# looking for a stud horse



## lacey met (Jul 30, 2011)

looking for a appaloosa, paint, quater, saddlebred to breed my arabian i use her just for trail riding. in nc thanks


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

You'd be better off buying what you want and not breeding another grade horse theres tons already on the ground ready to go.


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## gigem88 (May 10, 2011)

Is she registered? What do you want this potential foal for? Trailriding, show, western or english?


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## BarrelracingArabian (Mar 31, 2010)

why do you want those particualr breed studs?


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## MyLittlePonies (Mar 15, 2011)

An arabian can be registered half-arabian if one of the horses is an arabian, but with select breeds. But what are your plans with your foal?


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## sierrams1123 (Jul 8, 2011)

WOW!!! WHY DO PEOPLE CONTINUE TO BREED MUTTS!!!! 
not trying to sound mean or hateful I just do not understand!?!?
I agree with above comment....adopt or buy what you want.


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

sierrams1123 said:


> WOW!!! WHY DO PEOPLE CONTINUE TO BREED MUTTS!!!!


I have absolutely no problem with breeding grade horses....as long as both horses are fantastic at their jobs and the resulting foal will combine both of their attributes towards a definite purpose. If she/he has the means for for a foal, with pregnancy checks and regular vet visits, as well as a fund for covering anything that might go wrong (and with pregnancy, there is a LOT that can go wrong), why not let them breed?

The problem I have is when people don't give a flying rat's @$$ about their mare's conformation, temperament, or training, and are breeding just to breed, or because they think it will be cheaper than buying a foal, or because they want a "piece of their mare", no matter how worthless the resulting foal by the free colt down the street might be.

To the OP. Can we see conformation pictures of your mare, along with any attributes she has and her bloodlines, so that we can help you match her with a complimenting stallion?


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## MHFoundation Quarters (Feb 23, 2011)

OP, your post leaves many questions unanswered and I doubt you will get any stud reccomendations on the info provided. 

Why the wide variety of breeds? 
What is your mare? Is she registered? Does she have fantastic conformation that screams breed me? What are your plans for the foal? 

Can you raise a foal for less than you could pick up something similar for? Stud fees, vet care for the mare, raising the baby until it's of training age, cost of training, and on and on. 

Breeding isn't something to be taken lightly. It should be done with an extreme amount of thought & planning as well as the knowledge it takes to raise a foal.


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

sierrams1123 said:


> WOW!!! WHY DO PEOPLE CONTINUE TO BREED MUTTS!!!!
> not trying to sound mean or hateful I just do not understand!?!?
> I agree with above comment....adopt or buy what you want.


Let me help you to understand. Some crosses are the best horses there are at particular disciplines. The problem is not breeding mutts - the problem is using mutts themselves as breeding stock.

In the OP's case, she is wanting to breed an Arab to an Appy or QH - Araloosas and Quarabs make some of the best endurance trail horses there are if they are crossed properly, and she did clearly say she only does trails. Now whether her Arab is registered or worth breeding is a different matter - don't know from her post...it takes just as much savvy and good breeding stock to breed a good cross like an Araloosa or Warmblood as breeding within a breed, but you are making a mistake if you think breeding crosses is not prudent across the board...


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

gigem88 said:


> Is she registered? What do you want this potential foal for? Trailriding, show, western or english?


Gee, it was only a one sentence post - no way to miss it...she clearly stated she only uses them for trails...


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## SaddleDragon (Sep 20, 2010)

sierrams1123 said:


> WOW!!! WHY DO PEOPLE CONTINUE TO BREED MUTTS!!!!
> not trying to sound mean or hateful I just do not understand!?!?
> I agree with above comment....adopt or buy what you want.


If the mare is registered, she can breed to anything she wants. It will not be a mutt, it will be elidgeable for registration thru the AHA.
If you dont know the ins and outs, you shouldnt pass such harsh judgement.

OP, What is your price range on stud fees? I know quite a few saddlebred studs ( semi)near you. Are you looking for live cover, frozen, cooled?


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## sierrams1123 (Jul 8, 2011)

**



equiniphile said:


> I have absolutely no problem with breeding grade horses....as long as both horses are fantastic at their jobs and the resulting foal will combine both of their attributes towards a definite purpose. If she/he has the means for for a foal, with pregnancy checks and regular vet visits, as well as a fund for covering anything that might go wrong (and with pregnancy, there is a LOT that can go wrong), why not let them breed?
> 
> The problem I have is when people don't give a flying rat's @$$ about their mare's conformation, temperament, or training, and are breeding just to breed, or because they think it will be cheaper than buying a foal, or because they want a "piece of their mare", no matter how worthless the resulting foal by the free colt down the street might be.
> 
> To the OP. Can we see conformation pictures of your mare, along with any attributes she has and her bloodlines, so that we can help you match her with a complimenting stallion?


^^^i like what you said!!



Faceman said:


> Let me help you to understand. Some crosses are the best horses there are at particular disciplines. The problem is not breeding mutts - the problem is using mutts themselves as breeding stock.
> 
> In the OP's case, she is wanting to breed an Arab to an Appy or QH - Araloosas and Quarabs make some of the best endurance trail horses there are if they are crossed properly, and she did clearly say she only does trails. Now whether her Arab is registered or worth breeding is a different matter - don't know from her post...it takes just as much savvy and good breeding stock to breed a good cross like an Araloosa or Warmblood as breeding within a breed, but you are making a mistake if you think breeding crosses is not prudent across the board...





SaddleDragon said:


> If the mare is registered, she can breed to anything she wants. It will not be a mutt, it will be elidgeable for registration thru the AHA.
> If you dont know the ins and outs, you shouldnt pass such harsh judgement.
> 
> OP, What is your price range on stud fees? I know quite a few saddlebred studs ( semi)near you. Are you looking for live cover, frozen, cooled?


 
^^^ Yes, what I said is harsh about the whole mutt thing but in this case it seems to me she is just back yard breed for a "trail" horse....IMO you can buy so many good trail horses that no one wants easier then to breed something that is not papered and much harder to sell. Yes, I know sometimes you can reg. a cross but to me I only recognise certain associations. Yes, there are some very nice crosses IMO but in this case breeding does not sound like the answer.


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

sierrams1123 said:


> ^^^i like what you said!!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You have much to learn. Your quotes around "trail" reflect your attitude and lack of knowledge about trail horses, and your "I only recognise certain associations" speaks of prejudice.

Trail work is a discipline just as any other, that requires particular conformation, skills, abilities, and training, just as any other. Yes, almost any horse can mosey down a trail, just as almost any horse can jump an obstacle, run around some barrels, or chase after a cow. But it takes the right horse and training to excel at trails just as it does to do any of those other disciplines. In other words, all trail horses are not created equal.

