# Right of First Refusal



## Nightside (Nov 11, 2012)

I notice with a lot of animal ads (I'm a Craigslist addict) people seem to want the right of first refusal should you no longer want the animal you bought/got from them. I think this is silly and idealistic for a number of reasons, and since this is a horse forum, I'll stick to horses.

For the most part, I'm going to put more into a horse's value than it was how I got it. To be expected to return it for free or the cost I paid for it isn't fair, and I would feel weird calling up the previous owner and saying they can have the horse back for the new sale price. It would feel like a ransom or something. 

I have always been of the opinion that once I purchase an animal or it sets foot on my property, it is mine to do with as I wish, as long as it is cared for. I don't mind sending the occasional update but I don't like feeling pressured or obligated. So if I want to sell them off to a friend or someone offers me a big chunk of money or the horse just didn't work out, I'm going to do so. 

Also, as for the people on Craigslist, most of them seem to be in a horse must be gone by x date! State of mind. I've seen horses kept in neighborhoods with 2 strands of barb wire and no shelter to speak of, so why on earth would I send it back there, just because of a sentimental previous owner who didn't have the means for proper care anyway? 

Some of these ads even come with threats! If you take my horse and resell it I will call the cops or report it stolen! I don't have a bill of sale on some of my horses but I have shot records and receipts for feed and care, just in case. I'm not even sure how you'd go about calling the police for that. Help, I gave away/sold my horse and now they won't give it back! I know for more professional type places, like rescues, can sometimes come with a contract saying the horse has to come back, but that's also why I don't adopt horses. 

So, what do you guys think of rights of first refusal? Do you ask for them? Abide by them? Ever been called out on it? I can answer no to all three, myself.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## wetrain17 (May 25, 2011)

Nightside said:


> Some of these ads even come with threats! If you take my horse and resell it I will call the cops or report it stolen! I don't have a bill of sale on some of my horses but I have shot records and receipts for feed and care, just in case. I'm not even sure how you'd go about calling the police for that. Help, I gave away/sold my horse and now they won't give it back! I know for more professional type places, like rescues, can sometimes come with a contract saying the horse has to come back, but that's also why I don't adopt horses.
> 
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I would never buy a horse from someone with that on the ad. Right of first refusal usually won't hold up. You give up your rights to a horse when you sell it. Its more of a suggestion of good measure then a demand.


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## WorshipWarrior83 (Dec 31, 2012)

if its in your contract for the sale then it will hold up.

However I see it as this. If someone has that in there and everything seems okay with the horse and owner then I have no problem because if I get rid of it they are simply wanting to ensure that their old horse doesn't end up at a slaughterhouse because you don't want them anymore. its sometimes silly but if I know and trust the person I would never have a problem offering to sell back to them upon my choosing to sell.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

First rights of refusal aren't legally binding. They're only useful if the person who bought the horse is honest enough to actually call the previous owner and offer them the horse again.

The current owner isn't required to offer the horse back to the previous owner for the amount it was sold to them. You can put whatever sale price on the animal you want. If you're polite and offer the previous owner the chance to buy it first, that doesn't mean they get it for a discount. They can either pay the price you're asking, or turn you down.

People who put threats or unreasonable demands in their ads/contracts have no legal leg on which to stand. If they were so concerned about the animal and love it so very much, they shouldn't be selling it in the first place. Another demand that _really_ grinds my gears is a 'forever home'. Oh r_eally?_ YOU can't or won't offer the animal a forever home, but you expect someone else to do something you weren't willing to provide? Cry me a river.

I will _not_ let you come and view my property for your 'approval'. You will get vet and farrier references, as well as references from other horse people if you ask. You will NOT come to my property, nor expect me to let you see Snookums once I own him. 

If you can't live by my terms, don't sell me your horse. You don't get to come and drive a car you've sold to me, so what makes you think a horse is any different? You sold it and now it's* mine*. You have NO say in what I do or don't do with it.


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## Iseul (Mar 8, 2010)

First right of refusal is subjective. 

The way I see it is that you let them know you're selling and your price for the animal. If they say no, then you can sell to whoever and not have an issue. First right of refusal has nothing to do with the price in which you bought the animal. Period.

Others think that you'll sell back for the same price you bought and throw a fit. BUT, if you look into the meaning of the words "First right to refusal", it says nothing but the fact that you have to offer them the horse for whatever you're selling for before you offer to sell to someone else. That's it, cut and dry explanation.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Nightside (Nov 11, 2012)

I tend to avoid ads/horses with that in the title. I've actually had someone ask me what I had to hide if I didn't really like the idea of them checking up on the horse. If you have seen my other threads, my horses are all a good weight and groomed, with the exception of the ponies that I bought in worse condition than they are now, but still aren't great. Someone I got a horse from emailed me the other day and said they drove by and didn't see the horse I bought in the pasture and wanted to know where she was. Uhh... creepy! She is in the pasture, you just can't see every inch of my property from the fence, and I like to keep it that way. There was no contract or anything to make it their business.

