# My western saddle slips sideways breast collar or back cinch?



## netty83

I am new to western tack and have a question about my saddle. My saddle only has a front cinch and when i have tightened it as much as i can and i try to mount from the floor the saddle slides towards me. Someone said that maybe my latigo??? (the d ring and leather strap) is set a little too far forward for the saddle? the last time i rode in it i kept having to put my weight into my right stirrup to move my saddle over. Would a back cinch help to keep the saddle more secure or should i try a breast collar? It's not that i don't have my cinch tight enough as it's as tight as i can get it. :?


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## caleybooth

There could be several reasons for this. 1. the saddle may not fit the horse right. 2. the horse might be mutton withered. 3. the horse may be holding in air and blowing out his belly while you are cinching, and then when you go to get on the saddle isn't as tight as you thought it was. 4. you may be a little on the heavy side and pulling the saddle out of position when you mount. 

A back cinch won't help, all they do is keep the saddle down in the back. Your best solution is a breast collar and a mounting block. But you might want to get your saddle checked by a saddle fitter.


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## Skipka

I sometimes have the same problem. The western saddle I have is a good fit but my mare is very flat across the withers. A good product to use is a saddle pad with a non-slip surface underneath. You can also get cinches made from the same material - if you look up non-slip pads on the internet you should find something. My mare also hates being cinched up so I do it slowly so she doesn't get the chance to hold her breath!!


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## netty83

1. the saddle may not fit the horse right. 2. the horse might be mutton withered. 3. the horse may be holding in air and blowing out his belly while you are cinching, and then when you go to get on the saddle isn't as tight as you thought it was. 4. you may be a little on the heavy side and pulling the saddle out of position when you mount. 

A back cinch won't help, all they do is keep the saddle down in the back. Your best solution is a breast collar and a mounting block. But you might want to get your saddle checked by a saddle fitter.[/QUOTE]

Thanks i'll reply in your order.

I had the saddle guy come out and check a short while ago and it's a good fit.

Yeah my mare is very mutton withered and flat backed she is a uk native breed.

I usually move my horses around on the ground to get the feel of them before getting on but she does blow out and i have to re-tighten once i have moved her round.

You may also be right on this aswell i'm afraid to say i am slightly on the heavy side (12 stone) for my height. I do use a mounting block but sometimes i have to get on from the floor when we are out trail riding.

so breast collar would be the way to go then?


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## Tianimalz

Pictures of the horse and the saddle would greatly help. It could be that either your horse doesn't have any withers to hold up the saddle (been there!! I've never needed a mounting block before in my life until I went to get on that horse.), or you are doing a very common newbie mistake and pulling on the horn and cantle as you *pull* instead of *push* your way into the saddle.

Pulling on the horn and cantle brings the saddle to you, the correct way of getting into a western saddle is playing a hand on the horses neck/withers, and the other hand either flat down on the cantle or behind it, and pushing yourself (like a push up!) up and then swinging gently over and into the seat. It's pretty common for people to get up the wrong way, and it's nothing to be upset about as long as one works to fix the mistake- otherwise it leads to high discomfort for the horse. Please don't take any of that the wrong way, meant it in a polite manner.

As for your original question, to help keep a saddle in place you use a breastcollar, the back cinch is there to keep the back end of the saddle down- but it is usually fairly loose and does nothing to keep the saddle from sliding side to side. 

So I'd reccomend using a mounting block until you can push yourself up a little easier, and a breast collar. 

That said, make sure the saddle actually fits.... pictures would be a LOT of help  

Hope that helps some!


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## netty83

Skipka she is a dales mare so if you know the breed i'm sure you will know what i'm facing. I have a 1inch thick felt pad that i use under the saddle that i had imported from America. Did you get your pad from UK if so any recommendations of where to get them from. I'm from North of England.


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## Tianimalz

Skipka said:


> I sometimes have the same problem. The western saddle I have is a good fit but my mare is very flat across the withers. A good product to use is a saddle pad with a non-slip surface underneath. You can also get cinches made from the same material - if you look up non-slip pads on the internet you should find something. My mare also hates being cinched up so I do it slowly so she doesn't get the chance to hold her breath!!


