# Re-training a horse that balks



## ChitChatChet (Sep 9, 2013)

IMO When you when you 1st notice he's going to do his thing kick him up before he has an opportunity to stop and plant his feet. I'd really get after him not just lightly but very strongly. Keep those feet moving. 

Another thing is when riding down the trail start weaving him all over the place... Around that tree, that bush, this weed, that rock. Keep his mind on YOU. Keep him on his toes.... he'll have to pay attention to you as he hasn't a clue what you the crazy person is going to ask for next. He wont have time to think about stopping and planting himself. A leisurely stroll down some trail the horse gets bored and starts thinking on his own. NO! You do the thinking AND directing of the events. We have done this. Yes! It takes time, but oh so worth it. Horse never had time to think about going home as the crazy person on his back had him weaving all over the road like he was drunk. That was that. His mind is on the rider. Turns out he likes crazy quick stuff

I have had a horse who thought he was going home. Wouldn't go the way I wanted AT.ALL. But he didn't mind backing. So he got to look at home but we back my way and as quickly as I could make him. Quarter of a mile later he turned around and went my way. Never have had an issue with him going wherever we point him since even away from other horses.


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

Tips depend on your riding level as he may throw a royal fit, also depends on the horse. I'd say he wants to go backward then he can go backwards....really far and really fast in the direction you want him to go. OR simply work him really hard in the area he wants to balk then quietly walk forward. Also make sure to work him when you go home so he's not barn sour. Worst case scenario I'll get off and lead a bit then get back on. Whatever you do turning around and going back is the worst thing, don't let him win.

My green gelding would do it a little purely being nervous. I'd just sit for a minute then ask him to walk on and reward him. He never does it anymore. BUT if he tried to turn or do anything other than walk quietly forward that was not allowed.

I am guessing with your guy it's being barn sour as opposed to nervous or being afraid of an obstacle.

Agree, sounds like he gives you ample warning so try and prevent if before it happens. After doing that once the second he acted up he would get a major push forward and an "I'm not dealing with this" from me. Don't just sit there and wait until he stops.


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

I never back a horse that balks. The last thing you want to create , is ahorse that runs backwards!
Yes, I know , you are backing him away from where he wants to go, but still you are not correcting loss of forward motion.
Also, a horse that just flexes his head to the side, is a horse that has been over flexed at the standstill, just head and neck, without getting any suppleness in the rest of his body, esp shoulder control
Horses follow their shoulder, and not their nose, until a taught to follow their nose with their entire body.
A horse that side passes unasked, stalling out from forward, is not respecting your leg, and you also need to work on that.
In other words, get body control on the horse , before riding him out.
Then, when he even thinks of side passing to avoid going forward, get after him, and really, really make him move off that leg, in the opposite direction
Get shoulder control, so if you do loose foreward, and he just tries to over flex his head, bump those shoulders around several times, then face where you were going, and ask him for 'forward
Most of all, feel when he wants to stall out, starts to wander sideways, make him stay between your legs and hands and get that forwRD


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## ChitChatChet (Sep 9, 2013)

Smilie said:


> I never back a horse that balks. The last thing you want to create , is ahorse that runs backwards!
> Yes, I know , you are backing him away from where he wants to go, but still you are not correcting loss of forward motion.



For this horse it worked like a charm. It was punishment for not going forward. I went from a barn soured horse to a horse that goes where every you direct. End of problem.

Cant say I have ever seen a horse run backwards. *scratching head*


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

@Smilie not my first choice either, but an option. I agree with MAKING the horse go forward (soft as possible hard as necessary) but worry about the advise as the horse may not be so cooperative with that idea (rearing etc). I think it's better to play it safe in these situations without knowing the horse or rider.


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## Prairie (May 13, 2016)

Since we don't know your level of riding, I suggest finding a trainer who will work with both you and the horse. This horse seems to have your number since even a bat or whip does not work.


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## Avna (Jul 11, 2015)

ChitChatChet said:


> For this horse it worked like a charm. It was punishment for not going forward. I went from a barn soured horse to a horse that goes where every you direct. End of problem.
> 
> Cant say I have ever seen a horse run backwards. *scratching head*


Then you are lucky. I have. Scary. They aren't exactly looking where they're going when they do that.


