# Paco's Pregnancy Update!! ** Baby is Here **



## Aesthetic

Also has anyone heard of the PhTesting method to predict foaling?


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## anniegirl

Welcome!!!! and YES!! pictures...LOTS of pictures!!!!! they both sound lovely


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## Aesthetic

Here's her belly from a lower rear view 








Her slightly drooped and slightly hard teats..?








Big Ole Belly




































I'm really waiting on this foal!!


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## Aesthetic

Here's the Sire MissQuanahsDeltaChief


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## trainerunlimited

Should be a colored up foal!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

trainerunlimited said:


> Should be a colored up foal!!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 I sure hope so! He's tested homozygus black and white and possible bay and white with tobiano pattern!  His first colt came out with one blue eye<3


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## trainerunlimited

Aww sounds cute. What are they bred like and what are your plans for the foal?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

trainerunlimited said:


> Aww sounds cute. What are they bred like and what are your plans for the foal?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 Well both bloodlines are bred for cutting, but I have converted both to barrels. Same for the foal, for sure a pole and barrel baby!


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## Aesthetic

Here are pictures. Today she is 295 days into her pregnancy. Previous pictures are of her at 285 days.


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## anniegirl

She looks like she is getting closer!!! Both are gorgeous!!!! cant wait to see this baby!!


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## Aesthetic

anniegirl said:


> She looks like she is getting closer!!! Both are gorgeous!!!! cant wait to see this baby!!


Man I hope she doesn't hold this baby in to long!! I hate waiting!


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## Aesthetic

So paco hasn't really changed. Her bags seem a bit looser, able to see them hanging past her flanks when I'm a distance from her.


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## Aesthetic

Paco's rear end has a dip where her muscle is starting to relax by her tail head. No change in bags. But I have to keep in mind she's only 296 days pregnant today. Her vulva is starting to loosen up and relax though. She isn't doing her little routines yet, she normally walks for hours and works up one heck of a sweat and doesn't eat until she foals. Just a little dip in muscle on both sides of her tail head, and a bit of a relaxed vulva. I bathed her and walked her down the road today and man that must've been a work out!!


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## Aesthetic

So I have some pictures! and I've been sitting outside watching her baby jump in her belly for a good 45 minutes. It's throwing some serious fits in there!! Let me get those pictures!


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## Aesthetic

Muscles are slightly relaxed at tail head.










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## SMCLeenie

Exciting! Hope to see a baby soon! Both mom and dad are beautiful.


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## Aesthetic

Paco's bag is getting fuller! And I've got a video of the baby doing a few movements in her belly. So i'll get that video up. This morning her vulva was extremely loose, but the muscles around her tail head weren't as squishy. I don't know when exactly to start Ph Testing her. Should her udder be completely full?


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## BrieannaKelly

Looking forward to seeing what you get! Best of luck on Paco's foaling


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## Aesthetic

I took Paco out for a walk, her bag went away. When I came back I checked her vulva and her rear muscles. Her vulva is starting to stretch. It's a bit purplish red around the edges. She has an appointment at the vet tomorrow to get her shots so they'll transfer to the foal


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## SunnyDraco

Aesthetic said:


> I sure hope so! He's tested homozygus black and white and possible bay and white with tobiano pattern!  His first colt came out with one blue eye<3


I am confused... Is he homozygous tobiano (the color pattern) or homozygous black? Or was he tested and is homozygous black and homozygous tobiano? Even with the tobiano pattern, you are not always going to get a loud expression. There could be little or no white even though the foal received a tobiano gene. If he is homozygous black, you will get a black, bay or brown. Homozygous tobiano means the foal will get the tobiano gene but you will not know how much expression you will get.


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## Aesthetic

SunnyDraco said:


> I am confused... Is he homozygous tobiano (the color pattern) or homozygous black? Or was he tested and is homozygous black and homozygous tobiano? Even with the tobiano pattern, you are not always going to get a loud expression. There could be little or no white even though the foal received a tobiano gene. If he is homozygous black, you will get a black, bay or brown. Homozygous tobiano means the foal will get the tobiano gene but you will not know how much expression you will get.


