# Over the Knee horse



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

I was looking at this horse and I noticed that he looks over the knee. Is this a bad over the knee or just slight? Do you guys think he would be able to jump and stay sound? I dont own him, but I was looking at his listing online and really liked him. He is on the track right now but his owner says he is completely sound, just too slow.


----------



## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

He's not so much over at the knee as he is tied in behind the knee. I honestly don't see him jumping on a consistent basis and staying sound for any length of time.


----------



## MangoRoX87 (Oct 19, 2009)

I would never even consider jumping that poor horse...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

If he is sound enough for the track why wouldnt he be able to jump small jumps? Im not trying to be rude I am just thinking that theyre both high impact. If I got him, he wouldnt be jumping much more than 18" for trails. I'm just trying to learn more about this


----------



## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Running is not nearly as high impact as jumping is. When running, the weight of the horse is more or less distributed evenly over all four legs. When jumping, at one point or another, the hind legs and then the forelegs bear the entire weight of the horse and rider. Add to this that, in addition to bearing the entire weight of the horse and rider, the forelegs bear the concussive force of that weight crashing down and forward onto them, this can lead to a horse with less than optimal conformation breaking down much more quickly.

Out on the trails, he'd be fine occasionally jumping a 12-18" log or what-have-you. You said nothing about trails in your original post, so we automatically assumed that when you said "jumping," you meant competitive jumping, like hunters or show jumpers.


----------



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

Whitehouse Ridge

This is his link. if you watch the video, you cant even see the the issue with his legs


----------



## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Not sure what it is, but something about the way his front legs move in that video bothers me.


----------



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

DraftyAiresMum said:


> Running is not nearly as high impact as jumping is. When running, the weight of the horse is more or less distributed evenly over all four legs. When jumping, at one point or another, the hind legs and then the forelegs bear the entire weight of the horse and rider. Add to this that, in addition to bearing the entire weight of the horse and rider, the forelegs bear the concussive force of that weight crashing down and forward onto them, this can lead to a horse with less than optimal conformation breaking down much more quickly.
> 
> Out on the trails, he'd be fine occasionally jumping a 12-18" log or what-have-you. You said nothing about trails in your original post, so we automatically assumed that when you said "jumping," you meant competitive jumping, like hunters or show jumpers.


Thanks for the info, but do you think occasional 2nd field foxhunting would be too hard on his knees? I go out about 3 times a season and since its second field, there would be a very limited amount of jumps. usually under 5.


----------



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

DraftyAiresMum said:


> Not sure what it is, but something about the way his front legs move in that video bothers me.


I thought it was a little odd, but I figured he was "up" or thought he was being walked to the paddock or getting ready to be breezed. If you could hear the audio, you can hear a lady saying she brought another horse out.


----------



## SorrelHorse (Apr 9, 2009)

I think you can find better. I mean, honestly, why risk an unsound horse when there are plenty of others out there?


----------



## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

He might be okay. He definitely wouldn't stand up to any more than that, though.

I think what I'm seeing is him paddling with his front right. Am I crazy?

I agree with Sorrel, though. You can find much better out there. He's cute, but something about him strikes me as...delicate. He also seems very hot. I don't think he'd be a good horse for foxhunting.


----------



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

SorrelHorse said:


> I think you can find better. I mean, honestly, why risk an unsound horse when there are plenty of others out there?


I fell in love with his face and what you could see of his personality in the video. Its also difficult to find thoroughbred's that tall that are sound (from my experience at least.)


----------



## SorrelHorse (Apr 9, 2009)

Cute horses can break down too. So can horses with personality. Are you dead set on a thoroughbred? I really, really don't think that horse will stay sound for long.


----------



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

DraftyAiresMum said:


> He might be okay. He definitely wouldn't stand up to any more than that, though.
> 
> I think what I'm seeing is him paddling with his front right. Am I crazy?
> 
> I agree with Sorrel, though. You can find much better out there. He's cute, but something about him strikes me as...delicate. He also seems very hot. I don't think he'd be a good horse for foxhunting.


I dont really see it, but you may have a better eye than me lol. but i did notice that the pavement is uneven and really cracked


----------



## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

He's not paddling, but there's something about that right front that is really bothering me. Both legs, really, but more so that right front. It's like he's tip-toeing. 

I would seriously pass. I've watched that video four or five times now and I am just not liking really anything I see.


----------



## SorrelHorse (Apr 9, 2009)

Also, I don't like his attitude. I am apalled he was not corrected for kicking in that video. I'm just now watching it and am shocked. I don't care what the reason is, the horse I have my hands on are NEVER allowed to kick out like that.


----------



## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

SorrelHorse said:


> Also, I don't like his attitude. I am apalled he was not corrected for kicking in that video. I'm just now watching it and am shocked. I don't care what the reason is, the horse I have my hands on are NEVER allowed to kick out like that.


