# My horse hates her tack



## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

When I bring out her saddle and bridle, my 4 year old, Vanna, looks at it and runs away. She lets me catch her pretty easily and bring her to where I need her to go. She stands to put the saddle on but blows out when I tighten the girth. I walk her out a few times until it fits her. She holds her head up really high when I go to put on her bridle but I pull it back down and she takes the bit (I use a full cheek snaffle). When I ride her, she responds well to what I ask, but she is still really green and I can occasionally have problems that I work on. Am I doing something that makes her hate it? Or does she just want to stand around and do nothing?


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

She probably hasn't gotten used to it yet. Maybe you're inadvertently hurting her with how you tighten the cinch or perhaps the bit clangs her in the mouth so she's not looking forward to the process at all.

I'm not there so I don't know, but I do know it's better to tack up slowly and carefully than fast.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Reasons could be physical - saddle fit, too tight girth, back pain, tooth/bit pain, etc. Or it could be purely mental - she has just learned it's not nice or it's done a bit roughly. 

So number 1 I'd want to rule out/treat physical issues, to make sure it's all comfortable for her. No. 2 I'd want to turn around that association & get her happy about being tacked up & ridden. She's only 4yo, so I wouldn't be doing too much/hard riding yet anyway, & perhaps she needs more education yielding to pressure without a bit first too - I personally want a horse going very well & softly & willingly in a halter/bitless before adding a bit to the equation. But whatever the details, she's 4yo, so I do think it's important you make it all Fun & Good for her, to set her up for a happy life.:wink:


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

You might want an experienced horseperson to help you out and see what's going on with her. Could be your technique, could be the fit, could be some pain issues or it could be she would rather laze around instead of doing work. Whatever the problem is, you need some hands on help resolving this before it gets out of control. Good luck!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

Sounds like she associates the tack with bad things. As others have already posted, check for pain and pay attention to _how_ you are tacking her up. I would work _only_ on tacking up until she no longer has an aversion to the tack. No riding, no lungeing with the tack until she is OK with it. Put it on, do her feet, do her mane and tail, walk her, trot her, hand graze her. Even turn her out in the paddock with full tack, no reins and stirrups, and always under supervision. Tack her up for feeding time too.


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

Her tack fits her very well so that's not an issue. I'll try doing it a different way and see if that works better. The only reason that I can think of for her hating it happened almost two years ago. I was riding her at a walk and my brother was near the woods with his bb gun and he shot it and she got spooked and bolted. I fell off and she ran to the barn and the saddle fell to the side. I fixed it, calmed her down, and got back on. She kept trying to bolt so I got off when she was calm enough. She ended up being fine for rides after that. I've been riding her since she was a year and a half. I haven't started cantering her until she was three. I broke her myself and I'm still working with her, so I know her best. I know that she likes being lazy but works if I ask her to. Once I'm on her, there's no problems involving the tack. I know for a fact that she won't get out of control. She's a calm horse who almost never has an issue. If she does, we fight it out and we're fine again.


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## usandpets (Jan 1, 2011)

I have to think that it's not the tack she dislikes but the work. Everytime she gets tacked up, she has to work. If she can avoid being tacked up, she won't have to work. 

She is very young still. You may be working her to hard or too much too early. JMO, starting her at 1 1/2 is pretty early. How hard and how long do you work her? What kind of work are you doing with her? It can't be all hard work. Some should be easy and pleasurable for her. 

Horses figure humans out really well. She may have your number. Are you having any other handling problems, such as her being pushy or disrespectful? My wife's horse is like yours to you. She has problems with him. However, I don't. He will try the same things with me but finds it gets him no where. I won't put up with crap from any horse. I don't ask for respect, I demand it. 

How are you fixing or correcting her when she acts up? From your post, it sounds like you just keep struggling to get her tack on until she finally let's you. What I do is make them do what they want to do to avoid being tacked up but with a lot more energy than they want to. If they want to move, they're really gonna move. If they want to hold their head up, I'll make them back up until they bring their head down. If they turn their head away, I'll make them move their whole front end away. 

