# Is this Quarter Horse "Foundation" bred?



## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

Well a "foundation bred" horse is a horse that has bloodlines including, Hancock, Driftwood, Leo, King, Poco Bueno, Three Bars, Bert, Hard Twist, Lucky Blanton, Skipper W, Old Sorrel, Joe Reed, Wimpy, Oklahoma Star, Clabber, Peter McCue, and Zantanon, King P234, Doc Bar, etc. (all according to the foundation horse market website) 

So technically, yes, your horse is foundation bred. He goes back to Doc Bar, Three Bars, Driftwood, King, and Zantanon and probably a few more. They are a bit farther back, but like I said technically he is


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

JustaSkippenJess said:


> Well a "foundation bred" horse is a horse that has bloodlines including, Hancock, Driftwood, Leo, King, Poco Bueno, Three Bars, Bert, Hard Twist, Lucky Blanton, Skipper W, Old Sorrel, Joe Reed, Wimpy, Oklahoma Star, Clabber, Peter McCue, and Zantanon, King P234, Doc Bar, etc. (all according to the foundation horse market website)
> 
> So technically, yes, your horse is foundation bred. He goes back to Doc Bar, Three Bars, Driftwood, King, and Zantanon and probably a few more. They are a bit farther back, but like I said technically he is


You might want to read through this...

Foundation Quarter Horse Article


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

Faceman said:


> You might want to read through this...
> 
> Foundation Quarter Horse Article


Very informative article. Although her horse isn't able to be registered foundation, he still has the foundation breeding in his bloodlines, just like the article said it is truly a matter of personal opinion ( even if the horse doesn't technically qualify to be registered as foundation). Thanks for the information though!


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

No it is a matter of %. Depending in which registry you go with will vary in % but it has nothing to do with Opinion. They either have the % of foundation breeding or they do not. There are a lot of foundation horses by % that have little to non of the breeding you listed.

An appendix is just that a horse who has TB breeding who has not been advanced into the regular registire. It has nothing to do with % of any other aspect. It is a sub divition of the AQHA registiry.


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## texasgal (Jul 25, 2008)

So to answer the question of "is your horse foundation or appendix"? .. the answer is:

Neither! (Unless, of course, you figure the percentage of foundation and it meets the registry requirements...)

You have a Quarter Horse with some foundation breeding and a few TBs way back. Most quarter horses probably fall into this category. It makes your horse no less a QH.


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

texasgal said:


> So to answer the question of "is your horse foundation or appendix"? .. the answer is:
> 
> Neither! (Unless, of course, you figure the percentage of foundation and it meets the registry requirements...)
> 
> You have a Quarter Horse with some foundation breeding and a few TBs way back. Most quarter horses probably fall into this category. It makes your horse no less a QH.


That's basically what I was saying. The horse wouldn't qualify for foundation registration (not making him any less QH) but he does have some foundation lineage.


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

nrhareiner said:


> No it is a matter of %. Depending in which registry you go with will vary in % but it has nothing to do with Opinion. They either have the % of foundation breeding or they do not. There are a lot of foundation horses by % that have little to non of the breeding you listed.
> 
> An appendix is just that a horse who has TB breeding who has not been advanced into the regular registire. It has nothing to do with % of any other aspect. It is a sub divition of the AQHA registiry.


I understand the percentages etc. when referring to true foundation horses in registries, but the question was if her horse was foundation bred, and he is... just not a lot. He also does have TB lineage in him as well. foundation not speaking in the sense of a registry can absolutely be a matter of opinion (whether it is correct or not). You see horses all the time being listed as foundation bred that really aren't or are VERY minimal. Technically there is a lot of calculations to do to determine the percentage, but in a basic question if this particular horse is foundation bred or appendix... yes he is both appendix and goes back to foundation bloodlines.


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## texasgal (Jul 25, 2008)

She asked was the horse a foundation.

It might sound like semantics, but to people with foundation horses, it's not.

QHs are not considered "Foundation QH's" unless they meet the percentage to qualify for one of the registries.

He could be half TWH .. but you can't say he's a TWH just because he goes back to TWH bloodlines ....

