# Dangerous Advice Part II: The Gorey Details



## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

A few weeks ago, I posted about Rick Gore's ridiculous advice to eschew horse riding helmets. He actually went so far as to say that they "do more harm than good, and horse riding helmets are bad, people." (He claims they make riders overconfident.) He also rants against women in nearly all of his vids, saying they are incompetent with horses. Well, he finally ****ed off the wrong woman. See this link:

Liz Castelli - Another Petty Stalking Horse Knowitall

Now you will notice that this is on his webpage, so it is his point of view, but if you google the guy, you will find that he is known for calling horse women "barn witches" and that his favorite retort to anyone disagreeing with him is "I hope your horse kicks you in the head." And he says such things to detractors in some of his vids and in replys to comments. So I doubt his "replys" listed on the site are accurate, and I imagine her vicious tone is from someone who has just had enough of this jerk. 

At any rate, I was delighted to see that she got youtube to take down his very dangerous video on helmets!

(And no, I am not the secret Dr. Nikki... ; )


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

*Unfortunately...*

It looks like he made another one yesterday! he has put up another anti-helmet vid...


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

*Idiocy, Part II*





 
He does soften the message a bit.


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## Jessskater (Mar 16, 2011)

I think this guy fell of a horse one to many times without a helmet 
Very interesting post, thanks for sharing.


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## Iseul (Mar 8, 2010)

Although I don't agree with his reasoning for not wearing a helmet much (I don't, but that's my own business), "Dr. Nikki" had no decent reason to say what she did, call names, continue to escalate the situation, or use a fake name (of which could actually be someone else's name).
From what I understand, if he found out who she was (which is actually relatively easy if she has used this email from a computer of hers) he could easily sue her for harassment of some sort, slander (I think), etc. I won't say that for sure though, because I'm not particularly knowledgable about court cases and such.
I do understand though that from my point of view, she was the one in the wrong. No self-respecting, notable doctor (that I'd ever call as such) would be so low as to do what she has. So he says stupid things on a YouTube account, so what? She doesn't have to listen to that, it's his opinion and it's his right to freedom of speech to say so. I've not watched any of his other videos (aside from the first one posted in this thread three posts up), I cannot comment on his views of women, female riders/BOs/BMs, etc, but that's also his own opinion. He can say it all he wants, people can disagree with him all they want, but no amount of disagreeing and arguing can change a male's mind that is set in his own opinion. If he were to say I'm incompetent/a barn witch/etc to my face, I would tell him straight up what was on my mind about that comment. But, alas, he is only online, and there's no reason to waste time over his opinions that aren't in direct correlation to my life.
But, I can see why he thinks helmets make riding more dangerous since many people I know in fact get the "superman ego"-thing he is talking about and get more hurt than they would have gotten had they not worn a helmet and stayed more precautious. I would suggest a helmet to any new rider and would not go around saying to not wear one because you could become some over-confident, egotistical freak and get killed (despite wearing that life-saving helmet), but I agree to a point..From what I heard in his video (only one I've watched, so I'm only commeting on this specific video), he stated that he was not condoning the non-use of a helmet, but just explaining his opinion on them and why people endorse them.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LikeIke17 (Mar 18, 2011)

Well.... can't say I've ever heard that before, with that perspective. I like my helmet. Regardless of who endorses the studies and yada yada yada, stats are stats. Plus... I feel weird without it.  Not making this a debate by the way, just my thoughts.


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

I do suspect, Iseul, that he is misrepresenting the situation and that he was the one harassing her to begin with and that these are her angry responses. Gore also has a reputation of having his youtube and website fans harrass those who write to him with disagreements. As I said before, this thing is from Gore's perspective, and he is a ranter a raver and a dangerous voice in the horse world. I think it's good to speak out against his type: he gives dangerous advice and sets dangerous examples for many foolish enough to listen to him. A counter voice is needed.

His whole idea behind helmets is that anyone who wears one will be more foolish because of it. I.E. "You wear a helmet, you are a bad and foolish rider." I am sure this is true of only a very small percentage of riders. But if one person eschews a helmet because he says they are bad and suffers a head injury, there is blood on his hands... 

