# QH Endurance....



## HorseGirlie (Mar 27, 2012)

Oh the pic did upload! Yay


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## Sharpie (May 24, 2009)

I've got a QH too. Long slow distance to get in shape. There's a newish book, Endurance 101 that I like. Basically, what I've heard most is Yes, you can do endurance riding with a QH! You may not place top-10 and you'll have to watch them if its warm since their heavier muscles make it harder for them to cool compared to the lithe little arabs, but you can certainly ride and finish if you're both fit and up to it. The ride I helped out (in WA state) had lots of QH along with the arabs and a even a few draft crosses too.


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## 2SCHorses (Jun 18, 2011)

I don't see why not if he enjoys it. I have a registered Doc O'Lena/Peppy San Badger lines gelding, and we have had him do a few LD's (even though he'd probably rather be cutting cattle). He can do OK because he is long legged and lean, not a stout guy, but it does take some convincing to get him to travel at a trot for 3-6 hours! He's pretty smart and conserves his energy well and will go no faster than he feels he can maintain, but I do get the feeling he's always thinking "Why the heck are we trotting along when there's no danger?". He his a super safe bomber horse in the head, so we keep him in good enough shape to do a few LD's if one of our kids wants to ride the race - he's perfect for them because he doesn't care if he gets passed and doesn't get excited to lope off with the mass start pack. Only because he isn't super psyched about it do we keep him out of more races and/or longer races. He does it because he's good natured, but he doesn't love it. But if your horse loves it and tries hard, AND you feel safe, that is really what matters. He sounds like your best buddy, and that makes it so much more fun than anything!


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## HorseGirlie (Mar 27, 2012)

Okay, one other odd question. Do you have to stay the night at the ride site the night before it starts? For check-ins and stuff?


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## Sharpie (May 24, 2009)

"Have to" no, I don't think there's generally a rule that you must. However, it would be darn difficult if you didn't, since usually they're out somewhere odd, so it's quite a drive, you have to get your pre-ride paperwork and vet check in, and the riders meeting is the evening before, so you really ought be there then anyway. Listen to others though- to help crew, I just showed up that morning, but everyone riding was definitely there the night before.


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## HorseGirlie (Mar 27, 2012)

Okay thanks.


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## HorseGirlie (Mar 27, 2012)

Samurai and I will be doing our first ride in April, it's just a 12m one, short I know, but it's to see how well we do. Any could conditioning tips???


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## jillybean19 (Dec 23, 2011)

HorseGirlie said:


> Okay, one other odd question. Do you have to stay the night at the ride site the night before it starts? For check-ins and stuff?


Yes. Not a requirement, but a must. The night before, you need to attend the ride meeting and vet in as well as do any pre-ride paperwork. If you were trying to do this the morning of, you're going to run into trouble, especially since I'm sure the ride manager will be worried about other things. Usually, the ride start times can be anywhere between 5-8AM, with the longer rides starting first. Even if you were close, you would NOT be setting yourself up for a good ride if you drove your horse to the ride the night before to vet in, drove home that evening, then got up early enough to get ready for the ride and make sure your horse is, too. My ride day starts in the dark at 4AM - and I'm already THERE - if you were to try to drive in , you'd have your horse up and loaded and then get there and pray your horse settles down. With all the stress that is usually at a ride, you'd already be setting yourself and your horse up for failure in the transportation back and forth and the rush to be ready on time. In addition, there's so much chaos going on in ride camp, you'd have a lot of people ****ed at you trying to trailer in horses before the ride, which will probably interfere with other people getting ready and at the start line.

If you're showing up for a trail ride, they usually start around 10, which is much more reasonable to trailer in the day of. But don't try trailering in the morning before an endurance ride.


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## jillybean19 (Dec 23, 2011)

As far as breeds - some breeds are better built than others for distances. However, ANY breed can do it (though not every horse), and MANY breeds, including QH's, can do well. A friend of mine rides a big grade quarter horse and consistently top 10's with great vet scores. That horse is just built to MOVE!


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## HorseGirlie (Mar 27, 2012)

Thanks, really helpful! So....I got another odd question....how are you supposed to go to the bathroom on the long rides??? Lol what if its just dessert flat, like my first ride in April.......weird question, I know! Lol


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## grayshell38 (Mar 9, 2009)

If there is nothing to get behind, either lose your inhibitions, hold it, or teach your horse to lay down so you can hide behind them.


