# what would you do in this situation?



## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

:evil:

I don't know how to go about this but I have to bring it up and ask how everyone else would. I've just about reached the end of my "being nice" point. 

All this week my friend has been with me when I go to feed my horse (we hung out all this week) i absolutely love her and she's been with me for a year now but, every time I ask her to put my horse in the paddock she smacks his butt when he's walking off. 

I don't think it's necessary and I told her that I don't want him getting used to that or thinking that he's being scolded for something he didn't do. I mean not that he deserves it at all but, whatever. 

Today she did it again and I got really mad but, was so ****ed off I kept my cool and didn't say a word. It's not a hard smack but, it's a decently good one.

Pretty much this: I ask her to put him in the ring to let him roll around and run. Takes his halter and puts it on him, puts him in the ring (takes halter off) and as he's walking off with his butt torwards her (not threatening way, just walking away) she smacks his butt.

I've asked her more than once that I don't want her to do stuff like that but, i'm assuming it just hasn't gotten across to her. How can I tell her without having to raise my voice?


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## Carleen (Jun 19, 2009)

Tell her that if she does it again you will not allow her to handle your horse anymore. If she does it again, follow through on it.

He is your horse, if she can't handle him the way you want him to be handled then she has no right handling him.


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## Brighteyes (Mar 8, 2009)

What would* I* do? I wouldn't care. Smacking a horse honestly doesn't hurt it, especially if it's just a little hit. I wouldn't think the horse would think he is being reprimanded because she didn't yell at him or get her energy up in a "you're in trouble!" kind of way. I sometimes slap my horse to kill horseflies. She doesn't think I'm getting her in trouble. She acts like she hardly notices. The only time the smacking effects her is when it's used in conjunction with "NO M'AM!" and stomping my feet.


Does it annoy the horse at all? If not, I think you're over reacting a bit. :wink:


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

I'm well aware that smacking a horse doesn't hurt but, I don't want it done. It's also every time and I just don't appreciate it. I don't want to go and pat my horse good job and he pins his ears back and goes to be a little brat. 

i mean sure I'll give my horse a smack if he's out of line but, i don't think it should be done just because...


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## VelvetsAB (Aug 11, 2010)

_I give my horses a pat on the bum going into their stall or into the pasture. I do it as a "good job...now eat!" type of thing._

_Over reacting to me...but if you don't want it to happen, then stop letting her turn your horse out._


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## corinowalk (Apr 26, 2010)

I agree. I give Froggy a love pat when we are done. I think he would stand there and stare at me all day if I didn't.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

Don't get me wrong, I give Beau pats all the time but, there's a difference in a pat and what she's doing. It's a smack for definite sure.


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## Scoope (Oct 19, 2010)

I think your over reacting really , I 'smack' my boys butts when I let them off into the field - not a beating..... , like above , in a 'good job go have fun' kind of way - it isnt exactly like she is beating him over the head with a pole.

I'd try being grateful that she is showing an interest and willing to help out. Honestly you sound a bit neurotic.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

I'm not neurotic, thanks though. I'm saying i've asked her before and I don't want her doing it. Although, I never said I wasn't grateful I just said I didn't appreciate it.


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## Dressage10135 (Feb 11, 2009)

Honestly, if its that big of a deal to you, don't bring her to the barn with you. Simple fix. You seem to be blowing this whole thing out of proportion.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

yeah that would be the simple fix. Why is it every time I post a thread everyone thinks i'm blowing everything out of proportion? Or i'm neurotic??


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## Dressage10135 (Feb 11, 2009)

Maybe because when you post a problem you make it sound like a HUGE deal when in reality its something easily fixable.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

I never made this sound like it was a big thing. Just wanted some advice on how to work around this without having to make her stop coming to the barn that's all and I get comments saying i'm neurotic...


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## Dressage10135 (Feb 11, 2009)

If she isn't willing to listen to your requests about your horse, then the only thing to do is to not bring her.


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## Makoda (Jan 17, 2011)

Just tell her for her own safety its not a good idea to smack a horses but while behind them because every once in a while they will kick out at it and you don't want her to get hurt. Or you could give your horse a command of when they can leave you. For example I push my horses neck away and cluck to them, that way they don't walk off until I am finished. Then you could tell her to help you train him to leave her by doing that instead. I hope this was something along the lines of the answer you are looking for.


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## TheQuietGirl (May 21, 2011)

Alright everyone stop calling beauforever23 neurotic. Let me gently remind you that this is HER horse. No one should do something to your horse if you don't approve. She's the owner, so it's her decision. Anyways...
If I were you talk to your friend before you get to the barn. You don't have to yell but make sure she understands. She might think that it's no big deal either so just tell her how you really don't like or that if she really wants to slap his butt she should just do softer. I hope I could help. Good Luck!