Dr. Nikki or no, my goal is to make people aware of this bad Gore medicine. I am not trying to defame him or harm him in any way, but simply to speak against a dangerous opinion that a lot of people are listening to.


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

And in this new set of videos, the message is somewhat softened.


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## Iseul (Mar 8, 2010)

Ahh, that may make a bit more sense, lol. 
Although, I still stand by that she would have even responded, especially with such choice words. I cannot comment on his part in whole because I am unaware, bu I can note what I feel is wrong with how she handled the situation (regardless of who started it, who was harassing who, etc).
I just feel that, as a doctor with 2 master degrees (showing atleast a rough estimate of her age and supposed maturity le), that she should have (would have?) either not replied, not called names, not wished ill (seeing him in the ICU, etc), using a fake name, be willingto take down/block her YouTube videos, etc.
I'm only 17, and even I wouldn't have done something with such immaturity, save that I am more mature than quite a few at my age. But meh, isn't really my issue..just my thoughts. I do apologise for not even reading the OP and only skimming though, bad on my part. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Allison Finch (Oct 21, 2009)

What an uneducated dork. Someone needs to throw chlorine into his gene pool. Or, wait a while and he will be taken out naturally.


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

Actually, Iseul, yes, if these are in fact her real words, they are not those of a doctor, and frankly, I suspect they are not and that these are just messages from someone he has ****ed off (there are plenty). And I think any woman who watches his videos should be angry at his misogeny, just to begin.

I just wanted to use this to redirect attention to the issue of helmets and how ONE SHOULD HAVE A CHOICE, yes, but I think to give the impression that only a foolish rider wears a helmet is bad, bad stuff.

I don't know. Maybe those foolish enough to follow a fool deserve the conk on the noggin. But some of them have children too, and beginning riders and kids need to always wear helmets.

My original post DANGEROUS ADVICE can be referenced for my more detailed argument against Gore's false logic and reasoning.


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## coffeegod (May 6, 2011)

I don't ride with helmets. I would, however, make it a point to wear one around this asshat.


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## Iseul (Mar 8, 2010)

I do agree that even though everyone should have a choice to or to not wear a helmet, his telling peoplethat only fools wear them is wrong.
And although I wouldn't -make- my child (if I ever have one) always wear a helmet (after they've learned the basics on how to stop, turn, and back a horse, along with how to fall, I probably would suggest anyone else to make their kids. I'm an old-school rider, but that's my choice for me to make, everyone else I suggest a helmet. I'm not nearly as cautious as I should be, but oh well.
I would also most likely make it a point to wear a helmet in front on him though, ha.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

And this is really not to start an argument, but what do you mean, Iseul, by "old school?" Again, this sort of language sets up the idea of "cool/classic" and "careful" being at olds. How is "old school" at odds with helmets?


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

And let me throw a very easy twist on Gore's (il)logic:

People who don't wear helmets feel invulnerable to start with and thus will take more chances.

People who wear helmets will remember that accidents can happen and will be more careful. (That is the effect mine has on me!)

Now, I am not saying this is true of all people. But I can flip Gore's thinking around to fit another purpose and say the exact opposite and have it make just as much (and I think more) sense.


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## Iseul (Mar 8, 2010)

I didn't mean to word it as so that it comes off as such, but it's more of the preference of a hat over a helmet as my meaning. I was trying to word something that said I would rather just a hat or nothing over a helmet, and I guess I was trying to give some sort of image..
I guess it didn't do what I meant for the words to mean, lol. I'm extremely sore and slightly tired, so I do apologise for anything that makes no or little sense (such as my statement and possibly this post...).
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

I understand, Iseul. And I totally think you deserve a choice. But I think you did communicate, intentionally or not, an idea that is in the air, often subliminally: "helmets are not cool, and real cowboys don't wear helmets." That is why I think a pro-helmet campaign is necessary (WITHOUT CREATING LAWS, by the way! It should remain a choice.) Helmets need a better image.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

^^^ Helmets have tons of supporters. Those who choose to refuse can expect (from what I've seen on this forum) to be called stupid, selfish, criminal, guilty, etc.

