# thoughts on Clinton Anderson ?



## gypsygirl

i really like his methods, of course i wish all his stuff wasnt so dang pricey, but i know a lot of people dont like him.....what are everyones thoughts ?

THX 

=]


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## smrobs

If I had to choose a NH trainer, it would either be him or Dennis Reis. CA does things in a simple and easy to understand way. He doesn't pussyfoot around his horses or make a circus act out of it. I know that some people will say that he is more of a "reining" horse trainer but all the reining horses I know are the most well trained and broke horses I have ever been around. Of course, thier stuff is really pricey (not as much as others) but IMHO, you really don't need to buy the name brand stuff. You can get whips/sticks/lead ropes/halters at your local tack store that will work just as well.


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## Alicia

I agree with smrobs. CA is to the point and with my personality and the way I want a horse to respond, I think his methods are easy to understand and leave very little interpretation for the horse or me. 
From some research I have done all these trainers that have their own products are pricey and like smrobs stated you can find the same sort of stuff someplace else for cheaper.


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## gypsygirl

ok thanks guys !!

yeah i would never buy his ropes or anything, but even the videos are a lot


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## Kiara

I went to one of his clinics (thanks to my trainer . I do like some of his premises and that he basically trains the people to be confident and how to establish respect. However, I am a little on the fence about how his methods work on really hot headed horses. He does use a type of flooding (you keep doing it until they stop moving and relax), but some hot headed horses will run themselves into heart attacks before they calm down. I also didn't like one his clinicians. The audience called him out, ha. The other clinician was great though. So I am a little on the fence about him. I think he is great for teaching people and lazier horses, but as I said I don't know about hot headed horses...

ETA: Yeah, his stuff (most NH) is super expensive. I borrow his DVDs from my trainer or sister-in-law


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## Luv 2 Trail

I have been to his clinics - I like the basic ground exercises and he is easy to understand - I like to take little bits from all the clinicians - they all have good tips - I have a reiner and like smrobs said, there is nothing like that type of training for any horse! I have a friend that SWEARS by Clinton Anderson - my only problem with her is that she skips over important lessons and in my opinion her horses get confused and don't learn on the intended building block methods of Anderson. It is sort of "to each his own" - what method(s) are more practical for you and your horse. I do enjoy Clinton Anderson's Clinics - real people, real problems.
Anderson doesn't bring in a ringer to work with - I have seen his methods work, I don't tend to agree with him 100% on everything, but that is not to take away from what he teaches.


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## mom2pride

I have used CA's methods on both 'calm' and 'hot' type horses, and they do work well on both. I've found that hotter horses, once they get the concept, you can't do anything to take it away from them, so while it may take a bit longer at times for them to understand what you want, they often retain it really well. 

Of course, like any trainer, there may be things I don't agree with, but for the most part, I think CA is straight and to the point, and if you are doing things 'correctly' the horse catches on quickly.


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## kevinshorses

All these big time clinicians have worked thousands of horses all over the world. If the techniques didn't work on every kind of horse they would have been called out on it by now. An individual person may not be able to make the methods work on every horse but rest assured that if any of the clinicians we ussualy talk about were to work on your horse for an hour your horse would do things you have only imagined. Clinton Anderson, Dennis Reis, Pat Parrelli, Buck Brannaman ect. ect. didn't get were they are by only taking the gentle pet ponies. Many times when they ask for horses to use at demonstrations people bring them the worst horses they can find and often lie about them as well, yet the horses leave much better than when they came because these men are horsemen.


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## Scoutrider

Very well said, kevinshorses! 

Clinton Anderson is one of my favorite of the name brand NH trainers. I've used his groundwork with great success on a more "hot and nervous" horse, and on a more laid back horse, and got great results with both. He's a great "people" trainer; I hauled my mom (she's not really a horsey person, but she's awesomely supportive of my obsession, ha ha) to one of his trailer loading demos once, and she said afterward that he explained what he was doing wonderfully, and she really understood what he was doing and why.

If you're looking for a "trainer in a box," CA would be pretty high on my list of recommendations. A big part of that recomendation comes from the fact that his TV show is somewhat informative (while no one can become a trainer by watching a TV show...) and educational, as opposed to the standard "info-mercial" that many other trainers have.


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## Sunny06

He's ok. Better than most. He's got great posture, and great teeth.


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## nrhareiner

I will have to agree that he is Ok. I would put him higher on the list then say PP however he falls into the lets watch this DVD and we will know it all kind of thing. However I will say that those who use his techniques do not get as single minded as people who follow others. 

The ones I like are the ones who proved their techniques before they ever did a video or tried to sell things to people. I also like the ones that do not push their stuff to get the job done.


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## Spastic_Dove

I like him. I have never seen any of his DVDs, saw the tail end of a thing he did on RFDTV but I have read quite a few of his training articles and audited some of his clinics. I see him as a people trainer. HE makes the concepts easy for people to understand and then you add common sense and your horses own attributes into that and his methods work. 
And he's cute so it doesn't hurt  
I don't really follow any one big name trainer. The closest one you could say I "follow" is Monty Roberts but only really on the groundwork/join up. 

However I really liked some of CA's articles, so he is one of the people I steal from


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## lsucajun8

I like Clinton Anderson a lot. His methods are very simple and easy to understand and I have seen a difference in horses that have been trained on his method.


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## gypsygirl

Spastic_Dove said:


> I like him. I have never seen any of his DVDs, saw the tail end of a thing he did on RFDTV but I have read quite a few of his training articles and audited some of his clinics. I see him as a people trainer. HE makes the concepts easy for people to understand and then you add common sense and your horses own attributes into that and his methods work.
> And he's cute so it doesn't hurt
> I don't really follow any one big name trainer. The closest one you could say I "follow" is Monty Roberts but only really on the groundwork/join up.
> 
> However I really liked some of CA's articles, so he is one of the people I steal from


 
what exactly is 'join up' ?

i do have experience training horses, but is started looking to NH when i got my 3yo...she only knew how to lead & tie & i really was not sure where to start outside of brushing her. esp in terms of lunging, as my other horse was abused & is terrified of lunging.


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## kevinshorses

gypsygirl said:


> what exactly is 'join up' ?


 
Try google.


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## Spastic_Dove

Yep Google Monty Roberts Join Up and you will find his website. 
His books are at most libraries too  
It's a way of bonding with your horse and making yourself "Alpha Mare" using horse psychology and usually a round pen.


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## coccina

I like very much his DVD. There are really clear, and easily understanding for french people like me.
Actually, we are working his method with 2 friends, looking DVD together, and apply after on our mare. 

On one DVD of gaining respect and control on the ground, he talks about work in round pen, so with my friends, we asked us if some DVD exist on work underground without halter, a kinf of join-up.
Did anybody know?


(sorry for my english...)


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## JEAN

I think clint anderson is the best. He knows horses and he is the best!!!!!!!!


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## JEAN

I think clint anderson is the best. He knows horses and he is the best!!!!!!!! HE IS VERY FUNNY AND FUN TO WATCH. I HAVE LEARED ALOT OF TRAINING METHODS FROM HIM AND THEY ALL WORK.


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## gypsygirl

coccina said:


> I like very much his DVD. There are really clear, and easily understanding for french people like me.
> Actually, we are working his method with 2 friends, looking DVD together, and apply after on our mare.
> 
> On one DVD of gaining respect and control on the ground, he talks about work in round pen, so with my friends, we asked us if some DVD exist on work underground without halter, a kinf of join-up.
> Did anybody know?
> 
> 
> (sorry for my english...)


have you watched the episode called round penning made easy ? i would suggest that one ! its very good =]


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## coccina

Gypsygirl : no! Where could I find it? On his website, I suppose?


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## gypsygirl

coccina said:


> Gypsygirl : no! Where could I find it? On his website, I suppose?


yep, the no worries club


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## Crimsonhorse01

Also check ebay


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## gypsygirl

Crimsonhorse01 said:


> Also check ebay


i think that if you are a member of the no worries club you already paid for it ? not sure though, bc a friend gave me her password...


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## coccina

I don't know what is the no worries club :shock:

I'm going to search on ebay, I think 

Thanks!


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## gypsygirl

coccina said:


> I don't know what is the no worries club :shock:
> 
> I'm going to search on ebay, I think
> 
> Thanks!


the no worries club is CAs wibsite/forum thing...haha i cant really explain it... i think its at noworriesclub.com

you do have to pay for it though !