Yes he is homozygus for both. And i am aware. With the last mare he was bred with he threw a black and white tobiano colt. He has only been bred twice, and this foal will be an expirement as to what he foals with a sorrel. He can throw bay and black, the vet said something how a brown will be very unlikely since t is without black points. i dont really how true that statement is.


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## SunnyDraco

Aesthetic said:


> Yes he is homozygus for both. And i am aware. With the last mare he was bred with he threw a black and white tobiano colt. He has only been bred twice, and this foal will be an expirement as to what he foals with a sorrel. He can throw bay and black, the vet said something how a brown will be very unlikely since t is without black points. i dont really how true that statement is.


Vets are great for horse care but not color genetics, that is not what their focus is. The mare is the deciding factor for the foal's color in this case. 

Your stallion is EE aa, which means he is homozygous black and no agouti. 

Your mare is ee _ _, which means she is recessive red and agouti unknown. 

The foal will be Ee _a, black from the sire, red from the mare, unknown agouti from mare, non-agouti from sire.
If your mare throws no agouti, foal will be a heterozygous black. If your mare throws the dominant agouti (A), you will get a bay foal. If your mare throws the A+ agouti, you will have a brown. 

Brown comes in many shades and forms, is great at disguising as a bay, many go through seasonal color changes, has black points as well. A large number of horses registered as bay are genetically brown. A tell tale sign of brown is when those "bay" horses get light colored soft spots when they are in their winter coats.


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## Aesthetic

SunnyDraco said:


> Vets are great for horse care but not color genetics, that is not what their focus is. The mare is the deciding factor for the foal's color in this case.
> 
> Your stallion is EE aa, which means he is homozygous black and no agouti.
> 
> Your mare is ee _ _, which means she is recessive red and agouti unknown.
> 
> The foal will be Ee _a, black from the sire, red from the mare, unknown agouti from mare, non-agouti from sire.
> If your mare throws no agouti, foal will be a heterozygous black. If your mare throws the dominant agouti (A), you will get a bay foal. If your mare throws the A+ agouti, you will have a brown.
> 
> Brown comes in many shades and forms, is great at disguising as a bay, many go through seasonal color changes, has black points as well. A large number of horses registered as bay are genetically brown. A tell tale sign of brown is when those "bay" horses get light colored soft spots when they are in their winter coats.


thank you, ill write this down and keep it in mind. I am not really picky on my colors. I do also know if the stallion is bred to a red roan mare, he will throw a roan im told by vets, and that he will throw either a blue roan, or a bay roan. im really hoping to test that. i really need to freshen up on the color genetics.


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## SunnyDraco

Aesthetic said:


> thank you, ill write this down and keep it in mind. I am not really picky on my colors. I do also know if the stallion is bred to a red roan mare, he will throw a roan im told by vets, and that he will throw either a blue roan, or a bay roan. im really hoping to test that. i really need to freshen up on the color genetics.


Again, the stallion does not produce or throw roan when he does not have it. If he is bred to a roan mare, she might be heterozygous roan and have a 50% chance to pass the gene to the foal. If he is bred to a mare with a dun, the foal could be grullo or bay dun if the mare throws her dun to the foal. If bred to a grey mare, the foal will be grey if the mare throws it. Roan, grey, dun and cream are modifiers and cover any base coat (although cream can hide on some black based horses, but turns bays into buckskins, browns into brownskins and chestnuts into palominos).

Your stallion can only give 1 black gene and 1 non-agouti gene to all his foals. He does not carry any genes that modify/restrict the black to make bays/browns. He could "produce" bays, roans, buckskins, smokey black, grullo, bay dun, and grey but it is the mare that he is bred to that would be determining the color by her own color genetics. 

If you tested the agouti status of your sorrel/chestnut mare and the results were:
aa -100% chance your foal will be black with this cross
Aa -50% chance for black, 50% chance bay/brown -depending on the agouti
AA -100% chance for bay/brown 

The great thing about breeding homozygous horses is that the color guessing is simplified. Just so you know, when your homozygous black (EE) stallion is bred to a black mare (EE or Ee), you will get a black foal every time.


