# APHA Stallion for stud, Chief



## Aesthetic

Third time ever on the pattern.


----------



## NdAppy

Homozygous for what exactly? OWLs status? What genetic testing had been done?

In all honesty if you're serious get some professional or extremely well done conformation photos, post a stud fee and what not. Right now you AF smacks of something that could be found in Craigslist and not like an ad that is taken seriously.


----------



## Aesthetic

NdAppy said:


> Homozygous for what exactly? OWLs status? What genetic testing had been done?
> 
> In all honesty if you're serious get some professional or extremely well done conformation photos, post a stud fee and what not. Right now you AF smacks of something that could be found in Craigslist and not like an ad that is taken seriously.


I normally get messages for people who are serious about him. We havent made an ad out exactly because we dont have the photography to do so or the patience for a photographer.Hes homozygus black and white and homozygus tobiano pattern. His stud fee isnt actually up, because its debatable. Weve just recently decided to put him up. For his first breedig we are taking offers on what the owelner of a mare will pay considering he doesnt have any earnings from large rodeos. Hes inly recently started running. For my first time puttig him up, my job is just to show what and who he is. I message, text, or call details on him. Hence the reason some of his information is missing.


----------



## CCH

Have you had him tested for the At form of agouti? His sire is bay and his dam's sire is clearly brown, so it is possible he is brown too. I'm no bay/black/brown expert, but to me he looks brown/ heavy faded black in his registration photo. A horse can be homozygous for black and still carry At.

Also, I note that he has not gone through the stallion listing process or DNA typing with APHA. If you plan on registering current/future foals with APHA, I would suggest doing that. APHA also has a nice online website where you can keep up with breeding reports too.


----------



## PaintHorseMares

CCH said:


> Also, I note that he has not gone through the stallion listing process or DNA typing with APHA. If you plan on registering current/future foals with APHA, I would suggest doing that. APHA also has a nice online website where you can keep up with breeding reports too.


If you expect Paint folks, you need that stallion listing with the APHA. Without it, you can't get the breeding certificate without which someone can't register the foal (without a tremendous hassle).
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Aesthetic

He's currently in the process of actually going through. The previous owner before us didn't care to re-register him, and he also didn't sign his papers. We are fighting with APHA and the previous owner to try and speed the process of his papers. His test is actually in APHA, but he hasn't been listed on their site. As for testing, Yes everything has been tested EXCEPT his gene for dilute. 
His father is actually I believe a sorrel paint? I haven't looked in a while. Both father and grandfather were run over a cliff. So I don't believe there are many pictures available. I can call and check record. He for sure is a black and white stallion. As for expecting anyone to breed, he is open to any breed, currently going to breed a few jutlands I believe next spring when they come of age.


----------



## stevenson

what is a "jutland" ? do you mean shetland as in pony ? If he is not registered NOW, and you breed, his foals may not be able to be registered .. you should not list him as a registered horse until you have his papers in hand.. 
You can take photos with any camera, just take a ton of them .


----------



## stevenson

i see the spots , peacock spots. so that is why she is saying homozygous but the horse needs tested if she is going to stand it at stud


----------



## Honeysuga

So you arent trying to add anything to the paint breed?...since youll breed him to just anything. What you are saying is you have a stallion you find pretty but hasnt been proven and doesnt have all the proper registry paperwork done but you just want him to make babies?
Im sorry but that is imo what is wrong in the industry right now. Too many bybs willing to breed an unproven stallion to anything he can cover...
Before you go posting him for stud you may want to all of his information(genes,dilutions,pedigree,complete sire and dam info,training and performance records,terms,conformation photos) instead of "heres a pretty horse with a pair, breed to him"...
Just my .02
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Aesthetic

stevenson said:


> what is a "jutland" ? do you mean shetland as in pony ? If he is not registered NOW, and you breed, his foals may not be able to be registered .. you should not list him as a registered horse until you have his papers in hand..
> You can take photos with any camera, just take a ton of them .


I don't believe you are reading correctly. He is tested. When I bred him he was registered. He is currently in the process of being registered, meaning next spring he will be registered for breeding. A Jutland, is a draft horse. It is a breed.


