# Critique



## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

Okey, I want critique!  

I rode a lot as a kid, but was selflearned, and not verry intrested in learning properlly, so for example I would never lift in trot, and sad through it. I also never gallopped, and used to jump small fences, maybe 30-40 cm. But, then again, my balance was ****, and I really didnt know anything. 

Then, at the age of 13, my horse had to be put down, she was old and sick pretty much. and after that, I just didnt ride. Now, at the age of 19, I got her only foal, Hubble, and Im re-learning to ride. So even though I have SOME basics, Im pretty much a beginner at this point. This is how far Ive come, and I cant afford a trianer to help me develope (Hoping for that in a few monthes after I graduate from school and can work full time) 

So what can you guys see that need improving? 

Myself, I see this:
Stiff shoulders and back, acctually end up hurting a lot from it during and after a ride. 
Depending on the reins to keep my balance
Legs to much forward, move them back a little
To much movement in the hands

What are your thoughts, do you agree with what I see? Is there anything else youd point out?


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I don't have time to write much right now, but suffice it to say that your self assessment pretty accurate. I will try tad more tomorrow wi am on laptop instead of iPad.


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

An aside, but the video was not very sharp for me, so I could be wrong. But possibly the horse looks a little off. Could there be any slight lameness going on? Or possibly his stride is hindered a little at the trot by getting caught in the mouth by the reins. 

A tip:
In pictures online, you can see people doing any number of things with their upper arms while riding.
















Something I like to think of is that my upper arms belong to my torso. They should not be pulling behind my torso or pushed in front. Whatever angle my forearm takes or my hands take, my upper arm belongs with my upper body. That's because you want to keep your upper arms near your core for ideal balance. You don't have to press your arms against your body, they can hang loosely. Instead of moving your upper arms, learn how to shorten and lengthen your reins quickly and frequently as you ride along.









For now, while you are working on your balance, why don't you keep the reins with some slack so you don't have to think about the horse's mouth? That will also prevent you from using the reins for balance. If you lose your balance, you can put a hand down on the pommel until you get sorted out. 

It's a lot less important to think about if your lower leg is back far enough and more important to think about if you feel balanced over your lower leg and if your core is centered above it. Can you stand up and remain standing at the walk? Can you hold a two point at the trot? Trying those things will help you find your balance point. This can be different in various saddles and on different horses. You won't find balance if you are pulling the stirrup leather back from where it hangs down naturally toward the ground or pushing it forward. You won't be able to balance in two point if you are pressing your knee or lower leg into the horse to stabilize yourself. You will only be able to balance well if you're letting your entire leg distribute your weight along the horse's side and down into the stirrups evenly. This will mean your legs slide slightly up and down as the horse moves, rather than sticking perfectly still against the horse's side. But this also means you are using your joints appropriately as shock absorbers, and will help you not be as stiff. Very important when going faster or jumping.


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## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

Thank you for such a great respond! Yes, shes a tad lame due to mug, dont worry, its getting treeted  

Those are some great examples, haha, but I really see what you meen there with the hands! Ill try to do some more loose reins (As long as Hubble agrees as she tends to go faster and faster when she can) 

I havnt tried to stand up in a walk, but will absolutlly do that for next ride to see where that gets me! 

Thank you again for the great tips <3


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I love @gottatrot's advice. and, I would say basically the same thing.
also, you are doing not too badly, and just time and practice is really what you need. and, if you could do a lungeline lesson some time, that would be great, but maybe not possible in your situation. so, here's my additions:

I watched the video again, and another one you have of hubble free lunging. it's possible she is a tiny bit off, as one can see her neck bob ever so slightly from time to time, but I see it less in the free lunging, and more in the riding video.
I think you are posting a bit too fast, which is encouraging Hubble to go even faster, and you get off rhythm with her, which makes her take a few slightly odd steps. 

Hubble is carrying her back in a stiff, protective manner, so it's possible you are landing a bit hard, or the saddle isn't a good fit, which is making her raise her neck and hollow out her back. However, in the free lunging video, she also moves with a very stiff back, so it could just be her way of moving.

