# For Saddlebred owners out there :)



## morganarab94

Wow he is gorgeous!


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## FeatheredFeet

Have you seen or do you have pictures, of his sire/dam/grandparents? I don't know them personally. I ask, because he has a soft back at this point. I understand he is young, but I'd still like to see a flat back on him. Soft backs are an indication of Lordosis, which is rampant in Saddlebreds.

I think he's a prettily marked lad. I don't like his overly muscled lower neck. He does appear to toe out, but it is difficult to tell from the pictures. His tail is lower set and the croup more sloping, than many like to see in the breed.

Have a look here to see Saddlebred conformation.

Conformation of the American Saddlebred Horse

I'd run this boy on quite some time, before considering him for breeding. At the moment, he wouldn't be my choice.

Lizzie


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## Honeysuga

He is a cutie, I love his color!

Could a vet or chiro check his back(im not familiar with lordosis, but his back worries me at this young age, it already looks a little swayed). Id check his parentage and lines for lordosis.

What are your plans for him?

Oh and the video wouldnt work for me .


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## MyBrandy

- try to see the video now - the video is working fine - it's just the way this website is handling the link 






Or copy this and paste in your browser:
FirstLook.mp4 on Vimeo

==================

I think it's just the way he's standing in the pictures.. In person he really did not seem swayed.. See if you can see the video - it should give a better view.

- as far as plans with him, once he puts a little weight on and matures a little bit physically, will start him under saddle, with the way he moves, I'd get basic riding on him - and see what will be his niche  He will pick his discipline - my job is to get him healthy and fit and get basic training done .. I may or may not keep him after that.. I shall see  He really doesn't know much of anything at this point...


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## Honeysuga

video is private. hehe


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## MyBrandy

OK - try now - on Utube I did have settings "private" haha


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## MyBrandy

put it on higher resolution if your internet can handle it


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## FeatheredFeet

In your first post, I thought you were excited to get him as a possible forever horse. Now you seem as though you might not keep him after training? 

Saddlebreds make terrific mounts and can put their hoof to many diciplines. Why have you maybe changed your mind? If his cost is reasonable - as it should be by what I see, then I'd train him and show him in some dicipline. Even if he has lordosis, it most usually does not preclude them from a good and often long, show career under saddle. 

Were you hoping for just a stallion to put to stud? Saddlebreds - and even quite good ones, are ending up in rescue these days. Maybe it was his colour which attracted you? He is pretty, no doubt about it. Would probably make a lovely gelding for someone to have fun with.

Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

Thanks for your comment Lizzie - but where did I mention that he would be forever horse? Please re-read my 1st. post.. I did not mention anything regarding how long I would be keeping this horse.. I am pulling him out of situation where he is not being treated as he deserves.. I asked for constructive criticism on the horse's conformation ( stallion or not ) ONLY. Thank you.
If you revisit my 1st. post you will see I said quote: " I will see how he matures over the next 2 years to see if he'd be kept stallion." 

- he currently is not in a shape or age to judge whether he should be kept intact or not - the previous owner did not geld him and that is the way he's coming to me  Again - he may or may not be kept stallion couple years from now...Do I like color - yes - but I did not pick him for that. I like saddlebreds - I have another saddlebred gelding already in my barn


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## FeatheredFeet

Reading your original post, you said you were 'exccited'. To me, that might not mean a forever horse, but one or a breed you might have been wanting. Then, regarding his possibility of being kept whole, it looks to the reader, as though you might be planning on breeding. Again, to me anyway, it means you might be keeping him.

You also mentioned that you had put a down payment on him. That didn't look to me as though he was being taken out of a less than stellar environment. 

The video in the overgrown roundpen, was not good enough to really see how he moves. I do think he possibly has a nice long stride but not much action in the front. Quality Saddlebred babies are born with incredibly high action when trotting. 

Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

FeatheredFeet said:


> Reading your original post, you said you were 'exccited'. To me, that might not mean a forever horse, but one or a breed you might have been wanting. Then, regarding his possibility of being kept whole, it looks to the reader, as though you might be planning on breeding. Again, to me anyway, it means you might be keeping him.
> 
> You also mentioned that you had put a down payment on him. That didn't look to me as though he was being taken out of a less than stellar environment.
> 
> The video in the overgrown roundpen, was not good enough to really see how he moves. I do think he possibly has a nice long stride but not much action in the front. Quality Saddlebred babies are born with incredibly high action when trotting.
> 
> Lizzie




-- Yes I paid a deposit for him as I do think he's worth the money they were asking for him and will pay the remainder of the sum to be paid when I pick him up next weekend - owner was asking reasonable price considering the horse's condition and for lack of training there of.

-- I personally like the way he carries himself - not looking for the highest knee / hock action as I personally am not fan of saddle-seat, my saddlebred gelding that I have doesn't have the highest knee action - my dressage instructor wants to steal him  

-- are there any other things besides the back that stand out to you? Thanks


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## FeatheredFeet

Well if I were younger and looking for another Saddlebred, I'd be pleased to have him. However, looking at his as he is now, I would geld and train in maybe dressage or as a pleasure mount. Saddlebreds make quite reasonable jumpers, although I never jumped mine. Mostly when I rode for pleasure, I didn't ride saddle seat, although mine were 5 gaited.

