# Panic when braking



## amberly (Dec 16, 2012)

One thing it could be is the smell of the new trailer. Our horses did the same thing until they got used to the new trailer - they didn't want to go in and wanted to come out. They pawed and whinnied but after a while they got used to it and settled down. That could be one reason.

How are you stepping on the brakes? and how is the brake level on your trailer? You want your trailer to start braking just barely before your truck does - if you can control the amount of braking. You dont want the car stopping the trailer and you don't want the trailer stopping the car - but have the trailer stop just barely before the car does.

Have you tried putting another horse in with him? If it is because its a new trailer then sometimes having a buddy at first can help settle him.

You could also try opening the windows slightly.

and also - how does he 'panic' when you hit the brakes? does he kick constantly, whinny uncontrollabley, what?


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

Do you have a separate brake controller under the dash? The brakes should be set up so that the trailer brakes come on barely before the tow vehicle. Try taking your foot off the gas well back and lightly touching the brakes. The horse may have felt more secure with the snug fit of the two horse. Now, he's responsible for maintaining his balance.


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## color01 (Aug 12, 2013)

try to drive slow (10mph) and squeeze the brake controller, when it brakes turn it 1 -2 settings down....so you know you got the right brake setting.


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## Shadow1ane (May 26, 2014)

amberly said:


> One thing it could be is the smell of the new trailer. Our horses did the same thing until they got used to the new trailer - they didn't want to go in and wanted to come out. They pawed and whinnied but after a while they got used to it and settled down. That could be one reason.
> 
> Have you tried putting another horse in with him? If it is because its a new trailer then sometimes having a buddy at first can help settle him.
> 
> and also - how does he 'panic' when you hit the brakes? does he kick constantly, whinny uncontrollabley, what?


He paws at the wall in front of him and stomps his front feet. When I parked and got ready to unload to him, he was trying to suck back, but didn't make it too far with a wall & gate behind his butt.

I didn't think of the smell... I don't notice it with my puny human nose, and assumed since it's open (no windows) that it wouldn't have a "new" smell, but I'm sure it's different.

He was by himself, but that's never been an issue before - it did cross my mind.



color01 said:


> try to drive slow (10mph) and squeeze the brake controller, when it brakes turn it 1 -2 settings down....so you know you got the right brake setting.


The more responses I've gotten (also posted on another forum and on Reddit), I'm thinking we just need a new brake controller. We don't really know how to use ours since it came with the truck, and it's old enough we are having issues finding any instructions online. I'll hook it up this weekend and find a parking lot to play around in. I need to practice backing this one up anyway  (Not part of the problem! We only backed up after getting home and after he was unloaded.)


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

Brand new trailers sometimes have "surges", meaning your horse is getting a shock when you hit the brakes. Go in there and see.


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## Cynical25 (Mar 7, 2013)

waresbear said:


> Brand new trailers sometimes have "surges", meaning your horse is getting a shock when you hit the brakes. Go in there and see.


This! A friend's horse was doing the same thing in her new trailer, so she took a test ride in the stall and received a shock every time the brakes engaged.

Otherwise, I agree with checking the brake controller settings.


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## Dustbunny (Oct 22, 2012)

Do you have a long driveway or maybe a large parking lot close by?
Have your husband drive and stop and you ride in the trailer. That will tell you exactly what the horse is feeling. It is illegal to ride in the trailer on a highway which is why I mentioned the driveway or large parking lot. It's a real education being in the trailer!
Also, you may want to have a trailer repair shop check out the truck and trailer brake connection.
Sounds like you may have a scrambling problem. We have one of those. We tied the divider to the wall and gave the horse the whole space. It worked.


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## Dustbunny (Oct 22, 2012)

Electric shock? Oh my gosh. 
No end of the things to learn here........


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## PrivatePilot (Dec 7, 2009)

Cynical25 said:


> This! A friend's horse was doing the same thing in her new trailer, so she took a test ride in the stall and received a shock every time the brakes engaged.


I find that highly unlikely considering electric brakes operate at 12 volts.