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## ChitChatChet (Sep 9, 2013)

Avna said:


> They aren't exactly looking where they're going when they do that.


They don't always look where they are going when bolting forward either.:icon_rolleyes:


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

If a horse is deciding to balk (nap as we call it in the UK) getting after it with a whip or spurs/legs doesn't make a jot of difference to its decision 
Once its stopped using a whip or legs is more likely to make it rear or rear and buck like a rocking horse than it will make it go forwards
Making it back up is also a waste of time/counter productive and could also result in rearing horse
The only things I've found worked are 
Sitting it out if you've got the time and patience and the ability to keep the situation very non-reactive
Spinning the horse round and round in circles by bringing its head right around towards your leg 
Figuring out why the horse hates trail riding so much it doesn't want to go - *and this is the best long term method.*


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

ChitChatChet said:


> ...Cant say I have ever seen a horse run backwards. *scratching head*


I have. I was told to get Mia going forward by using a bigger whip and applying it harder. But the harder I whipped her, the faster we went backwards. Not fun at all.

There are variety of things the OP can try, but its hard to say without being there to watch.


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## Reiningcatsanddogs (Oct 9, 2014)

I have had similar successes with the methods suggested by Jaydee. they won't go forward after urging on with legs, a pop with the end of the reins or a moment to think it through, turn a tight circle, disengage the hind quarters with the leg and then ride out forward. Rinse and repeat until they move out.


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## smrobs (Jul 30, 2008)

ChitChatChet said:


> Cant say I have ever seen a horse run backwards. *scratching head*



I have ridden one and it is utterly terrifying. Got a mare in for re-training that would do that. Had been taught improperly how to "back off your legs" and as a result, any time she got huffy or ****ed or didn't want to do something, the first thing she would do is take off backward at a run and NOTHING could stop her. She would back into fences, trees, she nearly went over backward on me because she stuck a hind foot in a cow trail. That was hard to correct and I won't discuss methods here because of the risk of someone else getting injured trying to copy them.

The first thing I would determine is whether he's balking because he's unsure/scared or if he's just being a spoiled snot. If he's scared, then you should work on his confidence and his trust in you. Some people find it easier to do this on the ground. I don't. One method I use frequently, terrain permitting, is to circle the horse around the "scary thing" and spiral them in closer and closer until they are in it or over it or go through it.

If he's being a snot, then I'd get after him. If I took one rein and applied outside leg and he just tucked his nose to the side and stood there, I'd take my bridle rein to the off side until he was spinning circles. When he was huffing and puffing, I'd let him out and ask him to immediately go in the direction we were heading, no stops, no breaks to "catch his breath", etc. If he balked again, wash, rinse, repeat. He'll figure out that being a brat just makes more work for him.


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

I agree also with not backing the horse as I've seen several bad situations that came from a horse that was taught to back rapidly when the way forward was confusing or frightening. It is very hard to steer or stop a horse that is backing rapidly into traffic or toward the edge of a cliff or through a line of horses.

I've used the circling and also just weaving the horse side to side. My favorite fix for a horse that stalls out on the trail is to break the behavior by jumping off and trotting the horse forward. When I feel the horse just begin to hesitate, I quickly dismount, grab the reins and get the horse trotting forward next to me. I slap the hindquarters with the reins if they don't get moving right away. We trot until we are a ways past the "sticky" area, then I stop and get back on. If the horse doesn't immediately take off forward when I ask again, I get back off and we trot some more. I've done this with several horses and it doesn't take long before the pattern is broken. 

Horses that balk learn that you can't get them to move, and they will sit and take your kicks and smacking with the reins. But getting them to move (and faster than they would prefer) makes them realize they won't be able to stop, so they learn to keep moving. It takes three or four times for the lesson to sink in with some horses. They much prefer walking along with you in the saddle to having you on the ground driving them quickly past an area where they'd like to stall out. Circling or weaving can work too, but some horses decide they'd still rather do that instead of go past the part they don't like. It all depends on the mentality of the horse and as Jaydee said, finding out _why_ the horse is balking is key.