It could be that your horse has some holes in its training. How well does your horse yield to pressure. Correcting behavior is one thing but we also need them to know what to do before getting after them when they do it wrong.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

I only canter her if she has a lot of energy and it's not too hot out. It was pretty hot today and I only made her walk. She confuses me so much. I brought my saddle and bridles out. I put my 15 month old in one and grabbed hers. She stood for me to walk over, barely moved her head, and let me put it on. I patted her and told her she was being good and walked her over to the fence. I loosely tied her on a post and grabbed my saddle. She stood for that too. I praised her again and walked her out and tightened my girth again. I got on and she was fine. I worked on teaching her barrels and I didn't have a single problem. I rode her for about 20 minutes at only a walk and got off. I guess she just doesn't want to work some days. I never over work her. If anything, I don't work her enough. I know that a year and a half is young but my vet even told me that it was fine. I only weigh 110 and my saddle is another 10-15 pounds so I'm not putting too much weight on her. I don't ride her if she doesn't feel up to it. By that, I mean there was a time where she must have twisted weird when she rolled or something and she didn't want me to touch her back. She made it very clear that it was bothering her so I didn't ride. Her and I are very close. If her gets out of line, I let her know. If I'm pushing her too hard or doing something that she really hates, she'll let me know.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

> Her tack fits her very well so that's not an issue.


OK, but especially as she's still immature, it should be carefully checked regularly, because things change. On a mature horse it's a good idea to check/adjust saddlefit at least 6 monthly or otherwise if there's any weight gain or loss.



> I've been riding her since she was a year and a half. I haven't started cantering her until she was three.


Now that disturbs me, especially as your vet supposedly gave you the all-clear to do that! All I can think is that he's either not very knoweldgeable about equine development or he's in the racing industry or otherwise doesn't care for the horse's wellbeing.:evil: Regardless of how heavy you are, you're riding a youngster who hasn't finished developing, who's bones aren't fully set YET, let alone when she was only 18mo.



> I mean there was a time where she must have twisted weird when she rolled or something and she didn't want me to touch her back. She made it very clear that it was bothering her so I didn't ride.


...or she's got chronic back problems from being ridden since she was a baby, which happened to be worse at that time. What did you do about that, aside from not ride her that day?


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

Please don't criticize my vet. He said that he doesn't see it as a problem as long as it's light work. With her back, I didn't ride her that week, actually. I didn't do anything with her. it was that one time that her back her and it hasn't bothered her since. I don't ride her regularly but I'm going to start so I can get her better at whatever I want her to. Please don't criticize my training either. If you saw me ride her or rode her yourself, you would see that she's actually fun, easy, and safe to ride. If I was hurting her, she would make it clear to me. If she did make it clear, it would be during a ride or before I rode her and I would have it checked out.


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## EvilHorseOfDoom (Jun 17, 2012)

xVannaIsLifex said:


> Please don't criticize my training either. If you saw me ride her or rode her yourself, you would see that she's actually fun, easy, and safe to ride. If I was hurting her, she would make it clear to me. *If she did make it clear, it would be during a ride or before I rode her* and I would have it checked out.


But I think she is making it pretty clear that she doesn't like being ridden - whether it's a pain issue or whether she's sick of work, I think it would be obvious she is trying to communicate that she doesn't want to be doing this. If this were any other situation, I'd just say try tacking her up and un-tacking her without riding in between (perhaps doing something else that isn't work) but I think you really need to start listening to the signals she's giving you. There are very, very few people out there (I certainly know of none, on the forum or off) that would consider starting a horse at 18 mths a good plan for long-term soundness. Sorry if I sound brusque but there it is.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

> Please don't criticize my vet.


I did not criticise. I said they were the only reasons I can think of he would have that view. If he understood developmental physiology and cared about horses, I cannot fathom that he would have said anything of the sort.



> With her back, I didn't ride her that week, actually. I didn't do anything with her.


So you didn't get the vet or a bodyworker or anything? I would certainly be getting a good bodyworker now at least, regardless of how obvious or otherwise it is to you.



> Please don't criticize my training either.


I didn't, don't have a clue about your training.



> If I was hurting her, she would make it clear to me.


That's entirely the point - it sounds like she IS indeed trying to 'make it clear' but you're confused about her signals and discounting the possibility it is indeed her telling you she's hurting. Just because it's not blatantly obvious to you what the message is doesn't mean she's not trying to say it. I do appreciate you're not likely doing it knowingly & that your vet apparently gave you the go ahead, etc. 