Who knows, once you get him trained, you might not wish to part with him. 

As I said before, at the moment, he doesn't look stallion quality, except maybe to those who just breed for colour. I haven't been in Saddlebreds for a while, so someone still in the breed, might be able to say more about his immediate ancestors, which I don't recognise.

Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

Lizzie - thank you very much for your input  Yes I am unsure about keeping him as stallion (for breeding purposes) at this time.. Time will show.. I did want to keep him intact reasonably long to help him fill out.. He was being kept with a QH gelding up till now with no problem - so I think having a saddlebred gelding to keep him company might keep them both plenty exercised in my pasture  My ASB gelding is 5 yo and will probably keep this colt in check.


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## MyBrandy

I tried to dig out some info on the colt's ancestors..I found a video of this colt's grand Sire..






Also his Dam can be seen in the pictures at the bottom of this page:
Irish_Velvets_2001

- do they seem to you as having soft back? She can be seen at picture frame #7. She is moving in that picture - but her back appears pretty normal to me.. what do you think?


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## Honeysuga

I think he gets his back from his dam, hers looks pretty soft. His grandsires looks pretty good though.


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## FeatheredFeet

Agreed!

Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

Yes her back definitely seems long to me  Now - not sure if you guys noticed - she is 21 years old in the picture with him as foal  - she is 1989 model which would make her 21 yo in the year 2010 (his foaling year) - I have seen some saddlebreds that were 12 - 15 years old and had terribly swayed back.. hers doesn't look like that though.. It's long and yes it looks week-ish but that may be also the fact she is "elderly" and that she's been used a broodmare for years (there are more foals from her on that website)

I found more info on her here: Irish_Velvets


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## Joe4d

short weak sway backed and a low tail set, no way I would breed that horse. Nor would I pay any type of money for it. Looks like a lot of the "oooh purty color" horses I see getting bred around me. 
Not meaning to pile on, but you did ask for opinions on its confirmation. That horse should be gelded today.


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## MyBrandy

Alright Joe - thanks for your input


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians

I agree that he should be gelded because of his conformation faults which aren't fixable. You can't take a sloping croup and make it flat, raise his tail set or shorten his back. Though his back is my last worry because he's also 3 and a bit butt high still, so I'd reserve judgement on that. He's ewe necked but that can be compensated for with training and a head set, but won't change the way it's set on. 

Now that I said all the bad stuff, he's adorable, love his color and he moves just like my saddlebred mare. She has the softest, easiest to sit trot EVER and a rocking chair canter and the best temperament too. She is one of 2 horses on this place that will never be sold and the one that I tell people when they ask about buying her, "You can buy her when you can pry her lead rope out of my cold, dead fingers. Then you can try to get my husband to part with her.". 

So, while he's not perfect, he may have the perfect ride.


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## MyBrandy

Dream Catcher Arabians - 

"I agree that he should be gelded because of his conformation faults which aren't fixable. You can't take a sloping croup and make it flat, raise his tail set or shorten his back. Though his back is my last worry because he's also 3 and a bit butt high still, so I'd reserve judgement on that. He's ewe necked but that can be compensated for with training and a head set, but won't change the way it's set on. " 

<======= That is exactly what I was thinking that he's butt high! It makes his back look funny... he's not even 3 for Krist's sake and he seriously needs to gain some muscle and develop and grow.. Yes I agree about the eweneck. Definitely should not ride this guy saddleseat - actually many saddleseat trained ASBs look ewe-necked to me because of the way their training forces them to carry their neck.. Just think about the mechanics of the way they ride the saddle-seat horses.. I think teaching him how to properly carry himself would help address this neck issue as well as strengthen his back where it needs to be strengthened.

"Now that I said all the bad stuff, he's adorable, love his color and he moves just like my saddlebred mare. She has the softest, easiest to sit trot EVER and a rocking chair canter and the best temperament too. She is one of 2 horses on this place that will never be sold and the one that I tell people when they ask about buying her, "You can buy her when you can pry her lead rope out of my cold, dead fingers. Then you can try to get my husband to part with her.". 

<==== Yes I picked him for his movement - the color is icing on the cake - but I think he would make a great dressage and overall riding horse - he's got nice big bones in his legs, big solid fee (even though they need TLC by my farrier - his feet had nice long frogs and thick walls). Yes his croup is round and tail-set low, I think he would look great doing Western Pleasure too.. When his butt fills in I think it would look good, actually with the round croup - I think he will have good chance to be able to reach underneath himself better and collect himself better.. VERY true about the softest trot.. my other saddlebred gelding is just the smoothest ride, he is not taught to gait, so only 3 gaited but keeps up very well with all the gaited horses on the trail and I stay very comfortable myself. 

"So, while he's not perfect, he may have the perfect ride."

<=== Amen - please check his trot in that video again..  He floats... 
I may geld him this fall when it cools down or I may geld him in 2 years when he's done growing - keeping him intact will help with muscling him up.. Since they did not geld him when his testes dropped, might as well keep him intact until he's done growing or until he asks for it - whichever comes first..