And the truth, from what I've seen - which is pretty limited, I admit - real cowboys do NOT wear helmets. At least, the score is 0% in my experience.

Does that mean someone should NOT wear a helmet? Nope. The last cowboy I saw was a month ago, while I was out jogging. He was a Mexican, and I don't know Spanish, so we did a bit of sign language (he was looking for cattle) and went on our separate ways...me on foot, him on horseback with a straw hat. And no, there is no way I would ever consider riding in that country without a helmet! Shoot, I've broken a toe and had some impressive bruises just JOGGING on those trails.

Most of the helmet debate is based on anecdotal evidence, so making an informed decision can be a challenge. Riding horses is a risk in and of itself, and each person needs to decide for themselves what level of risk they choose to take.


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## Iseul (Mar 8, 2010)

While also completely agreeing with what you just said, there's one thing I'd also like to comment on. From what I've seen, "real cowboys" (on their ranches running cattle and such), actually don't wear helmets, lol. 
But I do get your point and agree, not wearing a helmet doesn't make me (or anyone else) "cooler" than someone who chooses to.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cfralic (Jan 17, 2011)

I used to watch his videos occassionally, but I got sick of his attitude. He can't seem to discern between a personal attack and a critique. I've seen many commenters leave viable questions for him that he replies to negatively, and he's said before he blocks anyone who leaves comments for him that he disagrees with. Sounds like he needs to head back to preschool and learn a little about good sportsmanship. 

This is definitely the last straw for me, regaurding the helmet issue. Although over-confidence is a possible side effect, helmets are in no way dangerous. They save lives. 

The bottom line is, any living thing can be unpredictable. You might be a horse whisperer, an animal behaviourist, an olympic medalist or a freaking psychic, even, but things will not always go 100% the way you expect. Anything alive has the potential to disregaurd what it normally does and try something new. A horse is perfectly alive, and it has nearly 900 lbs over the average human. Not to mention it can move a lot faster.


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

No problem with those who choose to refuse. Big problem with those who try to influence others not to wear a helmet. (I realize you are not doing this.) There is more than anecdotal evidence. There are competent studies. Someone (was it you, BSMS?) who cited studies that supported helmets the last time I started this thing.


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

CFRALIC: "The bottom line is, any living thing can be unpredictable. You might be a horse whisperer, an animal behaviourist, an olympic medalist or a freaking psychic, even, but things will not always go 100% the way you expect. Anything alive has the potential to disregard what it normally does and try something new. A horse is perfectly alive, and it has nearly 900 lbs over the average human. Not to mention it can move a lot faster."[/QUOTE]

(And so helmets are an important safeguard.)

This sums it up better than all my rambling.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

Based on studies, helmets reduce the risk of serious head injury by 50-70%. However, at some point you have diminishing returns.

For example, if your overall risk of head injury is 50%, then cutting it 50% reduces your risk by 25% (0.5 x 0.5). But suppose your overall risk is 0.5%. Then your reduction in risk is 0.25% - your call on if that is worth it.

Riding style affects your risk as well. An Australian saddle will help you stay on the horse more than an English saddle will. So is it a foolish risk to ride English?

Western and dressage styles of riding, with a long leg and low center of gravity, is safer than jumping. Jumping increases the risk by 1000-8000%, depending on the study, so is it a foolish risk to jump? But I look up to riders who jump (and particularly eventers), so how can I condemn that risk?

I normally ride with a helmet. When I do not (5%?), I don't think I'm acting suicidal or being selfish. I'm probably safer riding an Australian saddle without a helmet than an English one with, but I still ride English at times for the fun of it. OTOH, the lady who trained our horses and teaches my daughter always uses a helmet. She's had multiple broken bones (and a smashed pelvis when a horse rolled on her out in the desert), so she isn't some wilting flower filled with fear. Heck, if I had been hurt as badly as she has, I probably would give up on horses.