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

ChitChatChet said:


> For this horse it worked like a charm. It was punishment for not going forward. I went from a barn soured horse to a horse that goes where every you direct. End of problem.
> 
> Cant say I have ever seen a horse run backwards. *scratching head*


Ride enough horses, and you might meet one!
I had one that a trainer corrected everything by backing that horse,who I gave that stud to, to put some reining finish on him, while I was pregnant
He would then run backwards, not carrying where he went, including over a bank. If you never been on a horse that has really learned to zoom backwards at warp speed, you have missed something!


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

Reiningcatsanddogs said:


> I have had similar successes with the methods suggested by Jaydee. they won't go forward after urging on with legs, a pop with the end of the reins or a moment to think it through, turn a tight circle, disengage the hind quarters with the leg and then ride out forward. Rinse and repeat until they move out.


 That is why you need body control, able to take a horse;s head away, disengage the hips, ect
I think there was a very good example on the video I posted before, by Larry Trocha, where he went into the different kinds of spooks, including where a horse focuses on something ahead, and then balks
Yes, once you have failed to keep forward, just trying to whip a horse to go, or spur them, can then cause the horse to escalate that balk to the next level, by rearing, by bucking or by running backwards
You have to get their mind back to you,along with ingrained suppling and body control exercises instilled < BEFORE you ride out
As I was once told, 'you can't ride a board'


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## Foxhunter (Feb 5, 2012)

Big Tom was the nappiest horse I have ever had the pleasure of riding. He would try it on all the time, his routine was to stop dead, do a little rear testing if the footing was safe and then if I tried to drive him forward go up nearly vertical. The only thing I can say is that he was safe. If he was napping on the road and a car came along he would stop messing, let the car go by and resume. 

He did it one day in the middle of the village, I could have gone left or the wrong was up a one way system but not straight on. 

I played the waiting game - for three hours! People were walking by saying, "Isn't he lovely! Can he have an apple?" 

My answer was " he isn't lovely and NO he can't have a carrot! " 

When he wanted to go I wouldn't let him and made him wait another five minutes. It never stopped him trying it on but, it was just to see if I was awake or not.

As for horses running back, I have had several. One racehorse belonging to my late boss was a horrible horse and would do his best to drop his rider at unexpected times. 

I was on him and we had been out early morning exercise. We were about a mile from home riding up a farm track, there was a bank to the right and a heavily wooded thicket to the left. Across the track was a concrete run off to take the liquid from the muck heap at the top of the track. 

The boss and my work mate walked over the Dotch and Dancer decided that this dark brown liquid was way to dangerous to step over - the whole thing was only about 9 inches wide amd he had been over it many times before. He did his fastest reverse down the track into a field whilst the other two waited. I managed to get him back to the gully and when he started to reverse I turned him and made him reverse over it. This was fine and he did it without realising until he looked down when the other side and he saw it. He leapt onto the bank spinning as he did so, he got a hind leg through the wire and ended up on hos sode on the bank with me still sitting on him. He got his leg out with no damage. I went to remount when he started to kick out and do it hard. He was lashing out and bucking kicking out as he did so. I realised that he had been stung by nettles on the bank - as had I! I ended up leading him back home and the boss remarked that he had big lumps on hos butt. I offered to show him mine but he declined! 

That horse was one of a kind. I had an electric fence across part of his field to stop him going to two new brood mares in the adjoining paddock. He walked into to line amd got stung so he shot away bucking and kicking, ears flat back shaking his head. He then stopped amd ran backwards straight into the wire. He got a second bite and it took him three more times before he left it alone!, each time he ran back faster than before.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

Lou ran backwards once when I first had her - right across the arena and bounced off the fence on the opposite side and leapt into the air high enough to look like she's got Olympic jumping potential (she hasn't)
K ran backwards one time, still no clue why, she lost her footing, sort of sat down and rolled over backwards. DH was very lucky not to have been crushed underneath her.


