# Australian Saddles Anyone?



## Chevaux (Jun 27, 2012)

I have an aussie - Kimberley synthetic endurance model.; bought it on line. I plan to get a second one and, I've said this before, I can't decide if the second one is leather or synthetic and I realistically won't make that decision until I'm ready to push the order button. I like that it is minimal maintenance, it uses a dressage girth, it's light weight, it fits the horses, it is comfortable and secure.


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

I absolutely adore my Aussie saddle. I got it for $125 at a local tack consignment shop and have never looked back. I have never been comfortable in a western saddle. There's only one western saddle out of over a dozen I've ridden in. Anyway, I had always wanted to try an Aussie saddle, ever since I saw The Man From Snowy River as a child.

My only problem now is that my saddle is too wide for my gelding. I'm hoping he grows into it, as it's difficult to find an 18" seat that's affordable (heck, it's difficult to find Aussies PERIOD around here).

I'll have to post a pic later. My phone is being slow.
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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

I used this one this morning (although the picture is several years old):










With time, I've drifted from English to Australian and now have settled on western. I've ordered a good western saddle and hope to be able to use it the rest of my life.

I plan to keep the above saddle, although I've got 2 English and a western saddle I need to sell...and an older Australian one. But I've got plenty of time with my butt in an Australian-style saddle, and have no regrets. Back when my horse would spook and spin at just about anything, those poleys saved this new rider many times.


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## Shoebox (Apr 18, 2012)

Yes! I got an Aussie because my Western hurt my knees so badly I would dismount and hardly be able to stand. I would find myself sitting cross-legged one leg at a time in my saddle on trail rides to give my knees a break. 

I will NEVER look back. I love it. It is like sitting in a couch, and I love the poleys for if things ever get hairy. I LOVE sitting in it, and it fits my mare perfectly. I'm definitely one of the advocates for Aussies, I think everyone needs to try one! It's the perfect saddle for me.

Here is a picture of my mare and my saddle (with a girth that is too short, I am aware lol):


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

Ok. Here's my saddle.

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## cakemom (Jul 4, 2010)

I'm on the hunt for one now in fact.
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## Roman (Jun 13, 2014)

I rode in one in May when I rode a mustang. It was kind of like a Western saddle minus the horn, but it had the hump (can't think of the name) where the horn would sit.
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## its lbs not miles (Sep 1, 2011)

MW Roach said:


> Anybody else ever ride Aussie? What do you like about it? What don't you like about it? If you've never ridden in an Aussie saddle, try it and tell us all what you think!


Yes, I've ridden a stock saddle (still have a Syd Hill I use at times), as well as a vast variety of saddles. Opposite from you I started out at 11 in Germany with dressage and hunt seat (we didn't call them "English"...they weren't) and then went to Western when I moved back to the US, because let face it, the European style saddle is never going to make it as a working saddle. It's good for shows, fox hunts, and the like.

All saddles are designed (or at least that was the designers intent....even if it didn't turn out all that great) for a purpose. There is no saddle that does it all. Ideally people will pick the one that works best for their horse in doing the job they intend (and for rider too, but the horse first).

I've found that the stock saddle is exceptionally nice when dealing with a new or unbroken/untrained or a head strong horse that has leaned how and wants to unseat a rider. A Western or any high pommel saddle can work well too. Stock saddles advantage is that the poley can catch your thigh before you get as far forward as you might get with a Western style high pommel. Of course if they manage to get you past the poley (and it can happen) then you're now at a decidedly disadvantaged position since if you didn't come off you won't easily come back down into the saddle. That being said I still prefer them because it's not often you end up beyond the poley.

However, they do suffer the same disadvantages (or advantages) of the other European style saddles (unless you get one built on a tree like the UP or Western saddles vs the European style frames). They do not displace as much weight over a large enough area to be a great saddle for a lot of daily miles (e.g. 20 miles a day, several days a week for weeks on end).

