# lift your head up please!



## Jubilee Rose (May 28, 2008)

Yesterday when I was riding Jubilee she was being a complete dork and sticking her head way down. I was riding outside and it was snowing, but just lightly. I know that when a horse puts its head way down or way up its a sure sign of disrespect because they are evading contact. I don't know why she was doing this though. I had not ridden for a week and I know she was a bit stiff, but I did lunge her first and she was really good for that considering she was going through snow. But in the saddle, she would stretch her neck way far down and she was SO hard on the mouth. Whenever I'd try to get her to stop, I felt like I was pulling forever on her mouth and felt so bad. One thing I felt did help with this, was applying more leg and lifting my inside rein to lift her head up. This did help and whenever she did it, I made sure to praise her for it. She hasn't been this dorky in a while. Was she just annoyed at being ridden? It did start to light hail at the end, so I stopped riding. But why was she acting like this? And how can I fix it? Thanks guys.


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## wordstoasong (Jul 8, 2008)

You say you like you are pulling forever on her mouth? Are you pulling in general to get her head up? 

One thing I find doing is "see-sawing" the bit, left and right gripping on the reins for the effect, should soften her mouth. I try it with Murray (and other horses I ride) and it works, not perfect, but it does stop that "pulling forever" feeling. Maybe it will help you. Good luck. =]


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## Spyder (Jul 27, 2008)

wordstoasong said:


> One thing I find doing is "see-sawing" the bit, left and right gripping on the reins for the effect, should soften her mouth. I try it with Murray (and other horses I ride) and it works, not perfect, but it does stop that "pulling forever" feeling. Maybe it will help you. Good luck. =]


I would suggest you do not see saw on the bit. This is a good way to get the horse deadened to the bit.

What you can do is cross the reins in front of you so you form a bridge right about where her withers are and when she goes to pull the bridge will come against her neck so she ends up pulling against herself. They usually stop when this happens.


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## SonnyWimps (Feb 22, 2008)

wordstoasong said:


> You say you like you are pulling forever on her mouth? Are you pulling in general to get her head up?
> 
> One thing I find doing is "see-sawing" the bit, left and right gripping on the reins for the effect, should soften her mouth. I try it with Murray (and other horses I ride) and it works, not perfect, but it does stop that "pulling forever" feeling. Maybe it will help you. Good luck. =]


NEVER EVER see-saw a horse's! It does soooo much harm (and does no good)...makes them dislike the bit, hurt their mouth, and can even chip teeth. It it 100% cruel.

Spyder has a good suggestion which sounds like it would work. But since I want my horse to keep his head low I won't give any suggestions other than I defiantely agree with Spyder's idea


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## HorsesAreForever (Nov 9, 2007)

I agree with sonny and spyder!! NEVER see saw on horses mouth!!!!


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## SonnyWimps (Feb 22, 2008)

Jubilee, was she stiff while riding or lunging?
COuld it be that her back was really stiff and she was reaching down to stretch and not be rude and pushy?


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## Hoofprints in the Sand (Nov 23, 2008)

Sandie's been doing that to me lately, since she's still learning to accept the bit...my trainer told me to ALWAYS ask her to raise her head with leg pressure first, but then use your hands as a second aide...but I like Spyder's idea about crossing the reins...I'm going to try it the next time Sandie does that to me so that we're not just getting into a tug of war that I know she'll win! ;-)

PS -- Sonny, VERY cute Christmas pic with the matching Santa hats!!


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## Connemara93 (Nov 7, 2008)

My horse does this sometimes - she just completely leans against the contact, and puts her head down really low. The main thing to remember is DON'T let her pull the reins from your hands, in my case anyway, she does it to try and evade the contact and get more rein for herself.

When my horse does this I just push her on with my leg, and half halt the reins to bring her head back in. I find this helps me a lot, because you will find that as they get more impulsion, they automatically tend to lift their heads up.

I wouldn't know exactly _why_ she was doing this to you, but I would guess that she just wasn't in the mood for work - the conditions weren't great, and she'd had a week long break, so she probably just couldn't be bothered to work properly. 

Hope that helps a bit.


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## wordstoasong (Jul 8, 2008)

*Spyder, Sonnywhimps and horsesareforever:* I should have made myself more clear on my opinion/advice. Thank you for the info Spyder, on it being deaden a horse to the bit. I will keep this in mind.

What I should have explained in my opinion, was that I use this method to get my horses' head up. Once up, I leave it at that and carry on. I don't torture my horses' by this method at all. 

