# Got kicked...badly.



## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

Well, I knew this would happen eventually. I got kicked...hard, at close range right in the thigh. It was a direct hit, and ohhhhh it hurts. I haven't gone to the doctor yet, I'm pretty sure nothing is broken besides my pride. 

Here are a few pictures for your enjoyment. 




















I was working with my 5yr old Reno in the round pen on direction changes. For the past few days I have been doing direction changes at a walk on the line and off. Well today she was doing awesome with off the lunge line direction changes so I decided to put the halter back on and start working with a trot. 

Reno usually flicks her tail and acts annoyed when working but she has never really done anything like this. 

So anyway I asked her to trot and she definitely didn't want to. I had to tap her with the stick several times to get her going. She put her ears back and flicked her tail and I could tell it aggravated her but that just sort of made me want to make her listen and respect me more. I asked for a direction change and she did it and started walking. I immediately tapped her with the stick the trot and she turned straight toward me so I tried so send her off to the side. I had to tap her several times with the stick again and as soon as she turned she turned her butt toward me an kicked me square in the thigh. Hard 

I didn't fall down, but went back a few steps and came back up like I was going to kill her. I got her with the end of the stick once or twice and had her cantering around the pen with energy about 10 seconds or less after the kick. She still had her lead rope on and kept stepping on it but I just left it on for about 10 rounds because I wanted her to realize that I'm the boss and she doesn't kick me. I stopped her for a few seconds to take her halter off and send her off at a walk again, trying to get back to the direction changes but she pinned her ears and kinda kicked up her butt again so I ran her around for as long as I could, incorporating the direction changes, before I couldn't stand anymore because of the pain. 

After she ran and I had some Advil, I desensitized her to the stick and string, did some walking and trotting direction changes on the lead along with some flexing and yielding the hindquarters. 

Now, I can't walk. 

I know this is totally my fault, but I'm wondering if my hands are full with this horse. I know that she is very well behaved most of the time but she seems to explode when I push her to think a little and she doesn't "get it" right away. 

Maybe I'm not experienced enough for this....

I really don't have anything at all I'm good at. I'm bad at sports and music and dance or anything like that. The only thing I can really do is horses and it really discourages me when stuff like this happens.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## riccil0ve (Mar 28, 2009)

I was double-barreled right below my buttcheeks once. Went flying and crumpled to the ground. I feel your pain. =[ Sending you healing vibes!!

As far as your horse, we all have those "god I was stupid" moments. Only you can decide if your horse is too much for you. Don't get too discouraged though. We all have bad days. *hugs*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

As I tend to have a somewhat warped sense of humor and can laugh at myself frequently.....I must say your leg looks really sore....but at the same time it looks like a big smile on your leg!!!! Just draw a circle and two eyes

But in all seriousness, just as well she didn't hit a bone, thankfully it was in the fleshy part of your thigh! I've been kicked behind both knees, the horse had a very good aim! Bullseyes behind each knee!!!


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## Spotted (Sep 19, 2012)

Ouchies, thats probly going to turn purple and hurt for a long time 
I don't think she thinks of you as boss yet. If she is lead mare it may take some time.
Watch for sign of submission, ie, licking lips, droping her head to the ground, one ear on you. You did good! Try watching more videos on round penning and join up. Helps me if ever I get frustrated.
Keep your chin up and don't get discouraged, she is thinking of you as just another horse, right now and is fighting for her power.
Good luck!


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## oobiedoo (Apr 28, 2012)

Put an ice pack on that and get off of it for a little while, prop leg up on a pillow.
Sounds to me like you did just great with her, you didn't back down or give up. Be proud of yourself for what you do. Anybody that rides a horse is going to hit the ground one day and anyone who works with a horse is going to get kicked stepped on or bit or knocked down at some point. It's what you do when it happens that matters, and I'd say you are good at what you do! 
Now remember; ice,elevate and rest at least part of the day and if it looks or feels way worse then see a doctor. And give yourself a break, you're doing great.


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## Lins (Nov 8, 2011)

you reacted flawlessly, which made it a good learning experience for your horse. I morph into a screaming lunatic if a horse so much as thinks of kicking at me. Haven't been kicked badly ever though.


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## busysmurf (Feb 16, 2012)

Hugs. I know it stinks, but like Muppet said you're lucky it was where it was and not a bone...like a direct hit to the pubic bone. Yeah, that one smarted a bit
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## oobiedoo (Apr 28, 2012)

Put an ice pack on that and get off of it for a little while, prop leg up on a pillow.
Sounds to me like you did just great with her, you didn't back down or give up. Be proud of yourself for what you do. Anybody that rides a horse is going to hit the ground one day and anyone who works with a horse is going to get kicked stepped on or bit or knocked down at some point. It's what you do when it happens that matters, and I'd say you are good at what you do! 
Now remember; ice,elevate and rest at least part of the day and if it looks or feels way worse then see a doctor. And give yourself a break, you're doing great.


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## Peppy Barrel Racing (Aug 16, 2011)

Ouch that looks like it hurts, I seem to always get kicked in the joints. Hip, knee, wrist lol. Keep it elevated it will help the blood circulate and your immune system heal the damaged areas. Put ice on it and no heat as that increases circulation and will spread the inflammation which could also increase your swelling. I'm glad you stayed after her after being kicked. Sounds like more training is in order keep at it.


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

busysmurf said:


> Hugs. I know it stinks, but like Muppet said you're lucky it was where it was and not a bone...like a direct hit to the pubic bone. Yeah, that one smarted a bit
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yikes!!! That horse must have been crafty!!!


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## Canterklutz (Jul 20, 2012)

Ouch! I'm glad you're ok and just got kicked in the fleshy part of your thigh. Good for you with following up and not letting her get away with acting like a brat. 

I was kicked in the face by an aggressive horse that had sent two other people to the hospital. The horse took out my teeth and a chunk of my skull, tore open my face, gave me a serious concussion, and left me temporarily paralyzed. People kept making excuses for the horse, never got anything accomplished, and the horse learned it could get away with seriously harming people. 

If a horse is aiming to hurt you and has committed to doing so...don't work with it! I learned that the hard way and nearly lost my life. This was an extreme case of a horse never having ground rules established. It doesn't sound like your horse is like that though. I hope it hasn't discouraged you. Despite all the pain, trauma, and surgeries I've gone through I still continue to work with horses. It taught me to prioritize my own safety and not jeopardize it for something beyond my control. I hope this experience has taught you the same.


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## Thunderspark (Oct 17, 2012)

That looks exactly what I have on my butt! That has got to hurt!
Four years ago my mare was pregnant and while she was pregnant she didn't like any of the other horses, she listened to me all the time though. I always took her out when I went to take hay out for the horses but one evening I wasn't thinking and forgot to......big mistake! I was taking out the hay in a wheel barrow and the others were following me like usual behind me, she took after the one gelding and he had no where to go! I remember him slamming into me, me hitting the ground and looking up to see his face looking down and his front hooves, I covered my head and thought #@!* this is going to hurt!!! He caught me with his hind foot on my left butt check, that mark you have is exactly what I had on my butt and now have a permanent imprint of a hoove there LOL
Just always be aware, it sounds like you know the signs of her flippin' you off, when she pins her ears chase her and spank! That is the first sign of her warning you and you have to nip it in the butt right away!
Hope you aren't in too much pain but knowing how it feels it took days before it didn't hurt for me.....