Anyway, the forever home thing also bugs me for all the reasons you said, Speed Racer. I would say a horse is with one person for a few years at a time, for the average person. The longest I've ever had a horse was about 5 years, my first and second horses. When they no longer become suitable for my needs or wants, they will go on to someone else. Maybe they're getting older and better suited to a lighter or beginner rider raider that isn't looking to go fast or do much, maybe I switch disciplines, maybe I can't afford as many as I have or in my case, I want to be able to save up for a dream horse, so I'll sell off one or two eventually to help with that. I don't have any false ideals about keeping an animal for 30 years, much less a pasture full of them. Life is too unpredictable for that.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## nikelodeon79 (Mar 3, 2008)

Just like SR said, right of first refusal doesn't mean free our the same price you paid.

I signed a contact with a right of first refusal clause and if I ever sell the horse, I intend to honor it. I would not, however, be offering the horse at the same price I paid.

I paid $500 for a very green horse that had basically been backed a few times and potentially had a bucking problem.

I've put almost a thousand dollars into him so far for training, and plan on putting a lot more until I have a finished dressage horse.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Copperhead (Jun 27, 2012)

I had "Right of First Refusal" on some horses I bought. Its really not that big of a problem to call the previous owner up and inform them that you're selling. If anything, you might get a quicker sale if they say yes.

Previous owners who make demands need a reality check. Once they sign that bill of sale, they are no longer in control of that horse. I wouldn't buy a horse who's owner was that posessive/controlling. Theres a big possibility they'll cause problems down the road.


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## BarrelRacer23 (Aug 17, 2011)

I sold a horse with a contract, payment contract and right of first refusal. Why? I had owned the horse for 9 years but no longer had use for her. She is a finished youth barrel horse. I didn't add the price but I hope it's the same, because if and she most likely will be sold again I will buy her back. I know her new owners, only reason I sold her to them so hopefully they call me first.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## oh vair oh (Mar 27, 2012)

We sold my gelding with the clause right of first refusal. It's mainly in case the horse gets injured and cannot perform anymore, or has training problems, or something happens to the owners, we would like to be notified before an auction house or a kill buyer can be. If the horse increases in value, of course we would like to know if the horse is up for sale, but if we can't afford it, we won't buy the horse. But if the horse is selling for a large amount of money, odds are it won't end up at a sale or auction house. We still have sentimental value for the horse, and will happily buy the horse back to sit in our pasture if anything detrimental happens to it.


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## franknbeans (Jun 7, 2007)

Copperhead said:


> I had "Right of First Refusal" on some horses I bought. Its really not that big of a problem to call the previous owner up and inform them that you're selling. If anything, you might get a quicker sale if they say yes.
> 
> Previous owners who make demands need a reality check. Once they sign that bill of sale, they are no longer in control of that horse. I wouldn't buy a horse who's owner was that posessive/controlling. Theres a big possibility they'll cause problems down the road.


Your post doesn't make sense. YOu had it on some of the horses you have bought, but you wouldn't buy a horse from someone that controlling? :?

I sold one of mine with one, mainly because the woman who bought him had borderline resources financially, and I knew that it would not take much to tip the scales and my horse (who had been neglected by a previous owner) could end up who knows where. My purpose was not that I wanted the horse back, but I wanted to make sure he never got into a bad situation again. The new owner also saw it as a comfort, since she knew she could barely afford him, and that I would take him back if need be. That was 15 years ago, and they are still doing fine. She adores him, and thankfully she has not asked me to take him back. It was a great match for both. I do understand tho, that I had no real legal recourse if she decided to sell him.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

I actually dont see a problem with them asking for that as long as they agree that if the horse has been improved or the market price has gone up then the value of the horse will increase. 
Surely all they are trying to do is protect the horse they are having to sell for some reason from ending up in the hands of a meat buyer
I had that agreement with three ponies we had - two that we sold and bought back one of them then ended his life with us and the other actually eventually went back to the woman we bought him off to live out his life (as per the agreement we had with her) and one that we bought and sold back to its original owner where she lived out her old age as a companion. It worked very well for us and saved a lot of worry about what might happen to them. 
I guess it all depends on the motives of the seller


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## Copperhead (Jun 27, 2012)

franknbeans said:


> Your post doesn't make sense. YOu had it on some of the horses you have bought, but you wouldn't buy a horse from someone that controlling? :?
> 
> I sold one of mine with one, mainly because the woman who bought him had borderline resources financially, and I knew that it would not take much to tip the scales and my horse (who had been neglected by a previous owner) could end up who knows where. My purpose was not that I wanted the horse back, but I wanted to make sure he never got into a bad situation again. The new owner also saw it as a comfort, since she knew she could barely afford him, and that I would take him back if need be. That was 15 years ago, and they are still doing fine. She adores him, and thankfully she has not asked me to take him back. It was a great match for both. I do understand tho, that I had no real legal recourse if she decided to sell him.


