# Energetic pony!! Help!



## Lilley (Dec 13, 2011)

work her in the round pen more? perhaps her respect for the driver is not wat it should be. Can you work her in the pen with her harness on?


----------



## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

Horseygirlsmith said:


> My welsh pony mare is very energetic. Last year she ran away with the cart and swerved on to a lawn and threw the driver off the cart. She is well trained to the cart-she has a month and a half of training-but is very energetic and wants to go fast. She dosn't do any of this stuff when being ridden. What should I do to inprove my ponys bad cart habit?


Just to be sure I am reading your post correctly - you are saying she has had a month and a half of training with the cart? If so, and if she is doing as you have described, I would have to differ with you on your opinion that she is, in fact, "well trained" to the cart. This is not an issue of her being "energetic" at all. I would suggest going back to square one on her driving work so that you can find and fill the holes that are creating this issue for you.


----------



## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

themacpack said:


> Just to be sure I am reading your post correctly - you are saying she has had a month and a half of training with the cart? If so, and if she is doing as you have described, I would have to differ with you on your opinion that she is, in fact, "well trained" to the cart. This is not an issue of her being "energetic" at all. I would suggest going back to square one on her driving work so that you can find and fill the holes that are creating this issue for you.


 Agreed. She is not well trained. Was it 6 weeks from start to finsh? Or 6 solid weeks of just driving. Does she respond to voice commands. I would be taeching that 1st while long lining and then do lots of desensitizing. If she is fine when ridden I would think she may be scared of the cart and taking off.


----------



## OwnedByAlli (Nov 8, 2011)

if she were well trained, she wouldn't have run! 

Do ground work like long-reining and lunging so she respects peoples cues from the ground. I don't know if you have an availiable space, but then hitch her to the cart and drive around a safe, enclosed space. Do all cues the same as if she was being longreined. 

If she is unsure about the cart, longrein her hitched to it, but dont sit in it and walk along side the cart. She could be afraid of dragging a heavy weight and thats why she bolted- something might have spooked her near the end of those 6 weeks of training and its now set in her mind driving is scary!


----------



## adiposestem (Dec 19, 2011)

For me, there's nothing wrong with that.


----------



## themacpack (Jul 16, 2009)

adiposestem said:


> For me, there's nothing wrong with that.


??????


----------



## Saskatchewan (Jan 9, 2012)

It isn't uncommon for a horse to be energetic and maybe a bit wound up when it gets hooked up or saddled up. Maybe she enjoys it and wants to go? Should she listen anyways? Of course. Maybe a few laps in a round pen or a quick ride before you harness her would take out a bit of her energy. I also found that if I warmed them up and then made them pull a bit heavier cart they had to work a bit. Make her pull the cart in a few patterns. If she is thinking and working she will be less likely to just want to take off and run. Then when you do go out for a leisurely ride down the road, she is already settled in and ready for a walk. Good luck.


----------



## welshrider (Jan 24, 2012)

*Driving Ponies*

I have trained many ponies and not a few horses to drive. Because the potential for bad accidents is higher with a driving horse, it needs to be 100% before it ever gets out in the open, or even driven in an arena.

I think your pony needs to be restarted by a competant driving trainer. You can't train a horse to drive just because you know how to ride. Can you find someone who drives who can help you. If a driver trained your horse, you really need to find someone else.

Since it sounds to me like you are a novice, I would suggest that you take some lessons with a really well trained driving horse.

If you look on the American Driving Society website, you can probably find a driving club near you, where you can get good information and help with your pony.

Driving is a blast, but it can be very dangerous. My neighbour, who is an expeienced horseman and been driving for over 3 years had an terrible accident over Christmas and broke both his legs among other bad injuries.

Last but not least... PLEASE wear a helmet, it could save your life.