Maybe it is just that I'm 53, and the idea of making my decision based on what others will think of me is hard to remember. I haven't been 14 in a LONG time...


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

I watched 1st video (didn't even get to the 2nd one). What an idiot! I wish he'd see my helmet after I landed on my head and shoulders right on stones on trail (when my horse spooked and my bridle broke). Helmet went to trash, and I can only imagine how my head would look WITHOUT one. You just can't fix stupid, can't, can't, can't. :?

I do NOT care if someone doesn't wear one - it's not my business and every person's own decision. But discouraging and throwing all this BS on people (especially the beginners who often don't know any better) is just ridiculous.

P.S. He was smart enough to disable comments for the video! Wonder why! :wink:


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

kitten_Val said:


> ...But discouraging and throwing all this BS on people (especially the beginners who often don't know any better) is just ridiculous...


That is the scary part. Someone new to horses might take him at face value and skip wearing a helmet. And that, IMHO, is close to criminal. I make my own choices, but I cannot imagine telling someone to skip wearing a helmet, or that they are riskier.

When I first started riding, I rode my spooky mare down paved streets in an English saddle, when I barely knew how to get on a horse. How I survived that first year is a wonder...and my hip still aches, so I have a long term memento of my foolishness. Those who ride should encourage beginners to err on the side of caution, at least until they understand the raw power a horse has, or how their wild instincts can take over with little or no warning.


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

BSMS...well, yes, if we are going to participate in a risky sport, I think that is why we wear a helmet. Is it foolish to jump? Well, risky. Is it foolish to jump without a helmet? I would say that would be a big yes. Auto racing is risky. Auto racing without body restraint and a fire-proof suit (and a helmet!) is foolish. Being a policeman is risky. Being a policeman without a firearm is foolish. We live life, but we should take advantage of available precautions. And if a helmet gives me, say, a 5% chance of being saved a brain injury over a hat (and count the people who in these two posts on this subject I have made who have said "a helmet saved my life"--I have to think it is much more than 5%), I am going with the helmet.


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## DarkBucephalus (May 29, 2011)

To be honest, I say live and let live. Do I agree with this guy and his absolutely assinine opinion? Absolutely not. I am pro-choice when it comes to helmets. I hadn't used one in years until I started my riding lessons again recently, and honestly, my trainer, in my first lesson really opened my head up so to speak. I had only warn helmets when I was working a green broke horse. I didn't think it neccesary at the time as I was working with paso finos, and well, they have no bounce at all, so yeah. I was young, and probably stupid. Still young, and very likely stupid.


All that aside, the way the both handled that was very poor. Also, if he doesnt like dealing with the horse community and giving people advice, then why does he do it? That just doesn't make sense to me.:?


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

BSMS...sorry, I keep gabbing on...but you make another important point: you are 53 and can make the decision based on the situation at hand. The 14 year old IS going to make the "cool" decision. That is why we have to be pro-helmet, especially with younger people, and I wear one as an example to my daughter as much as anything. I do mostly slow, easy trail riding, and I look like a freakin Nazi storm trooper in mine, and sometimes my head itches, but if I am going to demand that my nine year old, who still has to be reminded to keep her heels down, wears one, I am going to wear one too to set a good example.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

I mostly wear a helmet. When I'm riding a calm horse in a deep seat on a sandy arena...maybe not. I honestly feel more comfortable without a helmet, although 95% of my riding is wearing one.

But I've done my homework. I've read the studies. I've talked to people. I've got 3 years of riding, and have been dumped hard (without a helmet). I figure I can make a choice.

Someone new to riding? Wear a helmet. It won't hurt you, and it could save you. And I won't ride off property where I live without a helmet, because the risk is more than I want and it robs me of the fun of riding. I don't want to worry about what will happen if my horse tumbles and smack my noggin against the pavement, or against the rocks that fill the trails.

I would never, ever tell a new rider to skip a helmet. But I now do at times, and I love the feeling of riding without a helmet. It is more in tune with why I like riding horses. I know others disagree, and I don't mind their disagreeing...as long as they don't jump in my chili for not wearing a helmet sometimes, while they go off jumping 'because it is fun'.

