# Pelham Bits Allowed?



## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

For schooling shows the best advice is to inquire with those putting on the show. This is an except from hunter/jumper coach Julie Winkel

"In *the hunter ring, traditional bits are recommended, which include snaffles, pelhams, and full bridles—all with a cavesson nosebands.* Nontraditional bits, such as hunter gags & Kimberwicks, MAY be penalized at the judge’s discretion. Illegal bits includes two & three ring bits, jumper-type gags, etc. The judge MUST eliminate the competitor if these are used. Illegal nosebands in the hunter ring include dropped nosebands, flash nosebands, and figure 8’s. Standing _and_ running martingales are allowed in over fences classes, but not in under saddle classes.

As a judge, I am not partial to a pelham vs. a snaffle. I want to see a horse that carries themself in a light uphill manner with a good expression. So whichever bit that individual horse goes best in is the right answer.

Martingales, correctly fitted, are acceptable except in flat classes, hunter hack classes, and tie-breaking hack classes. Correctly fitted for the standing means the strap touches the middle of the neck but not the throat. For running martingales, they are long enough as to not break a straight line to the horse’s mouth from the rider’s hand. Standing martingales are very common, however, you rarely see a running martingale used, but they are legal.

Standing martingales should be used if needed and can actually make a better overall picture with a horse that has a big front end or long neck as they looked more balanced. But if the horse doesn’t need a martingale otherwise, don’t use it. It’s whatever the horse goes best in.

I do think it’s a cleaner look to show in the under saddle classes in a snaffle, as we are looking for a horse that not only is a good mover but also has a good expression and is light in the bridle. But I would not consciously penalize a horse that’s hacked in a pelham"


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## horseponycrazy27 (Nov 15, 2015)

The shows I go to a watch and I have competed in them at my old barn, is a schooling hunter/jumper show. I have seen horses with flash bridles and at least one or two figure eight/grackle bridle. Are the flash and figure eight bridles legal or illegal with that type of show?


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

My feeling is if it is illegal in the rated show then it should be illegal in the schooling shows. I don't know what your local shows are like but here in the disciplines my child is in they keep to what is legal in the rated for what is allowed in the schooling. 

Illegal nosebands in the hunter ring include dropped nosebands, flash nosebands, and figure 8’s. Jumpers is a different story. Local shows that are not rated can do what ever they want but if your judges are coming from that background then I would say they would place a horse lower than one with proper equipment no matter whether allowed or not. 

This is from an article in Practical Horseman that talks about what is worn in the different disciplines. 

*By the Rule Book*
Flashes and figure eights are not considered conventional nosebands in the hunter show ring, but they are allowed in some of the jumper-oriented equitation divisions. U.S. Equestrian Federation Show Jumping Talent Search classes and the jumper phase of Washington International Horse Show Equitation classes allow for a flash or figure eight to be used, while USEF Hunter Seat Equitation Medal and ASPCA Maclay classes call for a plain cavesson. Flash and figure-eight nosebands are allowed in lower-level dressage competitions and in all eventing phases.

Here is a link to the article








Become a Horse Noseband Know-It-All


Learn about the different kinds of nosebands and what they do to pick the right one for your horse.




practicalhorsemanmag.com





If a top trainer blogs about it not being allowed and a prominent equine magazine says same then I suspect if you search the actual rules you would see the same. To me irresponsible for a local show to allow when a percentage of those riders may be going on to rated shows. I supsect though that those trainers with serious riders would not allow their students to ride in illegal equipment. 


Are you sure they were in one of the Hunter classes? Could they have been in a Jumper class? In which case flash or figure 8s are allowed according to the above.


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## horseponycrazy27 (Nov 15, 2015)

QtrBel said:


> Are you sure they were in one of the Hunter classes? Could they have been in a Jumper class? In which case flash or figure 8s are allowed according to the above.


They were in flat classes and hunter over fences 

At the show I go to at the same barn every month its not like the Hunter Hack or anything like that. It's hunter/jumper and very laid back. Hunter Under Saddle: Horse being judged, Hunter Equitation: Rider being judged, Hunter Pleasure: both horse and rider being judged. then there are two Hunter Over Fences Classes, again one is rider and one is horse. As you probably already know...


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

My advice would be not to worry about what someone else is using. If you are going to show then local or not follow the rules set forth for that discipline. Horse Trials are a whole different ball game. That is what I am most familiar with now. It has been over 30 years since I was in the Hunter ring. I keep up a little only because I have students that show hunter/jumper. They like to know their teacher has an interest in them outside of school.


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

Schooling shows _may_ permit equipment that a rated show will not.
I have _never_ seen a H/J show _*not*_ allow a Pelham bit in flat or over fences classes.
These are Pelham bits to me, not sure what you refer to but this is what I learned...















My thought though is if you are going to use a Pelham bit then learn to ride correctly with 2-reins as the bit is intended and made to have for minute signals given.








To me, using a bit converter, that strap thing that then allows 1-rein for the rider to hold is wrong as the minute information given can now not be but bombard the horse with information-overload.
As you see from the pictures below how that converter looks when no contact is had when riding and what the "overload" can be when the curb rein is engaged can make the bit strong, stronger and strongest instead of gentler/moderate and release as the animal complies...















The secret of riding is to only use as much contact as is needed for information shared but to not overwhelm with sensory overload of to strong a signal given to many times and held to that strong signal makes a horse over time dead to your signals...
🐴... _jmo..._


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

You may know more than I @horselovinguy 
about the bridles. Yes, pelhams as you show, as well as snaffles. Bridles with a cavesson. That is where the discussion took a turn. 

OP is now asking about flash, figure 8s and grackles in the hunter rings. 

I agree - local shows do as they please. In my mind though why ride in a local show in equipment not allowed in a rated show. Just doesn't seem fair to those that do follow the rules.


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

QtrBel said:


> OP is now asking about flash, figure 8s and grackles in the hunter rings.


None of those QtrBel named above are legal in any "Hunter" ring.
In the jumper ring it is more, anything goes.
A simple looking caveson is legal in the Hunter ring, period..

If your schooling show is so lenient to allow entry into the Hunter ring with that equipment named above, shame on them.
Today, these are "fad" bridle pieces used by those who want to look like everyone else, not for the specific reason they were designed and came into being.

Learn to recognize what your horse needs and not follow the crowd or fad, cause often the crowd or fad does your horse wrong...be a individual not a carbon copy for the wrong reasons.
Whether you show or just ride for yourself and pleasure, it *is* owed to the animal to use the right equipment on the horse they need, correctly applied and adjusted to their body so good, kind purpose is achieved...
Please, please keep asking those questions so you can learn why to do and when by our many experienced members here who would love to share their knowledge with those trying to learn the right way not the follow the other "fad" way of doing so many do today.
Question away.. 
🐴..._ jmo..._


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