----------



## PaintHorseMares

Aesthetic said:


> He's currently in the process of actually going through. The previous owner before us didn't care to re-register him, and he also didn't sign his papers.


If I read this right, he IS registered with the APHA, but previous transfers were never done, so he is not registered to you. In any case, you can't get a breeding certificate from the APHA until that is corrected and he has his stallion listing, so to be upfront, please make sure that anyone interested knows that.


----------



## Aesthetic

PaintHorseMares said:


> If I read this right, he IS registered with the APHA, but previous transfers were never done, so he is not registered to you. In any case, you can't get a breeding certificate from the APHA until that is corrected and he has his stallion listing, so to be upfront, please make sure that anyone interested knows that.


 As I said, When I bred him to MY mare, he was registered to the owner that had him before the man before us bought him. He's been passed through family members. As of now, he's only up for 2014. So I do infact have a breeding certificate to the foal about to hit the ground. He hasn't been bred since my mare was bred. We just recently put him up, and until I get him back in the arena we won't get many interested for 2014, just close friends who would like a patterened foal. If they don't want to register, than he is bred to their mare. If they want to register, they can only breed or AI in 2014.


----------



## Honeysuga

My point exactly. Breeding unproven, grade horses for color... headdesk**
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Aesthetic

Honeysuga said:


> My point exactly. Breeding unproven, grade horses for color... headdesk**
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Breeding Unproven? Grades? Those are the owners of the mares choices, I get paid a stud fee. So let him cover, if they don't show why does it matter? Not everyone registers horses or shows or wants them for lineage.


----------



## BarrelracingArabian

The problem is there are thousands of colored horses out there as well as I colored being neglected and shipped to slaughter because of people like you. The whole just let him breed just because they want to causes the over breeding


----------



## Aesthetic

BarrelracingArabian said:


> The problem is there are thousands of colored horses out there as well as I colored being neglected and shipped to slaughter because of people like you. The whole just let him breed just because they want to causes the over breeding


Because of people like me? Who lets a person breed their mare to my stallion because they want the experience with a foal? Also i've studied slaughter. Most are mules, donkeys, ponies and also horses without a large amount of fat such as roping horses or barrel horses. Horses bought at auction by kill buyers or horses stolen. So once again enlighten me on how many colored horses are sent to slaughter because of "People like me" whom do not have a big time stallion I can charge large bills for to breed?


----------



## WSArabians

Aesthetic said:


> Breeding Unproven? Grades? Those are the owners of the mares choices, I get paid a stud fee. So let him cover, if they don't show why does it matter? Not everyone registers horses or shows or wants them for lineage.


I go completely opposite campaining my stlion. I only breed to certain breeds, and I've turned down $1500 breedings due to poor conformation. 
I want his foals to be a better version of himself, so I'm EXTREMELY picky about the mares I will let him cover. 
But we are free to make our own choices.


----------



## Aesthetic

WSArabians said:


> I go completely opposite campaining my stlion. I only breed to certain breeds, and I've turned down $1500 breedings due to poor conformation.
> I want his foals to be a better version of himself, so I'm EXTREMELY picky about the mares I will let him cover.
> But we are free to make our own choices.


Exactly. And in your case, You have a nice stallion who you can get large money for. I also see you have a wonderful breeding program and a nice facility most likely correct? For his first few ads until Chief becomes more popular with the quarter horse owners and paint owners, he is open to breed whom ever would like to breed him and will pay a nice price. Right now he's just a little stallion in training. No huge skills displayed, all he has under his belt is his color.


----------



## waresbear

Yes, if you are trying to compaign a stallion, watch who you breed to, those babies are his advertisements.


----------



## Honeysuga

tons of horses are sent to slaughter because they were bred for color or so people want experience with a pretteh poneh. Those arent reasons to breed. That is why the market is flooded with thousands of horses bred "just because". Go to any auction and you will see plenty of riding horses that are young and ridable but no one wants them. Why? Because of irrisponsible people who get their hands on an animal with the equipment to reproduce.
If you dont have a quality animal to breed, it is irrisponsible to breed. If people dont have the money for a stud fee how in the heck can they afford to care for a mare and foal?g


----------



## Aesthetic

waresbear said:


> Yes, if you are trying to compaign a stallion, watch who you breed to, those babies are his advertisements.


