# Horse that just wont STOP!



## budgirl123 (May 28, 2011)

snaffle bit?! thats the simplest kind of bit
i recommend a pelham
they give a lot more leverage and if used correctly you can use the curb rein for downward transitions my horse is the same way! ahah
and you can run your horse into the fence if you can't stop...thats what i do it helps! even though it seems mean they will get the message


----------



## shelleyb (May 13, 2011)

Grackle* lol. and i would NOT recommend changing to a pelham! Its a very harsh bit and if not used in the correct manor can do more harm than good... and besides if she has the mentality that when she goes she doesnt want to stop then changing her bit may just make her harder in the mouth. 

How long have you had her for? has she been raced? It could just be a training/schooling issue that needs dealing with... im no expert so im afraid cannot give you any advise but just my opinion! xx


----------



## budgirl123 (May 28, 2011)

a pelham doesn't have to be that harsh it depends on what kind you get...
you can get a pelham thats is very harsh or you can get a happy mouth one
but either way it provides more leverage so when asking for the downward transition you can use the curb rein 
my 17.2 irish draught drags me around with a pelham in.


----------



## shelleyb (May 13, 2011)

budgirl123 said:


> my 17.2 irish draught drags me around with a pelham in.


Thats my point... if the horse has the mentality just to go... then it will just go... regardless of the bit.... as you have just said


----------



## pintophile (May 18, 2011)

budgirl123 said:


> a pelham doesn't have to be that harsh it depends on what kind you get...
> you can get a pelham thats is very harsh or you can get a happy mouth one
> but either way it provides more leverage so when asking for the downward transition you can use the curb rein
> my 17.2 irish draught drags me around with a pelham in.


Yes, but when the horse is already running through the bit, I don't think adding a harsher bit is the solution. I would agree with you to add a bit more breaks were it just a matter of needing the horse to slow down a bit and listen more, but this horse is obviously beyond that-it doesn't appear to be listening at ALL. The horse needs more training, not more force. Putting a bigger bit in is just going to make her even more hard-mouthed when she figures out she can run through this one too.

But sorry OP, I don't have any advice for you. I'm sure someone else will.


----------



## Spastic_Dove (Oct 4, 2007)

budgirl123 said:


> snaffle bit?! thats the simplest kind of bit
> i recommend a pelham
> they give a lot more leverage and if used correctly you can use the curb rein for downward transitions my horse is the same way! ahah
> and you can run your horse into the fence if you can't stop...thats what i do it helps! even though it seems mean they will get the message



No no no! 

The point is to have them go in the simplest bit possible. leverage bits can be used on finished horses with finess, but bits are not brakes! 

As already mentioned, if he is running through your snaffle, there's nothing stopping him from running through a pelham or any other bit. 

Training is your answer. Get him stopping at the walk, then bring him to the trot. Lots of transitions. 

Can you tell me what you do when you ask him to stop?


----------



## Teeny (May 29, 2011)

Spastic_Dove said:


> Can you tell me what you do when you ask him to stop?


I usually say 'whoa' because she actually responds to that very well and also saying her nickname (teeny) helps , but when she just runs through the bit i hold my hands to the sides and pull ( is that right or wrong:shock but if she doesnt respond to that i turn her in a cicle anc then she just walks again :-|


----------



## Spastic_Dove (Oct 4, 2007)

What I would do with her, is re-teach her (or just teach her) to stop based off of your seat. 

When you are asking your horse to stop, there should be a progression of your aides. It's not exactly fair to ask your horse to go from run to stop with no warning. So for instance if I am cantering along and I want to stop first what I will do is sit deep in my saddle letting my weight fall down through my legs so I feel heavy in the saddle. My position stays the same, but I am letting my weight sit more so the horse learns that means I want him to slow. 

If he ignores that, I may add a "whoa". If he ignores that, I will do a few half halts on the rein, and then pick up being a little more 'loud' with my aides. 


This isn't something you should just start from a canter. If you teach this at a walk, it will be much easier to translate to the canter. 
If you feel your horse isn't stopping, I don't recommend running him into a wall or fence. I've seen quite a few injuries happen that way. Instead if you can, I like to put them on a circle and spiral down ward. Pick up on your inside rein and push his hip to the outside of the circle. 


At a walk or a trot, you can try a one rein stop, but I really don't like them for anything faster because I feel like you can off balance the horse too easily.


----------



## budgirl123 (May 28, 2011)

if the horse is taking off then a snaffle isnt the answer shes taking advantage of the bit
a snaffle barely does anything 
if she is showing then she may need another bit maybe she doesnt need a pelham but a snaffle is obviously not working


----------



## Spastic_Dove (Oct 4, 2007)

The snaffle isn't working because the bit should not be your primary aid for stopping (or turning or anything else for that matter) a horse. Once the horse gets some retraining, the horse has no reason to not go properly in a snaffle. 

A bit is not brakes. 

If she is showing, she should make sure her horse is responsive at home in a snaffle of some sort before upping him to a leverage bit for showing. 

If the OP likes, maybe try a double jointed snaffle that does not have the nutcracker effect.


----------



## MHFoundation Quarters (Feb 23, 2011)

Spastic_Dove said:


> The snaffle isn't working because the bit should not be your primary aid for stopping (or turning or anything else for that matter) a horse. Once the horse gets some retraining, the horse has no reason to not go properly in a snaffle.
> 
> A bit is not brakes.