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## coccina

Thanks!

Interresting, but argghhh!!! 200$ per year...
I'm going to learn english before, I think 

(And 25% off on clinic, OK, but I'm in France!... )

(If I could get a giant poster of Clinton (naked preferably), why not  lol!)


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## Hali

I like some Clinton Anderson methods. I've used his methods for horses who always stop/always move and it's done wonders for my horses. Plus he's easy on the eyes.


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## catandminot

I highly respect Clinton. I was at a tour stop a couple weekends ago (my second one-- first being 3 years ago), and he greeted EVERY person at the door, welcomed/ thanked them for coming, and shook their hand. I don't know of any "big name" trainer who would do that. It pretty much made my day! haha 

He is so down to earth, than a someone like Pat Parelli, who seems to only be in the business for the money most days. And like other people said, he is a "people trainer"; He's an outstanding teacher. (For example, after each demonstration at the clinic, he would quiz the audience over what they just saw and would give out "prizes" (dvds, halters, bridles, sponsors items, etc)-- while other clinics would just raffle out prizes and things.) He admitted during the tour that he's not a great horseman "naturally, but spent/ is spending years trying to get to where he is today and constantly credits his teachers about 99% of what he knows. He just presents the information in an easy way for people to understand.

I think that the biggest issue people have with the big natural horsemanship trainers, is that ALL of their personalities are extremely different. For example, Pat Parelli seems more of the "lets play with my horse" (and buy 10 more dvds...), while Clinton is more "lets get things accomplished and move on". These complete different mentalities definitely affect students will like or not like following them. For example, I have tried Parelli (up to Level 3), but grew bored with it and switched over to Clinton. The basic groundwork and ideas are all the same... but it's the way it's presented to the "student" that makes all of the difference.


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## coccina

I don't heard good thinks about the challenge "Road to the horse". People said that he was abrupt, and did not a good job. 
Someone could tell me about it?


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## Rachelfailappraisal

He's awesome, and if you don't want to buy the DVDs, the book is really good, and only about $25.


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## FGRanch

I totally agree, he is super hot!  I love him just because of that! 

Kidding, Kidding. He is probably my fave NH trainer though, his methods get the horse trained for a job, not for wanna be circus act. 



coccina said:


> Thanks!
> 
> Interresting, but argghhh!!! 200$ per year...
> I'm going to learn english before, I think
> 
> (And 25% off on clinic, OK, but I'm in France!... )
> 
> (If I could get a giant poster of Clinton (naked preferably), why not  lol!)


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## starlinestables

coccina said:


> Thanks!
> 
> Interresting, but argghhh!!! 200$ per year...
> I'm going to learn english before, I think
> 
> (And 25% off on clinic, OK, but I'm in France!... )
> 
> (If I could get a giant poster of Clinton (naked preferably), why not  lol!)



LOL literally... You crack me up! He's not as cute in person though.. to much time in the sun! 

What I do like about CA is how hard he works!!! He's doing that clinic for 8 -10 hours a day!


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## safehavenfarmtn

We have seen Pat Parelli and Dennis Reis and Clinton Anderson in person.
And I must say Clinton Anderson is the best of them all. The methods he uses to teach riders and train horses are I believe presented in a way that anyone can learn from them. Like someone else says he takes the time to see if the crowd has picked up on what he just showed them and if they did not he does not move on till they do. He does sell dvds like the others do but he takes the time you paid for during the tour stop or clinic to teach a technique not just talk about what you should be able to do if you buy a dvd and go home and do it yourself. I personally cannot any of their dvds brand new so I buy them on e-bay and have been tickled to death so far.

I saw Pat Parelli at a tour stop and he wants you to watch him show off, talk about himself, and sell you dvds that he swares will teach you what he should have showed you for the money you spent to begin with.

I saw Dennis Reis at a clinic as well as a taping for a segment of RFD TV and during the clinic before the crowds arrived he was very arrogant to persons attending and actted like if you were having trouble getting it do not bother him or say you came to his clinic.

All I know is if we had teachers in the school system in America that had the attitude Clinton Anderson has then we truly would have no child left behind fore sure.


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## ShutUpJoe

We are using CA's techniques to train Piper. So far I'm liking the end result. My trainer uses CA and her horses are so well behaved it's like carving a duck out of wood on horse back. Piper has become a respectful horse, as when I first got her she was very mareish. She will meet me in the field now and doesn't fight being haltered anymore. I can control her from the ground 10 feet away from her. I think this method offers the best before you ride guidelines. 

I think the best part is the one rein emergency flex stop. (not sure if other trainers use that)


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## lb_cake

I love Clinton Anderson's training style! Ransom is so much calmer and respectful of my space. I love the one-rein stop and that is my emergency brake! He literally sticks his nose in his rope halter and drops his head to accept his headstall and bit. It is like magic!


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## Vidaloco

I use CA's methods primarily. He drives me a little batty with the "Make your horse move his?.....What?.........his?......feet, right" 
If you've ever listened to him you know what I mean :lol: I wonder if he had been school teacher at some time in the past. It reminds me of the school scene on Farris Bullers Day Off movie-
"In 1930, the Republican-controlled House of Representatives, in an effort to alleviate the effects of the... Anyone? Anyone?... the Great Depression, passed the... Anyone? Anyone? The tariff bill? The Hawley-Smoot Tariff Act? Which, anyone? Raised or lowered?... raised tariffs, in an effort to collect more revenue for the federal government..." 
:lol:


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## stacieandtheboys

Vidaloco said:


> I use CA's methods primarily. He drives me a little batty with the "Make your horse move his?.....What?.........his?......feet, right"
> If you've ever listened to him you know what I mean :lol: I wonder if he had been school teacher at some time in the past. It reminds me of the school scene on Farris Bullers Day Off movie-
> "In 1930, the Republican-controlled House of Representatives, in an effort to alleviate the effects of the... Anyone? Anyone?... the Great Depression, passed the... Anyone? Anyone? The tariff bill? The Hawley-Smoot Tariff Act? Which, anyone? Raised or lowered?... raised tariffs, in an effort to collect more revenue for the federal government..."
> :lol:


Dr Pepper just came out of my nose. CA is a cutie and the accent helps a lot. His new ranch is just a couple of hours from here. My farrier just moved from there and said that he wears a baseball cap around town and drives a mini cooper LOL


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## Scoutrider

Vidaloco said:


> I use CA's methods primarily. He drives me a little batty with the "Make your horse move his?.....What?.........his?......feet, right"
> If you've ever listened to him you know what I mean :lol: I wonder if he had been school teacher at some time in the past. It reminds me of the school scene on Farris Bullers Day Off movie-
> "In 1930, the Republican-controlled House of Representatives, in an effort to alleviate the effects of the... Anyone? Anyone?... the Great Depression, passed the... Anyone? Anyone? The tariff bill? The Hawley-Smoot Tariff Act? Which, anyone? Raised or lowered?... raised tariffs, in an effort to collect more revenue for the federal government..."
> :lol:


My dad does the Ferris Bueller quote EVERY TIME I sit down to watch CA on RFD!!! :lol::lol::lol:



stacieandtheboys said:


> Dr Pepper just came out of my nose. CA is a cutie and the accent helps a lot. His new ranch is just a couple of hours from here. *My farrier just moved from there and said that he wears a baseball cap around town and drives a mini cooper LOL*


That's great! Ha ha. Never would have pictured him driving a Cooper, lol, and my dad's convinced that the cowboy hat was surgically attached to his head. :lol:

You made my evening, guys!


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## kevinshorses

safehavenfarmtn said:


> I saw Dennis Reis at a clinic as well as a taping for a segment of RFD TV and during the clinic before the crowds arrived he was very arrogant to persons attending and actted like if you were having trouble getting it do not bother him or say you came to his clinic.


Ray Hunt was a little grumpy as well. Many people got thier feathers ruffled by Ray because he expected more of them than anyone had ever expected before. I think Reis is a lot the same way. The first clinic I ever went to was a Reis clinic. I am quite a bit taller than average and it gets pointed out to me often. I was a few minutes late and Dennis was sitting on the arena fence talking to the audience(about 100 people) and when I walked in he saw me and said "Wow! you're a tall drink of water." 200 eyes swung around and looked right at me. I was somewhat embarassed but he was pretty funny about it and we talked for a while after the clinic. he's a very nice man but he has very set opinions and if you argue them he will win.


