# Harley and I jumping!



## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

What do you think?
Harley and I jumping! - YouTube


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## whiskeynoo (Mar 17, 2010)

i don't know much about jumping so i can't really critique, but i do really like how calm he is coming up to the jump and how he takes his time.


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## Klassic Superstar (Nov 30, 2009)

Your horse is beautiful!He really listen and repsonds well to you and your very insync with eachother! 
What I see that would help is that you need to lift your handsa good 5'' higher, right now they are in your lap, quiet and still but in your lap....even going over the small jump. The jump itself being so small and your horse taking it smoothly makes it so you dont need a big relase but, stearing and a small relase are needed so you dont catch him in the mouth.

Beofre you pick up your reisn think about loosening your supper bpdy up....lik wet noodles, shake your are out, twost side to side arms out like aireplane wings then up to the sky and do shoulder circles, this will all help keep a soft bend when your hands come out of your lap, you will need to shorten your reins just a bit when this happens.

because your hands are in your lap, and though your hands a nice a quiet they are pulling down on him and thats why his head is in their and neck looks pretty braced. 

Is their a feild you could ride in other then this little area you are in? 

All in all you look good and very stable. I think your legs are at a good place os that you can get more of a wrapping senstation around his barrel and seems he steeers off your seat pretty good?

The minis are super cute, the little one running around when you go past is too cute!


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

I only got like half of what you said


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## Klassic Superstar (Nov 30, 2009)

Well what half did you not understand?


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## Oxer (Jul 9, 2010)

i would personally prefer for someone not to "tanter" to a fence. Either trot it, or canter it. There's no impulsion in his canter. Put your leg on either ask for a nice working trot, or a forward canter, with the impulsion from the hind.


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## ThoroughbredJumper (Oct 30, 2012)

i agree with Oxer. Have a steady pace before and after the jump. Sure, change a few strides after. But not basically OVER the jump. Also, it looks like youre sitting over the jump as well as everywhere else... Raise your hands a bit and keep your saddle light so he can have spring off the ground, it could round out his jump more and make him steady on the back side. I am trying to be nice, bare with me.


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## ThoroughbredJumper (Oct 30, 2012)

Also, it seems you are using his mouth for stability and you're not using much leg, if any...


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

I think its because my stirrups are a tad long. new saddle so havent adjusted. I was def not using his mouth to stabilize. This horse has an extremely hard mouth. Also he has a tendency to duck out of the jumps and I am just getting my confidence back so I made him approach slower. He also has a tendency to flatten out too much and go through the jump if I push him too much


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## ThoroughbredJumper (Oct 30, 2012)

It, honestly, didnt seem you were pushing at all (with your leg) maybe you were with your seat which would explain the sitting that was so apparent, but that wont help him. Try and use your leg to push him instead of your seat. Cheers'


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

I agree with Oxer, impulsion is nice when leading up to a jump. While it's pleasant to see him not rushing, he really ought to be into it too.
I think what Klassic was trying to say (it looks like she has a tough auto-correct) was that you should work on loosening up your upper body and reaching more forward into the jump.
So you can start your rides by stretching your arms, stretch them out to either side (like and airplane) make circles with your arms. Roll your shoulders in circles backwards to help open up your diaphragm and relax your upper body. 
Then when you jump and go into your half seat you want to stretch your arms up a little less than half way up the horse's neck and stand well up out of the saddle. You should practice this regularly at the trot and canter to work on your balance before jumping like this. This will help your seat a great deal because it will help align your lower leg and keep your balance. You should be able to comfortably reach up and rest your hands on the horse's neck, standing up off the horse's back without actually resting weight on the horse's neck - this is tougher than it sounds 
I think that will help a great deal to allow the horse a little more room to jump.
While I love that your hands are so still and quiet, but they should be a bit more forward in general, and much more forward over the jump 

So work on loosening up your upper half, stretching up into a full half seat when jumping and standing up well off the horse's back during the jump.
This diagram isn't perfect, but you can get the idea, when actually jumping I'd like to see the person even more forward than this:


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

The first thing I noticed is that you're using your reins for balance - can you go in a two point while in a walk, trot AND canter (and transitions between said gaits) without using the reins or neck for balance? I would be willing to bet $10 that you can't at the moment, which is causing some major balance issues.
Your horse can compensate by being a saint and just heaving himself over small jumps, but if you truly want to jump, you have to start with the basics.
At a walk, get up in the two point making sure that your weight is in your heels. Don't let your hands rest on your horse's neck, just maintain light contact. Stay up in the two point without falling forwards or backwards. Once you can do that for a few laps around the arena (consistently!!!!) then start by holding one arm out to the side, then the other arm. Remember, no butt-slapping or stabilizing on the neck! Once you have that mastered, move to the trot... then work on your walk/trot transitions... then move to the canter. Rinse, repeat. Then add in a few trot or canter poles. 
You do not have any sort of jumping balance right now - which is OK!! 6 months ago I didn't have any to speak of either.. I'm just getting back into jumping, myself. My ankles still hurt after a good ride, and my legs burn, but I know that I'm way ahead of where I was even two months ago. You can really see the lack of stability in your jumping position upon landing - your leg swings and pops you back out of the saddle. 
Your horse looks like a cute boy, and very forgiving. Give yourself the time to develop a good solid base so neither of you rush where you aren't ready to go just yet. 
You need to shorten up your rein a good 6" and bring your hands up and forwards; you want a straight line from elbow to bit. 
Are you working with a coach??


