# Jumping the "young" horse.



## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

I agree but my horse is 3yrs old and I take her over ground poles, logs about 1ft., and cross rails about 1ft. She's doing great but I have only jumped her like a week becuase of bad weather. The ground poles are really helpful with her picking her feet up. She likes the logs and cross rails too, she just hops right over them!


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

I agree with you Cheval, young horse need to be done growing before having all that strain put on their joints. I've seen that video on youtube before and didn't like it either. It seemed they were forcing him over the jump (having what looked liked a lunge whip in hand) because for the first few times, he hesitated and then went over it.

I say let them be horses for at least a little while, before you start making them work. and then at around age 2 or 3 when you start training them and doing stuff undersaddle, introduce a jump to break the training up. One day you introduce the saddle, the next you introduce a ground pole. 

I think the slower you take it with babies, the better it will come out. Same is true for horses as well. Just my opinion tho


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## 8horses (Jan 28, 2008)

Now, you can't stick one age on every horse. Many of the warmbloods take much longer to mature than most ponies. You have to evaluate the individual horse physicaly, mentally and emotionaly, before you pin an age on them.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Thank you Cheval and 8horses!!
I am completely against jumping horses, (or doing anything with a young horse) or going too far too soon. 
That video made me mad. I don't care how tiny the jump is, the colt was jumping at least 2' over the jump... over and over again. This puts tremendous strain on the joints and associated ligaments. For those arguing "but young horses jump in the wild!" .. yes.. when they absolutely have to. Usually they will go around an obstacle though...

When I eventually get my prospect, I will not jump it before it's 5 years old, and will not jump it over 2' before it's ready. By that, I mean hesitating, not moving forward, etc. 
I agree that not each horse can have the label that they shouldn't be jumped before such-and-such age, however I don't think ANY horse regardless of age should be jumping 3'6" at 4 years old. Too much strain. I don't like seeing a young young horse (4 years and younger) to be jumping anything, regardless of height, especially with a rider on board. (I'm talking jumps, not trot poles.)


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

That horse was almost 2 and I think it was fine to jump him. He didn't have a rider on him so I think it's fine. Now if it wasn't cross rails it wouldn't be okay. But come on there horses, not glass! :lol: :lol: 

My horse LOVES to jump. She loves cross country jumps the best! I like to design the jumps. Make them look like a competition jump. hehe :wink: I stack up some logs like put three together on the ground then two on top the one on top of them and I'll jump her over them! Lol it's so fun but now the weather has been bad so we can't ride outside.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Horse_Luver, that is your decision, and I can't tell you otherwise, I just personally would never jump a horse that young, as it can lead to permanent ligament damage. If there was damage done, you might not notice it now, but it can affect a horse when it gets older. And I wouldn't be jumping "solid" jumps that early either. If jumping a horse at a younger age, I would like to use a collapsable jump if anything. Please don't take offence to this, it is just my opinion. I am not attacking anyone, I just feel really strongly about this!

I do not agree with even free jumping a long yearling, again, it can damage ligaments and you might not even notice till it's too late. It may look like that horse is having fun, but I think that horse is very unsure of himself - see him hesitating, guaging the jump, and then springing over it? Not good. He's not even sure how to land properly, and he's over-extending, which could lead to injury. 

I'm sorry but I feel very strongly about this subject. I hate it when good horses are ruined due to the stupididity of people pushing them too far too soon.


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## Cheval (Jan 1, 2008)

JustDressageIt said:


> I do not agree with even free jumping a long yearling, again, it can damage ligaments and you might not even notice till it's too late. It may look like that horse is having fun, but I think that horse is very unsure of himself - see him hesitating, guaging the jump, and then springing over it? Not good. He's not even sure how to land properly, and he's over-extending, which could lead to injury.
> 
> I'm sorry but I feel very strongly about this subject. I hate it when good horses are ruined due to the stupididity of people pushing them too far too soon.


Wow - I think we have the exact same thoughts about this!
A lot of people ask me, "But why not even free lunging". I'm say "Because it's almost the same as jumping with a rider, except it takes of like, 150pounds." Still - there is a lot of stress.