----------



## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

Try switching to a regular headstall instead of the blind bridle. Some get nervous about the noises behind them, the sqeaking cart, etc. If they can see what's causing it it can be less of a problem. Also, put a halter and long lead (lungeline) on under the bridle. Have someone drive while you walk alongside. Allow the lead to float. It's there in case. Initially she may feel more secure if you are close to her head but the idea is to gradually work your way closer to the cart. Be sure the belly band isn't real tight that you can easily slip four fingers between it and the horse. Otherwise the back pads dig in, causing pain. This can bring up predatorial instincts, thus the running to escape. Be sure to pocket some treats and as she does well, reward her efforts. Your groundwork without the cart needs to solidify her whoas. Then practise while she is being driven and you are by her head only have the driver say whoa. If she does then a treat is in order.


----------



## Horseygirlsmith (Jan 12, 2012)

welshrider said:


> I have trained many ponies and not a few horses to drive. Because the potential for bad accidents is higher with a driving horse, it needs to be 100% before it ever gets out in the open, or even driven in an arena.
> 
> I think your pony needs to be restarted by a competant driving trainer. You can't train a horse to drive just because you know how to ride. Can you find someone who drives who can help you. If a driver trained your horse, you really need to find someone else.
> 
> ...


Thank You! She was trained by a experienced trainer, but maybe not well enough. Luckily the driver was wearing a helmet. We will always wear helmets it is much much much safer, I agree with you. Thank You, and I think getting her retrained will help her a lot.


----------



## hoopla (Jan 29, 2012)

welshrider said:


> I have trained many ponies and not a few horses to drive. Because the potential for bad accidents is higher with a driving horse, it needs to be 100% before it ever gets out in the open, or even driven in an arena.
> 
> I think your pony needs to be restarted by a competant driving trainer. You can't train a horse to drive just because you know how to ride. Can you find someone who drives who can help you. If a driver trained your horse, you really need to find someone else.
> 
> ...


200% in agreement with every word


----------



## welshrider (Jan 24, 2012)

I start all mine in an open bridle and then more to blinders when they are going well. Avoided a horrible wreck that way. If you look at the mare in the photo, you'll see that she is competing in an open bridle. She doesn't like the blinders. It's completely legal in any competition, but liable to be discriminated against.


----------



## hoopla (Jan 29, 2012)

The reason why driving horses wear bridles with blinkers is that it cuts down the field of vision and they concentrate on what is in front of them not all around.

I would never ever drive a horse in an open bridle.

As far as I'm aware the ADS does not permit open bridles in any of their sanctioned events.

http://www.americandrivingsociety.org/forms/Pre-Comp Checklist.pdf


----------



## Celeste (Jul 3, 2011)

I thought that the blinders were there so that the horse would not run from the cart that to his mind with his prey/preditor instincts is pursuing him. The instinct to run when chased is great so an open bridle is dangerous. Is this not the idea?


----------



## hoopla (Jan 29, 2012)

Blinkers shut down the big screen of visibility, reduce the reaction from the horse to uncontrollable features in the environment and to unconscious body signals you may give him. The horse is designed to notice these detail things, his survival depends on it, so blinkers close down the vision area allowed. 

Then consider that a well-trained driving horse understands and responds appropriately to whip cues. The blinkers prevent the horse from seeing the driving whip and anticipating the whip cue. This is important for any driving horse but especially so for multiples. You don't want to be aiming a whip cue at one horse and having the other(s) see it coming and react when they're not the intended target of the cue.

Riding and driving are very different disciplines. Hooking a wheeled contraption to a horse or horses is a far riskier endeavor than climbing on a horse's back, both for the driver and passengers and for all the innocent bystanders and their property who stand in harm's way when there's a runaway horse and carriage. Blinkers (blinders) have been used for hundreds of years and are used by the most experienced and skilled drivers. 

The preference of light harness horse instructors and professionals is to prefer a driving horse to focus on what is happening in front and when you commence driving it can be problematic not having blinkers. And I'd never drive one without. Also dependent on what you intend to do, you may find you have to wear get him in blinkers because of rules. The rules exist BECAUSE it's safer. Whenever folks mention in postings about blinkers on BB's someone always turns up to say they've done it or know someone who does/has. But it's not right and it's not what you should do and it's not what professionals do.