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

JustDressageIt said:


> The first thing I noticed is that you're using your reins for balance - can you go in a two point while in a walk, trot AND canter (and transitions between said gaits) without using the reins or neck for balance? I would be willing to bet $10 that you can't at the moment, which is causing some major balance issues.
> Your horse can compensate by being a saint and just heaving himself over small jumps, but if you truly want to jump, you have to start with the basics.
> At a walk, get up in the two point making sure that your weight is in your heels. Don't let your hands rest on your horse's neck, just maintain light contact. Stay up in the two point without falling forwards or backwards. Once you can do that for a few laps around the arena (consistently!!!!) then start by holding one arm out to the side, then the other arm. Remember, no butt-slapping or stabilizing on the neck! Once you have that mastered, move to the trot... then work on your walk/trot transitions... then move to the canter. Rinse, repeat. Then add in a few trot or canter poles.
> You do not have any sort of jumping balance right now - which is OK!! 6 months ago I didn't have any to speak of either.. I'm just getting back into jumping, myself. My ankles still hurt after a good ride, and my legs burn, but I know that I'm way ahead of where I was even two months ago. You can really see the lack of stability in your jumping position upon landing - your leg swings and pops you back out of the saddle.
> ...


Nope  just for fun! I don't want to be great at it, just to be able to say I can and survive. You see, when I let my horse go to a retirement home, I lost all my nerve for jumping. It has taken a long time for Harley and I to get to this point. Before Harley came this spring, I hadn't jumped in about 2 yrs and have never had any jumping lessons at all. I was just curious to see how my jumping was after having straight dressage and never having a jumping lesson and barely jumping at all


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## ThoroughbredJumper (Oct 30, 2012)

Amen to Dressage
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ThoroughbredJumper (Oct 30, 2012)

Horseychick94 said:


> Nope  just for fun! I don't want to be great at it, just to be able to say I can and survive. You see, when I let my horse go to a retirement home, I lost all my nerve for jumping. It has taken a long time for Harley and I to get to this point. Before Harley came this spring, I hadn't jumped in about 2 yrs and have never had any jumping lessons at all. I was just curious to see how my jumping was after having straight dressage and never having a jumping lesson and barely jumping at all


Look... Im gonna be honest here... If youre just out to do it for "fun" with absolutely no training, stop it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

Horseychick94 said:


> Nope  just for fun! I don't want to be great at it, just to be able to say I can and survive. You see, when I let my horse go to a retirement home, I lost all my nerve for jumping. It has taken a long time for Harley and I to get to this point. Before Harley came this spring, I hadn't jumped in about 2 yrs and have never had any jumping lessons at all. I was just curious to see how my jumping was after having straight dressage and never having a jumping lesson and barely jumping at all



I think it's fantastic you're opening up  Jumping can be fun. But even if it is just for fun, you really want to be sure you're doing it the right way. The 'rules' we make for how to jump 'properly' aren't just for show or to look pretty, but to enable the horse to move more comfortably and correctly. We, as riders, want to interfere with the horse's movement as little as possible, allowing them to move comfortably the way we ask them.
The more comfortable they are doing what we ask, the more likely they'll want to do what we ask. 

I would recommend following Dressage's advice pretty solid, especially developing a good solid half seat - that will also help correct all your little issues with balance and leg position too.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Sorry, HorseyChick94 - if you want to jump, you have to invest the time in learning how to do it correctly, not just "do it and survive." There's a LOT more that can go wrong with jumping than "just" riding around. Please please be safe - either take it seriously and learn how to do it properly, or maybe just not jumping isn't a bad idea. The way you're jumping now isn't correct and can end badly with either your horse becoming sore to the idea, or either one of you getting hurt. 
What are you jumping in that video, by the way?


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

PurpsTank said it wonderfully, and much more eloquently than I.


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

Horseychick94 said:


> Nope  just for fun! *I don't want to be great at it, just to be able to say I can and survive. *You see, when I let my horse go to a retirement home, I lost all my nerve for jumping. It has taken a long time for Harley and I to get to this point. Before Harley came this spring, I hadn't jumped in about 2 yrs and have never had any jumping lessons at all. I was just curious to see how my jumping was after having straight dressage and never having a jumping lesson and barely jumping at all


But what about the horse - the input that you have been given isn't so much about your benefit, but about making this whole thing as easy as possible on the horse.


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

JustDressageIt said:


> Sorry, HorseyChick94 - if you want to jump, you have to invest the time in learning how to do it correctly, not just "do it and survive." There's a LOT more that can go wrong with jumping than "just" riding around. Please please be safe - either take it seriously and learn how to do it properly, or maybe just not jumping isn't a bad idea. The way you're jumping now isn't correct and can end badly with either your horse becoming sore to the idea, or either one of you getting hurt.
> What are you jumping in that video, by the way?


Yeah I am going to take some time to improve my jumping but im not looking to be "the best" out there. A lot of enjoyment is taken out of riding when people try to be perfect. Now I highly doubt that popping a horse over a low jump once in a blue moon is going to be detrimental. Ive seen way worse. I live out in the country so trust me, I have seen some crap that will make you cringe. This is nothing. These are the first jumps I have done in years just to get my confidence back. Nothing more, nothing less. Am I any good? Probably not. But im definitely not hurting my horse. BUT I will start investing my time into getting better just so I don't suck completely. Maybe I might even do a few shows but there are a lot of snobs out there that I don't want anything to do with. I am jumping bales of shavings in the video.


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

themacpack said:


> But what about the horse - the input that you have been given isn't so much about your benefit, but about making this whole thing as easy as possible on the horse.