I could have probably worded that better. What I meant was that I had bought an animal with right of first refusal, which is fine in my eyes. When I was ready to sell, I called them up.

But if the previous owner starts making demands and threats before I even buy it, like stated in another post, I'd stay clear of it.


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## Cat (Jul 26, 2008)

I've bought and sold horses with first-right-of refusals on them. Sometimes they are limiting - for the first year. Just to help ensure you aren't flipping the horse. Many times I believe that clause is in there because it makes the owner feel better about the sale. And sometimes - like in a case a few years back - I had to sell due to hard times (I was laid off) but if the horse came up for sale when we were doing better I would have bought him - and yes, with full understanding that I would probably have to pay quite a bit more than what I sold him for. That is life.

I did a horse swap last year and both horses had first right of refusal on them. In the contract it outlined it as a reasonable market value at the time of the future sale. So if either of us put training on it or anything like that or the market improved - we would lose nothing by offering the horse back.

They still have the horse I sold to them, but the one I got from them did not work out. Quick note to let them know it was not working out and why and if they were interested in purchasing him back. They weren't. Simple and easy and I found him the best home that fit him that I could. 

I also like getting updates on horses I've sold and giving updates on horses I bought. I haven't found anyone trying to control a horse I bought from them - but just some updates to see the horse is settling in well and working out in the new home really helps the party that had to sell I think. Especially if they were selling for other reasons other than total dislike for the horse.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Cat, I think if people voluntarily give you updates that's great. For the first couple of years I owned JJ I'd keep his former owner updated with pictures and e-mails. He's been with me almost 5 years now, so the communications have pretty much ceased. But she never _demanded_ anything, which is why I was so willing to keep her informed.


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## thesilverspear (Aug 20, 2009)

When I bought my horse over 13 years ago, the woman who sold her had first rights of refusal. Her contact info has long since vanished into a random file and I doubt she'd want to ship the horse from Scotland back to the States! 

When I was away at university out of state (but not yet out of the country), she phoned my parents -- the number she had for us, as I was 17 when we bought the horse -- just to see how the horse was getting on. This was four or five years after we'd bought her. Ex-owner was pleased as punch to hear that we still had the mare and she was away at college with me. 

Sometimes I wonder what she'd think if she phoned my parents and learned the horse was now in Scotland. It's not what you expect to happen to your horse!


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## AlexS (Aug 9, 2010)

When I was horse shopping, I went to see a horse from a private seller that I liked and was planning to buy. We negotiated, I rode the horse etc. 

Then when I went to pick up the horse and pay for it, I was slapped with an unannounced 'contract'. I was there with cash, trailer etc thinking I was getting my new horse. 

Her previously unannounced demands: 

First right of refusal at the same price as the sale today. 
She was going to follow me to my barn to make sure she approved, she would have a trailer to bring back the horse if she did not. 
She had a right to visit the horse at any time, and without notice. I was not allowed to deny her access, or she would take legal actions to get the horse back. 

Erm no! This was a horse I was buying from a private seller - not adopting. 

I thanked the idiot for wasting my time, and left cash in my pocket, and an empty trailer to return to horse shopping. 
If she had told me these terms, I would never even had looked at the horse. 

Another horse I drove about 3 hours to see. The horse came out, it was totally different from the one pictured in the sale ad. I said, woah that's not the horse I saw on the ad. Apparently the girl didn't have a camera, and so just posted a random internet photo to her ad. 

I hate people!


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## rookie (May 14, 2012)

In the past we have sold horses with first right of refusal. If they want to get rid of the horse within the first year we refund the purchase price of the horse. After a year, if they want to get rid of the horse and they should contact us. We want a vet reference and if you board we would like to see the area when we deliver the horse. 

I have had this work out a number of times. Where a horse was not fitting with the owner they called and we went, picked the horse up and returned the money. To me, first right of refusal is not about money. Refund of money assumes that the new owner has improved the horse. I have gotten horses back from an owner where the horse is snotty and spoiled. We had another horse come back from a similar situation after a few years. The barn owner where they were boarding was not feeding the horses. The horse came back to us thin and once the owners built a new barn and we returned the horse. 

In my opinion, first right of refusal a way to try to keep a horse out of a slaughter pen. I also figure that with the time, energy and money I put into a horse its part of my job as an owner to make sure that it ends up in a nice place. I decided to breed a mare, I decided to foal out a horse and I decided to train this horse. So, its my responsibility to do my best to make sure the horse is in a safe place.


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## Ace80908 (Apr 21, 2011)

I did a right of first refusal for my old heart horse, Ace. I had him from the time he was a yearling to his 12 year old year. He has mild ringbone and arthritis, and just can't do what I need my horse to do anymore, but he has a lot to offer for the young ones or older ones who just want to mosey along. I didn't want him to end up starving in a field, so for him it made sense.. his owners know I love him and when he no longer works for them, I will happily hand them a check and bring him home. Made me feel a lot better about finding him a new home...