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## Honeysuga

As long as you are happy with him, that is all that matters!  I was just meaning to keep an eye on the back as he gets older, not saying it is godawful, hehe. Where as it does look soft, as I said, it may improve with conditioning and tons of topline work.


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## MyBrandy

Thanks Honeysuga 
I will post some new confo pictures here next weekend after we get him and get him cleaned up.. 

- I have nursed my now 4 yo paint filly to health and beauty back from when she was almost 2 - she was terribly underweight and neglected and she looks awesome now and is great riding / cow / game / pleasure mount.. I get a lot of satisfaction in getting them better and healthier and getting the young-ins trained and riding and blossoming.. I may or may not keep him.. It seems I am the kind of person that likes to put some pounds, training and LOVE into them and I know that eventually will start itching for a new project few years down the road - of course at that time I am attached and it's very hard to let go ..


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## LadyDreamer

Hi, that horse does not have lordosis. Not even mild. 

In regards to his back: He is under weight, no muscle tone, high behind and has pronounced withers. He has a weak back, certainly, but he does not have lordosis. His dam does not have lordosis either. Sway back from over work, poor muscling, and from being a longtime broodmare is not the same as genetic lordosis that you can find in Saddlebreds. You will see a little sway on the longer backed mares after years of carrying foals. The mares are stuck out in a field to work themselves. They are often fat and lazy, do not work any harder than they have to, probably couldn't accumulate a mile cantering in a full year. Carrying babies is hard on the body, and if you have a longer back, it really pulls on you. Age plays a factor too. 

Genetic lordosis has a very specific look, from mild to severe. When you know what you are looking for, you can certainly tell. You can tell a horse that has genetic lordosis before you ever lay a hand on them. 

THIS is a horse with mild lordosis. 
http://imgc.classistatic.com/cps/poc/111221/220r1/72307gj_27.jpeg

When he is in better shape, after good groceries and good work and done growing, THEN look at his back. There is not a big problem there. 

And he is definitely not worth keeping a stud. There are so many better options, and I believe you both would be happier if he were gelded. Kind of a non-issue right now since you don't have him yet, but still. 

I hope you love him and do well with whatever you choose to do with him. I fully agree with you working him as something that will require a lower head carriage. He is not built to be able to set up and carry himself as a Saddleseat horse. 


(As for the saddleseat Saddlebreds being forced to carry themselves with a high head and neck, why no, thank you, we do not "force" them. We cannot force them to do that if we want to keep a horse competitive for very long. We breed for the high, chess piece head carriage. If one is forced to do so, you destroy their air, cause back problems, cause temperament problems, lose power from the hind end which essentially makes you lose motion in the front causing you to try to make up for it elsewhere... all sorts of problems occur from forcing a horse to do something he was not built to do. Those that are "faked", which you see sometimes are not successful and don't last long. It is easier to force a neck up than to try to force motion though, I will give you that. We are pretty successful with breeeding for horses who carry their heads high though. When we get straight necked horses, or horses that are born with lower than ideal head carriage, we use them elsewhere. Same with the ones who are not built for or capable of high motion. THAT is something you cannot fake. You find a lot of hideous quality horses in the spotted horses, palominos, grays and other odd colors from those who breed for color. That is part of the reason why there are not very many top colored horses. There are a few out there, and growing, but still, there are not many. )


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## FeatheredFeet

LadyDreamer. I didn't mean to imply, nor did I say, that the OP's horse had Lordosis. I did say he had a soft back. Certainly it would be worth keeping an eye on as he matures. Plus if the OP didn't know, she should have looked into Lordosis. There is tons of info about it on the net.

I did notice that Habaneros Cassanova, shown in the movie as an adult, is also butt-high. As you say, and has happened in many breeds, when the colours became popular, it was harder and harder, to find a good one.

Lizzie


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## LadyDreamer

Yep, I just thought I would clear up that information. I have dealt with a lot of horses with lordosis. Genetic lordosis is not something that develops over time, whereas there are some sway back cases that are(age related mostly). If they have it, it can get worse, especially as the horse grows, but you KNOW a horse has it before they are weaned. Genetic lordosis is kind of funny. A horse can have the specific gene marker to be lordotic, and not show it, and never have a foal they produce show it. On the same note, a horse that shows it can throw all straight backed foals. Researchers have just recently found the genetic marker for it, and are currently researching causes. I personally believe nutritional and environmental factors play a big role. I have had them out to the farm, and have spoken to them numerous times. They really love their work. Since it is so funny on when it pops up, and saddlebred people too are really funny when it pops up, it is really difficult to study. Saddlebred people don't breed for it, and don't really want to be associated with the production of it, so they are well hidden, not talked about, and not promoted until they are showing. 

This colt honestly looks like he will be fine. Weak back for sure, but I wouldn't even consider it "soft"(granted, terminology is highly debated even in the saddlebred world. One man's "soft" is another man's "low".) He is likely not going to be put through any rigorous training that would severely damage his back at this point in its weakened, under-muscled state, at least until he is in a better condition. At the worst, he might be a little difficult to fit a saddle to.