There is very interesting opinions, and I love to listen to them.


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

I know but show me an old horse that doesn't have arthritis.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Hehe thanks, Cheval! I feel extremely strongly about this subject... mainly because I come from a showing circuit where young jumpers are the "fad" right now... drives me nuts. 
"Look! My 4 year old can jump 3'6""
.. yeah.. show me that horse and I'll show you a lame 6 year old.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> I know but show me an old horse that doesn't have arthritis.


I'm not saying that (most) old horses don't get stiff. And not all old horses get arthritic to the point where they're lame, if they get arthritis at all.. I knew a few at my old ranch - 20+ years old that didn't take a step lame in the time that I knew them.
What I'm saying is that overexerting a young horse could lead to lameness that may not be there if the horse wasn't pushed and injured at a young age, i.e. prematurely aging the joints because of stress on the ligament(s)


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

My horse loves jumping! lol shes got the legs for it! hehe She will acually go over the jump real easy and canter off all professional showing off! 8) And sometimes she even bucks! lol I just love to see horses having a good time and feeling good!


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## Cheval (Jan 1, 2008)

horse_luver4e said:


> My horse loves jumping! lol shes got the legs for it! hehe She will acually go over the jump real easy and canter off all professional showing off! 8) And sometimes she even bucks! lol I just love to see horses having a good time and feeling good!


Just because she likes it doesn't mean her joints do.
But I'm definatly not saying your a bad horse owner, or whatever. I'm really strong about this.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Like I said, that is your own decision. I just personally wouldn't because I know it could cause permanent damage that could show up later in their lives. I would wait until a horse is at least 4 to even start with cross rails. I'd even like to wait till they're 6 or 7 before asking to jump over 3'. But that's just me. I'm helping train my friend's WB filly (well she's kinda mine too.. ish) and we agreed that we wouldn't start her before she was 3 years old, and even then it would be for 6 months max to get her doing w/t/c, and bending correctly, then we'd turf her out for another 6 months and re-start her when she's 4. When we start her again, we're going to take her easy and not even think about jumping till she's 5. She has trotted over trot poles a few times as a long yearling, but will not set hoof over a jump until she's 4 at least, and then we'll make sure she has tendon boots on and the whole 9 yards.


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

> Just because she likes it doesn't mean her joints do.
> But I'm definatly not saying your a bad horse owner, or whatever. I'm really strong about this.


Aahh I know it's your opinion.  But don't worry she will be fine!  She's turning 4 March 11th and shes jumping 1ft and 1 1/2ft jumps. Believe me were I live, people I know still start breaking there horses when there a yearling and the riders weigh over 200lbs. :x Drives me crazy.


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## mlkarel2010 (Jan 27, 2008)

I hate that too. I work for a trainer and a lot of the horses he starts are 2 or even long yearlings. It really bothers me, but it's not his fault. Everyone wants their new horses ready right away and if he doesn't train them at the age the owner wants them trained they'll go somewhere else and he'll lose business. So he has to do it if he wants to eat. I just wish I could talk some sense into some of the owners. 

There was this little paint who had just turned 2 and he was breaking her. She was smaller than most yearlings and barely even 13 hands I would think. I felt so bad riding her, she was so tiny and she got worked just like all the other horses would have. It's sad that people can't see how this is bad on a young horse.


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## AKPaintLover (May 26, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> Believe me were I live, people I know still start breaking there horses when there a yearling and the riders weigh over 200lbs. :x Drives me crazy.


That makes me sick. No offense to you horseluver.


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

I know I hate that


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## AKPaintLover (May 26, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> I know but show me an old horse that doesn't have arthritis.


There are plenty of horses that have been well cared for working and competing well into their 20's. I do agree that many older horses have problems with arthritis. 

*As to the original post:*

I think the real issue at hand though, why cause a horse to have ligament and tendon problems, and arthritis at 15, 12, 10 or even younger as opposed to their late 20's, when it can be avoided in most cases? 

