# Sell a great horse to inexperienced riders?



## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

I have decided to sell my gelding (age 16 or so) that I have had for the past year as I believe I won't be able to get up the courage to ride him (not in shape, getting older, still mentally affected from an injury a few years ago). I want my lovely horse to have a great home where he has a job and he is loved, and I don't want to keep paying board and all of the other costs associated with a horse I do not ride. 


I am conflicted. A nice family came out yesterday to look at him and ride him. None of them have ever had lessons, and they leaned HEAVILY on the bit for control, jerking his head around constantly, not using seat or legs appropriately. I know my horse well enough, and as predicted he crow hopped once from frustration with the older daughter (age 12 ish?) because she continued to haul on the reins while asking him to move. It scared her a bit, but she kept riding him. Then grandma got on and she was a little better but still heavy handed, then mom got on who has only ridden a handful of times in her life -- she did ok but doesn't have a clue about how to ask for the movement she wants him to do. 


I do want to sell him, but I'm not sure I want him to go to this family and I'm quite sure they won't understand why. They all fell in love with him because he is beautiful, friendly, and well mannered, and I'm sure they will give him a great home as long as he behaves for them. I fear their inexperience will ruin him and he will end up with a nasty attitude and hurt someone. He of course will be blamed and likely end up shipped to Mexico for meat or mistreated by resentful humans because he caused injury to them and in their mind he's a bad horse. 


They are coming back tomorrow to ride again, and I plan to try to work with them on using seat and legs appropriately, and backing off on using the reins, but I'm smart enough to know that they will do what they have been doing as soon as they are on their own.


Any thoughts/suggestions/comments?


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## Hotrodz4me (Jul 17, 2016)

I understand your sentiments about selling your horse to someone that is not at this point capable of doing him justice. You the seller are in control of who you sell him to. If you feel they are not ready for your horse then politely say no to their offer and don't have them out a second time to become more invested in their "dream".


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

I think you need to go with your gut reaction....
The horse, because he is a nice mannered horse *tolerated* these people but _*was *_getting annoyed and aggravated within the few minutes of time they "rode" him...
I believe the horse will turn into a monster.
A change of personality and nasty is going to happen when these caregivers and riders _uneducated_ continue to arrive, ride and handle the horse.
Any horse will only take just so much _"attention"_ before lashing out in retaliation.

If he is as nice a horse as you say...
*Do Not Sell Him To These People....*
The horse, and your conscience deserve better...
That is not anything bad or nasty against them, but a truth be told statement.

Wait for the next person/family to come along,_ the *right *person/family._
It sounds like you are just starting to advertise him for sale..._do not _take the first offer of purchase if it feels wrong to you.
I remember selling my one horse about a year ago...
First rider who came fell in love with him...it was a horrible match though for him. 
Again, fell in love with looks but they could not ride him and he was miserable and let me know it. A long story short, I waited... I knew the right home was out their for him.
5 weeks later the perfect home came looking. 
Horse was incredibly happy and loved that rider and she him.
For the horse, wait and see who else answers the ad you have now placed...
So, I remember buying my first horse as a kid...fell in love with the first one I sat on... 
My parents and the sale barn owner both said "No"...:x
I was "in love" with any horse because I wanted so badly to own but the right horse was not the first one I saw, sat and rode...:neutral:
It may be the same thing happening here with your horse...
Do what feels right to you,_ in your gut._
_Nice horses find nice homes with caring and educated riders who appreciate making a partnership._

You owe these people nothing in explanation.
Tell them you truly need to think about it if you feel the need to say anything...
If they push, tell them the truth.
"You may want a horse, any horse, but you don't know how to really ride a horse and I want to make sure my horse would be happy. In a home of non-riders who are rougher in handling than he understands, I have to really think about his needs. Because of your inexperience and unknowing how to be kind and gentle riders...you are not the best home for him."
Truth sometimes hurts feelings....however, truth can also open eyes to needing to learn a better way.
Truth also gives you a clear conscience that you have done all you can do to find a good, caring, loving and educated rider home for your horse..

If you decide to sell to that family, I would _*not*_ want to know any updates or have a buy back clause because he will not be the same horse in a short period of time with the way you say they handled him. 
A signed bill of sale each has a signed & dated copy of as "Sold As Is" so no misrepresentation is ever leveled at you.
My opinion but I think uneducated riders and your horse are a accident going to happen and the horse will pay the price!
:runninghorse2:...


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## TXhorseman (May 29, 2014)

You might consider doing what I heard one horse trainer does. He requires anyone wanting to buy a horse from him take 20 hours of lessons from him first. I'm not sure whether he requires them to pay for the lessons or not. If not, he probably includes this in the cost of the horse.