I agree that you might want to give her a lot of rein until you can maintain better balance and not bop her in the mouth accidentally. when your balance improves. all the rest will start to fall into place. 

you will want to work toward keeping your hands pointed always at the bit rings of the bridle. like lasers, your thumbs can point, like lasers, at the bit rings. that means that you will have to have your elbow joints loose enough to open and close the angle , in order to keep that laser always pointed at the horse's mouth. even it the reins are loose, as an exercise, practice this, EVERY minute you are aboard the horse.

your legs does need to come back, but not sure if forcing it will help you, and not sure how much of that leg position is as a result of the saddle balance. perhaps you could take some photos of the saddle on the filly, with her outside, on level ground, in good light, that way we can see the way the saddle fits and how it sits on the horse.

So, slow down your posting a bit, keep hands pointed at mouth, if your leg CAN come back, do it.
practice some sitting trot, too.


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## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

Ive been thinking of asking a friend come with me to lunge, but shes so bad on the line right now I dont think thats a good idee (Will try going to fast for the circle the line will give to the point of loosing balance, a lot...)But she is getting better, so when I got that down with her, Ill make sure to work on the line as well! 

She does have problems with one of her legs. In the lunging video, its an old problem thats still lurking, the less she moves, the worse she gets, so I need to keep her moving. Most of the time shes not affected by it at all, but if shes not worked oftain enough, she goes lame. We are starting treatment for it this summer to heal it right up.  In this video where Im riding though, its not the injury, but her mug thats affecting her, and that is under treatment. Had been away for 2 days where my parents forgot to clean her legs, so it was a nit worse that day. 

As an old racehorse (trotting with a sulky behind them)I think its called harness racing, but unsure. But from that her back is verry stiff in movement, and on top of that has verry stale back legs from just walking a pasture for 2 years. So shes verry stale overall. Thats why her movement is like it is  

Ohh, slow down the posting, I can see Im going fast, but was hoping I was doing it "eith her" although I loose it a little in the middle. But okey, Ill try slowing that down a little as well!  

Thank you for the help <3 

Heres a picture if its good enough


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

I wish you had explained that she was a exracer, and a trotting horse. that would have explained a lot of her movement. and , she is old? I thought this was the filly from a horse you had when you were younger?

sorry, if I am getting confused.

also, what is "mug"?


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## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

Shes turning 11 this year  Sorry for not telling you, I relize now it might have made it a lot easier, haha  

She was born when I was 8 years old, Im now 19, so your still right, my parents leashed her for 7 years, so just got her back from that, they had her to race her as my parents thought she was too stubborn for them to do it themselves. In Sweden, they can only race until the age of 10 if its a mare, you get till 12 if its not.  

Im pretty sure thats whats it called, lol, but its a bacterial infection that horses easilly get in muddy areas. What happenes is that they loose fur on the legs, the skin will crack up and the legs will get warm and swollen.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

you must be talking about 'mud fever'.


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## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

Ohh so thats what its called? Did a google translate on the word, and it gave me mug, haha  Englidh is not my first language


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

I think, apart from the horse being a little sore/stiff so you struggle to keep her moving forwards at a nice even pace, your biggest problem is coming from that saddle being too small for you. You're constantly bouncing off the back of it and getting pushed forwards.
I don't think your hands are helping her maintain the rhythm that you need to get your trot right - maybe try using a neck strap on her that's not fastened up too tightly and hook your little fingers through it to encourage your hands to stay steady. You can use some baler twine to fasten it to the rings on the saddle so it won't drop down her neck if she puts her head down
Some work on the lunge riding with your arms folded would help your balance


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## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

I didnt know the saddle was to small :O Lucky I got 2 more, lol  Ill see if I can maybe use one of the other twos, I think their seet is a bit bigger  

Thank you for the help <3


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## cbar (Nov 27, 2015)

I am no expert on riding position, but I will comment on the mare. I have 2 ex-pacers (harness racers). And when I retrained my gelding to saddle, he was very stiff in the back and held his head high. You should work on exercises with her that will make her more supple. 