Be careful getting these- not all horses take to them well. I've said it on here before but I've had horses get rubbed raw in a few places after just two hours with one of the neoprene non-slip pads. I prefer wool or felt, it sticks pretty well and is heavy and soft.


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## netty83

Tianimalz said:


> Pictures of the horse and the saddle would greatly help. It could be that either your horse doesn't have any withers to hold up the saddle (been there!! I've never needed a mounting block before in my life until I went to get on that horse.), or you are doing a very common newbie mistake and pulling on the horn and cantle as you *pull* instead of *push* your way into the saddle.
> 
> she doesn't have much wither. it's very difficult to get saddles for our natives.
> 
> Pulling on the horn and cantle brings the saddle to you, the correct way of getting into a western saddle is playing a hand on the horses neck/withers, and the other hand either flat down on the cantle or behind it, and pushing yourself (like a push up!) up and then swinging gently over and into the seat. It's pretty common for people to get up the wrong way, and it's nothing to be upset about as long as one works to fix the mistake- otherwise it leads to high discomfort for the horse. Please don't take any of that the wrong way, meant it in a polite manner.
> 
> 
> I'm not offended and i suspect you could be right. I do take hold of my horses neck but also hold onto the swell. I'm not the most athletic of riders and i suspect this could be the case and i'm pulling the saddle towards me.
> 
> So I'd reccomend using a mounting block until you can push yourself up a little easier, and a breast collar.
> 
> I will use the mounting block more until i'm better at mounting. I have always been given a 'leg up' or used a moutnign block and as she is only 14.2 i was keen to start mounting from the ground just to get the technique and so that if i really had to get off wihile riding i could get back on but maybe i will stick to the mounting block for a while. I'll try get pics of me riding this weekend. I don't have many pics of me riding.:-(


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## netty83

thanks for the advice about the non slip pad. i'm not sure how my horse would react to the pads but i do really like my felt pad and at £60 i think i might have to stick with it.


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## Tianimalz

netty83 said:


> I will use the mounting block more until i'm better at mounting. I have always been given a 'leg up' or used a moutnign block and as she is only 14.2 i was keen to start mounting from the ground just to get the technique and so that if i really had to get off wihile riding i could get back on but maybe i will stick to the mounting block for a while. I'll try get pics of me riding this weekend. I don't have many pics of me riding.:-(


Practice makes perfect  

Plus, the more you build your upper body strength, the easier it'll be! I like to keep a pair of 10lb weights by the television and do a couple easy workouts with them while I'm watching Law and Order :lol: Since I don't always have time to ride as much as I'd like, it's important to keep the "riding" muscles in somewhat acceptable shape so that when I do get my chance to ride it won't be as difficult. I also like the wall crunches for working the leg muscles, but that's for a different topic.

So don't get discouraged, everyone has this problem at least once. Horseback riding demands a lot of fitness in many ways, and that isn't always easy :?


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## Saddlebag

When you are mounting you need to keep your body close to the saddle and really spring with your right leg to get up there quickly. It takes a lot of practise to do this smoothly. When you are riding if the saddle is slipping to one side you are putting more weight in one stirrup. A common occurrance is for the rider to unknowingly ride with a sideways tilt in the hip. This creates a longer leg on one side and shorter on the other. To compensate the rider often drops the shoulder on the short side. Altho it takes practice there's an easy remedy. Have someone stand directly behind at watch your waistband which should be parallel to the ground and let you know when to correct. Also then to correct your shoulder which should also be parallel to the ground. This will straighten your spine. Once you know how it should feel, an exercise is to sit in the saddle and focus on whether or not the pressure of your seat bones feels the same or not. This is the fun part as it will drive you nuts wondering if you really do have it right. It does make you aware of what you need to do tho. Do you find you seem to lose one stirrup whereas not the other? That's the one on your short side.


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## netty83

I do sometimes feel like i have more weight in the foot which the saddle seems to be slipping to. I was told that i am very very slightly leaning to one side and now i know i have been working hard to correct this. I also have realised that i do this in everyday things aswell. when i'm sat at my chair at work i can feel alot more weight down my left side and actually even when i put all my weight down my right side my left side is still the heaviest i know that might not make sense but even if i sit on my right bum cheek my left leg still feels far heavier than my right.