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## ShutUpJoe

Did anyone enter to win Cider?


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## Neckrein

I like him, i like everyone. I like to take something from each trainer i watch seminars with an read about. Its always good to look at each side of every way of training a horse, to learn an gain new ways of doing things an to better yourself and your horse. Im big into NH in alot of ways, but then again im not. Parelli is too commercialized but alot of what he has to say is interesting an needs to be taken into consideration, along with Clinton. Never hurts to listen to everyone an to be open minded!


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## smrobs

Sorry, completely off topic, but I just had to mention this. Neckrein, that horse in your avatar is stunning!!! Is it yours?


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## southerncowgirl93

I think he's pretty good. I actually went to a clinic today in Shelbyville of his. It was fun and I learned some new stuff.


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## Thatgirlsacowboy

Hali said:


> Plus he's easy on the eyes.


 

Oh, Clinton Anderson is NOT hard to look at... At all.

Be still my quick beating heart. lol


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## Ravenmoon

I have to say out of all the natural horsemanship trainers I've seen, he's one I prefer. I think his methods are very easy to understand whether you're a beginner or advanced. I just wish the DVDs weren't nearly so expensive -- it makes it hard to afford.


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## totalfreedom

Ravenmoon said:


> I just wish the DVDs weren't nearly so expensive -- it makes it hard to afford.


AHHMEN

I wanna buy all his dvd's but they are so dang pricey. I was gonna get groundwork series 1, but I found his book "downunder horsmanship" in the book store. And all the exercises in that first series are in the book. But from watching his tv show and reading the book I've realized it's much easier to see what he is trying to teach rather than read it. Such as one of the exercises of disengaging the hindquarters stage two. I watched the tv show and saw it happen, but while reading the book it really didn't explain enough how you really tap/whack the hindquarters to get the horse to put some energy into the disengage. In the book it says "when the horse begins to disengage his hindquarters, tap with more energy. Tap until the horse swings his hindquarter away from you and turns to face you with both eyes". And in the tv show you can SEE how much "more energy" really is. In the tv show it's really a whack on the hindquarters to get the horse to turn and face you NOW. So I'm kinda thinking about getting series 1 just to make sure I understand fully what's being conveyed. But to get all three series is EXPENSIVE. I've been watching ebay, but sometimes I would prefer buying the new dvd so I KNOW that if there's any problems I can return em and have em replaced.

Anyhow, those are my comments on clinton anderson. I watch parelli too on tv and have his book "natural horse-man-ship". And I don't know if I enjoy clinton more cus he has a longer eposide on tv to teach or if it's his simple to understand style. So I could like other trainers more or the same if only I was able to preview em on tv. I really wish they had more trainers actually training on tv like clinton does. But for now I beleive I'm gonna learn from clinton anderson. But it also seems that all the trainers selling informational dvd's charge an arm and a leg. It's as if one needs to pick up a side job just to afford the darn dvd's. "don't these trainers understand that all that bailout money went to the super-wealthy and none of the average persons fleeced their pockets with it?" LOL


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## kevinshorses

I think there is a phenomena in our country where we view something that is expensive as more valuable. The more a clinician charges for his DVD's the more valuable they are. The more the tuition to the college, the better the education. It's sad but true and that is why they charge so much.


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## ShutUpJoe

I agree Kevin. That is why I borrow : )


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## gypsygirl

can you imagine how much time effort and money he puts into to making them though ?

im not saying theyre not expensive, bc they are, just thinking of another view point


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## HorsesAreForever

Okay.... why are people so... okay with CA prices.... and judge parelli's prices.....

Just had to throw that in there......


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## Spirithorse

^^ I have my theories......boy are you gonna open up a can of worms! lol.


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## ShutUpJoe

He's got a BIG HUGE Horse farm/ranch/business type thing near where I live for sale in the millions of dollars. I wish I could even own a portion of that..........


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## gypsygirl

who said his prices were ok & PP werent ? jw i dont remember that


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## HorsesAreForever

I probably am....SpiritHorse..

and theres quite a few posts......


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## RadHenry09

I have seen Clinton twice at his tour , once here in PA and once in MD (they gave me free tickets which was awesome) I have met him and I didnt think he was that friendly. To me he comes across cocky and one thing I remember him saying was if you couldn't jump up on the horse from the ground you shouldnt be riding horses. That comment struck me as odd ....
I believe that he gets the job done though and I do own a few of his dvds and book.
I think I may of mentioned this in another post too but my husband really likes Chris Cox .....I myself (hides from the throwing stones ..lol) like Parelli . I actually got to work at one of his tours and my husband and I talked to him in length after the tour while tearing down and he is a really nice guy JMO : )


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## Spirithorse

Well this might come as a shock (I'm still in shock lol) but I'm actually going to see CA next month here in Kansas City.....CERTAINLY NOT because I like him or I want to follow his methods, but because a friend of mine asked me to (she doesn't have many friends) and she's "trying to find her way" with her horses I guess....so to support her I'm going to his tour stop (cringes). I'll just have to endure it....but I can for my friend.

I personally have had a lesson from Pat himself with my horse and I've got to say he is VERY genuine and very nice....I already knew that, but it's nice to have that one-on-one interaction. And for those who might think Parelli doesn't teach to get firm with horses....LOL you should have seen how firm he was with my guy! My horse's behavior changed immediately and at the end of it he burried his head in Pat's chest and closed his eyes. I LOOOOVED it! lol.


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## Scoutrider

Spirithorse said:


> Well this might come as a shock (I'm still in shock lol) but I'm actually going to see CA next month here in Kansas City.....CERTAINLY NOT because I like him or I want to follow his methods, but because a friend of mine asked me to (she doesn't have many friends) and she's "trying to find her way" with her horses I guess....so to support her I'm going to his tour stop (cringes). I'll just have to endure it....but I can for my friend.


Nothing wrong with taking a look see at a different method, not at all! :wink:

Mega kudos to you for supporting your friend, even if it means shelling out the money to see training methods that you don't agree with!


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## Spirithorse

Thanks  She was wanting to come see me at the Parelli Celebration, but the timing was wrong for her and she ended up not being able to make it. I told her there was always next year lol. I do want to support her with her horse adventures, I've been lucky enough to have a lot of people support me in mine and I can't imagine not having a lot of friends to talk things over with.


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## DSMissed

I think they all have their good points and bad points. Everyone is going to train differently. I watch all their training shows on RFDTV, and just take everything I see with a grain of salt.


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## kevinshorses

Spirithorse said:


> Well this might come as a shock (I'm still in shock lol) but I'm actually going to see CA next month here in Kansas City.....CERTAINLY NOT because I like him or I want to follow his methods, but because a friend of mine asked me to (she doesn't have many friends) and she's "trying to find her way" with her horses I guess....so to support her I'm going to his tour stop (cringes). I'll just have to endure it....but I can for my friend.


I hope you go into it with an open mind. If your not careful you may learn something that didn't come from the Parelli corp. I think both men are gifted horseman and can teach people a lot.


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## RadHenry09

Clinton is scheduled to come back to PA this summer , I think I may go check him out since it has been some time ago that I have seen him...I think I saw somewhere if you buy one ticket you get a second one free but not sure on that.
Besides the PA horse expo , it seems that there is very few clinics or chances to see many trainers w/o traveling far distances ,although which is very rare for a smallish town in Central PA a Parelli professional is giving a clinic in Jan not very far from where I live so I may audit this clinic.

I agree that it is much better to have a horsey friend to go with, I drag my husband a long sometimes kicking and screaming ...ha ha


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## Spirithorse

I've watched his shows, looked over his website, read some of his book...yeah I don't care to learn anything from a man who will kick the snot out of a horse with spurs just because he won't bend, or who won't hesitate to put a twisted wire snaffle in a horse's mouth. That's not the way I roll  lol! So to Clinton, I will admit I won't be going with an open mind, my mind is already made up about him. If this was Denis Reis, well I have a lot of respect for the man and would enjoy myself I'm sure.