Yes, I know that they do make them (non traditional) with the Western style trees which, if they are a good fit for the horses back, would make them an even better working saddle. Of course then we'd need to address the 15lbs of excess leather that's hanging down on the sides (a huge sweat flap covered by an equally large outer flap....I've never seen the value of any flap other than to give more weight to the saddle and the stock saddles have more than most...which is wonderful if your working on remodeling the cannon bones and need the extra weight, but after that's done it's just excess weight that the horse is having to carry around on it's back which nature never designed to carry weight anyway). :lol:

As for cinches. Give me a Western style cinch any day (and twice on Sundays). They are easy to make the perfect tightness. With the buckled, European style cinches you have to go with which ever hole fits best. If the best spot is between holes, oh well, that's just too bad. Either do it a tad looser than it should be or a tad tighter, if you're worried about slippage (do NOT ask the horse which one it will choose :lol. And if (heaven forbid) the cinch strap should break while your out, say 12 miles, you've got a long walk back either carrying a saddle AND leading your horse or hopefully being able to manage a balancing act with saddle sitting on the horse. With a Western style cinch you can take the busted cinch strap and loop the long end back through the ring to attach the cinch again and presto...your back in the saddle again.

There are very good reasons why people who worked from horseback day in and day out for months away from anyplace didn't use the European style saddles or cinches when there was a choice.

The traditional stock saddle is a good saddle for select uses (one of the best). I do use it for those purposes. It would never be my choice if I was restricted to only having one saddle for the rest of my life. I ride a lot of miles and love my horses backs too much :lol:

disclaimer: yes, I know that what we call the "Western" style saddle came from Spain, which is part of Europe (actually if you trace it back it came to Spain from North Africa), but people tend use whatever terms make sense to them for identifying saddles (e.g. the "English" saddle was not actually of "English" origin....but the UP - Universal Pattern- saddle was and they're military has been using variations of it since the 1850's)


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

its lbs not miles said:


> ...There are very good reasons why people who worked from horseback day in and day out for months away from anyplace didn't use the European style saddles or cinches when there was a choice....


Don't tell the Australians. They probably think they have worked long days in remote areas with Australian saddles. The difference in weight between a western fender and the excess flap of an Australian saddle is probably negligible. And having TWO attachments for the girth instead of one you can very easily inspect is probably a better design than the western one for holding the cinch to the saddle.

I'm switching to western, but I doubt it is all that superior to the Australian design.


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## Shoebox (Apr 18, 2012)

Aussie saddles were actually made originally with long days in the saddle in mind. The Aussies wanted a saddle that was rugged and comfortable for hours spent out in the bush working, and the stock saddle design is what they came up with - rugged, comfortable, easy on the horse, and with the security of the poleys - and with many Aussies, the flocking will take the shape of your horse's back as you use it and actually get more comfortable for the horse with wearing. It's a great trail saddle.


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## its lbs not miles (Sep 1, 2011)

There is a reason why by the mid 1800's two of the largest campaigning armies in the world abandoned saddles with the European style "tree". After years of dealing with back problems being one of the two biggest reasons for horses being unfit for duty they switched to a saddle that displaced more weight. You ride that type of tree day in and day out without the horse getting a break you're asking for a problem and long campaigns made those kind of demands. No one notices it much today, because how many people do you actually know (or even know of) who ride 20 miles a day, for around 23 days a month (a day or two off every 5-7 days) for 3+ months at a time? (only those with a lot of missing marbles We haven't had horse mounted, campaigning troops in close to 100 years. But when we did....for the British Empire (which included Australia) they went to the UP saddle. For the US they went to the McClellan (which has it's own unique issues, but if you find a horse that fits the saddle...it's biggest issue...it's great for displacing weight and for being light which are both great for the horse). While the UP saddle did still have a flap, it was typically smaller than the typical dressage saddle flap (they were also capable of being adjusted for both rider and horse by a trained person). And while heavier than the McClellan, they were still relatively light. 
Ever wonder why even Australia's mounted troops (prior to the end of the horse mounted era) used the UP saddle instead of their own stock saddle? Because the stock saddle isn't well suited for the horse if you're going to be riding that much. It was really designed more with the rider in mind, but to mounted troops it's the horse that matters most. If their horse becomes unfit for duty then they have a problem.

I'm not sure what kind of fenders you're using if they weigh anywhere near as much as the flaps on my stock saddle, but they must be massive. Both larger and thicker than a standard fender. While I find fenders to be as useless (I'm sure someone has a use for them) as the flaps (both missing from the traditional McClellan) I've never seen a set of fenders that came anywhere close to weighing what the stock saddle's 4 flaps (from about where the jockey would be on a Western saddle) measuring 17.5" by 13.5" each which is about standard for the stock saddle. I could almost make two fenders out of the leather from one flap. Of course you also have to through in the stirrup strap for the stock saddle, which is typically part of the fender (or visa versa) with the Western saddle, but we'll be nice and just call the straps a wash.