Serious trail work requires both performance and endurance capability. It may interest you (or not) to know that Arab/Appy crosses are among the best performing, if not the best performing, endurance trail horses in rugged terrain. I put more value in ability than whether a horse is registered, but again it may interest you (or not) that an Arab/Appy cross can be registered either by ApHC as an Appy or AHA as a half Arab, and I would assume, or at least hope, that as major registries, ApHC and AHA are not on your "not recognized" list.

Of course it is perfectly true that the OP may be a backyard breeder of unregistered horses, but with the information she has provided so far, that is an assumption only, and may not be true at all.

I raised Araloosas for many years, specifically bred for endurance trail work. If you and I were dropped into the Rocky mountains with a 25 mile trek to camp with nothing but mountain game trails to follow, I would be in my sleeping bag in camp with a belly full of hot food while you would be somewhere out in the dark, cold and hungry, leading a crippled and exhausted purebred horse...perhaps that would change your attitude a bit.

Of course my horse couldn't compete with yours at whatever discipline he/she excels at. The difference is I don't demean your horse just because it is not competitive at my discipline...


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## gigem88 (May 10, 2011)

Faceman said:


> Gee, it was only a one sentence post - no way to miss it...she clearly stated she only uses them for trails...


 
Geee, she said she uses her mare for trails, that is true. However, that may or may not change if she breeds her mare. She might actually be thinking about doing something different with the foal. Keep an open mind, it's all good!!


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## sierrams1123 (Jul 8, 2011)

Faceman said:


> You have much to learn. Your quotes around "trail" reflect your attitude and lack of knowledge about trail horses, and your "I only recognise certain associations" speaks of prejudice.
> 
> Trail work is a discipline just as any other, that requires particular conformation, skills, abilities, and training, just as any other. Yes, almost any horse can mosey down a trail, just as almost any horse can jump an obstacle, run around some barrels, or chase after a cow. But it takes the right horse and training to excel at trails just as it does to do any of those other disciplines. In other words, all trail horses are not created equal.
> 
> ...


 
I find it funny how you think by my comment it makes me uneducated and prejudice, I think I could say the same about you. 

I agree with you on some things, but IMO, and that is all I claimed it to be -> MY OPINION, is that there are so many horses out there that need homes so why breed another horse that could end up unwanted, starved, and left for dead like so many horses. (even reg horses)

Sadly this is the cruel reality to our world but if I have assumed wrong then I will say my apologies. I will say though that I am not sorry for the way I feel and my opinions.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

SaddleDragon said:


> If the mare is registered, she can breed to anything she wants. It will not be a mutt, it will be elidgeable for registration thru the AHA.
> If you dont know the ins and outs, you shouldnt pass such harsh judgement.
> 
> OP, What is your price range on stud fees? I know quite a few saddlebred studs ( semi)near you. Are you looking for live cover, frozen, cooled?


It's still a mutt. Registration does not somehow make an animal purebred.


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## megm5441 (Mar 7, 2011)

Jumping on the OP will NOT stop them from breeding. If anything, it will chase them away from the forum.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

megm5441 said:


> Jumping on the OP will NOT stop them from breeding. If anything, it will chase them away from the forum.


Nobody is jumping on anybody. And in fact, your statement is incorrect as this forum has deterred quite a few people from the breeding decision through education of the consequences and responsibilities. If she's going to breed anyway, I would rather see it discouraged than encouraged with no mention of why it's such a bad idea.


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## HannahFaith (Apr 27, 2011)

sierrams1123 said:


> I find it funny how you think by my comment it makes me uneducated and prejudice, I think I could say the same about you.
> 
> I agree with you on some things, but IMO, and that is all I claimed it to be -> MY OPINION, is that there are so many horses out there that need homes so why breed another horse that could end up unwanted, starved, and left for dead like so many horses. (even reg horses)
> 
> Sadly this is the cruel reality to our world but if I have assumed wrong then I will say my apologies. I will say though that I am not sorry for the way I feel and my opinions.



I completely agree with you! i think she should adopt. She can get an extremely young horse for less than a stud fee. not only do you save your mare the hassle of having to foal a foal <-- ha that souunds funny) but you get what you want. In just my looking i have found over 7 mustangs for less than 500 dollars and all under 2. I've found multiple arabs and arab crosses for less than 300 for anything froma year to 3 years. I think its silly that people breed dogs, horses, and cats while there are plenty of animals out there that need homes... 

good luck finding the stud you want, i hope your mare doesnt have complications and you lose her just because you want to breed her and not find an already foaled colt or filly..... goooooood luck.


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## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

I'm wondering if the thought of possibly losing her mare has been addressed. Mares still die while in foal of complications and/or during delivery and even the best vets can't save them. Every summer in a rural paper I read of foals in need of colostrum and that usually means they've been orphaned.


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## HannahFaith (Apr 27, 2011)

megm5441 said:


> Jumping on the OP will NOT stop them from breeding. If anything, it will chase them away from the forum.




and hopefully away from breeding for another pointless horse...


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## natisha (Jan 11, 2011)

I wonder why Arabian stallions weren't on the list of potentials?


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

HannahFaith said:


> and hopefully away from breeding for another pointless horse...


I will spare the mods and delete my own expletives here...

Ahhh...feel much better...


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

Folks, how about waiting for OP to return and provide more info before falling into guessing and judging?


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

Thank you, KV. I fear the OP may have left...


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

HannahFaith said:


> and hopefully away from breeding for another pointless horse...



Wow your just plain rude.


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## MsBHavin (Nov 29, 2010)

LuvMyPerlinoQH said:


> Wow your just plain rude.



I'm really surprised on some of the responses on this thread.


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

MsBHavin said:


> I'm really surprised on some of the responses on this thread.


I am not its seems to be a reg thing they jump like a pack of wolves on a fawn. if there weren't so many good knowledgeable people here with the will to share their knowledge I'd have left by now.


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## Allison Finch (Oct 21, 2009)

I will adress two of the points on this thread.

"mutt" horses.
I have absolutely no problem with well thought out grade breeding. None at all. I see it like dog breeding. Many papered breeds are so thinly bred that they have produced many breed oriented problems, both dogs and horses.

I am a real fan of "hybrid vigor", a proven advantage. I could care less about having papers on a horse, since I don't show in "breed" classes.

Some of the best horses I have jumped, evented, ridden dressage with were grade. As for a good trail horse...my absolutely BEST mountain trail guiding horse was an arab/QH cross. 

Here we are during hunting season...She is giving HER opinion of you grade haters..











Breeding your own horse

I do have to agree that buying/adopting a horse is the best option here, OP. My reasons are more financial than anything else. Reason?

1. stud fee
2. Vet fees for the almost year of gestation
3. the three year waiting time where you can do nothing but ground work a baby.