When I go helmetless, I feel more in touch with the horse and more aware of what I'm doing. Maybe it is the risk itself. I spent years strapped in ejection seats (mostly F-4s & F-111s), and now riding is my only real risk. I'm not sure why, and I don't do it often, but I really enjoy riding without a helmet more than with.

Maybe it is related to why I jog by myself in the desert miles from help, or hike in areas without trails. 95% of the time I wear a helmet, because my mare is spooky and the raw power of a scared horse reminds one how frail the human body is. I just don't like lectures from people who take greater risks themselves...

Internet photo. Most of mine disappeared on a move from England to Texas.


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

That is so interesting, BSMS. (Cool pic, by the way!) A student of mine (I teach college English) recently asked me why I ride, and my answer was that it was humbling that a 1,300 pound prey animal could come to trust me enough to let me ride peaceably on her back--and also that I could feel the fragility (and thus, the value) of life while I, in return, trusted this 1,300 pound prey animal with my well-being.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

Three cheers for Dr. Nikki. I'd buy her a drink in an instant at a bar. Aside from basically being as condescending as possible, I completely fail to understand WHATSOEVER how he possibly thinks legal action is possible. It's the internet, she didn't threaten him, she certainly didn't bully him anymore then he bullies women with every single little snide remark both on his website AND YouTube account. He is COMPLETELY capable of blocking her e-mail if he doesn't like it. He chose to respond, and therefore ANY potential legal action in terms of slander or libel are completely out the window, not that he had any sort of chance to begin with. You can't cry about bullying when you actively participate in the exchange of words you dolt!

Sounds like one great big fat macho case of little penis syndrome thrown into a fit of rage by a woman completely calling him on it and not being able to do a DARN thing about it. Good, I hope he loses sleep knowing this woman is cackling her head off at his ridiculous ignorant stupidity.

I would have been a LOT less nice in my emails, let me tell you.


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

You know, I have to admit a secret satisfation with "Dr. Nikki" too. And you really have to have followed Gore during the last few months to know why. He cracks and cracks and cracks on women, every time, just mercilessly, calls them "barn witches" and says all they are good for is pestering people and gossiping... It is sort of nice just to see a woman rear back and sock him in the mouth. That he publishes her emails puzzles me. His response to even the most innocent critique on youtube is delete all comments, block and mock.

So why do I keep watching his videos? He's like a bad car accident, and the car just keeps flipping and flipping. It's hard to look away.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

Wow. :rofl: I am 100% pro-choice when it comes to adults and helmets. I don't wear one, I may never wear one, but I would never dream of degrading the people who do or be so stupid as to insinuate that a helmet is dangerous to wear. I know that they greatly reduce the risk of injury should a fall occur and I _don't_ believe that helmets make people overconfident. I think it's the huge egos that are so common (and so encouraged) in some of the NH groupie crowd ("My horsey would never hurt me, we have a speshul majikal bond of luv") makes people overconfident. 

The only thing that I ask is that people respect _my_ decision to not wear one.

As for RG, he is what I would fondly refer to as a "f-ing sniveling tit". How old is he? 6...maybe 7? I have never watched him so I can't comment on his attitude toward women in general but just from what I read on the website and what little of the video I watched, that dude is a freaking cluck.


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

Allison Finch said:


> What an uneducated dork. Someone needs to throw chlorine into his gene pool. Or, wait a while and he will be taken out naturally.



Indeed, I would assume that he is single and bitter towards women, which is fine. I see no reason for him to carry on his genes to his children. He clearly has some issues thinking.


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## DarkBucephalus (May 29, 2011)

smrobs said:


> Wow. :rofl: I am 100% pro-choice when it comes to adults and helmets. I don't wear one, I may never wear one, but I would never dream of degrading the people who do or be so stupid as to insinuate that a helmet is dangerous to wear. I know that they greatly reduce the risk of injury should a fall occur and I _don't_ believe that helmets make people overconfident. I think it's the huge egos that are so common (and so encouraged) in some of the NH groupie crowd ("My horsey would never hurt me, we have a speshul majikal bond of luv") makes people overconfident.
> 
> The only thing that I ask is that people respect _my_ decision to not wear one.
> 
> As for RG, he is what I would fondly refer to as a "f-ing sniveling tit". How old is he? 6...maybe 7? I have never watched him so I can't comment on his attitude toward women in general but just from what I read on the website and what little of the video I watched, that dude is a freaking cluck.