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## texasgal

Sunny!!!! Oh no you didn't!!!!! *look at that avatar* ..


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## Aesthetic

SunnyDraco said:


> Again, the stallion does not produce or throw roan when he does not have it. If he is bred to a roan mare, she might be heterozygous roan and have a 50% chance to pass the gene to the foal. If he is bred to a mare with a dun, the foal could be grullo or bay dun if the mare throws her dun to the foal. If bred to a grey mare, the foal will be grey if the mare throws it. Roan, grey, dun and cream are modifiers and cover any base coat (although cream can hide on some black based horses, but turns bays into buckskins, browns into brownskins and chestnuts into palominos).
> 
> Your stallion can only give 1 black gene and 1 non-agouti gene to all his foals. He does not carry any genes that modify/restrict the black to make bays/browns. He could "produce" bays, roans, buckskins, smokey black, grullo, bay dun, and grey but it is the mare that he is bred to that would be determining the color by her own color genetics.
> 
> If you tested the agouti status of your sorrel/chestnut mare and the results were:
> aa -100% chance your foal will be black with this cross
> Aa -50% chance for black, 50% chance bay/brown -depending on the agouti
> AA -100% chance for bay/brown
> 
> The great thing about breeding homozygous horses is that the color guessing is simplified. Just so you know, when your homozygous black (EE) stallion is bred to a black mare (EE or Ee), you will get a black foal every time.


 I am aware of this, I have never had my mare tested since what she throws isn't all to important to me. I only test the stallion. Now his tested papers and everything isn't with me at the place I am now. With this mare, it will be I suppose a Brown and white, bay and white, or a black and white foal correct? I ruled brown out with one of the vets a while back but seeing as you are very educated on this subject you are most likely right. I'm not the one who bothered with the coloring, that would be my fiance who understands it.


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## Aesthetic

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This one below is the Edema on her belly right infront of her bag.








Okay, see how her bag still hands from the top with loose skin? The bottom seems hard and full but there is no milk. Is this possibly mastitis?

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These are from tonight.


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## SunnyDraco

Aesthetic said:


> I am aware of this, I have never had my mare tested since what she throws isn't all to important to me. I only test the stallion. Now his tested papers and everything isn't with me at the place I am now. With this mare, it will be I suppose a Brown and white, bay and white, or a black and white foal correct? I ruled brown out with one of the vets a while back but seeing as you are very educated on this subject you are most likely right. I'm not the one who bothered with the coloring, that would be my fiance who understands it.


I think understanding this is made easier with an illustration:

Stallion (just like yours) is EE aa -









Bred to a mare with an unknown agouti status, ee _ _ (but hidden under a single grey gene that she did not pass on this time and we know her base color because she was bred and raised by my sister). Together they produced a beautiful colt that appeared bay









He was registered as bay (which is common for the disguised browns to be registered as bay). But when his winter coat came in:








^notice the very light undersides of his flank area and by his muzzle? That is caused by the A+ form of agouti (brown) :wink:

Looking forward to see your little foal


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## Aesthetic

SunnyDraco said:


> I think understanding this is made easier with an illustration:
> 
> Stallion (just like yours) is EE aa -
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bred to a mare with an unknown agouti status, ee _ _ (but hidden under a single grey gene that she did not pass on this time and we know her base color because she was bred and raised by my sister). Together they produced a beautiful colt that appeared bay
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> He was registered as bay (which is common for the disguised browns to be registered as bay). But when his winter coat came in:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ^notice the very light undersides of his flank area and by his muzzle? That is caused by the A+ form of agouti (brown) :wink:
> 
> Looking forward to see your little foal


Thank You! You are literally the only person who figured I was a visual learner, because very much so I am. Now I'll pay very close attention to looking for those lighter brown area's when her foal comes.


