# English riding instructor teaching western riding?



## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

My point of view, having started out with and ridden English for a long time, then switched to Western with an instructor who came from English originally also ( that's Europe for you lol), it should not be a problem IF the person knows what he/she is doing. Same basics are the same, and since there are no rules in western as there are in English, pretty much anything goes as long as the horse goes, so to speak. 
I think, this lady shouldn't teach western, she seems to be too tuned to English/ dressage. A correct seat is good, but a little less important when riding western if you don't show.

I don't see nothing wrong in taking some things from one style into the other, could be beneficial. But what it sounds like she's teaching what she knows, and it doesn't seem to be what you want.


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## DancingArabian (Jul 15, 2011)

IMO, an English instructor who does not ride Western can teach the basics of good riding. However if you start talking about following a Western discipline then no, a teacher can't teach what they don't know.

If you're confused, ask her for clarification. If its not working for you, find a trainer more suited to you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## aerie (Jul 19, 2010)

I believe that an english rider can teach a western rider. The very basic stuff really is the same. You still need to sit tall on your seat bones with your heels down and your hands quiet. Honestly I feel like it shouldne't matter you are riding in an english saddle or a western saddle, you should still be riding the same. When I had my horse and took lessons my trainer would have me do both regardless of the saddle I chose to work in that day. I have done m dressage patterns in my western saddle and my reining patterns in my english saddle! Maybe you are confused because she is starting you over from the very beginning and if you are mostly self taught then what she is teaching you probably is a lot different than what you know! Not that what you did before was wrong by any means, but if she is just trying to teach you from a blank slate then I can see where it could be more confusing than just doing what you learned from reading and observation.

Now that being said, you did say that other people who take lessons from her are also confused by what she teaches. Have you even asked her what she knows? In a respectful way of course!  She may know how to ride well herself, but may not be able to teach it. If you are getting worse instead of getting better I would suggest shopping around for different trainers/instructors and seeing who you mesh with better then either trailer your horse out there for lessons (If you can) or ride the school horses and see if the other instructor can write down what you did and use that as a reference when you go out to ride your horse.


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## Dustbunny (Oct 22, 2012)

It sounds like you and your horse could get really confused. I might look for someone with western experience.


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

Why not ASK her what her background is? Perhaps she was actually trained Western. You never know.


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## Oldhorselady (Feb 7, 2012)

Thanks guys for the input. I think I will finish up my last lesson with her, and do it bareback....lol. There is another trainer on the ranch that sounds like it would be more up my alley. She is not an 'arena' only rider like the first trainer. This one will actually go out on a trail with you and ride, if that's what you are looking for, and help you solve issues there too besides the arena.

Yes, I just want to feel secure and confident when I am trail riding mostly. I know you can never prepare for everything, but I just want to feel confident with all gaits in case I encounter a canter unexpectedly or something on my horses.

Plus, riding my percheron is a little different altogether. It's really hard for my body to remain in a perfect position when I am already doing the splits, can't get my short legs around her barrel well, she is sway backed and has a very animated gait....lol. Maybe I should have the trainers ride her first to see what I'm talking about....lol.


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## Paintlover1965 (May 22, 2009)

I had a western certified instructor give some lessons several years back whilst I was riding english. She didn't pretend to know more than what she was capable but I learned a lot and I really liked how she was relaxed not like the instructors I was used to as a child. She stopped teaching and I tried a certified english and western instructor and she taught me even more than my previous coach but I still benefited from my first coach. You can always learn a little something from different people. And to that I'm grateful. 

I would say if your coach isn't helping you progress and you're getting confused then you need to try someone else. I know its hard to try a new coach but you're paying them to learn and when you stop learning you need to try someone else. If you do a lot of trail riding then a coach that goes out on the trails with you may be more helpful to you. Happy riding!


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## Eolith (Sep 30, 2007)

Good riding position is good riding position. Any instructor of any discipline should be able to teach you to ride in a more secure and effective manner. I can't say if your actual instructor is good or not, but I don't think that English vs Western background and experience is relevant when considering the goals that you have, which do not sound discipline specific.


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## Oldhorselady (Feb 7, 2012)

I must say, I have become very discouraged. While I understand that riding is not just sitting on a horse, I think it is way to complicated for me now.....jiggle this rein on the inside, while you tap with your foot on the outside, no wait.....change sides now because the horse is going the other way, no, back to the original way, and tap faster because she is not hearing you. At the same time put your reins here on the neck to walk, no wait trot so open the reins off the neck, but wait your pelvis is moving wrong.

There are too many things going on all at once for me....and then there are my poor horses! They have only learned some simple leg pressure and cues from me. I think they are beginning to think I lost my mind and am having a seizure while on top of them with all the things being asked of me, just to ride them around the arena at the walk/trot.