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## usandpets (Jan 1, 2011)

I agree that you should explain to her that possibly at some point the horse may kick out from being slapped. If she still insists on doing it, don't let her turn the horse loose. Do it yourself. I don't think it's really that big of a deal, but it is your horse.


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

i think only one person called her neurotic...not everyone.

beau, i agree you are making way to big of a deal about this, just dont let her turn your horse out. you could tell her to stop again, but its clear she doesnt listen to you.


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## iridehorses (Oct 22, 2007)

Actually, it's a pretty dangerous thing to do. Some horses will get overly enthused when they are turned out from their stalls and romp off instead of walking. Slapping a horse on the backside can be a good way to get yourself kicked. When I turn a horse out, I have my back to the gate and turn the horse so that he is facing me when I take the halter off - I don't want to be anywhere near his rump if he decides to take off or to let out a little kick from excitement. It's just good horsemanship when handling any horse.


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## Clayton Taffy (May 24, 2011)

I do not think you are over reacting at all. This is your horse and you have the right to dictate how he is handled. 
It doesen't matter at all what you are asking your friend to do or not to do, she should respect your wishes. You asked her repeatedly not to do something and she ignored you. 
It is a matter of respecting you, and unfortunatly I don't think she does. But fortunatly there are a lot of great future friends out there.


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

beauforever23 said:


> I'm well aware that smacking a horse doesn't hurt but, I don't want it done. It's also every time and I just don't appreciate it. I don't want to go and pat my horse good job and he pins his ears back and goes to be a little brat.
> 
> i mean sure I'll give my horse a smack if he's out of line but, i don't think it should be done just because...


Then don't have her turn YOUR horse out. Why is she anyway? Are you hurt?


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

Thank you everyone for your responses. Again although other people have said it I don't want my horse associating this with "okay smack? that means it's okay to kick you right?" and than one day I give him a pat and he kicks me in the head or otherwise. He's already a kicker

I posted this thread because, before I have to result in not bringing her to the barn I want to find a reasonable way to deal with this. Kicking out of the barn is one of my very last resorts and I don't want to have to do that. 



mls said:


> Then don't have her turn YOUR horse out. Why is she anyway? Are you hurt?


She is turning him out because, I was cleaning and was over whelmed with crap to do at the barn already so, I asked her to turn him out for me. I'm not hurt though


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

If she's not listening to you even after you've told her multiple times to stop, the _only_ recourse is to stop having her turn out the horse. 

I'm with Iride, because my horses are to turn and face me before they're let loose. I need to take off their halters anyway, and I don't want their butts to me when I'm turning them out. 

As he stated, a horse can get a little over enthused about being out and will kick out without thinking about a human standing behind them. Once their halters are off and I'm out of the gate, then they can do a, 'Yay, I'm out!' kick or two.


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

beauforever23 said:


> She is turning him out because, I was cleaning and was over whelmed with crap to do at the barn already so, I asked her to turn him out for me. I'm not hurt though


Take the five minutes to turn him out. It will reduce your stress and keep you from saying something you don't want to.


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## Clayton Taffy (May 24, 2011)

This is what I would do in your situation. I would explain, once again, that you do not want her to hit or smack your horse on the way to the pasture. You do not even need to explain why, it is your horse and this is the way you want it. Maybe your friend is not hearing you, before you drop her as a barn buddy, give her the benifit of the doubt. Maybe even ask her to repeat it to you, In a fun kind of way. Sometimes a person can make a round about request thinking that they are being perfectly clear and they really are not. ( like me asking my friend not to bring her dogs to my house) After this, if she again hits your horse then you might want to take another look at your friendship.
This is a good life lesson, stick up for yourself and don't let people walk on you.
Keep, if possible, only people around you that respect you


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

Speed Racer said:


> If she's not listening to you even after you've told her multiple times to stop, the _only_ recourse is to stop having her turn out the horse.
> 
> I'm with Iride, because my horses are to turn and face me before they're let loose. I need to take off their halters anyway, and I don't want their butts to me when I'm turning them out.
> 
> As he stated, a horse can get a little over enthused about being out and will kick out without thinking about a human standing behind them. Once their halters are off and I'm out of the gate, then they can do a, 'Yay, I'm out!' kick or two.


I agree. Beau is taught to turn and face me also so I can get his halter off and than after i move out of the way he's allowed to do whatever he pleases. 

He is a kicker and you don't even have to give him a reason for him to kick out at you and I don't need that to become his little habit. 



Taffy Clayton said:


> This is what I would do in your situation. I would explain, once again, that you do not want her to hit or smack your horse on the way to the pasture. You do not even need to explain why, it is your horse and this is the way you want it. Maybe your friend is not hearing you, before you drop her as a barn buddy, give her the benifit of the doubt. Maybe even ask her to repeat it to you, In a fun kind of way. Sometimes a person can make a round about request thinking that they are being perfectly clear and they really are not. ( like me asking my friend not to bring her dogs to my house) After this, if she again hits your horse then you might want to take another look at your friendship.
> This is a good life lesson, stick up for yourself and don't let people walk on you.
> Keep, if possible, only people around you that respect you


I am going to take this approach more than likely. I do let people walk like all over me and it's sad, which I am trying to fix. Thank you.