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## Aesthetic

So, we had to reschedual the appointment for Paco at the vet for her shots and to get the position and foal check for tomorrow. Really can't wait. Nothing has really changed on her except for her belly is poking from her sides way more. Her bag is the same, vulva is the same. She just seems extremely and oddly lazy now. She doesn't seem to care about much. I'm hoping to hear tomorrow that she DOES NOT have mastitis. If so, it'll be very hard to find some colostrum for the little one when it's born :/
Anyways. I need help with names here. Momma's registered name is Wamps Poco Lynx and daddy's is MissQuanahsDeltaChief..
Here are some I made.
1. MissQuanahsPocoDingo
2. ShezaDeltaTwoStep
3. HezaMoneyMaker
4. DownByDeltaBay

Any other suggestions? For both Colt and Filly?


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## oobiedoo

Love the first two names you listed.


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## Aesthetic

I went out to check paco this morning. Shes got a fuller bag and its quite tender. Her vulva is slightly puffy toward the bottom. Its not light pink inside, more of a raspberry or dark pinkish color. She has an appointment today at the vet. Lets hope this one sticks.


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## Aesthetic

On our way to the vet now looking forward to what the vet says. I dont know if she will check the position of the foal or not. Paco is 299 or 300 days today. I believe 299


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## Aesthetic

Vet went well, they didn't check the foal. They gave Paco her shots and gave Twister hers too. I was able to get enough 'milk' to ph test paco. She's either at 7.8 or 8.4 . .To me it was really hard to tell which color it was on. Her vulva is slightly swollen towards the bottom, and the color is still on the raspberry or hottish pink side.


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## Aesthetic

So I checked on Paco this morning She had a very pronounced bag, not full but definitely there. Her teats were more swollen than before, I was actually able to milk her. Her ph was at 7.8 today. No change in vulva. I'll go get some pictures of her
I thought she was in labor for a moment today because she was walking laps around the pasture, which she never does. though, not labor -.-


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## KyMoMoF3CuTiEs

Subbing, sounds like all is going good and your getting closer!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

Well tonight her rear end muscles are so jiggly. Her bag is half way there. She is to tender to test for ph:/


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## paintedpastures

your poll doesn't give any color other than black to choose from:? you know getting a Bay Tobiano is a very possible option from this mating:wink:


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## WyndellaRose

I voted for a bay tobiano colt...the option is there for me with the poll...


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## Aesthetic

paintedpastures said:


> your poll doesn't give any color other than black to choose from:? you know getting a Bay Tobiano is a very possible option from this mating:wink:


There is a bay option but i typoed on one -.-


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## Ebony2Rose

updates?


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## Aesthetic

Nothing nrw. She has a huge edema under her belly. Ive been kind of nervous, actually i havent felt the foal move in her belly in a while. She is huge and seems so miserable. Her pasterns are swollen and she is extremely jiggly in her hind end. Her vulva is puffy and kinda relaxed. There is some drainage but there is no color change.


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## QuarterCarolina

My mares foal movement ceased a few weeks ago and she gave birth to a beautiful paint filly with two blue eyes yesterday  (foals of 2013 thread). I knew she was going to foal because the lips of her vulva were noticeably turned outward.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

QuarterCarolina said:


> My mares foal movement ceased a few weeks ago and she gave birth to a beautiful paint filly with two blue eyes yesterday  (foals of 2013 thread). I knew she was going to foal because thShe e lips of her vulva were noticeably turned outward.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Well her vulva was puffy but thats about it. She has only had one foal and i never saw what she was like. Just impatiently waiting. Her bag isnt full but it looks it. I try to milk her for ph testing and barely a thing comes out.


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## QuarterCarolina

She may be one that doesn't let her milk down until after. Mine was a stealth foaler so the vulva lips were the only change that I got. Not knowing her routine I would treat her like a maiden and expect the unexpected. No worries, we are all impatiently waiting with you. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

Impatient is for sure the word. Im sitting with her while she eats, her belly is huge. I believe she is at day 318


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## texasgal

Almost the "safe zone" !


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## Aesthetic

I hate waiting!! I wake up every morning and peek out my window lol Still no foal and currently she is day 322 into her pregnancy <3 My last number of days I had up was wrroonnnggg xD She is at day 322.