Snivelinh tit? I'll have to remember that one!:rofl:


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## newhorsemom (Jun 20, 2008)

> And although I wouldn't -make- my child (if I ever have one) always wear a helmet (after they've learned the basics on how to stop, turn, and back a horse, along with how to fall, I probably would suggest anyone else to make their kids.


This make me chuckle. Iseul just wait until you have kids and come back and re-read this. If your kid rides they will fall off and as soon as you witness a fall you'll be adamant that they NEVER get on a horse w/out a helmet! Especially after a bad fall - trust me, it's not fun to see! You will also find that every time you hear of a tragic accident resulting in a serious head injury your heart will skip a beat and the story will remain in the back of your mind. My daughter has a poster of Courtney King-Dye in her room and when she had her accident I told my daughter and we talked about it so she is well aware ANYONE can fall at anytime. The poster is still on her wall and she will ask about how Courtney is doing from time to time. I am fully aware that in a few short years she will be making her own decisions about this.

I also take note with the theory that a helmet makes riders overconfident. Anyone who has fallen off knows that more than your head can get injured and most of the time falling off hurts!!! For me, a helmet does take one worry off, just knowing that although I might still fall and get hurt, I have done what I can to protect myself. Even if I still get hurt or incur a brain injury there won't be any "I should have" or "I wish I would have".

Riding horses is a risk helmet or not. Just be aware of the risk and make your own choice. Think about what you're doing and be sure of your choice so that you don't have any regrets and never have to say "If only I had...". 



​


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

Excellent point, NewHorseMom. And yes, the internet is littered with stories of pretty young girls who are dead or brain damaged because of riding (usually jumping) without a helmet. And yeah, you can't protect against everything, but you take what precautions you can.


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## Reiterin (Mar 28, 2010)

Allison Finch said:


> Someone needs to throw chlorine into his gene pool.


lol :lol:


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## Heelsdown (Jun 5, 2011)

Okay, I'll admit in the past, I never wore a helmet. Rode many horses at a friend's house growing up and hey, it was the 80's. We just never wore them. At the barn I ride we have to wear them so I've gotten used to it. Will I wear one when I get my own horse? Probably. The older I get, the more aware I am of my own mortality. 

BUT, to even argue that helmets don't prevent head injuries is just ludicrous. Seriously......do we really need someone to tell us that a helmet can prevent a head injury? I guess football players, racecar drivers, baseball players, motorcyclists are just big wussy women then right? 
Wear a helmet, don't wear a helmet. Your choice. But really, there is just no sane way to argue against the fact that your head is more protected when you are wearing a helmet. Period. End of story. It's like saying the sky is blue.

Will a helmet prevent all injuries or deaths? Of course not. Will it prevent all head injuries? No. Will it prevent most head injuries? Yes, absolutely. 

And wearing a helmet has never, ever made me or anyone I know less careful. Oh my gosh. If there is anything that made me reckless it was my youth! lol. Wearing a helmet? Uh no.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

^ LIKE

This is so true. I don't wear a helmet half the time by choice, but if I actually believed that a helmet couldn't potentially save my head, I should probably already be wearing one along with the matching strait jacket. That's like saying bullet proof vests don't save lives - we may not wear them every day, but you'd be an idiot to claim they're a waste of time!


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## Heelsdown (Jun 5, 2011)

LOL @ straightjackets! 
I can just see it on the news..... "Sharp blows to the head can cause brain injury and a helmet may protect your head! News at 11!"


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

After a ride tonight (in my helmet), watching those who did and didn't wear, I finally figured it out. And yes, I WILL tell you what I finally figured out! (Sorry, that's from another post...) 