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## boots (Jan 16, 2012)

I, too, would not sell to the inexperienced people you describe. It is going to be awkward regardless of how you turn them down, but so be it.

I do recommend networking with riders you like and admire, but suspect you don't have a large network or someone would have already known and been sending buyers your way. So...

Do you know anyone who might ride him in public for you? Do you know, or can you meet, a trainer/instructor in the horse's discipline who might market him for you through their contacts? Sure you have to give them a percentage of the sale price (somewhere around 8% depending on your area), but it gets your horse out there in front of better riders.


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## cbar (Nov 27, 2015)

It is your horse, you can decide who to sell him to. You don't even need to give a reason if you don't want to. 

But, if you do not want to sell to them I definitely wouldn't have them out for another visit. 

If you do think they could give him a good home, you could always ask if they would plan to take lessons with him.


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## DancingArabian (Jul 15, 2011)

PresleysMom said:


> I have decided to sell my gelding (age 16 or so) that I have had for the past year as I believe I won't be able to get up the courage to ride him (not in shape, getting older, still mentally affected from an injury a few years ago). I want my lovely horse to have a great home where he has a job and he is loved, and I don't want to keep paying board and all of the other costs associated with a horse I do not ride.
> 
> 
> I am conflicted. A nice family came out yesterday to look at him and ride him. None of them have ever had lessons, and they leaned HEAVILY on the bit for control, jerking his head around constantly, not using seat or legs appropriately. I know my horse well enough, and as predicted he crow hopped once from frustration with the older daughter (age 12 ish?) because she continued to haul on the reins while asking him to move. It scared her a bit, but she kept riding him. Then grandma got on and she was a little better but still heavy handed, then mom got on who has only ridden a handful of times in her life -- she did ok but doesn't have a clue about how to ask for the movement she wants him to do.
> ...


I think you should cancel the visit. If you have to provide a lesson during a trial ride, it's not a good fit. I think you should direct them to a nice barn that provides lessons. I don't think this would end well for your horse - especially considering he was already acting out. I am confused as to why your thinking anything other than "hell no" for this match.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

As a seller you have to decide what your goal is. Is it to make a buck? Is it to match your horse with the best person for him and vice versa? Is it to get him a good retirement home and hope for the best in the middle? Only you can answer those questions. You just have to understand that once you make up your mind and do sell, you have relinquished ALL control and right to the horse. So, when you sell, you need to not look back or let that little demon Regret start sitting on your shoulders.


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## SteadyOn (Mar 5, 2017)

Even if they promised you that they'd take lessons on him as a condition of the sale, unfortunately you'd have absolutely no way to enforce that.


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## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

TXhorseman said:


> You might consider doing what I heard one horse trainer does. He requires anyone wanting to buy a horse from him take 20 hours of lessons from him first. I'm not sure whether he requires them to pay for the lessons or not. If not, he probably includes this in the cost of the horse.



This is exactly what I thought about today while mulling this over in my mind. I would be willing to do the lessons for free where he is currently boarded and then we can all decide at some point if he will be a good fit for the family. That way at least I have made an attempt to educate them and protect the mouth of my horse at the same time!


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

PresleysMom said:


> I would be willing to do the lessons for free where he is currently boarded and then we can all decide at some point if he will be a good fit for the family. That way at least I have made an attempt to educate them and protect the mouth of my horse at the same time!


_I would be very careful about using your horse... _
He already told you with his body english that he is* not* going to tolerate this for long.
Playing the pessimist, what if this backfires on you...:neutral:
You teach, the horse gets a sour and nasty attitude, and this family then decides they don't want a horse with "attitude"....
I see you wanting to educate, but to get educated the horse will be getting his face and mouth smacked and tagged repeatedly as they learn...something he has already objected to..
Correct?

I _would_ just look for a family or individual rider who has some prior experience riding not a absolute beginner group of riders...
_I advocate for the horse_...he is _not_ going to be happy, period.
I think you set yourself up for problems to arise then truly not be able to sell this horse for the sum you have decided upon...
Don't do this to your sensitive horse...please!
Please think, truly think of your horse first...and realize that your offer of kindness in giving lessons could also open you to a lawsuit if a injury happens on _*your*_ horse with _*you*_ as a "instructor/trainer" and no insurance...:frown:
Today people are quick to sue if something goes wrong...protect you, protect your horse.
:runninghorse2:...
_jmo..._


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## Acadianartist (Apr 21, 2015)

No... I wouldn't sell him to them. I have a problem with the fact that none of them have bothered to really get educated but they want to buy a horse. This tells me they're not likely to get professional help when (not if) they need it. Your horse may have tolerated them because you were there, and it was on your property. I can see this situation going downhill fast. Tell them you've decided it's not a good fit. If your horse is so beautiful, well-trained, and has such good manners, it won't be hard to find a truly good home for him. 