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## SaddleOnline

I've had good luck with non-slip pads, though I'd be wary of rubbing with a non-slip girth. 

Since your saddle fits, I'd say you just need to make sure to get the girth as tight as possible, use a tall mounting block and possibly even have someone hold the opposite stirrup for you while you mount, if someone is around. 

Mounting quickly with agility will also help, the more time you spend pulling on one side of the saddle, the more likely it is to slip. 

A breast collar is not going to significantly improve the situation - if anything, it may irritate your horse by applying additional, uncomfortable pressure as the saddle slips. Your breast collar would have to be extremely tight before it would do much of anything for slipping. A back cinch would slip right along with the front cinch.


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## kevinshorses

You might want to consider getting a longer cinch(girth). I've found that if a cinch is too short that the saddle has more slide. 

As far as mounting I'll tell you how I do it. I ride a lot of green or spoiled horses so it's important for me to have two hands on the horse at all times. I place my left hand along with the reins on the neck and get a hold on the mane. I put my other hand on the saddle horn. I stand close to the horse, bounce once or twice and then swing on in one steady motion. I try to use my arms very little and only to keep me close to the horse and use my leg to push myself high enough to get in the saddle.


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## netty83

thanks Kevin great description I'll give that a try when i next mount. I also have just switched cinches from a long one that wouldn't go tight enough as I ran out of leather before it was tight enough so my presumption was that the cinch was too big to a small one which seems alot better but saddle slips with both.


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## MHFoundation Quarters

Kevin gave great advice. Another trick for a mutton withered horse, is to mount more facing forward instead of straight on looking at your horses side. Mounting that way will put a more backwards pull on your saddle than sideways. Takes some practice to get it down, but it will help.


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## Saddlebag

Netty, it's great that you are aware of your uneven weight. You don't need a coach to have someone stand behind you while riding just as long as they can see your waist band or belt. Oftentimes the rider also moves the pelvis on the short side forward to compensate altho likely done unconsciously. So your spine and shoulders and waist need to look like this .. I. Then you saddle will quit slipping. A test of your balance is to ride a 20' circle, both ways. If you saddle seems to slide to the outside going one way but not the other then you know for sure which side has the greater pressure. Riding the circles will help you readjust. It doesn't matter if it takes a month, one day it will be second nature.


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## NCPH

I agree with what some of the others have said above. If you are only having trouble with the saddle leaning sideways, then it is probably a combination of your horse being flat backed and your balance in the saddle. A breast collar won't really help, if you were to use it you would have to fasten it tight enough to wear it would actually impede the horse's movement. I would not go for the non-slip girth. Even if they do not rub the horses back raw, they can cause great discomfort to your horses muscles by constantly pulling the muscle in a direction it does not normally go. I would just try to be conscious of your weight and really trying to keep your weight out of your stirrups. Try holding on to the saddle more with your thigh. This will cause you to sit up and in the saddle; not pushing yourself off to one side like when you balance with your feet. If you do this enough times, it will become second nature to you. Then, your leaning and subsequent saddle sliding should decrease a lot. Good luck!


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## tasunke

I had the same problem with a horse I was leasing - he has mutton withers and was wide. Thankfully there was another saddle at the barn was wider than the Wintec his own had for him. 

Tacky Too pads are great from what I've heard.


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## tinyliny

I haven't read the whole thread, so forgive me if I duplicate others.

I really don't like nonslip pads. Can really irritate the horse. 
However, a 1 inch felt pad might be really thick. Sometimes those heavey felt pads need a lot of use and time to conform to the horse's back shape, and in the meantime, they cna make the saddle not sit well on the horse's back. My new 3/4 wool felt pad does this, so I went back to my older wool pad that's all broke in.

Did your saddle fitter have familiary with western saddle fitting? 
I found that Mac's saddle was always rolling to the right, and it had to do with the way he walked and the shape of his back. So, I used a small "shim" that I now velcro to his saddle pad. It keeps the saddle centered. I also almost never get on from the ground, but that's due to my laziness and fatness.

Try a different pad under the saddle just to see if the pad has some of the fault.

Good luck. OH, feel free to post pictures of the saddle on your mare, no pad under it and from various angles. ok?


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