# Bay colt how will he shed out



## Qualityqh (Dec 12, 2014)

Here is a picture of my 3 month old bay qh colt sire was a smokey black mare is bay. He was born jan 5 with a coat like a wooly mammoth . Definetly a bay coat but had lots of white long guard hairs like under the jaw and hips. Iam looking at his eyes and the hair around nd them is black or at least very dark. His undercoat is al the same blackish color. Do you think he will shed out bay lIke he looks now or the dark under coat color. I do not see him as a reddish bay like mom iam betting dark brown. Would of gone with the smokey black but looked that color up for foal and he didn't look like the examples. Just warming up here so will be awhile before he sheds his coat. Can't wait to see his true colors! Also he has no white on his legs these I expect to turn black black patches behind his Pasternak joint and knees.


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Well, considering Momma is actually a brown, not a bay, I'm betting baby will end up brown. He may end up a darker brown than her, though.


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## Qualityqh (Dec 12, 2014)

Ok iam new to qh colors. But this mare is black mane and tail with black points brown body is that not bay? It's what she's registered as. Brown does confuse me my sisters jet black qh mare was registered brown would like to know how that worked.


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Brown and bay are both extensions of the agouti gene. Agouti restricts the expression of non-red (black) on black-based horses.

Bay restricts the expression of black to the hard points of the body, which would be the mane, tail, legs, muzzle and ear tips.

Brown does the same, however it adds in cinnamon coloring to the soft points of the horse, which are the muzzle, under the elbow, flank and point of the buttock. Another hallmark of brown is that they change color with the seasons (sometimes a subtle color change, sometimes a drastic one).

This mare has clearly visible cinnamon points. Hence, she is brown.


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## Qualityqh (Dec 12, 2014)

Ok this is eye opening. So should she of been registered brown or is bay still correct for qh registry .


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Technically she should have been registered as brown. However, since the two colors can look so much alike (and a lot of people don't know the difference), a lot of browns get registered as bays. Registries are notoriously behind on the times when it comes to colors. They are also less concerned about accurate colors, unless the horse is VERY obviously not the color it is registered as (for example, a black horse registered as a chestnut).

Here's an example of misregistering browns versus bays. The two Arabs in this pic are both registered as bays. Only the one on the right is actually a bay. The one on the left is a brown.


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## Qualityqh (Dec 12, 2014)

Ok I would never of known. What iam seeing in your Arab example is the one that is true bay does not have definite black points on the legs. We're the brown has very defined black points and black shading over the head too. Hard to see the cinnamon coloring. Now I can't wait to go out and look at my Arabs see what they truly are!! Have a very light golden bay mare Arab people have always asked if she was buckskin. She's not since she's purebred wondering what color you would say she is I always wondered if she was some type of chestnut since she's never had black black mane and tail or very dark points. But she is registered bay no better option. Thanks so much


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Let me find a better pic. 

This is a closer pic of the horse on the left. The one that is registered as bay, but it actually brown:


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## Cherrij (Jan 30, 2013)

Qualityqh said:


> Ok I would never of known. What iam seeing in your Arab example is the one that is true bay does not have definite black points on the legs. We're the brown has very defined black points and black shading over the head too. Hard to see the cinnamon coloring. Now I can't wait to go out and look at my Arabs see what they truly are!! Have a very light golden bay mare Arab people have always asked if she was buckskin. She's not since she's purebred wondering what color you would say she is I always wondered if she was some type of chestnut since she's never had black black mane and tail or very dark points. But she is registered bay no better option. Thanks so much


I think the one on the right is wild bay, so that is why it has less black points on it's legs. 

Bay horses can have black legs up to their knees, but not all will have..


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

Unless you wait until they are older you will not be able to tell which agouti extension is present. Registering them as bay is the accepted practice as at a young age that is all you will know for sure. Once they go through their shed then you know but may have to pay higher rates for registering later. Bay is technically correct and you can have the registry change to brown if it is an accepted color for that breed. The mare is brown and your baby will likely be as well.


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## SunnyDraco (Dec 8, 2011)

The first foal shed is usually the darkest shed, meaning that the coat will likely shed to a shade darker than they will be as an adult. 

Most browns are disguised as bay, winter coats force brown to reveal its disguise as the cinnamon soft points will be shown no matter how cleverly it was disguised as bay. When a bay grows the winter coat, they don't get the cinnamon colored soft areas, there is little to no coat color change from season to season (some color may change slightly with diet/vitamin/supplement changes). What a brown horse will never have is a dark muzzle, they will always have a lighter colored muzzle.

If your sister's horse is jet black but has the light spots around the muzzle and other soft areas, the horse is a brown as well. Think of the old stallion in Man From Snowy River, the wild stallion is brown.


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