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## texasgal

She is JUST in the safe zone ... you could be waiting another month! *running and hiding*


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## Aesthetic

texasgal said:


> She is JUST in the safe zone ... you could be waiting another month! *running and hiding*


I know!!!  I really don't like waiting  Also, I really hope its not to long. She will stay retired and probably not bred again. Her injury that we nor the vets could find out what was bothering her is flaring up and she is limping around the pasture under the weight  This odd injury comes and goes. I think it's time to make the pretty girl just a pasture and trail horse after this foal. . .


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## FrostedLilly

What a pretty mare and sire! You should have a nice looking baby and hopefully she doesn't keep you waiting too long! Here in Alberta, I've heard that many mares are going extra long, perhaps because of the super late spring we had here. Hopefully she won't keep you waiting much longer! 

Too bad about her injury. A friend of mine is in a similar situation with her show mare. The mare went lame and despite trying multiple treatments, the vet could not figure out what was wrong. Her mare is also in foal and on day 365 today. I hope Paco doesn't make you wait this long.


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## Aesthetic

Glynnis said:


> What a pretty mare and sire! You should have a nice looking baby and hopefully she doesn't keep you waiting too long! Here in Alberta, I've heard that many mares are going extra long, perhaps because of the super late spring we had here. Hopefully she won't keep you waiting much longer!
> 
> Too bad about her injury. A friend of mine is in a similar situation with her show mare. The mare went lame and despite trying multiple treatments, the vet could not figure out what was wrong. Her mare is also in foal and on day 365 today. I hope Paco doesn't make you wait this long.


Thank You!! I sure hope she doesn't keep me waiting!! I'm worried about that limp of hers! And she needs her shoes back on ASAP! 

I'm sorry for your friends mare It's a shame, but it's better than asking them to hurt themselves more.. I probably won't breed her again. If this foal comes out a filly I'll possibly breed the filly later in life.


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## Aesthetic

She's getting so big!! Well she isn't the only one expecting, Our cat is due for a litter any day! Also, I am wondering if you can DNA test a foal to a sire? My ex boyfriend will not give me my breeding certificate back.

Anyways her bag is starting to get bigger. Her vulva keeps getting swollen and dark red inside but goes away. I just can't get enough milk out of her to PH test her.....Another thing, we are going to Corpus Christi this Saturday for a family members graduation...I hope she holds that foal in if she doesn't have it before this Saturday!!


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## SunnyDraco

You would need to call the registry and find out, if a breeding report was sent in, you may be able to register without the breeding certificate depending on the registry's rules and regulations


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## Aesthetic

Thanks sunny

I have been in corpus christi the past two days. My neighbor has called and said no changes. i hope she doesnt foal until we get back. I am bringing a cousin home and she has never witnessed a live birth and neither have I. I have seen a video of one of my previous mares.foaling.


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## Aesthetic

Well i got a call this morning saying paco had her baby, the guy only knows it looks brown and white. Im getting an early start out of corpus christi to go see my new child lol


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## Aesthetic

What the man described sounds like the foal is a medicine hat paint. Both blue eyes and minimal color on the body. Im not sure what gender


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## aforred

Waiting for pictures!


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## Druydess

Congrats!! Pics are mandatory!!


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## WhyAHorseOfCourse

:happydance:Can't wait to see pictures!


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## Aesthetic

Here she is. She has black ears but everything else seems a brownish bayish color. But i also havent seen her in person.


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## Falcor74

awwwww... it does look like she is a medicine hat. Can't wait to see more ppics and see what color she is "for sure" lol... congrats!


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## cmarie

What a cutie, congrats.


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## Aesthetic

A pic of momma and baby at a kind of distance


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## SunnyDraco

Congrats 
Hope to see more pictures soon, she looks like a bay/brown paint to me but better pictures where she and mom aren't all wet could help lol
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aesthetic

Hee is the foal. It is indeed a little colt. He has one blue eye, but no liner around his eyes.he is bayish, black on his ears.


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## KatieAndZanzibar

Looks like a medicine hat.


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## WyndellaRose

Gorgeous! I voted for a bay toby colt! I finally got one right!!!


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## Oliveren15

He's adorable! Congratulations!