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## sarahver (Apr 9, 2010)

I think I know where you are coming from. There is a difference between a pat "good boy, go have a roll" and a smack "yee-haw git GOIN".

I give my girl a pat on the shoulder after I have let her go but the impression I get is that isn't what this girl is doing? There is a girl where I keep my horse that SMACKS her horses on the butt like some sort of wild west cowgirl as if to make them run into their pasture madly. I would have a problem with that if it was my horse.

Bottom line: it's your horse so it's your perogative. Pat or smack if you don't like it then tell her nicely not to do it. Or you could offer her an alternative such as "when I let Beau out into the pasture, I usually scratch his ears instead of patting him on the butt, you could do it that way too" or whatever. Otherwise remove her turning out rights altogether.


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## kevinshorses (Aug 15, 2009)

First, just turn your own horse out. You should be doing that anyway. Second, your horse should not leave you when you take the halter off. YOU should leave them. It's a much safer way to do it and teaches the horse to respect you even if the halter is not on.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

sarahver said:


> I think I know where you are coming from. There is a difference between a pat "good boy, go have a roll" and a smack "yee-haw git GOIN".
> 
> I give my girl a pat on the shoulder after I have let her go but the impression I get is that isn't what this girl is doing? There is a girl where I keep my horse that SMACKS her horses on the butt like some sort of wild west cowgirl as if to make them run into their pasture madly. I would have a problem with that if it was my horse.
> 
> Bottom line: it's your horse so it's your perogative. Pat or smack if you don't like it then tell her nicely not to do it. Or you could offer her an alternative such as "when I let Beau out into the pasture, I usually scratch his ears instead of patting him on the butt, you could do it that way too" or whatever. Otherwise remove her turning out rights altogether.


That's exactly what I mean. She does it like "yee-haw get moving" and I don't appreciate it. I love the girl and she's my best friend but, um no just don't smack him, there's no need to. 

I wouldn't mind a pat because, I always give him a pat like "good job" but again a smack is not needed. 



kevinshorses said:


> First, just turn your own horse out. You should be doing that anyway. Second, your horse should not leave you when you take the halter off. YOU should leave them. It's a much safer way to do it and teaches the horse to respect you even if the halter is not on.


I know a lot of people who don't turn their own horses out. Just stating the facts, I have her put him out for me when she's there (which might change depending on if she listens to me) I do leave him before he walks away. I said before that Beau is taught to turn and face me also so I can get his halter off and than after i move out of the way he's allowed to do whatever he pleases.


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

I wouldn't be very comfortable someone else smacking my horse's butt mainly because I'd be too afraid that person can get a hoofprint. Why wouldn't YOU let the horse go instead of your friend? This way you'll solve the conflict without even starting arguments.


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## Skipsfirstspike (Mar 22, 2010)

Make sure you are letting her know Why you don't want her smaking his rump. Not just because you don't like it, but because you don't want her to get hurt if he kicks, and you don't want him to anticipate the smack in the future (which could prompt a kick), or get nervous and kick when someone is around his backside while he is being used.
Then show her the proper way to turn him out, walking him into the paddock, turning him to face you and the gate, then removing halter. You could also say it is barn rules that you are supposed to let him out like that. A little white lie for safety's sake is ok, I think.


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## Beauseant (Oct 22, 2010)

IMO, it is VERY irresponsible of you to ALLOW this girl to turn your horse out, smack or no smack!!! 

She is not observing proper turnout safety procedures, and is taking an inherently dangerous task and making it even more dangerous with her smacks on the rump. If she did that to MY Beau, she'd be flying across the field!!! He kicks out when turned out, and proper turnout procedure MUST BE STRICTLY adhered to with him.

I am being extremely serious when I say that she could end up being seriously hurt or even killed. And do you realize it would INDEED be YOUR fault??!! You allowed someone completely inexeperienced in horse handling procedures to handle your horse in a manner that is terribly dangerous. THAT is irresponsible. A horse's butt should not be anywhere near your reach during turnout. 

You need to seriously consider possible consequences of what you are allowing her to do. Consequences being her being hurt or killed. Even if she NEVER smacks your horse again, she should NEVER be allowed to turn out your horse until she is taught the proper way to do so.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

Beauseant said:


> IMO, it is VERY irresponsible of you to ALLOW this girl to turn your horse out, smack or no smack!!!
> 
> She is not observing proper turnout safety procedures, and is taking an inherently dangerous task and making it even more dangerous with her smacks on the rump. If she did that to MY Beau, she'd be flying across the field!!! He kicks out when turned out, and proper turnout procedure MUST BE STRICTLY adhered to with him.
> 
> ...