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## Tennessee

Spirithorse said:


> I've watched his shows, looked over his website, read some of his book...*yeah I don't care to learn anything from a man who will kick the snot out of a horse with spurs just because he won't bend, or who won't hesitate to put a twisted wire snaffle in a horse's mouth.* That's not the way I roll  lol! So to Clinton, I will admit I won't be going with an open mind, my mind is already made up about him. If this was Denis Reis, well I have a lot of respect for the man and would enjoy myself I'm sure.



Funny. We have all of his DVDs, and I don't remember any of that. Not only that, but I watch the show.

Maybe you shouldn't be so biased about it and you might actually learn something other than how to befriend your horse, which Parelli seems to be stuck on.


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## Juniper

You know you can get the DVD's used on the internet. I did for a fraction of the price and they work fine.


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## 1dog3cats17rodents

Spirithorse said:


> I've watched his shows, looked over his website, read some of his book...yeah I don't care to learn anything from a man who will kick the snot out of a horse with spurs just because he won't bend, or who won't hesitate to put a twisted wire snaffle in a horse's mouth. That's not the way I roll  lol! So to Clinton, I will admit I won't be going with an open mind, my mind is already made up about him. If this was Denis Reis, well I have a lot of respect for the man and would enjoy myself I'm sure.


I find it sad you don't keep an open mind. Where would the world be if everyone closed their mind to others beliefs and methods?


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## Spirithorse

Funny, I've seen him with my own eyes, on his own show on RFD-TV spur the crap out of a horse. And his catelog that they send you if you call the office, he sells twisted wire snaffles...I worked at a tack shop and for some reason we had his catelog and on the page where his bits and headstalls were advertised was that nasty twisted wire bit.

It's also funny that you seem to think Parelli is stuck on befriending your horse. If you knew anything about the program you would know that we learn to use Love, Language and LEADERSHIP in EQUAL doses. Pat gave me a lesson with my own horse at the Celebration I was a part of and you should have seen how firm he was with my guy. I was being firm, but not firm enough to cause a drastic change. Just accept the fact that I don't like Clinton


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## Spirithorse

1dog3cats17rodents said:


> I find it sad you don't keep an open mind. Where would the world be if everyone closed their mind to others beliefs and methods?


Like I've said before, if Denis Reis, for example, came to town I would want to go see him because I like what he does and how he goes about things. Would I stop doing Parelli? No, because I know it works and it works for me and I'm happy with where my horsemanship is going, so I'm not going to change anything. However I AM closed off to Clinton because I've never seen anything from him that I like, plus I find him to be a cocky son of a....


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## Tennessee

Spirithorse said:


> Funny, I've seen him with my own eyes, on his own show on RFD-TV spur the crap out of a horse. And his catelog that they send you if you call the office, he sells twisted wire snaffles...I worked at a tack shop and for some reason we had his catelog and on the page where his bits and headstalls were advertised was that nasty twisted wire bit.
> 
> It's also funny that you seem to think Parelli is stuck on befriending your horse. If you knew anything about the program you would know that we learn to use Love, Language and LEADERSHIP in EQUAL doses. Pat gave me a lesson with my own horse at the Celebration I was a part of and you should have seen how firm he was with my guy. I was being firm, but not firm enough to cause a drastic change. Just accept the fact that I don't like Clinton



So because he offers it for sale you think that he shoves it in every horse that crosses his path? That is very ignorant of you. And everyone has their own interpretation of "spurring the crap out of a horse." He may have been using a gentle spur, hence the reason he used more force. It seems to me that you are very biased, closed minded, and naive about his training methods.

I will admit, I have learned some great things from Parelli, but it is quite obvious to me that he seems to be out for the money. Sure, he does have some decent methods, but when it comes down to it the most popular thing Parelli has out there is games to play with his horses. When it comes to training, I would prefer my horses not think that we are training just to have a jolly ole time and for me to show my undivided love for him. I would rather give my horse a little tough love and let him know that I mean business, and to inform my horse that I am the boss. 

But hey. If you wanna prance around playing games with your horse and let a four legged creature be your equal partner, then where am I to stop you?


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## kevinshorses

Spirithorse said:


> Like I've said before, if Denis Reis, for example, came to town I would want to go see him because I like what he does and how he goes about things. Would I stop doing Parelli? No, because I know it works and it works for me and I'm happy with where my horsemanship is going, so I'm not going to change anything. However I AM closed off to Clinton because I've never seen anything from him that I like, plus I find him to be a cocky son of a....


You shouldn't waste your money on Dennis Reis then because he spent 15 minutes talking about the proper way to spur the crap out of your horse. I like Reis but if you think CA is too physical you won't like Dennis either. As far as personality goes denis is about as cocky and self assured as anyone I have ever met.


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## Spirithorse

Tennessee said:


> So because he offers it for sale you think that he shoves it in every horse that crosses his path? That is very ignorant of you. And everyone has their own interpretation of "spurring the crap out of a horse." He may have been using a gentle spur, hence the reason he used more force. It seems to me that you are very biased, closed minded, and naive about his training methods.
> 
> *Umm, no, I never said he puts it in every horse's mouth. He puts it in horse's mouths who are "hard mouthed" instead of takng the time to cause a soft mouth, he gets it through force. When I say spuring the crap out of him, I mean exactly that....he was lifting his leg and really kicking the horse in his side with the spur just because he wouldn't bend. I've been around horses for quite awhile, so I'm not naive in knowing what spuring the crap out of a horse looks like:wink:*
> 
> I will admit, I have learned some great things from Parelli, but it is quite obvious to me that he seems to be out for the money.
> 
> *No he isn't. Yes he is a marketing genius, but he's not out for the money, he genuinally cares about his students, I know first hand.*
> 
> Sure, he does have some decent methods, but when it comes down to it the most popular thing Parelli has out there is games to play with his horses.
> 
> *Those games establish dominance and trust. If they didn't, I'd be seriously hurt right now due to my warmblood. He was very aggressive when I got him and I've done nothing but Parelli with him and it's cured all his aggressiveness.*
> 
> When it comes to training, I would prefer my horses not think that we are training just to have a jolly ole time and for me to show my undivided love for him. I would rather give my horse a little tough love and let him know that I mean business, and to inform my horse that I am the boss.
> 
> *I'd rather have my horse have fun when we are together and to not think of training as training. Yes sometimes we have to get firm with a horse, that much is a given, but they need us to have a sense of play, not just be a goal oriented dictator.*
> 
> But hey. If you wanna prance around playing games with your horse and let a four legged creature be your equal partner, then where am I to stop you?
> 
> *Wow, this really shows your true colors. Way to show how critical you are. I for one am PROUD to say I do Parelli and no one, not even you, will change my feelings about it. So you can go on being critical and mean hearted about it, go for it, but really input from you about how I train is not encouraged:wink:*


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## Spirithorse

kevinshorses said:


> You shouldn't waste your money on Dennis Reis then because he spent 15 minutes talking about the proper way to spur the crap out of your horse. I like Reis but if you think CA is too physical you won't like Dennis either. As far as personality goes denis is about as cocky and self assured as anyone I have ever met.


Well I have yet to see any of that, so until I do my opinion of him remains the same


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## gypsygirl

watching a trainer work with one horse once doesnt really tell you all that much about their methods IMO bc every horse is different we treat every horse differently, so you must watch a trainer with at least a few horses & try out their methods on your own. then you will truly understand if their methods work for you & your horse.


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## 5cuetrain

I've learned something from everyone I've had the pleasure to meet. What do do and what not to do.

all of the trainers mentioned are very good at what they do. They all have a similar foundation but use different methods and techniques.

In my opinion Clinton's methods will work on the largest percentage of the horses that one can run accross. An added plus is that his methods are a great foundation for reining--hence most all of the other disciplines out there.

As with everything in horse training its the system that generates the results. Apply all of them consistantly--that means every day--and all will yield good results. Don't blame the system if you modify it--learn it in its entirety before you start tinkering with it.


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## HalfPass

gypsygirl,
I have seen Monty and CA at clinics. Clinton a few times and Monty once. Also have seen some others on TV.
Actually when I saw Monty he had a horse that was a bad loader. I also saw CA do a loading clinic. I have to say I certainly thought that CA's methods were much better.
My family has used CA's methods with all the horses going to sales. The methods worked well. I have used them on my gelding, and also on my mare.
I have a few of his DVD's and they are chalk full of great information.