By all means, don't just take my word for it(or anyone else who knows & cares, who will likely say the same) but don't just blindly take your vet's word for it either if you care about your horses. There are some good studies out there on this subject. One good one that you can find online is from Dr Deb Bennett @ http://www.equinestudies.org/ranger_2008/ranger_piece_2008_pdf1.pdf


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

With her back, it was a one time thing. She was in the same pasture as her yearling and he plays too rough. It could have been from that too. Yesterday I rode her and didn't have a single problem. I even took extra time to make sure I wasn't hurting her. I don't think her back was the main problem. I just don't think that she likes working sometimes. I didn't start riding her when I did because my vet okay-ed it. That's how I wanted to train her. I'm sorry if no one likes it. That's what I prefer doing. Just because they're being started young doesn't mean they won't be able to be sound.


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## spurstop (Mar 22, 2012)

A four-year-old horse that has been under saddle for two years and is still very green....I would say she has a ton of holes in her training and would probably benefit from some time with a professional trainer.


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

She has your number. She puts her head in the air because she can. Same with leaving when she sees the tack. Horses often blow their belly up when being cinched and you are doing it the correct way by walking her until she deflates.Use a knotted halter and teach her to lower her head. There are lots of vids on youtube. When next she walk off when you approach with tack, set the saddle down, keep the halter/bridle in your left elbow and start walking her down. When she stops, you stop for 10 seconds then shoo her (like chickens) to get her moving again. Keep doing this until she will allow you to approach. If you do this each time she starts to walk away she will realize there is no point. It may take a few days or more.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

spurstop said:


> A four-year-old horse that has been under saddle for two years and is still very green....


Just want to point out..

Horses learn at their own pace, nothing wrong with that..

But I do agree about there being holes in the mare's training.


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## BlueSpark (Feb 22, 2012)

Just a few questions



> She was in the same pasture as *her* yearling and he plays too rough


By "*her"* yearling, do you mean you started her at a year and a half, then bred her at 2, and the yearling is her colt(gelding I hope)?



> I didn't start riding her when I did because my vet okay-ed it. That's how I wanted to train her. I'm sorry if no one likes it. That's what I prefer doing. Just because they're being started young doesn't mean they won't be able to be sound.


So you started her really young because you felt like it, not because she was ready or your vet approved? 

Starting very young has been linked to future soundness issues. The last bones to "close" are those in a horses back, which in a saddle horse are the most vunerable to the stress of weight carrying. Riding a horse that is a year and a half, the knees arn't even closed yet, never mind the back, which is years away from being mature.

I think it is probably a combination of two things causing her to not like her tack. She could very well be sore. As with humans, back problems often dont just go away on their own, so the one time issue could still be causing pain.

Also its fairly likely that she is on the lazy side and thinks she can get away with it.


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## Almond Joy (Dec 4, 2011)

BlueSpark said:


> Just a few questions
> 
> 
> 
> By "*her"* yearling, do you mean you started her at a year and a half, then bred her at 2, and the yearling is her colt(gelding I hope)?


Just to clear the yearling thing up (I'm friends with xVannaIsLifex), it was an accidental breeding by a stupid BO, she moved her horse out of that barn ASAP. The yearling was gelded as soon as he could be.


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

Professional trainer? First of all, I can't afford that. My grandmother, who pays for my horses, just manages to afford my two horses. Second of all, I find that very offensive. I work really hard with my horses and I've always wanted to be a trainer. When she was a year and a half, I rode her bareback, at a walk, for ten to twenty minutes. I did that about once of twice a week. I would never push her too hard. Saddlebag, I'll try that if she starts acting that way again. After yesterday, it's really seeming like she's just lazy and didn't want to work.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Well, you know best luv. Don't consider listening to anyone else then.


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## usandpets (Jan 1, 2011)

loosie said:


> Well, you know best luv. Don't consider listening to anyone else then.


I thought the same thing yesterday but didn't say it. Seemed like vanilla was already defensive
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

I was just asking for advice on how I should handle the situation and got more that I wanted. I'm going to continue working with her and she should get better. I feel like everyone just wants to tell me what is and isn't right. I know my horse, you don't. I appreciate your concern but I'm not hurting her. It seems that my horse is lazy, not having back problems from my riding. Just for the hell of it, I'll have my mom check her back (she's the best horse person I know and is also a trainer). I'll just keep training her the way I am because if i ask for help, I have people telling me I'm doing everything wrong. This is the first horse I've trained and I'm still learning a lot. I'm a kid. Like, seriously, so obviously I'd take criticism more to heart than an adult. If I mess up this horse, then I mess her up and I learn from it. We all have different ways of working with horses. There's no "right" way. Okay? Thanks.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

xVannaIsLifex said:


> I was just asking for advice on how I should handle the situation and got more that I wanted.


