# cant pick... aussie or border collie



## Paint Mom (Jun 28, 2010)

ready for a pup anytime now, but just cant pick between a border collie or an australian Shepherd. 

Need a good working dog, one that'll really help me at the barn and around the horses. need natural instinct and just a good dog.

any ideas/opinions/pros/cons?


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## dressagebelle (May 13, 2009)

I've met more Australian Shepherds than Border Collies, so I may be completely wrong, but to me Border Collies are more barky and loud than Australian Shepherds. What type of help are you looking for, what do you want the dog to do exactly? Is it your personal barn, do you have other people who have horses or is it just you? Those answers will help decide what dog may be better. Personally I would go for an Australian Shepherd, just cause I don't want a dog barking every time I'm asking them to do something, though like I said, I could be wrong, and I could just have seen a small group that happened to be noisier than the average.


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## Dusty1228 (Dec 2, 2010)

I have to agree with dressagebelle about the barky-ness. I've had a plethora of both breeds, plus mixes of both (I rescue.) and border collies, I find, are more high strung than aussies.
I currently have an 8 y/o BC and when he came to me I thought he was still a puppy, because of how he acted, and still acts to this day. I found out he was 6 and I was in awe.
Both dogs are great farm breeds, though and can be trained to do just aboue ANYTHING. 
I recently trained my BC to realize that a finger to the lips means 'hush' and he will calm down immediately and tip toe over to me. No joke.
I might prefer an aussie around horses, though, and/or others, just for the excitability factor. I also find them a much easier breed to train.
Both breeds are super intelligent and it could just be me, but it takes me longer to get down to business with a BC than an Aussie.

Good Luck to you! I hope you find what you are looking for!


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## coffeemama (Jul 10, 2009)

French bulldogs....two to be exact.....you won't need anything else in life


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## Poseidon (Oct 1, 2010)

There are 2 border collies at my barn. I don't think I've never heard either of them bark, but they are fantastic for herding the horses when the gate doesn't latch all the way and they get out. 

The barn on campus (I am taking an equine class) has aussies. Several of them. Very sweet dogs.


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## Wallaby (Jul 13, 2008)

I much prefer BC's. 
All the Aussies I've ever met (5 or 6 different dogs) have been very sweet dogs, until you look at them the wrong way/do the wrong thing, then they get super aggressive. Perhaps I've just met "bad" ones, but I don't know, I am not a fan of the breed. In their defense I can say that all the Aussies I've met have been owned by owners that probably didn't understand the temperament of a herding dog and most likely kept them in a way that was more conducive to owning a lower energy/less intelligent breed.

I have been around quite a few Border Collies and I can safely say that I've never met one I didn't like. However, I do like more sensitive, in tune with their human animals and BC's certainly fit that bill, most of the time. The ones I've met (I've grown up with a purebred, from herding lines, and a BC/Greyhound mix as well as working at a boarding kennel where BC's often came in) are very sweet but highly intelligent with a very high prey drive. The purebred I grew up with was a very very silent dog but the mix is a lot louder. He is still very quiet as dogs go but he will bark/whine/moan etc when he feels the need, unlike the purebred who would only bark when she was desperately lonely or lost. They definitely need a strong leader and instruction for how to live their life. They don't seem to do well just left to their own devices.

If you haven't spent a bunch of time around either breed, I'd suggest you find a way to be around both breeds so you can choose one that will fit best with your lifestyle. They are very different breeds and a person who likes one is not necessarily going to like the other.


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## gaelgirl (Mar 3, 2011)

Both of these breeds will do well for your needs. There is an Aussie at the barn I board at, and he is a real sweetheart. I also love borders, though. All in all both will be able to help you, but I would go with the Aussie. They are, in my opinion, better suited for ranch work.


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## SMCLeenie (Mar 3, 2011)

Agreeing with gaelgirl, Though I have meet and loved both breeds, I think an Aussie would be better for you, but be sure to post pics whatever you decide


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

IMHO, each breed is pretty much the same. We have bred, raised, and trained Border Collies for 20+ years and I wouldn't own any other breed. We've had several Aussies come and go through here as well during that time. What I've found is that a herding dog's temperament has more to do with his bloodlines than his actual breed. When I was younger and most of our stock was directly descended from BCs that were shown sheep-dogs, all our stock was more reserved, especially when they were working. We had a heck of a time teaching them that it was okay to bite when we told them because they had been bred to flank out really wide (run quite a ways from the herd when they went around) and never bite (that's an automatic disqualification in a trial). Neither of those work very well at all when herding cattle because the cattle would just keep pushing the dogs back farther and farther.