The idea of telling them they need to take lesson with you first sounds good hypothetically, but realistically, will probably not happen. Why didn't they take lessons before? Why do they think it's ok to buy a horse without really knowing anything about riding? What do they know about horse care? I don't think this can be fixed with a handful of lessons. Horsemanship and riding are a lifelong journey. Not something you pick up in a couple of lessons. They're in over their heads and don't even know it.


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## SteadyOn (Mar 5, 2017)

Acadianartist said:


> No... I wouldn't sell him to them. I have a problem with the fact that none of them have bothered to really get educated but they want to buy a horse. This tells me they're not likely to get professional help when (not if) they need it. Your horse may have tolerated them because you were there, and it was on your property. I can see this situation going downhill fast. Tell them you've decided it's not a good fit. If your horse is so beautiful, well-trained, and has such good manners, it won't be hard to find a truly good home for him.
> 
> The idea of telling them they need to take lesson with you first sounds good hypothetically, but realistically, will probably not happen. Why didn't they take lessons before? Why do they think it's ok to buy a horse without really knowing anything about riding? What do they know about horse care? I don't think this can be fixed with a handful of lessons. Horsemanship and riding are a lifelong journey. Not something you pick up in a couple of lessons. They're in over their heads and don't even know it.


Yes, this!!

As someone who bought my first horse when I was too young, too stupid, and thought I knew everything, I was LUCKY that the place I boarded at offered lessons. I was LUCKY that I was pointed there. It could have gone so much worse, and as it was, it went badly enough. I wish the woman selling me that horse had told me frankly that it wasn't a good fit. And had suggested a place to take some lessons before buying any horse. If I had decided to keep him somewhere without a safety-minded coach in charge, I can't even begin to imagine how horribly things could have gone.

If you tell them no, and tell them why in the nicest and most constructive way possible, you'll be doing everyone a favour.


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## jumpingtothemoon (Jun 16, 2017)

I may not be not be an experienced rider, but I agree with everyone on this thread. Personally, I would NEVER sell my horse to a family that hasn't bothered to think this through. They should at least have invested enough time and interest in taking lessons before even thinking of buying. Again, this has already been mentioned, but what if they do ruin your horse? I have heard of horse horror stories where a great schoolmaster was given to clueless owners and came back with zero manners and respect.


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## farmpony84 (Apr 21, 2008)

well... I can't really post on here because I only "sold" one horse... And I didn't really sell it - I traded it to a trainer. It was a crazy pony and I couldn't sell it because people always wanted it for their kids and it was just plain dangerous so I traded it and never asked what the guy did with it. 

I have kept all of my horses... I have 6 now. One is 33 and retired... one has navicular... one severed her tendons... I can't sell them... Because I can't guarantee what kind of home they'll have... so I keep them... forever.

I do feel for you... it's a hard decision. My suggestion is to sell him as an intermediate horse. I would just say he is not appropriate for beginners... at least then you should get a different level of rider looking at him.


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## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

Thanks for all the input! I sincerely appreciate it and the effort behind it.


I am going to meet with them today and tell them I believe their level of experience is not appropriate for my horse, and I will go into the reasons why and possible solutions for it. I will also have in hand a couple of places that offer lessons (one place I took lessons myself last year). I will also offer to help them find a more suitable horse if they want my help, and if they find one and want to board the horse at the facility where my horse is currently, I would be happy to help them practice what they've learned at the lesson barn. 


I have been horse crazy almost since I began walking, and I see myself in those girls -- probably why I feel for them and want to help them learn all the things I did not know when I began riding as a 10 year old. I think about the two horses I rode back then -- the Welch pony I learned on from age 10 to 15, and the sweet and tolerant quarter horse gelding I bought at age 15. I actually feel some guilt and regret about how I treated those horses just because I didn't know any better. They weren't overtly abused, but I handled them roughly much like that girl did recently when they didn't immediately do what I wanted them to do. I have learned so much since then! My current horse would thank them if he could I'm sure.


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## edf (Dec 20, 2013)

I would have a serious talk with them- and be honest. I'd say this:

"I do believe you will give the horse a great home, however, with my experience with him, he has the potential to act up a bit when heavy handed on the bit ( or however would be the best to describe how the horse handled having his head tugged on). I'd fear this would make the horse less well mannered when being ridden, and could turn into a not so good experience for the both of you."

I'd say this before they rode- because lets be honest- perhaps it was what I call new horse syndrome and they just feared the horse would take off or were just a tad insecure and it showed that way?

However- I just read the rest of peoples posts- and do agree that they are going into buying a horse rather quick. See, if they were newbs but currently working with a trainer/taking lessons- I think the heavey handedness could be corrected. I started out heavy handed- classic tell the horse to trot, then pull back the reins. I even done this with Zoe when I got her- it frustrated her, but she didn't act up- and I learned what I was doing sooo much quicker and corrected it. If someone doesn't take lessons- how are they going to know what they are doing wrong.

