# What on Earth is wrong with this horse?!



## myhorsesonador (Jun 21, 2009)

The hair loss is probably from the mud. :/


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

She started losing the hair when she was stabled..Sorry forgot to mention that.


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## myhorsesonador (Jun 21, 2009)

oh ok. have you had a vet out? If not I think it would be a good idea to get one out ASAP! Maybe she has a fungus or some thing? Does her stall have shavings or straw or????? How clean was the bedding?


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Also she has been in mud for the past 3 months. The horses hay is placed where it is extremely muddy! I mean like the mud goes up to my knees and very easy to get stuck! Could she have pulled a muscle or something..But would that last a month...Hmmm

The vet came and never even told me how she could have did it..

But like I do not get how it can happen to both legs in the same place...One gets better then the other goes bad like straight after..Does that mean it is not something serious? Because how could the exact same thing happen..Wouldn't she not be able to walk...Ahh I am going crazy.. XD

Sorry didn't see your post XD

She had shavings as her bedding. It was cleaned out everyday so I would say it was clean enough. 

Once I put her out it got way worse. ( The hair falling out not the lameness) The lameness has stayed the same not matter if she is out or in. It has gone away then come back a few times.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Is the skin rough and scabby where there is no hair?

I do not remember the lameness history. What did the vet say it was?

If she is standing in that much mud I would guess she has thrush and that can cause lameness.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Hmm but would thrush cause a swollen fetlock and heat there? 

The vet just came and flexed her joints..He never said one thing about how she could have damaged herself..

I totally forgot to say I checked if she was lame today. Not a sign of it at all. So I was told to lunge her. I lunged her going both ways a few times and still not sign of being lame. After I lunged her I felt her leg and the heat was gone...I then hosed all of her legs and the heat came back. 

When I put her back into the field she trotted off and was lame again =/ 

The skin is rough but I don't think it is scabby. I will check tomorrow. When someone tried to touch it she attempted to kick so I guess it hurts.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Things like Scratches can hurt.

There can be more than one thing wrong here. One thing can be causing the lameness issue and another can be causing the skin issue.


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## Zimpatico (Nov 5, 2010)

If the balding and the lameness are NOT related, have you thought about Lyme's disease? I've seen several horses experience unexplained lameness, seemingly moving to different parts of their body from Lyme's...


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Yep I would say so...But does heat always mean lameness? Because there is heat where there is no hair but she is not lame there.

She is being very aggressive lately..She actually got really angry at people walking past her. She pinned her ears back and attempted to bite. Would you say it is just the pain in her leg or is she just being a cow...Like I said before she has only started biting this past month and would never be so mean to people..


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Never thought about that..I have no idea what it is XD


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

Viewing the photos - there also appears to be edema where the hair is missing. 

Has she been checked for cellulitis?


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## Zimpatico (Nov 5, 2010)

My first thoughts would be a fungus from the mud that is causing the hair loss, and some type of virus/infection/lymes causing the odd lameness... Sorry I can't offer any other help, but good luck!!


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Just a FYI (for the people who might be Googling it), there is no S on the end of Lyme. It is Lyme disease not Lymes.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

I know it could be the mud causing the hair loss but like I said she started losing it after she had been in a stable for about a week. 

That is just mud on her legs where the hair is gone. I didn't want to scrub it off in case it hurt.

But no she was not checked for cellulitis.

Can horses get lime disease anywhere in the world? I just read about it and it seems to only affect certain parts? 

I will more than likely get the vet on Wednesday if it does not improve or gets worse.

Hopefully it is just an infection or something so it would not be that serious?


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## Zimpatico (Nov 5, 2010)

Interesting, it looks like its fairly new to Ireland... Ticked off by danger of Lyme disease - The Irish Times - Tue, Jun 15, 2010 

I'd definately talk to your vet. I'm not sure what types of common threats you have across the pond...


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

If she has lyme disease won't other horses there have it too? She is in a field with 20 other horses. I know she hangs out with two of those horses the whole time and they seem fine so far. 

Can other infections cause lameness?


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Yes, infections can cause lameness.

Lyme disease does not spread from horse to horse. Not every horse has to get it.


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## sarahver (Apr 9, 2010)

Could be mud fever or a fungal infection. Whilst these types of things often start on the surface, any small cut or abrasion can allow it to penetrate the surface of the skin. With mud fever, the skin will often crack thus providing a point of entry for bacteria and other nasties. If left untreated some infections can enter the bloodstream and become systemic, something you will need a vet to check out.


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## Horse Poor (Aug 20, 2008)

I think you may have 2 issues going on and both of them stem from the mud. I think she may have a skin infection and may also be dealing with bruising. I agree with sarahver. I also would ask the vet about dosing her with some Dexamethasone (Azium) for the swelling in her legs and skin irritation…she may or may not have an infection, but she certainly seems to be having a negative reaction to something in her environment. Perhaps it is the combination of both mud and the type of shavings in her stall. Mud and water will cause the hoof to soften, the photos show her standing on very rocky soil, soft hooves and hard rocks = bruising. Personally, I'd call the vet and tell him your concerns about her having a skin infection and then I'd have the farrier out to check for bruising and thrush. 

Good luck with your girl!


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## equiniphile (Aug 16, 2009)

There was a good article on scratches in one of my magazines, Lola's leg looks a lot like it.


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## mswp27 (Nov 6, 2009)

Lyme disease is associated with lameness and behavioral changes (most common symptoms). The horse gets Lyme disease through the bite of a tick, which are usually spotted during grooming. These ticks are most likely to feed on horses in late fall and early spring. The horse may also be generally stiff, but I don't know if your horse is. The majority of these symptoms seem to fit your horse from the information I've gotten from this thread. Lyme disease can be treated with antibiotics in a few different ways and the horse typically starts responding to the treatment within 2-5 days. 

Hope this helps! I wish the best of luck to you and your girl!!


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Thanks everyone! I will suggest lyme disease to my trainer and she what she says.

She will not need to be isolated if she has it will she? 

At least if she has that she will get better quick enough.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Sarahandlola said:


> At least if she has that she will get better quick enough.


Not always. Treating lyme can be a long road.

I would not jump on the lyme thing. It could be lyme, it could be lots of things.