I did lots of bending, circles, and asking him to move through his rib cage - on the track they are trained to move straight, with their heads up. A lot of these exercises can be done at the walk. And do carrot stretches with her to increase her flexibility side to side. This will probably help a lot in your trot work with her. And of course, ensure your saddle fits her properly.


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## DanisMom (Jan 26, 2014)

You need some bend to your elbow. There should be a straight line from elbow to bit no matter where the horse carries her head. I see you pushing your hands down, which causes your elbow to be straight. 

When you are posting wait for the horse's movement to lift you from the saddle. Also, it looks to me like you are just moving straight up and down (I could be wrong so correct me if I am). Your hips/belly button need to move forward in order for you to stay with the horse's motion, then sit softly in the seat. As the others mentioned, a larger seat will help with this. And the too small saddle may be what I am seeing rather than your technique.


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## sayazeleznik (Oct 31, 2016)

i dont know if this applies right now but try not to land too hard in the saddle, sometimes if a horse is pampered they can get ****y if you're landing on their back in a way they dont fancy. If you feel your inner thighs and core burning, it means your carrying yourself in a different way which is required for posting so don't stress. You're critique is basically everything i was going to say and your riding is coming along great!! :^)


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

I think your self assessment is pretty good
What I also see, is you trying to get impulsion by exaggerated posting, versus getting the energy from the horse, and letting that posting flow in rhythm from the horse. Why not ride without posting for now, so you can more easily use your legs effectively, and get that correct balance between hands and legs? That will help you from balancing on the reins at this point\Start posting once you have that independent seat and feel.
The horse does appear somewhat off, but I believe that is exaggerated by uneven movement, that includes no consistency and frame.
The fact that a good rider, can make a slightly lame horse look sound, shows the importance of getting the movement from behind , staying out of the horse;s way, esp in the mouth, and containing that energy generated from behind, with a light bit , thus the horse moving in frame, off his front end, engaged behind


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## DanteDressageNerd (Mar 12, 2015)

Do you have someone to train with or someone who could give you lunging lessons to helps you, so you can focus on finding your balance and rhythm?

Right now. I'd just focus on finding a consistent rhythm and thinking about landing as softly as you can in the saddle. I'd probably lengthen your stirrup a hole and I'd definitely post. I'd also try grabbing the front of your saddle pad when you post and count 1 when you sit, 2 when you're up to help you find your rhythm. Don't worry about her rhythm, she will learn to match you. You have to find yours first. Same in the walk. Think when her barrel pushes into your inside leg follow and same with when her barrel pushes into your outside leg follow the movement like you're moving her barrel between your legs but not in a forced way, just following the movement. You want to sit lightly in the walk. Put weight down your stirrup irons, rather than your seat bones and allow your body to move. I think you'll find if you sit too heavily at the walk or too stiffly you stagnate their movement and lose rhythm. I always have a count in my head when I'm riding youngster at each gait. At walk 1, 2, 3, 4 and trot 1, 2 and canter 1, 2, 3 (1 hip slides forward, 2 hip slides back, 3 hip at cantle). It helps so much with establishing a clear rhythm. Especially since the youngsters don't really have a rhythm because they don't really have a natural balance and cant be in balance without rhythm (it's a circle). It helps to count foot falls as well. I also pay attention to my breathing quite a bit. I had a lesson once entirely about breathing but it affects us quite a lot. I always think about long, deep, slow breaths. No matter what happens to help keep my body as supple and relaxed as possible. 

The unevenness I can't tell if it's from lameness or just from being off balance and trying to compensate or if you're landing too heavily in the saddle. I've seen horses in saddles that don't fit them look lame but take it off and are sound. I've seen horses who with their rider look lame and otherwise sound or a horse whose on the ground look lame but with a rider appear sound (in this sort of instance, the horses had scar tissue and were short but not lame). She may also need to see the chiropractor. It can be any number of things. 