 
SD, Do you mind if I repeat... A bit is NOT brakes. 

I agree that she just needs more training, certainly not a stronger bit. Spend time mastering things at a walk & trot before worrying about the canter. A good responsive stop, or anything we ask of our horses really comes from all of your aids.


----------



## apachewhitesox (Dec 9, 2010)

I agree with the others the bit is not your brakes. 

My newest horse is similar to yours not wanting to stop and he chucks his head up and braces himself against your hands, a stronger bit would have simply made him harder in the mouth. I have taken the time to get him focused and it has taken a few months and he is still no where near great at it but he has definitely improved. I have simply worked with him on stopping with my others using my hands as a last resort. He still has his days but once he is warmed up he stops from a walk just using my seat, I can control his pace when trotting just using my seat and I can bring him back to a walk just using my seat and voice most times. I haven't even tried cantering until I have the gaits before under control, I will start working on his canter soon though. You should work on the slower gaits before moving up. I think this what you need to do.

Oh and my boy is in a snaffle.


----------



## shelleyb (May 13, 2011)

Teeny said:


> I usually say 'whoa' because she actually responds to that very well and also saying her nickname (teeny) helps , but when she just runs through the bit i hold my hands to the sides and pull ( is that right or wrong:shock but if she doesnt respond to that i turn her in a cicle anc then she just walks again :-|


How does she lunge? Because if she responds well to your voice then maybe it may be worth lunging her and getting her used to your voice 'aids' such as "walk" "trot" "canter" obviously using tone of voice as to weather you want her to move up or down in transition. 

After she lunges well then ask somebody else to lunge her whilst you are riding... but with you giving voice aids.... maybe this will help?

My mare used to be similar when i got her... (ironically she came to me in a pelham... but i changed her to a snaffle because bit made no difference) when i lunged her she used to not stop once in canter but after months of lunging sessions she understands now and i can ride her using purely my voice (and seat obviously) 

And you mention about turning her in circles and she walks.... do you think this may have just become habit that you both anticipate? therefor you both believe this is the only way to stop? just something to think about...

These are only suggestions  xx good luck


----------



## shelleyb (May 13, 2011)

OH also.. if you are consantly pulling and she is constantly running...try half-halt (sqeeze and release, sqeeze and release.... etc..)


----------



## christopher (Feb 11, 2011)

whenever slowing or stopping a horse it should be done with squeezes and releases just like person above me said. give whatever cue you want (seat/voice), then back it up by picking up on the reins untill the horse is slowing at all then release the reins, followed by picking them up again etc.. they learn faster that way, there's less for them to ignore/lean on, and it helps them to engage while stopping, which are all very useful things if you ever want a good stop.

also backing the horse up will help.


----------



## candandy49 (Jan 16, 2011)

I am another one who suggests the "squeeze, release of the reins" rather than a straight pull of the reins. A horse will run right through a straight direct pull of any sort. In some instances, when I felt the need I have also resorted to doing a small less than an inch of a see-saw give and take of one rein then the other in rapid succession. As an example, I was helping a friend train his Saddlebred mares to drive/pull a wagon. We started out with harnessing each mare to a sulky type cart and doing preliminary driving training that way one horse at a time. On one session I was driving the sulky cart with one of the mares. She spooked and took off galloping with me on the cart. I remained calm, started doing the small squeeze, release with slight one rein to the other less than an inch of squeeze and release see-saw of the reins. Even though I was not mounted on her I talked to her from behind her on the cart. She came "back to me" in a very short time.

I do not believe in going to a more severe bit to correct any problems that can be fixed by less severe methods. My learned theory with horses is that "less is better". I have another example of "less being better". Back several years ago I worked at a Western/English Tack and Clothing Store. I had a man come in the Store asking me to help him with a more severe than what he was using with his horse. I asked him what the problem was with his horse. He told me his horse was not stopping or slowing when asked. I took a complete Western bridle from our supply and asked him to show me what he was riding his horse with bridle-wise. He pointed out the under the chin curb strap was one of the flat leather type. I suggested he get a try a chain curb strap and told him how to make the proper adjustment. He took my advice and a few days later he came back into the store and I asked how that simple solution had worked form him. His reply, "his a different horse now". You know to this day I feel I saved a horse from receiving a terrible experience.

I also agree *that the bit is not the brakes*.


----------



## touchofsleep (Mar 9, 2011)

Try riding her in a harsher bit. She can probably run right through that snaffle. And try a pair of forks.


----------



## touchofsleep (Mar 9, 2011)

Also instead of pulling back and holding it, try to pull and release. (bumping) at the horses mouth


----------



## Marecare (Jan 1, 2009)

I have had many horses like this come in and I find that their desire to run is a short lived situation.
I mean if a horse has a desire to run....I let them and don't really get into a fight about it.
Run,run,run and then I check in to see if they are at all interested in stopping.
If not we run,and run,and run.

Now we want to stop all of a sudden and no we can't yet.
Run some more and all of a sudden we can stop any time we want as their attitude changes.

Most people that are not accustomed to a good strong gallop go into panic mode and never see what happens on the other side.
It is just fine and the horse tires and slows into a lope in most cases.

Three or four sessions like that and they just stop the big gallop in many cases.

It is a glass is half full or half empty kind of thing and I choose to approach it as half full and enjoy the gallop for a bit instead of hauling on their mouth.

Bits are not for stopping.


----------