If you have four + years to wait to get a horse that may OR MAY NOT be decent quality and you think your mare is really want you want passed on....It's not my business. I, personally would rather pick my horse, showing the qualities I admire, and is usable NOW, than take such a chance.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

WOW, I suppose it's not surprising that the inevitable trainwreck is happening, nothing like innocently asking what stud to use to call down the wrath of horse people.

I as always stand on the 'nothing wrong with a good mutt' side of the street. Most of the horses I have owned and ridden are mutts, bought for what they can do, and how they perform rather than a bit of paper that sits in the drawer.


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

Golden Horse said:


> WOW, I suppose it's not surprising that the inevitable trainwreck is happening, nothing like innocently asking what stud to use to call down the wrath of horse people.
> 
> I as always stand on the 'nothing wrong with a good mutt' side of the street. Most of the horses I have owned and ridden are mutts, bought for what they can do, and how they perform rather than a bit of paper that sits in the drawer.


Haha...I believe you have a mutt that is accumulating quite a ribbon collection...:lol:


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## Ladybug2001 (Mar 15, 2011)

For once, I might come to the stand here. How about everyone stop yelling at people when they simply want to breed? When I first came to this site it wasn't like this, what happened?

How about we stop critizing, ask for more information on what kind of stallion the OP wishes and to what she wants with the foal. Stop cracking into people buisness and personal life, slamming them to the ground and walking all over them. Instead, be informative and help her look for what she wants. 

With the way everyone is acting now we are going to scare everyone away.


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

Ladybug2001 said:


> For once, I might come to the stand here. How about everyone stop yelling at people when they simply want to breed? When I first came to this site it wasn't like this, what happened?
> 
> How about we stop critizing, ask for more information on what kind of stallion the OP wishes and to what she wants with the foal. Stop cracking into people buisness and personal life, slamming them to the ground and walking all over them. Instead, be informative and help her look for what she wants.
> 
> With the way everyone is acting now we are going to scare everyone away.


Sometimes I wonder if thats not the plan...to scare off newcomers or the folks with a thin skin. Your post is spot on.


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## Ladybug2001 (Mar 15, 2011)

LuvMyPerlinoQH said:


> Sometimes I wonder if thats not the plan...to scare off newcomers or the folks with a thin skin. Your post is spot on.


I'm becoming annoyed at going onto threads of people innocently saying they are breeding or thinking of breeding, they get jumped on the spot. I have no issue with people breeding as long as they know fully well what they are getting into. They don't need to be critized and lectured. What is stopping them from going to a more innocent forum site and getting what they asked for! Sometimes I think of doing that, and I haven't even been jumped. I feel sorry for the ones I see it happen to.


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

Ladybug2001 said:


> I'm becoming annoyed at going onto threads of people innocently saying they are breeding or thinking of breeding, they get jumped on the spot. I have no issue with people breeding as long as they know fully well what they are getting into. They don't need to be critized and lectured. What is stopping them from going to a more innocent forum site and getting what they asked for! Sometimes I think of doing that, and I haven't even been jumped. I feel sorry for the ones I see it happen to.



Agreed. I give my opinion and back off if they ask a question and I think I may know the answer too or even may be able to add to the conversation then I am happy to help.


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## Spyder (Jul 27, 2008)

We hashed over this question on etiquette in the breeding section a while ago.

It was started by Mike the Admin.

http://www.horseforum.com/suggestions/should-we-add-agreement-when-members-83819/

Too bad that all that effort is for naught.:-(


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## redape49 (Jul 29, 2011)

gigem88 said:


> Geee, she said she uses her mare for trails, that is true. However, that may or may not change if she breeds her mare. She might actually be thinking about doing something different with the foal. Keep an open mind, it's all good!!


Was thinking the same thing.


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## Ladybug2001 (Mar 15, 2011)

That's all well. Though giving critizim is one thing, continuing to harass the OP is another. And that is all that happens anymore.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Druydess (Jan 25, 2008)

LuvMyPerlinoQH said:


> Sometimes I wonder if thats not the plan...to scare off newcomers or the folks with a thin skin. Your post is spot on.


Bingo!- you are very astute..


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## Druydess (Jan 25, 2008)

Ladybug2001 said:


> I'm becoming annoyed at going onto threads of people innocently saying they are breeding or thinking of breeding, they get jumped on the spot. I have no issue with people breeding as long as they know fully well what they are getting into. They don't need to be critized and lectured. What is stopping them from going to a more innocent forum site and getting what they asked for! Sometimes I think of doing that, and I haven't even been jumped. I feel sorry for the ones I see it happen to.


Very true, and I agree. I get the interrogation routine ANY time I even mention breeding- and here's the fun part.. I've had 5-6 mares for over 6 years now and a stallion for over 2, and not ONE has been bred..
How irresponsible!..:shock:

Best to ignore the jibes and personal agendas and respond to those who actually answer and enlighten with regard to the original question. To the OP and others like her(him)- there are supportive people here..please speak your minds and listen to those who treat you with respect... :wink:


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## Ladybug2001 (Mar 15, 2011)

Druydess said:


> Very true, and I agree. I get the interrogation routine ANY time I even mention breeding- and here's the fun part.. I've had 5-6 mares for over 6 years now and a stallion for over 2, and not ONE has been bred..
> How irresponsible!..:shock:
> 
> Best to ignore the jibes and personal agendas and respond to those who actually answer and enlighten with regard to the original question. To the OP and others like her(him)- there are supportive people here..please speak your minds and listen to those who treat you with respect... :wink:


I'm glad I started a bit of a trend on the OP's side.

So to the OP, give a little more insight what you plan to do with the foal and what exactly you are looking in a stallion. Also, is your mare registered or not?


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## Druydess (Jan 25, 2008)

Ladybug2001 said:


> I'm glad I started a bit of a trend on the OP's side.
> 
> So to the OP, give a little more insight what you plan to do with the foal and what exactly you are looking in a stallion. Also, is your mare registered or not?


I'm glad you did too Ladybug.. 

Yes OP- tell us a bit more...


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## lacey met (Jul 30, 2011)

okay i understand what you r saying about adopting horses i done though of that and looked at some. and thar is noting wrong with grade horses. thar r a lot of great grade horses and reg horses out thar. but to me pappers dont mean a thing to me but thats me lol. and i love arabian/appaloosa horse breeds they have the sprit of a arabian and the color of appaloosa. i am looking to spend about 100 two 200 on a stud horse. it dose not have to have pappers. thanks ps sorry about some miss spelled words.