I also agree with a bit of slack in the reins for right now. Just focus on rhythm and staying in balance. If you can establish a clear rhythm it will help her balance quite a lot.

For her it may also help to lunge her in side reins (not tight but to have contact) to help her with her own balance. Lunging helps a lot with establishing a basic rhythm and allowing the horses to figure out contact and their own balance without rider interference. When I use side reins I do use them to force the head down, they're there to give the horses something to work into and help the horse balance. About 3-4cm shorter on the inside rein than the outside rein. I also teach horses to leg yield in hand and on the lunge line and also turn on the haunches to help. Rhythm is not too fast or you lose the swing in the back or too slow or you have no energy from behind. 

Another thing is when you're not riding would be to do some stability and balance type exercises. Like planks, standing on one foot with the other leg held out to the side and then putting it back and in front without falling over. Squats or even getting on the floor with your knees on the floor. Sitting up straight with your shoulders and "posting" it'll help train the "right" posting muscles, as well as help your body get stronger and set a rhythm. Also push ups and rows and anything to strengthen your back and core is helpful and stretching in general is just goo practice. Especially hip flexor stretches!


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## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

Thank you for such an indepth answer! 
Im acctually bringing 2 friends out today, one who will be filming, and one who will be lunging me! Hopefully I can post this here as well and "continue" the awsome help I do get here! Ill also try the counting and breathing you recomended, that might be of great help!  

As for her lameness, yes, its due to mud fever which we are struggeling with. her left hind leg is the worst at the moemnt, and in that leg she also has some knee problem from an old injury down the leg... She is reciving the best care I can afford For the mudd fever, thats what needs to be done, and for her other old injury that needs some help to close up properlly, that is, unfortinatlly some extra vitamins and such that will keep it feeling the best it can, and a chiropractor out every 6th week. A little later this summer Ill be abel to pay for the treatment to get her leg healed up nicelly, but asccording to the chiropractor, this aint nothing thats gonna go worse from riding, what she needs is to move and flex and USE her body at the moment  

Once agian, thank you <3!


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## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

Heres a video of me during practise this week. Last week I was holdinng on to the sadel for dear life, and it did not look this good, haha, so a lot of improvement from that to this week, But what do you see? With only watching the videos 3 times, ÄI can say: My feets are moving to much,and I need to sit streighter in the sadel, Im falling forwards all the time, haha!


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## SteadyOn (Mar 5, 2017)

That's awesome that you were able to get a friend to lunge you! It looks like it's exactly the kind of practice you need, and your horse seems a lot happier going forward without getting yanked in the mouth. Based on how much you're tipping, it shows how much you've been depending on the reins.

Keep up this kind of practice as much as you can!

A couple other things you can try on days that you don't have assistance: 

Hold two-point position at the walk for as long as you can, with a loose rein and using either the mane or the front of the saddle as a support if you slip, rather than using the reins to hold you up.
At a trot, on the long side of the arena, put your reins into one hand, keeping them nice and loose, and working on staying balanced in your posting with NO tension on the reins. Your other hand is free, this way, to grab a neck-strap, the front of the saddle, or the mane in case you need to rebalance yourself. You might not even need to use your hand for this, but at least it's there until you KNOW you're not depending on the reins!


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## 3Horses2DogsandaCat (Apr 19, 2016)

SteadyOn said:


> A couple other things you can try on days that you don't have assistance:
> 
> Hold two-point position at the walk for as long as you can, with a loose rein and using either the mane or the front of the saddle as a support if you slip, rather than using the reins to hold you up.



I was going to suggest the same thing. When I started riding again as an adult, my trainer made me spend a lot of time standing in the stirrups in the walk and trot, and it helped my balance tremendously. Looking at your videos, it seems like you are struggling to balance. I can't tell if it's because you are squeezing with your knees rather than letting your weight sink into your heels. Doing the two-point exercise will help you align your body to stay in balance.