I'm going to always try to learn and ride my best for my horse and their comfort. However, I don't think I will ever ride like real riders! I feel like it may be too difficult for me to retain so many things all at once. God Speed to all of you who DO do all of this.


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## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Oh hun....I hear ya......
The instructor is actually quite good. But she should keep it less complicated, one thing at a time. Could you ask that of her? Riding is actually quite logical. Look in the direction you want to go and your body will automatically give the right aids for the horse to follow.
I wish I was closer.......


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## Oldhorselady (Feb 7, 2012)

deserthorsewoman said:


> Oh hun....I hear ya......
> The instructor is actually quite good. But she should keep it less complicated, one thing at a time. Could you ask that of her? Riding is actually quite logical. Look in the direction you want to go and your body will automatically give the right aids for the horse to follow.
> I wish I was closer.......


My brain must be leaving me as I age, I swear. I thought it was more logical, or at least it seemed that way, until I've had to change everything I was doing. You are right, maybe too many things at once. I must say though, the place that made me nervous, no longer made me nervous, because I was too busy focusing on the other four things I was supposed to be doing all at once during that time!

I am going to try and practice one thing at a time and get comfortable with each. I'm a litteral and logical thinker, so it has to all physically make sense as I practice it. I want to just ride bareback at the walk and get a real feel for the horse. I do know that I was pushing too much with my seat, thinking I had to, and then throwing my horses off. I also hold them back, especially Belle since she is so big, when I ask them to go more forward, but then hold them back due to my fear of the unknown.

I am so grateful that my horses put up with me and take care of me. Belle and Snickers babysit me...lol.


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## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

They probably sit down at night and figure out the way to break it down for you....
Can you ride Belle in the roundpen instead of a large arena for a while? It might give you a little more security.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

I've told this story before, but repeat it FWIW:

I've got a bunch of books on riding. When I tried to figure out how to cue the horse to canter, it seemed to all be, "Push the right side of your hip here, turn your left ankle inside out, breathe deeply 3 times, and fart gently, directing the gas out to the left side of the horse..." Don't know about you, but I never thought of my hips as having independently moving sides...

I was taking western lessons at the time, so I asked the other, more experienced riders in the lesson how to cue a horse to canter. They all looked at me kind of odd, and finally one replied, "Kick harder?" 

There is a lot of truth to that in how I cue my horses. I usually trash talk to them first: "You want to canter? YOU want to CANTER? You're just a nag...you aren't strong enough to canter!" Since my horses understand my eccentricity, they get a bit excited. Then a firm squeeze with the legs, and we're off! And since a lot of our cantering is on a trail, I don't worry about leads.

That obviously isn't 'proper' riding. Imagine watching a show, WP or dressage or ANY show, and hearing the rider say in a loud voice, "You aren't HORSE enough to canter!" - and then cantering after the horse got excited. Any judge that didn't laugh would probably toss a beer can at me!

How much English and Western riding differ depends on the style of both. Western riding includes the old style cowboy approach, which can drive modern riders nuts:










I often direct rein, which I don't associate with western riding. How much slack, if any, in the reins depends on the horse - Trooper gets a lot, while Mia prefers very little. But then, one of the reasons I consider myself to be a western rider, even if I often use a *******ized forward seat and an Aussie-style saddle, is that I'm only interested in what my horse and I like.

I also find, as an older rider who took it up late, that a lot of the instructors I've met seem to focus on how they learned when they were 10 or 12, rather than prioritize things based on how a much older body bends, moves, etc. I think an older rider benefits more if you work on one thing at a time, or accept that some things won't happen right away. After 5 years of riding, my heels aren't as far forward and my toes aren't quite 90 deg out any more, but I wasn't physically capable of riding in the 'correct position' at the start. Can't now either, and one foot sticks out sideways more than the other. Finding an instructor who appreciates both the different capabilities of an older body, coupled with an older mind that understands that a fall hurts more as we age...that's tough. They exist, but they aren't hanging around everywhere.

< / rant >

BTW - Good luck!


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## Dustbunny (Oct 22, 2012)

You mentioned there was another trainer that you might try. It seems to me the basics of English and western should be the same but the trainer you have been working with does not seem to be working for you. Some can ride, some can teach, some can do both, and some can't. 
If you could start out with this other one, begin by showing just what you are doing as far a cueing your horse. The fact that this person will go out on trails is a good thing also.
I'm sorry this has been an ordeal. I hope this gets better for you and your horses.


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## Oldhorselady (Feb 7, 2012)

Thanks Desert and BSMS....I really started feeling like a failure and not being smart enough to ride my horses. I think I will go to the roundpen. I'm not scared of riding Belle's faster trot, I'm scared of her going into the canter and doing her crow hop or lead change and me falling out of the saddle again. I also made the mistake when I first started asking for the canter, of running the diagonal down the arean towards the gate to get her to speed up. So, now when we are in that corner and she speeds up, ever so slightly, I panic. I hold her back and she babysits me, no wonder she won't canter with me....either of us are ready for that.