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I am really affected by your story because the other day I was working with a friend's very large warmblood and he came very close to kicking me in the face. I was too close to him while trying to get him to change directions, (just like you) and had to put on a lot of pressure to get him to change and he expressed his opinion about this.

IN this case, I see something similar between this horse and what you describe of your mare; they are too used to being tapped multiple times with a stick to make them do anything.
This hrose has an owner who does Parelli. And in some ways, she has done a really nice job with some of the slower things like backing up, bridling and lifting his feet and such. The hrose is 17hh and very strong. But, watching her work with her carrot stick wtih this horse I can see a whole lot of stick waving happening for not much response from the hrose. 

When I asked to play with him off lead, she asked me to use the carrot stick, but first of all, they are too heavy to manuever well, and secondly, I could not get any kind of real response oout of that horse with the stick. He would do things I asked, but slowly and on HIS schedule. Ok, maybe fine if I am getting him to do Parelli type tricks, like stand on a pedestal. But, when I wanted him to move! he was pretty resentful about it. So, I switched to a long dressage whip and that worked but it sure took a LOT to get him to break loose.

your mare needs to break loose! and tapping her over and over again to get her to go is basically nagging her. I would ditch the "stick" and get a long enough whip that you can put some real zing behind your "ask" and stay out of the danger zone (I plan to bring myown carriage whip when I go back . It's half way between a dressage length and a lunge length. works well).

Dont ask more than twice before you get serious! and when you get serious, you'd better have a change in that horse that matches your seriousness. get her sharp off the whip, then back down to sharp off your body language. You may not have to do so many changes of diretions. you can start with just changes in speed.

and watch your entire interaction with her to see, "Am I nagging her? am I really getting a change? did I "beg" for that?


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

I have been kicked twice, badly. I don't play with a kicker. The minute a horse turns their butt in my face, and acts the least bit nasty, I nail 'em with the whip or carrot stick or whatever else is handy. For the ones who actually landed the kick, I went after them so hard that they never ever even thought of kicking me again. There are 2 things that will get a horse euthanized or sent to auction around here and that's kicking at humans and biting a human. I absolutely convince the horse I'm going to kill him for doing it, and honestly, if I'd had my gun with me the 2 times I got kicked, I probably would have. That's just how unacceptable I find kicking and biting. 

That is the extreme agression act from a horse and I won't tolerate it. I will flail on them with whatever I have in my hands. I hope you never let her get her butt pointed in your direction again.


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> I have been kicked twice, badly. I don't play with a kicker. The minute a horse turns their butt in my face, and acts the least bit nasty, I nail 'em with the whip or carrot stick or whatever else is handy. For the ones who actually landed the kick, I went after them so hard that they never ever even thought of kicking me again. There are 2 things that will get a horse euthanized or sent to auction around here and that's kicking at humans and biting a human. I absolutely convince the horse I'm going to kill him for doing it, and honestly, if I'd had my gun with me the 2 times I got kicked, I probably would have. That's just how unacceptable I find kicking and biting.
> 
> That is the extreme agression act from a horse and I won't tolerate it. I will flail on them with whatever I have in my hands. I hope you never let her get her butt pointed in your direction again.


Isn't amazing how a cellphone or a bucket can become a horse grenade!!! LOL!

When I got kicked I couldn't get up!!!


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Muppetgirl said:


> Isn't amazing how a cellphone or a bucket can become a horse grenade!!! LOL!
> 
> When I got kicked I couldn't get up!!!


The 2nd time, I had my cellphone in my pocket, but she nailed me in the right side under my ribs. I thought she had probably taken out my spleen and I couldn't breathe. She kicked me so hard I got hung from the top rail of a 5 ft tall pipe panel. It took a few for me to catch my breath, I couldn't talk so I couldn't even call 911, LOL! By the time I had wind again, I figured out she hadn't broken any ribs and I was so ****ed I didn't care about the friggin' spleen anymore. I went after her when I could breathe again, we had what I call a Come to The Waters and SEE GOD meeting. She saw God, she got born again and she never ever ever raised a hoof at me again. She did a buncho of ther stuff, but nothing that hurt me that bad. 

I got lucky, she missed the spleen but I was purple from my armpit down to my knee for weeks.


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> The 2nd time, I had my cellphone in my pocket, but she nailed me in the right side under my ribs. I thought she had probably taken out my spleen and I couldn't breathe. She kicked me so hard I got hung from the top rail of a 5 ft tall pipe panel. It took a few for me to catch my breath, I couldn't talk so I couldn't even call 911, LOL! By the time I had wind again, I figured out she hadn't broken any ribs and I was so ****ed I didn't care about the friggin' spleen anymore. I went after her when I could breathe again, we had what I call a Come to The Waters and SEE GOD meeting. She saw God, she got born again and she never ever ever raised a hoof at me again. She did a buncho of ther stuff, but nothing that hurt me that bad.
> 
> I got lucky, she missed the spleen but I was purple from my armpit down to my knee for weeks.


Ive never had good timing with getting kicked! The few times I've been kicked, I've either been flattened on the ground or it's been awkward, like at the races - you can't go all God Almighty at the races!!!! 

At a show a few years ago, a man walked directly behind a horse while it was being tube drenched, obviously the horse was twitched, it it flew back onto this guy so fast, he lost an eye and nearly half his face, was in intensive care for quite some time.......that's why I always tell my kids to stay closer to the horse than further away, I make them approach the shoulder and firmly run their hand along the side of the horse while moving around it, that way they'll be pushed rather than walloped!!!!


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## hollysjubilee (Nov 2, 2012)

Hi, new here . . . but not new to being hurt by horses  I wore a hoofprint (green) in the front of my thigh for years. It was an indentation in the muscle and it literally took years to disappear. It happened when I was about 16 and lasted until after I was married with at least 2 kids! Your's doesn't look as bad, so take heart! You'll be feeling much better, soon, but it does shake our confidence. You did well to get her moving right away after the incident.
Your description of her getting annoyed, though, may be the clue you need to refine the cue for trot. You said that you tapped her . . . and tapped her . . . and tapped her. Sometimes, a horse will view that as nagging/teasing . . . not a clear, confident cue given by a boss horse. I would suggest that you give her the verbal cue; if she doesn't respond, give her the verbal cue followed by a tap; if she doesn't respond, give her the verbal cue and whack her hard, no apologies. She has no business getting pizzy with you . . . and needs to respond on cue. Sometimes, I find that if I use my body language more aggressively toward the hip (be sure to stay a horse length away, just in case! A horse can kick the length of its body) then the horse will move off my body language and I don't need to touch him. No matter what, give her 3 chances, but on the third asking, make it count . . . and allow her to move off around the pen freely. Ask for halt, but not a "come to me." Tell her she's good, ask her to walk off . . . let her go for a complete round and ask for trot with your verbal cue . . . if she doesn't move into trot, ask again with verbal cue and solid tap; She shouldn't want to wait for the third asking and the whack, but if that's what she wants, then give it to her and make it count, no apologies, and as matter-of-factly as anything . . . no anger, no timidity . . . just confident that she will give you what you ask. 
Be safe . . . be good to yourself and may you have swift healing!