Just like he's not a TB .. but he goes back to them..


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

must just be the different ways we are taking it. she seemed pretty simple about it, a conversation in passing with someone regarding this would be as simple to say yes he is foundation bred, but not foundation registered.. simple.

And I do happen to own horses that are 'foundation bred' as well as 'foundation registered' i do understand the difference.


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

First that horse is not at all Appendix bred. Saying a horse is Appendix is saying one of 2 things. One the horses sire or dam is a TB or the horses sire or dam is an Appendix horse themselves meaning they have a TB sire or dam or some where in the Pedigree that is a TB cross that has not been advanced into AQHA full reg. That is the only definision of Appendix in refering to a QH.

As foundation. To say a horse is a foundation horse they better be just that. All QH go back to some foundation horse or they would not be a QH. My stallion goes back to Bert Wimpy and several other Foundation QH yet he is in no way a foundation bred or foundation horse in anyway. He is also over 40% TB yet he does not have a single TB on his papers. He is also not an Appendix QH. Basically he is nither. So calling him either would in incorrect.


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

Ok, after spending a lot of time looking into this information and learning how to actually calculate foundation breeding, I started with my mare and it was just about dead on with what NFQHA calculated her at. 

So your gelding, Sun Frost Dude came in at 85% Quarter horse foundation and 15% thoroughbred lines. So he is in fact according to NFQHA (they require 80% or higher) foundation bred.


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## Monty77 (Aug 8, 2011)

Thank you for going to all that trouble to find that percentage out for me. I have only ever had Arabians so this whole Quarter horse thing is new to me.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## AQHSam (Nov 23, 2011)

Would you say Sam could meet the foundation %. I found only one line back to 3 Bars (Depth Bars) born in 1959. The rest looks solid with lots of Poco and Otoe's blood. Any opinions?


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

JustaSkippenJess said:


> And I do happen to own horses that are 'foundation bred' as well as 'foundation registered' i do understand the difference.


Not if you list Three Bars as foundation breeding as you did in your opening post, which is why I posted the article to begin with...


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

AQHSam said:


> Would you say Sam could meet the foundation %. I found only one line back to 3 Bars (Depth Bars) born in 1959. The rest looks solid with lots of Poco and Otoe's blood. Any opinions?


It's hard to say without actually seeing the papers. It isn't just Three Bars, it's any thoroughbred in their bloodlines 1941 or later. But if your horse only traces to one TB line then that's pretty good, all quarter horses born 1940 or earlier are considered "foundation"
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

Faceman said:


> Not if you list Three Bars as foundation breeding as you did in your opening post, which is why I posted the article to begin with...


I wasn't so sure to begin with I do admit, but after reading further up on it I learned more... No need to keep putting the fact that I was wrong out there. My mistake at first but now I have got it!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

Monty77 said:


> Thank you for going to all that trouble to find that percentage out for me. I have only ever had Arabians so this whole Quarter horse thing is new to me.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Hey no problem at all!  It helped me learn a lot more too. My mare has been registered both AQHA & NFQHA for a while now and now I can actually say ii fully understand her percentage and how it is calculated.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## nrhareiner (Jan 11, 2009)

JustaSkippenJess said:


> It's hard to say without actually seeing the papers. It isn't just Three Bars, it's any thoroughbred in their bloodlines 1941 or later. But if your horse only traces to one TB line then that's pretty good, all quarter horses born 1940 or earlier are considered "foundation"
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 
Yes ands no it depends on which Foundation reg. you use. One is by date one is by number and one is by generation.


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## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

JustaSkippenJess said:


> Hey no problem at all!  It helped me learn a lot more too. My mare has been registered both AQHA & NFQHA for a while now and now I can actually say ii fully understand her percentage and how it is calculated.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Sorry for butting in....you feel like doing another?...
I read the article and tried, but gave up, since I operate with a cell and it's rather complicated ....only thing im pretty sure of is the dam's side....no TB there.......
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

nrhareiner said:


> Yes ands no it depends on which Foundation reg. you use. One is by date one is by number and one is by generation.