It seems like the best thing to do is find a GOOD vet and work through this and determine what is going on.


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## Zimpatico (Nov 5, 2010)

Alwaysbehind said:


> It seems like the best thing to do is find a GOOD vet and work through this and determine what is going on.


^ This...


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## mswp27 (Nov 6, 2009)

I agree. I would definitely work with a vet.


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## horsplay (Jan 25, 2011)

You said something about having the vet out tomorrow, weather the same vet or a different vet I would make a list. Make a list of all the things you have noticed and want answers about and write a list of specific questions you have for the vet, this will help youremember everything you wanted to ask when the vet is there. I know I always space 50% of my questions when the vet is acctually there then remember them once the vet has left.


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## faye (Oct 13, 2010)

Personaly looks like mudfever or cellulitis to me.

The bacteria has gotten under her skin and is now causeing the hair loss.

Get the vet!


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

I'm fairly confident in telling you it is scratches, a.k.a. mud fever (greased heel). My horse has a case of this right now. It is caused by bacteria that enters skin that is broken down from too much moisture/mud. Usually the bacteria is Staph. 

Symptoms are: Rough, scaly skin. Scabby areas, patches of hair loss. Swelling in the lower leg/pastern area. Heat around the pasterns and lower legs. Can cause lameness.

Treatment: Wash the lower legs once daily and allow to dry completely. Ideally, apply medicated shampoo or spray. I'm not sure what you have over there to treat bacterial infections. Over here we have a variety of products at the feed stores. 

Prevention: Brush mud off or wash horse's legs daily and allow the skin to have a period of dryness.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

I got her a medicated shampoo yesterday. It is for bacteria and fungus so it should help. I asked the person who I bought it off could what she has cause lameness and she said yes. Then I asked my trainer and she said no! 

So can it? I think maybe it could..It could have cause the swelling and heat and obviously it in uncomfortable. And since she does not get any worse if she is worked or outside it would not be muscles, bones or tendons would it? 

I put her in an area of the field that has no mud..Hopefully she stays in there because she likes to break out =/


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## faye (Oct 13, 2010)

lameness can be caused by mudfever. Any swelling or heat will make thing uncofortable and some horses are complete wusses and go lame!

Eg my arab came in one day on 3 legs, I honestly thought he had broken his leg, I examined his leg from shoulder to toe and depth so I could let the vet know what I felt! and you know what I found! a 1 inch nick on the side of his knee, it had barely broken the skin, some aloevera and a small dressing later and miraculously he was sound!
On the otherhand stan had an abcess burst out through his coronet band and the only sign was the puss oozing out! he was a big bruiser of a pony who NEVER showed when he was in pain!

Mud fever can present with no visable cuts etc, horses with very little feather and thin skin are most prone to it. It can also lead to cellulitis


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## sarahver (Apr 9, 2010)

Sarahandlola said:


> I got her a medicated shampoo yesterday. It is for bacteria and fungus so it should help. I asked the person who I bought it off could what she has cause lameness and she said yes. Then I asked my trainer and she said no!
> 
> So can it? I think maybe it could..It could have cause the swelling and heat and obviously it in uncomfortable. And since she does not get any worse if she is worked or outside it would not be muscles, bones or tendons would it?
> 
> I put her in an area of the field that has no mud..Hopefully she stays in there because she likes to break out =/


Yes it can cause lameness, especially if it is bad enough. Also I mentioned in my first post that if it enters circulation and you have a systemic infection that you will have a rather more dire situation on your hands.

So I find it a little concerning that you asked the person that you bought shampoo off, your trainer, us on the interwebz but have not consulted a vet since the first diagnosis which didn't help at all.

Even give your vet a phone call, they don't charge for it and most don't mind giving advice over the phone. It would be preferable of course that you have him take a look.


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

sarahver said:


> Yes it can cause lameness, especially if it is bad enough. Also I mentioned in my first post that if it enters circulation and you have a systemic infection that you will have a rather more dire situation on your hands.
> 
> So I find it a little concerning that you asked the person that you bought shampoo off, your trainer, us on the interwebz but have not consulted a vet since the first diagnosis which didn't help at all.
> 
> Even give your vet a phone call, they don't charge for it and most don't mind giving advice over the phone. It would be preferable of course that you have him take a look.


I agree. The edema impeds the natural flexion of the joint. It will cause the stride to be noticeably different.

You need a vet to determine what it is. There are several different possiblities - all with different preferred treatments.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

mls said:


> You need a vet to determine what it is. There are several different possiblities - all with different preferred treatments.


This. Totally!

Stop guessing and asking people who do not know.

Find a good vet and have them look at the horse.

Isn't the long term well being of your horse worth a vet charge?


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## mls (Nov 28, 2006)

Alwaysbehind said:


> Isn't the long term well being of your horse worth a vet charge?


Especially if it is a cellulitis issue. There are some things you absolutely do NOT do if it is cellulitis versus scratches. Or if it is Lyme or another auto immune disorder.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

I am talking to a vet via email...

I have absolutely no problems getting a vet out. I already had one out. 

Oh I have one more question..Can a horse have mud fever without it showing up for a few weeks? Like she went lame 5 weeks ago. The mud fever only started showing 2 weeks ago. And I mean showing in the way of hair loss. I found scabs today. 

I had the vet 2 weeks ago. Like I said he did not have a clue what was wrong with her apart from it was her fetlock that was swelling and had heat. I am talking to a different vet right now so I will see what he says.


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## ~*~anebel~*~ (Aug 21, 2008)

Get a vet out TODAY.

It's a very long story and was compounded by another medical condition but I know of a horse who is now in the ground because of a similar looking ailment.

What is the whole history here?
The horse was lame - put on stall rest and then began to lose the hair on the lame leg - now two legs are losing hair and three are hot?
This is what I have gathered.. Now I am NOT a vet, and you should have a vet confirm this but this is what I would guess it is.