First of all, woah on your post. Second of all, I never in here said this girl was inexperienced so why don't you take a BIG step back 

How is it irresponsible of me to let her turn my horse out? This is not about her turning him out. I know she could be kicked that's why I want to find a nice and civil solution to tell her without having to kick her out of the barn. 

You need to take a step back my dear


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## Beauseant (Oct 22, 2010)

MY DEAR< if she is able to smack a horse's rump at turnout , SHE IS INDEED INEXPERIENCED in safe turnout procedure.

PERIOD.

Get snotty all you want, but the fact of the matter is: when turning a horse out, their rump shouldn't be within your reach, nor should it be facing you.

ANYONE with experience handling a horse would know this.

NO whoas or neighs about it.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

Beauseant said:


> MY DEAR< if she is able to smack a horse's rump at turnout , SHE IS INDEED INEXPERIENCED in safe turnout procedure.
> 
> PERIOD.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry for being such a total b*tch right now but, seriously? She's been around horses all her life. She is NOT inexperienced or I WOULDN'T let her near my horse AT ALL. so let's just get that one thing straight (i really felt like cussing right there i'm so mad) 

I see 10x worse situations concerning "safe turnout procedures" so don't tell me and i've been riding since I was 5 years old. I know what improper turnout procedures are. This is why I am here trying to find a CIVIL solution. 

I don't want to hear "oh she doesn't know how to handle horses" or "she's inexperienced" and I certainly don't want to hear "oh you are irresponsible for letting her turnout your horse" or "do it yourself" 

Now, that I have made myself clear on that subject. Anyone have a CIVIL way of me dealing with this?


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

kevinshorses said:


> First, just turn your own horse out. You should be doing that anyway. Second, your horse should not leave you when you take the halter off. YOU should leave them. It's a much safer way to do it and teaches the horse to respect you even if the halter is not on.


This, a million times this. 
Even if YOU don't turn your own horse out, he should respect whomever does, and YOU have to teach him that.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

If she is knowledgeable in handling horses like you say, yet refuses to do it the way you want, then obviously she is pretty much saying that her way is the right way to do it and to heck with what you want her to do.
Easy way to stop this? Quit letting someone else take care of your horse, take a few minutes to do it yourself and then nobody will be turning your horse out in a way you don't want, and no chance of her or you getting kicked at a future time.
Maybe if she sees you are serious about how you want your horse handled, she will do it your way.
Personally,if my friend refused to do as I asked two or three times and continued to do what she wanted, she is not a friend I would want around my horse.
Do it yourself, end of story.


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## Beauseant (Oct 22, 2010)

If she's been around horses all her life, then someone should have taken the time to teach her how to PROPERLY turn a horse out. 

If she is able to smack a horse's butt, she IS NOT doing it right.

Whether YOU tell me she's experienced or not, her actions PROVE she is not.

No EXPERIENCED horse person would have a horse's rump within their reach, and be well within the reach of the horse's hind hooves, during turnout.

Argue all you want, say whatever makes you feel better about you allowing her to put herself in a dangerous situation, but ANYONE WITH HORSE EXPERIENCE would not find themselves near a horse's rump when turning out.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

I do not want to overstep my bounds, but Beayforever, this is a site that encourages children to participate - one starred out letter hardly makes your use of a curse word acceptable. Please consider the entire community when posting.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

Yeah really, his butt is by me all the time... ALL THE TIME!.... i'll answer everyone else when I can cool off my horse's butt is within my reach.

I'm waiting for you to tell me that I'm INEXPERIENCED because, I have my horse's butt in my reach. I'll laugh if that's what you come back with next.

You have NEVER met my friend, whether you think so or not (really don't care what you think) she IS experienced. Just because she makes a couple of slip ups DOESN'T make her an inexperienced horse person.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

JustDressageIt said:


> I do not want to overstep my bounds, but Beayforever, this is a site that encourages children to participate - one starred out letter hardly makes your use of a curse word acceptable. Please consider the entire community when posting.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I well aware. I wanted to fix it up but, it was too late.


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## Beauseant (Oct 22, 2010)

I don't have to know her... or you....to know that if your horse's butt is within reach during turnout, you/her are inexperienced horse handlers.

As I said, my dear, you can get angry, you can cuss at me, you can stomp off to count to ten.....but there IS an accepted protocol for turning out a horse that is safe and considered standard procedure for experienced horse men and women.

Your friend is not following this protocol.

You are now implying YOU do not follow this protocol. 

You say you realize the danger(which is considerable) and both of you are highly experienced horsewomen, yet your friend, and now you imply you yourself, do not turn this horse out correctly.....because??? 

Because you don't think your horse would ever kick out?
Because you don't care if you or your friend are seriously hurt or killed?
Because you don't agree with the standard turn out protocol?
Because you don't KNOW the turnout protocol?

Or is there another reason? 

