# Restore humane horse slaughter to improve horse welfare



## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

Banning US slaughter only shipped it over seas where no controls were in place. At leastt in the US we had a chance to monitor the process. Not sure if there is any way to do humane slaughter and it is all terrible but I guess in certain situations it could be less terrible. Of course this is another example of our government pandering to the masses and not really addressing the real problems. 
Feral horses are just that, feral, they are not wild and should not be allowed to breed uncontrolled.
Somehow we need to come up with a way of controlling breeding, there are un trained and unwanted horses everywhere. Somebody's stallion is making these horses.


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## WickedNag (Sep 7, 2010)

I think as horse lovers we all hate the thought of slaughtering our majestic, beautiful animals. But the ending of horse slaughter in the US did not end the slaughtering of the horse, we just insured more suffering as they have to travel further and end up in plants with no regulation.


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## usandpets (Jan 1, 2011)

I think that slaughter is a necessary evil. With the overabundance and poor economy, the horse industry has been delt a hard blow. Slaughter is not the fix by any means. If breeding could be controlled, slaughter wouldn't be needed.

Many of us have seen the horrific videos of what happens in the slaughter houses. However, if the horse is there, it is going to die. At that point, they are just an animal no different than a pig, chicken, cow or turkey. Why doesn't the animal rights activists and HSUS fight for those other animals. Just a thought
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## abbyshamrock (Jul 12, 2010)

usandpets said:


> I think that slaughter is a necessary evil. With the overabundance and poor economy, the horse industry has been delt a hard blow. Slaughter is not the fix by any means. If breeding could be controlled, slaughter wouldn't be needed.
> 
> Many of us have seen the horrific videos of what happens in the slaughter houses. However, if the horse is there, it is going to die. At that point, they are just an animal no different than a pig, chicken, cow or turkey. Why doesn't the animal rights activists and HSUS fight for those other animals. Just a thought
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



I agree, and doesn't it cost America a lot more to ship them over seas or to Mexico? Have y'all been to a horse auction resonantly? It's horrible! 

Most people view horses as livestock. It's sad, but they are. Just like what usandpets said, people view horses no different than a pig, chicken, cow, turkey. Why only horses? 

I love horses, don't get me wrong. They are important in my life! This article just caught my eye and I wanted to share.


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## Katesrider011 (Oct 29, 2010)

Slaughter is a subject I have made myself neutral about. I don't really care much about going deeper into the subject. Whatever happens happens. As long as one doesn't get built near me if it's ever legalized in America again.


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## ShutUpJoe (Nov 10, 2009)

Oh jeez...here we go... if it were actually HUMANE then I say sure why not! But it's not. In no way. Doesn't matter if it's in America or not! We'd use the same methods as Canada and those methods have been proven time and time again to NOT be humane! We just had a law passed saying no double deckers. Which I think is a step in the right direction. From what I've been hearing Europe is thinking about banning American horse meat due to the toxins they carry. Race tracks have a saying "Seven days from stable to table". Seven days does not effectively allow the substances given to a racehorse to clear that horse's system. So we are sending toxic meat from America to foreign countries. Horses that haven't been given anytime to process out the drugs that are said to remain in the system for a long long time. Such as bute or bantamine. Which most horses get regurlarly to control pain. 

This is a quote from someone explaining the effects of these drugs...:
*"There is irreversible binding of phenylbutazone to cyclooxygenase, producing oxyphenbutazone , which remains in tissue much longer than does bute itself. This is the reason bute has a lifetime ban. Oxyphenbutazone , the metabolite of PBZ, is known to cause aplastic anemia. We have shown this to be a scientific finding over and over again with peer-reviewed studies."*


It's very easy to fake an IED. All you have to do is print out the paperwork and sign any vet's name to it. Horses often go straight from auction to the slaughter house without being contained. There has been cases of horses with strangles or other diseases actually in the pens at the slaughter houses. And with no clear answer on to what that could do to humans... 

The slaughter houses that were in America were foreign owned and NOT regulated. Their were illegal dumping of blood and by-products and residents complaining about the smell as well as blood and hair coming out of the drains. Someone stated on here that they are okay with it as long as it isn't near them... well it's got to be near somebody! 