While I do believe these people have the best of intentions- and the problem could indeed correct itself with the rider taking more lessons- once you sell the horse, you have no control over what they do.

And no one wants to hurt any ones feelings, but if you decide to not sell to them, i'd say the heavey handedness of the rider will make the horse not react ina favorable way-this horse needs a rider that understands seat/leg more than using reins, and that you don't think this would be the horse to teach the rider this.


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## LoriF (Apr 3, 2015)

My answer to them would be that I can't sell this horse to you. He will eventually hurt you. Some horses are very forgiving and some horses are not. 

You can see that he is not going to put up with rough treatment and you can't fit a square peg into a round hole without chipping away at it's integrity. 

Beginners have a lot of misunderstandings with horses and the horses get frustrated. Some act out and some don't. Yours acted out and told you loud and clear. Just wait for a different person that he can get along with.


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

I am assuming this is the horse that you bought from a kill pen? A year ago and this is his second place to board. He developed a fixation ( I think it went beyond buddy sour) on a mare that he then mounted and penetrated, was boarded with but not stalled or pastured with in the first. He was moved. You are not happy with where he is at now. You have no history because he is a rescue, have only been on him once, have had him evaluated twice by experienced riders and he did well? Are not willing to put him with a trainer because of cost. Are older, not in shape, have had a past injury from horses and mentally affected by this as well as frustrated with where you are at with the boarding? Now, you don't want to pay for a horse you don't ride. It sounds like financially and time wise having this horse has become a burden and you are ready to walk away.

IMHO the best for the horse is to bite the bullet and put him with a trainer for at least 30 days and you spend time with the trainer as well. 60 would be better as 30 days isn't necessarily 30 rides, usually closer to 20. Doesn't have to be the one you used. It may be that is all it takes to get your confidence back and you in the saddle. You then know more about how he is under saddle and around mares in general. Could be he was used as a stud and gelded late. He may have been gelded and not used to stud but is just that way about certain mares or the one. Maybe she was his dream girl. If you could get to that point and work out what you feel are issues at the barn you have him at then you could get back to what you enjoy and not feel as you do. If not tack the training on to his price and sell him for where he is after that experience with an honest evaluation form the trainer on level rider to sell him to. If you can't do that because of finances then it doesn't matter how sweet and lovely he is he may still end up on the truck to Mexico especially if he mounts someone else's mare and it results in a vet bill or has some other reason he was there (killpen) in the first place. An alternate would be to offer someone a percent of sale price (plus expenses) and have them ride him places where he can be seen (trails, local shows). You'd have to set a good enough price that you'd both be ok with what you pocket at the end of the day but that is how I got my first horse. Then decided to purchase her because I fell hook, line and sinker for her royal attitude. We had agreed on a price before hand in the event that happened. I was given several months at my expense if I boarded her closer to me to work weight off of her and bring her back to show condition. 

Having said that, there are many who dream of having a horse, do nose/tail trails and think they know much more than they do. Think they have much more experience than they do just because they have ridden not realizing all they did was stay in a saddle built to keep you in the saddle. They have a little grass or know that they can board as an option but have no clue about all that is involved and even if they have read a book or looked stuff up without the experience they still don't have a clue. BUT they are willing to learn. Would this be the case with these people? 

I sold my first horse to a woman that rode trails on an old as dirt, boombproof trail horse that she borrowed from friends. She'd feed for the owner/friend and thought she was ready for her own horse. They did too and gave her high marks on her riding and care ability. I sold my favorite mare to her thinking it was going to a great home and even if she wasn't experienced she had friends ready and willing to help. She was to be boarded at the same place her friends had their horses. She had an excuse for not riding even though I rode her out for them. None of the friends would get on either. That should have been my biggest red flag. They didn't come "dressed" to ride. Once the mare was paid for and moved though, those same friends helped her buy the harshest bit I had ever seen to put on her bridle, made sure the woman had a set of spurs to match, put her in a stall with no turn out time and then I had the misfortune of being on the same trail ride she decided to take her out on her first ride. The woman was bucked clear over the fence that was a good 10 foot away. If I had had the money I would have bought her back in a heartbeat but I needed that money for something else and with the new job had no time which was why I sold her. She'd have been better off if I had given her to the woman that boarded her for me and just ridden around the pasture by her kids. (That BO had just bought property, had no clue about horses, just knew she enjoyed waking up and seeing them out there plus wanted the income to help pay for the property.) Turns out the woman that bought her never cleaned the stall or had a farrier out so her feet were in awful shape; she wasn't being fed because I guess just looking at grass was supposed to put weight on her. I cried my self to sleep many a night over that mare. Next time around I was more careful but I still had a bunch of those looking for a first horse and similar to what you describe out to look. If all your horse did was crowhop for the FIRST rider and settled even with the heavy hands of rider two and three with help they may not make a bad home. They may be able to give it a loving home and realize they need some help to get started. I'd ask plenty of questions and see what happens with their second ride today. No matter who you sell to you have to be prepared to accept that you sold him and move on. I am sorry you find yourself feeling like you need to sell.