And if he did kick out like that, you can be sure as shootin' that he'd be in for a SERIOUS come-to-Jesus-meeting.


----------



## SorrelHorse (Apr 9, 2009)

I've had come to jesus talks with colts for less.


----------



## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Cute face, but goes down hill after that, I did like this guy Sea Doctor until I saw his video, he doesn't go anywhere with his action


----------



## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Golden Horse said:


> Cute face, but goes down hill after that, I did like this guy Sea Doctor until I saw his video, he doesn't go anywhere with his action


I like him too, but you're right...he moves very...flat. His confo is halfway decent, though (a far cry better than the horse the OP is looking at).

OP, is there a reason you want such a tall horse?


----------



## Chevaux (Jun 27, 2012)

In the video, he was feeling his oats there I think; typical reaction of the confined horse getting some air (don't need to bother with a discussion on his kicking out as that's been covered). 

What I saw in his movement was restricted upward and forward motion in his front legs which, in my humble opinion (and I hope the jumping folks will weigh in here), means he's going to work that much harder getting and keeping those legs in decent position for clearing a jump.

Overall, I liked the look of him (of course I am partial to a thoroughbred) apart from his front legs. I don't think he could handle a second career as a full time hunter/jumper though so it would be kinder on him to focus on flat and trail work. Thus, if you could content yourself with minimal to no jumping on him, then it might work out for the two of you.


----------



## Muppetgirl (Sep 16, 2012)

Hmmmm what I saw was not necessarily a horse over at the knee (I think in The pic he was just about to move forward, exaserbating the look of the knee),
However I do see a horse that's pretty fresh.....seen as he's finished racing he probably hasn't been worked for a while and is still receiving his daily ration of grain.....it can nly take one day without work for a racehorse to get like this....and this is mild to say the least:lol:

Im a big believer in this saying:

'it costs just as much to feed a bad horse as it does a good horse'

You either want to dump your money into a so-so animal or else you want to dump it into a horse who is worth your while.

Attitude is paramount with any horse, he could be as ugly as sin, but be the best horse you've ever sat on. He could be as pretty as heck, but an a$$ to boot!

It's a big investment, don't fall in love with the first or the second or even the third one you see....

Write a list of what you want, and write a list of what you are willing to compromise.....

At the top of the list of wants for me would be:
Good Attitude
Good Conformation

And pretty would jus be a bonus


----------



## SorrelHorse (Apr 9, 2009)

Best horse I ever rode is the nastiest, ugliest arab cross thing. Hates everyone. Makes nasty faces at you when you saddle and get on him.

But, when you do get on...It's amazing. That horse flat drug my two year old who is twice his size last year across the arena because he wouldn't walk through the mud puddle in the footing. 18 years old and won an endurance ride. Ran barrels for awhile (hated it, but did it willingly), jumped for me, did dressage, played with some XC even. Don't judge books by their covers. :lol:


----------



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

DraftyAiresMum said:


> I like him too, but you're right...he moves very...flat. His confo is halfway decent, though (a far cry better than the horse the OP is looking at).
> 
> OP, is there a reason you want such a tall horse?


Well Im very short so I dont need a tall horse (Im just a tiny bit too big for a pony actually) But me and my 6'3" father will be sharing and he really needs a tall horse because he looks like a giant on anything shorter than 6.2 hands lol.


----------



## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Honestly, I would get something with more substance than a TB if your father is going to be riding him. Like a warmblood cross or even a tall appendix. TBs tend to be light on bone.


----------



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

The owner still has him racing, actually in 2 days, and im suspecting thats why he was so up, just from being in the stall and being so fit. I am not pleased with the fact that they discipline him either, as you guys said also, we woulda had a come to jesus moment because of that.


----------



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

DraftyAiresMum said:


> Honestly, I would get something with more substance than a TB if your father is going to be riding him. Like a warmblood cross or even a tall appendix. TBs tend to be light on bone.


 yeah im trying to convince him that too...lol. we have an all thoroughbred farm and hes ridden and hunted just about all of them consistantly and we havent had a problem with them because of his height or weight or anything (hes not fat, but he is tall so he does weigh a little more than other men) but he has his mind set on a thoroughbred


----------



## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

TheSkipper said:


> yeah im trying to convince him that too...lol. we have an all thoroughbred farm and hes ridden and hunted just about all of them consistantly and we havent had a problem with them because of his height or weight or anything (hes not fat, but he is tall so he does weigh a little more than other men) but he has his mind set on a thoroughbred


The thoroughbreds he's used to may be heavier in bone than the boy you're looking at. I didn't mention it at first because we were focused on his knees, but he is rather light on bone. If you were the only one riding him, then fine, but with your heavier father riding him, I wouldn't expect him to hold up long. 