As some have stated...I also feel it is a good thing to have an open mind when watching these folks. You just never know what might work. Having an open mind about things will allow you to "hear" something that would ultimately be missed when going in with a Bias or "closed mind"
There are times when I am in a situation where I need to be present for something and do not necessarily like the way a particular person does things. Not just in the harse world but in all aspects of life. If I am able to go into the situation with the open mind, I personally find I gain so much more from whatever the experience might be.
Also I have to agree with the purchase of things such as "handy stick" or other tools. We can always find something to do the same job without it having a "brand name" or whatever attached to it.
All these trainers have something to bring to the table, so take what you need and leave the rest if that is what will work for you.
Halfpass


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## Honeysuga

My professional(well, professional in training anyway) opinion-
I like how he works. I am into his work and that of Denis Reis and other such trainers much more than the Parelli types, but that is my personal taste coming out. I would kill to be able to get ahold of a few of his DvD's or attend a clinic or two, but being a poor college student I jst can't stretch the budget any further.

My female opinion-
I think he is *YUMMY*. But I have a fetish for accents soo ya. Don't dig the hats though, I'd much rather see him in a baseball cape any day. And if you want to see a marketing genius, I do not know how much more genius it is that to be an adorable suntanned Aussie with a cute accent and a tight *** to sell some DVD's! G'Day Mate! HEHEHEH And I love how he says move too "meywve", cracks me up.


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## gypsygirl

Honeysuga said:


> My female opinion-
> I think he is *YUMMY*. But I have a fetish for accents soo ya. Don't dig the hats though, I'd much rather see him in a baseball cape any day. And if you want to see a marketing genius, I do not know how much more genius it is that to be an adorable suntanned Aussie with a cute accent and a tight *** to sell some DVD's! G'Day Mate! HEHEHEH And I love how he says move too "meywve", cracks me up.


haha that is hilarious !


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## southerncowgirl93

Honeysuga said:


> My female opinion-
> I think he is *YUMMY*. But I have a fetish for accents soo ya. Don't dig the hats though, I'd much rather see him in a baseball cap any day. And if you want to see a marketing genius, I do not know how much more genius it is than to be an adorable suntanned Aussie with a cute accent and a tight *** to sell some DVD's! G'Day Mate! HEHEHEH And I love how he says move too "meywve", cracks me up.



Well said, well said. :lol: However, I do like the cowboy hat. 

I also like his training techniques.


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## LoveTheSaddlebreds

I love his methods. He's really straight forward and smart about his training. Plus I think he's cute  lol


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## HollyLolly

I like his methods, and I prefere him to parelli, simply because he explains things in a more simple, straight forward manner. He never over-complicates things


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## SavvyHearts

horses in general are complicated. There is no way to make a simple step-by-step training method as all horse's are different. One horse will react different than another, which is why I personally like Parelli over CA, but that's just my opinion


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## ridergirl23

I dont really dislike, or dont listen to any trainers, i have met plenty of cocky cowboys that think they know everything(nost of them are cocky around here,amybe theres something is the cowboy water they drink??) but i try not to block out learning from someone because of their attitude, i try and laugh it off. What i do is learn from everybody and pick out what i think would word, and spit out all i think is bullpoopy. Haha i also have little phases on trainers, right now, i am obsessed with the trainers of cavalia, lol. so, I think clinton anderson is cute  and knows some good things. but i think the rest of them do to... baha but most of them arent cute. For all the people that think some of them are cocky: we all must remember that there are a lot of horse people that dont have good social talents at all, and those ones end up being famous because they spent their whole lives around horses, and they have lack of social skills because of that. lol but there are some out there with great people skills


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## HollyLolly

I didn't mean that horse behaviour isn't complicated, but I mean, some things that i find with Parelli is that he will make it even more complicated than necessary (in my opinion) but I don't find CA does that


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## Honeysuga

And of course we must remember that that is HollyLolly's opinion, nothing to be argued or taken offensively.


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## PaintsPwn

Eh, Clinton used my horse in a demo. I was not impressed by him or the way he handled the other horses.

Honestly, I've quit the whole BNT fad. I met Cleve Wells at the same expo CA used my horse at, and I would have sworn he was the kindest most awesome guy who was extremely down to earth and friendly - and I'm sure most of you have heard the whole fiasco with that training colt. It disgusts me. They're all like politicians, say one thing and do another.

To put it lightly, professional trainers could fall off the face of the earth and I wouldn't mind at all. If you can't tell, I've been burned out XD


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## Juniper

I did not hear about the fiasco. Did something go wrong when Cleve Wells was training a colt? I have actually never heard of Cleve Wells either. I am so curious to hear about someone who actually had a horse used in a demo. How did you get your horse to be the one, what was the issue, and what did you not like about the way CA handled your horse?


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## PaintsPwn

Well they advertised on the site that they needed a Demo horse for a spooky horse. I applied and I was desperate, my horse was spooky as all heck, so I drove 14 hours for CA to sell his tie ring and then work with my horse for 15 minutes 8\ He was a complete and total butt to everyone. The hostess of the event was so fed up with him and getting complaints on him, she told him to go take a vacation. He ended up severely rope burning a horse (who was very laid back, CA intentionally worked him up to create a show) and washed the same horse in 32 degree weather with cold water, without forewarning the owners, who were running all over kingdom come trying to find coolers and blankets.

Cleve Wells had a colt in training, the owner's dad went to go check in on him. The colt had a broken jaw, and really nasty infected spur wounds. Cleve Wells is a BNT in the AQHA who has won ALOT of World Championship titles. They indefinitely banned him for at least a year I believe it was.


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## Honeysuga

^^Wow, that is terrible to hear about. What is a BNT? Never heard the term before...


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## Juniper

Thanks for the answer. I wish I could say that is hard to believe but it is not. I think the famous people tend to get that way at all costs. I find CA's methods very helpful to me. However, I can imagine that he is so successful because he uses anyone, including the horses as a means to becoming famous, with little regard for individual well being. Horrible about the Cleve Wells guy. Success at all cost again, sigh.


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## PaintsPwn

BNT is Big Name Trainer.... Or Big N Tasty if you work at McDonalds LOL


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## morgangoolsby

i like clinton anderson..his methods are easy to follow and he puts humer into his clinics...he does work the horses pretty hard during a clinic. if anyone has noticed by the time hes done the horses are pretty hot...which is not nessesarily a bad thing..the horse got a good lesson and workout. but some people dont like him due to that. following any top trainers method is going to be pricey. which is why i follow my own... you cant buy horsemanship


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## HollyLolly

One thing that does bug me about CA is that he is a question talker! Like even when he is on his own (in the rescue horse give away series) he'll go something like: "she's a horse that will use the reactive side of her...? Brain!" has anyone else noticed that? Once I noticed it, it started to bug me a bit lol, it's like, why are you asking a question just to answer it yourself, seconds later!? lol :L


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## Juniper

Ya, people have said he sounds like a school teacher when he does that question thing. Dennis Reis does it too sometimes and it is annoying. Guess we would be annoying too if we were in the spotlight all the time


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## gypsygirl

haha i dont mind that at all ! it probably comes from teaching all the time i would guess


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## HollyLolly

hehe it doesn't bother me too much, it's just as soon as my brain pointed it out to me (see, my brain does this thing, it'll shut things out for ages, then suddenly notice it haha!) and since then, I can't ignor it and it annoys me after a while!
"and that makes him move away from thee? pressure, that's roight!"


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## GoldSahara

I was a pretty loyal follower of PNH, but now I can hardly stand to watch him. He has some good practices, but his teaching methods can simply drive me batty! I have for the last few months been watching CA on RFDTV and have really enjoyed it. I also saw him give a demonstration at the Reining horse championships. Definetly a much better teacher and his methods get quick results because his doesn't mess around. You get results based on how hard you are willing to work, and CA works hard!


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## IllComeALopin

I like CA. His products are expensive, but they are also tough and well made... not cheap in the least bit, in price or quality.
I like that he is pretty honest, he doesn't care if he makes someone cry, he isnt afraid to smack a horse on the nose/face, he doesn't care what the owner says or thinks. 
He tells a lot of stuff like it is, and he speaks pretty simple which helps becuase most of his clientele are begginer, backyard types.

Personally I like Chris Cox the best....


