# Pistol Conformation



## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

I posted conformation pics of Mav the other day and asked what y’all’s thoughts are. Now I am curious to see what you think about Pistol. Breed unknown, once again. Most people see pictures of him and assume paint. A few people who have seen (and, especially, felt) him move (including me and his previous owner) guess “....mustang? part mustang?” So if you wanna take a stab at breed feel free to but keep in mind that he doesn’t move like your avg paint. I will include summer pictures in which he was overweight, for the purpose of y’all being able to see his legs better. His winter feathers make it look like he has more bone than he does. He has very long leg hairs. Any that I post where he has a very long mane are at least a couple years old probably. Sorry that I don’t have a better one from behind!




















































(He is wet in the last one).


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## Baby Lotus (Mar 7, 2021)

this horse is Beautiful and ADORABLE!!!!!!! His head and neck look a bit large...
BUT OMYGOODNESS WHAT A MAGNIFICENT BEING!!!!!!


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

He says thank you! Lol


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## BethR (Feb 17, 2021)

What a doll! LOVE his markings, especially the white mane with the dark tail😊


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

Thank you!


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

He's cute but....
To do a critique is asking for personal opinion given, a ripping apart of the animal so don't ever take to heart what is said....
That said... 

I see a horse who is not well balanced back to front.
A overly heavy front end compared to hind.
His head is large for him as a whole, but it fits his neck structure.
Neck is overly thick and .... but it doesn't fit the rest of the horse nor does the head to me.
Horse stands over his front legs not having them placed to the corners of the body.
What starts as refined becomes unrefined the further forward I looked.
He looks to have a splayed way of standing his front legs and a slight twist especially to _his_ front right from above the knee down.
Shorter pasterns, and hooves in front appear a bit narrower than I would want if I could pick and choose putting a horse together.
A set back SI joint makes the back look longer along with the swept wither, The SI weakens his hind end..
A nice deep heartgirth and well-sprung barrel for lots of lung room and heart space.

I think your horse has widened considerably from the pictures front on you presented of a immature horse...
Hind legs look nicely set and wide, can't tell exactly but to the corners of the body itself...good support and a nice engine those legs can push you around.

He's cute as all get-out...
Quite the mane cowlick he has.
He looks to have a draft influence in his background with the neck and front-end he has.
I would caution you not let him get overweight as drafts have a tendency to develop metabolic issues you wish not to travel down the path of if you can avoid it.

Sweet looking boy...
How old is he??

As said before, my comments are my opinion only.
_*Enjoy your boy...*_
🐴...


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

In answer to the question, he’s 15


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

The long hairs certainly suggest the metabolic issues perhaps brewing. Wormy horses can also have them as well as a sign of their presence. hlg was pretty thorough. 

Sweet looking horse. 

There is no average way a Paint moves and you can't tell a Mustang just from looks or way of going. There are QH lines that have draft influence and most Paints are just loud QH. 

Grade horse with pinto markings. I do really like that he has a dark face as that will help prevent eye issues. Overweight which will contribute to metabolic issues.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

QtrBel said:


> The long hairs certainly suggest the metabolic issues perhaps brewing. Wormy horses can also have them as well as a sign of their presence. hlg was pretty thorough.


He has had long hairs on his feet and lower legs during winter as long as I have known him. They shed out during the summer. If it’s “metabolic” he’s been metabolic for the last 7 years and I would think that it would have caused a complication by now. 



QtrBel said:


> Overweight which will contribute to metabolic issues.


In some of these pictures he is overweight because some of them are old. But in more recent ones, no, he is not. He has a belly that hangs down due to the low quality hay he has had to eat all winter to keep his weight down. His fluffy mane that sticks way up makes his neck look thicker than it is. But no, he is not overweight. I can feel his ribs by lightly trailing my fingers along his side.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

here’s a recent picture where the light hits just right and you can literally see a bit of rib. Not to a point that I am concerned. I wanted to get him down on the weight over the winter so if he gains over the summer he hopefully will not become obese.


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

If the only long hair is on his feet then that would just be light feathering some horses have. If he has longer guard hairs or a longer, shaggy winter coat that doesn't all shed in a timely fashion - especially the longer hairs along the underside of the neck or other spots on the body.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

He does get very fuzzy but he always has. He starts shedding earlier than my other two and sheds for longer but he still has it all gone by the time he needs it to. I think he really just has a naturally thicker winter coat.


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## riderforever (Feb 28, 2021)

He’s beautiful! I love him. ❤


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## Woodhaven (Jan 21, 2014)

I like the rear shot of him, especially the base of the tail, If i had a horse like him I would call him Target or Bullseye, he is a cute guy looks to have a sweet nature


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

He is very sweet natured, he doesn’t like grooming much (he tolerates but does not enjoy it) but he has warmed up to petting over the years, and he is willing and sweet as pie once he trusts enough. He does better outside than in his pasture when it comes to riding but he’s a good little man either way.