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## Falcor74

Congrats and he is absolutely beautiful!!! One thing I have learned with white faces and blue eyes with no eye liner, and this may depend on where you live too, but you have to make sure that he will not have problems with his eye. There are a couple of articles out there you may want to check out, especially on Paint Horse Connection. Some people have also gone as far as to have a recognized vet tattoo "eyeliner" to prevent problems (can be expensive. Not to worry you this early on, but it is something I have to worry about too and have been checking into.


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## Aesthetic

Falcor74 said:


> Congrats and he is absolutely beautiful!!! One thing I have learned with white faces and blue eyes with no eye liner, and this may depend on where you live too, but you have to make sure that he will not have problems with his eye. There are a couple of articles out there you may want to check out, especially on Paint Horse Connection. Some people have also gone as far as to have a recognized vet tattoo "eyeliner" to prevent problems (can be expensive. Not to worry you this early on, but it is something I have to worry about too and have been checking into.


Already thought about it gonna talk to the vet tomorrow


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## Aesthetic

I was hoping for a filly, but whatever I get is what I got! Now, I'll wait to see how his temperament is, conformation, and skills are before I decide if i'm cutting him. He's got two very nice blood lines, peppy's, Poco's, Kings, Deltas ect. Hopefully he turns out wonderfully and he would through some nice babies. If not, oh well, he will make a nice prospect in something. I have a LOOONNNGGG wait until I can decide this. He has a long time to prove his worth to me.


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## Aesthetic

Also I was told by the owner of the stallion his first foal was born bay and white, and when he molted his coat he turned out to be a slick black and white baby.


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## Aesthetic

Here's The little man, name is undecided. still throwing together names from his bloodline. Anyone wanna help with name creation?


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## texasgal

How cute is he?!?!?!?!?!?


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## anniegirl

OMG HE IS GEORGEOUS!!!!! Congrats!!


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## Falcor74

I will bounce a few around... I usually try for both sides, if it blends well together. What is the mare's registered name? (I don't recall if you listed it, sorry)


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## morganarab94

AWW! He's so cute.


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## Aesthetic

Falcor74 said:


> I will bounce a few around... I usually try for both sides, if it blends well together. What is the mare's registered name? (I don't recall if you listed it, sorry)


Dam is - Wamps Poco Lynx 
sire is - MissQuanahsDeltaChief

Since the colt is a paint, we need more from the sires side with known horses like the Delta and Quanah bloodline, even the Calicos


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## Aesthetic

Well he just got his first vet check up. His temperature was 101.1. He has no heart murmur and his bpm was 80. His respirations was 44 and clear. His eyes are clear, needs tattoos around his eyes. His joints are aligned good, his tendons are fine. Both testicles present 
in other words, a nice healthy colt
on the way into the trailer, lil man ran in under momma during loading!! no problem!!


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## BrieannaKelly

Congrats on a beautiful colt! Love his marking and Medicine Hat!


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## Mollysue

So exciting I definitely will follow. I just posted info on a thread for my pregnant mare. It's called Peppys first pregnancy journey . Would love to share with you all!


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## Mollysue

Looking really pregnant, I too started a thread about my mare. It's posted under (Peppys first pregnancy journey) would love any info from every one as this is our first time!


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## Mollysue

Never heard of tattooing around eyes. Is that because of color around eyes?


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## Falcor74

Molly, a lot of horses with blue eyes on a white face tend to have eye problems that can eventually lead to blindness. I know here in the SW, the sun poses the greatest risk for this situation, so many people tattoo "eyeliner" to prevent this from happening. It acts much the way a football players black smears under their eyes does. It prevents sun glare/ /sunburning to the eye. Others may have a more defined reasoning, this is just a quick response, since it is something I have to watch on my little boy as well.


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## Mollysue

Thanks so much, my mare Peppy was bred first week in April, and is pregnant. I started a thread called Peppys first pregnancy journey. If your interested I'd love any info or advice. Judy


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## Aesthetic

Here he is at 8 and a half weeks old  His name is now Gunner for at home. We are working to get him DNA tested.


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