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Muppetgirl said:


> Ive never had good timing with getting kicked! The few times I've been kicked, I've either been flattened on the ground or it's been awkward, like at the races - you can't go all God Almighty at the races!!!!
> 
> At a show a few years ago, a man walked directly behind a horse while it was being tube drenched, obviously the horse was twitched, it it flew back onto this guy so fast, he lost an eye and nearly half his face, was in intensive care for quite some time.......that's why I always tell my kids to stay closer to the horse than further away, I make them approach the shoulder and firmly run their hand along the side of the horse while moving around it, that way they'll be pushed rather than walloped!!!!


 
LOL, I don't have your restraint. If a horse kicks me, I rain fire & brimstone on 'em I don't care who's looking. It's my safety or someone else's sensibility, their sensibilities will lose every time. 

I try to get my husband to understand that you just DON'T get behind a horse and stand there. Well, one of my mares was talking to a stallion and he came right behind her and stood there laughing at her talking to the stallion. She bellowed and kicked back and got him in the leg. I looked right at him and said, "Just how effing stupid are you? After 30 years you still want to stand behind a horse?" Yeaaah....we didn't speak for a few days......OOOOOPS! :twisted:


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## hollysjubilee (Nov 2, 2012)

Oh, just one more thought that I forgot to add . . . She might not have felt well that day . . . Maybe she had a headache or some other ache . . . or could she have been in heat and crampy? That's not an excuse for her hurting you, but it may explain her belligerence.


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> LOL, I don't have your restraint. If a horse kicks me, I rain fire & brimstone on 'em I don't care who's looking. It's my safety or someone else's sensibility, their sensibilities will lose every time.
> 
> I try to get my husband to understand that you just DON'T get behind a horse and stand there. Well, one of my mares was talking to a stallion and he came right behind her and stood there laughing at her talking to the stallion. She bellowed and kicked back and got him in the leg. I looked right at him and said, "Just how effing stupid are you? After 30 years you still want to stand behind a horse?" Yeaaah....we didn't speak for a few days......OOOOOPS! :twisted:


Lol! No, I got kicked right on the hand at the races while I was grooming a horse just before it got tacked up, I had to take it through the birdcage using mainly my left hand!! Then the stewards were yelling at me to walk on the near side!!! I switched to the near side when the jockey came out and got on, just as well he was swinging on!!!! With owners and trainers all floating around you dare not let loose on the horse, even if it was a mongrel!!! Smile and keep ******ing on!!!


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## hollysjubilee (Nov 2, 2012)

ha, ha . . . tinyliny . . . I didn't read your response before I added mine. I should have just said, "Ditto."


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

BB it's ok if she doesn't "get it". Step back, think about what you've been doing and how you can change it. Go easy on how many circles she has to do in the pen. She knows how to go in circles so just a couple in each direction are plenty. Reward her with a face rub then walk away and think of anything but her for a minute or two. Your departure is a big reward and it removes all pressure. Now if you want to ask for the trot it is the time to do it. Back away when she does as you ask, even if only a half circle. Ditch the halter and whip and just coil your lead. Usually just raising it gets the horse moving faster. If you feel you are anything but relaxed, leave the pen until you are. Sorry you got kicked, she'd actually given signals that it was going to happen but in your determination they were ignored.


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## AnrewPL (Jun 3, 2012)

****, if you kept going after that and tried getting her straightened out you did really well and can be proud of yourself; probably did teach her a valuable lesson at that too. Don’t feel too bad about it happening, as oobidoo said, if you handle horses its bound to happen sooner or later. Having said that, though I have been bitten bad twice, skin ripped off, and been kicked AT plenty, I have always managed to see it coming and get away, and haven’t actually been kicked yet, touch wood, (touch wood? or rather rub every bit of exposed skin I can find on my wooden desk top; that looks painful). 
And ricci0ve, I have to apologise, the image of your kick floating in my head is like something out of a slapstick comedy and has me giggling about it, I don’t mean to laugh at your pain.


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## AnrewPL (Jun 3, 2012)

****, if you kept going after that and tried getting her straightened out you did really well and can be proud of yourself; probably did teach her a valuable lesson at that too. Don’t feel too bad about it happening, as oobidoo said, if you handle horses its bound to happen sooner or later. Having said that, though I have been bitten bad twice, skin ripped off, and been kicked AT plenty, I have always managed to see it coming and get away, and haven’t actually been kicked yet, touch wood, (touch wood? or rather rub every bit of exposed skin I can find on my wooden desk top; that looks painful). 
And ricci0ve, I have to apologise, the image of your kick floating in my head is like something out of a slapstick comedy and has me giggling about it, I don’t mean to laugh at your pain.


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## flytobecat (Mar 28, 2010)

I'm glad nothing is broken. I second the dressage whip and getting a little firmer. 
I suppose it's silly, but I always feel safer free lunging in a round pen versus lunging on a line (even a long line).


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

<- two knee surgeries from a kick to the lateral side of the knee. 

Oops. 

I feel your pain. Take it easy, and RICE that sucker. Ice is especially important right now. Move the leg as much as you can within a pain tolerance to make sure it doesn't seize up.


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## StarfireSparrow (Jan 19, 2009)

I have been kicked a hand full of times, the first one was by and large the worst. I was working with a 2yo stud colt, training him to lunge and the BO's dog wanted to "help." The colt worked his way over until he managed to get his nose into a corner because I wasn't quite paying attention. As I stepped towards him to push him a little stronger while pulling his nose out of the corner with the line, the dog rushed at his face barking like he means it. The colt jumps backwards, twisting to start to run from the dog, putting him squarely with his butt to me. I can only guess that he saw me out of the corner of his eye when he jumped and turned the other way, because he double barreled me in the chest and upper arm. I almost went into shock, but the dog kept licking my face (only reason I didn't kill the dam mutt). 

The other kicks, I guess you could say went better. LOL Each one, I saw it coming too late to avoid, but just in time to make sure that within a nanosecond of their hoof making impact, I wrapped the lunge whip around their back legs. And at least 2 of them were a matter of me underestimating the reach of back legs!

When I have one that is reluctant the way you describe, I find it works best to turn them loose in the round pen and just make them MOVE. She sounds to me like she has a lot of pent up energy and might benefit from being made to explode before you ask her to concentrate. 

