses legs, and do very little of it. It is a great feeling as the horse sails over the jumps, but I want my horse to remain sound as long as he is alive. 

I don't really like to critique other people's horses unless they are planning on buying one that could be a potential problem. So many things on horse that are not perfect will seldom effect how the horse will ride. A few times there are problems that can prevent you from participating in the events you are looking forward to. 

If I were to post my colt, I would be told that he has a thicker throat latch, and feet turn out in the back. He is not sickle hocked, as his hocks travel straight when he walks. He is not real fat, but I like a light layer of fat on my horse. But will it effect his way of riding if I train him correctly? No.

He is not meant to be a world champion but will make a nice riding horse in my eyes. So, if your horse has a few things that are not perfect, it does not make him a bad horse. Just make sure that it is not something in the mechanics of his legs and being able to carry a rider. Get a good angled shoulder, pasterns and hocks. Make sure that the stifle is not straight and set behind where it should be. Make sure the horse does not have pig eyes or a swell or bow in the face as I believe it shows a bit of lower mental thinking. It could be the case that the swell between the eyes keeps them from seeing so well. 

I personally want the rear end level with the withers.

I rode a Mustang/Quarter Horse cross for many years as a child. I jumped him bareback and he was a really good horse. But he was not perfect. He had a long back and a thick neck. He drug his feet when he walked or trotted, but still, he often placed in Western Pleasure classes at Saddle Club shows. He did not have that small Quarter Horse head that I loved, but it was attractive enough as he had very expressive beautiful eyes. 

He was far from perfect, but was perfect for me at the time. There is no telling how many miles I put on that horse. We had such a great time together. He lived to be 36 years old.


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