As for breaking. While it's not common and most of the people I know today have never experienced it. I've had two straps break on me. Both were less than 2 weeks old. One broke on it's 3rd use and one on it's 4th use and each within a week of their first use. Both snapped across the point of a hole. Fortunately I was within 1.5 miles of home on both occasions.

As for the two vs one, I've never (even when I worked cattle) preferred using the back separately. I prefer pulling it forward and just use the one cinch. But even so, if you ride a stock saddle traditionally you're using a surcingle anyway, which gives you a second strap. I use one religiously when I ride with my stock saddle.

After the 1880's the US went to a more controlled range system around ranches. Much like the cattle stations of Australia. A ranch or station hand is seldom out more than a week which means the horse gets a pretty regular break even if it's worked hard for a few days. A far cry from what it was like for horses of the pre 1870's open range cowboy who was out the better part of months at a time. In the US most of that land was not owned and cattle were freely grazed all over it. When land started being owned the truly open range vanished as ranchers only wanted their cattle on their land and the non ranchers did want anyone's cattle on their land.

As I stated before. Saddles were designed for purposes. The stock saddle was designed as a working saddle with the rider in mind (rather obvious if you look at it). Specifically for riders comfort and to help keep the rider in the saddle. It's a good saddle for dealing with unruly or ornery horses or if you're going to do some riding where you worry about coming out of the saddle. The poley will do a respectable job of keeping a person in the saddle. If I'm going to ride out for 100 miles I'll leave the stock saddle home. It's not the best choice for that, because my horses back is more important.

It doesn't really matter for the vast majority of people. Most of them don't have a saddle that fits their horse really well anyway. Most don't average 10 hours in the saddle per week. I know many that don't average 2 (makes me wonder why they have a horse :lol. If the saddle doesn't fit well, they hardly notice, because it's not on the horse for long enough to have a real lasting effect. They endure it for an hour or two and have 3 days break after that :lol:.

The question was did we ever ride a stock saddle (sorry, "Australian saddle") and what did we think. I have, I still own one, that is what I think and why.

No one has to agree, or even believe the information :lol: (there are people who believe a dressage saddle displaces as much weight as any other saddle and even people who don't believe the holocaust happened). Fortunately we still have the right to believe, or not believe what we want :lol:


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## Chevaux (Jun 27, 2012)

Interesting discussion, its lbs not miles. I agree completely that if I were to ever spend as much time in the saddle (delightful as it might be) as a cavalry person then I would be picking the absolute best saddle possible for the horse whatever design that may be. I also agree that most saddles probably aren't a perfect fit for the horse but we get away with it because it mostly fits and because of the length of time (particularly in a typical day) that we spend in the saddle.

Something that may also be worth mentioning is that I believe the norm for North American cowboys was to have a string of horses at their disposal (I wonder if that was the same in Australia?) so that when they were out and about they could spell off their mounts which would have been a help to individual horses. I've seen 19th century western saddles as well as pictures from the same era (let's say they weren't overly generous with the padding on either saddle or blanket) and I do find it hard to believe that they didn't cause some problems for the horse on that point alone.

Now all said and done, I still like my little Aussie.


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## its lbs not miles (Sep 1, 2011)

Chevaux said:


> Interesting discussion, its lbs not miles. I agree completely that if I were to ever spend as much time in the saddle (delightful as it might be) as a cavalry person then I would be picking the absolute best saddle possible for the horse whatever design that may be. I also agree that most saddles probably aren't a perfect fit for the horse but we get away with it because it mostly fits and because of the length of time (particularly in a typical day) that we spend in the saddle.
> 
> Something that may also be worth mentioning is that I believe the norm for North American cowboys was to have a string of horses at their disposal (I wonder if that was the same in Australia?) so that when they were out and about they could spell off their mounts which would have been a help to individual horses. I've seen 19th century western saddles as well as pictures from the same era (let's say they weren't overly generous with the padding on either saddle or blanket) and I do find it hard to believe that they didn't cause some problems for the horse on that point alone.
> 
> Now all said and done, I still like my little Aussie.