We've spent a lot of years picking our lines carefully for temperament and courage. We breed dogs that are aggressive when you need them to be and slow/steady when you don't want them to be.

My best suggestion is to go play with the litters or puppies of each breed and just see if there is one that stands out with a better connection to you than the others. Also, consider what you want in appearance (if that matters). Aussies generally have their tails docked where BCs don't. Aussies also have more color options as the merle colors are very rare in good BCs.


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## Tasia (Aug 17, 2009)

I am vote for Aussie. I have found them to be very reliable and smart, quieter then border collies a little more laid back. Then again it depends on how the dog was raised. I know in the hot summers here the Austrailan Shepards would get quite hot and tired but Border collies may have the same issue.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

My Border Collie will bark, but you can silence him with a dirty look. My Aussie rarely barks. I don't need either for herding, but the Border Collie could while the Aussie wouldn't have a clue.

For herding, go Border Collie. It is tough to find Australians Shepherds that are still raised for herding - but they are darn good dogs if you DO find one. For someone to trot along beside you while doing chores, I'd go Aussie. I love both breeds, but really regret the AKC nosing its way into the Australian Shepherd world, and both breeds are being harmed by breeding for 'dog sports' instead of their real reason.

With my youngest:


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## dressagebelle (May 13, 2009)

I agree with checking out litters of both breeds, and seeing what you think, but going along with the whole bloodline thing, I would look for dogs that are bred from working dogs, not show ring dogs, who's parents are used as working ranch dogs in some form or another. I know that my BO breeds Aussies very small time, and she's got her breeding female and a year old possible stud prospect that have both been at the barn extensively, and are great dogs, the male loves to go after the mice for some reason. I've only had one problem one time where I turned my mare out, and her male dog for some reason got it in his head to try and chase her down, and I had to grab him and hand him off to my friend because he wouldn't stop. Only happened one time, but he's normally quite sweet and nice. He loves to give my mare kisses when I'm grooming her. I do have to agree though that as working dogs, they need a job and a purpose, and I'm sure that some of the ill mannered herding dogs I've met were that way because they didn't have an outlet for their energy and need to move things around. Definitely keep us posted though, and put up pictures when you find a pup.


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## nworkman82 (Jun 18, 2009)

A female Aussie. I have one. They are naturally attached to their person and are often called "the Velcro dog". I like her because while working outside she is always within sight. I never have to worry about her wandering, because she is happiest following and being with me. I've seen collies and get the impression they are more independent and prone to run off to find their own fun. And bark alot. My aussie has a natural tendency to herd but it tends to be the household cats. Haha. They were bred for herding delicate animals such as fowl. They are "soft mouthed" which means they do not nip to herd they use their body language. Collies nip in order to herd larger animals ex sheep. So they have a higher tendency to nip at people they "think" they are herding ex mailman or a bicyclist.


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## Chiefsgirl (Mar 26, 2011)

i love them both but i have only owned a aussie, you know they are the only dogs ,that i know of, that can outrun a squirrel. not to mention they are beautiful colors and very smart matter of fact once they figure out fetch they wont play nomore haha


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## LoveTheSaddlebreds (Jul 9, 2009)

I had an aussie for 15 years and he was the best dog I ever had. Go for the aussie.


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## coffeeaddict (Jun 18, 2010)

It really depends on if you want the dog to herd the horses or any other livestock. If you want herding ability then a BC from strong herding lines will probably be your best bet. But be warned, they are INSANE with energy and they had better actually be working on a very regular basis or you won't want to live with one. 

Aussies can be great at herding too, but they are not as crazy obsessive. Many aussies are also sharper in temperament than a border collie. I have two aussies now and one of them will tear you a new one if you look at me, the car, or the house the wrong way. I can control him and he is trained, but he is very sharp dog. I've found this to be the case more so with working line aussies than show lines. 

Personally, I like that temperament, I wish my aussie puppy was sharper. Hopefully he will develop that with time because right now he's just silly. 