It is most likely an infection, cellulitis, which is being compounded by the mud and lack of treatment. If left untreated it is likely that the infection will spread to all four legs and the infection will then travel up the legs, bringing the hair loss with it. Eventually the infection will seep into the blood stream, at which point the horse will go septic and die.
While it is important to keep the horse moving to remove the adema from the legs, in that mud it is just useless. What I would do for treatment is as follows:
First of all, take vitals. Temperature, heart rate and resting respiratory. Report these to the vet.
Then I would bring the horse inside and thouroughly clean the legs with plenty of water and a chlorhexidine scrub (the pink stuff







).
I would towel dry the legs as thouroughly as possible without causing disconfort or breaking the skin.
Then, depending on the vets instructions and the vital signs I would proceed with treatment. An elevated temperature will most likely be present if it is cellulitis so I would start on antibiotics and in any case I would reduce inflamation with oral bute or banamine.
I would also keep the horse only in a clean environment. If this means the horse needs to be in a stall then so-be-it. A wrap is not going to keep that mud out and if the horse is already lame, swollen and unconfortable it's not going to move around that much in the mud anyways. I would try to handwalk the horse on a clean surface as much as possible.
Do not sweat (DMSO wrap) out the inflammation. There is broken skin and a potential infection.

Now, if it is mud fever I would do everything exactly the same and add in a topical anti fungal/anti bacterial.

This is acting agressively and needs agressive treatment. If it were me I might even be inclined to trailer the horse to the vet clinic where he could have acute care and monitoring.

Good luck!


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

~*~anebel~*~ said:


> Get a vet out TODAY.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


She went lame 5 weeks ago. She was put in a stable about a week after she went lame. She has been in and out of the stable for the last 5 weeks. She actually began to lose hair on one of the back legs. Then on the leg that was lame and then on the other back leg. On the front leg that has just gone lame a few days ago there is only a tiny patch of hair gone. I found the scab on that leg and picked it off. It is the only scab I have found. All four legs were hot on and off for the past few days.

Does Cellulitis only happen if there is an open cut or can it happen at any time? There has been no open cuts until today ( When I picked the scab off ) And that was cleaned with the anti bacterial/ anti fungal shampoo. Since I have been using the shampoo ( 2 days today ) the heat in her legs has gone down a lot. There is pretty much only a tiny bit of heat in her back legs. Also her legs are not getting any worse and there has not been any more hair loss since it first starting happening.

She is also getting a mud block on her leg to help protect them more.

There is another pony who legs came out red raw. I mean like they were terrible, scabby, red and burnt looking. Now they are perfect after four days! And all that was done was them getting hosed down. Nothing was put on them...And they were a lot worse than Lola's. Hers is pretty much just skin which is a bit rough looking. I will get more pictures tomorrow since her legs are now clean it might look a bit better.

I also forgot to say the swelling is totally gone from her front legs but she is still lame =/ She doesn't look lame in her stepping but her head is bobbing a lot more than usual so I dunno...


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## faye (Oct 13, 2010)

cellulitis can happen with no cuts or abraisions


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Ok thanks. I am just waiting for the vet to reply which is not gonna happen now since it is nearly midnight XD


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Sarahandlola said:


> I know it could be the mud causing the hair loss but like I said she started losing it after she had been in a stable for about a week.
> 
> That is just mud on her legs where the hair is gone. I didn't want to scrub it off in case it hurt.
> 
> ...


The hair loss probably showed up after it got some air. I couldn't imagine leaving a horse in deep mud for 3 months


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

I think everyone is giving good advice but I wouldn't be terribly concerned as long as your horse is improving. Around here it is a common problem because of our weather and probably one horse out of twenty has it at any given time (in the winter). If it is treated it usually is fairly easy to get rid of. The only time I had a vet help out in treating it was on a rescue horse with a low immune system and we couldn't resolve it easily. Actually even the vet could not resolve that case for quite some time. 

Cellulitis is a word that simply means a bacterial skin infection. It could caused by any bacteria and be anywhere on a horse's (or human's) body. Just like with people, there is always a possibility of any infection entering the bloodstream and causing sepsis. But it would be a rare occurrence and would be more likely in a sick or old horse. Staph is usually the culprit since it is present normally on a horse's skin so enters easily into any abrasion. There has to be a break in the skin (even too tiny to see) for the bacteria to cause an infection. This is the same as in humans, and although people often can't remember getting a cut or scrape, doctors know that they had to have at least a tiny open area in order for the bacteria to enter through the skin's barrier and cause cellulitis.

Your horse should obviously improve over the course of a week. If the infection does not appear to improve or begins to look worse, then I would have the vet out right away. The reason more than one leg is infected is not because it is spreading, but because different legs separately had an area of breakdown that allowed the bacteria to enter. This is common and my horse I'm treating right now has three legs affected. Two are still swollen slightly after three days of treatment and feel warm but the heat has lessened considerably, the swelling has lessened considerably, and the scabby areas are smaller. All I'm doing is keeping the legs clean and dry and using a medicated shampoo once a day (antibacterial).


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## justjump (Jan 18, 2011)

I know of a horse that blew a tendon, and ha all those symptoms besides the hair loss. Im not a professional or even know much for that matter, but he also had heat in his front leg, and would switch to the other. Call a vet and get it checked out?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

churumbeque said:


> The hair loss probably showed up after it got some air. I couldn't imagine leaving a horse in deep mud for 3 months


I have no say in were she can stay. She was standing in mud for three months because that is where her hay was. I cannot just go up and tell them to move it and I could not move Lola unless I wanted her to starve.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

gottatrot said:


> I think everyone is giving good advice but I wouldn't be terribly concerned as long as your horse is improving. Around here it is a common problem because of our weather and probably one horse out of twenty has it at any given time (in the winter). If it is treated it usually is fairly easy to get rid of. The only time I had a vet help out in treating it was on a rescue horse with a low immune system and we couldn't resolve it easily. Actually even the vet could not resolve that case for quite some time.
> 
> Cellulitis is a word that simply means a bacterial skin infection. It could caused by any bacteria and be anywhere on a horse's (or human's) body. Just like with people, there is always a possibility of any infection entering the bloodstream and causing sepsis. But it would be a rare occurrence and would be more likely in a sick or old horse. Staph is usually the culprit since it is present normally on a horse's skin so enters easily into any abrasion. There has to be a break in the skin (even too tiny to see) for the bacteria to cause an infection. This is the same as in humans, and although people often can't remember getting a cut or scrape, doctors know that they had to have at least a tiny open area in order for the bacteria to enter through the skin's barrier and cause cellulitis.
> 
> Your horse should obviously improve over the course of a week. If the infection does not appear to improve or begins to look worse, then I would have the vet out right away. The reason more than one leg is infected is not because it is spreading, but because different legs separately had an area of breakdown that allowed the bacteria to enter. This is common and my horse I'm treating right now has three legs affected. Two are still swollen slightly after three days of treatment and feel warm but the heat has lessened considerably, the swelling has lessened considerably, and the scabby areas are smaller. All I'm doing is keeping the legs clean and dry and using a medicated shampoo once a day (antibacterial).