Good hair: no helmet. Not so good hair: helmet. Just got a cool new hat?": no helmet. Wear the same dirty Broncos hat day in and day out? (no, I am not a fan; I just like the horse...): helmet.

This seems a strange twist on Darwinism: the steady weeding out of the cool and well-coifed and the preservation of split ends and a lack of fashion sense. (Perhaps the Bill Gates gene has something to do with all this...)


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

I didn't read everyone's posts, but I will say that wearing a helmet DOES NOT make people over-confident. I worked at a Girls Scout horse camp last fall and EVERYONE there is required to wear a helmet when working in the arena, even us adults who knew what we were doing. I don't recall seeing any of the girls (or adults for that matter) take unnecessary chances or risks as a result of wearing a helmet and it making them feel more confident. Usually the girls would do something stupid because they thought they knew what they were doing and didn't.

Also, I was nearly thrown from a horse yesterday while coming back from a trail ride because some idiot on a motorcycle didn't think we'd cleared the road quickly enough and revved his engine at us (and had sped up so he would reach us just as we got to the edge of the road). I was wearing a helmet. Not because it was required, but because I was on a strange horse. I'm very glad I was wearing that helmet, even though I didn't actually need it. It made me feel more secure in the knowledge that if I did come off the horse, I wouldn't have cracked my head open on the asphalt. I didn't take any unnecessary risks or chances because I was wearing a helmet.

The guy in the vid sounds like a complete loon, to me. His whole rant about helmet manufacturers pushing the use of helmets left me scratching my head. At the GS horse camp, it wasn't a helmet manufacturer that told us to wear them, it was the GS governing board. Yesterday when I was riding, it wasn't a helmet manufacturer that told me to wear a helmet, it was a personal decision because I was riding an unfamiliar horse. *shrug*


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

At the stable where I take lessons, no one wears a helmet. And no one has special hair - certainly not a 53 years old guy who cuts his own hair! I suppose I could ask around, but I've never heard of anyone dying there, and the stable has been around since I was a kid. Of course, the norm is riding in an arena or down the wash, rarely at anything faster than a trot and I've never seen anyone jumping stuff there.

And I've met a number of old cowboys, and none of them wore helmets while working. I've met folks (two) who had their backs broken, and one who had a broken pelvis. I've met a lot who had broken arms or ribs.

I usually wear a helmet, but I don't understand the disdain for those who do not.


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## Heelsdown (Jun 5, 2011)

bsms I don't think there is disdain for those who don't wear helmets. My personal issue is 

1) people who don't wear helmets mocking on people that do as though they are wusses or not real horsemen. I saw this a LOT when I was riding western. The snicker, chuckle, "Yer not a real cowboy" attitude. Like I said, helmets are worn in many sports, so why NOT riding horses? 

2) my other issue is the utter denial that helmets can save you from injury. For some reason the non-helmet group like to point out accidents like Jessica and say, "Seeeee? She was wearing and helmet and still died!" as though anyone has ever said that a helmet will stop you from being hurt or killed in 100% of cases. 

I used to hate wearing a helmet. I wear it now. I can't swear that I'll wear it all the time. Maybe I will. I'm sure there will be times I won't. But dang, I'd never deny the safety of it and I'd never mock someone for choosing to wear one all the time.


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## ladybugsgirl (Aug 12, 2009)

Its wierd that when hes filming its of horses not of him???huh
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

BSMS: I have yet to see (in either of these helmet posts) any disdain for those who didn't wear a helmet. I have seen a whole lot of people who were pro-choice who did wear one.

And I am with HeelsDown: I have seen the disdain run a lot more in the other direction (not here, necessarily, but in "real life.")


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

^^ There are a number of threads on the subject, and many condemn those who do not wear helmets & support laws requiring anyone under 18 to wear a helmet anytime they are on a horse.

"adults choose to endanger their kids by not making _them_ wear a helmet"

"under 18's IMHO it should be mandatory to wear a helmet at all times while mounted, no exceptions"

"it'd be a little weird to see someone without a helmet...I think she's crazy"

"not wearing a helmet is one of the silliest things you can do"

"I think not wearing a helmet is pretty stupid"

"It may not be an ego thing for you, but I think it is for a lot of people."

