# This could be the one!!??



## jadeewood (Feb 18, 2009)

ermm, that reminds me off my project horse i just sold.
he was arraginaly driven and thats al they did walk/trot.
but i broke him to be riden and took me like 1 week to get the canter but when he got it he got it. 1st of all he kept ging disunited, ect/
i persived and i did finally get a canter.


its up to you, if you want a horse you can just get on and do it dont get it, if you want a horse you are willing to work with get it. 


its up to you. dont just get it becuase its pretty make sure its whatyou want to do.


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## 1dog3cats17rodents (Dec 7, 2007)

He would figure out canter with time, I don't see that as being a big issue.

He is very cute and sounds like a very nice, bombproof horse. I would snap him up!


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## beckyarchie (Aug 29, 2009)

i totally agree! he looks/sounds sooo sweet, and even if he has some schooling issues, his nature and personality means that you'll enjoy teaching him, and he'll end up as a horse that's worth (to you at least) ten times what they're asking. nature is just such a huge aspect, and his issues dont sound too difficult to rectify 
i'd go for it x x


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## horseluver50 (Mar 19, 2009)

thanks guys 

Also, im not sure, but he might be drugged.. i dont trust the owners, as they say something, then say something else after.

We will ask them if we can have a trial, and we will get vet check on em


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## horseluver50 (Mar 19, 2009)

wow.

so I emailed them asking if they would consider a trial on him..

this is her response:
No I am not interested in giving a trial. He's only a 2000 dollar horse, if he was 5 or up then I would consider it. My dad is not comfortable having him leave the property without the full amount down on him. If he was to be hurt, or not come back in the same state of mind I would have no choice but to hold you guys responsible. It's not fair to the horse or to either family's.


My response back:
Okay, is he still available for lease?

We would prefer to do a trial, would you consider doing a shorter one at all?


her response back:
No. I will not give a trial at all. He stays on my parents ranch. 
Dad made the decision not to lease him or give trials. 
We do not have insurance to cover you or the horse if either parties are hurt during a trial basis.


The way we look at it, this is the sale of an animal. Warrenty's are handed on mechanical items that are tested and expected to perform a certain way. There are not trial basis given on any other type of animal - dogs etc. It's simply part of the buying process, everybody takes a risk when buying an animal.


Our decision is based on the idea that we can't risk him being hurt, we loose too much money value. Also, we are showing him to other families as well. We need him sold before winter, and if he is being tried out elsewhere, we loose any potential buyers. Nothing personal - just business.


If you would like to try him out again, let me know. I'm not trying to "hide" anything - he is just as you saw him the other day. There are just too many factors to consider when doing a trial basis. Trailering, relocating, health risks with being in a new environment with horses that may or may not be vacinated or in good health. We just can't risk it.


When you think about it, would you lend your horses to a stranger in another town for a length of time with only a small deposit? Running the risk of never seeing the animal again? It's just a money loss we can't risk.



well.. i trust her even less now.. 
she wont lease him out, when he was posted for lease just a week ago..
after I sent the message, she deleted the ads for the leasing of him..

She just assumes that I think shes "hiding" something, when all i asked was if she would consider for a shorter trial.



What I'm wondering is.. 
If i get a vet check, would the vet know if he has been drugged?
Would they be able to see if there is any injuries that they are hiding?


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## Saskia (Aug 26, 2009)

I can understand about you not trusting her BUT at the same time I understand her not giving him out on trial. I have given a horse out on trial I think, but generally I don't like to. I just don't feel comfortable sending it somewhere that they could ruin its training, injure it, fall of and sue me, just a range of issues. Not to mention it also means that people don't get to look at it while it is on trial. 

It doesn't say how old he is, I presume you have asked? He'd be getting on a little if he has been there for seven years, I tend to wonder why they are getting rid of him, if they run him with some kind of business you would think they would keep him if he is so good. Their reasoning doesn't seem too right with me.

If you are nervous get a full vet check, but say you are going to ride him first. If you really think he is being drugged then they'll do it again for your riding and then the vet can take some blood, says its for diseases or something, talk to your vet about it first and your concerns, there are probably other ways that the vet could determine if the horse was drugged if he knows you are concerned. 

You could maybe tell her how concerned you are he is not the right horse, and see if you can do a trial on her property. Its a bit tricky though. 

All horses can canter, that is something that with a little work you could fix, although if you are wanting a perfect, bombproof horse (like it seems you do) this horse isn't all that. Don't confuse bombproof with educated either, consider what you want and what this horse is.


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## horseluver50 (Mar 19, 2009)

> I can understand about you not trusting her BUT at the same time I understand her not giving him out on trial. I have given a horse out on trial I think, but generally I don't like to. I just don't feel comfortable sending it somewhere that they could ruin its training, injure it, fall of and sue me, just a range of issues. Not to mention it also means that people don't get to look at it while it is on trial.
> 
> It doesn't say how old he is, I presume you have asked? He'd be getting on a little if he has been there for seven years, I tend to wonder why they are getting rid of him, if they run him with some kind of business you would think they would keep him if he is so good. Their reasoning doesn't seem too right with me.
> 
> ...


thank you for replying 
He is 9 yrs old. (so they say), and they say he has been used on a dude ranch for 7 yrs before they owned him, and they've owned him for less than a year.
which would mean, he was a dude horse when he was less then 2 yrs old.. 

I rode him already, would a drugged horse be able to trot? Cause he trotted with ease and everything.. but isn't there a special drug that hides injuries or anything?