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## IllComeALopin

I would like to add however that no one is perfect... and I went with two freinds, to two different clinics... and they both had him use his horse as a demo horse...

Things I found out:
1) he gets up real early to ride the tar out of his personal horses... everday... so they are quite and good for when he shows off.
2) His horse Mindy does not clip, and she is afraid of her blankets.
3) He doesnt like to talk to the owners much... about anything.


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## GoldSahara

I also heard that he doesn't like to talk to strangers. That he tends to be a bit of a womanizer. Luckily, that isn't something that effects his teaching or skills. That's interesting about Mindy. I used similar methods to his to get my horse over a blanket and clipping issue


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## MuleWrangler

I'm not that familiar with CA or PP, but I attended Horse Day a few years back in Arkansas and one of the clinicians there was a fellow named Curt Pate (a little info here: feature). I had brought a problem mule for someone to hopefully work with, and was pleasantly surprised to find several of the clinicians were able to! Curt was one of them.

He was very calm and steady, VERY good with my mule and the other horses he interacted with, and seemed to really know what he was about. He had a no-nonsense, get-things-done approach that really resonated with me. He DIDN'T have products to sell, hawk a book or DVDs, or seem to be out for anything other than getting people to understand more about working with their horses. 

He started a colt under saddle at the clinic and did a fine job. I was very impressed by how he worked to make the situation understandable and acceptable to the horse, yet retained his control and mastery over it. 

I wish I lived closer to him, so I could learn more from him! But Kentucky is a lo-o-o-ong way from Montana...


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## IllComeALopin

GoldSahara said:


> That's interesting about Mindy. I used similar methods to his to get my horse over a blanket and clipping issue


 
I think its more like he tours all over, doing demos and clinics... when your training horses for a living (let alone doing all the demos and clinics) you have to put your horses on the backburner a lot.... I'm sure with all the things Mindy can do and does fussing about the clipping and blanketing is the least of his concerns...

PLUS thats a heck of a living for a horse, being shipped all around, doing the demos and such... it could be that she is just a little sour or cranky about traveling.


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## Northern

*Some reservations about CA...*

I studied PP for several years, then got into the No Worries Club for a year. From what I saw on the dvd's: 1) CA is definitely more dominating/harsher physically on the horse, is more concerned with "getting the job done" than the_ horse's_ enjoying that job. 2) That said, the basic method is same as PP: knotted halters (CA's more severe), sticks & strings, approach & retreat, prevent horse from being afraid of you, etc. 3) Priceyness is same as PP (and I do not find a good reason for it).

I am even more turned off by experiences posted here of his treating horses badly, & do appreciate that people shared!

I wrote to him about how he had his assistant kick a horse 35+ times in the ribs (asst. was standing on the ground & kicked him with pointed toe boot with full force), this was on dvd, and also how he recommended that people leave their horses on trailers for 3-5 days straight. Two vets told me that the rib-kicking & extended trailer time is dangerous. CA's people told me that I don't fit into their method, so, adios! (Does that mean that they don't want me to buy any more of their merchandise?:lol 

I also think that his constant lateral flexing of the horse, plus backing, must be very tedious for the horse. He does those things many more times than others do, & others' horses are fine without so much of it.

Also, a horse that he rides a lot is so bent in the neck rather than the poll, so very behind the verticle, constantly, that it pains me to watch. He said in a dvd that this horse carries his head naturally that way. He hardly lets up on the horse, so it's hard to tell, but he let up a couple times, & the horse lifted his head, so I'm not saying CA is lying, but I'm not gulping down his explanation like kool-aid.

BNT's are difficult: they can be so helpful, like with SpiritHorse, yet ruinous at other times! Proceed with Caution!


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## Juniper

What DVD did the assistant kick the horse in and which one did he recommend leaving the horse in the trailer? Do you remember the names of them?


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## Northern

It was this past year's No Worries Club, I'll find & post before I go to bed, 'k?


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## Spirithorse

It doesn't surprise me Clinton had an assistant to that to a horse. Sickens me.


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## Juniper

I would be very interested to see it, thanks.


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## MIEventer

I like Clinton Anderson.

I acutally use his style with working with hard to load horses. I was handed a TB that wouldn't load no matter what, regardless of how you attempted to get him in. He got into the habit of rearing and bolting because he would get away with it and win.

When his handlers would get him into the trailer, he would rear and spazz out, causing quite a scene, making the situation intense and heated.

So I started to use Clinton Anderson's methods and stayed dilligent to them, on a day to day basis, step by step. 

Now, the horse is a beautiful loader. He walks right in, regardless of what trailer you point him at, and he stays quiet and calm while inside.

His owners are tickled pink to have their quiet, calm horse back. 

I like Clinton and his approach on Natural Horsemanship.


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## Northern

*Ok, here are the dvd's...*

1) Rib-kicking, 10/09 dvd, Regaining Lost Confidence II, skip bay Arab, for Paint.
2) Leaving horses in trailer for 3-5 days, 1/10 dvd, Cold Weather Exercises. To quote him exactly, CA said that when he takes a 5-day road trip, he'll "probably take them out after 3 days", and qualified it by saying _his_ horses are "used to it". The vets said that all horses need to move their limbs for circulation, one said 12 hrs max, the other said 24 hrs max. It's on 1:++, after the advert on his clinics at his new ranch, after initial demo sessions.


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## Juniper

Eww, three days in a trailer. That is hard to believe. Wish I could see one of those DVD's myself because I have had good luck using his methods. Too bad those aren't in the library maybe I can find one used.


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## RadHenry09

Why would he have someone kick their horse in the ribs 35 times to regain lost confidence? I am curious to know? thanks


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## Northern

The gal who owns him didn't have the expertise to deal with preparing for riding a greenie, but she did gain confidence in RLC Part I, just doing groundwork. So the assistant did the "prepping" on the ground, then got on & worked him.


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## Cinnys Whinny

I'm on the fence about him. I will be honest, I do not have any experience with him, haven't watched him, haven't gone to a clinic BUT my BO is ALL Clinton Anderson this and Clinton Anderson that. And well, I'm not much on the way SHE works with horses and trys to gain respect and um...neither does my horse. In fact, she can't get near him because he will charge at her, rear on top of her, etc etc. 

It all started one day when we were going to trailer him somewhere and she went to lead him in. He walked a little too close and she suddenly jumped and SCREAMED at the top of her lungs like a banshee and then slapped the heck out of his face open handed. Is this really a Clinton Anderson method to get respect? Anyway, for her it's been all downhill since as I can do pretty much anything with him and too him but she can't get within 6 feet of the horse without him rolling his eyes and going nuts.

So, not to steal the thread or anything, but is what she did something that Clinton Anderson would do and teaches, or um...is my BO just psycho?

BTW, yes I am moving him due to differences in opinion as soon as I get my clear coggins.


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## Northern

*Lol - your horse is teaching her if only she'd listen!*

I've never seen/heard CA suggest slapping the heck out of a horse's face & screaming at the top of one's lungs at it. Anyone else? 

:rofl: "Oy suggest, when a horse gets into youah spaice, to, what is it, class?....that's roit, SLAP IT'S FAICE ALL OVAH! Then to really GET THE JOB DONE, it's what?...Roit, SCREAM BLOODY MURDAH AT IT! NO WORRIES!"


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## Cinnys Whinny

Ok, so it's just my BO... I find that he moves off just fun with a harsh "quit" and an elbow in the shoulder...it always gets him to move to the right and look at me like "sowy mom." ha ha.


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## Juniper

I had a person show me how CA gets horses to back up. This was before I had watched any of his DVDs. She was whacking this poor confused horse on the front of her face. I watched the DVDs and there is NO whacking the horse on the face. Where do people get that from? I also went to part of his clinic here and there was NO whacking on the face. Unless the horse was about to trample you to death or something. You tap, or whack, the horse on the chest or the clip under their chin. With Ca you always ask the horse first with a shake of the lead rope or body language. I have never seen him raise his voice in any video either. That is why I would really like to see his assistant kick the horse 32 times and make up my own mind. I suspect he is not always the nicest guy but so far, from what I have seen, his methods help the horse.


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## Northern

*Juniper, I hope you can get the dvd's.*

If you can't, let me know & I'll mail them to you.  I'm in northern CA. You will, God willing, see these dvd's!