Thank you for this! I was getting so worried she was going to die from mud fever! I was thinking if it was so serious I would have been told by the plenty of people who have seen her.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Sarahandlola said:


> I have no say in were she can stay. She was standing in mud for three months because that is where her hay was. I cannot just go up and tell them to move it and I could not move Lola unless I wanted her to starve.


Then I would find another place to keep my horse.


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## horsplay (Jan 25, 2011)

If they are feeding her in the mud they are cruel..... I always find a semi-dry or at least semi-solid place to feed if I can. I am sorry but I find it mean to force a horse to eat in knee deep mud if there is some place else that is dry or at least semi-sold ground. Was there a dry spot they could have fed in?


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

It was dry to start with. But with 20 horses gathering around two bales of hay everyday made it very muddy. One of the bales was moved a few days ago. 

I moved Lola into a different part of the field. It is a small area with about 6 horses in it. There is no hay in there at the moment so she is getting very little to eat. But it has to be done. When they do put hay in there again I am pretty sure it will get muddy. There is already mud around the hay thing but it is dry and the horses are eating the grass..


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

New pictures..These were taken after I washed her legs that is why they are wet...

Back legs..










That thing in the middle is hair not scabs or anything










Front leg that went lame first



















Other front leg with scab pulled off. Only scab found.










Back leg










The skin is now fairly smooth. It is still kinda hot but not as much as before. Still lame =/ All swelling is gone though.


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## Astrid01 (Mar 4, 2011)

That sounds like an inflammation of the Phalanx.
The inflammation in there cause the hair loss and the cooling down with water causes also the new heat.
If you are cooling down an inflammation with water you will increase the blood flow through the blood vessels that causes a new swelling, heat and pain.
If you work your horse it increases also the blood flow but also the circulation of the water in the swollen area So the swelling can be reduced.
Please let the Vet come again and get some X-rays.
So you can find out what causes the pain and do something about it.
And force the Vet to give you an answer.

I the horse was not aggressive before she has had the inflammation than you can be sure it is because of the pain.
You have to imagine how it would be for you to have constantly pain.
Would you be calm and friendly?





Sarahandlola said:


> Yep I would say so...But does heat always mean lameness? Because there is heat where there is no hair but she is not lame there.
> 
> She is being very aggressive lately..She actually got really angry at people walking past her. She pinned her ears back and attempted to bite. Would you say it is just the pain in her leg or is she just being a cow...Like I said before she has only started biting this past month and would never be so mean to people..


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## sarahver (Apr 9, 2010)

Sarahandlola said:


> Thank you for this! I was getting so worried she was going to die from mud fever! I was thinking if it was so serious I would have been told by the plenty of people who have seen her.


I was not suggesting that she would die, I was just concerned about the sources of information you are relying on, since they are not vets.

I was actually just genuinely concerned, even the most benign seeming conditions can become serious and I just wanted to impress that upon you. Doesn't hurt to get the vet out (apart from your hip pocket, but hey it's part and parcel of horse ownership) but sometimes it DOES hurt to delay veterinary attention.

Anyway, I'm done, hope all goes well.


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## Astrid01 (Mar 4, 2011)

QUOTE=sarahver;949734]I was not suggesting that she would die, I was just concerned about the sources of information you are relying on, since they are not vets.

I was actually just genuinely concerned, even the most benign seeming conditions can become serious and I just wanted to impress that upon you. Doesn't hurt to get the vet out (apart from your hip pocket, but hey it's part and parcel of horse ownership) but sometimes it DOES hurt to delay veterinary attention.

Anyway, I'm done, hope all goes well.[/QUOTE]


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## Astrid01 (Mar 4, 2011)

Thak zou for that advice !!!!:lol:



Astrid01 said:


> QUOTE=sarahver;949734]I was not suggesting that she would die, I was just concerned about the sources of information you are relying on, since they are not vets.
> 
> I was actually just genuinely concerned, even the most benign seeming conditions can become serious and I just wanted to impress that upon you. Doesn't hurt to get the vet out (apart from your hip pocket, but hey it's part and parcel of horse ownership) but sometimes it DOES hurt to delay veterinary attention.
> 
> Anyway, I'm done, hope all goes well.


[/QUOTE]


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## Astrid01 (Mar 4, 2011)

Sorry my Keyboard is not working well
I mean thank you for the advice !!! 


Astrid01 said:


> Thak zou for that advice !!!!:lol:


[/QUOTE]


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## sarahver (Apr 9, 2010)

Astrid01 said:


> Sorry my Keyboard is not working well
> I mean thank you for the advice !!!


[/QUOTE]

I was wondering what you were getting at! :wink:


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

sarahver said:


> I was not suggesting that she would die, I was just concerned about the sources of information you are relying on, since they are not vets.
> 
> I was actually just genuinely concerned, even the most benign seeming conditions can become serious and I just wanted to impress that upon you. Doesn't hurt to get the vet out (apart from your hip pocket, but hey it's part and parcel of horse ownership) but sometimes *it DOES hurt to delay veterinary attention.*


(bolding mine)

I totally agree.

Please just make an appointment with a good vet. Not email them questions. Have them out to actually see and touch the horse.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

The vet said he would contact me so I am waiting until he does. He is probably busy. 

It is just a lot of the school horses/ponies get mud fever and they are never treated for it. They turn out just fine.

She is still as moody as ever! She actually attempted to kick a dog today =/ She is getting worse with her moodiness...If she starts doing to people I dunno what to do!