He is 3 hours away, so too far for a trial on their property..

He is a nice, quiet horse (if they didnt do anything to him), and beautiful conformation, in which I think he would be suitable for almost anything..

But, I have heard that if you don't trust the owners, don't buy off them..

I really feel bad for him though, if he is like I saw he was, then I would love to give him a good home where he will be loved


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## APHA MOMMA (Jul 10, 2009)

I have no experience on drugged horses, but I would say trust your heart AND your brain on your decision. Around here, any horse that was or is a dude horse are naturally well behaved horses and very calm, also willing to please, not normally high-spirited horses. Also his temperment could be because of his breeding. My 2 yr old is so far bombproof to any sounds, movements, or anything at the moment and he has been exposed to ALOT, but he was bred to be a really really well minded horse, which is what alot of ranchers look for when having a horse on a dude ranch. It is not uncommon for alot or ranches to start a horse after 2 but before 2 is just too early for my taste. Even if started after 2 it should have been really really really light work. I am thinking that if he was started that young, that would also be the reasoning for his very calm and mature nature. I am not the most experienced horse person out there, but I am only speaking from experience from and around the dude and cattle ranches out here.

As for the trusting of the owners, that is up to you and you just have to go with and trust your instincts on this one. Some of the best horses come from VERY crappy owners, as that is how I got Scout needless to say. Scout's owner was horrid, rude, very high-class (better than anyone attitude) and cared more about a horse's color than the horse itself. Let me know what you choose though, I can't wait to see a horse that you finally choose. Also, if you think you have a bond or just click with the horse, then go for it.


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## Saskia (Aug 26, 2009)

From what you say it sounds like you really like him. I find it difficult to believe that he is 9 if he has done what they say. If you are really uncomfortable about getting him from those owners then don't do it, but if you really like him just get a vet check by the best independent vet you can. Tell them you are concerned about his age, possible injuries, etc. If you want him. The vet can check his teeth which can give you an estimate on the age, check for lameness, flexion (sp?) tests etc. 

If the owners do not let you get a vet out then do not get him. Try and be there when the vet is there so you can talk after, or so you can point things out that may bother you. 

As horrible as it sounds you shouldn't buy a horse because you feel bad for him. He's going to cost you time and money, and if he isn't the right horse for you his life may not be improved, and he'll just be sold on to other people, or even worse, one of you will get hurt.


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

First of all he looks very cute. 

I do understand you want a trial, but I do understand also why other party doesn't want to go with trial: they don't know you either.  What you COULD do though is suggest them to write them on paper what they say about the horse and that you'll return him for full refund in, say, 2 weeks, if something goes wrong (like he's bucking or rearing or such). Also if you decide on him DO the exam before paying the price. 

To see whether the horse is drugged (and I was told about it by the local horse dealer, btw) is 1) check any blood on his neck (although that's hard), 2) when the gelding is drugged his male private part is very relaxed and somewhat dropped, so with geldings you usually can say whether something is suspicious (with mares it's much harder). Of course, they could give him oral supplements, but personally I didn't find the oral ones all that helpful (at least to the point of making them very calm). Also (yes, I know it's far) you could of show up there without the advance note (or say you'll come at 2 pm and come at noon instead) to see how he behaves in field and while grooming/ tacking.


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

Well, there is probably some funki-ness here with the owners. If you read her other ads, she also wants to complete her Western levels 1 -4 by spring of 2010. Western people -- is that doable? And the age vs. experience of the horse doesn't add up. Their comment about "18 mo. old niece can ride him" is just completely stupid.

However, none of that means anything about the horse. Personally, when I see a horse, I know if I like it or not and that means personality. You don't need to worry about learning the "skill" of cantering, but maybe the "ability" to canter. So, if you don't trust what the people are saying, but you really like the horse, have a prepurchase exam and sign an contract abour pre-existing conditions at purchase time. Take down their vehicle license plate number as a precaution if you do buy as well. (Maybe on the sly.) A contract is only good if you can find the other party to uphold it later.

And yes there are lots of drugs that do lots of wonderful things -- like hiding pain and calming down, etc. etc. Ask the vet if (s)he will be able to pull a blood sample for a drug test before you decide on the vet. That's a good idea to say you will ride the same day that the vet comes out, but it's usual. Often the vet will want to see the action of the horse with a rider. 

Good luck.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

My opinion, for what it's worth:
*please bear with me, this is me typing on a caffiene/sugar rush - stupid Pumpkin Spice Lattes... 


I understand the no-trial thing, I really do. As a single-horse owner, I don't want the horse to go missing without full payment; she doesn't know you from Joe the Horse Stealer down the road.
However, there is a professional way of dealing with it, and to me the email she sent was not professional.
When I was selling Maia, I collected full payment and allowed her to be transported to the new owner's property. The new owners were to get a vet check within a week, and if Maia failed the vet check I would take her back. I told them to do whatever tests they wanted as I had nothing to hide, as long as they were covering the bill, I wouldn't care less. Anyways, during that week they were able to test drive her as well. I stipulated very clearly in the contract that if she was hurt in their care, she was to be considered sold. 

When I bought Denny, he came with a 30 day moneyback guarantee.. but the lady was a big time racehorse owner, and could take that chance no problem.

I can see both sides, so you have to go with your gut on this issue. If you are seriously interested in this horse, get a vetcheck. Get the vet to do a drug test if you're worried - better safe than sorry! I have bought a drugged horse once, and it wasn't fun to deal with.


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