# X-rays for PPE?



## Saddlebag (Jan 17, 2011)

When it comes to the hoof, xrays don't always reveal what may cause lameness. Horses have been dead lame yet no indicators on the xrays. When you visit the horse try slipping your hand under it's tail barely below the rectum. Good sign if he clamps down tight. A drugged horse will be more relaxed. Walk him on halter and do tight turns. A sound horse will step over as he turns, a sore horse will hop or shuffle on the front.


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## Tihannah (Apr 7, 2015)

My vet likes to do the examination and then determine if xrays are needed. He keeps a travel xray machine with him. If he's seeing something off during the exam, then he will recommend an xray.


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## Dreamcatcher Arabians (Nov 14, 2010)

Reining and roping can be tough on the legs. I'd have the vet do the physical exam and if he passed that, if the vet recommended xrays, I'd do them.


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## churumbeque (Dec 20, 2009)

Saddlebag said:


> When it comes to the hoof, xrays don't always reveal what may cause lameness. Horses have been dead lame yet no indicators on the xrays. When you visit the horse try slipping your hand under it's tail barely below the rectum. Good sign if he clamps down tight. A drugged horse will be more relaxed. Walk him on halter and do tight turns. A sound horse will step over as he turns, a sore horse will hop or shuffle on the front.


That is inaccurate. A well trained horse shouldn't clamp down. That is part of training for them to let you do what ever with no resistance.


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## rookie (May 14, 2012)

I think it depends on the horses conformation, what they have done in the past, what you plan to do with them and last of all the cost of the horse. For a horse that comes from a breed known for leg issues (navicular) and from a sport that is hard on legs (reining) I would get radiographs and possibly ultrasound the legs. If you are planning on competing with this horse an ultrasound might reveal previous damage or tears that keep it from being competitive. If you want a happy hacker than I would ignore the ultrasound but get radiographs. 

Sometimes its better to consider the cost of radiographs in a pre purchase against the cost of treating an issue that would otherwise be unfound. I would do the radiographs at the time of the pre purchase examination after price has been roughly set but no money has changed hands. The pre purchase may allow you to negotiate the price down pending what is found or allows you to walk away.


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## sonib82 (Jul 24, 2015)

Thanks all! The horse is well built and has good bone structure. The people who own him are recreational riders and have had him for quite a few years - so I don't think he's been over-used. As I mentioned, he hasn't been ridden much the past 3 years at all (they have 2 kids < 3, so no time - also the reason they are selling him). I do want to show him, so future usability is of concern, but this would be lower level - not buying a world champion reiner 

Anyway, appreciate the advice; if I do make an offer, it would be PPE dependent, but I will make sure to speak with the vet to get a recommendation on x-rays based on what they see.


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## Yogiwick (Sep 30, 2013)

It also depends. If you are buying a show horse for $50,000 you can bet the PPE covers EVERYTHING. If you are buying a backyard horse for $1,000 I wouldn't plan on x-rays unless you had reason to think they were needed. The vet can advise you, depends on medical history, price, intention (what you're going to do with him), anything that may predispose him, etc.

It's like a car, if someone gives you a ten year old car and says "it runs" and you just need a car that runs, fine. If you are buying a Ferrari you would want it triple checked by a trusted professional.

Just talk to the vet about it, ultimately it's your choice but I would let the vet advise.


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## FineFilly (Oct 10, 2015)

I'm not sure if it is the same in America, but in the UK x-rays will often form part of the PPE as a lot of insurers won't insure a horse over a certain value without. 

For me personally, it depends on the value of the horse, what I plan to do with him/her and the insurers stipulations. 

If I just wanted to hack - then no, I probably x-ray. If I wanted to compete at a fairly decent level - then yes, I would.


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## beverleyy (Oct 26, 2011)

Saddlebag said:


> When it comes to the hoof, xrays don't always reveal what may cause lameness. Horses have been dead lame yet no indicators on the xrays. When you visit the horse try slipping your hand under it's tail barely below the rectum. *Good sign if he clamps down tight.* A drugged horse will be more relaxed. Walk him on halter and do tight turns. A sound horse will step over as he turns, a sore horse will hop or shuffle on the front.


Uhh?? Neither of my mare's clamp down ...at all. Guess they are both drugged heavily at all times:wink:

OP - Purchase price of the horse has little to do with whether you should Xray or not. You buy a $100,000 horse and a $1.00 horse, vet bills and rehab and all that fun stuff comes out the same $$ in the end anyhow. 

Regardless of what the horse has been doing for the past few years, get Xrays anyway. The owner may not even be aware there is an issue (if any). Get the vet to PPE, see what they think then move on to Xrays. Actually, I'd Xray regardless - I have a friend who went through a very unfortunate situation recently (horse passed PPE, later did Xrays some time after buying horse and found he had a very old injury that only showed upon xrays and horse would continually become more unsound as time went on ...very sad situation).


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## Regula (Jan 23, 2012)

With more and more diagnostics becoming available, the decision what to include in a PPE becomes harder and harder.
Not every PPE has to include x-rays. If I were buying a young unstarted horse for example, I would probably skip the x-rays if the horse passes a lameness exam and flexion test.

Whether or not to include x-rays depends on the risk you want to take.

I am assuming that you are considering spending the money on x-rays because you are planning to keep this horse long-term, not because the horse is very expensive.
Personally, I would probably do the ten standard x-rays (all four feet, all four pasterns, and the hocks), since the things he used to do are quite high impact. Also, lots of reining and cow horse people tend to start their horses at two, so I'd be a bit worried about arthritic changes. With the standard x-rays, what you are mainly looking for are navicular, arthritis, and bone chips.
I wouldn't x-ray the knees and back, if the clinical exam is ok.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sonib82 (Jul 24, 2015)

Regula said:


> With more and more diagnostics becoming available, the decision what to include in a PPE becomes harder and harder.
> Not every PPE has to include x-rays. If I were buying a young unstarted horse for example, I would probably skip the x-rays if the horse passes a lameness exam and flexion test.
> 
> Whether or not to include x-rays depends on the risk you want to take.
> ...


Correct; the purchase price of the horse would not drive me to get x-rays in this case. I want to make sure I'm getting a horse I can use. The last 2 horses I purchased were both yearlings, so x-rays weren't really a consideration in those cases. I have an aunt that rides at a hunter/jumper barn where they don't buy a horse without looking at x-rays. This is the first horse I would be buying where it would even be a question - just trying to weigh everything going into it and make sure I'm making a smart, non-emotional decision if I choose to bring him home


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