"I" should mean "we". We just want to be able to jump every now and again for fun as dressage gets stale after a while. This horse gets fried easily so he needs new activities to keep him happy. He was pretty **** happy doing a few jumps. We are even working on western and reining


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

ThoroughbredJumper said:


> Look... Im gonna be honest here... If youre just out to do it for "fun" with absolutely no training, stop it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Wow thats encouraging to a rider that is conquering her fears....more like rude and snobby. Riding isn't all about being perfect and being show quality. Its about having fun with your horse and trying new things


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## ThoroughbredJumper (Oct 30, 2012)

Dont do jumper shows if you dont bother to get a trainer, all im saying is maybe training wouldnt be such a bad idea.. An dude ive been jumping for over 8 years and i have alot to learn. Just get your basics down first like JustDressageIt said, then try again. Cheers'
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ThoroughbredJumper (Oct 30, 2012)

Horseychick94 said:


> Wow thats encouraging to a rider that is conquering her fears....more like rude and snobby. Riding isn't all about being perfect and being show quality. Its about having fun with your horse and trying new things


Ok, im sorry. I wont be honest anymore. I didnt know you put this in the critique section for a nice pat on the back and a round of applause. And did i know any of that previously? You stated that after i commented. Try not to be so defencive, and listen to people like Oxer and Dressage and the others on here. Dont like me? Fine by me. But i will not be told what oppinions i can and cannot have.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

Horseychick94 said:


> Yeah I am going to take some time to improve my jumping but im not looking to be "the best" out there. A lot of enjoyment is taken out of riding when people try to be perfect. Now I highly doubt that popping a horse over a low jump once in a blue moon is going to be detrimental. BUT I will start investing my time into getting better just so I don't suck completely. Maybe I might even do a few shows but there are a lot of snobs out there that I don't want anything to do with. I am jumping bales of shavings in the video.


Which is, I'm sure why you came here to have people point out things for you to work on to improve your jumping 
So here's what I think we've all come up with
-Develop a solid, balanced half seat - first at the walk, trot, then canter, then eventually jumping
-learn to relax your upper body, and reach a bit more forward with your hands
-build better balance, working more with your legs than your hands

Those things all together are great things to work on. It's not about being 'show' quality or about looking correct, it's about riding in a way that's safer and more comfortable for you AND your horse 
I'm not a competitive rider, I've never shown once in my life to be honest (barring a few kids school shows ). And even though I'm a riding instructor myself I still take riding lessons when I can afford them. I often find I get lazy riding on my own without an instructor barking at me  And often my 'lazy' bad habits can be detrimental to my horses or my own safety. I typically ride bareback, so I get pretty lazy when it comes to keeping my heels down - but truly heels aren't about keeping your feet in your stirrups, it's all about keeping your body weight balanced correctly on a horse. 
If you can't afford a trainer just keep taking videos and asking for critiques - or even self critique! I tape most of my rides and training sessions with my horses to see what I could do better next time. 

You're doing great by looking for help - and sometimes it's hard to hear critique, especially over the internet when something said as friendly advice can be translated as rude or mean. I try to read everything someone writes like as if they're smiling or laughing while saying it - it lightens the feels and often they mean it nicer than it comes off without the smile behind it  Which is why, professional or not, I use smilies ALL the time! 

Just wanted to add, you and your horse look like a great pair - he really wants to please you.


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

ThoroughbredJumper said:


> Ok, im sorry. I wont be honest anymore. I didnt know you put this in the critique section for a nice pat on the back and a round of applause. And did i know any of that previously? You stated that after i commented. Try not to be so defencive, and listen to people like Oxer and Dressage and the others on here. Dont like me? Fine by me. But i will not be told what oppinions i can and cannot have.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


there is a line between being honest and snooty


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Horseychick94 said:


> Wow thats encouraging to a rider that is conquering her fears....more like rude and snobby. Riding isn't all about being perfect and being show quality. Its about having fun with your horse and trying new things


I don't see anything here that should discourage a rider conquering her fears, all that is being said is you should learn to do it safely for the sake of both you and your horse. Guess what safely is also correctly.

I get that some horses need a break from dressage, it is easy to sour a horse, but often they just need to do a little trail riding, or maybe some trail obstacles, it doesn't have to be jumping.


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## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

Can you please provide one example of what you consider someone being "rude, snobby or snooty" in their response(s) to you in this thread?


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## sarahkgamble (Nov 7, 2011)

I tried to watch the jumping, but was mostly distracted by the minis in the background.


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

Golden Horse said:


> I don't see anything here that should discourage a rider conquering her fears, all that is being said is you should learn to do it safely for the sake of both you and your horse. Guess what safely is also correctly.
> 
> I get that some horses need a break from dressage, it is easy to sour a horse, but often they just need to do a little trail riding, or maybe some trail obstacles, it doesn't have to be jumping.


Telling me not to do it because I can't afford a trainer is very discouraging. Especially when I am working my 18yr old A$$ off for these horses' upkeep. Feeding them is a tinge more important than a trainer. Especially when I can post pics/vids of my riding to my facebook and ask advice from a local trainer and friend


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## ThoroughbredJumper (Oct 30, 2012)

Horseychick94 said:


> Telling me not to do it because I can't afford a trainer is very discouraging. Especially when I am working my 18yr old A$$ off for these horses' upkeep. Feeding them is a tinge more important than a trainer. Especially when I can post pics/vids of my riding to my facebook and ask advice from a local trainer and friend


How was i supposed to know any of this??? I am not a discouraging person by nature, nor am i "snooty" by nature. Why assume this? Why instead dont you take what ive said to mind in a different light, rather than jumping on the defence and calling me out for things i did not mean nor know about? Think please... Then call me out again.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

While it might be discouraging, it is nothing about your fears, and everything about future safety.