I'd like to hear why two highly experienced horsewomen put themselves in danger by having a horse's hindquarters within reach of them during turnout yet say they know the risk of pain and/or death that could result and are fully aware of the correct, safe and accepted way of doing turnout......


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

Beauseant said:


> I don't have to know her... or you....to know that if your horse's butt is within reach during turnout, you/her are inexperienced horse handlers.
> 
> As I said, my dear, you can get angry, you can cuss at me, you can stomp off to count to ten.....but there IS an accepted protocol for turning out a horse that is safe and considered standard procedure for experienced horse men and women.
> 
> ...


I swear I wish I wouldn't loose my cool right now but, I really can't promise that. You don't know me, who in the (wanted cuss word) world do you know that does everything by the book? Come on, tell me!! You? Boy I would love to see how your horses act, they are probably saints. I know my horse certainly isn't. 

I don't give a flying rats butt that I don't follow my own protocol, it's my horse, i'll do as I please. Again I don't care about the standard turn out protocol and YES i know it. What do you think i'm stupid? 

You know what? Here's a beautiful idea!! Why don't you stop burning my bridges, okay?!!

By the way, when I turn my horse out I face him face torwards me and take his halter off and he waits until I am out of the way!! I NEVER said I DON'T follow the protocol so SHUT UP!! (this is me trying to be nice without all the cursing) If you would have read CORRECTLY, you would have seen that I NEVER, EVER not ONCE said my horses' butt was in my reach WHILST turning him out... 

You need to take a BIG step back my dear.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Beauforever, people are trying to help you and you won't listen, you are instead making excuses. This happens in a lot of your threads.
Perhaps it might be time to take a step back for a while and realize this is the internet, and you are going to get all sorts of advice and all sorts of deliveries - some more blunt than others. That doesn't make it wrong, nor does it give you an excuse to start swearing at people or to get all up in arms.
Beyond that, this is a very helpful community - some threads degrade though as the poster argues every point.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Northern (Mar 26, 2010)

*This is a deja vu*

The OP asks how to tell someone "nicely" at the barn what needs to be told, then ends up "raising the voice" at one or more who offer their opinions.:shock:

I'll say the same as I always do re: this "how do I say it without offending/raising my voice?" dilemma: Just say it politely & don't raise your voice. 

Of course, if the person then continues doing the wrong thing, one must take further action, but it needn't involve rudeness or voice-raising. In this case, if she keeps up the bum-slapping, say plainly that she's off-
duty permanently on putting the horse up.

This is where SHE might indulge in rudeness/voice-raising, because when someone is deliberately flouting reasonable directions, there's hostility toward the "authority".

I always hate to see this scenario, because life with horses should be as free of human ego trips as possible, for the sake of the horses. There was a person who used to enjoy arguing with me at a barn once, & I had to say that I wouldn't allow him to put the horses through that discordant energy. We do have an obligation to keep the vibe peaceful for these prey animals, & even for our dogs/other pets.


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## usandpets (Jan 1, 2011)

Beauseant said:


> I don't have to know her... or you....to know that if your horse's butt is within reach during turnout, you/her are inexperienced horse handlers.
> 
> 
> I'd like to hear why two highly experienced horsewomen put themselves in danger by having a horse's hindquarters within reach of them during turnout yet say they know the risk of pain and/or death that could result and are fully aware of the correct, safe and accepted way of doing turnout......


 Not taking sides or adding fuel to the fire...

When we turn our horses out, the others in the pen are usually crowding the gate. I can send them away, but they almost always return. Why? Because they want to go out, they want to be rode, they want attention, they want to be groomed. Even after a long hard ride they want to go back out to be with us. Having up to six horses by a gate will end up with a butt close by. Of course I know my horses well and they generally get along. I've never had a problem with having their butt near me, but I guess that makes me inexperienced according to you. 

There is more than one way to turn a horse out. I'm assuming from your posts that you are facing the horse head on when you take the halter off. Personally, I prefer to stand at their shoulder and have them bring their head to the side and downward. It is a very submissive position for them. All I would have to do is spin after I take the halter off and their butt is easily within reach. 

Again, I must be inexperienced because of this. I don't claim to be a professional but I do know how to handle horses. It really shouldn't be a problem if you truly have the horses respect.


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

idk usandpets, if you have their respect they also shouldnt croud the gate. 

more important that what height or exact place their head is, is that their head is facing you and not their bum.