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## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

_I am assuming this is the horse that youbought from a kill pen? A year ago and this is his second place to board. Hedeveloped a fixation ( I think it went beyond buddy sour) on a mare that hethen mounted and penetrated, was boarded with but not stalled or pastured within the first. He was moved. You are not happy with where he is at now. You haveno history because he is a rescue, have only been on him once, have had himevaluated twice by experienced riders and he did well? _


Yes,this is the horse – the only one I have. He did well with the other two riders –no problems at all after the trainer’s third ride (popped up in front duringthe first two rides but not third ride). 
_Are not willing to put him with a trainerbecause of cost. Are older, not in shape, have had a past injury from horsesand mentally affected by this as well as frustrated with where you are at withthe boarding? Now, you don't want to pay for a horse you don't ride. It soundslike financially and time wise having this horse has become a burden and youare ready to walk away._
Yes thatabout sums it up. I am not sure if money is the complete reason I don’t want tosend him for training; a small part of it is that, in my mind, he would begetting trained for ME to ride as I believe that a trainer needs to work withthe rider and horse together at some point. So, for me to go through the effortand expense of getting us trained, it would be more difficult, if not impossible, to part with him.

_IMHO the best for the horse is to bitethe bullet and put him with a trainer for at least 30 days and you spend timewith the trainer as well._ 
That maybe ultimately what I end up doing. Not completely in sync with the idea yet.
_Maybe she was his dream girl._
LOL Ithink that was the case! He paid NO attention to the other mare even when shewas in heat and peeing all over the place.
_Having said that, there are many who dreamof having a horse, do nose/tail trails and think they know much more than theydo. Think they have much more experience than they do just because they haveridden not realizing all they did was stay in a saddle built to keep you in thesaddle. BUT they are willing to learn. Would this be the case with thesepeople? _
Fromwhat I gathered, grandmother has two horses – Cowboy (nasty attitude geldingwho will lay down and roll to unseat rider, run with rider against trees/undertrees to unseat them, become extremely stubborn and refuse to move, etc), and amare who will tolerate the children for a short while then suddenly take off ina dead run or suddenly change directions. So, it appears this family reallydoesn’t much of a clue. I will find out today if they are WILLING to learn – that Idid not discern at our first meeting. 
_She had an excuse for not riding eventhough I rode her out for them. None of the friends would get on either. Thatshould have been my biggest red flag. They didn't come "dressed" toride. _
Not surewhat you gleaned from that other than perhaps they were not as confident intheir abilities as you were? Or perhaps were hesitant to ride in front of youbecause she feared you would refuse the sale? Ultimately the end result was that the horse was too much for her. I believe that is the same here -- probably why you relayed the story.
_Next time around I was more careful but Istill had a bunch of those looking for a first horse and similar to what youdescribe out to look. If all your horse did was crowhop for the FIRST rider andsettled even with the heavy hands of rider two and three with help they may notmake a bad home. They may be able to give it a loving home and realize theyneed some help to get started. I'd ask plenty of questions and see what happenswith their second ride today. No matter who you sell to you have to be preparedto accept that you sold him and move on. I am sorry you find yourself feelinglike you need to sell._
Thankyou for your well thought out response. I appreciate the time and effort. 
Perhapspart of the reason I purchased him last year was because I felt bad about wherehe was, and it was impulsive on my part. The expense is only part of the issue I’m now facing – it’s more that he’sbeing wasted as a pasture pet. I thought having him may also propel me through myfears; I can’t tell you how many beautiful sunny days I’ve spent in the lastyear pumping myself up, loading up the tack, getting out there, lunging,grooming, tacking, putting on the helmet, setting up the mounting block, positioningthe horse, getting to the top step of the block, watching his head and ears (relaxed,in my direction) while he stands there waiting for me to get on. I pet his neck,put some weight with my arm across the saddle, pet his butt, adjust the reins,pull on the saddle a bit, all the while he is standing there relaxed waitingfor me to mount. My heart races, pounding in my ears. My breath shallows, Inearly become lightheaded, paralyzing fear takes over and I step down. Over andover again. Shameful.