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Sarahandlola said:


> It was dry to start with. But with 20 horses gathering around two bales of hay everyday made it very muddy. One of the bales was moved a few days ago.
> 
> I moved Lola into a different part of the field. It is a small area with about 6 horses in it. There is no hay in there at the moment so she is getting very little to eat. But it has to be done. When they do put hay in there again I am pretty sure it will get muddy. There is already mud around the hay thing but it is dry and the horses are eating the grass..


2 bales of hay for 20 horses?


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Yes they last about a week.


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## ~*~anebel~*~ (Aug 21, 2008)

Please for the sake of you horse get a vet in the flesh out to your property to do an exam on the horse.
That's nice that other people's horses are neglected and they are "just fine". This is your horse.
Your horse did not ask you to be turned out in deep mud and neglected when she is obviously in pain and possibly in serious trouble.
She can't tell you how badly it hurts, this is why it is your responsibility as a horse owner to CALL A VET and physically get them out to see your horse.

And please stop picking scabs until a VET tells you to do so. You should not EVER pick scabs which bleed. If it is an infection, you are just making it worse. And even so - if it is not now, you are providing a direct route for bacteria from the feces and urine in the mud to get into your horse's blood stream and give her an infection.


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

Sarahandlola said:


> The vet said he would contact me so I am waiting until he does. He is probably busy.


Call him again, he is probably assuming you don't need him anymore.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Ok number one I am not neglecting my horse! I am getting a lot of help from people who know what they are talking about.

And number two I am pretty sure you do pick the scabs. Obviously they are gonna bleed if you pick them. 

I will call the vet tomorrow if he doesn't ring before then.


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

You first posted about your horse being lame on 2/9, since then you had a vet who had no idea what is wrong, and the problem is getting worse. There is nothing that the internet can do to help, your horse needs to see a vet and you need to make that happen.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

I never said she was getting worse? 

She has mud fever..Big deal. Horses get it the whole time without seeing vets. 

And she is lame...Which is not bad lameness. She has never gotten worse since it first happened and she has been out most of the time. So I know it is nothing serious and so do a lot more people who have a lot of experience with horses, lameness, mud fever etc.


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## ~*~anebel~*~ (Aug 21, 2008)

OP - you don't even know if it IS mud fever!!! You have not taken a temp and therefore cannot verify that the horse does not have a serious infection!!
There are things other than mud fever which cause lameness, hair loss and swelling! 
Also - mud fever "scabs" are not actually scabs in the traditional sense and will not bleed if you pick them. If you are picking a scab and it is bleeding you are inhibiting the healing process and providing an easy access freeway for bacteria into your horse's bloodstream.


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

Sarahandlola said:


> I never said she was getting worse?
> 
> She has mud fever..Big deal. Horses get it the whole time without seeing vets.
> 
> And she is lame...Which is not bad lameness. She has never gotten worse since it first happened and she has been out most of the time. So I know it is nothing serious and so do a lot more people who have a lot of experience with horses, lameness, mud fever etc.



Well then stop posting updates and pictures, if you don't care and don't think it's a big deal, I don't see why we should have to worry about it.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

I have been told it is mud fever by people who know and see mud fever the whole time. I am sorry I picked the scab..I have read so many topics in here that you have to pick the scabs if it is mud fever or rain rot. Anyways it did not actually bleed it was just red.

I am getting a vet out to see her. There is nothing more I want than for her to be better.

And I think I said before the swelling is gone and no more hair has been lost since it first started happening.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

I am posting updates and pictures for people who actually want to help not criticize every little thing I say or do 

I also never said I did not care so you do not have to put words in my mouth.


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## lacyloo (Jul 1, 2008)

I don't believe anyone was being rude or criticizing. You asked a question and got an answer.
_*We are NOT vets*_

Anyways, are you sure there is nowhere else you can move your horse to? I understand being in mud for a few weeks, my two have been there but for a week at the most. I KNOW how quickly a dry lot can turn to mush.

3 months is a long time IMHO, the mud must be full of bacteria from the urine and feces and the horses are having to stand in it and eat off the ground? I'm actually surprised she doesn't have anymore hairless or infected areas. If there is absolutely no where you can move her to, then defiantly wash her in an antibacterial scrub every few days.
Goodluck


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

I stopped reading after page 3 so I'm sorry if I've missed anything. I know there has been mention of the vet, did the vet actually come out or did you talk on the phone? What did the vet say? I don't understand the vag seen ness (sorry about spelling). I've some folks mention cellulitis, which it could be if there is any puncture in the skin, even a minute one but I would think if it were cellulitis it would have gotten progressively worse. I'm leaning more towards scratches but I'm not a vet. It's not goign to go away by just switching pastures. You need to scrub and treat. Are you at a barn where you have trainers and knowledgeable folks or are you at your house?


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

I always have to go back and check which country people are from when they say they are waiting for the vet to contact them because I'm not used to that. When I call the vet I only wait about 10 minutes for a call back. It may take an hour or two for them to get out (maybe a day if they feel it can wait after we've spoken). I'm not used to waiting days for a call back.

If it is scratches it does need to be treated. You can scrub it really well with a betadine solution twice a day and you can even put DMSO on it. BUT if it's not scratches, you may not be doing any good. Do you know how to check a temp? You should check her temp daily to ensure she's not running a fever. She may need antibiotics. Minor things like this, left untreated, can become serious, so while you may feel it's not a big deal, just be aware that it could be.

Good luck.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Thank you. I am at a yard with other people who pretty much deal with horses and their problems everyday.

The vet is coming on wednesday because Now she is missing a patch of hair over her hock on her back leg. It is red and swollen looking. It looks kinda like a big red blister. Like I said a few pages back another pony has horrible red marks with hair loss. Lola's looks the same as that. But her fetlock areas are still just skin. I found a few more scabs. 

I have been treating it for mud fever but of course it could be something else. Hopefully something related to the lameness so I can get that sorted too =/


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Glad you are having the vet out.

I can not imagine going a month not knowing what is causing an lameness issue.


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## BarnQueen (Mar 7, 2011)

Let us know what it is - it does look somewhat like Scratches to me - some one already mentioned that, but we did have a horse at our barn that had pretty much what you are describing. The horse was lame, on & off, unhappy, and similar markings to your horses problem. 

There was no scabs on the horse I am talking about either, but since it was a leopard appy, those spots where pinkish read and the legs looked stocked up and where hot on and off. 