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## NorthernMama (Mar 12, 2008)

I gave away a mare to what I thought was a good home. I also thought he was honourable. Months later I found out she was not well taken care of -- was substantially underweight, probably by 200 - 250 lbs. She wasn't a hard keeper, but she did need a whack of hay -- a WHACK! Anyway, by the time I found out about it, the mare was in a new home - thankfully a good one and she is now well taken care of again.

I was floored that the man didn't contact me when he was no longer interested in having her. I had told him numerous times to let me know if he had any difficulty whatsoever and I would find another home for her. We spoke several times over the following months about other things.

I will never again let a horse go from my property without a written and withnessed right of first refusal unless I am getting rid of the horse because I am no longer able to physically or financially care for it. And I will be much more careful. And snoopy. I will do drive-bys on any new home. I feel bad to this day that I caused her to be in that situation.


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## verona1016 (Jul 3, 2011)

I have my horse because of "right of first refusal"- his previous owner had to sell him due to divorce and offered him first to the breeder from whom she had bought him. The breeder has a "right of first refusal" clause in the bill of sale he gave me, too, but to be honest I'd call up the previous owner first; I exchanged a few e-mails with her around the time that I bought him and it was very clear to me that she was heartbroken that he had been sold and she no longer had the opportunity to eventually buy him back again. That, and I wasn't impressed with the condition he was in when I bought him (underweight even though he's an EASY keeper, poorly maintained feet, etc.)


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## Nightside (Nov 11, 2012)

I can understand using the right of first refusal to prevent the horse from.ending up in slaughter if someone knows if all else fails, they can get x amount of money back. And I would be fine with it if it ended there. I don't like people checking up on me and driving by the house. Call me paranoid, but I live in the country so I don't have to deal with people, including nosy neighbors. But that's kind of off topic.

My issue starts when people think they have the right to the horse at any/all time and should get it back in the amount of their choice. I'm happy to send updates for a little while so they know their horse has settled, and that's just because I'm a decent person, and once those hooves are on my property, anything I inform the previous person about is out of the goodness of my heart. I don't lease or adopt horses because I don't like being told what I can and can't do with them. But by some of your descriptions, it seems the people I have passed over weren't using the clause properly. If all they wanted was first option to purchase the horse at whatever price I set it at, sure. No need for drama and hurt feelings because I didn't keep a horse forever. In this day and age, people should be happy to know that a horse had a great, spoiled life while it was with me, however long that might be, whether it is is a month or 10 years.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Horsesdontlie (Mar 11, 2011)

I've always thought about it as a courtesy thing. When I sold my father's older gelding (20 years old, we had him for 6 years) I asked that if something came up that they might consider notifying me. I didn't require it and didn't even mention it in our contract (they leased him first), but let them know that the horse meant a lot to me. 

Ends up two years later that the family was relocating out of the states and gave me a call and offered him back to me for free. Very sadly I was unable the support two horses at the time and wished him luck with rehoming him. 

I think its a nice thing to do, but never should be necessary.


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## BBBCrone (Jan 28, 2012)

Both the horses we have recently bought have a "First right of Refusal" clause. It's a simple one liner that merely states that should we for whatever reason decided to sell said horse, the folks we bought them from get first chance to buy them back at whatever price we are asking.

I'll honor that. I see no reason not to, really. They aren't up in our business and made no demands. Course, if they had, we wouldn't have bought the horse in the first place!


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## kiwi79 (Nov 11, 2011)

I brought my gelding from a lady that I hadnt known long and she did ask if I ever decided to sell him that I would give her the first option of buying him back. We never put anything down on paper and have lost touch for the most part but I would probably still let her know if I did sell. To me its a good sign if someone values the horse enough to want it back in the future or least to have that decision. If it got to the point where he had been retired and for whatever reason I could not keep him on then I would definitely consider letting her take him back. I doubt I would expect any payment in that situation though.


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## wetrain17 (May 25, 2011)

I hate right of first refusal. Sure I'll give a previous owner updates at MY discretion, but don't expect me to let you see the property and have unplanned visits. If you want to keep ties to the horse, don't sell the thing. UGH, some people!


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## WorshipWarrior83 (Dec 31, 2012)

See to me though right of first refusal is only used when it comes time for you to sell. If you want to sell then I want first crack at buying back at whatever price you have it listed for. I think anyone saying well I get to buy it back at the price you payed me for it is stupid. I mean if you have put thousands of dollars and hours into additonal training then the horse will be worth more than you paid for it and I would expect to have to pay for that if I wanted my old horse back.


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## Prinella (Jul 12, 2011)

I do agree with visiting a property before you sell or lease a horse. It's great to see a persons other horses. If they're all in good condition it's a relief, if their horses are in a bad way don't leave the horse. 
Right of first refusal is a privilege and a favor but it makes sense
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

Prinella said:


> I do agree with visiting a property before you sell or lease a horse_._


Leasing yes, selling no. You have no right to visit my property if I've BOUGHT the animal. It's not yours anymore once you accept my money. Leasing is a whole other ballgame.