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## SteadyOn (Mar 5, 2017)

3Horses2DogsandaCat said:


> I was going to suggest the same thing. When I started riding again as an adult, my trainer made me spend a lot of time standing in the stirrups in the walk and trot, and it helped my balance tremendously. Looking at your videos, it seems like you are struggling to balance. I can't tell if it's because you are squeezing with your knees rather than letting your weight sink into your heels. Doing the two-point exercise will help you align your body to stay in balance.


Another thing I'd add, which helped with position and balance for me, and helped stabilize my lower leg:

Think about getting your weight into your heels by pushing your knees down and back towards them. I've found that helped with so many things!

-Allows you to get your heels down without bracing and having your leg come forward
-Keeps the inside of your calf stable against the horse, instead of pinching with the knee
-Gets your leg under you in the correct alignment
-Encourages using the backs of your thighs as a stabilizing extension of your seat.
-Discourages gripping inward with knees and thighs, which only creates tension and pops you out of the saddle.

Just by keeping this in mind, I was able to improve my seat a lot, and my posting trot, too! I had previously been pushing off the stirrups too much. By thinking of using my leg this way instead, I was pushing down into my heels, like I should be.


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## Linda G (Aug 23, 2016)

Can you stand up and remain standing at the walk? Can you hold a two point at the trot? Trying those things will help you find your balance point. This can be different in various saddles and on different horses. 


I saw this exercise asked about in another thread. (standing in the stirrups and remain standing at the walk) Many had never heard of this exercise. I have been asked to do this exercise in my lessons. It's been explained that this exercise is used to increase strength and balance. If most riding (if not all) is done with the seat or in 2 point; how does balancing while standing up in the stirrups help? I'm not being rhetorical or anything, I really would like to understand the purpose.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

I tend to just look here, on this part of the forum, but must comment on your vid. That horse looks VERY uncomfortable, quite possibly lame. I would ensure she's sound or treat her to become so, and not ride if the horse is lame/hurting. I would also have the saddle checked out, ensure it fits *comfortably* or don't ride in it.

Perhaps it's just your heavy hands though, that the horse is having such a hard time of - as you say you already appreciate it's bad that you use the reins for balance. I'd suggest you don't be afraid to take hold of the saddle or mane if you need extra security, rather than hanging off the reins, until you learn to have an independent seat. I also suggest that until you're at the point of being able to ride without using the reins inadvertently, that you consider riding in a halter, so you're not hurting the horse so much(& also training him to put up with it & ignore rein pressure).

Others are far better able to evaluate your riding otherwise, but suffice to say, when you're hanging onto the reins, causing the horse to go so uncomfortably with his head up & back, regardless of how good a rider you may be otherwise, you will find it difficult to sit to a horse who goes in that way.


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## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

She is an old sulky racing horse or whatever theyre called, and the way she is moving is what she picked up from that, getting her back uo and her head down is sadlly not possible at the time, she also has some issues with mud fever in the video which is causing some irritation in her hind legs so she is a bit uncomfortable although not hurt  

The sadel SAT fine on her when I got her, but as shes been groweing bigger and gotten mucle, its starting to get a little small, Im going to try one of my other 3 sadels and see if one of the little bigger once work better on her until I can get one accustomed to her later this year


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Hubble said:


> I didnt know the saddle was to small :O Lucky I got 2 more, lol  Ill see if I can maybe use one of the other twos, I think their seet is a bit bigger
> 
> Thank you for the help <3


You need to ensure first & foremost that whatever saddle you use, fits HER comfortably & doesn't interfere with her shoulders, etc. Also that it's not too long for her.