There are thoroughbreds out there with more substance than this guy. I've even worked with a few. One was a huge 17.1hh bright bay brute who you'd SWEAR was a big warmblood or even a draft cross, but he was a pure racing thoroughbred.


----------



## SorrelHorse (Apr 9, 2009)

I'll sum up what Aires was saying, LOL.

There is legitimately no way this horse is what you are looking for. If you'd like, we can help you look for something that is though.


----------



## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

SorrelHorse said:


> I'll sum up what Aires was saying, LOL.
> 
> There is legitimately no way this horse is what you are looking for. If you'd like, we can help you look for something that is though.


Thanks, Sorrel. I do tend to get overly verbose.


----------



## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

If he is tall but not heavy a TB may work, they come in fairly solid build as well, what is your budget?


----------



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

Yeah I get what you guys are saying. and thanks for all of your input, i appreciate it.  too bad I dont ride western and it woulda just prettymuch been me riding him. then it mighthave worked. I understand why his price was so much lower than the other horses on the site. Im going to hold off on getting another horse for now. My horse died about a month ago and Id feel like I was replacing him. But Im always looking, and this one just kinda caught my eye. You guys are right, were not the right match for eachother lol. but hopefully someone else will enjoy him over the knee'd and all haha


----------



## caljane (Feb 7, 2009)

TheSkipper said:


> If he is sound enough for the track why wouldnt he be able to jump small jumps?


Who says he is sound enough for the track? Race sport has not exactly the reputation to care much about the long-term lameness issues a horse can get from the track.
You, in contrary, sure want to ride your new horse for many, many years. I would not recommend looking any closer at this one because he really does not have good front legs (unless the picture is misleading). There are so many retired thoroughbreds around - keep looking!
Good luck!


----------



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

okay guys, so i was looking at some other postings on canter and... HOLY CRAP HOW IS THIS A THOROUGHBRED??? LOL.
Cupcake Lover- located on farm in Chesapeake City, Md


----------



## PaintLover17 (Jan 3, 2011)

TheSkipper said:


> okay guys, so i was looking at some other postings on canter and... HOLY CRAP HOW IS THIS A THOROUGHBRED??? LOL.
> Cupcake Lover- located on farm in Chesapeake City, Md


They say she was never bred due to a thyroid problem which I'm willing to bet is Cushings. You probably would want to pass on her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## TheSkipper (Jul 28, 2012)

Yeah thats what I figured lol. I was just shocked at how huge she was!


----------



## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

That's how that gelding I worked with was built. His name was Bizzaro. Difference was, he was all muscle, whereas that mare just looks fat.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## HagonNag (Jul 17, 2010)

My husband (6' 3-4" 245 lbs.) rides an OTTB in the mountains that we have had since he was 9. The difference is that our horse had PERFECT conformation and wonderful bone, had been raced very lightly and had always had wonderful care. We got him when he was 9. This year he will be 21 and he's still sound. He's 16+hh. Just under 16.1.

Tall, big people do not have to have tall horses. In fact, shorter horses with more bone in their leg and a stockier build may be better for them because the center of gravity that the horse has to balance isn't as far off the ground. Height is not all you should be looking at. 

The thoroughbred you were looking at has definite faults in his knees and leg structure. I think he was also young? It's bad enough that they begin racing so early, but if you really want them to be carrying weight, it would be good to let them mature. I watched the video and I definitely saw a constricted stride. He's at Canter because he won't make a race horse. With those legs, he's not going to be good at anything that requires any kind of athletic ability. I'd pass.


----------



## sarahejohns (Mar 22, 2013)

I actually bought Whitehouse about a year ago. Completely sound - super gentle - holding up to 18" jumps currently and his over at the knees has gone down considerably by correcting his heel toe ratio and letting him rest in a pasture over the last year. He has never acted like he did in his video and is actually a farm favorite with the smaller children and the barn owners. I took him as a project for a potential beginner but he is actually doing well enough we're working towards eventing. 

Just goes to show even the ugliest conformation can surprise you - and attitude at the track is far different after retirement.


----------



## CandyCanes (Jul 1, 2013)

sarahejohns said:


> I actually bought Whitehouse about a year ago. Completely sound - super gentle - holding up to 18" jumps currently and his over at the knees has gone down considerably by correcting his heel toe ratio and letting him rest in a pasture over the last year. He has never acted like he did in his video and is actually a farm favorite with the smaller children and the barn owners. I took him as a project for a potential beginner but he is actually doing well enough we're working towards eventing.
> 
> Just goes to show even the ugliest conformation can surprise you - and attitude at the track is far different after retirement.


Can we see some pictures of this horse now? I would like to see how different he looks


----------