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## WorshipWarrior83 (Dec 31, 2012)

SR they are talking about before the sale. Wanting to ensure you take care of your horses before selling you the horse is smart. Id want the peace of mind to know you will be taking care of my friend which is what my horses are to me.

Now if we are talking checking up on you after the sale well the previous owner is delusional if they think they have a right to do that. Once that sale is completed the only thing that I think they should have a right to is having the first crack at buying the horse back if it is being sold.


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## Nightside (Nov 11, 2012)

The only time someone wanted to see my property before I bought a horse, I let them. I spent the previous day making sure.everything was perfect, not a stray dog toy in the yard and even the big water trough was scrubbed back to a brand new look. They came, said everything looked great, said they'd call later that week to trailer the horse, and I never heard back. So that kind of soured my whole experience with letting people inspect. None of my horses have come away with as much as a bruised hoof or a bad scrape, they are all a good weight and you won't find a burr or a tangle in their mane and tail. So, no, whatever my next horses are, it will not be at the discretion of some snob who can't or won't keep said horse for sale.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## wetrain17 (May 25, 2011)

Nightside said:


> The only time someone wanted to see my property before I bought a horse, I let them. I spent the previous day making sure.everything was perfect, not a stray dog toy in the yard and even the big water trough was scrubbed back to a brand new look. They came, said everything looked great, said they'd call later that week to trailer the horse, and I never heard back. So that kind of soured my whole experience with letting people inspect. None of my horses have come away with as much as a bruised hoof or a bad scrape, they are all a good weight and you won't find a burr or a tangle in their mane and tail. So, no, whatever my next horses are, it will not be at the discretion of some snob who can't or won't keep said horse for sale.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 
I'm a private person. I hate the thought of someone I don't know coming to inspect my property to see if its up to their standards, snooping around, putting their noses where they don't belong. I'll answer any questions a seller may have. But coming to inspect the property is going too far. If they find a reason not to trust me in all the answers I give and seeing me ride, then forget it. Horses are a dime a dozen. I don't need their horse; my money will be just fine to someone else.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

WorshipWarrior83 said:


> SR they are talking about before the sale. Wanting to ensure you take care of your horses before selling you the horse is smart.



I _know_ what she's talking about, and I simply don't agree with it. If references from my vet, farrier, and horse owning neighbors aren't enough to set your mind at rest, I'll find another sale horse whose owner isn't a control freak.

My horses are well cared for. Insinuating that you think otherwise and have to visit my property beforehand just in case is insulting.


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## WorshipWarrior83 (Dec 31, 2012)

I would agree that if yo have references from all those people then that should be good enough. I missed where you said you had all that.

Without references Id most certainly want to check out the situation to make sure Im not walking my horse into a bad situation just because they don't work for me any more.

Id be more concerned about people that don't care who they are selling to than someone just trying to make sure their friend finds a good home.


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## Nightside (Nov 11, 2012)

I am the same way, Speed Racer. When I had less of my own horses I thought of pasture boarding one or two to help offset the cost of my horses. But every time I think about it, I imagine some busybody letting my dogs loose or messing with my other critters, leaving gates open, or just hanging around too much for my tastes. I go about 2 weeks before I have to go into town and see another human being, aside from my neighbors who also keep to themselves. I like it that way.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

It's nobody's business where I live unless they're a neighbor, friend, employer, or relative. Somebody with whom I'm doing a simple financial transaction doesn't fall into any of those categories.

I'm fiercely private, and intend to keep it that way. If you think I'm going to let some random stranger waltz all over my property to 'approve' it for their Precious, then they can keep Precious and continue to bemoan about how _hard_ it is to sell the animal.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

I sold a horse with a clause in the contract saying that if they sold her, they needed to offer me the chance to buy her back at the same price I sold her. I also gave them the right to return her for any reason within 90 days for a full refund.

2+ years later, I've never contacted them about her. They could probably sell her to someone else, and I wouldn't know for some time. If I found out, then I could make a claim against them in small claims court for the value of the horse, which was $600. Would it stand up? Don't know. Don't know if the contract we wrote up by hand would enable them to have forced me to take her back for any reason within 90 days, either.

She was a sweet, good mare. I sold her because she hated Trooper as much as he hated her. My vote was to keep the mare. The rest of the family voted to keep Trooper. The intent was just to keep her from being dumped at some time in the future. In return, they had 90 days to decide if they wanted to keep her.

She lives about 2 miles from here, and I'm told by our shared farrier that they think she is a great horse.

Short discussion here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_of_first_refusal


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## WorshipWarrior83 (Dec 31, 2012)

I only have an issue with the right to purchase at the price they paid you for the horse. If they had invested a lot of time and training into the horse and they had to come back and offer it back at the same price Id say thats a bit unfair.

