# Crit him as a possible hunter/dressage prospect



## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

What level would you like to do?


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Is that the same horse as in the 1st picture? If so, it is too bad he has been let go and loose condition but I se he has shoes on so I assume he is being worked. Looks like he has really lost his top line


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## sarahver (Apr 9, 2010)

Wow, he was once a beautiful horse! Just looks like he has been a pasture ornament for a few years.

As for conformation photos it is best if he is unsaddled and standing square. You can't tell much when they are moving. Photos taken from the front, both sides and from behind are best.


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## Eliz (Jun 16, 2010)

Yes he was pastured for a while, under light-meduim work. The second and third photos were right after the last photo, he was shown this fall (which is why he had padded shoes on..).

As far as levels go I'm only a beginner at dressage and jumping, so I'm sure we'd only do some local shows and at the end of the season some rated shows. I plan on doing some haul ins and working with my hunter/dressage trainer.  I'll get some photos in a few hours. Thanks!

And yes, it is the same horse, but the first photo was taken in 2006 and his grey has changed quite a bit since then


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## haleylvsshammy (Jun 29, 2010)

Just curious, how tall is he? He looks to be a good sized arab!


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Well, if he is show sour, then doing dressage with him would require you to do a ton of circling. 
He's a cute horse and is not as but high as many Arabs are. That's good for dressage. Overall, he looks good to me.
The lack of muscling behind his withers suggests he might have been wearing a saddle that constricted his shoulders for a LONG time. Since he is gray, you would not be able to see if any white hairs had developed from bad saddle fit, but the way he is hollow behind the prominant wither could be from that.

If you do showing, thing about doing something fun and stimulating for him like trail riding, to freshen him for more arena work. Also, working on uneven ground will develop his muscles. Show horses are often worked only in arenas; flat and excellent footing. Need to ride on hills and uneven footing to build baance and muscle .


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## Eliz (Jun 16, 2010)

haleylvsshammy said:


> Just curious, how tall is he? He looks to be a good sized arab!


He's 15.3hh 

Tiny:
Hm, I've never thought about that, I'll check into his saddle fitting. He's really a hot horse so we do a lot of circles & serpentines already 

I'm uploading photos right now, I'll post them in a second. Videos will be posted in about 40 minutes


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## Eliz (Jun 16, 2010)




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## Eliz (Jun 16, 2010)

I just edited these real quick, sorry for quality 





 




 




 
** 
You can crit my riding if you want as well. Keep in mind this is the first time I have ridden him in a while and I didn't try to keep him bridled the whole ride.


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## Bandera (Jul 31, 2010)

sorry to say but he looks off... i wanna say right hind but its hard to tell with the video...


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## Eliz (Jun 16, 2010)

Off? I dont think so...


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Liz
I don't see ANY offness in him at all. He has a wonderful walk, which will earn you a lot of points in dressage. nice 4 beat and he steps under nicely. I think he is awesome!
You will want to start encoutaging him to reach more forward so that he is not coming behind the vertical on the bit. Look at these videos again and you will see that he is walking and trotting most of the time behind the vertical. He isn't really bad about that and seems to come honestly to the bit. With some work on getting him to strethc forward, (will really get free walk up there in points, too) and let even take the bit in front of the vertical at times. 
You look like a very competent rider. If you chose to do dressage on him and get a dressage saddle, you will be working on not leaning forward so much . That will be a natural thing for you to change, going from hunter to dressage.

I really like the pair of you!


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## ptvintage (Feb 12, 2010)

He looks off to me too. It's hard to really tell since the video isn't good, but I think it's something you should look into.


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## MyBoyPuck (Mar 27, 2009)

Bandera said:


> sorry to say but he looks off... i wanna say right hind but its hard to tell with the video...


I saw that too Bandera. First 3 trot passes in the first video. I thought he was off too, but I think he's just anticipating and trying to canter. 

He'd probably do well at dressage. If he focuses well, he'd probably like it. Their are infinite things to learn in that discipline.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

Well, I looked again at the video and to me it looked like he stumbled in the mud. But if that was not the case, then I can see what the others are talking about. Didn't notice it the first time.


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## Bandera (Jul 31, 2010)

i could be totally wrong because it was hard with that video. He looks like a nice horse that could probably do very well maybe up to 1st level or possibly second level when he gets into shape and maybe some jumping!


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## Eliz (Jun 16, 2010)

Thanks you all! I looked back at the video and it did look like he was trying to sneak in some canter steps... I also remember when I was riding he was sneezing quite a lot so that could've tripped him up a little. I'll maybe get a video of me lunging or something, it's super hard to just set the camera and give you all a good view of stuff 

Yes, I have problems with a more forward seat sometimes... which I'll really have to work with on him since he's so gogogo. I love riding him because he's such a challenge (you can hang on his face all day but he wont slow unless you really ride with your seat).

I'll start working with him a little in front of the bridle then gradually move him down.


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## sarahver (Apr 9, 2010)

Overall he seems like a nice horse. His walk really stands out and I think as you fine tune your driving seat and allow him to power more from behind it will be exceptional. I see where people are coming from with him being off but it does look more like he may have been trying to canter there for a couple of strides. Again nice trot and canter, both of which will improve tremendously with more rhythym and drive.

Conformation wise, the only thing that bugs me are his high withers, you may have trouble finding a saddle that fits him well and gives him a full range of motion through his shoulders. He looks like he stands under himself a little although he is not standing square in the photos so it is hard to truly say.

Beautiful head and a kind eye, he looks like a nice little horse!


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

Wow, he's a looker! Have you considered endurance riding?