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## jenndieu (Oct 31, 2016)

Thank you for this thread. My horse (auction rescue with an unknown history) is behaving badly in a similar way. If he does not want to go forward, he starts backing like a maniac. He'll back down hills and off the sides of gullies. If I put leg pressure (to avoid going sideways down a gully), he'll start to side pass like a maniac. Back (like a maniac) - sidepass (like a maniac) - repeat. He did this when I first got him, and I am proud of myself that I never lost my temper with him. I would calmly make him do circles until his fit passed. Oftentimes, this meant that we circled and circled and circled. I called it "doing doughnuts". (When asked, "how was your ride?", I'd reply, "well, we did doughnuts for 8 minutes on the way to the trailhead." 

He got seriously injured and has been out for 7 months. I'm now permitted 10 minutes in the saddle (as part of his rehab) (up from 5 minutes last week). He's doing it again! (Prior to the injury, I thought that I had him cured of this behavior). I *almost* lost my temper yesterday (as I also haven't ridden in 7 months and so am less confident). I also have lots of folks trying "to be helpful" by offering unsolicited advice (hit him with a whip! Make him go backwards in the direction that you want to go!). I was seriously considering the "make him go backwards" until I read this thread. If I do that, I'm just going to encourage his crazy backing behavior. (When he starts to back, there is nothing that I can do to stop him. I've found that being calm is the only thing that makes him stop. If I try to push him, he ups the ante.)

I'm going to go back to what I did before: remain calm and never lose my temper. Doughnut, doughnut, doughnut (without force) until he stops. Typically, I'll doughnut in both directions (a few turns clockwise, a few turns counterclockwise). Note that this is being done before we're on a narrow trail. (It's **scary** when he starts this on a trail. Uncontrolled backing and sidepassing on trail terrain can be extremely frightening). 

My take with this horse is that this situation is a combination of fear and a willful, bratty streak. He'll almost never act like this when he's with other horses. He does this when it's the two of us alone. I think that he's unsure, and this triggers a bratty fit. 

If you disagree with my approach on this, please let me know. I'm open to learning.


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## gottatrot (Jan 9, 2011)

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I think your approach is fine since it fixed the issue before. Some horses get worked up by circling, so it's more beneficial to quietly lead them past the point where they got "stuck" or frightened. If your horse becomes calm by circling and will soon proceed, it may be a good solution for him.

It's common for a horse that was off for a bit to lose some of the courage he had built up for going out alone. As you say in your quote: 


> ...I also haven't ridden in 7 months and so am less confident


He feels the same way you do. You're both out of practice and need to build up your courage again.


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## Folly (Jan 27, 2015)

I've learned SO much from the experienced posters who have offered advice on this thread - and they are full of wisdom on training. So take this for what it is, simply the anecdotal experience of a novice.

I have a mare who occasionally will balk (similar to what you describe) - Stop and back up a few steps when asked for forward. Like your horse OP, she is a terrific trail horse (she actually seems to enjoy it most of the time), and this doesn't happen often thankfully. She did do it the second time I tried her before buying. I loved how soft and responsive she was usually, but I almost passed on her because of it (and asked about it on this forum, where thankfully I was reassured). I'm SOOOO glad I didn't let her go - she's my dream horse and this has proven very manageable. In her case, though, the secret to getting her to move is a slight pop on the shoulder with split reins. It's actually more of a 'cue' that proves to her that I 'know what I'm doing' (Not really true - I'm a novice for sure). I was lucky enough to be able to talk to the woman who had owned her most of her life - ends up she had been loaned out to some of their friends at a Colorado dude ranch for a summer - she got tons of trail experience, but did learn a few tricks. So this 'shoulder tap' is how her owner corrected her. It was probably a pretty solid correction in the beginning! - but now a small tap (or even just letting her see the rein in my hand), and she sighs and moves on. Anyway, it's possible that someone else had already used a specific correction that works... and maybe it's just a matter of finding it? I'm grateful that someone else has already had this discussion with her. She will try it, though, on any new rider. I've only had her 9 months so I'm hopeful eventually we'll get past it completely if course.

- now I'll hand it back to the experts.