I've heard of the occasional (rare) horse who for one reason or another goes better in an open bridle. But IME its more a case that sometimes people just get warm and fuzzy about letting the horse see everything and the results can be disastrous. 

I've known folks who went "open" bridle to drive. All claimed to be experienced drivers and with solid driving horses. It worked for a while. In every instance, horse later saw something, reacted, ended up causing a wreck. Some were modest wrecks, others quite horrific. I don't know any of the wrecked horses who were able to be SAFELY driven again, even in blinkers.


----------



## welshrider (Jan 24, 2012)

As far as I'm aware the ADS does not permit open bridles in any of their sanctioned events.

Fracois Bergeron, Canadian FEI Driver and level 3 driving instructor was the one who told me to keep her in an open bridle. Last summer he finished and place in an FEI competion in the states with his PAIR. 
Yes open bridles are entirely legal in any driving competition under FEI, American Driving Society, and Canadian Driving Society rules. You may be penalized against as judges see it as a loack of training,but won't be disqualified.
http://www.americandrivingsociety.org/forms/Pre-Comp Checklist.pdf 
[/QUOTE]


----------



## jimmy (Aug 26, 2009)

i have a 5yr old working mare that is very headstrong and will pull the arms off you but only when she has,ent been drove for a week or two,after that she settles down,if you don,t drive yours regular and your giving her corn etc etc in the mean time that may be the cause


----------



## Horseygirlsmith (Jan 12, 2012)

churumbeque said:


> Agreed. She is not well trained. Was it 6 weeks from start to finsh? Or 6 solid weeks of just driving. Does she respond to voice commands. I would be taeching that 1st while long lining and then do lots of desensitizing. If she is fine when ridden I would think she may be scared of the cart and taking off.


I Think I will most likely have to send her to a different trainer, and get her retrained.


----------



## Horseygirlsmith (Jan 12, 2012)

Thank You For all your wonderful comments. I think I need to get her retrained because she is now scared of the cart. That trainer was a waste of MONEY!!


----------



## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Horseygirlsmith said:


> Thank You For all your wonderful comments. I think I need to get her retrained because she is now scared of the cart. That trainer was a waste of MONEY!!


 If this is a new developement she just may have been sent home too early if you were not prepared and qualified to continue her training. That could have been something that the trainer may or may not have had a say in.


----------



## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Horseygirlsmith said:


> My welsh pony mare is very energetic. Last year she ran away with the cart and swerved on to a lawn and threw the driver off the cart. She is well trained to the cart-she has a month and a half of training-but is very energetic and wants to go fast. She dosn't do any of this stuff when being ridden. What should I do to inprove my ponys bad cart habit?


 6 weeks is not very long and depending on what handling the pony has had in the past could make a big difference. Any way at 6 weeks I would not be on a lawn but in an enclosed arena for safety.


----------



## jbuzzitt (Apr 16, 2012)

*Blinders*

I have been driving over 25 years and most of that was in downtown traffic conditions. Anytime you are driving a horse it should be with blinders on. A horse has mon-nocular vision ( they see 180 degrees on each side - not right in front of their face or rright behind them) In the wilds they are flight in times of danger. So if a car comes from behind them it does not spook them. 

I would never ride in a carriage or drive a horse and carriage that does not have blinders on them. Just plain unsafe!!

If you are in a show that may be totally different - but when I take my drafts into a ring they always have blinders on.

Put saftey first!


----------



## michaelvanessa (Apr 25, 2012)

Horseygirlsmith said:


> My welsh pony mare is very energetic. Last year she ran away with the cart and swerved on to a lawn and threw the driver off the cart. She is well trained to the cart-she has a month and a half of training-but is very energetic and wants to go fast. She dosn't do any of this stuff when being ridden. What should I do to inprove my ponys bad cart habit?


 start from basics long rein her in 20 meter circles and if she bolts away let her run in a circle and wear her down she probley wont listen to you first but she will have you ridden her in a blinkerd bridle that mite help when she does good reward her dont for get keep an eye on her eye as you mite get dizzy and rember count how many laps she does from a fixed point and dont for get do the same amount on the other rein i hope this helps.