Yes, that can often happen. If you knew what you were going to get, you wouldn't need to ask.



> I know my horse, you don't. I appreciate your concern but I'm not hurting her.


You may know *your* horse, but it sounds like you have little if any understanding for development of ALL horses, and you don't want to even consider the possibility that you are indeed hurting her.



> Just for the hell of it, I'll have my mom check her back (she's the best horse person I know and is also a trainer).


Good for you, but just because she's a trainer & horseperson doesn't mean she knows diddly about backs & bodywork & I'm thinking that if she hasn't already said anything to you about riding babies, she knows very little in that particular area.



> I'll just keep training her the way I am because if i ask for help, I have people telling me I'm doing everything wrong. This is the first horse I've trained and I'm still learning a lot.


I think a smarter approach - especially as you admit you're a novice trainer & have a lot to learn - is not to be so close-minded and ask for & *consider* advice. Yes, we all have different attitudes about things & often have disagreements, but if you won't even consider different opinions/information, where does that leave you - or more to the point, your poor horses??



> I'm a kid. Like, seriously, so obviously I'd take criticism more to heart than an adult. If I mess up this horse, then I mess her up and I learn from it.


The first 5 words above tell me you're a kid:lol: but why is that supposed to make you 'take criticism to heart', and if that's the case, why don't you do it?? It didn't start out as criticism either, but respectful information. It's become criticism - on my part anyway, because you seem so close minded & uncaring of your horses. Don't take it to heart because we say, don't take our word for it, but start taking it to heart & being considerate for your horse's sake, if you care for her at all.

If you were dealing with an inanimate, unfeeling thing, then go ahead & do what you like, but if you 'mess her up'(assuming it's not already too late), you don't just learn from it, you force another sentient being to suffer. Have some consideration for other than yourself & have some of that 'heart' you say kids have more of.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

OP, we give advice because you ask for it. We all have our own way of teaching a horse particular things. But there is a blatant wrong way to do things, especially if they lead to dangerous situations, which we get very passionate about.

I don't know which post upset you most, but it would be best to break it down for your horse. Desensitize this horse to her tack.. as in teach this horse that the saddle is nothing to worry about.

If it is causing pain or discomfort, it's ALWAYS best to check that 5 times over, first. Because no matter the lesson, if pain is involved.. doubt the horse will ever be completely okay with what's being taught.

Check the saddle fit, check for any protruding nails or burrs. Check the pad, check her back; check her girth line, check her girth. Check her feet and check your OWN emotions and body language. Check how you handle things, check the speed, check her expression as you do things. Check your timing, check her mouth, check the bridle, check how you ride.

Check everything. And if there is no improvement, have the vet come out to make sure she's okay internally too. Or you may have missed something.

Then if nothing comes up, start focusing more on behavior. Don't get mad at her for evading.. just work with her to accept the saddle and bridle and other tack without getting nervous.

By the way, this is coming from a beginner who trained her own horse. The same horse who would bolt backwards, sideways, any direction to get away from people, tack, everything. Especially western saddles.. big ones. He really had some trouble with those. He got over it via the Aussie I rode him in for a good handful of months.

I did all of the above. Otherwise I'm not a trainer.

But it pays to check, double, triple, quadruple check.


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## spurstop (Mar 22, 2012)

xVannaIsLifex said:


> Professional trainer? First of all, I can't afford that. My grandmother, who pays for my horses, just manages to afford my two horses. Second of all, I find that very offensive. I work really hard with my horses and I've always wanted to be a trainer. When she was a year and a half, I rode her bareback, at a walk, for ten to twenty minutes. I did that about once of twice a week. I would never push her too hard. Saddlebag, I'll try that if she starts acting that way again. After yesterday, it's really seeming like she's just lazy and didn't want to work.


How old are you? You sound young, just based off the title of this thread. 

Have you ever ridden with a professional? Not just lessons, but actually learning and absorbing everything you can about training a horse?

Even professional trainers take the time to learn from others to improve their skills, and will even send a horse they are not clicking with or having a difficult time with to another professional that can assess and work out the issue objectively.

