# Stubben dressage saddle



## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Looks like an Excalibur. I believe the Excaliburs are the only monoflap dressage saddles that Stubben makes.

As far as age, it's probably not more than 5-10 years old. You can always contact Stubben NA once you get it.


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

NA stands for North America? I'm in Australia 

If it's that new then I've scored myself a real bargain. Got it thinking it was probably older, considering the price [very rarely see leather saddles for less than about $700 that are less than 15 years old, especially Stubbens as they are considered, at least here, to be a good quality brand; I paid $500 including postage]... it doesn't look like it's seen a heap of use, I can't see any stirrup wear, although the girth straps look a bit stretched. I'm hoping it fits and allows me good contact with my horse... I struggle to get my leg on in his old saddle.

I am going to blow up the images that show the stamp on the skirt, and see if I can decipher what's written between the two rows that say 'stubben'. All hail the power of Photoshop.


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

Here we go. The other image [the one on its side] you can clearly see ...us RC, so based on this and the other, I think what I've got is a Romanus.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Cool! Glad you could figure out which one it is. 

If it's a Romanus it's older, because they're the 'ancestors' of today's Genesis line. They were made in Switzerland, so yours could be anywhere from 10-30 years old. It's in gorgeous shape, no matter how old!


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

Wonder if there's anywhere I might find the serial number? Being that it's a monoflap I can't exactly check the billet guard... just because if I can find the serial I might be able to find out exactly how old it is. I don't REALLY care, it's purely a matter of curiosty. Far as I'm concerned if the saddle is nice to ride in and safe it doesn't matter what it looks like or how old it is...

...but this one looks to be still in show condition which is AMAZING age considered. Not too many 10+ year old saddles in such awesome shape. I have to wonder how much use it's seen, lady I bought it off commented that it was lovely to ride in and she wouldn't be selling it if it fit her horses [horse it's on in the photo isn't hers]. It's only a 17 inch which makes it a touch on the small side for me. I normally ride in a 17.5. But for the price I just couldn't pass it up.

When do you think something stamped Romanus RC would have been made? Is there a particular decade in which monoflap dressage saddles were popular?

I have a thing for European-made saddles, especially Swiss-made, so if this fits my horse [praying it does, it should... he's not a hard horse to fit, and based on the photos it looks like it will] I will be a very happy person! I don't mind a harder seat, and if my young Thoroughbred bulks out as much as I hope she will, it should fit her too... I may just have a "lifetime" saddle here considering how Stubbens just won't die!


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Monoflap saddles are becoming all the rage again but they've been made for many years, so it's impossible to age your saddle just from that.

As a dressage saddle, maybe it was only used for showing and nothing else, so stayed in show-ready condition. Stubbens really are hard to kill, and you have to abuse them horribly before they start showing any real wear and tear.

If it's a blue button Stubben, it's one of the newer models made in the late 1980s or even more recently. My Siegfried has a plain silver button so I know it was manufactured in the 1960s, or early 1970s at the latest.


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

I see green buttons, what does that mean? haha


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

It's HEEEEREEE!!

Found what I think is a serial number, and another two digit number below that.

4589524 and then below that 31.

My curiosity on date of manufacture is purely curiosity, and wouldn't it be cool to be able to say, hey, my saddle's 25 years old and check out the condition it's in. I haven't actually got a clue how old it is and it doesn't matter, if it fits my horse and I like riding in it I'm happy.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

The first one is the serial number and the second is the tree size. A 31 cm is a medium/medium wide. My Siegfried has a 31 cm tree, and it fits my TB like a glove. 

Good luck! Hope it fits the horse and you as well.


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

I would be wanting Stubben Australia, right? Or else the manufacturer direct? All I want is a year of manufacture. But I've noticed in other threads that they don't keep records longer than a certain amount of time, so is it even worth bothering?

I was sold it as a medium tree, my gelding is a wide in the Bates/Wintec range but I'm told Stubbens tend to be wider as a rule. It's definitely too wide for my filly who is a medium in the Bates/Wintec range... can tell just looking at it and knowing how slender she is.

The makers marks under the skirts have blue on them, so would that mean the green on the tree point buttons is discoloration from age? Or is that just how it's meant to be?

It's beautiful... I gave it a good saddle soaping, and tomorrow I'll probably soap it again and then attack it with some good leather conditioner [if I can find the leather conditioner that is - the dogs like to try to get the tin open!]. It's really coming up nicely. All the residual dust is gone, the leather is so smooth, and it feels like it's really durable. After synthetic saddles for the last four years, it's a bit of an adjustment to go to a leather saddle at all, and I can't wait to ride in it... but first fatass has to stop limping. I think he's hamming it up  these part Arabs are just too human sometimes.