Re: why students get it wrong: Looks to me like CA method has spawned some screaming face-slappers, just like PP has spawned some rope-flapping chin-thunkers & sitters-under-horses-legs! Sad & scary!


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## Juniper

Northern, I am afraid you are correct. When CA came here some people came away from the clinic hearing only the part about being firm and using the stick. They did not hear all the parts about taking small steps and rewarding the smallest try. I will try again on e-bay to get them used and if not I could buy or borrow them from you.


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## franknbeans

I like CA, but frankly take some stuff from several NH peeps. It just works for me that way, and i don't think anyone has all the answers. Just watched that DVD 2 days ago. Frankly, first, altho I did not count, I an very sure it was more like 10 times. And it was in response to the horse trying to kick at the assistant, so needs to be put in context. She was trying to get the horse comfortable with flapping stirrups. As CA said-what she did was nothing in comparison to what horses do to each other to teach. Frankly, one of the things I like about CA is that if a horse does something dangerous-like the above-he, like me, basically uses the 3 second rule. Make them think they will die (figure of speech people.....get a grip) for 3 seconds. Then-move on. Some of the NH peeps are just too mamby pamby for my taste, but that is me. If my horse kicks at me you can believe he will be WELL AWARE that I do not put up with that crap! And I won't just stand there and wiggle a string about it, for sure! Like everything in life-moderation and a reaching a happy medium is great. Nothing in extremes. JMHO


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## Juniper

Interesting, the horse was kicking at the person. Now I really want to see it.


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## franknbeans

Have lent it to a friend-when I get it back I will have to rewatch and count!


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## Juniper

It looks like people sell the no worries club DVds on HGS, so I registered there. Can't post for 24 hours thought.


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## Northern

Juniper, the horse didn't kick until she'd rib-kicked him a bunch! It was just a little buck-kick, (two legs off the ground & moved his bum into her) because it was understandably sick of it! You can't tell the exact # because camera panned away from it a few times to CA talking, but sometimes you could see assistant's head in front of CA sitting on fence, & you knew she kicked him again by her head jerking. I did count, & so I think 35+ is fair to say. _*Juniper, please see it for yourself!* I'm not going to reply to people's statements about it anymore; don't want the job._


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## Juniper

I did pm someone on here that had some dvd's for sale, not sure if they are the right ones. I really do want to see it. Surely does not sound good.


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## franknbeans

Way overblown IMO. But then, I believe in not letting a horse behave dangerously. I found nothing that I personally disagree with, however, we are all entitled to our opinions. There are plenty of NH peeps who think the clip hitting them in the chin when you are teaching backup is too rough.  And-BTW, Northern-noone asked you to take the job. Thanks. Have a great day.


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## 2horses

I went to his clinic in Kissimmee this weekend. I was wondering if anyone else was there and what you thought of it.


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## gypsygirl

^^ what did you think of it ??


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## Northern

I watched it again, counted 32 kicks to the ribs that were visible on-camera. I see that she _might_ not've kicked him in the two panned-to-CA parts, so I correct my initial 35+ to 32 visible kicks. While I was there, I slo-mo'ed the horse's "kick", & the horse didn't even try to kick her; it hopped its bum into her, landing full on the inside hind leg, lifting its outside hind leg up & folded.


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## Juniper

I hope the ones I am trying to buy are the correct videos. I am really wanting to see them myself. Horses are such a lifelong learning experience is all I know for sure!


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## 2horses

Gypsygirl, sorry I didn't answer your question yesterday. I'm usually a big fan of Clinton, and I definitely think his method makes sense and works. On Saturday his clinic was even better than I expected because he's so funny, but on Sunday, I got a different vibe from him, and I was wondering if anyone else who was there noticed it too. I wasn't there for the full day; so I didn't see everything that took place that day. 

I don't know if I just prefer his groundwork style to his riding style, but he seemed rougher than I expected when he was riding. I had thought about applying my horse to be a demo horse, and I was thinking that I probably wouldn't have liked for her to be ridden that way. He was jerking on the reins and slapping the horse on the top of the head with the mecate. I wondered what the horse's owner thought of it.


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## Northern

Thanks for sharing that; for those out there who want to get an accurate picture of CA, all CA-related experiences help!


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## Juniper

Okay, I got to watch the "kicking" dvd. I still have not gotten to the leaving them on the trailer one. I think leaving the horse on the trailer too long would bother me more than what they were doing with the green horse. 
I know when my horse first bucked with me the trainer said it was because I did not ask him to "go" firmly enough. I would kind of ask for the trot and if he did not I would ask again, and again. The trainer said then when we got to loping Peppy thought well I may as well buck if I don't want to go. I learned to ask nicely and then get really firm. Funny thing is, now I never have to ask other than softly. I think the assistant was making the horse move when asked and that probably kept her more safe when she did get in the saddle. That was a pretty disrespectful horse. The horse did not seem traumatized or fearful from the experience. Just my take on it. Thanks for starting the discussion Northern Mama.


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## gypsygirl

^^thats a good point, i would never ever kick my horse scout, but i do know some horses who could learn a lot from that sort of lesson. it really depends on the horse.


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## farley

i love clinton, i have used alot of his methods with my own mustangs i watch him weekly on RFDTV and have seen nothing cruel or questionable. therefore i am also interested in those DVDs, i love my horses and would never do anything to hurt them or do anything i find questionable if it came from a very well known trainer or not. Clinton has helped to make my ten yr gelding more calm and to prepare for a ride that could have spookies or obsticals, however every horse is diferent because what has worked with him has not always worked with my mustang mare unless i where to use unecessary force which i dont i jus mix what i know from other trianers with Clintons and try from a different perspective i train with love patients and respect not force or fear and defenitaly not by tiring a horse into ecceptance!!!

if you when you find that video of the horse in the trailer for an unapropriate amount of time i am very interested


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## Northern

*Glad you got to see it, Juniper*

I thought the horse was _tolerant_ of the kicking; a lot of horses'd've objected much more strongly than one "bum-hop"! Such tight turns, at a trot, & so many of them! Yet, endless repetition of stuff (lateral flexions & backing esp) is why I'm not CA's biggest fan. The horses _seem_ to be emotionally ok after such treatment as rib-kicking, but it's probably "I'd better do it, or I'll get smacked!" rather than, "I'm enjoying this partnership!" I think that the way he had the woman ride the Arab (1st segment on same dvd) was just what that horse needed, & how the woman needed to ride him. His method has nothing about different "horsenalities", so maybe he sees what one horse needs better than he does another.


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## Deerly

GoldSahara said:


> I also heard that he doesn't like to talk to strangers. That he tends to be a bit of a womanizer. Luckily, that isn't something that effects his teaching or skills. That's interesting about Mindy. I used similar methods to his to get my horse over a blanket and clipping issue


My mom has met him at a clinic and had a long, wonderful conversation with him. She left with such a glowing impression of how personable, grounded and kind he was.

All these rumors seem to come from "I heard this" and not "I experienced that". :?


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## Juniper

How lucky is your mom!


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## Deerly

Juniper said:


> How lucky is your mom!


So so so so so lucky! She's a huge huge fan and sent me the full Fundamentals dvd set, lucky me too!


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## EternalSun

I agree, Deerly. Too much stuff gets started when people start spreading gossip . . . "oh, well, I heard he's a womanizer and he beats horses and he's unfriendly." 

That's a load of bs. I met Clinton when he came to the Equine Affaire 2 years ago. He signed autographs at his booth after putting on a 2 1/2 clinic with an extremely difficult horse (whom he worked wonders with). I waited in a HUGE line for what felt like forever, but I wasn't dissapointed in the least. He was very genuine and friendly with me, actually listened to me babble about my horse while there was still a ton of people in line, gave me a hug, talked to my Dad, and took a picture with me. He must have been tired after giving clinics all day but I didn't feel rushed or anything, he was just a nice, funny guy. I was 18 at the time, and he made my year! And yes, he's extremely easy on the eyes and I only wish I had the guts to grab his butt when he went in for a hug - I wont pass up on that oppurtunity again!