This will sound harsh, but if your grandmother can barely just afford your two horses, then maybe you should re-prioritize. Downsize to a single horse, find a professional that will let you work off riding time, or something.

The best thing you can give your horse is a solid foundation and education. A horse that is a willing partner and well-broke is a much easier sell if necessary than a horse that has been trained by a youth without an experienced teacher helping her.


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

What do you mean by "*your*"? She is my horse. I've had her for almost three years and I helped pay for her. I can't even describe how much I care about this horse. I've gone through absolute hell and back with her. This is the only thing that I had for a very long time. My mom knows a little bit of everything you can know about horses. She let me train her by myself. She's been training for years and told me that she let me start riding her so young because I wasn't riding her hard and I wasn't planning on riding her hard or overworking her. She could have taken over her training if she wanted if she wanted, but she didn't. If you read my replies, I am taking advice, it's just not from you. I'm also trying something my mom suggested. By ruining her, I'm not saying that I plan on causing her to be put down. By that, I mean she has to be retired early. If that were to happen, I'd start horses at 2 with the same light work I already do. I take criticism more to heart, I take it more seriously than most would. In all honesty, I feel hated on by you and a few others. I've always wanted to be a trainer and the way people are helping me makes me feel like I shouldn't even bother working with horses because I'm nowhere near good enough. I have very few people already believing in my abilities with horses. By very few, I mean eight people at the most. The last time I rode my horse, I remembered what everyone said about the saddle fit and I checked it a ridiculous amount of times before I even got on her. I checked everything to see if she was in discomfort or not. She reacted fine. No "don't touch me" spots, no pinned ears, no head tosses, no problems at all. I got on her and sat on her and she stood there and wasn't phased at all. I walked her and she responded the way I've taught her to. I turned her, no problems. I backed her up, not problems. I walked her up and down hill, no problems. I didn't trot her the last time because I didn't want her to get sweaty because it's hot out. The time before last it was cool out so I trotted her. She didn't seen to have a problem at all. Even when I first began sitting on her, she never reacted in a negative way. I've seen her in a bad mood and I've backed off from her and didn't push her to do anything. I never push her further than she's capable of. Ever. I'm used to being around and riding multiple times of horses and I have a huge amount of experience. Completely training a horse is new to me, but handling horses on and off the ground is not.


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

I turn 14 in late July. We gave my yearling away but he came back because I'm moving to a new barn that is so much cheaper. Once I move, I only have to pay for grain and work around the barn to keep them there. I've never gotten professional lessons. My mom has taught me a small amount of what I know. I've had a friend teach me walk, trot, and a few other things in English. I've taught myself a lot. I learn wherever I can. I went to a friend's show today and learned a hand full of things. I really do try to be the best horseperson I can. I know a lot about heard behavior, which help me a lot. I'm not a genius when it comes to riding styles. I ride a mixture of ways in a western saddle. I'm not a perfect rider but I can stay on whatever I choose to ride fairly well. The friend whose show I went to is giving me English lessons on her horse soon. She's 19 but has trained two horses and is going to regionals, then nationals in both English and western in the Arabian Horse Association. She knows what she's doing and is amazing at it.


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Honestly, I'm with everyone else in thinking that there's a pain issue here. Have her teeth ever been done? If so, when were they done last? She might just simply not like the regular two-piece snaffle and that's why she's throwing her head up. 

When we started Aires as a two-year-old (he was two and a few months, actually), my BO started him in a tom thumb, but only for the first couple of times he was bitted up. After that, I got my own loose ring snaffle for him to use. Aires hated the two-piece snaffle and would fight it, so I bought an eggbutt french link (three-piece) snaffle and he's now quiet and responsive to it. So, it could very well be that her shooting her head up into the air is her way of telling you she doesn't like the bit you're using. My friend's arab gelding became extremely head shy with the bridle because she had him in a hackamore (what she was told he rode in by the BO who gave him to her) and she had the Quick Stop on backwards and didn't know it. She switched the hackamore around and he was fine. Then she switched to a bit because she needed more control when they did endurance and the hack wasn't working for her and didn't realize he needed his teeth done, so he went back to being head shy about the bridle. After he got his teeth floated, he's better, but she still has issue with him sometimes. Horses remember pain WAY more than they remember the good stuff.