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## Druydess (Jan 25, 2008)

lacey met said:


> okay i understand what you r saying about adopting horses i done though of that and looked at some. and thar is noting wrong with grade horses. thar r a lot of great grade horses and reg horses out thar. but to me pappers dont mean a thing to me but thats me lol. and i love arabian/appaloosa horse breeds they have the sprit of a arabian and the color of appaloosa. i am looking to spend about 100 two 200 on a stud horse. it dose not have to have pappers. thanks ps sorry about some miss spelled words.


Is there a bit more info/pics about your mare so that a good match might be suggested? Araloosas are wonderful horses with a lot of heart and a good Arab stud may get you what you want, but it would probably cost more than you're looking for.


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## Ladybug2001 (Mar 15, 2011)

OP, yes please maybe post a picture or two of your mare so we can set her up with a stallion that would increase better qualitys in the foal. Also, what disipline were you wanting the foal for?

I just looked up some Appy studs, the lowest I've seen has been 500. you may not find any lower then that with any kind of good conformation.


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## NdAppy (Apr 8, 2009)

Unfortunately if you cannot/will not pay more than 100-200 bucks for a stud fee you are not going to find any stallions worth breeding to.


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## Ladybug2001 (Mar 15, 2011)

Not to mention any stallion owner that doesn't have mare owners pay much for a stallion breeding more then likely don't have live foal guarantee.


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

Have you considered the costs of routine pregnancy evaluations and ultrasounds? By breeding the right way, you're going to go waaayyy over your limit of 1-200, not even counting the stud fee. In this case, I would buy rather than breed.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

Faceman said:


> Haha...I believe you have a mutt that is accumulating quite a ribbon collection...:lol:



:rofl: yes, fortunately dressage judges are more interested in a horse correctly completing the test, while horse and rider are wearing the right clothes, rather than what breed they are.


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## sierrams1123 (Jul 8, 2011)

Druydess said:


> I've had 5-6 mares for over 6 years now and a stallion for over 2, and not ONE has been bred..


I knew there were responsible horse owners out there!!! I am so sick of the "well the mare got out" or the "our stud got out" ---> it all gets so old so fast.

There is a lady that lives down the road from me and she sent her mare to a "trainer" and when she got her back she ended up having a foal some time later and the lady claimed she had no clue and the "trainer" claimed he had no clue ->thus being an uneducated horse owners and having a POS claiming to be a "trainer". 
Then the same lady sent her mare back to this "trainer" and it all happened again!!! They both claimed they had no clue once again. (I would have thought the first time she would have learned to not send her mare there but it did not and she ended up with two unplanned foals and she only has 1 acre of dirt that they are turned out on) Oh wait it gets worse!!! 
Now the 2nd foal is at the age of like 2 or 3 and the lady thinks it smart to send her off to the same "trainer" and what do you know she comes back and sometime later has a foal and the lady calls me for help!!! This time I spoke to the "trainer" and he says he found out that some of his "students" find it funny to let the mares in with the stud and he had "no clue" any of this was going on. ---> now that is what really makes me angry!!!
Sad thing is the colt by the 2nd foal died because the mare would not let it nurse (lady did do one thing right-just not soon enough- by taking the colt to the vet but even they could not save it)


So I do have to say maybe I was a little harsh and quick to jump but it is things like this that really eat at me. Unlike how my comment about "mutts" may seem I nothing against cross breeds just so long as it is being crossed/breed by sensible horse people and for good reason.


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## MsBHavin (Nov 29, 2010)

I would suggest that you try to get a bit more for a stud fee, I would worry about the quality of the stallion for $100-200


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

I have to wonder why people keep stallions and don't breed them, that just seems to be a risk that isn't worth taking. 

If they are young and being proved then that is one thing, but then they haven't started their career, so that may be a different issue.


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## MsBHavin (Nov 29, 2010)

Golden Horse said:


> I have to wonder why people keep stallions and don't breed them, that just seems to be a risk that isn't worth taking.
> 
> If they are young and being proved then that is one thing, but then they haven't started their career, so that may be a different issue.


Maybe it's a ego thing? Maybe they think they can make tons of money off breeding?


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

I think the ego thing has a lot to do with it, The Black Stallion has a lot to answer for.

I understand people having working studs, and as I say youngsters who are being proved, but if they are not breeding worthy do everyone a favor and chop off his nuts.

Irony here, I had my yearling gelded last month, yesterday someone offered to buy one of them as a stud prospect....typical, but I don't regret the decision to geld him, he IS a nice boy, but his life will be so much better as a great gelding than it would of been as an OK stallion.


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## A knack for horses (Jun 17, 2010)

Golden Horse said:


> I have to wonder why people keep stallions and don't breed them, that just seems to be a risk that isn't worth taking.
> 
> If they are young and being proved then that is one thing, but then they haven't started their career, so that may be a different issue.


I know this doesn't account for every situation, but some stallions may have a medical condition that make it dangerous for the stallion to recieve the castration surgery. I remember a lady who had a mini stallion she only kept a stallion because he'd bleed to death if he had the surgery done.


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## A knack for horses (Jun 17, 2010)

Personally I'm a fan of removing the "berries" from the "bush". I think an okay stud would be much happier and have a better life as an outstanding gelding


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## Ladybug2001 (Mar 15, 2011)

sierrams1123 said:


> I knew there were responsible horse owners out there!!! I am so sick of the "well the mare got out" or the "our stud got out" ---> it all gets so old so fast.
> 
> There is a lady that lives down the road from me and she sent her mare to a "trainer" and when she got her back she ended up having a foal some time later and the lady claimed she had no clue and the "trainer" claimed he had no clue ->thus being an uneducated horse owners and having a POS claiming to be a "trainer".
> Then the same lady sent her mare back to this "trainer" and it all happened again!!! They both claimed they had no clue once again. (I would have thought the first time she would have learned to not send her mare there but it did not and she ended up with two unplanned foals and she only has 1 acre of dirt that they are turned out on) Oh wait it gets worse!!!
> ...


You just had to jump in, eh? If you have no plan to help the OP and instead interrogate, why post?

"Mutts" or grade horses, are not bad what so ever. I have a mare whom I have no clue what she mostly is or what. She has Quarter Horse in her, that is all I know, doesn't mean she is a horrid mare. I bred her, produced a nice little foal. So instead of being so quick to jump the gun, why not try and help people out? The OP simply wants some help finding a stallion for her mare. Either do such, or quick yapping. You have already stated your opinion about mutts and breeding grade horses. Everyone heard you and several people. Opinion stated, now lets move onto the whole reason this thread was made. ._.


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

A knack for horses said:


> I know this doesn't account for every situation, but some stallions may have a medical condition that make it dangerous for the stallion to recieve the castration surgery. I remember a lady who had a mini stallion she only kept a stallion because he'd bleed to death if he had the surgery done.