Learning to jump without a trainer is about as sensible and safe as learning to drive a car from books, and advice on the internet.


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

ThoroughbredJumper said:


> How was i supposed to know any of this??? I am not a discouraging person by nature, nor am i "snooty" by nature. Why assume this? Why instead dont you take what ive said to mind in a different light, rather than jumping on the defence and calling me out for things i did not mean nor know about? Think please... Then call me out again.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think its because my stirrups are a tad long. New saddle so havent adjusted. I was def not using his mouth to stabilize. This horse has an extremely hard mouth. *Also he has a tendency to duck out of the jumps and I am just getting my confidence back so I made him approach slower.* He also has a tendency to flatten out too much and go through the jump if I push him too much

and thats before you commented with 

Look... Im going to be honest here... If you're just out to do it for "fun" with absolutely no training, stop it.

when you quoted this comment from me:
Nope  just for fun! I don't want to be great at it, just to be able to say I can and survive. *You see, when I let my horse go to a retirement home, I lost all my nerve for jumping. It has taken a long time for Harley and I to get to this point.* Before Harley came this spring, I hadn't jumped in about 2 yrs and have never had any jumping lessons at all. I was just curious to see how my jumping was after having straight dressage and never having a jumping lesson and barely jumping at all
Read more: http://www.horseforum.com/horse-riding-critique/harley-i-jumping-146225/page2/#ixzz2EhpKUaS8



Read more: http://www.horseforum.com/horse-riding-critique/harley-i-jumping-146225/page2/#ixzz2Ehp2O0Bl



Read more: http://www.horseforum.com/horse-riding-critique/harley-i-jumping-146225/#ixzz2EhoM4JYQ
​


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## ThoroughbredJumper (Oct 30, 2012)

Horseychick94 said:


> I think its because my stirrups are a tad long. New saddle so havent adjusted. I was def not using his mouth to stabilize. This horse has an extremely hard mouth. *Also he has a tendency to duck out of the jumps and I am just getting my confidence back so I made him approach slower.* He also has a tendency to flatten out too much and go through the jump if I push him too much
> 
> and thats before you commented with
> 
> ...


You named basically one circumstance several times. Never did you tell your financial stance, your view on the true nature, ect. On the subject, which is where you got upset with me in the first place. I dont know you, i dont know your horse, i dont know your situation. All i know is what i hear and what i saw. So please, dont take it like youre taking it. You put something in the critique section, i gave my view. And you jumped on me. Please, "speak soft and carry a big stick." (-Theodore Roosevelt.) just try and take what people like me and everyone else has said and try it. Ya know, maybe i dont know anything. Maybe ive been jumping for 8 years and havent learned the safe way. Since you have shown that you think that is the case, then feel free to throw accusations at me. But it is not the reality, if you dont like what im saying, stop pouncing and getting defencive against me. It will not make my oppinion change, nor will it help your jumping. Im not trying to start anything, and im trying to be very straight forward with you. Please stop attacking me for things i didnt know about you, and my own oppinions. Thank you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

ThoroughbredJumper said:


> You named basically one circumstance several times. Never did you tell your financial stance, your view on the true nature, ect. On the subject, which is where you got upset with me in the first place. I dont know you, i dont know your horse, i dont know your situation. All i know is what i hear and what i saw. So please, dont take it like youre taking it. You put something in the critique section, i gave my view. And you jumped on me. Please, "speak soft and carry a big stick." (-Theodore Roosevelt.) just try and take what people like me and everyone else has said and try it. Ya know, maybe i dont know anything. Maybe ive been jumping for 8 years and havent learned the safe way. Since you have shown that you think that is the case, then feel free to throw accusations at me. But it is not the reality, if you dont like what im saying, stop pouncing and getting defencive against me. It will not make my oppinion change, nor will it help your jumping. Im not trying to start anything, and im trying to be very straight forward with you. Please stop attacking me for things i didnt know about you, and my own oppinions. Thank you.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Im not saying you have no experience. Difference is, other people on here were being nice. You seem to have somewhat of an attitude. I have dealt with snobs from the minute I put a foot in the stirrup about 10 years ago. Excuse me for being intolerant when someone rubs me the wrong way. Being straightforward doesn't mean being sarcastic towards me either. Im not expecting people to pat me on the back. I just want respectful and supportive answers. But you felt the need to start being sarcastic and disrespectful


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## ThoroughbredJumper (Oct 30, 2012)

Being a long time jumper and rider for 14 years, i too have delt with snobbs, and i honestly am not one of them. I could be alot more crude toward you right now, and honestly at this point im using a lot of restraint not to be, but lets just meet in the middle and say this. You dont like me, and im quitting your thread and hoping you get some jumping sense before you get hurt. Mkay? HYDB*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

I think we need to remember the internet can make it difficult to really tell the emotion behind the words.
I think everyone should be aware of this- it can help us word things to be sure we don't offend people (unless that's what you're looking to do) and help us read everything with a great big grain of salt. Realize it's just someone on the other end of a computer and not take anything negative to heart.

I think the best thing to do is if we can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all. We all have to realize that when we say anything negatively it's not going to be taken well... it's not like you're going to say something rudely to someone and they're just gonna go "Oh you're right I should do it your way". But sometimes if we word things nicely and aim at educating and helping people in a more open, gentle fashion you can make more progress that way. 

We also have to remember that what someone types on the internet may have been said with the most positive intentions, but when typed out with no emotion it can come off very different. So we need to remember not to add emotions that aren't always what was intended.


