# What will I do with my mare after the miscarriage?



## Derry girl (Nov 20, 2011)

Hey Iv decided to share my story to see what you folks think... 

In the last few weeks Iv had some terrible luck, my 10yr mare flo miscarried her foal. She was 7months gone. Turns out it was a twin that caused the miscarriage, unfotunatley with me been away with work I wasnt able to get her scanned untill she was nearly 4months gone, and the twin was missed, but everything looked great. good strong heart beat. 

The vet done an atopsy and said that the twin lived for about 3/4wks. The healthy foal was perfect, a little filly. In laymans terms the two cords got twisted and the healthy foal got starved of blood and she died. The mare is fine now, shes been washed out and she had a blood test done, and the vet said to give her a month out grazing and then try her again.

But to be honest am not sure if I have the emotional energy to try again yet after what has happened. Because she miscarried before at 9/10wks last year....I was told that was just down to pure bad luck.

See I had used nearly all my savings on the stallion she was infoal to and then vets fees. I do work so could start saving again and send her of to something abit cheaper but I was thinking of giving her a year of to let her body competely recover from the miscarriage and trying her again next spring. 

A friend of a friend has emailed me that does hunting and cross country and he said that he'd be interested in taking her for a yr, get her fit and back into shape.. would this be a good idea? Iv never loaned a horse out before, only sold them on so am not sure what you would charge someone.. would you just get them to insure the horse or would I do that? These might seem like silly questions but hey if your not sure, ask..


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## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

If you really trust your friend, this could be a way to keep ownership of your horse and save some$--sorry, I don't have a key for "pounds."
I'm truly sorry. I imagine that she'll heal up physically and heal emotionally quicker than you will. Was there any guarantee on the stallion? Not a breeder myself, but I have heard of this before, though it might just cover conception. Look into this bc you could breed to him again without having to shell out any more. Certainly you could talk to the stallion owner who might take some pity on you.


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## Country Woman (Dec 14, 2011)

I am sorry for the loss of your foal


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

Have you called the stud and told them? Most stallion owners offer NFFR - No foal free return, this can and usually means no live foal, or even NFNF - No foal no fee.

Be straight with them and tell them what happened they might offer you a free return or even a reduced fee.

When we send the mares away to a stallion then we leave them at the stud until they are 52 days certified in foal. After this tie they are less inclined to reabsorb or abort. The stud has them scanned to check they are in foal and not carrying twins.


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## LadyDreamer (Jan 25, 2008)

you loan her out, be sure to get insurance on her for any potential mishaps. Your friend might be the best keeper in the world, but accidents and fatal illness may still happen at no fault to your friend. This is just to cover you in case of a loan.

Breeding is an emotional rollercoaster and nightmare at times. If you are not strong enough to go through this again, don't breed her back. Breeding is a gamble. You have to be willing to lose every variable in the equation. The mare might miscarry, the mare might die and the foal might live, both might die, the vet might come and might not be able to save them and you still owe him money, the stallion might not be available next season for your perfect cross.... if you can't handle it, it is okay. Don't do it.

If you want to try again and risk your heart and horse, check with the stallion owner for a Live Foal Guarantee(lfg) or similar, and since you know she has miscarried multiple times, schedule your vet out regularly to prevent problems and help her carry.


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## Derry girl (Nov 20, 2011)

Yey Iv informed the stud about what happened. The breeder was very sympatheic about what happened and he offered a free covering but see Id still have to pay for her keep for the wk/2weeks that she'd be there and its £100 - $160 dollars per wk and then its a 2hour drive so to cover leaving her down..driving home and then collecting her again that will be at least £200 - $320 for diesel.. brave we bit of money. 

Theres a few lovely stallions closer to home that Id give serious thought to but like I say I just wonder should I give her body more time to recover, I have seen her staring at the foals in the next field and I cant help but feel she is pineing for her baby :-( so am just confused about whether I should loan her out to this fella and let him work away with her and get her fit again, and it might help take her mind of what has happened, Iv looked into the insurance and Iv got a quote from a company that would cover loaning her out and cover any accidents/theft/vets fees...

Or just try her again, see am trying to keep her age in mind to, she'd be 11 going into foal If I did give her the yr in work, like Iv seen broodmares that have had foals right up into their 20's.. but considering the miscarriages shes had is there a higher chance of another the older she gets?? more chance of compilcations? 