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## whisperbaby22 (Jan 25, 2013)

No it's not shameful. It's just where you are at. Since finances seem to be an issue, I would tell you just to sell the horse. If finances were not an issue, I would say just keep him as a pasture pet. Maybe don't sell him to these people, but just sell him and let him go. You need to start over with another horse at some point, maybe an old pony would help you get over your nerves.


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## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

For any of you that are curious about today, I met with the family and expressed my concerns stating that the horse is sensitive and somewhat reactive, and I was afraid someone would end up getting hurt. I suggested that they continue to come and spend time with him while I teach them some things. They were EAGER and VERY EXCITED about it! I told them I could teach them some basic skills, but anything other than that they would need to find lessons elsewhere. So, we began today with leading, grooming, picking out feet, fly spray, and lunging. We also saddled him and I used his halter and lead rope (no bit or bridle today) to teach them balance. He did great with all of them. We mainly walked in the pen, and I was leading him most of the time while explaining the basics of using seat and legs for control. I told them that it doesn't mean they will end up buying THIS horse necessarily, but at least it will give us all an opportunity to try some different ways of communicating with him which will only help advance their skillset. Plus he will get some saddle time which benefits me since I'm not able to do it myself. It's a win-win!


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## newtrailriders (Apr 2, 2017)

Awesome way to handle it and I’m so glad to hear they were excited and willing to learn! They’re fortunate you’re doing this for them and the horse is blessed to have someone looking out for his best interests


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## Mewlie (Apr 14, 2017)

What you are doing to help them is far more generous and thoughtful than what most people would even dream of doing. Kudos to you! Even if this family won't end up with your gelding, you've given them a great experience regardless. I hope you can find the perfect home for your boy.


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## QtrBel (May 31, 2012)

Sounds great! Hopefully they bought the others as they are and didn't have a part in making them that way or if so this will help them as well. It is generous of you to spend the time with them.

If I am buying a horse I expect to ride before I buy if I am going to go out to see the animal. I have bought sight unseen but had someone i trusted go out and evaluate/ride before hand. I also expect to see the owner ride though there are times I understand it is not possible but typically they had someone else there to ride first to show what the horse is capable of if not I do go ahead and ride but ask that I can get the animal, groom, tack, work on the ground first to get a feel. Yes, relayed for that reason. I had never sold a horse before and while i thought they would/should ride I was new to selling so when they had excuses I didn't think twice. Perhaps if they had ridden I would have been in the same place you were questioning whether to sell or would have seen the horse was too much for her and passed. Then again she could have ridden beautifully and the influence of her friends would still have meant we ended up in the same place on that trail ride.


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## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

UPDATE: The husband came out last weekend and rode Presley -- he was a fantastic rider! He got the horse to behave for him and when the horse was a bit barn sour and jigged back toward the stable, he continued to work him exactly like I would have if I would have been riding. THRILLED TO SEE IT!! So, essentially, they bought him for the husband. The new palomino mare they brought in last week is now in heat, so I'm sure that's not helping Presley's behavior. Ugh.


I told the wife that I would continue to work with her on developing her seat and balance on him, which she appreciates. She is just as unable to handle him as I am -- she needs to find a more relaxed, laid back horse that is willing and easy. Of course these types of horses are usually not for sale, so it may take awhile to find; in the mean time, I will continue to teach her what I know and I will even help her look at other horses if she needs me. 


They are keeping him at the same boarding place until they complete the fence at their home. I told them the good and the bad in my 6 months there, and wouldn't you know the first time the BO meets with them in this partial board we feed your feed situation, after signing the liability contract, the BO says to them, "Yeah, if you are ever down here at feeding time, just go ahead and feed them all. Send me a text so I know it's done." Can you believe the balls of this BO?? 


Anyway, not my monkeys, not my circus. I was a bit sad about selling Presley; but mostly RELIEVED. Thanks for reading!


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## newtrailriders (Apr 2, 2017)

Awesome, sounds like it worked out great for everyone involved!

That barn owner WAS joking, right?!


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## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

newtrailriders said:


> Awesome, sounds like it worked out great for everyone involved!
> 
> That barn owner WAS joking, right?!



SHE WAS NOT JOKING!!! She was ABSOLUTELY serious!!


She also tried to get them to buy feed from them, supplements from them, use their farrier, and also pay for lessons from her! My GOSH the balls they have!! mg:


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## PoptartShop (Jul 25, 2010)

Aw, that's great it ended up working out for everyone.  That is good they were willing to learn, hopefully it sticks with them! And good for you for helping them. 