In short, if you're goal is just lots of herding, then I vote BC. If you want a dog that will guard the farm and do some occasional herding while still having an "off button", then I vote Aussie.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

coffeeaddict said:


> It really depends on if you want the dog to herd the horses or any other livestock. If you want herding ability then a BC from strong herding lines will probably be your best bet. But be warned, they are INSANE with energy and they had better actually be working on a very regular basis or you won't want to live with one...


No working bred collies are insane with energy. Dogs like that get shot on ranches and farms. I've owned two working bred Border Collies, and both were/are entirely capable of being lazy.

Sports bred Border Collies may be nuts, but no Border Collie should ever be bred except for work. There are plenty of them around, and those who don't herd make fine companions.

Of course, if one of your kids is trying to escape...


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

nworkman82 said:


> ...They were bred for herding delicate animals such as fowl. They are "soft mouthed" which means they do not nip to herd they use their body language....


No. Australians Shepherd typically were used more on cattle than sheep because they were willing to get in and mix it up if needed. Border Collies are more likely to use "eye".


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## coffeeaddict (Jun 18, 2010)

> No working bred collies are insane with energy. Dogs like that get shot on ranches and farms. I've owned two working bred Border Collies, and both were/are entirely capable of being lazy.
> ​


I've seen quite a few that are in fact insane with energy and bounce off the walls. 

Most of the BCs I've come across are like this, that's not to say that there aren't some that have an "off button" and can chill out, there are always exceptions, but it's been my personal experience that border collies need a lot of exercise and work to be sane pets. If they can't provide the job that's when a lot of people run into problems.

I'm not anti-BC but I do think they require a lot of their owner for everyone to be happy.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

BCs are a working dog, that means that they are high energy. If they don't have a productive outlet for that energy, that's when they begin to get unmanageable and destructive. So if a BC is insane with energy, then the owner isn't doing a very good job with exercise management.


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## coffeeaddict (Jun 18, 2010)

The four BCs at the herding farm I take my dogs to for lessons have no off button, they are trained and it can be channeled but they are are always go, go, go, GO!, and they get plenty of working time. That doesn't stop them from being tightly wound balls of energy. 

I know several people who run flyball and agility with their BCs and they also have the mindset of go, go, go, GO! all the time. And they get plenty of exercise and training. Yet, they too are like little rubber balls.

My point was exactly what you said, that if the dog doesn't get the required exercise and training can you imagine how much energy it would have, if the ones I mentioned above are STILL bouncing off walls even though they have their needs met?


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

If the Border Collie is bred by a competent breeder, it WILL have an off switch. If you meet a Border Collie that can't stop and relax, you've met a poorly bred one.


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## coffeeaddict (Jun 18, 2010)

I'll agree to disagree on this one. I think we've simply had different experiences with this breed.


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## Reiterin (Mar 28, 2010)

I've only met one border collie that was "barky" and that's because it lived in a house. If the dog has a job, than border collies are excellent breed. You just have to be smarter than the dog.
BCs are my second favorite breed of dog, so IF I had the time and space and job for one, I'd get it. (but I don't have either of the above, so I won't)

Aussie's seem like fine dogs too, though. - I know less about them, but the one's I've met have been good dogs.

That doesn't really help you decide. But I'm just a little thrown off by the people saying BCs are "barky/loud." Most people get dogs not knowing what they are bred for and don't give them proper exercise for it. That's why there are 'so many' neurotic BCs out there. It's not the breed, it's the owner.


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## nworkman82 (Jun 18, 2009)

bsms said:


> No working bred collies are insane with energy. Dogs like that get shot on ranches and farms. I've owned two working bred Border Collies, and both were/are entirely capable of being lazy.
> 
> Sports bred Border Collies may be nuts, but no Border Collie should ever be bred except for work. There are plenty of them around, and those who don't herd make fine companions.
> 
> Of course, if one of your kids is trying to escape...


Hahahahaha, funny pic! 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## nworkman82 (Jun 18, 2009)

bsms said:


> No. Australians Shepherd typically were used more on cattle than sheep because they were willing to get in and mix it up if needed. Border Collies are more likely to use "eye".