Always, the only people interested as of now is the owner of a few jutlands, and he's looking to get a few patterned heavy babies to pull his little wagon around for his kids when they're older. Although apparently it's the worst thing ever to breed to a mare who won't have the foal registered because they're looking for a patterned baby.


----------



## Muppetgirl

Aesthetic said:


> Exactly. And in your case, You have a nice stallion who you can get large money for. I also see you have a wonderful breeding program and a nice facility most likely correct? For his first few ads until Chief becomes more popular with the quarter horse owners and paint owners, he is open to breed whom ever would like to breed him and will pay a nice price. Right now he's just a little stallion in training. No huge skills displayed, all he has under his belt is his color.


In your words 'No huge skills displayed, all he has under his belt is his color' - *SORRY FAIL* this IS NOT the sole reason to breed a stud to 'whom ever would like to breed him and pay a nice price' - your logic is backwards.


----------



## Aesthetic

Honeysuga said:


> tons of horses are sent to slaughter because they were bred for color or so people want experience with a pretteh poneh. Those arent reasons to breed. That is why the market is flooded with thousands of horses bred just because"
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 Hmmm, If you say so. Seriously though, I believe i'm the owner of the stallion and if I wish to breed him, I will. Case closed.


----------



## Aesthetic

Muppetgirl said:


> In your words 'No huge skills displayed, all he has under his belt is his color' - *SORRY FAIL* this IS NOT the sole reason to breed a stud to 'whom ever would like to breed him and pay a nice price' - your logic is backwards.


 If You say so, if you haven't noticed. The reason most people breed is because of a stallions accomplishments. Correct? My stallion doesn't have accomplishments yet? Right? As of now, all he has people would like to breed for is a pattern and color, and his conformation. So tell me again how is this a fail when in all reality it's true?


----------



## DraftyAiresMum

Usually people go out and prove their stallion, THEN stand their stallion at stud. Not the other way around. Just saying...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Aesthetic

DraftyAiresMum said:


> Usually people go out and prove their stallion, THEN stand their stallion at stud. Not the other way around. Just saying...
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Normally correct? Considering he is 8 years old and three months of training in a local barrel arena, and a lack or sponser in high school rodeo or transportation to larger rodeo's not much can be done right?


----------



## Honeysuga

So a logical responsible person wouldnt breed unless there was something worth advertising like quality genetics. Your "reality" isnt true. It is a complete and total fail.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Aesthetic

Honeysuga said:


> So a logical responsible person wouldnt breed unless there was something worth advertising like quality genetics. Your "reality" isnt true. It is a complete and total fail.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Whatever you say hun, in reality, I am the breeder, not you. Something worth advertising, Conformation, lineage, and color. So your point right here, invalid.


----------



## Honeysuga

You arent a breeder. You are a person who has a horse with balls. He doesnt have very good conformation. What was his lineage again?? And color is worthless.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## COWCHICK77

Aesthetic said:


> Also i've studied slaughter. Most are mules, donkeys, ponies and also horses without a large amount of fat such as roping horses or barrel horses. Horses bought at auction by kill buyers or horses stolen. So once again enlighten me on how many colored horses are sent to slaughter because of "People like me" whom do not have a big time stallion I can charge large bills for to breed?


No, most are not mules and donkeys. However they do run low because of the lack of demand. Color or not, horses are horses and I have seen decent cutting/reining bred horses ran through the sales in east TX. Roans, palominos whatever they still get ran through. Depends on the bidding as who gets them, a backyard owner or kill buyer. Not all of the horses are stolen either. The market would have to warrent the risk and in the last 15+ years the horse market has not been well enough to make stealing and sending horses to auction or kill pens to make it lucrative.