I'll get it on his back tomorrow even if he's still lame, just for saddle fit photos... I am having a professional come to fit it, because it needs its flocking all replaced, but I want to know if it's close enough in the meantime to ride in with a sheepskin half pad to cushion the hardness and slight lumpiness.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Yes, I'd say you have a blue button Stubben, and they've just kind of greened out due to age.

My maker's mark is silver and blue, but that's just because it was made in Switzerland.

A regular medium tree would be a 30 cm. If your gelding takes a wide in other saddles, the 31 cm is probably the better bet for him. 

It certainly wouldn't hurt to send the serial number and pictures of the saddle from both sides to Stubben Australia. Include a picture of the maker's mark, as well. They should be able to give you a good idea of the age, if nothing else.

Here's a closeup of the button on my Stubben. As you can see it's plain silver, which means it was made in the 1960s-early 1970s so at the very least it's 45 years old, but I'm betting it's closer to 50.


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

I shot off a quick email. Only managed to attach one photo - my computer doesn't like my email program - but it should be enough. Apparently we don't have Stubben Australia, so I don't know who imports them, but I emailed Stubben UK instead. I didn't think NA would be able to help me because it is the other side of the world we're talking about, but asked that my email please be forwarded to the right address if I sent it to the wrong place.

Your saddle looks AMAZING. I borrowed one a while back that was really narrow, same grain leather, with suede kneepads. It was a dressage, and lovely to ride in but too small for me unfortunately and too narrow for the horse I had at the time. Is that likely to have been from around the same time period as yours? As best I can remember it did have silver buttons but other than that, I don't think I still have any of the photos my mother took of it on the horse I had then. It wasn't in nearly as good condition but I know for a fact it was neglected for nearly 20 years before I borrowed it, and was bought second hand and used for a few years before that.

edit; to clarify, the saddle I just bought has been beautifully cared for, and the one I borrowed a few years ago was the one that was neglected.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

If it had the silver buttons then yes, it's from the same time period as mine. The suede knee patches were all the rage for awhile. Mine has 'em, too. 

I don't think it matters which Stubben branch you contact, as they have a central data base that they all tie into.

Yes, my saddle looks almost brand new. It needed some conditioning when I got it, but there was absolutely nothing else wrong with it. Here are several more pictures of it. Hard to believe it's almost 50 years old, isn't it? Yours will look the same way at 50 as long as you care for it properly. :wink:


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

That's incredible, yours doesn't look any more than about 5 years old! I can see a little bit of stirrup wear but other than that, WOW. Stubbens just never bloody die, do they?

I hope I have me a lifetime saddle. I don't think it's going to be a "show" saddle for much longer because a lot of the leather has faded and gone grey, but looked after it could be a "home" saddle for a lifetime. If I had it re-dyed and made black again I think it would be show-ready but that might damage the leather, and it would be difficult, I think, to dye it properly, with the black leather on top, and then the brown/tan leather on the panels. Kind of wish it was brown all over for that very reason. The brown looks gorgeous, it's such a pretty colour, but the black is sort of faded.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

You might try a light oiling with pure Neatsfoot oil to see if that will bring some of the color back. That stuff is like liquid magic, just don't use too much!

Yep, except for a small bit of stirrup wear on the panels, my saddle looks fantastic. You're right, as long as someone takes care of them, Stubben saddles last just about forever. 

My goal is to one day own a German made Stubben. I had one but it was _humongous_, so I sold it on. It was sold to me as an 18" seat, and it turned out to be a 19" which is just far too big. It was custom made for a German cavalry officer. I have pictures of it too, even though it belongs to someone else now.


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

Good idea, I didn't think of neatsfoot. I will have to get some next time I'm at the tack store [I buy most tack online, because it's cheaper, and we no longer have a tack store in town; we have to drive to the next city].

That cavalry officer must have been a tall fellow! 19 inch, wow, that's enormous.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Biggest dang saddle I've ever seen! LOL! I pulled it out of the shipping box and burst out laughing. 

The lady who sold it to me was his daughter and she doesn't ride, so I couldn't blame her for not knowing the right seat size. It was also a fairly narrow saddle, and she said it was a medium. Nawp. I pegged it at 28 cm.


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

well maybe she was basing it off her understanding of other brands' sizing? There isn't a standardized system, which means that a medium in one brand can be a narrow in another, and an extra-wide in yet another. And as for the seat size, maybe she just assumed because it was a big saddle. I know you said she doesn't ride but that doesn't necessarily mean she doesn't know anything!