Pistol is the name he came with. I liked it and thought it was cute so I kept it. I named my other two though, Dixie and Maverick. But I never call Pistol by his actual name when I see him, it’s always “Pitew”. I think he reminds me of a pistol in a way, he may be little but he’s powerful and reliable.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

A little off topic, but everyone saying this made me want to post these so... Just for the folks saying that he seems sweet natured 💕 I don’t know that I would be here without him. I definitely wouldn’t be who I am today. He is one of my best friends in the whole world.


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

[QUOTE="LilyandPistol, post: 1970950353, member: 155553]
He has a belly that hangs down due to the low quality hay he has had to eat all winter to keep his weight down. His fluffy mane that sticks way up makes his neck look thicker than it is. But no, he is not overweight. I can feel his ribs by lightly trailing my fingers along his side.
[/QUOTE]
My personal opinion is that feeding poor quality hay is often doing a horse a disservice. When I look close up at the recent pic I see ribs, and also loss of topline muscle with a pot belly. Your horse may not be getting the nutrition he needs if the hay is mainly undigestible fiber, which I suspect if his body is holding onto large amounts in the hindgut (causing the pot belly) in order to eke out as many nutrients as possible. 

Besides missing essential proteins, vitamins and minerals, the other reason I dislike low quality hay is that it often has higher sugar/starch levels than regular hay. So you can be avoiding good nutrition while adding sugars. Is there a reason why he can't be fed higher quality hay, in amounts appropriate to his caloric needs? You don't have to feed him more than he needs to maintain a good weight, and he'll be much healthier.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

Cutie! He looks nice. As far as conformation, he's got a big head & neck, that doesn't fit the rest of him. Might be a bit unbalanced for dressage or such, but otherwise, shouldn't matter. His hq look well developed. He looks perhaps a tad valgus at the knees in one of the pics, but it's off centre & the other front on, while his forelegs look a little... fine, they don't look crooked at all in that one. And he looks a little cow hocked - that might be to do with his type.

And his type.... well, he's obviously a paint, but I don't know what that means, aside from colour, breed-wise. And mustang - I thought that mustangs were just feral horses, same as brumbies over here - a mish-mash of whatever domestic horses were let go in those parts, not a breed. But I'd bet there's drafty blood in there, what with the shape of his head, thick neck, hairiness, the shape of his HQ....


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## Avna (Jul 11, 2015)

Horselovingguy has said about all I would say concerning a conformation critique. He appears to me to be a cold-blooded grade pinto. Salt of the earth, this type of horse. 

Nomenclature clarification: "pinto" refers only to the coloring of the horse. There are pintos in many breeds. In Britain he would be a "piebald". Genetically the pinto coloration comes from various unrelated sources. Pistol appears to be a straightforward tobiano type of pinto. 

PAINT refers to a registered breed, developed from pinto-colored American Quarter Horses. A Paint should be recognizable as a pinto Quarter Horse. Pistol is not a Paint.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

gottatrot said:


> Is there a reason why he can't be fed higher quality hay, in amounts appropriate to his caloric needs?


Yes. Avoiding giving him ulcers. I have heard over and over again from different people that withholding food for hours on end causes them stress and can cause ulcers. I’d rather not find out for myself. If so many different people claim it is true, including some studies I’ve looked into, I believe it. And, the last time I took away food for hours on end from mine while getting them to lose weight, they started eating trees, so I have no doubt they were indeed stressed. I know someone is going to claim that’s a mineral thing but as you pointed out, low quality hay does not contain that many minerals and they quit chewing wood and trees when I started giving them low quality hay during the hours that they were off grass. That is also an important point to make, the low quality hay is not all they are getting. From the morning to 2:30 in the afternoon, they were on pasture eating fescue grass and small amounts of Bermuda grass. After that they would come into a smaller pasture where all they could do was nibble grass because they kept it mowed down, and then at 5:00 or so they would come in and be given four slow feed nets of fescue hay that has been sitting around (dry and unmolded) for a while, to tie them over for the night until morning. After they finished their nets, they would sleep, and stress was avoided. They also have 24/7 access to salt blocks and, yes, they are able to get enough because they do not just lick it. They bite it. They eat much more of it in the summer.

However, now that the grass is coming back in and hay is running low and we don’t want to keep feeding hay all summer, tentatively, they are being allowed in the field with the shorter grass all night now as well. As for now I am still providing hay so that they do not fight over a lack of it when they go in the barn but am slowly weaning them off it.

All of that said, no offense intended, this isn’t a nutritional thread.