Ah, you're talking about the classic open range cowboy  (something often referred to, but almost never depicted correctly) vs the ranch cowboy (which is what is usually depicted even when referring to open range). Yes, the open range cowboy, when possible, had a spare (maybe two) horses that he would strive to insure were about the same build (he could only afford one saddle). This allowed him to work pretty much every day (open range was just that....there was no limit to where cattle could end up) since that is what the job required, but give the horse a day off to recover and catch up on eating. A system that has worked well throughout history (even the Mongols used it).

I like my stock saddle too, for certain jobs. It's a comfortable saddle to ride. It's the heaviest saddle I own so it works well (don't have to add as much extra weight) for building up my horse to carry a load and in remodeling the cannon bones. I take every saddle design for it's merits.
I do think that there was some poor thinking in making the stock saddle. There's no reason for so much flap (and 4 of them?). It's a lot of unneeded, excess weight that some poor horse has to carry.

For any who are not very familiar with the stock saddle and the amount of flap I'm talking about I'll post two photos (they say a picture is worth a 1,000 words :lol of me on my older mare with a stock saddle and one with me on my younger mare in a civilian version of the UP saddle. You can see in both pictures I'm wearing leather leggings and that in the UP style saddle my kneed is bent more (my thighs would be hitting the poley if my leg was bent that much on the stock saddle). Note that even with my leg bent more the flap on the UP style saddle barely reaches the bottom of my calf while on the stock saddle, with my leg extended farther down the flap still comes almost to my ankle (if it was bent the same angle as the UP saddle the stock saddle flap would extend past my ankle). Add to this, although you don't see it, that there is a second flap of the same size underneath the outer flap which you see. Making for 4 flaps of that extreme size. UP saddles do generally use European style rigging, but I have mine rigged out for Western style (for a variety of reasons....getting the best fit being a primary one).

(disclaimer: I am in no way saying that the UP saddle is the best of all saddles. Like every saddle it was designed with a function in mind. It is not well suited for ever purpose. No saddle is. Pick your saddle based on what you plan to use it for and keep your horse's back and the weight it has to carry as limiting factors).


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## karliejaye (Nov 19, 2011)

Off Topic- what does UP saddle stand for? All I can think of is Union Pacific (I must be watching too much Hell on Wheels). I am interested in seeing a picture sans rider if you have one!

On topic- I have ridden in Aussie stock saddles and I love quality ones, but it seems like 98% of the ones I see around here are rubbish. Cardboard leather, shoddily stuffed panels and horribly unbalanced trees. If I could get my hands on a Syd Hill at a decent price I would have one in my tack room. I especially like the ones without horns, but that do have more western style fenders rather than the big flaps.


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## DraftyAiresMum (Jun 1, 2011)

karliejaye said:


> If I could get my hands on a Syd Hill at a decent price I would have one in my tack room. I especially like the ones without horns, but that do have more western style fenders rather than the big flaps.


There's a gorgeous Syd Hill on consignment at a local tack store by me for $750. It's the right size for me and my gelding. I'd KILL for that saddle. Or sell a kidney. Whichever is easier .
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## karliejaye (Nov 19, 2011)

I actually have a Syd Hill, I keep forgeting about. Well kind of. It is actually a leather bareback pad with mini polleys that they custom made for a friend of mine. Bought it from her almost 20 years ago.


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## its lbs not miles (Sep 1, 2011)

karliejaye said:


> Off Topic- what does UP saddle stand for? All I can think of is Union Pacific (I must be watching too much Hell on Wheels). I am interested in seeing a picture sans rider if you have one!
> 
> On topic- I have ridden in Aussie stock saddles and I love quality ones, but it seems like 98% of the ones I see around here are rubbish. Cardboard leather, shoddily stuffed panels and horribly unbalanced trees. If I could get my hands on a Syd Hill at a decent price I would have one in my tack room. I especially like the ones without horns, but that do have more western style fenders rather than the big flaps.