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

Have you read Angie Mcghee's book "The Lighter Side of Endurance Riding?" It's great and very funny. Anyway, she describes the three things you need in a good endurance horse. If I remember right, it's Mind, Metabolic and Legs. I don't have the book with me so I might be quoting wrong, but basically the idea is that you have to have at least two out of three.

If you have great feet and legs so your horse is never lame, and your horse eats, drinks, cools down, poops and pees no matter what, then it's OK if they're totally nutso on occasion (to some riders anyway). :lol: Or else have to be pushed along the trail.

And if they're very sane, calm, willing and are also never lame, then you can rate them well enough to deal with the cooling and metabolic issues.

Likewise, if you have a horse with a great attitude that wants to go and has no metabolic problems, then you can deal with a lameness on occasion.

But if you only have one of these, then you'll end up too frustrated and the horse will not work out for endurance. Sometimes the reason Quarter Horses don't work out is because they have both metabolic issues (difficulty cooling) and also lack the mental drive to keep going over the miles. If your horse has the mental drive, then you can deal with the metabolic.


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

While I am pretty much a sink or swim kinda guy, I think you should get involved in AERC or more likely some CTR groups and find a mentor. Endurance starts at 50 miles. Not to say there is anything wrong with LD's (Limited Distance) of 25-35. Sorry but any horse cannot do endurance. The horse pictured is definetly not suited for it. asking him to do it would be like asking a shetland pony to carry me. While they could probably get through the task, probably not the best route to take. 
With a decent amount of conditioning and paying attention to nutrition and electrolytes, you may be able to get him through some cool weather LD's. Going back in time you do see some QH's doing endurance, but back in time pretty much any stock horse was refered to as a QH, also we didnt have the muscle bound halter class types like yours that we do now. 
Volunteer as ride staff at an AERC event, maybe get involved with the shorter distance fun rides or competitive trail. maybe look in to ACTHA, you do have a horse suited for that and sounds like it would be right up your alley.


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## jillybean19 (Dec 23, 2011)

Joe4d said:


> While I am pretty much a sink or swim kinda guy, I think you should get involved in AERC or more likely some CTR groups and find a mentor. Endurance starts at 50 miles. Not to say there is anything wrong with LD's (Limited Distance) of 25-35.


CTR and endurance are NOT the same thing and usually appeal to completely different people. To the OP - please don't confuse the two thinking that doing a CTR will be similar to endurance. There are certain qualities that are the same, but the events are completely different with different goals, practices, and outcomes. It'd be like me saying you should to Western Pleasure in order to get into Reining. As for any horse being able to do it, no. Almost any BREED can do endurance or LD's, most individual HORSES, can do LD's as long as they're fit and ridden correctly, fewer can do endurance. There are even Arabians not cut out to do endurance. As far as starting at 50 miles - yes, this is important once you really get into it, but if you want to do "endurance", generally most people would be happy with doing 25's and I know a few "professional LD-ers" that have thousands of LD miles. They enjoy their LD's just as much as I enjoy any distance, if not more.



Joe4d said:


> Sorry but any horse cannot do endurance. The horse pictured is definetly not suited for it. asking him to do it would be like asking a shetland pony to carry me. While they could probably get through the task, probably not the best route to take.
> With a decent amount of conditioning and paying attention to nutrition and electrolytes, you may be able to get him through some cool weather LD's. Going back in time you do see some QH's doing endurance, but back in time pretty much any stock horse was refered to as a QH, also we didnt have the muscle bound halter class types like yours that we do now.
> Volunteer as ride staff at an AERC event, maybe get involved with the shorter distance fun rides or competitive trail. maybe look in to ACTHA, you do have a horse suited for that and sounds like it would be right up your alley.


And here's where I am very frustrated with your response. You have NO IDEA what this horse is capable of, and are wrong to say that this horse is "definitely" not suited for endurance.

First, the horse has fuzzies and has not been conditioned, which makes a big difference in how the horse looks. It could look like a completely different horse when it's race fit. 

Second, there are actually quite a few quarter horses of all builds doing endurance. Yes, even the stocky ones. In fact, the one that my friend rides is built like a tank, muscly, stocky, etc. Everything that'd make you think it'd be terrible at endurance. HOWEVER - she consistently top ten AND got her Sandybaar award from the PNER conference, awarded to a horse that has 10 consecutive rides without a pull. She does great, and even BC's. At 230 lbs when she weighs in, no wonder she needs a stocky horse! (Yes, I'm aware that an Arab could easily carry her, but she feels much more comfortable on top of a tank)

Third, you'd be surprised what breeds do compete. I have even heard of DRAFT horses completing the Tevis. Rarely, but it does occur, proving that even unlikely breeds can be successful. If you look up the Tevis results, you'll see the breeds of all the horses. Lets see here....