As for loss of topline, yes, of course he lost topline. He lost weight and isn’t being ridden as much. He needed to lose some topline. He had a crease down his back so prominent that he got rainrot in it in winter. Because when it rained water would sit there.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

loosie said:


> And his type.... well, he's obviously a paint, but I don't know what that means, aside from colour, breed-wise. And mustang - I thought that mustangs were just feral horses, same as brumbies over here - a mish-mash of whatever domestic horses were let go in those parts, not a breed. But I'd bet there's drafty blood in there, what with the shape of his head, thick neck, hairiness, the shape of his HQ....


You’re right! Mustangs are a mishmash of breeds. But they are also recognized as their own breed now here I believe. Spanish Mustangs are also an entirely different thing but that’s not what I suspect he could be, lol.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

Avna said:


> Nomenclature clarification: "pinto" refers only to the coloring of the horse. There are pintos in many breeds. In Britain he would be a "piebald". Genetically the pinto coloration comes from various unrelated sources. Pistol appears to be a straightforward tobiano type of pinto.
> 
> PAINT refers to a registered breed, developed from pinto-colored American Quarter Horses. A Paint should be recognizable as a pinto Quarter Horse. Pistol is not a Paint.


I am aware of this but I am not sure that the people who constantly tell me he’s a paint do. Also, paints can have TB blood too, can’t they? Ive heard this is because QH are derived from TB.


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

LilyandPistol said:


> All of that said, no offense intended, this isn’t a nutritional thread.


I apologize if you did not wish to discuss it. Someone else brought it up, which triggered me to look at the photo closely. Just something to consider if you wish to look into it more. Just a thought: ulcers don't tend to kill or cripple horses, or shorten life and laminitis frequently does. In studies, horses did not eat 24 hrs a day but around 17, so that can be one way to justify some time without food, if it is required for weight management. Wood chewing tends to be from a lack of fiber in the general diet. Losing fat over the topline is different from losing muscle, which tends to happen if the diet is lacking in essential amino acids. A thinner horse can still have strong muscling over the back and hindquarters, on a good diet.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

gottatrot said:


> I apologize if you did not wish to discuss it. Someone else brought it up, which triggered me to look at the photo closely. Just something to consider if you wish to look into it more. Just a thought: ulcers don't tend to kill or cripple horses, or shorten life and laminitis frequently does. In studies, horses did not eat 24 hrs a day but around 17, so that can be one way to justify some time without food, if it is required for weight management. Wood chewing tends to be from a lack of fiber in the general diet. Losing fat over the topline is different from losing muscle, which tends to happen if the diet is lacking in essential amino acids. A thinner horse can still have strong muscling over the back and hindquarters, on a good diet.


I believe I mentioned that he had not been ridden as much, and so yes he has lost muscle a bit because he hasn’t been worked as much, but most of what you are seeing is the loss of fat i believe. The most recent picture is the one where he is wearing his hackamore. His muscle really doesn’t seem to be suffering any more than it usually would with a lack of work. The only major difference I see between this picture and the one below it from when he was around 9-10 or so is 1) he has winter hair in the recent one 2) I chopped his name at some point and it’s in an awkward growing out phase now and 3) he is no longer obese.


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## loosie (Jun 19, 2008)

LilyandPistol said:


> I am aware of this but I am not sure that the people who constantly tell me he’s a paint do.


Obviously I (was) one of those, but now stand corrected. I thought 'pinto' or 'paint' were just different names for a coloured horse. I suppose there are many who think the lable is just the colour.


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

loosie said:


> Obviously I (was) one of those, but now stand corrected. I thought 'pinto' or 'paint' were just different names for a coloured horse. I suppose there are many who think the lable is just the colour.


But also to make it a little confusing, horses can be registered as Pinto through the Pinto Horse Association and they even for some reason register solid colored horses. So you could have a registered Pinto that was a roan or a buckskin. So strangely, I've run across horses that appeared to have quarter horse conformation and pinto coloring, but since they did not have registered stock horse bloodlines, they were not a registered Paint but a registered Pinto. But of course some horses are registered Paint and Pinto, which people do in order to show in more places. 
And a horse can actually be registered as a Paint and be a full TB, because the Paint horse registry accepts Jockey Club bloodlines and it is possible genetically for a TB to be a pinto. This horse could be registered as a Paint.


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## LilyandPistol (Dec 2, 2014)

To loosie: totally understandable. A lot of people don’t know and I’m not sure if there might even be a difference depending on the dialect. 

To gottatrot: That is my understanding as well, what I understood was that the paint registry accepts QH, TB and appendix (I think that’s the right word?) because QH are derived from TB.


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## tinyliny (Oct 31, 2009)

He seems like a very 'cute' horse, not a 'pretty' horse. But,, best of all, in my mind, is that he strikes me as a really good 'using' hrose. I bet once conditioned, he could go all day, carrying a big load. He has good bone, and no real conformational faults in back or legs, to my eyes. Yeah, his neck and head are big. Gives 'im character!


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