I hope you figure it out... your poor horse must be uncomfortable! Mud is really like a bad enemy when it comes to this!


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Sigh..The other vet does not know either =/ She does have mud fever which is clearing up. The heat is gone from it. But there is not heat or swelling etc in the lame leg so they reckon it is not serious..There is a neuromuscular man coming out tomorrow to see if it is her back or something else.


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## keepa (Mar 4, 2011)

i think i would get another vet that can give you some answers. chiropractor, or massage may find sore spots, teeth are good? Hooves dont smell rotten? shoes or barefoot? maybe the swelling is from the hair loss problem, could try clipping all hair off legs and rub in any vitamin a or sorbolene cream. Best of luck...


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

What type of testing have the vets done to determine what is causing the lameness?

X-rays? Ultrasound?


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## HopalongCassidy (Dec 19, 2010)

Just to say TWO VETS not knowing what’s wrong. I don't think so. If you’re getting some wannabe vet that has no licenses to be a vet.... well don't use them. But a licensed vet will now what the problem is. Tell you the truth. I'm not sure you got a vet out. I can't see how TWO would not know what’s wrong. There’s no way. I'm not calling you a liar or anything else but I’m getting kinda skeptical about you and your vets. If my horse was doing this for the past how long two weeks I'd take him to a vet PERSONALLY. Also I wouldn’t pick the scabs. To me you’re not even putting anything on the scabs after you pick them. You should try getting some Wound-Kote. Comes in a blue can and is purple when you spray it on. Or you can get Hoof Alive. That works to. 

This is what you said. Sounds to me you don’t need our help?????? 

Quote:

I never said she was getting worse? 

She has mud fever..Big deal. Horses get it the whole time without seeing vets. 

“And she is lame...Which is not bad lameness. She has never gotten worse since it first happened and she has been out most of the time. So I know it is nothing serious and so do a lot more people who have a lot of experience with horses, lameness, mud fever ect.”

So you have the problem sorted out good. You THINK you know what it is so you THINK it’s no biggy. Well I’d really hate to be your horse. Kinda sounds like you don’t even care. I just hope she gets better. Good Luck and Bye.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

I am just gonna ignore the stupid people =/ 

But Wooohooo I am so happy! We have finally found the problem! It is a torn ligament at the top of her leg! And guess what...It was not a vet who diagnosed it and those two vets were totally looking in the wrong area! Stupid vets...

So now I have to keep her in for a few days on bute and rub methylated Spirits all over her leg and shoulder then stretch her leg and massage it etc. She should be better in a week or two.! You will not believe how happy I am about this =D Even though it is a bad enough injury the man said she will be perfect after =D So glad to finally know what is wrong..!

And her mud fever is clearing too so it is all good =D


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Alwaysbehind said:


> What type of testing have the vets done to determine what is causing the lameness?
> 
> X-rays? Ultrasound?



Sorry I forgot to answer they just felt her leg and trotted her. They said they could not find the problem and if she was not better in whatever amount of time she should get an X Ray

Sorry first vet said it was her fetlock and the second didn't know


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

Sarahandlola said:


> It is a torn ligament at the top of her leg!
> 
> ......
> She should be better in a week or two.!


:? Not sure about the couple of weeks healing time.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Sarahandlola said:


> I am just gonna ignore the stupid people =/
> 
> But Wooohooo I am so happy! We have finally found the problem! It is a torn ligament at the top of her leg! And guess what...It was not a vet who diagnosed it and those two vets were totally looking in the wrong area! Stupid vets...
> 
> So now I have to keep her in for a few days on bute and rub methylated Spirits all over her leg and shoulder then stretch her leg and massage it etc. She should be better in a week or two.! You will not believe how happy I am about this =D Even though it is a bad enough injury the man said she will be perfect after =D So glad to finally know what is wrong..!


Having dealt with more than my fair share of torn ligaments you were either given very poor advice or this is something you made up.

How did a none vet diagnose this?

If you are not willing to pay the vet for doing diagnostics they have a hard time telling what is going on inside.

When my horse was lame last time and the farrier determined it was not an abscess I did not let the vet walk away with a 'do not know'. When hands on did not determine the issue we moved to other things. In the end X-rays proved what it was not so we moved to an ultrasound to determine what it was.




AlexS said:


> :???: Not sure about the couple of weeks healing time.


Exactly!


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

I have never met a vet who says 'I do not know' and walked away. They are in the business of helping and they want to earn money. 
Of course they don't know everything and there are times that they cannot tell what is going on with a horse, but the majority would offer xrays, ultra sounds or anything else that would be needed. 

The only time I could imagine them walking away like that would be if the owner did not want (or was unable) to spend that kind of money. 

But that's just my personal opinion.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

I agree Alex.

That is basically how things went with my vet.
We started with hoof testers and that did not get an reaction.
She then said she could not determine what was wrong with out further testing and my options were all listed out for me.
Yes, one of the options was we leave it with not knowing what it is (only knowing it is not an abscess) and see if it gets better on its own.

The vet never said, "I do not know, wait and see". She just offered up wait and see if I did not want to spend the money to diagnose.


(PS - I did end up being a ligament and it took more than a couple of weeks to heal.)


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

Right and the wait and see method is something that we sometimes have to do if we do not have a spare $600+ laying around. I can certainly see while it is not ideal, it happens. 

However if I were in that position, I would present it as such. When Lucas had all of his abscesses, I was not keen to call a vet as I had spent in excess of $4k on my dog, and we were living very tightly.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

This man deals with muscles, ligaments and tendons so he knows exctly what he is talking about. 

It is not my fault the vets did not know what was wrong. And I already said one of them told them if she was not better in a certain amount of time she was to go for a X Ray. I asked the other vet who does the X Rays about one and he said he would contact me when he thinks she should have one. That is when I got this other man ( Who I had to pay of course =/ I am not a cheapskate. ) And he told me exactly what was wrong and where it was wrong and how long it would take to heal with treatment. He is a trusted man who I have got a lot of great reviews from so I am going to believe him on this. 

Both vets never asked me did I not have the money etc so I don't know why they did not offer more help than they did..Again it is not my problem and I don't know why I am being bashed for the vets decision.