2011:
Saddlebred
Kentucky Mt.
Paint
Mustang
Grade Morgan	
Rocky Mt
Shagya
Appaloosa
Mule
Friesian X	
Akhal-Teke	
Mustang/QH	
Miss-Fox-Trotter	
N.F. Horse	
TW
American Bashkir Curly	
Paso Fino	
Mustang


On a related note, I noticed there are more stock horses on that list than Walkers....


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## jillybean19 (Dec 23, 2011)

OP, my point is that you'll need to try endurance before you'll know whether your horse is up to it. What someone else said about the "Ligher side of Endurance" was great about the three things your horse needs. Never read the book myself, but it sounds about right 

I just get frustrated because certain posters prefer to sink before they ever try swimming.


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

looking at tevis you'll finds onesy and twoseys of other breeds, then 200 arabians , 
The OP asked if her horse was suitable for endurance, Not fun rides of 12 miles, or LD;s but endiurance IE 50 plus miles. and nope it isnt. And neither is a draft horse. your simply asking it to do something it wasnt built for. Sure condition the heck out of it, and you can squeak by at a turtle pace and MAYBE pulse down most of the time. 
Im the first to admit my walkers will never be contendors, You know why ? because they arnt suited for endurance. I do it anyway because thats what I have out in the field. And yep I get pulled for pulse when it gets hot. SO now I pretty much will stick to cold weather rides. 
My sink or swim issue was about the rider, soulds like the OP has limited trail experience and would benifit from a mentor or working a vet check. Also sounds like they would really enjoy ACTHA much better than endurance.


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## jillybean19 (Dec 23, 2011)

My point is that other breeds are fully capable of doing endurance and are used to do so. This onesy or twosey of other breeds represents that horses of other breeds can be quite accomplished in endurance and do quite well. Yes, Arabs and a few other breeds are built for endurance and, if you have one, you have a better chance of having a horse that's able to be successful (depending on your definition of success) and competitive. However, the OP didn't ask whether she would be able to be competitive - she asked


> Do you think he would even have a shot at finishing?


 And yes, he does. Definitely at the LD level as long as he is fit and healthy. And, if she's lucky, he'll have the motivation to. As she indicated, this horse does move, so I think she'll have a blast using him for rides. I would not be any more or less inclined to tell her that her QH could be successful in LD's or 50's as I would someone who owned an Arabian. Her horse could even be Top 10 and Tevis-worthy. At the same time, he could be none of the above. We surely cannot tell from a picture - she'll just have to ride him to find out. As far as having a shot at finishing? I'd say, with what we know from this post, he definitely has a shot at finishing.

I do agree that she and every other person new to endurance, regardless of trail experience, should get a mentor and volunteer at rides before they attempt to ride in one. Maybe even bring your horse along to see how he acts and take a little trail ride and learn how to follow the ribbons 

I see no indication that she would enjoy ATCHA better than endurance. As you pointed out, she asked about ENDURANCE, which I do feel that LD's are a very important part of, and much more closely related than Competitive Trail in every way.

It's a bit hypocritical that you go and tell the OP that her horse is not capable of doing endurance while you do endurance with a horse "not typical" in then endurance world. You're right, each horse has to be ridden in a way that meets its needs, but that takes a lot more into account than just the breed. Like you, she wants to do endurance with what she already has, and simply wants to finish. Her horse may perform better or worse than yours, but that's simply something you cannot know from what she posted. If your horses are truly only capable of what you're saying, then there are indeed draft horses (and horses of other breeds and even TWH's) out there that do much better in endurance.

From this and other posts I've seen from you, it seems that you know some about endurance, but have a lot to learn still. Heck, I'll admit that I have a lot to learn. However, repeating the same stereotypes about endurance are what prevent people from ever trying this sport in the first place, one of which that you NEED an Arab to be competitive or even compete. The great thing about this sport is that it's open to anyone, and anyone can be successful to a certain extent as long as their horse is healthy and fit (I know many people whose best endurance horse was a grade rescue horse). Beyond that, there are certain things that make you more likely to succeed at higher levels, like going faster, placing better, and going farther, but there is no "sure" combination that's guaranteed to get there, and you'd be surprised and what things people have succeeded with.