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## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

I have 3 saddels in 3 different sizes, the one shes wearing is the smallest, and the sadels have been used on a horse simillar to her while growing muscles and such. She was in the video right before the switch to the next sadel that I can saw fitts her perfectlly right now!  When she starts to outgrow this sadel, Ill give her the last sadel before she start to get to the point she needs to get, and at that point, I will create a custome sadel for her


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Um... Saddle fitting is indeed a... difficult subject, to be sure. That she's a mature horse but going to 'outgrow' the saddle & so just need 'bigger'(in what way?) sounds like you don't have a great idea about saddle fit I'm afraid. If it's about developing muscle for eg, that you're hoping she will 'outgrow' it, using a saddle that fits her now(atrophied, running with head in air & hollow back, or unfit) will very likely *prevent* her from being able to develop further, and may also damage what she has got further. Get a pro saddler/saddle fitter, to check/advise/adjust. Or a good bodyworker(sounds like she could need anyway) should also have a good idea about saddle fit & what she needs.


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## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

She is in the middle of a process of gaining loads of both fat and muscle, so getting her a sadel that is specificlly fitted for her today would be idiotic as she would be a different horse in 2 months time, and need it refitted again. The sadel she got now fitts her well, and after this one doesnt, she will get the biggest sadel of the 3. That one she will most likelly be abel to have until shes at the point I want her before it gets to unfitted for her, and at that stage I will get a sadelfitter and fit one for her. 

She is not hollow or head high due to the sadel, its how shes been tought to move. Shes a trotter


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Hubble said:


> getting her a sadel that is specificlly fitted for her today would be idiotic as ... The sadel she got now fitts her well,


Precisely my point - if you have a saddle that 'fits her well' now, you will be PREVENTING much if any further development! Quite probably even damaging her further, esp if she is not fit for riding. Therefore you will need a good saddler/bodyworker NOW, to show you how you might, for eg, use padding in such a way to have a saddle that will ALLOW development to fit her well enough now.



> She is not hollow or head high due to the sadel, its how shes been tought to move. Shes a trotter


I did not say she was NOW hollow from her saddle, but again, that she will be unable to develop a better way of going, better muscling if you use what fits her now.

Balance International is one website that has a heap of great info on better understanding saddle fit.


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

OP, I was looking at your video on your new journal thread of your horse free jumping. 
When I see her move without a rider, it makes me feel like she might be having some saddle fit trouble. 
You say she is a Standardbred and yes, I see that type of leg movement. But she carries herself a lot better without a rider.
If you would like to post any photos of her with the saddle on, from different angles, you could get some good advice on the forum about what you might do to improve the fit. 
If your saddle fits well it will make a big difference in your riding too, because your horse will be moving more loosely and not bracing against your weight, and everything will be smoother and more balanced. 
It's possible that the saddle you are using and believe fits the best, might not actually be the one that fits her best right now. If you are open to input, it might help your horse with her development.


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## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

Ive locked my saddles away so I cant use it until Saturday acctually, lol, thats so I wont be tempted because I really need to work on my seat  

But I can post some pictures on Saturday on how it looks on her  I have 3 sadels overall, the black one is to small for her now, so she uses a brown one, but Ive acctually concider changing her over to the third one. Might just me who likes it better as its really comfortable, but Ill post of both of them, so you could judge wich one you thinks fit the best


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

^Depending on the pics, we may be able to give a bit of an idea, but unless they're really obviously terrible fits, we won't be able to 'judge' them just from pics here. That's why I suggest you get a saddle fitter. And as she's likely to need bodywork...


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## Hubble (Nov 8, 2016)

Sadlly, the sadels I have, are the sadels I have today. I dont have any money for a sadelfitter to come out, and for that matter get me a new sadel. I spend every last dime on making sure shes healthy, and on top of it, Im moving next month. I will be abel to afford it towards the end of summer or the fall hopefully, but till then, these are the sadels I have.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

In that case, I suggest you ride bareback, until you have the money(which will greatly improve your balance & riding too). It's not fair on your horse to ride in an uncomfortable saddle just because you can't afford better. Treeless saddles are generally a lot cheaper. There are some limits & probs with those, but if you can't ensure a good fitting treed saddle, then that would generally be far kinder to your horse.

If you have 3 saddles, selling at least 2 of them will hopefully provide you with enough funds for saddle fitter/bodyworker & a decent saddle. If you sold the smallest, you should have money enough for a bodyworker, who might even tell you how you can make the larger fit or have it adjusted.


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