I mean market value for a trail riding horse and a barrel racing horse is considerably different so what if they had started training and competing with the horse on barrels. Your 500.00 trail horse may have just become a few thousand dollars more than that depending on how good they got at it so putting in your contract they have to sell it back at the same price they bought it for is a deal id never take for any horse.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

Speed Racer said:


> ...I'm fiercely private, and intend to keep it that way. If you think I'm going to let some random stranger waltz all over my property to 'approve' it for their Precious, then they can keep Precious and continue to bemoan about how _hard_ it is to sell the animal.


That is your right, and it is their right to put into the contract whatever they want. And if the parties don't agree, then the sale falls thru. There is nothing immoral about wanting to make sure a horse's new home isn't awful, nor is there anything immoral about wanting the option to buy a horse back. No one forces another person to agree to a contract. As long as both sides know what is in the contract, then both sides can agree or not - and live by their agreement.

There may be states that prohibit right of first refusal contracts. If so, state law would override the contract. If someone REALLY wants to know what is legal, they need to ask a lawyer licensed in their state. I know our local county bar association has a program where you can discuss an issue for 30 minutes with a lawyer who specializes in that area for a flat fee of $35 - money well spent for anyone who is serious.


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

WorshipWarrior83 said:


> I only have an issue with the right to purchase at the price they paid you for the horse. If they had invested a lot of time and training into the horse and they had to come back and offer it back at the same price Id say thats a bit unfair...


Why is it unfair? If it is in the contract, they know it in advance and can decide how they want to proceed. In my case, I also took the risk that they would ruin the horse in 90 days - which is entirely possible - and I'd have to buy her back and try to undo the harm. And since it was in our contract, I'd have no right to complain...


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## wetrain17 (May 25, 2011)

bsms said:


> Why is it unfair? If it is in the contract, they know it in advance and can decide how they want to proceed. In my case, I also took the risk that they would ruin the horse in 90 days - which is entirely possible - and I'd have to buy her back and try to undo the harm. And since it was in our contract, I'd have no right to complain...


 
You can put anything you want in the contract. That is your right. I'm sure there are plenty of other people who will sign; I happen to be one that would not. There are plenty of other horses out there that come no strings attached. For me, it would be a deal breaker. And I'm sure you wouldnt bat an eye by me not signing. But because I wouldnt sign, doesnt mean the horse would have a horrible home.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

bsms said:


> That is your right, and it is their right to put into the contract whatever they want. And if the parties don't agree, then the sale falls thru.


Absolutely. Except in my case, there wouldn't be any sale to fall through. The first mention of crazy conditions and I'd smile, thank them for their time, and walk away.

I still say if you want to keep your thumb on Precious then _lease_ the animal, and don't try to sell it with silly stipulations.


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## riccil0ve (Mar 28, 2009)

I didn't read the whole thread. I did ask the lady who bought Gracie to please let me know if she ever planned on selling her, as I would like the opportunity to buy her back at whatever price associated with added training. Will I pitch a fit if I find her on Craigslist without being contacted. No. If I have the means to buy her back at the time, I'll just respond and say I would love to have her back. I am aware that she isn't my horse anymore, I have no right to her at all. The new owner offered to send updates, and even gave me a vague invitation to visit her, but I do not ever plan on just stopping by. People who expect anything from the new owner are fooling themselves. You sold the horse. You have no rights.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## WorshipWarrior83 (Dec 31, 2012)

ricci that is is your opinion. In certain states if you have a contract then what that contract states is what goes.

Now weather someone would do a deal with someone with a contract that had too many stipulations is one thing but if you agree to the contract and they do too then you have every right to expect it honored


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## waleybean (Jan 20, 2013)

I think with most people it's just because they have genuine concern for the animal they have sold you and don't want it passed around, which could potentially be upsetting for the horse. When I purchased my boy, the lady asked if I should ever sell him to give her first refusal. I have no intention of parting with him and the seller and I are still friendly.


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## Speed Racer (Oct 21, 2009)

If you're _that_ worried about the horse's mental state, then why are you selling it in the first place? 

Honestly, I find all the angst to be something of a disconnect. If you were _really_ that concerned about the animal you'd be moving heaven and earth to keep it, not putting a monetary value on it.

I'm truly puzzled. You want me to PAY you for it, but you think* I* should have to keep it forever when you weren't willing to do the same thing? How does that even make sense?

I'd be more than happy to offer you the horse back at _my_ determined price as a courtesy should I ever decide to sell, but if you can't afford it how does that set your mind at ease?

I tend to keep my horses for life, but to have someone TELL me flat out that they expect ME to do something THEY weren't willing to do, is ludicrous.


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

so right after first right of refusal, put in permanent lifetime money back guarantee. seems thats what people are saying. Id be good with that.


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## wetrain17 (May 25, 2011)

Joe4d said:


> so right after first right of refusal, put in permanent lifetime money back guarantee. seems thats what people are saying. Id be good with that.