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

Glad it worked for you Folly, and I think the key point was, that you nipped it in the bud, before she got really serious about balking, esp to the point of running backwards
Horses (ones that start out well trained ), will start by trying arider in little ways, and if that is not corrected, will eventually take the proverbial mile
Worst riding, JMO, that does not much, far as creating a good trail hrose, is having that horse in a dude string, with all kinds of level of riders, including dudes, riding that horse
Sure, they get miles put on them, but they also learn to just follow that hrose ahead of them, learning they can insist on when to jog, when to refuse to take a slightly different route, then the hroses ahead of them, ect. In other words, they learn to take a rider for a ride, much like a passenger, versus an active rider
Luckily, your horse was not as far 'gone;as that of the OP!


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## Folly (Jan 27, 2015)

Smilie said:


> Horses (ones that start out well trained ), will start by trying arider in little ways, and if that is not corrected, will eventually take the proverbial mile
> Worst riding, JMO, that does not much, far as creating a good trail hrose, is having that horse in a dude string, with all kinds of level of riders, including dudes, riding that horse
> Sure, they get miles put on them, but they also learn to just follow that hrose ahead of them, learning they can insist on when to jog, when to refuse to take a slightly different route, then the hroses ahead of them, ect. In other words, they learn to take a rider for a ride, much like a passenger, versus an active rider
> Luckily, your horse was not as far 'gone;as that of the OP!


Yes, I'm lucky. My first horse had been really ruined by being used at summer camps and as you describe nose-to-tail. She was a real balker, and barn sour - we thought the kid experience was a good thing. Now, I find that something to run away from.

Luckily my horse now truly is a gem. Not above testing me occasionally, but how else would I improve? She prefers following as long as the horse in front is moving along, but doesn't mind taking the lead and is very brave (though I have to gently urge her sometimes) - we often have to do that with my friend and her fairly green mare (who LOVES to lead, but can turn into a scaredy cat, and needs to follow a steady horse). My girl trots or canters when cued, and will 'ask' to go faster (especially to catch up), but never over-rules me. Neck reins like a dream. I did get very lucky. But, I can see how she could turn that 'napping' into a problem... which I don't intend to allow.

I understand my situation won't apply to most... but I do find it interesting that sometimes all it takes is stumbling onto the 'right' way to discuss things with her, based on her unique background.

** BTW, whenever I have any indication of an issue I run to this forum and post my silly questions. Your advice is always valued. I've definitely learned the value of nipping things early.


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

Glad your girl is proving to be a nice trail horse,Folly, and learning along the way, for alifetime, is just part of being a true horse person
One never can learn evreything-life unfortunately is too short for that! Happy trails!


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## boots (Jan 16, 2012)

I've had some that quit after doing many circles. I've had some that I could anticipate easily and drive forward before they balked. I've had some that just needed a break from what their regular routine was (roping, showing).

But... I got in one that was dangerous. The owner was committed to selling regardless of how he did, but wanted to give the horse a chance at something other than being canned.

With him I got a digital recording of mountain lion, wolves, and grizzly all on the attack. A guy near me thought it was a hoot to mix and loop it. 

Horse balked. I cranked it on. Horses fight or flight. There was nothing to fight, so he fled. Took three times. It was a wild ride. But I had him three more months and he never did it again, though I would kind of growl when I even *felt* him tense the first couple weeks after he seemed largely cured. 

Maybe it helped that we have those carnivores here and horses don't take them lightly, but it worked. It is lightly borrowed and adapted from a Carlos Castenada approach with kids that throw fits from his book "The Teachings of Don Juan." Who'da thunk. 

Now I kind of wish I had video of that goober running off to all that noise.

Next buyers knew the horse's history. Knew me. Never had a problem.


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

boots said:


> I've had some that quit after doing many circles. I've had some that I could anticipate easily and drive forward before they balked. I've had some that just needed a break from what their regular routine was (roping, showing).
> 
> But... I got in one that was dangerous. The owner was committed to selling regardless of how he did, but wanted to give the horse a chance at something other than being canned.
> 
> ...


Hey, Boots, sure would have loved to have seen that!Now there is an idea I never would have thought of!Would've made great youtube video!


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