Wow haha and I certainly did not make this up! I am unbelievably delighted to find out what is wrong with my horse and what to do about it...What is the point in posting in here anymore people are so judgmental it is unreal =/


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## ILOVEMYHORSE123 (Mar 11, 2011)

I did a little research and I found couple articles that might help you. The symptoms are very similar to your horse. Hope this helps. Also remember that a horse can easily become lame in one leg from trying to take pressure off of another sore leg.

http://www.hoofcare.com/article_pdf/HoofcarePemphigusKnot7D4CD.pdf

How to manage a laminitic horse - by Jenni Hillis - Helium


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

"Not a vet that diagnosed it"

... legally speaking, nobody BUT vets can diagnose a problem with an animal. I would be highly suspicious of anyone claiming to diagnose a horse without their DMV. 

2 weeks' healing time for a ligament issue is just this side of insane; 2 weeks' box stall rest, then starting to handwalk thereafter is more reasonable, but not 2 weeks for it to be healed. 

No vet will give up on finding out what's wrong with a horse unless limited by the owner. 2 vets giving up is even less likely.


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## DunOverIt (Dec 14, 2010)

Sarahandlola said:


> Both vets never asked me did I not have the money etc so I don't know why they did not offer more help than they did.*.Again it is not my problem* and I don't know why I am being bashed for the vets decision.
> 
> Wow haha and I certainly did not make this up! I am unbelievably delighted to find out what is wrong with my horse and what to do about it...What is the point in posting in here anymore people are so judgmental it is unreal =/


I suffered through this whole thread to read what I bolded on top of the whole quote. 

You don't deserve to own a horse. And that's me being nice.


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

Sarahandlola said:


> Both vets never asked me did I not have the money etc so I don't know why they did not offer more help than they did..Again it is not my problem and I don't know why I am being bashed for the vets decision.


It IS your problem though. Your horse, your responsibility to get a vet out and get proper diagnoses and treatments done. This does NOT have to mean that you spend your life savings, it means you have to let the vet know about your limitations, and perhaps make arrangements for a payment plan or talk to the vet and see if you can work something out. Vets want to help animals, and most are willing to work with the owner to make sure the horse gets diagnosed and treated. 
I don't know a SINGLE vet that would throw up their hands and walk away from a case without a lead. Ironically, I DO know of many, many stories claiming that's the case.
You are receiving some less-than-butterflies-and-rainbow responses because you are avoiding the issue. Nobody worth listening to would claim a ligament injury would be healed in 2 weeks. I would strongly suggest getting a Veterinarian's opinion on the injury, and set up a treatment plan. 
 Vets don't just walk away from cases unless the owners say "don't do any more." Firstly, if they did that then they wouldn't make any money, and secondly... most vets I know genuinely want to help the animals they work with.


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## MacabreMikolaj (May 9, 2009)

As a side note, I'm pretty sure you wouldn't X-RAY a ligament injury, so that in itself sounds suspicious.

I actually find it enormously surprising how often you hear on forums about vets who can't diagnose, or just don't know, or shrug and walk away. It makes you wonder....


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## JustDressageIt (Oct 4, 2007)

I'm relatively sure you can't x-ray a ligament; x-rays go through soft tissue and image dense material such as bone. You might catch a glimpse of a strong ligament here or there, but the x-ray would not make sense as a diagnostic tool for this situation. Ultrasound... now that would make sense... imaging soft tissues.


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

For those posting, here is some history. 


She first said her horse was lame on 2/9/11, she was lunging it at that time. 

http://www.horseforum.com/horse-health/lame-lame-lame-78163/

She asked about giving Bute 2/12. Here she says 'someone' checked on her horse she didn't say it was a vet, but whoever checked on the horse could find nothing wrong. 

http://www.horseforum.com/horse-health/bute-78397/

Since then the hair is coming out in chunks
http://www.horseforum.com/horse-grooming/hair-coming-out-chunks-79633/

I don't think the OP has any desire to call a vet or do what it takes to find out what is wrong, but some unqualified person came along and said the horse would heal from a torn ligament in a few weeks of stall rest. 

I give up.



Edit for typo.


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## mom2pride (May 5, 2009)

I myself have had ligament injuries and I can tell you that they do not heal in a matter of 2 weeks; soft tissue injuries can often times take TWICE as long as a bone injury to heal...no joke, here, it is the utter truth. Based on that alone, I would want to investigate further for my horse's sake...maybe all she needs are some serious adjustments, or massage therapy, who knows? 

I know you are convinced that your mare has been diagnosed, but if it were my horse,I would want to know for sure, and have an US done on the area to make sure that was what I was treating for, and to make sure that the treatment I was doing would be adequate. I've never had a vet say "I dunno" to a lameness, until we'd actually thoroughly exhausted all options!!! Those vets weren't worth their salt, if they actually did that to you...and instead of forsaking all vets, I would just keep looking for a better one, plain and simple.


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## MaggiStar (Mar 19, 2010)

Funnily i am from less then an hour from the OP and an hour from her there is 3equine hospitals that vets refer horses to all the time(most vets here specialise in catlle or small animals your hard pushed to find a specialist equine)however all the vets around here are good and will find out exactly whats wrong!
The UCD hospital only costs aaround 250for ultrasound and treatment or further test due ti the fact that it is a teaching hospital
I have never heard of a vet not knowing and happily leaving the horse it just doent happen here so i am calling her up on all of it


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Oh gosh I am seriously about to explode so I am leaving this thread. I actually do not have to explain to anyone and frankly do not care what you say or think anymore. I think I will get advice from people who are not judgmental immature people who like to attack other people over and over again. 

I would like to thank the people who have helped me =) And thank you for giving me advice without telling me I do not care or should not own a horse.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

mom2pride said:


> I myself have had ligament injuries and I can tell you that they do not heal in a matter of 2 weeks; soft tissue injuries can often times take TWICE as long as a bone injury to heal...no joke, here, it is the utter truth. Based on that alone, I would want to investigate further for my horse's sake...maybe all she needs are some serious adjustments, or massage therapy, who knows?
> 
> I know you are convinced that your mare has been diagnosed, but if it were my horse,I would want to know for sure, and have an US done on the area to make sure that was what I was treating for, and to make sure that the treatment I was doing would be adequate. I've never had a vet say "I dunno" to a lameness, until we'd actually thoroughly exhausted all options!!! Those vets weren't worth their salt, if they actually did that to you...and instead of forsaking all vets, I would just keep looking for a better one, plain and simple.