That's very true. For some its just not recommended (although those are exceptions of course). Also in some countries people just don't fix animals so when they move to, say, US, they just do the same (because that's how it was done their whole life). I know one foreign guy who keeps TB stallion as a stallion. No intentions to breed, but he just considers him to "be a man". I'm not saying I'm excited about the idea, but then he's the owner and it's up to him to decide.


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## Ladybug2001 (Mar 15, 2011)

kitten_Val said:


> That's very true. For some its just not recommended (although those are exceptions of course). Also in some countries people just don't fix animals so when they move to, say, US, they just do the same (because that's how it was done their whole life). I know one foreign guy who keeps TB stallion as a stallion. No intentions to breed, but he just considers him to "be a man". I'm not saying I'm excited about the idea, but then he's the owner and it's up to him to decide.


 
Off subject a second, but that is like my friend and her cats! Oh my lord, everytime I go over there she is like "Yeah ____, is pregnant again"....


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

Ladybug2001 said:


> Off subject a second, but that is like my friend and her cats! Oh my lord, everytime I go over there she is like "Yeah ____, is pregnant again"....


Bahahahahaha... Yeah, its pretty common in some barns I know too... 

Actually my old cat was not fixed: she was too old (and had health issues) to do it so I just let her be till she died (she was indoor). All my 3 young cats were fixed as long as they reached 6 months. No kittens, thanks!


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

I had a paint I almost lost from gelding complications he had all the symptoms the vet said to call if he had them I called vet blew me off saying it would be fine..it wasnt Gryf lost so much blood almost bled to death I got another vet and sued the other over it he got so down looked horrible iron deficient it was such a long process to get him back to the horse he was before he was gelded.


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## Ladybug2001 (Mar 15, 2011)

kitten_Val said:


> Bahahahahaha... Yeah, its pretty common in some barns I know too...
> 
> Actually my old cat was not fixed: she was too old (and had health issues) to do it so I just let her be till she died (she was indoor). All my 3 young cats were fixed as long as they reached 6 months. No kittens, thanks!


Haha, funny part is, they aren't barn cats! They are indoor cats.. I think she has... three adult females and 1 adult male, one female is pregnant and one just gave birth not to long ago... Its like... GEEZE. I've had only two of my cats get pregnant. One was right after I took her in from the city, her and her daughter we kept got fixed. Then when we rescued another cat from under our porch she ended up already pregnant. We kept all three of her daughters and all four of them got fixed as well. No more kittens, even though they are so cute. ... Hey, thats about how it goes with horses.


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## Golden Horse (Feb 20, 2010)

kitten_Val said:


> I'm not saying I'm excited about the idea, but then he's the owner and it's up to him to decide.


I agree to a certain point, if people are going to keep their horses and dogs entire then they best be protecting the female populations from them. 

An entire mare or ***** comes into heat for a few days on a regular cycle, as owners of ladies we just have times of extra vigilance.

As owners of entire males, well they come into heat at maturity and stay in it until they die, you have to watch them the whole time.

All my dogs are neutered, I have no intentions of breedings dogs so why would they need that hassle? 

I have one stallion, and I have problems wondering what to do with him in the future, at the moment he lives with what ever mares he is serving, so he has company. If he is no longer needed for breeding he is either going to have to go back to living alone, as he was when I bought him, or he is going to have to learn to love with other male company, and at 17 I'm concerned that he won't be able to do that :-(


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## sierrams1123 (Jul 8, 2011)

Ladybug2001 said:


> You just had to jump in, eh? If you have no plan to help the OP and instead interrogate, why post?
> 
> "Mutts" or grade horses, are not bad what so ever. I have a mare whom I have no clue what she mostly is or what. She has Quarter Horse in her, that is all I know, doesn't mean she is a horrid mare. I bred her, produced a nice little foal. So instead of being so quick to jump the gun, why not try and help people out? The OP simply wants some help finding a stallion for her mare. Either do such, or quick yapping. You have already stated your opinion about mutts and breeding grade horses. Everyone heard you and several people. Opinion stated, now lets move onto the whole reason this thread was made. ._.


 
I find it funny how I was adding my IMO help to the post, sorry if you find it harsh or mean, but yet you still feel the need to say help or stop yapping.
I also then attempted to apologize for my quick to judge and harsh comment and seems to me you do not understand or see that, although you quoted my post. 
I also find it funny how you made the comment about either help the OP or stop yapping, my eyes may be playing tricks but I am pretty sure you are YAPPING about cats in some other post.

Your right we all should get back to what the forum is really about and that is helping one another.
I also think we should go by the old saying If you do not have anything nice to say then do not say anything at all, I for one know I do not listen to that saying enough.
I will admit when I am wrong and when I have jumped the gun, and in this case I may have done just that. 
I have not yet seen a reply from the OP to verify anything.


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## Ladybug2001 (Mar 15, 2011)

sierrams1123 said:


> I find it funny how I was adding my IMO help to the post, sorry if you find it harsh or mean, but yet you still feel the need to say help or stop yapping.
> I also then attempted to apologize for my quick to judge and harsh comment and seems to me you do not understand or see that, although you quoted my post.
> *I also find it funny how you made the comment about either help the OP or stop yapping, my eyes may be playing tricks but I am pretty sure you are YAPPING about cats in some other post.*
> 
> ...


 
Do you see where the OP has posted a reply? Because I haven't? Not sure I can help anything if we have yet to figure out a few things.


If the OP will go up on the price range.
What the OP plans on doing with the foal.
Picture of the said mare.
And so on. 
Frankly, I see no way how your post about the trainer issue was needed in this conversation?


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

sierrams1123 said:


> I find it funny how I was adding my IMO help to the post, sorry if you find it harsh or mean, but yet you still feel the need to say help or stop yapping.
> I also then attempted to apologize for my quick to judge and harsh comment and seems to me you do not understand or see that, although you quoted my post.


Well I noticed. You are young and learning and like all of us in that situation tend to jump to conclusions. But unlike some, you are open minded enough to be aware of it and adjust accordingly. Kudos...


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## sierrams1123 (Jul 8, 2011)

ladybug2001 said:


> do you see where the op has posted a reply? Because i haven't? Not sure i can help anything if we have yet to figure out a few things.
> 
> 
> if the op will go up on the price range.
> ...


 

wow!!! Do you not read the entire post i post???? I clearly said i have yet to see a reply from the original poster. I also said in my post about the lady that lived down the road from me was one of the reasons i hate people who breed just to breed or when horse "oops, get to each other"!!!!!!!


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## Ladybug2001 (Mar 15, 2011)

sierrams1123 said:


> wow!!! Do you not read the entire post i post???? I clearly said i have yet to see a reply from the original poster. I also said in my post about the lady that lived down the road from me was one of the reasons i hate people who breed just to breed or when horse "oops, get to each other"!!!!!!!