----------



## Aesthetic

Honeysuga said:


> You arent a breeder. You are a person who has a horse with balls. He doesnt have very conformation. What was his lineage again?? And color is worthless.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Here is his pedigree. Oh, I'm not a breeder? really now? Is that why we've had two foals drop this spring, and one more coming? A stallion for stud? And two mares being bred back? Tell me how this works? Breeding I mean? 
Missquanahsdeltachief Paint


----------



## Honeysuga

I was just thinking,hun, how old are you?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Aesthetic

COWCHICK77 said:


> No, most are not mules and donkeys. However they do run low because of the lack of demand. Color or not, horses are horses and I have seen decent cutting/reining bred horses ran through the sales in east TX. Roans, palominos whatever they still get ran through. Depends on the bidding as who gets them, a backyard owner or kill buyer. Not all of the horses are stolen either. The market would have to warrent the risk and in the last 15+ years the horse market has not been well enough to make stealing and sending horses to auction or kill pens to make it lucrative.


You basically just proved my point. Not all horses running through auction are color. Also saying being bred only for color and getting ran through the auction? There are many breeds that come in color, and not always bred for such.


----------



## Aesthetic

Honeysuga said:


> I was just thinking,hun, how old are you?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 Me, I'm 21. And you?


----------



## Honeysuga

Lol i thought something like that. Im withdrawing from this little debate. There is no use arguing.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Aesthetic

Honeysuga said:


> Lol i thought something like that. Im withdrawing from this little debate. There is no use arguing.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 Thank you for finally realizing you started a pointless and completely losing argument Bye


----------



## Honeysuga

Bye  there is no point arguing with an ignorant and obviously inexperienced young person.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Aesthetic

Honeysuga said:


> Bye  there is no point arguing with an ignorant and obviously inexperienced young person.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Whatever you say darling


----------



## myhorsesonador

Just another clueless BYB.


----------



## Aesthetic

myhorsesonador said:


> Just another clueless BYB.


Obviously I'm clueless


----------



## xxdanioo

As a breeder you should be looking to better your breed, and looking to produce the best quality foals. You shouldn't be looking for a quick $5 to let your stallion cover any mare who's owner is throwing money at you. 

One day maybe you will open your eyes and see this, but I don't see that being anytime soon.


----------



## Aesthetic

xxdanioo said:


> As a breeder you should be looking to better your breed, and looking to produce the best quality foals. You shouldn't be looking for a quick $5 to let your stallion cover any mare who's owner is throwing money at you.
> 
> One day maybe you will open your eyes and see this, but I don't see that being anytime soon.


Yeah for sure. I would definitely breed for a quick $5? I took the price of the jutlands at $525 each. Which for a stud with nothing but conformation and color to these mares, is pretty good.


----------



## xxdanioo

You just don't understand... It just looks like you are in it for the money more than anything, which is just sad.


----------



## Aesthetic

xxdanioo said:


> You just don't understand... It just looks like you are in it for the money more than anything, which is just sad.


 If I were in it for money I would pop his semen off to anyone. No. This guy is my ferrier who just wanted two of his mares bred. So bad? Didn't think so. Everyone here is thinking I am only breeding him for color or just popping him to any mare. No. Those two he's breeding because the guy wants a pair of foals to raise and cart train. My foal, i'm hoping will be a nice barrel prospect. His first foal, is acutally a hunter jumper. Now saying I'd breed to an mare and they don't need registration, doesn't mean i'm spouting him off. Many people like having a foal to raise and don't have a registered mare themself. Or can use them in sports like barrels and not need them registered. It happens in a small town right? So everyone saying i'm in it for the money, or breeding only for color, or other things, really have no idea what they're talking about.


----------



## WSArabians

Aesthetic said:


> Exactly. And in your case, You have a nice stallion who you can get large money for. I also see you have a wonderful breeding program and a nice facility most likely correct? For his first few ads until Chief becomes more popular with the quarter horse owners and paint owners, he is open to breed whom ever would like to breed him and will pay a nice price. Right now he's just a little stallion in training. No huge skills displayed, all he has under his belt is his color.


No, no nice facilities. Hoping to actually build a barn this year! LOL
I'm not a big rich breeder - just a small one that worked my wee little tush off to get the best I could - Most of my horses I paid on payments but some things I couldn't sacrifice. 
Thanks for the compliments, though! 