*Jubilee Rose: *You have many opinions on here so far, many that are great to try out on your horse. Don't take my opinion to heart. Good luck with her. =]


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## SonnyWimps (Feb 22, 2008)

wordstoasong: there is NO good explination to "saw" the horse's mouth. Whether it's slight or extremely hard it still is really damaging to the horse's mouth. I would NEVER do that even in the slightest bit to my horse or any horse's mouth. Sawing is NEVER right

Leg pressure might get her head up, good idea Hoofprint!! And thanks! He hated that hat lol


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

Jubilee, I think your horse was being a silly willy... it's cold outside and she was not listening to you. You just needed to get her head up and force her to listen to you.

I don't think "see sawing" was the right word phrase but I do understand I think what wordstoasong was saying. I think shew as saying use alternating preasure and that, done correctly won't deaden a horses mouth. She's not talking about ripping the reigns from side to side. 

I'll be honost, My 24 year old qh will yank the reigns out of my hands and put his head close to the ground when he's feeling obnoxious, he's avoiding the bit and ignoring me. I'll pull him up gently, I'll do all kinds of things, in the end I'll end up yanking his head up forcefully. It's rough but it gets his attention and he will stop his antics, well... he'll move on to a differnet obnoxious tactic, but he's mr. manners himself.

Just get her attention and keep her working.


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## Jubilee Rose (May 28, 2008)

Thank you everyone for your suggestions. When I'm out at the barn tuesday night, hopefully she won't continue to be a dork. I understand what wordstoasong was saying about "see-sawing." Maybe it could be put in different terms but its simply playing with the bit softly to remind the horse of contact and get them listening. Yes, she could of have been still slightly stiff from being off exercise and I did take that into consideration. However, that does not mean she has to be ill-mannered. IDK, I'll see what happens Tuesday. Maybe she was just being moody. :?

Also, this may sound odd since this is my own thread, but I just want to remind everyone about the Conscientious Etiquette Policy. Everyone has their own opinions and no one method is necessarily right or good for everyone, so please keep this in mind when posting. Thanks. :wink:


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## iridehorses (Oct 22, 2007)

Some horses need to be reminded that they are not in charge. Although hard yanking while see-sawing can cause damage, done as a reminder is just that.

The way I have done it - and only with a snaffle - is to make light contact while holding the reins with just my thumb and index finger. I use the other three fingers to alternately squeeze and release which sets up a slight motion in my horse's mouth. It is more annoying then anything else and the moment my horse reacts, I stop.

It can be an affective tool if done properly but a hurtful one if not. I'm sure that is what wordstoasong was refering to and not sitting back and yanking back and forth.


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## Jubilee Rose (May 28, 2008)

Thanks again, everyone for your advice.

I was out at the barn tonight and I rode Jubilee again. She was MUCH MUCH better. She still was putting her head down, but I got another lady to watch me while I was riding, and she told me she was just balancing herself out. It's snowy and the footing's not the best. Plus where I was riding was kind of a slant. So I don't think she was trying to be dorky, she was just balancing herself. If she stuck her head down way too far, I tried crossing my inside rein over my outside and lifting it, this REALLY helped. All in all, it was a SUPER ride! She was soo good. I could feel her working her back end a lot and "giving me her back" at the sit trot. It was awesome. Just wanted to give you the update!


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## MrsB (Dec 2, 2008)

Jubilee Rose, what you did to get her head back up is exactly what I would suggest. 
Use your legs and lift your hands up, and forward slightly to encourage her to move forward into the contact.

Horses have their off days too and sometimes just need that little extra push.


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## horsegirl123 (Jan 7, 2009)

A martingale might help... or were you already using one?


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## dressagegal (Jan 15, 2009)

Because she hadn't been ridden or exercised in a week or so maybe she was feeling a bit sluggish and wasn't up to her usual fitness standard so was streching her head down as it relaxes their neck muscles. Orr, because she hadn't been ridden she had a bit more energy and wanted to run off with you because thats what my horse does when he goes into a gallop on a hack. - Puts his head down and REALLY grips the bit.


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## montezuma (Jan 16, 2009)

I doubt it was just stretching the neck down to be fair. Perhaps she is evading your control? You need to really sit up and push through with your body and ride off of your leg rather than mouth as has been suggested.


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## Lopsidale (Oct 12, 2012)

I would suggest using a daisy rein. Not known by meany, but it is a 'rein' that attaches from the saddle to the top of their bridle. You don't want it to be hurtful so you can adjust it, but it will discourage your horse from pulling its head down. Obviously an artificial aid is not going to be the best solution however you can try it.


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

Haha I was kind of giggling about using your legs to bring her head up....I ride reining and if I just touch my horse sides ever so lightly with a little bumping action....he drops his head! Too funny how different we all are:lol:


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