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

ThoroughbredJumper said:


> Being a long time jumper and rider for 14 years, i too have delt with snobbs, and i honestly am not one of them. I could be alot more crude toward you right now, and honestly at this point im using a lot of restraint not to be, but lets just meet in the middle and say this. You dont like me, and im quitting your thread and hoping you get some jumping sense before you get hurt. Mkay? HYDB*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:rofl: excuse me for not taking you seriously. There is a rider in my town that has no jumping experience at all yet jumps a horse western in a 7 in shank bit though to prevent her from popping the horse in the mouth at the canter, she has to hold the saddle horn. I am NOT causing harm LMFAO


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

Horseychick94 said:


> :rofl: excuse me for not taking you seriously. There is a rider in my town that has no jumping experience at all yet jumps a horse western in a 7 in shank bit though to prevent her from popping the horse in the mouth at the canter, she has to hold the saddle horn. I am NOT causing harm LMFAO


Just because someone else does it worse, doesn't mean what we do is right. It's unfortunate people that uneducated ride horses. I'm glad you decided to seek help - you've come a long way from where you were before and I'm sure if you practice ignoring negative things and focusing on being receptive to positive help you'll go much further too.
There are a number of things you can do to improve your jumping - it sounds like your well on your way


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

I would say I have come a long way, too. For like 5 years I did nothing but walk. I was scared to death of TROTTING. I jumped on and off for about a year with trainers watching from facebook. Ones that WOULD say something if I was doing something harmful for my horse. That is why I find it a load of crap that someone would tell me otherwise. Its a bit dramatic. Im being safe. SOFT and LOW jumps approaching them SLOWLY and wearing a helmet. AND using proper tack


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## Oxer (Jul 9, 2010)

In the picture you attached i see a rider that is ahead of the motion, pinching at the knee, with an unstable base of support causing the lower leg to swing back. This has made the horse heavy on his forehand and with a dangerously hanging leg, you two could wind up with a nasty rotational fall. A green horse with a green rider... means a rider whom is not setting the horse up to jump correctly and confidently. This means running out, slamming on the brakes, or crashes. So while it may all seem pretty harmless, a nasty fall is something neither one [you or your pony] need. So at the very least, I'd say to always jump with someone there with you. Just my opinion.


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

That newest picture looks Much better than everything in your video - is that new or old? There are still some things that could use work, but worlds better than what was in the video.

I don't think anything in the video was earth-shattering or concerning, but I do advice taking the positive advice given to you and learning from it to become a better rider. All in all it's better for you and your horse if you ride in a more appropriate way. It takes time and work to rebuild your abilities riding - so don't be dissuaded, but realize there IS still much more work to be done. There ALWAYS will be. 
It's not about riding well enough for shows or for looking pretty, it's about riding in a way that's most comfortable and safe for rider and horse together. While little things can be forgiven and/or worked around, it's safest/easiest to learn and do it the right way. But we all need time to learn and practice 

ETA: I just read Oxer's post - I completely agree with it all, but still that picture is better than what was in the video. That being said, there is still potentially dangerous situations that could come of it. Seeking more help is admirable, please head the advice you were given, work on that and keep looking for more help.
I also completely agree with having someone around while you're riding, even if your not jumping. I always have my fiance check out the window every couple minutes when I ride - just to make sure I'm not dead xD Even on the easy horses.


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

Oxer said:


> In the picture you attached i see a rider that is ahead of the motion, pinching at the knee, with an unstable base of support causing the lower leg to swing back. This has made the horse heavy on his forehand and with a dangerously hanging leg, you two could wind up with a nasty rotational fall. A green horse with a green rider... means a rider whom is not setting the horse up to jump correctly and confidently. This means running out, slamming on the brakes, or crashes. So while it may all seem pretty harmless, a nasty fall is something neither one [you or your pony] need. So at the very least, I'd say to always jump with someone there with you. Just my opinion.


this is forever ago.....


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

PunksTank said:


> That newest picture looks Much better than everything in your video - is that new or old? There are still some things that could use work, but worlds better than what was in the video.
> 
> I don't think anything in the video was earth-shattering or concerning, but I do advice taking the positive advice given to you and learning from it to become a better rider. All in all it's better for you and your horse if you ride in a more appropriate way. It takes time and work to rebuild your abilities riding - so don't be dissuaded, but realize there IS still much more work to be done. There ALWAYS will be.
> It's not about riding well enough for shows or for looking pretty, it's about riding in a way that's most comfortable and safe for rider and horse together. While little things can be forgiven and/or worked around, it's safest/easiest to learn and do it the right way. But we all need time to learn and practice
> ...


*sigh* its an old photo. Thats the horse I retired. Bigger jump and more scope on this horse than Harley. I never ride without my cell phone and nobody in my family gives a crap about me enough to even watch me from the house.


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

Horsey - I think if that's an old picture, you need to find a happy balance between you're old way of riding and your new. Your new seat is too stationary - your old one is too forward. 

I'm curious why you haven't responded to anything I've mentioned? You only seem to respond when you need to 'defend' something. But I think people will feel less of a need to want to correct you if you try to come forward saying what you _will_ be working on, more than what you won't be working on.

We all want to see you safe and happy with your horse. You're two styles of riding are both opposite extremes, both better than some atrocities you may see around you, but neither truly safe or ideal.
I think you could use taking the positive advice given to you on this forum, filter out the negative stuff - and build on it to make yourself a better rider as a whole.  
After all - that's all we all really want - to enjoy safely riding with our favorite horses ^^


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

Horseychick94 said:


> *sigh* its an old photo. Thats the horse I retired. Bigger jump and more scope on this horse than Harley. I never ride without my cell phone and nobody in my family gives a crap about me enough to even watch me from the house.