Jumping at any age is a high impact activity, and younger horses are not physically ready to do it. Even if they think they are ready mentally (though most of the time horses of that age can't possibly have the maturity or experience to really know what they are doing and stay level headed about it. They are prone to getting over-excited or frightened (though this happens with older horses too of course). 

I feel this way about many high impact sports though. When I still barrel raced a few years ago, people were buying, training, and racing them younger and younger. Many were track rejects (still fast for barrels), who were racing barrels at 3 years old. The lameness of horse under 10 was SICKENING. Starting reining horses at 2 years old in hard training! Futurities for several disciplines where 2 year olds compete at a national level! Racing 1 and 2 year olds heavily!

*What is the rush?! * 

My boy is turning 6 this spring (young still, I know, BUT), he has yet to take a single lame step because I have taken things slow with him...and not even as slow as some might. I rode him A LOT from age 3 on, and lightly as a late 2 year old. If I had been barrel racing him since 3, he would probably be arthitic by now. :? 

My 2 cents...no offense intended toward anyone


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## AlmostFamous (Jan 16, 2008)

I think many factors are on the horse and its rider. I am actually helping train some of my trainers youngsters and I am pretty little 5'5 and 110, so I can easily ride the younger ones. One is a half-welsh and one is a quarter horse. The half welsh needs things much slower even though she is quite a bit smarter, because her bones have not formed as fast. She is about 3 and we can walk, trot very well, we can canter but it is just harder on the bones so we choose not to do as much. I admit, we do jump over little x's because it helps them naturally canter with me up there instead of forcing. There is nothing wrong with doing it very lightly, its jumping bigger every time as a baby that can end up with joint problemos. As for the quarter horse we can do a little more because quarter horses develop faster than welshs, warmbloods, or throughbreds.
I think the biggest factors in jumping younger ones are what the breed is, how big the rider is, the situation, and mentally how the horse can handle the task at a young age.


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## upnover (Jan 17, 2008)

grrr! I just wrote the worlds longest post about my opinions on jumping too early and it just got erased!! :evil: (<- haha, i've been waiting to use that face!)

Here's the gist of it:

1. Horses may jump a bit in the wild, but they are not built to jump. CATS are made to jump. Horses? are built to eat and run away. 

2. Jumping puts a tremendous amount of strain on their legs, why in the world would you want to do that to a horse joints and ligaments that are still forming?

3. Just because a horse will jump well doesn't mean it's mentally ready for it! My vet (a reiner, but has a lot of hunter/jumper clients) who is on the national board for equine behavior says that reiners (who start at 2) and hunters (who start at 3) have the most mental breakdowns then any other discipline! Does that tell you anything?

4. Use your brains and common sense people! 

5. Your horses love you, love them back!


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## EquiSoup (Dec 20, 2007)

The best trainers are the patient ones. Do you want to risk your horse going permanently lame early in life? Or would you rather wait an extra year so your horse will have a better chance at staying sound through it's life??? Would you rather teach your horse slower and develop a more physically fit, mentally sound, physically sound horse? Or would you rather rush your horse and have a damaged horse? 

There is no such thing as a bad horse, just bad pasts.


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## jazzyrider (Sep 16, 2007)

oh man! here we go again! im very disappointed that there are people here who are so impatient that they are willing to risk their horses soundness for the sake of a few jumps :evil: between this and the horse racing thread i really am stunned.

ok, a horse may seem to enjoy jumping but does the horse have the faculties to know that what they are doing could be harmful to them?? no!! its up to us as thinking people to make these decisions for them. a horse would not naturally jump in the wild...especially not grand prix height and i know we arent talking that but it comes down to logic. logic states that a horse is subjected to huge amounts of strain even when they are "old enough" for jumping. why, oh why would we do it before their joints are even in a position to remotely handle it???

i cant put into words without blowing my top just how angry it makes me that many people are more than happy to jump their horses before they are sound enough to do so. think of your horses. they love you and will do anything for you but why take advantage of that? they do their best for you so why not do the best thing for you horse? its been something ive heard my entire life. people from all around my country and from many others agree on age and jumping. who is anybody else to question it?

anyways, before i go on so much that i find myself in trouble im going to leave it there. all i ask is that people start thinking about what their horses NEED rather than what YOU want


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

my horse is 4 years old and over the summer i introduced ground poles and baby cross rails. I would first hand walk her over it so she got a feel for it and basically knew what it was. Before i jumped her while i was riding, I'd play with her in the ring and have a jump set up and make it part of our play time, just so she would associate that with having fun. 