I hear a lot of people say that the transport is part of the problem. Horses being in a trailer for a long period of time. Well since the new law passed horses are supposed to monitored, given food water and rest upon transport while within the American borders. However if we did have American slaughter houses we would still have to transport them. And if they open in the states that are considering this a lot of horses would be travelling the same or longer distances to get to the slaughter house. 

You spoke of having a HUMANE slaughter house. Well there isn't an actual way to humanely slaughter a horse yet. There are three main methods being use. One is the bullet: The horses skull is too thick and often it renders them unconscious but not dead. So they are alive for the bleeding out process. Second is the boltgun: This was made for cattle. It also doesn't kill them most of the time and the horse regains consciousness after 30 seconds. As well as the fact that the boltgun is intended for animals with shorter necks. A horse moves around in the kill box and sometimes they get hit with the bolt gun up to ten times in order for them to go down. There has been statements from previous workes in AMERICAN slaughter houses saying they knew some of the horses were alive after being hit with the bolt gun because they could hear them gurgling blood as they breathed. The last method is commonly used in Mexico: It's the (excuse my spelling) pintello knife. Where they slice the horse's spinal cord so the horse cannot move but is still very much alive. If you watch the videos of this you'll hear people cheering in the background everytime a horse that fights being stabbed goes down. Really sick... It's funny because an employment record was said to have been released (although I never found it) and it was said that the main people who worked in the slaughter house in America when we still had them was illegal immigrants and ex-cons. Which I believe to be true because I know someone who currently works at a rendeering plant that was convicted of animal cruelty as a young adult. 

My point is the link you provided is probably from Sue Wallis and the Summit of The Horse. Sue Wallis wants plants to open back up because she wants to open her own so that she bank in the money. Unfortunately Sue Wallis has tripped and stumbled her way through her campaign for this. She had a meeting for the Summit of the Horse and which it was discovered that BLM Mustangs are being sent over the border for slaughter when there are regulations against this. But since we don't have any brand inspectors at either border it's happening daily. She also got tripped up at the same meeting because she had a raffle for a truck but a lot of people didn't show up. She asked Temple Grandin to speak for her and Grandin didn't want anything to do with it. She specifically said that she in now way supported Sue Wallis or her efforts. 

"Wallis is also likely disappointed with *Temple Grandin, Ph.D.*, whom she had touted as a featured speaker at the Summit, claiming she was involved in Wallis' plans to build a Wyoming horse slaughter facility. Dr. Grandin told Animal Law Coalition, however, "_I have told Sue Wallis that I want no involvement in her business dealings. ...[W]e have done no design work."_ Dr. Grandin was also quoted by Horseback Magazine as saying Wallis had "_misrepresent[ed]"_ her involvement."

As a side note I'd like to put out there that there is a lot that goes on in a slaughter house that is not well known. Such as the slaughtering of foals for their coats to make shoes. And even though it's supposed to be illegal pregnant mares are sent to slaughter and their foals are cut from their bellies and thrown into the waste pile. It's an ugly ugly business (as is all slaughter).

I can honestly say that my main worry is that once they require the horses that are raised for human consumption to be micro chipped and have FULL LIFE medical records that it will back lash and the people who are fighting for our American horses to not go across the border or be slaughtered here will not be able to handle the onslaught of horses. Is this going to be their fault? I don't think so because most of the people that are fighting it DO NOT BREED. These horses are coming from PMU farms, nurse mare farms, race tracks, bigger breeders, bigtime backyard breeders, outriders who only keep horses seasonally, stables that are shut down, the unknowledgable, the unusable Amish work horses and big name breeders that go out of business. It's not the rescues, hobby farms or simple horse owners fault. People should be held reliable for the amount of horses they pump out just like you are required to have a breeding license in most places for dogs. 