I've addressed already what I think you should work on  To be honest, the horse your on now is a better fit for your riding level now. He'll help you grow a great deal and seems to be very forgiving. 
A cell phone is wonderful if you have the ability to use it - see if you can get someone to just look out a window every few minutes. Or give them a specific time you'll be back in so they know to check if you're not back.


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

PunksTank said:


> Horsey - I think if that's an old picture, you need to find a happy balance between you're old way of riding and your new. Your new seat is too stationary - your old one is too forward.
> 
> I'm curious why you haven't responded to anything I've mentioned? You only seem to respond when you need to 'defend' something. But I think people will feel less of a need to want to correct you if you try to come forward saying what you _will_ be working on, more than what you won't be working on.
> 
> ...


Its because you are nicer, more understanding, and more supportive. I guess I only stated what I wouldn't be working on because normally when I ask for critique, I get expected to be professional. I just want to be able to jump when I want to. Not show. I think I get really irritated easily, too because I am SO proud of being able to jump again and then having someone tell me I can't do it because I don't have a trainer. Its heartbreaking. Im not doing anything earth shattering wrong. Just when I feel happy about something, its usually crushed by someone saying I'm not good enough. That is why I am a backyard rider because I don't want to have to please everyone. Its impossible. I just want to be able to ride without having to worry about being ostracized for little things like my weight, my horse, my equipment, my facilities, etc. I have just been so hurt by the equestrian community. Im really disappointed by it. You are one of the few people that is actually nice but honest with me without being snarky or snobby. Which is why I haven't said anything


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## Conway (Nov 30, 2012)

I don't know a darn thing about jumping or riding english, but you will get there 

I think some good advice has been given, with advice you can take it or leave it, but most times it is best to hear everyone out, ask for help and how you can improve (even if it is just for fun ) and do your best, to be your best. If you get a bad taste of advice, say "thank you" and let it go.

I think you did a great job and the minis in the back are so, so cute. I used to like jumping oh about 100lbs ago lol! But we ride western, and western saddles can hurt a horse jumping, we used to set up poles on 5 gallon buckets and jump the horses bare back around the yard. It was fun, looking back it was pretty stupid too.


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

Horseychick94 said:


> Its because you are nicer, more understanding, and more supportive. I guess I only stated what I wouldn't be working on because normally when I ask for critique, I get expected to be professional. I just want to be able to jump when I want to. Not show. I think I get really irritated easily, too because I am SO proud of being able to jump again and then having someone tell me I can't do it because I don't have a trainer. Its heartbreaking. Im not doing anything earth shattering wrong. Just when I feel happy about something, its usually crushed by someone saying I'm not good enough. That is why I am a backyard rider because I don't want to have to please everyone. Its impossible. I just want to be able to ride without having to worry about being ostracized for little things like my weight, my horse, my equipment, my facilities, etc. I have just been so hurt by the equestrian community. Im really disappointed by it. You are one of the few people that is actually nice but honest with me without being snarky or snobby. Which is why I haven't said anything


I completely understand where you're coming from. Growing up I was tortured at school and when I found horses I thought I'd finally fit in - but never did. I was always the dork who wanted to ride western and bareback in formal english riding schools. After years of switching riding schools repeatedly because of trouble with the other girls I started volunteering at a local rescue. 
It was like a whole new world, everyone there was just as 'different' as me. I stopped taking riding lessons and spent every waking second at the rescue. There I learned all about the real issues happening in the equine world, I learned all about horses on the ground. Everything from dealing with physical and mental health issues - in dealing with their issues I overcame my own emotional troubles.
I decided I would never work in the horse industry because it was all immoral and all the people were nasty and mean- so I went to college for fashion design. What a mistake xD if you think horse people are catty - go to fashion school!! I struggled through 2 years with minimal horses and by the end of the second year I was so depressed - numerous other issues had occurred to make things all the worse. I gave it all up - dropped out of school and was ruined. 
I went back to the rescue (I needed a place to sleep after all)- they took me in and a year later I had my own horse, I was in a healthy relationship and I started looking at the horse world with fresh eyes. The people in the horse industry aren't uniquelly unkind people - they're simply human. Humans, especially teenage girls, are really difficult to get along with - especially if you're even not comfortable with yourself, like I wasn't, there was no way I could be comfortable with other people! 
Horses were different I could be me with them. I got a really awful horse-related job, where the people I worked with turned into being like family, including the blood-curdling yelling matches. In this job, the people were my family, but the horses were treated poorly - I struggled with that for a good long time before I left. 
That's when I realized I couldn't live my life without horses, I couldn't have a regular job and just have horses on the side - No horses are my LIFE. 
So I started looking around, what job could I do that would involve horses but not compromise my very high standards. 
I finally realized, I could be a therapeutic riding instructor! Having never reached advanced levels of competitive riding I couldn't teach recreational riding beyond beginner level - and honestly I didn't want to teach those kids who had tortured me either. 
I eagerly worked for a year as a recreational riding instructor while I got licensed for therapeutic work - I've been doing it now for a couple years and can't get over how much I love this career. I spend my days with well cared for horses and students who thrive with them. 

I got my own horse, unwisely and untouched 8 year old draft horse xD At the rescue I had learned a great deal about training - I had NO idea how much I _didn't_ know until I got my mare. It was appalling! I immediately educated myself in everything I could find on horse training. I read every book in every book store and library, read the internet a million times over. 
Still my mare still had serious issues- I still hadn't even tried to back her, her ground work was so miserable.
I finally posted on a forum - I got BLASTED by rude and mean people - including everything up to telling me my horse was better off if I euthanized her than keeping her! I was so miserable - it haunted me I couldn't sleep and I didn't want to even look at my mare anymore. 
I finally posted something on this forum, I don't know what compelled me to try again - masochism maybe?
I was met with similar aggression and rudeness, people telling me I couldn't do it and I shouldn't try. But among the masses there were a few small voices with some really good advice. And when I went back and read *without such a heavy heart* the messages from the people who were less than kind - the advice they offered was valid - they just said it in very harsh ways. 
The few kind voices had made a world of difference in me and my horse's life - we have come so far together now and are working on mounted work together. I even got a pony too! I'm using the same methods that they taught me here, and having equally exceptional results. I am more than thrilled.