Now, Monty Roberts is a different story. I met him when I was very young, like 13, again at the Equine Affaire. All the seats in his clinic were filled so my Mom and I sat in the dirt for 2 hours to watch him. Afterwards, at the fan meet and greet, he was very rude to me, jdidn't even say hello, just signed my book, told me to buy another book, and I was then "escorted" out of line so the next person could meet him. I was crushed, he was like my hero when I was younger, and yes I still like some of his methods, but I was so turned off by his arrogance I will never be a fan. 

I think CA is the best of the "natural horsemanship" trainers. He seems to be the most effective and at the same time the easiest system for both horse and rider to understand, which is a win-win in my book.


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## MyBoyPuck

HollyLolly said:


> One thing that does bug me about CA is that he is a question talker! Like even when he is on his own (in the rescue horse give away series) he'll go something like: "she's a horse that will use the reactive side of her...? Brain!" has anyone else noticed that? Once I noticed it, it started to bug me a bit lol, it's like, why are you asking a question just to answer it yourself, seconds later!? lol :L


Yes!! That bugged me too. I think he's working off the logic that the average human needs to hear the same concept 7 times minimum in order to absorb the information. Doesn't help if you're in the fast learner club though. 

I do like most of his logic. Both approach and retreat and release of pressure are very effective tools. If anything, he does himself a disservice by showing how basic most problem solving is since it's all based on the same priniciples. After you understand the foundation, anything is solveable without paying for DVD's or training gadgets. He is extremely entertaining in person. I love how he demonstrates the problem and then says, "this is how most people would handle this...'It's okay precious' (indicating that most of us let our horses get away with murder..." and then go on and fix the problem.


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## Cobalt

I read through these posts, which took awhile, but I can see I am in a pretty big minority of folks here who are not overly impressed with CA. 

I think a person should always learn what they find useful from anyone without developing tunnel vision and without turning a blind eye and a deaf ear to what they can learn from others. I have watched and seen a lot of the big names in Natural Horsemanship and I've watched and seen some of the lesser known people out there who do fantastic work with horses but don't happen to have a tv show or a "club" people can subscribe to. 

I get super annoyed with what I call "the Horse Pimps" on RFD TV. I get so aggravated with the "my way" mentality and the constant endorsing of products (usually their own) that Natural Horsemanship has turned into. 

Personally, I love the mentalities of the Brent Graefs and Mark Rashids of the horse world. They aren't as well known...don't have tv shows...aren't out there trying to be famous or make a fortune, but have a genuine interest in helping people and horses connect. They don't approach every problem with the same tool (like CA) and leave room for people and horses to make their own discoveries and figure things out in a unique and meaningful way. 

I'm not crazy about CA. I have seen him stand next to a woman and tell her to whack her horse in the face with that silly stick he forces everyone to use. The woman was uncomfortable doing it, and he was all but yelling at her. The horse was scared and didn't understand. It wasn't a devastating thing and I'm sure they all moved on from it, but that moment turned me off from him forever. That methodology may appeal to some, but not me. And at the end of the day, I don't want someone to browbeat me or my horse. I don't want a person calling my horse an "ignorant pig" after I've paid him a thousand plus for the "honor." I don't want someone to talk to me like a kindergartner asking a question with every sentence and then supplying the answer like I'm a dummy and haven't heard him say the very same thing a hundred times before. I like to set my horses up to succeed and learn what TO do rather than stress them through their failures until they learn what NOT to do. And I'm sorry, but the constant "flexing" of the neck at a standstill is just silly. To me, that serves no useful purpose. It's just busy work. Flexing should be taught and practiced in conjunction with movement. 

Now does that mean I can't learn anything from CA? No! Of course he has some useful things. I have used his tie ring and some of his methods on a horse that I had trouble with laying back on ropes. But he's not and never will be my "go to guy" for a person I care to emulate in the horse world. 

I think the best thing we can do is be open to learn from anyone and watch and absorb from many different people and sources. 

Btw, in case you haven't heard of them, the online netflix of the horse world is called GiddyUpFlix. I use it and its a great way to save tons of money on the dvd's and things we all like to watch. It works just like netflix and they have tons of things to choose from. Check it out!


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## barrelracer892

I like some of Clinton Anderson's stuff, but I don't like following on solely one single trainer's methods. I like to piece together several trainers methods. Mostly because every horse is different and needs to be trained different than others, and if you follow only one trainer's methods you might run into something that doesn't work with your horse and have to find a better way to do it. Plus, what those big trainers are after is money. It's their job. They overprice their books, videos, equipment, etc. I like to ride with friends and get their opinions on what to do, and I've also had a few lessons with different trainers around the area so they can watch what my horse and I are doing and aren't doing and help us out with our problems.


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## Juniper

I guess if you have a slightly warped sense of humor, I think I fall into that category, then you are more likely to see the CA appeal. Calling a horse an ignorant pig is to kind of lighten up the situation maybe. People take themselves so seriously around horses, or like me get tense and forget to breath. Laughing at a joke takes the tension out of the air.


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## Cobalt

I can appreciate humor as much as the next person, and definitely don't take it too seriously, but I believe that when you have paid someone an ungodly sum of money, they ought to try very hard to be positive around your horse rather than negative. That's just me!


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## barrelracer892

Cobalt said:


> I can appreciate humor as much as the next person, and definitely don't take it too seriously, but I believe that when you have paid someone an ungodly sum of money, they ought to try very hard to be positive around your horse rather than negative. That's just me!


 
AGREED!!!! I once went to a trainer that chewed me out for putting a medium ported curb bit with a 5 or 6 inch shank (can't remember exactly what it is). He said if I felt the need to put that on my horse then it was time to sell him and move on. I put it on him not because of the brakes, but because he likes the roller and he HATES broken bits. Snaffles, tom thumbs, etc. I just thought why couldn't he have just told me it would be a good idea to switch bits instead of chew me out for the one I was using? I stopped taking lessons from after that. He wasn't very friendly.


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## Juniper

I know what you mean, just because you are famous and charge a lot of money does not give you license to be rude.


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## Jolly Badger

Juniper said:


> I know what you mean, just because you are famous and charge a lot of money does not give you license to be rude.


I'm going to use the dreaded "it depends" phrase here, because I kind of disagree with the above in certain cases. But, so much of this idea of trainers being "really nice" or "really rude" probably depends less on the actual trainer and more on the personalities of the people who meet them.

Simply paying someone a lot of money to help you with your horse, or to improve your own riding, does not mean you are _entitled_ to have sunshine blown up your skirt.:? Of course, some trainers (at all levels) make a good living by working with clients who pay them to make them feel like everything they do is just marvelous. If that's what works for them and their clients, fine. Then again, I've known people who are used to being spoon-fed compliments, who are forced to relocate for a job or whatever and end up in another barn with a trainer who isn't quite so "fluffy." And drama ensues.:lol:

Those are the trainers who don't like to waste their time (or their clients' time) sugar-coating things no matter how much money they are being paid. It _doesn't_ mean they are miserable, mean people _all_ the time. It doesn't mean they are rude or antisocial. But they're not being paid to be your friend, they're being paid to show you how to be a better rider, or how to do a better job of handling your horse. 

Just as there is no "one style of training" that is perfect for all horses, there is no "one style of trainer" that will mesh perfectly with all clients. Some students/clients excel under the tough, demanding, no-nonsense trainer because they feel challenged. . .and yet, a different student with that same trainer may find them "rude" and "mean" because the trainer didn't give them a pat on the head and a cookie every time they did something right.

On the subject of those "meet and greet" with the big-name trainers at various expos. . .I never really understood the appeal of waiting in line for over an hour just to get their autograph or ask them a question about a horse "problem.":-|


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## Juniper

I personally like CA's, tell it like it is method, when watching it, but I suspect I would be fairly intimidated to ever go to one of his clinics!


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## EternalSun

Hahaha, Jolly Badger, I have to comment . . . I just read your personal quote about Parelli and laughed out loud. That's a funny one.


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## PaintHorseMares

Cobalt said:


> I get super annoyed with what I call "the Horse Pimps" on RFD TV. I get so aggravated with the "my way" mentality and the constant endorsing of products (usually their own) that Natural Horsemanship has turned into.




I'm open to just about all ideas, so I'll read/watch the 'horse pimps' when I get it for free, but I would never pay for it. In my opinion, whether it is CA or any of the others, the thing they are best at is salemanship and making $$s. In my experience, you can solve a whole host of 'problems' with simply enough miles under saddle and common sense.


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