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## FeatheredFeet

LadyDreamer said:


> Yep, I just thought I would clear up that information. I have dealt with a lot of horses with lordosis. Genetic lordosis is not something that develops over time, whereas there are some sway back cases that are(age related mostly). If they have it, it can get worse, especially as the horse grows, but you KNOW a horse has it before they are weaned. Genetic lordosis is kind of funny. A horse can have the specific gene marker to be lordotic, and not show it, and never have a foal they produce show it. On the same note, a horse that shows it can throw all straight backed foals. Researchers have just recently found the genetic marker for it, and are currently researching causes. I personally believe nutritional and environmental factors play a big role. I have had them out to the farm, and have spoken to them numerous times. They really love their work. Since it is so funny on when it pops up, and saddlebred people too are really funny when it pops up, it is really difficult to study. Saddlebred people don't breed for it, and don't really want to be associated with the production of it, so they are well hidden, not talked about, and not promoted until they are showing.
> 
> This colt honestly looks like he will be fine. Weak back for sure, but I wouldn't even consider it "soft"(granted, terminology is highly debated even in the saddlebred world. One man's "soft" is another man's "low".) He is likely not going to be put through any rigorous training that would severely damage his back at this point in its weakened, under-muscled state, at least until he is in a better condition. At the worst, he might be a little difficult to fit a saddle to.


Not sure I agree with this (red marked)

A long time ago on one of these forums, a lady was showing her mare with extreme lordosis. She showed pics from the time the foal was born and through her successful halter show career. No sign of it. The mare had excellent care and no hard work. She was not an aged mare, but had major lordosis. So it can come on later and not be seen when young. This was also a Saddlebred. I cannot remember her breeding.

In Gypsy Horses, I have only seen it once. Even looking at huge herds of Gypsies in the UK, I have never seen it. However, in this one horse - again a mare, as an adult it became incredibly pronounced. She was imported to the US as a nicely conformed youngster. She had plenty of very close relatives here. I was shocked when I saw her. She had never been worked hard and received proper care. As far as I know she has never been bred, which is probably a good thing.

I know Lordosis has been noted in many breeds, but I have only really been interested in it, in Gypsies and Saddlebreds, since they are my favourite breeds. 

I do think that such horses should not be bred. I do think that in many cases, it is covered up, just as many other problems in animals. Certainly aged mares, having produced many offspring, will have weak backs, but true Lordosis is something quite different.

Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

Hello everyone - just an update - the colt is not home yet. He will be gelded sometime this week, we will be picking him up before the end of June


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## Little Jane

He is a lovely mover . . . I REALLY like the way he moves! He does seem butt-high, but so did my mare, and she grew out of it. He's still young and changing. I'd love to see more videos and pictures when he arrives


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## MyBrandy

Little Jane - yes he's turning 3 on June 17th  My other saddlebred grew big time between age 4 and 5..


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## Little Jane

MyBrandy said:


> Little Jane - yes he's turning 3 on June 17th  My other saddlebred grew big time between age 4 and 5..


Sounds about right ... my mare is half ASB, and she's 5 and still changing a lot, and not just in height. Anyway, he's a gorgeous little guy, and looks to have a great mind and willingness about work. The video of him in the round pen showed some nice attentiveness to you. He looks like a heck of a lot of fun


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## MyBrandy

Yes he was pretty easy to handle for 3 yo stud colt  I thought.. did not lead very well but will fix that  I will make sure to upload photos after we get him as well as progress pictures


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## Inga

Honestly I think he would make a nice gelding. He isn't built correct enough to be kept a stud and his bloodlines are not fancy either. That said, he is a colorful guy and would be a fancy little pleasure horse. Saddlebreds make amazing trail horses too and he would catch a lot of eyes on the trails for sure.


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## MyBrandy

Yes - I spoke with my friend who breeds saddlebreds and arabians in Texas and she agreed he should be gelded - so we decided to do that this week.. Yes saddlebreds are wonderful trail mounts! I am pretty sure that with the way he moves he will be able to tap into dressage


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## MyBrandy

Hi there. Just an update - I just got a message that the colt was finally gelded this morning.. it took some time to schedule this because we have been hit with nearly constant rain and thurnderstorms.. then to line up the sun with the vet's schedule.. but yes he just got gelded - we will go pick him up on Saturday.. I will post pictures after we get him home next weekend!


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## Little Jane

I'm looking forward to seeing more pictures! Keep us updated


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## MyBrandy

Hi everybody - so we finally picked him up yesterday! We had to wait yet another week because we got badly flooded here in Northern Illinois.. Anyways, he is pretty spooky guy, just really doesn't know anything - has not been off the farm since they brought him home as a baby, he is very thin and still has raging testosterone running through his veins.. he is definitely all boy with absolutely no manners, I have to keep on my toes when around him. That being said he seems to want to trust us and has accomplished trusting us quite a bit in the 24 hours we have known him.. Again he is afraid of absolutely everything.. I did not expect he would accept water hose after the rodeo he did when I pulled out the fly spray! He was so eaten by skeeters today after being outside for 3-4 hours, he actually let us hose him down completely after about 1/2 hour working with him and the hose - my dear husband was bravely helping me at that task  in about 10 minutes the colt figured out that the water coming from the hose is a LOT better than the skeeters in the paddock! Anyways I am attaching few photos of him from today - I tried to square him out, but he won't stand still for 2 seconds now. Note his hooves! The former owner has not been keeping up on trims.. I think he has a good base in those feet, I think they are just really overgrown with some splitting / cracks as result.. I called my farrier on the way home with the horse in the trailer to make an appointment, he's from WI so I am hoping he can make it here sooner rather than later.. Please see these updated photos and let me know what you think about his conformation


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## Little Jane

So glad he's with you now!