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

I don't get this OP. You come on this forum asking for help because a friend is not handling your horse the way you want. You asked what to do. So, just about everyone replying to you has said" turn the horse loose yourself if your friend refuses to do it the way you want" 
As soon as everyone told you to do it yourself and also some said if the horse was being turned loose with their butt to you or your friend, that somebody was going to get hurt. Now you have thrown a temper tantrum and basically told everyone to back off, because 
A. For some reason, even though you ASKED how to tell your friend who refuses to listen to you to stop turning the horse loose" everyone said do it yourself" since your friend must not know horse safety 101 , and you got mad at those replies.
B. Everyone was saying she must not have experience and now you have gone balistic because no where did you state in the beginning that this person was knowledgeable in horses.
So, you asked, you were given replies, now you are acting like a spoiled child in your replies. Why would you need to "blow up" just because everyone said, do it yourself, then your friend won't get hurt" . Since you can't seem to control your friend and she is doing it her way, not yours, the owner of the horse, then when she gets her brains kicked out, you will be responsible since you keep stressing how much experience YOU have.
If this is not someone wasting the forums time, then YOU need to get your big girl pants on and tell you friend" either stop turning out my horse like that or don't come around again, and instead of having someone else doing your work, do it yourself. Many people every day manage to turn out their own horse , in a safe manner, then go clean their stalls.


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## Beauseant (Oct 22, 2010)

Beauforever, you're right about one thing: we don't know you. We don't KNOW that you have horse handling experience just because you say so. What we do know is that you only take advice if it fits your criteria. We also know you apparently are prone to cussing and temper tantrums and that criticism can cause you to have anger control issues. 


My dear (I hope you don't mind me calling you that since you called me that), you are not presenting yourself in a favorable light to the entire forum. 


No one here really cares how you choose to position your horse's rump during turnout, but you must know that LEGALLY, there may be ramifications if your friend continues to flout safety procedures and becomes hurt. 

Take a deep breath, chill...and consider that, regardless of if you board or your horse is on your own property, there could be a lawsuit in you or your parents' future if your friend is injured. 

Of course, you probably will blow off this advice as you have all other advice from forum members.

So, again....if she is injured or killed and her family sues.....it is truly and indisputably YOUR fault. 

IMO, be a mature person and request proper safety measures be observed when turning out, or she will no longer be able to do so. 

One point that is missing from all this is that if you cared about your friend as much as you SAY you do, you wouldn't let her put herself in danger like this. I wouldn't let anyone turn my horses out as you have described, whether I liked them or not.....but that's just me.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

I'm not throwing a temper tantrum towards anyone. I held my cool pretty well I might add. 

My parents don't own my horse. I do and she would never file a law suit. I'm done and I am going to take a step back from this thread for now


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

Why am I not surprised? You came to the forum, asked for advice, got advice you didn't want and now you are not willing to admit that maybe, just maybe some of us have lots more experience than you and gave you sound advice.
I don't have a clue how old you are, but let me give you a news flash. You might think your friend is your best friend and would never sue you BUT, in reality if your friend gets her head kicked in because you didn't act like an adult and tell her to stop letting your horse loose in a dangerous way or she would have to stop doing it altogether, she will sue or her parents will sue. Period. 
What I don't understand is WHY you are continuing to pretend this behaviour is okay. Whether you are a child, teenager or adult, YOU are in fact responsible for an injury that can occur when horses are not handled correctly. If you board on someone elses property, THEY are responsible also.
Quit saying "i held my cool". What was there to be upset about for hecks sakes? You asked and were told. 
Oh yea, even if you own your horse, if you are a teenager, then your parents are responsible for your actions. Getting a friend killed by your horse kicking in her head because you won't stop it is pretty juvenile. I don't believe you have the experience you think you do, nor does your friend. I wonder if it is more of a : I have a horse and I am letting you take my horse out to the corral, isn't that nice of me? attitude towards your friend.


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## Beauseant (Oct 22, 2010)

Wyoming, you have summed it up perfectly!!

Beauforever, the OWNER of the horse isn't the only one who assumes legal liability, the PROPERTY OWNERS where your horse is kept can also be held liable unless a waiver is signed. 

Also, a word of wisdom from someone older than you: NEVER assume friends/family would never sue you or the property owners. That is naive. And in my opinion, what you are allowing your friend to do is gross negligence, and I PERSONALLY believe that if she were to get hurt or killed, her family would have every RIGHT to sue you. If you are over 18, you could find yourself and/or the property owners in alot of legal trouble. If you are under 18, you could find your parents and/or the property owners in alot of legal trouble.
Why risk it?

IF you know proper turnout protocol, then teach her how to do it, and demand it be followed. Tell her that you care about her and don't want her to be hurt or killed. Explain the dangers, show her pictures or videos on the net of people who have been injured or killed by being kicked by a horse. 

If you DON"T know proper turnout protocol, educate yourself, then you can educate her.

owning a horse is not a game nor is it something to be flippant about.... it is a serious responsibility with inherent dangers. I don't think you understand that...yet. Someday you will. I hope it is not at your friend's expense.

on a closing note: horses are dangerous creatures, regardless of how experienced you are....or in your case, THINK you are. One of our VERY EXPERIENCED former boarding facility owners is now a paraplegic(can't move arms or legs) and in a wheelchair due to being run over by a horse. Anothere VERY EXPERIENCED friend recently had her face broken in 8 places from being kicked by a horse. Both were professional trainers in their 40's with ALOT more experience than you THINK you have. 