& wow what's with the BO? That's nuts! :O


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## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

UPDATE: I willcontinue to work with the buyers through the end of the month. Wife does not understandthe concept of not letting horse do whatever he wants to do; consequently, hedoesn’t listen and does whatever he wants to do once he gets tired and decideshe wants to go back to the barn. I was guiding her outside of the pen while shewas lunging, and I know he is willful and if not corrected he will just dowhatever. She wanted a direction change, he continued going in the samedirection, and she did nothing about it even after I said, “Follow up with yourcommand of direction change until you get the response you want from him nomatter what it takes.” She just sort of threw up her hands and he justcontinued trotting in the direction he was going. Both she and her husband arebad about continuing to ask for something when the horse is already doing whatthey ask. Example: I had been workingwith him on clucking for trot and kissing for canter. Well, he is trotting inthe pen for the wife and she continues to cluck at him the entire time. I saidthe same thing to her husband last week who was also doing the same, “If he isdoing what you want him to do, stop making noise at him. Only use verbal cueswhen he is not doing what you want quickly enforced by physical cues if he doesnot respond.” Apparently this concept is over their heads. Frustrating towatch. 
Anyway, I don’t want to turn this into a complaining post,so I will say that wife has really improved in her balance! She was trottingyesterday and looked great!


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## horselovinguy (Oct 1, 2013)

You have to turn a blind eye to what you are seeing...
You have no control nor if the sale is finalized any input they need to listen to anymore.
These people will do as they wish with their horse...good or bad.
The "tricks" you trained into the horse he will now learn new ones and without a steady strong influence become bad mannered with his doing as asked...he will now become a "pig" as I refer to them on the ground when manners are absent.
I *had*, _past tense_..one of them till he and I had a meeting of minds and he realized it was much easier to be respectful, stay out of my space and do as asked than do it his way and pay the consequence when I got big and ugly for disrespecting me, threatening me and or my safety...

You've made great progress with what you have been able to teach them in such a short time...
They are going to have to learn through the school of hard-knocks though what you're trying to educate them about...
They don't "get-it" and won't "get-it" till someone gets hurt. 
They'll blame it on the horse and then when someone else comes in and a different animal appears with firm handling and boundaries the animal understands.... then they might "get-it".

I hope this new ownership works out for new owner{s} and horse.
This though was a risk you understood when you sold your horse to a family of beginners knowing your horse will push and take every inch he can if allowed..._sounds like most horses actually. 

You've done all you can do in the time allotted to helping them.
A vast difference from the first day till now...but always we have room for improving ourselves with our horses...time, time and continuing to work together now determines where they all progress to.
:runninghorse2:....
jmo...
_


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## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

horselovinguy said:


> You have to turn a blind eye to what you are seeing...
> You have no control nor if the sale is finalized any input they need to listen to anymore.
> These people will do as they wish with their horse...good or bad.
> 
> ...


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## teakwood (Aug 20, 2014)

Don't do it. I have a neighbor - an older man who has ridden horses forever but I've never ridden with him as we just moved here 6 years ago and just met him as one of our horse neighbors. And he and my husband have become friends. Long story short.... he was horse shopping. I found him a horse - a full sister to one of mine. I have ridden this horse and she's a nice horse! No drama, doesn't spook, no buck but hasn't been used much. But with consistent riding, she'd be an awesome trail horse. Arabian. So.... now he has her and it's been a nightmare. I wish I could take her away from him. LUCKILY, he doesn't ride unless we go with him. He doesn't bond with her and she's a very sensitive mare and wants a person to be her person. She's sweet and friendly and tries really hard. He doesn't have soft hands, he yells at her to stand still when getting on. One day I told him, "good grief, she's not deaf!!!" I couldn't hold back.
My husband is going to ride her and work with her. He's going to ruin this good horse. He has a horrible bit on her. We told him what to get and he will buy it. He wonders why she tosses her head when he's cranking on her mouth. This guy needs a nice older quarter horse that isn't sensitive. I wish I had never put these two together. My husband will ride her with a nice fitting saddle, a nice fitting bit, he has good soft hands and lots of patience and listens to the horse. Work with her not against her. She's actually a better horse than her sister (mine). ha, ha.... Mine spooks quite a bit and has issues with strange horses behind her. This other one could care less about other horses and rarely spooks. And when she does spook, it's nothing. Can't even call it a real spook. She's just unsure.


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## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

teakwood said:


> Don't do it. I have a neighbor - an older man who has ridden horses forever but I've never ridden with him as we just moved here 6 years ago and just met him as one of our horse neighbors. And he and my husband have become friends. Long story short.... he was horse shopping. I found him a horse - a full sister to one of mine. I have ridden this horse and she's a nice horse! No drama, doesn't spook, no buck but hasn't been used much. But with consistent riding, she'd be an awesome trail horse. Arabian. So.... now he has her and it's been a nightmare. I wish I could take her away from him. LUCKILY, he doesn't ride unless we go with him. He doesn't bond with her and she's a very sensitive mare and wants a person to be her person. She's sweet and friendly and tries really hard. He doesn't have soft hands, he yells at her to stand still when getting on. One day I told him, "good grief, she's not deaf!!!" I couldn't hold back.
> My husband is going to ride her and work with her. He's going to ruin this good horse. He has a horrible bit on her. We told him what to get and he will buy it. He wonders why she tosses her head when he's cranking on her mouth. This guy needs a nice older quarter horse that isn't sensitive. I wish I had never put these two together. My husband will ride her with a nice fitting saddle, a nice fitting bit, he has good soft hands and lots of patience and listens to the horse. Work with her not against her. She's actually a better horse than her sister (mine). ha, ha.... Mine spooks quite a bit and has issues with strange horses behind her. This other one could care less about other horses and rarely spooks. And when she does spook, it's nothing. Can't even call it a real spook. She's just unsure.