What would you do if it was your horse?


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## Ace80908 (Apr 21, 2011)

Honestley if you are concerned about her mare care fees and gas I can't see how you wouldn't be concerned about the necessary vet expenses that would be needed to help her carry to term.. she'll need the ultrasounds, shots, and the vet fees in case something goes wrong.... getting a baby on the ground is going to be expensive.

Might be better to just buy a baby - there are lots needing homes right now.


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## mselizabeth (Oct 29, 2011)

Ace80908 said:


> Honestley if you are concerned about her mare care fees and gas I can't see how you wouldn't be concerned about the necessary vet expenses that would be needed to help her carry to term.. she'll need the ultrasounds, shots, and the vet fees in case something goes wrong.... getting a baby on the ground is going to be expensive.
> 
> Might be better to just buy a baby - there are lots needing homes right now.


Couldn't agree more. 

Personally, I wouldn't risk her miscarrying again. Like you said, it was her second time. 

I would loan her out with some sort of contract in place, if you can't afford her anymore. I'm not a huge fan of the use of a horse strictly to be a broodmare, anyways.


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## Derry girl (Nov 20, 2011)

Its not that I cant afford it am just saying that with what has happened her is it worth chancing again, I know theres a 50/50 with ever pregnancy but has she a higher risk considering the 2miscarriages... Id love to take her back to the stallion she was with before but I hate having to pay out a fortune just for a stable and petrol for 1/2weeks. It doesnt bother me paying the actual stud fee or vets fees because thats a must. But for example the stable fee, as nice as the people are I think their just milking it charging that much considering there already getting £500 ($795) for the stud fee. 

And I Know what your saying that theres an over population of horses and theres loads of ones in rehoming centres, Iv actually taken 3 over the past number of years so am doing my best on that part, I was breeding her for myself, I hadnt intended on selling the foal on, it was meant for when I finished my degree that Id have her and her foal for getting back into showjumping full time..

Am just at a lose, the pregnancy was going so well, never had any problems and I had even made arrangments for her to go to a local breeder to graze with his mares and foals for the next year or 2 so that the foal would be around other babies.

Like I have worked in a few stud farms and have seen foals die and orphaned foals so am not a complete novice to this world but when its your own and you just have all these we dreams of whats going to happen over the next few years its heart-breaking when something like this happens, I think whats making it worse is that I found the foal, wouldnt wish that on anyone. 

..So my dilemma is with her been 10 now do I try her once more or put her to work again for a yr and try her as an 11 yr old...


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

Derry girl said:


> Its not that I cant afford it am just saying that with what has happened her is it worth chancing again, I know theres a 50/50 with ever pregnancy but has she a higher risk considering the 2miscarriages... Id love to take her back to the stallion she was with before but I hate having to pay out a fortune just for a stable and petrol for 1/2weeks. It doesnt bother me paying the actual stud fee or vets fees because thats a must. But for example the stable fee, as nice as the people are I think their just milking it charging that much considering there already getting £500 ($795) for the stud fee.
> 
> And I Know what your saying that theres an over population of horses and theres loads of ones in rehoming centres, Iv actually taken 3 over the past number of years so am doing my best on that part, I was breeding her for myself, I hadnt intended on selling the foal on, it was meant for when I finished my degree that Id have her and her foal for getting back into showjumping full time..
> 
> ...


That is just a decision you will have to make. If it were me, I would not breed her, but that is just my personal opinion. I wouldn't be concerned about the second abortion due to the twins - that one is explained and expected. The real issue is the first abortion. An unexplained abortion is for breeders like myself a disqualifier to use a mare as a broodmare. You have made several references now to "luck" and to "50-50", but abortions have nothing to do with luck, and there are no "odds" - again, abortions happen for a reason. The first abortion was early, so you can generally eliminate certain reasons for the abortion such as fescue or other issues that cause late term abortions. If your mare did not have the flu or was otherwise sick, you have an unexplained abortion - one of the reasons you should always get a necropsy on the foal and a thorough examination of your mare when your mare slips a foal.

An unexplained abortion can be due to a physiological issue with the mare, such as varying degrees of endometritis, and can sometimes be genetic in origin, which is why some breeders disqualify mares as broodmares that have had unexplained or apparently spontaneous abortions.