Don't feel "hated on." The people on this forum have a WEALTH of knowledge. Between the few that have answered your thread, there's probably enough years of experience to equal your age three or four times over. I'd be willing to bet they all have more experience combined than your friend and your mom together. If they are concerned that you started your mare too young, maybe you should be listening rather than throwing a fit every time someone says something you don't like. You are trying so hard to make yourself come across as more adult than you actually are, but every time you get your hackles up over something someone says, it really shows your age.

When I first said that I started Aires as a two (and a few months)-year-old, I caught a lot of flack for it. However, my two-year-old was physically mature enough to carry a well-seated adult rider and mentally mature enough to handle learning what was being taught. He was also cleared by the vet when he was gelded (at two years and two months old) to be started lightly. All his riding was simply walk and putting a foundation on him. He trotted once his first time in the arena, but after that it was only walk (except a couple of accidental trots on the trail to catch up to the horse in front of us). He's now three and we're starting to trot.

I was also confused by something you said in post #26 (sorry, didn't think to quote it). You said that the last time you rode her, you didn't trot her because you "didn't want her to get sweaty because it's hot out." Ummmmmm...that's what the hose is for. Aires gets a hose down (not a bath, just a quick rinse) every time he's ridden or worked, whether it's for five minutes or two hours on the trail.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

DraftyAiresMum said:


> I was also confused by something you said in post #26 (sorry, didn't think to quote it). You said that the last time you rode her, you didn't trot her because you "didn't want her to get sweaty because it's hot out." Ummmmmm...that's what the hose is for. Aires gets a hose down (not a bath, just a quick rinse) every time he's ridden or worked, whether it's for five minutes or two hours on the trail.


To be fair that's a smart thing for the OP to do. If a horse works out in high heat.. they can get dehydrated very quickly. Better to keep it slow on hot days unless you're having that horse stuffed with a lot of electrolytes and water (which has SOME electrolytes in it already.)


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

My horse has recently had a loose tooth but she doesn't need her teeth done. A good amount of my rides until the last one were bareback, in a halter, and rope as reins. The bit I use now was recommended by a friend who knows a lot more about bits than I do. I switched bits because the one before wasn't working for her because she wouldn't listen half the time. By that, I mean she would make it harder to turn or stop. I'm not trying to make myself sound older. I'm also not trying to throw a fit. I'm trying to defend myself from everyone saying everything I do is bad and I don't care about my horses. Obviously, I'd be upset over something like that because I do care about my horses. I don't think being told I'm doing things wrong is fair. My horse doesn't show that she's in pain in any part of her body. I would never intentionally hurt my horse. I didn't ride her past a walk the other day because it was in the 90's and I didn't want her getting too hot. Working my horse hard when it's hot is just something I don't like to do. Also, I'm teaching her to barrel race and I walked her through the course at least five times.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Curious what bit you were using before and what you're using now.

Has anything else changed for her? Feet? Diet? Tack?


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

Her feet need to be trimmed but they're not long enough to bother her. She's barefoot too. Her diet only changed because she was pregnant but she transitioned back without a problem. Her tack doesn't seem to be a problem. I started her in an egg butt snaffle, changed it to a Tom Thumb Copper Mouth, then changed it to a full cheek snaffle. My friend told me to change it from the Tom Thumb because she thought it wasn't working for her. She bought me the new bit and it's worked the best out of all of them. When I ride, I use more leg than rein.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Did she 'fear/dislike' her tack before she was pregnant/foaled?


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

No. It didn't affect her at all when I used it on her then. When she reached seven months, I started riding bareback.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

And after she foaled, and had time with her baby and stuff.. when you rode her again, did she react to the tack in this manner?


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

Not at all. She wasn't perfectly behaved but it's not a problem anymore.


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## Skyseternalangel (Jul 23, 2011)

Alright thanks for answering all of my questions


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## Palomine (Oct 30, 2010)

Actually horse are amazingly stoic about pain. The fact that you are able to ride her, doesn't mean she isn't hurting somewhere, just means she may be hiding it.

I would get a chiro to work with her, and a equine massage for her. You would be amazed at the results.

You posted you were having problems. You were given suggestions and opinions. 

Many of us are horse people of long standing and long experience. Which, in a nutshell, means we have been exposed to vets that don't have a clue as to what they are doing, especially if they are not an equine vet, but more of a cow vet, or small animal. We all have been around horses that proved to be having some serious problems, yet never really gave a sign that they were, or we have worked for training stables where that happened.