Right. FQHA is the one that I have learned you follow the their bloodlines back until you hit a TB or a QH born 1940 or earlier and start calculating from there.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

deserthorsewoman said:


> Sorry for butting in....you feel like doing another?...
> I read the article and tried, but gave up, since I operate with a cell and it's rather complicated ....only thing im pretty sure of is the dam's side....no TB there.......
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


ya for sure! It will take me a bit to do it, have to work today but I can work on it on my lunch hour. Just need the registered name and needs to be on all breed pedigree 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Wow, thanks
Snip my Skip
Snip My Skip Quarter Horse

Hope the link works
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Since I also own a "Skip" QH, how do you feel about doing another? I have no clue about Foundation this or that and am severely math challenged to boot! 

Skip N My Assets link:

Skip N My Assets Quarter Horse


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## texasgal (Jul 25, 2008)

deserthorsewoman said:


> Wow, thanks
> Snip my Skip
> Snip My Skip Quarter Horse


Skipper W much??? Lol ...


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## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

texasgal said:


> Skipper W much??? Lol ...


???? Don't follow you on that one.......is that bad?
_Posted via Mobile Device_
ETA im an Arab person, no clue about QH...that's why I don't follow you;-)


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## texasgal (Jul 25, 2008)

Noooooooooo .. I love Skipper W! On allbreedpedigree, your horse goes back to Skipper W at least three times ... love it!


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## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

9 times all together, I counted 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

AND she looks it, too
She was a rescue, mind you
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

I know I thought the same thing holy cow Skipper W! Love it my little stinker is Skipper W but not near that much! 
So when I have the time at lunch I am going to attempt both NFQHA and FQHA calculations on your horse. been looking into the way NFQHA does their calculations and want to give it a shot! 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> Since I also own a "Skip" QH, how do you feel about doing another? I have no clue about Foundation this or that and am severely math challenged to boot!
> 
> Skip N My Assets link:
> 
> Skip N My Assets Quarter Horse


surely I will probably be able to have it done tonight. Keep in mind all these aren't "dead on" percentages, they are approximate, but shouldn't be off more than a percentage or so either way 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Great
This mare was sold due to a bad divorce and later bought back specifically. Unfortunately her papers "can't be found" by the last seller, but one of her previous owners, which got me all the info would provide me with anything I need to get her replacement papers. Now if she was, on top of linebred Skipper W also high % foundation, I'd be able to convince hubby to try breeding her. She's only 16 after all.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

JustaSkippenJess said:


> surely I will probably be able to have it done tonight. Keep in mind all these aren't "dead on" percentages, they are approximate, but shouldn't be off more than a percentage or so either way
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


LOL! The wee percentages you might be off are still going to represent a WHOLE lot more than the sum of my total knowlege about Foundation QHs!:lol:

Thanks for whatever you come up with.


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## JustaSkippenJess (Jan 25, 2012)

deserthorsewoman said:


> Wow, thanks
> Snip my Skip
> Snip My Skip Quarter Horse
> 
> ...


Ok so the way I figured it your horse, Snip my Skip is roughly 81% foundation bred.

on the top side he goes back to TB lines 5x
on the bottom side he goes back to TB lines just 1 time.

I can explain further if you want/need, i will keep the sheet that i have it all written down on 

i have noticed an several that i have done i have been off by official calculations from 1-3%, i am figuring the reason for this is because some horses on allbreedpedigree have holes in the bloodlines and i don't have access to AQHA records online at this time. but it still gives an idea!


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## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Thank You
I figured it couldn't be much higher than that, since Skipper W is only 88% according to their list and there was quite a bit TB from the sire side. I suppose it could come out different depending on the association you're dealing with ( including Three Bars as foundation or not)
Good Job!
*goes off trying to convince hubby;-)*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## AQHSam (Nov 23, 2011)

JustaSkippenJess said:


> It's hard to say without actually seeing the papers. It isn't just Three Bars, it's any thoroughbred in their bloodlines 1941 or later. But if your horse only traces to one TB line then that's pretty good, all quarter horses born 1940 or earlier are considered "foundation"
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Ugh. I didn't post the link. Here it is. Ddf Sam I Am Quarter Horse


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