But then again, you might be successful the third time and there might be nothing wrong with your mare. 

About all you can do is what you are doing - solicit the observations of experienced breeders, and work with your vet. But in the final analysis you will just have to decide one way or the other based upon the information you can put together. 

Good luck with whatever direction you take...


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## Derry girl (Nov 20, 2011)

Thanks, I competely understand everything your saying. Before we got her covered the first time the vet came and done some tests on her to check her fertility/womb/ovaries(focilies) and just a general health check and we were told she was in perfect health. 

I cant prove it but during the first pregnancy, I was away with work for about a wk and left her with a friend who keeps horses. She was grazing with a crowd of other broodmares. My friend is a farming contractor and I found out through the neighbours that the week I was away they got a big job and wernt at the farm for about 2/3days, it was unusally hot that week and my dad went down to the farm a day to check her and discovered the horses water never got refilled. the big tank was lying on its side, bone dry and the horses seemed very agitated, my dad tryed to get it filled and there was nearly a riot so we think it might have been that way for at least 1/2 days.. 
now I know horses bodies are designed to store water and fat but when its a pregnant mare I wouldnt chance it.

I talked to my vet about my concerns and he agreed that there is a small chance thats what could have caused it but unfortunatley we couldnt prove it, because by the time I had her scanned and we discovered what had happened she was back home and in perfect condition. So it was just put down as a unexplained miscarriage... bad luck

I know what your saying about her not been an "ideal candiate" .. I remember one of the yards I worked in, and the vet was there doing all sorts of tests on the young mares and the ones that basically didnt get 100% were sold on as riding horses. 

It was just the fact that with me been away most of the time I didnt want her standing idil in the field and thought Id put her good breeding and ability to use and try and get a foal from her. 

Aw the stresses of having horses! Theres 2 stallions closer to home that Iam going to go and see and Ill explain to the breeders what has happened the mare previously and see what they think. 

Thanks for all your advise, I keep it in mind..


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## Prinella (Jul 12, 2011)

Please don't get offended by this. To me it sounds like you may not have the time to be breeding her. The twins should have been caught in the scan but as you weren't there there was no scan. And then the water incident with your friend. I'd encourage leasing her out over re breeding draw up a good contract though. That way when you have time once you've finished your degree you can have her back already fit!


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## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

Ace80908 said:


> Might be better to just buy a baby - there are lots needing homes right now.


 I kinda agree. My mare was bred 4x before I bought her as a 10yo. Since I've never owned a mare with this sweet a temperment, I was very tempted to breed her. Also, she's KMH and the numbers (I've been told) are low. Finally, I decided that she'd contributed enough--all 4 foals were healthy--to the cause and I didn 't want to consider losing her while foaling. I remember my (previous) Vet's words in the Horse Health Care class he taught at his clinic. The 2nd 1/2 of the course was entirely devoted to breeding. It was clear: You risk losing the foal, risk losing the mare, risk losing both. Horses don't birth easily, like cows do. 
_This Vet is exclusively equine and has large and wealthy clientelle. Too bad his clinic is 1 1/2 hours away--had to find a new one bc of distance after my move_.


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## BlueSpark (Feb 22, 2012)

if you really want to breed her and have a foal, factoring her age, as long as she has a clean bill of health, try again. My barn owner has a lovely mare, great breeding, great conformation, proven under saddle, clean bill of health, who miscarried before catching the first time at 11. She has since had 3 beautiful foals with no issues.

If you can't emotionaly deal with it again, or you decide buying one on the ground is a better option, thats ok too.


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## Derry girl (Nov 20, 2011)

Prinella said:


> Please don't get offended by this. To me it sounds like you may not have the time to be breeding her. The twins should have been caught in the scan but as you weren't there there was no scan. And then the water incident with your friend. I'd encourage leasing her out over re breeding draw up a good contract though. That way when you have time once you've finished your degree you can have her back already fit


Am not affended by what your saying... 

Iam living at home while am doing my degree, my horse is a 5min walk down the road, I see her everyday. I just dont have the time to compete in showjumping with her at the mo with coursework. I couldnt do anything about me been away when she needed scanned, I was given about 2days notice that I had to go as part of my work placement, and I tryed to arrange an appointment before I left but the vet was of for a few weeks because his wife had just had a baby and Iam not keen on the vet that was filling in, I txt my vet and he said she'd be fine and we took her as soon as he was back at work. 