You wouldn't take a child and tell tell him/her to go jump over those hurdles. You have to teach the child what to do, how to get the approach and how to land. And even then it will take a couple of months (i'm not sure on the time frame) and we have to use that same thing for young horses. Yes horses can jump at a young age, but they aren't ready for it. They have to be mature and mentally ready to learn how to jump. If you rush into it, you *could* ruin a horse, not saying all horses started young are going to be ruined. I do remember reading on here that someone had bought a horse that rushes at jumps. I forgot the details and stuff, but I believe someone said it was because the horse wasn't introduced to jumps properly and the horse just wanted to get it over with.

By having a horse, you are making a lifetime commitment to them. Don't jeopardize their soundness just so you could join the "My horse is 4 years old and jumping 4'" club. When they are ready to jump, you'll know and you'll have a blast with them.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

*wipes away tear of pride* yay! I'm so glad Appylover and jazzyrider agree have some sense in them! They took the thoughts out of my head and put them on paper.
I could be a good human example: I loved hurlding as a kid, and pushed myself higher and higher... while my joints were still weak. I didn't think anything of it then, but now (and I'm not old by any means!) I feel it. My knees and ankles are weak because I was jumping too high too young. Sure, I could do it, but was it smart to do so? Probably not. 
I see horses the same way. If we push them too far... injury is inevitable. Like I said, you might not notice it right away, because young horses seem to bounce back from injury very quickly, but you're writing off their sound older years.
Sure they _can_ do it, but so what? It doesn't mean their joints are ready to! And are they mentally ready? NO! Do you think it's coincidence that most Grand Prix horses are in their early teens? No. If you listen to announcers on T.V. when they introduce a 9 year old to the ring they say "Now here's a youngun'! This horse is just starting its Grand Prix career." There's a good reason for that.


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

JustDressageit, i know exactly what you mean! A couple of months ago there was this grand prix thing on TV and of course, I told my boyfriend i HAD to watch it! lol Well almost all of the horses were in double digits, maybe there was a 9 year old in there. And you could see the difference between the 9 year old and 12 year old horses. The older ones just seemed to know exactly what to do, and didn't seem to care that they were on TV, in a huge area with hundreds of people around them.

Not to mention if you start jumping a 4 year old 4' right away, do you think by the time its 9, 10, 11 or older that it will be able to jump those grand prix jumps? I'm going to say no. 

And I was looking at another horse to buy, to lease to someone to help make some money, well there were like 10 year old horses that could only be lightly ridden, even though it had competed with jumps (i want to say hunter, but i'm having a brain fart)


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## Cheval (Jan 1, 2008)

A golden star for appylover & jazzy! Haha, golden star?...
Anyway, I don't even like free jumping at a young age.


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

lol yay i have a golden star!

I think free jumping young horses is just a way for people to be like "look at my young horse. He can jump so high" What is the point of that? I don't know, i think you have to give horses time to be what they are before you start asking them to work for you.


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## Cheval (Jan 1, 2008)

appylover31803 said:


> I think free jumping young horses is just a way for people to be like "look at my young horse. He can jump so high" What is the point of that? I don't know, i think you have to give horses time to be what they are before you start asking them to work for you.


YES YES YES! Sorry, but I totally agree with you.


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

Don't be sorry Cheval. 