Wise up and stop taking chances with people's lives....yours and/or hers.


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## lildonkey8 (Dec 12, 2010)

It's not the way you want your horse to be handled, so don't let it happen.
GET RID OF THE PROBLEM


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## Mike_User (Oct 24, 2006)

beauforever23 will be back in 3 days. Please note that being unreasonably sarcastic, hostile, or otherwise lashing out at members who try to give you the help you ask for is not tolerated at the Horse Forum.


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

Beau, when you come back I assume that you will read this thread. If you do, I have a few opinions. 

You are very angry, you think you are controlling your anger by not cursing, that's not it. You could control it by not posting til you calm down. Your next step should be controlling yourself so you don't flip out when you hear things you don't like. 

Secondly you started this thread because you did not agree with what your friend was doing, once others joined that you flipped. Surely that means you are getting angry when people agree with you?


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## shelleyb (May 13, 2011)

Am i the only person that understands why beauforever is getting upset? She asked for advice on how to approach her friend not for everybody to judge her :S Im not starting i just want to voice my personal opinion....

As for the 'correct turnout procedure' does anybody really do EVERYTHING 'correctly'??? REAAAALLLLYYY? wow!!!!! lol

when i turn my mare out i face her towards the gate and then give her a little pat as she walks away... if i didnt know her and didnt trust that she wouldnt kick then i of corse wouldnt do it! And as Beauforever has stated she DOESNT do it for that reason and has advised her friend also not to do it - if her friend is ignorant enough to ignore that advice then agreed... she shouldnt be turning the horse out! 

In my opinion that doesnt make you INEXPERIENCED... It just doesnt make you PERFECT!!! BUT WHO IS?

Answer to the OP: Tell your friend firmly NOT to do it and tell her WHY... IF she doesnt listen dont let her turn your horse out!!! simples


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## Beauseant (Oct 22, 2010)

shelley, no more fuel for this fire is needed, thank you.

It is not about any of the things you mentioned, i.e. perfection. It is about temper tantrums, cussing, bad presentation of yourself to other forum members, careless horse handling which may lead to legal issues, and possibility of injury or death.


If someone wants to IMPERFECTLY handle their own horse, that is fine. I'm sure alot of people do, most, if not all of us. What IS a deeper issue is when someone ALLOWS SOMEONE ELSE TO HANDLE THEIR HORSE IN A DANGEROUS MANNER. It is different in many ways if a grown adult is handling their horse imperfectly vs. whether someone else is. Explanation: liability insurance will cover most horse owners at facilities or a waiver is signed, but usually will not cover "friends", family, or other visitors. If she is keeping her horse on her own property, SHE is liable. If she is underage, HER parents are liable. If she boards, the BO will NOT appreciate her negligence in regards to allowing her friend to handle this horse in a dangerous manner.

And lastly, my two horses belong to my 20 year old son. Do I allow him, or my adult daughter who is 28 to handle either horse in a negligent manner??? absolutely not. I am still their mom, and I bought my son these horses. All I ask from him is that he always observe the proper protocol that he spent YEARS learning. Years of money I paid for ground and under saddle lessons ..... 

I ask this of him because I love him. When living and working around horses, one should never be flippant and lax, nor take your horse's behavour for granted. Not for yourself, as there are people in your life who care about you and putting yourself in danger needlessly will hurt them as much as you. and certainly, not to put other people in danger who are working with your horse whether out of love for horse, or you...or both.


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## Beauseant (Oct 22, 2010)

Also, you must realize, shelleyb, beauforever wasn't suspended by the administrator for 3 days for not being a PERFECT horse handler.


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## jrcci (Apr 28, 2011)

you arent over reacting. it is your horse. ignore the rude comments about neurotic... cause it isnt true. i would just tell her not to do that to your horse and tell her if she continues that you will not bring her to the barn. it isnt something to loose a good friendship over but just make sure she really knows that it bothers you.


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

AlexS said:


> Secondly you started this thread because you did not agree with what your friend was doing, once others joined that you flipped. Surely that means you are getting angry when people agree with you?


She was willing to accept the responses that had been given prior to a couple of later comments. IMHO - Those folks jumped on her and she did what the rest of us do when cornered - got rather defensive.


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## shelleyb (May 13, 2011)

Beauseant said:


> Also, you must realize, shelleyb, beauforever wasn't suspended by the administrator for 3 days for not being a PERFECT horse handler.


Well suspend us all then!!!!!!

And i wasnt putting fuel on the fire!! I was simply stating my opinion on the matter..... thats the great thing about forums is you can say what you want when you want where you want! 

I totally agree with the previous 2 comments....


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## gypsygirl (Oct 15, 2009)

and its not like this is the first thread that this has happened in. she starts new threads all the time and they pretty much always end up with her fighting, getting defensive, and changing her story.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

I never try to get defensive, nor do I want to. I got cornered and I tried to defend myself, that was all. 