My 2yo is in that phase right now where I have to first send her to the end of the line and just push her until she has her fit where she digs in and charges for about half a circle before bucking and hopping around for a few min. After that, I do something that makes her think, like trot poles, and then I have her mind and her focus. 

I'm sure I am not saying anything you don't know when I say horses are claustrophobic. She might feel like when you have her on the line that you are restricting her and if she already needs to blow off some sillies, she is going to be tense.


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## EvilHorseOfDoom (Jun 17, 2012)

My preferred whip for ground training is a good driving whip - short enough that it's easy to maneuver and a lot whippier and with better reach than a dressage whip. Even my super lazy gelding leaps into a canter off a quick lash across his hindquarters.

He kicked me once - I was doing up the belly straps on his rug and he was in a pig of a mood so he cowkicked me very hard on the thigh (lucky to miss my face!). I kicked him in the ribs with the flat of my foot as hard as I could, bellowed blue murder at him til he scuttled into his corner and I went limping off to get some ice. Was left with a massive bruise and a corked thigh, couldn't walk properly for a week, but he never kicked again!


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## flytobecat (Mar 28, 2010)

Sorry, I meant to say lunging whip instead of dressage whip, but I actually like the driving whips better also.


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## Peppy Barrel Racing (Aug 16, 2011)

So i have a sort silly story that I find it kind of funny now but i was pretty mad at him at the time. Years ago when my yearling Jet's father Mojo was living with me he kicked me on the rear not once but twice. He was maybe 6 months old at the time friend wanted to wean him but didn't have a separate place to keep him. Anyways I went out to feed him and as soon as I placed his feed bowl down I guess he saw me bent over with my rear in the air and thought target! Hit me square on the butt then runs off. So I get after him a bit but it was kinda already to late to correct him so I took his dinner away for a bit. So the next day the little brat does it to me again I'm bent over and whacked in the rear again! And it didn't hurt or bruise me really it was kinda comical how I was kicked. But the second time I was prepared with the lunge whip and I popped him good and he never did it again. And then within the same week I went to feed Mojo's mother and she kicked me square on the wrist. Oh did she regret that decision. I was like seriously what is with the family of horses and me. But it's kind of a running joke that my friends horses like to kick me as they have never kicked anyone else
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Peppy Barrel Racing (Aug 16, 2011)

So i have a sort silly story that I find it kind of funny now but i was pretty mad at him at the time. Years ago when my yearling Jet's father Mojo was living with me he kicked me on the rear not once but twice. He was maybe 6 months old at the time friend wanted to wean him but didn't have a separate place to keep him. Anyways I went out to feed him and as soon as I placed his feed bowl down I guess he saw me bent over with my rear in the air and thought target! Hit me square on the butt then runs off. So I get after him a bit but it was kinda already too late to correct him so I took his dinner away for a bit. So the next day the little brat does it to me again I'm bent over and whacked in the rear again! And it didn't hurt or bruise me really it was kinda comical how I was kicked. But the second time I was prepared with the lunge whip and I popped him good and he never did it again. And then within the same week I went to feed Mojo's mother and she kicked me square on the wrist. Oh did she regret that decision. I was like seriously what is with the family of horses and me. But it's kind of a running joke that my friends horses like to kick me as they have never kicked anyone else and that Jet is just biding his time waiting for the right moment lol.
But the worst I've ever been kicked was by Pepper. It was feeding time (notice the bad feeding time trend) and Joy was crowding me and I was trying to hold onto her bowl and get her away from me with the lunge whip. Well Pepper thought Joy was going for his food and he kicked out to get her away but kicked me instead right square on my hip. Now I don't think he saw me and I don't think he intentionally wanted to kick me but he shouldn't of been kicking out in the first place. And I had thought I had made him quit doing that but I was wrong. So I'm bleeding but I was so mad I didn't feel the pain and I kicked him back then I got after him with that lunge whip. Then he wasn't allowed near the other horses while they are eating so he had to watch them eat an he got no grain that night. After that though I walked with a limp for a while and that night I couldn't walk at all.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Kayty (Sep 8, 2009)

You are VERY lucky that you were at close quarters. If you're close, you'll generally just bruise and they haven't got so much power behind the kick. It's why you should either walk VERY close around the horse's back end, or get meters out of reach. You do not want to get hit with the end of a kick. My coach got kicked in the same place as you, but with the tail end of a kick. It snapped her femur completely in two - as in, she had two knee caps. 

Glad to hear that you're ok, I'm sure you'll learn from this one  
With horses, nagging is just going to annoy them. So your constant 'tap tap taps' would have probably driven your horse batty, his kick would have been a 'for god's sake girl, you're driving me crazy'! Like a 2 year old child tugging on mum's sleeve constantly until she snaps. 
If you want your horse to move, ask nicely once, and if you don't get a reaction, you TELL that horse to move.


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

As my mother would say "Worse things happen at sea - you don't drown riding horses!"
You are going to have a good bruise to show for that one.

If you have to get within range of a horses back feet to use a whip when lungeing then you are not using a lunge whip. 
Please get one!

You did the right thing in getting her to move on afterwards.


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> I have been kicked twice, badly. I don't play with a kicker. The minute a horse turns their butt in my face, and acts the least bit nasty, I nail 'em with the whip or carrot stick or whatever else is handy. For the ones who actually landed the kick, I went after them so hard that they never ever even thought of kicking me again. There are 2 things that will get a horse euthanized or sent to auction around here and that's kicking at humans and biting a human. I absolutely convince the horse I'm going to kill him for doing it, and honestly, if I'd had my gun with me the 2 times I got kicked, I probably would have. That's just how unacceptable I find kicking and biting.
> 
> That is the extreme agression act from a horse and I won't tolerate it. I will flail on them with whatever I have in my hands. I hope you never let her get her butt pointed in your direction again.


It was off because she has never even offered to kick EVER. She's always been like a resentful teenager, but never turned her butt to me until that day.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

Thanks everyone for the advice and suggestions! I have both a lunge wip and a dressage whip, but the dressage whip just doesn't seem to phase her. Maybe I'm using it wrong, but she just doesn't respond well to it. But, then again she doesn't respond well to much. She did move her butt after I ran her around for about 30 minutes so maybe that changed her mind. 

She really is a good horse and I realize the mistake I made...after I made it. 

Of course, my mother and my boyfriend want the horse GONE and have told me to sell her ASAP. I'm 21, so obviously the decision is mine but... It sort of gets to me when no one really supports me. 

Everyone here has definitely made me feel better and I am just glad that it wasn't worse! 

I probably won't do direction changes with a halter and short lead rope again. I do have a round pen so I figured I should at least use it! 

I am BOUND AND DETERMINED to ride this weekend though, hurt leg or not. My bestie is coming in from college and we have a trail ride planned at the lake come hell, high water or bruised bones! 

I should be icing it...... But I'm up in a deer stand waiting for a big ole buck. 