Where i board my horse they have an indoor ring, so you can ride all year, but i have ridden her twice all winter. I'm giving her the winter off and letting her chill and relax. Other people are there everyday riding for a while (and even though they aren't jumping, they don't really seem to let the horse rest)

The funny thing is, there is such a huge difference between how my horse acts around me, and the other horses who are worked act around their owners (one horse refuses to let his owner into his stall, especially around feeding time, and there I am talking to my horse, petting her, grooming her in her stall while she's eating)


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## AKPaintLover (May 26, 2007)

appylover31803 said:


> Where i board my horse they have an indoor ring, so you can ride all year, but i have ridden her twice all winter. I'm giving her the winter off and letting her chill and relax. Other people are there everyday riding for a while (and even though they aren't jumping, they don't really seem to let the horse rest)
> 
> The funny thing is, there is such a huge difference between how my horse acts around me, and the other horses who are worked act around their owners (one horse refuses to let his owner into his stall, especially around feeding time, and there I am talking to my horse, petting her, grooming her in her stall while she's eating)


I don't think there is anyting wrong with workng a horse that is old enough regularily. I do agree though, that they do well to get periods of time off where they can just relax and reset their minds. I worked my boy nearly every day over the summer of his five year old year (I am not talking jumps at this point - I don't jump him). After the last show in the fall though, I gave him 2 weeks off to reset, and then resumed daily riding until the cold weather hit in late november. He is down to 2-3 days riding a week, and I am hoping to pick it back up to almost daily as soon as the weather turns. 

I have to say that he is very affectionate, and while he clearly appreciates the breaks, he also does really well with all the work/fun (we trail ride and play around some too ). I could not imagine giving him the whole winter off...of course he is a young stallion, and a bit higher maintainance...not to mention, I think I would go Crazy not riding for that long!


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

What i wrote definitely came out wrong. (I'm not too good at taking whats in my mind and putting it down on the computer lol) I think it's just how the people at the barn do it. Like they take no time into tacking up and warming up and a very little cool down. My previous barn really emphasized on warming up and cooling down and this barn doesnt. They'll take horses spend like 2 seconds tacking them up, canter/trot them for like 10 minutes and then untack and put them away. And in that time, I'm grooming my horse, taking my time and everything.

But that is definitely off topic, sorry

I think it's necessary for a horse to have time to reset, like you said. And on the other hand, having daily mental exercise i think are necessary to keep the horse in check and healthy mentally


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## AKPaintLover (May 26, 2007)

I get ya


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

> not to mention, I think I would go Crazy not riding for that long!


I do go crazy not riding for the whole winter, but i find it hard where I am. The indoor ring is small, my horse is afraid of the monsters that are in there, and there are always like 3-4 people riding in there. 

I just rather wait for the warmer weather so we can go outside, or be inside while everyone else is outside.


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## jazzyrider (Sep 16, 2007)

Cheval said:


> A golden star for appylover & jazzy! Haha, golden star?...
> Anyway, I don't even like free jumping at a young age.


yay! gold star for me  i havent had one of those since primary school like twenty years ago lol

justdressageit - im glad ive made you proud lol :lol:


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## AKPaintLover (May 26, 2007)

appylover31803 said:


> > not to mention, I think I would go Crazy not riding for that long!
> 
> 
> I do go crazy not riding for the whole winter, but i find it hard where I am. The indoor ring is small, my horse is afraid of the monsters that are in there, and there are always like 3-4 people riding in there.
> ...


I know a lot of people don't think much of it, but it is really quite possible to ride out in the cold. I don't have an indoor arena. I sometimes ride a couple of miles to one nearby, but when it gets colder, I ride in the arena in our yard outside. If you keep the snow packed down well, it stays really nice for riding (not too slick or heavy). I ride until about zero degrees F, and stop when it gets colder. 

sorry to continue the tangant off topic, but I hear a lot about people not riding because of snow and cold weather, and I just wanted to share that it is possible


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

That is so true about not needing an indoor to ride. I'll have to check out the footing for the outdoor rings. You've inspired me!


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## AKPaintLover (May 26, 2007)

I have spring fever really badly already!