Again, in regards the water incident, It cant be proved because like I say horses bodies are suprisingly tuff in them situations...All them other broodmares have since had their foals, with no problems. My parents were on hoildays when I had to leave otherwise she would have been at home so I thought Id take her the 5min drive down the road to my friends to let her graze with the brood mares for a wk. As I didnt have a lift back home everyday to check her. There was people still working on the farm that wk but they wernt aware that the automatic drinker wasnt working and they needed to fill the tank by hose (the tank is about the size of a sm car). My dad called down as they came home a day early.

Thanks for your thoughts anyway, Am currently getting her insurance rejiged so that I can loan her out for a yr..


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## Derry girl (Nov 20, 2011)

BlueSpark said:


> My barn owner has a lovely mare, great breeding, great conformation, proven under saddle, clean bill of health, who miscarried before catching the first time at 11. She has since had 3 beautiful foals with no issues.
> 
> If you can't emotionaly deal with it again, or you decide buying one on the ground is a better option, thats ok too.


 
See thats what I keep thinking about, because the same thing happened a friend, the mare lost 2foals and then had about 5..all healthy. 

When I said about my emotions.. am not a wreck.. am just abit of a softy and it was heartbreaking to find that we foal I think anyone would have been the same, I was just saying with her losing the 2 is there a high chance it could happen again. My vet is very confident with her recent test results that we could try her again. Shes in great form and is looking well. I just wanted to share my story incase something similar had happened another HF member and ask what they done.. try again straight away or give her a yr back in work..


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## Derry girl (Nov 20, 2011)

Corporal said:


> I kinda agree.


Yey, I know what your saying, like I say I adopted 3 over the years, 2 have went onto great homes and am keeping the other one for life. My local horse rescue has over 100 horses in at the min, I'd love to go down and give them all a home but I just would have loved to have bred my own horse for competing.


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## anameli (Jul 4, 2014)

new Member permission join this discussion









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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Derry girl said:


> Yey, I know what your saying, like I say I adopted 3 over the years, 2 have went onto great homes and am keeping the other one for life. My local horse rescue has over 100 horses in at the min, I'd love to go down and give them all a home but I just would have loved to have bred my own horse for competing.


I'm going to take all the emotion out of the discussion and try to just put down the facts I've gotten from your posts. Right now you're really upset and all over the place in your thinking. 

#1. First abortion, 9-10 weeks, could have been the water or lack, or it could have been Mother Nature saying, "Something wasn't quite right, I needed to flush this breeding out and start over.". 

#2. Second abortion, twins. Thank God she did abort, if they don't, it's very common to lose both foals at term and frequently you lose the mare too. At this point, you still have your mare, so you still have options. 

#3. You have already paid the stud fee and the stallion owner has said you can come back and recover under the Live Foal Guarantee. Your expectation for them to take the mare for a week or 2 and cover all feed costs in addition to recovering her is unrealistic. You actually breached your LFG by not having the mare ultrasounded at the appropriate times. They could have said, "Too bad, how sad." and required another fee to rebreed her. Give her 30 days and send her back. 

#4. Breeding is an expensive game, and I use the term game here because that's what it is to you, it's not your livelihood. You're just breeding to get a replacement for your mare. 

#5. If you pay the care and transport costs, that leaves you with vet fees for the pregnancy. The easiest way to ensure success in this case is to take the mare down to the stallion, and leave her until she is confirmed in foal and not carrying twins. Then get the vet to give er a 10 day shot of Regumate (or whatever product you use in Ireland) and bring her home and make sure someone can be there for the subsequent pregnancy checks and 45 & 60 days. Once you pass 60 days in foal, only carrying 1 foal, she should do fine with no trouble. 

#6. You can waste everything you've paid so far and leave her open for a year, let your friend ride her while you take a year off from horses and then you can start all over again next year and pay another stud fee and transport & care fees for the new stallion. In effect, you'll be paying for the same real estate twice, by buying another stud fee. Not what most breeders, who are pretty frugal by necessity, would do.


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## TaMMa89 (Apr 12, 2008)

I moved Dreamcatcher's comment to the initial thread since it belogned to there and edited few comments that referred the new thread "being old".


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