 
The problem is, if you buy a young horse and then put training on it, it will increase in value. You're not going to want to sell the horse for a fraction of what it's worth.


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## Cat (Jul 26, 2008)

It seems to me that many take a simple concept of "first right of refusal" and try to shove every other stipulation they can under that heading. First right of refusal is exactly what it says - when the horse is up for sale the previous owner gets offered a chance to buy the horse at that time. A few stipulations may be added as to price (set value determined in contract vs. fair market at the time) and how many days they have to decide, etc. And if the owner turns down the horse at that time - then they are done. That First Right of Refusal does not carry over to the next owner - they have no obligation. 

Now I did see a crazy contract that stated that the first right of refusal would follow the horse and any following owners would have to agree to those terms. Seriously? I don't see how they think that is legally binding at all. First Right of Refusal is tricky in of itself.

First Right of Refusal does NOT include - property visits after the sale, updates, conferencing the old owner for approval of what the horse eats or does, etc. If I wanted that I would go through a rescue/adoption.


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## Cat (Jul 26, 2008)

On a related question - how many are fine providing references of vet, etc? 

My newest horse needed references - which I had no problem. But it sounded like she got a lot of flack from other potential buyers when asking for references. I'm just curious how others feel.


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## WorshipWarrior83 (Dec 31, 2012)

id have no problem with giving that myself. Though it would suck if your going to be a first time horse owner.

The only reference you might have then would be from a trainer you took lessons from.


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## jaydee (May 10, 2012)

To me if someone seems to care where they're horse is going and wants to have first right of refusal (that does not mean they have the right to check up on it after the sale and the return sale price would be negotiable depending on many things) then I would be more inclined to think that the horse was genuine and not some drugged up unsound nutter that somewone wanted to cut and run from


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## Cat (Jul 26, 2008)

I think adoptions rely more on personal references when it comes to a first time owner, anyone they took lessons with, and if the horse is going to borded - talk with the bording facility to make sure its all lined up. And if they have another pet - cat or dog - then a vet reference there can be used just to show that they properly care for their animals. I would think a private sale would be similar?


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## Nightside (Nov 11, 2012)

I wouldn't have a problem giving a vet reference, although a vet wouldn't have much to say. I do shots and minor treatments myself.about all a vet could say is that my horses have coggins done and my dogs have rabies shots. Oh, and my ponies have worm in the poop I dropped off. Not very helpful, since all of those are pretty cheap, bare bones care. I would just rather do it myself and save a few bucks. 

My neighbor could say that the horses get fed twice a day, and he has probably seen me brushing them. I know his dogs name but I've had two, brief conversations with him since I moved in October. It would be weird to knock on his door and ask for a reference. So I probably wouldn't bother with someone checking references. I will answer questions on care and things like that and while bad people can come from all walks of life, the people I have gotten horses from all say I seem like a nice person, hand over the lead rope, and that is the end of it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

i just looked some of the law up on this, basically FROR is a joke, it is pretty meaningless and non enforceable, and in most states not even legal. SO put all you want in the contract. You really have no way of doing anythign about it anyway. For one even IF the contract is legal, and thats a big IF, if horse is sold to a third party all you could do is suit for damages. If a horse you dont own and isnt on your property and isnt used by you and you havent seen in years and you have already recieved FMV for, is sold what damages have you incurred ? No more than if I sell my horse now. No damages no claims, no nothing.


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## WorshipWarrior83 (Dec 31, 2012)

well I would say that on a ROFR you could put in the language that if the horse is not offered to you first then you reserve the right to collect the full sale amount. I would also insist that the deadline for decision be no more than 1 week. After 1 week the original seller loses the ROFR and you can sell to whomever you please.


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## Gremmy (Feb 17, 2009)

So...what if you've bought a horse, signed a contract that included giving the old owner first right of refusal - no pricing stipulations, just a clause stating you will give them the first opportunity to buy if you decide to sell...BUT, this is not a home you'd want the horse going back to? Would you still be alright with honoring the contract if it puts the horse in a bad situation?

I'm with Speed Racer on this, I don't like strings. Rescues and Private Sellers alike are welcome to attach whatever strings they'd like to what they want to sell, but I won't be buying.


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## Joe4d (Sep 1, 2011)

what ? you have already collected the full sale amount when you sold the horse. 
for a normal horse transaction, if the new owner resells it, the old owner has suffered ZERO damamges, therefore has no claim. doesnt matter what the bill of sale says.


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## WorshipWarrior83 (Dec 31, 2012)

There are a lot of legal ROFR clauses that include that if the horse is not offered back that the penalty will be the amount originally paid for the horse.

So if you paid me 500 for the horse and then sell it without offering it back to me the penalty would be 500 and if you refuse to pay despite signed contract then I can assure you that it would indeed be a breach of contract and I would be able to sue for that 500.

After the horse is sold to someone else its too late to get the horse back legally and thats where you could sue for damages.