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## 8horses (Jan 28, 2008)

I haven't been able to ride sense October. NEPA has awful weather from October until March or April. We have awful drainage where I live so it gets extreamly icey. I have been lucky that I can even longe my horses on a regualr basis.


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## Tammy (Mar 1, 2007)

this may be off the subject but my mom got her first horse when she was 17 and the horse was 3 and she is still here on th farm now 31 this year anyway she has had 4 colts in her life and my mom not knowing knowing alot back then said she broke all of them to ride at age 2 to 3 and none of them have any leg problems. her 1st is now 28 i think ,26,20,and13. now we do know alot more and have waited to start our new horse just alot of ground work but still sometimes i do wonder!


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## .A.j. (Aug 29, 2007)

In my opinion, as long as the horse is fully developed, jumping shouldn't be a problem (obviously not pushing them to jump 4' right away) as long as it is a slow process.
My horse (QH) was broke to ride (w/t/ and some canter) at 2 1/2 and then was just used on the occasional trail ride until I bought him at age 5. And we have just started jumping up to 2 foot crossrails this fall (he was then 5 1/2)
Its been very easy training since he's had it quite easy to start, he is not sour or grumpy about being worked and has never been lame, even with his slight pigeon toe.
I think its best to go easy on them to start it gives them a chance to fill out and grow.


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## Tammy (Mar 1, 2007)

all our horses was ever used for was trail riding. and i did make a mistake in my last post the 31 yr old has arthiris.


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

well i think its kind of expected for a 31 yr old horse to have arthritis. It's like someone being in their 80s or 90s and not having to get glasses, or having some arthritis.

I don't really have a problem with starting a horse at around 2 1/2-3 years old, but like you said A.J. work them easy and then let them fill out.

I want to say Vida, but i'm not sure, will work with her young horses for a while, and then turn them out until they're like 3. I may be mistaken and I am sorry if I am. But i think that's a great thing to do. Let the horse have some idea of the things he will be asked to do, and then turn around and be like "ok, go be a horse now"


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## Abby (Nov 26, 2007)

A coworker of mine weighs 170 something and she has "fully-broke" her late yearling filly and is jumping her at 2' already. That poor foal. I want to just beat her to death for doing that to the horse but she claims the horse loves it and if it was hurting her she would stop. Just because she's a TB and is tall doesn't mean she's ready to do all that! The horse struggles over the jumps with all that rider weight and I fear she's going to break her legs on landing, she has no idea how to land either. :/


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

Abby thats horrible! That poor baby.


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

That is terrible! See people think they know everything just becuase they own the horse but it usualy ends up in disaster. :?


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## Abby (Nov 26, 2007)

Thats what I tried to tell her. Not only are the horses kneecaps undeveloped enough to carry rider weight, the horse isn't developed period. Even worse she's not even using jump boots or anything. Ugh. I wanted to buy the filly to save it from that but she said she's not for sale. :?


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

That's dumb.

A friend of a friend killed a horse by pushing it too far. She had this long yearling colt, broke him in and was teaching him rollbacks (STUPID!!!) because she wanted to make him a cutting horse, and while he was turning back, he broke his leg. Had to be put down on the spot.

ps ... This girl wasn't small.. around 5'10" and about 150 lbs.


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## AKPaintLover (May 26, 2007)

Both of those stories are so sad...what are people thinking!


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## jazzyrider (Sep 16, 2007)

hearing all this stuff makes me so sad. i think people should have to have licences to keep horses and other animals. some people just dont deserve them


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## appylover31803 (Sep 18, 2007)

^^ i totally agree with you Jazzy. Some people just get a horse just for the sake of getting a horse.

There's this guy at my stable that has 2 horses. He pays attention to only the one he rides and doesn't even say hi to the other horse. That poor horse kicks the stall and everything because he's bored, and i also think he does it for attention.
Whenever my boyfriend are there, we always say hello to Skippy and if we have carrots give him a piece. I'd love to buy him, just so he knows he has someone who loves and cares for him


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

Goodness! That makes me mad! You shouldn't even be on a horse when it's a yearling. I was allways taught that you should work on groundwork, lounging, and desensitizing when they are under 2 then when they turn 2 you can saddle them.