That was sort of the point, wasn't it? I know you said it, but that was exactly my point. The OP hasn't said anything, but I meant "yapping" for more of a insulting continious use of your opinion. Though seem how I have nothing nice to say here, I won't say anything at all.


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

Golden Horse said:


> I agree to a certain point, if people are going to keep their horses and dogs entire then they best be protecting the female populations from them.
> 
> An entire mare or ***** comes into heat for a few days on a regular cycle, as owners of ladies we just have times of extra vigilance.
> 
> ...


I agree with you GH. I don't breed my animals and don't plan to. All I was trying to say if the person decided to keep the horse (dog, cat ...) "natural" (hmmmmm), any attempt to tell him/her that it's wrong usually doesn't do any good. The worst part is when that stud jumps over the fence and look for neighbor's mare to breed. That's something I really, really dislike.


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

kitten_Val said:


> I agree with you GH. I don't breed my animals and don't plan to. All I was trying to say if the person decided to keep the horse (dog, cat ...) "natural" (hmmmmm), any attempt to tell him/her that it's wrong usually doesn't do any good. The worst part is when that stud jumps over the fence and look for neighbor's mare to breed. That's something I really, really dislike.



I had a case of the mare getting out looking for the stud when my paint was a stud the neighbor whose horse never remained in their pasture this mare would come to the fence line calling winking carrying on like a hussy she took to going thru his pasture thru his front yard into my yard my fencing was to tall and strong for her but she would tear my yard up with her running bucking fits I ended up running a strand of extremely hot hot wire around my whole farm to keep her out Gryf never looked twice at her. He was a good colt very gentle and loving until I got Dusty.


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## sierrams1123 (Jul 8, 2011)

Ladybug2001 said:


> That was sort of the point, wasn't it? I know you said it, but that was exactly my point. The OP hasn't said anything, but I meant "yapping" for more of a insulting continious use of your opinion. Though seem how I have nothing nice to say here, I won't say anything at all.


 

Thank you for clearing up the fact that your use of the word "yapping" to be an insult I had no clue at all you were trying to be mean!!!

I am not stupid, I clearly understood.

I think it is more of you have nothing to say, so you can not say anything at all.

I did not come on to this forum or this post to argue. I came on this forum and this post to state my opinions just like everyone else did and does. If you do not agree with a previous opinion made by someone else that is not odd and it is normal, everyone has a difference of opinion and everyone is entitled to their own opinions. --> thus I do not see my comment to be "yapping" nor do I find others opinions to be unwanted or unneeded.


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## Druydess (Jan 25, 2008)

sierrams1123 said:


> I knew there were responsible horse owners out there!!! I am so sick of the "well the mare got out" or the "our stud got out" ---> it all gets so old so fast.


Very pathetic little prank by those kids.. 

Yes, there are many of us that breed, or wait to breed, responsibly.. you just don't hear about them much, well - because they're responsible.. 

I do get tired of the idiots (not you) though who keep throwing unsolicited opinions for some imagined future possible event at those of us who actually are doing the right thing . 
:roll:


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

When I worked for a big Dressage barn, we got a new client's horse in, a young 3 year old stud for training. He did his quarantine in the barn, and as the BO also had a Hanoverian stud there were two stud pens - large 6" wooden fences, about an acre fenced and in the front well away from any mares that were penned in the back.

The first day we turned this youngster out, he went completely ballistic, racing around the pen and screaming and within 5 minutes we were playing "OH MY GOD, STOP HIM" when he cleared the fence in a single bound. Thank god we were there, I managed to get a hold of his halter and almost got a broken toe when he proceeded to rear trying to get back to the mares.

He spent the rest of his training days in the barn...

This woman produced colts worth 10K when they hit the ground. She was not an amateur, she had every certificate for equine reproduction. Horses are not figurines, things DO happen and even the best of us could be dealing with an "oopsie".


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

when I read these threads and especially from new poster I tend to think it is someone just trying to get a rise out of everyone for entertainment value. There seem to be so many of the same type of topics that get everyone going and many times the OP sounds like they are intentially trying to sound ignorant. Who asks for a stallion fee request at $100.00-$200.00?


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

churumbeque said:


> when I read these threads and especially from new poster I tend to think it is someone just trying to get a rise out of everyone for entertainment value. There seem to be so many of the same type of topics that get everyone going and many times the OP sounds like they are intentially trying to sound ignorant. Who asks for a stallion fee request at $100.00-$200.00?


I am looking at stallions right now and the cheapest is $750 up to the thousands


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

Golden Horse said:


> I have to wonder why people keep stallions and don't breed them, that just seems to be a risk that isn't worth taking.
> 
> If they are young and being proved then that is one thing, but then they haven't started their career, so that may be a different issue.


 
Keeping stallions is a major headache. If you are not breeding a stallion, why would anyone want that hassle. Not being judgemental, but I would just like to know why because I am nosey? This is a question for stallion owners that do not breed their studs, just curious, as I was always under the impression to keep a horse intact was to breed, I would like to know the other reasons.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

waresbear said:


> Keeping stallions is a major headache. If you are not breeding a stallion, why would anyone want that hassle. Not being judgemental, but I would just like to know why because I am nosey? This is a question for stallion owners that do not breed their studs, just curious, as I was always under the impression to keep a horse intact was to breed, I would like to know the other reasons.


I had a peruvian stallion and was planning on breeding but not many peruvian mares to breed to. I kept him a stallion for several years because

1. he was worth more as a stallion so didn't want to knock his value down. I wouldn't sell him so it didn't matter but I wanted a stallion not a gelding.

2. he was very well behaved and a little more testosterone than a gelding

3. Just in case I wanted to breed him. I did breed to a few outside mares and would have bred some for myself but gaited horse trainers are hard to come by so I held back on breeding my own.


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## waresbear (Jun 18, 2011)

Peruvians Paso??? I have trained one, however just as a riding horse for her owner. Very easy to train, & sorry to say this, boring to ride after experiencing the initial paddling & winging gait. Amazing how smooth though, but I like doing some work while I am riding, with Holada Rojas (Red Ice), I pretty much set her, & sat there. Thank you for your reasons, but still your boy is kept intact because he will be bred.


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## WildJessie (Oct 15, 2010)

If you are going to breed do it RESPONSIBLY! If you are not going to breed responsibly, do NOT breed at all.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

waresbear said:


> Peruvians Paso??? I have trained one, however just as a riding horse for her owner. Very easy to train, & sorry to say this, boring to ride after experiencing the initial paddling & winging gait. Amazing how smooth though, but I like doing some work while I am riding, with Holada Rojas (Red Ice), I pretty much set her, & sat there. Thank you for your reasons, but still your boy is kept intact because he will be bred.