Gosh, teakwood, that's a bleak story. I know you think it's a positive to be able to be around the sister mare whenever he rides her, but for me that would be prolonged torture! 

Once they move the horse to their home, I won't see him again unless she invites me over to see him (and that would likely only be if she's having problems with him since I am "working" for free for them right now). I believe they will give him a good home whether or not they ride him, so I have to be ok with that.

Thanks for the input!


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## Smilie (Oct 4, 2010)

I sort of just skimmed through the posts, but see a'project horse', that should be sold to experienced horse people only.
Since I never flipped horses, but raised and trained the ones I bred, my horses all had good foundations
Still, if a green horse person came out to look at a three year old I had going, I always told them it was not the hrose for them UNLESS, they put that horse in further training, with a good trainer, and took lessons at the same time, on that horse.
I can see wanting to sell a horse, cut costs, but then that horse should not be sold to people that know no better. Either sell the horse only to some one experienced, or just put him through a sale
I never sold a horse that I did not get on and ride first, before the buyer rode the hrose, nor would I buy a horse that the owner did not get on first. 
Once a horse is sold, he is sold
If this family buyers the hrose, (I guess they did), the onus is on them to work with a trainer, that can both get on the hrose, make him solid (not that any horse is ever completely 'solid' ), work with who is going to ride this horse (wife?) then after some time, working with both the hrose and the wife, decide if the match is good


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## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

Smilie said:


> I sort of just skimmed through the posts, but see a'project horse', that should be sold to experienced horse people only.
> 
> 
> *Yes. Fortunately the husband is experienced and knows how to handle him. Doesn't really help his wife much, but at least he has more knowledge and experience.*
> ...


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## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

Update for anyone interested: Presley is doing great for the wife! She continues to text now and then to tell me how things are going, and she has been working with him over the last few months and he has really come around for her. She is very happy with him, and now they have purchased a paint mare which of course makes Presley happy (he has an affinity for paint mares). Both horses are at their place (they moved him the end of February after they completed the fencing) and she has invited me to come visit once they complete the barn. She has gotten her confidence back and is getting him to listen to her. So happy it worked out for all of us! 


Also I sold all my tack to another friend so it's not sitting in my garage collecting dust! Yay all the way around!


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## whisperbaby22 (Jan 25, 2013)

That's great.


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## AtokaGhosthorse (Oct 17, 2016)

THIS is how people who know nothing at all about horses buy one and then a few weeks later accuse the previous owner of acing the horse.

I didn't know much, but I knew enough to know it was my own inexperience with horses and bad advice that caused a lot of problems with our first three and of the three, only ONE of them was handled correctly in their previous 'life'. The other two had mountains of problems and holes in their training and we didn't know what we didn't know. 

This is a recipe for disaster, selling your horse to these folks. No is a complete sentence and it is perfectly acceptable to use it early and often. I am the party of No. It comes to my lips easily and without hesitation.

I'd worry less about it being awkward and just be honest but firm: Your son/daughter, you guys, are not prepared for this horse. He needs an intermediate to advanced rider. I'd rather you not get hurt and I'd rather him not take the blame for it when it happens. I'm sorry, but no.

EDIT: So this was totally resolved. LOL Oh well. The advice remains for anyone else in the future. It's totally okay to say no to people.


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## PresleysMom (Nov 21, 2017)

AtokaGhosthorse said:


> THIS is how people who know nothing at all about horses buy one and then a few weeks later accuse the previous owner of acing the horse.
> 
> I didn't know much, but I knew enough to know it was my own inexperience with horses and bad advice that caused a lot of problems with our first three and of the three, only ONE of them was handled correctly in their previous 'life'. The other two had mountains of problems and holes in their training and we didn't know what we didn't know.
> 
> ...



Yay! Thanks for reading it though -- and you have great advice.


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## UnhappyHacker (Dec 30, 2017)

congrats, I admit to not reading the thread having been in a simularish situation it hit a nerve, its good that the father is a decent rider as I think any horse can learn to handle different riders provided they still are able to be corrected and know whats asked of them.


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