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## jillybean19 (Dec 23, 2011)

grayshell38 said:


> If there is nothing to get behind, either lose your inhibitions, hold it, or teach your horse to lay down so you can hide behind them.


Hahaha I can just imagine teaching my horse to lay down to hide me while I'm peeing!!

Unfortunately, I don't think I drink enough on the trail and usually don't have to pee except at the vet checks. And on ride days, I don't eat enough to have to take care of a #2! When I've ridden with another person, we just step behind our horse and have a lookout for anybody coming!


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## jillybean19 (Dec 23, 2011)

By the way, this is my friend's grade quarter horse that she consistently Top 10's and BC's with. Muscly much? But yet, still a very competitive horse that my full Arab cannot keep pace with.


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## HorseGirlie (Mar 27, 2012)

Thanks for everything you've said jillybean! I don't have any interest in competitve trail. It's nothing like endurance riding. I just want to ride for hours with my best friend (my horse), win or lose it doesn't really matter to me. Of course I would be fine placing in the top 10.  I know it takes time to condition, but I'm not expecting to go out and have him do a 50m. I know he wouldn't be able to do that. I am totally fine sticking with the LD rides. That seems like something we could do with some conditioning work, no problem. He just loves to trail ride. If we were just trail riding he could do it all day (at a walk). He is so level headed and always wants to please. We get alone great, so I would never want to use another horse even if its a better breed. I do have a Arab/QH or a TB/QH, we don't know for sure because she was a rescue and has no papers. She has great energy, but she sweats so much, is a little unsure on her feet, and I just don't trust her enough yet. So even though everything else other then my horse would be better, I wouldn't trade him for the world.
As for having them lay down so you can go to the bathroom, that's funny!!


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

I think there is a balance between discouraging people from trying endurance and encouraging them to have realistic goals. My first thought when looking at the OP's horse was similar to Joe4D's in that the horse is too heavily muscled to do more than LD. 

Fortunately, I doubt the horse would come to harm by any ambition the rider may have, no matter how unrealistic, because a horse built like that is just not going to hurt himself by going too far or too fast. The rider would wear out far sooner by trying to get him into a pace that would mean he finishes in time.

The grade QH that was posted as a successful endurance horse is not built the same but has leaner type muscles. He is built more like a TB. The OP's horse appears to have halter type muscles that are big and bulky. I feel it is kind to point out to people who may not realize all that endurance entails that their horse may not be suitable. If you have read Endurance Granny's Blogspot you can learn about the frustrations and pitfalls of trying to condition a non-suitable horse for LDs.

I have a friend who managed to get a Paint mare through an LD ride but it was tough. The horse kept up with the Arabians and SB cross but was mentally fried by the end. She started trying to quit after about 18 miles and it was hard to push her through even though there was nothing wrong with her. She was as fit as she could possibly be for her body type and leaned down, but she hated it.


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## jillybean19 (Dec 23, 2011)

gottatrot said:


> I have a friend who managed to get a Paint mare through an LD ride but it was tough. The horse kept up with the Arabians and SB cross but was mentally fried by the end. She started trying to quit after about 18 miles and it was hard to push her through even though there was nothing wrong with her. She was as fit as she could possibly be for her body type and leaned down, but she hated it.


You make a valid point here that while a horse may be capable, some may simply HATE it - including Arabs. If you don't have a horse that wants to do it, then you're going to have a miserable time pushing them through it. I do have a few friends who've described their horses simply shutting down at a certain distance, and the rest of the ride was hell. And these were mostly Arabs! (not that Arabs are more likely to do this, but that most of my friends have Arabs)


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## BlueSpark (Feb 22, 2012)

I have competed on an arab, a OTTB and an appaloosa. all had the desire to do it. 

my friend competed and placed in Ctr and endurance on a VERY stocky arab x qh. he didn't pulse down quite as fast, but he could go forever and had the desire to do so.

i say if you want to know how he'll do, take him out asap and start putting miles on him. when he's in decent shape, find a trail about 20 miles, take him out and do a mini endurance race, seeing how quickly you can finish at a pace he can maintain. it will also show you if he really has the drive to do it.


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## LeynaProof (Jan 3, 2013)

HorseGirlie said:


> Samurai and I will be doing our first ride in April, it's just a 12m one, short I know, but it's to see how well we do. Any could conditioning tips???


What ride will you be doing in April? Are you in the SouthEast?


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## HorseGirlie (Mar 27, 2012)

I'm in the North/West, it's the Grizzly Mountain ride.


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