OP, what trailer brake controller do you have? Cheap "time based" controllers typically create herky-jerky trailer braking that could be annoying your horse - the brand new brakes on your trailer would be exaserbating a cheap controller because the brakes are super-effective vs your old trailer on which they might have been heavily worn and much less grabby.

A high end brake controller, setup properly (an important part of the equation, obviously!) will provide seamlessly smooth braking between tow vehicle and trailer.

This thread at the DieselPlace forum I help run might be a good read for you:

FAQ: Timer Vs. Proportional Brake Controllers - Diesel Place : Chevrolet and GMC Diesel Truck Forums


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## Darrin (Jul 11, 2011)

I second/third/whatever checking out your brake controller settings and seeing if it's working right. Odds are even the controller isn't working right anymore but then if you're not used to using that controller odds are even you don't have it set up right. 

Another thing to try, put him in the back stall of your slant to see how he his. It takes most horses a bit to adjust to standing up against the front wall. They move their feet, hit the wall causing a banging sound then jump, cause more banging then panic. Some horses never do figure it out and need to be put in a stall away from the wall every time they are hauled..


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## 2BigReds (Oct 7, 2011)

PrivatePilot said:


> I find that highly unlikely considering electric brakes operate at 12 volts.


Aren't horses extra sensitive to electricity, though? I think I read that from someone on HF not too long ago... :? In any case, I would think it might be just enough to make a horse super anxious in a trailer that they've never been in before, and if the brake controller in the truck is junk then that could add just another thing on top of that. :think:


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## PrivatePilot (Dec 7, 2009)

It takes a lot more amps (at 12 volts) then what makes it to the trailer brakes to feel anything so far as an electric shock.

Next time you have your hood open put one hand on each battery terminal - feel anything? Didn't think so. And that's right at the battery, with your body creating a dead short across several hundred amps of battery at 12 volts.


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## 2BigReds (Oct 7, 2011)

PrivatePilot said:


> It takes a lot more amps (at 12 volts) then what makes it to the trailer brakes to feel anything so far as an electric shock.
> 
> Next time you have your hood open put one hand on each battery terminal - feel anything? Didn't think so. And that's right at the battery, with your body creating a dead short across several hundred amps of battery at 12 volts.


Huh. The more you know!


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## KsKatt (Jun 2, 2014)

Have you tried riding in the trailer to find out how it feels? Seriously, that is step number 1.


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

PrivatePilot said:


> It takes a lot more amps (at 12 volts) then what makes it to the trailer brakes to feel anything so far as an electric shock.
> 
> Next time you have your hood open put one hand on each battery terminal - feel anything? Didn't think so.


(Warning: Nerd alert! )

This is correct. Dry skin has quite a bit of resistance. Now try it with your tongue!  Or stick a metal watch band on the positive terminal, while leaning your arm across the negative ground frame. Suddenly those electrons are moving! As a car battery has quite a bit of amperage compared to a household battery, you can get skin burns from the current flowing through the wrist band.

So while it's uncommon to receive shocks from 12V car batteries, it's not impossible. Now the detective work is figuring out how the current was entering the metal parts of the float that were probably involved in the shock the lady in the example observed while riding in the float.




> And that's right at the battery, with your body creating a dead short across several hundred amps of battery at 12 volts.


Technically it's not a short unless electrons are moving! ;-) Which won't be happening much with dry skin, or even that much more with moist skin, because skin is quite good protection with that kind of low-level power source. But get some crocodile clips and connect them to the battery terminals on the one hand and to a sewing needle each on the other, and stick the sewing needles just below the surface of the skin, where the body's (electrolytic) fluids can be reached with the metal. This is guaranteed to be a really bad experience.

Electricity and the body is a really interesting subject. 10-20 microamps (1 microamp is a millionth of an amp) across the heart is often enough to induce fibrillation. But even the above unpleasant experiments shouldn't cause that to happen, unless you're going to stick those sewing needles through your ribcage.