I have although told my friend that she has to do it my way or she has to leave and she chose to leave and i havent seen her since.


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## Beauseant (Oct 22, 2010)

gypsygirl said:


> and its not like this is the first thread that this has happened in. she starts new threads all the time and they pretty much always end up with her fighting, getting defensive, and changing her story.


 
Yes, a few posters have mentioned that.

Shelleyb:

I say beauforever was not suspended from the forum for not being a perfect horse handler and YOU say "suspend us all then".

I am sorry but that doesn't make sense. 

It's nice to stick up for her , but what you are doing is not productive. You are taking a situation that is trying to simmer down, and reigniting the fire. you are acting like a troll. beauforever has stated she felt cornered and that is why she lashed out, whether that is vindication of her actions or not is open to debate. But YOU should not feel cornered, and there IS NO vindication for your continuing to stir this pot of stew to a boiling point. 

Leave it alone. Stop trying to stir things up. This has nothing to do with YOU, therefore you cannot justify continuing a fight that is not YOURS. Unless you ARE beauforever under another name??!!


Beauforever: I am truly sorry your friend took your talk with her hard. It is probably of little comfort to you having lost a friend, but you did do the right thing. Perhaps it is only a temporary gap in your friendship....she may come around eventually and be your friend again. If she does, stick to your guns and don't waiver in your resolve. 

I am hoping things work out for you, good friends are hard to find.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

Beauseant said:


> Yes, a few posters have mentioned that.
> 
> Shelleyb:
> 
> ...




Well she came to the barn and she did it again and I told her to do it my way or take the highway pretty much. This was before I posted that she decided to leave. 

She smacked his butt again and I happened to see it and told her that it needed to stop right than and there or she could leave now. She turned her back to me and walked away, haven't seen her since. Honestly i'd rather not have my horse kick me in the face at some point and I did explain to her that I didn't want her hurt and all I was doing was trying to be nice and keep her safe. She hasn't called nor texted me so, I don't know what to take from the situation and I honestly don't care anymore. I'm not dealing with anymore stuff from her. i think she deleted me from facebook too.


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## maura (Nov 21, 2009)

> I was simply stating my opinion on the matter..... that's the great thing about forums is you can say what you want when you want where you want!


No, that's not true, at least on this forum. Not only can you not curse or use bad language, you can't work your way around the language filter by using spaces and asterisk. You also can't make explicit insults or derogatory comments against another poster. 

As a matter of fact, here's link to the forum rules:

http://www.horseforum.com/horse-forum-rules-announcements/horse-forum-rules-354/

I suggest you read them.


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

beauforever23, sorry that your friend left when you told her to either be safe or not to do it. Sounds like she was possibly trying to act like she knew more than you and therefore what you said was not correct. 
You have averted a dangerous situation and now you can go back to handling your own horse your way. No chance of her getting hurt and all the stuff that goes along with that.
Move on, if she got mad and left because you told her how to handle YOUR horse, she was not a friend, she was using you.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

wyominggrandma said:


> beauforever23, sorry that your friend left when you told her to either be safe or not to do it. Sounds like she was possibly trying to act like she knew more than you and therefore what you said was not correct.
> You have averted a dangerous situation and now you can go back to handling your own horse your way. No chance of her getting hurt and all the stuff that goes along with that.
> Move on, if she got mad and left because you told her how to handle YOUR horse, she was not a friend, she was using you.


You know what you are right because, honestly I'm not dealing with it. My friend from the barn texted me today and told me her car was there. I told my BO i don't want her on the property or anywhere near my horse. 

I agree that she was more than likely using me. I honestly can't trust anyone anymore


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

I completely defend you. It is your horse and the gal was showing a complete lack of respect for your request that she not smack the horse's butt. Let her pout if she's that childish.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

I don't care about her anymore. I tried to be nice but, I can't anymore. I don't care what she does but, I want her to stay far away from me and my horse. She has tried to text me a couple of times today and I totally ignored her.


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## wyominggrandma (Nov 4, 2009)

You have learned a lesson, now move forward with it. Be bigger than her, if she texts you, just reply that you have chosen to not have her around you and your horse because of her intentional disregard for your horse and your rules. 
then move on and enjoy your horse. You will find friends you can trust as you grow more in confidence about yourself and know when you need to speak up.
Walk tall and have confidence, you made a good decision and should grow from it.


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## beauforever23 (May 6, 2010)

wyominggrandma said:


> You have learned a lesson, now move forward with it. Be bigger than her, if she texts you, just reply that you have chosen to not have her around you and your horse because of her intentional disregard for your horse and your rules.
> then move on and enjoy your horse. You will find friends you can trust as you grow more in confidence about yourself and know when you need to speak up.
> Walk tall and have confidence, you made a good decision and should grow from it.



I have, you are right. Thank you for your kind words.


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