I recently did a blog about the difference between horses being called a pet and being called livestock. It's such a thin line and everyone has a different opinion on it. My opinion they are far more than a pet or livestock. Why do I think so? Well because horses do a lot of the things that we ask our dogs to do plus some because they carry us on their back. We ask our dogs to do weight pulls... horses do that as well. Agility-show jumping. Sled dogs-horses pull sleds. Hiking with your dog- Trail riding. Weave poles- Pole bending. Obedience-Trick training. Breed shows- Showmanship. The major difference is the space a horse requires and the fact that they cost more to keep. But it's up to the owners to realize this. 

Eventually horse slaughter will reduce A LOT because of the fact that all horses will need the micro chipping in order to be slaughtered. And a lot of people are not going to dish out the money to put in a chip. A lot of people don't plan to send their horses to slaughter. I know my horses won't get chipped and I know that three out of the five have had bute. Two of them are still young and haven't required it yet but they might eventually. This would make them inelligable for slaughter. 

I'm not sure there is a fix to this. If there was a way to regulate and humanely slaughter horses that were safe for human consumption I wouldn't have a problem with it because before I started researching it I was fine with the idea of horse slaughter. But after viewing videos and actually doing a ton of research I've come to the conclusion that it's not as hunky dory as some people make it out to be. Everyone is intitled to their own opinion though. And because I hate arguing I won't return to this thread again. I just thought I'd get out there what I have learned. If you'd like some links I can provide them to you through PM. Thanks for reading that if you got through it all.


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## WickedNag (Sep 7, 2010)

You are right ShutUpJoe...But the transportation for this poor horses is hideous and double deckers have been illegal for years. Well, at least 5 in most states that I know of. Hasn't' stopped it from happening though... because unfortunately that law only applies to horses headed for slaughter. Think it is too easy to forge that and suggest they are going elsewhere.

And if it could be regulated it could be done humanely. IMO Not all slaughter plants for cattle, beef, sheep etc are humane and not all are hell holes. 

So IMO I would like to see very strict laws in the hauling of animals to processing plants and have officials oversee the humane treatment of all the animals sent there to be processed.

I hate the idea of horse slaughter as much as the next horse lover but I am sick of seeing horses being abused and neglected as well. I am not sure what the answer is except responsible breeding!


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

The first thing that needs to be changed is how the horses are trucked. They are hauled in cattle liners. Go to a big auction some time and see the condition of the horses being unloaded. We need slaughter houses, like it or not as we can't let horses just starve because of feed shortages and other unanticipated changes. Imagine a horse being forced to travel 3 or 4 thousand miles to a slaughter house because of the US ban, squashed into a cattle liner with many others. Despite a loathing for slaughter houses we need to look at the overall picture. So, Step One - transportation better designed for horses.


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## Crystal09 (Jan 7, 2011)

Can't they come up with more humane ways of slaughtering them? Like make a bolt gun that is meant for horses or something?


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## ponyboy (Jul 24, 2008)

Humane slaughter can be done (Iceland is the best example), but I don't believe for a second that we in North America would ever be willing to spend the time and expense needed. It just isn't part of our culture.


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## Bearkiller (Aug 10, 2011)

I'm not sure I follow. I spent several hours the other day trying to find where horse slaughter had been banned. I can't find it. All I could find were failed federal bills. Some places like montana and utah have passed laws making it easier to open one if someone were to desire to do that. Maybe someone could share a link or something. I see they were banned in specific states but there wouldn't be anything stopping one of these companies from opening up somewhere else. If there were a decent market for it.


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## Ladytrails (Jul 28, 2010)

I think it's more subtle than outright banning of horse slaughter. There are laws against selling/transporting horses intended for slaughter; and there are appropriations bills that defunded the USDA inspectors at slaughter sites. So, if you can't buy/sell/ship for slaughter, and you can't get your horse meat inspected you have no way to get horse meat to the market. Thus, the slaughter houses go out of business.


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## its lbs not miles (Sep 1, 2011)

The subject of humane killing can be discussed forever without ever changing anyone's mind. Having lived on a farm where we killed and processed our own meat in addition to euthanizing an animal when it had to be done, I feel comfortable saying that when we killed an animal (for whatever reason) it was clean and fast. 150 gr pullet to the head is going to finish any animal, including a horse.