(Read the end of my first post) 
UP - Universal Pattern
The modern civilian version is known as a Trooper (sort of appropriate I guess since back in the day mounted soldiers were known as "troopers")

There was a girl several months back selling her Syd Hill on here. I think she wanted about $400 for it. It look good from the photos, but had the one problems that comes with all European style cinches eventually. The cinch strap was broken at the point where cinch buckled to it. At that point your options are to find someone who does saddle repair for that (can do actual saddle repair) or you could probably just have the cinch off centered a bit by using the next hole up (and tighten from the off side since you won't have enough strap to pull for the on side). Of course, as I said earlier, you don't have that problem with the western style and if the strap does wear out (all straps tied, buckled, etc... at the same point will eventually wear down) it takes a couple of minutes to fix (even if you're camping 200 miles away :lol and anyone can do it. Someone could steal your western cinch strap off your saddle (they're easy to take off and put on) and if you have a good belt you could use it to tie off your cinch in a couple of minutes :lol:.

I like a saddle that nothing short of the tree breaking will stop me from being able use it after some quick repair that can be done on the spot.


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## 2scicrazed (Apr 7, 2014)

Here in trail riding country (TN) all the big tack stores carry them. Nothing fits a narrow gaited horse better than an English or Aussie. And trail riders don't normally use English 

Bedford tack has a large selection.
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## 2scicrazed (Apr 7, 2014)

Oh, but we converted the rigging to western...easier to find different sized girths.
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## ponyboy (Jul 24, 2008)

its lbs not miles said:


> For any who are not very familiar with the stock saddle and the amount of flap I'm talking about I'll post two photos (they say a picture is worth a 1,000 words :lol of me on my older mare with a stock saddle and one with me on my younger mare in a civilian version of the UP saddle. You can see in both pictures I'm wearing leather leggings and that in the UP style saddle my kneed is bent more (my thighs would be hitting the poley if my leg was bent that much on the stock saddle). Note that even with my leg bent more the flap on the UP style saddle barely reaches the bottom of my calf while on the stock saddle, with my leg extended farther down the flap still comes almost to my ankle (if it was bent the same angle as the UP saddle the stock saddle flap would extend past my ankle). Add to this, although you don't see it, that there is a second flap of the same size underneath the outer flap which you see. Making for 4 flaps of that extreme size. UP saddles do generally use European style rigging, but I have mine rigged out for Western style (for a variety of reasons....getting the best fit being a primary one).
> 
> (disclaimer: I am in no way saying that the UP saddle is the best of all saddles. Like every saddle it was designed with a function in mind. It is not well suited for ever purpose. No saddle is. Pick your saddle based on what you plan to use it for and keep your horse's back and the weight it has to carry as limiting factors).


I've never seen someone sitting in a trooper saddle before. If it makes your knees bend that much, it's definitely not something I would want to try. It also seems to me that the suspended seat would make it difficult to use seat aids.


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## DreaMy (Jul 1, 2014)

I really wish that I could try a quality aussie saddle, only ones I've seen are garbage and seemed really uncomfortable. I can't afford another saddle right now so I stick to my synthetic Circle Y western. I always find discussions on saddles really amusing because its like listening to a bunch of teen aged girls talk about jeans, everyone is more comfortable in something else.


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## its lbs not miles (Sep 1, 2011)

ponyboy said:


> I've never seen someone sitting in a trooper saddle before. If it makes your knees bend that much, it's definitely not something I would want to try. It also seems to me that the suspended seat would make it difficult to use seat aids.


As with any saddle, the height of the stirrup is what determines how much the knee bends. If I lower my stirrups my knee will bend less. If I drop them enough my leg will end up fully extended.

The UP was not made to be a dressage saddle. It wasn't made for doing show maneuvers or looking nice. It was designed for the demands and requirements the actively campaigning soldier and horse. The real beauty of it's seat is that it is adjustable. Underneath the seat it has straps that can be adjusted. Having the seat extended allows the best air flow (something missing from the majority of saddle designs). Something common in the last generation of military saddle designs (the McClellan allows for it too). It's important, because heat build has an impact.
No, you won't want to ride an UP saddle for dressage shows or for show jumping. It wasn't designed with that in mind. At the same time you won't (or at least your horse won't appreciate it even if you do) want to ride 500 miles in 5 weeks or less in a dressage saddle or a show jumping saddle (hunt or otherwise).
You're unlikely to see anyone working cattle in a UP saddle. Not that it couldn't be done, but it's not the best design for it.
You "should" pick the style of saddle that is best suited for your horse which is designed for whatever riding you plan to do. That is why there are so many different styles of saddles out there. There is no one saddle that is right for doing it all.