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## Eliz (Jun 16, 2010)

Thanks, all! Of course we'll be getting with my instructor/trainer and we'll get on the right track for this show season. He's an awesome horse!

As for endurance riding I've thought about it but I'm not really into it. We might could go that direction with him if dressage or jumping does not work out for him..

Ok about saddle fit. I ride a horse that has really high withers and he has a pad that you put under the saddle for that. I don't know much about it, I'll have to look into that. Would that kind of thing help? Like I said I don't know much about saddle fitting. I'm off to do some research!


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## sarahver (Apr 9, 2010)

Eliz said:


> Ok about saddle fit. I ride a horse that has really high withers and he has a pad that you put under the saddle for that. I don't know much about it, I'll have to look into that. Would that kind of thing help? Like I said I don't know much about saddle fitting. I'm off to do some research!


I too have a horse with high withers. There were a few things that I considered for her when looking for saddles:

-Good wither clearance (obviously!) basically I wanted to see good clearance of at least an inch so that the gullet wasn't resting on her withers at all.
-The slope of the wither will also determine which makes and models will fit best as some withers are high but slope gradually into the back. Others are much more clearly defined and you need to be careful that this lack of slope is equalized so that the weight is distributed evenly along all of the muscles and the wither is not used as a platform, thus bearing too much weight alone.
-Consideration for the shape and width of the shoulders and back is also important so it will depend greatly on the individual horse. A horse with narrow shoulders and a high wither will require a different fit to a horse with broad shoulders and high withers. The same goes for the back conformation. 

I just tried a variety of saddles until I found one that was suitable. As for pads, you can buy 'cutback' pads that are like a normal pad with the wither section cut away and they can help to boost the saddle off the withers. These only work when the saddle itself fits well but the gullet is resting too low on the wither itself.

Having said all of this, I am by no means a saddle fitter so if you have access to one they will be able to help you far more than me!


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## upnover (Jan 17, 2008)

He's not the ideal hunter, but at the lower levels on a local circuit he should be ok. He doesn't really carry himself as a hunter (most Arabs don't) but he doesn't have terrible knee action and his canter is better then his trot. If he can clock around a hunter course on a consistent (and correct) pace, get the correct distance to all his jumps, and swap his lead you should be ok.


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## Eliz (Jun 16, 2010)

Thanks Sarah & Upnover!
I'll look into a saddle fitter for sure.
Like I said I'll get with a trainer and see how far we can go


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## wheeler4x4 (Dec 10, 2010)

I can definitely see potential for dressage. As for being show sour, im assuming you mean like flat classes, just going around the outside edge of the ring? If that is the case, he will probably find dressage a little less boring, I know my sisters mare got bored with hunter and western flat classes. Dressage causes more brainwork, so it might be different in his mind, who knows.

As for the high withers, lots of dressage horses have high withers, tb's especially tend to, so you can be sure there are saddles out there to fit. I also like to stick a half pad under the saddle, they work nicely.


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## Eliz (Jun 16, 2010)

wheeler4x4 said:


> I can definitely see potential for dressage. As for being show sour, im assuming you mean like flat classes, just going around the outside edge of the ring? If that is the case, he will probably find dressage a little less boring, I know my sisters mare got bored with hunter and western flat classes. Dressage causes more brainwork, so it might be different in his mind, who knows.
> 
> As for the high withers, lots of dressage horses have high withers, tb's especially tend to, so you can be sure there are saddles out there to fit. I also like to stick a half pad under the saddle, they work nicely.


Yes, just rail classes, going around the ring. That's why I'm hoping he'll like dressage, after all it is more brain work and it's more than just going around the outer edge of the ring.  I think that's what a horse I ride has.. a half pad. Like I said I'll look into saddle fit and ask around. Thanks!


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## ladybugsgirl (Aug 12, 2009)

Sorry I noticed to that he seemed off or stumbled in that one spot.


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## Eliz (Jun 16, 2010)

Yes...

I've been researching saddle fit and I read that stumbling is a common side effect of an ill fitted saddle. I'm going to take a look at his saddle and see if it fits. I'm thinking of ordering an front riser pad if thats the case because of the lack of muscle he has around his shoulders/withers.


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## reachthestars (Jul 2, 2010)

I see him as much more of a dressage horse than a hunter. There are arabs who do well in the hunter ring, but they're few and far between - they tend to have too much knee action and get up and go when compared to the WBs that are dominating the shows now. But fortunately what works against him for hunters is great for him in dressage! 

My biggest critique is for you to be always thinking of what diagonal you are on. Through the first video you're rising with the inside leg . Also, it's minor, but they're HUGE petpeeves of mine - riding without a helmet, and riding in jeans. Both scream (to me) unprofessional, and riding in jeans will actually scratch the seat of your saddle from the seams rubbing.


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## equinesalways (Jan 5, 2010)

If you enjoy dressage, I think this horse would probably be a better dressage horse than a hunter as most Arabs are. At least in the USET world of hunting, not the Arabian HUS stuff which he previously did. Arabs are usually very adept at learning lateral work, are light in the bridle, and ones built like yours are good at collected work. The tricky part is getting them relaxed, straight, reaching to the bit instead of curling, and really moving forward/extending, so their strengths are also their weaknesses. Your guy has a nice walk, is comfortable to ride and is responsive to your aids; all things good for dressage. I didn't really get to see a pure trot as I think he was trying to canter instead, but the trot can be improved and developed quite a bit. His canter looked nice and I think 3 beat for the few strides I saw, but you will need to sit into him, drive him forward and let him go. Don't hold your hands low to try to get him to put his head down. Just follow his head and focus on getting the hind end active and the forehand lighter. Enjoy!


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