I can't blame Reno for being stubborn... She is just like her mom.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MySerenity (Jul 18, 2011)

I got kicked by my old horse, Squirt, about (wow) 3 years ago now. He was being a jerk to my old mare and I smacked him on the butt and he kicked me. Holy man, did that hurt. I didn't even cry because it was such a shock and hurt too bad. I hobbled into the house just stunned. 

Needless to say I had an amazing bruise but the best part is that I still have a dent in my thigh from it which is fun to use to gross out weak people.


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## Elana (Jan 28, 2011)

I hope you went to the doctor with this. Blood clots can form and they can kill you. 

I have been kicked by horses 3 times. The last time was in 1984. I was separating a gelding from a herd and the lead mare saw the gelding by himself (and not with her herd) and she came at him backwards kicking. One of those kicks landed on my knee and dropped me. Tore my medial meniscus and I had to have arthroscopic surgery to have if removed. I trained horses after that for many years. 

Fast forward to now. I just had that knee totally replaced on October 8th of this year and recovery is going well, but it is no picnic. 

Get thee hence to a doctor and feel better soon.. and be careful. All horses can kick. 

I agree with TinyLiny.. don't nag the horse. Ask once for what you want, and if you do not get it, demand the next time, don't 'ask.'


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## rbarlo32 (Aug 9, 2010)

The only time I have been kicked was by Prince when he was about 9 months all he was still an entire colt at this point as was being kept in 24/7 due to mud fever so was being a right brat rearing, stamping, bardging and sometimes kicking, but he only got me once on the back leg but luckly it wasn't a full on kick he just got my, still hurt like hell and left a huge black bruise for weeks but I now can read my ponies well enough to not get kicked.

I do have one evil gelding, he hates me, when he sees me he will try to kick me and is worse around food and if I am trying to catch him, doesn't matter how much I tell him off he does the same but when my brother tried to do anything as long as food isn't involved he is usually as good as gold, I want rid of him but as I hate working with him but he is my mums so can't get rid of him plus the only way I could sell him is if I lied and I am not going to as nobody would want a childrens pony that kicks.


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

Elana said:


> I hope you went to the doctor with this. Blood clots can form and they can kill you.
> 
> I have been kicked by horses 3 times. The last time was in 1984. I was separating a gelding from a herd and the lead mare saw the gelding by himself (and not with her herd) and she came at him backwards kicking. One of those kicks landed on my knee and dropped me. Tore my medial meniscus and I had to have arthroscopic surgery to have if removed. I trained horses after that for many years.
> 
> ...


I will definitely be more demanding with her from now on. I'm just so afraid I am being too harsh and I don't want to ruin her at all. It's hard for me to find that line, if you know what I mean?

I didn't go to the doctor, I figured nothing was broken. Hopefully I won't get blood clots! My aunt is a nurse and came an looked at it and said I should be alright.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Muppetgirl said:


> Lol! No, I got kicked right on the hand at the races while I was grooming a horse just before it got tacked up, I had to take it through the birdcage using mainly my left hand!! Then the stewards were yelling at me to walk on the near side!!! I switched to the near side when the jockey came out and got on, just as well he was swinging on!!!! With owners and trainers all floating around you dare not let loose on the horse, even if it was a mongrel!!! Smile and keep ******ing on!!!


 
AH Yeah, if it's not your horse it's different, though I'd probably get fired for killing the horse anyhow! I'm fortunate, I only work with my own.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

BB2 said:


> I will definitely be more demanding with her from now on. I'm just so afraid I am being too harsh and I don't want to ruin her at all. It's hard for me to find that line, if you know what I mean?...


One of the first sessions I had with my mare in a round pen, the trainer teaching me said, "Does she ask another horse to move away from food, or demand it? Does she worry about the other horse's feelings?"

From the description, it sounds like you are letting 'small things' get by until they become big things. Horses start subtle and work up.

From your OP:

"Reno usually flicks her tail and acts annoyed when working but she has never really done anything like this. 

So anyway I asked her to trot and she definitely didn't want to. I had to tap her with the stick several times to get her going."

Tail flicks or acting annoyed is unacceptable. I wouldn't ever use a stick, unless it was about 10 feet long and 4 inches thick, made of wood. Mind you, I'm not a trainer or instructor, just a guy who has worked with a whopping 3 horses for a few weeks each in a round pen. I use a whip. If my mare wasn't happy about trotting, I'd whip as hard as needed - including *on* her butt - to make her RUN. She can trot because I asked, or run because anything less than a run means I'm going to be on her like stink on poop.

And I'll decide if she gets to come in, and she'd better be acting submissive when she does. If she just wants to come in on her own terms, she can get her butt back out and start moving. When we started, if she got worked up, she would run 15 laps without me moving. When she acted defiant, I sometimes had her running for 10 minutes non-stop, until she was soaked with sweat. 

On one occasion, she acted like there was no way in hell she was going to do what I wanted. We were in a larger area, about 80 feet in diameter. I whipped and she ran. And ran. She ran for 30 minutes, because she wasn't willing to quit except on her terms, and that wasn't good enough. I'd offer, and she would refuse to come in on MY terms. She fell down once. At the end she was so covered with sweat that even her face was soaked. Lather all over. But that was what it took to get her to stop arguing. 

It was also the last time I round penned her, because after that she stopped ignoring and started listening. I wasn't pushing her. She was pushing me by refusing to listen. She is our lead mare, and she would NEVER tolerate disrespect from another horse. 

A horse who acts annoyed isn't a horse who is submitting. Pinned ears, tails swishing, that 'you aren't the boss of me' attitude - that is defiance. If tolerated, you are telling the horse it is ok to jump in your chili. With both feet, if needed.

My sample size is only 3 horses, and none of them were aggressive by nature. If I met a truly aggressive horse, I'd shoot it. Life is too short to deal with an animal who wants to make yours shorter. But that isn't what I hear you describing. It sounds like your horse doesn't want to give in, and you aren't willing to force the issue. If you don't have someone teaching you, I'd suggest hiring someone to give you a few lessons on how to round pen a horse. Done wrong, it makes the horse worse. Much worse. And like sausage making, it isn't always nice to look at. Depends on the horse.

All IMHO. I'm not a trainer or teacher or instructor or competitor or shower or anything else, so take it FWIW.


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## Corporal (Jul 29, 2010)

bsms, I couldn't have put it better, myself--WELL WRITTEN!!
BB2, your mare is aggressive. She will hurt you again if you cannot get her to respect YOU as the lead broodmare. I don't put up with little disobediences, and therefore my horses don't do the big disobediences. *It ALL starts with disciplining every little thing with your horse.* THIS mare should not be allowed to take one wrong step around you, or you will be creating a little monster. I bought one such mare several years ago, and she was only 14'hh even, but had a BAAAADDDDD attitude, so I sold her.