Not saying I'm right or your wrong - We're all entitled to do what we will with our own horses.


----------



## xxdanioo

Aesthetic said:


> If I were in it for money I would pop his semen off to anyone. No. This guy is my ferrier who just wanted two of his mares bred. So bad? Didn't think so. Everyone here is thinking I am only breeding him for color or just popping him to any mare. No. Those two he's breeding because the guy wants a pair of foals to raise and cart train. My foal, i'm hoping will be a nice barrel prospect. His first foal, is acutally a hunter jumper. Now saying I'd breed to an mare and they don't need registration, doesn't mean i'm spouting him off. Many people like having a foal to raise and don't have a registered mare themself. Or can use them in sports like barrels and not need them registered. It happens in a small town right? So everyone saying i'm in it for the money, or breeding only for color, or other things, really have no idea what they're talking about.


So why don't you point them towards foals already on the ground that aren't finding any buyers? There are SO many horses that are unregistered, and just itchin' to find a home and be trained. Why don't you have standards set for your stallion? Any horse good enough to be kept a stallion should have high standards set for the mares wanting a foal out of him. Why just allow him to breed to anyone?


----------



## Aesthetic

WSArabians said:


> No, no nice facilities. Hoping to actually build a barn this year! LOL
> I'm not a big rich breeder - just a small one that worked my wee little tush off to get the best I could - Most of my horses I paid on payments but some things I couldn't sacrifice.
> Thanks for the compliments, though!


 Well you've for sure have the absolutely stunning horses!! Could've fooled me! We have a nice barn, but recently a large branch came through the roof. Thank heavens all horses were turned out. We paid for our horses, except for the stallion. Actually we had a few cattle we raised and a man needed to rid of two broodmares and get a hold of cattle. So there is how we got two mares, both registered and with amazing lineage! I love your stallion by the way(; Wish I still had my arabian now.


----------



## Aesthetic

xxdanioo said:


> So why don't you point them towards foals already on the ground that aren't finding any buyers? There are SO many horses that are unregistered, and just itchin' to find a home and be trained. Why don't you have standards set for your stallion? Any horse good enough to be kept a stallion should have high standards set for the mares wanting a foal out of him. Why just allow him to breed to anyone?


 Not actually breed /anyone/, More so along the lines of a horse that isn't what people around here would call....sadly 'nags'. Bad conformation, temperment, or whatever. As for finding buyers, out here we don't have much of a problem with horses finding homes. The ones in the auction either return home with the seller because they're asking to much, or they find a home where they're pastured to gain wait and then trained further more. Small towns, you see horses repeatedly in better condition or making a five year old girl happy.


----------



## Honeysuga

I love how the story changes with every post. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Aesthetic

Honeysuga said:


> I love how the story changes with every post.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Darling, I don't believe my story changed. Are you here to cause problems? Because it's proving to be pointed in that direction.


----------



## Poseidon

Aesthetic said:


> If I were in it for money I would pop his semen off to anyone. No. This guy is my ferrier who just wanted two of his mares bred. So bad? Didn't think so.


Except what happens when every 4th horse owner "just wanted two of his mares bred?" That adds up real fast and you know what? That's why we're in the situation we're in with overpopulation. 

His color is also nothing special. Tobiano and splash. You have not mentioned if he is positive for frame though. There are plenty of stallions with those same color genes that are both proven and actually well conformed for not much more then you received for the farrier's mares.

Also, just pointing out that you posted your stud's name on a public forum with your attitude along with it. If I found your ad on craigslist, I would most likely google his name to see if anything came up. Horse Forum threads are usually pretty high up in that list more often than not. If I was interested in a stud and saw this thread, I wouldn't come near either of you with a 10 foot stick.

And as someone your own age, you should probably check your maturity level.


----------



## Allison Finch

Aesthetic said:


> Hmmm, If you say so. Seriously though, I believe i'm the owner of the stallion and if I wish to breed him, I will.* Case closed*.


 
I believe that everything that can be said, has been said. As such, *at least for the time being*, this thread will be closed.


----------