----------



## Raven12 (Apr 18, 2012)

As a beginner driver, I can't imagine going without a helmet or blinders.. my mini is very well trained,, but I'm not... That said... I use the same precautions that I did when I was riding.. but more of them.. because now not only do I have a horse to worry about if something goes wrong but that horse is attached to a very deadly weapon! When he is fresh.. we work in the jump feild and stay there until he has worked himself calm..doing patterns and gait changes. Then, and only then, once I am truly convinced that he is settled do we venture out onto the laneway. It isn't busy, but I don't need him to get distracted or silly at the wrong time!:?


----------



## michaelvanessa (Apr 25, 2012)

Horseygirlsmith said:


> My welsh pony mare is very energetic. Last year she ran away with the cart and swerved on to a lawn and threw the driver off the cart. She is well trained to the cart-she has a month and a half of training-but is very energetic and wants to go fast. She dosn't do any of this stuff when being ridden. What should I do to inprove my ponys bad cart habit?


 hiya just like you i have a welsh section a a welsh mountain pony his name is tricky and well were do i start about him to us he is our son he drives and is very stroung as well he is 27 years old now he was paired with vanessas cremello tammy who we lot 7 months a go dew to old age we drove them in tandem one infront of the other.
i think like me you need to go back to basics and find your selfs and bribe him or her with titbits when told to stand and walk and trot i think he winds him self up a little by the sounds of it and it is better if you train him your self it takes time trust me youll win him over in good time.
i think an exercise is to ask him to stand square the welsh ponys stand like a rocking horse in the show ring tap his legs with a wip and lift his fore
feet one at a time and say stand and build up from there tricky gives you kisses asks for food lifts left to right fore legs makes a chewing sound as
well for titbits and stands on podums so a 12 hh pony becomes 17 hh tall
with his fores on a podum and hinds on the ground i have a picture of him here.


----------



## michaelvanessa (Apr 25, 2012)

Raven12 said:


> As a beginner driver, I can't imagine going without a helmet or blinders.. my mini is very well trained,, but I'm not... That said... I use the same precautions that I did when I was riding.. but more of them.. because now not only do I have a horse to worry about if something goes wrong but that horse is attached to a very deadly weapon! When he is fresh.. we work in the jump feild and stay there until he has worked himself calm..doing patterns and gait changes. Then, and only then, once I am truly convinced that he is settled do we venture out onto the laneway. It isn't busy, but I don't need him to get distracted or silly at the wrong time!:?


 hiya that is very wise to have a jocky skull cap to protect you and its wise to drive in blinkers to as the pony will think the cart is chaseing the pony and desaster would occure if you have a manage or a paddock lunging would help you and even long reining in harness ill tell you how when the reins come through the pad terrets lets say you send mini in the clockwise direction rule 1 give and take on the rein if mini backs up slacken off if she goes to rear the left hand near side rein goes under the tail so you have more controle as the pony evades think in your minds eye when to give slack and then prompted mini to walk foward and once she does keep her going for a few circules then ask her to woa and feed a tit bit rule 2 the pony will apply and will fight with her own weight through the rein and once she is going fine you can long rein her with 2 thingers
it takes time but its worth it in the long run as you will instill what you want in your pony i have a section a welsh pony 27 year old and he is lovley to drive i broke him in my self 
if you need any more help just ask and i will advise you many thank mick and ness.


----------



## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

When horses were the only source of horse power, many many people were killed because of horses bolting. All of them typically wore blinders. Someone figured out that it was much safer to allow the horse to see what was going on behind and matching the noises to the implement, quickly becoming old hat. I drove a horse that was a wreck in blinders yet settled beautifully in a regular bridle, no fears at all.