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## MyBrandy

My farrier just messaged me - he will come out this upcoming weekend! Yay!! Will take pictures after he's done with cleaning his feet up..


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## FeatheredFeet

Well he's a handsome lad and I love his much desired, 50/50 markings. Hate his ewe neck of course, but I think you will be able to help that a little bit in the future. Needs weight as you say. Hope to see him a year from now and I'll bet it will show a lot of difference. Once gelded, he won't be so much of a handful for you. He's a leggy lad isn't he. How old is he now?

Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

FeatheredFeet said:


> Well he's a handsome lad and I love his much desired, 50/50 markings. Hate his ewe neck of course, but I think you will be able to help that a little bit in the future. Needs weight as you say. Hope to see him a year from now and I'll bet it will show a lot of difference. Once gelded, he won't be so much of a handful for you. He's a leggy lad isn't he. How old is he now?
> 
> Lizzie



- Hey Lizzie, he just turned 3 last month. He got gelded 2 weeks ago, but is acting studdy around my mare.. (they have a stall across each other and get turned out in different paddocks for another 2 weeks or so, depends how it goes). Last night he was prancing around his stall with a big one on and I am pretty sure he was ready to do the deed if he was given the opportunity.. I don't know what they have been feeding him, but he at first turned his nose up at my hay (beautiful grass / alfalfa 1st. cut), he would devour the the Blue Seal grain I gave him (I feed what used to be Kent's SBP 14/10 - I forgot what it's called now). I tried to warm him the first day we got him, probably did not get the whole dose as he had a fit about it.. But he did clean up the 2 heavy flakes of hay I gave him last night in his stall - so I think he'll be OK

- have you guys noticed anything else about his conformation that "jumps out at you? "


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## FeatheredFeet

Maybe they had been giving him grain, in his previous home and that's probably why he's hot. He doesn't really even need it and often it does make them not eat as much hay as they should. They can quickly get spoiled on grain and not want to eat anything else. And it's hay that puts the weight on them, anyway. I'd not give him any grain - just hay right now. Besides, it sounds as though he's pretty hot. Doesn't need grain to add to it. 

I'd hope to see a lot more meat and muscle in his rear, during the next couple of years. He's very shallow back there. 

Since you started showing your boy, it got me looking at the spotted ones more closely. I googled American Saddlebred stallion and it brought up hundreds of pictures. Even making allowances for colour patterns, which can sometimes fool the eye, it really did appear to me, that many breeders have been breeding for colour and nothing else. I found a few on a par with their solid counterparts, but tons which were a conformation nightmare. But there again, that happens in any breed which have colour as part of their pattern. 

Your boy will never be a silk purse, but he will be a handsome riding partner for you in the future and I'm always envious of those who own a Saddlebred.

Lizzie


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## Boo Walker

Congratulations!! I really like this boy!


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## MyBrandy

My husband is at home today and he just told me he was able to get a fly mask on the colt!! We also put him in a paddock where there is not much grass left now.. so my DH just put a hay bag there now with hay.. he said it took some time to get the colt to come to it as he was afraid of it.. but hunger is a good motivator! He said he's eating the hay now with a fly mask on! This is what I LOVE about saddlebreds.. they are so willing to try and willing to trust humans, much more than any other breed I have experienced.. they are very sensitive but very smart..
-- Lizzie - the feed I started giving to the colt is very low starch / sugar it's this one:
Blue Seal - Pet, Farm, Home & Garden Supplies in New England and NY

-- I mixed some extra rice bran into it and wetted the feed to get more water into him as he is so busy minded he just forgets to drink..


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## FeatheredFeet

Sounds as though you and he, are making a good start. There is no doubt he will be a little nervous and even scared, for a while. But he'l settle down and become a mama's boy, just like my favourite old Saddlebred. While I've had a lot of different breeds over the years and do love my daughter's Gypsies, I have never known another breed which loves their humans, as much as the Saddlebreds. 

Did I tell you how I came to get my favourite old boy? If not, I'll tell it again.For many years, I had been going to shows with Carol Smith-Shannon, who had some of THE best horses in the US at the time. I was looking for a Saddlebred and looked at several, including some spotted, which were fairly rare at the time. Didn't see anything I liked. Found an ad for a five gaited chestnut gelding, with a good show career behind him. I had a look at him. I loved everything about this horse, as did the friend I took with me. I even took a picture of him. But - and it was a big but, there was something wrong with the sellers. They didn't want to answer all my questions. Avoided questions and just plain refused to answer some. I came away, with the strange feeling, they didn't actually own him. He might even have been a stolen horse. There was something definitely wrong. So, I decided not to buy him. I kept his picture in my wallet for several years. Didn't find another horse I liked as much.