My point in telling you my life story is to say, I've been there - but the thing I've noticed in all your posts is the same problem I have - I focus on the negative and ignore the positive. We get offended and mad about the slight negative jabs here and there, that we don't even see or acknowledge the positive, constructive advice that really could make a world of difference.
So please work hard at focusing on the positive, because _that_ is what will last - that is what will make the difference (if you let it). The little negative bits only matter for a short time, it's the good stuff that matters!

Sorry for the novel


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## Conway (Nov 30, 2012)

I love this place. I have been on a few internet forums that I just did not fit in at all. 

I really like this one *kicks back in recliner* my legs are still sore from getting back on a horse for the first time in months.

Keep up the hard work girl, you'll get there


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

PunksTank said:


> I completely understand where you're coming from. Growing up I was tortured at school and when I found horses I thought I'd finally fit in - but never did. I was always the dork who wanted to ride western and bareback in formal english riding schools. After years of switching riding schools repeatedly because of trouble with the other girls I started volunteering at a local rescue.
> It was like a whole new world, everyone there was just as 'different' as me. I stopped taking riding lessons and spent every waking second at the rescue. There I learned all about the real issues happening in the equine world, I learned all about horses on the ground. Everything from dealing with physical and mental health issues - in dealing with their issues I overcame my own emotional troubles.
> I decided I would never work in the horse industry because it was all immoral and all the people were nasty and mean- so I went to college for fashion design. What a mistake xD if you think horse people are catty - go to fashion school!! I struggled through 2 years with minimal horses and by the end of the second year I was so depressed - numerous other issues had occurred to make things all the worse. I gave it all up - dropped out of school and was ruined.
> I went back to the rescue (I needed a place to sleep after all)- they took me in and a year later I had my own horse, I was in a healthy relationship and I started looking at the horse world with fresh eyes. The people in the horse industry aren't uniquelly unkind people - they're simply human. Humans, especially teenage girls, are really difficult to get along with - especially if you're even not comfortable with yourself, like I wasn't, there was no way I could be comfortable with other people!
> ...


Wow. Thank you SO much for posting this!!! It makes me feel soo much better! Thank you thank you thank you!!!


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## PunksTank (Jul 8, 2012)

Haha I'm glad my novel was helpful 
You're on the right path - it's so easy to be dissuaded and pushed down. It often feels like the whole world is up against you. But you know you and your horse are working together (even if sometimes they're working at a different pace ;P) and you WILL make it through. Try not to take things too personally, focus on the positive!

I'm gonna PM you something in a sec - be ready!


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## ChingazMyBoy (Apr 16, 2009)

Welcome to the wonderful world of jumping 

Firstly, remember not to rush things as both you and your horse are learning, together. This can be a very positive or negative experience for you and/or your horse, and I'm sure you'd like it to be a positive one. 

So, start small. Make your two-point (over fence) position as strong as you can, before you begin jumping actual jumps. This way, you're able to strongly support and help your horse. Begin by working on two point at trot and canter (even walk!) Stretch your heels down, lift yourself gently out of the saddle and move your hands up your horses neck to give with your hands. Then, move onto doing this over poles on the ground (trot or canter poles), making sure that you still keep a stable and supportive position. Moving onto small crosses and going up from there. 

It looks like your bracing on your horses mouth a little (I'm sure this isn't done knowingly). Try to relax, even if you're subconsciously tense, it'll make your horse believe there is something to be worried about and take away from the fun. It looks like over the jump you move your hands into your lap instead of away from you, this is causing your contact to become tighter instead of softer. So, remember, hands go forward over the jump. 

Whilst you cannot afford a trainer, fair enough, many people cannot. Maybe you could ask family members to put money towards the occasional lesson, etc. This way, someone can physically see how you're going (there is so much you can learn from people on the internet). Good luck, you've got a lot of work to do, but, remember safety always comes first. Take things slowly and don't be afraid to ask for help when you need it. 

** PLEASE remember though, that if you want jumping to be fun and rewarding for both you and your horse. You need to make sure it is comfortable and safe for your pony aswell. Good luck!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

Thanks so much!!!


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## Milking Moo Moos (May 4, 2012)

I have read through most of this and I just have a comment from the peanut gallery. When people were giving you advice to get a trainer, stop jumping, etc. you took it like 'why are these people attacking me, I don't want to be a professianal, I am not looking to win at anything,...' I just wanted you to know that I completely understand where you are coming from because it doesn't seem like anyone explained it to you. They were saying those things because the things that you have been thinking of as " for people who show' are really not. They are the rules for ANYONE jumping, not because of looks, or for show, but because it is the only way to not harm you or the horse. Rather than trying to be mean, they were really only looking out for you and your horse. I can assure you that everyone saying that has seen MANY occasions of self taught jumpers on here, usually asking for a crituqe. I can say confidently that 99% of the time both the horses and the riders are in danger because of it. Most people on here never reccomend jumping without lessons for this very reason. Again, everyone wanted you to either stop jumping or take lessons not to 'be the best' but just so that you could continue to have fun but do it SAFETLY. Everyone on here has said pretty much the exact same thing, everyone has just used different word choices. I know to you it haden't seemed like you were putting your horse in danger at all, but really that was not the case. I do think that with time, you could definatly make it completely safe(I know you probably have already been working in the right direction) Good Luck