----------



## Raven12 (Apr 18, 2012)

I suppose that having no blinders would work for some horses, but I think that I would be afraid to try.. especially scince my guy has been trained with them.


----------



## michaelvanessa (Apr 25, 2012)

Horseygirlsmith said:


> My welsh pony mare is very energetic. Last year she ran away with the cart and swerved on to a lawn and threw the driver off the cart. She is well trained to the cart-she has a month and a half of training-but is very energetic and wants to go fast. She dosn't do any of this stuff when being ridden. What should I do to inprove my ponys bad cart habit?


 hiya iv put one of our pictures of both ponys being lunged at once on 2 seperert lunge lines in a 20 meter circle at walk trot and canter and was schooling 2 ponys at once.


----------



## michaelvanessa (Apr 25, 2012)

Raven12 said:


> I suppose that having no blinders would work for some horses, but I think that I would be afraid to try.. especially scince my guy has been trained with them.


hiya i think plastic poles would make the pony spook as thay would be uncontrolabe in different directions hiting your ponys quaters and the risk of the other person geting barged by the pony or trod on the other alternative is if you have a harness have a small pole at the end of the traces to exert a little weight or like i said the traces come to a point through the trace crew holes thread a bit of string or bailing twine (nylon) with a quick release knoton to a small chain and a car tire but the most important thing get your pony listening to you and your vocal comands and long rein in circles as well like lungeing but with your ponys full harness on say thet your horse is travleing in a clockwise direction your out side rein goes behind on the hind quaters and that helps the pony to go foward and keep in a circles and have 30 minuit sessions 15 minuits on each rein and the golden rule is to finish the lessons on a good note never on a bad one as things will fester untill the next lesson.one of my photos is of me and tricky in the sea he is expolring his reflection in the water.


----------



## michaelvanessa (Apr 25, 2012)

Raven12 said:


> I suppose that having no blinders would work for some horses, but I think that I would be afraid to try.. especially scince my guy has been trained with them.


 hiya its all down to trust i can drive tricky down the road in an open bridle and i was worred to i put him to the small troting sulky i have and walked with him by his head with titbits and we did intaval training on the road walk on for 3 strides woah then another 3 strides and so forth and when he was settled i got on board and have not look back since and have been driving him on and off with blinkers.


----------



## michaelvanessa (Apr 25, 2012)

Horseygirlsmith said:


> My welsh pony mare is very energetic. Last year she ran away with the cart and swerved on to a lawn and threw the driver off the cart. She is well trained to the cart-she has a month and a half of training-but is very energetic and wants to go fast. She dosn't do any of this stuff when being ridden. What should I do to inprove my ponys bad cart habit?


 the other thing i can sugest is to cut down on hard feed and give none heating horse and pony cubes and mix that mite help as well.


----------



## GreySorrel (Mar 5, 2012)

Personally, I will keep my blinders on my head stalls when I drive, if that makes me bad or an accident waiting to happen, so be it. Blinders are there to keep the horses attention from straying by something as they go by, to listen to the driver, and to pay attention, there is nothing wrong with using them. 

Saddlebags, can you show me statistics that it is safer to drive without blinders vs with? I call your bluff on that one....


----------



## Ladytrails (Jul 28, 2010)

Bolting is one problem, most likely due to incomplete training (six weeks is not nearly enough time). The other problem, of tipping the cart, makes me think that the pony has gone through the roadside ditch or uneven ground and gotten out of control. 

Training must include desensitization to the cart shafts being uneven, one higher than the other, such as would happen if one wheel was lower than the other, or the wheels bouncing through a ditch or rut in the road. 

Uneven ground puts pull/twist on the belly band and all the harness, and is undoubtedly very uncomfortable, just like going downhill can be odd. The pony probably didn't know what was grabbing him and over-reacted and tipped the cart. 

I would say that if the pony is now frightened of the cart, you should start over with the training, for sure, going very slow to make sure all these "holes" in the training get addressed - whoa, rating speed, uneven ground, and desensitization to the cart.


----------