As for the making it legal again to slaughter horses in the US. They're going to be slaughtered somewhere. It's mainly the world's Anglo societies that aren't willing to accept that from a nutritional perspective equine meat is the healthiest domestic red meat (all mamals are red meat) we produce in this country (followed by goat). You pay a hefty price for equine in restaurants in Italy.

Yes, they are animals that we don't think of as a meat sourse in our society (today), but we represent a minority of the world. Yet, prior to the later part of the 1900s horse meat was still eaten by citizens of the US. In the 1800's even more horses were consumed in this country. In this country, as in Europe and Asia, there were times when we've also eaten animal species we usually see as house pets. But I digress.

Better to slaughter them here. It'll will be more humane than the treatment unwanted equines currently get. And after learning to deal with having to kill and slaughter, or take to slaughter, pigs that use to follow me around like having another dog, or cattle that I raised on a bottle from the time they were 3 days old , I'd have no problem eating an equine steak from an animal that I never knew. No more so than I have a problem eating a beef steak or ham from an animal I didn't raise. I'd rather they use the better parts of the animal for human consumption than put it all into dog food. A lot of it will get shipped to Europe anyway, which is were a lot of it goes now after the animals have been slaughtered someplace else.
Imagine if we had a law outlawing the slaughter of any domestic animal. Canada and Mexico would be ranking fortunes processing all of our livestock.


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

Why not just to put it down with vet or fire up a bullet rather than using a bolt? Because it's more expensive or there are other reasons?

ponyboy, how is it done in Iceland?


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## ponyboy (Jul 24, 2008)

kitten_Val said:


> Why not just to put it down with vet



if by "with vet" you mean euthanasia, that isn't allowed for horses meant for human consumption. I can't find the article now, but I think in Iceland they take them one by one into a room and shoot them. They also have a good system of quality control – all horses are microchiped, and when a horse gets a drug humans shouldn't have, and alarm is put on the microchip to say that it can't be slaughtered for human consumption for a certain length of time.


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## its lbs not miles (Sep 1, 2011)

ponyboy said:


> if by "with vet" you mean euthanasia, that isn't allowed for horses meant for human consumption. I can't find the article now, but I think in Iceland they take them one by one into a room and shoot them. They also have a good system of quality control – all horses are microchiped, and when a horse gets a drug humans shouldn't have, and alarm is put on the microchip to say that it can't be slaughtered for human consumption for a certain length of time.


You can buy some really nice horse hides in Iceland too. Horses are actually a better usage of feed than most domestic food animals. The horse is useful to humans for years in different capacities. Then when it's life is finished (and I've seen some live a long time...my cousins mule is in his 30's) it can provide a good quality protien. Horse is also one of the few animals that the better quality meat is from the older animals vs the younger ones.
Probably why the horse was so vital to many ancient cultures like the Scythians, Huns, Mongols and the horse tribes of the US. Both for the work and food it provided.
Not many animals can claim to provide as much use as the horse when you take everything they can be used for into account.


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## Beauseant (Oct 22, 2010)

Why even bring such a subject up? People who are for slaughter aren't likely to change their minds. People who are against slaughter aren't likely to change their minds. 

It's a moot point to be discussed.

We ALL live by our own codes of ethics and views of what is considered humane treatement.....or not.....most of us aren't likely to change our minds because of an internet discussion board. Nor is the USA Ag dept likely to change their ruling because we want them to. Or not.


It is what it is..... a sensitive subject that oftentimes descends into bickering and/or vilifying of those who are pro slaughter and mocking and condescending of those who are anti slaughter.


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## ponyboy (Jul 24, 2008)

Bearkiller said:


> I'm not sure I follow. I spent several hours the other day trying to find where horse slaughter had been banned. I can't find it. All I could find were failed federal bills. Some places like montana and utah have passed laws making it easier to open one if someone were to desire to do that. Maybe someone could share a link or something. I see they were banned in specific states but there wouldn't be anything stopping one of these companies from opening up somewhere else. If there were a decent market for it.



My guess is they didn't ban it outright because they don't want to make it illegal for people to shoot (and maybe eat) their own horses. Don't know about the U.S., but Canada's anti-prostitution laws are written the same way.


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