Then one day, I answered another ad. Strangely enough, the seller turned out to be the son of a friend of mine. I arranged to see the horse, who was at the LAEC. I think I cried when I saw the horse. Here was the boy I had wanted for so long and still carried his picture with me. I asked no questions, but knew it was meant to be and I think, so did the horse. As soon as I walked up to him, he was immediately, 'my' horse. Didn't want anything to do with the seller standing there, although I knew they had never mistreated him. Wierd eh?

I'll tell you another strange Saddlebred story one day. Maybe even more strange than this one.

Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

FeatheredFeet said:


> Sounds as though you and he, are making a good start. There is no doubt he will be a little nervous and even scared, for a while. But he'l settle down and become a mama's boy, just like my favourite old Saddlebred. While I've had a lot of different breeds over the years and do love my daughter's Gypsies, I have never known another breed which loves their humans, as much as the Saddlebreds.
> 
> Did I tell you how I came to get my favourite old boy? If not, I'll tell it again.For many years, I had been going to shows with Carol Smith-Shannon, who had some of THE best horses in the US at the time. I was looking for a Saddlebred and looked at several, including some spotted, which were fairly rare at the time. Didn't see anything I liked. Found an ad for a five gaited chestnut gelding, with a good show career behind him. I had a look at him. I loved everything about this horse, as did the friend I took with me. I even took a picture of him. But - and it was a big but, there was something wrong with the sellers. They didn't want to answer all my questions. Avoided questions and just plain refused to answer some. I came away, with the strange feeling, they didn't actually own him. He might even have been a stolen horse. There was something definitely wrong. So, I decided not to buy him. I kept his picture in my wallet for several years. Didn't find another horse I liked as much.
> 
> Then one day, I answered another ad. Strangely enough, the seller turned out to be the son of a friend of mine. I arranged to see the horse, who was at the LAEC. I think I cried when I saw the horse. Here was the boy I had wanted for so long and still carried his picture with me. I asked no questions, but knew it was meant to be and I think, so did the horse. As soon as I walked up to him, he was immediately, 'my' horse. Didn't want anything to do with the seller standing there, although I knew they had never mistreated him. Wierd eh?
> 
> I'll tell you another strange Saddlebred story one day. Maybe even more strange than this one.
> 
> Lizzie



AWWWWWW !!! Yes I know they grow on you so fast - these guys are SO personable - they just WANT to be your friend no matter what.. even though he tried to ram through the stall door yesterday trying to get to my mare LOL (nice try!), I had to swing the lead rope at him few times pretty hard to get him to settle down - he still comes back for attention and wants to be a friend.. I think that first bath and grooming did miracles already.. Here is a close up on his eyes.. He has almost human-like eyes!! I mean just really like a puppy dog!


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## MyBrandy

Lizzie - do you still have that saddlebred boy? I would love to see some photos


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## FeatheredFeet

What a 'knowing' eye. Secrets of long ago, passed down to him and taking in, all the new things which surround him.

I have only one pic on this computer of my old boy. It's in my album here. He's long gone now, unfortunately. I think he was maybe 17 or 20 in the pic. I know he was no younger than that.










Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

Oh gorgeous guy!!!!!!! Yea, I think once a person has owned a Saddlebred they will be always inclined towards them.. I really just kind of "stumbled into" owning my 1st. boy couple years ago.. Sad truth is that the general "horse public" is not aware of the many talents, beauty, grace and intelligence these horses possess....


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## FeatheredFeet

Thank you. Glad you like him. And chestnut is one of my least favourite colours. I really lean towards dark bay Saddlebreds.

Yes, I do wish more people would give the breed a go. I think they'd be surprised at just how versatile they are. I believe someone on this forum, has one that they use on cattle, all the time.

I wanted to buy Denmark's Aquarius for years. Even when he was old and broken down, the silly owner, who was a politician from Las Vegas, wanted $75,000 for him! There was nothing I ever saw as thrilling, as that little horse, racking around the ring at the end of the shows, with Royce Cates aboard. It pains me greatly still, that I never could own him. And he was yet another chestnut! 

Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

FeatheredFeet said:


> Thank you. Glad you like him. And chestnut is one of my least favourite colours. I really lean towards dark bay Saddlebreds.
> <---------- yes I am very much the same way.. I love bays when it comes to solid color (2nd. would be buckskin), not crazy about chestnut.. although my 1st. horse (Brandy) was a chestnut tobi grade mare, but she was very dark chestnut...
> 
> 
> Yes, I do wish more people would give the breed a go. I think they'd be surprised at just how versatile they are. I believe someone on this forum, has one that they use on cattle, all the time.
> <------- I was thinking how my other Saddlebred gelding would do on cattle.. He has tendency to chase small animals that come across his ways LOL.. I ride him both Western and English - and he does have a decent stop after practicing lots of rollbacks on the fence (I started seeing a cutting trainer with my cutting bred APHA filly - lot of fun!)
> 
> 
> I wanted to buy Denmark's Aquarius for years. Even when he was old and broken down, the silly owner, who was a politician from Las Vegas, wanted $75,000 for him! There was nothing I ever saw as thrilling, as that little horse, racking around the ring at the end of the shows, with Royce Cates aboard. It pains me greatly still, that I never could own him. And he was yet another chestnut!
> 
> <======== that is CRAZY!!!
> 
> Lizzie



Thank you. Glad you like him. And chestnut is one of my least favourite colours. I really lean towards dark bay Saddlebreds.
<---------- yes I am very much the same way.. I love bays when it comes to solid color (2nd. would be buckskin), not crazy about chestnut.. although my 1st. horse (Brandy) was a chestnut tobi grade mare, but she was very dark chestnut...