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## Hunterjumper7654 (May 28, 2010)

JMO take it for what it's worth. I don't see anyone being snooty or snobby, I see a couple of riders that are respectful riders in jumping and want to see you get your confindence back and be safe. I know you said you have no interest in showing and can't afford a trainer, non of them are saying IF you jump you HAVE to show they are just trying to make sure you are aware of how unsafe some of the things they see are. I wouldn't want to see you get hurt and loose all of the confidence you have been trying so hard to recover. Nor do I want to see your horse hang a leg and injury themselves. I think if you can see that and take it for what it's worth you are in headed in the right direction!
I see a rider that needs to work on two point in walk/trot/canter so for a more soild leg. With a soild leg you will find that it will be easier to control your horse before and after the jump and free up their back while jumping. I know you said that horse runs out on jumps but if you had a stronger leg you could push his forward and gaurd your rein so he can't run out rather then hanging on his mouth, whether he is hard mouthed or not. It will also make it easier to ride a run out or refusal if that does happen. Where your leg and seat are now I would be worried that if your horse refused or ran out you would come over his head. I would hate to see someone who is working SO hard on gaining confidence back loose it do to a fall! Once again just my two cents. Cheers and happy riding! 

OT- I understand working your tail off to provide for your animals. I am in the same boat and 19.


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## Sunny (Mar 26, 2010)

Hi there. 

Like you, I'm a 19 year old who works my tail off to keep my horse. I work at the barn four+ days a week, and I am also a full-time college student. Because of it,I can't afford lessons. I am a 100% self-taught English rider and have been riding for about ten years.

I'll tell you what I do to make riding for myself and my horse as safe and enjoyable as I can. I read, a LOT. I read about flat work, jumping, training, anything. I read a lot about lightness and connection. I also do a lot of watching. I watch videos, other people ride, and audit lessons when I can. And of course, I stalk Horse Forum. :wink:

There is nothing like hands-on, direct teaching from an instructor, but some of us have to do what we have to do, and make the best of it.

So, I suggest you do the same. Consider subscribing to Dressage Today or Practical Horseman. Tons of good information in those. 

Like I said, I am completely self-taught and currently own a coming five-year-old Thoroughbred who I have had since she was a yearling. I saved and saved and saved to afford two months training for her so she could have a great start. Since then, I have been reading, watching and listening to get us to where we are now.

Here we are today, jumping 2'3 for the first time, only the third or so time we have cantered a fence.





 
We aren't perfect, but for a young horse and a self-trained rider, I think we are pretty great. 

The point of this is to let you know that, even without lessons, you can become a safe, confident rider. Don't let other people get you down! As long as you work hard and are determined, you can become a fine jumper.  Keep your head up, and keep working! Take videos and pictures whenever you can and get critiques. Wade through the ugly comments and focus on the constructive ones.

So, here is my critique of your video.

You need to lighten up your seat. It seems like you have a great full seat canter; now just work on that half seat! I am working on that same thing. I love full-seat but hate riding in half-seat. I think I'm a dressage rider at heart!
Also, work on some inpulsion from your sweet horse. Do lots of transitions to get him up on his forehand and working from behind. 
Even though the jump is small, work on having a bit more fluidity in your hands. 
Also, maybe try to build some jumps. A length of sand-filled PVC is a cheap and easy way to make poles. Be creative with jump standards! Anything that will support a pole but also allow it to let the rail fall will work, so long as a hoof or leg can not get caught it in. Upside down buckets are great! :lol:

Sorry for the VERY long winded post. Cookies for reading my life story!


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## Horseychick94 (Nov 19, 2009)

Sunny said:


> Hi there.
> 
> Like you, I'm a 19 year old who works my tail off to keep my horse. I work at the barn four+ days a week, and I am also a full-time college student. Because of it,I can't afford lessons. I am a 100% self-taught English rider and have been riding for about ten years.
> 
> ...


Thank you SO much! I as well am mostly self taught. I have been started WTC by a trainer and everything and have learned mostly basics, but the rest is mostly self taught other than the ONCE IN A BLUE MOON lesson.  I think riding is mostly just common sense. Biomechanics, balance, and science. BUT you have to in turn apply the skill! Thanks for your post. You and I are really alike in the sense of not being able to afford lessons. It may seem like BS to a lot of folks on here but as long as you have the will to do it, you can if you apply yourself! You do what you do with what you can!


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## shaggy (Dec 8, 2010)

Hi I was wanted to say I know exactly where you're coming from as well. I'm self taught as well! I did have a trainer when I first started for about year but she divorced her husband and moved to new york. Its a very long and complicated story. She was strickly a saddle seat,hunt seat person so she hated jumping. So when she left I decided I really want to jump! Lucky for me she didnt own the propery where my horses are so i didnt have to move them! For the last two years i've been working my butt off to get my confidence back at the canter (i fell first time canter my horse because said ex trainer didnt teach me how to sit it right) so I could jump. When I posted on here I got blasted like you did for not having a trainer and not knowing how to canter properly. People were saying your gonna get you and you horse hurt. Just like they have to you! There was a pretty big blow out between me and another girl on here in that thread. Looking back now its all pretty funny because I've come such a long way! Jumping is actually helping me get confidence back at the canter! Lucky I've also had my cousin to help out with position and stuff because she's an eventer. The only thing I really noticed that needed work in video is your two point! Dont feel bad cause I've been jumping for a year and I'm still working on mine!


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