Also if you find out about the sale prior to its completion you could go to court and get an injunction until your rights as stated in the contract are honored.


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## Copperhead (Jun 27, 2012)

I'd be hard-up to provide vet references since I don't use a vet for much of anything unless I'm stumped. The vets I have used were my employer's vets for my employer's horses who needed a vaccination record, coggins and health cert to travel or be sold. Other references (professional, personal, farrier) would be fine.

I would never allow someone on my property. I don't know them. I don't know their background. I don't want them knowing where I live. I don't want them knowing where I board. I don't want them around me. I didn't show up at their facility begging for friendship or to be stalked. I want the piece of property they're selling.

In return, I don't ever plan on visiting a location that my horse will go if sold. Again, I don't know them. They don't know me. Its _dangerous_ to go inspect a stranger's property. The check clears and the references check out, then come get your horse.


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## Cat (Jul 26, 2008)

I believe most vets can only legally give out that you are a client - depending on individual state laws though. The few times I actually had references check my vet that was all they needed - that yes, I have used their vet services. They don't give the details out. 




> no pricing stipulations, just a clause stating you will give them the first opportunity to buy if you decide to sell...BUT, this is not a home you'd want the horse going back to? Would you still be alright with honoring the contract if it puts the horse in a bad situation?


In a case where I do not want the animal going back (not talking about a situation where I just disagree with their keeping practices - like stalling vs pasture or something but the horses are otherwise okay, but if the horse was starving when I got it from them or something like that where I feel it would be neglected/abused) I would probably chance it and just place the horse as I see fit. 

I do not mind letting previous good homes know that I am selling if they want a shot at buying the animal and may even give them a heads-up if they did not ask just incase they were interested - I mean quick sale if they do want it back, right? But in a case where the animal may be put in a bad situation, I'll just chance having to pay something in court to ensure the horse is safe.


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## pebbs (Mar 5, 2012)

*Turn the tables...*

Well lets say that you have had your beloved horse for long while and have put a lot of care love time and training into the horse. Then something happens you didn't count on. You lost your job. Not so uncommon in today's economy is it? People are selling horses at a quarter of the value their worth on average that I've seen. They are forced to sell and usually with these people if you ask them their not really wanting to sell it but have to because of this reason or that reason. Those cases are the ones in which I see a lot of first right of refusal's on it. Because you know what just because time is hard right now maybe in a year things will be good for them again and you decide you don't want the horse and yeah they'd want it back. Just because they had to sell it don't mean they didn't love it!
I see people comparing it to buying a car. Horses aren't cars people. Unless your buying from a horse trader then the owners usually care a great deal about the horse. 

Its not bad or mean either if they want to know whereabouts the animal is going to be kept. Seriously. I sold a horse last year and thought the people were the most loving on earth. Claimed they rescued horses! Come to find out my precious stallion was holed up in a tiny stall where he could barely move and standing in 2ft of manure and mud. We ended up getting him back barely alive after 6 weeks. He'd lost 350lbs. Do you honestly THINK when I sold him that THIS was what I wanted for him?? Everyone said why didn't you check out the place before selling him. Oh because I didn't want to be one of "those" sellers. Well guess what. I am now. I spent a year getting him back to good physical & mental health and am looking once again to sell him. Guess what my first question is?? 
And do you think for a minute I wouldn't want first right of refusal? Because maybe I want to ensure that what he went through NEVER happens again. 
Just because a horse I've raised for 10 years isn't what we need now don't mean I don't care about him. And hey what would it hurt you after buying the horse to be able to say how much you love and adore your new horse to me? Isn't that what most people say about their new horse is how much they love it and what their new goals are to achieve together? Maybe I'd just like to know you love him as much as I do becaue it'll give me peace in my heart knowing I allowed you to buy him. 

There's no reason to treat previous owners as a bad ex-boyfriend/girlfriend. 

Unfortunatly horse prices are in the toilet so bad that you can't set prices high to weed out bad buyers. I thought that couple was awesome. How wrong I was!


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## mangomelon (May 11, 2012)

My horse has recently had some lameness issues that the vet thinks will be resolved enough for him to be a really nice trail horse with light arena work, perfect for someone who just wants a nice horse they can hop on and ride out on the trails. I, however, want to start jumping and becoming a better rider. My horse isn't the horse I need anymore but I would never ever ever want him to end up in a bad situation because he's not totally 100% sound for hard work.

Reading your responses to this post have helped me feel much better about including a right of first refusal if I decide to sell my horse. I don't want to be able to check up on him whenever I feel like it or be snoopy, I just want to make sure that if the buyer ever ends up in a situation where they have to get rid of the horse, I know he can have a good home with me. I know if he ever ended up in a bad situation I would never forgive myself. He means the world to me so if I sell him I will take the time to find someone who fits him perfectly so I don't have to worry but horses are expensive and unpredictable things can happen. I always want to know that the horse will have a good home.


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