And we've seen the results too of horses started too young. And of horses with broken ribs, withers, vertebrae who are being ridden anyway, whose owners didn't have a clue anything was seriously wrong.


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## AmazinCaucasian (Dec 10, 2010)

xVannaIsLifex said:


> When I bring out her saddle and bridle, my 4 year old, Vanna, looks at it and runs away.QUOTE]
> 
> Somebody probly beat her with a saddle


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## Ian McDonald (Aug 24, 2011)

AmazinCaucasian said:


> xVannaIsLifex said:
> 
> 
> > When I bring out her saddle and bridle, my 4 year old, Vanna, looks at it and runs away.QUOTE]
> ...


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## AmazinCaucasian (Dec 10, 2010)

haha I didn't think of that but it makes a funny mental picture


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

She could have been. Bought her at an auction in early August of '09. She turned a year old sometime in April by my guess. I didn't start sitting on her until early September. I didn't use a saddle until mid October. Her previous owner could have hurt her with one. I'm not sure. I plan on working with her a lot more on not hating it.


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## AmazinCaucasian (Dec 10, 2010)

Probly a mean cowboy or horseshoer that done it. Was the previous owner a mean ole cowboy or shoer?


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

Vanna, you will make mistakes, we all do. Be careful not to love on the horse if you think she's upset as she sees that as a reward for her behaviour. Just continue with what you are doing. The one trait young horses have is their ability to think of things to do rather than cooperate. You will get one issue resolved and within a month she's likely thought up another. Saddling, tip her nose toward you with her halter and lead so her neck is bent a little. Lift the saddle and if she starts moving away just follow her with the saddle. The tipped nose will cause her to walk in circles. Stay in the saddle zone so she can't kick at you. I'd be surprised if she completes a full circle. The way she is moving will cause her back end to make a larger circle than the front and this unnatural action is tiring. For hellery, try saddling her from the off side. She might just stand still. She's not hating the saddle. She's figured out how to avoid it.


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## BlueSpark (Feb 22, 2012)

_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

I'll try that. I also tack her and ride her in her normal pasture. I've heard, and believe, that she finds it a place to play and not learn. Her pasture is where she eats, rests, and plays with the other horses, so why should she have to learn something? There's a round pen where I'm moving to and I'll work with her in there. If I mess up, it's better off if it's with her because she's well behaved, sweet, and calm.

BlueSpark, I can't see you comment.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

xVannaIsLifex said:


> Her previous owner could have hurt her with one. I'm not sure. I plan on working with her a lot more on not hating it.


Um, sarcasm doesn't come out in writing(I've learned, previously getting in trouble for my sarcastic sense of humour!) - you weren't meant to take AC's comment seriously.... sorry to spoil your fun AC!


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

I guess it's fun to joke around with someone a lot younger than you when they're upset over you already. Thanks.


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## AmazinCaucasian (Dec 10, 2010)

Didn't mean any harm, Vanna. Just making fun of the general consensus on here. I apoligize


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Vanna, I too mean no disrespect. I do not apologise for what I have said, as it's a point, having seen so many results, that I'm passionate about. But I am not meaning it in a nasty way & am trying to be fair too. I do admit the last 2 responses were a bit short:-(, as I was getting the idea you just didn't want to even entertain the possibility that just maybe, you might be *inadvertently* harming your horse.

At the end of the day, I think the vast majority of people do the best they can with the knowledge they have at the time, you included. Vast majority of the members of this forum included too. IMO this is a very respectful bunch (esp for an internet forum!:shock & we mostly succeed in taking suggestions in the way they're meant - as another opinion worth considering seriously, but opinion just the same. 

But we only have eachother's written words to go on (well & a few :wink::?:lol, aside from the fact that I've never met a perfect communicator who was never misunderstood & I'm certainly not one. So there are bound to be misunderstandings, relevant things left unsaid, differences of perception, etc, etc. I do strive to keep that in mind & read & respond to posts in a 'charitable' way & I think that's vital to a good forum. But I'm also only human & far from perfect.:twisted:


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

It's not what was written, it's how it was written. I could have taken things differently than you or anyone meant me too, but still. I feel like a lot of you were too harsh on me. I can take advice from others, which I have, but I don't to if I feel it's written in a mean way. I wasn't thinking anyone would be joking since it's not something to really be able to make jokes out of. I was looking for some advice. It's not like I'm trying with my horse. I care about her and want the best for her. If I was hurting her and she needed professional training, I'd give her up if I knew there was nothing else I could do. I always want the best for her. She's an amazing horse and it wouldn't be hard to find someone else better for her. I've put a lot of work into her by myself. When I got her, she was only halter trained. When we fed her her first meal, she didn't even know how to eat grain. That showed me that I had to do everything with her. I taught her all the groundwork she know like leading extremely well, picking up her feet, etc. I haven't stop trying my best with this horse. I;ll even try to have someone take a video of me riding her so you can see for yourself how she is when I tack her and if she's in pain or not. If someone see's what I haven't, then I won't hesitate to get help for her.