"I HATE when people say 'its my head, I can do what I want.' that is very selfish and immature IMHO."

"I admit I dont always wear a body protector and in all honesty that's just me being ignorant! But I would NEVER ride without a hat! Ever! And people that do ride without one its your choice, ride at your own risk, but its pure ignorance!!"

"Again ALL kids should wear helmets!!!!!!"

"I agree; children under a certain age should be _required_ to wear helmets, regardless of the discipline."

"I believe that helmets and children shouldn't even be a conversation. It should be required whether they are show jumping, running barrels or doing walk trot pleasure."

"I firmly belive that helmets should become mandatory, if everyone is required to wear one then the image of the helmet will change and it will cease being "cool" not to wear one."

"The sorrow and guilt this family is going to endure is traumatizing."

"Why not make children wear helmets? We make children wear helmets while riding bikes"

"Good hair: no helmet. Not so good hair: helmet. Just got a cool new hat?": no helmet...This seems a strange twist on Darwinism: the steady weeding out of the cool and well-coifed and the preservation of split ends and a lack of fashion sense. (Perhaps the Bill Gates gene has something to do with all this...)"

Those are comments made in the last couple of weeks.

I require my daughter to wear a helmet. If someone wants to ride my horse or on my property, they will wear a helmet. But I continue to find it odd that people strongly support allowing kids to jump, but want to ban kids from wearing a cowboy hat - when jumping is much higher risk. 

Happily, I'm no longer a teen and I don't have to deal with the social nonsense that goes on in high schools and, apparently, 'barns'. I would be furious if someone gave my daughter flack for wearing a helmet. But I also resent people saying it is ignorant to wear a ball cap riding western, and I'm tired of nanny-state laws like mandatory bicycle helmets.


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## DSJ46 (Aug 11, 2010)

For my "Bill Gates" comment, I will say I was kidding...(sort of) I do think there is often (though not always) a fashion thing involved...

and as to children, I too think they should always have one. I don't see how this condemns adults that don't wear one...

for one, I don't condemn anyone for not wearing one. And I don't see my thinking it is better to wear one as a condemnation


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

At our last boarding barn, it was a dude ranch of sorts and the employ quite possibly the stupidest most idiotic city slicker jack arses around. This one guy there is just a creepy disgusting pervert, and a grade A moron to boot.

He would always harass me for wearing a helmet on my green broke 3 year old while he was safe on his bombproof dude horse that someone ELSE trained. I finally got so fed up he asked me for the dozenth time "Why are you wearing that stupid helmet?" and I replied with "so I don't end up being as much of a blithering idiot as you are."

He quit asking after that. :lol:


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## MHFoundation Quarters (Feb 23, 2011)

DSJ46 said:


> Good hair: no helmet. Not so good hair: helmet. Just got a cool new hat?": no helmet. Wear the same dirty Broncos hat day in and day out? (no, I am not a fan; I just like the horse...): helmet.


 
This made me chuckle. I live in ball caps and I have a particular favorite too and it's pretty beat up. My hubby gives me grief & tells me that I need to retire it, but not gonna happen! It was a freebie with my shotgun (Go Benelli!)it fits good & I like it :lol: 

Everyone who rides on my property (aside from myself) wears one or doesn't ride. My hubby chooses to wear one, he grew up on water skis not horses and prefers to have one on. I think that's great. Just not my personal choice. I know my limits however and should I find a horse that makes me feel that I need one, I would absolutely wear one. 

I still think RG is an idiot for the record.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

WooHoo for free hats!! I've got one that I love that came free with my saddle , not to mention 2 that I got at my last place of employment that I am doing my dangdest to wear out so I can throw them away LOL.


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## MHFoundation Quarters (Feb 23, 2011)

Heck yes! Gotta love those freebies. I used to wear hats with the farm name embroidered on them, but decided I'd rather leave sweat stains & dirt on ones I don't pay for!


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