Yes, I do wish more people would give the breed a go. I think they'd be surprised at just how versatile they are. I believe someone on this forum, has one that they use on cattle, all the time.
<------- I was thinking how my other Saddlebred gelding would do on cattle.. He has tendency to chase small animals that come across his ways LOL.. I ride him both Western and English - and he does have a decent stop after practicing lots of rollbacks on the fence (I started seeing a cutting trainer with my cutting bred APHA filly - lot of fun!)


I wanted to buy Denmark's Aquarius for years. Even when he was old and broken down, the silly owner, who was a politician from Las Vegas, wanted $75,000 for him! There was nothing I ever saw as thrilling, as that little horse, racking around the ring at the end of the shows, with Royce Cates aboard. It pains me greatly still, that I never could own him. And he was yet another chestnut! 

<======== that is CRAZY!!!


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## MyBrandy

Ok we introduced the colt (we call him Hank) to my 5 year old saddlebred "Bruno". We took a video of it here: https://vimeo.com/70005365
(If the link doesn't work for you then please copy and paste it into your browser.) The new colt is the one who is "the rearing drama queen"


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## FeatheredFeet

Silly boy. They all look so lovely running about, but I notice food often makes him forget to act tough. And I'm incredibly envious of your gorgeous property. 

Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

FeatheredFeet said:


> Silly boy. They all look so lovely running about, but I notice food often makes him forget to act tough. And I'm incredibly envious of your gorgeous property.
> 
> Lizzie


LOL - yes it's very very pretty.. but very very mosquitoeeeeeee!!!!! Northern IL is just a bug heaven!  Would love to live out west.. like Colorado.. I visit there 2 x year for work and it's dry and sunny and very few bugs.. I love everything being so green around here, but the bugs and the humidity are a killer..


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## FeatheredFeet

When I lived in Tennessee, it was like that. Hot, humid and lots of buggy things. But I loved the green and trees. Reminded me a bit of home in England. I've been homesick for 50 years. 

Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

Oh wow.. 50 years eh?? I hope you visit the old country on regular basis 
BTW my husband took this picture - I really believe the colt's neck will be fixed with the correct training.. check this picture.. does he look ewe necked in it?? That is the way he should be carrying himself all the time and his neck will get built the right way  (He's the horse on the left in the picture - the bay and white on the right is "Bruno" my 5 year old ASB gelding.


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## FeatheredFeet

What a fab picture. You should have that for your avatar. 

As we've discussed before, once you get the boy under saddle and teach him to hold himself properly, his ewe neck will not be nearly so noticeable. 

No, I don't get to go home. However, I do have cousins who write to me. I have several friends with whom I'm still in touch, since we started school together, in about 1945!!! Some are now in different parts of the world, so it is fun to keep up with them.

Lizzie


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## ApolloRider

He's very pretty what height is he at now? I'm sure he will grow, My saddlebred just turned 5 and he went from 16.1- to 16-3 in just a few months!
I actually have no idea if thats a lot for a horse in that short of time, but standing next to him it makes a diff! =p


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## MyBrandy

"ApolloRider" - I haven't measured him, but his wither seems to be about the same height as my 5 yo Saddlebred gelding.. and he's 16HH! And yes he also grew between the ages 4 and 5.. This new colt is only 3 yo and is butt high and if you look at his knees and hocks they are very large - which gives me a hint he's definitely NOT done growing.. I have a feeling he will probably end up at 16.1 or 16.2 HH.. but what is most important now is that he gains a lot of weight - he is like big puppy that has not grown into his skeleton yet


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## FeatheredFeet

Actually, it is probably a good thing, that he's not carrying a ton of weight now, given his long bones and current height. Long, slow growth, is always better for animals who are tall or likely to be tall. 

Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

FeatheredFeet said:


> Actually, it is probably a good thing, that he's not carrying a ton of weight now, given his long bones and current height. Long, slow growth, is always better for animals who are tall or likely to be tall.
> 
> Lizzie



=== yes probably true.. I just want to get some healthy weight on him - his hip bones are sticking out like he's a goat 
- his spine is definitely peaking too.. he just looks like an overgrown baby


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## MyBrandy

Alright - so my farrier was here last night and we got to trim "Hank's" feet  I was so relieved - my farrier thinks the colt has very decent hooves - he cleaned really nicely! He did have to make a notch in one of the hooves because of the crack that he had a result of overgrown horn. He said it looked those feet did not see a rasp for probably a yeah


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## greentree

You may not be able to "cover " those hipbones.....some saddlebreds and TWH have BIG hipbones!

He is quite handsome. and his feet look WAY better!!

Best wishes!