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## AmazinCaucasian (Dec 10, 2010)

OK I'll try to help. Your horse is a little skeptical of the saddle. Well, it looks strange and scary and is possibly made of leather, which probably seems extra confusing to her. Doesn't matter what the issue is that needs attention, COMMON SENSE is your best asset. If she's reluctant to take a saddle, expose her to it more. If she doesn't like potato chip bags, sack her out with them. If she pulls on your hands when you ride, soften her up. If she resents pressure, apply pressure until she yields. 

The trend is to have a structured step-by-step training ritual, but you don't need that. Just walk out and catch your horse and whatever doesn't feel right, fix it. Whether it's haltering, standing still to mount, bad ground manners, herd-souredness, whatever. Just use common sense and fix it. 

If this was my horse, I'd first feel around the back and see if they're sore. If not, I'd tie it up or put the lead rope in my belt and desensitize it to the saddle. No gimmicks or voodoo. Just confront the problem. Doesn't matter why she's scared of it. Get her over it. But that's me, you may want a more indirect or slower approach


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

xVannaIsLifex said:


> It's not what was written, it's how it was written.


Yes & IMO it was how you wrote/responded too. Let's move on?



> to have someone take a video of me riding her so you can see for yourself how she is when I tack her and if she's in pain or not. If someone see's what I haven't, then I won't hesitate to get help for her.


Good idea & might get you some appropriate observations, but remember there's a reason that bodyworkers don't do video diagnoses - it will only show the bigger things as a rule.


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## fatfreddiefreckles (Jul 3, 2012)

ive seen a video of you riding and they is no problem for you when you ride with out a saddle, it might just be that she likes to be riden saddleless as most horses find that more enjoyable in that case all you ca do is get her more use to being ridden with one and in time she'll be fine :3


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## BlueSpark (Feb 22, 2012)

> It's not what was written, it's how it was written


When things are written, you lose tone of voice, jestures and facial expression. Thus things that are read are more easily misunderstood, or subject to the readers moods. I think you need to step back and take it as it was intended, advice and/or constructive critisism from experienced horse people trying to help you out.

Get someone out to take a look at your horse(vet, etc) and have them confirm she is not uncomfortable and your tack fits. Then proceed with desensitizing her to the saddle and making work fun for her.


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

Hi Carmol. :3 I'm riding her today and will keep working with her. I make work fun for her by not doing what she hates (the trail and jumping up to a foot, but she jumps 2'6 when I free lunge her.) Then, after I ride, I always give her a treat for being good.


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## AbbeyCPA (Jun 29, 2011)

IMO, I wouldn't be jumping her at this point. If there are underlying back issues, that most definitely will not help. 

You can't go back and re-start her, what's done is done. So all there is to do now is look at what you can do in the long-run that will be most beneficial for her. Have a chiropractor come out and check her back. If you paid for part of her yourself, I'm sure you're able to save up to at least have a vet or chiro check her out. 

Maybe for the time being just bring her in, saddle her, and hand graze her? If you insist on riding, keep it short and sweet. You could also try a softer bit (one with a rubber mouthpiece, or a happy mouth) so it's less likely to cause any extra discomfort to her teeth or mouth.


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## AbbeyCPA (Jun 29, 2011)

Also, I just took a peek at your photos. Vanna's bit looks too big, maybe try fitting her with a smaller size? I'd go about half an inch smaller.


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

I've only made her jump while on her once and she hated it, so I won't force her through it. I don't always make her jump while lounging her. I actually haven't lounged her in a while. I don't want to ride her for too long anyways because it's pretty hot where I am. I'll feel her back later and see if she reacts to anything. I'll try to get a chiropractor out soon and I'll look into getting mouthpieces.


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## xVannaIsLifex (Jun 21, 2012)

I'll try to find a smaller bit too.


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