Thanks I will definitely get her an ultrasound. The ligament damage is not at the cannon bone and it is really not that bad at all. It is already getting better and I got some great tips to help it along.


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

JustDressageIt said:


> "Not a vet that diagnosed it"
> 
> ... legally speaking, nobody BUT vets can diagnose a problem with an animal. I would be highly suspicious of anyone claiming to diagnose a horse without their DMV.
> 
> ...


JDI, you rock!

For the record, a person handing out diagnosis and prescribing medical treatment is practicing medicine with out a license. There are laws against that.

The OP having paid this person makes what they did even more illegal. They can not claim it was just a friend helping a friend.





JustDressageIt said:


> I'm relatively sure you can't x-ray a ligament; x-rays go through soft tissue and image dense material such as bone. You might catch a glimpse of a strong ligament here or there, but the x-ray would not make sense as a diagnostic tool for this situation. Ultrasound... now that would make sense... imaging soft tissues.


True. 
Ultrasound is the way to go.
It is the only way to truly know the extent of the damage and what exactly is damaged.
Sure, you can guess with out one. But you do not truly know what is damaged or how it is damaged.

I guessed correctly the last time my horse pulled a check ligament. Ultrasound confirmed the diagnosis and determined just how bad it was (big black hole = really bad).
(For the record, horse was not lame.)





Sarahandlola said:


> Thanks I will definitely get her an ultrasound. The ligament damage is not at the cannon bone and it is really not that bad at all. It is already getting better and I got some great tips to help it along.


You have absolutely no way of knowing it is not that bad if you have not had an ultrasound done. Period! You have no way of knowing that it is getting better if you have not had an ultrasound done. Period!

For your horse's sake, please stop listening to people and go to a real vet. 


If this truly is a ligament issue you want to make sure it heals correctly. Poorly healed ligaments are life long issue.


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

The man that looked at her and diagnosed her was a neuromuscular man. It is his job. So he is qualified. He felt the ligament and knew how bad it was. He deals with these type of things everyday. And he did a better job at helping than the vets did. 

And I know ligament injuries are bad. The horse is staying in until she is fully better! He told me to keep her in for a week then when that week is up she should be walked until she is better. He said there will be a great improvement by then. 

I have never made up anything I posted in this thread..Just because I say it is not my fault the vets did not help more does not mean I do not care. It was the vet who said get an X Ray. He did not know what was wrong with her. He thought it was her fetlock. The other vet said he would tell me when she could have an X Ray. They are the ones who could not diagnose the problem. Ya know they can get it wrong every now and then. Just because they did not help more I am getting bashed. I have been doing everything I can to get help for my horse. You cannot judge me by what I say on here. 

Again like I said you can judge me all you like I do not care about people I do no know. Especially those who make it a hobby to attack people.


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## HowClever (Feb 16, 2010)

I don't see anyone making a hobby of attacking people here...


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Good to know. I do so I guess we have different views.


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## HowClever (Feb 16, 2010)

I guess so. Especially since I would be having my horse ultra sounded if I suspected ligament damage. *shrug*


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Ok if you are gonna do the same as the others then don't bother =/ 

You are obviously not reading my posts...




Sarahandlola said:


> *Thanks I will definitely get her an ultrasound.*


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## Sarahandlola (Dec 16, 2010)

Anyways I am outta here. Thanks again peoples...


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## Alwaysbehind (Jul 10, 2009)

Sarahandlola said:


> The man that looked at her and diagnosed her was a neuromuscular man. It is his job. So he is qualified. He felt the ligament and knew how bad it was. He deals with these type of things everyday. And he did a better job at helping than the vets did.
> 
> And I know ligament injuries are bad. The horse is staying in until she is fully better! He told me to keep her in for a week then when that week is up she should be walked until she is better. He said there will be a great improvement by then.
> 
> ...


I will start with I see nothing wrong with a vet suggesting an X-ray. 
X-rays are great. They are a great tool to determine what is going on inside. They can rule out lots of things being wrong and allow you to move on to the next diagnostic tool if they do not answer your question. They also give you the bonus of having a record of how things looked on that day. That way in the future you will have something to compare to. 
A vet suggesting an X-ray is not a bad thing.

Part of the reason I do not believe you is your posting of the conversation with your vet people just does not seem logical. As Judge Judy says, 'it if does not sound realistic then it probably is not realistic' (or something like that).

If my vet said they would let me know when it was time to do an x-ray I would ask them for specifics. What will determine when it is time? Are we just waiting to see if the horse is lame for a longer time? Why can't we do the x-rays now? Etc.

What exactly is a neuromuscular man? And what about a neuromuscular man makes it legal for them to act as a veterinarian with out having a license?

Someone with lots of experience can surmise that the damage is where it is. But there truly is no way to know the extent of of a lesion on a ligament with out using something like an ultrasound.

And no, a ligament lesion will not be lots better in a week. 
If that was the case, I would not have given up two summers in a row worth of riding while healing a horse that was not even lame looking.

Please put the amount of energy you are putting into being indigent with us into getting a real diagnosis for your horse.
Maybe contact Maggistar and get more details on the vets she uses.


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## vivache (Jun 14, 2009)

I want to go to college to be a 'neuromuscular man.' It's my dream job.

:roll:

Did you ask to see proof? Or did the man just poke her and say 'WHOOPS it's her ligament there.' Because, I mean, that's how I diagnose broken bones and stuf..

If you don't have proof, it doesn't exist.


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## kitten_Val (Apr 25, 2007)

Sarahandlola said:


> Oh gosh I am seriously about to explode so I am leaving this thread. I actually do not have to explain to anyone and frankly do not care what you say or think anymore. I think I will get advice from people who are not judgmental immature people who like to attack other people over and over again.
> 
> I would like to thank the people who have helped me =) And thank you for giving me advice without telling me I do not care or should not own a horse.


I'm sorry, Sarahandlola, but I see nothing but people trying to help you with advices and suggestions based on somewhat controversial statements you make. 

I think all advices were given already and this thread is going in loops. With that being said I'm closing it now.


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