# Silver in the Haflinger breed



## BlackCricket (Oct 20, 2011)

So...I've seen a handful of foals over the year that are obvious silvers with one haffy parent. In some cases, sure, the silver may have been with the other parent, but in others (as in the case with a haffy/arab)....well, it had to come from the haflinger. But I can never find names. Or at least registered names. 
And since silver does not express on a red horse...it's very well hidden in the breed. 


I've also seen an article by a Dr. Ramsey who states:



> _"ASD is not unique to the Rocky Mountain Horse, it occurs in all breeds I have examined that carry the Silver Dapple gene.... This includes the Shetland Pony, Miniature breeds, Rocky Mountain, Kentucky Mountain Saddle, Mountain Pleasure, Morgan, Bashkir-Curly, Naraganssett Pacer, and Haflinger... The disease is probably just as prevalent in some of the other aforementioned breeds. It has only been studied extensively in Rocky Mountain Horses because the breed Association recognized it and was proactive to determine whether the abnormality was a severe defect."_


yup..Haflinger is listed in his breeds there. Found that totally by accident while looking up some stuff on Silver for a friend..LOL

But..I cannot find names of horses. A name or two would help narrow down what line or lines for me...since they name a certain way. 

Anyone have any info on silver in haflingers?


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## jillybean19 (Dec 23, 2011)

There's one for sale, so you may be able to email them for a pedigree or something...

Rare Color Silver Dapple Haflinger Rides and Drives


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## Cat (Jul 26, 2008)

That one you listed really isn't silver. Its a smutty flaxen chestnut.

ETA - Silver Dapple is possible - though I haven't seen it personally. I have seen quite a few bays from haflingerXblack crosses. Keep in mind the breed did not start out as the flaxen chestnuts you see today, but was bred over time for that favored color, which unfortunately obliberated any black-base from the breed. However - any of the factors that effected only black based horses could still be there since no one bred away from those since they didn't care due to the lack of effect on the chestnut coat.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

Wouldn't it be theoretically impossible to ever have a purebred Haflinger showing silver, or even bay as chestnut X chestnut will ALWAYS produce chestnut and flaxen chestnut is the only color Haflingers come in anymore?

Or are there some strains where the black base hasn't been bred out yet?


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## Cruiser (Aug 28, 2011)

I've met a haflinger that looks like that, her dam had this grey sooty marks all over her, and her sire was a deep gold color. She was born she looked like someone rubbed charcoal all over her, I would post the pictures but she isn't mine, nor do I know her now owner very well. Or the picture has people in it, her full brother turned out the same way. They were from the W line and M line of dam side. Don't know what causes it. These are purebred and registered haflingers, the judge doesn't like them tho I should point out, just like they don't like excessive white.

all of them were born with a chestnut solid coat, that as they aged it darkened over, they don't look anything like a silver to me, but different times of the year they are diffidently chestnut with something covering it. Is it a sooty chestnut to the extreme?


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## CLaPorte432 (Jan 3, 2012)

Silver won't express itself on a red based horse. Purebred Halflingers, should always be e/e, therefore silver won't express itself. It's possible that some might carry silver, but it had to of come from some outcross to a silver carrier from back in the pedigree. Then the gene was passed on and on and some halfies may be carriers now, but they won't express it unless they are crossed with a horse that can express it (black based horse, resulting in black based foal)

It's possible that your mistaking the sooty gene, for the silver gene. Sooty can be expressed very minimally, or it can be expressed very maximally.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

CLaPorte432 said:


> Silver won't express itself on a red based horse. Purebred Halflingers, should always be e/e.
> 
> It's possible that your mistaking the sooty gene, for the silver gene. Sooty can be expressed very minimally, or it can be expressed very maximally.


I think she's just discussing though how silver must exist in Haflingers due to the color popping up in crossbred breedings with other breeds that are known to not carry the silver gene. I was just asking a theoretical question about Haflingers ever showing silver after another poster posted an ad for an advertised silver dapple.


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## Chiilaa (Aug 12, 2010)

Haffies could be carrying silver, it would not be amazingly unusual, given they are all e/e and silver only shows on horses with an E/e or E/E genotype. 

The one posted above is a sooty chestnut. It is impossible for him to be a purebred Haffie and have a black base coat.


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## Cat (Jul 26, 2008)

MacabreMikolaj said:


> Wouldn't it be theoretically impossible to ever have a purebred Haflinger showing silver, or even bay as chestnut X chestnut will ALWAYS produce chestnut and flaxen chestnut is the only color Haflingers come in anymore?
> 
> Or are there some strains where the black base hasn't been bred out yet?


Right - only a cross to a different breed of horse that carried black would show either bay or silver.


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## BlackCricket (Oct 20, 2011)

I was just wondering what lines it may be in...or if it's possible in all. Having seen haflingers used in studies for silver and the eye defects as a "silver carrier" in more than one spot is what got me curious. 
I knew it wouldn't express on a pure haffy


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## Amakai (Aug 8, 2012)

I have heard elsewhere that Haflingers can carry Silver and also Agouti. Haflingers wouldn't show silver though so any Haflingers with grey/silver coats and manes probably have a Sooty Modifer. However, I am just about to embark on a quest to colour test a range of bloodlines to see what comes up. I thought that Haflingers should be ee+flaxen but the results may surprise me! Will let you know the results


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## Chiilaa (Aug 12, 2010)

Amakai said:


> I have heard elsewhere that Haflingers can carry Silver and also Agouti. Haflingers wouldn't show silver though so any Haflingers with grey/silver coats and manes probably have a Sooty Modifer. However, I am just about to embark on a quest to colour test a range of bloodlines to see what comes up. I thought that Haflingers should be ee+flaxen but the results may surprise me! Will let you know the results


Considering the genes responsible for flaxen are yet to be isolated, I bet you will be surprised indeed.


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## scooter46 (Aug 7, 2012)

Amakai said:


> I have heard elsewhere that Haflingers can carry Silver and also Agouti. Haflingers wouldn't show silver though so any Haflingers with grey/silver coats and manes probably have a Sooty Modifer. However, I am just about to embark on a quest to colour test a range of bloodlines to see what comes up. I thought that Haflingers should be ee+flaxen but the results may surprise me! Will let you know the results


Amakai, there are indeed silver haflingers -- they are quite stunning. Both parents would need to be silver carriers then could each pass the gene to the offspring. Google silver haflingers and you will see some pictures.


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## Chiilaa (Aug 12, 2010)

scooter46 said:


> Amakai, there are indeed silver haflingers -- they are quite stunning. Both parents would need to be silver carriers then could each pass the gene to the offspring. Google silver haflingers and you will see some pictures.


No, there are not any "silver" Haflingers. Silver only acts on black hair. As ALL Haflingers are RED based (ie: chestnut) then there is no POSSIBLE way for a Haflinger to be silver.


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## scooter46 (Aug 7, 2012)

*No silver haflingers*



Chiilaa said:


> No, there are not any "silver" Haflingers. Silver only acts on black hair. As ALL Haflingers are RED based (ie: chestnut) then there is no POSSIBLE way for a Haflinger to be silver.


Sorry for my blunder. I wasn't aware that haflingers are 100% red gene horses. 

I guess that's what looking up something on the internet will get you...

And trying to join a forum....

Ooops slinking away to her Rockies...

Excuse please


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