Nancy


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## MyBrandy

greentree said:


> You may not be able to "cover " those hipbones.....some saddlebreds and TWH have BIG hipbones!
> 
> He is quite handsome. and his feet look WAY better!!
> 
> Best wishes!
> 
> Nancy



Oh yeah.. I have another one Nancy - and yes he's got bony butt  but this new fella just lacks flesh all over


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## MyBrandy

Hi guys, I wanted to follow up on this colt - we went through a turmoil of events since we got him 5 weeks ago..
We call him "Hank" - he mellowed out a lot since being gelded about 5-6 weeks ago, I gave him few weeks to adjust to his new home before starting to work with him, got his feet all trimmed up and gave him a lot of TLC and he cleaned up very well - he even gained some weight during that time . Now - during that time I also started slowly working with him on ground manners and little bit of round pen work. I wondered why he really did not want to canter for me in the round pen and if he did, he would always crossfire or break the gait back into trot.. I thought well he was really out of shape since nobody has done anything with him for the 3 years of his life - so I did not pay much attention to it and just really eased him into work in round pen - did not push him very hard. The weekend of July 27th. we did another round pen session but I noticed he really did not want to even trot much anymore let alone canter - I did not notice any lameness on that day - however the following day I noticed 1 of his hocks seemed swollen up and he was definitely sore in trot and in canter he too - both his hocks were kind of larger size back when we went to first look at him at the seller's property but I never thought much of it - because when we got him he was quite thin and tall and I thought he "just needs to grow into himself" he is young yet. I cold hosed his hocks for about 5 days last week - however by Friday last week I did not see any change in the hocks and he was still lame.. I called my vet and she came by Saturday morning and after $600 vet bill (Xrays were taken) she gave me pretty devastating news.... Hank has severe Osteochondritis dissecans (OCD) in both hocks..!!!!! She was showing me the bone fragments were loose in each hock on 2 places.. She said that basically he will never be sound for more than very light riding at most .. I am so bummed out about this.. this boy really started coming around and started growing on me and now these terrible news.. I have decided I will need to try to find him a new home - because I wanted to get sound horse that can definitely take more then "1-2 trail rides per year"... Who would have thought things would end this way?? (expensive one - I sunk $1500 into this colt in the past 2 months: purchase price - gelding him, transport, trims and the final glorious vet bill.." .. but I guess lesson learned: Don't skimp on pre-purchase vet exams".. I guess did not even think about it - as all my horses I've had before did not get one and I probably got lucky, but not with this one  He is a very sweet kiddo and if I had large acreage I would just let him be on pasture to enjoy his life till the end of his days.. but that is not the case.. So he will have to go  On the bright side of things I am glad we found out now and not 1-2 years later when I am really attached to him.....


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## Little Jane

Oh no! I am so sorry


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## FeatheredFeet

Oh dear, how very sad. Sad for the horse and devastating for you. Unusual to see it in Saddlebreds. Most of the time, we see this in Thoroughbreds and Quarter Horses, although all breeds can have it. Too bad you didn't get him as a baby, since caught early enough and with major changes in diet, it can be stopped. We see it a lot in Great Danes and other very large breeds. In dogs it is almost always caused by diet. ie. too much calcium and not enough quality, trace minerals.

You boy is past the age of control, unfortunately. Worse, that this has come at a time when so many healthy horses are seeking homes. I wonder if any of the Saddlebred rescues could give him pasture for life. It would be very difficult to place him in a home where you could be sure he would stay for ever and not passed on and become abused for not wanting to move. Be very careful what you decide upon for his future.

I am truly sorry to hear this. Like many here, I was looking forward to seeing you both progressing.

Lizzie


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## MyBrandy

Thanks guys.. yes pretty devastating news.. He is currently on stall rest with hand walking.. He can go in the round pen for turnout but it rained last night and it's kinda slick there... also he gets excited and wants to prance around or play "charge" at my other gelding over the fence... so he is inside by himself today.. He is on Bute 1gram per day for 5 days, if he doesn't get better we can go to every other day for 10 days.. if he is still lame (he can walk but lame in trot and hopping on 3 legs in canter now!) in 10 days, the vet said I should consider putting him down.. it just depends if he gets better if the swelling is acute now..


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## barrelbeginner

OH my I'm so sorry to hear about this.. Hope he starts to get better


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## Inga

I am very sorry to hear this news. I too wonder if a rescue might have a place for him. He is such a handsome boy. Maybe he could be a lead line pony for someone? It seems especially sad that this horse finally finds himself a home where the person cares about him and takes care of his needs (that were neglected in the past) and he has this wrong with him. So sad. I wish you the best and hope that Hank can find a happy place to live out his days in comfort.


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## MyBrandy

Hi guys, just an update, I had a lady from a saddleseat training barn come by (actually like 5 people from that barn came with her)  They loved him and they would like to show him in "model" classes (kinda like English - in hand), he is very handsome and I think he would be perfect.. doesn't require strenuous work and he would still have some kind of a career . He is going to the new home of Sunday - I will be delivering him and will be checking the place out. I did Google about the trainer and did "view" the facility online too.. The trainer said it would be her personal horse. They don't have any horses they are offering for sale on their website or their FB page...  So that is good, I don't think it's a resale barn at all....Although I am not naive enough to think he it will be a "forever home" - its a pretty good shot he's got at some quality life.. I may be even able to see him in the local shows or even visit when in their area (about 1 hour away driving).. If it all works out then both Hank and I will be happier about the whole situation


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