I wish I could cut and paste my book. I found a stray Aussie last year so I picked up a book on the breed.... That was a description given. Oh well, it doesn't really matter. My Aussie is a cat herder and that's certainly in no books! Hehe.  The cats do not appreciate the vililant guidance but my little Aussie has to give them constant direction by bumping their butts with her little wet nose... Till they give in... And wander off in whatever random direction the dog chooses. Quite hilarious.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cali (Feb 4, 2011)

I have a working stock Aussie and a working stock BC. I think BCs only belong in the hands of people who are 200% committed to making the dog a priority. They are wicked smart and have a lot of energy- if they get bored, they WILL find something to do, whether you like it or not. I think people that believe BCs are barky have experienced understimulated BCs. 
I think that for the slightly above average person, the Aussie is a better choice. My Aussie is my heart dog, a little velcro girl if there ever was one. I love my BC but she definitly puts herself first, whereas with my Aussie it's all about me. I will own a BC again, but never another female. The boys tend to be more into their people.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CheyAut (Nov 26, 2008)

I have both (6 Aussies and 2 BC's, we do agility and started herding), I absolutley love both breeds. But I usually recomend Aussies over BC's unless you are very into dog sports (agility, flyball, disc dog, herding, ect), in which case you could go either way. But as said, it is very much up to their breeding, so get to know your breeders dogs/temperments before choosing their pup over someone elses. And of course I have to encourage you to check into rescues, they even get pups!


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

For those with an interest in Border Collies:

BC Basics

My Border Collies have been quite content to sleep on my feet. I have a friend who has 2000 sheep, and I asked him if his dogs were hyper. He said he'd shoot them if they were. When he needs them to work, they work. When he doesn't, they hang out and mind their own business.

Any Border Collie without an off switch should be neutered, at a minimum.

My Aussie sticks by my side doing chores. My Border Collie watches from the shade and sees if there is a reason for him to join me. When we go walking in the desert, the Aussie is usually within 50 feet of me. The Border Collie is usually within 1/4 mile, but he'll come running at a whistle. For most people, the Aussie is a better choice.


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## sarahver (Apr 9, 2010)

BSMS your dogs are absolutely beautiful!

I am extremely biased as I love Border Collies so my vote goes for them. I have to say though, both dogs are purpose bred to be working dogs and as such they do much better in a farm environment. Neither are really 'house dogs.'

Nothing suits a BC more than long days and hard work, if they don't get that then they can be restless may choose to expel the additional energy in ways that do not suit urban owners :shock: I wouldn't say they are crazy or hyperactive though, that would be a very bad attribute for a working dog, they are designed to be obedient and respond to the slightest of commands.

A more intelligent and loyal companion you couldn't ask for, I haven't had much contact with Aussie shepherds so I can't vouch for them although I have heard good things about those dogs also.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

sarahver said:


> ...I have to say though, both dogs are purpose bred to be working dogs and as such they do much better in a farm environment. Neither are really 'house dogs.'
> 
> Nothing suits a BC more than long days and hard work, if they don't get that then they can be restless may choose to expel the additional energy in ways that do not suit urban owners :shock: I wouldn't say they are crazy or hyperactive though, that would be a very bad attribute for a working dog, they are designed to be obedient and respond to the slightest of commands...


Agreed.

Border Collies like being with people. The ones I know relax just fine - if someone is around. However, many people can't afford to be around the house - everyone is at school or work so the house is empty for long hours. And yes, a Border Collie left alone in a house for 12 hours/day, most days, can become very destructive.

I tried to get a Border Collie from a rescue. The woman who was keeping him said he was too energetic and destructive for us to handle, and in the end we got a Border Collie from a breeder in Oregon.

But the 'rescue' worker admitted she was out of the house 12 hours/day, and that she kept the dog in a crate 23 hours/day...said he went bonkers when let out. :shock::shock::shock::shock::shock:

No joke, GI! Keep a Border Collie in a crate 23 hours/day, walk him outside twice/week, and you say he has too much energy?!?!?!?!?! And our 2 acres next to state land, with me retired and home schooling our daughter isn't good enough? Weird rescue! Unfortunately I had no legal options for forcing the rescue to approve of my taking the dog. A year later, he was still listed as up for adoption...THAT was animal abuse in my book.

Border Collies need exercise, but I think even more importantly, they need their people to be around. Jack will sleep on my feet, but he'd be pretty difficult if the house was empty all day, every day. It also helps that he has another dog (our Aussie) to keep him exercised.


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