On the topic of the OP's floating issue: Drive the float a short distance like you normally would, and brake like you normally would, with a human "reporter" in the float, holding on to the breast bar. They can give you some feedback on whether it's hard to balance during braking. Float brakes are often quite savage and act so quickly that the horse has little warning and struggles to maintain its balance (even worse when standing on an angle). It can cause scrambling injuries and float sourness. When I float horses, I try to avoid braking as much as I can by coming off the accelerator way before a turn or traffic light, and letting the vehicle slow down naturally as much as possible, and engaging brakes lightly and early rather than more heavily and late in the piece. It makes a lot of difference, and the horses appreciate it.

Good luck with it! Let us know how it goes!


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## PrivatePilot (Dec 7, 2009)

OP needs to get back to us on the model of the brake controller they are using. I suspect (as the OP touched on last) that it's simply an issue with rough braking due to a combination of a cheap improperly setup brake controller, and super-effective brand new trailer brakes.

As others have suggested, taking a ride in the trailer is apt to be an enlightening experience as to what your horse might be upset about.

A good quality proportional brake controller that is setup properly, as well as proper braking techniques for livestock hauling (agree with SueC above, your driving style means a LOT!) will probably alleviate a lot of the issues.

The Tekonsha Voyager and Primus series are well regarded proportional controllers, and if you want top of the line, the P3 (the controller I have towed with coast to coast) is simply unbeatable.


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

2BigReds said:


> Aren't horses extra sensitive to electricity, though? I think I read that from someone on HF not too long ago... :?


I don't know, but it wouldn't surprise me. Dogs are way more able to sense smells than us, and have better hearing, for instance. A lot of the human brain is tied up in complex cognitive processing and we have kind of dull senses compared to some of the other mammals. Relatively good (daytime) vision though.

One thing we can say for sure is that the horse's nose and muzzle area are very sensitive, and I wouldn't be surprised if they provided less resistance to small electrical shocks than the dry skin of a human arm. The thinner and moister the skin, the less electrical resistance.


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

PrivatePilot said:


> OP needs to get back to us on the model of the brake controller they are using.


PP, I'm not very well versed in mechanics, would you mind explaining to me what a brake controller does and how it works?


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## PrivatePilot (Dec 7, 2009)

See the link I posted earlier in this thread In one of my previous responses. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

Ooh, do I need to go and see an optometrist? :shock: Thanks for the link!


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## KsKatt (Jun 2, 2014)

It may very well just be a jerking problem. I had to deal with that before, it took some fine tuning to get it just right.
But, like I said, riding back there is the first step. You don't know what to fix until you know what the problem is.


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## PrivatePilot (Dec 7, 2009)

With a timer based controller it's virtually impossible to get rid of trailer brake jerking without setting the controller so low that it provides inadequate/unsafe braking. This is why I'm such a proponent of quality proportional brake controllers vs cheap timer models. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

The best and safest way to retrain him is to train him to not fear a human sized door. Do you have any at your barn? I used to lead my horses randomly into the building that I kept my hay and extra tack when I was teaching lessons. It was the typical 34" wide and 6 ft tall human door and the building was dark even with the lights on.
You could start by using a long lead rope, walking though and waiting then ask your horse to walk through it from the inside to the outside, at first, and then, the other way.
I own a 4-horse slant load and the entrance is narrow.
Using a regular door, your horse isn't gonna feel trapped bc they is an exit. He will show some fear. Just keep repeating every day until it's no big deal. Then, the trailer should also be no big deal, too. =D


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## Darrin (Jul 11, 2011)

Another nerd and safety alert, in the right conditions as little as 30 volt shock can kill a person.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PrivatePilot (Dec 7, 2009)

Darrin said:


> Another nerd and safety alert, in the right conditions as little as 30 volt shock can kill a person.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


...with enough amps. Amps play a big factor. An electric fence may have between 2500 to upwards of 8000+ volts, but usually only around 100 milliamperes. 

Volts don't kill. Amps do.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## nrchacowhorse (Jun 13, 2014)

Sometimes new trailers have a surge. If not turn down the brake settings. And if that still doesnt work dont worry. Maybe he just needs to get used to it.


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## SueC (Feb 22, 2014)

Corporal, the problem with walking horses through human sized door frames is that they can break their necks on them. It doesn't happen very often, but it did happen to someone we know, when their horse panicked and reared, and bashed into the top of the solid door frame. :-(

PP, amps are the big factor, but volts also matter.


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