BSMS, I am with you, learning to ride later in life, after my body is already set in it's ways. I agree that it's so different teaching an old person to ride than a ten year old. I guess I associated that I was doing it right with my horses because the outcome was usually what I ask.....as far as turning, yielding, backing etc. It's going forward that I'm screwing things up with my own body. Well, actually all of it, but that's where I've had the problems...lol.

Desert...I'm still unemployed, so I have plenty of time to practice at the moment!


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## Oldhorselady (Feb 7, 2012)

Dustbunny said:


> You mentioned there was another trainer that you might try. It seems to me the basics of English and western should be the same but the trainer you have been working with does not seem to be working for you. Some can ride, some can teach, some can do both, and some can't.
> If you could start out with this other one, begin by showing just what you are doing as far a cueing your horse. The fact that this person will go out on trails is a good thing also.
> I'm sorry this has been an ordeal. I hope this gets better for you and your horses.


 
Thanks Dustbunny, I think when I add some more lessons, I will do just that. I went on a camping trip last weekend and she was there teaching another rider older than myself, who has the same fears. She was very laid back and I enjoyed her company.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

I once tried to get my daughter to canter, using Trooper. Trooper & I had cantered a number of times at that point, and I knew he could do it & that he loved cantering. However, my daughter couldn't get him to canter at all. Total failure after about 30 minutes of trying.

After the ride, she admitted to me she was nervous about cantering and didn't really want to do it. She didn't feel ready.

About 6 months later, she was riding in our little arena, and suddenly she & Trooper were cantering. I asked her about it, and she said she wanted to try cantering, and she squeezed a little...and Trooper immediately cantered. He knew. And he did what she WANTED, not what she 'said'. Trooper believes in taking care of his rider (unlike Mia, who figures staying on is MY problem). :?


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## Dustbunny (Oct 22, 2012)

Amen to bsms's post!


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## sillyhorses (Sep 2, 2011)

While I don't find fault in the fact that a primarily English rider teaches Western (at least on a basic level, or figures out a way to smoothly intertwine the two), I am concerned that she is confusing you (and others, for that matter). A good instructor (any discipline) will have you walk away feeling more confident and with clear training tools/exercises to practice and build upon in their absence. If the lady is doing the complete opposite of that, then regardless of discipline, you should find an instructor who helps you grow, as opposed to oppressing you!


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## Oldhorselady (Feb 7, 2012)

sillyhorses said:


> While I don't find fault in the fact that a primarily English rider teaches Western (at least on a basic level, or figures out a way to smoothly intertwine the two), I am concerned that she is confusing you (and others, for that matter). A good instructor (any discipline) will have you walk away feeling more confident and with clear training tools/exercises to practice and build upon in their absence. If the lady is doing the complete opposite of that, then regardless of discipline, you should find an instructor who helps you grow, as opposed to oppressing you!


I'm thinking we are not a good match. I feel like while I'm trying to figure out one thing, I'm told to do yet another thing. There is just too much going on all at once. Before I even get to try and feel what she is talking about, she stops me and talks in more loops and circles. I just don't get to even get to the point of understanding or feeling what the first thing she told me to do is. I guess it doesn't help that my horses have only been ridden by me either. The type of horses I have don't help either, I'm sure. However, it is what it is. I thought taking lessons would benefit us and it has done the opposite. I'm going to breathe again and take a step back to simplicity. Then, when I am ready again, use another trainer. Thanks for the help!


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## deserthorsewoman (Sep 13, 2011)

Oldhorselady said:


> Thanks Desert and BSMS....I really started feeling like a failure and not being smart enough to ride my horses. I think I will go to the roundpen. I'm not scared of riding Belle's faster trot, I'm scared of her going into the canter and doing her crow hop or lead change and me falling out of the saddle again. I also made the mistake when I first started asking for the canter, of running the diagonal down the arean towards the gate to get her to speed up. So, now when we are in that corner and she speeds up, ever so slightly, I panic. I hold her back and she babysits me, no wonder she won't canter with me....either of us are ready for that.
> 
> BSMS, I am with you, learning to ride later in life, after my body is already set in it's ways. I agree that it's so different teaching an old person to ride than a ten year old. I guess I associated that I was doing it right with my horses because the outcome was usually what I ask.....as far as turning, yielding, backing etc. It's going forward that I'm screwing things up with my own body. Well, actually all of it, but that's where I've had the problems...lol.
> 
> ...


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

Lessons should NOT leave you confused. A good instructor will explain the theory behind the reasons they have you do things. At least the good instructors do, it's very enlightening.


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