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## ThoroughbredJumper (Oct 30, 2012)

OUCH! i know how you feel, my twins horse Bugsy did this to me in the exact same circumstance! how ironic, i have a deep bruise from it, and that was like 2 months ago. haha you go girl! tough as nails! I was kicked in the head when i was 9, lost half the sight in my right eye, its totally black for that part of my vision, half my face was hanging off, including my eye. Katie (my twin) who saw it happen said i looked like something from a horror movie, she said you could see all the way to my skull and that my skin was just hanging there. I cried for about 5 min, not knowing what happened. Thanks to medical care and alot of prayers, i lived  

All this to say, people who get kicked are cool  hahaha sorry that happened though, good luck on recovery!


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

When you do your round pen work, you will ask her to go forward with honesty and vigor. One thing I wanted to mention , and you might already know this, is to not chase her once she is broken loose and moving.

So, you use your lunge whip to get her to really move forward. If she pins her ears and kicks, you put more umph into it. wave it rapidly back and forth so it makes a vibrating sound, and take a step toward her and conjur up the same energy you had when you were mad at her for kicking you. I don't mean do this right off the bat, but do it a few seconds after asking nicely, (I am assuming that she will not respond to being asked nicely).

When she leaps forward , even if she kicks out a bit or pins her ears, as long as she goes forward with honesty, let her go. Don't follow her, just let her run forward as long as THAT "ask" will carry her. There is freedom in foreward. Meaning, if she goes forward, you no longer push her.

When she comes down again, you ask for forward movement, first nicely then wiht umph. again, if she goes forward, you can turn and follow her, pivoting ion a small cirlce of your own, but don't apply any more pressure. At this point, you don't care that she carries the forward a long distance, only that she moves off promptly and with honest vigor from your "ask". 

As you work, try to get that big response from her using less push from yourself. That's how you make her mores responsive.

Dont' be afraid to get as big as you did when you were mad., Hopefully, you'd only have to do it once.


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## StarfireSparrow (Jan 19, 2009)

When I started working with horses I had the same fear that a lot of people do: I don't want to ruin the relationship and the trust by having to be mean. The thing that I finally worked out between reading horse behavior and natural horsemanship books as well as just watching the broodmare band interact is that they are gonna make you earn their respect 4 out of 5 times. More over, the way respect is earned within the herd is by not taking any crap and being very clear about what is wanted. 

The best example of this that I ever saw was an old mare named Sundee. She was the top of the pecking order, hands down. When a new horse was introduced to her herd, she would make a point of making sure they knew she was boss. It would start with pinned ears, tail swishing and make a face at them, maybe toss her head their way. If that did not get them to move RIGHT NOW, the next thing she did was squeal, lunge at them and then swing her butt around to kick. They had all of a second to get out of her way the first time before she escalated. It rarely took more than 2 days to have the herd sorted out and back to normal. And that was the point when I realized the amazing thing. The new horse, who two days before had been threatened with death for not moving out of Sundee's way fast enough, behaved like the sun shined out of Sundee's butt! 

What I took from all this is simple. As long as you are not being excessive or doing it only out of anger, horses respect solid discipline. They want a leader that speaks their language. Be decisive and swift and never take no for an answer.


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

Day 2 











Thanks everyone for the kind words and advice. I'm going to start being more assertive with her...as soon as I don't have to use crutches. 

The example about Sundee really is true... And I have seen the exact same thing happen. It's just so hard to take emotion out of things!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cacowgirl (Feb 19, 2011)

Sure looks sore! Hope you are icing it & doing the rest/elevate. Take care!


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

Cacowgirl said:


> Sure looks sore! Hope you are icing it & doing the rest/elevate. Take care!


I've iced it all of 5 minutes. 

Rest? What does that even mean? 

Two jobs, 4 horses, and 18 hours of college classes has sadly made that impossible. 

Not to mention, it's the middle of the rut here
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

MysterySparrow said:


> When I started working with horses I had the same fear that a lot of people do: I don't want to ruin the relationship and the trust by having to be mean. The thing that I finally worked out between reading horse behavior and natural horsemanship books as well as just watching the broodmare band interact is that they are gonna make you earn their respect 4 out of 5 times. More over, the way respect is earned within the herd is by not taking any crap and being very clear about what is wanted.
> 
> The best example of this that I ever saw was an old mare named Sundee. She was the top of the pecking order, hands down. When a new horse was introduced to her herd, she would make a point of making sure they knew she was boss. It would start with pinned ears, tail swishing and make a face at them, maybe toss her head their way. If that did not get them to move RIGHT NOW, the next thing she did was squeal, lunge at them and then swing her butt around to kick. They had all of a second to get out of her way the first time before she escalated. It rarely took more than 2 days to have the herd sorted out and back to normal. And that was the point when I realized the amazing thing. The new horse, who two days before had been threatened with death for not moving out of Sundee's way fast enough, behaved like the sun shined out of Sundee's butt!
> 
> What I took from all this is simple. As long as you are not being excessive or doing it only out of anger, horses respect solid discipline. They want a leader that speaks their language. Be decisive and swift and never take no for an answer.


Yes. I often put it this way:

*"Be merciless in order to be merciful"*


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## showjumper09 (Nov 1, 2012)

Ouch, I know how that feels! Took a good kick in the thigh from a boarder's WB gelding a few months ago that left a nice horse shoe bruise. Hope you heal soon!

Also, don't beat yourself up about your error - we all (ALL) have them!


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## Elizabeth Bowers (Jan 26, 2012)

Oh yea thats going to be sore. Been there!!! 
I had moved my geldings to my new farm (its been 4 years now), and i wanted to go out and see how they were. Well they were standing nose to tail and i walked up to Shadow and pet him, and i went to walk around Leroy, and he was in just a mood. He kept ignoring me, so i made him move away, and well he landed one massive hoof in the middle of both my thighs (was standing with my legs together facing his rump) I had a huge black and blue hoof print for a month. After he kicked me i chased him across the field, and he never tried it again! 
It's definitely a trip working with horses!! But your doing good, and keep at it. Sending good healing vibes!!!!


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## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

It's looking more and more like a smiley face! But I feel your pain!!!!


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

It's terrible! I had to drive an hour to pick up a new horse tonight and could barely get out of the car since it had been sitting still so long. 

She also got my in the love handle but I didn't notice until I banged it this morning and almost started crying because of the huge bruise there too. Idk how that even happened.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

I think I'd be teaching that horse to speak French.


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## Captain Evil (Apr 18, 2012)

Woh, lovely bruise! That's got some color to it! You can even see an outline of the frog. That is impressive. If you can't ice your leg, try a big bowl of ice cream, and think the cold down to your leg. That was quite a kick, but you handled it really well; better than most would have, including me. Take care, and I hope you are feeling better soon.


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## Reno Bay (Jul 8, 2012)

Ouchie. I'm so glad my Reno wouldn't dare act up with me...take care of that leg and don't let her give you crap.