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## AKPaintLover (May 26, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> Goodness! That makes me mad! You shouldn't even be on a horse when it's a yearling. I was allways taught that you should work on groundwork, lounging, and desensitizing when they are under 2 then when they turn 2 you can saddle them.


I agree that the young horses should have groundwork as a focus, but from what I have read on here and elsewhere, they actually should not be lunged young either because it too is really hard on their undeveloped legs.


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## horse_luver4e (Jul 12, 2007)

No not 'work' lounging, lounging for respect.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Regardless of what king of lunging you're doing it's not good for a young horse to do. The constant circling is hard on their joints. Even at a walk, you shouldn't lunge for long at all.. and what youngster just walks in circles? Not anything I've worked with - they all like to buck and run and fart around for the first little while, then they'll settle down, and I've only lunged horses 5 years and up.
It's akin to the jumping issue, although most people don't know lunging is bad for a young horse.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

It's ignorance that hurts these horses.


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## Kyani (Apr 30, 2007)

Long reining! (or 'ground driving') That's what youngsters should be doing. It removes all the issues lunging has with circling and the cues are much closer to those the horse will recieve in the saddle. It's perfect for youngsters. You can even take them out on trails and roads to get them used to things.


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## AKPaintLover (May 26, 2007)

Kyani said:


> Long reining! (or 'ground driving') That's what youngsters should be doing. It removes all the issues lunging has with circling and the cues are much closer to those the horse will recieve in the saddle. It's perfect for youngsters. You can even take them out on trails and roads to get them used to things.


agreed  fun too. There are plenty of in hand activities and yielding activities as well.


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## jazzyrider (Sep 16, 2007)

appylover31803 said:


> ^^ *i totally agree with you Jazzy. Some people just get a horse just for the sake of getting a horse.*
> 
> There's this guy at my stable that has 2 horses. He pays attention to only the one he rides and doesn't even say hi to the other horse. That poor horse kicks the stall and everything because he's bored, and i also think he does it for attention.
> Whenever my boyfriend are there, we always say hello to Skippy and if we have carrots give him a piece. I'd love to buy him, just so he knows he has someone who loves and cares for him


very true! to me there are 2 kinds of horse people. the first kind see horses as a status symbol and like being able to say they have horses as this makes them sound rich and cool. the second kind truly love horses and see having them as a priviledge. these people do everything they can to ensure that their horses are getting to treatment they need/deserve.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Kyani said:


> Long reining! (or 'ground driving') That's what youngsters should be doing. It removes all the issues lunging has with circling and the cues are much closer to those the horse will recieve in the saddle. It's perfect for youngsters. You can even take them out on trails and roads to get them used to things.


Yes! Thank you!! I never ONCE lunged the 3 year old I helped start. (Yes, 3 year old! And never lunged!) We long-lined instead, and it's a brilliant alternative, as it teaches the horse to respond to rein pressure before you even step up on the horse.
I just took on a 6 year old training project, and I will be long-lining her. 
Lunging does have its place.. with older, developed horses, with developed joints. 
Again, very similar to horses injuring their ligaments jumping too high too soon.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

horse_luver4e said:


> Goodness! That makes me mad! You shouldn't even be on a horse when it's a yearling. I was allways taught that you should work on groundwork, lounging, and desensitizing when they are under 2 then when they turn 2 you can saddle them.


I come from the Warmblood world, and perhaps that's why, but I still don't see the sense in breaking a horse at 2. Can anyone explain it? It just seems like unnecissary stress, both mentally and physically, when you could wait a year and probably have a more sound horse. 

When my friend and I start "our" (my friend owns her, but we kind of share her) coming 3 year old filly, we will get basic w/t/c on her, and won't push her to accept something before she's ready. if it takes months to get her to canter under saddle, so be it. I really couldn't care less. Once she has the basics (along with some suppling exercises) we'll chuck her out for another 6 months to just be a horse again, then we'll bring her back in and re-start her, and work her slowly.


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