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Oh, she told me right off the bat she didn't know a thing about saddles or riding as her father was the one who rode, and she didn't really care for horses. 

Very nice lady, but admittedly clueless. I took a chance on the saddle and knew if it didn't work for me, I could always sell it on. German made Stubbens, especially larger seats, are very much in demand.


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

Fair enough  That's refreshing... someone who's clueless and actually admits it. Not too many of those around. Best thing about the clueless ones is that they quite often sell their stuff for well below its value just because they don't know it's worth more. I've been tempted a few times to buy something purely to sell on because it was for sale for less than half its true value.

...but I don't do "selling on"... if this Stubben doesn't fit my gelding, it's still staying here in the hopes that it will fit something I own down the track!


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

She just wanted it to go to someone who would use it. I'd have gladly used it if it had fit me and either of my horses, but nothing doing. 

So I sold it to someone who I presume has been very happy with it. She seemed ecstatic to have gotten it and said it fit her horse, so all's well that ends well.


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

haha yeah I'm just a bit of a hoarder  I have... something like 20 rugs between two horses, and ONE of those is Magic's. The others are all my gelding's. Or the wrong size. As for saddles, I personally own 5, only ever use 3 of them. I'm a halter hoarder but my lead ropes keep getting broken, lost, or simply disappear off my halters [I suspect there's something fishy going on there, we never find them], so I presently have one lead rope between two horses, but 6 or 7 halters. I hoard bits too, never know when you'll need it after all!

I'm also a bucket hoarder but that's for practical purposes. I use old suppliment buckets as feed scoops [only small suppliment buckets though!], all sizes from 2L right the way up to 240L for feed and the multiple additives... and 20L buckets with lids are brilliant for moving/storing my horse's grain feeds when I'm taking him away to a show or a clinic for a weekend. I "hoard" feed bags because I can't be bothered throwing them out, and if you look in my sharps container, apparently I hoard used needles/syringes too... but that's what happens I guess, we had a horse for a while that HAD TO have injections every 6 weeks to be pasture sound... eventually the injections stopped working and he was euthed, but that works out to a huge number of used needles/syringes! And there's a used suture cutter in there as well from taking the stitches out of Magic's leg.

I'm terrible -blushes-


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Naw, we all hoard stuff. My addiction is halters with matching lead ropes, and saddle pads! LOL!


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

ohmygod... I can see this coming on badly with me -blushes- I NEED more lead ropes but of course they have to match my halters, except for some reason I can't find any leads to match my halters, so of course I buy more halters to match my new lead ropes... dreadful... hahaha

...and I have a million flymasks too, I forgot to mention those!

edit; oddly, the one thing I barely have enough of is saddle pads. I have one jumping pad, one dressage pad, one half pad, and one show pad... that's it. Oh and a purple puffer pad I never use.


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## mnl764 (Apr 8, 2012)

*oh yes...*



Speed Racer said:


> Naw, we all hoard stuff. My addiction is halters with matching lead ropes, and saddle pads! LOL!


I have the same disease......I have several halters...piles of lead ropes and many many many saddle pads that haven't even been used yet. 

Honestly, the saddle pads get me, I see a cute color and I buy it.....I keep waiting for the ones im currently using to die but they look too good to donate yet...ugh. What is it with these well made saddle pads!


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

See I never wash my saddle pads because then they're wet when I want to use them!! I need spares haha. Only saddle pad that's been washed recently is my show pad.

Next thing to buy methinks... I do need a white jumping pad [or pink and grey to match his jumping boots] but also more work ones.


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

They got back to meeee!! My saddle is a 1995 baby, meaning it's 17 years old turning 18 [same age as my horse haha]. Going on Speed's experience that means I could have it for 30+ years if I look after it! Maybe even 40 or 50. That seems like such a long time to me. I'm only 18!


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Whoot! Good to know, BEP. It's still a youngster then, comparatively. :wink:

You could theoretically have that saddle another 50 years, then sell it on to someone who will own and ride in it another 50 years. 

Older Stubbens and cockroaches are going to be the only things left after Armageddon! :rofl:


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

lol yes, that's why I call it a baby 

Of course after it's 118 years old it may only be good as a home/breaker/trail saddle, but I can't see why it couldn't be a functional strong and safe saddle and an antique at the same time!

I reckon. Never seen a Stubben that couldn't be ridden in. Some of them were a bit ugly [especially the neglected ones] but all of them were safe.


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