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## StarfireSparrow (Jan 19, 2009)

I'm sorry, but I do have to giggle at the fact that seeing your bruises makes me wish I had saved some picks of mine. I had a lovely imprint from the pony hoof that showed the shape as well as yours does and included some amazing color combinations.


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## Thunderspark (Oct 17, 2012)

Horses are like kids, they test you in very sutle ways and then it gets worse and worse!
I have a 3yr. gelding and a 4yr. gelding, they are still young but they think they should do things that the older horses (3 others) don't. When I take the hay out in a wagon, the older horses stand back and wait for me to put it on the ground, the two younger ones used to but in the past week I noticed they would run beside it and grab a mouthful and then the next time grab some out while I am putting it on the ground, I have to take the buggy crop out with me again to remind them of the rules! The other night I wasn't stopped yet but they were jogging behind grabbing at the hay, so they both got whaps on their noses! Needless it shocked them LOL they took off bucking/kicking at each other! Don't know if they thought the other one did it to the other or what. Now I just have to have it with me and they wait back.....with the others and wait for it to hit the ground before they touch it. I may have to carry the buggy whip with me for awhile yet but eventually I can put hay out without the whip but sooner or later someone tests me and it has to come out again. You have to be consistant, not let them do something one day and then the next day they can.......if it's no.....then it's always no.
Good luck!


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

Day 3. Ouch. Getting better though. I actually rode for about 4 hours today and it didn't hurt toooooo bad. 

I did go to the doctor and have a cracked rib (from where her top foot got me) and some muscle separation. Joy. 









_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

OOOOF! That's a beauty!


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## flytobecat (Mar 28, 2010)

Ok-I'm giving you the mommie lecture.
Take it easy. You've only got one body and it needs time to heal. I didn't listen to my doctor when he told me to rest and ended up tearing a ligament. 
Rest.


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

flytobecat said:


> Ok-I'm giving you the mommie lecture.
> Take it easy. You've only got one body and it needs time to heal. I didn't listen to my doctor when he told me to rest and ended up tearing a ligament.
> Rest.


Hehe you do sound like my mom, but my mom also is telling me to sell the horse NOW... We've had more than a few arguments over it at this point. 

I'm hoping to have some time off tomorrow after church to rest up. I need it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## flytobecat (Mar 28, 2010)

Well, I didn't say to sell the horse. :wink:


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

flytobecat said:


> Well, I didn't say to sell the horse. :wink:



That's a relief! That's all I've heard the past 3 days. Sell her, shoot her, give her away, she is too dangerous, can't learn...blah blah blah. 

I come from a family of people who are NOT horse people (besides my daddy) and they just don't get the obsession sometimes.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

The only reason I haven't advocated selling her is because you were harrassing her on a lead line. If she'd either been free lunging or on a long line, I'd have said sell her because that would mean she had deliberately been aggressive toward you. Since you were on a short lead line, I say give her the benefit of the doubt one time. Start teaching her French, just in case LOL, but ..... give her one more chance.


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## Thunderspark (Oct 17, 2012)

You will probably have that bruise for awhile yet! Glad you went and got checked out by the doc though!
Today was beautiful here, except we had a few inches of snow so it's extremely slippery seeing it's been pretty nice today, so I decided I best not ride with it this slippery.....glad you got in a good ride though!


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## countrylove (Oct 18, 2012)

My cousin went through the same thing as far as people telling her to sell her horse because he was dangerous... 

She was thrown and had to have stitches in her hand, nothing to major though, just a green horse who learned bucking gets him what he wants. Her mom and her husband wanted the horse dead or gone. She sold him to her trainer and he is doing amazing. 

She now has a new horse "the perfect horse", which threw her (rare occasion that he bucks), with no injuries but the same thing from her mom and husband about getting rid of him. 

She stuck this one out and again amazing. 

BTW she has a thing for the more stubborn horses LoL but she is good at working with stubborn horses too. But she gets frustrated when no one supports her in working out the kinks.

She is good at what she does and I support her but it is scary seeing someone you love hurt as well.

Good luck


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## dixieray53 (Jul 25, 2012)

My opinion is not to sell her...my opinion is to get assistance from a trainer or someone with some training to assist you in learning position so that you can be safe and helping you teach your horse more respect. I know your 21 and very expercienced but a trainer can help you and may also be able to point out some things as you are doing them that will keep you out of hooves way in the future. If your mom knows you are getting help with this horse she may change her opinion about selling her as she will feel you are better prepared to handle her.

Tracy


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

dixieray53 said:


> My opinion is not to sell her...my opinion is to get assistance from a trainer or someone with some training to assist you in learning position so that you can be safe and helping you teach your horse more respect. I know your 21 and very expercienced but a trainer can help you and may also be able to point out some things as you are doing them that will keep you out of hooves way in the future. If your mom knows you are getting help with this horse she may change her opinion about selling her as she will feel you are better prepared to handle her.
> 
> Tracy


If my mom would pay for it, that would be great! Sadly, I'm a poor college girl. 

I have all of the horses care paid up, and an emergency fund.. But I hate to blow that on a trainer. The closest trainer is $600 per month or $200 per week and that is just crazy. Plus, he isn't a great trainer. 

The best trainer is an hour away and would charge $50 to come here and then $45 an hour. So that's 200 bucks for just 4 hours. 

There is just no way.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

BB2 said:


> If my mom would pay for it, that would be great! Sadly, I'm a poor college girl.
> 
> I have all of the horses care paid up, and an emergency fund.. But I hate to blow that on a trainer. The closest trainer is $600 per month or $200 per week and that is just crazy. Plus, he isn't a great trainer.
> 
> ...


I think if you'll just put her in a round pen and free lunge or use a proper lunge line, you'll be fine. The problem came with proximity caused by a short lead line.


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## Mochachino (Aug 14, 2012)

I always use a lunge whip lunging. Although I've never laid into either of my horses with it, they respect it when being pushed out. I ask for changes first with my body, then verbal, then crack of whip if needed. Use a long lunge line and make sure she is always far enough away from you. I hope you heal and feel better soon. I never make excuses for the horse, and it doesn't excuse the behavior, but if she doesn't like trotting away on a smaller circle could she be sore somewhere?


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

I didn't read through the post but why not use a lunge whip so you are not with in kicking range?? Also it makes me wonder what is causing her to switch her tail and act annoyed? Pain possibly? Also mares will do that when her teets need cleaned. I make a point to clean them every time we work and that is important.One time I forgot to clean them and my mare didn't want to go forward and was swishing her tail. I cleaned her and then she was fine.


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> I think if you'll just put her in a round pen and free lunge or use a proper lunge line, you'll be fine. The problem came with proximity caused by a short lead line.


I'm sure that was it. This wasn't the first time she has been in the round pen. Free lunging she has done fine, and lunging on a lead rope at a walk was fine. 