 I had him gelded a few years ago so I could turn him out with the other horses


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## apachiedragon (Apr 19, 2008)

I get the impression from the original post and the following one that the OP simply does not want to spend much money just to have another horse. Maybe they are not aware of the actual figures involved in caring for a pregnant mare and the subsequent foal. Wasn't there a thread a while back that broke it down into estimated number figures, how many thousands it takes to do just that? I wonder if someone could find that and link it. The OP may also not be considering the fact that there will also be a length of time where her mare (aside from the medical risks involved) will not be rideable as well. 

I personally believe the OP would do better spending a little bit more and just buying the crossbreed she wants. You can find Araloosas or other Arabian crosses out there without spending a fortune and generally without looking too far. If the OP wants a young horse to raise and train, there are weanlings and yearlings around for the price of the stud fee listed, however, not many stud fees are that low, unless the horse should not be breeding anyway.

I live in NC as well, and have not seen one single stud, in ANY of the breeds listed, for that price range.


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## Ashley at Rivermont (Aug 18, 2011)

I specialize in Half Arabians (registered) so I can understand why you would want to breed your Arabian mare. I have a black APHA stallion on my farm if you want to check him out. His first two foals this year were bay's with 4 gorgeous white stockings and a blaze! Go to Rivermont Hidengoseek 

Those of you who wonder about why people breed grade horses, in the Hunter Jumper world papers don't matter, and some of those "mutts" I have stumbled upon wound up becoming very valuable show horses. A lot of times I think they make the best horse! A good horse is a good horse, papered or not in my opinion. 

Good luck!


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

Ashley at Rivermont said:


> I specialize in Half Arabians (registered) so I can understand why you would want to breed your Arabian mare. I have a black APHA stallion on my farm if you want to check him out. His first two foals this year were bay's with 4 gorgeous white stockings and a blaze! Go to Rivermont Hidengoseek
> 
> Those of you who wonder about why people breed grade horses, in the Hunter Jumper world papers don't matter, and some of those "mutts" I have stumbled upon wound up becoming very valuable show horses. A lot of times I think they make the best horse! A good horse is a good horse, papered or not in my opinion.
> 
> Good luck!


So basically, getting 1 good grade is worth sending 10 more to slaughter, is that it? I will never understand how sensible people can be so illogical. MOST Grades do not end up going on to become champions, regardless of their ability or not. People who are in a position to be able to support them going far financially are not interested in wasting their money on long shots. Horses are one big gamble, and anyone with a brain is going to gamble on the horse that was DESIGNED to win. No, it may not, that's life, but you're a pretty lousy gambler if you pick 10% odds over 50% odds.


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## Ashley at Rivermont (Aug 18, 2011)

I assure you there are probably more registered horses that end up going to slaughter as all one needs to do is look at how farms who specialize in whatever breed may get dozens if not more foals per year, giving no thought to anything but money. I don't see anything wrong with people breeding a horse or two a year for hobby as long as they are responsible horse owners. I'm not sure why you believe slaughter is something registered horses are exempt from.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NdAppy (Apr 8, 2009)

No one said that registered horses are exempt. But you have to look at the fact if there are two horses, alike in every way except on has papers and one doesn't which do you think is going to be bought? The one with papers...


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## Druydess (Jan 25, 2008)

Ashley at Rivermont said:


> I assure you there are probably more registered horses that end up going to slaughter as all one needs to do is look at how farms who specialize in whatever breed may get dozens if not more foals per year, giving no thought to anything but money. I don't see anything wrong with people breeding a horse or two a year for hobby as long as they are responsible horse owners. I'm not sure why you believe slaughter is something registered horses are exempt from.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Agree completely Ashley!


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## Ashley at Rivermont (Aug 18, 2011)

Also, did I ever say anything about thinking it was good to send horses to slaughter or that I would RATHER send 10 to slaughter? NO! Don't be so dramatic. All I said was a good horse was a good horse, papered or not. I've never been one who cared anything about papers or bloodlines, and I have had many a Champions roll out of my barn in my 27 years of being in the horse business. I own registered and grade horses and love them all the same. If this nice lady is a responsible horse owner and would like to breed her horse, she has that right and no one should bash her for it. Go slam the registered breed farms who spit out 100 foals a year because they have that "bloodline" that might be "designed to win". Anyone who breeds horses, papered or not, needs to be responsible and never over breed. I've never had more than 2 foals born on my farm each year at a time for this reason. My barn is full of Champion "grade" hunters, and you can't tell me there aren't gobs of registered unwanted's all over the world, sadly enough. Be nice, all she wanted to know was who she could breed her horse to!


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## Druydess (Jan 25, 2008)

Well said Ashley!! I have said the same thing. Look at the big breeders and TB farms pumping them out by the hundreds!! Your advice to the OP is well thought out and sound.


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## NdAppy (Apr 8, 2009)

And people told her their opinions. Just because it doesn't jive with your opinion does not make it any less valid. The fact that she wants to spend no more than $100-200 on a stud fee says a lot about the quality of stallions that the poster would be looking at.


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## iridehorses (Oct 22, 2007)

This has now degraded into a contest to see who's opinion is best - it either gets back on target or closed.


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

MacabreMikolaj said:


> So basically, getting 1 good grade is worth sending 10 more to slaughter, is that it? I will never understand how sensible people can be so illogical. MOST Grades do not end up going on to become champions, regardless of their ability or not. People who are in a position to be able to support them going far financially are not interested in wasting their money on long shots. Horses are one big gamble, and anyone with a brain is going to gamble on the horse that was DESIGNED to win. No, it may not, that's life, but you're a pretty lousy gambler if you pick 10% odds over 50% odds.


I agree with you 100%...however with a qualification. A good breeder using very good registered breeding stock (being registered is important to establish ancestry and to determine if the breeding stock is true to their breeding), that is breeding good crosses such as half Arabs for which there is a strong demand, produces no more "slaughter-quality" horses than a good breeder of registered horses.

The problem, however, which is why I agree with you, is that very very few breeders of crosses meet those criteria - so few that it is not unreasonable to generalize as you have. I bred both "purebreds" and crosses for many years and in my experience it is far more difficult and takes much more expertise to breed good crosses than it does to breed good registered horses. The irony of that is that breeders of crosses usually have less expertise than breeders of registered horses, so what you end up with is a a very low percentage of crosses being of notable quality.

My own opinion, and it is just my opinion, is that no one should undertake breeding crosses until they have a good history of producing good registered stock and have achieved a high level of breeding expertise. For example there are quite a few Arab breeders that have expanded into breeding half Arabs because of the high demand that consistently produce some very high quality horses. But you and I know that such breeders are the exception rather than the rule...