BTW: Those stirrups on the Trooper are up that high because I was too lazy to lower them after my girl friend got off (she wanted to ride Kit a little since she always rode Val using the stock saddle). I can ride with them a bit short easier than she can with them a bit long. They are usually the same length as the ones in the stock saddle photo (which are that long because I lowered them to suit me when my girlfriend wasn't riding and because unlike the Trooper, if your knee's too high it's hitting the poley and makes posting brutal).


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## AnrewPL (Jun 3, 2012)

I grew up riding in stock saddles, and mainly Syd hill Barcoo poleys, and I really am not a fan. its interesting but here in Australia, in the time it seems that the traditional stock saddle is becoming popular around the world, here, people are moving much more to the "half-bred" saddle, basically a stock saddle built on top of a western saddle. I have had a custom built one I had made in about 1993/4 and its a pretty ****ed good saddle, miles better than the average stock saddle, all the same, it doesn't even come close to my wade saddle (both saddles were built by the same person, the trees were also built by the same person" I have spent many hours in the saddle, working cattle, in both traditional Australian saddles, my half-bred saddle and my wade, which was also custom made, and I can say, without any shadow of a doubt, that the wade is the best of them, for years I thought being stiff and sore after a good day of work was normal, I can step out of that wade saddle as fresh as I sat in it. I think they got it right when they came up with that design, at least when Dorrance put in his improvements of it leading to what the wade is today, leaves every Australian saddle I have ever seen for dead. Having rown up with them Im not that impressed to be honest (and I have come to learn to turn and run at sight of a Syd Hill saddle)


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## bsms (Dec 31, 2010)

I love my Australian style saddle. When a green rider with a very spooky horse, those poleys kept my butt in the saddle a number of times. I had poley sized and shaped bruises on my thighs several times, so it isn't hard to image what would have happened without them. When the horse hits the fan, I'd rather be in an Australian stock saddle than anything else.

Mine feels to my butt the same as my Bates Caprilli AP saddle did, but with greater security.

The Clinton Anderson/Martin saddle I bought used last year was the first western saddle I felt comfortable in. Although it doesn't fit my mare - too wide for a slender Arabian - she moves well in it for our hour long rides. My lower back usually limits me to 90 minutes or less, and a horse can pretty easily handle an imperfect fit for short times like that.

But she moves so well in it that I'm having a western saddle built for her after trying a bunch of different trees. It will be a slick fork hard seat saddle. If it fits us both, I'll have a saddle to keep for life. If it doesn't, my wife will probably kill me so I won't care anymore...:? I really wish there was a simple way of determining western saddle fit, but it seems more art than science.

Saddles are very individual items. I enjoyed my English saddles, but I sold them Saturday because they don't match my personality and what I like doing with my horse. My Aussie-style saddle will probably stay with me for life. I have a lot of good memories of riding it, it fits my little mustang almost as well as my much taller mare, and it is a good choice for someone who might need some help sitting out a spook or buck. My daughter used it yesterday to race around the desert on our little BLM mustang, who is our only horse I trust to show flawless judgment in the desert.

If I needed to go out for a 10 hour ride, apart from pain-killers for my back, I'd go western. If I had a horse who was likely to spook & spin, I'd probably grab my Australian. I've done a lot of "spook and spins" in it and I trust it in a way I trust no other saddle.

I've noticed that Australians seem to be switching to the western saddle tree for work. I'd be curious if they are having the same problems figuring out a good fit as I have had.


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## ponyboy (Jul 24, 2008)

its lbs not miles said:


> As with any saddle, the height of the stirrup is what determines how much the knee bends. If I lower my stirrups my knee will bend less. If I drop them enough my leg will end up fully extended.


The flaps are so forward that it looks like your leg would be almost off the back of them if it was hanging straight, that's all.


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## AnrewPL (Jun 3, 2012)

bsms said:


> I love my Australian style saddle. When a green rider with a very spooky horse, those poleys kept my butt in the saddle a number of times. I had poley sized and shaped bruises on my thighs several times, so it isn't hard to image what would have happened without them. When the horse hits the fan, I'd rather be in an Australian stock saddle than anything else.
> 
> Mine feels to my butt the same as my Bates Caprilli AP saddle did, but with greater security.
> 
> ...


I haven't been much involved in cattle work for years now but from what I can observe that's right, though it seems the half-bred saddles are still the most popular, after that possibly wade saddles, they are everywhere these days here. Never heard much of people having much trouble fitting them though.


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