Honestly, I asked too much from her too fast and wasn't thinking at all. Add in a slightly disrespectful horse, and that's just what happens.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

BB2 said:


> Add in a slightly disrespectful horse, and that's just what happens.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Have a CTJ (come to Jesus) meeting with her and cure this first before you worry about any other issues. For me, the fact that she even considered kicking makes her disrespect priority number 1, she can do so much worse if it isn't put in check.


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> Have a CTJ (come to Jesus) meeting with her and cure this first before you worry about any other issues. For me, the fact that she even considered kicking makes her disrespect priority number 1, she can do so much worse if it isn't put in check.


How would I do that?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## StarfireSparrow (Jan 19, 2009)

Start with your normal work routine for her, but when she flicks her tail like she in annoyed, instead of just ignoring it, make her think you are going to kill her for every little bit of "I don't want to" she expresses. Whether that means you asked for trot and she didn't want to so you make her little butt run till she thinks she is gonna drop, or you ask her to turn and you have to get into her face like you are the second coming and you are going to eat her soul if she does not move out of your way RIGHT NOW. It should not take more than one or two sessions at "full volume" followed by just not taking crap off of her for her to get the point.


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## flytobecat (Mar 28, 2010)

Also, make her turn into you when you do direction changes. Let her know if she faces her butt to you she's in trouble.


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## Palomine (Oct 30, 2010)

Why are you using a stick, instead of a lash whip/lunge whip?

Anytime you put yourself inside a safe distance, you are chancing this.

Glad you didn't end up with hoof to face instead.


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

Palomine said:


> Why are you using a stick, instead of a lash whip/lunge whip?
> 
> Anytime you put yourself inside a safe distance, you are chancing this.
> 
> Glad you didn't end up with hoof to face instead.


It's a handy stick with the string attached so I can still get her from a safe distance. 

And, she wasn't getting direction changes without the halter very well so I started with a halter and then worked my way to direction changes without a halter.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

If she gives you any negativity at all, you get after her with that handy stick and knock the spots (or her imaginary spots) off of her. When I say CTJ, I mean Come to the Water, See God, Get Born Again, Full Immersion Baptized and come up speakin in tongues and shouting Hallelujah! 

Any infraction that indicates she is even 'mildy displeased' with the course you have set gets immediate correction and if she 'runs into' that handy stick a few times, she'll get over herself real quick.


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## BB2 (Oct 22, 2012)

Dreamcatcher Arabians said:


> If she gives you any negativity at all, you get after her with that handy stick and knock the spots (or her imaginary spots) off of her. When I say CTJ, I mean Come to the Water, See God, Get Born Again, Full Immersion Baptized and come up speakin in tongues and shouting Hallelujah!
> 
> Any infraction that indicates she is even 'mildy displeased' with the course you have set gets immediate correction and if she 'runs into' that handy stick a few times, she'll get over herself real quick.


She won't be afraid of me and hate me?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

BB2 said:


> She won't be afraid of me and hate me?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


No, not if you're fair. In a herd, if a horse gives the boss mare or stallion lip, they get the bejesus kicked or bitten out of them. The punishment is swift, fits the infraction and is as harsh as it needs to be to make sure the horse won't challenge again. As long as you get after her immediately, and only give as much as it takes to make her lick and chew, and then QUIT and no grudges. You punish, she gives you the horsey, "I'm sorry" and you immediately let up and let it go. You don't beat her in the face or my very biggest pet peeve, belly kick her, just swift justice. You make her think you will eat her and the minute she backs down, you quit immediately. 

For instance, you ask her to reverse, she spins so that her butt is facing you, you yank the rope to pull her face to you and crack her in the butt til she 'hides her hiney'. The minute she starts to pull her hiney out of your face, you quit. 

I work my horses on the ground and have them face me, I hold the rope close so they can't turn away from me, and I look at the hip I want them to move over and I start making small circles with my whip, not touching them. I start away from the hip but move the whip closer and closer to the hip and I tell them, "Hide your hiney" and I keep adding pressure to the hip by staring at it and moving the whip closer and closer. If they don't move, they get tapped and I repeat, "Hide your hiney" and I tap harder. I keep that up, increasing the energy I'm putting into moving the whip and they get tapped harder and harder until they move that hip, one tiny step and I quit and rub their hip with my hand and say, "gooood boy". I give them a minute to think about it and I ask again, and usually they will move off quicker. I do everything in 3's or 5's so that it sticks and then once they do it quickly enough that I'm not WHACKING on that hip, I either quit (if it's a youngster) or I move to the other side and work on that. 

I do that a couple of times a day until I can just look at the hip or point at it and say, "Hide your hiney" and they make that butt disappear. That way, no matter where they are, I can make them move their feet and they know it. A superior horse makes them move their feet (run away) when he's dominating them and putting them in their place. If you can make them move their feet with a look, they've acknowleged that you are in charge. 

Never work with this horse without a long whip in your hand. I don't care if it's a lunge whip, a carrot stick or a long thick branch, but make sure you have it because timing is everything with horses.


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## Army wife (Apr 29, 2012)

How short is your stick? Prior to being kicked, your much nicer than me. I would've smacked her with a rope. Or even a lunge whip. You might want to get something longer to work her. You really should try to stay out of her line of fire. Hope you feel better soon!!


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## Bluebird (Jul 20, 2011)

BB2 said:


> Well, I knew this would happen eventually. I got kicked...hard, at close range right in the thigh. It was a direct hit, and ohhhhh it hurts. I haven't gone to the doctor yet, I'm pretty sure nothing is broken besides my pride.
> 
> Here are a few pictures for your enjoyment.
> 
> ...


Ouch! Sounds like you have some deep muscle damage. Welcome to the world of horse ownership. I don't think you have a bad horse but maybe the constant tapping with the stick just pushed her too far. It really is not about dominating the horse all the time but establishing mutual respect. You tell her off when she doesn't do right by you, she tells you off when you don't do right by her. I'm really not trying to patronise. I have an 18 month old Clydesdale. My other boy is a 5 year old and I can do anything with him within reason and I feel very safe (but respectful) around him. Well, I got the young one and decided to get him to pick his feet up. The method I had been recommended was to lightly tap, tap, tap, on the bone just above his hoof. 'Foolproof' I was told by an 'experienced' horse person who owned a QH but never owned a heavy. So I thought I'd give it a try. Well Saxon got irritated with the tapping and he did pick his front hoof up. 'Result!' I thought. I got cocky. Tried it with the other front hoof and I think by this time he had had enough of the irritation. He caught me in the middle of the head with his back hoof kicking forward. Knocked me out cold and it was all my own stupid fault. I should have trusted my instincts and listened to what he was telling me..."I've had enough...now back off and do something else". Lesson learned. Sometimes wiggling a schooling whip behind the horse can help (no contact with the horse) but if the hrose refuses to do something a couple of times, change tack. The horse could be tired or bored. Try something else or give the horse a rest. Its not a failure on your part or that your horse is bad. Just a recognition that you can take a horse to water but you can't make it drink. Keep enjoying your horse. It isn't about you winning all the time. Hope your wounds heal soon.


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