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## QHDragon (Mar 6, 2009)

To the OP, if you only want to spend 100-200 on a stud fee then please go over to your local kill pen and pick something up. It would be much cheaper and you all ready can see what you are going to get. Any stud with that type of stud fee (never seen anything that low in my area) is not worth breeding to. If you are still intent on breeding do the foal a favor and save up until you can spend 1000-2000 on the stud fee in order to breed to a stud worth his man parts.

And don't forget all the costs of vet care while the mare is in foal, the risk that you may lose the mare and/or the foal during birth, and the costs should there be any complications. Then you will have to keep/feed/vet/farrier the foal for three-four years before you will ever get to ride him/her. 

I kind of have a feeling that the OP is not thinking beyond the cost of the stud fee.


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## blue eyed pony (Jun 20, 2011)

There was a very nice clydesdale stud we were looking at breeding Mum's old TB mare to a while ago... she was a proven broodmare, had produced a few nice foals. The fee was to be free, or a 'foal swap' arrangement. But the mare had uterine cysts and so the breeding did not go ahead. Since then, I've read a lot about which Clyde/TB crosses do and don't work, and it seems that TB stud and Clyde mare tends to work better than Clyde stud and TB mare. The resulting foal could have been a superstar... or it could have been totally worthless.

There is a very reputable stud here in western australia that breeds Clydesdale crosses as sporthorses. These horses are a motley of different breeds and the majority are completely unknown, yet they consistently compete and win at high levels in jumping and eventing.

And my filly is a grade, of basically unknown breeding, and she is going to be spectacular. She can REALLY move, and she has a massive jump (this was discovered accidentally), and she usually sits fairly level in her back, just occasionally goes a bit bum high as she is still growing.

So grades can be GREAT, and free stallions aren't necessarily bad (of note, before we found out our old mare had the cysts, we were offered a breeding to a very nice Friesian stallion that is top 2% of breed, provided they could lease the mare to get a second foal - these people breed spectacular horses from a truly exceptional stallion). BUT, and this is a HUGE caviat, if you can't afford a stud fee on an expensive stallion, then no way could you afford the potential vet bills that may happen, and with mares in foal these can be HUGE. I'm talking in the tens of thousands.

I wanted to breed my own foal for the longest time. I still do but even though I do have a mare now, IF I breed her she will have matured into something TRULY exceptional, I will breed to something that will guarantee a registerable foal (welsh, arab, certain others), and she will be bred to something incredible, that compliments her conformation, is a proven competition horse, and is proven to throw quality progeny. I also would not be breeding to a dilute horse, as Satin is one and I don't want a double dilute, or to pass one on that may be bred just for its colour.

Umm. I guess what I'm trying to say is that not everyone who breeds grade is irresponsible. And that a little education is often all that's needed for prospective breeders to make an educated decision. Though I do agree that it will be very hard, if not impossible, to find a stud for less than $200 that is worth keeping entire. Around here a halfway decent stud, regardless of breed, will have a fee of no less than $800. I don't know about miniatures but the full sized breeds for sure.


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## gigem88 (May 10, 2011)

I don't fully agree that stud price is a good measure of a stallion. I bred my Arab mare to an Arab stud for $400. He has champions in his pedigree, top and bottom, and I've seen his foals. Very nice babies. Many QH people use him because he does make good crosses.


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## Buckcherry (Nov 18, 2010)

Let me just say, any horse wheather it be "grade" or "purebreed" can end up in slaughter. I don't think they are picky as to what breed of horse they are cutting up. 

Yes everyone should be more responsible with breeding but that should go for people breeding "purebreeds" as well as people who wish to breed "grade"

Who are we to judge what people have the right to do.
Yes you should educate people, but when it's done in a rude mannor, do you really think they will listen?


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## Faceman (Nov 29, 2007)

gigem88 said:


> I don't fully agree that stud price is a good measure of a stallion. I bred my Arab mare to an Arab stud for $400. He has champions in his pedigree, top and bottom, and I've seen his foals. Very nice babies. Many QH people use him because he does make good crosses.


Thank you.

Stallion fees reflect market conditions, market demand, owner financial condition, potential of get that might increase the value of the stallion, achievements or non-achievements of previous get, success of marketing and P/R efforts, location, facilities, and probably other variables I can't think of at the moment.

While naturally one would expect a stallion with a $2,000 fee to be of higher quality than one with a $500 fee, there are many variables that can substantially affect the fee.

The current recession is a good example of the theory of "compression". A very good stalion might have commanded a fee of $1,500 5 years ago, while a BYB type stallion might have commanded $300. Thus the good stallion commanded a price 5 times greater than the poor one, with a substantial dollar difference of $1,200. Today, because of the recession, that same good stallion may only command a $600 fee, while the poor stallion may still command the same low $300 fee. Now the difference is only double, with a nominal dollar difference of only $300.

That is a hypothetical example, of course, but we have all seen stallion fees drop dramatically from 5 - 10 years ago. The bottom line is there is certainly (generally) a relationship between the size of the fee and stallion quality, but many other factors come into play...


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

A shelter 2 counties away just siezed 8 horses all pretty emaciated you can see every bone makes you cry to look at the pictures. The network has asked me to take on one or 2 but man I dont know so crunched for time with 3 kids all my horses and cows not to mention I have to study my butt off for my state board test then get a job not sure I have the time to devote to care for one like they should be cared for..what to do what to do.


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## gigem88 (May 10, 2011)

Still tooooo early in the day for math, Faceman! lol That made my head hurt.


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## AliceN1derland (Sep 15, 2011)

Too bad you're so far away. I'm in Az. I've just purchased a beautiful App/Arab stallion. Blk/brn with a white spotted blanket. He has the temperment of a kitten. You wouldn't think he's a stallion. When bred with a solid mare, 3 out of 4 of his foals have had his blanket. He isn't registered, so breeding fees aren't high. Who cares about mixed breeds. Some ppl just want a sweet, beautiful horse. Good luck to you.


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## LuvMyPerlinoQH (Jun 21, 2011)

AliceN1derland said:


> Too bad you're so far away. I'm in Az. I've just purchased a beautiful App/Arab stallion. Blk/brn with a white spotted blanket. He has the temperment of a kitten. You wouldn't think he's a stallion. When bred with a solid mare, 3 out of 4 of his foals have had his blanket. He isn't registered, so breeding fees aren't high. *Who cares about mixed breeds.* Some ppl just want a sweet, beautiful horse. Good luck to you.


No one thats why the feed lots are so full of them.


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## notfartofall (Sep 8, 2011)

Its a shame the OP dont live in england for £150 more than her limit she could have bred to this stunner  : Appaloosa horse , Appaloosa, Stallion for sale in Derbyshire | Horsemart


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## deineria (Mar 22, 2009)

Looks like a lot of folks need to visit their local auctions - People please - PLEASE - remember that quality horses are being slaughtered daily - don't breed more unless there is NO WAY to find what you're looking for -


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